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DEL.ICIO.USCuba will pay claims? Only in your dreams
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
The Cubans stand ready to compensate American businesses for property seized when Fidel Castro came to power in 1959, which could amount to $10 billion.
They stand ready, too, to pay $22 billion in debt to the former Soviet Union, which propped up the Cuban economy for more than two decades, ending 15 years ago.
The entire gross national product of Cuba in 2005 was $11.2 billion.
There are some caveats, though. Josefina Vidal Ferreiro, director of the North American Division of the Cuban Ministry of Foreign Affairs, notes that 5,911 American claims have been recognized. She did not specifically say — and I neglected to ask — whether the Cuban government recognized them for payment. The claims for properties and businesses were certified in the 1960s by the Foreign Claims Settlement Commission of the United States. Ferreiro said Cuba has been “prevented” from paying those claims by the embargo. But, she said, other international claims filed by Canadian, Spanish, French businesses have been settled. “We have compensated them all,” she said.
Ah, but there’s a catch.
The Russians, just now extending paltry sums of credit to Cuba, $355 million over 10 years, assert a claim to be repaid for the $22 billion loaned by the former Soviet Union before it broke up in 1991. But, say the Cubans, that withdrawal of Soviet support caused greater billions in damages to the island, suggesting that it should be written off.
While acknowledging the 5,911 American claims, Ferreiro insists that the American embargo has damaged the Cuban economy by $106 billion. Another Cuban government official, during an informal conversation later, stiffens noticeably and his tone hardens when discussing compensation claims of Cuban Americans. “Never,” he said. Those who fled to the United States were Cuban citizens when their property was nationalized and, like other Cubans, have no valid claim to restitution, he declares.
On these questions hinge the future of U.S.-Cuban relations after Castro. Cuban assets in the United States were frozen in 1963 and bank accounts that once totaled almost $270 million have been drained to pay court judgments.
After almost half a century chances are remote that anybody will get homes or businesses back — and, frankly, the cultures of Cuba and South Florida are so dramatically different that it’s hard to imagine any American, save the armchair revolutionary guilt-ridden about the abundant fruits of capitalism, could find satisfaction in the Cuban lifestyle.
Cuba has the transportation system and the lifestyle that Smart Growth zealots dream about — except that ordinary people devote years of their lives to waiting — waiting for hitched rides, waiting for overcrowded buses, waiting and walking.
Few have cars, and for the ordinary Cuban, those are the relics of pre-revolution Americana. Where else in the world is it possible to rent a ride in a 1952 Cadillac convertible with an up-to-date Toyota engine? Auto body filler and replacement parts designed and built by creative mechanics preserve Cuba as a living museum of 1940s and ’50s automobiles. Mostly, though, people walk — one of the reasons, to be sure, that life expectancy is 77.6 years. It’s 78 in the United States.
Cuba, for all its potential appeal to tourists, will not be a country that appeals to native-born Americans who’ve grown up accustomed to its lifestyles and options. It’s hard to imagine the young in today’s Cuba relating to old-line revolutionaries, and it’s equally hard to imagine people who have lived on food rations and inconveniences embracing South Beach.
“Transition,” says Ferreiro, turning the questioner’s description of the process now begun over slowly in her reply, “in Cuba, that word doesn’t say anything. It is a continuation … a very organized process without any changes.”
Pipe dreams abound. The dream that Cuban Americans can go back and reclaim property that’s now been occupied by two generations of Cubans. The dream that American businesses will get fair and just compensation for property taken. The dream that a totalitarian state can control a nation of individuals, once they are inspired to dream.
- Jim Wooten is the associate editorial page editor. His column appears Sundays, Tuesdays and Fridays.
Permalink | Comments (105) | Post your comment | Categories: Column
Comments
By Amber
June 23, 2007 2:47 PM | Link to this
The problems with communism, planned economies and in Cuba have have thoroughly documented. However, rather than rehashing Cuba’s well-known flaws (long lines, old cars, etcetera), I’d rather read about what we can learn from their successes that might be applicable to two of our most pressing problems here at home — all Cubans have access to quality health care, and are Cubans are well educated. In these two areas, America (and Georgia especially) is deficient.
What are they doing right, and what are we doing wrong?
By getalife
June 23, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this
“President Bush has made closing the prison in Cuba a priority, though the Afghan site is not meant to be a substitute, the White House said Friday.”
cheney and ganzo are fighting to keep Gitmo open.
I am guessing they win this one.
By getalife
June 23, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this
Willard Romney spews:
“Guantanamo is a symbol of our resolve.”
“Our resolve to what? Violate human rights? Sneer at the rule of law?”
Dead wrong position willard.
By Stuff Wooten Won't Tell You
June 23, 2007 3:20 PM | Link to this
Cubans say they offer health care to the world’s poor because they have big hearts. But what do they get in return?
Cubans live longer than almost anyone in Latin America. Far fewer babies die. Almost everyone has been vaccinated, and such scourges of the poor as parasites, TB, malaria, even HIV/AIDS are rare or non-existent. Anyone can see a doctor, at low cost, right in the neighborhood.
The Cuban health care system is producing a population that is as healthy as those of the world’s wealthiest countries at a fraction of the cost. And now Cuba has begun exporting its system to under-served communities around the world — including the United States.
The story of Cuba’s health care ambitions is largely hidden from the people of the United States, where politics left over from the Cold War maintain an embargo on information and understanding. But it is increasingly well-known in the poorest communities of Latin America, the Caribbean, and parts of Africa where Cuban and Cuban-trained doctors are practicing.
For decades, Cuba has sent doctors abroad and trained international students at its medical schools. But things ramped up beginning in 1998 when Hurricanes George and Mitch hammered Central America and the Caribbean. As they had often done, Cuban doctors rushed to the disaster zone to help those suffering the aftermath. But when it was time to go home, it was clear to the Cuban teams that the medical needs extended far beyond emergency care. So Cuba made a commitment to post doctors in several of these countries and to train local people in medicine so they could pick up where the Cuban doctors left off. ELAM, the Havana-based Latin American School of Medicine, was born, and with it the offered up to 10,000 scholarships for free medical training.
Today the program has grown to 22,000 students from Latin America, the Caribbean, Africa, Asia, and the United States who attend ELAM and 28 other medical schools across Cuba. Cuba covers tuition, living expenses, books, and medical care. In return, the students agree that, upon completion of their studies, they will return to their own under-served communities to practice medicine.
By Markus
June 23, 2007 3:25 PM | Link to this
“I’d rather read about what we can learn from their successes that might be applicable to two of our most pressing problems here at home — all Cubans have access to quality health care, and are Cubans are well educated.”
Cuba has such a fine health care system that Castro brought in a surgeon from Spain to deal with his “issue.”
NO thanks.
By Nathanial H.
June 23, 2007 3:37 PM | Link to this
I first visited Cuba in 2004 as a journalist and hooked up with a group of activists from the Midwest while I was there. They were on an approved visit. The Bush Administrations justification for granting these licenses was that visitors would show the Cubans how free and fat and happy we are in the United States. Their tour included visits to Cuban schools, hospitals and talks with Cuban labor officials, all coordinated and controlled by our Cuban hosts.
But according to Leslie Balog, an American who worked for Cuba’s Radio Havana for 20 years and now runs the Global Exchange trips there; many American travelers actually come home quite impressed with what they see. “The Americans were liking Cuba, instead of the Cubans liking the Americans so much,” Balog said. “I guess that’s why Bush ended it [humanitarian tours].”
By Saperstein
June 23, 2007 3:46 PM | Link to this
The World Health Organization ranks health care systems based on objective measures of medical outcomes: The United States’ health care system currently ranks 37th in the world, behind Colombia and Portugal; the United States ranks 44th in the world in infant mortality, behind many impoverished Latin American countries. While infant mortality in the United States is skewed toward poor people, who have rates double the wealthy, the top quintile of the U.S. population has infant mortality rates higher than Canadians in the lowest quintile of wealth.
The United States has fewer physicians, nurses and hospital beds than most developed nations. In the United States, 28 percent say it is “difficult to get care”; in most European countries, Japan, Australia and New Zealand, 15 percent say that. In terms of continuity of care (i.e., five-plus years with the same doctor), the United States is the worst of all developed nations. By every objective measure, the United States has a second-rate health care system.
By Don
June 23, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
A segment from the new Michael Moore file about health care in American includes an increasingly controversial boat trip to Cuba. Moore took ailing rescue workers to Cuba for health treatment for respiratory ailments which they suffer as a result of working at Ground Zero, and for which a number of the workers have no health insurance. The purpose of the trip was to show that, for many, the health care system in Cuba is superior to the health care system in the U.S.
Cuba has, in fact, made recent advancements in biotechnology and exports its treatments to 40 countries around the world, raking in an estimated $100 million a year. … In 2004, the U.S. government granted an exception to its economic embargo against Cuba and allowed a California drug company to test three cancer vaccines developed in Havana.
By Opinionated One
June 23, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this
Hurry, and lift the embargo, then make Cuba, the Las Vegas South. Biggest cat house in the world.
By DS
June 23, 2007 4:43 PM | Link to this
For all the comments about how bad the US healtcare system is compared to other countries, some important facts are being over looked:
We need for the FDA to be more open to alternative therapies and treatments such as those used in Western Europe that have been proven to work. This means depoliticizing and tort reforming the whole drug approval process. Part of the reason it takes so long to get an approval is fear of political backlash for making reasoned judgments based upon evidence at hand, and fear of the trial bar.
We also need for reform to be more market based, but also for reforms to be more conducive to the dynamics of each state’s population. What works for New York (particularly with the differences between the City of, and upstate) are not going to necessarily work for Mississippi or Minnesota.
European and Cuban style medicine is not going to work in the United States on a national level, a la HillaryCare, because our population base and economy is too large and diverse. Furthermore, attempts on a state level have been made to make modified versions of European care(TennCare and PeachCare are great examples) to work, but have ended up busting state budgets, because of the complexities of the US system.
When you have as diverse an economy and population base as the U.S., the only thing that will best work is market based reforms and increased education. As long as there are people out there who choose to remain ignorant either for ignorance sake, or choose not to be educated based upon past fears for whatever reason, then the US will probably have skewed results compared to other populations.
Cuba may have good healthcare, but is the Cuban government and economy the model we want for the United States, I think not.
By Claire
June 23, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this
Markus, Thank you for the compliment @ 10:22.
I would like to post more often but this is really my son’s past time and he likes to stay on the sidelines.
Plus I have been following these blogs for some time now and I have noticed the one sided treatment that the AJC gives to the conservative bloggers here, it seems like rules have been made to silence them but yet the vulgarity and the off the wall rambling from the left leaning posters goes unchecked.
I guess while I’m here I can say that if Michael Moore is promoting the virtues of Cuba’s health care, then you can be rest assured that it is far inferior to that which is found in the United States.
Moore is not what you would call an honest man.
By Bosch
June 23, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
Claire, Plus I have been following these blogs for some time now and I have noticed the one sided treatment that the AJC gives to the conservative bloggers here, it seems like rules have been made to silence them but yet the vulgarity and the off the wall rambling from the left leaning posters goes unchecked
What? You obviously haven’t been reading all of the posts. Please don’t post such non-sense.
As far as Cuba is concerned, just let it go. Castro will be dead soon, and they will as one poster said earlier, be Las Vegas South, and all will be forgiven.
DS, those were some good observations about European medicine, socialized medicine wouldn’t work on a large scale here, we have socialized medicine to some degree now anyway.
You are forgetting though that Europeans view medicine and going to the doctor a lot different than Americans do. They go to the doctor when they are sick. They don’t sit around in fear that they have cancer or other diseases because they aren’t brainwashed by the fear mongering insurance and pharmaceutical companies. They aren’t on 5 different prescription medications for cholesterol, high blood pressure, etc. because they don’t eat as much crappy processed and fast food as we do.
The American system will always be market based, but the incredible profits of the insurance and pharmaceutical companies and their influence in Washington needs to be reduced.
By getalife
June 23, 2007 5:02 PM | Link to this
[Yes, one thing is for sure. They will smear Moore and the 9/11 victims])http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/06/23/big-pharma-and-health-insurance-companies-go-after-michael-moore/)
Its how they roll.
Geez.
By getalife
June 23, 2007 5:07 PM | Link to this
Yes, one thing is for sure. They will smear Moore and the 9/11 victims](http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/06/23/big-pharma-and-health-insurance-companies-go-after-michael-moore/)
Its how they roll.
Geez.
By getalife
June 23, 2007 5:09 PM | Link to this
Yes, one thing is for sure. They will smear Moore and the 9/11 victims
Its how they roll.
Ok, I’m drunk.
By catlady
June 23, 2007 5:11 PM | Link to this
So what does Flip-Flop Chambliss say NOW about the immigration reform bill?
By getalife
June 23, 2007 5:22 PM | Link to this
catlady,
Last I heard, he said he would vote no.
Here are some Dem candidates
By Walter LIppmann
June 23, 2007 5:23 PM | Link to this
Cuba did negotiate settlements with the owners of every other foreign company from every other country on earth, and they’ve been doing business with Cuba ever since, and had normal relations as well.
Cuba offered to negotiate settlements with all nationalized U.S. companies back in the beginning. The U.S., thinking the Cuban government would fall, refused to do that.
But Cuba has claims against the U.S. for the damage done to Cuba in the nearly half-century long blockade.
Here are the details: http://www.granma.cu/cubademanda/ingles/index.html
Ultimately, normalization of relations will require a political decision by the U.S. to allow people from the U.S. to visit, allow Cubans to visit the United States, and to resolve differences through conversation and negotiations.
Walter Lippmann http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CubaNews/
By Vic
June 23, 2007 5:41 PM | Link to this
Do not ever heed the words of Americans who think Cuba is the greatest thing since Bill Clinton. Always take the words of Cubans themselves who used to live there with regards to how much of a paradise it is and has been under Fidel’s regime. Remember, the Clinton regime thought so highly of Cubans that they took a child at gunpoint to make sure he went back to Cuba. I’m sure everyone remembers the video. Please visit this link to learn the truth about Cuba.
http://www.canf.org/Issues/medicalapartheid.htm
By GodHatesTrash
June 23, 2007 5:43 PM | Link to this
Back in the good old days before Castro there were almost as many w-hores in Havana than there are at Markanus’s family reunions.
By Markus
June 23, 2007 5:59 PM | Link to this
“Ok, I’m drunk.”
Gitmo, you ARE a drink.
A Zombie.
By Missy
June 23, 2007 6:18 PM | Link to this
Vic wrote, “Do not ever heed the words of Americans who think Cuba is the greatest thing since Bill Clinton.”
Vic is missing the point. The point is that the one-sided propaganda that we get from “journalists” like Mr. Wooten that Cuba is entirely evil and America is entirely wonderful is inaccurate and unacceptable.
Like most mainstream journalists, Mr. Wooten wrote a one-sided piece highlighting Cuba’s faults without balance. In truth, we can see where they’ve been unsuccessful and learn from their mistakes while also observing where they’ve been successful and learn from their accomplishments.
To DS at 4:43 heralding the benefits of a free market health care system — that’s what we have now, and it’s not working so well. Legislating that patients can’t seek compensation from negligent doctors, hospitals or HMOs would only exacerbate the problem.
With regard to your right-wing reference to Hillarycare, we do have socialized medicine, and it works reasonably well — it’s called Medicare. I would say to you that you should stop choosing “to remain ignorant either for ignorance sake” [sic].
By Steve
June 24, 2007 8:43 AM | Link to this
Who has the longest life span in Latin America? Puerto Rico
By Steve
June 24, 2007 8:43 AM | Link to this
Who has the longest life span in Latin America? Puerto Rico
By Chet Sanson
June 24, 2007 9:18 AM | Link to this
FOR ALL OF YOU WHO PRAISE CUBA——WHY DON’T YOU MOVE TO CUBA?
By GaLiberal
June 24, 2007 9:24 AM | Link to this
I love it when neo-con pundits like Wooten take a few cherry-picked pot shots. Wooten’s diatribe against Cuba is typical of the stupidty they try to pass off as intelligent discourse on a subject which they do not understand. The US has forgiven billions in debt to Mexico and other countries. Why shouldn’t Cuba expect that their debt will be forgiven? As to personal claims, I doubt if a 25 or 30 year old claim would stand up in court be it US or international. The US is not fulfillling a multi-million dollar financial obligation to the UN. Do the neo-cons ridicule the US? Nope. Just whine about everyone else. But, whine away Jim, whine away. After all, that really all your good at doing.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 10:08 AM | Link to this
The doctor that Castro imported from Spain was actually a Cuban born Cuban trained specialist who had defected three years earlier, and Castro only requested his services to trick him into returning to Cuba so Castro could keel heem.
The method of execution chosen by Castro was an exploding cigar, followed by lethal flossing with chinese dentifrices, and of course, being bored to tears by listening to any of Castros 80 thousand speeches which he fiendishly used to torture all his Cuban serfs with. Cause Havanna is really Serf City. (key beach boys)
CUBANS ARE CASTRO’S TOYS
Serf City, here we come.
I got a commie reputation but I’m really a fascist…Serf City here we come….Waterboarding, bible-flushing nothing’s off limits…Serf City here we come…oh we aint got no freedom or the right to bear arms, cause our bill of rights is just a firing squad……
And we’re going to Serf City cause we are the Huns, yes, we’re going to Serf City cause evil’s fun,
CUBANS ARE CASTRO’S TOYS…..
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this
(Don’t look now, but Lott is on Fox News Sunday. This should be good).
Listen to all these communist fascist dictator loving diseased liberals. Viva la Cuba! Viva la Cuba! Well, as someone else said, pack your bags and HAUL @SS. Go live in your communist dreamland. You jackals SURELY won’t be missed. Sickos. I cannot FATHOM what the hell has gone wrong with diseases in this nation that think Cuba is the bastion for what America should become in even ONE realm.
Vic @ 5:41pm, I assume you are Cuban or know someone who is. Great link with factual information straight from the horse’s mouth. I’ll betcha Michael Commiepig Moore didn’t mention those little fact things (well, that sicko lied and said Kaiser Permanente was profit-driven and greedy; yeah, “greed” from a freaking NON-PROFIT company <— how the hell does THAT work? Stupid overestrogened mealy mouthed liberal).
Anyway, yeah, Cuba is so great people are risking drowning or getting eaten by sharks to make it to our shores. Well, the sickos on the diseased left like Jimmy “Mr. Election Certified” Carter love Chevez too, so why bother with the obvious.
Anywhere anyone is “equal” is all that gutter debris on the pathetic left cares about, even if everyone is all equally miserable, so long as everyone is “equal.” Sick, sick, sick. Just let them fester in their own communist Utopia and fight with all means necessary their wishes for that junk government here which takes away the freedoms we have to be prosperous, successful, and most importantly, the capacity and infrastructure to make our lives as joyous and pleasant as humanly possible on this entire planet. P!ss off, RATs.
By Brent
June 24, 2007 10:10 AM | Link to this
Judging health care by measuring infant mortality can be misleading. In the US a 26 week gestation that dies after a month in the NICU is counted in the statistics. In Cuba they do not count or treat infants born at 26 weeks. Frequently in the US people of wealth will put off having children until late 30’s. Women of this age are more likely to have problems with delivering healthy children. Lastly because of fertility treatments we have a significant increase in multiple births in US. Multiple births have a lot higher chance of death and thus increase the statistic of infant mortality. In most other countries these women do not get pregnant.
The big reason our general health numbers are so poor is because of the unhealthy life styles we live. Our rates of obesity, diabetes, smoking and hypertension are very high. In Cuba you have no choice but to eat healthy (all you have is rice and beans) and walk. Populations in other countries (Europe and Canada) tend to choose healthier life styles.
By Jo
June 24, 2007 10:15 AM | Link to this
If everything was so wonderful in Cuba why do you think Cubans take to the water in makeshift rafts to travel 90 miles through shark filled waters? And to the journalist who went on the “controlled tour” didn’t that raise a question in your mind about why everything was controlled? Say what you will about the U.S. but the government is not controlling and watching your every move.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 10:17 AM | Link to this
Song.
CUBANS ARE CASTRO’S TOYS (sung to the tune of Surf City by Jan and Dean)
“I’ve got a Commie reputation but I’m really a fascist, Serf City here we come, Waterboarding, Bible Flushing, nothing’s off limits, Serf City Revolution!
Oh our bullets trump our ballots and that dont seem odd, cause our electoral college is a firing squad…
And we’re going to Serf City cause we’re the Hun, oh yeah we’re going to Serf City cause that evil’s fun…
CUBANS ARE CASTRO’S TOYS……”
copyright, Socialists Inc…….D’OH!
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 10:21 AM | Link to this
Pat Robertson on Meet the Press….now…..please tell me you’re watching this…
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:26 AM | Link to this
“The big reason our general health numbers are so poor is because of the unhealthy life styles we live. Our rates of obesity, diabetes, smoking and hypertension are very high. In Cuba you have no choice but to eat healthy (all you have is rice and beans) and walk. Populations in other countries (Europe and Canada) tend to choose healthier life styles.”
BINGO Brent. CHOICE. Cubans don’t HAVE much of a choice. That is what the diseases on the sicko left want for THIS nation. Did you think sick liberals were all about choice or something? People who smoke, eat fried foods, and never work out or even at least take walks wonder why they have one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel down the road. Then that’s all the fault of our health care system, not that it’s 100% perfect.
But I will not EVER be handed that crap that the government is the solution for our health care. Do you think those idiots on the left who are so lawsuit happy (of which is a LARGE reason for health care costs) have thought about not being able to sue the government if the wrong leg gets sawed off?
Let’s get Moore’s fat@ss into a few VA hospitals around this nation and see how well things are under this wet dream of the government teet. I’ve been there and seen that. NO THANKS.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:29 AM | Link to this
Oh look who’s on the front page of Time this week? Billy">http://www.time.com/time/covers/0,16641,19940404,00.html”>Billy the Clintoon and is former Left-hand man, George Steponanoctopus. Someone pinch me. That leftwing rag is brining up old Whitewater dirt on the Clintoons? Shrillary must have dissed Time in an interview or something. Actually that wouldn’t surprise me because the only time the Shrill ever gets questioned is in a controlled environment. No tuffies, no off-the-walls, and no surprises she can’t be prepared to respond to. The Shrill Clintoon bash machine is only getting warmed up. It’s going to be a fun 16 months looking forward.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 10:30 AM | Link to this
“Insurgents in Iraq have been morphed into being called ‘al-Qaeda’:
The U.S. military has increasingly referred to insurgents in Iraq as “al-Qaeda fighters” or “Qaeda militants.” When and why this is happening is not certain, although linking the insurgents to those who attacked us on 9/11 would appear to have certain benefits in the court of public opinion.”
Only idiots like macaca and the base believes this propaganda.
They are Iraqis fighting the occupiers. I would hope we would do the same, if we are occupied by China or Russia.
The military had video of a row of rockets set up in a school yard and said they came fron Iran. Laughable.
Geez.
But this is not funny:
25 US soldiers killed in Iraq:
Eight American servicemen and one British soldier were reported today to have been killed in Iraq, bringing the four-day death toll to at least 25 as insurgents continue to use huge roadside bombs to rip through combat vehicles.
Pathetic.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this
Pat Buchanan and an Illinois Democrat were debating Amnesty vs Apartheid for the 12 million illegals.
Buchanan wont settle for anything less than the PLO scenario for our country as it pertains to the Mexican Labor Force.
He wants civil war so bad he keeps shouting, “Dont wait for orders, Ride to the sound of the GUNS!”
Buchanan is a lunatic, and he represents the last, putrid vestiges of the Right.
AMNESTY, NOT APARTHEID!!!!!
AMNESTY, NOT APARTHEID!!!
btw:anyonenoticemarkuspostingtohimselfwithanaliasfemalename?bwa!marcusdoesn’twanttobeatrollit’sjustthatthere’scertainthingshewantstoblogthatonlyasociopathwouldblog.
bwa
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:44 AM | Link to this
Who the hell wants to listen to a drunk dieased liberal whining about word technicalities when the same drunkard said we “abandoned Afghanistan?” Hell I guess I’d stay drunk too if I were a miserable liberal. Useless. Worthless. Meaningless. Dead air. Zombietime.
Meanwhile,
“Army Lt. Gen. Ray Odierno, commander of the Multinational Corps-Iraq, said on Friday that three developments suggest progress for U.S.-led troops in Iraq.”
1) Attacks in Ramadi, where insurgents have long had a strong presence in what is the Sunni-dominated provincial capital, are at a two-year low, he said.
2) “Large-scale … car and truck bombs are down because Iraqi security forces are doing their job,” Odierno said.
3) Tribal and former insurgent groups are “reaching out to us and we are reaching back. They want to fight al Qaeda, and we think they can help us.”
By getalife
June 24, 2007 10:45 AM | Link to this
“Sunni Blocs Boycott Iraq Parliament”
Man, they were close to getting w’s oil law too.
Still no political solution to end this occupation.
Geez.
By Claire
June 24, 2007 10:50 AM | Link to this
Good morning to all, it’s another day and I have another round of questions for those that publish the AJC.
I suppose it is too much to ask that you could be pro American but do you really have to be pro terrorist?
U.S. forces acting on tips from Iraqi informants raided a safe house in Sadr City, Baghdad’s main Shiite enclave, before dawn Saturday and detained three militants suspected of ties to Iran, the military said. In the deadliest attack Saturday, four U.S. soldiers were killed and an Iraqi interpreter was wounded when a bomb blew up their vehicle during combat operations northwest of Baghdad.
Read that article published in today’s AJC and tell me, once again, which very important story is missing. What I posted up there is the closest this supposed newspaper gets to acknowledging the successful Iraqi American joint operation Arrowhead Ripper.
Like some small child, the AJC still refuses to share good news about our brave soldiers:
What needs to be said is this is one of the war’s largest operations to date, and perhaps the most significant. If successful, it could push al-Qaida out of Iraq. It also might lay the groundwork for an eventual war-ending peace. Using unusually blunt language, Army Brig. Gen. Mick Bednarek told American Forces Press Service, “The end state is to destroy the al-Qaida influences in this province and eliminate the threat against the people. That is the No. 1, bottom-line, up-front, in-your-face task and purpose.”
Are you worried about demoralizing Al Qaeda?
Not hardly:
Afghan leader criticizes U.S., NATO troops Afghan President Hamid Karzai chastised U.S. and NATO-led troops Saturday for their “careless operations” and accused them of killing more than 90 civilians in the past 10 days, as fresh reports emerged of more noncombatant deaths. By Griff Witte Associated Press- AJC
I wonder if we will ever see an article criticizing the Taliban or Al Qaeda who have killed hundreds of thousands of innocents?
I had to keep checking the front page this morning to see if I had gotten some Syrian newspaper by accident.
In a funnier note, I liked the column in the @Issue section that accuses Republicans of being mind control brainwashers:
This is such a typical example because it wasn’t a fair fight. Every Democrat who gets on the air is making things up as he or she goes along. Democrats have no shared language, they have nothing like talking points. They don’t have the kind of messaging machine that Republicans have. There’s nothing like that on the left.-AJC
Can you believe they said that? How ridiculous.
I honestly don’t think Hillary Clinton has ever had an original thought and who can forget when John Kerry got called in the 2004 election run up saying that he didn’t mean to bring up outsourcing, after his wife’s company was outed for doing it, instead he blamed it on his speech writer.
The AJC is a wholly incorporated subsidiary of the Democrat party, all of this nonsense of them saying they aren’t is either a lie or their ignorance.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 10:51 AM | Link to this
Told ya idiots like macaca believes the military propaganda.
Earth to macaca, they lie.
Geez.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this
Told ya Craponlife takes the words of our enemies over our military and loves our enemies.
No, you can’t make up a character like Craponlife. Just sit back and watch him drool in his wheelchair.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:55 AM | Link to this
“It was a stupid excuse.”
-Britt Hume 6/24/07 Fox News Sunday with Chris Wallace on the question of Cheney insinuating he’s a member of the legislative branch which made it all good to ignore an executive order.
Yeah, that extreme Reich Wing media outlet the diseases on the left wet their panties over. But that’s neither here nor there. Any time the sick liberal RAT pack whines about handling classified documents from the National Archives, I laugh in their faces. They have no say in the matter since Bergerpants. P!ss off.
By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL
June 24, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this
Lott was pathetic on Fox. He avoided the awkward questions and gave no direct answers on the 20 million or so illegal leeches he wants to roll over and (politically) die for. He just puked up bland evasive typically glib Bush lies/bollocks about the DUI killer Kennedy/ John McKennedy destroy America amnesty bill. He did gently put the shrill Feinsteinbitch in its place on demoNcrat hypocrisy.
Please aborted foreskin kill your sorry pathetic indequate moronic cyber self and permanently cease posting on here!! Your unremitting grossly cretinous execrable puke has all the gravitas and rationality of a Charlie Manson rant!!
Seek out the newly freed Dr Kevorkian and plead with him for some immediate help. Better still ask your family vetinarian to put you to sleep …
By Markus
June 24, 2007 10:58 AM | Link to this
btw:anyonenoticemarkuspostingtohimselfwithanaliasfemalename?bwa!marcusdoe
HAHAHAHAH!!! Hey Pollypeck, don’t you know weed makes you paranoid? What’s up you little pencil neck pothead, can’t handle a nOOb on the blog that knows you are a pathetic POS?
Go back to reading your High Times where you belong.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 11:02 AM | Link to this
Oh goodie, another insane wingnut Claire.
Truth hurt much Claire?
Geez.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 11:03 AM | Link to this
ISSUE ONE: now getalife! The general petreus told us that the surge would cause extra casualties because our troops are getting all up in the enemies faces, but overall, the trend will be less violence cause we’ll finally destroy the enemy and win the peace in Iraq. He wont make predictions but he thinks we’ll win in Iraq with the surge.
ISSUE TWO: Illegal aliens?
Assimilation, not Apartheid!
ASSIMILATION, NOT APARTHEID!!
ASSIMILATION, NOT APARTHEID!!!
ISSUE THREE: song….serf city
CUBANS R CASTRO’S TOYS
I’ve got a commie reputation but I’m really a fascist…serf city here I come….waterboarding, bible-flushing, nothing’s off limits…serf city here I come….
Oh I dont need a congress or a bill veto….cause any opposition gets guantanamo’d.
CUBANS R CASTRO’S TOYS!!!
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this
Don’t look now, but the drunk intern killer who authored the amnesty bill is on Steponanoctopus!
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:07 AM | Link to this
By getalife
June 24, 2007 11:02 AM | Link to this Oh goodie, another insane wingnut Claire.
Yeah craponlife you sick old man, the hell did you think this was, a diseased liberal blog like Daily Kook?
Zombie.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 11:08 AM | Link to this
PF,
You are missing the point.
Paris gets out of jail on Tuesday and NBC did not offer her a one million dollar interview.
Now, that is news.
Geez.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:11 AM | Link to this
Another warmongering moron joins the Woo-ten Klan, this time the silly b-itch Claire.
Why aren’t you in Iraq, you filthy coward?
America has been run into the ground by you warmongering idiots who blah blah blah on the blogs all day because you are too cowardly to go to Iraq to fight the fight the moron you selected President has got us into. Go to Iraq. Fight in Iraq. Die in Iraq.
Of course not. You’re a stupid cow coward.
Trash.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this
Ted Kennedy on “This Week w/ George Stephanopolous”.
He’s hanging on by a thread trying to explain the amnesty bill. He’s trying to be the great compromiser. He’s trying to avert a civil war, but he’s failing.
the Right wont be satisfied till we can turn this country into an Apartheid against the Mexicans.
Our future will be Iraq’s in a cosmic karma of turnabout and what comes around goes around.
THe Right finally got some political traction by shouting “Amnesty”, which everyone was against, not because the immigration bill is amnesty, but because the word amnesty itself has a power over the American People whose zeitgeist is pregnant with fear of amnesty, whatever amnesty means.
Also, amnesty implies that illegal immigrants are terrorists, which alienates them.
So we are setting up an Apartheid, and a civil war, just because the fat bellies on the right got traction with a word they pulled out of their azz.
Assimilation, not Apartheid!!!
Cordial Mores, not Civil Wars!!
By getalife
June 24, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this
No macaca,
This blog will never have the political influence of kos.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:15 AM | Link to this
Yep, all those fighters in Iraq are Iraqis. No al Qaeda, no Iranians, no Saudis, and no Syrians are coming across the borders of Iraq. One day an overestrogened liberal would say “the generals said we need more troops” and that word is golden. Another day the pink thong showing limpwrists would say “the military lies” when it says there are al Qaeda insurgents in Iraq (I guess they never heard of al Qaeda In Iraq). See how this warped game plays in liberal la-la land? See what pot and cheap booze does to the mind? Stupid liberals.
Hey check this report of lies out!
Idiots.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:21 AM | Link to this
“This blog will never have the political influence of kos.”
Good, then maybe you sickos will finally STFU and stop b!tching about this blog having so many wingnuts on it. And WTF are you diseases doing here anyway?
Stupid tools.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:23 AM | Link to this
Claire, pay no mind to God’s Liberal Trash. He’s just our resident diseased liberal ID spoofing sicko stoner demoncat who couldn’t come up with an original talking point if he smoked page A1 of the New York Slimes.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:28 AM | Link to this
Front page of the Sunday Parade:
“Does the UN still matter?”
What the hell do YOU think.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this
Moron Markanus is surprised that there are foreign nationals in Iraq. Dumbya can’t keep our own borders secure, how do you expect that stupid idiot to keep Iraq’s borders secure.
You idjit neo-kkkons live in a shoot-em-up fantasy world. Sort of like Grand Theft Auto on steroids, that if you blow things up enough you can make the world right.
But Markanus, you silly poof POS - who you gonna kill from under your bed you d-ickless brainless KOWARD?
Greasemonkey trash.
By Dennis
June 24, 2007 11:38 AM | Link to this
Between the lines of Mr. Wooten’s columns about Cuba, one cannot help but notice the rightwing salivating that one day Cuba will once again be controlled by the U.S. as it was during the days of the U.S. supported dictator, Batista, which gave rise to the Cuban revolution in the first place.
So much for “building a democratic nation” and, honesty and ethics in the media.
You don’t have to be a blind conservative not to see it, just an ignorant one to deny it.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this
Senator Sessions (R ALABAMA) is the poster child for naivete about Iraq. He plays with a “reduction in troops” but rejects a timeline, yet says, “the sooner the better”.
We aint never gonna get outta Iraq. We are there. Forever! The fact that our congress debates about timelines 4 withdrawals is only a smokescreen to fool the American People into thinking we may someday see our boys again…We Wont!
Accept it. W has blundered into a 100 years war, and we are going to be bled dry into a second rate power and fifty years from now, we will be canada or mexico, or both, or just a bunch of senile socialists sitting around in nursing homes waiting to get nuked by islamic uberkinders.
W has blown it.
Eleven Score and Eleven years ago, our forefathers brought forth upon this continent a new nation, dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.
Bush has taken a great big dump on that nation, and has left us with no way out of a giant sucking sound of resources and men into a vast gulf in the deserts of mesopotamia, the historical and ubiquitous geo-trap of the ages, which every sane person living today knew to stay out of.
Bush is a new category of criminal: the global outlaw, a planetary system wide monkeywrenching of destiny which has galactic implications for the universe of truth and justice.
Bush will be the new boy who cried wolf. In fact, you wont have to say, “boy who cried wolf” anymore, you’ll just say “bush”.
example in a sentence: The tornado alarm went off, but everyone knew it was a bush.
language of origin: “Bush” comes from the Stooge derivations of the Pig Latin for Moron, Imbecile, Nitwit, Nincompoop, Idiot, Retard, Liar, Thief, Incompetent, and Fool.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:44 AM | Link to this
“Moron Markanus is surprised that there are foreign nationals in Iraq.”
You still here d!ckhead? That^^ goes back to Craponlife’s 10:30am insinuating that there are no foreign fighters in Iraq and they are all Iraqis. You really are a dumb worthless existence of carbon, but, you ARE a pathetic diseased liberal monkey.
Stupid tools.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:44 AM | Link to this
Po Fo - excellent - but you left off COWARD.
By Liberal Drive-by
June 24, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this
“Does the UN still matter?”
What the hell do YOU think.
Yeah it only matters when right-wing wackos want to invade a country using U.N. resolutions as some lame excuse.
Morons
By Markus
June 24, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this
“Yeah it [UN] only matters when right-wing wackos want to invade a country… blah blah blah.”
Less than half of UN members have submitted their documentation proving they are complying with UN sanctions on Iran. How long has Darfur been an issue?
Case closed, jackass.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this
Speaking of cowards, w and cheney said they are above the law.
No accountablity for their crimes is the most cowardice act in US history.
How in the world can Americans support these cowards who think they are above the law?
Looks like they should have locked up Nixon to set an example.
Geez.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this
Retards like Markanus, Wooten and the other morons of the Woo-ten Klan find Dumbya a courageous leader.
For a sociopath like Dumbya, it requires absolutely no courage to make a decision to put other people in harm’s way.
The heart and soul of neo-cons like Markanus is a whiny two-year with dirty diapers.
Boohoo you whiny stunted greasemonkey POS kkklown.
Trash.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this
Keep running that mouth, God’s Liberal Trash. How does it feel to be an insignificant pile of diseased left wing blog gutter debris?
By Dusty
June 24, 2007 12:08 PM | Link to this
GHT,11:11
Silence is golden. Why don’t you try it? Your daily insults are pathetic.
By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL
June 24, 2007 12:14 PM | Link to this
@ God(if you exist)killthisyankkkeeLEPERtrash
Replicating the spirit of your very recent anal obsessive post @ 11.11 …
Don’t wait to die in Iraq Mrs JM Karr-NAMBLA … just do it NOW!!! Thank you so much!!!
AND LEAVE THOSE vulnerable KIDS ALONE!!!
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:15 PM | Link to this
Will someone advise those know-it-all sick liberal Hollywood-heads to actually RESEARCH the culture they are invading first instead of just showing up? Good GOD man. First flaming liberal kookbat George Cloony effed up in India by showing public affection on a woman, and now Dumb Ditz Diaz sports a bag with a Zedong slogan in Peru.
And those^^ jackasses think they know about everything in the world and could run this nation? Sick, sick, sick.
Stupid liberals.
By Dusty
June 24, 2007 12:17 PM | Link to this
Pofo 11:41
Better stick with the jokes, Pofo. Now you’re telling big lies and that’s not funny at all.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:20 PM | Link to this
Hey Craponlife, did you read my report link on all those “non-al Qaeda Iraqis” that are stirring up so much trouble in Iraq as you said? Dude, you must actually be in Iraq to “know” so much.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:28 PM | Link to this
Heads’s up my British friends. Those peaceful “muslim students” you have there… you need to watch them. CLOSELY. Tell your candy@ssed liberal countrymen to go F themselves.
“The queen of England should also know that her shameful and undignified act will not be left unanswered and that Salman Rushdie had been sentenced to death long before this through the Fatwa of the founder of the Islamic Republic of Iran, Ayatollah Khomeini and therefore such actions could not bring him back to life.”
By THE ONLY GOOD LIBERAL IS A DEAD LIBERAL
June 24, 2007 12:30 PM | Link to this
I see Mrs JM Karr-NAMBLA has been caught molesting young boys again. It always, without fail, gets this hatefully bilious and poisonous when its depraved paedophilia is interrupted. Court ordered chemical castration of its last transplanted (in Albania) syphilitic warthog testical will save a few more kids from brutish defilement.
Better still just f off and die rednekkks!! There’s a good leftist cut and run dogturd!!!
You see NAMBLA how easy it is to wittily mirror back your irrational hate.
All you EVER post on here is hatepig puke. You are incapable of reasoned debate and/or logical thought. You are the poster dogturd for a should have been aborted at birth leftist fookwit!!!
By getalife
June 24, 2007 12:30 PM | Link to this
I see they dish it out but can’t take it.
No macaca,
I do not read your lies but have been keeping up with all the lies they spew about Iraq when w cut and ran from OBL to occupy Iraq.
I thought, why in the world would he do such a cowardly act?
Now, I know.
w and cheney are cowards who do not want accountability for their crimes. They think they can do whatever they want and do not serve the people. They have destroyed this country.
And idiots like you cheer them on.
It is just disgusting.
Pathetic.
I am out of words for these criminals and their supporters.
Geez.
By Redneck Convert
June 24, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this
Well, I’m just fed up with the commies praising Cuba’s doctoring system. Our Drs. are much better if you just pay them enough, which we don’t. What we need in Cuba is some insurance cos. that can deny claims and squeeze the Drs. and the patients and make a few million $ doing it and jack the cost way up. There might be a few thousand more dead people but at least we could have a good old American doctoring system in Cuba. Instead of a system where just anybody can get care. What kind of commie system is that? If we had a American system pretty soon there wouldn’t be no commies left. They would all be dead and the people that had the money would be the only ones left.
I don’t hold with no socialized medicine. Let the people that can afford it go to a Dr. and them that can’t just die off. That way we will be rid of the leeches and be much better off. We need Private Enterprise in the doctoring system in Cuba. Lots of people that don’t get no care and sort of slip away and leave the doctoring to the good productive citizens like me.
This Moore guy is nothing but a trader. Going to Cuba when he’s not suppose to and trying to show up our good American doctoring.
I see Markus ain’t gone back on his truck run yet. I hope he keeps dishing it out to the libruls. I guess Sister Dusty ain’t signed on yet. She is probly still down at the Church of Holiness handling the big copperhead Joe Bill caught for her.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this
“I do not read your lies..”
Yeah we all know your truths come from such awe inspiring links such as C&L and Daily Kook. That wasn’t my report Crapola. I suppose Princeton lies now. Ok. I am out of words for your sheer blind stupidity. But, you are a diseased liberal, so that goes without saying.
See folks why I don’t waste time here actually trying to converse with these diseased liberal spider monkeys who crawl up walls when they are presented with something that doesn’t fit into their mold of ideology?
Sickos.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:46 PM | Link to this
“w cut and ran from OBL”
Yeah, I’m sure you sick freaks on the diseased monkeyassed left would be down with us invading Pakistan to look for his cowardly @ss along with his fellow cave monkeys. Not that your wonderbread boy Clintoon let Bin Laden slip through or anything.
Useless. Meaningless. Pointless. Dead air.
Zombietime.
By Claire
June 24, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this
Getalife @ 11:02,
Does it not seem like a legitimate question to you to ask why the AJC is ignoring the Arrowhead Ripper operations in Iraq?
And how, exactly, do I qualify as a “wingnut” just because I ask this question?
You may not be able to understand this but the AJC is showing a stunning lack of maturity by censoring good news that comes out of Iraq, and you are also, when the best answer you have is to call people names.
It just seems like you and the AJC don’t have much faith in your positions in this war, considering you won’t subject them to any scrutiny or give voice to a view different than yours.
Do you think your readership is too stupid to think on their own?
Markus @ 11:23,
I am reminded of something I read about American flight 11 that hit the north tower of the World Trade Center, how the ticket taker at Logan airport longs to have that morning back more than anything else and is suffering great guilt because of it. See, when she took Mohammed Atta’s ticket she remembers that he had a grimace of rage on his face like that of a wild animal and she wishes she would have called security over it.
When I read comments like those at 11:11, I too wonder if we will one day wish we could have this day back.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this
Has anyone noticed how nobody has challenged Michael Fat@ss Sicko on his LIE that Kaiser Permanente is a profit-driven greed hole when in reality Kaiser is NON-PROFIT as it has been since the 1930s for industrial workers (that would be God’s Liberal Trash workers he refers to as rednecks and trash… diseased libs really care for the working class, don’t they)?
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
Last word on the Clinton/Soprano spoof ending: “Hillary and Bill are sitting at a booth when the waitress brings them their carrot stick appetizers. As she leaves, Bill’s eyes and head turn and follow her every bounce. Then, he realizes that he lost himself for just that moment in front of his wife and he freezes, turns his head slowly back toward Hillary, who is looking straight into his eyes, expressionless, not giving away one ounce of the disgust she feels, yet she communicates it devestatingly. “What, no onion rings?” he manages. Then Bill passively bites down on a carrot stick, with a very loud crunch.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 1:02 PM | Link to this
No Claire,
After all the lies, I do not believe anything they spew.
Stupid people do.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 1:03 PM | Link to this
“See, when she took Mohammed Atta’s ticket she remembers that he had a grimace of rage on his face like that of a wild animal and she wishes she would have called security over it.”
Claire, surely by now you understand that we shouldn’t be “scared” of those islamofascist animals who are stuck in the 7th Century.
“When I read comments like those at 11:11, I too wonder if we will one day wish we could have this day back.”
The way this nation is going with the disease of liberalism and not wanting to be “scared” of anyone or “offend” anyone, that day will more than likely come again, and it will make 9/11 look like a boyhood backyard firecracker plastic model explosion. The problem with the sick left is that they have NO IDEA of the threat that is imposed on not only us, but the entire freaking GLOBE.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 1:09 PM | Link to this
Oh yeah, and God forbid if “that day” comes, may we all pray that God’s Liberal Trash and other extremist sickos like that thing are a part of it. They deserve it.
Amen.
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 1:16 PM | Link to this
New Song Parody
Serf City (sung to the tune of “Surf City” by Jan and Dean)
Cubans are Castro’s Toys…
“I’ve got a commie reputation but I’m really a fascist…Serf City here I come….Waterboarding, bible flushing, nothing’s off limits…Serf City here I come…you know I aint gotta uphold constitutional votes…and if my jails are full I put ‘em all on boats….oh yeah I’m goin’ 2 Serf City cause I am the Hun, yes I’m goin’ Serf City cause evil’s fun….
Cubans R Castro’s Toys…….
What if Wooten comes back brainwashed? What if he was kidnapped and drugged by Castro and then programmed to be a Cuban Spy and inflitrator? Isn’t that enough suspicion to allow the CIA to quantanamo his azz? I think so. Ask Cheney. Cheney would garrot Wooten in a new york second, just on the possibility that Wooten got brainwashed and is now a terrorist. I’m only trying to be a homeland security watchdog, that’s all, I didn’t really mean nuthin’, but you know what? IT DONT MATTER TO CHENEY, HE’S GONNA HOLD POOR WOOTEN FOR A YEAR IN A CELL NAKED AND CHAINED TO THE FLOOR.
Why? Because Cheney aint part of no executive branch. You see, Cheney doesnt’ crave the oval office, he simply wants to do things that only a traitor would do…….
Cheney is the New Castro.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
The Daily Hos are getting all pantyp!ssy over Iran and what we may do. Get a load of this mile long liberal terrorist appeasing candy@ssed psychobabble. Hey @ssclown, ever heard of editing? Sheesh.
But don’t worry girls. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: Israel will take care of the nuke issue in Iran just like they did in 1981 with American military weaponry. Now that’s just tuff tiddie (again), little liberal girlie men.
By AmVet
June 24, 2007 1:34 PM | Link to this
Good afternoon all. I just wanted to throw in my last two cents about a discussion from yesterday regarding elected veterans in DC.
Dusty - You seem to pick your worthy veterans by political party only.
And that is not an altogether untrue accusation, especially in this case. But it is done so to make an important point that YOU foolishly, in my opinion, brought up in the first place.
Democrats do fight for their country. I have demonstrated that beyond doubt. And so do Republicans. But why is it that the GOP has virtually no ELECTED leaders, including their closest advisors and supporters, who have done so? And the Dems have so many? These are not unreasonable questions to ask and questions I believe that YOU would NEVER ask. I think that is because you have no good answers.
Two points are irrefutable. First, the GOP leadership and the Decider have “chosen the time and place” of this preemptive invasion and occupation.
Secondly they have, by most accounts (even those of the majority on active duty!!), mismanaged it terribly. My question goes to the point, “is the neo-con leadership’s combined lack of relevant military, and almost total lack of combat experience a factor?” I believe it is very much so.
Dusty - You are making a big deal about Cleland. Do you even live in Georgia?
Yet again you choose to misread, misconstrue and mischaracterize. It is becoming obvious that trait is not done by accident. I was in fact, making a big deal about Chambless. Why? Because he had the audacity and cowardice to question Clelands courage! Call Max misguided. Call him a liberal. Call him all of the names Karl Rove can think of. BUT DON”T QUESTION HIS COURAGE! And for that one grave error in judgment alone, he is IMHO a despicable man, certainly politically savvy, but not worthy of being an elected leader.
If people refuse to see that war veterans, as American citizens who have put their lives on the line for ALL of us, can come home and change their minds and grow against a war or future wars, then they are in my opinion, horribly misguided themselves. And their definition of patriotism is indeed twisted.
I watched a good movie last night, “Flags of our Fathers”. And there was one line that really jumped out at me. “Any jackass can have an opinion about war. Especially those that have never been.”
Dusty - Do you even live in Georgia?
Completely irrelevant. But yes I EVEN LIVE in Ga. Since 1979. Are non-Georgians not allowed to have informed opinions about our senior US Senator? Sure sounds like you think so.
Dusty - …posting all the names of Republican politicians who were not in the military, then proclaiming it doesn’t matter. Why then did you post that list ?
First see the comment about about your less than quaint habit of intentionally misreading posts. Unless of course you can show where I wrote that “it doesn’t matter”.
It does matter. At least to me, it does. And there are many reasons, I vote for who I will. But especially as I am a veteran it is only natural that military service, or a lack thereof, is a fairly important factor.
And notwithstanding that, it also explains why I would never have voted for John Kerry. His courage and heroism are well documented (thank you swift boaters for so patriotically pointing that out) but his anti-war message when he came home seemed to be mainly to begin and propel a political career. I can’t know that, but I can think it.
And ditto for that President of the Screen Actors Guild, who didn’t do squat in Lebanon when he didn’t even deliver any even remotely serious American retaliation, even after losing the most US Marines in one day since Iwo Jima!! A few meaningless shellings but essentially NOTHING!! But fortunately less than a week later he saved us from those dangerous Grenadian Marxists.
So you see, unlike the extremist partisans who almost certainly vote a straight party ticket at every chance, I swing both ways. Oh my! Does that disqualify me for military service? (Big sh-it eating grin!)
Do you?
By Markus
June 24, 2007 1:42 PM | Link to this
I’ve got $500 that says Ohio governator Ted Strickland, (RAT), will only serve one term. Anybody want some action? No? Well maybe you’ll want in after this little RAT jewel. The man sucked up to CAIR, and the media constantly ignores the BLOOD MONEY that is on CAIR’s hands. Other RATS are running from the CAIR ship. (To think we only thought BLOOD MONEY was on the hands of US military contractors, RIGHT RATS???).
By Political Foreskin
June 24, 2007 2:07 PM | Link to this
Cheney is the New Castro!
The Veto Bandito! Cheney eschews the presidential seal…”I dont need no stinking seal!”
This coup is coming soon to a sunni detainee near you.
By jbmlaw
June 24, 2007 2:40 PM | Link to this
Dear PoFo @ various times, you have saved up a lot of your good material, funny stuff this weekend, thanks for publishing.
Dear AmVet @ 1:34, I would respefully interject myself, “why is it that the GOP has virtually no ELECTED leaders, including their closest advisors and supporters, who have done so?” The asnwer is that most GOPers of substance are not in politics - the best of the best are running industry and making the nation work. Politics is not a hallmark of conservatism, productive work is the hallmark of conservatism. Only statists dedicate themselves to politics, and that is why your best are found there.
By DJ
June 24, 2007 2:49 PM | Link to this
Cuba? CUBA? what?? What’s the matter Jim? no good relevant issues today to rally the right wing drones? So you waste everyones time setting up a straw man just so you can earn more conservative cred by kicking Castro around? As if he more then tangentially relevant to current world affairs? Very good Jim - so we all know you’re a “good right winger” because you toe the thoughtless and uninspired party line. Whoop-de-do. And now the legion of dittoheads who eat up your red meat “intellectualizing” (definitely in quotes) will know what to think for another whole day until you can come up with some more pressing issue with which to bash the left for no other reason then to continue to assert the questionable superiority of the neo-con ideology. Which, I might point out, is working out splendidly. Not.
By AmVet
June 24, 2007 3:06 PM | Link to this
jbmlaw, first thank you for thanking me (that sounds weird, doesn’t it?) for my serving in the US Armed Forces. It was grueling at times but especially in retrospect, an amazingly valuable experience. But I don’t feel terribly worthy of any thanks or one iota as deserving of them as are the men and women serving and dying in the desert right now. And their families.
I don’t mean to disparage, but I would have predicted the response, * The asnwer is that most GOPers of substance are not in politics.*
Of course not. And that is the same for Democrats, Libertarians, Independents and probably every other stripe of American.
Though with 6 plus consecutive years of GOP failures looking America squarely in the face, I can see how you could definitely conclude such a thing.
And perhaps “conservatives” are indeed a bit less problematic and not as damaging to the United States or her national interests when they do not have the opportunity to mangle the management of our government and of our national interests.
And again the exact same thing can be said of the Ted Kennedy Democrats.
Politics is not a hallmark of conservatism
So, I find this a strange deduction indeed, but clearly neo-conservatism is dying and I can’t help but wonder, if because of it, the hijacked Republican Party will again be forty years on the outside looking in.
And that too, is bad news for America.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 3:25 PM | Link to this
Well, WaPo finally decided to write about the biggest coward and worst American, cheney
Better late than never, I guess.
Geez.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 3:32 PM | Link to this
“Williams: …Maybe they have a reason because he stopped complying with the law…emails disappear in this White House and you say well what happened to the emails—oh–no…we have a private account…..This is all a dodge, this is a game in order to I guess to keep Dick Cheney in some kind of a secured, undisclosed bunker of his mind…so that he he can’t let the American people know what’s going on with their government and how decisions are made…who’s visiting his house….who’s visiting his office…Scooter Libby is letting people know who is working for the CIA…
The panel laughs, but this is no joking matter”
Even Hume, who the CIA spied on, called cheney pathetic.
Geez.
By AmVet
June 24, 2007 3:36 PM | Link to this
Let me say that I take no joy in the President’s failings of the past few years. None.
And unlike almost everybody who posts here, I am an equal opportunity critic. That is why I find it less than amusing that the more vocal “debaters” on this blog have demonstrated that they are either of the “The GOP is always right, The Democrats are always wrong” camp, or vice versa. At least to the point where they NEVER show any balance in their statements. It makes it exceedingly difficult for me to give a lot of credibility to them.
As the GOP is now in control of the White House, and until recently in control of the Congress as well, and with their truly abysmal track record recently, it is easy to assume that I hammer ONLY on them. Not true.
Though Clinton was at least, basically an effective President, I have thoroughly lambasted him on numerous occasions, as well.
And Slick Willy has certainly contributed to some very disturbing ongoing trends while in the West Wing. One of the more egregious was when he was so tempted by an obvious power grab, that he supported that inane clause in the Contract with America called the Line Item Veto.
Fortunately American jurisprudence rescued us from that particularly stupid neo-con idea.
But nonetheless, he was more than happy to see the US Congress cede one of it’s more important responsibilities to him.
And his predecessor has now gone even further in his attempts to create a “Super Executive” branch of the US Government, trying constantly to skirt the Constitution and even reasonable attempts to have an open, somewhat transparent, government.
At least Reagan, Carter and Bush 41 ignored those Lorelei calls.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 3:37 PM | Link to this
I thought it was just Markanus, but it’s the smell of neo-kkkon fear that permeates the blog today. The Woo-ten Klanners blog for war, and blog for my death and destruction while they hide behind their screens and screen names and under their beds, p-issing their diapers yellow with fear, their drawers matching the stripes up their backs.
Pathetic PsOS all. Trash.
By Carbon Footprint
June 24, 2007 3:39 PM | Link to this
Cynthia Tucker wrote a superior column today which reminded us of how we got stuck with the monkey in the white house. She did an amazing expose of the most rancid aspect of the vast right wing conspiracy: Voter Disenfranchisement. Bush never got elected to nuthin’. The American People’s Choice was Gore, and then Kerry. It was the shenanigans and fraud perpetuated by traitors which skewed the polling.
but what is a patriot to do when our own government turns on itself and overthrows itself? Endure the unendurable, like Gore and Kerry did, and allow the travesty to perpetuate.
And now look at the mess.
By Carbon Footprint
June 24, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this
Cynthia Tucker is a great journalist. Her article today about GOP dirty tricks and voter-fraud pandering is eye-opening.
By getalife
June 24, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
“Everybody’s favorite xenophobe Pat Buchanan was on Meet The Press this morning with dire predictions for this country. Was he worried about a Constitutional crisis that makes Watergate pale in comparison? Nah…Pat’s convinced–convinced, I tell you–that the immigration bill is de facto amnesty and that’s going to result in our borders being overrun and turning the US into a “third world nation.”
They said the same thing about the Irish and you are Irish Pat.
Geez, its cheap labor idiot.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 5:41 PM | Link to this
Pollypecker yesterday b!tching about “hate” on this blog:
By Political Foreskin
June 23, 2007 3:51 PM | Link to this
I knew there was no audience. I knew it.
You neo-penpals who post to yourselves all day every day chased the readership of this blog, which was once considerable, away.
Wooten, you’re at fault because you let these pinheads ruin your own blog. You should have banned the handful of mutants right off the bat, and you’d have a thriving blog. Nobody wants to read hate speak. nobody.
Seems a shame.
God’s Liberal Trash today:
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:11 AM | Link to this
Another warmongering moron joins the Woo-ten Klan, this time the silly b-itch Claire.
Why aren’t you in Iraq, you filthy coward?
America has been run into the ground by you warmongering idiots who blah blah blah on the blogs all day because you are too cowardly to go to Iraq to fight the fight the moron you selected President has got us into. Go to Iraq. Fight in Iraq. Die in Iraq.
Of course not. You’re a stupid cow coward.
Trash.
Pollypecker today b!tching about “hate”: chirp chirp chirp *chirp
Once again the disease of liberalism rears it’s ugly head for all to see. Damned hypocrites. They can dish it out, but they can’t take it. Pansies.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 5:50 PM | Link to this
By getalife
June 24, 2007 10:30 AM | Link to this
“Insurgents in Iraq have been morphed into being called ‘al-Qaeda’:
Only idiots like macaca and the base believes this propaganda.
Me @11:15 - killer link disproving Craponlife’s usual BS.
By GodHatesTrash
June 24, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this
Moron Markanus is surprised that there are foreign nationals in Iraq. Dumbya can’t keep our own borders secure, how do you expect that stupid idiot to keep Iraq’s borders secure.
The poor little liberal girls here have a hard time sometimes, to be sure. Sometimes, you just have to shake your head and move on.
By Dusty
June 24, 2007 5:52 PM | Link to this
Oh bother. Now I have to answer Amvet who has “fancied up” his great left leanings (anti-war) to tell us about the suffering of the poor folks fighting in the desert for nothing. Folks, he is talking about our TROOPS FIGHTING IN IRAQ and AFGHANISTAN, like they are a bunch of rabbits being stepped on. Hooey!
His slanted vision is so great that he has forgotten that Congress, including Democrats approved this war. Amvet suggestively calls it “occupation”.
He “understands” that veterans may change their minds about war, i.e. they no longer want to fight for their country. Thus we have Amvet. No wonder he/she understands.
Then he happens to hear a quote he likes. I bet he does. It goes like this:Any jackass can have an opinion about war, especially those that have never been there. In other words, the average citizen is not worth listening to if he has not served in the military.
My father, husband and oldest son are all veterans and not one of them became anti-war protestors. They considered it their duty, not a privilege to incriminate the president, the country and anyone whose politics did not agree with them. Their heads did not swell. Any complaints they have are straight forward, not clothed in slanted dialogue.
Amvet uses all the key words from liberal propaganda: occupation, suffering,stupid neo-con idea, “Super Executive Branch”,skirt the Constitution, Karl Rove, misread posts, and of course, “Chambless is a despicable man”. He might as well add “or any other Republican.”
Amvet never answered why he listed GOP leaders who were not veterans as if they were “lacking”. He just thought it was a good idea. He did not mention that President Bush served honorably in the military. (He throws in “combat” later, in case any one mentions the President.)
Anyone can state their opinions here but the undercover, presumptuous political laden ones who come here acting like they are impartial, then downgrade our country and its leaders, they are not to my liking.
Amvet ends with this paragraph:ulike extremist partisans who vote the straight party ticket at every chance, I swing both ways. Oh my! Does that disqualify me for military service?
Well, Amvet, I thought you had already been in military service. Maybe I was wrong or maybe you were. But there is no doubt that you are a far left Democrat.
By Markus
June 24, 2007 5:58 PM | Link to this
Dusty, clue: our usual RAT suspect(s) sometimes re-invent themselves. The clue is between the lines as you suspect, and sometimes what’s posted itself which can be traced back to a wingnut website. Follow your instinct and you will just about always be Right.
By Claire
June 24, 2007 6:03 PM | Link to this
Why do I have to report this?
The Anbar Salvation Council model is spreading. The Diyala Salvation Front was formed in May. More than 10 tribes in Baghdad and its suburbs have banded together to fight al-Qaida, USA Today reported Tuesday.
If Arrowhead Ripper succeeds, al-Qaida in Iraq will suffer a blow from which it may not recover. “In Diyala, both the foreign jihadists and their domestic allies are beginning to feel cornered, with few places left to hide,” STRATFOR said.
But if Arrowhead Ripper succeeds, you may not hear much about it. A U.S. victory would be too embarrassing for those in the media who have staked their reputations on defeat.
Is the very thought of success in Iraq something not to be spoken?
By AmVet
June 24, 2007 6:17 PM | Link to this
Oh brother, bother!
Skip every salient point made and then carry on listlessly like that substitutes for reasoned answers or counterpoints.
Amvet suggestively calls it “occupation”.
Not as catchy as the war on terrorism is it? Never mind, it is a rhetorical question and my characterization of it is sadly accurate. I know it bothers you as an unquestioning Bush supporter that I don’t rely on slogans and sound bites, but too many in this country, like yourself have already shown a great relish for doing so and look at what you’ve brought to creation? Disaster overseas and a consistent failure to resolve domestic challenges as well.
Oh well, Dusty, here’s another old adage you can parse rather than explain why you never ever really answer any questions you don’t like.
Opinions are like a*******holes, Everybody has one. And it has been my experience that those who question others patriotism simply because they disagree with them are in fact, some of the very worst US citizens I have ever seen.
And so as most can understand, as for your family serving in the US military I am quite doubtful.
You assert that there is no doubt that you are a far left Democrat though I’ve made snarky comments about Sen. Kennedy, Sen. Clinton and ex-President Clinton.
But I do know one thing, YOU COULDN’T POSSIBLY THINK OF, MUCH LESS SAY, ONE LESS THAN FLOWERY THING ABOUT THIS PRESIDENT OR ANY REPUBLICAN EVER. Prove me wrong. And that makes you such an ultra far-right neo-con that you couldn’t find the political center with the Hubble telescope!
By Markus
June 24, 2007 6:42 PM | Link to this
“YOU COULDN’T POSSIBLY THINK OF, MUCH LESS SAY, ONE LESS THAN FLOWERY THING ABOUT THIS PRESIDENT OR ANY REPUBLICAN EVER. Prove me wrong. And that makes you such an ultra far-right neo-con that you couldn’t find the political center with the Hubble telescope!”
Well. I guess he told Dusty off! Typical whine from a RAT: “you haven’t said one bad thing about Bush or and Repubican. Therefore you are a neocon. Waaaah!” NOTHING could be further from the truth, including me rep/con bashing here (because they didn’t ACT like them). That said, NOTHING could be more truthful than not ONE SINGLE RAT here not having ONE SINGLE THING negative to say about ANY liberal or ANY RAT. Period END OF STORY!
DAMN what hypocrites!