Thinking Right

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this

Good morning all. While I am with Jim on 99% of the facts above and 100% of the sentiment above, I would respectfully note that the price controls on gasoline persisted until the Reagan administration.

Our leftist friends often lament the absence of alternative fuels, and affirm that the government should be subsidizing production of those efforts – corporate welfare for a particular group of innovative, if inefficient, producers. Truckers now demand that government cap the price of oil. Both views are wrong-headed.

Higher market prices for oil make alternatives economically viable. Until new sources are economic, any subsidy is wasteful. We note that only “special friends” of legislators get government subsidies, e.g., those who produce ethanol from corn.

The economics of oil price caps are just as certain as the economics of the minimum wage floors. Last year the leftists demanded an increase in the legislated minimum wage floor. On the assumption that the legislated minimum is above the market – otherwise such legislation is inconsequential - we noted the simple economic truth that such a floor would increase unemployment in two ways, (1) direct layoffs of those employees whose marginal value was less than the new higher wage, and (2) indirect failure to increase employment as business will forego opportunities now rendered uneconomic by legislative fiat. Just by coincidence we now see increasing unemployment after 50+ months of job creation. Leftists are aghast, but I suppose they are comforted by the knowledge that only the poorest, most vulnerable workers in our society were harmed by such legislation.

In the case of legislated price ceilings, the market will produce only so much oil as is economic. Assuming that the price ceiling is below market – otherwise the legislation would be meaningless – the demand for the price-limited product will be higher than would be the case in a free market. (People will buy more milk at $1 per gallon than they will at the market price of $4 per gallon. Fuel is no more essential than food.) The reasonably-anticipated result of price-limited fuel is local shortage, just as we saw in 1978 in the Carter administration.

Economic Truth #1: Producers will sell their wares anywhere a higher price is offered. If anyone doubts that economic truth, cogitate through the effect if State of Georgia passed a law limiting the sales price of diesel fuel to $1 per gallon. How much diesel would producers deliver to Georgia? The same economic principle is applicable worldwide; unless we wish for the producers to ship all of their production to China and India, we will wish to pay the market price. Poor Jimmy got the blame for something he did not do – fix oil prices – but deserved the blame for something he did not do – remove price limits when the world price soared above the legislated limit. Old timers will recall the leftist howls of outrage and predictions of soaring gas prices when President Reagan determined to remove the limits. And indeed gasoline prices soared for six months. When producers saw the higher prices available in the US market, they rushed into higher, previously uneconomic, fields and churned out more oil. The over-supply led to a significant world-wide price decline.

Economic Truth #2: Markets work, legislators don’t. Anti-economic legislation is always doomed to failure, due to unforeseen consequences. The collapse of the Soviet Union was not due to military weakness, or lack of rigid internal social control – it was a simple economics failure. The lack of a responsive supply side caused the economy to grind to a halt.

Economic Truth #3: Governments make more money on fuel taxes than oil companies make on oil. If the legislators wish to make an economic change that would benefit truckers, they could repeal all taxes on fuel. Urge the states to follow suit. No conservative will object to abolition of an excise tax.

By drey

April 10, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

Nobody’s going 2 wade through that much tripe, jbm. I looked at the sheer volume of it, and gave up, like everyone else will.

Blogging 101: write your opinion. Delete. do a second draft. Delete. Do a third draft, delete.

Then go stick your head in the toilet. Flush.

25 words or less, jbm or stfu. How much time do you think readers have? Your mother must have really indulged you as a child. “Look, jbm, I used a magnet and stuck your composition on the refrigerator.”

“But mom, I wrote it on toilet paper and it extends out into the hallway, that’s just what stuck to my shoe, I didn’t write anything.”

“I’m so proud of you.”

Ew.

By Stan

April 10, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

Wow jbmlaw, I couldn’t have said it better, or longer myself :) OF course I could pretty much give you proxy of my comments as I don’t believe I seen a comment from you that I disagree with.

If the truckers think there should be price controls on gas/diesel, then there should be. Of course there would also have to be price controls on shipping costs, food costs, clothing, office supplies, light bulbs and everything else.

Stan

By Aquagirl

April 10, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this

By all means, let the free market set fuel prices. Quit subsidizing oil companies. If you don’t, then stop squawking about “leftists” who want to extend subsidies to other producers of ethanol, solar energy, etc.

jbmlaw, why should fuel be exempt from taxes? And why is it that fake conservatives never object when their favored industries are given handouts? You want to repeal excise taxes, repeal them for everyone. Otherwise it’s simply government providing an advantage to one private business over another.

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this

Dear PoFo @ 9:39, maybe that explains why the bumper sticker company fired me.

Dear Stan @ 9:39, thanks. You know I didn’t even fire my second barrel, on ANWR and production generally. Maybe if I have another 12 cups of coffee I write that one too.

By drey

April 10, 2008 9:48 AM | Link to this

Oil prices are rising and will continue to rise because of increased global demand, and a aggravating factor or uncertainty caused solely by the Iraq War.

Cut Taxes? On Gas? Campaign spin.

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this

Dear Aquagirl @ 9:41, you raise good questions. We discussed the fake conservatives, who merely wish to aggregate power, last week; they are indistinguishable from leftists. True conservatives do not wish to control others, and thus lack the incentive to climb the steps to political power.

As to exempting fuel from taxes, that principle applies to every product with an excise tax – tires, cigarettes, alcohol, cell phone service. Any tax operates as a disincentive for use, in that it makes the price higher. Broad taxes cause less economic dislocation, as they do not reflect legislative efforts to promote friends and punish enemies.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

Aquagirl @ 9:41 - Mostly because The Esquire doesn’t believe that what’s sauce for the goose should also be sauce for the gander.

Tax breaks for oil companies? GOOD

Tax breaks for alternative energy companies? BAD

Etc., etc., etc. He’s the classic example of the Paleocon “Help only the rich, and screw everyone else” attitude.

By Dennis

April 10, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

By jbmlaw April 10, 2008 9:25 AM (1) direct layoffs of those employees whose marginal value was less than the new higher wage….”

This is the ususal neocon arguement, that everyone who is not making top dollar must be of “maraginal value”; which is an ignorant way of looking at the bigger picture.

No one who is at the top remains there unless someone of “marginal value” is doing the grut work.

That includes you as well as me.

As far as price controls the oil companies are gouging the public and you and I, and Jim Wooten, know it.

Seems I read a few weeks ago where the natural gas companies, who had been selling gas to some for more than to others, settled with the Georgia Public Utilities Commission (while admitting no wrong doing) in order not to have the Commission peek into their profits books.

That and more is what the public will get if there are no controls. Only those with a lot of money will be able to afford water, heating oil, natural gas and electricity.

And I have a hunch that you would be in the same boat as I would be in - can’t afford it.

(And just as an after thought, the “no regulation” that you and Wooten preach is exactly what got us into this home mortgage mess).

You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.

By drey

April 10, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

Good one, jbm! Your mother must be proud of your inimitable sense of humor and she must also never have known analytical depth about any issue like that was possible.

In 1970, they had gas station wars. I bought a gallon for 8 cents, (50 cents in today’s money).

However, the average price for gas was as high as 35 cents, or 40 cents sometimes, so today that would be 2.40. about.

SO gas has risen by 50% in forty years. That’s hardly going to sink us. However, now that gas prices have broken out above the 10K year moving average, we can expect to see 1000 dollars a thimble-full by 2010, when we have the national census, which is actually a menu, as ted turner warned us.

Expect it.

By BadOleBoys

April 10, 2008 10:05 AM | Link to this

As my daughter would probably say on the topic, “blah, blah, blah”. That’s probably the best attitude to take. Let’s look at the economic facts:

Economic Fact #1: If you are not pumping your own oil, then you must get it elsewhere if you want it bad enough — no matter the price,

Economic Fact #2: If you want gasoline, then it must be refined from something and that’s going to cost someone,

Economic Fact #3: All people and businesses are not affected equally by changes in oil prices, gas prices, etc.,

Economic Fact #4: We all have options. Some of those options may or may not be economically desirable,

Economic Fact #5: The collective efforts of the consumer have the greatest potential influence on the price and availability of any commodity including gasoline,

Economic Fact #6: If I drive a 25mpg vehicle 10k miles per year and the taxes on that fuel is reduced by 20 cents per gallon, I will save $80 per year. For the same scenario except for no change in tax and a drop in fuel price from $3.30 to $2.00 per gallon, I would save $520. Heck, that’s less than the average Fed stimulus for a family. If say 3 million people driving 10k miles per year in 25 mpg vehicles were no longer paying 20 cents per gallon in tax, then the gov’t would be out $240 million that year. That would be 2.4 billion dollars for 30 million such drivers. The Fed spends how much per day in Iraq? How much was spent to bail out Bear Stearns? How much was Exxon’s revenues last quarter? How much pay did the Fortune 500’s CEO’s get last year? How much will be spent on the presidential election?

Let’s start looking at things from different perspectives, shall we?

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this

Off topic, but the “faithful” here should read Mike King’s article in todays AJC, which says it all: Laughingstock Legislature.

(That’s it! I’m canceling my subscription!!!)

Let’s just admit the obvious, shall we? The first Republican governor in Georgia since Reconstruction is a misguided embarrassment.

When the state was suffering through the worst days of an epic drought what did our porcine Purdue do? Started a Go Fish campaign! That, and the incredibly stupid Pray for Rain stunt.

And the entirety of his “contributions” during the final weeks of this year’s session was to write an op-ed piece equating Sunday beer sales with prostitution.

How in the name of (your favorite deity here) did we get saddled with this flag-changing boob?

And anybody who voted for that little pr!ck Casey Cagle IMHO needs to have their head examined.

No wonder Dixie has always been, still is and may well be forever, the butt of so many factual jokes throughout the rest of America.

When will these non-conservative reactionaries in the Moron Belt realize that electing incapable, tea-totaling, bush league (get it?!!!) nut jobs is NOT in the best interests of the people?

At the state or federal level.

Pray for regime change…

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

Dear GGG @ 9:53, do you intentionally write like a 13 year old, or is that natural for you?

Dear Dennis @ 10:02, “As far as price controls the oil companies are gouging the public and you and I, and Jim Wooten, know it.” Since the government makes more on taxes on each gallon than the oil companies, would you agree that the government is gouging the public?

By Aquagirl

April 10, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

jbm@9:50, if an industry is based on government subsidies, an excise tax can be considered an attempt to recover such subsidies, as opposed to a “sin tax.” Gasoline prices are like healthcare costs…totally unrelated to the free market. It’s difficult to argue either for or against the validity of an excise tax.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

Esquire - I realize that in your world the sky is a bright purple Madras plaid and that unicorns poop rainbows, but in the Real World where the rest of us live, your perspective is as clear as the finest lead srystal.

By Craig

April 10, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

Well said, Amvet. And Republicans are supposed to be clear headed problem solvers.

Wasn’t it just a couple months ago that someone floated the idea of our idiot gov as VP?

What a sad joke God is playing on us, to saddle us with these morons.

By Dan

April 10, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this

Economic Fact # 4,361 You can’t tax companies, period. They simply pass it along to the consumer. You raise corporate taxes the cost of goods goes up. But politicians thrive on an ignorant population that thinks taxing corps is helping the “working man”

By bill

April 10, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

jbm, When the min-wage goes up so do union salaries that get their yearly increases plus any change to the min-wage oil is not a free market. GWB or Iran rattles a saber and the petrol futures skyrocket. And then there is the strategic reserve, where we had to pump it full at top dollar at the beginning of this CINC’s tenure. Strategically, wouldn’t taking a little out to flatten the steep price help stimulate other sectors of the economy by not robbing everyone to pay Dick?

By ron

April 10, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

I believe that the traditional market reasons for the rise and fall of the price of crude are being amplified by other factors such as unsteady demand,panic,greed,whim,uncertainty for the future,as well as traditional supply and demand.

One thing for sure:the good times are all gone.I hope you enjoyed them like I did.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

AmVet - I suspect the only other legislative-style grouop King could have used for his comparisons would have been the Cobb County Commission of the 1990’s.

Oh, wait - they, too, were controlled by the Republicans. Well, at least there’s consistency in the wingnuttiness therein…

By Tray

April 10, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this

Economic Fact# 457- If car A leaves Atlanta on I-20 westbound at 55mph, and car B leaves Atlanta on I-20 at 65mph, which one will burn all their gas first?

Doesn’t matter, they are now out of GA and our dumb gov’s reach!!

Oh, by the way, the gov’t could never regulate gas prices, but if they wanted to reduce the price for a while, they can bring all the troops and equipment home from Iraq…lowring demand = more supply for the people who really need it-Americans in America. Take that for economic fact!

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 10:49 AM | Link to this

If I were in a position to do so, I would implore the staff of Sen. McCain to NOT consider a neo-con running mate.

The third rate amateur Condi or the praying pontificater Sonny or any of these other failed phony conservatives would spell political suicide for McCain as he would almost assuredly lose a huge percentage of the moderates, independents, disillusioned Dems and disgusted Republicans who will otherwise vote for him.

That the faithful “family values” “base” would then jump on the RINO’s band wagon would not begin to offset the enormous losses.

I hope the McCain campaign realizes they can succeed by continuing to pay lip service to the dwindling lunatic fringe in the GOP.

Notwithstanding the amazingly ludicrous rhetoric from Mann Coulter and Rush Limberger, based on what I read here, I think McCain can easily dupe many of these ever-gullible “conservatives” into voting for him as opposed to the mulatto or that woman…

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this

If the environmental whack jobs would quit complaining about newts and ducks we could drill in Alaska and Florida. Alternative fuels WILL NEVER WORK. If they did then we’d have something by now. Buy smaller cars and get rid of your Hummers and Yukons. Also, blame ALL politicians for the gas tax they’ve put on gasoline.

By Jim Jones

April 10, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this

At three dollars plus a gallon governments do not make more off gas than the oil companies. The oil companies cost of exploration, production and distribution have risen over the years, but not near the rate of the price they have charged for their product. True it’s a market driven product, but our government gave this industry the biggest subsidy ever given to any industry with the oil depletion allowance. I know only a few old timers will remember that!! I’m absolutely against any government involvement in the free market. I’m also against having my pocket picked by people who have reached their position of dominance in my economic life because of public tax dollars. I wish I had an answer; I’m sure a good one is out there. Unfortunately I don’t think the oil barons will ever allow it to see the light of day.

By BadOleBoys

April 10, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this

Dan,

Those facts just keep piling up, don’t they. I must disagree with you on your statements though. First, the government can tax anyone or anything — heck, it taxes dead people. Second, taxes are not typically considered as a part of the cost of a product however it may be treated as a part of the cost of doing business — like bribes in some countries. That cost does indeed get passed on to someone just not always the end user of said product. Fairness in taxation is a whole ‘nother topic though. Some people here have touched on it from time to time and Republicans, Democrats, Libertarians, leftists, right-wingers, etc., and even possibly jbmlaw, all seem to touch on the topic from time to time. For example, here in Georgia we typically pay fees to the government such that the person receiving the immediate benefit is actually shouldering more of the cost than all the other taxpayers. At least, that’s how tag fees, hunting licenses, gas taxes, etc., are supposed to work — to help pay for the road wear, bridges, park rangers, blah, blah blah. The same thing actually applies (or, should apply) to corporations as well — it’s just not always as obvious.

By Dennis

April 10, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

By jbmlaw April 10, 2008 10:09 AM “Dear Dennis @ 10:02, “As far as price controls the oil companies are gouging the public and you and I, and Jim Wooten, know it.” Since the government makes more on taxes on each gallon than the oil companies, would you agree that the government is gouging the public?

No doubt, Counselor, you have the figures to back up your statement, or are you just hopefully trying to impress (bamboozle) the jury?

The government isn’t in the profit making business, although I will admit government unfairly gouges the public in favor of “big bidness”.

As to the facuality of your statement that the government makes more from oil than the oil companies, the government wouldn’t need your taxes and mine - we’d just spent the tax money we get from the oil companies.

You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 11:03 AM | Link to this

AmVet, Your liberal rhetoric is hilarious. Can you actually read? You’re bashing conservatives instead of commenting on gas prices. Take your crap and go blog on Huffingtonpissed. Rush Limbaugh is a hell of lot smarter than you’ll ever be. At least he’s relevant. I don’t care if you served in the military or not. You sound like John Kerry with all the garbage you throw around.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this

AmVet - I don’t see any “duping” needed. The xenophobic conservatives in these environs - whether they label themselves as economic cons, or “family-values” cons, or paleocons - would never vote for one of Those People anyway, regardless if That Person was melanin-enhanced or pen!s-impaired.

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

Dear bill @ 10:42, I have a conceptual problem tapping the strategic reserve. The oil market changes daily. Tapping the strategic reserve is a political gambit by an overlord, guessing that he can fool the market into lowering prices by adding short-term supply. Rather like throwing a bucket of water in the ocean. I don’t think anyone is fooled, but if it makes you think you are doing something about the problem, have at it.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

The Twoof @ 11:03 - Rush Limbaugh is the radio equivalent of “Goofus” from the old “Highlights” magazine. His only “relevance” is as an example of how not to handle situations.

By getalife

April 10, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

Here are the war criminals

Where are the demands for their resignations and trials?

By George Washington

April 10, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this

The day the guv imposes price controls on gasoline is the day the count down to no more oil starts…..China has increased its oil imports by 16.1% this year over last year….The refineries are not going to pay 112 dollars for a barrel of oil that yields only 20 gallons of gasoline that sells wholesale for 3 bucks under price controls….The rest of the barrel of oil will not make up the cost difference…So that barrel of oil will not be imported by America, but it will be imported by China, India, Japan, and Europe….Don’t you people get it yet? The days when America could use the printing press to solve its problems are over, now we have to live by the rules that the rest of the world has lived by for lo these last 50 odd years….The Gulf States are very close to dropping the dollar peg, after which they will shortly stop selling oil priced in dollars…Euro’s are the next currency that comes close to being a world currency…of course there is the old standby of Gold and Silver…Price controls in dollars will fail because we cannot control the price of imported oil, just of domestic production and refining…Not only that, but we import a significant percentage of our refined gasoline from Europe, and Europe in turn imports the surplus diesel and home heating oil that we do not need….Price controls in America would destroy that useful trade of diesel for gasoline…

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this

GayQueerGoose, I love how libs, such as yourself, trash people like Rush and Reagan yet you defend monsters like Castro, Che and Bin Laden. It’s only a matter of time before Obama and Hillary get us all nuked.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 11:36 AM | Link to this

The Lies,

If reading what you don’t want to hear bothers you so much, as it obviously does, do yourself and your blood pressure a favor and turn up the Limberger to a deafening volume and move on. (.org!!)

And as for drilling in ANWR, it reminds me of the “surge” crowd.

In spite of overwhelming evidence that it will not fundamentally change a thing, it sounds good. Especially in lieu of cogent alternatives.

Like nuclear.

And as for the legitimate concerns regarding the dangers, look at France’s track record of no problems yet providing 80% of their energy needs.

80%!!!

Still, to ensure it is as safe as it can be I suggest building the plants very near 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and in decidedly “conservative” environs…

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 11:39 AM | Link to this

The Twoof @ 11:32 - I’d love to see you provide URLs where I did any such thing. Of course, you can provide none since you’re as unfamiliar with “The Truth” as is your hero, Fearless Leader.

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

AmVet, At what point in your miserable life did you decide to sell your country out? I am from a military family and no military vet I’ve ever met speaks liberal rhetoric like you. Did moveon or code pink pay you? As for France, I know some Frenchmen who would gladly argue your case for French energy. They would gladly trade their “energy” for our health care. Also curious to know if you voluntarily served in the military or if you were drafted? You sound like a deserter.

By Khan

April 10, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

Tray, you had a great start to a great bit and then bailed. Look, I want to be entertained and informed just like the next troll, too, so why bail, or do you expect me to pick up the bit and carry it to it’s hilarious yet informative conclusion?

Go ahead. Make my day. :>}

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this

AmVet @ 11:36 - Actually, The Twoof is providing a Useful Purpose today. He’s demonstrating why the US so incredibly desperately needs Universal Healthcare - so schizophrenics like him will be taken off the streets and put in hospitals where they will get the care they need.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this

“truth”, are you English?

You definitely remind me of that infamous xenophobe, the twisted Brit.

Perhaps, like {{{{Andy}}}} you have returned from a temporary banishment?

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this

GayTroglodyte, You have not denied that you like Castro. Every lib I’ve ever talked to loves the idea of communism. You hate religion and therefore need communism to replace religion. You’re all the same and easy call out. If Rush Limbaugh was a liar he’d have little to no listeners. Your fantasy world of Obama the great is going to come crashing down. Have fun blaming that on conservatives.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 11:58 AM | Link to this

The Twoof - along the same lines…you’ve never denied that you aren’t really Monica Lewinsky, thus priving that you love providng “service” to Clintons, most especially Bill.

(Tee-hee! Yanking the chains of Psychotic Paleocons is fun!)

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this

The Lies, how unusual that YOU personally never served. [SARC!]

Moral turpitude issues?

A “checkered” past?

Cheney-esque “Priorities other than military service?”

And like your favorite service-avoiding hero, Bill Clinton, you want us to believe that you too never inhaled?

Just another garden-variety misanthrophic, “conservative”, chest-pounding chickenhawk.

You cannot possibly win this one, son.

Give up, while your behind…

By swolf4810

April 10, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this

No, price limits on gas probably won’t work. BUT what just MIGHT work is some SERIOUS wind-fall profits taxes on big oil. If they won’t reinvest in more refining capacity, let’em pay off the nationl debt.

By Dave

April 10, 2008 12:05 PM | Link to this

All I know is everything the Republicans told us to do over the last 8 years have resulted in historically the highest gas prices in our history time for a change.

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 12:08 PM | Link to this

AmVet, Thanks for answering my question. You are indeed a deserter. And no, I’m a full blooded American. Actually, it should be people like you who should be banished. Countries like Cuba, North Korea and Iran would love to have you. You could go with an envoy with Jimmy Carter to bash our troops and America. He’s going to “talk” with Hammas today. I hear you can get cheap airfare on Airtran. By all means, GO!

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this

AmVet, How do you know I’ve never served? I could be in Baghdad right now for all you know. I can win this and already have by calling you out for what you really are! A TRAITOR!

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - you really need to get your head out of Bill Clinton’s lap. Your brain needs all the oxygen it can get.

By Peer Pressure

April 10, 2008 12:22 PM | Link to this

Okay, I’ll write the bit. Car A goes 55 mph, which is the f’n speed limit, and Car B goes 75 and tailgates Car A. Both leave the train station at the same time. Car B has a radar detector and sees a speed trap dead ahead. How does Car A not get pulled over by the cop if Car B pretends to speed in the oncoming lane and then blames it on Car A? (this happened once to me).

Okay, the answer is, that the cop pulls over the wrong car and the speeder gets clean away laughing.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this

And no, I’m a full blooded American.

Who never served and never will.

Obviously from your sophomoric writings and idiotic, laughable pretenses of being in country you are still very young.

The United States Army is accepting enlistees up until the age of 42.

You could use some discipline. A lot of it.

And more importantly learn how to live a life of honor, courage, sacrifice and country before self.

Concepts you clearly have nary an inkling of.

Though I’m reasonably sure that even if they waived the usual requirements and you could get in, some mean cowboy, maybe even a gay one, would kick your a$$ up and down the street with a filthy hateful mouth like that.

By W

April 10, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this

My loyal believers,

It has come to my attention that you do not believe the truth. Well let me tell you, the truth. The fact is you cannot handle truth, truthfully. The truth has been a lie, a lie about truth. If you call truth, the truth will respond but it’s a lie, truthfully.

Thank You, Your Leader, W

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this

GayGeek, Kind of funny that you are telling me to get my head out of slick willies lap. Seems like you’re the one giving head.

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this

AmVet, Did I strike a nerve? I called you out for what you are and I’m filthy? Ladies and gentlemen, that is how you should all handle liberals. Call them out for what they are and they explode.

By Peer Pressure

April 10, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

Amvet is there any role a 57 year old can play in the army? Do they need cooks or shoe shine boys? Latrine orderlies? I dont care, I want to join the troops in Iraq so bad I can taste it.

Maybe it’s guilt because in 1969 my lottery draft # was 283. Funny how I remember it exactly. I thought I had fooled the system. But when my girlfriend broke up with me a month after that, I wrote my dad, who was already in nam, that I wanted to join the army and join him. He wrote back and forbade me, saying that one fighter in the family is enough and stay home and take care of my mother.

Well, amvet? Do they need fat aging baby boomers in Iraq?

By WW5

April 10, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this

if georgia has the ability to eliminate property type taxes, why not eliminate the gas tax and do with less like the public that pays for the crooks woking under the gold dome

By ron

April 10, 2008 12:43 PM | Link to this

By The Truth,I fail to believe that Rush Limbaugh is a people.I’ve listened to him and I have to tell you this:people I know don’t talk like that.Also,ever notice that the persons that call to talk to him all sound alike ?Phil Hendry?

By George Washington

April 10, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this

AmVet, as much as I usually agree with your ideas, nuclear will not solve our energy problems…We do not have a problem generating electricity, it is transportation fuels we have a problem with. Nuclear will not help there…

By Peer Pressure

April 10, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this

Truth, knock it off. You’re arguing about arguing. (like a weetard would)

By BadOleBoys

April 10, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this

A word in response to Jim’s word on third-party presidential candidates. I too have been there, done that, from both angles — you know, vote for the third-party choice because he’s the “better” candidate even though you know he won’t win versus vote for one from the two mainstay parties because you want to make your vote count. I’m going back to voting my conscience because that’s the only shot I truly will ever have at making my vote count. The lesser of two evils is no longer good enough for my vote. The difference between them just isn’t great enough.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - you still haven’t denied being Monica, thus the infamous blue dress was yours and yours alone.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this

Peer Gynt,

I doubt you, or I at this point in my life, could pass the physical!

Though I did read where some cat aged 55 did reenlist (out of the reserves?)!!!

I’m just having fun with the gutless little faketriot twerp who pretends he is in Baghdad! His type drive by here from time to time and in his dementia isn’t aware that there are too many veterans, conservative and liberal, Democrat and Republican, who could see through his obvious bullsh!t from a mile away.

The kid is a disgrace and NO vet would ever take him seriously.

By George Washington

April 10, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this

The Truth is a LIAR by implying that he “COULD” be in Iraq right now: more likely he is in Tele Aviv, sowing hatred of arabs, muslims, and good people in America who oppose the war in Iraq, and the Zionist war of extermination against Arabs and Muslims, via their puppet government in WashingASS, the neocon clowns known as the Bush Administration. Whenever you see the words The Truth mentally substitute LIAR.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this

GW, you cannot imagine how ecstatic I am to have garnered a response from you!

Never in my wildest dreams did I ever hope for such an honor.

I am truly grateful.

I have, and for a long time had, very mixed feelings about nuclear energy. The advantages over petrochemicals are undeniable, as are the risks.

I guess the trump card for me is how in the h&ll are we ever going to get to Star Trek if we can’t successfully manage a few fissionable facilities?

Beam me up, Scotty!

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

AmVet, Never said that I was in Baghdad. Said I COULD be for all you know. John Kerry was also a veteran and from what I’m hearing from you, you guys sound a lot a like. Gutless? How? Is it because I’m commenting just like you? Guess you’re as gutless as I am if that’s the case.

GayQueerGeek, Monica’s dress? I can not stand Bill Clinton you moron! I thought that he would be your king? Or queen in your case? Don’t you have a schlong to swallow right about now?

By George Washington

April 10, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this

Yo The Truth Liar: My country is not the lying traitorous Neocon Scum currently controling the Administrative Branch of the Federal Government. I suggest you go back to Civics class, if you indeed are an American (Americans are required to take a Civic course to graduate from middle school or high school, while foreigners from Tele Aviv are not).

By @@

April 10, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this

I’m not a truck driver Jim, but I saw one deliver groceries. Produce likely to spoil must be rushed.

If what’s waiting in the left wings is any indication, the government can’t do for one without being expected to do for all.

My daughter’s boyfriend, for the time being anyway, is about to graduate. His degree has something to do with Transportation - Supply Chain Logistics. Industry snaps these graduates up in a hurry.

Since his is a lucrative field, no doubt he’ll be viewed with disdain by the left regardless……

From a point of personal responsibility, if you can’t save your money, then save your gas.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - You still don’t deny being Monica, thus you must be her. Which also explains your dislike of Hillary.

By AmVet

April 10, 2008 1:08 PM | Link to this

NO, you’re gutless because you PRETEND to be in the US Armed Forces.

I know you neoliths are big into parsing words, like COULD, and spinning like whirling dervishes, but trust me, keyboard koward, I don’t see anybody here rallying to your defense as some sort of never-served never-will patriot.

Go spend some time in uniform and then come back and bluster all you want like some rough tough leatherneck.

You’ll still be completely FOS but at least people won’t outright laugh at you…

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this

AmVet - Playing with The Twoof is like making a kitten chase the light from a laser pointer. It’s easy, it’s predictable, and it’s endlessly entertaining. I dunno about you, but I’m having a hoot of a time today with him (well, her, since one of The Twoof’s personalities is either Monica Lewinsky or based on her).

By Peer Pressure

April 10, 2008 1:20 PM | Link to this

Dont they need point? I’d volunteer to walk down a street they’re patroling so if there is a sniper, let them shoot at me first. Just give me a vest. I know, they go for face shots, but if you saw my face, a bullet would be an improvement.

Why cant any american go over there and fight? At gettysburg, they let old men pick up their muskets and stand up and fight!

This is simply not fair. I’d gladly get blowed to smithereens to save the real fighting men, the terrorists wont know the diff. I mean, come on. Uncle sam is old.

WHy not 50 somethings in the army?

By @@

April 10, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this

I see AmVet is here riding his “Battled Starship”. His objective?

“Obe-one-can-he-be” skuirmish.

Give it a rest will ‘ya AmVet?

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this

Dear Truth @ various times, welcome to the blog. You will note that there are two separate threads running at any given time, one with reasonably intelligent argument and, when PoFo (man of 1,000 identities) or Glenn are around, with witty exchange going back and forth, frequently featuring people new to the blog. The second thread is populated by a handful of people who never post anything substantial, mostly just fling epithets all day. By now you perhaps have identified a few of them. To the extent you enjoy wallowing with the pigs, please enjoy yourself, but your 10:53 suggested you have a few ideas worthy of presentation and discussion, so please do not ignore us for the sake of fun.

By The

April 10, 2008 1:30 PM | Link to this

truth is that there is a blogger here, using the handle “The Truth”, that cannot even figure out that he (or she or it) is being toyed with. This blogger reminds me very much of curly. They probably are very close to each other — very close — very, very close.

By Glenn

April 10, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this

Hate to shock y’all, but I enjoyed jbm’s introductory post even more than I did Jim’s column. Good one, jbm. And you even got the honorary Bronx cheer from PoFo. (That’s almost as good as Dylan’s Pulitzer.)

I reckon when somebody’s been thinking long and hard about something he’s going to form some opinions about the thing that are worth considering. Governmental price fixing is not my bailiwick. I can come at it only as an historian, and that’s boring.

There is one interesting part I happen to have learned about. It was WWII, when the U.S. experimented with a centrally planned economy, based on demand from DC. J.K. Galbraith presided over price controls, and ultimately, in part, over tax policy. By 1944 the country was on the brink of bankruptcy. The War Against States’ Rights also broke the bank so badly that the U.S. government came one gold shipment away from bankruptcy. That’s why the reversals at Gettysburg/Vicksburg and ultimately Atlanta were so extremely important. But WWII was closer to Sovietization than we’ve ever come, and what emerged was a thoroughly consolidated manufacturing economy with the little players strangled to death by 85% federal taxation. I’ll leave it to others to place those little lessons into present context, should they choose to do so.

I’d go with eliminating the excise taxes—-all of them—-on oil, backfilling the lost revenues from existing, even non-germane, streams only where absolutely necessary. Deal with germaneness through a Presidential finding of exigency, and that would give the government until January to figure out how to jigger the budget so as to sustain whatever vital programs are currently underwritten by gas taxes. Drivers aren’t the only beneficiaries of ground transportation systems. Try selling that misconception in Alaska! No, everyone benefits, fundamentally. And programs of general benefit should be funded straightforwardly from common taxation.

The truckers ought to use their power of the purse to hold down prices. I hear they have a union. Their union ought to look at the price trending for the big oil retailers and tell its ranks to purchase from whichever refiner has been the most fair player in the marketplace. (It doesn’t really matter which company they pick—-as long as it isn’t Citgo; just the favoritism alone will scare the others to the table, as they say in Labor Law.) Then the Teamsters can plan on shopping in unison with whichever refiner sells the lowest-priced gasoline, as well as diesel.

Teamsters are patriotic SOB’s.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this

@@ @ 1:22 - AFEES Is Ready When You Are.

Either step away from the keyboard and take the oath, or give it a rest and admit that you’re the Faketriot you are.

Time for you to put up or shut up, your choice.

By El Bubba

April 10, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this

25 words or less, glenn

jbm what witty? I’m not trying to be funny. If you think it’s funny, great, but I’m just bloggin’ truth, justice and the american way, not the communist manifesto preamble to mein kampg like what glenn blogs.

BTW, jbm, is there a two year statute of limitations for a lawyer’s malfeasance against their clients?

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek, Maybe you and AmVet should suck each other off.

By @@

April 10, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek:

Just to point out how stupid this ongoing debate can be, I’ll sign up Monday.

If a new name shows up here, say…Tuesday, you’ll be speculating that it’s me and that I lied about enlisting. You might be right and you might be wrong.

My Dad served, brother served, husband served, husband’s cousin served, all my uncles served, nephew served.

As PoliFore and AmVet often say….

‘Muff said.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - That’s your job, Monica, as well as to get down to AFEES and Take That Oath.

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this

Dear Bubba @ 1:38, yes, but that is the only area where the trial attorneys stacked the law against the plaintiff. Hard to win.

By @@

April 10, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek:

Forgot one, probably more….

Husband’s second cousin presently serves in Iraq as a marine.

Now…

‘Muff said.

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek, My job is to make fun of commies like you.

By @@

April 10, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this

Stuff your muff, stuntwit.

By George Washington

April 10, 2008 1:58 PM | Link to this

Peer Pressure - The whole point of an ambush is to trap and kill as many of the enemy as possible….So smart ambushers let the point people pass through freely, while they wait for the main body to enter the kill zone, at which point the mines are detonated, then the machine guns open up to the front and to one side. The point group is delt with only after the ambush has been sprung….Old, deaf, half blind people are never put on point…Hyper senses are required, not just vision, but smell, and sound…You would just get in the way….I suggest a razor as a solution to your problem….

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this

@@ @ 1:47 - My apologies, I’d forgotten that in your other guise you’re the DustBuster, just another Faketriot who’d rather be a KeyboardKommando than actually serve their country.

By jbmlaw

April 10, 2008 2:04 PM | Link to this

Dear Glenn @ 1:31, thanks, high praise indeed.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - Awwww, you’re down to “commies”? You’re slipping, Monica. That, or the lack of oxygen is really starting to show…

By @@

April 10, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek:

I’d forgotten that in your other guise you’re the DustBuster

You just reiterated my point.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

Ding-a-ling!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Copy Right

April 10, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this

CHINA says it has uncovered a criminal ring planning to kidnap athletes and others at the Beijing Olympic Games…He said the gang had been acting on orders from a radical Islamic Xinjiang independence group, East Turkestan Islamic Movement.

Hey China, just do like we leftist pacifist libs do here in America: ignore radical Islamic terrorism and pretend it’s not a problem, or at best, a bumper sticker political issue scaremongering people into submission into controlling the internet and violation of their civil rights (oh wait, you do that, we don’t). You’ve got nothing to fear but the ignorance of pacifism.

Then, if you do get attacked, you can just blame Bush!

By The Truth

April 10, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this

GayGreyGeek, You’re really hung up on Monica. Too bad that you’re gay or you two could have hooked up.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 2:27 PM | Link to this

@Dusty@ - I have to give you credit where credit is due - you’re certainly consistent in your Faketriotism.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this

The Twoof - You’re Monica dear, since you’ve never denied being her.

Actually, since you’ve never denied being Hillary, I guess you’re her, instead.

Ta-ta!

By CJ

April 10, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this

Back to the topic: Yes, put a cap on gas prices! When it costs me $60 to fill up my tank (V6 with good MPG), I can only imagine how hard that burden is for people who must do it several times a week due to their work or trade. The fact that big oil raises the price just because it’s summer time is BS! They don’t any more change the ingredients in gasoline than I do. The fact that big oil makes such huge profits cannot be considered a success… it’s a failure to keep them in check and to instead bend over and take it. We need alternative fuels so that big oil finally has some competition!

By Glenn

April 10, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

El Senor Bubbilon @ 1:38,

Right on cue. Infallible.

By deegee

April 10, 2008 2:48 PM | Link to this

“The U.S. does not control the global economy. It can’t fix prices on oil.”

That may be the case but the U.S. can control its monetary policy. While the Fed continues its rate cuts making it easier for banks to re-capitalize after getting themselves into the fix they are in, the value of the dollar keeps declining. As the dollar buys less, the oil producing countries will continue to raise the price of a barrel in order to compensate for what they are losing in the value of their dollars. Lets give thanks to our Harvard MBA grad residing in the White House for the wonderful way in which he turned his back on the economy.

By GayGreyGeek

April 10, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this

deegee @ 2:48 - Isn’t the the great irony of Shrub’s administration - that he’s made sure he and his cronies have millions if not billions of what are now worthless dollars?

By BadOleBoys

April 10, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this

As much as people are moaning and groaning, gas prices are not to a level where the masses will look seriously for alternatives. Ten dollars per gallon will do the trick. People will change then. They’ll carpool. They’ll instruct elected officials where to locate the bus routes. They’ll pay their taxes and insist on having that train up and running all over the state, seven days a week. Really. They will. Try it. Call up your elected official and tell him or her to do whatever it takes to get fuel prices to ten dollars per gallon NOW. If my predictions are proven wrong, I’ll shine everyone’s shoes free for one year — transportation not included.

By Glenn

April 10, 2008 3:07 PM | Link to this

@@,

Lemme aks U som’n. You referred me to the Clayton blog and now I’m discouraged. I’ve followed the Clayton one and also the “Get Schooled” one, which on any given day is the single worst—-and I really mean psychopathological—-discussion of education I’ve ever seen. (And I used to work for AFT!) Our approach—-mine and my partner’s—-to restructuring is not going to make sense to anyone on those blogs if measured out in bloggers’ spoonfuls. I’m quite willing to present it to anyone anywhere pro bono, but the AJC blogs are just too inhospitable to sustain fresh thinking following a clean break from the cognicidal banalities that pass for educational discourse on these sites. Is there a group of Clayton folks (esp. educators) who are open-minded?

By chipper

April 10, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this

Let’s put a few myths to rest about gas prices.

First, oil is traded on the international market. “Big oil” cannot control that price. Global supply and demand set it.

Second, “big oil” raises gas prices in the summer because of higher demand. Higher demand and tighter supply = higher prices. Put a cap on gas prices and watch the pumps go dry, you stunningly brilliant people out there.

Third, the summer months require an increase of different additives in formulations for certain regions around the nation. Ever wonder why smog is so bad in the summer time and not in the winter? Summertime decreases the density of the air which causes more pollutants to be trapped; hence, certain additives for summer months are needed to inhibit that. This slows down production which further causes a tightening of supply.

Anyone who can understand basic economics and science can understand the above pointers; that obviously excludes the folks who would rather mindlessly listen to a babbling politician or clueless bobblehead reporter whine about “Big Oil” and gas prices than actually research facts for themselves. But hey, that’s what Democrats need politicians and the media for, right?

By jm

April 10, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this

I wonder which presidential candidate (or any politician for that matter) will be the first the tell the voters that cheap gas is not an american birthright. It would be interesting to watch the impact on their poll numbers.

By @@

April 10, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

Glenn:

I don’t think you’re gonna find the solution through any educational group here in Clayton County. I’ll make some contacts though, and see if I can point you in a direction.

Our teachers are divided into political team players. School administrators are similarly divided - some even with their in-house staff. Even the populace is divided thanks to political influence.

Have you considered approaching the Chamber of Commerce? They may be able to point you in the right direction if not work with you directly. They’re motivated to get Clayton County back to normal - it benefits their bottom line. Quite a few realtors (maybe Association of?) have become involved. They could also be an option.

Visiting “Clayton Talk” has a tendency to get me down, that’s why I only visit on rare occasions. Check out the mood and move on if it’s steeped in negativity and infighting.

Don’t need that.

By Glenn

April 10, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this

Thanks, @@. Chamber’s a good idea. Have worked well with state chambers, but never with local chapters on other than ceremonials. You said that they want to get things back to normal; I’ll check with them directly to make sure that they won’t settle for status quo ante, with at least 40 percent of pupils sold fashionably ~~~~…

I also think I’ll ask to sit down with one or two of the more imposing pastors there.

“Clayton Talk” already has gotten me down. Way down. But it’s better than the “Get Schooled” psychoprattle, which is enough to make one want to tar and feather the next teacher to cross one’s path. Get schooled indeed.

By jm

April 10, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this

off topic but I think most here will find this commentary interesting: The Flickering Light of the News

By Dusty

April 10, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this

WHAT???

I have not posted one word on this blog today and some creep is ANSWERING? Will the lefty lost brain please stop replying to the voices in his head? There now. Be a good boy.

By Bored

April 10, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this

Chipper,

You’re all mulched. If you give me control over a significant portion of the world’s oil fields, then I can CONTROL THE WORLD! HA!