Thinking Right

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 8:52 AM | Link to this

Biometrics. Biometrics.

And good morning y’all.

By RCH

November 15, 2007 9:06 AM | Link to this

If you give drivers licenses to illegals you may as well give pharmacy licenses to drug dealers.

By Curious Observer

November 15, 2007 9:06 AM | Link to this

So, Republican business interests want illegal aliens readily available for jobs that “no American worker will take,” but their main street supporters do not want these aliens to have access to social services, nor do these supporters want them to have drivers’ licenses. Rather, the illegal workers are to get to their jobs by walking, bus, pickup trucks driven by licensed drivers, or illegally driving cars on the highways.

Does anyone else see a disconnect here? Republicans have become collective Saxby Chamblisses—all too eager to help business owners evade minimum wage and other labor laws in order to keep the cost of products and services as low as possible, but unwilling to acknowledge the human needs of the illegal workers being hired. The business owners want to dump the costs of medical care and social services on the taxpayers, while the Republican voters who support these owners want to pretend that the illegals don’t exist, or at least that the illegals are subhuman without legitimate needs.

You can’t have it both ways, Republicans. Either develop a uniform policy that calls for the deportation of all illegals in this country and enforced criminalization of hiring illegal workers, or develop policies that provide for services, including drivers’ licenses, for these workers. Your hypocrisy is showing.

By MELO

November 15, 2007 9:07 AM | Link to this

Giving illegals drivers licenses is a good move.The catch is the states must be able to verify the passports,establish a fingerprints data base and differentiate the licenses from those who are regular,citizens or with proper authorization to be in the USA.Whether states budgets would be able to afford those costs and defray them with revenue coming in is another matter. The advantage for states and the USA is that this ensures that we know who is in the country and where and allows competent people to be on the roads. But with the current ignorant hysteria fuelled by nationalism,rationality will be thrown out of the window.

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 9:09 AM | Link to this

Good morning all. I am reasonably certain I hold the only position that Hillary has not embraced, one of my loopy libertarian attitudes. I would abolish driver’s licenses and insurance “requirements” entirely, and eliminate all civil tort-negligence actions related to vehicles other than first-party claims (i.e., vs. one’s own insurance company.) I am unpersuaded that the driver’s license has any meaningful effect on the quality of driving anywhere. Rather than guaranteeing a market for insurance underwriters, I would allow each to insure or not, at his own risk. If our undocumented brothers need to drive, have at it – they cannot be any worse than the cell-phone and blackberry addicts I see on I-285 daily.

On the substantial question, yes the driver’s license issue is over-rated as a concern among voters. However, the more important question, honesty and integrity and willingness to embrace a position – any position – can hardly be over-rated in a dangerous world. Hillary could have earned my respect by saying, “I don’t know and I don’t care” when the driver’s license issue arose at the last debate, with an appropriate explanation. As I have previously written on this blog, I think a spectre of “electoral fraud” also colored the driver’s license debate in NY.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 9:10 AM | Link to this

Jim, because you’re right, Hillary and Spitzer are right to be wary (though Spitzer’s especially right to have tried), and Obama and your colleague are Amateur Hour. The immigration nerve runs up the spinal column and into the center of the cerebral cortex, where it hitches in just behind the pituitary gland. A campaign season is not the time to attempt surgery with the scalpel of ID cards, which can save the patient but which can also do mortal harm. No surgical theatre on the campaign bus, thank you.

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 9:17 AM | Link to this

Minor correction, now that three hours of coffee has begun to kick in: a contract claim against one’s own insurance company is obviously not a tort-negligence action, but my clumsy grammar tends to suggest equivalence.

By Redneck Convert

November 15, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this

Well, all I got to say is giving the illegals a driver liscense will be the end of my job. Soon as that happens my boss will start hiring a illegal that will take less pay and dump me. In no time I will be mowing the yards of the big houses that the Mexicans will be able to buy and the missus will have to take a job as their maid. Pretty soon jbmlaw and Sister Dusty and Van and all the good conservatives will be complaining about the redneck problem at hospitles and how they are taking up all kind of tax money because they can’t afford no insurance and how they are crowding the schools and using tax money that taxpayers are suppose to get.

Now I know we got to have cheap prices at WalMart and other places but making the Mexicans legal ain’t the way to do it. We need to round them all up and truck them back to Mexico. Like I said before us rednecks got millions of pickup trucks and we could haul them all back to the border in a couple days. For free. Its bad enough I lost my sheetrock job because the boss decided to bring in a bunch of illegals, I don’t want to lose my beer truck job too.

I’m as Republican as anyone in this state but I draw the line at giving the Mexicans driver liscenses and acting like they got any rights. Long as they don’t hurt my job they can take every job in the U.S. of A. and leave everybody else broke. So this is a big deal because it could hurt me. And you know, me is what the Republican Party is all about.

By Dusty

November 15, 2007 9:30 AM | Link to this

Well, Jim Wooten wants us to answer a question about “who is right?”.

I was going to extract an idea from jbmlaw’s post and say, “I don’t know and I don’t care!”.

But that would not be honest since I think that only legal citizens and legal visitors should be in our country.

But..eeeeeyioooo…that makes me agree with Hillary on the driver’s license bit. But I would not vote for her under any circumstance.

So…I will say that driver’s license for illegals, whether right or wrong, is an impotent question in regard to elections.

PS. I disagree with Spitzer’s crowd pleasing evaluation.

By Aquagirl

November 15, 2007 9:40 AM | Link to this

Jim, you’re completely right (no pun intended) on this one. Licenses for illegals is the next big hysteria issue for the brainless GOP leaning black-and-white thinkers. It’s the litmus test of this election, a question that millions of idiots think instantly defines a candidate. This saves them the trouble of actually evaluating candidates or complex policies. Besides, self-righteous indignation feels so good when voting. The Republicans can rely on right-wing mouthpieces to perpetuate this vote-producing cycle. Not that I’d name any cough Jim cough names.

I guess they could only recycle gay marriage and abortion for a limited time.

By T

November 15, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this

Absolutely no way should illegals be given driver’s licenses. Just yesterday both my boss and I, at separate times in different places, almost got into accidents because of hispanic males who could not drive to save their life! When confronted, they each yelled and cussed in spanish. These people can not even speak English. Hello people!! If they can’t understand/speak English, that means they cannot take an English driving test, or READ OUR ROAD SIGNS!!!!

I am an English immigrant who waiting in line 4 years for a green card, to do everything the legal way, and it makes me FURIOUS to see these people jumping the lines and breaking the law.

Mr Redneck, please round up your friends and their pick ups and take these leeches BACK WHERE THEY CAME FROM!!!!

I’m SICK AND TIRED of having to choose english or spanish every time I call somewhere, or use an ATM, or at the checkout in Publix. Last week I went to buy a book in Walmart, and in the ENTIRE section, there was not ONE book in english. We are being overrun and undercut and our government are not only allowing it, but encouraging it with their lax attitudes!!!

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 9:55 AM | Link to this

Special thanks to Jim Wooten for the Spitzer quote, which I had not heard. Orwellian double-speak, in a Monty Python sort of way, paraphrased “Leadership does not mean doing right, it means mindlessly chasing poll numbers.” Comic.

By Dusty

November 15, 2007 10:01 AM | Link to this

Hmmm…ever since RedNeck won the Ugliest Truck Driver Contest he’s got the “big head”. Now he wants to tell us “what the Republican Party is all about”.

I think he ought to team up with Jackie and let them talk about “right-wing mouthpieces” and other trivia. Like Jackie says,”self-rightous indignation feels so good!”

Yep, she and RedNeck make a great “feel good” pair for the liberal team.

By Truthifier

November 15, 2007 10:02 AM | Link to this

I agree with others here that the drivers license issue is just an attempt to stir up another round of useless hysteria. Personally, while I don’t recall much of anything I learned while studying for my drivers license many years ago, it would seem that ensuring that everyone on the road, citizen or illegal alien, has gone through some minimal level of scrutiny to determine if they even know how to drive a car would be a good idea. On the other hand, if I were an illegal, why in the world would I go down to the local DMV and announce that I’m in the country illegally? I say let Governor Spitzer implement his new licence and then sit and wait to see how many people sign up.

I really wish I could use lots of legal terms like our good friend jbmlaw. It sounds so much smarter!

By Dusty

November 15, 2007 10:05 AM | Link to this

AquaGirl, I’m sorry I designated you as Jackie in my previous post. Your “precious jewels” should never be credited to someone else.

By Redneck's wife

November 15, 2007 10:07 AM | Link to this

Dusty, since you ain’t got my man, you don’t know nothin’ ‘bout feel good pairs or big heads. Bless your heart.

By Dusty

November 15, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this

Redneck’s wife????

All I can say is…my condolences, dear madame.

By aurora_27

November 15, 2007 10:19 AM | Link to this

I think issuing drivers licenses to illegal immigrants would be a good thing. Giving them D.L. isn’t going to make the problem any worse…in any case it’ll improve the current illegal immigration issue.

By @@

November 15, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this

Your colleague is wrong Jim and you are RIGHT.

Hillary is trying to dance around this recent “pole”. Stripped of all dignity her fatuous flab is bouncing. We’re all looking on and saying “Eeewwwwwwww”.

2/3 of NYers Oppose Gov’s License Proposals – New & Old

BTW, thanks for the info on Obama’s stance. It’s so much easier when you do the necessary work and I don’t have to.

See…there’s a little “lib” in all of us and I’m no exception.

By Jb

November 15, 2007 10:33 AM | Link to this

Go ahead give them all licenses. When they go to get them, have the USCIS Officers waiting to deport them all. SEND THE LEECHES HOME!!!

By Ed

November 15, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this

Yep, here’s Hillary at her best. She wasn’t prepared for the question so she danced around it as best as she could. She took a little heat and then took a poll. What can I say that will give me the most votes. I really hope she gets the nomination because she has the most baggage and will be a huge target. The best line I’ve seen so far is that if she gets elected they will rename the White House to the Waffle House. By the way what would we call Bill - the First Pimp?

By Aquagirl

November 15, 2007 10:39 AM | Link to this

Dusty @ 10:05, thank you for properly crediting my copywrited phrase. I’ll call my lawyer back and tell him to drop the lawsuit.

However, you have mistaken my claims to any precious jewels on this blog today, I believe they are the property of Redneck’s wife.

By James

November 15, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this

“Corruption”
-Duke Cunningham
-Bob Ney
-Bob DeLay
-Bill Frist
“Corruption Possible”
-Ten Stevens
-Don Young
-Tom Feeney
-John Doolittle
-Rick Renzi
-Gary Miller

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 10:42 AM | Link to this

The 9/11 hijackers were illegal residents who used their driver’s licenses as “breeder documents”, parlaying them into everything form of ID and credit they needed to remain in the country undeterred from preparing the attack.

MELO @ 9:07, you’re spot on.

CO @ 9:06, all true. Democrats also are two-faced about the issue, only their motive is power instead of money. They’re not interested in illegals as cheap workers, but rather as maleable voters. Both parties have swept the problem under the rug since the 1960s. W, of all people, actually has exercised leadership at least insofar as he’s pointed out bluntly and repeatedly that (a) both parties are to blame for letting it go this far, (b) the matter can’t be dodged forever; and (c) 9/11 radically changed the issue.

[Rudy 08]

By Redneck Convert

November 15, 2007 10:45 AM | Link to this

Dang! I finish my 1st 2 deliverys and log in to find a bunch of women fighting over me. Its hard to get took serious when you are a sex god.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this

Ed @ 10:35, nice touch, the Waffle House bit. The unvirtuous Mr. Clinton is not so much a pimp as a w*******. Witness his presidential dealings with China. Pimping is what Ms. Clinton did when she rented her husband to her brother Hugh for the pleasure of Hugh’s visiting conventioneers, his clients. One might also point out that she did a lot of bearding too. Soon it may be Bill’s turn to beard for Hillary.

By RCH

November 15, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this

Glenn@10:42 You hit the nail right on the head.This is a way to slowly justify “illegals” into the mainstream of our society

By Curious Observer

November 15, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this

Sorry to rain on some parades here, but I repeat my assertion made six months ago: if Hillary is the Democratic nominee, the Democrats will lose the presidential race unless the Republicans are insane enough to nominate a nut-job like Mitt Romney. She not only has to confront a 50% disapproval rating and the memories of her husband’s administration, but also the hidden misogyny that runs deep in American male voters. If fully half the polled voters in the United States assert that they would never vote for her under any circumstances, what chance does she have?

It’s time for Democrats to confront reality if they are serious about recapturing the White House.

By ron

November 15, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this

By Evelyn

November 15, 2007 10:59 AM | Link to this

Jim, I think you are right. While I went back and forth between Obama and Edwards, financially contributing to both campaigns, neither will get my vote now. Anyone who supported ” the comprehensive approach to immigration problem” bill(Dem or Repub)will NEVER, EVER, get my vote. Fred Thompson looks better each day that passes.

By Mid-South Philosopher

November 15, 2007 11:04 AM | Link to this

Good morning, Jim

I just dropped by on my way to the “prayer meeting for less rush hour traffic.”

Seriously, I have no problem with politicians “praying”…they sure do need it.

On the issue of drivers licenses for illegal aliens, I may have missed it, as I don’t pay much attention to lame ducks or cooked gooses, but does anyone know what Georgie Bush’s opinion is on this issue?!?

By time for the quintessentially English truth and a long lingering slow DEATH TO ALL cut and run LIBE

November 15, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this

FAO T …

p!ss poor try bollock chops - no self respecting genuine Englishman writes/talks/thinks like that bubbaturd!! Its a driving licence sh!tferbrains!!

U is just another utterly inadequate anally retentive leftist yanKKKee abortion bucket escapee desperately trying to aspire to something U aint entitled to nor ever (will) be capable of both intellectually and genetically!!

I do however note u’re apposite and witty use of leeches in relation to greasy illegal mexican type leeches, a term I am mighty proud to have ‘injected’ into everyday forum speak.

Even this worthless yanKKKee pandering hatepig SPITzer has seen the light and reversed itself on driving licences for illgeal leeches and HiTllary the lard arsed pathologically lying venal hatchet faced lesbian dyyyyyke has finally, albeit kicking and screeching like a KKKlinton waddled its shrill hectoring corrupt to the core flatulating yanKKKee yellowbelly in line.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this

I think the Shuler Save Act will pass to stop the flow and enforce the law.

The next step is what to do with the millions already here.

Should be an interesting debate tonight in my home town.

Immigration is the #1 issue in Nevada for the service industry.

By Van

November 15, 2007 11:17 AM | Link to this

Why are we even talking about giving licenses to folks that do not belong here to begin with.

I just renewed my license, on the form it asked if I was a citizen, no validation, and if I wanted to vote.

Along with the privilege of voting, they now have a state issued identification for any purpose, legal or illegal.

How quaint, how progressive, how stupid.

By Shar

November 15, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this

Good morning to all. Curious Observer,I agree with both of your posts this morning. If Senator Clinton is nominated, the Republicans will win the White House as long as they nominate someone that moderates can vote for, such as Senator McCain or Mr. Guliani (the latter contingent upon avoiding incrimination in the Bernard Kerik saga).

The issue of drivers’ licences for illegal aliens is a tangible stalking horse for the wider immigration debate, which neither party has or is prepared to deal with effectively. Licenses will provide some safeguarding to the public in terms of road safety and security tracking, but they will permit broader legal access without concurrent legal stature for holders and as such are unacceptable to voters. The government continues to be incapable of accounting for who is here, the politicians depend on support from business owners who rely on cheap labor and taxpayers underwriting benefits for these employees and taxpayers themselves take full advantage of lower prices for goods and services made possible by illegal workers. None of us want to admit these points, however, and all of us are outraged by the advantages reaped by others. It’s a tangled web indeed, and one that is reaching a tipping point in terms of overwhelmed services we all rely on (schools and hospitals head this list) and the specific gravity of population growth that makes this group too juicy to resist for political advantage.

Therefore I’d agree and disagree with Jim’s position today - drivers’ licenses themselves are not a huge concern for voters, but the overall immigration snafu is and the license issue can be molded as a proxy for the larger fight.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 11:24 AM | Link to this

Van,

On Piedmont, I have seen illegals crash and then run away.

Spitzer wanted to insure these drivers because there are a million of them in his town.

By RCH

November 15, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this

getalife I have a better question for you. What are we going to do with all those who are connected to the lawn service industry. It has been estimated that a Billion dollars have been lost. You can probably surmise who holds many of those jobs. Can they be incorporated into other parts of the economy. I think not. Will they leave on their own volition? Will they resort to crime? How about the home building industry. Will these all become prized jobs by legal residents?

All those who debated that they fill jobs that Americans don’t want may have to rethink their position.

By Van

November 15, 2007 11:32 AM | Link to this

getalife,

If they run, they must be guilty. They have committed a criminal act by driving without a license and no insurance.

But, the left wants us to reward them a license and a pass into the voting booth.

It may sound redundant, but it is progressive and stupid - a leftie perfecta.

Wait, that is redundant. Just progressive will work just as well.

By Dennis

November 15, 2007 11:36 AM | Link to this

Just a brief moment on the site today.

This “liberal” says “No” to license for illegals.

Granted there are heartbreak stories of illegals who have come into this country and made a success for themselves and have contributed to their community.

But for each one of those, how many have not?

I’ve asked myself, if the shoe was on the other foot, i.e., another country was being flooded with illegal Americans (don’t laugh)would we be welcomed?

There is the recent case where an illegal dishwasher had worked and saved 50/60 thousand only to have it taken away from him at the airport on his way home. The American government is WRONG in this situation. It’s his money, honestly earned. And he’s on his way out of the country.

Another case or two with those who have finished, or almost, a college educaation. Let them finish, leave the country and apply to get back in. If we can accept those from other nations, we can accept those from south of the boarder.

The question arises, however, and is raised again by Mr. Wooten’s column over drivers license, why is the emphasis mostly on illegals and not on the companies that hire them?

I may be wrong, but I can’t recall Mr. Wooten writing about how these companies should be fined or punished in any way.

For “quality assurance purposes”, the National Security Agency may be monitoring this message.

You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

RCH,

I knew you would show up on this one.

Yes, the effect of your drought has cause businesses to go under like Pike. I think they might move to where the jobs are.

Van,

There were eleven but now I think there are eight giving them licenses. They tried it in California and the Governor was recalled.

Look at the Shuler Save Act, you will like it.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 11:44 AM | Link to this

@Dusty

I think he ought to team up with Jackie and let them talk about “right-wing mouthpieces” and other trivia. Like Jackie says,”self-rightous indignation feels so good!”

You have never heard or seen where I have said or implied what you just quoted.

It is amazing to me that a square-head like you would try to find a rounded conversation. Just does not fit. You try to find unsubstantiated half-truths to bolster your specious arguments, of which there are none, for example your supporting the troops, then you gleefully post your “flat lies.” Now, make a denial to what I have just posted, as I do not believe you have one.

By TJ

November 15, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this

Hillary was right in the way that she handled the questions about illegal immigrants having drivers license at the last debate. She didn’t say whether she agreed are disagreed to illegal immigrants having drivers license. She just said its a good idea, something to think about. And now that she has thought about the issue, she has come out and said that she does not support illegal immigrants having drivers license. It’s perfectly ok for her to take time to make her decision on this issue. This is not the most important issue of the day. This should not determine her electability.

The other Democratic candidates, Rush, Hannity and the Rebulicans are making this too big an issue. Surely they can do better then that.

By Aquagirl

November 15, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this

Glenn @ 10:42, Mohammad Atta got his drivers license through fake documents, not by just applying as an “undocumented consumer” or whatever we’re calling illegals nowadays. All the 9/11 hijackers entered the US with proper visas. Proper for the issuing countries, at least.

So the issue with the 9/11 hijackers isn’t connected to the idea of giving licenses en masse to plainly illegal immigrants.

By Van

November 15, 2007 11:46 AM | Link to this

“Leadership is also about listening to the public.”

Like Bush listens to the American people about the Iraq war?

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 11:54 AM | Link to this

@Glenn,

Yesterday, you posted the following

“By Glenn November 14, 2007 5:46 PM | Link to this Actually, Jackie, you are “a liberal full of propaganda”, as witness your not specifying which White House criminals and which crimes, enforceable by the Justice Dept.”

The list of crimes that are open for prosecution are: Domestic spying on AMERICAN citizens, asking for the right to exempt the communications companies from litigation; Signing statements where Dubya completely ignores the laws passed by the Congress; disregarding the Presidential records act where documents are supposed to be released 15 years after a President leaves office; Guantano Bay and declaration of enemy combatants, in defiance of the United States Constitution and the Geneva Convention, a treaty signed by the USA, which is law by our signing of the treaty; the outing of a covert CIA officer; violation of the 14th Amendment to the Constitution, Voting Rights Act by voter couching. The list goes on and on. In that context, it appears you are the one the is so full of it, your eyes are brown.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 11:56 AM | Link to this

I think Osama’s position is to get the illegal immigrant vote because Clinton is getting the black votes.

This is trickle down justice. When the president breaks the law and not held accountable, Congress gives amnesty to law breakers, the libby pardon, blackwater murders, etc….., it effects the rule of law in this country.

As an Independent progressive for change, I believe to be a nation of laws we must enforce the laws and nobody is above the law.

I think Ron Paul’s Freedom Act and Shuler’s Save Act will enforce the laws.

By Van

November 15, 2007 11:56 AM | Link to this

okay, who is the butt leak that used my id @11:46.

The topic is illegals and how we can reward them for entering this country without the proper papers and regard for our law.

I think a one way trip back home in a cattle truck would be correct.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this

Oops, I pulled a willard.

Make that Obama’s position.

By Van

November 15, 2007 12:06 PM | Link to this

getalife ,

Actually, Teddy Kennedy made that mistake first, but he is special.

By Van

November 15, 2007 12:10 PM | Link to this

I posted at 11:46 under my name. A blog is not your supreme domain and I didn’t take time to read all of the posts to make sure I wasn’t “violating” another person’s id. Get over yourself. I will post under whatever id I want.

By Dusty

November 15, 2007 12:16 PM | Link to this

Jackie @11:44

Do you ever read before you post? At 10:05 TODAY I told Aquagirl that I had posted her words as Jackie’s by mistake.

She in turn aknowleged my post @ 10:39 saying she was glad I had made the correction of “quoting”Jackie when it was Aquagirl.

So relax, dear one. Sorry about the mistake. You have posted nothing that I would repeat.

By Van

November 15, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this

By Van @12:10 PM

A very liberal and progressive response. I can do anything I want because I am superior, but not original.

Your “first” post was tripe and off topic. If you must use someones id, use getalife’s, he doesn’t use his at all.

By Aquagirl

November 15, 2007 12:23 PM | Link to this

Jackie @ 11:44, Dusty already admitted @ 10:05 her error in attributing my words to you.

I think we should give her a break. It exceeds her minuscule brain to distinguish between those of us who aren’t Bush cultists.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 12:25 PM | Link to this

Van,

Just to be fair and balanced, so did Laura.

Focus on the topic.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this

@Dusty,

I do accept your apology. I am man enough to stand up to what I say and what I believe, therefore, I try to make my words clear and concise to remove all ambiguity. Onward and upward!!!!

By getalife

November 15, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this

Speaking of breaking the law

Geez.

By Van

November 15, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this

getalife,

Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.

The Prez can fire any of them he wishes for any reason. Granting driver licenses and voting rights to illegals should be a violation of federal law.

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this

Forgive me for a wild tangent, but Ann Coulter publishes an interesting argument on Pakistan and Gen. Musharraf today. It is easily her funniest essay of the quarter; the humorless among us would do well to avoid it. http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=23430

By Curious Observer

November 15, 2007 1:20 PM | Link to this

Granting driver licenses and voting rights to illegals should be a violation of federal law.

So should hiring them and refusing to enforce existing law.

By time for the patriotic truth

November 15, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this

DAMN!!!!

peeping tom actually posted something that makes complete sense …

hiring illegal leeches and NOT enforcing immigration law against ALL illegal leeches - from what ever backward Mexican (type) sh!tehole, Canadian US Army deserter harbouring sh!tehole or worthless European socialist sh!tehole the illegal leeches emanated from - should be a violation of federal law and punished heavily!!

ROUND THE illegal leech SCUM UP NOW - AND immediately JAIL and HEAVILY FINE ALL grasping US employers exploiting greasy racist sullen non-English speaking illegal leeches!!!

By time for the patriotic truth

November 15, 2007 2:03 PM | Link to this

I truly wish I’d been in court to hear this visionary fearless High Court Family Division judge Mr Justice Singer making these fooking hilarous remarks!! I’d have cheerily PMSL!!

Sadly the politically correct scum at the Lord Chancellors Office forced him to apologise and he was forced to ‘recuse’ himself.

A top man is this judge. His ilk selflessly help ensure that the art of quality judicial entertainment is not quite yet dead.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/law/article2876160.ece

By ray

November 15, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this

well, if it ain’t the buttface olympics on here today!

background check, social security card, and a map when they come across - problem solved, nazis.

then maybe we do something about the white trash meth problem in georgia, something that actually is making our state unsafe…

By getalife

November 15, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this

Van,

Using ganzo to break law is against the law. If we do not hold them accountable for torture, the international law will.

ambulance chaser,

rush and ann are funny in a very sad way because wingnuts actually believe in what they spew.

It is beyond pathetic.

By jm

November 15, 2007 2:29 PM | Link to this

Ok, IF the federal government refuses to enforce the current immigration laws (by law this is in their ballpark), that means there will be illegal immigrants. Given that IF issuing driver’s licenses to the illegal immigrants will make the roads safer, then the governor of a state should issue the driver’s license as a matter of public safety. Unfortunately, it is not up to the states to enforce immigration laws but it is up to the states to figure out a way to deal with the problem.

The Governor of New York can’t fix the problem of illegal immigrants in his state, that is the feds job. What he can do by issuing driver’s licenses is to try to exert some control over who drives on the roads in his state.

By Van

November 15, 2007 2:36 PM | Link to this

getalife,

The only problem I see in your last posting is our definition of torture.

The federal lawyers serve at the whim of the President.

One man’s torture is another man’s boot camp.

I have seen worse treatment from ex-wives and teenage kids.

By time for the patriotic truth

November 15, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this

getaturd

take Bwarney Fwank’s Fwankfurter outta ya treasonous fetid gob for a moment and explicitly state

exactly what is FALSE

about Ms Coulter’s superb rib tickling trenchant (look it up crackpipe debbieturd) FACT FILLED commentary on the Pakis. Remember also that the assiduously corrupt paki bast ards also persistently cheat at cricket and casually butchered a couple of million Bangladeshis in a racist genocidal war that the Indian army had to stop, with some rather belated mournful dirge like help from George mine’s a beef vindaloo Harrison and chums!!

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this

The Geneva Convention Treaty and the US Army field manual clearly spells out what is torture. The trials at Nurenburg convicted Japanese soldiers for waterboarding during WWII. There is no way Dubya can have it both ways.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 2:51 PM | Link to this

toilet,

If I want comedy, I go to Comedy Central.

Flush……..

By Van

November 15, 2007 2:53 PM | Link to this

jm,

The problem is not whether they should be allowed on the road or not. That is already established when they sneaked across the border.

The other problem is the ease of voting because of motor-voter laws enacted by the democrats.

The Governor’s idea would not work if they were issued a different license than legit drivers, no one would sign up for it.

By jm

November 15, 2007 3:04 PM | Link to this

Van@2:53 - I guess W the incompetent, that good law and order president should tell the person running the executive branch of the federal government to start doing their job regarding illegal immigration.

By deegee

November 15, 2007 3:05 PM | Link to this

Giving drivers licenses to illegal aliens is unpopular with the local yokels because it can dip into the coffers of the local communities. Typically the fine for driving without a license is around $1,000.00, after spending the night in jail. It’s a tax that illegal aliens pay along with sales, social security and medicare, assuming that they are working with a fraudulent social security card.

If you question someone point blank as to whether they think you should give a drivers license to an illegal alien the obvious answer is “no”. However, the complete answer is to resolve the illegal immigrant problem by reforming immigration laws in order to reflect the demands of the economy today, not the economy of 25 years ago. This is the answer that Hillary gave and is the one that most Americans agree with. Illegal immigrants aren’t interested in voting in American elections, and it’s not the fault of the DMV that drivers licenses have become the defacto national ID. If you want to vote you should show a voter ID card, and the voter ID card should include a picture. Drivers licenses are just that, a license to drive a car.

BTW, those of you with teenagers might want to take a peek into their wallet to make sure that they aren’t walking around with a fake drivers license. It might save their life.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl @ 11:45, you are refuting my 10:42 statement that “the 9/11 hijackers were illegal residents who used their driver’s licenses as ‘breeder documents’”. I can’t think of any good reason why you would wish to refute this cautionary note, which is historically accurate. I was well aware, when I wrote it, that it did not apply universally to all the hijackers, but rather to the hijackers generally, and that is explanation for the otherwise inscrutable coincidence of my having phrased the claim accordingly. Most of the 9/11 hijackers were on expired student visas, a fact of which you certainly are aware but which you choose for some reason to try to bluff your way past. Also, most of them used their driver’s licenses as breeder documents. This information was easily obtainable from the Internet within a week of 9/11; I remember because I was paid to obtain it at the time. Soon thereafter an Al-Qaeda handbook that had belonged to the Atta cells (there were two) was discovered and translating, revealing that it was Al-Qaeda procedure to use student visas to enter this country at its largest airports and proceed immediately to obtain state driver’s licenses as breedeer documents. Their objective in employing this tactic was to continue to parlay their driver’s licenses into other forms of legitimacy long after their visas had expired and their presence here become illegal. Hence your statement that “the issue with the 9/11 hijackers isn’t connected to the idea of giving licenses en masse to plainly illegal immigrants” is dangerously deceptive and cavalier. Why would you wish to assert such a thing?

By RCH

November 15, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this

Jackie You are correct thatone Japanese officer was convicted .In 1947, the United States charged a Japanese officer, Yukio Asano, with war crimes for carrying out water boarding on a U.S. civilian. Asano was sentenced to 15 years of hard labor.

Notice the term U.S. civilian. Those who we use this torture against are terrorist and saboteurs. They have no rights under the Geneva Convention and could technically after conviction be put in front of a wall and shoot!

By Evelyn

November 15, 2007 3:19 PM | Link to this

Jim, you are right. Lots of politicians have under estimated the importance of this issue. Saxby Chambliss, for one. All year long, I bounced back between Obama and Edwards, contributing to both, but last week that changed. I will never, ever, vote for anyone that supported that ill fated “comprehensive immigration bill”. Fred Thompson, and Dale Cardwell look better each day, as time passes.

By Van

November 15, 2007 3:19 PM | Link to this

Jackie,

The Japanese war crime trials were in Tokyo not Nuremberg.

Charge #54, the charges were - Ordered, authorised, and permitted inhumane treatment of Prisoners of War (POWs) and others.

Water boarding wasn’t mentioned in the records.

By BS Aplenty

November 15, 2007 3:21 PM | Link to this

(Piling on accepted) Jim, no driver’s licenses for illegal immigrants - check.

Dusty you sure wield a mighty big pen - could we entice you to run as the Republican nominee (along with jbmlaw (VP) and tftt (SOS)? Always glad to hear your thoughts,

tftt good to see you in the fray,

Van always eager to hear your thoughts.

jbmlaw Jesus had his rock, Peter, to build a church. Wooten’s got you. Selah.

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 3:27 PM | Link to this

Dear TFTT @ 2:03, funny story. I guess the judge did cross the line, so the appellate court ruled correctly.

By time for the patriotic truth

November 15, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this

getaturd

“flush?” … as in Bush flushing the worthless yellowbellied two johns in 2004 … huge smirk

BTW getaturd one doesn’t “go to” Comedy Central one watches it/selects that channel!!

what a snivelling illegal greaseball Cuban MoRoN

geeeeeeeeez!!!

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this

Thanks BS. I always see our friend Van as a chief of staff type, the guy who really runs things. I have too many skeletons in my closet, so maybe you could be Dusty’s VP.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 3:44 PM | Link to this

getalife, at 11:41 you say that “they tried” issuing driver’s licenses to illegal immigrants “in California and the Governor was recalled.” Not so. Normally I wouldn’t sweat the correction, but the assertion has been made here that 9/11 did not transform the debate on licenses for illegals, so the California case is suddenly relevant. The Governor was not recalled because of his having tried to credential illegal immigrant drivers; rather, the Governor recalled the legislation before it ever was enacted. The Legislature had passed, and Governor Gray Davis had signed, legislation authorizing licenses for illegals. Unfortunately for the hapless Mr. Davis, 9/11 occurred immediately after his signing, sending the Governor scrambling, in an unprecedented fashion, to recall the bill from enrollment before it could be enacted. Had the Governor allowed the bill to go into effect after 9/11, then that would have been the people’s cause for recalling him. As it happened he was able to spike the bill (unconstitutionally) well past the eleventh hour, only to be recalled by the voters as a result of his budgetary profligacy and utter incompetence in the face of California’s energy crisis, which he had managed only to exacerbate at a final cost to the taxpayers of $30 billion. The same Senate author has put the driver’s license bill back onto the Governor’s desk every session since, but Mr. Schwarzenegger refuses to sign it on grounds of national security. (His veto messages to this effect are easily obtainable online.)

By deegee

November 15, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this

Glenn, your point about breeder documents and the drivers license may be valid. But, trying to tie the issue of Islamic terrorism to illegal immigrant workers is a bit twisted. In the case of the terrorists you have a small group of people that enter the country legally in order to do harm. They obtained their drivers licenses legally and then purposely overstayed their visas. This is not an immigration problem, it is a failure of the state department to properly track those that overstay their visas.

In the case of the illegal immigrant workers, you have a large group of people that come here illegally with the sole intention of getting a job and making money to sustain themselves and their families. They are not here to harm the US. When you have an estimated 10 million workers in the country that are here illegally then that is an immigration problem. Denying illegal workers a drivers license does not resolve the problem of Islamic terrorists entering the country legally and overstaying their visa.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this

@Van,

Thank you for the correct spelling of Nuremberg. However, your inference that waterboarding was ordered and therefore legal is not factual. There were Japanese soldiers imprisoned for torture using waterboarding. Check out those facts.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 4:01 PM | Link to this

Jackie @ 11:54, that is so cool of you to accept the challenge to enumerate the White House crimes to which you’d alluded yesterday. Very cool, upstanding & straight. I officially retract my statement of yesterday to the effect that only what you had called “a liberal full of propaganda” would make such accusations without explaining them. You now have explained what are the things you suspect White House officials to have committed, and although I know neither the facts of each case nor the details of its actual criminality, I do now understand what you were miffed about and that those possible crimes are indeed major crimes and worth our being miffed about. (I’d appreciate it if you’d sometime explain what is voter couching and what is supposed to have taken place along those lines, as it sounds disturbing and I’m altogether ignorant of this.) I just want to acknowledge here that my eyes are indeed brown and, at the moment, my face red.

By Van

November 15, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this

Jackie,

I saw the other post and I stand corrected.

By Aquagirl

November 15, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this

Glenn @ 3:15, I was refuting your cautionary note because there is a difference between “I’m a citizen of another country who entered illegally—gimme a drivers license” and “I originally came here legally because y’all suck up to oil-rich nations, and have fake documents—gimme a drivers license.” We knew the 9/11 hijackers were involved in terrorist activities. They didn’t have to wade across the Rio Grande, they used legally issued paperwork, such as their passports, to support their license applications. And to enter the country and establish residency, even if they overstayed illegally.

So, even if we agreed to not issue drivers licenses to illegal immigrants, such measures would have not stopped the 9/11 hijackers.

The just say no approach is as dead as Nancy Reagan’s 80’s hairstyle. Telling illegals they can’t have licenses, then doing nothing to prevent them from obtaining them fraudulently is pointless.

All it does—as I said in my first post—-is fire up idiots who like tough talk but are too stupid to know they’re just being patronized. In other words, Republicans.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 4:26 PM | Link to this

Glenn,

While you are using the google, google ahnold’s water crisis bill.

You just might need it.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 4:28 PM | Link to this

@Glenn,

Voter couching is the denying of minorities the right to vote by using a pseudo-type poll test to disqualify them. An example of voter couching is the use of Identification Cards issued by the State of GA. It puts an undue burden on the citizens to prove they are citizens even though they may have state issued identification of other documentation to show they are citizens/resident of said state. I apologize for being so vocal in my response. The things that this regime has foisted upon this country is truly criminal. As a veteran, I was highly offended by Dubya when he refused to attend the wreath-laying ceremony at Arlington, yet, he had the nerve to say that he attended a memorial service at the VFW Post in College Station, TX. There are more than 58,000 names on the VietNam memorial wall and this draft dodger has the temerity to say he supports the troops. What an outrage.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this

deegee @ 3:47, you might say that, and I might say that (as indeed I have done, to politicians). Now if we can only get them to say that and believe it, we maybe could get somewhere. My own suggestion was that, as long as the two issues post-9/11 are inextricable in the politicians’ minds, let’s then proceed to kill two birds by getting the damned braceros nobody wants to admit to licensed and insured while at the same time making the card itself more secure by using biometrics. The simplest would be fingerprints, which are required by most DMVs and kept on file but never really used at all, much less optimized. But this turns out to be a hot potato too, because the pols can’t separate it from the issue of the long-awaited national ID, which is long-awaited for a reason.

I see no partisan angle on this at all. A lot of people, including the author of the CA legislation and his boyhood friend the L.A. Mayor, have tried to inject partisanship, but I think they come out looking foolish each time they do that. The biggest impediment is political cowardice, which knows no party boundaries. Sen. Brownback knows this issue inside and out, and he’s honest and gutsy, but has no juice. Sen. Feinstein also treats the matter with great care, managing to juggle her pragmatism on immigration with her longstanding concern for security (esp. in re Chinese industrial espionage, a pet peeve of hers).

No go, though. Looks like this one will have to await the next President. Which brings us back to Jim’s column…

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this

getalife, I wasn’t Googling, my good man. I was there! I was the first Democratic consultant to cross the line and throw in with the original conspirators in recalling Governor Davis, who like Sonny was worse than a non-entity.

Too bad the same can’t be done to Sonny. I don’t know much about water policy—the water nerds come to me on educ., I go to them on water—but holy JAY-eezus-sah!—this Gov has the worst political tin ear I’ve ever even heard of. How hard can it be, especially after Katrina, to announce a five-point water plan?

I don’t think there’s been anything quite like it since FDR slept through the entire year of 1937.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this

@RCH,

Thank you for you research. Most professional military people will tell you that torture DOES NOT WORK and for us to be a signatory of the Geneva Convention, which is codified in our laws, is criminal, as you know. I find it incredulous that those who choose to ignore history and/or are drinkers of the “Bush Kool-Aid” do not understand if we break treaties and use these tactics, what is to stop our enemies from using the same tactics on our military. Many of these folks watch too many of the old cowboy movies starring John Wayne or Audie Murphy.

By Bikini Bimbo

November 15, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this

Voter concerns: Guns, Gays, and God. (and no amnesty for nobody nohow).

Driver’s licenses for illegals? Doesn’t even poll. By praying for rain, Sonny has assured himself a lifetime job in the mansion. Why? Lets see, when he prayed did it have guns in it? No. Uh, did it have Gays in it? No. Did it have God in it? BINGO! He’s re-elected! Hooray! Whoopee!!!

Remember, to stay incumbent you must inculcate the redstate inbreds with incantation.

By getalife

November 15, 2007 4:56 PM | Link to this

A dem consultant from Cali.?

Get em wingnuts.

It is a southern thing Glenn.

The guv from Alabama did the same thing.

I think Sonny’s timing with the forecast was to fool the wingnuts.

They are a gullible bunch.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 4:57 PM | Link to this

The following was published over the newswire today:

By GEORGE JAHN, Associated Press Writer 14 minutes ago

VIENNA, Austria - A report from the U.N nuclear watchdog agency on Thursday found Iran to be generally truthful about key aspects of its nuclear history, but it warned that its knowledge of Tehran’s present atomic work was shrinking.

The White House said it would continue to push for a third round of U.N. sanctions against Iran despite the findings by the International Atomic Energy Agency report.

I wonder if Dick Cheney is still getting his forces to support him in his quest to attack Iran, even though the professional military has told him in no uncertain terms do they have the manpower to support an invasion of Iran. Further, the intelligence community has told the Administration an attack on Iran would close the Straits of Hormus and oil prices would go through the roof, effectively shutting down the world’s economy. Sixty percent of the world’s oil come through that narrow waterway.

By deegee

November 15, 2007 4:58 PM | Link to this

The whole issue is inflamed by D-list talk show hosts like Lou Dobbs reviving their washed up careers by demagoguing the illegal immigrant issue for the viewing and listening pleasure of our nation’s grumpy old men and their sour old ladies.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 4:59 PM | Link to this

Jackie @ 4:28,

• Thank you for explaining the outrage of voter couching. In the past I’ve been forced to resort to push-polling, a similar suppression tactic, and I’m ashamed to have caved. It backfires anyway. It’s especially ugly that consultants in GA would use such tactics, given the ugly history of poll testing, which concept Jim all but endorsed last week in this blog.

• Thank you for your military service. Very much.

• I’ve always been reluctant to call W a draft dodger, even though I remember well the various ways in which the princelings avoided Vietnam, because he was a Guardsmen, and they often are among the first fallen, as in Iraq, and as told by many of the names on the uphill slope of that arresting black gash in DC.

• I have no standing whatsoever to say this, but I had and still have a gut feeling that something very heavy prevented W’s appearance at Arlington this year. Something we won’t know for years. I’m not covering for him or anything, I just have a feeling that there was some sort of credible threat of something that may have missed him but gotten others and desecrated the Cemetery. (An esp. sick thought, since ANC is itself a desecration, of Lee’s front yard.)

• Oh well. He’s a dork anyway.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 5:09 PM | Link to this

deegee @ 4:58, and in just a couple of minutes of viewing such brimstoners one gets the feeling that were it not for illegal immigrants they’d be whipping some other boy, any other boy.

By Bikini Bimbo

November 15, 2007 5:14 PM | Link to this

CNN just reported that China is exporting pencils and ammo containing lead.

Today’s quiz: Name a Chinese Rock Band from the 70’s: Answer: Lead Zepellin.

We now go to weather: “This is your local weather reporter with today’s forecast: We see prayers from several districts leaders; over in the fourth district there are widely scattered fire and brimstone for widely scattered showers… and…. In the sixth district there is partly-shrouded vespers for clouded tempests. that’s it for weather now over to sports……”Hershel Walker did everything but stand on one foot and badger Coach Spurrier with “Put em up! Put em up! I’ll fight you with one eye closed. I’ll fight you with one hand tied behind my back. Put em up!”

Great stuff\ from a forgotten hero, hershel walker.

By Jackie

November 15, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this

@Glenn,

Dubya says that he was a member of the Alabama Air National Guard. No one remembers him ever being there. Secondly, he did not take his flight physical and he does not have a pilot’s license, he came to the National Guard after graduate school and never had basic training or ROTC. I know if you were a pilot for the F-100 flying out of Thailand, you had to be on your game because those guys were “required” to essentially fly a straight line to the targets. What happened to Dubya and his graduation from flight school? Why is his DD214 missing? What is his military number? Bet you he can’t remember it. If you are a vet, I bet you can remember all that information.

By Abbie

November 15, 2007 5:28 PM | Link to this

Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall receive Nobel Prizes.

Blessed are the poor in spirit, for they shall be medicated.

Blessed are the clean of artery, for they shall see God later than most.

Blessed are the meek, for they shall inherit the Magic Kingdom together with the California Experience and discount rates on any midsize rental from Avis.

By DemDems4Ever

November 15, 2007 5:37 PM | Link to this

deegee @ 4:58

You self-righteous, insufferable little twit. Were there no old men and their sour old ladies you would be speaking German or Japanese and incapable of spouting your ignorant tripe in a blog.

The illegals are just that - illegal. We can not afford them and their drain on our economy ( do not even waste my time with your nonsense about their positive input).

Their leaders continually spout anarchy and their intent to overthrow our government and the jobs they take from those who need the jobs most are creating more poverty in our under-educated.

What a joke you and your position on the illegal stampede is. Go ahead and support Hillary Clinton as well you one-trick pony.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 5:39 PM | Link to this

“The voters are looking for someone who has the strength and experience to lead, and little has changed in the last few weeks outside of the massive media coverage of the attacks,” Clinton chief strategist Mark Penn stated.

This has to be some sort of joke. Hitllary sat on the bloody fence about illegal immigrant driver licenses until the NY bozo who put it out there suddenly withdrew it. Tim Russert caught hell by the Hitllary Goosestepping Stormtroopers for having the gall to ask her if she supports what the governor of New York does. Now that the governor has withdrawn his liberal stupidity, Hillary says she’s against it. That “woman” couldn’t lead a pack of hyenas to a lion kill, but she can sure lead a bunch of sheep right over the cliff.

Meanwhile in other news, CBS has wet their pretty pinko panties and blamed Bush over African American military recruitment going down. Well ain’t that a bich? Wasn’t it good ‘ole Charlie’s Rangels a year or two ago that slobbered on his mustache over how many black men were being sent to Iraq? Now they stop signing up and the left still raises hell. WTF is wrong with the left in this nation? GD you can’t make any of those warped kooks on the left pleased.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 5:49 PM | Link to this

@Jackie,

First of all liberal communist wench, Bush’s instructor in the F-102 (get your facts straight idiot) said W was a fine pilot. Second of all, Bush went into politics while still in the Reserves and got an HONORABLE DISCHARGE. Third, CBS had to LIE and make up a story about Bush’s service and they LOST THEIR AS-SES as well as Dan Rather over it. Fourth, Bush did WAY THE HELL MORE than your wonderboy t!tlick Clinton, back when you jerkof-fs on the left said military service WASN’T EVEN IMPORTANT TO BEING PRESIDENT. Now go fish in the dead see, you scroll.

By jbmlaw

November 15, 2007 5:52 PM | Link to this

Dear Jackie @ 5:27, you question the mysterious disappearance of a 30 year old piece of paper that was in exclusive custody of the government? I have been out of government barely over 20 years and they have no evidence of my prior status. The incompetent one is not necessarily the one whose papers disappear. Your admiration for government competence is unparalleled.

By Bikini Bimbo

November 15, 2007 5:54 PM | Link to this

Blessed are the hacks for they shall reap what they did not sow.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 5:57 PM | Link to this

The original lardas-s rapist in chief is back at it again pigging out on cheeseburgers. Suck one down for the “wife” there, Bill old boy. You’ll be due for another bypass in no time. What a bunch of clowns.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 5:59 PM | Link to this

I’ve got one for you, bikiniwax:

Damned are the liberal devils for they will know eventually that they do not own nor run this nation and there are a HELL of a lot of people that don’t think like them, thank God. Amen.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 6:02 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw - you have to understand that to a liberal, no government, especially if run by them, can do bad. The only time libs and RATs ever complain about the incompetence of government bureaucracy is when Republicans are in charge. What hypocrites.

By Glenn

November 15, 2007 6:06 PM | Link to this

Jackie, omigod. I didn’t even suspect that it was that bad, W’s AWOL problem

You probably know that during the Clinton presidency there was a huge fire at a USDVA storage facility that obliterated a huge number of DD214s. It’s possible that W’s went up in smoke, but how would we know? Isn’t it illegal for third parties to obtain them? (I’ve been hired to try, and operated with the understanding that it was a no-no.) Point being that e.g. CBS may have W’s service record but not be able to say so or use too much of it too tellingly.

By Bikini Bimbo

November 15, 2007 6:11 PM | Link to this

We liberals want naked government! An orgy of legislation!

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 6:11 PM | Link to this

Let’s also not forget any liberal asking about files has absolutely no voice after the 9/11 investigation and Sandysocks Burglar and stolen National Archives documents which were destroyed. All together again: HYPOCRITES.

By Stormin' Normal

November 15, 2007 6:13 PM | Link to this

Then move out to San Freaksicko, bikiniwax. You’ll fit in well with the rest of the lib sick freakshows on the left.