Thinking Right

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 8:34 AM | Link to this

Good morning all. Today’s topic is one of those fault lines between conservatives and leftists. Although I am on the “wrong” side of the immigration issue – like so much of life, I think we have entirely too many laws, and that is the main source of the problem here – I am grateful to talk radio for provoking the conversation and stalling what may well be flawed “compromise” legislation. Certainly our leftist friends deplore “hatred” they perceive arising from talk radio, but from our perspective there is no hatred – simply informed disagreement.

Talk radio ensures the ugly side of each argument is held up for public review – that was disconcerting for the leftists during the administration of the flawed President Horndog, and I suspect the Bush people are unhappy now about Congress’s inability to pass immigration reform. Certainly on the plus side of the ledger, talk radio exposed the Senate’s unwillingness to vote on conservative judicial nominees – that is a topic ripe for new attack – and talk radio exposed the bridge to nowhere. I am a fan of talk radio.

By RCH

June 25, 2007 8:37 AM | Link to this

The big three networks are considered left, most major newspapers are considered left,and all you have is talk radio. Yet it is feared by the left, especially Hillary and Nancy. Talk radio is popular because of its listeners, not because of Limbaugh, Boortz, or Hannity. It is they who keep the programs on the air. Millions of them. It is a vehicle were an ordinary citizen can give his opinion on the air. Maybe our government officials should listen in more often and hear the will of the people.

By Redneck Convert

June 25, 2007 8:49 AM | Link to this

Well, I think talk radio is important. When I’m driving my beer truck, I listen to Rush and Sean and Neal and beleive everything they tell me to beleive. I don’t listen to libruls like Al Franken. They are unAmerican and just plain traders. If Rush says the new immigration bill is amnesty, that’s good enough for me. The libruls need to keep their hands off of talk radio. Its about the only kind of radio where us good conservatives rule the roost and where people can hear The Truth.

Anyway, this bill is just a way to give my beer truck job to the Mexicans. I know my boss can’t wait to hire a Mexican to replace me. My boss complains all the time about me taking lots of breaks so I can log in and write on this blog and stop and chat with the bar owners. There ain’t much he can do about it now. But if the Mexicans become legal and get drivers CDL liscenses, he will put one in the drivers seat of my beer truck lickety-split and pay him about half of what I make. He will be delivering all kind of Mexican beer and leaving the good stuff like PBR behind. And I will be out mowing yards for a living and tipping my cap to the Mexicans that come to own the big houses.

I thought Saxby and Johnny already said they wouldn’t vote for this bill. Now Wooten says they ain’t decided yet. It must be a misprint. I know these good Republicans are looking out for my interest. A good Republican wouldn’t vote to bring in cheap labor to replace real Americans. And Saxby and Johnny are good Republicans.

Well, I’m all excited again about getting the death penalty for one of Those People that kilt a pregnant white woman in Ohio. I stop along the road to listen to the news about it every time it comes on. There ain’t nothing better than hearing about one of them getting the needle. And there ain’t nothing lower than a guy like this Nifong disappointing us rednecks and letting us down about getting long prison sentences for the Duke guys.

My boss just called to check where I am. He don’t know I’m logged in. I guess I better get back on the road and get him off of my back.

By MarkP

June 25, 2007 8:58 AM | Link to this

I don’t think I’d trust anything endorsed by the author of a column called “Thinking Right” to be anything but biased. The problem with both talk radio and pundit columnists — Mr. Wooten included — is that their fans tend to mistake them for journalists. Whether this is, technically, a problem with the fans or the columnists is semantics. Mr. Wooten frequently rails against citizens who would trust more balanced sources such as NPR (an actual journalistic production) or openly advocate groups such as AARP, but today he’s espousing the valuable service provided by talk radio. Media consumers — including our so-called “leaders” like Sens. Isaakson and Chambliss — should be more savy about recognizing when they’re being pandered to with a bunch of cherry-picked talking points and statistics meant to justify a pre-determined position. Let’s get back to grammar school composition: employ a variety of sources and analyses and employ some critical thinking skills when forming conclusions and positions.

By Southern Democrat

June 25, 2007 9:25 AM | Link to this

I hope that everyone had a wonderful weekend!

My good friend Jbmlaw extolls the virtues of talk radio and names a few specific issues where it has proved its worth. While this may be the case in certain instances, I would respectfully disagree.

Talk radio (based upon my listening) seems to play to the lowest common denominator. The vast majority of on-air personalities has little to no political experience and tends to barrage their audiences with extreme hypotheticals and “straw man” arguments (a very disfavored argument method in this Commentary section). There is not much new information offered or exchanged.

I find it intelectually lazy to discuss politics and listen to like-minded persons. I was blessed to marry a brilliant woman whose views tend to be right-of-center and have benefitted tremendously from her point of view in trying to figure out the best solution to various political issues. Similarly, I have thoroughly enjoyed getting to spar with many of you on here and have been made to pause and reconsider my stances on many occasions. I do not think that many talk radio listeners have this experience.

By 06

June 25, 2007 9:37 AM | Link to this

Let’s see. The redneck anti immigration wing of the Republican party lost 10 points worth of immigrant votes in 06 for the party. Enough to turn over seats in the senate and congress. Go ahead you less than intelligent cretins. Keep it up. Go for 20 points…no let’s make it 30 for the 08 elections. You bigots are going to hate 08. And if you don’t wise up and understand what kind of immigration bill you will get then, then you deserve to have it shoved deep and broke off in ya.

By Laurie

June 25, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this

Jim Wooten’s lies are annoying. I’m against the immigration bill being debated. It’s astoundingly bad on so many levels. However, one thing this horrible bill is not is an amnesty bill [penalties for coming into the country illegally are up to 50 percent of a low-income worker’s annual wages compared to McDonald’s having to pay less than 1/10 of 1 percent of annual revenues in punitive damages to the woman who suffered third-degree burns and multiple skin graft operation because of their coffee being dangerously hot]. Jim Wooten knows it’s not an amnesty bill, but he repeats that lie again today – as does Neil Boortz and the other talk radio misinformation specialists that Wooten credits.

With regard to the problem with talk radio, right wing radio dominates the public airwaves by 9 to 1. Limbaugh and fellow on-air liars will argue that nobody wants to listen to a radio show from the left. In truth, however, the cause of the disparity is that radio stations are owned by a small number of organizations. The FCC used to limit the number of stations that could be owned by any one organization, but as soon as those rules were loosened, consolidation took place and a very few got control of what the many have access to on the AM dial.

Nobody wants to censor speech. In fact, we want more speech. The solution is to break up the concentrated ownership that seeks to express their own political views via propaganda experts Limbaugh, Boortz, Hannity and others. The result would be more local programming and more choices for the listening audience.

By Curious Observer

June 25, 2007 9:51 AM | Link to this

I find talk radio to be a huge bore. By and large, it is dominated by reactionaries who give their sycophantic listeners what they want to hear. It has become a virtual recreation room for the intellectually lazy. Long gone are the days when informed figures of disparate political views exchange ideas and arguments. Instead, talk radio hosts invite the equivalent of straw men as a means of demonstrating the inevitable superiority of the hosts’ viewpoints.

The immigration bill is doomed, and perhaps rightly so. It is the creation of vested interests. Democrats want it as a means of increasing their voting support, while corporate interests want it as a means of ensuring an endless supply of cheap and legal labor. Left out of the equation are the interests of the working class.

The right-wing opponents of the bill will settle for nothing less than the deportation of all illegal immigrants, including, if possible, the revocation of the constitutional provision that bestows citizenship upon all who are born in America. The unionists and other opponents want no part of a bill that creates a permanent underclass of workers who will drive down wages and supplant legal workers.

The only reason that Chambliss and Isakson are still on the fence is that they are loath to surrender the contributions of their corporate masters. It is passing strange that the bill has become the wedge that splits business interests from the nativists and jingoists who have formed the principal support of the Republican party ever since the implementation of the Southern Strategy. Perhaps the one positive that has come from the bill is the removal of the cataracts from the eyes of workers who think that the Republican Party really represents their interests.

By deegee

June 25, 2007 9:53 AM | Link to this

Chambliss and Isakson made international news for their reversal of support for the Senate immigration bill. The Headline: “Letter from Washington: Profiles in cowardice over immigration bill.” Good for Chambliss and Isakson for taking advice from a self-described B.S. artist. They deserve the attention they are getting.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/06/24/news/letter.php

By Chip

June 25, 2007 9:59 AM | Link to this

I don’t think I’d trust anything endorsed by the author of a column called “Thinking Right” to be anything but biased. The problem with both talk radio and pundit columnists — Mr. Wooten included — is that their fans tend to mistake them for journalists. I suppose Kieth Olbermann, Katie Couric, and Chris Matthews are textbook objective reporters. Then there are the Jon Stewarts out there who many younger people get the majority of their news information from. What MarkP said is laughable at best. People like him see no bias, because their mindset is lockstep with what’s presented.

There is no such thing as an objective journalist anymore. Those days are long gone. Back in the days when the New York Times was a credible unbiased source of information, weeknight news with Walter Cronkite was just that - news. There were no personal biases injected into the news of the time. Something happened to the media when Ronald Reagan was elected. No longer were they able to cover news objectively, and surprise! Limbaugh went on the air soon after. The BBC recently came out of the closet and actually admitted they are liberally slanted .. duh. Today it’s the worst I have ever seen in subjectiveness. There are countless sites out there that track and follow everything from the Times to MSNBC to regional news outlets like WSBTV. One has to wonder though, are people like Katie Couric even aware how obvious it is that they are superimposing their own biases? Or do they just not care? One reason talk radio has been so successful as well as the internet is that people are seeking to escape the in your face bias. A new market was created, and it is really the failure of the media establishments that caused talk radio to take off as well as internet sites like Drudge. Interestingly, some mainstream media factions are starting to come around a little to conservative points of view. MSNBC has former congressman Joe Scarborough, and CNN has Glenn Beck. No matter what the Left says in this nation, conservatism is far from dead, and there will always be alternatives for us to find information that is either ignored completely or shunned back to the back pages of the New York Times.

By Chip

June 25, 2007 10:11 AM | Link to this

06 - the moderates rule this nation, and they can swing either way depending on the circumstances. They can cause conservatives to lose as in 2006, or they can cause liberals to lose as in 1994. Just so you know, that dagger of yours is going to get confiscated and destroyed regarding the current writing of the immigration bill. Only 5% of Americans think the immigration bill is good. How’s that for being in a minority, 06?

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this

One additional thought before the next round of meetings: in my previous post I expressed my affection for talk radio, in that it has proven useful, in a few instances, of exposing corruption and waste in our government. I admit my standards are low, however I have yet to find any comparable value in the administration of Congress. Our overlords understandably resent the questioning of their collective wisdom by the peons of talk radio; I simply place myself on the side of the questioners.

Dear Laurie @ 9:42, you express a desire, “to break up the concentrated ownership that seeks to express their own political views via propaganda experts…” Would you include the NY Times, CBS, AP, etc. in your proffered solution?

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 10:21 AM | Link to this

snigger smirk snigger TOO FUNNY!!

These arrogant lobotomised simpering leftist arsewipes are now puking up deranged bollocks about talk radio hosts (not) being journalists and using straw man arguments etc. Given the unremitting stream of obsessive leftist lies/distortions/propaganda and Bush hate that oozes virtually unchallenged from the party of hate media this is some kind of new sick leftist joke - right? Given that 89% of the D.C. based party of hate media voted for the pardon selling perjuring Arkansas rapist and that the commie rag Newsweek just admitted that media scum donate roughly 9 - 1 to demoNcrats I am assuming this snivelling dogturd Markprickface @ 8.58 will now quietly slither off into a shamed silence at its own execrable pinko brainlessness.

The guttersnipe racist inbred rednekkk UNDENIABLY needs the needle just as badly as any one on death row!! This worthless POS incessantly racebaits on here about black criminals with NO attempt to put such crimes into any kind of context. inbred’s sick abd twisted racism needs to dealt with properly!! A decent old timey lynching in a hippety hop hood would work for me!!!

A couple of days and the slimy putrid sleacy Klinton litter mate Tony B Liar will be history. This walking lying spin machine was very sound on Iraq and somewhat sound on towel head terror. Virtually everything else this dissembling corrupt wanker did in office has earned it the ever lasting hatred of most folks across ther political spectrum in the UK. GOOD RIDDANCE!!! Now we get the sullen misanthropic cut and run leftist porridge gobbbler and failed tax and spend Chancellor Gordon runt face Brown. The UK is still a long long way from being in safe hands!!

Uplifting thought for the day:

We have a vaccine for cervical cancer, for polio, for hepatitis, for rabies … why not one for liberalism?

By Dennis

June 25, 2007 10:21 AM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten writes, “Lott drew the wrath of talk radio hosts and listeners for saying last week that “talk radio is running America. We have to deal with that problem.”

How often has Lott complained when “talk radio” promoted Lott’s views? Which is more often than not.

Too, how much attention is Lott paying to Republican efforts that will allow the media, t.v./radio/newspapers/the internet, to be controlled by fewer and fewer corporations? (And those efforts ARE REPUBLICAN)!

Yes, it is interesting to hear complaints from the right-wing about a media that has produced so many supporters for right-wing causes.

And jbmlaw would be wrong to suppose all lefties are pro ammnesty. Hardly!

While some members of the left-wing may be hollering “human rights”, it is the right-wing that is hollering “think about the money”.

You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.

By Adam

June 25, 2007 10:23 AM | Link to this

The only thing this immigration bill is designed to fix is the Politicans problem. For more than 25 years there has been no concerted effort to control immigration particularly alnog our southern border. Both parties have blithely ignored the issue and given no sense of dedication to correcting the problem. In an attempt band-aid the issue we granted amnesty back in the 80’s but did nothing to quell the flow. Reagan, Bush Sr., Clinton, GWB, and Congress have not even given lip service.

Now we have 12-15 million and growing unabated. We have a situation that has been created solely by inaction and unwillingness to stop this illegal mass migration. So in order to deal with this we are told that this bill will fix the problem once and for all. Right! All this does is allow the politicans to say ‘What problem? We’ve already dealt with that’ thereby once again alleviating them of responsibility because by redefinition they’re all now legal immigrants.

Poof, just like that, no more illegals. Who says politicans can’t perform miracles.

By RCH

June 25, 2007 10:25 AM | Link to this

Lauri Your comment @ 9:42 does not hold water. Cox enterprises which owns the AJC and WSBTV tends to be a very liberal slanted news organization. However WSB Radio has a strong right lineup including Neal Boortz. People listen, and that gets the ratings, and that is what sells advertising. It all comes down to the big buck.

By Van

June 25, 2007 10:28 AM | Link to this

The “Talk Radio” jab is a distraction from what is really important.

While the left is trying to place blame on a bill that is so bad that it makes Michael Moore look good, they refuse to listen to what the people want.

1) Seal the borders to illegals 2) No path to citizenship for illegals.

If the Senate did just this little bit, their approvals would increase and they can proudly boast that they accomplished something these session.

Until then, it does not matter what talk radio says. With the news print media and the major networks beating the drum for this putrid bill, I can only guess that they want to erase all opposition to their way of thinking.

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this

come on heebeedeegee have the stones to admit you’re black (or at the very least non white)!! You ran away when challenged on this before! Your blatant vile racebaiting on ‘black’ topics, your obsession with the black child molesting pervert Wilson and general far left lunacy evince a sullen ebonics view of the world which you need to step up and admit too. Or are you JUST TOO ASHAMED to admit you’re black???!!!

I am proud to admit I am right wing secular white leftist hating Englishman with US citizenship.

snigger smirk snigger!!

By GodHatesTrash

June 25, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this

Talk radio is effective because it tells angry simple-minded rednecks things that support their angry simple-minded world view. It appeals to their fears and their hatreds.

Media is always slanted - some people value facts and reason, most people - and all rednecks - value simple-minded stupidity that sounds good, especially if a whiner/hater like themselves deliver the message in a whiny hatefilled style.

Notice that despite all the whining and hating and moaning about illegal immigration since the days of Reagan, our borders still aren’t secure, that thousands of people flaunt our immigration laws daily, and that hundreds of thousands of employers break our employment laws daily as well.

So whine and hate away, talk radio folks. Or, for all the good you do, why not fart in the wind? Same result.

Trash.

By Redneck Convert

June 25, 2007 10:36 AM | Link to this

Well, I’m disappointed as a good GA redneck can be to see that The Only Good Liberal Is a Dead Liberal or TFTT or whatever he calls hisself wants me lynched. And just because I come right out and say what he is really thinking. I have read his stuff when he blasts black crime and such and I couldn’t say it better myself.

I know good and well that he and Sister Dusty and Van and RCH was nodding their head when they read what I wrote. They have just been bullyed by the libruls till they are ashamed of saying what they really think.

Anyway, TFTT is just mad because us rednecks up at Billy Bob’s withdrawed the Ornery Redneck award we give him after he throwed it in our face. I wish I knowed who TFTT was. I would run him down with my beer truck.

By Dave

June 25, 2007 10:42 AM | Link to this

These problems from politicians will not happen until the Republican party splits in two. I think both major parties are barely able to hold on to their members.

For Democrats the socialists are in charge who will do anything for power, like all good socialists, they need to keep people from talking to get their way. If they get power look for National Socialism.

For Republicans, they are tired of greed and corruption and all this waffling and compromise. There are just some things you cannot make a compromise with.

If both parties were to split and a moderate party were to emerge, that moderate party would gain a majority.

By RCH

June 25, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this

Trash Maybe simple minds like simple ideas. Like the difference between right and wrong. Is is it that talk radio exposed all the loopholes in this bill, while the leftest controlled media sweep ed them all under the rug. I guess telling the truth is to simple, and breaking the law no longer wrong.

By Dennis

June 25, 2007 10:50 AM | Link to this

By Adam June 25, 2007 10:23 AM “The only thing this immigration bill is designed to fix is the Politicans problem.”

Bulls eye!!!

All intelligent Georgians wish they had two GOOD senators instead of the weak game players presently in office.

You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.

By GimmeAbreak

June 25, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this

By Chip

June 25, 2007 10:11 AM | Link to this

06 - the moderates rule this nation, and they can swing either way depending on the circumstances. They can cause conservatives to lose as in 2006, or they can cause liberals to lose as in 1994. Just so you know, that dagger of yours is going to get confiscated and destroyed regarding the current writing of the immigration bill. Only 5% of Americans think the immigration bill is good. How’s that for being in a minority, 06?

Chip where in the hell did you get that load of crap….the Aryan Times Hate em all poll? You’re an idiot. But sleep well thinking that crap Chip. Watch how many more seats the republicans lose plus the White House when even more Latinos go dem in 08.

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this

I am now completely convinced that inbred rednekkk is an interloping pathologially embittered product of extremely primitive yanKKKee genetic engineering. The truly evil, baleful (look it up crackpipe debbie turd) sociopathic kind that puked up the Kennedys and Rockefellers.

inbred’s magical unhinged homicidal hissy fit was a little gem. I am so proud I was able to elicit sucj dernaged bollocks so easily. Knowing exactly who your mortal enemies are and effortlessly manipulating them this EASILY is just too much fun!!

Feeding inbred to the Aryan Nation as a race traitor … huge smirk … would be the most fitting of ends for this worthless morose far leftist RACIST dogturd!!!

The killer point (gedditt??) about inbred’s rabid hiisy fit is that it repeats its obsessive fantasy about driving a beer truck. We all know from that CNN mockumentary its a scowling extra chromosomed scabies ridden eunuch at Bwarney Fwanks Asschussetts bathhouse for queeralicious turdburglars.

Greetings again MRS JM Karr-NAMBLA @ 10.36 … nice to see your VT based child molesting arse is NOT (yet) on its way to Europe to try and single handedly kidnap and despicably abuse the Vienna Boys Choir!!!

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 10:58 AM | Link to this

I am now completely convinced that inbred rednekkk is an interloping pathologially embittered product of extremely primitive yanKKKee genetic engineering. The truly evil, baleful (look it up crackpipe debbie turd) sociopathic kind that puked up the Kennedys and Rockefellers.

inbred’s magical unhinged homicidal hissy fit was a little gem. I am so proud I was able to elicit such deranged bollocks so easily. Knowing exactly who your mortal enemies are and effortlessly manipulating them this EASILY is just too much fun!!

Feeding inbred to the Aryan Nation as a race traitor … huge smirk … would be the most fitting of ends for this worthless morose far leftist RACIST dogturd!!!

The killer point (gedditt??) about inbred’s rabid hiisy fit is that it repeats its obsessive fantasy about driving a beer truck. We all know from that CNN mockumentary its a scowling extra chromosomed scabies ridden eunuch at Bwarney Fwanks Asschussetts bathhouse for queeralicious turdburglars.

Greetings again MRS JM Karr-NAMBLA @ 10.36 … nice to see your VT based child molesting arse is NOT (yet) on its way to Europe to try and single handedly kidnap and despicably abuse the Vienna Boys Choir!!!

By GodHatesTrash

June 25, 2007 10:59 AM | Link to this

RCH, do you think all this talk radio blather has stopped one illegal immigrant from coming in? Has it kept one single employer from breaking the labor laws?

Nope. It merely serves as a distraction for you simple-minded folks. You think you have accomplished something because a stupid redneck POS like Trent Lott backpedaled on an earlier statement?

Feel better? Moron.

Trash.

Trash.

By harold

June 25, 2007 11:01 AM | Link to this

HAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAHAHA

U SAID ‘snatches’

AAAAA HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAAA!

By getalife

June 25, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this

Never listen to drug addicts unless they are singing songs on the radio.

I think most of the right are using immigration to vent against their loser party.

w and cheney have cut and run from the law, not just on immigration but accountability for the crimes.

They think they are above the law.

Does talk radio talk about this or the failed Iraq occupation?

I am sure talk radio from the left does but many of us listen to music.

We already know w and cheney are cut and run cowards.

By Dusty

June 25, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this

Well, Jim Wooten, just put me down as NO OPINION on this one. I don’t listen to the radio unless I can find some good jazz filling the air or just plain ol’ peace and quiet. Kinda nice most times.

Maybe I am missing something but I doubt it.

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 11:09 AM | Link to this

the only good liberal is a dead liberal salutes harold for having the guts to post immediately after federal court ordered ECT … electro-convulsive therapy!!

By getalife

June 25, 2007 11:10 AM | Link to this

w and cheney are not cut and run cowards:

Because the Constitution needed shredding.

Because the rule of law is quaint.

Because all those lies that got us into the war have been proved worth it.

Because the war should never end.

Because being an international pariah is kind of cool.

Because international law is silly.

Because torture is fun.

Because ignoring all the screaming alarms before 9/11 was prudent.

Because New Orleans wasn’t all that great, anyway.

Because the people of New Orleans and Iraq were expendable.

Because our military personnel deserve to suffer unprecedented abuse at the hands of their own government.

Because it’s exciting knowing we’re all being spied upon.

Because we missed out on all the fun that was life in the Soviet Union.

Because the Department of Justice is meant to be used as a political weapon.

Because the way to get rid of election fraud is to get rid of elections.

Because every national regulatory agency should be run by former lobbyists from the industries each agency regulated.

Because corporate executives were underpaid and their employees were coddled.

Because our government should be of, by, and for the fossil fuel industries.

Because billions of dollars needed to be funneled from hardworking taxpayers through off-book, no-bid contracts to corporations owned by members of the Administration, and their friends and relatives.

Because our minds just aren’t beautiful enough to appreciate a war president commander guy unitary executive.

Because Congressional lawmaking authority was meant to be nullified with the stroke of a signing-statement pen.

Because Rococo art was actually pretty amazing, so the Divine Right of Kings must also have been.

Because global warming doesn’t exist.

Because people suffering from Alzheimer’s, Parkinson’s, and Multiple Sclerosis are less important than single cells in petri dishes.

Because we need to set a precedent that presidents have impunity.

Because Democracy was a failed experiment.

Because the backlash against President Clinton’s impeachment proved that the public has no taste for impeachment- no matter the extent of the high crimes and misdemeanors.

Because Congressional Republicans are just dying to sacrifice their careers to defend an imploding Administration.

Because it’s scary to be decisive.

Because it’s scary to rise to history’s challenges.

Because David Broder would write something nasty about the Democrats.

Because all those annoying bloggers might start to believe they were actually right.

By RCH

June 25, 2007 11:12 AM | Link to this

Trash

RCH, do you think all this talk radio blather has stopped one illegal immigrant from coming in? Has it kept one single employer from breaking the labor laws?

Never said it did,but it gave many the “real” bill that was being passed. Many of those called their congressman and senators making their wills know. Whats wrong with knowing all the information and then making an informed decision? Many elements of this bill were never discussed on the mainstream media. Why do you want to keep people in the dark?

By John Chambers

June 25, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this

I completely agree, however since the public airwaves are polluted with race baiting, elitist, bigoted scum, such as boortz, hannity, and savage I pay 12.99 a month for XM radio. Joe Madison The Black Eagle on XM channel 169 is a breath of fresh air. No longer do I have to listen to these scumbags push their conservative agenda. To be honest, with the state of the union in such shambles, who in their right mind would actually vote another conservative in office? And no matter what boortz calls himself, he is a cowardly conservative and all of his followers are dopes.

By Qman

June 25, 2007 11:22 AM | Link to this

Boortz, Hannity, Limbaugh, O’Reilly…just Jerry Springers for right wing retards.

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 11:28 AM | Link to this

Seeing the oh so preDICKtable irrational envious leftist hate puked up about Rush, Hannity, O’Reilly et al is just pure magic. Makes you REAL proud to be part of the growing vibrant movement to euthanise ALL cut and run treasonous leftists!!

By zenith

June 25, 2007 11:29 AM | Link to this

No longer do I have to listen to these scumbags push their conservative agenda.

John, were you ever forced to listen to it in the first place idoit? You are so typical of the intolerant left. What are you afraid of, someone having a differing opinion than you? It’s always easy to just call everyone you have disagreements with a racist, homophobe, bigot, xenophobe, or insert word here _. It is amusing listening to the hate bellow from your empty souls like God Hate’s Trash.

By Billy

June 25, 2007 11:30 AM | Link to this

We get the daily bombings in Iraq from the network newscasts and city dailies, it’s true. We also get a daily dose of the Dow and a reminder about the employment rates from time to time.

But how much air time do these stories get in the so-called liberal ((i.e. fact-based and reality-based) news media:

The right-wing myth that network news, the New York Times, the AJC, and others are liberal news organizations is exactly that.

Thank God for the internet.

(Note: For those that claim they’ve heard some or all of this news from the main stream media, the point that is the amount and placement of such coverage is deliberately inadequate.)

By C.K.

June 25, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this

The news media is liberal because they report the truth about what’s happening to our troops in the war zone and when they get home and about corruption and mismanagement in the White House?

If that’s the definition of liberal, then I’m for it.

By harold

June 25, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

NPR.. We put the NPR in uNPRecedented bias!

Seriously they are as bad as limbaugh and friends. and they talk sooooo slooooooowwwwwwww harold cant stand listenign to them!

Attention span should not come into play while listening to the utterance of a single syllable!!

By getalife

June 25, 2007 11:42 AM | Link to this

From the producers of an excellent documentary on Vietnam, “The Fog of War”, there is another one out this summer filmed by the troops

By I'm angry. Why aren't you?

June 25, 2007 11:43 AM | Link to this

If the news media was liberal, as some here have claimed, then Bush, Cheney, Gonzales and others in the White House would have been impeached by now.

The truth is that most Americans don’t know the half of the damage they’ve done and are continuing to do. The clowns in the White House (and their apologists in Congress) have been destroying this country for the benefit of their friends since day one, and if people really knew the magnitude of the damage, then they wouldn’t put up with it.

Liberal media my a$$.

By harold

June 25, 2007 11:48 AM | Link to this

the media is just a few huge corporations

huge corporations are not liberal

never had it never will

7up the uncola

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this

the only good liberal is a dead liberal is shocked!! harold made an unexpected irrefutable incisive point about the vile bias on NPR - Noxious Pinko Rats - hate radio!! jolly well done harold!

By Brian

June 25, 2007 11:51 AM | Link to this

(Note: For those that claim they’ve heard some or all of this news from the main stream media, the point that is the amount and placement of such coverage is deliberately inadequate.)

I’ll just address two of those issues brought up. 1, poverty is based on income, not wealth or lack of it. A 19 year old who lives with her parents and only works part time while going to college is included in those poverty statistics. A millionaire with no income is also included in said poverty statistics. 2, the crime rate increase is directly proportional to the increase of illegal immigration.

Those are but two examples of why the media doesn’t tell you everything you need to know, or as in point 2, doesn’t have the guts to tell everything you need to know due to political correctness. Inadequate coverage indeed.

By Van

June 25, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this

Why is it that liberals are all about tolerance and fairness, until it comes to talk radio?

Then, it is all about censoring what the people want to hear.

Radio is a market driven arena, if it can’t sell advertising, it does not survive on the air.

By getalife

June 25, 2007 12:18 PM | Link to this

“Neal Boortz, he popped us pretty good,” said Lindsay Mabry, a spokeswoman for Sen. Saxby Chambliss, R-Ga., who shifted from qualified support to opposition to the bill in recent days. She said Chambliss consulted with Boortz on immigration even though the senator was not an on-air guest during the debate.”

Vote this idiot out of the Senate.

Geez.

By @@

June 25, 2007 12:21 PM | Link to this

Although I don’t listen to talk radio, I have a general idea of the format based on others who do.

What I find most interesting about the whole immigration hooplah is that it was created by politicians, compounded under the negligent eye of politicians, and is now the target of politicians while at the same time, the politicians themselves have become the American peoples’ target on the issue.

Trent Lott expanded on his comment regarding talk radio saying “We, as politicians, have failed to explain what our intentions are when we implement legislation; what we are trying to accomplish with the bills, and as a result talk radio presented the immigration bill absent the facts.”

The politicians have gotten away with ^^^ that long enough. Talk radio will hold their feet to the fire.

Trying to slip it in on the American people and stepped on their “banana” peeeeel.

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 12:22 PM | Link to this

Dear harold @ 11:41, I share much of your perspective, especially early in the morning. Mrs. jbmlaw and I discovered WCLV on the internet, and now we listen to classical music without NPR – best of all worlds. WABE plays good music, but not at the rush hours, which is when we need Mozart the most. Thank goodness for mp3s for the commute.

Dear Dusty @ 11:07, although I greatly admire your standards generally, I respectfully suggest that “good jazz filling the air” may be an oxymoron.

By River Rat

June 25, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this

I can’t wait til the moonbats here get some clout and solve the earths ills.Can you imagine if one or more of these dipwads actually had a voice.If you don’t need someone to tell you what to think, why would you listen to talk radio.

By Brian Too

June 25, 2007 12:24 PM | Link to this

“the crime rate increase is directly proportional to the increase of illegal immigration”

uh-huh.

The crime rate increase is due to the fact that police departments are experiences serious shortages around the country because so many cops were are also in the National Guard or Reserves and are in Iraq and because Bush and the Republican-led Congress gutted the COPS program that had provided needed funds for hiring tens of thousands of police officers around the country. In addition, the poverty rate is climbing, high-school drop-out rates are climbing and with these increases come increases in violent crime rates.

As you wrote, due to “political correctness” (use of this well-worn phrase is a good indication of where you get your so-called facts) the media does not have the guts to tell us everything we need to know

By MarkP

June 25, 2007 12:25 PM | Link to this

“Chip” at 9:59 AM shows how easy it is for a pundit to make a loud, pithy, misleading non-argument. My original points: Talk radio and newspaper columnists rely on their products being mistaken for researched journalism by their fans while people should instead rely on a variety of sources, their own research and aggressive critical thinking. Chip’s response: Left-leaning reporters are no better, I refuse to see bias in the sources I view, (which apparently include Jon Stewart) etc. ??? Chip — don’t insert arguments that haven’t been made, or reverse the ones that were, unless you’re aiming for a job as a talk radio host or columnist.

By DJ

June 25, 2007 12:33 PM | Link to this

Gosh - another day, another reflexive, fawning defense of any and every right wing issue by Jim Wooten. All those who are surprised, raise their hands. And of course, right on cue is Jim’s #1 butt-li…. er… fan, jbmlaw, who apparently lives each day to be the first poster on the board to chime in with the obligatory “I support everything Jim says” post. How boring. And JBM - got to love your reference to squak radio as “informed” disagreement. “informed”??? that’s funny, considering talk radio is 95% ideological partisan spin (with a healthy dose of misinformation or outright lies). Of course you love it. It’s much better then thinking.

By Bumper Sticker

June 25, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this

Like pornography, right-wing talk radio is enormously popular.

Apparently a lot of lonely men jack off to it.

By tc87

June 25, 2007 12:40 PM | Link to this

Brian Too, so long as you are going to blame the lack of cops on Bush and war, why don’t you also blame the lack of them on an aging demographic front and more kids going to college out of high school than even ten years ago. If you are going to be credible, at lest tell all sides of the story. As USA Today said, it was a perfect storm and all three factors play a role. If it bothers you that much, why don’t you sign up and be a cop or a figherfighter then?

By Jackie

June 25, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this

Talk radio is the propaganda outlet for the extremist who do not wish to be fully informed. They take half-truths and outright lies to formulate a decision, not taking into account their decision is flawed because it begins with a flawed premise. The only nerve talk radio hits is that of being loud, obnoxious and the taking of a large swath of public bandwidth. Ask the question, what is Rush right about?

By van's a nose picker

June 25, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this

Wow, what an observation! Talk radio sponsors have it figured out. They can provoke heart attacks and high blood pressure in their aging market with hate inspired rants by Laura Ingraham, Lou Dobbs, et al. Then they can sell them pharmaceuticals and motorized wheel chairs to keep them around and hooked into their market. Trent Lott’s got it half right. It’s the pill pushers that are running the country by proxy. It’s brilliant!

By BS Aplenty

June 25, 2007 1:02 PM | Link to this

I think all is well in America. We’ll cobble together legislation that manages the current immigration issues but legislation that also promotes continued non-inflationary economic growth. That’s one of the important reasons our President & Congressmen are reluctant to strictly enforce the current immigration law.

If you think immigration’s bad just imagine how you’d like to manage the country if chicken prices rose to $10.00/lb and we won’t discuss vegetable, fruit & housing costs, among many others. They’re managing those types of issues - so, managed immigration is necessary.

To our new Mexican-American friends I would say: learn the language & culture of your new home - assimilate and be good citizens. Honor the laws of your new home - dealing drugs & gang-banging will make you and other immigrants short-term guests of this country or long-term residents of the NAMBLA day spa (federal pen).

By Truths Sister

June 25, 2007 1:05 PM | Link to this

I wish I knowed who TFTT was. I would run him down with my beer truck.

I’ll tie him up, and you can drag him down the road. Thank God for beer trucks!!

By AmVet

June 25, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this

First, let me say that Bumper Sticker’s addition to this discussion, though crude, was funny!

IMHO talk radio is taken WAY too seriously by both sides.

And to me it appears to be the genesis of many of the extremists web sites now so frequently quoted, both far right and far left.

I have never viewed it as much more than entertainment with the primary goal of making money for the sponsors and to do so strictly by being controversial.

I tried listening to it but gave up about 15 years ago.

Is there useful information to be gotten there. Probably, but it is generally only provided to make a predetermined point. It may be the ultimate example of the old adage - liars figure and figures lie.

And think about it. IF it were not primarily entertainment, but was truly a serious outlet for important information, the format would have to change entirely.

There would need to be extensive input from varying quarters with open ended questions not targeted towards a preselected conclusion of correctness. Give and take. A clear understanding that compromise is how solutions are formed. And a real search for ALL of the best options available.

But that would be incredibly boring and wouldn’t last a week, much less decades.

So I’m not sure if it’s art imitating life or life imitating art, but the venue is eerily similar to the failings we see in Washington.

By Truths Sister

June 25, 2007 1:10 PM | Link to this

nice to see your VT based child molesting arse is NOT (yet) on its way to Europe to try and single handedly kidnap and despicably abuse the Vienna Boys Choir!!!

Sigh…….He sure does Aunt Eloise, (who’s also our sister and also our mother), proud!!! You show ‘em Big Brother!!! Inbreds RULE!!!

By Truths Sister

June 25, 2007 1:12 PM | Link to this

Rock on Dusty!!! There IS such a thing as good jazz!!! jbmlaw doesn’t know what he’s talking about!! He’s still listening to Druid Love Chants and Chamber Music anyway!!

By Shar

June 25, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this

I wholeheartedly agree with those posters who say that talk radio, like any commercial enterprise, aims to attract the greatest possible number of people and thereby make the greatest profit. Before Limbaugh speaks, he does not decide what issue he wants to promote but what his listeners want to hear. So does Jon Stewart. Their delivery is very different but their intent is the same, to reinforce brand preference among their target audience. Secondarily, they try to vet their speech to avoid such rampant offense as would embarass their employers, the advertisers, into disassociating themselves with that brand. Remember, Don Imus was not fired for making sexist, racist remarks - he lost his job because he made the station lose advertising.

That said, the more interesting question about advocacy media in general is why we want to listen to it. Citizens of a democracy have the duty and the privilege of seriously assessing issues of importance and expressing their considered opinion through the ballot box or in interaction with their representatives. I believe that we have somehow degenerated into more of a stadium of football fans, rooting only for one side, cheering those who denigrate the opponents and silencing those who would admire good plays of the other side. I believe this is both lazy and devisive, encouraging extremism and stifling both debate and accountability.

As far as advocacy media’s “efforts to explain the bill’s provisions”, I support legitimate efforts to get all of the salient elements and consequences of this unwieldy legislation before the public and to spark debate and participation. Talk radio has done a good job of the second, but not the first. The complex issues have been boiled down to insults flung indiscriminately at those who don’t agree - “nativist redneck racists” versus “vote-pandering globalist profiteers” - in order to discredit the speaker and undermine the legitimacy of opposing perspectives. This is counterproductive and shameful, whether done by the right or the left.

By catlady

June 25, 2007 1:22 PM | Link to this

Our senators, my friends, are blowing in the wind. The senators are blowing in the wind. (Apologies to Peter, Paul, and Mary)

For those clammoring about $10 chicken and vegetables, could we not allow LEGAL immigrants to come in (health and background checked) and do this work, in a controlled way, after deporting those who have come illegally? In other words, REWARD those who are doing it right? And have protections for them and for the rest of us in place, up front (ie, for them, a decent wage, health care, and housing provided by the employer, and for the rest of us, no anchor babies, no presumptive Medicaid, etc)?

By BS Aplenty (Talk Radio Apologists - Sort of)

June 25, 2007 1:27 PM | Link to this

Re: Jackie

It’s like asking the prosecutor or defense attorney whose side they’re on - you know what you’re getting when you listen to them.

By Bumper Sticker

June 25, 2007 1:33 PM | Link to this

Like left-wing talk radio, good jazz is barely popular.

Apparently a lot of lonely musicians prefer really bad jazz.

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this

Dear DJ @ 12:33, your post reflects the highest level of leftist logic, thanks for exposing your capacity.

So far none of our leftist friends offer any objection to talk radio other than, “I don’t like it.” I don’t like leftism; my dislike, however, is a long way from any attempt to silence it.

I think Jim’s unstated question arises from Sen. Inhofe’s affirmation of overhearing conversation between Senators Clinton and Boxer, affirming a need for oversight of talk radio, i.e., a content-based “control.” Today Senator Feinstein demands a recreation of the pre-talk radio world of the “Fairness Doctrine” which required all ideas, no matter how stupid or unpopular, receive equal time on the radio; I think it no coincidence that the era of the Fairness Doctrine was also the era in which leftist control over the government was at its highest point, and economic growth in the country was at its lowest point. What say ye leftists to the idea of censoring content on the radio by any means other than market forces? Tell us what you really think.

By BS Aplenty

June 25, 2007 1:45 PM | Link to this

Re: catlady

Quit strokin’ your p*** and listen.

I am for managed immigration. No doubt the folks in Congress have seriously dropped the enforcement ball. But also, no doubt, they’re now worried about the ramifications of a sudden exodus of those employed immigrants (and the attendant costs of exporting them).

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 1:46 PM | Link to this

Dear AmVet @ 1:07, about the time I wrote my latest screed, you posted an efficient and well written argument, my compliments.

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this

a rather revealing, decidedly unsympathetic picture of inbred rednekkk has recently emerged.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/1103061allgier1.html

Lookee here wot I found (by accident) on Google folks. One’s witty originality is NOT in vain it seems.

Rudy’s dozen promises | Thinking Right | ajc.comyou’ll have the resident obsessive queers Mrs JM Karr-NAMBLA nee rednekkks and aborted foreskin hitting on you (hopefully with a heavy baseball bat) … www.ajc.com/opinion/content/shared-blogs/ajc/thinkingright/entries/2007/06/13/rudy_commits.html - 175k - Cached - Similar pages

By RCH

June 25, 2007 1:57 PM | Link to this

BS You and I know well that those with jobs and an inroad to our society will not leave. But, if they did there are many in the wings that would gladly take their places. Costs to deport them. Zero. Deprived of jobs, shelter, social services, most would return home to their country of origin. After the 1983 amnesty only 35% of the three million illegals applied for citizenship. Where did the rest go? Home.

By Brian Too

June 25, 2007 2:01 PM | Link to this

tc87 @ 12:40 wrote,”Brian Too, so long as you are going to blame the lack of cops on Bush and war…”

I don’t blame the lack of cops on the Bush and war — the facts do:

“Communities across America have been especially hard-hit by the deployment of some 24,000 police officers since September 11, 2001…Police across the United States say the wars have also robbed police academies of fresh faces…Guard and Reserve service has affected just about every police department’s ability to respond to calls for service”

Not liking certain facts, doesn’t make them any less true.

By Brian Too

June 25, 2007 2:04 PM | Link to this

Here are some more facts that tc87 won’t like:

“According to the study by the Government Accountability Office, COPS hiring grants were responsible for reducing crimes by about 200,000 to 225,000 crimes between 1998 and 2000 – one third of which were violent. Even though the COPS program has been credited with helping significantly reduce crime rates during the mid to late 1990’s, previous [Republican-led] Congresses have consistently cut funding for COPS hiring grants – reducing them by more than $1 billion a year in the late 1990s to just $198 million in 2003, and then to only $10 million in 2005.
“

By Southern Democrat

June 25, 2007 2:05 PM | Link to this

Jbmlaw,

I understand and agree with the gist of your point. I would note, however, that the intersection of the FCC and the overzealous protection of all media outlets (particularly cable and telecom) prevents any true “market” functionality.

We have a dangerous “perfect storm” where the vast majority of news outlets are owned by a tiny, tiny few, coupled with an executive branch that seeks to expand power while restricting access, while having an increasingly undereducated and detached populace.

Thus, there is a dearth of information, controlled by a few, that is questioned by none.

To me, the talk radio mentality is reminiscent of my dear Catholic Church’s view on indulgences pre-Martin Luther: allowing citizens to delude themselves into being active in the political discussion while, in actuality, simply providing a limited forum of targeted blame-playing. By the way, I consider Air America, The Daily Show, and the Colbert Report to be just as guilty of this perpetuation of laziness.

By BS Aplenty (More than Aplenty)

June 25, 2007 2:08 PM | Link to this

Re: RCH

Point taken.

By Shar

June 25, 2007 2:11 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw@1:42 - Since you have previously plopped me down in the leftist camp, albeit with a few kind and appreciated comments, I’ll take your censorship challenge on. Whether right, left or center, I’d censor the same sort of speech that the Supremes have outlawed - yelling “Fire!” in a crowded theater. Talking heads should not launch personal attacks or posit unsubstantiated “facts” in order to cut off dissent or incite mobs. The Feds have also decided that obscenity is subject to censorship, which I think is a bit more problematical although I admit that I prefer not to be ambushed by spewing filth when I incautiously turn a dial or switch channels. That, however, is a preference and therefore more appropriately falls under your market force category.

I don’t want Senator Feinstein telling me what I have to listen to any more than I want Senator Brownback telling me what I can do with my body. But I don’t believe that lies should be allowed to provoke stampedes in pubic opinion. Look at Iraq!

By Tim

June 25, 2007 2:11 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw wrote, “So far none of our leftist friends offer any objection to talk radio other than, “I don’t like it.”…”

I see that jbmlaw borrows the tactics of those he condones: lying. See the posts at 9:25 and 9:42, among others.

By CBL

June 25, 2007 2:17 PM | Link to this

If talk radio has done anything right in this debate, it has caused Congress to tremble in their boots at the behest of the American people, as they should, because they’re working for me and they’re on my payroll. That “problem” that Trent Lott wants to deal with is the fact that the middle and working-class Americans heard of this B.S. and and became a bunch of NIMBYs. If I may be so frank, Trent Lott can go suck an egg.

Thanks be to Boortz, Hannity, Rush, and my favorite Michael Savage for igniting the fires of anger from Americans who feel they have been cheated. This whole debate would not have occurred had it not been for them.

By RCH

June 25, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this

BS I agree we are as a nation responsible for the illegal influx of these people, therefor we are responsible to cleaning up the mess. I realize that we need them as much as they need us.

However, we are responsible to “scrub” all immigrants for criminal background, medical checks, etc., just like our forefathers were inclined to do.

This is our nation and if you want to play here you must follow the rules regarging immigration and not the rule of the mob.

By Katie

June 25, 2007 2:24 PM | Link to this

In response to jbmlaw’s question, “What say ye leftists to the idea of censoring content on the radio by any means other than market forces?”

I can’t speak for “leftists”, but this liberal agrees that the Fairness Doctrine likely would not correct the imbalance in talk radio and market forces should be the means by which content is decided.

We should address the significant problem of concentrated ownership in order to push the market structure. If we break up concentrated ownership, and encourage greater local accountability over radio licensing, and still end up with lots of conservative talk, then so be it.

As somebody wrote earlier — we need more speech, not less.

By dorae

June 25, 2007 2:28 PM | Link to this

I for one enjoy talk radio. It is what it is. Commentary for the most part. You don’t get a viewpoint on current issues from the mainline media. And this from someone who when given the chance enjoys the morning shows on tv. But, I’m particular. I enjoy Boortz especcally and would really like to hear more from Jamie Dupree ( I hope I spelled his name right). Contrary to what Boortz may wish to portray I don’t feel he has any hate agenda. It would be great if WSB was to bring Royal back and get rid of Savage who is very irritating and sounds lke a conspiracy theorist most of the time. Please forgive me if I get this next wrong, but I believe It’s Hewitt that comes on in the Pm on 920 who has interviews with public figures. I find that format very informative and Royal use to do that on his program.
From what I can tell the radio talk show hosts ask questions and express views that most people don’t hear elsewhere which is why they have listeners.
I don’t think one would clasify Clark Howard as talk radio in the format being disucssed here but he is also very informative. I believe people want to be informed and talk radio answers questions and provides a format that allows the public to speak out on a wide range of subjects. It would be a great shame to do away with talk radio as we know it. It would seem that it is the people who are scared of talk radio who have a hidden agenda and a tendancy to “hate” radio. As for public radio. Please keep me from people who talk like they are so above everyone else in their false artsy/educated radio voices. If they really wanted people to listen to their views they would talk like the people they claim to represent.

Well that’s my 2 cents worth.
Please overlook the missspelled words and grammer errors.

By Redneck Convert

June 25, 2007 2:34 PM | Link to this

Well, it looks like TFTT has come across a guy with worse tattoos than the guy I saw at WalMart at lunch. The guy I saw was real old and using a walker, kind of bent over and puny looking. The tattoo on one arm said “Born to raise hell” and the other tattoo said “Your mother’s worst nightmare.” I guess the guy was right about the last one. It just goes to show you need to be careful what you get tattoed on you because it will be with you for a while.

I think I like Truth’s Sister. You tie him up, girl, and I will drag him behind my beer truck till they arrest me for polluting. We all know what’s inside a person like that, and you can’t leave it all over a road.

By Brad

June 25, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this

The difference between Neil Boortz and Clark Howard is that one is a serial liar and the other wouldn’t tell a lie if a gun was held to his head.

By van's a nose picker

June 25, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this

CBL, it’s time for your Lotrel. Take it before you bust an artery. Michael Savage has ignited enough fires of anger in you to burn right through your chest cavity.

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 2:46 PM | Link to this

Dear Shar @ 2:11, thanks for your thoughtful commentary. I wish to follow up, and Southern, please feel free to jump in also.

“Talking heads should not launch personal attacks or posit unsubstantiated “facts” in order to cut off dissent or incite mobs.”

(1) Does your standard apply to politicians also, e.g., Howard Dean as head of DNC?

(2) If, hypothetically, Move On made untrue statements about the administration in order to ‘cut off dissent’ or ‘incite mobs,’ what sanction should be applied? Does your answer differ if the NY Times reports the ‘untrue’ statement word-for-word? Does your answer differ if WSB AM thereafter reads the NY Times article word-for-word?

(3) Do you think it appropriate to terminate the existence of a broadcaster who, in the subjective view of a bureaucrat, crosses the line, and thus pull the broadcast license?

I am not intentionally playing gotcha, but – forgive the trite phrase – I see a slippery slope.

By getalife

June 25, 2007 2:52 PM | Link to this

Turn off hate radio and tune into some music to sooth your poor souls.

That guy in Utah is a product of “white power” in our prison system.

Geez.

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 2:56 PM | Link to this

Dear Katie @ 2:24, a question pops in my mind, derivative of your argument, “We should address the significant problem of concentrated ownership in order to push the market structure. If we break up concentrated ownership, and encourage greater local accountability over radio licensing, and still end up with lots of conservative talk, then so be it.” My argument: Google exercises far greater control over the thoughts and freedoms of America than all of talk radio combined. We should break up the ownership of that true monopoly, and encourage greater local accountability over internet search engines.

I seek your reaction to my argument. (Parenthetical thought, you have not seen enough of my ramblings, but “leftist” is not particularly an epithet as I use it. Many of my collectivist friends dislike “Socialist,” “Progressive,” “Liberal,” and “Collectivist.” I strain to find a word that does not offend when I address statists collectively.)

By C. Charles

June 25, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this

I won’t speak for Shar, but I believe that jbmlaw is comparing apples and oranges in his 2:46.

We’re talking about the airwaves that belong to the public and are, by definition, limited in supply (there can only be so many stations on the dial in any one location). Move-on.org and Howard Dean do not have control of the airwaves.

With regard to the question of subjectivity…facts are not subjective. If one attempts to persuade others with lies (e.g. the immigration bill contains an amnesty provision), then I would argue that their broadcast license should be under suspended or revoked — I suppose by a “bureaucrat”.

By Adam

June 25, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this

The prospect of allowing the government to shut down radio outlets based on what these autocrats deem “fair” should be chilling to everyone. However we see little resistance to this idea from the Leftists who normally rail against censorship. I can only guess they get inspiration from Jimmy Carter’s hero Hugo Chavez and feel they should follow suit.

These anti-freedom types typically don’t bother to refute the arguments presented by talk radio but rather just resort to the same tired old chant of hate, homophobic, racist, etc etc. As we all know, “Progressive” radio has been a huge bust. Whenever I tried listening there was little thoughtful substance but a lot of the same old boring “Bush is a Terrorist” ranting. Try ideas instead of name calling.

Aside from the dreadful lack of ratings in Lib Talk, there is also the problem of attracting advertising. After all. with their demographics who would want to spend money advertising to their listeners unless you were selling Earth Shoes or Hookah Pipes?

By AmVet

June 25, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this

getalife, your point at 2:52 is exactly why I choose not to listen to radio, especially talk radio.

Ironically, I’ve always been a big sports fan, but for me, even sports talk radio is death! Yuck!!!

Hundreds of CDs of the music I choose, is my way to make it down the highways and byways of Hotlanta!

Talk radio reminds me of Fat Bastard’s sentiments: “There are two things I can’t stand. One is intolerance of other cultures. The other is the Dutch!”

Off to find my mojo!

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 3:13 PM | Link to this

Dear C Charles @ 2:57, there is only a fixed amount of land. I assume you would concede that an affirmation that “all land belongs to the government” would be a false statement. Why should airwaves be any different? Why should we not sell them, to eliminate the national debt?

By Katie

June 25, 2007 3:14 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw,

With all due respect, Google is a poor analogy. You can enter any search engine you want into your browser (or any other url address). The internet is as close to resembling or providing as perfect a free market as we can hope to get.

On the other hand, as C. Charles just indicated, the supply of public radio broadcast stations is limited in Atlanta and everywhere else (a significant obstacle to the free market we both desire).

I’m sure that you can find a way to address those on this blog who disagree with you without using an objectionable term (I’ve never heard anyone from the left object to being called a “progressive”) just as I can address my fellow Americans on the right without labeling them Nazis or fascists.

By jbmlaw

June 25, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this

Dear Katie @ 3:14, we conservatives universally appreciate “Conservative.” I fear whatever term I use for your fellow travelers comes out as a sneer – I am that way, you understand.

Back to my argument, though, I am in earnest about Google, I insist that they are corrupting our searches, and as they control 85% of the search engine market, I think the ownership must be broken up, to ensure voices not carried by Google are heard, and to ensure diverse use by their competitors. Alternatively, I think Google ought to be regulated, to ensure they do not hold such corruption in their searches. - How does my argument differ from the criticism of talk radio?

By Curious Observer

June 25, 2007 3:23 PM | Link to this

Is it not strange that this Allgier was featured in a TV documentary about Utah’s prison system, one that ran just last week? And is it not stranger still that at the time he was in “ad seg”—administrative segregation—as a danger to the rest of the prison population? Now we learn that he has since been paroled and—surprise, surprise!—has violated probation twice.

Apparently, the parole board deemed him unsafe to unleash on the prison population, but not on the unsuspecting public.

By harold

June 25, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this

WABE plays steven spielberg movie theme song type classical music. they should be dragged outside and shot! even the kids on the Georgia Tech radio station play far better classical music than WABE

between WABE’s terrible musical choices and their lack of news shows they are the worst NPR station Harold has ever heard!!!! its better to “donate” to XM and get real news and real classical than to donate to WABE’s presumably outrageously high salaries and get nonstop garbage

By Adam Fan

June 25, 2007 3:28 PM | Link to this

GOP Operations Manual

Rhetoric Tactic 212:Label those you oppose as “anti-freedom”, “unpatriotic”, etcetera.

Rhetoric Tactic 213:Associate the opposition in a sentence with Castro, Chavez, Marx or Stalin.

Rhetoric Tactic 214:Associate your opponent with 1960’s style hippies.

Rhetoric Tactic 215:Complain that your opponent will only resort to name calling.

Rhetoric Tactic 216:Whatever you do, do NOT provide actual facts with supporting documentation. Somebody might call you on it, thereby forcing you to actually think and engage (this would be bad for our cause).

Adam at 3:06,

Good job again, buddy.

By harold

June 25, 2007 3:29 PM | Link to this

“ownership must be broken up, to ensure voices not carried by Google are heard, and to ensure diverse use by their competitors”

finally people are starting to see the light about the google!! thank goodness!!

By Katie

June 25, 2007 3:40 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw,

Google controls the search engine market because consumers have choice. “Conservatives” dominate talk radio because consumers do not have choice.

By Shar

June 25, 2007 3:42 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw@2:46 - Yes indeed, it is a slippery slope. Hence the caution with which censorship is approached by those who P.J. O’Rourke memorably called “our nine old nags in black muumuus.” As Charles pointed out at 2:57, facts are not subjective. Howard Dean and Karl Rove can spin events to suit their perspectives and purposes, but neither can accuse the other of being a closeted transgendered lesbian without some sort of proof (ewwww!). To dootherwise is libelous. Even advocacy groups who play the fastest and loosest with the truth - Move On and Swift Boat Veterans come to mind - have to draw the line at bald faced lying, although they dance as close to the line as they can. The media ripple effect gets iffy, requiring some level of judgement and corroboration before “reputable” media report the specifics of allegations made by others. If the accuser is credible and the accusations can be corroborated in some regard, then the media would have reason to report them as allegations.

Market forces alone are not enough to stifle the desperate urge to discredit opposition or incite reaction. This is particularly true in this age of instant information, when a well-timed lie can win an election or inflate an earnings estimate. Catastrophic consequences can mitigate that temptation significantly.

By BS Aplenty (And the Award Goes To...)

June 25, 2007 3:45 PM | Link to this

Re: Katie the Not-so-Great

Such a sweet-sounding name for such wickedly ugly logic…

By grim

June 25, 2007 3:47 PM | Link to this

Liberals and leftists alike have Air America-and people choose not to listen. NPR is ripe with liberals-and many listen. Do not give me the “we have to be fair” crap-because that’s all it is-crap. This is America-a republic, not a democracy. What’s happened to free speach? Oh wait, I remember, if you’re not a Liberal, you don’t have free speach.

By grim

June 25, 2007 3:54 PM | Link to this

Just caught my typo-should be speech.

By Hallway monitor

June 25, 2007 3:59 PM | Link to this

harold, why don’t you share with us what you REALLY think of WABE!

Also, people who refer to themselves in the third party are reminiscent of Richard Nixon. And that is not a good thing! (Bob Dole too. But at least he wasn’t scary!)

And I agree that the Grieg, Mendelsson and Tchaikovsky are terribly unrepresentative of “real” classical music and should be banned from NPR!

By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

June 25, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this

@ silly liberal cow Katie

HA HA HA HA … nice one honeybutch!!

Conservatives “dominate” talk radio because few folks wish to hear some treasonous Bush hating anal retentive liberal dogturd p!ss and moan about how bad and hateful and racist - as if (smirk) America is. The choice folks make regarding the wireless is a very simple one - to listen or not to listen to a given show/station. THis is called freedom by normal non-liberal folks. This perfectly explains why the likes of NPR and the morally and financially bankrupt dead air america had/have such pathetic ratings and would NOT survive without elitists subsidising their smug elitist leftist puke. Your arrogant simpleton bogstirring bollocks is the kind of puerile twisted argument that scum like Al FWanker, also known as Stuart Smalldick would regurgiate at a kool aid drinking Bush hate fest. Folks who own/run radio stations are there to make money using the independent Arbitron ratings etc to ensure their stations continue broadcasting. That is why liberal vermin have so few stations across the fruited plain. A pleasingly similar situation enjoyed by the far left Atlanta Urinal, the NY Slimes and the San Fran Sicko Queersheet etc which are deservedly and hilariously losing readers even faster than the Arkansas rapist was dropping its heavily soiled trousers back when it was infesting the White House.

By THE SWIFT BOAT CHAPS TOLD THE TRUTH ABOUT KERRY THE GIGOLO

June 25, 2007 4:16 PM | Link to this

Kerry was a snivelli ng coward wgo scratched himself THREE times to get his purple heart and slither away like a cowardly dog!! He was virtually the ONLY wanker to take a homeo movie cmaers to capture some foftage to use in future campaigns. Kerry’s despicable cowardly comments about the US military bordered on treason!!

His second, Ketchup chugging wife is the most unhinged, self absorbed female nutter in America - this side of Naomi Wolf who is by far the funniest, most pathetic risible narcissistic feminazi hag in the USA.

By Scholar

June 25, 2007 4:20 PM | Link to this

ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL

Why the hate?

By THE SWIFT BOAT CHAPS TOLD THE TRUTH ABOUT KERRY THE GIGOLO

June 25, 2007 4:21 PM | Link to this

I was sniggering so hard I hit the post button too soon … enjoy

Kerry was a snivelling leftist coward who disgustingly scratched himself THREE times to get his purple heart and then gleefully slithered away like a cowardly dog!! He was virtually the ONLY wanker in Nam to take a home movie camera to capture some truly vile cynical footage to use in future campaigns. Kerry’s despicable cowardly comments about the US military bordered on treason!!

His second, Ketchup chugging wife is unassailably the most unhinged, self absorbed female nutter in America - this side of Naomi Wolf who is by far the funniest, most pathetic risible narcissistic feminazi hag in the USA.

By AmVet

June 25, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this

jbmlaw, thanks for the accolades earlier. Every once in a blue moon I post something lucid!

Shar, your 3:42 was excellent.

Much of what passes for the “truth” now is IMHO not much more than sound bites and slogans.

Valor is cowardice. Questioning authority is treason. Bush is evil.

And the bedrock of our free press have become “news” channels and publications that provide a bunch of jingoistic pablum intermixed with endless sensationalism about Paris, Rosie and Donald, or the latest pretty white woman to turn up missing.

And the die-hard listeners of talk radio are one of the primary forces driving the direction of this market. IMHO a market where sadly now this type of “information” is “relevant”.

BTW, did the idiot factor here just go off the scale?

By Redneck Convert

June 25, 2007 4:23 PM | Link to this

They can change talk radio to put more libruls on but they can’t make me listen. I’ll just listen to the conservatives and turn the radio off when the libruls come on. See, I need to be sure I’m right in what I think, and Rush and Sean let me know I am. They even let me know what to think even if I ain’t thunk about it yet. It saves me a lot of time and effort. I hear them and keep saying ditto, ditto, ditto.

What I like about Rush and Sean and the boys is how they can turn just about any topic to a bashing of the libruls. Say a bunch of snails in South America all turn homosexual. Well, Rush and Sean will report it and then point out that the libruls done it by promoting gay marriage and this environmental stuff. In no time at all they will be all over Al Gore and his bunch.

Anyway, My President is the Decider and he won’t sign no bill that gives libruls more radio time. So we are safe for awhile. But I’m leaving this country if this Hillary woman gets elected president. She won’t stop till some woman has my beer truck job and all the gays get married and I have to go to some quack that went to medical school in Cuba.

By Bumper Sticker

June 25, 2007 4:33 PM | Link to this

Finally! A 100% bipartisan bumper sticker!! And it comes from Georgia!

RUN! NEWT! RUN!

Republicans put it on the rear bumper. Democrats put it on the front bumper.

By THE SWIFT BOAT CHAPS TOLD THE TRUTH ABOUT KERRY THE GIGOLO

June 25, 2007 4:34 PM | Link to this

Scholar …

what “hate”?? I suppose being a tad logocentric and perhaps a little bit direct is hate for liberal vermin!!

jeezus bubba - I just tell it like it is!!!

Back to Led Zeppelin on my i-Tunes library … HItLLary should have chosen the Zep song In My Time Of Dying as its theme song. I’d have even voted for that one!!

By Adam

June 25, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this

Adam Fan @3:28

Flattering to have a fan, but I fail to see any direct response to the issue at hand. If my attempt at humor has left you uneasy then I can only assume you recognize the undelying truths. The reference to Chavez, I think, is timely and and germaine. If you don’t see a eerie comparison between a “Man of the People” dictator shutting down dissent and the current subject being discussed then what can I say?

My main point however is that rhetoric from the left is predictable and boring because of the same old - same old. Rhandi Rhodes, Mike Malloy et al have nothing to offer except half baked Haliburton conspiracies, evil corporations etc etc. If that’s your cup of tea, then have at it. Conservatives don’t cry for the government to shut it down. The majority of Americans don’t buy it and I’m sorry but heavy handed government censorship won’t make those views any more popular.

By Michael Silly Savage

June 25, 2007 4:43 PM | Link to this

The toughest “top” on the AM dial? Me, Mike Weiner.

(Actually, I’m a bottom, like the vast majority of my listeners. Duh. I just talk tough, when I’m not on my knees…)

By Robert Plant, Jimmy Page , John Paul Jones

June 25, 2007 4:53 PM | Link to this

To the scumbag who listens to us,

Please do us a favor and don’t ever mention us again.

We are excedingly LIBERAL and always have been. And if you had ever listened to our lyrics you would know that. We are assuming of course, that you have a working brain.

We made our music for liberals and other non-dirtbags and hate it that a slimey puke like you even enjoys our music.

Go listen to Lee Greenwood and Toby Keith, PLEASE.

By Adam is Misinformed

June 25, 2007 4:53 PM | Link to this

For those who don’t know what Adam is talking about, under Chavez, the government of Venezuela decided not to renew a broadcast license for RCTV, one of the oldest and largest opposition-controlled TV stations in the country, when its 20-year term expired on May 27. The US mainstream media has seized upon this opportunity to portray this as an assault on “freedom of the press.”

It’s not clear why a TV station that would never get a broadcast license in the United States or any other democratic country should receive one in Venezuela. But this is the one question that doesn’t seem to come up in any of the news reports or editorials here.

RCTV actively participated in the military coup that briefly overthrew Venezuela’s democratically elected President Hugo Chavez in 2002. The station promoted the coup government, reported only the pro-coup version of events. It censored and suppressed the news as the coup fell apart.

Even ignoring RCTV’s role in the coup, its broadcast license would have been revoked years ago in the U.S., Europe, or any country that regulates the public airwaves. During the oil strike of 2002-2003, the station repeatedly called on people to join in and help topple the government. The station has also fabricated accusations of murder by the government, using graphic and violent images to promote its views (imagine Rush Limbaugh during the Clinton impeachment, times fifty, but with much less regard for factual accuracy).

The whole idea that freedom of expression is under attack in Venezuela is a joke. Most of the media in Venezuela is still controlled by people who are vehemently (sometimes violently) opposed to the Chavez government. This will be true even after RCTV switches from broadcast to cable and satellite media.

In fact, if the government carries through on its promise to turn RCTV’s broadcast frequency over to the public, for a diverse array of programming, then this move will actually increase freedom of expression in Venezuela - rather than suppressing it.

By getalife

June 25, 2007 5:06 PM | Link to this

The song remains the same.

“lies” is upset his poodle is history and leaving the church of England to become a wingnut like his daddy w.

By Page Plant and Jones say F OFF Lefties

June 25, 2007 5:07 PM | Link to this

see how easy it is to goad these leftist pukes on here!!

after 08 the defeated vanquished demoNcrats will be enviously listening to conservative talk radio continuously gloating whilst playing Led Zep’s glorious TRAMPLED UNDERFOOT as the treasonous cut and run scum are … trampled underfoot!!!

liberals mostly listen to assorted queers and d ikes like G Michael, E John, B Manilow, Liberace, B Streisand, Cher, Bruce Sh!tstream from NJ, the Dixie Slappers et al

By Fred Phelps

June 25, 2007 5:15 PM | Link to this

Adam is misinformed at 4:53, please do not try to educate us and bore us with actual facts and data to support your premise that Adam is not completely correct or forthcoming about his assertion concerning the Venezuelan TV station.

Its true that Adam actually gives us NO useful information, such as dates, names, places and events, etc. to prove his accusations, or help us decide if the information is factual and can be corroborated. Though it is obvious from his sheer passion and his reliance on stereotypes and generalizations that he and only he could be correct on this matter.

You are just trying to confuse us and that is not nice! Besides it sounds like the RCTV folks were just trying to get rid of that Chavez man! And isn’t that, not freedom of the press, really the only important thing!

By Lex Luthor

June 25, 2007 5:22 PM | Link to this

Trent Lott is saying that the First Admendment should only grant freedom to the left and censor all else. Who elected that socialist?

By RP, JP, JPJ

June 25, 2007 5:32 PM | Link to this

See how easy it was to get this poofta to take the bait?!!

Of course we are ultra-liberal. As was all of us early English and American rockers. When asked, virtually without exception, we will tell you that we despise Bush, his idiotic policies and especially his mindless brown nosing suck-ups!

And this neo-con cavemen is so utterly stupid and pigheaded that he can’t even admit that?!!! He must be what you Yanks call a gutless chickenhawk!

No wonder the neo-cons got stomped on like a worthless cockroach last November. (Around the world, we’re singing HALLELUJAH!!) And this diseased American philosophy is now virtually dead after 12 short years. Just like the Third Reich.

From our Immigrant Song (ode to a Neo-Con)

So now you’d better stop and rebuild all your ruins, For peace and trust can win the day despite of all your losing.

By RP, JP, JPJ

June 25, 2007 5:46 PM | Link to this

One last thing you bloody gorm. We asked a few of our mates and think that all of the following: G Michael, E John, B Manilow, Liberace, B Streisand, Cher, Bruce Sh!tstream from NJ, the Dixie Slappers could all kick your sorry little arse around the block.

However we do feel you’d stand one helluva chance against Johnny Cash.

By catlady

June 25, 2007 5:46 PM | Link to this

“ramifications of a sudden exodus of those employed immigrants”

BS Aplenty (mind if I call you BS?) I don’t think anything we do will be “sudden”, given the governments’ penchant for making things to be implemented YEARS in the future. Example: our state legislature’s work, 2 years ago, which has not taken place yet re immigrants.

I don’t necessarily hold the views I present, but I think airing them gives those with tunnel vision more to think about. Be flexible and put ideas on the table for discussion!

By Bumper Sticker

June 25, 2007 5:48 PM | Link to this

Maggots should not let maggots listen to Led Zeppelin.