Thinking Right

By harold

July 3, 2007 8:05 AM | Link to this

Harold says two things this morning..

One, to be a good right winger means only that you DENY what you do, not that you don’t do it. See the movie but deny having seen it. Like that meth and gay sex preacher buying meth: You bought the movie ticket so nobody else could see the movie. You were just about to throw it away.

Second, how do you seriously think anybody is going to create an active lifestyle for themselves? You insist that walking and bicycling are not viable forms of commuting, so how are we supposed to squeeze in some activity?? Already there is no time. That’s what leads people to eat the garbage that makes them fat, and the lack of time for activity keeps them fat. To make us less obese we have to squeeze in some activity somewhere. Only way to do that is to eliminate time elsewhere. Your commute is a great place to look for time that could be freed up. Walking and cycling to work can work. People all over the world do it. Why don’t we here? Bad choices.

The viability of walking to work depends very highly on where you live and where you work. If the Marta train fits in there very nicely then you can greatly extend the distance between the two end points as long as each end point is very close to a Marta station. You really have to plan your life carefully to be able to walk to work.

Cycling, though, is much less dependent on where you live and where you work. Cycling depends on what’s in between home and work. If the DOT has kept cyclists in mind in their never-ending scrap-and-redo road projects, you can easily bicycle 10 miles to work and arrive maybe 10 minutes slower than if you had driven. Bicycle to work just 3 days per week and you have your active lifestyle. If your workplace lacks showers, yeah you might be a little smelly. A sink bath is only so effective. However, if you continue hauling your lazy butt to work in a car every day and just keep getting faster, you are gonna get fat man B.O. anyway so a wee bit of a smell is inevitable.

People have all sorts of reasons not to bicycle.. What if it rains? Feel free to drive that day. What if I have to buy my 50 pound of dog food? Drive that day. I have to look great for the big meeting today.. DRive that day. I should stop by the grocery store on the way home.. If you are doing a lot of shopping, drive that day. It’s no big deal. You don’t have to bicyle EVERY day to be a bicycle commuter. Cycle every other day and you’ve just turned one month’s gasolien budget into two months. You’ve taken $2.79 gasoline and effectively made it $1.40. What about hauling clothes? Drive one day and swap out clothes for the week. Even Harold drives to work sometimes. HOpefully one of his driver’s licenses is not supsended!!

Anyway if you walk or bicycle to work then you can eat cuban sandwiches and not get fat.

By jbmlaw

July 3, 2007 8:06 AM | Link to this

Good morning all. Somehow I suspect the blog will go off topic within 10 minutes of opening – can you say “Scooter” without injecting another paragraph? Nevertheless, government control of the health care industry is a worthy topic and merits discussion.

One striking assertion in the morning essay: “Combining the free market’s medical care innovation and invention with a totalitarian state’s ability to manage lifestyle would, no doubt, produce a remarkably healthier population.” I can agree with the factual assertion only so long as we limit “healthier” to the physical meaning. (You know baby-killers define “health” much more broadly than the physical meaning.) Thus NYC prohibits trans-fats, I assume under penalty of death for any deviant restaurateur. I would never dine in NYC, for the sake of my non-physical health.

The difference in perspective between “progressive” and conservative arises before the Rawlsian curtain descends in the first place. The core issue is that “progressives” insist that only they know the correct amount of our limited financial resources that should be burned for this generation’s healthcare; we conservatives sense that our society, if allowed to choose, would spend less than the “progressives” demand. Further, “progressives” generally demand that poor people be allowed to demand that others pay their medical bills, without limit. Thus the system to be erected by “progressives” is one with no cost constraints, and one with guaranteed corporate welfare to those producing the health industry product. Or, in other words, the “progressives” give us the superior care of Grady Hospital, or, alternatively, the “progressives” give us a world – like Cuba – where every pleasant thing is drained from society to prop up an excellent healthcare system. Our “progressive” friends remain amazed that, despite the magnificent health care and great weather, nobody wants to move to Cuba.

We conservatives, in contrast to our “progressive” friends, would eliminate the gentle touch of government from the industry entirely, and allow the supply and demand to meet without subsidy or quota. I understand that “progressives” insist that health care is too important to be left to the decisions of free people; I simply disagree. So which of us is the Sicko?

By RCH

July 3, 2007 8:07 AM | Link to this

When Michael Moore’s fat butt needs triple by-pass surgery, I wounder where he will have it done? The USA or Cuba?

By Rich

July 3, 2007 8:11 AM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten don’t you think column on “Sicko” would have been better if you had seen it?

I have a bootleg copy of “Sicko” I’ll send you if you like. Moore won’t mind, I feel sure. Perhaps seeing the thing you report on is against the By Laws of whatever, too. Moore is right, health care is a mess and everyone knows it. Except you. You’re busy not seeing the film and babbling about socialism. No one gives a damn about your ideological labels. I hear you saying “I haven’t seen the movie, but it’s bad.” “Socialism!”

You like the libraries, the police, the post office, the fire department, the ambulance service, the public schools, the military, don’t you? All collective “socialism” Ironic your column is next to the Grady article. Not your best work. Next time, see what you write about, eh? That’s not much to ask.

Otter357

By harold

July 3, 2007 8:13 AM | Link to this

Scooters are another problem.. The only place these morbidly obese people will walk is to get more food. When the Krogers and the Publix supply scooters for the morbidly obese, they are not doing anybody any favors. Force these incredible fatasses to walk at least around the grocery store for their food!!!! Harold can’t wait for Jack’s comments today. Jack DOES love the fat ones!

By Scooter

July 3, 2007 8:18 AM | Link to this

Hmmmm, government takes responsibility/power over health care and then dietary habits make government’s health care system too expensive. Then, politicians can begin to ban specific foods - for the “common good” of course.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 8:23 AM | Link to this

Harold. What are you doing at 5a.m. I have already begun to my 45 bike ride with a 30 minute walk with the dogs to follow. My question is always this; if your Dr. told you you would die tommorow if you don’t start excercising today, would you find the time. Yes, you would make the time!

By Anonymous

July 3, 2007 8:25 AM | Link to this

Wooten’s half-right; changing our lifestyle would be a big boost to our overall health (although, as Harold has pointed out, our rabid free-market rampage means nobody has time for anything but work and consumerism).

But national healthcare would be the other half of the equation. Not only would it take us a bit closer to living up to our democratic ideals, but it would significantly cheaper than the broken system we have now.

By Ricardo Chavira

July 3, 2007 8:26 AM | Link to this

There are a few things to keep in mind in comparing the U.S. to Cuba. The latter is a third world country, with all the deprivations that brings. For instance, with no McDonalds, Wendys and all of the other junk food outlets we’re blessed with, most Cubans have to eat limited quantities of healthy food. The life expectancy is equal to ours and infant mortality is lower. The health care system is grim by our standards—few computers, no posh waiting rooms with magazines—but it’s free.

By harold

July 3, 2007 8:28 AM | Link to this

Uh, RCH, Harold is advocating making time to exercise from time currently wasted sitting in a car.

If Harold had the resources of TV salespeople he could become billionaire selling product that keeps you skinny and cuts gasoline costs in half and gets you out of traffic three days a week: a commuter bicycle. Harold would employ sexy hairless actors and cover them with oil because this apparently speeds up purchases.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 8:28 AM | Link to this

This just beats all!! Scooter gets out! So I guess the only people who have to serve their time, no matter how biased or “unjust” the sentences are the poor and the minorities. Since the rich are the ones who are benefitting so much from this great theocracy that Dumbya and his buds have thrust upon us; then perhaps THEY should be the ones risking their lives in Iraq and Aghanistan. Because all of a sudden “We The People” is starting to stand for “We The Rich People Who Rule This Rock”.

Dissuade anyone who is not “Upper Class” from serving in the Armed Forces. Let the richest 10% blood spill for once.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 8:29 AM | Link to this

This just beats all!! Scooter gets out! So I guess the only people who have to serve their time, no matter how biased or “unjust” the sentences are the poor and the minorities. Since the rich are the ones who are benefitting so much from this great theocracy that Dumbya and his buds have thrust upon us; then perhaps THEY should be the ones risking their lives in Iraq and Aghanistan. Because all of a sudden “We The People” is starting to stand for “We The Rich People Who Rule This Rock”.

Dissuade anyone who is not “Upper Class” from serving in the Armed Forces. Let the richest 10% blood spill for once.

By Katharine C. Otto, MD

July 3, 2007 8:29 AM | Link to this

I disagree with the concept of universal insurance instead of direct health care for services.

However, I agree with the idea that American nutrition and American knowledge about nutrition is pathetic. Let’s look to McDonalds and all the fast food conglomerates, shall we? Those who subsidize the media with advertising, and all the Ronald McDonald houses at hospitals?

Let’s look to the fact that doctors know next to nothing about good nutrition and don’t educate patients about it.

The least expensive food is also the most nutritious and the healthiest, because you’re not paying for advertising, packaging, processing, and distribution. Fresh produce, dairy, dried beans and the like, don’t need advertising. They sell themselves, but do you hear anyone in the medical or media establishment praising their benefits?

NO.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 8:30 AM | Link to this

It’s not the plenty, Jim; it’s the plenty of WHAT. By subsidizing animal feed we produce the cheap big mac. By subsidizing the paved world and gasoline, we produce the drive-thru, mass-produced and shipped foodstuffs, and the inability to walk anywhere. Harold beat me to the point that any subsidies for transportation aside from the car are unthinkable in this column.

And what an interesting choice of places to bring Cuban-style authority—pregnant women. Yes, like a true Right-Winger, you want to choose the groups that the government can treat like children. How about we take the potato chips away from the 55 year old white men who have had triple-bypasses?

Oh, and I think your Conservative friends would have allowed you to pay the $8 or so to see a film that you’re criticizing by default. It’s questionable journalism to hack a movie that you didn’t see. “Sicko” raises some good points about the state of health care in America. To not even listen to the opposition’s case under pretense of not supporting them is close-minded. It’s the mark of a Bush fan.

By Mid-South Philosopher

July 3, 2007 8:30 AM | Link to this

In the words of the old woman in church, who, when the preacher started to bemoan the sinfulness of taking a dip of snuff, stated forcefully, “Hold up now, Preacher [in this case, Jim] you have stopped preaching and gone to meddling!”

While there is ample room for improvement of the corporatist dominated drug companies and health care provision conglomerates (I think we ought to apply the No Child Left Behind logic to them), you are right on target that we Americans are eating ourselves into oblivion.

“Guilty, your honor, thrice Guilty!”

Incentives are one answer. National health savings accounts are another. United group buying (a non-labor “union” of people joining together to get a better deal is still another.

National health care is NOT. In fact, it would be the biggest nightmare in the 21st Century.

Now here is where we will disagree, Jim.

The corporate, government, and business interests, who, when health insurance was cheaper in the 1960s and 70s, used it as a perk to keep from paying more to workers in wages, need to have the privilege of continuing to pay it for those people who have depended upon it for all these years.

Sonny Perdue’s slimy insinuation several months ago that the state might have to drop health insurance coverage for retired teachers is a prime example of what I am talking about. In the 70s and 80s, the George Busbees, Tom Murphys, and Joe Frank Harrises all poor-mouthed and held teacher salaries to a minimum level. It wasn’t until Zell Miller that wages were brought into the 20th Century…sort of.

Of course, Sonny’s warning was just one way of getting us old fools ready for an increase in premiums. We would all rather pay more than to lose our coverage. Shame on you “silly Sonny!”

This is just one example. There are many others in the private sector. I am sorry for the corporatists, and they can refuse to pay it on new hires, but for those who have borne the burden in the heat of the day, it ought to be theirs.

By Redneck Convert

July 3, 2007 8:31 AM | Link to this

Well, when the missus read your column this morning, she just about had a heart attack. Said it was a shame that a good conservative like Wooten would go off like a librul and start putting down the food she likes. Anyway, she said she was going to keep cleaning out the meat and mashed potatos at Ryans on steak night, she didn’t care what Wooten said. Next thing you know Wooten will be putting down pork rinds and Cheese Whiz and MacDonalds and all the other food us rednecks love. I don’t know what has got into Wooten lately. He wants cameras to spy on us and now he wants to make us walk when there’s perfectly good pickups to take us where we need to go. I think he’s lived in the city too long.

Me and my buddy Jim Earl was talking about My President letting Scooter Libby off without a stretch in a pen. Anyway, Jim Earl says a good Republican like Libby should have got off scot free anyway because there wasn’t no crime to investagate. So the lying don’t matter. I decided right then and there that if the police ever started investagating me, I was going to lie like a cheap rug because if I lie and make it too hard for them to find a crime there ain’t nothing wrong with the lying. Its only bad if they find a crime in spite of me lying.

Anyway, leave the doctoring just as it is. Don’t go spending my tax money on getting doctoring for Those People and the other bums in this country. If we let it be, alot of them will die off and we can get our two House seats back here in GA. If they really need doctoring they can just go to any hospitle where its free. And we can keep the White House and keep that Hillary woman out of there. This Michael Moore is nothing but a trader. I turn my back to the TV every time he comes on.

By Anonymous

July 3, 2007 8:31 AM | Link to this

RCH: Even by your standards, that’s a pretty weak dodge. Moore notes that America has a great healthcare system—but only if you’re rich.

Which, of course, is counter to our American ideal.

By Katie

July 3, 2007 8:40 AM | Link to this

Americans are wasteful, overweight, self indulgent people—on the whole. There are many who do their best to conserve but over all we are much fatter than any other culture.

By Jeff

July 3, 2007 8:44 AM | Link to this

241 years ago, several men got together to declare their independence from an overgrown, corrupt government.

241 years later, the very government those men founded has become overgrown and corrupt. (Both Democrats AND Republicans. I find EXTREMELY FEW - as in I can probably count them on one hand - HONEST politicians AT ANY LEVEL.)

Those men 241 years ago had it right: the only thing the National government has a right to be involved in is coining money and the common defense. EVERYTHING else should be left to the States and the People.

National healthcare, like National education, will only lead to the ruination of this once-great land.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 8:47 AM | Link to this

Anonymous Millions of Americans are not rich but have health insurance, provided by their employers. Millions have no insurance yet receive medical services through the govt.(same as Cuba)Basic medical services are available to all. I think you will find it rare that an individual dies of medical neglect in this country.

If you can afford better health care services than the average person, so be it. When Fidel Castro became ill, they flew a specialist from Spain to treat him. Would they have done that for the average citizen? No.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 8:54 AM | Link to this

Oh, and if Jim had seen “Sicko” he’d have noticed little details. Like Michael Moore wrote a check to cover medical expenses for one of his big bashers. This guy’s wife got sick, and even with insurance the costs were enough to threaten his livelihood of running a big Moore-bashing website.

Given that, I’m sure Michael Moore would have let Jim in to see his movie free.

By Jeff

July 3, 2007 8:59 AM | Link to this

Aqua:

So in other words, Moore took advantage of a man during a very trying moment in that man’s life for Moore’s own political gain.

Sounds once again like it is Moore that is the true “Sicko”.

By Jim

July 3, 2007 9:00 AM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten wrote, “…a stroll through the streets of Havana and other parts of Cuba… reveals few people who look like Michael Moore. You’re more likely to see him at Five Points in downtown Atlanta, at an all-you-can-eat buffet in Marietta…”

Wooten goes onto to assert that Cubans are healthier because of “totalitarian state’s ability to manage lifestyle”. Mr. Wooten apparently hasn’t traveled to London, New York City, Paris, Rome and other non-totalitarian cities where effective mass transit and mixed use development get people out of cars and onto sidewalks. If so, then he would have found that there is little obesity in urban environments with more opportunities to walk and fewer opportunities to drive. Wooten’s “totalitarian state” theory is, in fact, more demagoguery.

Also, for the record, Michael Moore has continually stated that the American lifestyle is a significant part of our health care woes. He has repeatedly confessed his hypocrisy (or denial) on this matter, began walking for 30 to 60 minutes per day, added fruits and vegetables to his diet and has lost 30 pounds. When fat-man Newt Gingrich was my Congressman, I went to a town hall meeting where he was blustering on about “personal responsibility” being a significant part of the solution to our health care worries. I wonder how Newt’s lifestyle changes are coming along.

By harold

July 3, 2007 9:04 AM | Link to this

we dont want to put city life on a pedastal though.. to be fair it is the 20somethings and 30somethings who live in the city and wear fancy clothes. once they pop out a baby or two they move out from the city and get fat. maybe it’s the babies that makes people fat. how many gay couples are fat? hardly any

By vivifiant

July 3, 2007 9:05 AM | Link to this

I’ve read the initial article and the comments and it seems nobody here knows what the movie is about. Maybe all you know about it derives from Fox TV. The movie is not about Republican bashing, it is about exposing the problems of a health care system based on uncontrolled health insurances who’s primary objective is to care about share holders not about insured. That’s all. That’s is the whole topic of the film. So by bashing the messenger you side with the insurance companies against the US citizen. I am a European living since over a dozen years in this country (declared the best country on the face of this earth by Americans who have never traveled to countries like Sweden or Switzerland etc.)I think many things are working well in a capitalist country favoring capital over work, but some pilars of safety should not be left to the free market: education, health care and retirement should be safe and sound. I only wish you would be able to live for some time in France to understand. I lived in France for 10 years and, after watching the movie, I cannot find any statement made by Michael Moore that is not accurate. Many services provided in France are even understated. And France is not a socialist of communist country. It is a capitalist country with some checks and balances. Just watch the movie and then comment here. Have a pleasant day. Vivifiant.

By harold

July 3, 2007 9:05 AM | Link to this

“Moore took advantage of a man during a very trying moment in that man’s life for Moore’s own political gain.”

So what. Show Harold a politician (R or D or anythign else) who hasnt had a dead soldier’s wife in the audience to be recognized and thanked in the last few years.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 9:08 AM | Link to this

DebbiedoRight A pardon for a man that supposedly lied about something where no crime was committed, years after it happened, and where all concerned had conflicting testimony. Sounds like a political witch hunt to me.

Lets take Bill Clinton’s pardon of Marc Rich, who fled the country not to stand trail, who’s wife contributed millions of dollars for a presidential library. Are you going to compare the two?

By Curious Observer

July 3, 2007 9:12 AM | Link to this

If you can afford better health care services than the average person, so be it.

There’s good little Republican, plutocratic lap dog. Here’s a treat for Fido.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this

By william

May 24, 2007 1:14 AM | Link to this

Folks, there is a cancer growing in America’s society and it is money and power. This is very noticeable if one just stops, looks, and listens. The elite, rich, and powerful individuals, corporations, and a collaboration of industry and other organizations and institutions have bought the United States Government, and are attempting to install an oligarchy form of government in which a few persons hold the ruling power.

The cost of gasoline keeps climbing higher as vaction time approches. Most Americans expect that gas prices will be at or above $4 dollars by years end. It will cost some Americans who are at the lower end of the wage scale (mimium wage) a day and a half to fill up their tanks. Most of these people make only $5.15 per hour and simplely cannot afford gas at these prices. Meanwhile, Exxon Mobil reported this year the largest annual profit of any U.S. company ever, $39.5 billion. That folks is #75,000 dollars a minute in profits. The Gas and Oil industries donated to the Bush Presidential campaign in 2004 two and one half million dollars, and this was from just the Oil and Gas industry spending on and to one person.

The Pharmaceutical Industry has given millions to the Republican President and members of Congress in return for a secured industry-friendly changes to landmark drug safety Bill, according to public records and interviews. The Bill grants the Food and Drug Administration broad new athority to moniter the safety of drugs after they are approved.

The U.S. Senate allow the drug Vioxx to stay on the market for years after signs that it could cause heart attack. “It is not that money buys votes”, said Senator Bernie Sanders I-VT., the lone vote against the bill “ but you have a cultture in which big money has significant influnce. Big money gains you access, access gives you the time to influnce people”.

The pharmaceutical companies spent $ 855 million dollars more money on lobbying than any other single industry from the year 1998 to 2006 according to the non-partisan Center for Public Integrity. In the Defense Industry alone the Republican party and it’s candidates recieved $9,996,874 dollars or 62% of the donations handed out by the different organations in the Defense Industry during the 2005-2006 year election cycle and was released by the Federal Election Commission on Monday, February 19, 2007, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

Corporate donors from the Defense Industry have seen a high return on their campaign contributions and have seen exponential growth. These have not been proportional returns, as the top contribution have not in all instances been the companies to be awarded the most contracts. The Defense Industry in general has enjoyed unprecedented growth during the Bush administration, and much appears to be linked to former Republicans and Defense officials involved in both the Pentagon and private companies.

The Republicans are doing their best to get a lock on political power. After the reorganization of political thought that culminated with the “contract on America” in the mid 90’s the Republicans captured a majority in both houses of Congress. The way they did it was hitching the imcumbency to the wealth of industries and conservative churches via K street, and by using other despotic and anti-democrary tactics, These tactics let lobbying budgets blind legislators to the real needs in our country and eventually made some of them blind even to the difference between a bribe and a legal favor, with the false assumption that “anything goes” as long as money goes into the campaign fund.

The Republicans out spent their opponents in most of all the recent elections. This is why they so vehemently oppose McCain-Feingold initiatives!! They are back at this facade again, lining up their ducks in a row and counting all the feathers. Are Americans going to fall far this luncy once more. If they do it may be a long long time before they will ever vote again.

By vivifiant

July 3, 2007 9:15 AM | Link to this

I’ve read the initial article from Jim Wootan and the comments above and it seems nobody here knows what the movie is about. Maybe all you know about it derives from Fox TV. The movie is not about Republican bashing, it is about exposing the problems of a health care system based on uncontrolled health insurances who’s primary objective is to care about share holders not about insured. That’s all. That’s is the whole topic of the film. So by bashing the messenger you side with the insurance companies against the US citizen. I am a European living since over a dozen years in this country (declared the best country on the face of this earth by Americans who have never traveled to countries like Sweden or Switzerland etc.)I think many things are working well in a capitalist country favoring capital over work, but some pilars of safety should not be left to the free market: education, health care and retirement should be safe and sound. I only wish you would be able to live for some time in France to understand. I lived in France for 10 years and, after watching the movie, I cannot find any statement made by Michael Moore that is not accurate. Many services provided in France are even understated. And France is not a socialist of communist country. It is a capitalist country with some checks and balances. Just watch the movie and then comment here. Have a pleasant day. Vivifiant.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 9:19 AM | Link to this

So what. Show Harold a politician (R or D or anythign else) who hasnt had a dead soldier’s wife in the audience to be recognized and thanked in the last few years.

Bingo, Harold. It’s only exploitation if it’s the other side doing it.

Moore’s alleged exploitation aside, there was a good reason for that story to be in Sicko. Basically, here was a guy who was about to lose his livelihood because of medical expenses. Now, the guy says his website was saved by contributions from his faithful supporters, not Moore. I can certainly believe that.

But what happens if you can’t pay medical bills and you don’t have a website to ask for help? Answer: you lose your job. And home. And health insurance, so now you have a wife with a serious illness and little chance of getting health coverage ever again. And go from being a productive citizen (Michael-Moore bashing is a legitimate contribution to society)to being a drain on society.

By Rod

July 3, 2007 9:19 AM | Link to this

My oh my, Wooten failed in two areas today (Only two you say? yeah, for now). He has shown again how little (if any) integrity he has.

1st - He bashes a movie which he hasn’t even seen. That’s just a.s.s.inine. Who the hell reviews a movie without watching it? Gonna give us a food review without going to the restaurant while you’re at it? You could even expense the ticket to the AJC and not have to pay. No self-respecting journalist would ever do something this heinous.

2nd - Wooten cowardly avoid the Scooter situation. The story broke yesterday, so it should be your topic today. If it was something the Democrats did, he’d totally re-write his blog to blast about it. But again, Wooten has no integrity. He’s just a two-bit opinionated bloat who has no sense of right and wrong.

Grow some balls Wooten and do your job right.

By melo

July 3, 2007 9:22 AM | Link to this

We conservatives, in contrast to our “progressive” friends, would eliminate the gentle touch of government from the industry entirely, and allow the supply and demand to meet without subsidy or quota JBMLAW,Would it be okay to privatise Police force and the Fire and Rescue sevices as well.Just let market forces determine if its worthwhile to come over to ur house when its burning? Your answers ti this will be interesting to me. Matters pertaining to health cannot just be left to the whims of those who seek to get the maximum dollar.Its just plain common sense.

As for the Scooter, in the Bush-Cheney world, it was destined that he be reales because not doing so would have guaranteed that he was going to sing and write a ‘good,juicy and revealing’ book. He can now go ahead and work in Cheney’s garden.

By gttim

July 3, 2007 9:25 AM | Link to this

So in other words, Moore took advantage of a man during a very trying moment in that man’s life for Moore’s own political gain.

The guy certainly could have stood by his wingnut convictions and turned down the evil liberal’s money. I guess money is more important than other things. Which, by the way, is what Sicko is all about. It is about how money, specifically profit, is more important than making people better. There lies the problem with financing a national health care system with insurance. The health of the people is never the first priority.

BTW, it is so funny to see all the wignuts, who have for years been screaming “It wasn’t the sex, it was the lying” now start screaming that the lying wasn’t important and certainly isn’t a crime. Hypocrisy, thy initials are GOP! It is sad when you guys can only justify your ethics by yelling “But Clinton did it!”

By K-Squared

July 3, 2007 9:29 AM | Link to this

Jim Wooten fails to inform his readers that much, if not most, of the “free market’s medical innovation and invention” are a result of funding provided by our federal government via the National Institutes of Health. Of course such misinformation is to be expected from a market fundamentalist who relies more on faith than on reason (market fundamentalists maintain the exaggerated and irrational belief that the market solves all problems).

Market fundamentalism is what prevents us from having universal health care, mass transit, trains that cross the nation, and government efforts to reduce carbon emissions. The list, of course, is endless. If we don’t address misguided efforts to privatize every government service that would otherwise benefits all of us (e.g. military operations, health care, free education for all, privately operated toll-roads), we will ultimately fail to progress as a State and as a nation.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 9:30 AM | Link to this

Curious Observer Providing basic health care is the norm in this society, especially if it is provided by the taxpayer. If you want more you should have to pay for it.

By getalife

July 3, 2007 9:33 AM | Link to this

Geez Jim,

I thought you would be praising w today for commuting Libby.

He did it for you and the other cons.

Cons love cons and treason.

They hate the law.

KO ripped w a new one last night.

Called him a gutless coward for commuting Libby in a press release on a 4th of July holiday.

I agree.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 9:38 AM | Link to this

We conservatives, in contrast to our “progressive” friends, would eliminate the gentle touch of government from the industry entirely, and allow the supply and demand to meet without subsidy or quota. I understand that “progressives” insist that health care is too important to be left to the decisions of free people; I simply disagree. So which of us is the Sicko?

Oh, I didn’t realize that was Bush’s Evil Progressive twin at the signing of the multibillion dollar Medicaid drug bill. That created a lot of gentle government intervention. Wrinkly people now get government-subsidized drugs at whatever price the pharmaceutical companies deem fair.

Conservatives were quick to bash Hillary Clinton for her idea of socialized healthcare, then they came up with their own socialized plan that benefited them more.

Who’s did you think was Sicko again, jbmlaw?

By harold

July 3, 2007 9:39 AM | Link to this

at least this bush administration has FINALLY taken a step in support of alternative commutes

By Richard Patterson

July 3, 2007 9:39 AM | Link to this

Only an idiot would review something they admit they have not even taken the time to see. Anyone whom reads your review has just wasted their time and I feel this must be the same each week with anyone reading Mr Wooten’s column.

By Mid-South Philosopher

July 3, 2007 9:41 AM | Link to this

As to the Scooter Libby matter, while I don’t mind the President commuting Scooter’s jail term, it only goes to prove that he is at best a half-a**ed chief executive. If he had any guts, he would have pardoned Libby and ended the matter.

Valerie Plame’s status as a CIA operative was the most loosely kept secret in Washington since James Buchanan’s closet gay status before the Civil War.

Sure the outing of Plame was retaliation for Joe Wilson’s column. A blind man, even a not too smart one (conservative or liberal) can see that.

Neither, Richard Armitage nor Robert Novak, the leak and the drip respectively, are not in jail. Billy (Out, out damn spot) Clinton, who lied to a grand jury, is not in jail.

I think Scooter should be totally exonerate. Come on Georgie, I thought you were supposed to have the gonads.

By Luke

July 3, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this

Insurance companies claim to reduce health care costs by “managing wellness” (as Wooten puts it). In fact, HMOs (for example) decided to reduce health care costs by reducing the patient’s ability to see a physician (I was forced to see a physician’s assistant who couldn’t diagnose a textbook case of eczema) and deny care (a friend who was covered by Kaiser Permanente was denied necessary operations after a serious automobile accident and was forced to go outside the Kaiser network to get the needed care at her own expense).

I’m now covered by Blue Cross/Blue Shield of Georgia. Just last week, my doctor prescribed a non-steroid cream for the above mentioned eczema because it’s safer for long-run use. BCBS denied coverage for this prescription, because according to them, less-expensive (steroid) creams are available. So, because of the profit motive, my insurer gets to tell my doctor what he can and cannot prescribe.

Managing wellness, my a$$.

By Adam

July 3, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this

So what else is new? All of our woes are due to the evil, despicable, vile, greedy corporations and their wicked lust for profits. Yes we may have all the healthcare, pharmaceuticals, food, gasoline, housing etc that the market demands but horrors - someone’s making a PROFIT!!!

Let’s turn to the wonderful, pure, sinless system of socialism. It will solve all of our problems. We will have better doctors and medicines, not to mention energy sources, housing and more at a mere fraction of the price. It’s simple, just turn everything over to the government and our worries are over. After all we can see the remarkable success of government run education.

By Richard Patterson

July 3, 2007 9:44 AM | Link to this

Only an idiot would review something they admit they have not even taken the time to see. Anyone whom reads your review has just wasted their time and I feel this must be the same each week with anyone reading Mr Wooten’s column.

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 9:49 AM | Link to this

Brilliant, Mr. Wooten! Brilliant! Even by your infamous standards!

Don’t go and see the movie so that you might actually be able to speak intelligently about the pros AND cons of it.

Notwithstanding Katie’s valid points at 8:40, you instead, do what you do best. Rather than address the REAL issues and possible solutions proffered by the film, use the fact that the director is overweight as an excuse to spin the topic into something almost on target. Be sure to use a few red herrings and figures about strokes in Cuba.

And then predictably end your “argument” with the right wing rallying cry of “Don’t let the socialists allow the government into anything that can be controlled by market forces”! And voila! The magical neo-conservative formula of debate is again reached!

And my esteemed “non-progressive” friend jbmlaw echoes the cry with We conservatives would eliminate the gentle touch of government from the industry entirely.

And there might very well still be cars without seat belts (Go Ralph!), toxic lead in the paint of baby cribs, countless more dead coal miners, a Love Canal near every elementary school (OK, a little hyperbole there) and nary a tree left in our National Forests if not for those evil, intruding government policy and safety enforcement types.

It takes a compromising coalition of labor, management (to use those dreaded terms) and the government “of the people” to fix something so obviously broken as our “health” care system.

Nine million kids without proper, if any, access to care. More people bankrupted by medical bills than for ANY OTHER reason. And no sense of urgency in Washington, or almost anywhere else for that matter, to even address the problem in a meaningful way.

Quit deflecting, Mr. Wooten.

Or maybe, you’re thinking right - lets just leave it up to those bright and conscientious men who own the pharma and insurance industries to solve the indisputable problems. They’re doing a great job so far. For themselves.

So with a track record like this, it is no wonder that I see your writings as many times one-sided, off base or simplistic. NOT what I would consider common sense, but certainly “Thinking” “Right”.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 9:50 AM | Link to this

Adam

“Let’s turn to the wonderful, pure, sinless system of socialism. It will solve all of our problems. We will have better doctors and medicines”

Is this why people from Canada come here for medical treatment?

By Lauren

July 3, 2007 9:53 AM | Link to this

Wooten wrote, “The solution is not socialized medicine. It’s to build incentives into this one so that we’re not killing ourselves”

Jim Wooten,

It’s too bad that my Grandma didn’t have the incentive to prevent the birth defect that damaged her heart and required multiple open heart operations. It’s too bad that my co-worker didn’t have the incentive to prevent that brain tumor that killed him. It’s a shame that my neighbor didn’t have the incentive to prevent the Parkinson’s Disease that made the latter half of his life a living hell. If only my niece had the incentive to keep her from developing the asthma that prevents her from being able to go outside on a smoggy Atlanta day.

Mr. Wooten — You know what you can do with your incentives, don’t you?

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 9:54 AM | Link to this

RCH: NEWSFLASH: The majority of the people that Clinton pardoned had already either (a): Completed 2/3 of their sentences or (b): Were in prison to begin with!!

Scooter never even made it to B!!

Also some of the ones who were “convicted of drug offenses” were mostly women, caught up in the “pushers girlfriends” category and/or were caught between a rock and hard place because they were trying to turn state’s evidence on their boyfriends, but when the boyfriend cut a deal to give the Feds bigger fish; were cut loose and their statements used against them. They weren’t “active participants in the drug trade”. They were sacrificial lambs for prosecutors unwilling to loose face agains the “war on drugs”.

By Mid-South Philosopher

July 3, 2007 9:55 AM | Link to this

Sorry…fourth paragraph in the 9:42 post should have read:

Neither, Richard Armitage nor Robert Novak, the leak and the drip respectively, are in jail. Billy (Out, out damn spot) Clinton, who lied to a grand jury, is not in jail.

By jm

July 3, 2007 9:56 AM | Link to this

well, improving the diet and exercise is a good starting point. However, there is still the conflicting nature of insurance. The insurance provider’s goal of maximizing profit is in direct conflict with the insurance consumer’s goal of maximizing usage. Until that is solved, there is going to be a problem with health coverage.

By tlc

July 3, 2007 10:00 AM | Link to this

America’s healthcare is fantastic - if you have a group insurance plan through your employer and/or a ton of money. The point of the movie is that a very large portion of Americans do not have access to this fantastic healthcare. I agree with the blogger who suggested that you actually watch the movie before critiquing it. I’m one of the lucky ones who has an employer sponsored healthplan, but I have also been on the other side of the fence. Until all citizens have the same access to America’s fantastic healthcare then the its healthcare system will be “Sicko” and the insurance company executives will be filling their pockets.

By Katie

July 3, 2007 10:00 AM | Link to this

Wooten says the solution is not socialized medicine, but we already have socialized medicine in the form of Medicare, and no doubt, Jim’s friends and family are relatively happy with it.

I don’t see what the controversy is about. Remove the cap on the Medicare payroll tax, so that those in the lower and middle classes don’t continue to subsidize Medicare for those in the upper classes, impose a carbon tax to supplement Medicare funds while simultaneously reducing our carbon output (killing two birds with one stone) and expand Medicare to cover all Americans. Even if payroll taxes go up slightly, they’ll be a hell of a lot cheaper than health insurance premiums.

Problem solved.

By getalife

July 3, 2007 10:07 AM | Link to this

Our “corrupt to the core” (hat tip/ Joe Wilson) loves their socialized medicine.

Guess who is paying to replace dick’s batteries.

Geez.

By 911

July 3, 2007 10:08 AM | Link to this

Wooten is right,Americans are fat and lazy especially in the south!yes we do need to exercise and eat more healthier foods.But Wooten forgot to tell you is that eating heathy is more expensive than eating junk food!Look at Mcdonalds and Wendy’s,they all have $1.oo hamburgers,as opposed to buying vegetables which can be expensive,a bag of chips is cheaper than fruit,a can of soda costs less than bottled water,look at all the all you can eat buffets,all the food their is bad for you,but if you are poor thats all you can afford to go take your family. Now you people get off the internet today and go do some exercises!

By 911

July 3, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this

Wooten is right,Americans are fat and lazy especially in the south!yes we do need to exercise and eat more healthier foods.But Wooten forgot to tell you is that eating heathy is more expensive than eating junk food!Look at Mcdonalds and Wendy’s,they all have $1.oo hamburgers,as opposed to buying vegetables which can be expensive,a bag of chips is cheaper than fruit,a can of soda costs less than bottled water,look at all the all you can eat buffets,all the food their is bad for you,but if you are poor thats all you can afford to go take your family. Now you people get off the internet today and go do some exercises!

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 10:10 AM | Link to this

Why don’t you would be editors get your own column instead of telling Wooten what to write?

Wooten said in the beginning he did not see the movie. But like most people, he has heard the gist of this movie which sounds much like the other movies of Moore. (I haven’t seen it either and don’t plan to spend a cent to see how Moore runs down the country this time.)

Moore specializes in demonizing America. He never shows the freedoms and benefits of living in the greatest country in the world. He “immortalizes” every petty incident he can find to prove that America is one sorry place to live. But will he leave it to enjoy the pleasure of other nirvanas he always treasures? No indeed. He sticks like a leech to the USA while trying to suck the blood out of it.

I have no use for such people. State your facts and work to improve what is not doing well. But don’t undermine the country to do it. That is the Mooreish Method of Malicious Meddling.

You can support that method if you have the same goals as Moore. But don’t fool yourself that it is “to help”. It is a money-making political endeavor from Hollywood that should be graded as a Grade “C” movie to incite the ignorant and the naive.

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 10:12 AM | Link to this

Rich’s point at 8:11 and melo’s at 9:22 truly go to the point of this issue.

The health care industry, like police forces, fire departments, etc address matters of LIFE AND DEATH.

This isn’t some silly debate about deregulating cable TV or even natural gas. (BTW did anyone else here in Georgia notice how the price went up and the value down after deregulation in those industries?)

The fact that they are for-profit goes to the heart of the matter. Greed is good, right, Mr. Gekko?

You bet your dying two year old, who needs some “unapproved” medicine or operation, it is.

By Janine

July 3, 2007 10:13 AM | Link to this

Mr. W. The solution is not socialized medicine. It’s to build incentives into this one so that we’re not killing ourselves” In a country where freedom is a core value…and you, Mr. W…remind us of this in almost every column….Citizens have the right to be wrong!!! Eating and exercise habits cannot be legislated ! And who is to actually know for sure any of the stats we see daily….[remember lies, damn lies, and statistics??] are really valid. You know the story, Asians have a lower incidence of heart disease, but die twice as often as Americans of stomach cancer. As long as we value freedom, legislating personal habits is not a good option.

By harold

July 3, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this

if everything can be excused by finger pointing at the previous administartion, what Hilary will be getting away with truly scares harold

By RCH

July 3, 2007 10:16 AM | Link to this

Katie Why not get a great education and job skills, therefor prompting competitive business to offer you health care as part of your employment. That way my taxes don’t increase to provide your health care and you won’t have any premiums at all to pay because your employer will.

If at the time you don’t have health insurance, cut back on the beer, eating out, $200 pair of shoes, and driving a luxury car. Then go buy some.

By harold

July 3, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this

harold cannot substantiate this, but harold heard mr wooten has been seen around town with that bringer of badness, crazy harry potter lady laura mallory!

By Adam

July 3, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this

RCH@9:50

You’ve hit it exactly. Surely you saw my tounge in my cheek.

By Curious Observer

July 3, 2007 10:20 AM | Link to this

Sadly, the minute that Congress and a new Democratic administration work a single-payer health plan through the system, the employers who have opposed such a plan vigorously will dump all their health care costs onto it.

Let’s be realistic—there will be no health coverage for those without it until this corrupt administration and the jackals of the insurance and pharmaceutical industry in Congress are out of office.

But it will come. Health is simply too fundamental to human welfare to be left to the capitalistic system. We are the only so-called advanced nation not to provide universal health coverage.

For another 18 months or so, the Republicans will be able to continue to shill for their campaign donors and to assert that health is just another commodity to be bought and sold in the marketplace. Come January 2009, however, it will be payback time, and it will be sweet. I look forward to hearing Wooten, jbmlaw, RCH, Van, Dusty, tftt, and other right-wing hangers-on squeal when they get their fat paychecks and see the deduction for federal health coverage.

By Renee

July 3, 2007 10:22 AM | Link to this

Dusty - an a.s.s. again as usual. Blasting a movie just because you don’t like Moore. Um, the movie isn’t about bad republicans - you know. Therefore, it’s okay if you see it.

Get a clue.

By In other words

July 3, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this

Why don’t I, a would be cartoonist and ultra-hypocrite, get my own column instead of telling Luckovich what to draw? CONSTANTLY.

By A V 8 R

July 3, 2007 10:24 AM | Link to this

Michael Moore’s full of dung as are his followers, Get the koolade ready michael they’re on the way, so much for the pied piper of doggydoo.

By JUSTICE AT LAST - SCOOTER IS FREE!!!

July 3, 2007 10:28 AM | Link to this

At long last Bush finally does the right honourable thing and (albeit shamefully only partially) pardons Libby. He should clearly have wiped the slate completely clean … no fine, no probation. But a weak, constantly pandering to leeches president is running skeered of the leftist filth so the expected weak Bush response to this despicable hypocritical very selective lynching will have to suffice.

I am really looking forward to ALL the glorious endless hysterical screeching from the treasonous hateful leftists at this glorious news. Plame and Wilson deserve jail time for lying and for being utter scumbags - they deserve utter life long scorn for their corrupt, vile self serving venal lies and their irrational anti-Bush hate. Watching the noxious Klinton hypocrisy over pardons is beyond freaking hilarious!! Dingy Harry Reid who sleazily lined the pockets of his money grubbing kiddies and himself in NV in various sleazy deals needs a good (verbal) kicking to remind him of the importance of intellectual honesty!!

CONGRATS TO SCOOTER at this timely - albeit sadly incomplete - honourable natural justice.

The Arkansas rapist raped two women, one in England, one in Little Rock, It openly lied to a grand jury, commited perjury, openly sold pardons for its library slush fund to the highest bidder, stole White HOuse furniture, sexually harassed many women, used the IRS to intimidate/audit those who exposed his corruption and lies and it still didn’t serve any jail time.

Nice to see the unhinged crackpipe debbieturd hysterically racebaiting again over nothing. You go you sullen hateful lardarsegirl!!

harold needs to try riding his new stolen bicycle from Baghdad Airport to the heart of the Green Zone in Baghdad. That should shut him up for a little while!!

By Richard

July 3, 2007 10:30 AM | Link to this

Of course Wooten is going to call Moore fat and consider his opinions wrong simply because he’s fat. Wooten is as prejudice as they come.

If you’re not rich, white, male, non-fat then your opinion doesn’t matter. He’s constantly insulting (without cause) anyone who’s poor, black, fat or female.

Wooten, grow up.

By Janine

July 3, 2007 10:32 AM | Link to this

Just a thought….In this country…. a person who purchases his/her own health insurance [one who is not covered through employment] and who is diagnosed with a serious illness, leukemia for example, will face hugely increased insurance premiums that are unaffordable for all but the very wealthy. Our FOR PROFIT health care system is unsustainable. Regardless of which political party is in power in 5 years, some form of national health insurance is on the horizon.

By Renee

July 3, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this

I see tftt is blaring his usual hatred (and ignorance of actual facts). Shame, he doesn’t even have the balls anymore to use his own name - he uses other names so it looks like many people agree with him.

He’s a sad little puppy (smirk)

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 10:37 AM | Link to this

Wooten said in the beginning he did not see the movie. But like most people, he has heard the gist of this movie which sounds much like the other movies of Moore. (I haven’t seen it either and don’t plan to spend a cent to see how Moore runs down the country this time.)

Oh, so it’s great to comment on things just on hearsay from sources you approve. You’re back on the crazy train today Dusty.

Dusty, if you want to bash things without reading,hearing,watching, or thinking about them, it’s just par for the course. Join the nut in Cobb who wants Harry Potter off the library shelves. But Jim is a journalist. Even if it’s a opinion column, he should try to check out facts before commenting. His ethics as a journalist should trump his personal dislike or bias.

If he really can’t stand “Sicko” or Michael Moore, leave them out of the colunm. He could have written the entire thing without mentioning either. How do you rationalize visiting Cuba, but then say you won’t spend less than $10 to see a movie by a left-wing guy who is supposedly (as far as you heard) pro-cuba over the US?

BTW, Michael Moore does say good things about the United States in Sicko. If you had seen the film before popping off at the mouth you’d know that.

I don’t know about his other films, I haven’t seen them, so have no comment—unlike you and Jim.

By WTF

July 3, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this

I’m curious if we should read anything into Jim’s complete aversion to the biggest news item of the day — Bush’s commutation of Libby’s sentence. I don’t think the old-by-now story about Sicko and Michael Moore is the obvious topic on such a news-worthy day.

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this

To find the source of the near disaster with our “health care” system, just follow the money.

I saw where Sen. Obama says that he is not taking money from certain (any?) PACs, lobbyists, corporations, etc. to finance his campaign. I hope it is true.

To my knowledge, he may be the first serious candidate for President other than Nader to do show some real integrity in this regard.

And this amazingly unusual unwillingness to be bought and sold by the highest bidders is the first thing I’ve heard about his run that makes me want to look at him very seriously.

harold, maybe Jim and Laura are going to team up with Monty Python and clean up Lawrenceville!

“What do we burn besides witches?”

“MORE witches”!

By Sicko FAN

July 3, 2007 10:42 AM | Link to this

When you take a look at the 5 letter word GREED; that truly defines the sicko problem in this country. From the white house to the “hood” $ is the motivator. But in reality, The gun-slingin RIGHT…protect what benefits them. the healthcare industry & our “decider” commit murder daily. the only difference is that one does it in IRAQ and the other does it right here in America. Dude, we all have the same fate..last time i checked my blood is as red as yours. Deny healthcare to someone who needs it? I might as well put on my BDU’s and go to GITMO…I then can get some of the best health care America offers.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this

If health insurance had the status of driving a Mercedes, everyone would have it.

By getalife

July 3, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this

Wooten is scared to watch the movie.

Coward.

Pathetic.

Geez.

By Adam

July 3, 2007 10:44 AM | Link to this

Lauren@9:53 It’s too bad that my Grandma didn’t have the incentive to prevent the birth defect that damaged her heart and required multiple open heart operations. It’s too bad that my co-worker didn’t have the incentive to prevent that brain tumor that killed him. It’s a shame that my neighbor didn’t have the incentive to prevent the Parkinson’s Disease that made the latter half of his life a living hell. If only my niece had the incentive to keep her from developing the asthma that prevents her from being able to go outside on a smoggy Atlanta day.

This has to take the prize as the most asinine comment today. I guess socialized medicine will instantly eliminate birth defects, brain tumors, Parkinson’s and asthma. In addition to being “free” it also accomplishes scientific and miracles and there will be no more disease or maladies. There is seemingly no end to the wonders of socialism.

By Corn

July 3, 2007 10:44 AM | Link to this

It’s appropriate.

The president who led the nation into a disastrous war in Iraq by peddling false statements and misrepresentations has come to the rescue of a White House aide convicted of lying.

Before the ink was dry on yesterday’s court order denying Scooter Libby’s latest appeal — a motion to allow him to stay out of jail while he was challenging his conviction — George W. Bush commuted Libby’s sentence. Libby will no longer have to serve the 30-month prison sentence ordered by federal district court Judge Reggie Walton. He will, though, have to pay the $250,000 fine that was part of the sentence.

The commutation — which is not a pardon and does not erase Libby’s conviction — is a reminder that Bush and his crew do not believe in accountability. Bush has been rather stingy in the use of his pardon power. And regulations issued by his Justice Department note that recipients of pardons should serve their sentences and demonstrate contrition before obtaining presidential absolution. (Libby had expressed no remorse and was not scheduled to report to jail for several weeks.)

Yet with this commutation, Bush ducked those requirements, and he is allowing Vice President Dick Cheney’s former chief of staff, who was found guilty of lying to federal investigators in the CIA leak case, to go unpunished. The fine will be no problem for Libby. His neoconservative friends and admirers will kick in to cover that tab. (Perhaps even Cheney will send a check.)

Libby had become a symbol of the Bush White House’s problem with the truth. After all, his lies had been designed to block FBI agents and federal prosecutors from learning the full truth of a White House effort to discredit a critic who had accused the Bush administration of twisting the prewar intelligence. And now the final act in the long-running CIA leak scandal — Bush’s commutation — stands as another symbol of this grand theme: lying doesn’t really bother this crowd.

By Renee is a pathetic lying leftist cow

July 3, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this

@ Reneebitch

you sad pathetic whining lying leftist cow … its kind a nice when the id and post “gel” - eh love?

Its actually more fun using different factual/fair comment witty ids, like this one - happily it usually gets the leftist filth on here that little bit more wound up!!

I see the bleating little DICK is still being a sullen race baiting hateful lying DICK!! Well done very small DICK - bet your hubby never asks you to stop DICKing around - eh DICK_head?

By GodHatesTrash

July 3, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this

The Arkansas rapist raped two women, one in England

tft-tranny’s mother has no idea who tftt’s daddy is - could have been anyone one of a few thousand guys hanging around the arse end of Liverpool looking for some street action.

Years ago, tft-tranny’s dear mum told him that his daddy was Bill Clinton. The English, like rednecks, always claim to be the bastard offspring of royalty.

Unless Bill Clinton was hanging around the back alleys of Liverpool, there’s no way he ever met your mother, you silly POS. And, since Bill likes sex with women, he never met your pappy either.

So - you filthy redneck Englishwoman POS - dream on.

Maybe your daddy was Maggie Thatcher?

Good God, what a leprous lesion you are on the arse of humanity, you fey POS pustule.

Pure unadulterated trash.

By Jake

July 3, 2007 10:59 AM | Link to this

Responding to Lauren’s 9:53 comment, Adam sarcastically wrote, “I guess socialized medicine will instantly eliminate birth defects, brain tumors, Parkinson’s and asthma”

This has to take the prize as the most asinine comment today. Of course, Lauren was pointing out that free market incentives, such as those advocated by Mr. Wooten, could have no impact on the ability to prevent many major illnesses and diseases. That point, it seems, went right over Adam’s pointy little head.

By so towel heads are terrorists!! DUH!!

July 3, 2007 11:02 AM | Link to this

In todays Daily Telegraph - a comment from amazingly enough a sitting Labour MP who actually has some balls - unlike the cut and run pandering multicultural filth running the execrable BBC and the Guardian. He was predicktably excoriated by multicultural leftist vermin immediately after 9/11 for these sensible, pragmatic views though. One of the VERY few lefties in this world with an actual brain!!

‘Islamist’ is the word for these terrorists By Denis MacShane MP

Why consult the crystal ball when you can read the book? Bevin’s epithet is more than ever appropriate as Britain wakes up to the beginning of a long combat with the Islamist ideologies that send young men to kill and maim our citizens.

The calm, rational, determined and unfussed response of the new Home Secretary, Jacqui Smith, as well as sombre language from the Prime Minister, Gordon Brown, is a welcome change after the theatricalities of declaring war on terrorism, or instant consultation committees whose members are keener to denounce Britain’s foreign policy than ask hard questions about the thought processes that guide the suicide and car bombers.

Six weeks ago, David Cameron wrote an article in the Observer criticising those who used the word “Islamist” to describe the ideological roots of the terrorist threat. Yet “Islamist” is an accurate description of a global ideology that has been slowly incubating for decades. It took 69 years between the writing of the Communist Manifesto and the imposition of Bolshevik terror on Russia after 1917. Hitler’s hatred of Jews was derived from writings and ideologues active before he was born. The Islamist equivalent of Marx’s revolutionary appeal can be found in the writing of the founder of the Muslim Brotherhood, with a growing presence in Egypt, as well as off-shoots such as Hamas and a European network, including prominent members of the Muslim Council of Britain.

Writing in the 1930s, Hasan al-Banna declared: “The Koran is our Constitution. Jihad is Our Way. Martyrdom is Our Desire.” At a stroke, the history of modernity that is based on separation of faith and democracy, church and state, politicians and priests was overturned. Today, it is al-Qa’eda and the myriad Islamist outfits from Indonesia to Britain who are inspired by Islamist ideology to carry out evil acts.

These are repudiated by decent Muslims everywhere. I spend more time in mosques than in churches in my constituency of Rotherham, where 10,000 Muslim citizens live. Their imams and members of mosque councils are men of peace. They teach their children to recite the Koran, just as I learnt to recite the Latin mass as an altar boy. British Muslims know the difference between their faith and the ideologies of Islamism. For Mr Cameron to deny the concept of Islamism would have al-Banna and all the other founding fathers of Islamism laughing in their graves.

But measured and impressive as the Government’s response (and, to be fair, Mr Cameron’s) have been to the attempted atrocities in London and Glasgow, the fact is that the Labour Government, Whitehall and the entire political-media class in Britain have been slow to wake up to the need for an intellectual-ideological confrontation with Islamism.

I experienced this first-hand when, in November 2003, as Europe minister, I made a speech after Islamist terrorists drove a lorry bomb into the British consulate in Istanbul, killing scores - mainly Turks. At the same time, a young man from South Yorkshire had been groomed by Islamists into becoming a suicide bomber in Tel Aviv.

I made what I thought were banal points, saying a choice had to be made between “the democratic rule of law, if you like the British or Turkish or American or European way, based on political dialogue and non-violent protests, or the way of the terrorists, against which the whole democratic world is now uniting. We need to move away from talk of martyrs and I hope we will see clearer, stronger language that there is no future for any Muslim cause anywhere in the world that validates, or implicitly supports, the use of political violence in any way.”

Read today, those words are so commonplace every MP would endorse them. Four years ago, they were seen as provocative and unacceptable. “Experts” wrote articles denouncing me. Inside the Foreign Office, I was ordered to negotiate with a representative of the Muslim Council of Britain a partial retraction of my statement. I regret now my temporising, based on the genuine upset I could sense among Muslim friends in Yorkshire and, of course, any politician’s wish to hold on to office.

Now, there is no excuse. If ministers and MPs want to know where terrorism comes from, they can read Ed Husain’s book The Islamist, with its self-explanatory sub-title “Why I joined radical Islam in Britain, what I saw inside and why I left”. Husain is one of a growing number of British Muslims who are telling the truth. Shiv Malik’s remarkable reportage on the Islamist factionalism that won control of the July 7 bombers in Leeds can be read in a recent issue of Prospect. Unlike non-Muslims who tried to raise issues before a complacent political-media world was ready to listen, today’s witness from British Muslims cannot be gainsaid. They are not like Tariq Ramadan, the grandson of al-Banna, who writes reverently about the founding father of Islamism. Recently, Prospect published a sympathetic profile interview of Ramadan. Last month, the magazine’s editor, David Goodhart, wrote an open letter to him after Ramadan condemned a meeting at Downing Street that included Muslim leaders opposed to Islamism. Goodhart pointed out that neither foreign policy nor racist attitudes in a Britain where Muslim citizens have freer lives than in any Muslim state can justify the constant attacks on British democracy from the Islamist ideologues.

Ramadan did not deign to reply. He remains however a Whitehall consultant - despite his refusal to call for the abolition of stoning women to death under sharia.

But the days of refusing to confront Islamist ideology are drawing to an end. There is a new determination in government to spell out hard truths. And soon someone will explain to David Cameron that there is such a thing as Islamist ideology and Islamist terror crimes, and that they represent a fundamental challenge to everything Britain and British citizens - of all faiths and none - stand for.

Denis MacShane was Europe minister, 2002-05

By so towel heads are terrorists!! DUH!!

July 3, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this

THIS IS EASILY THE BEST ARTICLE SO FAR ON THE RECENT TOWEL HEAD OUTRAGES IN THE UK!!

Daily Mail. Richard Littlejohn

The car bomb you are calling may be switched off - please try later!

Difficult to know whether to laugh or scream after the weekend of madness we’ve just been through. And it’s not over yet, with the security level raised to ‘critical’ and another terrorist attack imminent.

So let’s get the laughter out of the way first, something which wouldn’t have been possible had the bombers succeeded and hundreds of innocent people been killed or maimed.

Mistake One as far as the jihadists were concerned was trying to set off car bombs in the West End of London. The chances of either vehicle staying put for long enough to detonate were always going to be negligible.

In Westminster, you can get ticketed at traffic lights. One of them was towed away because it was parked on a double yellow. The second was spotted by two alert paramedics attending to a paralytic drunk, a routine casualty of another quiet night under Labour’s rock-around-the-clock drinking regime.

We’ve only seen pictures of one side of the green Mercedes in the Haymarket. From a different angle, it too may well have been clamped, awaiting the removal truck.

Then there was the folly of relying on mobile phones to spark the explosion. Apparently they made at least two failed calls. What did they expect? Have you ever tried to get a signal in Piccadilly at chucking out time?

“The car bomb you are calling may be switched off. Please try later.”

At least they didn’t try loading their deadly cargo into a couple of SUVs. They’d have been beaten up by the provisional wing of Friends Of The Earth before they’d had time to set the fuse.

And if they forgot to pay the congestion charge, their chances of escaping detection would have been less than zero.

Meanwhile, in Glasgow the attack was foiled when the Jeep packed with petrol, propane and nails hit a bollard outside the terminal.

They would have needed a 4x4 just to get over the Crazy Golf speed humps on the approach road. Only in Britain could traffic calming and wheel clamping make a major contribution to homeland security.

My favourite moment was the interview with the have-a-go hero at the airport who helped apprehend one of the would-be bombers. His account went something like: “I saw this Asian guy running towards me shouting ‘Allah’ — so I battered him.”

Go on yerself, big man. I’m surprised he hasn’t been charged with racially-aggravated assault.

Curiously, by yesterday morning this clip had vanished from the TV news websites — along with reports of passengers yelling “Let the bastard burn” as police grappled with the suspect who set himself on fire.

Call me flippant, but gallows humour is the only thing which is going to get us through this with our equanimity intact.

It’s best not to dwell on the enormity of what has led us here. In yesterday’s Mail, Melanie Phillips summarised superbly not just the deranged evil of those who seek to destroy us, but also the frightening criminal negligence, stubborn stupidity and callous indifference of those charged with protecting us.

Don’t blame the police or the intelligence service, this is a mess made by politicians. I felt like retching when Gordon Brown sauntered on camera to announce that the safety of the British people was paramount.

Here is a man who for the past ten years has been one of the two most prominent members of a government which has turned Britain into a playground for jihadists.

Labour tore up border controls, allowing a mass influx of Islamist psychopaths from all over the globe. Radical preachers and terrorist recruiting sergeants were encouraged to settle here. They were fed and watered, handed benefits, council houses and free cars.

Two years after 9/11, Captain Hook was still given a police guard to peddle his message of hatred and murder on the streets of Finsbury Park. Omar Bakri was safely tucked up in free accommodation in Edmonton and driving a brand new people carrier paid for by the mug British taxpayer.

These were but two among tens of thousands of Muslims living among us who make no secret that they hate Western society and intend to establish an Islamic state in Britain. Yet Gordon Brown’s government wasn’t interested.

Those of us who had the audacity to question the folly of allowing Islamic radicalism to foment in this country in the name of ‘diversity’ and ‘multiculturalism’ were smeared as ‘racists’.

Background checks on those coming here were somewhere between cursory and non-existent. It turns out that almost all the members of the terror cell involved in the weekend’s failed attacks were doctors.

Why the hell are we importing newly-qualified doctors from Iraq when we’re training thousands of home-grown medical students for the dole queue?

Two men still on the run are described as members of a Middle Eastern terror cell who moved to Britain last year. How did that happen? Who voted to make this country a safe haven for Middle East terrorists? Why were they allowed in? And if they were known terrorists, why weren’t they subsequently rounded up and kicked out?

Don’t expect any sensible answers. And don’t expect anything to change, either. Under Labour, the ‘human rights’ of terrorists always come way ahead of the safety of British citizens.

We’re being treated to the same fine words, platitudes and trite analysis from the usual crowd of useful idiots we hear after every Islamic terrorist attack.

All you need to know is that the Government has no intention of ‘getting tough’ and the calls to the Muslim ‘community’ to offer up the extremists in their midst will fall on deaf ears.

We can only thank God that this little gang were so inept. Laugh while you can, next time there might be nothing to laugh about.

Let the bastards burn.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 11:14 AM | Link to this

This is not a democracy. It’s becoming more and more of an oligarchy.

When Karen Armatrout died of cancer in 1997, her husband, Richard, collected a modest amount in life insurance benefits from her employer, Wal-Mart. But Armatrout claims that, unbeknownst to him, Wal-Mart also collected on a life insurance policy, one the company took out on Karen Armatrout years before without her knowledge.

The attorneys, who have brought three identical lawsuits against Wal-Mart in Texas, Oklahoma and Louisiana, say the company made use of favorable tax regulations in Georgia, which allowed the company to take out corporate-owned life insurance policies without the employees’ knowledge. (Better check your company to see if they have insurance out on you!)

Wal-Mart settled the suits in Texas and Oklahoma, where the company paid back 100 percent of the benefits, amounting to just over $5 million.

Along with Armatrout’s case in Florida, another suit is pending in Louisiana.

In the previous cases, Wal-Mart attempted to argue that Georgia law applied because that was where the policies were purchased and paid out. But the courts found that the proper venue for deciding whether Wal-Mart had an insurable interest was the deceased’s state of residence.

SIDEBAR: Can anyone guess how much WalMart has paid to Isakson, etc. here in Georgia? How about the State’s insurance commissioner - you know the one who’s supposed to be looking out for OUR best interest?

By Tony

July 3, 2007 11:15 AM | Link to this

Moore did not just compare the U.S. to Cuba. He also compared it to France, Canada, and Britain.

If our doctors had more time and incentive, they could take the time to counsel people on how to better take care of themselves. Doctors are pressed for time during patient visits and encouraged to do procedures which bring in money rather than talk to people about how to stay out of the hospital by changing their lifestyle.

Government is not the solution to everything but neither is the free market. Jim needs to read something besides Ayn Rand occasionally. When are the moderates in this country going to rise up and take over the discourse?

By the way, I have conservative friends who are always repeating the line (almost word for word) about not giving Moore any money by buying tickets to his movie. Is there a secret talking paper that goes out to card carrying right wing nuts so that they are all on the same page or do they all get this from Rush?

By Adam

July 3, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this

Jake Perhaps you could explain to my pointy little head how the glories of Collectivism will bring these miracles about. Has the great vaunted Cuban medical system eliminated these diseases? If so please share this breaking news.

You guys get so touchy whenever someone questions the supremacy of Socialism.

By JD

July 3, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this

Katie@10:00,

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

There is no cap on the Medicare deduction from salaries and wages. The cap is on social security - Medicare deductions are unlimited.

I know of a case where an individual paid over $15 million dollars of Medicare tax in one year. That is right all you little Socialists out there - $15 million dollars.

The point both sides are missing in this debate is that ALL the members of Congress and the White House are complicit in the ills you are arguing.

One post described the money contributed by Big Pharma and Defense to the Republican Party in this decade, in an attempt to vilify the party in power. Analyze the same information when the Dems are in control and the answer will be the same. The donors do not care to whom they contribute, just hold the majority and the White House.

Those of you looking to the government to protect your health, or your earnings, or your food, or your education, or just about anything else domestic, are dreamers pure and simple.

There is not a dimes difference in any of the candidates for President. They are all big government, steal from the people, take from the donors, to hell with the borders, one-world government and line their own pockets, POLITICIANS.

There are fewer than a half-dozen true conservatives or true liberals in Congress or the Executive Branch.

If George Bush were actually a Conservative there would be no IRS today, there would be no budget deficit (war or no war), and much of the government would not exist (Depts of Education, Commerce, etc.).

Bill Clinton did little or nothing as President to advance left-wing politics, yet that was how he ran.

None of you “get it”, once in Washington the only goal of a Member of Congress is to stay there.

The President, Dem or Rep, simply tries to establish policies to advance his PARTY, not conservative or liberal platforms.

Occasionally, as in the case of the Senate Immigration Bill, the people can speak loudly enough to be heard. Only in the extremes does Government care for the opinion of the people. The politicians have learned there is a huge middle ground extending both left and right that will not rile enough voters to cost them their jobs but still benefit their political ambitions. Until we end the reign of career politicians this will remain the way of the US Government.

By RectilinearPropagation

July 3, 2007 11:24 AM | Link to this

Well of course we need to take better care of ourselves. However, I believe that Sicko is more about health insurance than health care. Exercising and eating right won’t prevent you from getting hit by a drunk driver.

Injuries and illness can happen even if you take the best possible care of yourself. The problem (at least the one addressed in “Sicko”) is the health insurance companies deny legitimate claims and people stay sick and injured because they can’t afford to pay out of pocket.

By HA HA HA HA nambla has gone beserk!!!

July 3, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this

SNIGGER SNIGGER SNIGGER SMIRK SNIGGER

My best ever elicited hissy fit folks!!! Such a proud moment (NOT!!).

The resident hate America child molestor Mrs chokesondick Oedipus-NAMBLA has truly puked up the finest most poisonous bilious load of bollocks yet psychotically posted at yours truly. My humble daily effortless goading of the pinko human scum on here is worth every second when one beholds such opulent hilarity as this.

Cheers and a huge thanks very much rednekkks vermin - that’s made my day. Now you can hopefully immediately die in quiet peace, knowing you’ve surpassed yourself - just once in life.

I know that having a heavily soiled chipped and cracked test tube for a mother and a deadbeat analwart ridden necrophiliac obese chemically castrated hog for a father made life in that home for unwanted flatulating hunchbacked yanKKKee bastards very difficult for you. Your deeply ashamed of you uncledaddy wasn’t George Lincoln Rockwell was it? Or KKKlansman D Byrd, or David Dukes pappy? But you stoically persevered. Good for you!! I can honestly say you have now become my favourite leftist dogturd to mercilessly goad on here!!

Any chance of another classic FAR LEFT paedophile melt down??!!

still cheerily LMFAO!!!

By harold

July 3, 2007 11:33 AM | Link to this

Exercising and eating right won’t prevent you from getting hit by a drunk driver, but using public transit will.

45,000 dead americans every year millions to the ER

where is our war on cars?

By getalife

July 3, 2007 11:35 AM | Link to this

Wow, I have never seen such outrage on the blogs.

Of course, the cons who love cons are showing their true character and principals.

They have none.

w does not care about his legacy. He knows he is a pathetic failure.

KO’s special comment tonight will call for w and cheney’s resignation.

The gutless cowards will never resign and the spineless Dems will never impeach.

When Dems blog, I tell them, being spineless will not win elections.

If they want trash the Constitution, they should strip the power to pardon and commute. It is an abuse of power.

By Amber

July 3, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this

JD,

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. The Medicare tax is 1.45 percent of wages or 2.9 percent of self-employed income (no cap and it’s not applied to investment income). For your friend to have paid $15 million in one year he would have earned over a half billion dollars through his own company that year or been paid over a billion by his employer — in wages. It’s clear to anyone with a calculator that you’re full of crap.

Your demonization of ideas you disagree with (i.e. “little Socialists”) doesn’t help your cause either, prick.

By Adam

July 3, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

JD@11:19

ABSOLUTELY on point!

The dreamers as your call them are always anxious to turn over more and more of their liberties/responsibilities to the politicans. And of course the politicans are glad to assume the power. The lemming like Progressives simply want daddy government to take them by the hand and lead them through life because individual responsibility is too hard.

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 11:46 AM | Link to this

Aquagirl,10:37

If you want to send money to Michael Moore, go ahead. I don’t support him and I don’t go to his movies. And I can STILL say that I don’t like his politics or his movies. That’s because we have free speech in America.

I was not at the Neurenberg Trials but I am sure convicted Germans were guilty. I have not seen the tapes on the beheading of Pearl but I am sure he lost his head. I was not at Pearl Harbor but I am pretty sure we were attacked. I saw excerpts of Moore’s previous movie on TV and it was a political piecemeal of sought out incidents to prove how America is sooooo sorrrrryy! Many movie reviewers had the same opinion as mine. I will not pay to see such trash.

I am sure Moore has some talent at making movies. He is smart enough to throw in a bit of “good” to make the bad incidents seem everyday and frequent. It is a common propaganda move. You fell for it, like a willing liberal.

Don’t get all excited because many of us know the difference between a good movie made for entertainment and one for putrefaction by propaganda.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this

If the neo-cons weren’t being so asinine about seeing Sicko, they’d have noticed the strong points of other healthcare systems. In an interview, a doc in the U.K pointed out that he gets paid more if his patients reduce their blood pressure, quit smoking, etc.

Our current system discourages what Jim is pushing…preventative measures. It’s not just the Cuban lifestyle that encourages people to live healthy, the medical system does too.

But geez, go back to grumbling about the movie you haven’t seen.

By getalife

July 3, 2007 11:50 AM | Link to this

“Biden: Flood the White House with calls I call for all Americans to flood the White House with phone calls tomorrow expressing their outrage over this blatant disregard for the rule of law. 202-456-1414”

By JK

July 3, 2007 11:57 AM | Link to this

Dusty, CNN-Health reports that information in Sicko is mostly accurate, with the criticism that more context is needed. I’ve read nowhere that this movie “spins” the truth, which was the predominant (Republican) criticism of Farenheit 911 which brought many facts to light a few years ago. Fortunately for the Repubicans in 2004, their base is not overly swayed by facts, but is, as you demonstrate daily, still driven to climatic states of arousal by shrieks and cries that “lefties hate America!!!” Facts be darned, you know, those endorphins are addictive!

It’s almost lunch time, Dear. Please enjoy something deep-fried and covered in cheese, followed by a rich, satisfying bowl of Haagen-Daas. You deserve it!

By LIBBY IS FREE ... YIPPPPEEEEEEE

July 3, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this

Yesterday I saw two paid professional demoNcrat consultants on live cable TV admit the truth about Libby.

That the far left were utterly obsessed about this nothing case. That the leak was not generated by Libby. That it was a pointless, horrendously expensive witch hunt that should never have occured. These two HiTllary defending ladies also stated that the left and far left were NOT doing their party any favours by obsessing over such a minor matter.

SEEING ALL THE HATE AND BILE about Libby on here is just fantastic. Please keep your pinko hate coming … its freaking hilarious!!!

By Eric

July 3, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this

Jim,

I, like you, refused to hand over a dollar to Mr. Moore, so I happened to watch it over the Internet before the movie was officially released.

I am telling all of my friends to go see it. You may not like his solution, but the problems he presents are real ones that are going unaddressed.

In the US, HMOs have financial incentive to withold care from patients. In the UK, doctors make extra $$$ for having their patients lose weight or stop smoking.

Private insurance fosters this environment. In the examples that Mr. Moore presents, it appears that open healthcare makes for a healthier, happier populus. I’m not saying there isn’t a way to fix this with the private insurers, but as long as profit incentives exist for these companies to withold care, claims will continue to be rejected.

By Natalie

July 3, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this

Whenever I read one of these posts by people who think they can win an argument by typing the words “collectivism”, “socialism” or “your Cuban hero”, I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.

These idiots drive on national and state highways and roads, purchase subsidized gasoline, eat safe food (USDA/FDA), drink safe water (EPA), drive safe cars (NHTSA), live their lives protected by our military, receive medical care or have parents who receive medical care from Medicare — and on and on — as a result of “collectivism” or “socialism”. They reap the benefits of socialism in America while decrying it when people advocate for it in areas where it might provide solutions to problems inherent in the free market.

FDR pulled us out of the great depression, in large part, because of many collectivist/socialist policies that remain in effect today and that we all take for granted. Eisenhower applied a form of socialism when he built the interstate highway system and Nixon instituted a socialist idea when he created the Environmental Protection Agency.

This post isn’t an argument for socialist fundamentalism — it’s an argument against market fundamentalism (as defined in a previous post).

The debate between free markets versus socialism is silly. If we have a problem, then the question should be — what is the best solution? If a market solution is best, then so be it. If socialist/collectivist solution is best, then that’s fine to.

People are becoming less and less frightened by the name-calling by bullies from the right. Pragmatism is taking hold.

By JD

July 3, 2007 12:01 PM | Link to this

Amber,

At least you are able to use a calculator.

In the year of death of a corporate chairman all his stock options vested and yes you are correct his W-2 income was over $1 Billion dollars. So, he paid over $15 million and the employer matched, so the total was over $30 million.

You should check the water before you leap into the pool.

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 12:01 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, you coninually amaze me.

A doctor in UK got paid MORE for reducing a patient’s blood pressure? If you want your pressure lowered you should go to a higher paid doctor in UK? Or doctors only treat well who are paid well? Oh, oh, what a fairy tale sought out by a whacko looking for a whacko.

I think Michael Moore’s UK doctor was the one who drove his gasoline laden jeep into the Scottish Airport. Not a real smart fine citizen, you might say.

By LIBBY IS FREE ... YIPPPPPPPPEEEEEEEEEEE!!!

July 3, 2007 12:02 PM | Link to this

Yesterday I saw two paid professional demoNcrat consultants on live cable TV admit the blindingly obvious truth about Libby.

That the Bush hating far left were utterly obsessed about this nothing case and just wanted ANY Bush admin political blood for the sake of it. That the leak was not generated by Libby. That it was a pointless, horrendously expensive witch hunt that should never have occured. That it was an open secret that the vile Plame was a CIA operative of some kind. These two HiTllary defending ladies, who were hardly right wingers, also stated that the left and far left were NOT doing their party any favours by obsessing over such a minor matter.

SEEING ALL THE HATE AND BILE about Libby on here is just fantastic. Please keep your pinko hate coming … its freaking hilarious!!!

By Eric

July 3, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this

Jim,

I, like you, refused to hand over a dollar to Mr. Moore, so I happened to watch it over the Internet before the movie was officially released.

I am telling all of my friends to go see it. You may not like his solution, but the problems he presents are real ones that are going unaddressed.

In the US, HMOs have financial incentive to withold care from patients. In the UK, doctors make extra $$$ for having their patients lose weight or stop smoking.

Private insurance fosters this environment. In the examples that Mr. Moore presents, it appears that open healthcare makes for a healthier, happier populus. I’m not saying there isn’t a way to fix this with the private insurers, but as long as profit incentives exist for these companies to withold care, claims will continue to be rejected.

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 12:04 PM | Link to this

There is much gnashing of teeth by the right-wing in America today as so perfectly demonstrated by Mr. Wooten’s swipe at “socialism”.

BTW, I am almost always suspicious of those who rely excessively (solely?) as so many here, on BOTH political sides do, on using sound bites, slogans, buzzwords, stereotypes, non-denial denials and ad hominem opinions in lieu of more accurate and informative speech.

Some of the complaining by the political right, of course, is well deserved. Many liberals have for 40 years now, had an idealistic, even naive slant on how the Utopian American society should be administered. And there has been much misguided liberal policy.

But at the same time for them to disregard the obvious historical excellence and benefits of our “socialistic” public systems including education is hard for me to understand.

Remember that this is essentially the same public school system that produced virtually ALL of our giants - in business, government and every other facet of our lives.

Yes, bureaucracies, and school board/district administrators have a VERY uneven record in effectively managing public schools. But that needs to be taken in the context of the numerous and unheralded social challenges facing them now.

But at the same time, integration through busing made some sense back then, didn’t it?. And at the time the EEOC made some sense too, yes?. (Now? Not as much, if any.) No question that schools have been mismanaged to some degree or another. But the opposing movement of sometimes not even acknowledging the problems, much less doing anything to find solutions, would have gotten us exactly where today?

So to believe that the precipitous drop in our youth’s academic achievement is solely, or perhaps even primarily, due to the bureaucracy is somewhat “uneducated” IMHO.

The factors for this slide are many, not the least of which is an intentional acceptance by way too many for the dumbing down of our society.

I remember a time when being dumb and ignorant wasn’t necessarily OK. Much less cool! And a time when being smart and driven to educate yourself through whatever means and resources available wasn’t considered square or non-essential.

Until the American people first and foremost, take ownership of their own laziness to learn and grow, American schools, public and private, will continue to turn out an unacceptably high percentage of kids who can’t even find Iraq on a map, much less have any historical knowledge or reference about it.

By JD

July 3, 2007 12:14 PM | Link to this

Amber,

If you are a Socialist why are you bothered by being named a Socialist?

The little socialists want the masses to pay for their health care, their education, their food, their water, their clothes, their transportation and the internet connection so they can complain that their neighbor makes more money than they do. How dare he work hard?

Move to Cuba, or China or North Korea where all of the above will sometimes be provided, and sometimes not. But at least all of you and your neighbors will have the same amount of nothing.

Hardly any of you “progressives”, “socialists”, or “liberals” seems to be able to make a point without profanity. Why is that?

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this

Dusty, if you are unable to watch what you say is propaganda without succumbing to it, again….your problem.

There are plenty of holes in Sicko, of course Moore emphasized the points he wanted to and then glossed over others. He has an agenda. But it’s not like he had to look very hard for evidence that the current healthcare system is screwed up, and that other nations might (gasp) have aspects of their systems that work better!

You see, Dusty, the world isn’t black and white. As a Libertarian, I think the free market should dominate healthcare. As a realist, I know it isn’t doing so now, and your nimrod idol Bush has socialized healthcare for payoffs from the drug industry. We can’t go back to a payer only system now.

Telling people who are sick that it’s all their fault is the height of “Conservative Compassion.” It allows wingnuts to ignore their socialization of the system to as long as it puts more cash in their pockets. They can then claim to be so much smarter and moral than “Progressives” without admitting they’re a%$holes.

So no, Dusty, I didn’t “fall for it” I went to see what Moore had to say without the fear that I would be brainwashed. It is possible to listen to another point of view, or admit the opposition has points without labeling them “cut-n-runners” “communists” or whatever the right-wing language is today.

I don’t support him and I don’t go to his movies. And I can STILL say that I don’t like his politics or his movies. That’s because we have free speech in America.

Yes Dusty we do. For you, that means the freedom to spout off about a movie you haven’t seen and look like an a$$.

Glad to see you exercising your Constitutional rights.

By B.J.

July 3, 2007 12:20 PM | Link to this

JD at 12:01,

Your buddy (or his family) made over a billion dollars from stock options and your b*** that he had $15 million Medicare tab (1.45% of his winnings)?

Greed is good. Right Gordon?

By In other words

July 3, 2007 12:21 PM | Link to this

Though I really haven’t the first clue what the film actually details, I can STILL say that I don’t like his politics or his movies. That’s because we have free speech in America.

And apparently in America we also have no shortage of “free thinkers” who through osmosis already KNOW all truths?

By Rich

July 3, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this

Thanks Am Vet, vivivant, william, aquagirl and others. William thanks for all that homework, which I knew but was too lazy to write. Those who haven’t seen the movie should. Its pretty evenhanded. It doesn’t have anything to do with anti Americanism, democrat vs republican (a fake two man con if I ever saw one) or those retarded screeds about “isms” capitalism, socialism, etc. that dogmatic Wooten readers are so fond of.

Its about comparing health insurance and health care. I don’t give a flip if Moore is gay and fat, anymore than I care that Wooten didn’t pay cash for his triple bypass. Insurance paid, didn’t it Jim? OMG, (opens mouth, points, screams..”Socialism!” ) Run, run, an ism is threatening us!

Of course if Jim reviews movies he hasn’t seen, I suppose its too much to ask that he refuse the support of the collective.

My offer still stands Jim, you want to see the movie for free? I’ll take the risk. You’d enjoy the part where it shows how much the senators (including Hillary, who was second in amounts taken) take from big Pharma.

Next time I see Moore I’m going to suppress my natural heterosexuality and give him a kiss right on his big fat gay mouth. Thanks Mike, for bringing this front and center. Jim, once again, please see the movie before you review it.

Other things done collectively: power grid, water and sewer. Jim, better disconnect those too. Ideology is important! Don’t forget Jim, dig your well uphill from your cesspool. Keep those precious bodily fluids pure! In case of emergency the recall code is “OPE”! Jim, your column is not good today. And don’t forget my offer. I’ll send you a copy and then you can see what you already reviewed. If Mike sues me, I’ll take the heat.

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this

JK,11:57

If I go looking for everything rotten and overlook what is good, then I can say that EVERYTHING looks rotten. That is the Michael Moore approach. He knows “a” doctor who gets paid more for this or that unethically (does not give the same good treatment for ALL) or an HMO that is below ethical standards or a hospital that did not pass JCHA inspections. Yes siree the US medical profession EVERYWHERE has gone to “pot” and should only be administered by GOVERNMENT (Democratic directed in this case).

I don’t go for dependency on governmental healthcare. America still has the best healthcare system in the world. Critics want to site Switzerland or Sweden for longevity of life supposedly from perfect healthcare. Amazingly enough, people still die. National Healthcare hasn’t prevented that any more than our free choice system has.

And JK, may I recommend Burger King? Their burgers are great, full of tender beef, lettuce & tomatoes & onions!!Yumm. Now I’m hungry. Gone to lunch!!!

By JD

July 3, 2007 12:38 PM | Link to this

B.J.,

I did not complain that $15 million was unfair, I merely pointed out to Katie that the Medicare Tax is collected on all earned income and not limited as she had claimed in her post. She suggested we have socialized medicine in the form of the Medicare payroll tax but the “cap” on taxable wages prevented the tax from supporting the program and the lower and middle classes were supporting the program for the upper class.

The argument often made here by the Left is that the wealthy do not pay a fair share. How can anyone assert $30 million dollars is not a fair amount? That does not include the over $300 million in federal income tax.

By the way, he was not a lucky “winner” as you would like to assert. He personally drove the company to record high stock prices by directing and implementing a corporate plan that made significant amounts of money for employees and investors, created an untold number of jobs for Atlantans and others around the world, and made his company one of the most renowned and applauded corporate citizens in American history.

He earned his money!

By Katharine Otto, MD

July 3, 2007 12:38 PM | Link to this

THE REAL REASON CORPORATIONS PROVIDE HEALTH INSURANCE: They can pay with pre-tax dollars, while individuals must pay with after-tax dollars. This way, the corporations can write off their investments, get away with paying lower wages, and insure a stable work force of people who believe the “benefits” help them. It’s another sleazy way to disenfranchise individuals while pretending to help them.

By @@

July 3, 2007 12:47 PM | Link to this

‘Ya know Jim, Michael Moore is the guy you want on that little dingy when you decide to escape Cuba by sea.

Shute, talk about a seafood diet. With Michael Moore on board, it would be a “seefood buffet”.

Michael Moore, a self-proclaimed authority on cannibalism.

“Fatso”….

By JD is a Dittohead

July 3, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this

JD wrote, “[My billionaire friend]personally drove the company to record high stock prices…He earned his money!”

No, JD’s billionaire friend did not “personally” drive any company to record high stock prices. He did it with the help of his underpaid employees (I know they’re underpaid if one man in the company is given stock options worth a billion dollars).

Nobody earns a billion dollars — and anybody who takes that amount is stealing, albeit legally, from employees and shareholders.

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this

Now, folks, don’t dare comment on history because YOU DID NOT SEE IT. That’s right. Seeing is believing and all that stuff. Doubting Thomas must be your hero.

Skip history, records, family ancestral stories, etc. YOU DID NOT SEE THEM so there is no way they could be true.

Yep, Michael Moore is one smart liberal. He puts out his propaganda, makes you pay for it and then gets it spread for free. He really is a very rich capitalist who probably uses the best medical care that money can buy while preaching for ordinary (national) care for all.

Yes, liberals, go for it. He’s all yours.

By healthseeker

July 3, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this

Incentives and healthy lifestyles are a great idea, but how can I be healthy when almost everything around me is determined by big business and the politicians that cater to them?

How can I choose to walk or bike when the DOT & their friends at the road lobby created a sprawling mess of highways & speeding cars (with my tax dollars), while sidewalks and bike lanes are a rare occurence?

How can I eat healthy when our food industry subsidizes corn (for corn syrup and cattle feed), cheese, and other high calorie food so much more than fruits and veggies, so a salad costs 5 times more than a hamburger?

How can I avoid the pollution in the air and water, caused by cars and factories, that causes asthma, cancer, etc.? Why do I have to spend so much more to buy food, cleaning products, and so forth that don’t contain pesticides or dangerous chemicals?

We’ve worked very hard to become fat, sick, and lazy. Now the health care system is paying for all the diseases we’ve given ourselves. We need to fix the health care system, but we also need to fix the environment we live in.

By Jim Wooten

July 3, 2007 12:58 PM | Link to this

Now don’t be mean, @@. (I may never get in a boat again.)

Rich @ 12.28, no thanks. I’m not going to see Sicko until Cynthia Tucker picks up the tab. Or even then, come to think of it. Those hours of my life would be gone forever and I would have spent them with Michael Moore.

By JD

July 3, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this

Katherine Otto, M.D.,

Was there no economics class in your school?

A job is worth X number of dollars and the free market gives the employee the opportunity to seek the employer who gives the most value to the skills that employee possesses.

Once the employee finds the employer who wishes to make the hire, the employee has the option to take his pay all in dollars or direct some to benefits.

If the employee takes the pay in dollars then he pays tax on the gross pay and ultimately pays for his insurance with dollars on which he has paid tax. Not such a good deal for the employee and the employer is able to deduct from his income the cost of the pay.

If the employee takes some pay in dollars and the other in benefits, such as insurance, then the employee pays for the insurance in PRE-TAX dollars, thus saving money for him or herself and family. The employer still deducts the same as in the previous example but some is payroll and some is health insurance. The pre-tax dollars are the employee’s not the employer’s; all is pre-tax to the employer as part of the compensation package.

The idea that health insurance is a “right” is false and is offered, or not, as the employer views the ability of the company to provide the benefit. The incentive to the employer is to acquire more qualified employees than if the employer cannot afford the benefits.

Most small businesses are unable to offer health insurance and other benefits. If the government imposed a mandatory health insurance benefit there would be many small businesses closed.

By Rich

July 3, 2007 1:02 PM | Link to this

Dusty, come on. Specious city. While differential time travel is possible for us at this time, so far, only in the forward direction. No one knows how to go back. Fortunately, the movie is available in the same space time horizon you occupy. Would you maintain that those who have not seen the flick have as much to say about it as those who have? Maybe Jim will sub let his next review to you. Not seeing the film seems to be an advantage to both of you.

By JK

July 3, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this

Dusty and Mr. Wooten, There are none so blind as those who continue to comment with authority on that which they have not seen. In other words, NO CRED! NONE!

Fun facts for you both: (Warning: Facts may be injurious to your deeply-rooted ideals!)

Burger King Whopper: 670 calories, 41 grams of fat, 44 carbs

Please continue to enjoy the truth “YOUR WAY!” Hahaha! Seriously, go for it.

By Aquagirl

July 3, 2007 1:10 PM | Link to this

Yep, Michael Moore is one smart liberal. He puts out his propaganda, makes you pay for it and then gets it spread for free

This from a woman who says George Bush is one of the greatest presidents ever.

There is a difference, Dusty, between arguing a solid or commonly accepted fact (what’s the national debt, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor)and holding forth on the content of a film that you’ve never seen.

You don’t know what Michael Moore says. You haven’t heard him. The entire thing could be in Urdu with English subtitles, as far as you know.

The ability to discern is acquired by most grown-ups, Dusty. Keep posting. Every time you do, a couple of lurkers decide to vote against the Repubs.

Then go stuff that Whopper into your gaping mouth. We’ll subsidize a triple-bypass on your fat self. I’m going to go have a healthy lunch.

By Rich

July 3, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this

Jim you have an impish sense of humor and I appreciate that. But you and I both know that you could have expensed it to the paper, I’m sure a mechanism exists. Forgive me, your reply is specious (designed to distract and mislead).

Would you agree that the column and we readers would have been better served had you seen the movie before writing the column? Or do you maintain that it is the best thing to review without seeing. I mean come on. Puckish speciosity is still speciosity. Dodge that.

By JD

July 3, 2007 1:15 PM | Link to this

First,

The individual was not my friend as BJ and the nameless one like to assert. I did know him but only as an acquaintance.

The information I have provided here is a matter of public record and to label someone a thief when you have no knowledge of their work or personal life is a travesty, and unfortunately typical of the Left.

Employees became millionaires along with their leader because they were all offered stock options. The results of the company before and after his tenure give proof positive that he EARNED his money, he was the leader, he instituted the plan, he directed the plan and untold numbers of ordinary people profited due to his wisdom and leadership.

I would say that both of the critics here are simply jealous and so limited intellectually they are unable to fathom an individual providing not only corporate governance but also being a philanthropic community leader.

By Billy

July 3, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this

“…the employee has the option to take his pay all in dollars or direct some to benefits.”

This is true to some extent in some companies — but not most.

For example, both my employer and my wife’s employer offer health insurance. We only need one family health insurance plan, so we took the one through my wife’s employer and declined the insurance offered by mine.

However, my employer, didn’t raise my salary to reflect the savings the company received when I declined the coverage that I didn’t need (I asked — they refused).

My situation is significantly more common than the less-common cafeteria-plan scenario that JD describes (such “cafeteria plans” are usually limited to the larger corporations).

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 1:22 PM | Link to this

The idea that health insurance is a “right” is false and is offered, or not, as the employer views the ability of the company to provide the benefit. The incentive to the employer is to acquire more qualified employees than if the employer cannot afford the benefits. Most small businesses are unable to offer health insurance and other benefits. If the government imposed a mandatory health insurance benefit there would be many small businesses closed.

That’s why a National Health Care Service would make sense. That’ll keep a lot of small businessess in business while providing for the health of the common wealth.

By Kat

July 3, 2007 1:26 PM | Link to this

It’s easy to be philanthropic when you have billions to be philanthropic with — stolen from underpaid employees and company shareholders.

JD confuses anger with jealousy (perhaps because of his own bias). I, for one, am not jealous of thieves.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this

Employees became millionaires along with their leader because they were all offered stock options.

Dang!! Which company is this?

By Adam

July 3, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this

DebbieNoThink@1:22 First you quote a previous post ending with the sentence, If the government imposed a mandatory health insurance benefit there would be many small businesses closed.

Your brilliant retort is * That’s why a National Health Care Service would make sense.*

Lib logic I guess.

By .

July 3, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this

I’m sorry, Adam, but your post is incoherent. What the hell are you talking about?

By Curious Observer

July 3, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl:

Some advice for you as you deal with the obstinate and ignorant Dusty. An old aphorism:

Never try to wrestle with a pig. You just get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.

By Health Care Exec.

July 3, 2007 1:56 PM | Link to this

As a health care executive w/ a BS and MS in health administration from reputable universities, our system of care is fundamentally faulted and broken.

All parties involved are to blame: third party payers (health insurance companies), lobbyists, physician organizations, pharma, hospitals, and non-compliant patients all have a hand in our broken system.

Do you realize that half of every health care dollar is spent not on patient care, but on administration costs? We spend more dollars of our GDP on health care than any other industrialized nation on the planet, but do not deliver better care than some. People who are not clinically trained nor trained for the business of health care (politicians) are making decisions about your care that they have no training for.

It is time for all tax paying Americans to acknowledge the desperate need to change our system, and deliver quality health care to all Americans regardless of their health insurance status or wealth. The basic right of a human is a right to good health. Oh, and by the way, you already have national health care on some levels in this country already…it is called Medicare and Medicaid.

For the sake of a healty workforce and a strong economy solutions not party lines should be where our attention is.

By RCH

July 3, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this

DebbiedoRight Microsoft 3,000 of the original employees for one.

By jbmlaw

July 3, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this

Dear Vivifiant @ 9:05, mostly well-argued; I note that France ranked 45th (of 157 countries) on this year’s WSJ Index of Economic Freedom. 30% of the world’s countries are freer. Having said that, I thought Amelie was a pretty good movie.

Dear Melo @ 9:22, you asked, “Would it be okay to privatise Police force and the Fire and Rescue sevices as well. Just let market forces determine if its worthwhile to come over to ur house when its burning?” Of course it would be okay. Why not? Why would I prefer government services to those of a private company?

Dear gttim @ 9:25, surely you do not suggest that Bill Clinton should serve the same sentence and pay the same fine as Scooter Libby?

Dear Aquagirl @ 9:38, where did you ever get the mistaken idea that President Bush was a conservative? Not from me. I applaud him when he does conservative things, like bombing Islamists, but I don’t approve of big spenders. To the extent you argue that President Bush’s version of socialized medicine is as bad as HillaryCare, I would disagree on “extent,” but not on “nature” of the foolish behavior.

Dear Midsouth @ 9:41, I agree with the essentials of your post. Re: the commutation of sentence rather than pardon, that allows the appeal to continue, thus Mr. Libby may be exonerated. If there had been a pardon, the appeal is dismissed as moot.

Dear Debbie @ 9:54, lest we forget, Marc Rich, the poor put-upon, indicted but uncaught fugitive, whose wife contributed so generously to the Clintonistas.

Dear AmVet @ 10:12, I agree that government is an efficient tool for death-dealing, imprisoning, and deprivation of property. Where did you develop your theory that it was also effective in preserving life? Waco or New Orleans?

By .

July 3, 2007 2:01 PM | Link to this

Public healthcare, like public education and public transportation, is a matter of national defense. It all should be part of the Dept of Homeland Security’s budget (okay, kidding).

By Southern Democrat

July 3, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this

This is one issue where I vehemently disagree with my good friend Jbmlaw.

Doctors, like ministers and teachers, were traditionally answering a calling and seeking to help their fellow citizens of the world. Many (most?) still adhere to this belief when entering med school and going out to practice on their own.

Private hospitals and for-profit health insurance companies have ruined health care, plain and simple. Capitalism is wonderful and truly liberating, but it usually has winners and losers. We can’t have losers in the health care system. We can’t continue denying the fact that there is a gross disparity between the levels of care afforded to and available to the children of neighbors. I have been blessed to live a relatively illness-free life and, when sick, my family has had access to the best doctors in America (cousins with cancer went to Duke University and M.D. Anderson for treatment). Thousands (millions?) of people do not get these opportunities.

Now, much of the system’s broken down nature is due to lawyers who play to juries’ sympathies who can more easily envision themselves being the innocent victim of malpractice than a human being doing the best s/he can and making a mistake… but I digress.

National health care is the safest, most humane way to ensure adequate treatment for all. No one life is more important than another (Christians in particular should understand that) and the suffering of one should be the suffering of all.

We need to fix this problem fast and the marketplace is not the way to do it as the market has only driven up costs and decreased access to the best physicians.

I’ve been somewhat shocked by the level of ignorance and pettiness in the commentary today, but Happy Fourth to you all in any event.

By .

July 3, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this

“conservative things, like bombing Islamists”

WTF? You’ve just officially labeled yourself as a maroon. A complete putz.

That’s probably the dumbest thing I’ve heard today….

By Rich

July 3, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this

dear jbmlaw 1:58

Dear AmVet @ 10:12, I agree that government is an efficient tool for death-dealing, imprisoning, and deprivation of property. Where did you develop your theory that it was also effective in preserving life? Waco or New Orleans?

Maybe AmVet was thinking of the water system’s required purification, the FDA, the National Institute of Health, the CDC, the fire, the police, the power grid, the FAA, and a least fifty other manifestations of government that are effectively preserving life.

By Health Care Exec.

July 3, 2007 2:20 PM | Link to this

As a health care exec. with both a BS and MS in health adminstration our system is fundamentally broken and delivered poorly. Make no mistake, we (lobbyists, pharma, hospital/doctor associations, health insurance companies and non-compliant patients)are ALL to blame.

Do you realize that half of every health care dollar is spent towards administrative costs? Also, the US spends considerably more of its GDP than other industrialized nations, yet we sometimes don’t deliver better care (infant mortality, immunization) rates.

It is not only a fundamental right of all humans to have health services, but the strength of a progressive, productive nation also depends upon it. By the way, you already have national health insurance on some levels, it is just called Medicare and Medicaid. It is time for all Americans to acknowledge that health care HAS to be changed, and party lines and personal convictions are not where our efforts and thoughts should be focused, but on solutions to this problem, a problem that ultimately affects us all.

By Jane

July 3, 2007 2:22 PM | Link to this

Anyone besides me waiting for Jim’s answer to Rich 1:58?

By Jane

July 3, 2007 2:26 PM | Link to this

I meant Rich 1:14

By Scotter Libby

July 3, 2007 2:29 PM | Link to this

I vote for “jblaw” as Jim “I never met a right winger that ever did anything wrong” Wooton’s #1 @SSKISSER.

SMOOCHES<<

By RCH

July 3, 2007 2:35 PM | Link to this

S.D “National health care is the safest, most humane way to ensure adequate treatment for all. No one life is more important than another (Christians in particular should understand that) and the suffering of one should be the suffering of all.”

Is that why Canadians flock here for medical services? I agree basic health services should be available to all, however to maintain integrity all should pay to recieve it. If it is through your employer, self paid, and a split between govt. and the insured. If you desire above basic services( pick and choose, Dr’s., hospitals, private rooms etc.,you can indeed choose those options.)

“Doctors, like ministers and teachers, were traditionally answering a calling and seeking to help their fellow citizens of the world. Many (most?) still adhere to this belief when entering med school and going out to practice on their own.”

Knowing many Dr.s,this may not be the case at the present time. Many hear a calling yet many do the job for the money.Many potential Drs. choose other fields because for many reasons the money is no longer there. Many physicians choose fields not to heal but play on our vanity for higher incomes.(Platic surgens.)

By Jim's a Cherry Picker

July 3, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this

Jbmlaw,

Re your 1.58 @ Debbie bit, I find it funny, sad and interesting that defenders of Bush must constantly refer to Clinton when discussing current events.

If I remember correctly, and I do, the GOP’s whole gameplan when ginning up for the “revolution” was to restore American’s faith in there government by running a clean shop. Or, translated, Republicans aren’t corrupt like Democrats, so they should be trusted.

Well, as it turns out, they’re every bit as corrupt. Libby is a convicted felon, and he was protecting others who were treasonous. Traitors who are hiding behind bibles and flags.

So continue dodging and spinning and weaving (you too, Jim), but they’re slimeballs. Plain and simple. Just as slimy as the Democrats.

Republicans can no better run government than any of those they attack.

By B-Rad

July 3, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this

Geez, people. I don’t get why you don’t get it. Nationalized healthcare sounds great. But not without answering two huge questions that everyone seems to be overlooking. A) How ya gonna pay for it? Have you looked at HR 676 that’s in the House? Taxes, taxes, taxes. Want nationalized healthcare, then imagine a 10 or 20% increase in both your fed and state taxes.

B) Do you really want the government to administer H/C? Most fed agencies are the worst form of inefficiency and waste. Do you really think that will be better than market-driven?

I also have go defend our host here. You’re lambasting him, but ignoring the good point he raises. Pogo said it 40 years ago: “we have met the enemy — and he is us.” Have you looked at the obesity numbers in this country? 125M Americans overweight (that’s > 1/3, people), and 70M are Obese or grossly obese. That factor alone could sink our entire healthcare capability in the next 20 years if we don’t do something about it. I am 50, but ride my tri bike 40 miles a week and lift weights 5 days. Yet i pay the same for H/C as the fat-aes I see on the L. So I have to subsidize their diabetes, CHF, and all the myriad other diseases caused by obesity. We are a nation of lazy, fat-ases. And fixing that would save millions from our healthcare system.

By Jim Wooten

July 3, 2007 3:01 PM | Link to this

Rich @ 1:14: If you read the Sunday @issue section, you saw four reviews: one by a physician, another by a policy analist, a third by a bookstore owner who had problems wiwth insurance and the fourth by a professor. In addition, reviews of the movie are a dime a dozen in print and on the air. For me, life is too short to spend hours with Michael Moore and I have no plans to see Sicko. My intent was to focus on health care, not to review a movie that others have reviewed adequately, at least for my purposes.

By JK

July 3, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this

B-Rad, you make some great points (2:46). The problem with Mr. Wooten’s commentary is that he buries a good point in a “lefties-are-bad” rant about a movie he refuses to see (no cred), instead of commenting on the ways our health care system is broken, including what you mention. (Actually, it’s not that broken for those who can afford it.)

For those of you afraid to see “Sicko” (what would the neighbors say?), why not rent “SuperSize Me” by Morgan Spurlock. That one addresses a HUGE (get it? haha!) problem with American health care, namely, the widely-accepted cultural norm of stuffing one’s face with garbage that is produced specifically to be addictive, heavily marketed to the masses, and more affordable than healthy food, since it’s packed with cheap, processed crap and served in oversized portions. The food industry lobby gets their garbage in most schools and institutions in this country — politics as usual and friendly contracts to friends and contributors — when the truth is it’s no darn good for anybody! Facts can be soooo interesting!

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 3:10 PM | Link to this

Rich at 2:10. Just got back from helping a colleague with a printer problem and lunch. (Yes it was relatively healthy! Chicken salad on greens with carrots and tomatoes and a bowl of soup. Living a healthy lifestyle pretty much sucks compared to my younger, more carefree days!)

When I read jbmlaw’s rejoinder to me, I thought WTF? Did I imply something about religious nut jobs or hurricanes and the government’s role therein? Clearly my non-progressive friend chose to miss my point entirely.

You, however, are absolutely correct in you analysis of my post, which I thought was pretty clear. As much as the corporate demagogues and those who who idolize them, refuse to admit it, without government sanctions and protections, and left up to those always honorable market fundamentalists (thanks to Natalie for that euphemism - I love it!) conditions in this country would be an even bigger freaking disaster!

Unless of course you really are an advocate for bringing back child labor and toxic land fills!

By Health Care Exec.

July 3, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this

Dear B-Rad:

I know it seems a daunting task, but as a professional in these settings I know we as Americans can build solutions that work. Here is a couple of facts: Approx. 65 million Americans have no insurance and half of those actually work, but b/c they have NO insurance they are considered under-insured. At the end of the day, gov’t is already involved in your health care in some form. I would prefer gov’t to make decisions in lieu of insurance companies whose ONLY job is too keep costs down and deny claims.

I also took another look at HR 676 and here is something interesting:

As copied from HR676 website: “Proposed Funding For USNHI Program: Maintaining current federal and state funding of existing health care programs. A modest payroll tax on all employers of 3.3%. A 5% health tax on the top 5% of income earners. A small tax on stock and bond transfers. Closing corporate tax loop-holes, repealing the Bush tax cut.” Here is the site: http://www.house.gov/conyers/newshr6762.htm#1 Keep in mind that health care at this moment is for profit, HR 676 you can consider to be a NonProfit initiative. I personally think we (myself included) can make a living out of healthcare, but I am not concerned with Profit only. Our system is so layered and desperately needs to be streamlined.

Congrats on your good health and exercise habits, I too try and stay fit, and our obesity issues in this country, I agree are out of control.

By Carrie

July 3, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten,

You see daily posts from people who disagree with your point-of-view. To engage in an honest debate, one must know the arguments coming from the other side of the issue.

On the other hand, in faux debates in which straw man arguments or implications are erected (e.g. America should precisely duplicate Cuba’s health care system) and personal attacks (Michael Moore is fat) are favorite tactics, knowing the actual arguments from the other side of an issue are not necessarily a prerequisite.

I’ve suffered through your columns and blog posts to engage in honest discussion. You should reconsider and see “Sicko”.

By Doyle

July 3, 2007 3:18 PM | Link to this

If you think health care is expensive not, just wait till its free!

By Doyle

July 3, 2007 3:18 PM | Link to this

If you think health care is expensive now, just wait till its free!

By Curious Observer

July 3, 2007 3:19 PM | Link to this

B-Rad raises the old taxes, taxes, taxes spectre. The truth is we’re already paying for universal health care and more—in added insurance premiums, in higher costs of hospitals forced to treat the uninsured (ever hear of Grady?), in inflated bills caused by medical plans that negotiate sweet deals for themselves but leave the rest to make up the difference, in Medicaid, in PeachCare, and in a thousand other ways.

And all to fatten the profits of private health plans that account for huge portions of medical costs and work to minimize health care for members.

Get rid of the private health plans, not only to save tremendous amounts of money but also to give all Americans the incentive to help create a national health care plan that really works. We will never have one so long as fat cats like B-Rad can sneer at the medical needs and conditions of the unfortunate while enjoying the benefits of employer-paid health insurance. With any luck, B-Rad will run his tri-bike into the front of a speeding Mack truck, and we will all be better off.

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 3:33 PM | Link to this

B-Rad, those are two good points you raise. And as you might correctly surmise, I am neither an economist nor tax expert.

But let me play devil’s advocate for a moment, if I might,

A) How are we going to pay for it?

Just like with my home and business budgets, it is simply a matter of choices. Nothing more or less. I may choose to pay the money to go see Sicko or I may take that money and spend it on something/anything else. And obviously I have priorities and non-priorities.

And the government has those same options regarding their expenses.

It doesn’t always take more money to accomplish things, just better choices of where and how to spend a non-infinite amount.

So I’m not sure that we can’t afford it is a valid argument.

B) Most fed agencies are the worst form of inefficiency and waste.

Maybe true, maybe not. Would you include the US Armed Forces? Or local police vs. rent-a-cops? Look at the TSA and the people being used to “protect” us at airports. Do you feel safer with the Feds or with Argenbright?

These are not easy questions to answer, even though all of these examples go to matters of life and death for Americans. As does health care.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this

*AdamDUmbA$$: If you kept reading my quote ended with “That’ll keep a lot of small businessess in business while providing for the health of the common wealth.”

Conservative confusion I guess.

By Adam

July 3, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this

Contrary to my basic belief of the less gevernment intervention the better, I do believe that we are fast approaching the day of SOME type of Nationalized health care. There is no doubt that too many people are without health insurance because the price on an individual level is so steep. I believe this is because we expect basic health insurance to cover virtually 100% of everything.

A system of publicly funded coverage for MAJOR expenses makes sense for all. Very few can afford a prolonged hospital stay with bills in the 10’s of thousands of dollars and more. Without employer contributions, middle and lower class workers simply cannot individually afford traditional insurance coverage for all expenses. However most proposed public plans envision providing ALL care and ALL doctor visits. This would be horribly expensive and would certainly lead to abuse.

For any public plan to work, there has to be an expectation of individual responsibility. Any public plan should only begin at a level beyond the everyday aches and pains, flu, headache, sprained ankle etc. There is a threshold below which we should be individually responsible just as we pay for all other ordinary expenses of life. Either pay out of pocket or buy insurance that covers these ordinary run of the mill medical expenses. The affordability of this type of “lower level” coverage would be well within the reach of most Americans. As the tragedy of unexpected MAJOR expenses occurs, this is the area to which we should confine discussions of public involvement.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 3:50 PM | Link to this

Dear Debbie @ 9:54, lest we forget, Marc Rich, the poor put-upon, indicted but uncaught fugitive, whose wife contributed so generously to the Clintonistas.

Dear jbmlaw: If you read down further, I’ve already answered this exact same parroted comment by another of your parrot cronies. Please keep reading.

Also, don’t you have an ambulance to chase?

By getalife

July 3, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this

The Dems answer to this outrage:

Bill Clinton back in the White House.

Hahahahahaha.

By Rich

July 3, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this

B Rad, 16% of the dollar goes to health care now. More than everyone else. It’s just where that money goes that’s the problem. I’m kind of lazy but someone has numbers on this…

By NetBanker

July 3, 2007 4:10 PM | Link to this

Yes we may have all the healthcare, pharmaceuticals, food, gasoline, housing etc that the market demands but horrors - someone’s making a PROFIT!!! Let’s turn to the wonderful, pure, sinless system of socialism. It will solve all of our problems. So why is it that conservatives seem so frequently to go the extreme opposite side of the equation rather than explore alternatives that exist somewhere in the middle? Certainly there is a balance that can consider profits for the insurer and the interests of the insured. This isn’t a mutually exclusive situation so let’s not run to the farthest extremes of each side during the discussion since we all inherently know that the solution lies somewhere in the middle.

I think that this boils down to a systemic problem in our country where managing a business to the highest possible profit/share price without regard for the people that allows those companies to do so or the customers who purchase the product has become not only acceptable, but the common practice. There was an era when companies earned profits AND took care of/valued the people who performed the work to earn that profit.

Our use of language is a simple way to note this shift. It was Personnel, but now it’s Human Resources. People used to be employees, but now they are ‘resources” (which puts them on par with material resources). The corporate world is dehumanizing the workforce and customers in favor of profit. There used to be a saying that if you take care of the employees they’ll take care of the customers and business. Chik-fil-A proves this still works, but they have become the exception.

Profit isn’t evil nor is it bad. It just needs to be in balance with the needs of employees and customers. Today, we’re out of balance.

By Gary J.

July 3, 2007 4:12 PM | Link to this

AmVet,

For a non-economist, your instincts are pretty darn good.

A basic tenet of economics is that people act to make themselves as well off as possible, or as an economist would say, maximize their “utility”. Those on the right, appear to believe maximizing one’s utility is always equivalent to maximizing one’s wealth (for them, this may be true). In truth, utility varies with the individual and maximizing utility is not always the same as acting selfishly.

Paying to see a documentary, giving to your favority charity, or electing leaders who will raise your own taxes to fund a single-payer health care system (to displace rapidly rising insurance premiums) are all reasonable decisions to maximize one’s utility. Market fundamentalists (see the post @9:29) can’t seem to understand this.

By Health Care Exec.

July 3, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this

Dear NetBanker: As a person trained to run health care entities like a business I am certainly not against profits in this setting, in fact, not in any business setting. I am, however, against profits becoming first and not access to care or good patient care, which is why health care should exist. You are correct, we are completely out of balance. I must say, it has been my experience that insurance companies are making decisions about patient care that they have no training to make, therefore, the patient suffers while they protect their profit margins. Your comment, “Certainly there is a balance that can consider profits for the insurer and the interests of the insured.” I agree that this should be the ideal, but this is not the reality. They exist to keep their costs down by denying your claims and procedures, meanwhile, illegal aliens are getting care for FREE, (look up a law called EMTALA) b/c they certainly DON’T pay taxes. As you can see we have problems at ALL levels. Health care is not a typical business, and cannot be run like a department store. Take a look at HR 676, I think you might find it interesting. Best Wishes!

By test

July 3, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this

…………………../´¯/) ………………..,/¯../ ………………./…./ …………./´¯/’…’/´¯¯`•¸ ………./’/…/…./……./¨¯\ ……..(‘(…´…´…. ¯~/’…’) ……………………..’…../ ……….’'…………. _.•´ ……………………..( ………………………

By time for the truth

July 3, 2007 4:38 PM | Link to this

Also, don’t you have an ambulance to chase?

presumably the one taking your sorry hateful racebaiting arse to Milledgeville crackpipe!!

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 4:40 PM | Link to this

test

This makes perfect sense to me. In fact, those are my thoughts exactly.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 4:50 PM | Link to this

Whoever jacked my name (probably time for the straight jacket), you could’ve came up with something better than that. Doh!

By oldpunk

July 3, 2007 5:03 PM | Link to this

Well, now I’m waiting for all federal prisoners convicted of perjury and/or obstruction of justice to also receive Bush’s commutation, since their sentences must be excessive since they’ve spent more time in prison than Scooter.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 5:03 PM | Link to this

Pulp Politicians

By Butterball

July 3, 2007 5:05 PM | Link to this

We need a law that requires MARTA to refuse to pick up any fat person (weight over 50 excess pounds) until they walk a mile to the next stop. Fat bellies is a personal thing….do not expect the government to fix it for you.

By DebbieDoRight

July 3, 2007 5:08 PM | Link to this

Time For The Straight Jacket’s Baby Picture, (diaper included)

By NetBanker

July 3, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this

Moore specializes in demonizing America. He never shows the freedoms and benefits of living in the greatest country in the world. He “immortalizes” every petty incident he can find to prove that America is one sorry place to live.

When examining a problem one doesn’t spend a bunch of time looking at all the stuff that works well that has nothing to do with said problem. At least we don’t do that in the business world otherwise all we’d be doing is celebrating all the stuff we do really well instead of figuring out how to improve on the things we don’t do well. Mr. Moore has simply given a perspective on something we all seem to agree is a problem to be solved not completely trashing America. Once again the conservatives show their penchant for going to the extreme.

By Dusty

July 3, 2007 5:29 PM | Link to this

So many misquotes. So much name calling. Some of you even make getalife look good. But let us review a few points.

I will go to whatever movies I want to see and say what I want to say about them. I don’t want to see and will not see a sicko “Sicko”. MYOB

I will go to Burger King when I want to and eat what I want to eat, i.e. a Junior Burger(just the right size) and not a “Whopper” as you misquoted. Quit lying..I am not a “walrus” like your sicko idol. Probably most of you are but I’m not.

I have never said that “George Bush is the greatest president ever”. Another misquote. I have said that history will look favorably on Bush as I believe he has a good view of the future.

I know nothing about pigs. Some of you bloggers seem to know all about them. Compare their lifestyle to your own as its your pigpen.

Conservatives sometimes mention their departure so liberal ID stealers will know that this is not a good time to make fools of themselves. Some try anyway but they are fools already.

Well, that about covers it. Go, Libby!!! I may be gone awhile. I may not. What’s it to ya’???

By bb

July 3, 2007 5:45 PM | Link to this

I love when people write a column without seeing the movie. Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. At least he’s getting on in years and therefore his time on this site is limited.

By Deport 12 million scumbags

July 3, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this

First, Chief Justice Roberts: “…the best “way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”

Then this from the obvious non-scholar at 5:29: “I have said that history will look favorably on Bush as I believe he has a good view of the future.”

Ah, the logical fallacies of circular arguments at their best. They say nothing but it sure sounds great to the neo-con sheeple!

By AmVet

July 3, 2007 6:03 PM | Link to this

NetBanker, IMHO you are precisely accurate with your 5:11. Many of these “patriots” are incredibly insecure and think that anyone who dares to even mention problems with our democratic republic is traitorous. (And don’t ever say anything bad about any Republicans! Shhhh.)

It doesn’t even matter if you profess a sincere love for this nation and have served her in time of war. That is insignificant.

However you make one grave error if you believe that the poster at 10:10 is “conservative”. Extremist? Unquestionably. Conservative? Absolutely nothing could be further from the truth.

I gather you have not read any of her many, many diatribes and other “odd” writings.

By Jane

July 3, 2007 6:06 PM | Link to this

yes bb I agree.
But Mr. Wooten won’t even admit that it would have been better to have seen it first. (Wooten 3:01)

His answer to Rich 1:14 was no answer at all.

He won’t answer any of his reader’s questions about…anything. I think he does not work very hard at his craft.

His time is too precious to spend learning about what he writes…too bad. His stuff would be better were he not so uninformed and mentally rigid. I don’t read this column much, so maybe others are much better. But this one shows and evasive, dishonest, and perhaps fossilized mind.

By Bill Scher

July 3, 2007 6:22 PM | Link to this

Business leaders jumped into the universal healthcare pool, as 36 companies formed the Coalition to Advance Healthcare Reform and called for a system where all individuals are required to carry health insurance. The announcement further shifts the center of gravity of the healthcare debate, where opposing health insurance for every American is understood as unreasonable. But that doesn’t make the Coalition’s emergence an unequivocally healthy development.

The crucial debate now is over what role our government should play to secure affordable, quality coverage for all. The coalition, which includes some insurance and pharmaceutical companies, appears to favor continued restrictions on our government’s ability to keep insurance companies honest and serve all the public.

The coalition is not backing a specific plan yet, but it has “core principles” that were laid out by the group’s founder, Safeway CEO Steve Burd, in a column for the conservative Washington Times. Their first principle? “Because market forces are largely absent in today’s healthcare system, costs are spiraling out of control,” writes Burd. “Market forces, if properly introduced, can fix this problem.”

Come again? Burd doesn’t see that it’s market forces that entice insurance companies to cherry-pick the young and healthy as customers to score an easy profit, leaving millions behind without insurance, leading to higher costs for everybody? This complete misreading of the problem doesn’t bode well for any future policy proposal.

The emphasis on “market forces” sends a signal that the coalition wants universal coverage in name only, where our government mandates individuals to get private coverage but does little to reign in the detrimental practices of the insurance industry. Everyone might be covered, so to speak, but for too many, it would be paltry coverage at high cost.

The nominally universal system that the coalition proposes would, of course, be a great deal for the insurance companies. They would get millions of new customers in one fell swoop without having to comply with new regulation. But for the rest of us, it would be nothing more than a dressing up of the same failed healthcare system. Costs would continue to be squeezed where they shouldn’t, leading to a continued rationing of care, and allowed to run rampant elsewhere. The coalition principles give a nod to assistance for low-income families, but that won’t necessarily protect them from getting squeezed along with the middle class.

There are better ways to achieve universal coverage that don’t depend on market players as insurance companies somehow changing their DNA. There’s single-payer, where our government provides health insurance and puts private companies out of business — though that comes with the major political hurdle of convincing those who are happy with their insurance to switch to a new system.

And there’s the new Health Care for America proposal from Yale professor Jacob Hacker, which would create a Medicare-style public plan for all Americans under 65. The public plan would compete with private plans, but on a fair playing field with no cherry-picking. Employers would have to provide good quality coverage or help fund the public plan.

These are the three main visions for universal coverage: a government-managed system completely replacing the private insurance industry, a new public plan that competes with private insurers on a government-regulated fair playing field, or reliance on private insurers to fix a problem largely of their own making.

Business leaders, who are in the best position to understand how the status quo hurts them and the country in a global economy, deserve credit for helping to shift the healthcare debate. But the Coalition to Advance Healthcare Reform will have to rethink some of its “core principles” if it is truly interested in meaningful change.

By R.W. - The Original

July 4, 2007 9:34 AM | Link to this

The USA ranks poorly in healthcare because of a flawed system. For every congressman, there are four lobbyists, skewing the decisions that have brought us to where we are, and conservatives are “just fine” with that.

It’s such a relief to be leaving this country. I’ll be able to have intelligent conversations with my new fellow countrymen again.

So long, nation of morons.

By Dusty

July 4, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this

Hmm

RW is in Florida. Since when is that no longer a part of the country? Also, RW loves the USA and always acts like it.

I smell a rat here, a liberal wanker rat, slinking around trying to act “smart”. Doesn’t work. Set the traps. There’s another liberal loser running amuck.

By steven

July 4, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

if you had seen the movie.. you would know that they discuss preventive medicine.. duh.

By greg b

July 4, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this

People are responsibly for their own health care. Bad health habits will kill you faster than any medical doctor. Drinking, drugs, obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer are the true killers. As my buddy always says, “It is not their fault, the rest of the world is screwed up.” Most people go thru life blaming their problems on everyone else. If I become sick, I will trust a doc in the good o’ US of A anyday, Have a happy 4th. Kick A* Troops!!!!!!!

By CodeName

July 4, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this

I loved the documentary. I believe that the health care providers in the United States are robbing the masses!