Home > Thinking Right > Archives > 2007 > July > 19 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USHillarycare?
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
President Bush on Wednesday vowed to veto Senate legislation that would increase spending on the federal program that funds 70 percent of Georgia’s PeachCare spending. The President had recommended an increase of $4.8 billion over the next five years. Democrats want it expanded by $50 billion.
At the heart of the dispute is the broader ideological dispute over health care financing in this country — whether it’ll be Hillarycare or a system that relies on the private sector. Since the defeat of Hillarycare, the left has moved to get there by gradually expanding taxpayer-financed coverage. PeachCare provides coverage to children whose parents earn too much to qualify for Medicaid, the taxpayer-provided health care program for the poor.
The program, called the State Children’s Health Insurance Program, or SCHIP, was targeted to the children of families earning up to 200 percent of poverty. Georgia has expanded it to 220 percent. In other states adults are included and proposals have been floated to extend it to all children under the age of 18.
“If Congress continues to insist upon expanding health care through the SCHIP program - which, by the way, would entail a huge tax increase for the American people - I’ll veto the bill,” the President said Wednesday. Democrats plan to pay for the expansion with a 61-cents-per-pack tax on cigarettes.
“Members of Congress have decided … to expand the program to include … families earning [up to] $80,000 a year, which would cause people to drop their private insurance in order to be involved with a government insurance plan,” said Bush.
A group of Democrats and some Republicans indicate they’ll support a $35 billion expansion to a total of $60 billion over five years. The Democratic proposal would have raised spending from $25 billion over the previous five years to $75 billion.
One reason the PeachCare debate now underway in Georgia is so important is that it is a test of whether conservatives can rein-in spending for a non-entitlement. It shouldn’t grow into something that entices parents to drop medical coverage for their children in favor of a more attractive taxpayer-financed plan.
The responsible course for state officials is to deal with the problem at hand, not to appeal to Washington for more and more money.
Comments
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:44 AM | Link to this
what is the obsession with peachcare? it costs less than one road!
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:46 AM | Link to this
75 million is more than 25 billion?
oh yeah.. trickle down economics. right!
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:48 AM | Link to this
and remember.. that road dont go nowhere. it just sits there. you gotta add personal vehicles and gasoline before a taxpayer fundered road is of any use to anybody.
so, peachcare costs less than half a road
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:50 AM | Link to this
speaking of roads…
NO CARS ON PEACHTREE BY JULY 4, 2012!!!
(there could be sh!t geyser like NY.. you really want cars on there when it happens?)
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:53 AM | Link to this
So the NFL will let Vict play.. and immediately change their name to the No Fans League
By HAROLD
July 19, 2007 8:56 AM | Link to this
So how would SCHIP cause Merikans a HUGE tax increase but that other thing, um, what was it, OH YEAH, the unfundered unbudgeted IRAQ WAR.. it won’t. right? no tax increase? Nope.. Just NEW taxes! hahahah.. the old taxes won’t increase. there will just be new taxes.. read harolds lips!!
By harold
July 19, 2007 8:59 AM | Link to this
wake up, jbmlaw! harold cant carry this on his own all dang day!!!
By jbmlaw
July 19, 2007 9:04 AM | Link to this
Good morning all. Congressional Republicans were tossed out of office in 2006, justifiably, for failure to rein in wild spending. Most of us Conservatives thought that bringing in democrats under that rationale was a disconnect with rationality, roughly equivalent to putting Barry Bonds in charge of steroid-law enforcement. Nevertheless fairness required that we give the democrats a chance to show they are competent to the task. They’ve shown enough to satisfy any lingering questions I had.
Robert Novak’s column today lays it out starkly: “Sen. Kent Conrad (D-N.D.), chairman of the Senate Budget Committee, delivered a menacing threat about the confirmation of former Rep. Jim Nussle (R-Iowa) as OMB Director. To get confirmed, Conrad hinted, Nussle will have to express compromise on appropriations bills. Implicitly, he would have to back down from President Bush’s plans to veto nine out of 12 appropriations bills because of overspending.
“But none of those bills has yet cleared the Senate. Democrats do not want a string of Bush vetoes, highlighting their spendthrift tendencies. Only three bills are likely to get through to final passage: Homeland Security, Military Construction-Veterans Affairs and Legislative Branch. Of these, only Homeland Security will be vetoed. The remainder of the appropriations bills will likely be bundled into one omnibus bill. “
By Redneck Convert
July 19, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this
Well, the cost of Skoal and Redman and cigarettes are already out of sight and now the libruls want to make them cost more. And use my tax money to pay for doctoring the kids of Those People to boot. This is nothing but a commie plot. All you get when you use tax money to pay for doctoring is a bunch of Those People that grow up and vote Democrat and want to keep us good white people from putting up the 10 Commandments and such. I’m all for spending billions to arm our troops or build good roads, but not one penny should go for this kind of welfare for Those People.
If God had meant for these kids to be healthy he wouldn’t have let them get sick in the first place. Its against God’s Plan to use tax money to doctor Those Peoples kids. At least that’s what the Revrend Jim Bob Buice claimed before he was locked up for accidently being found nekkid with that boy he was trying to rescue. We need to let these kids fend for theirselfs and stay out of God’s Work. Anyway, they can always go to any hospitle for doctoring. They have to take them there and it don’t cost nobody nothing.
And its against good Southren people too. If we are going to spend all the tax money on doctoring kids we won’t have none left for the War. No real Southren person would be against spending all the money you can get your hands on on the War.
Anyway, I’m scared to death this Hillary woman will get elected President. This country won’t be fit to live in then. Us rednecks might as well just take our pants off and bend over and hand over our billfolds while we are doing it.
That’s my opinion and its very true and backed up by the Bible. Well, I got a bunch of beer to get out. Wednesday is prayer meeting night and the Baptists just flock to the bars after church services to get rid of the powerful thirst they got while listening to the preacher. They just about cleaned out my bars last night. And I’ll have the same kind of heavy load tomorrow to deal with all the Baptists that go to tip back a few on Sunday. Have a good day everybody.
By harold
July 19, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this
So they are not gonna admit it was a dirty bomb in the vehicle found in the hole, eh? It was a “steam” bomb.. with “asbestos” contamination. what a joke! how dumb do they think we are? oh yeah… PLANES caused all those buildings to collapse. we ARE that dumb! better clean up the ASBESTOS
so this is what DHS came up with for dirty bomb response.. blame asbestos. nice.
how’s all that al qaeda “chatter” going anyway?
By Dusty
July 19, 2007 9:17 AM | Link to this
Well, harold,
I don’t know where jbmlaw is but here’s dashing Dusty to the rescue.
POOR FAMILIES making $80,000/year?? POOR FAMILIES???? The government might help them with their health insurance?? What next? The government will spoonfeed everybody in the country under the age of 25?
I am glad our President sees the folly of this Democratic move. He will make the right choice. And I never want Georgia to be known as the handout state.
There, harold. You are not alone, like it or not. Carry on…
By RCH
July 19, 2007 9:17 AM | Link to this
I am forced to support Rent, health care, transportation, education, and God knows what else for a family I never knew I had. The govt. has now even attempted to make me adopt illegals into my growing family. But for some it is still not enough. When will I be forced to allow them to move in with me?
By Analchord
July 19, 2007 9:28 AM | Link to this
If the catholic church can buy sex-abuse insurance, shouldn’t the repudlickans be able to buy traitor insurance when one of their leaders sells us out to the saudis?
National HealthCare is a Human Right. The money we’ve used to shift sand around in the Iraqi Desert could have paid for a lot of USA healthcare.
The Iraqis are getting our social security money, our healthcare money AND our entire army.
Where’s traitor insurance when you need it? The mascot for Traitor Insurance is The Iraq Duck. “Attack Iraq”. Whose that lame duck president who attacked the wrong country after 911 and let the real threat regroup? (“ATTACK IRAQ”)….Beats me….You know, the goofy malaprop prez…..dunno….(“ATTACK IRAQ!”)…..come on, you know, he wasn’t elected he was appointed by the supreme court which is technically treason and we should have hanged the lot of them?…..(“ATTACK IRAQ!”)…..shrug….look, he’s always talking about mission accomplished and what a threat al queda is even though he cant really identify what or where al queda is…..”ATTACK IRAQ!”…..
Oh that catholic church story. Dateline’s internet predator ambush show proves that it’s not a priest problem, it’s a human problem, and that the catholic church really is not a breeding ground of child abuse.
But it’s rough. I meet more and more atheists every day. We are forgetting god. People are actually at the point where they consider any christian belief to be symptoms of insanity.
The church abuse press doesn’t help a whit. And half the American people think that Iraq attacked us first on 911 so we needed to attack iraq.
Nobody pays attention to the short history of the War of 911: we invaded Afghanistan and had the culprits cornered only to let them slip through our army. Gen. Franks was the bum here. In a weird historical twist, it was another Gen. Franks which ruined our Desert Storm end around which would have captured all of the Republican Guard. He had a case of the slows, and because of the complication which ensued after Saddam’s Army remnants escaped, it indirectly effected the situation now.
By getalife
July 19, 2007 9:33 AM | Link to this
This wingnut argument would have merit if the gop did not waste over a half a trillion dollars in the Iraq occupation.
Another reason to vote for a Dem President. Money would be spent for the sick, poor, children and going after OBL in Pakistan.
The choice is clear.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 9:34 AM | Link to this
Analchord
“National HealthCare is a Human Right”
Since when?
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 9:40 AM | Link to this
Members of Congress have decided … to expand the program to include … families earning [up to] $80,000 a year, which would cause people to drop their private insurance in order to be involved with a government insurance plan,” said Bush.
Pardon my disbelief, but if BUSH said it, I’d recheck those facts if I were you. Remember, he’s the one who also said “Mission Accomplished”; and my own personal favorite “The British government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa.”
SIDENOTE: The British government itself backed away from that assertion. What’s clear now is that earlier intelligence reports suggesting Saddam Hussein’s regime was attempting to obtain uranium from the African nation of Niger were based on false information, including forged documents.
Hmmm it makes me wonder now just WHO forged those documents that hurtled America into this “War” in the first place?
By cmd
July 19, 2007 9:44 AM | Link to this
Mr. Wooten:
It’s a bit misleading to characterize the legislation as proposed by “Democrats and some Republicans” when in fact senior Republicans (Grassley, Hatch and others) are co-sponsors of the legislation. This is a bipartisan bill with strong support from senior Republicans, not “Hillarycare” (or whatever buzzword you next invent to appeal to your ignorant masses). Get your facts straight.
By Van
July 19, 2007 9:44 AM | Link to this
If we can only provide it to those that really need it, that is one thing - but to provide it to those that can afford coverage, or do not want coverage, is a waste of tax payer money.
The Kaiser Family Foundation, a nonprofit group often quoted in news reports, puts the number of uninsured Americans who do not qualify for current government programs and make less than $50,000 a year between 8.2 million and 13.9 million, far less than the mantra of 40 to 50 million.
With the median income in the US of $46,000 (2006) it appears that the pool of folks the really need insurance is smaller than every liberal says it is.
Seems that there might need to be a shift in thinking between what is needed as oppose to a shotgun approach.
By harold
July 19, 2007 9:44 AM | Link to this
Well, by all appearances Al Qaeda was in Manhattan yesterday trying to blow up Grand Central Station with a radiological dirty bomb.
Oops harold means a “steam pipe” exploderized and got “asbestos” everywhere, and never mind the vehicle remains stuck in teh crater. it was not a dirty car bomb. not not not. it was STEAM and ASBESTOS and it only HAPPENED to be at grand central station.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 10:04 AM | Link to this
Debbiedoright
Thought you might be to busy spending my hard earned money today. Started packing yet? LOL
By BS Aplenty
July 18, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this
While I wish good fortune to DebbieDoneRight when the man runs her out of Techwood Homes I just hope she stays away from my neighborhood. Tough enough to keep the dogs out of the trash
By jbmlaw
July 19, 2007 10:11 AM | Link to this
Apologies to all for the following distraction, promise to get back to topic later today:
Dear getalife @ 9:33, the last time the dems went after a foreign national, Woodhead Wilson was chasing Pancho Villa all over Mexico. How’d that work out? In the meantime, we note your adherence to the dem talking points, quoted here with commentary by an average conservative observer:
“In the past week, B. Hussein Obama said the war in Iraq has made us more vulnerable to terrorist attacks. Americans are “more at risk,” he said, “and less safe than we should have been at this point.” We would be safer with “better polices” — such as, presumably, Bill Clinton’s policy of pretending Islamic terrorists don’t exist and leaving the problem for the next president.
“Hillary Clinton said we need to start “reversing our priorities. Let’s stop sending troops to Iraq and let’s start insuring every single child.” Yes, that should put a good healthy scare into the insurgents. “Run for your life, Ahmed! All American children are getting regular checkups!”
“Sen. Chris Dodd miraculously straddled both arguments — that the threat of terrorism is a fraud and that the Iraq war had increased its danger. He said “al-Qaida is insurgent again” because we’ve “turned Iraq into an incubator” for jihadists. But simultaneously with warning of a terrorist attack, Dodd also said he was “more skeptical than I’d like to be” of the Bush administration’s warning of a terrorist attack. Damn that Bush! He’s inflamed an imaginary enemy!”
By time for the truth
July 19, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this
The human scum criminal dog killer Vick should NOT be allowed to play this micky mouse, utterly pointless “sport???” (a truly sick joke) of thuggish unthinking mental midgets. The human scum Vick should be shunned by ALL decent normal folks - except the sick and twisted vermin who deem a worthless plebian micky mouse so called sport more important than countless tortured, maimed and murdered dogs.
But in this country money and greed and instant (narcissistic) gratfication is infinitely more important than the now sadly wistful fast fading memories of morality and decency and providing value for money and good service. The trashiest moronic bollocks puked up by ‘popular culture’ is eagerly and gleefully embraced by lemming like neanderthals -some even with an ivy league education, some just knuckle dragging uneducated limousine liberal Hollywood thickos with barely a high skool education.
Which is why we have vile racist/sexist/thuggish crime glorying black/urban garbage like hippety hop, the self deluded psychotic trendy lefty church of global whining, the execrable NBA, a huge ever growing drug abuse and drug ‘culture’ problem, a craven liberal refusal to deport illegal leeches, a cowardly yellowbellied cut and run treasonous demoNcrat party, a pandering wimp in the White House, an ever growing bleating herd of self absorbed dim and unsurprisingly stupid computer game addickted kiddies teens and yoofs whose only real ‘expertise’ is in the coming new Olympic field of puffed up self esteem, aggressive (self) immolation behind the wheel of daddy’s car and blind terror when it comes to taking any kind of responsibility for their immature selfish actions.
Thanks to the mental wasting disease of liberalism we now have politically correct barrack room lawyer types everywhere perpetrating to perfection their Pelosibitch like oppressive, implaccably INTOLERANT of any disagreement little Hitler leftist moral fascism. The liberal sickness of moral relativism and its sick and twisted sistah clone of restorative justice - e.g. coddling of child rapists (Hi there rednekkKs NAMBLA) is now the norm in yanKKKEE run cesspits, smallish corrupt septic tanks of racial spoils liberalism like Atlanta and what’s left of Kalifornia and the surrender monkey left coast.
The world desperately needs a vaccine to wipe out the moral cancer of liberalism for ever. The advanced western world also urgently needs a ‘collective’ backbone implant to enable patriotic free thinkers and lovers of freedom to swiftly eviscerate mohammedan towel head terrorism and its craven apologists and enablers.
A few USAF smart bomb practice runs using disposable unimportant buildings warehousing a hefty sprinkling of treasonous scum posing as the modern day Lord Haw Haw and Tokyo Rose - the NY Slimes, NBC, CNN, PMSNBC, NPR, DNC HQ, CBS, ABC, any G SOREos funded org etc - should prepare the lads admirably for the impending inevitable attacks on Nazi Iran.
By jm
July 19, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this
van - would the Kaiser Family Foundation be associated with the Kaiser HMO? (I don’t know, just asking). If they are, any numbers they report should be taken with a very large grain of salt.
As for some of this push to “Hillarycare” as Mr. Wooten phrases it, I wonder how much of this is driven by companies who wish to get rid of or reduce their current healthcare plans.
By harold
July 19, 2007 10:18 AM | Link to this
harold cant wait to see the ga dome full of spectators flinging dog sh-it at mike vict. how they gonna keep people from smuggling in dog sh-it? they cant.
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 10:20 AM | Link to this
puts the number of uninsured Americans who do not qualify for current government programs and make less than $50,000 a year between 8.2 million and 13.9 million, far less than the mantra of 40 to 50 million.
Van, the psuedo subject for today is concerning SCHIP,(PeachCare in Georgia). NOT adult healthcare. However, you did, find the flaw in Jim’s rant-of-the-week.
If (I’ll take your low number), 8.2 million people make >50K; and these people have 2.5 children each; then the requested 50B makes more sense then the counter offer of 4.8B made by your lord and master Dumbya.
By getalife
July 19, 2007 10:23 AM | Link to this
fakelaw,
Clinton won his war while the gop were screaming to cut and run.
His wife will get OBL and his friends.
Lying loser.
By jbmlaw
July 19, 2007 10:23 AM | Link to this
What’s in your wallet? What’s a paltry one million dollars to a member of Congress?
Well, apparently not enough to know if an organization about to receive that big block of cash actually exists.
Republican Rep. Jeff Flake of Arizona, the fiscal crusader who’s never met an earmark he likes, questioned Democratic Rep. Peter J. Visclosky of Indiana on the House floor Tuesday about whether the Center for Instrumented Critical Infrastructure actually exists - since, hey, it’s getting like a million bucks or something.
Visclosky, who chairs the spending subcommittee responsible for the project, had to admit that, well, he didn’t have a clue.
After a lengthy back-and-forth, Flake, complaining that his staff couldn’t find a website for the center, asked Visclosky, “Does the center currently exist?”
“At this time, I do not know,” the Indiana Democrat replied. “But if it does not exist, the monies could not go to it.” And who could possibly be the sponsor of such an earmark? Yes, you guessed it, the man Republicans love to hate, Pennsylvania Democrat John P. Murtha.
Despite the money’s uncertain destination, the House rejected Flake’s measure to strike the funds, 326-98. And the Visclosky bill also sailed through, 312-112.
As I said, what’s one million dollars to a member of Congress? http://www.politico.com/blogs/thecrypt/0707/Whatsinyour_wallet.html
By Aquagirl
July 19, 2007 10:23 AM | Link to this
Seeing as how Bush signed the Medicare prescription boondoggle, he needs to STFU.
Legislation that benefits Pharma companies and people who are 65+ is a priority for the government, and “depending on the private sector”. But our ever-vigilant Shrub will veto legislation that benefits children. Nice to know he can spot UnAmerican Communist thinking so easily.
You people elected this wingnut? How do you sleep at night knowing you’re so stupid as to be fooled by his BS?
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 10:28 AM | Link to this
RCH: I wasn’t on the blog yesterday so I don’t know what was said behind my back, (I notice that a LOT of people don’t wanna face me “face to face”, they wait until I leave the blog [or never show up] to make derogatory comments about my postings — Debbie thinks they may be a little bit scared of the truth); but BSaplenty, (as I’ve said numerous times), has definitely picked the most accurate blog name of anyone I’ve ever seen.
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 10:30 AM | Link to this
You people elected this wingnut? How do you sleep at night knowing you’re so stupid as to be fooled by his BS?
The people who love him the most are too stupid to know that they’ve been fooled. They think he’s the next best thing since Skoal.
By Dusty
July 19, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this
DebbieDoRight,9:40
Why don’t you and harold get together and share all your dark dismal secrets about who did what?
You are suggesting that the British found “counterfeit documents” about yellow cake in Niger and those documents were PROBABLY MAYBE GUESS WHO (but not saying it was Bush, USA, neocons, Republicans, Cheney…) but just MAYBE, huh??? Or did you mean poor lil innocent Valerie Plame’s husband Joe Wilson?? NO? OH, you meant President Bush? I’m just trying to get your insinuations in order.
And our sleuth harold tries to tell us that we have been bombed with MORE than a broken steam pipe etc. etc. etc. and it is all hidden and nobody will do anything about our BOMB!!! Anything else hidden that you want to tell us about, harold?
You two should join the staff of the Inquirer. They make great “exposures” every day and could certainly use your expertise.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this
Debbie
By BS Aplenty
July 18, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this
While I wish good fortune to DebbieDoneRight when the man runs her out of Techwood Homes I just hope she stays away from my neighborhood. Tough enough to keep the dogs out of the trash
If (I’ll take your low number), 8.2 million people make >50K; and these people have 2.5 children each; then the requested 50B makes more sense then the counter offer of 4.8B made by your lord and master Dumbya.
I don’t think each of these individuals would have 2.5 children. This number would contain couples. Your total spent over the next 5 yrs. would be 70 billion just for these children. Can you imagine if Hillary gets her health care wish for all!
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 10:45 AM | Link to this
You are suggesting that the British found “counterfeit documents” about yellow cake in Niger and those documents were PROBABLY MAYBE GUESS WHO (but not saying it was Bush, USA, neocons, Republicans, Cheney…) but just MAYBE, huh???
“Suggesting” that the documents were counterfeit!??!!! Dusty, where have you BEEN the last few years!!! No suggestions needed, these are FACTS. Or more to the point factual history now.
As to which person/entity planted those false documents to encite a war, perhaps we need to look at this as Dr. Holmes might………
a) Who had the most to gain from America being entangled in a never ending war in Iraq?
b) Who had the most to loose, Iraq or America?
c) Who said, “He tried to kill my dad”? With a catch in his voice and a tear in his eye?
d) Enron
Elementary My dear Dusty….Elementary.
By getalife
July 19, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this
Can you imagine if Hillary gets her health care wish for all!
Yes I can RCH.
Back to the good ole days and the gop disaster will be history.
Looking forward to having sanity return to the WH and the wingnuts marginalized back to a tiny minority where they belong.
By Analchord
July 19, 2007 10:55 AM | Link to this
When did Healthcare become a human right? Since man first climed out of the slime and realized that we are all connected and it’s up to us to help ourselves as part of a united effort.
Healthcare is the first rule of life. In war, the marines never leave a wounded man behind, and risk their lives to save a guy and pull him out to safety. It’s healthcare first in war. It should be in peace too.
Shame on us. Why is there a profit motive for healthcare? Fraud prevention? There’s more fraud in healthcare now than in any other arena of fraud, including our electoral college, supreme court, and congress and every publicly traded corporation. We are Fraudmeisters.
FRAUD!
Is there any doubt about the trickery that lives in every person’s heart? We are evil, we make evil like bees make honey. We are sheep who would do anything we’re told simply because we we’re told to do it.
So I’m telling you to pass National Healthcare for our sick.
Do it. Now.
We’ve got a country to save and a world to convince.
And we’ve got to cleanse the world’s palate from the bitter aftertaste of the W years.
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 11:01 AM | Link to this
RCH: I don’t think each of these individuals would have 2.5 children. This number would contain couples
a) How many children do you think they should have?
b) Why would you automatically assume that the number of children would be for couples only? Have you factored in the variable of divorced or single parents, widows, widowers, grandparents taking care of kids, other family members taking care of kids, etc.?
By Dusty
July 19, 2007 11:03 AM | Link to this
jbmlaw@10:11
You are in top form this morning. What talent!!
On Hillary:”Run for your life, Ahmed!!All American children are getting regular checkups!!”
Your thoughts on the actions of Chris Dodd:”Damn that Bush! He’s inflamed an imaginary enemy!”
In a later post, you mentioned Democrats approving a million dollars for a “center” that does not exist and DEMOCRATS KNEW IT AND VOTED FOR IT ANYWAY. C’est la vie a la Democrat!
Keep up the good work, jbm. I’m leaving here with a smile.
By JD
July 19, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this
You people elected…
So who are “you people”?
Are they the “you people” like DDR and Aquagirl who sponge off those who actually work? The great Democrat Party base of entitlement junkies perhaps? No, no the Dem base would rather we be a Mexican state than the United States - along with the Left thinking President Bush.
DDR and Aquagirl, don’t you just hate when you are caught using a term that for so long has been villified by “those people”?
The Left here keeps referring to the future when Hillary is elected and the troops are out of Iraq but do these Left loons even listen to their Queen? The Shrillary has already been quoted as saying she would maintain a large enough force in Iraq to keep the country stable. How many troops would that be? One hundred thousand?
Much like the earlier post citing the number of Rep leaders sponsoring the SCHIP program, you Left Loons still have not discovered there is no difference in ANY of those clowns in Congress. Dem or Rep does not matter; they are there only for the power that attaches to the office, the perks, the money, the TV time, etc. etc
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 11:10 AM | Link to this
jbmlaw@10:11 You are in top form this morning. What talent!!
You mean he finally caught an ambulance?
By Dusty
July 19, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this
DebbieDoRight10:45
Before I leave, Dr. Watson, please answer the question. Who concocted the counterfeit reports of Niger yellowcake on Bush and Blair?
And please, dear Watson, illusionary questions from propaganda sources are not an answer to the original question. Your quiz is just a ploy to dodge the truth. You should deal with facts, not political delusions.
By the stopper
July 19, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this
upthread we heard:
This wingnut argument would have merit if the gop did not waste over a half a trillion dollars in the Iraq occupation.
No, it still wouldn’t. A single-payer government-funded plan would be more efficient than a profit-based one. If you want waste, keep on keeping this pathetic, corporate-welfare-based POS alive.
the fact that Goopers love to shovel money literally by the palletload to Eye-rack to help kill brown people might help explain why they loath providing workable healthcare for the groundlings at home, but it doesn’t help their argument, such as it is, one whit.
Let’s face some more facts. The reason Jim hates the idea of “Hillarycare” is because it has the word “Hillary” in it.
Not that I think Hillary has the cajones to actually get us a single-payer plan on her own (she’ll have to have her hand forced by Congress). but that’s another topic.
By getalife
July 19, 2007 11:36 AM | Link to this
This headline for this drivel will get Clinton more votes.
We all know she was right about health care but the gop bashed her.
Thanks Jim.
By the stopper
July 19, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this
per JD
The great Democrat Party base of entitlement junkies perhaps?
Oh, what a lovely argument from the basement dwellers!
I’ve been self-sustaining my entire adult life, you pig. I’ve worked in the private sector the entire time. My entire “entitlement” largess, such as it was, was six weeks’ worth of unemployment compensation between one layoff and the next gig, several years ago.
I work my a* off and provide for myself and my family. Part of that responsibility includes providing medical insurance, because this country, alone among civilized industriallized nations, doesn’t do so for its taxpaying citizens. What I get in exchange for a family policy that runs nearly $500/month is a very high-deductable piece of junk, whose premiums are almost guaranteed to rise next year, and the year after that.
So take your foul-smelling right-wing memes and shove them whence they came.
By AmVet
July 19, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this
July 18 2007
FORMER COMMANDER OF THE FIRST INFANTRY DIVISION IN IRAQ PRAISES SENATOR HAGEL FOR IRAQ VOTE
Lifelong Republican, Major General (ret.) John Batiste says vote was “the right thing to do for the troops, the military, and America”
NEW YORK - Former division commanding General in Iraq, Major General (Ret.) John Batiste, today praised Senator Chuck Hagel for his vote to change course in Iraq, despite significant political pressure to do otherwise.
“As a lifelong Republican, I’m proud of the true conservative credentials that Senator Hagel showed today,” said Batiste. “Without a real diplomatic, economic, and political surge in Iraq, the President is continuing to sacrifice American life and limb on a conflict that cannot be militarily resolved. Our incredible all-volunteer force can not sustain the current pace and America desperately needs a focused Middle East strategy. Conservatives never have stood for using our military for nation building or refereeing civil wars, but unfortunately this is precisely what the administration has done. Senator Hagel’s vote was one that is consistent with a true, conservative, pro-military policy.”
The Levin-Reed Amendment to the Defense Authorization Act, which Senator Hagel voted for, calls for a responsible redeployment from the war in Iraq to be completed by the first half of next year.
“This bill will allow our military to refit and rearm, and get us ready for the long term struggle against global Islamic extremism that we face in the years ahead,” Batiste added. “Let no one criticize Senator Hagel for this vote. It is strong, it is pro-military, and pro-security.”
Major General Batiste served in the United States Army for 31 years. His final assignment in the Army was commanding general of the 1st Infantry Division from August 2002-June 2005. During this timeframe, the “Big Red One” conducted successful peace enforcement operations in Kosovo and combat operations in Iraq in support of Operation Iraqi Freedom II. In Iraq, the division was deployed to north-central Iraq from February 2004 until February 2005 and included 22,000 soldiers from active and reserve component units from throughout the United States.
By Dusty's mom
July 19, 2007 11:46 AM | Link to this
Please be nice to Dusty today. She’s all excited about that new Harry Potter book. I had to give her a double dose of ritalin this morning to keep her from bouncing off the walls. That kind of slows her down a little bit and makes her say some silly stuff but it’s better than having to change her bed sheets every morning. I’m hoping she’ll be back to normal next week.
By Where does the insanity stop?
July 19, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this
I no longer want to have the responsibility for providing for my own transportation to and from work and to the grocery store. I want the government to provide me with a car and car insurance. I also want the government to provide my renter insurance and homeowner insurance too. Further, I want the government to provide me with a free college education and furnishings for my living quarters from Ikea. On top of that, I demand the government provide me with a daily meal plan since I no longer want that responsibility either. Then I expect the government to provide burial planning and life insurance for me since I don’t want the responsibility of that either and feel that should be the government’s job. After all that, I expect those rich top five percent of income earners to pay for it all. To heck with individual responsibility. That’s not my problem. Hillarycare - when going to another doctor outside of your government-assigned physician can give you and that physician jail time. Idiots.
By the stopper
July 19, 2007 11:55 AM | Link to this
WhereDoes gave us:
I no longer want to have the responsibility for providing for my own transportation to and from work and to the grocery store. I want the government to provide me with a car and car insurance.
Straw man much?
Jim, better trolls, please.
By Adam
July 19, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this
the stopper @11:33 A single-payer government-funded plan would be more efficient than a profit-based one.
What utter nonsense! I guess this is the reason Grady Hospital is the model of efficiency. No problems there are there? With typical limitless spending of public funds they are so deep into it they can’t figure out a way out. How about a real revolutionary idea - people being responsible for their own expenses. But that wouldn’t live up to the utopian ideals of the Collectivists.
Why stop with healthcare? How about “Single-payer” grocery stores? Everyone has to eat so why not make grocery stores free and open to everyone? Better service, more locations, better selections, fresher stock, at a fraction of the price. Clothing, shoes, utilities, cable tv, appliances, on and on and on. It would be great!!!
Just imagine, all free, no need to work. What a wonderful vision the Libs have, and the best part is they CARE so much more than those evil conservatives.
By BS Aplenty
July 19, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this
Re: AquaGirl
Sweetheart, I’d veto legislation for my mother if it wasn’t the appropriate legislation. You may actually have a point somewhere in your argument if you can brush aside the emotions (that time of the month?) & provide a little factual support. Dropping the word “child” in your argument doesn’t make it valid.
P.S. Nice rant but you still didn’t get the “Little Mermaid” gig.
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 12:09 PM | Link to this
JD: Such a bitter, disillusioned man. Do you, perchance, happen to drive a Depends truck? Is it embarassing to be their number one customer? (He’s not just the driver, he’s a member too). Oh well, you have my deepest sympathy.
OH, and FYI: I had a partial scholarship and worked part-time during the school year and full time during summer to put myself through school. When I graduated I didn’t owe anyone one dime. I am now gainfully employed!!! (With insurance!!! whooopeee!!!), and probably pay more in taxes (properties, etc), then you do driving that Depends Trucks.
You must really hate that huh? :)
By whissler
July 19, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this
NBC is going to pull Law & Order reruns if Fred Thompson announces his candidacy. Their lame excuse is because of ‘equal time’ rules. What? Since when was Sir Fred ever campaigning in L&O? Here’s an idea to settle the matter. Let NBC show ‘The Princess Bride’ after a back to back run of L&O and we’ll call it even with the John Edwards camp.
‘stopper’: fyi, you aren’t very impressive as a dumocrat blog troll.
By BS Aplenty (Piling On)
July 19, 2007 12:21 PM | Link to this
Adam, for a second there I thought you were describing the discredited, failed economic systems of the former Soviet Union and China. Then I realized you were only laying out the long term economic vision of liberal Democrats.
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this
Dear Adam, I hope you never get cancer because the treatment may bankrupt you since you believe in “people being responsible for their own expenses.” Also, I hope your house doesn’t catch fire because I’d hate for you to have to pay to rebuild it from the ground up and replace all of your personal belongs. Since you probably don’t believe in tax-paid fire departments maybe you could hire someone to help you put out the fire since you believe in “people being responsible for their own expenses.”
By jbmlaw
July 19, 2007 12:25 PM | Link to this
Dear Debbie @ 10:45, nothwithstanding your bizarre list of conspiratorial nonsequiturs, you continue to overlook the fact that Joseph Wilson was the primary source of the CIA’s belief that Saddam sought yellowcake in Niger. I think that is what Dusty remembers, and this is why she is teasing you on the subject. Wilson’s report of his meeting with the Niger head of government – that the head asserted that Saddam’s people were seeking to expand trade with Niger, but specifically not for yellowcake – persuaded CIA; Niger has no exports other than yellowcake. Incidentally, yellowcake has nothing to do with Little Debbies.
Dear Analchord @ 10:55, you correctly affirm, “We are sheep who would do anything we’re told simply because we we’re told to do it.” I have often said the same thing, so I’ll warn you, the moonbats don’t want to hear that – it interferes with their effort to rein us in.
By jm
July 19, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
one thing I get a kick out of when listening to conservatives talk about “how the market” will provide when dealing with healthcare is what to do with pre-existing conditions that require long term care (diabetes, high blood presure, etc.) or catastrophic situations (stroke, cancer, etc.). The market has shown how they deal with that, they will drop you like a stone or make the cost of coverage astronomical.
then again, I guess the person with cancer should accept personal responsibility for their fate.
By Adam
July 19, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad @12:24
What a lame response! If someone’s house burns down and they lose their belongings they recover via fire insurance that they have paid the premiums for.
Maybe in your collectivist world that’s another thing taxpayers should be responsible for.
By Scholar
July 19, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
I just don’t think Republicans will ever have the right to talk about wasteful spending after the Iraq war.
By JB
July 19, 2007 12:37 PM | Link to this
For those that think universal healthcare is something thats free from the government. You are far from the truth. Its no more free then highways,police,libraries,lakes,parks,space program and so on. We pay when we pay our taxes. Surely healthcare ranks higher then parks and go fish on a list of priorities. These are government programs we all pay for weather we use them are not. Why can’t we do the same for somethings important as heathcare. We will not become a communist country because we provide healtcare for children as Bush would like for us to beleive by his threat to veto support of programs like peachcare. Why does it hurt him so bad to help americans.
By jm
July 19, 2007 12:43 PM | Link to this
adam@12:34 - hope you never have to file a claim for fire insurance, you might be surprised at what is actually covered and what you are able to recover. If you think you are getting full value replacement, think again.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 12:43 PM | Link to this
By Analchord
July 19, 2007 10:55 AM | Link to this
When did Healthcare become a human right? Since man first climed out of the slime and realized that we are all connected and it’s up to us to help ourselves as part of a united effort.
Healthcare is the first rule of life. In war, the marines never leave a wounded man behind, and risk their lives to save a guy and pull him out to safety. It’s healthcare first in war. It should be in peace too.
That is not health care. That is Emergency aid. It is provided as part of your service in the military. We provide that type of service already at emergency centers. We are discussing health care plans that the tax payer provides.
By melo
July 19, 2007 12:44 PM | Link to this
@JBMLAW&JIM, u said the Iraq war has cost how much?…Its like putting money in a bottom less pit. We started of fighting Sadaam, he is gone. Now who are we fighting?
U want to enforce democracy in Iraq and Iran when u cannot do the same with your friends in Saudi Arabia and Jordan.Saudi Arabia is one of the worst corrupt dictatorship there is. Get a clue Bush lovers.
What is the cost of the meaningless war so far?We cannot even talk about the human killings of Iraqis. Noone is counting them. SHAME!!!
By catlady
July 19, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this
PeachCare provides coverage to children whose parents earn too much to qualify for Medicaid, the taxpayer-provided health care program for the poor.
Thank you, Jim, for NOT saying that Peachcare is for POOR families. It does serve some poor families. I would love to see an income breakdown of Georgia families served. I think it would be eye-opening. (example: For a family of four Under $25,000-20%, 25-$30,000 35%, 30-40,000 35%, 40-48,000 10%) Of course, with medicaid available, the percent under 25,000 would be small, but I would still wonder how many recepients make over 40,000 per year. Does anyone have those figures?
I would like to see something much more modest, IN LINE WITH REALITY, funded, instead of the current give-away.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this
“In the first hour of his testimony, Crocker said Bush’s troop buildup in Iraq was just now hitting its stride and was showing some gains in tamping down sectarian violence in Baghdad” Statement by top U.S. diplomat in Iraq.
If General Patrias(who had high praise from both sides) comes out in Sept. with a favorable report, the Democrats are toaste. No wounder they are in a hurry to cut and run. That will cost them the election. Good news in Iraq is bad news for Democrats..
By HAROLD
July 19, 2007 1:09 PM | Link to this
I want the government to provide me with a car and car insurance.
This is a fair idea. Why allow the government to provide such a huge subsidy to those who manufacture and sell private motor vehicles? (it’s the roads, stupid)
The gub’ment wastes our money on a BIG THREE subsidy while calling it transporation but in fact it does nobody any good unless they spend tens of thousand of ADDITIONAL dollars beyond the taxes that pay for the BIG THREE subsidy (roads) to then drive on them!
Well, the BIG THREE moved to Mexico, so really our roads are just MEXICO SUBSIDIES unless we buy Japanese cars in which case the roads are JAPAN subsidies. Japan does not need subsidies!
The government should be in the business of PUBLIC transportation, not useless roads that do nobody any good unless they spend thousands upon thousands more beyond the taxes they were aleready forced to pay
If the government wants roads to be our tranpsortation system, they need to give us cars too. Otherwise they should be building damn trains and thats it.
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this
AND TO THOSE LACKING READING COMPREHENSION THE POINT IS THAT THE GOVERNMENT SHOULD NOT BE SPENDING OUR TAX MONEY FOR ROADS. THE GOVBERNMENT SHOULD BUILD PUBLIC TRANSPORATION BUT THAT’S IT. IF PEOPEL WANT ROADS, LET ROAD BUILDERS GET IN BUSIESNS OPERATING PRIVATE ROADS AND CHARGE THE USERS DIRECTLY. GEORGIA COULD SELL ALL ITS ROADS TO PRIVATE PARTIES AND OPERATE PUBLIC TRANSIT FOR US. THINK HOW MUCH MUNNI U COULD MAKE SUNNI PERDUE IF U DID THAT! YOUR LITTLE LAND GRAB DEALS WOULD BE PIDDLY PITTANCES COMPARESED TO IF YOU SOLD OFF ALL THE ROADS TO BE OWNERED AND OPERATED PRIVATELY. DO IT SUNNI, DO IT! AND BY THE WAY CLOSE DOWN PEACHTREE. NO CARS ON PEACHTREE BY JULY 4, 2012. TAKE THE TRAIN, WALK, BIKE.. OTHERWISE PAY SOMEBODY WITH A ROAD TO LET YOU DRIVE ON IT.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 1:16 PM | Link to this
Harold While you are at it ,you can not function in this society without a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL. Better put that on the God given right too.
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:19 PM | Link to this
harold you got one thing right.. you are “ale ready”
By Quality Health Care for All
July 19, 2007 1:21 PM | Link to this
Wooten wrote, “One reason the PeachCare debate now underway in Georgia is so important is that it is a test of whether conservatives can rein-in spending for a non-entitlement. It shouldn’t grow into something that entices parents to drop medical coverage for their children in favor of a more attractive taxpayer-financed plan.”
There’s nothing conservative about maintaining a health care system that’s more expensive and more dysfunctional than any other in the industrialized world. Yet, in spite of it’s inherent and inevitable flaws, “conservatives” stubbornly cling to profit-driven health care because to concede the obvious truth would be to concede that they were wrong.
Any economist will tell us that the way to accomplish desired outcomes is to align incentives with those outcomes. A profit-driven health care system where the financial incentive for insurance companies directly conflicts with the desired outcomes of patients (i.e. quality treatment and recovery) could never be expected to work for long. And, as expected, our health care system is failing both the uninsured and insured alike.
Despite the stubborn pride of such “conservatives”, Republicans and Democrats alike at both the state and federal levels are seeking to expand SCHIP. Why? Because it works (just as Medicare, or “socialized medicine”, works for our seniors).
I, for one, am not going to cling to the ideology of “free market fundamentalism” to satisfy the egos of those on the right. I want Medicare for ALL!
That’s why I wrote my Congressman and asked him to support H.R. 676 which would extend Medicare to cover all Americans.
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:23 PM | Link to this
RCH the government is not probiding cell towers without service or laptop batteries with no laptop or cable cards with no service or phones with no phone lines like they provide roads with no cars. how about if the government provdied empty school buidlerings and all the parents had to hire teachers and run the schools on their own? that would be unaccpeted, so why accept roads that have nothing on them? it is ludicrous that we allow them to get away with this subsidy for car makers and call it transportation. they should provide commuter rail or nothing and get out of transporattion altogether. providing a HALF system is in ansult to all taxpayers
By THESURGEWILLWORK
July 19, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
The surge will work, in those areas where our troops are fighting and holding, but the Iraqi situation cant be fixed with the surge.
If we had a million man army in Iraq, then the surge would win the war and peace and we would rule and freedom would fly…for a while, and then the country would fall apart under some other etno-sectarian uprising.
We need a million men. Draft? Fine. Draft. Then watch america howl!
This perpetual war is the result of a man’s stubborness: W! Most wars were the result of one or two men who just couldn’t accept the facts of the situation.
Nobody would vote for war…..D’OH!
By Curious Observer
July 19, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
Thank you so much, RCH. I feel so relieved that we are about to win the war in Iraq—despite what thousands of experts have said. No doubt we will see a quick end to the headlines blaring about dozens of casualties in car bombings and U.S. troop deaths in combat.
Whew! For a while, I was beginning to believe that this war wasn’t winnable. Thanks for setting us straight.
Moron!
By the stopper
July 19, 2007 1:25 PM | Link to this
Adam gave us:
*I guess this is the reason Grady Hospital is the model of efficiency. No problems there are there? *
Stop thinking micro, think macro. Look at the healthcare per capita cost of countries with single pay plans vs. ours.
Comparing Grady to the rest of the United States is, well, idiotic, and I suspect you know better.
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:29 PM | Link to this
the surge is not enough. we need a tsunami!
tsupport our troops with a troops tsumani!
harold heard some nutcase saying we could not leave iraq because there could be headlines reporting that we left iraq. um ok so how to you avoid that headline? only answer.. stay in iraq forever! if a headline reporting your leaving means you cant leave, you are really in trouble! polticiains that stupid should be rebpulcian. oh he WAS republicant. hats right.
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:31 PM | Link to this
saddam had a million man army in iraq. didnt work for him. wont work for us. only solution is gas 10,000 of them and wait for the others to get in line. theres a reason saddam was the way he was. its called ‘country grafting’ like if you made a north amaerican union from canada USA and mexico and then told all the rednecks their new leaders were mexicans. they woudl all kill each other. unless you gassed 10,000 of them and said “get out of line and youre’ next”
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
oh an RCH maybe YOU cannot function without a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL but harold functions just fine without them. they are all useless time an money wasters. you should revaluate why so are so pooor let me help you its a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL and cars too
By harold
July 19, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this
oh an RCH maybe YOU cannot function without a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL but harold functions just fine without them. they are all useless time an money wasters. you should revaluate why so are so pooor let me help you its a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL and cars too
By RCH
July 19, 2007 1:35 PM | Link to this
Curoius Observer ” No doubt we will see a quick end to the headlines blaring about dozens of casualties in car bombings and U.S. troop deaths in combat.” That is not war, that is terrorism. When they perform those acts here, where will you run Curious Observer? The twin towers?
By BS Aplenty
July 19, 2007 1:36 PM | Link to this
Re: jm @ 12:34
I agree. Legislation is needed to address the “pre-existing conditions” gap - it’s the only indictment in the “Sicko” movie that resonated with me.
This concession doesn’t absolve Americans of their poor health practices leading to some of those diseases you mention. The least costly step in healthcare is to first take care of your health - no excuses people. Then we can talk about pre-existing conditions.
By jinkie1
July 19, 2007 1:43 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad at 12:24 — Also, I hope your house doesn’t catch fire because I’d hate for you to have to pay to rebuild it from the ground up and replace all of your personal belongs.
What a great observation! To think those fools who pay home insurance premiums won’t get their homes rebuilt now. What suckers. Should the government pay for that too now?
Since you probably don’t believe in tax-paid fire departments…..
What a foolish comparison. Local non volunteer FDs as well as PDs are funded mostly by local taxes including property taxes. A federal taxpayer in California does not pay for local fire protection in Fayetteville. However, a federal taxpayer in California would pay for health care for someone in Fayetteville with a government mandated universal health care plan. I thought draconian socialized libs always saw gray areas in matters.
By AmVet
July 19, 2007 1:49 PM | Link to this
RCH,
My two cents worth? IMHO, the report in September cannot possibly be “good enough”. It could be good, it could be OK, or it could, like almost everyone preceding it so far, suck.
In any event the Republican, neo-con, Bush legacy is going to almost completely own the situation there.
So even if I was a Democrat I would not be terribly concerned about that changing nor would I be incredulous if the “surge” fails to turn anything around about this clusterfork.
So the question is, is it going to be “good enough” to continue this chosen madness of occupying and policing another country (whose people by and large don’t even want us there nor value American lives!!!) and our guys getting their heads blown off?
IMHO, NFW!
If you have already done so, reread my post of 11:45 in which two guys who actually know a thing or three about combat and have much relevant experience (as opposed to our fearless leaders in the White House) have to say about the “surge”.
This bill will allow our military to refit and rearm, and get us ready for the long term struggle against global Islamic extremism that we face in the years ahead…
Unlike those in the GOP who are completely invested in following this irrational path in Iraq to the very bitter end, some are looking further into America’s future.
Iraq is Arabic for Viet Nam.
By Redneck Convert
July 19, 2007 1:55 PM | Link to this
Hijacked beer truck crashes into police car—AJC headline
I know you all was worryed that it was me in the wreck. Well, it wasn’t me, it was somebody else. Your favorite beer will be there when you get out of church, all cold and fresh. Or maybe when Harold gets off his bike. Or when Sister Dusty rolls out of bed. Nasty woman, that Sister Dusty.
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 1:55 PM | Link to this
Adam, your post said “people being responsible for their own expenses” you didn’t mention insurance.
By Gene's pool
July 19, 2007 1:55 PM | Link to this
Harold, lay off the sauce! The Fed isn’t the only funder of roads in this nation. What in the world do you think local gas taxes are used for, litter control? Even if you don’t use roads and don’t even own a car, unless you grew it or made it yourself, everything you own came to you via roads one way or another.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 2:02 PM | Link to this
AmVet
This bill will allow our military to refit and rearm, and get us ready for the long term struggle against global Islamic extremism that we face in the years ahead…
Who in the hell do you think we are fighting now? And now you want to give those same enemies another platform to engage us from . I would rather battle in Iraq than in the streets of our own cities. Lets wait to hear from the General in Sept. Is that not what both Democrats and Republicans promised?
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 2:03 PM | Link to this
RCH said “you can not function in this society without a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL.” You can’t?? Many people do.
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 2:06 PM | Link to this
RCH said “you can not function in this society without a cell phone, lap top,cable T.V. and DSL.” You can’t?? Many people do.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 2:09 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad
It was being fascias, building on what “Where does the insanity stop?”, was saying.
By DebbieDoRight
July 19, 2007 2:23 PM | Link to this
jmblaw and Dusty: seems that Wooten won’t let me post the truth about Niger here on this blog, every time I try it won’t go through, so I’ll just go over to Luckovich’s blog. Since you both lurk over there, if you really wanna know the truth and not just what Fox News tells you, then go over there and read my post, (with links) for yourselves. If not, then I commend you for your blind obedience to a narcisstic meglomaniacal madman. Oh and the old gray mare w/dementia, (wooten), too.
By AmVet
July 19, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this
And now you want to give those same enemies another platform to engage us from . I would rather battle in Iraq than in the streets of our own cities.
You sound courageous, but I have never, from day, one believed this argument. It relies totally on emotions and opinions. NOT facts. Unless you have some you would share with me.
But here is a fact. We have, to this administration’s credit, not had one single attack on American soil since 9/11. (The essentially insignificant anthrax episode was never conclusively shown to be from Islamic extremists). Why is that, do you think? A coincidence, RCH?
And the chances for another, though some say are inevitable, are small, IMHO, IF and this a big IF, we do even more correct things to protect ourselves. And that means do an even better job of border security, port security, etc. Yes, the job seems daunting, but fear tactics and questionable militarism are not part of the equation.
Getting soldiers and Marines (needlessly, IMHO) KIA in Iraq, which is irrefutably the new magnet for worldwide terrorist scumbags who want to kill our guys, does NOTHING to minimize/eliminate these risks.
There are smarter ways to wage this battle and some have been proposed to and by our elected leaders in Washington, but I fear that this Republican President will never even consider them.
Even so, America will prevail. I am sure of that.
By catlady
July 19, 2007 2:25 PM | Link to this
I thought draconian socialized libs always saw gray areas in matters.
Gray areas, maybe. Gray hairs, definitely.
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
This draconian socialized lib loves her grey hairs! Stop the ageist remarks.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 2:40 PM | Link to this
AmVet
Maybe the old term “the best defense is a great offense” is best seen at this point. It is difficult to plan, organize, and fund such a large operation while being chased all over Iraq and Pakistan. Yes better border security is one of those answers, but the key is to contain the battle to one small area. But more importantly, we must win the battle of ideology. We must communicate to the enemy that we intend to win here and now. Without recourse. We must give the Iraq’s sufficient time to train for their own defense. Then it will be time to leave.
By Adam
July 19, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this
Lily Toad @1:55 - Adam, your post said “people being responsible for their own expenses” you didn’t mention insurance.
Yes Lily, insurance is a way of being responsible for your expenses. You can purchase a policy, pay premiums and get coverage. It’s called individual responsibility and proper planning. I thought I explained that for you at 12:34. Similarly, you should plan for retirement through savings and investments.
Is this a new concept for you?
By AmVet
July 19, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
RCH,
Good points. I don’t necessarily agree with “the one small area battle” argument, but I understand it has some advantages.
One addition I would like to add is that the war of ideology would include some sort of message that attempts to bridge the gap between “them” and “us”.
Kind of a two pronged approach - one message is: screw with us and we will kill you. The other is work with us and we can help you a great deal to improve your lives and futures.
I think of the young people in Iran as a benefactor of this dual message.
Maybe I am just righteously impatient these days, but just how much time is sufficient to get the Iraqis to “stand up”?
FDR defeated the European axis powers in less time than GWB took to secure the road from the Baghdad airport to the green zone.
I know. Not a fair comparison, but again, I am just very frustrated and disappointed in this “war”.
By RCH
July 19, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this
Amvet “Kind of a two pronged approach - one message is: screw with us and we will kill you. The other is work with us and we can help you a great deal to improve your lives and futures”
I agree with this type of approach. The enemy must know that we are serious, yet the general populace must realize we are there to help them get on their feet. As to Iran, they are beginning to have their own problems. Should we throw some gasoline on the fire? How long will it take? Make the enemy aware you will win. A disheartened enemy is an defeated enemy.
“I know. Not a fair comparison, but again, I am just very frustrated and disappointed in this “war”.
So am I . Its like fighting a fog bank. There is nothing to shoot at.It goes away and then comes back. However there is a way. We must destroy their minds.
By jbmlaw
July 19, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this
Dear Debbie @ 2:23, you err in your assumption. I have never clicked over to Mike Lukovich’s blog. I have never seen an intelligent argument in any of his cartoons (although I confess that I have not looked at one in several years) so I cannot imagine any reason to go to that site. Time is too precious, and there are too many other useful things to do. Self-flagellation is a leftist trait.
By Lily Toad
July 19, 2007 3:15 PM | Link to this
Yeah, Adam, I have all kinds of insurance, retirement savings, etc., because I am a healthy, middle-aged, middle-class educated person with a good job. Not everyone is so privileged, and could be devastated by enormous doctor and hospital bills. Why don’t you try a little compassion for those who are less fortunate than yourself and quit preaching personal responsibility when you don’t know anything about people’s situations?
By RCH
July 19, 2007 3:19 PM | Link to this
**jbmlaw”
I made that mistake this once. The topic of the day: “who has been more destructive to this country, bin laden or bush-cheney?”
Need I say more.
By time for the truth
July 19, 2007 3:31 PM | Link to this
FEDERAL JUDGE to the vile treasonous worthless lying Plamebitch:
F OFF AND DIE!!!
Happily this evil hag has failed in its sickening attempt to shake down the govt for yet more grasping personal gain.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D8QFR71G1&show_article=1
By getalife
July 19, 2007 4:20 PM | Link to this
Yes, fake law and rch should keep thir gop lies on this wingnut blog.
Of course, Plame’s case is dropped.
Like the victims of the priest’s child rape, they will get paid but there is no justice.
Geez.
By Adam Fan
July 19, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
Adam at 2:50 assumes that just because individual health insurance is affordable for him that it must be affordable for everybody else (apparently Adam has never heard of “pre-existing” conditions that are unrelated to whether people exercise or take their vitamins).
In addition, Adam assumes that insurance companies are always operated by generous and kind individuals who bend over backwards to make sure their clients are always well cared for.
I can only assume that Adam is an idiot.
By Pope rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda I
July 19, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this
Greetings, Woo-ten Klan trash and the few decent people that blog here, it is We your Pope. Today’s front pagers here in London’s papers - Iraqi insurgent groups meet and pledge to increase attacks until US leaves. The occupation is going so poorly that the insurgents are free and come and go as they please. They launch 5000 attacks a month against US and British troops.
The insurgents define Iraqis not by tribe, but by whether they are with the occupation, and those who are against it.
Most are joining the resistance because of what has happened to their relatives at the hand of occupation forces. Generally, the Brits are seen as less cruel than the Americans.
They know that peaceful resistance will not end the American occupation, that Bush wants to have Americans there for decades.
These folks are in it for the long haul, folks, they are fighting for their homes and families and way of life.
Looks like we got us another Vietnam folks - that’s what happens when you put a Texan in the White House - we lose.
By Really RCH
July 19, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
“So am I . Its like fighting a fog bank. There is nothing to shoot at.It goes away and then comes back. However there is a way. We must destroy their minds.”
That has to be the funniest thing I have ever read on a Woo-tang blog. Thanks, RCH.
By Barb
July 19, 2007 5:20 PM | Link to this
You don’t have to have seen “Sicko” to know that if there is one area of human endeavor where private enterprise doesn’t work, it’s health care. Consider the private, profit-making, insurance industry that “conservatives” are so determined to defend. In general, the great accomplishment of the private health insurance industry has been to overturn the very meaning of “insurance,” which is risk-sharing: We all put in some money, though only some of us will need to draw on the common pool by using expensive health care. And the insurance companies have overturned it by refusing to insure the people who need care the most - those who are already, or are likely to become, sick.
I once tried to explain to a Norwegian woman why it was so hard for me to find health insurance. I’d had breast cancer, I told her, and she looked at me blankly. “But then you really need insurance, right?” Of course, and that’s why I couldn’t have it. This is not because health insurance executives are meaner than other people. It’s just that they’re running a business, the purpose of which is not to make people healthy, but to make money.
But let’s not just pick on the insurance companies. Sunday’s Los Angeles Times featured a particularly lurid case of medical profiteering in the form of one Dr. Prem Reddy, who owns eight hospitals in Southern California. I do not begrudge any physician a comfortable lifestyle - good doctoring is hard work - but Dr. Reddy dwells in a 15,000 square foot mansion featuring gold-plated toilets and keeps a second home, valued at more than $9 million, in Beverly Hills, as well as a $1.4 million helicopter for commuting.
The secret behind his $300 million fortune? For one thing, he rejects the standard hospital practice of making contracts with insurance companies because he feels that these contracts unduly limit his reimbursements. (In a battle between Aetna and Reddy, it would be hard to know which side to cheer for.) In addition, he’s suspended much-needed services such as chemotherapy, a birthing center and mental health care as insufficiently profitable. And his hospitals are infamous for refusing to treat uninsured patients, like a patient with kidney failure and a 16-month-old baby with a burn.
But Dr. Reddy — who is, incidentally a high-powered Republican donor - has a principled reason for his piratical practices. “Patients,” the Los Angeles Times reports him saying, “may simply deserve only the amount of care they can afford.” He dismisses as “an entitlement mentality” the idea that everyone should be getting the same high quality health care. This is Bush’s vaunted principle of “private medicine” at its nastiest: You don’t get what you need, only what you can pay for.
If government insurance for children (S-CHIP) isn’t expanded to all the families that need it, there is no question but that some children will die — painfully perhaps and certainly unnecessarily. But at least they will have died for a principle.
By osaycanusee
July 19, 2007 5:40 PM | Link to this
we aint nevah gonna git outta iraq.
By BS Aplenty
July 19, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this
Re: Barb
There’s no free lunch, Barb. Insurance doesn’t exist unless it’s profitable otherwise it’s called charity.
But I’ll make you a deal - I’ll agree to universal healthcare for you if you’ll become an MD and provide your medical services free.
By catlady
July 20, 2007 8:19 AM | Link to this
I still think we should hire Israel to take care of Iraq. They would take great personal satisfaction in it, be cheaper and work even harder than our own GIs (if possible), never ask to be pulled out, and they would do it quickly. Plus, Iraq would “get ready” to take care of itself a WHOLE LOT quicker. Right now, we may be killing them with our kindness.