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DEL.ICIO.USGet Russia out of Georgia
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The Russian invasion of Georgia, initially represented as necessary to protect its citizens in the breakaway Georgian province of South Ossetia, is a reminder that where Russia is concerned, the world is still a very dangerous place.
Vice President Dick Cheney told Georgia President Mikheil Saakashvili on Sunday that “Russian aggression must not go unanswered and that its continuation would have serious consequences for its relations with the United States, as well as the broader international community,” said his press secretary, Lee Ann McBride.
Russia is the villan here clearly. Since the collapse of the Soviet Union, Russia has attempted to make South Ossetia and Abkkhazia Russian outposts — or even Russian territory — on Georgian soil. Russia has “peacekeepers” stationed in both. The longer they stay, the more difficult to impossible it becomes for Georgia to assert sovereignty over its territory.
It is another measure of the impotence of the United Nations or any other world body that Russian peacekeepers remained on Georgian soil allegedly performing a function that required neutral forces.
The timing of Georgian military action to reassert control of its South Ossetian territory is somewhat surprising though. Russia has been sending signals recently that it is threatened by Western efforts to establish military ties with buffer states. It’s been looking for some way, including reestablishing a relationship with Cuba, to send a message. Georgia now is the message. It has applied for NATO membership and is a strong U.S. friend and ally, providing 2,000 troops to help stabilize Iraq.
Diplomatically, the U.S. has to do everything possible, including chilling relations with Russia, to get its army out of Georgia. This is an instance where the world’s security interest requires a world response. Georgia is our friend, but it’s not specifically the U.S. security interest threatened by Russian aggression. It’s the world’s.
The over-reaction by the Russians is a reminder that inexperience in the White House is risky business. Why John McCain over Barack Obama? You don’t want the Russians to miscalculate the intentions or the resolve of a U.S. President.
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Comments
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 8:50 AM | Link to this
Good morning all. The name of the column is “Thinking Right” and today the essay is about morality rather than politics. Nevertheless I eagerly anticipate the statements from the candidates, as that will give us the clearest insight into their respective executive capacities. One expects Hussein to spout something like Rodney King’s “can’t we all just get along.” Captain Queeg surely will be tempted to sing something by the Beach Boys.
Seriously I liked Vice President Cheney’s statement. I would wish to see a public statement advising Russia that we will be sending armaments to “our ally Georgia” much as we did to Afghanistan when its sovereignty was challenged by the Soviet Union.
By Ga Values
August 11, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this
Our Senior Senator Saxby Special Interest makes the WSJ & Rush show.. He looks like an Idiot
Republican Energy Fumble August 8, 2008; Politics has its puzzling moments. John McCain and most of the GOP experienced one late last week. That was when five of their own set about dismantling the best issue Republicans have in the upcoming election.
It’s taken time, but Sen. McCain and his party have finally found — in energy — an issue that’s working for them. Riding voter discontent over high gas prices, the GOP has made antidrilling Democrats this summer’s headlines.
Members of the “Gang of 10” discuss their energy plan, Aug. 1. Their enthusiasm has given conservative candidates a boost in tough races. And Mr. McCain has pressured Barack Obama into an energy debate, where the Democrat has struggled to explain shifting and confused policy proposals.
Still, it was probably too much to assume every Republican would work out that their side was winning this issue. And so, last Friday, in stumbled Sens. Lindsey Graham, John Thune, Saxby Chambliss, Bob Corker and Johnny Isakson — alongside five Senate Democrats. This “Gang of 10” announced a “sweeping” and “bipartisan” energy plan to break Washington’s energy “stalemate.” What they did was throw every vulnerable Democrat, and Mr. Obama, a life preserver.
That’s because the plan is a Democratic giveaway. New production on offshore federal lands is left to state legislatures, and then in only four coastal states. The regulatory hurdles are huge. And the bill bars drilling within 50 miles of the coast — putting off limits some of the most productive areas. Alaska’s oil-rich Arctic National Wildlife Refuge is still a no-go.
The highlight is instead $84 billion in tax credits, subsidies and federal handouts for alternative fuels and renewables. The Gang of 10 intends to pay for all this in part by raising taxes on … oil companies! The Sierra Club couldn’t have penned it better. And so the Republican Five has potentially given antidrilling Democrats the political cover they need to neutralize energy through November.
Sen. Obama was thrilled. He quickly praised the Gang’s bipartisan spirit, and warmed up to a possible compromise. Of course, he means removing even the token drilling provisions now in the bill. But he’s only too happy for the focus to remain on the Gang’s efforts, and in particular on the five Republicans providing his party its fig leaf.
Equally gleeful was Louisiana’s Mary Landrieu, the Senate’s most vulnerable Democrat. She had been sweating the energy debate, especially after her vote against more oil-shale production — a position her Republican opponent, John Kennedy, had used against her to great effect. Yet there she was, chummily standing with the Gang of 10 and boasting that she is working with “five Republicans” to “lower prices at the pump by increasing offshore drilling here at home.”
Mr. McCain, who had been commanding the energy debate, was left to explain why he, of all people, wasn’t more enthusiastic about a “bipartisan” effort on energy, especially one that includes “drilling.” His camp was forced to take refuge in taxes, explaining that their boss couldn’t sign up for a bill that included more. If this is what Mr. McCain’s good friend Lindsey Graham considers “helping,” somebody might want to ask him to stop.
And pity poor Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, who has been working overtime to stanch GOP losses this fall and head off a filibuster-proof Democratic Senate. His dogged efforts to highlight Democratic opposition to drilling has kept energy in the news and laid the groundwork for GOP candidates to use the issue to their advantage.
In the Colorado Senate race, Democrats had christened former GOP Rep. Bob Schaffer “Big Oil Bob” — hoping to smear his oil industry career. “Big Oil Bob” has instead embraced his pro-drilling positions and is pummeling opponent Mark Udall for his antidrilling stance. In recent weeks, Mr. Schaffer has erased Mr. Udall’s lead. Polls show Republican Sens. Norm Coleman (Minnesota) and John Sununu (New Hampshire) both climbing in the polls on the back of strong energy arguments. As two of the GOP’s most vulnerable senators, both might well have run for cover with the Gang of 10. Instead they’re fighting on the merits.
The “bipartisan” Republican senators have undercut these efforts, and boosted Ms. Landrieu. They’ve even put a smile on Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid’s face. He’d been struggling to tamp down the energy debate through November, where he hopes to increase his majority and permanently shelve drilling. He’s now counting on the Gang to fruitlessly continue “negotiations” straight through the Senate’s short September session and solve his problem for him.
Not one of the five Republicans in the Gang is facing a tough election this year. That’s the sort of security that leads to bad decisions. And theirs is the sort of thinking that could leave Republicans in a permanent minority.
By Dennis
August 11, 2008 9:14 AM | Link to this
Ah! Dick Cheney says the Russians need to get out of Georgia?
“So?”
What is the Cheney/Bush administration going to do, borrow more money from China to finance a war with Russia?
You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.
By @@
August 11, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this
Jim:
I, too question the timing of Georgia’s encroachment into South Ossetia.
A friend of mine who handles logistics for the military, said they were shipping armaments to Tiblisi (sp?) prior to Georgia’s encroachment. As Russian troops were already amassing on the border, it stands to reason that we were aware of the impending conflict.
Putin’s intentions were clear. His was a message to the other Caucasus and the U.S…….We can and will protect our periphery with air, ground and naval force. As much as I am pained to say it; Georgia was a trade-off. Putin’s “useful idiots” encouraged his aggression.
The invasion of Georgia by Russia last Friday confirms that a new generation of Lenin’s “useful idiots” are alive and well. Senator Charles Schumer, apparently now a lead negotiator for Russia, recently opined that Russia could be persuaded to support stronger sanctions against Iran if, in return, the United States refused to share its anti-ballistic missile shield with our allies in Central and Eastern Europe (CEE).
But simply undercutting American foreign and defense policy isn’t enough for Mr. Schumer. Again, acting as Russia’s agent in place, he proposes that American taxpayers make annual payments to Russia for its losses incurred from trade sanctions against Iran. By Mr. Schumer’s own reckoning, this system of fealty payments would cost American taxpayers approximately $2 billion to $3 billion per year.
What’s that they say about A Bear poopin’ in the woods? Time for Europe to beef up its’ own defenses I suppose.
Whoops! can’t do that……the cost of their socialist programs limit their ability to fund an endeavor such as defense.
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this
Well, Dennis @ 9:14
Did you put down your anti-war banner before suggesting a war with Russia?
In the meatime, Bush is at the Olympics speaking right into Putin’s ear that NOBOY LIKES IT & THE UN DOES NOT LIKE IT & CUT IT OUT!!! This is known as diplomacy.
Back at home, Cheney is beating the drum and saying REMEMBER AFGHANISTAN of years back and U R INVADING and ever heard of a blockade, you Russian blockheads?? This is know as bullish anti-belligerence.
Meanwhile, Obama is studying his ouiji board on what to say. McCain is sharpening his Swiss pocket knife just in case. And Carter said, “Those Russians can’t have MY peanuts!”
Ah.. a long hot summer. Is the Energy Battle in the House of Reps still being bravely led by Repubs against dilly-dally Dems? Is dilly dally Edwards in the Demo dog house? Will Mrs. Godzie still cut’n’past now that Bookman is back? Is PoFo a no no? Will lightning stike my computer again like it did last week?
So many questions. So little time.
By hillbilly ragger
August 11, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this
Putin to Wooten: “You and what army?”
Dusty, I see you’re back.
When last we criss-crossed paths, couple of weeks ago, you were mistakenly claiming that there were no wiki entries for Obama’s first post-college real-job gigs.
I never had a chance to correct you, but here they are:
Business International Corporation
Public Interest Research Group
I’m not claiming you were trying to mislead, earlier—I figured you must have done a search within Wikipedia and came up snake eyes. But the links are there to the entry on Obama himself; that’s how I found them, originally.
Just wanted to clear up that little loose end. Welcome back.
By GayGrayGeek
August 11, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this
Dusty @ 10:14
AFEES, now. AFEES, 5 minutes ago. AFEES, or STFU. Take your pick of those two acronyms, and apply.
By Redneck Convert
August 11, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this
Well, I got my two machine guns and the anti-tank weapon when the Russians show up in Forsyth County. The rest of you that have disarmed are in a fine pickle now that Russia has invaded GA. You can’t even take your pea-shooters into the Atlanta airport, much less fight the Russians.
I never heard of this Ossetia. Probly a small town with a good BBQ place like so many other GA towns. Anyway, we are up on world events and ready to put old Saxby back in the Senate.
Anyhow, us GA rednecks fought the yankees and now we’ll fight the Russians. You might of knowed war would break out here the minute the librul Democrats took over Congress. Bunch of cut and runners. Maybe we need to start a war with Iran so the Russians will have to withdraw troops from here to fight there.
Have a good day everybody.
By Leo Huggins
August 11, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this
I had quit reading the AJC about three years after coming to Georgia, because of the papers hard left leaning!
This article sent to me by a friend is a refreshing breath of air from the AJC! Continue moving toward center and i may even consider reading your Paper again!
Oh, yes, I came to Georgia to live in 1984.
Leo Huggins
By hillbilly ragger
August 11, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this
BFKaJ, I think the Georgians were expecting a lot more than just “sending armaments to ‘our ally Georgia’”.
Per a real-newspaper-with-a-real-foreign-bureau’s lead story today:
*The grimmest among the Georgians were the soldiers, haggard, unshaven and swinging their Kalashnikovs. A group of them had piled onto a flatbed truck, crowding on in such numbers that some were sitting on the roof, their feet dangling over the windshield.
One, who gave his name as Major Georgi, spoke with anger.
“Write exactly what I say,” he said. “Over the past few years, I lived in a democratic society. I was happy. And now America and the European Union are spitting on us.”*
By getalife "whiners"
August 11, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this
Watching the Georgian President check the skies and run for his life today.
Cold war back on.
Hell, Russia could take back all territories and nobody can stop them.
PUTIN TO US: STAY OUT OF THIS CONFLICT
I think he told cheney to GFY.
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this
Dear hill billy ragger,10:27
Well, thank you, my little correcta tape man. I don’t even remember about Obama’s “work” experience since there is so little to remember. Was that before his long “community organizer and gardner” job? Indeed. Don’t forget his university magazine editorship also. Great stuff!! (I’ll have you know that I was EDITOR of the HiTimes of my HIGH SCHOOL. So there!! I was one of the few who could read AND write!! OK…so it wasn’t Harvard!!)
Hang in there, now. I am gone again.
By ghost rider
August 11, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this
DUSTY ..
Wasn’t it George W. Bush (R-The INCOMPETENT) Who in 2001 looked into Putin’s eyes and proclaimed “I found him to be very straight forward and trustworthy.”
NEXT CASE!
And, your comment about Cheney! Isn’t he (the man of FIVE draft deferments) always “beating the drum” for war?
Only one caveat!
It’s not me who has to go.
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this
Ghost Rider, as I leave, 10:53
SOOO maybe Putin’s eyes are trustworthy but…the rest of him is a proberbial banana peel. You know. Kinda like Obama. Those big brown eyes so sweet!! But who knows about the rest of that gallant guy of strange lifetimes. What is here this week may be gone next week.
Cheney could beat a bunch of wildcats in a fight. He’s got a brain that can overpower the giants. He uses that with those of lesser talents. Too bad you don’t know that. But it does take one to know one.
Gone ..the clock moves on…
By fearless fosdik
August 11, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this
“I was EDITOR of the HiTimes of my HIGH SCHOOL. So there!! “I was one of the few who could read AND write!!”
What a testement of where you went to school….
By @@
August 11, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this
What a testement of where you went to school….
PoliFore, check your breath. It’s testament…..inserting an i.
By jm
August 11, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this
I dunno, the reaction by the current President with 7+ years experience in office is to go to the Olympics and hang out with beach volley ball players.
By Lily Toad
August 11, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this
Get USA out of Iraq By Jim Wooten | Monday, August 11, 2008, 08:19 AM
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The American invasion of Iraq, initially represented as necessary to protect its citizens from weapons of mass destruction, is a reminder that where the USA is concerned, the world is still a very dangerous place.
Russian President Mikheil Saakashvili on Sunday told VP Dick Cheney that “American aggression must not go unanswered and that its continuation would have serious consequences for its relations with Russia, as well as the broader international community.”
The USA is the villan here.
By findog
August 11, 2008 11:37 AM | Link to this
BFKaJ, I thought it was the Caucasian truck driver beaten by the mob in LA that said the get along thingee… Dusty, Sorry to hear that lightning hit your place. Obama is still on vacation and Mrs. Godzilla is still not posting; I really think they are one in the same…
Jim, I think we need a refresher on history. Big country sends a bunch of natives into small country [Tibet recently for China and Chek by Germany for WW-II] and then the big country rides to their citizen’s rescue [Texas for the US vs. Mexico]. The only ones who pay are the civilians and the cannon fodder defenders. Too bad the US is not capable of meeting this threat. What was it President Bush said in the 2000 debate about two of ten combat divisions not being combat ready? Hubris?
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this
Dear Leo @ 10:36, welcome to the blog. Don’t want to disappoint you, but Jim is sui generis at AJC.
Dear Ragger @ 10:36, I just had a good laugh, thought you would enjoy it too. I searched Google News for “Obama Georgia” and got several funny returns, mostly suggesting Obama and Bush were kindred deer in the headlights. McCain had a great statement. President jbmlaw would call Congress back into session, and ask Congress for authority to provide military assistance for 60 days (to make sure the issue came up again two weeks before the election.)
By AJC/DNC Management
August 11, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
By Lily Toad August 11, 2008 11:31 AM The USA is the villan here.
Yeah, America sucks, blah, blah, blah.
POS.
By candide
August 11, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this
The Georgians are fools to battle the Russians, a pipsqueak nation against a bear. The Georgians were probably egged on by American neocons and Zionists. We have no interest there. In fact, we need to improve our relations with the Russians.
By Hillbilly Deluxe
August 11, 2008 12:12 PM | Link to this
To Findog @ 11:37 AM
BFK@j is correct. It was Rodney King who said, “Can’t we all just get along”.
For the topic at hand: Don’t forget where Putin came from, the KGB. In my opinion he wants to put as much of the old Soviet Union back together as he can. He moved before Georgia became a part of NATO. Unfortunately they will probably be left to twist in the wind on their own. Putin has calculated that the West won’t risk a major confrontation over this. It’s a very sticky situation indeed.
By ghost rider
August 11, 2008 12:16 PM | Link to this
DUSTY…
The only thing Cheney (R-COWARD) could beat is the draft!
By hillbilly ragger
August 11, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this
BFK @ 11.37, I don’t see Bush going out on a limb to help his erstwhile primary challenger all that much, but you never know.
HDeluxe @ 12.12, I don’t think anyone forgets that Putin’s KGB (I don’t think you ever are “ex-” KGB!) — he’s a military dictator, and while those in here who claim he’s trying to re-unify the old USSR are being a little silly (the USSR didn’t really turn out all that well, remember?) he sure as hell will grab any easy pickins, which it appears these breakaway provinces are.
I’m sorry to go back off-topic, and I’d tried to ignore it, but… but…why does Dusty keep on clinging to a case that’s built on sand?
Look, if she or anyone else wishes to argue that McCain is more experienced at a higher level of government affairs than is Obama, that’s not really controversial; obviously, 26 years vs. 4 in the US Senate, at a certain level, speak for themselves. Indeed, Obama is happy to point out that McCain’s been in DC serving as a Senator for 26 years.
But she (and others) insist on taking it further. The discussion I’d referred to upthread did take place a coupl of weeks ago, but it was something that Dusty felt compelled to reply to ME, and I was unable to reply before that thread went dead (and she left for awhile).
Fact is, Obama’s personal, professional, and educational life has been pretty exemplary. That he decided to work for a fairly obscure, church-based community organization after he graduated from Harvard seems endlessly hilarious to Dusty and others, but he’d already worked at high-level institutions (hence the links I’d provided) and, obviously, wanted to see what he could do building up a grass-roots organization. The experience served him well, and he’s handled the forthcoming managerial responsibilities and challenges brilliantly.
I don’t know what’s so difficult about acknowledging as much. You want to argue that his tax policy will hurt the economy? that there’s merit to opening up more public lands to drilling? that we should let the marketplace dictate what happens to the US healthcare system, such as it is? that the Surge is so awesome that we can thank it for the sun rising in the East and setting in the West? Swell.
But the constant carping about “Is he ready to lead” is just getting silly. The guy just knocked out the most formidable husband-wife political tag team in history. He can friggin’ lead.
Dusty, can you friggin’ read?
By findog
August 11, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this
HD, I stand corrected, my apologies, I remember the news conference when the trucker got out of the hospital and forgave the thugs that randomly attacked him, I hope BFKaJ can find it in his heart to forgive me…
In the presidential vein would the quote have been better from the Mars Attacks movie, was not appeasement what we are expecting from uno?
Too bad Georgia didn’t get into NATO in time. As George Will mentioned yesterday there has been only one attack on a NATO member: England’s Falkland Islands by Argentine…
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By 6foot6
August 11, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this
Jim, there you go once again twisting the facts, Im not surprised though this is typical of you conservatives. Russia is in Georgia because Georgia attacked South Ossetia first which is a Russian state that sits in between the borders of Russia and Georgia, only after Georgia attacked South Ossetia, did Russia invade Georgia and start their military offensive. On top of all that Georgia really is just a puppet state of the USA and Israel, the president of Georgia was placed into power by none other than the USA., and BlackWater, DynCorp, and other mercenary companies have been conducting exercises in Georgia for years and all signs point to them working hand in hand with the CIA to instigate this whole conflict. With that said Georgia does not make a move militarily unless the USA and Israel tell them to, they are essentially a puppet state of the USA, just like Iraq, Afghanistan among others. This whole charade was timed perfectly by the USA and Georgia to coincide with the opening of the Olympics; they are trying to undermine Russian stability in the region because Russia is again showing interest in establishing a military presence in Cuba. Basically this whole dog and pony show is the USA getting back at Russia for wanting to renew ties with Cuba, but you won’t hear that because Jim and the rest of the neo-cons like to hide truths in BS rhetoric. JIM TELL THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHATS REALLY GOING ON IN EASTERN EUROPE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU DON’T KNOW WHATS REALLY GOING ON IT’S UP TO YOU TO BE A JOURNALIST AND DO YOUR RESEARCH, THEN GIVE THE PEOPLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How in the world is Russia looked as an aggressor in this situation when Georgia attacked them first?????????? That’s like when the Iraq War started and people were calling the Iraqi’s terrorist’s for attacking the coalition soldiers, when they were just defending their homeland from the US led thug style invasion of there country. If some other power invaded this country and walked down main street USA, all of us red-blooded Americans would be doing the same thing
By Lily Toad
August 11, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
Oh, yeah, Dusty, anyone can become editor of the Harvard Review. I don’t object to statements that Obama doesn’t have much government experience, but belittling editor of a prestigous law review just shows shallow thinking.
By mickeymouse
August 11, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
Jim Wooten gets paid to sit and create this poppycock!It should be in the cartoon section,instead he’s held up to be educated,articulate and an informed commentary,when all he really is ,is another narrow-shoulder,tiny-hands,big-headed liar!He’s a neocon as his lousy,pitiful column suggest!God bless the USSR so they may stamp out the US proxy Georgia,if nothing else,for sending troops to the once proud and sovereign nation of Iraq,under false pretenses!
By mickeymouse
August 11, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this
Jim Wooten gets paid to sit and create this poppycock!It should be in the cartoon section,instead he’s held up to be educated,articulate and an informed commentary,when all he really is ,is another narrow-shoulder,tiny-hands,big-headed liar!He’s a neocon as his lousy,pitiful column suggest!God bless the USSR so they may stamp out the US proxy Georgia,if nothing else,for sending troops to the once proud and sovereign nation of Iraq,under false pretenses!
By The Truman Show
August 11, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
“The USA is the villan here.”
Of course! The US bombed Georgia and killed thousands of innocent civilians. Go ahead and blame Iraq on global warming too. What a moron. BTW: where is the left’s hero, the corrupt UN on this matter? Haven’t heard a peep out of them, have we? But one has to keep things in perspective here: the left said “Raygun” was the villain in the Cold War. It is not hard to understand why the moonbat libs have no clue about global issues of confrontation other than the US sucks.
Speaking of sucks, Nanny’s congress has locked the doors and hence, shut out debate and a vote on drilling for our own energy, even though the majority of Americans are fed up with gas prices and want drilling now. Now you know the argument the moonbats always regurgitate up: “b-b-but but it will take years for that to have an effect.” Yeah, and had Bill Cilnton not vetoed a Republican plan for that back in the 1990s, perhaps we wouldn’t be where we are today. Besides, can’t that same primitive left wing moonbat argument be said about replanting trees? Why the hell replant trees if it will take years to show an effect? Libs don’t think much, do they?
By findog
August 11, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this
HR, The surge is so assume that we can thank it for the sun rising? I thought we thanked Obama for the sun rising. But seriously, I would take either McCain or Obama over Bush or Cheney, my fear is that the electorate will take an instantaneous snapshot of world affairs to make a long term commitment to our future. Must go now…
By relative theory
August 11, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this
Someone help me understand this method of thinking please. John McCain is perceived as an old man who practically needs a walker to hobble around [let us not forget that he has had to jump out of airplanes twice, once on a carrier on fire and another over north Vietnam where he became a distinguished guest of beatings and torture for many years]. How is House Speaker Nancy Pelosi perceived? Is age even brought up by the left about her? I only ask because a), I haven’t heard a thing about her age referenced, and b), Senator McCain is only four years older than she is. Bib wearing libs really have a hard time sometimes trying to gain people’s attention who are not libs; assuming that is their intention of course.
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
candide,
You have no reason to rope Jews into the blame for this, unless you believe that Chuck Shumer’s been running the show. But what’s really off the wall is your claim that we have no interest in Georgia, for it Georgia is the center of Eastern Europe, as Prague is the capital of Central Europe; the capture of any part of Ossetia gives Russia a chokehold on Turkish oil, of which we are a principal consumer; and the taking of All of Georgia gives Russia access to three-season ports. Morever, Putin hereby gets to thumb his nose at NATO, at US, and at the moribund and corrupt UN, the diplomatic equivalent of the Harding Administration.
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this
Dear Ragger @ 12:31, query, would President Bush help the other pseudo-conservative more by doing as the pseudo-conservative claims he himself would act, or does he help more by doing (nothing except talk) exactly as would the opponent of the pseudo-conervative?
Dear Findog @ 12:45, to the extent you need absolution, go forth and sin no more. In truth I was less certain of the original speaker than my assertion allowed, but I’ll take credit for being accidentally correct.
By SCY
August 11, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this
For mediocre a President has been…where are all the critics when a real tyrant (i.e., Putin) marches into a sovereign country like Georgia?
By Ga Values
August 11, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this
Just caught Saxby Special Interest on the Neal Bortz show & he was even worse than on the Rush Show. Basically told the Georgia voters to get off his back, he knew what was right & did not have time to bother with a bunch of fools like us. What Special Interest group has contributed to his war chest to get Saxby to stabb President Bush, John McCain, & the GOP in the back on the DRILL NOW DRILL HERE program?
By Aunt Pittypat
August 11, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this
Oh, dear, Russians in Georgia! How did they ever get in?
By ron
August 11, 2008 1:30 PM | Link to this
Russia’s in Georgia and there Russia will probably stay.They appear to have reason to be there.If not they’ll invent one.We do that.
Hillbilly Ragger.A Wiki entry?Is there anything on there that isn’t opinion and supposition?How does one weed out the facts?
Russia and the Brits have been sparring for quite some time now.Dead spys and bomber flights.Bad people are in charge over there again.
Redneck,You got the wrong Georgia-I hope.One is never sure these days.
By hillbilly ragger
August 11, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
BFK @ 1.19, I honestly don’t know what would help McCain more, although I will grant you’ve posted an interesting hypothetical.
My gut says doing nothing except talk helps McCain. Because McCain has a decent shot at winning so long as the status quo is unchanged, and if he can continue making this race about Obama more than it is about himself.
If it becomes about making smart decisions about new foreign entanglements, I think it favors Obama more than McCain.
That’s just the horse-race guy talking. I have no clue what either candidate really thinks about this situation, to be honest.
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this
6foot6,
You can only be a troll to come on here with that mumbling street-psycho gibberish. Ossetia at large joined Georgia in boldly breaking from the Soviet Union, now extant, and not from the present day Russia. Georgia punctiliously did not invade Russia, but this weekend and especially last night Russia did invade a sovereign European democracy.
Those words still mean anything to you, burnout, or have you forgotten which way’s up!
By SCY
August 11, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this
For mediocre a President has been…where are all the critics when a real tyrant (i.e., Putin) marches into a sovereign country like Georgia?
By Lily Toad
August 11, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this
Don’t any of you see how hypocritical it is of Bush/Cheney to criticize the Russians when they did the same thing to Iraq. All I did was switch USA and Russia in Wooten’s column. Can’t you see how relevant it is. Oh, it’s okay to say Russia is evil for invading another country, but not the US. Look at the facts, compare the situations and tell me where Bush and Cheney get off telling another country what to do when they’ve done the same thing. Oh, and try to do so without name calling.
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this
Dear Ragger @ 1:37, my analysis mirrors yours. I think McCain is better off if he can offer tough talk and the administration nevertheless does nothing (at least publicly) but refer to the UN. Thus Bush embraces the Obama strategy. What can Obama say? And McCain sounds like the noble voice urging that humanitarian relief only the Marines and Navy and Air Force can provide..
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 2:24 PM | Link to this
Dear Lily @ 2:16, to the extent you do not distinguish a freely elected democracy from a murderous dictatorship, yes Georgia and Iraq are just alike. And to the extent that you do not distinguish Russia’s land-grabbing war from the US’s purely humanitarian action in Iraq, yes there is no difference. I suggest you get new glasses.
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this
Findog @ 11:37,
You have a lot to learn about the founding of the Republic of Texas, and in the meantime please resist making the sh!t up. Please? Thank you.
And since you bleed for the Georgian civilians, would you care to name which side, the Russian or the Georgian, is responsible for targeting civilian citizens and their residential dwellings? (And please don’t ooze poison about how the innocent were victims of [morally equivalent] “crossfire”; we’re grown-ups here.
By Caroline
August 11, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
McCain would just bomb Russia with a nuclear weapon and solve everything. With his hair-trigger temper, he’d be perfect for diplomacy. Don’t you think?
By political maelstrom
August 11, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this
For those pining for Mrs. Godzilla (as if) you can find that stank stuff she posts over at Bookman’s blog.
By Poste Haste
August 11, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
The US Women’s Gymnastic team is terrific. One look at their faces is all I need to know that the USA is going to shine in the olympics. They show the American Spirit of overcoming all obstacles, (they lost a favorite to an injury off the bat), yet they performed very well.
The team had a kind of huddle after their performance where they support each other with monologues about how they rely on each other and how well they each did etc. But the huddle ended up with good old USA girls giggling very cheerfully and silly and solid like 16 year olds are supposed to laugh, and I’m telling you this is a great USA team.
The chinese have a very impressive woman’s gymnastics team and will be hard to beat. Some of their girls look like they’re only 14 or 13, and that’s against the rules, but the Chinese are denying all age allogations and sticking to their story. But take a look at these tiny little preteens and tell me that they’re 16. Dont think so.
This is going to be a rare treat for me, these 2008 Women’s Gymnastic Events at the Beijing Olympics.
By political mail storm
August 11, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
Write your Congressmen, Senators and the Russian president to let them know your displeasure and hope that this, uh, aggression … will not stand, dude. Bury them in a mail storm.
By Bishop Eddie Long
August 11, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
Anybody needing a bachelor’s degree from N.C. Central can get one here at the church. We’ve got a ream of blanks we need to get rid of. Thanks.
By Poste Haste
August 11, 2008 2:46 PM | Link to this
Hey everone, CATFIGHT! Roowwrr!
Corporal Duhng and Godzilla are in a spat! I love it when two chicks fight!
CATFIGHT!
Rowwr!
By AmVet
August 11, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this
I saw where the GOP’s King of Class and now Fox Flunky, Mr. Rove posits that Obama already has a huge, possibly insurmountable lead in electoral votes.
And I note that McCain is running around campaigning with Tom Ridge lately. I know very little about him other than his unremarkable tenure at the GOP’s latest bigger, excuse me, smaller government program - Homeland Security.
I believe he is a moderate/slight conservative and supports abortion rights. He is also a Vietnam veteran and as such is someone else the chickenhawks cannot possibly relate to.
Does anyone know much about this guy?
By Post Taste
August 11, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this
You may be asking yourself, “Self, what does post taste like?” Pretty much like creosote. Any other questions?
By Lily Toad
August 11, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this
US’s purely humanitarian action in Iraq,
HA, HA, HA, HA, HA!
How many civilians have been killed in this humanitarian action, Bfk?
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
Poste Haste,
The U.S. Women’s Basketball Team are a bunch of mercenary professionals, and had they any kind of moral compass not one of them would be over there.
Upon their return I’ll be one of many to first greet them with the utmost colloquy, and then help to make each one of them a pariah. Should any of them show up on a Wheaties box, that will become the weakest selling Wheaties campaingn ever.
By Post Cereals
August 11, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this
V-Dog 85, it would have to be a real stinker to sell fewer than the Earl Anthony box of 1974.
By Pierce Randall
August 11, 2008 3:10 PM | Link to this
Just curious, Wooten, is Putin returning your calls on this one?
However, perhaps this is more serious than a partisan issue, or joke…. (My point only being that it’s pretty easy to say that one of the belligerants should just stop; it’s tougher to say what we should do.)
I say the U.S. should escalate presure through NATO and the UN, and stop further incursions into non-separatist parts of Georgia, even if at the end of the day a treaty is drawn in which Georgia doesn’t get to keep these areas. (This may well not work, since in reality we’re probably not going to actually fight Russian troops, and I have a lot more fear in Putin’s resolve than the Bush’s — or any other leader of a NATO state, for that matter.) After that is over, we need to start bridging the gap of diplomatic and security interest between Russia and NATO. We can’t keep the alliance as an anti-Russian club, or we’re the ones playing the first move towards a new Cold War. We’ve been playing that move since the end of the last one; how do you think Putin rose to power in the first place?
By Randall Pierce
August 11, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this
The U.S. and its NATO allies need to quit holding Russia at arms length. We had an historic opportunity to invite them into the alliance and fully engage them in trade, educational and cultural exchanges, etc., etc., but did not fully exploit it. Why? Anyone?
By Common Sense
August 11, 2008 3:21 PM | Link to this
Hello All,
Dusty are you a paid blogger for Jim Wooten?
Your comments really leave a lot to be desired? Jim writes this article Russia should leave Georgia now what do you proposed the Government to do? Oh they are going to talk to the Russians! Why because we are blogged down in 2 wars that will not end anytime soon!
Now that Russia has regain economic strength what can we do to them? Nothing but talk!
Oh McClain can talk to leaders but Mr. Obama cannot not.
Such stupidity is how we got here in the first place.
By Paul
August 11, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad 2:16
[[Look at the facts, compare the situations and tell me where Bush and Cheney get off telling another country what to do when they’ve done the same thing.]]
So compare similarities between US/Iraq and Russia/Georgia-S Ossetia. Okay, here goes:
Georgia had a history of development and in some cases using, WMDs. For years, they alternately cooperated with, then opposed, cooperation with the UN.
Oops. Wrong similarity.
Okay, the Russian Parliament had passed a resolution calling for the overthrow of Georgia’s President.
Oops. Did not.
Well, how ‘bout the United Nations had passed numerous resolutions, including specifically telling Georgia to disarm and submit to weapons inspections. When they didn’t, Russia took the lead with other members of the UN to enforce its resolutions.
Yeah, that’s it.
V-Dog 85
The other day we, along with @@, were having a discussion regarding the Israeli-Syria situation and implications regarding Hezbollah and Iran. You referred to Syria as Iran’s proxy state, then the blog shut down for the evening.
Is it possible you were thinking of Lebanon when you said Syria?
Caroline 2:31
[[McCain would just bomb Russia with a nuclear weapon and solve everything. With his hair-trigger temper, he’d be perfect for diplomacy. Don’t you think?]]
You may want to be more concerned about a Pres Obama, given his pronouncements on what he’d do to prevent Iran from going nuclear, or if they somehow did, what he’d do to them if they attacked Israel with nukes.
‘Course, he can always change his mind –
By Paul
August 11, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
Randall Pierce 3:16
[[We had an historic opportunity to invite them into the alliance ]]
You are not referring to NATO, are you?
And what leads you to conclude Russia was at all interested in becoming “fully engaged” with the US and its NATO allies, or with the West, in trade, educational and cultural exchanges?
By AmVet
August 11, 2008 3:30 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad at 2:55,
That “euphemism” also caught my eye.
If it is an attempt at irony, it is either exceptionally clever or just plain awful. I can’t tell.
If it is not, it positively pathetic…
By BFKaJ
August 11, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this
Dear Lily @ 2:55, you won’t trick me into the leftist trap. You omit the word “innocent.” All of Al Qaeda are “civilians” of course, and you leftists, of course, oppose killing guilty civilians. And, of course, you leftists do not distinguish the civilians killed by Iran and its minions from those killed as US and related “collateral” damage. The number of innocent civilians killed by Allied forces is probably not significantly larger than the number of Americans who have died in action there. That being said, I acknowledge that a huge number of innocent Iraqis died at the hands of al Qaeda and at the hands of Iran and its minions.
By AJC/DNC Management
August 11, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this
By Lily Toad August 11, 2008 2:16 PM Look at the facts, compare the situations and tell me where Bush and Cheney get off telling another country what to do when they’ve done the same thing. Oh, and try to do so without name calling.
Allow me to let Christopher Hitchens explain this to those of you who are unable to distinguish between good and evil:
So, yes, major combat operations appear to be over, and to that extent one can belatedly say, “Mission accomplished.” If there is any Iraqi nostalgia for the old party and the old army, it is remarkably well-concealed. Iraq no longer plays deceptive games with weapons of mass destruction or plays host to international terrorist groups. It is no longer subject to sanctions that punish its people and enrich its rulers. Its religious and ethnic minorities—together a majority—are no longer treated like disposable trash. Its most bitter internal argument is about the timing of the next provincial and national elections. Surely it is those who opposed every step of this emancipation, rather than those who advocated it, who should be asked to explain and justify themselves.
Russia made it a point to bomb not only Georgian soldiers but also Georgian citizens.
It is their strategy, to terrorize and wantonly maim, kill and rape the innocent.
You’re sticking up for them?
By D
August 11, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
what Russia? I thought Reagan ended the Cold War, why are we even thinking about Russia? surely Russia can’t be anything we should be concerned about, Reagan fixed all that. and since Reagan cured that problem completely forever, we shouldn’t concern ourselves anymore with Russia than say, oh I don’t know…Tonga, or maybe Andorra.
By Finch
August 11, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
Thank God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Bookman blog has re-opened. The crazy people are back over there clogging up Jay’s blog with a bunch of inane off topic cr@p. Poor Jay, he really doesn’t deserve the Lucko castoffs, his blog used to be good and he stayed involved. It will be down to 3 people soon, RW, Paul and AJC/Mgt, blogging each other all day. No joke, they are discussing cucumbers right now.
Welcome back Dusty! Believe it or not you were missed, don’t ever leave us with RW and AJC/Mgt again. This place was horrendous.
This place is back to normal, hooray.
By findog
August 11, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this
6’6 Actually South Ossetia is a break away from Georgia. Just happens to have been populated by non-native species of Russian nationals. So based on your line of thinking when Gwinnett County become majority Latino Mexico can invade and take over the area correct?
By Paul
August 11, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
D
I believe you’re referring to the Soviet Union, the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. ‘Russia’ was the dominant state left over when the Soviet Union imploded. On Reagan’s watch.
Finch
and here I thought you had a sense of humor… or cucumbers… or something…
By hillbilly ragger
August 11, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this
ron @ 1.30, it was Dusty who had brought up the lack of a wiki entry for those two companies for whom Obama had worked. She was the one challenging me, and I provided what she was looking for.
And as for wiki being, as you put it, only “opinion and supposition”, that’s really not fair, and frankly it sounds as if perhaps you’ve never really bothered to navigate the site or at least don’t understand how it operates. A wiki entry is, generally, as good (or as bad) as its own links to other outside sources. If you find one that has a ton of “Citation needed”s then it’s good to be suspicious, although it also indicates that people are paying attention and calling BS when needed.
Put it to the test. Think of a topic about which you’re pretty well versed, whether it’s (say) a church denomination to which you belong, or a sport you like, or a company you work for, a school you attended, or whatever. Check its wiki entry. How’d they do?
By deegee
August 11, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this
Wooten says, “The over-reaction by the Russians is a reminder that inexperience in the White House is risky business. “
That is so funny. Over-reaction hahahaha. Like Russia is just over-reacting like a parent that grounds their kid for the entire school year for breaking curfew. Oh, Putin, you’re just actin’ all crazy. Lighten up, okay. And then when the smoke clears the Georgian people see what a big mistake they made by hitching their wagons to a bungling, inexperienced POTUS. Hey! it’s me, W. Jes spreadin’ democracy all ‘cross the world. Try it, you’ll like it. Trust me.
By findog
August 11, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
V-dawg, Are you saying that Mexico did not invite US homesteaders into the land mass known as Texas, and subsequently those US citizens did not ask to be saved from the tyranny of those who invited them in, and subsequently did not Sam Houston out maneuver the Mexican General and have him surrender said lands for his life? Georgia fired on a breakaway internal republic and Russia as an outside force showed up to not only ouster the government but to, as we shall probably see in the coming days, completely overrun the country trying to do what Russia has used as an excuse to bully the small peripheral land masses they lost when the USSR broke up. I by no means am an American self-hater, but really the truth will set you free…
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this
Ho hum….
Let’s straighten things our here.
Bloggers don’t get paid. (Anybody got any good offers?)
President Bush is a fine president and acting like one at the Olympics. He is not there to declare war, insult China, or answer dumb questions from liberal TV hosts (as was tried yesterday). He is simply representing America as the honest, patriotic leader that he is.
If you don’t know anything about Ossetia, please stop showing your ignorance.
If you don’t know who attacked whom in Ossetia, please stop showing your ignorance.
If you are totally ignorant and prejudiced about the Iraq war, please stop showing your ignorance.
If you think Jim Wooten talks to Putin, please stop showing your ignorance.
If you live in a dream world and think Obama’s experience is good preparation to run more than a hot dog stand, please stop with the hallucinogens.
If you want to run down the President, the USA, McCain, the Iraq success, the elderly, Olympians, Wooten and all Republicans, please run over to Bookman’s where you will feel at home. He’s your liberal baby boy of bogus blues..and all blamed on America. Yes, go where ignorance is bliss!!
By Lily Toad
August 11, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this
*Russia made it a point to bomb not only Georgian soldiers but also Georgian citizens.
It is their strategy, to terrorize and wantonly maim, kill and rape the innocent.
You’re sticking up for them?*
NO, I’m not sticking up for the Russians. I think they are attacking a sovereign nation, which is wrong. I also think our attack on Iraq was wrong. And, no, I didn’t support Saddam Hussein. He was an evil dictator. My point is: Russia attacked a sovereign nation and is killing civilians. That is wrong. The USA attacked a sovereign nation and is killing civilians. That is wrong. Bush and Cheney are hypocrites for calling Russia out for doing what they did also.
By Paul
August 11, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad 4:23
This “sovereign nation” thing gets dicey. Would it be okay to attack them if they weren’t sovereign? (joke) Anyway, given Obama’s indicated his willingness to attack a sovereign nation if we don’t agree with their gov’t (Pakistan) or if they appear (not a done deal, but appear) to be doing something we think they oughtn’t (Iran) - well, you could very well repeat the past eight years’ unhappiness with eight more.
Glad to see your concern with lack of adherence to the “rules” of war and the killing of civilians. But notice the outcry of many in the press and politicsy when a few civilians are inadvertently killed (Afg, Pak, Iraq) in a strike and the lack of outcry - just perfunctory reporting - when many hundreds of civilians are targeted and killed (Russia in Georgia).
By getalife"whiners"
August 11, 2008 4:36 PM | Link to this
PUTIN’S OFFENSIVE TELLS BUSH, CHENEY, WORLD LEADERS TO BACK OFF
Come on chickenhawks.
Where are the brave warmongers that want to bomb Iran?
He just told us to GFY.
WTF?
By findog
August 11, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
Dear Lily, Had not heard of the rapes. Is that a turn of a phrase or an actual fact?
By MrLiberty
August 11, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this
I would like to see the US government out of Georgia, and I think that most Georgians would like the same.
By AmVet
August 11, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this
MrLiberty, and given the popularity among the cracker crowd of Sonny “Pray for Rain” Purdue’s critically important secessionist flag plebiscite, some Georgians would probably like another try at their own little CSA…
By Algonquin J. Calhoun
August 11, 2008 5:02 PM | Link to this
The Russian invasion of Georgia, initially represented as necessary to protect its citizens, sounds familiar to me. How hypocritical that the fascist United States of America would chastise the Russians for a brutal attack upon a people who had done nothing to them. We certainly have some brave leaders in office now, don’t we Jim? I’ll guarantee they won’t demand the Russians get rid of their weapons of mass destruction and they won’t talk all that bullsh*t about preemptive strikes. The Russians will stick a nuke up our sanctimonious a* if we do!
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this
Findog, I hope you’re not Finnish, because Finland may be next on Moscow’s list.
As to Texas, the settlers there — Mexicanos, Tejanos, indigenous Indios and old Colonial Spaniards — found themselves utterly unrepresented in a Capital so far away and so imcompetently administered that in effect the new Territory of Texas existed only on paper, as a taxable entity. When an effective dictatorship over Mexico was declared by Santa Ana’s fiat in 1836 several of the territories, declared independence. That being rejected, the Texans declared a revotionary war, expressly intended to seize Mexico City, restore the Constitution and democratize the nation. That Texas-led Mexican Revolution did not come to full fruition because the other territories did not succeed in defeating federal forces; only Texas did.
What any of this has to do with Russia’s invasion of the soverein, democratic Republic of Georgia escapes me.
By dirty harry
August 11, 2008 5:15 PM | Link to this
There happens to be an oil pipeline that runs through Georgia…Is this of any consequence? YEAH!
If “Putty Poot” (AKA Putin) and, Bush who gave Putin that stupid nickname are such great buds…Why doesn’t Bush make a call and say knock the sh!!t off “Putty Poot!”
By catlady
August 11, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this
Sounds like more of the “let’s you (U.S. soldiers) and him fight”.
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this
Ah.. to reason with lilytoad the anti-war protestor.
If you really think that war is just an allowance for men to rape women, why are you against fighting those who would do such things?
Do you want NO ACTION against aggressors even when they come knocking down YOUR door? Will you fight them THEN?
Right now in Darfur, women are being raped everytime they leave the compound hunting for firewood and food. No one is fighting for them. Injustice reigns without hinderance.
But, there is no war in Darfur. Can you really say that there is never a reason for war, lilytoad?
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 5:22 PM | Link to this
Paul,
I appreciate your asking, but I did mean to say that Syria has become so dependent on Iran — especialy financially, and also due to the threat from Hamas and even Hezbollah — that it is unable to make any moves that might provoke Tehran.
By Dusty
August 11, 2008 5:22 PM | Link to this
dirty hairy 5:15
Where have you been? Bush told Putin in person at the Olympics just about what you said but in nicer language.
Try to keep up.
By @@
August 11, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this
An interesting turn of events. While I deplore what Putin has done to Georgia, he may have brought about that which he did not want.
According to Stratfor sources, Tusk and Kaczynski are cleaning house of anyone who stood in the way of an immediate BMD deal with the United States and are entering into fast negotiations with Washington.
But events in Georgia have just upped the ante in Eastern Europe. One option Washington has is reinforcing those forces — and moving them eastward. Poland and Romania are the most logical choices for three reasons:
First, their governments have already shown that they are loyal to Washington.
Second, Romania already hosts a U.S. logistical “lilypad” base, and Poland could soon agree to host a BMD installation. Both could be expanded in scope quickly (the Polish BMD site was already likely to be brimming with advanced air defenses in addition to its 10 interceptors).
Finally, Poland and Romania — the former on the northern plain of Europe and the latter on the cusp of the Central European mountain chain before reaching the heart of Europe — are two geographic key points that would create a new form of containment of Russia.
While Russia was concerned with Washington’s BMD plans in Europe, it is just the tip of the iceberg of what the United States can do — and now it seems that Washington has been properly motivated to do more.
I wonder what Putin’s henchman Chuck Schumer will have to say.
By @@
August 11, 2008 5:33 PM | Link to this
Dang! I made dohs big dots.
How did I do dat?
By dirty harry
August 11, 2008 5:34 PM | Link to this
By Dusty
Ole “BLOOD and GUTS Dusty…
Do you not understand that the war in Iraq has basically depleted our armed forces…
Where do you go to get the manpower needed to fight on other fronts?
You don’t!
There is nothing left!
Our armed forces are now doing at least 3 tours in hostile environments!
They are tired, and I am personally tired of your NONSENSE!
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 5:37 PM | Link to this
Very cool intel, @@, thanks.
Meet you at the safe house on Mustique.
Getalife,
you really are playing on the wrong field when it comes to geopolitics and military affairs. Maybe you could try to do what most young liberals do when times get dicey: try to think up some lame, self-contradictory and irrational moral equivalency with something you feel drags your United States down to the same level.
Just a suggestion.
By Poste Haste
August 11, 2008 5:52 PM | Link to this
Russia attacks Georgia? What happened? Did Japan bomb Moscow? Did Litchenstein blow up the Kremlin?
That makes as much sense as attacking Iraq after 911. I really dont see why Wooten doesn’t get it? He seems to follow the Iraq/911 logic real good.
Hey Wooten, did Osama’s chaffeur drive the get away car after they looted and burned the trade towers? BWAA HAA
Wooten must wear little tin hats that tell him all about how rocket tubes can enrich uranium, bwa, and how Saddam Hussein flew all four jets on 911 and how saddam met with Osama in casablanca at Rick’s cafe.
BWAAAAA! Wooten needs some paper clips to attach to his little tin hat. Then Wooten will know how it was GOOD to let Osama get away in Afghanistan. Secret stuff for secret boys. Shhhhhh!
Obama 08: No little tin hats, just an iron resolve to change america and to get Osama for 911. America takes over in the war on terror.
By V-Dog 85
August 11, 2008 5:54 PM | Link to this
dirty harry,
The 30-day war in Iraq and the subsequent occupation there have “depleted out military resources”? Really.
That’s a bit of a put-down of the U.S.N., don’t you think? Those folk have been chomping at the bit for years, and they pack more mobile firepower than anything ever seen. Georgia is, after all, on the Black Sea…
Besides, we could bust up Soviet tanks and ground forces in Georgia using stealth drones without even leaving the comfort of air-conditioned suburban Las Vegas.
By AJC/DNC Management
August 11, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this
By Lily Toad August 11, 2008 4:23 PM The USA attacked a sovereign nation and is killing civilians. That is wrong.
Are you saying the United States intentionally targeted civilians in Iraq?
By Marcia Smith
August 12, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
If you are a journalist, you shouldn’t be endorsing any candidate. If you are a columist, I simply disagree with you.