Thinking Right

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 08:08 AM | Link to this

This is an insurance remedy. the question is whether Karina caused the flooding, or whether there were two separate legal events: wind, then flooding. This is why I agree with Mr. Wooten that we need to overhaul education.

Even if you had flood and wind insurance, the insurance companies could argue over which caused the damage and hold off payment for years trying to legally define the cause of the damage in court.

I personally feel that without Karrina, you have no flooding. I cant prove that the levees wouldn’t have failed on that day without the hurricanE pushing the water over the levees which then gave way, and that is why an isurance company could hold me at bay for years in court.

There still hasn’t been a satisfactory explaination about what actually happened to the levees, and if the lawyers are successful, there never will be.

By jbmlaw

August 28, 2006 08:16 AM | Link to this

Before Katrina, our New Orleans friends always displayed a gallows-humor about the prospect of a city-killing flood. The ruptured levees provided such a flood. I respectfully suggest that Mr. Wooten skipped over the threshold question, whether it makes sense to rebuild in the city. “Reconstruction” is not a safety-net issue; nobody dies if there is no reconstruction. There is no question as to whether Federal largesse here would be anything other than pork-barrel spending. Until rupture-proof levees exist, I would condition any Federal gift on implementing a prohibition against construction there.

The flooding was seemingly not an issue with Gretna or Metairie, but limited to the city proper. I would support Federally-subsidized purchase – at current market prices - and construction of a Federal “Central Park” covering the entire area that flooded. Call it a Federal monument to short-sighted development, a permanent reminder of the stupidity of man. By any measure a park would be cheaper than the next evacuation.

Cannot stay to play today, see you all tomorrow.

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 08:27 AM | Link to this

Law just commented that Maybe none of the flooding would have occurred if we had thought to downgrade Katrina to a category Two hurricane before it stormed ashore. The levees were built to withstand that. We just dont think fast enough.

Good one, law. you get better with age.

By Jim Wooten

August 28, 2006 08:30 AM | Link to this

Morning jbmlaw, 2nd String and others. My first choice, actually, would be as jbmlaw suggests, that flooded neighborhoods not be rebuilt. But we lost that argument.

By Joe T

August 28, 2006 08:30 AM | Link to this

New Orleans is a filty, crime infested city run by crooked politicians. May it never come back as it was.

By Van

August 28, 2006 08:37 AM | Link to this

Folks,

Why couldn’t the affected areas be filled and brought above sea level?

I am sure that if the ground was stablized and filled, the ninth ward could be rebuilt and survive the next hurricane.

With the massive aid that has flowed into New Orleans and the state, there should not be anyone without the means to rebuild if they wanted to.

While the state and the city seems unable to manage a project of this size, maybe private industry should be given the chance to help this one state that seems to be behind the rebuilding curve.

By JK

August 28, 2006 08:41 AM | Link to this

Federal Emergency Management Agency: A federal agency funded by your tax dollars, the purpose of which is to manage and coordinate response and relief efforts from multiple state and local jurisdictions which may be, at the time of an emergency, unable to respond or provide relief, due to being blown away, under water, falling into crevices in the earth, scorched by fire, or worse.

If this federal agency cannot effectively manage anything, per its charter, then perhaps this pointless guzzler of tax dollars should be disbanded, and the monies appropriated toward something besides salaries and benefits for incompetent cronies. If they continue cashing their paychecks, however, I expect to NOT see news of American citizens dying by the hundreds of thirst and heat, stranded in puddles of their own waste, on the streets and sidewalks of America EVER again.

By Brian Curtis

August 28, 2006 08:43 AM | Link to this

I notice that even Wooten doesn’t seriously suggest that Brownie WASN’T an example of incompetent crony appointments. He does, however, correctly point out that screwups happened at several levels, and that sensible plans for reconstruction are needed.

By Mid-South Philosopher

August 28, 2006 08:54 AM | Link to this

Good morning, Jim,

Flat tire on the early morning bicycle ride this morning! I remember now why I quit riding them as a boy.

With respect to recognizing the New Orleans/ Katrina/Rita Fiasco, the entire situation proves my primise about “politicians” from the “highest” in the land to the “local” yokels and “all” the levels in between.

“Politicians” are like “septic tanks” Even the best and most efficient have a bad smell and full of….oh, well, you get the picture.

Off to court…not as a defendant!

Have a good day.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 09:02 AM | Link to this

I have no engineering background, and have no idea if Van’s idea of raising ground would work. I do imagine it might cause a LOT of other issues, but again, I don’t have an engineering background. It’s really to bad that we can’t make the 9th ward a park area, but as Jim pointed out, emotion prevailed over that logical notion. I actually LIKE Jim’s proposal. It makes excellent sense.

By Van

August 28, 2006 09:11 AM | Link to this

Dana,

Making the 9th ward a park might appeal to many folks, but my concern was the folks that lived there prior to the flooding.

It would seem to me that by raising the ground level and allowing folks to rebuild would accomplish two things. Give folks their land and houses back, through rebuilding and making the ward safe from flooding.

Just making it a park would still leave it open to flooding and what about the people that lived in the 9th? What about the poeple that lost their homes, businesses and possessions. Do we just kick them out? Do we build a park AND compensate them? How do we address the tax revenues the city and state collect on these homes?

No, filling and rebuilding is the only way for everyone to gain.

By Janine

August 28, 2006 09:12 AM | Link to this

@I totallty agree with JK,8:41 regarding his either PUT UP OR SHUT UP recommendation. FEMA’s purpose, according various sources, including its own website, is to “coordinate the response to a disaster which has occurred in the United States and which overwhelms the resources of local and municipal authorities.” FEMA was absorbed into DHS as of 2003. As a result, FEMA became part of the Emergency Preparedness and Response Directorate of DHS, and employs more than 2,600 full time employees. Very interesting is the following …In September 2003, Michael D. Brown, FEMA’s director and DHS Undersecretary, warned that the shift would make a mockery of FEMA’s new motto, “A Nation Prepared,” and would “fundamentally sever FEMA from its core functions,” “shatter agency morale” and “break longstanding, effective and tested relationships with states and first responder stakeholders.” The inevitable result of the reorganization of 2003, warned Brown, would be “an ineffective and uncoordinated response” to a terrorist attack or a natural disaster. [Washington Post Dec 23, 2005]! If locals are to take care of disasters, then the stated purposes and organization of FEMA should be revised ….or it should be abolished .

FEMA and DHS both came under intense criticism for their handling of the Hurricane Katrina disaster in 2005 (see Katrina and Criticism sections below). As a result, FEMA Director Brown was relieved of command of the Gulf Coast region and resigned shortly thereafter

By Fall Line

August 28, 2006 09:17 AM | Link to this

Now that New Orleans is being rebuilt, it’s time to end the blame game. The incompetence of Michael Brown, Governor Blanco and Mayor Nagin is no longer in doubt. They have proved with their actions, on in this case inactions, that they are not up to handling emergencies of this type. Blame has become a red herring at this point.

Why would you assume that the federal government cannot be part of a first response in disasters of this type? The government owes it to the citizens of this country to prevent such disasters and save lives through proper planning and coordination with local authorities to ensure that evacuation plans for disasters are adequate to meet the requirements. The pre-positioning of supplies in cases as clear as Katrina is a real no-brainer.

My wife and I sat in the comfort of our little home in Woodstock and wondered at the lack of evacuation in New Orleans with this dreadful storm bearing down on them. The television coverage showed empty highways and airports at a standstill. It was obvious even to the most casual observer that there were no school buses and Greyhounds on those empty roads, and there were no C-130’s or C5A’s at the airport air-lifting people out. That was to the time to act.

You can debate the lack of fairness in the news media all day long and never reach a conclusion. Just assume that the news coverage will not be as fair and balanced as you would like it to be and just leave it at that. News people are after all people, and they bring their baggage to what they do for a living just as everyone else does. This falls into the beating your head against the wall category.

Now is the time to rebuild the public education system in New Orleans. Hopefully, the city will never again have such a wonderful opportunity to shape the public education system to what it feels best serves its people.

Why would you deny the people public housing? Public housing can be a stepping stone out of the poverty that grinds people down. The problem with public housing is that it is so often abused. In order for public housing to be of benefit to the entire populace, there must be strict and enforced rules for occupation. First of all, there must be a time limit set. Four years and no more. Each family will have four years to transition from public to private housing or they’re out in the streets. No drugs. If anyone in the family is convicted of a drug offense, you’re out. Public housing is a privilege, not a right.

I agree that easy loans for home building and business restoration (not start ups) are needed. But why do you assume that faith based organizations are any better at giving advice than government organizations? Faith based organizations will come to the party because that’s what they do. The federal and state governments need to come to the party because that’s why they exist.

Why would you on one hand declare the incompetence of the state and local government and then on the other hand want to charge them with the awesome responsibility of caring for the levees? Instead, we need to cure the Corps of Engineers of the maladies that so often keep them from doing a good job. Oversight of the Corps is impossible because of the squabbling between Congress and the Army. The Corps pretty much gets to do whatever it feels like doing, but that’s a subject reserved for a day when I’m not so rushed.

How long is a refugee a refugee? If you are not a home or business owner in New Orleans and you evacuated to Atlanta and you have nothing to go back to New Orleans for, then you are now an Atlantan. Live with it.

“New Orleans is a responsible, working city composed of people who recognize a hurricane’s danger, prepare for it, and leave when their lives are at risk.” How naive.

By getalife

August 28, 2006 09:22 AM | Link to this

Lets get real. Corruption and incompetence is today’s reality in our government. The gop’s accountability consists of Brownie being blamed for the Katrina fiasco. The people responsible for the levees, city, states and federal officials were not held accountable.

No accountability = failure.

By Van

August 28, 2006 09:23 AM | Link to this

Jim,

Regarding you question on “how fair and balanced the news media is in telling the Katrina anniversary story”.

I will predict, that no mention of the other gulf coast areaswill be reported or will be reported in passing. The aftermath of Rita will be ignored.

I also predict there will be scant mention of the 100,000 aid workers that were on site within 72 hours.

Little will be said of the almost criminal manner that the Governor or Mayor acted. There will be some comments on the school buses but the offer of the Amtrak train will not be brought up.

In all, I would say the media will slant the story to make it all FEMA’s fault with little or no local fault.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 09:35 AM | Link to this

Van, I don’t disagree with you at all, I just don’t know if your idea is, from an engineering perspective, possible. No, I don’t think we (and I am using that term only because I can’t come up with a better one) should “take” anyone’s property - I have a real problem with the whole Eminent Domain issue. It simply makes NO sense to me whatsoever why we should be expected to pay the cost for someone elses short sighted decisions. I don’t have an issue helping to rebuild NO (or any other area devastated by a natural disaster) but I WILL have a problem if I have to pay for it a second time, when problems are known!

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 09:43 AM | Link to this

How about the para-military force that prevented the Katrina victims (or looters, as Bush called them), from fleeing the flooded areas by lining the bridges with armed men with orders to shoot to kill any “looters” (or fleeing victims, as logic and reason defines them).

Gee, could Haley Barbour have called on his network of clansmen to prevent anyone from evacuating the city towards that area?

you want the truth? YOU CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!

The big story of Katrina is that bridge, and those armed men. And THAT’S the story that Bush/Cheney and the vast right wing conspiracy will not allow to be told. Bush WAS reading, “Mein Pet Kampf” on 911 to that assembly of the Hitler Youth Elementary Vermacht, just as we suspected.

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 09:48 AM | Link to this

Katrina was Two storms. It hit Florida first, as a cat 2, and Jeb Bush declared a state of emergency, and recieved all the fed disaster relief funds available even though virtually no damage was caused by Katrina in Florida.

Thus, when Katrina hit N.O., Jeb Bush had drained every available cent for his reelection campaign, and nothing on the federal level was available for N.O.

Follow the money, and the blame presents itself: the bush family pirates.

By @@

August 28, 2006 09:50 AM | Link to this

Jim:

Optimist here. I have friends who reside in NO. They tell me of the progress being made but I don’t see mention of it in the news. I’ll take the word of a long-time resident over the media any day.

I’m wondering, has anybody done a study on just how many of the 9th Ward residents actually want to return to their previous situation. The results of such a study could determine whether the 9th should be rebuilt of not.

My friends down there have told me that Mayor Nagin has repeatedly changed his mind on whether the 9th should be rebuilt. Can anything move forward on that issue without a firm commitment from the Mayor?

Also, I did not appreciate Mayor Nagin’s comment regarding New York’s “hole in the ground” not being resolved after five years. If you want to define “unsuspecting” victims of a disaster, those 3,000 fit the bill. Nagin had prior notice to evacuate his citizens. The WTC didn’t.

I like your solutions. They’re simple, clear and concise. Not conducive to political warfare though. But then you are a conservative, so there you go…..

NO will come back bigger and better than before if considerable thought is put into what they want NO to be in the aftermath of Katrina. That takes time, but people prefer impatience. It fuels the political objective.

My first and last paragraphs show my optimism. The others show my frustration with the status quo.

I know you say I can leave long posts, but I’ll apologize anyway if you don’t mind.

By JP

August 28, 2006 10:05 AM | Link to this

This is really simple. The lower 9th, and other areas below sea level such as Lakeview and Gentilly, should be either restricted or built upon at owner’s risk. Given that the population either gallow’s humor or denial to avoid contemplating the possibility of a catastrophe, that luxury is gone—reality must be considered.

Those areas would serve better as wetland anyway, as would the restoration of the wetland south of the city further destroyed by Katrina. The state should allocate a portion of oil exploration revenue toward wetland restoration. The city wasn’t at quite as much risk before the loss of wetlands, partially exacerbated by removing oil from under the earth’s crust.

Finally, with the most dangerous areas unpopulated, the core of the city—the higher ground along the river that remained mostly dry during Katrina—can be restored. The metro area itself will and should diminish in size. The neighboring suburb of Jefferson Parish is also very low-lying and overpopulated. I see no easy solution for this—a flood one day will affect Metairie much the same as Lakeview, as they’re both built upon drained swampland. The population center should really be at worst across the lake, if not in Baton Rouge.

All that said, the words of one 9th resident on Discovery Channel’s “Surviving Katrina” from last night recur to me: “YOU give up YOUR house and live somewhere else, this is my HOME!” Who should be making that decision? How do you tell someone to abandon their home, an area their family has lived in for generations—since the mid 1800s?

By deegee

August 28, 2006 10:09 AM | Link to this

I watched a portion of Michael Brown’s testimony before congress last year. My impression is that he knew the restructuring of FEMA would make the agency ineffective, and he watched his reliable escalation path break. He should have done what alot of other experienced people in FEMA did at that time and resign. I think that he made the mistake of thinking that as long as he kept good records and documentation then he would be shielded in the event of a disaster. Big miscalculation. Chertoff stayed and Brown became the sacrificial lamb.

A year after the disaster New Orleans is slowly rebuilding but in my opinion Baton Rouge deserves a good portion of whatever aid is going to New Orleans. Baton Rouge had tens of thousands of people descend upon them overnight. This is how New Orleans in a practical sense rebuilt on higher ground. By and large, those that wanted to return to New Orleans have already done so and Baton Rouge needs help with schools, law enforcement and infrastructure. Given the history of flooding of the lower ninth ward and how little has been done to rebuild it this time, I think it would be a good exercise in eminent domain to pay out the pre-Katrina value of homes destroyed by the levee break to the homeowners. Then use the property for a park, a pond or whatever makes the best sense.

I would rather see government subsidized homeowners insurance denied first to beachfront property owners. For those that live below sea level, the government is responsible for the design and maintenance of a levee system so the government should bear the risk if it fails.

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 10:10 AM | Link to this

To find clansmen in mississippi, you look at a list of NRA members. Then cross reference that list with a list of civil war reenacters. There they be..aauurrghh!

To find morons in mississippi, reference the above instructions.

To find morons on this blog, simple read any blog that aint mine.

By 2nd String

August 28, 2006 10:13 AM | Link to this

aaurghh!

By Monarch Hames

August 28, 2006 10:16 AM | Link to this

New Orleans was built on the backs of slaves and their childrens children. Now it is being rebuilt for the ancestors of the slave masters on the dead bodies of the raped women and babies and the old that were trapped. Why were the houses below the sea? Why did the levees only break where those who could not escape couldn’t leave. Why didn’t the busses start? A football stadium of anger and starvation will not be constrained any longer.

By Janine

August 28, 2006 10:30 AM | Link to this

@getalife,9:22.. I have often wondered why the media ignored Michael Brown’s 2003 criticism of Bush’s putting FEMA in the Homeland Security bundle.. and his on target prediciton of tragedy that came to pass in Katrina catastrophe. Though he was definitely a PR and strategic train wreck, he was, most of all, a scapegoat for the administration.

By Redneck Convert

August 28, 2006 10:32 AM | Link to this

Well, the preaching was really good yesterday, and there was even applause when the Reverend Joe Bill Yoakum got into how we shouldn’t be giving money to the lazy n—I mean, to Those People—cause we’ll just make them keep being lazy.

Anyway, I have to get things ready down at the bowling alley for Jim Bob’s birthday party, so I don’t have a lot of time. Jim Bob could use a boost. He’s going through his fifth divorce, and he’s dead set against paying child support cause he don’t pay none for the six other kids he’s had. It’s all taking time away from his race for county commissioner. He might just win, cause he’s running on a family values platform.

Anyway, I say don’t give a penny to those people in New Orleans. If they want to live 20 feet below the water level, let ‘em drown next time. Bush and Brown were right to be a little slow in getting there last August. If I want to live under a big rotten tree, I shouldn’t be surprised if the tree falls down on me over time and plunks me on the head. Besides, the people down there are all Democrats anyway. It won’t be a big loss if the next one sweeps them away, and giving them money to rebuild will just let ‘em qualify for more money.

By Janine

August 28, 2006 10:39 AM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten…RE your opinion that “The federal government simply cannot be the first responder in planning, managing and reacting to disaster…Do you not agree that the purpose , i.e. Mission Statement of FEMA should be revised to reflect and clearly state that notion,.. OR that FEMA should be abolished and and then there would be no confusion or discussion about responsibiliy.?

By JK

August 28, 2006 10:47 AM | Link to this

With the massive aid that has flowed into New Orleans and the state, there should not be anyone without the means to rebuild if they wanted to. I agree with Van!!!

maybe private industry should be given the chance to help this one state that seems to be behind the rebuilding curve.

Um… where do you think all that money WENT? No-bid contracts to private conglomerates who kept some, then “contracted” out to people who kept some, then “contracted” out to people who kept some, then “contracted” out to people…. It’s called the “trickle down” method of getting nothing done.

By I fart for laughs

August 28, 2006 11:06 AM | Link to this

The swelling of Bush’s head was apparent in his interview for Bob Woodward’s Bush at War, which took a largely flattering look at Bush’s “gut” decision-making but reported some disturbing attitudes within the White House.

“I am the commander, see,” Bush told Woodward. “I do not need to explain why I say things. That’s the interesting thing about being the President. Maybe somebody needs to explain to me why they need to say something, but I don’t feel like I owe anybody an explanation.”

So, Bush had come to see himself as beyond accountability, much as ancient royalty viewed their own powers as unlimited under the divine right of kings. In the traditional droite de seigneur, a nobleman had the right to deflower the bride of a male subject on their first night of marriage.

Now we’re told that George W. Bush has another way of demonstrating his supremacy over subordinates: when new White House aides are brought in to be introduced to the President of the United States, the President farts.

By atltoday

August 28, 2006 11:06 AM | Link to this

Should the 9th ward be rebuilt, sure. We don’t stop resident of parts of california building even though they know of the fires and the possibility of earthquakes. The levees must be rebuilt higher but you must know that the Corp asked this administration for money to reinforce the levees and were denied because of hte Iraq war. Also, I would hold the state and federal government at higher responsibility than the local govenermnet in the aftermath because all local officials were stranded and virtually had no communication. Its over…Lets try to figure out how to help these people rebuild their lives. Unlike other times, this is not one house…these are whole neighborhoods that are virtually gone forever.

By Van

August 28, 2006 11:12 AM | Link to this

JK,

The private industry I was referring to would be as a project management team. The state, parish and city seem incapable of handling the details required. The fedral government has filled to overflowing the state coffers, with enough funds to rebuild anyone and everyones home. If I am not mistaken, it is about $400,000 per household, or something along that line.

By Jim Wooten

August 28, 2006 11:22 AM | Link to this

Janine, local government is the first responder, the state second and FEMA third. The federal government cannot possibly prepare to be first responder for every imaginable disaster that occurs anywhere in America. It’s an impossible mission, for one. For another, it allows state and local governments behave irresponsibily — allowing construction in environmentally fragile areas, for example — or to sit passively, as they initially did in Louisiana, blaming somebody else for their fate and for everything bad that happened in New Orleans.

The reality is that prepositioning massive amounts of food, water and equipment would be prohibitively expensive, wasteful, and inefficient. Besides it deterioriates and moving it on a massive scale at once would be a logistical nightmare.

We really can’t continue to be passive and expect Brownie or somebody like him to save us. Expectations for FEMA past, present or future are unrealistic. FEMA’s mission statement should never assume first responder responsibilities.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 11:25 AM | Link to this

Funny how Brownie was perfectly competent in his handling of many other storms in FL and elsewhere. Funny how it was just when he encountered the poisonous, incompetent corrupt leftist racebaiters and Bush haters in NO and LA who refused federal aid before the storm, refused to evacuate properly, then refused food and water etc for the NO Dome after the storm that things went south.

Schoolbus Nagin can keep his corrupt chocolate city, hopefully it will never be properly rebuilt and repopulated and the refunding game that’s being played here will just quietly peter out. Happily the corrupt demoncrats in LA dont have sufficient political clout to make the rest of us pay for their initial ludicrous demands which have now been very quietly rolled back.

Exactly why the hell taxpayers should have to foot a bill for corrupt black/liberal incompetence christ only knows!! The racist Nagin injected race into this at the first opportunity and hasn’t really stopped.

It magically sums up local blacks that they switched from a white liberal candidate to a black one for mayor - racial spoils votes are obviously alive and well in NO. The fool Nagin was voted in by whites last time - this time it was blacks who reelected his cowardly hide out in a luxuryhotelarse when the looting was going on. Then he went and bought a house - in Houston wasn’t it??

The racebaiting media LAUGHABLY and systematically still sickeningly tells us that its anti-black racism that’s at the root of all NO problems. NOT the black gangs, welfare fraud, the carjackings, the HUGE MURDER RATE and violent drug crime, the illegitimacy rate, the illiteracy rate, the endemic local corruption etc - in a city that was overwhelmingly black run by black democrats!! And this was all BEFORE Katrina!!!

Yet it was overwhelmingly ordinary whites that for days rescued stranded blacks, volunteering in their hundreds to help out along with the coastguard and other authorities. Whilst armed black gangs looted the drier parts of the city at night - gangs from Mepmhis, FL and other urban centres actually drove down there for easy pickings. And corrupt local cops stole cars and robbed stores.

And the lies about rape and murder in the Dome were peddled by the unthinking, factually wrong liberal media anxious to smear ordinary black folks and over dramatise a serious sitaution when thousands of (mainly black) folks were simply trying to save their lives when their mayor and their governor did sod all to help them - other than blame Bush - for several days!!!

Let us NOT forget the actual truth of what happened and why!!

By Van

August 28, 2006 11:34 AM | Link to this

2nd String, or should I say getabrain.

As everyone knows, katrina hit Florida as a cat 1 storm, unless you want to correct the National Weather service?.

0 GMT 08/26/05 25.9N 80.3W 80 983 Category 1 Hurricane

6 GMT 08/26/05 25.4N 81.3W 75 987 Category 1 Hurricane

12 GMT 08/26/05 25.1N 82.0W 85 979 Category 1 Hurricane

I guess you are right and everyone else is wrong.

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 11:47 AM | Link to this

@time for the truth

It is funny that you would use all this time and effort to obfusicate. It is apparent and obvious that you are an out-of-the closet racist and want to use a plethora of lies and half-truths to distort the obvious. The leeves in New Orleans are designed, owned and maintained for the US Corps of Engineers. There is an article today in the Washington Post about how the Corps of Engineers has decided to “study the problem” in consultation with the Dutch, the acknowledged experts in this field. Holland is BELOW sea level and on the stormy and violent North Sea and they do not have a problem with flooding. The Corps of Engineers acknowledged the problem with New Orleans flooding was with the design of THEIR leevee in that it allowed the water to undermine the structure and cause the dirt and other barrier materials to fall over causing the breach. The storm caused the problem with the breach because the design was so poor. For you to say that armed black gangs from other cities roamed the streets of New Orleans exposes your obvious ignorance and racial attitudes. You sir, are one of the few low-lifes that has the courage to articulate your base human condition.

By passerby

August 28, 2006 11:56 AM | Link to this

Time for the truth is that clown from Marietta that runs the Daniel Inman Society. Don’t believe it? Go over to vdare.com. You will see him for what he is for sure.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:00 PM | Link to this

the levees in NO were frequently allocated federal and other funding for repair/strengthening … the local blacks/liberals did NOTHING with the money. The GOP had little to do wiuth running NO for many many years. IT was dem controlled -

Tell me which of my half truths re not correct!!

tlemm me which of my points are “lies”

you see you vile lefties dont lie it when somneone actually uses facts to hammer you with.

unlike the lies and half truths frequently used against BUsh!!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:00 PM | Link to this

the levees in NO were frequently allocated federal and other funding for repair/strengthening … the local blacks/liberals did NOTHING with the money. The GOP had little to do wiuth running NO for many many years. IT was dem controlled -

Tell me which of my half truths re not correct!!

tlemm me which of my points are “lies”

you see you vile lefties dont lie it when somneone actually uses facts to hammer you with.

unlike the lies and half truths frequently used against BUsh!!

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 12:01 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten,

You indicate that pre-positioning food water and other supplies would be too expensive, wasteful and ineffective when you should know that there were 11 such sites operational and ready to act in case of such disasters. FEMA and other governmental agencies had experience with other storms in Florida and they had determined this would be the way to handle these events. Secondly, the storm struck New Orleans because of the barrier islands being removed by the dredging of the river and starving the gulf of oxygen so that vegitation could grow and protect the gulf coast from such events. New Orleans is a vital area for shipping and energy transporation (pipelines), therefore, it was decided by the FEDERAL government to keep the flood waters at bay by keeping the leeves in place and dredging the shipping channels. The local and state governments have limited resources to handle events of this nature. The state National Guard is usually called to help in situations of such proportions, but, if you will remember, the Lousiana National Guard was in Iraq and the President refused to release them for duty in their own state. Tell the truth!!!!!!!!!!

By Markus

August 28, 2006 12:10 PM | Link to this

@Jackie-

First of all, TFTT just spoke the TRUTH. You are the epitome of the mindless left who calls anyone NOT OF THEIR IDEOLOGY a “racist” when bringing up FACTS. That is cowardly and yet more proof that you liberals don’t want to address problems, just pin them on others.

Second, WASHINGTON chooses to fund what projects of fhe Army Corps. Just about every congressperson calls the other contituent’s funding wishes as “pork barrel” spending, especially if said constituent is from the other party. In 2004, Dirty Harry Reid visited the levee system with Landrieu and said, “

For DECADES it was known that those levees couldn’t withstand anything more than a Cat 3. What category was Katrina days before it hit, hmmm??? What about all that federal money that was supposed to go to the levee system upgrade? Why was nearly $20m of that diverted to other local causes like Riverboat Casinos?

http://www.capoliticalnews.com/discuss.php?id=120

No, we’re not going to let you liberals get away with lies and mis-appropriating blame here. The media may, but we won’t. Oh and here’s another “race” fact for you: Houston’s crime rose 25% right after some of the Katrina evacuees were relocated there. Coincidence or the truth blinded by ignorancec of facts?

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:11 PM | Link to this

over the years the levees in NOLA were frequently allocated federal and other funding for repair/strengthening … the local blacks/liberals WHO ACTUALLY RUN NOLA did little or NOTHING to the levees with that money. The GOP have had little to do with politically running NOLA for many many years. IT was dem controlled - thus the blame at the very least lies mostly with the dems.

Tell me which of my “half truths” are not correct!!

tell me which of my points are “lies”

you see you vile lefties dont like it when someone actually uses facts to hammer you with.

unlike the lies and half truths frequently used against Bush!!

The bottom line is that many blacks stupidly refused to leave, or were simply unable to leave, and local black/liberal leaders simply left them there - and of course the poorer blacks were expecting someone to magically come save them - if they needed it.

they weren’t pushed to leave by the authorities, hundreds of UNUSED life saving school buses were ruined, except for one which I seem to recall a young black yooof took to get his family/neighbours safely out to TX.

in some places the levees were actually lower than thought as satellite pictures taken after Katrina showed that parts of NO were sinking faster than realised.

its real easy to dismiss awkward hard facts as lies/half truths - which is why the dishonest left are despised by honest folks everywhere!!

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 12:13 PM | Link to this

@time for the truth

What money was turned over to New Orleans. The leevy board can only make recommendations to the Corps, who must go to Congress to get funding for ALL Corps Projects. So your inuendo that the city or state controlled this money is not true. The rumor there was shooting at police and helicopters in New Orleans has proven to false. There is no reports filed by the military where any helicopters were hit with gunfire. The police in Gretna, LA did block the folks at the bridge from leaving evacuating because they put up a road block to keep the New Orleans resident out of “their” city. You simply pontificate without any means of substantiating your statements. If you do not tell the truth, i.e., a half-truth, are you not lying?

By Markus

August 28, 2006 12:18 PM | Link to this

Everyone who thinks cute little perkie Catie Couric will talk about all those “redneck” Missippians, West Alabamians, and non-New Orleans residents who are still living in cramped FEMA trailers without A/C and using public restroom/shower facilities all raise your hands at once! Don’t forget to keep in mind all those N.O. Katrina evacuees who are still milking the government teet in posh hotels, no jobs, and blown $2,000 debit cards on booze, strip clubs, and Gucci handbags.

By Liberal

August 28, 2006 12:19 PM | Link to this

I’m sick of the politicizing of this tragedy! Why do people try so hard to defend the people they vote for in the midst of incomprehensible incompetence. The whole system failed from the top down. The local and state governments could not put there differences aside and evacuate people in a timely matter. The local authorities were overwhelmed after the hurricane struck and the federal government, Bush included, was totally incompetent in their late arrival…after 6 days!

Some people like to comment on looting and violence, but instead I saw an old man going into insulin shock. I saw numerous dead bodies lying in the streets. I saw children sleeping on freeways in the hot sunlight. I saw people trapped on their roofs. I heard of reports of hospitals left in distress. Don’t castigate a whole group of people for the actions of a few!

The government failed! And it failed because it was set up to fail! FEMA is marginalized as a result of the Patriot Act and we all know how disfunctional the state of Louisiana is. Tragedies like Katrina should not happen in the USA! It was pathetic, dispicable, and criminal!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:21 PM | Link to this

same for you passerby … you’re another moronic lefty LIAR who denies actual facts. YOU failed as usual to address any of my points - you just proffered a poisonous race baiting sneer.

The media has racebaited this all abouit anti-balck racism all around the world, but it was black/liberal leaders who left their fellow blacks, and anyone else including disabled home residents and hospital patients not able to get out to drown or at worst to fend for themselves.

WHAT DO YOU THINK WOULD HAVE BEEN THE HYSTERICAL MEDIA OUTCRY IF THE EXACT SAME SCENARIO HAD UNFOLDED AND IT HAD BEEN A WHITE MAYOR OF NOLA??

By Van

August 28, 2006 12:22 PM | Link to this

Jackie,

While the Corps has responsibility of the leeves, the local parishins have final say. Each parish has a leeve board that controls that portion of the leeve.

By Redstate Trash

August 28, 2006 12:23 PM | Link to this

$2000?? $2000??

That’s more money than this white man has ever seen - wee doggies!

Markus and me are jellus.

By Markus

August 28, 2006 12:25 PM | Link to this

@Jackie-

“There is no reports filed by the military where any helicopters were hit with gunfire”

That’s because the punk thugs were TOO STUPID TO HIT THEM. Holding those pistols sideways may look cool, but it sure ain’t accurate. And reporters THEMSELVES reported all KINDS of gunfire. For you to deny even THAT is all we need to know where your mindset comes from, which is to say not very far from dimentia. The mind… a terrible thing to waste under liberalism.

By Missy Rottweiler

August 28, 2006 12:26 PM | Link to this

Nature abhors a vacuum. New Orleans is like a vacuum in that being below sea level nature will want to reclaim what is its own. Instead the city should be moved further inland. Otherwise the increased number of storms caused by globabl warming, as well as the rising tides induced by melting ice gaps and glaciers, will ultimately swamp the city. Higher levees will only trap the already imprisoned poor and cause more death. End criminal wars and put America’s resources to work for the victims of Bush/Cheney’s racism and greed.

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 12:26 PM | Link to this

@Markus

If I am a leftie, that makes you what? Where have you neo-facists spoken about anything that remotely speaks to the truth? The problem is the repairing the leeves. I suppose you don’t realize the money being spent on the leevy system is spent by the Corps. Any other money that goes to other projects, be they gambling casinos or other items, are not a part of the Corps mission and spending. Apparently, you do not understand what the Corps of Engineers does and what the mission of the organization is. The Corps of Engineers is a FEDERAL agency that oversees many FEDERAL projects throughout the country. The are responsible for all major waterway projects in this country. Speak to that truth and find a “liberal” slant to that!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:28 PM | Link to this

tell it to to CNN, BBC MSNBC the NYT and the rest liberal …

its an inconvenient truth that it was a black dem mayor and a white dem gov that were primarily responsible for this debacle - more through incompetentce and non existent planning. the feds were slow because they weren’t allowed in before the storm hit and the chaos afterweards everyone knows

buit it wasn’t white criminals doing the looting etc … was it??

you complain about the politicising of this - but why do you think that dem “lies and half truths” about Bush have become the international stereotype about Katrina???

wholly … because of liberal media racebaiting and dem partisanship!!

By Redstate Trash

August 28, 2006 12:29 PM | Link to this

Click on this to read more on TFTT and Markus’s Katrina theeries

By I farted after Katrina

August 28, 2006 12:31 PM | Link to this

“Bush’s “performance” in the news conference was so unbalanced and over-the-top that not only his intelligence should be questioned — as even Joe Scarborough managed to do — but his mental stability should be topic number one on the talk shows.

Adding fuel to that last point was an item in U.S. News and World Report, largely ignored by the mainstream press, that Bush loves to amuse himself by openly passing gas in front of White House aides. They said, “He’s also known to cut a few for laughs, especially when greeting new young aides.” Is this what Republicans mean when they claim Bush brought back “honor and dignity” to the White House?

“Farting” for fun to humiliate new young White House staffers isn’t just passing gas, it’s a downright disgrace to the American people and to the White House.”

By Liberal

August 28, 2006 12:31 PM | Link to this

I haven’t mentioned one word about race in my posts and frankly I could give a damn. Nor could I give a damn about party affiliations. It was a tragedy of epoch proportions fueled by government incompetence. There is absolutely no excuse for the neglect of New Orleans…none whatsoever. Bush messed up, Blanco messed up, and Nagin messed up. I don’t pay my taxes to watch people dying in the streets like dogs.

By Janine

August 28, 2006 12:34 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten…re your 11:22 post… Are you saying that Local gov’t SHOuLD be the first responder, state should be 2nd, and FEMA should be 3rd? Or are you saying that is present stated order of response?
In looking at info on the website and on the website for Homeland Security under which FEMA now functions, it does not appear to be that way. “We will lead the unified national effort to secure America. We will prevent and deter terrorist attacks and protect against and respond to threats and hazards to the nation… and regarding response —states that DHS will: “Lead, manage and coordinate the national response to acts of terrorism, natural disasters, or other emergencies. Is there another place where the Local, State, Fema responders are listed in order of response?

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 12:35 PM | Link to this

@Van,

The local leeve boards can only make RECOMMENDATIONS to the Corps as to what they want completed. The locals told stories of how the 17th street leevy had been leaking for years and the Corps of Engineers came in a put more dirt in the hole, for it to begin leaking almost immediately. The city of New Orleans is sinking because the water table has been diminished because of the routing of the river away from it’s “natural” course and the ability of the river to deposit silt and keep the water table replenished. New Orleans did not have this problem years ago, witnessed by the fact that folks in that city could not be buried underground because the water table was so high.

By Repubs Lie

August 28, 2006 12:36 PM | Link to this

Repubs lie, people die.

Whether its in the middle east or here in the homeland, makes no difference to them!!!!

As long as the record oil company profits continue its good times for Bush and his rich base.

Dont get me started on 9/11 either. You’ll be sorry.

By Michael Silly Savage

August 28, 2006 12:37 PM | Link to this

I farted, I always wondered how Bush met Rove - and where all the obvious physical chemistry comes from…

As a leading San Francisco conservative, I imagine Bush’s farting is just a way to see if the interns and junior staffers might enjoy a “special relationship with the President”. I use the technique in interviewing staff for my show.

By Markus

August 28, 2006 12:40 PM | Link to this

@Jackie-

You need to get out and read more beyond the New York Slimes and Washington ComPost, Jackie. It is a FACT that Corps. funding was DIVERTED in Louisiana by the New Orleans Levee Board. If you want to be an ignoramus liberal, that’s your problem. But if you want to come on this blog and pontificate BS, that’s OUR problem.

Read it and weep, bedwetter.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9342186/

By Realist

August 28, 2006 12:40 PM | Link to this

Jackie Brown, I think you must have been asleep during the Katrina disaster or else you dont own a TV. I dont need military reports to tell me something happened, i saw it with my own eyes. A Bell Jet Ranger (helicopter) was attempting to land with a load of bottled water, and started to take small arms fire from group of 4-5 black men, so the pilot abandoned the landing and took off. It was caputured on camera. Dont need a military report to tell me what I saw.

TFTT’s post at 11:25 is dead on balls accurate. The most pathetic part is, the “citizens” of the most devastated part of NO, aka 9th ward, are now no where to be found during the rebuilding. There are jobs o plenty, and nobody to fill them. I suppose thats the fault of Bush and Brown and FEMA too.

Go sell your racist blame game somewhere else, because just like a Katrina victim, it aint working.

By Rockey

August 28, 2006 12:42 PM | Link to this

“I wanted to thank President Bush for the millions of FEMA trailers that were brought down there. They gave roofs over people’s head. People had the chance to have baths, air condition. We have TV, we have toiletry, we have things that are necessities that we can live upon.

But now, I wanted to remind the President that the job’s not done, and he knows that. And I just don’t want the government and President Bush to forget about us. And I just wish the President could have another term in Washington.

This guy is a symbol of the misery that so many people in Louisiana and Mississippi? This couldn’t have been more of home run for Bush if the whole thing had been set up by Karl Rove.

Why did anyone think Bush would be “too busy” to meet with the only guy in Louisiana who thought it was a great move for Bush to ignore them for five days while they drowned?”

By Monarch Hames

August 28, 2006 12:42 PM | Link to this

So the same Dutch boy who first brought slaves to this country will now be building the levees that are supposed to protect the children of those slaves but we know won’t.

By Sexione

August 28, 2006 12:44 PM | Link to this

The dependent are encouraged to find jobs and stay where they fled.

I DISAGREE COMPLETELY!!!!!!! The dependent NEED to take their butts back home to NO (or wherever you came from). Everything is already over-crowded in many states (esp. GA). Go home, claim yours (land, house, etc.), help to rebuild your city, and stand strong!!!!

By Markus is an idiot

August 28, 2006 12:45 PM | Link to this

“Excerpt: This was getting down to the primal underpinnings of the 2003 invasion. According to Paul Roberts in his 2004 book The End of Oil, Cheney and his task-force colleagues:

pored over maps of Iraqi oilfields to estimate how much Iraqi oil might be dumped quickly on the [post-invasion] market. Before the war, Iraq had been producing 3.5 million barrels a day, and many in the industry and the administration believed that the volume could easily be increased to 7 million by 2010. If so-and if Iraq [under U.S. control] could be convinced to ignore its OPEC quota and start producing at maximum capacity-the flood of new oil would effectively end OPEC’s ability to control prices.

The Anglo-American firms, in turn, would be in the catbird’s seat.

If Bush & Blair did act substantially for oil-and that seems highly likely-then it is fair to judge the Iraqi failure by oil-policy yardsticks and outcomes. The quick summation, obviously, is that whereas oil was selling at roughly $30 a barrel in 2002, by late 2004 it cost $40 per barrel. By the time the operation was marking its third anniversary this spring, petroleum was flirting with $75 a barrel..”

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 12:46 PM | Link to this

Anny Wooten tries to obfuscate and distract - but here is the order government should respond to a large hurricane tracking towards a major metropolitan area:

First - city and local and state and federal.

Second - given the state of the American economy and public infrastructure - the UN, Venezuela, Saudia Arabia, Mexico and Cuba should be contacted and asked for financial aid and personnel.

Let’s face it - if we’re not third world yet we will be soon.

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 12:48 PM | Link to this

@Markus,

Again, it shows how you are using half-truths to make your point. Make a lot of noise and expect that wheel to get greased; what a concept. The argument has not merit because you can not substantiate any of it!!!!!!!! As for my mindset, I want the problem resolved. If you were paying attention, you would be up in arms about the Bush proposal to bring the National Guard under Federal control. Does it not violate the Second Amendment to the Constitution? Where you at Markus?

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 12:48 PM | Link to this

jackie

your post was moronic …

after Katrina there were endless discussions in TV studios by politicians about this - millions of funds over the years were allocated for the levees - much of it was corruptly used for local dem politics, even local dem politicians grudgingly accepted this … do the research yourself - I could care less if you believe me or not.

I note you dont challenge the more awkward points

the shooting at choppers was a very minor thing -and had not much affect overall, the media lies about rape and murder in the dome was not inconsequential -

the red cross and fema were prevented from going into NOLA by state officials, BEFORE the storm, dozens of buses were ready and turnd back at one point … and keeping the thugs and killers out of other areas was a sensible thing, it was chaos

see what happened in Houston afterwards to crime/murder with thugs —- the huge racial tension amongst blacks from TX and LA in schools - all this with no hurricane damage!! … I saw a local NOLA parish sherriff the other night saying that his murder rate had more than doubled because of black thugs from NOLA … its black on black crime that is the problem … not white on black!!

only a moron would make such an obtuse simpleton point about the corps of engineers - so what!!

the local blacks/liberal leaders had decades to ensure the levees and other defences were strengthened/repaired/built up etc and they did little or nothing!!

the corps do what they’re told to - or what obviously needs doing!!

its local failure!!

By mo

August 28, 2006 12:52 PM | Link to this

Ok, if I was to run New Orleans:

First off, I would totally impress the federal government to improve the levee situation. The Army Corps of Engineers should get a handle on it and fast.

Next, I will improve and press upon local government to have an effective policy on evacuation with no shelters of last resort.

Also I would impress the state and federal governments to fund loans for rebuilding homes and businesses. Also we should make it easy for entreprenuers to get funding for businesses, especially minorities.

As for education, I would ask for state funding to rebuild the schools.

And I will hold the state and local governments responsible under criminal negligence if there’s another hurricane and the evacuation plans are not adhere to in the strictest of fashions.

Oh, and as far as the whole black/white issue is concerned, I’ll leave that to the racists… too many of both races were killed to even start talk about that.

BTW- remember the most racist thing I’ve ever heard in the media was that some black men were raping 7-year old girls in the Superdome. That junk was simply not true, and it just shows just how low the media thinks of us.

By getalife

August 28, 2006 12:53 PM | Link to this

I told you Markus is an idiot.

Once again, Wooten diverts the buck away from w.

The buck stops with the President Wooten, no matter how much you try to ignore it. Fema and the DHS should be eliminated.

By the curse

August 28, 2006 12:56 PM | Link to this

I have to say that Realist and Markus are very absorbing today. They seem to be spot on a very heavy flow of ideas. They both come across as real string pullers. I dont mean to make them sound like twin tampons, thereby staining their reputations, rather I think they insert themselves nicely into the fold, without pushing themselves too far into the seams of the top leggings of their Bush supports.
I’m impressed, but will avoid any intercourse with their cylindrical logic.

By Liberal

August 28, 2006 12:56 PM | Link to this

Mo, I’ll be your campaign manager.

I would also petition the president as well as Congress to restructure FEMA in order to give them more control in crises as well as for them to be more efficient.

By James

August 28, 2006 12:58 PM | Link to this

Joined the conversation late and I don’t want to read all the past comments. Jim, you are correct in stating that New Orleans should not be rebuilt. Its an engineering disaster that started when the French diverted the Mississippi River. Engineering drained the wetlands and caused the “sinking” of the city that is ongoing.

But if it must be rebuilt then I suggest thinking big and rejecting short-term solutions. Orleans Parish will need to upgrade its pumps, move them to Lake Pontchartrain and close off the canals that failed. Neighboring Jefferson Parish, with similar geography, built its pumps along the lake levee with no canal openings and survived the storm with minimal flood damage. Placing flood gates across the Industrial Canal connection to Lake Pontchartrain and the Mississippi River Gulf Outlet, a 76-mile, man-made shipping channel that provides a short cut from the Gulf of Mexico to the Port of New Orleans. It is believed that the Industrial Canal and the MRGO funneled the storm surge that overwhelmed levee systems east of New Orleans.

An Engineer’s perspective.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 01:00 PM | Link to this

The Katrina disaster is what happens when your government values ideology more than competence.

Notice how happy the usual suspects here are with 1300+ dead from the widespread incompetence of Army Corps of Engineers and FEMA, especially since so many of the victims weren’t Caucasians.

To the neo-kkkon, the death of these people is their fault, social Darwinism run riot.

This is from the same people who, if it weren’t for the largesse of northern taxpayers and FDR, wouldn’t have indoor toilets or electricity in their homes.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:00 PM | Link to this

the non existent “racism” perceptions/lies came from the fact that it was OVERWHELMINGLY blacks who were filmed being rescued and leftie media types used these images to perpetrate the despicable convenient lie that it was all anti-black discrimination, mixing it in with stats about self inflicted black poverty etc.

if this had happened in a major white city it would have been constant footage of whites being rescued and no one could have warped the perceptions!!

By edge770

August 28, 2006 01:05 PM | Link to this

Simple fix to New Orleans, don’t fix, the area is a continuous wetland that has no business being a major metro city. This is not being mean, racist or insensitive. I would give everyone 3 years to leave, and if you do stay, required to sign a waiver that insurance or feds don’t pick up tab. Get over it folks, New Orleans is gone.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 01:06 PM | Link to this

Mark this down as a red letter day - I agree with TFTT’s 12:48 post. Well, portions of it, but essentially, tftt has an excellent point.

By James

August 28, 2006 01:07 PM | Link to this

TFTT,

I really don’t like arguing someones opinions but to put this in Black/liberal poilticians is idiotic. Fact: Federalism begs the question of who does what, who pays for what and who delivers what service or program. It involves power and legal authority in our federalist system. In the disaster-relief area, we have a shared responsibility between city, state and national governments. You overlay who is responsible for what with the Civil War legacy in the South of deference to state and local sovereignty plus Lousiana’s colorful and arcane political structures, and you have big disaster problems. Show me a local government in the south that wasn’t corrupt before black elected officials! I’m white, and tired of the spin.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 01:08 PM | Link to this

Easy loans are available for home ownership and for start-up businesses, but to prepare purchasers faith-based organizations are invited in droves to provide counseling, training and support.

Oh - Anny - I don’t think either of these are good ideas - easy loans to rednecks? Kiss that money goodbye - it’ll end up in the casinos in Biloxi or the pockets of whores in Tunica.

Money to faith-based organizations?? Are you kidding? Evangelical and fundamentalist preachers are nothing but ignorant conmen who can’t run their own lives - why would we want to make them counselors - it would be like making John Mark Karr a parenting coach. We’d be better off just burning the money.

By getalife

August 28, 2006 01:09 PM | Link to this

If you have to get 5 different divisions in a department to sign off on anything, it will not get done.

They must deregulate during a disaster to avoid the bureaucracy to get something done or tranfer the responsilitry to state or local governments with quick response teams.

By RWH

August 28, 2006 01:11 PM | Link to this

AS of this writing. As Mayor, I would now focus on the poor-areas that’s not being touch and figure out how to bring these area back but with a whole new outlook. I would seek the best ways to instill the type of engineering that would sustain the homes and the complex that would be structure especially in the low-income-areas. This is where most of the people are and where most of them left or died. My goals is not to seek the best for a few, but to seek the best for all of New Orleans for the future ahead. The only way you can seek the best is by actually seeing what would it take with the budget you have and the type of advice pose by those who know how to build quality verse building a lot more only to be destroyed with little or no force.

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 01:14 PM | Link to this

@time for the truth

It is apparent that you choose not to evaluate and understand the information presented in newspapers, tv reports and government findings. You indicate that the locals prevented help from coming into the city. If you remember, you can remember that far back, the aid from private individuals, Wal-Mart and other businesses was stopped from bringing in food, water and transportation by the Federal government. It was reported and acknowledged that the President wanted to control the situation by using Federal troops and having the Gov. Blanco to turn over control to him. When she refused, he essentially told her, “you are own your own.” Have you ever asked yourself, why did they military require men to go to one part of the facility, women to other and children to other? why were residents of the city moved all over the country when there were several closed military bases in Northern Lousiana and Arkansas? Even the Senators and Rep. from Mississippi were complaining about how little was done to help the people of New Orleans. I bet you did not know that 95% of folks in Saint Bernard’s parish were white and 80% of the homes in that parish were destroyed.
They were not moved and dispersed, yet, they suffered just as much damage as New Orleans.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:15 PM | Link to this

James

“colorful and arcane political structures” DUH!!!

you mean DEMOCRAT (mostly) black corruption at local level and (mostly) white corruption at state level

the lefty and black politicos and media has put this in a rarely challenged white racism against blacks “box” for a year now!!

that’s why I simply mirror it back … its alright for them to assert and insinuate white racial bias - but when I use facts to back up what a liberal media lie this is you and your liberal ilk get all uppity!!

I am sick of the spin too - but its NOT the GOP doing it!!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:20 PM | Link to this

I see rednekkks is still incapable of objective discussion - and just spews more of its filth … “To the neo-kkkon, the death of these people is their fault, social Darwinism run riot”.

you’re hilarious rednekkks - just a walking - well knuckle dragging, flatulating dishonest plebian.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 01:20 PM | Link to this

Let’s face it - most of the neo-kkkons here would have been happier if even more people in NO had died.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:23 PM | Link to this

its a damn shame you weren’t down there rednekkks!!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:24 PM | Link to this

I would have happily volunteered to save you in a chopper and then kept hilariously dropping you back into the water!!!

By Hadden Knough

August 28, 2006 01:26 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten - Your proposal sounded good until I go to where, “The dependent are encouraged to find jobs and stay where they fled” part. Why are those who fled now the problem of whatever location they were in when they decided to stop fleeing? We already have a whole nation, a/k/a Mexico, encouraging their poor to flee northward and and not bother to come back (but get a job and send home the cash). How much more are we expected to put up with?

By James

August 28, 2006 01:27 PM | Link to this

TFTT,

Ok…I will not argue your opinion or anybody’s on this topic. I can only argue on the rebuilding issues from an engineering and factual basis.

Fact: Flooding of New Orleans can only be blamed on the engineers including the corp responsible for diverting the Mississippi river and destroying Southern LA’s natural flood protection, the wetlands.

Opinion: In order to rebuild, I believe that we must model the city’s levee system after the Dutch engineers system in Amsterdam.

Having an idiot black mayor elected by wealthy liberals or having an idiot President that can’t string a complete sentence together doesn’t matter in the design phase for engineers. We only want our projects built as designed.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 01:27 PM | Link to this

tftt, you can’t even drive a car - how are you going to learn to fly a helicopter?

huge smirk

By Freudian Slips

August 28, 2006 01:28 PM | Link to this

If anyone made any sense out of timeforthetooth’s 1:15 post please tell guys in white suits to pick you up along with him. If there was any doubt that this poor sod is totally insane, then read the babbling in his last post. The dittoheadwounds really ARE out of material, and out of spokemen (who aren’t lunatics or mad).

By Van

August 28, 2006 01:29 PM | Link to this

James,

The flooding of New Orleans did not come from the Mississppi River, the dikes and leeves on the River side held and prevented major flooding of the southern part of New Orleans.

By Retroactive Flashback

August 28, 2006 01:32 PM | Link to this

Y-Y-Yeah, how is T-t-t-f going to f-f-fly a h-h-helicopter????

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:34 PM | Link to this

DAMN!!! THAT SURE WAS FUN

what topic do we slap the lefties around on next? …. GARGANTUAN SMIRK

By James

August 28, 2006 01:35 PM | Link to this

Van,

Thank you for your ignorance, I will explanin. The seeds of much of the problem were sown in the 18th century when French settlers first began to develop the New Orleans area, then largely a cypress swamp. They diverted the Mississippi River to create land for growing rice and raising cattle. When river flooding became especially bad in the early 19th century, they went on a levee-building spree, . New Orleans has always presented significant problems having to do with site and having to do with acts of man and acts of nature.

Centuries of development, erosion (from the diverted Mississippi river)of barrier islands and coastal wetlands and ongoing construction of additional levees left the region vulnerable.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:39 PM | Link to this

rednekks vermin - I have run you over five times in my car now. The Cobb County cops have given me a citation for safe, courteous driving on three of those occasions! Hell even your ambulance chasing lawyer keeps giving me your daily welfare cheque cashing routine do I can keep finding you!!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 01:41 PM | Link to this

Hell even your ambulance chasing lawyer keeps giving me your daily welfare cheque cashing routine SO THAT I can KEEP the public service going finding you on Bankhead Hwy!!

By James

August 28, 2006 01:42 PM | Link to this

The science of living more sustainably on the Mississippi Delta is actually quite well developed. The mechanisms that were causing erosion of wetlands and coastal islands are understood, and can be reversed. The task involves rethinking the management of the entire river system. It involves restoring wetlands, the “land” part of which were being erased by lack of sedimentation from above, and getting sucked down under the water level from below, by subsidence caused by oil removal. It involves letting the river rebuild the intricate network of coastal islands and shoals that buffer the region from storm surges. It’s about learning to work with the natural features of Southeastern Lousiana, rather than continuously fighting a pitched battle against them, or attempting to bend them to the will of vested economic interests.

By Darwin

August 28, 2006 01:42 PM | Link to this

I don’t understand why everybody is getting thier knickers in a bunch over this Katrina thing. It’s called natural selection people. It’s mother nature thinning out the herd. There is no way to avoid it. You can do as Jackie and others would have you do and throw billions of federal dollars at it, or you can do as egghead history teacher/engineer James would have you do and build some goliath moat or levee system, but at the end of the day, you can’t fool mother nature!

By getalife

August 28, 2006 01:43 PM | Link to this

One Year Later:

One year later, hundreds of thousands of families from New Orleans and the Gulf are still without jobs and unable to return to their homes.

One year later, the administration has used less than half of the $110 billion in federal aid approved by Congress to help people rebuild their lives.

One year later, families in New Orleans are still waiting for trailers to live in and for demolition and clean up crews to clear their neighborhoods so they can rebuild their homes.

One year later, half of the city’s hospitals remain closed and less than half of the New Orleans public schools plan to reopen this fall.

One year later, the levees are no safer than the day Katrina hit.

By Cletus Snow

August 28, 2006 01:44 PM | Link to this

It seems really strange to me that all of these self proclaimed experts have not availed their services to the people of New Orleans,who could use the assistance.HOW ABOUT A LOT LESS TALK AND A LITTLE MORE ACTION. Guys we don’t need talkers we need DOers.Most of you armchair quarterbacks are so full of bovine excretement that you don’t even know it when you read it.

By TFTT's Mother

August 28, 2006 01:48 PM | Link to this

Please pardon my son Stephen (you know him as “time for the truth” for his somewhat irrational statements.) He has been unhinged ever since a little Jamaican girl, the foster daughter of a liberal MP here in England, pummeled him during the second year of his educational experience. Since that time, he has harboured an animus toward people of colour, members of the political left wing, and females. His father and I have sought counseling for him, but to no avail. I know you will be charitable in forming your opinion of him.

By getalife

August 28, 2006 01:48 PM | Link to this

W’s priority is in Iraq:

Iraq pumped 3.5M barrels daily before Bush invaded and then they got their 2003 Halliburton upgrade

Bush’s oil gouge, which is going to $100a barrel makes $350,000,000Bush will steal every day.

No wonder they were so eager to start a war,

stealing $350,000,000every day.

It’s the biggest theft in Earth’s history and it conitues every day while soldiers die.

Bush’s “Bring ‘em on” death taunt is up to…

2615….2619 American victims

Four more dead since yesterday. If we “stay the course,” that’s another 1500 dead each year.

By Van

August 28, 2006 01:54 PM | Link to this

James,

I guess the storm surge into Lake Pontchartrain had little to do with the leeve failures, and over dredging of the 17th St. Cannal did not weaken the leeves there.

By Redstaters R Retards

August 28, 2006 01:58 PM | Link to this

Click on this - One reason Markus isn’t a Democrat

By getalife

August 28, 2006 02:02 PM | Link to this

Hey, I found Markus

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 02:04 PM | Link to this

tftt’s mother - when that chimp raped you, you should have an abortion, and spared the world your son.

Giving birth to an anomaly like tftt and then not strangling it in it’s crib is a crime against nature. Shame on you. You will definitely slow roast in hell.

By Van

August 28, 2006 02:05 PM | Link to this

James,

In 1998, Louisiana started a $14 billion Coast 2050, a 60-project program that rivaled the Everglades restoration in scope.

Since 1990, the Corps has initiated dozens of such projects, although their scope and impact remain small when compared with the natural processes of the river. Kerry St. Pé, director of the Barataria-Terrebonne National Estuary Program, advocates 36-in. pipelines to carry 70 million cubic yards of dredged silt annually from the Mississippi west to vanishing wetlands.

I guess you missed the news

By James

August 28, 2006 02:06 PM | Link to this

Where’s KP, or White Jesus….and my other engineers that can explain this better to Van, Darwin and others. I’m too much of an egghead I guess. You watch too much Fox…turn on PBS and Discovery…Extreme Engineering or Building the Ultimate is an excellent show for the non-egg headed too.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 02:17 PM | Link to this

The weekend column was about building more nuclear power plants - interesting that today we are talking about the failure of levees - if this country can’t even build dams and levees that work, should we be engaging in building more nuclear power plants??

By KP

August 28, 2006 02:20 PM | Link to this

James,

My thoughts are that any are now arguing for a multi–billion-dollar program to rebuild the wetlands of coastal Louisiana. After Katrina, the argument (your company! I should say the name..hehehe) has focused on the potential storm protection afforded by the wetlands. I believe that restoring Louisiana’s wetlands is an admirable goal. The delta region is critical habitat and a national treasure. But we should never pretend that rebuilding the wetlands will protect coastal communities or make New Orleans any safer. Even with the wetlands, southern Louisiana will remain what it has always been: extremely vulnerable to natural hazards. No engineering can counteract the fact that global sea level is rising and that we have entered a period of more frequent and more powerful storms. Implying, as some have, that environmental restoration can allow communities to remain in vulnerable low-lying areas is irresponsible. Yes, let’s restore as much of coastal Louisiana as we can afford to, but let’s do it to regain lost habitat and fisheries, not for storm protection.

By KP

August 28, 2006 02:22 PM | Link to this

Now back to work James!

By James

August 28, 2006 02:24 PM | Link to this

KP, I called you to back me up..not rationalize my suggestion!! Adios people

By b. white

August 28, 2006 02:29 PM | Link to this

The mayor of New Orleans commented that he had to contact each home owner before clean-up could begin. I say clean it up anyway because it is condemned, not fit for habitation. Taxes must be paid on property; if taxes are not paid then a public auction results. Clean the ninth ward up and the tax season should resolve owner issue. Then let the new owner decide what to do with the property.

By @@

August 28, 2006 02:32 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten:

I stopped back by to drop this off.

Nobody can claim this as a biased source. It’s March 2006, but the delay is today’s topic. It does give page by page insight. Maybe there are those who would enjoy.

There’s been some good discussion I see, and then there’s been the usual ridiculous and off-topic comments.

You need a blog called “Wooten’s Woodshed.”

By @@

August 28, 2006 02:34 PM | Link to this

Mr. Wooten:

Better yet…call it “Wooten’s Deadwood Shed.”

Bye.

By Van

August 28, 2006 02:35 PM | Link to this

@@,

I agree, but since it counters many of the medias talking points, it will not be well received by the lefties.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 02:44 PM | Link to this

I see rednekkk vermin is still smarting about yesterday when I exposed his secret jail house tryst with his life long soulmate JM Karr.

My mother rednekkks vermin, like Markus’ father, who you also had an equally nasty sneer at the other day, died a number of years ago.

If this clearly pretty sick post about my mother is supposed to rile me rednekkks you are sadly mistaken.

I enjoy abjectly humiliating you on here with sardonic wit and erudition rednekkks, because you always descend to this level - you simply cannot help yourself. Getting you to do so is actually half the fun. The fact that you are now so frequently compelled to resort to this level shows how utterly empty and bilious you are.

I used to (briefly) pity you - now I just see you as a caged (in its own mind) defanged, intermittently rabid poisonous snake to verbally toy with with a big cyber shovel and excoriate as when the mood and need arises!!

By Dana

August 28, 2006 02:45 PM | Link to this

What a load of crap! You have an engineer in here who tells you what will work from an engineering standpoint, and you blow him out because he isn’t a conservative engineer. I’m pretty sure you don’t have an engineering degree, and reading articles certainly doesn’t qualify you as an expert on any subject!!!

By Van

August 28, 2006 03:02 PM | Link to this

Dana ,

Good engineers can have diffent opinions also. When looking at possibilities for reducing future disasters would it not be prudent to look at many sources?

Or would you prefer a less tolerant and diverse thinking.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 03:14 PM | Link to this

lol… I prefer open and diverse thinking Van, I suspect you are quite well aware of that.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 03:19 PM | Link to this

HOWEVER, my preference for open and diverse thought has nothing to do with the habit many posters have of implying knowledge and understanding as a basis for their opinions. Not for a moment do I deny anyone an opinion, however the knowledge to back one tends to trump supposition. That said - I am really going to feel like an idiot if you reveal an engineering degree….

By Susan

August 28, 2006 03:21 PM | Link to this

Jim: Shame on you for a blog that permits posters to display the very worst of mankind. When 911 occurred we were driving the streets with American flags and bumper stickers that read: “United We Stand” Now it’s “wipe them off the earth”. There is more than enough blame to go around as far as Katrina goes. But do the people of N.O. deserve this vitriol - absolutely not. I would like a response from you on the order of: Jim - explain to your readers what Atlanta’s plan is for handling a disaster. We have had difficulty managing “Freaknic” and snow jams.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:25 PM | Link to this

to the extrachromosomed coward who lamely attempts to smear me on racial matters using my “mother” as its chosen foil.

have the guts to actually post your factual challenges to my earlier posts - especially the initial longer one on the aftermath of Katrina.

all I’ve seen so far is some wanker bleating inanely about helicopters. and several moronic blanket denials about widely acknowledged corruption by blacks and whites in NOLA.

All I have done today is post awkward facts about the undeniable behaviour/attitude of certain black politicians and criminal types in and around the Big Easy. In the context of a still very racially atmosphere.

What is deeply nauseating is the implict ‘assertion’ that I (nor any white person seemingly) am not allowed to do this. Despite a year long of lefty media and black activist racebaiting, framing the after math of Katrina as white American racist indifference to (poor) blacks.

It is this blatant racial double standrad that is most troubling. I refuse to EVER kow tow to such racist hypcorisy.

Tell me why it is I am NOT ‘allowed’ to simply state facts - not stereotypes, which seesm to be the usual dishonest liberal ploy on here - but FACTS - without having several liberal vermin crying their eyes out and robotically and emptily screeching racism.

It is NOT racism to point out what happened and the liberal/racial distortions perprated and still being perpetrated by Bush hating black activists and liberals.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:28 PM | Link to this

All I have done today is post awkward facts about the undeniable behaviour/attitude of certain black politicians and criminal types in and around the Big Easy. In the context of a still very racially charged atmosphere, still being fed by the media!!

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 03:31 PM | Link to this

@susan

Those neo-facists HAVE NO SHAME!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:33 PM | Link to this

these imbecilic snivelling lefty cowards have NO BRAINS!!!

By Van

August 28, 2006 03:40 PM | Link to this

Dana ,

Not having an engineering degree, and reading different opinions on this subject, from what the Corps has tried to do in the past and what the state has tried in the past, I tend to wonder, who has the right answer.

Therefore, as a person that takes everything with a grain of salt, and without regard of politics, in these types of matter, I would tend to give the Corps the benefit of the doubt. While, James, may be a grand fluid engineer or evironmental engineer, the Army Corps of Engineers has a long history of being the ones to handle the complicated problems.

Did you ever wonder why the storm drains in Los Angeles are shaped as they were? They were also designed to be an evacuation route out of the city, back during the cold war.

As I said before, based on what I have read, there is not a single agreed upon solutions (there maybe, but I don’t think it is widely published)for the sinking of New Orleans, for the problems of flooding in New Orleans or the best way to protect New Orleans in the future.

Until then, I will remain cautious.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 03:43 PM | Link to this

TFTT, Susan and Jackie,

It isn’t racist to point out mistakes made. It IS racist, (and incredibly unimaginitive) to state that anyone who disagrees with a position is “Bush hating black activists and liberals.”

By BIGMOE

August 28, 2006 03:43 PM | Link to this

I’m from New Orleans. You can’t blame this current government for the flooding in New Orleans. This started way back. For the past 30+ years, everyone knew that the levees were insufficient. Both parties and races that ruled New Orleans, Louisiana, and the U.S. ate away at the funding to fix the levees. The similiar may happen in the future with us putting off paying off the national debt. Our creditors may come for payment in full one day.

On the other hand, as far as some of the deaths, you can blame Nagin(I’m black criticizing Nagin) for not putting people on the buses earlier, the governor for not asking the federal government for help earlier or requesting them to be on stand by. Finally, you can’t deny that the federal government could have provided food and water sooner. It was a major cluster f#$% that we have to learn from.

I forgot the name of the country with the dams, but it they can do it, I know we can build something to put them to shame.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:44 PM | Link to this

Shame on you for a blog that permits posters to display the very worst of mankind.

what you mean like your saying “I’ll jump for joy if Israel is destroyed” (an accurate paraphrase of Nazi Susan at least).

so no nazi like hypocrisy there eh love??!!

imagine in this day and age - who would think that anyone could advocate the death of AROUND 4.5 million jews (like Iran, hizbollocks and hamas and their vile EU/US sopporters) - I mean - nothing like that has even happened before in history - has it???

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 03:44 PM | Link to this

Now tftt, I can’t respond to any factual information in your posts because there isn’t any, you little silly. smirk You drone on and on with the same nonsense every day, and every day people kick your silly little a-ss from one end of the day to the other. bigger smirk

Tell you what, tftt, all you ever post here is crap - when we see your byline, we know it’s just warmed over yesterday’s dittohead ramblings. You get the response that you deserve - ridicule and laughter.

still LOL.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:45 PM | Link to this

it isn’t just a position Dana - its a mindset!!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:50 PM | Link to this

also Dana - it is NOT racist to accuse someone being a Bush hater - however true!!

Every leftist (as if there are actually many other kinds) black activist I’ve ever encountered in the media is anti-Bush - maybe not a literal Bush hater - but its a generic term to cover varying degrees of opposition to Bush.

By Eniska Scott

August 28, 2006 03:54 PM | Link to this

Iam not a lawyer, nor am I a politician, just a hard working single mother that wants the same thing for my family that most of you do.New Orleans has been my home all of my life, and some of the comments that I have read here today break my heart.Its seems to be okay for our country to send aid to everybody all over the world, except the people that live right here in a country where they pay taxes just like anybody else.It is so easy for you all to sit at your computers and type these little nasty comments, because you haven’t lived it. How many of you actually reached out to assist someone affected by this tradegy? Until you have done your part to help your fellow man, don’t sit in judgement of others, especially when you don’t know they’re pain! Let’s not forget that you are not exempt from Nature’s wrath! Have you any idea what it feels like lose everything you spent your whole life building? Simple things like a toothbrush!So before you suggest that New Orleans not be rebuilt, you keep in mind that it could’ve been you, and would you feel that way about the only home you know? Let’s stop promoting a problem, and be a part of the solution! None of you have been chosen to sit in judgement of others, that job has already been filled, and the last time I checked there were no openings for the position of “Judge”.Furthermore, why should I expect my government to treat me like I am less than human because I am not “white” when I pay the same taxes, work just a hard, and want the same things that any parent wants for they’re children, the ability to provide and ensure my family of the same comforts that you desire for yours! Stop letting the media guide and perpetuate your ignorance, live outside of that and seek the truth, everybody did not come from the poorest areas, some of us did live comfortable, and are educated. To that person that refers to us as n@#$&s, I feel sorry for you, but ignorance is bliss! Ask yourself, what have I done to assist someone who suffered from this “death like” tradegy? Unless you did your part to assist a missing child, or an elderly person who had no where else to turn, and only knew one home that they could not return to, don’t suggest not rebuilding.To hell with politics and beauracy, what about human being to human being? Because you are a certain color you don’t deserve to be treated with dignity, you don’t deserve for your governmnet to aid you when you are in need because you are “black” or because you don’t fall within a certain pay bracket? African Americans were not the only ones affected by this catastraphe, its the media’s fault for presenting it that way, it is your fault that you don’t seek knowledge outside of what is fed to you. And what city isn’t crime infested, and tell me about a city that doesn’t have a crooked politician! There are many cities that have poverty, you just don’t hear about it, because they didn’t have a “Katrina”, and for the record, African Americans are not the only poor people in this country, we’re just focused on more!There are poor people in every ethnic group, your skin color is not the problem, being poor is definitely a problem.

By Hadden Knough

August 28, 2006 03:56 PM | Link to this

Hell, relocate everyone left to Houston and rename it New Orleans. Problem solved.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 03:56 PM | Link to this

I the defanged rednekkk snake has slithered out again …

as ever rednekkks you humiliate your inbred self - its not honest debate to just moronically childishly deny something with a puerile petulant NA NA NA type assertion. You simply cant debate your conservative betters - and you prove it every day!!!

watching you endlessly slither and wriggle to avoid getting hammered factually on here by never saying anything is hugely amusing!!

give Karr a big sloppy kiss from all your buddies at NAMBLA!!!

By Dana

August 28, 2006 03:59 PM | Link to this

OK, tftt, I’ll agree that the “bush hater” isn’t racist when used alone. That is, however, the only point you get this afternoon.

By BIGMOE

August 28, 2006 04:00 PM | Link to this

Sorry for the rant, but to answer the question, ‘What if I ruled New Orleans’?

After I got safe water and electricity back to the city. Along with the cleanup, I would work on the school system so that would attract parents back to the city. With the parents returning come the people to fill many private and public jobs vacancies. With working people come taxes that the city and state really need. We have a do over. We can streamline a new more efficient government that could better help the people.

I hear that the only thing holding up the federal funding is red tape. I would also work so that everyone had a hand in rebuilding the city not just a few construction companies.

By Susan

August 28, 2006 04:04 PM | Link to this

TFTT. I have family in the N.O. area, I was speaking only to that situation. You have no knowledge of my political views. Again, you add nothing to the discourse. And Jim, I am still waiting for a response regarding Atlanta’s preparations for handling a disaster(s). We are certainly not immune.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:07 PM | Link to this

Eniska - today we had a simple straightforward political debate (pretty one sided as usual) on the racial dimensions of Katrina. Unfortunately certain tyopes on here cannot debate anything that goes against their slavish robotic mindset.

Many of your points I have heard countless times in the media, I can and do only wish you well for the future - you and every one - of all colours in and around NOLA,

But dont forget the poor, equally homeless FEMA victim white folks in Ole Miss who have been at least somewhat neglected because of all the politically correct attention on the black victims of NOLA. Which is mostly - but not all - what we hear about in liberal Katrina coverage.

By rednecks - Amerikkka's Al Qaeda

August 28, 2006 04:07 PM | Link to this

Now, tftt, you silly little jizslooper you, stop your crying - you’re not a failure because of some black people in New Orleans, or because of some woman governor in Louisiana, or because you think I like to pick on you or because Susan is a woman and you’re not -

you are a failure because you are you, tftt.

huge smirk

still LOL

Ciao!

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:09 PM | Link to this

Susan … my apologies, I mistook you for someone we call Nazi Susan - a well known anti-semite on here. She often posts under just Susan.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 04:10 PM | Link to this

Eniska,

You have my heatfelt empathy - I have a certain amount of understanding though I am not a NO resident. I have, however, done alot of volunteer work along the gulf coast, and I did see quite a bit of the devastation when I was there, and will see it again in a few weeks when I go back. Lucky for me, I get to leave and choose when I go down.

Aside from a few morons who have nothing better to do than to point fingers and come up with new epithets, I do not think the average poster in here has any genuine antagonism towards the innocent victims of Katrina, Rita and the resultant flooding. Unfortunately, not many of them have actually gone down to see, though I’d be willing to bet quite a few of them have sent money and supplies, either to organizations helping in the gulf region, or to assist with displaced persons. Unfortunately today you are reading what is coming from people so far removed from the situation that many have forgotten that there are actual people involved here. And, equally unfortunate, it only takes a few opportunistic, greedy individuals to stain the opinion of the whole group, and that has certainly happened with this situation.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:16 PM | Link to this

I see NAMBLA rednekks is still slithering around unable to actually factually debate its conservative betters.

hopefully it will soon become yet another hapless and bloody victim of a Katrina refugee and then this sad seedy little story will be over!! And rednekkks NAMBLA will be reborn as a conservative with an objective, well informed view on life.

By Joe

August 28, 2006 04:17 PM | Link to this

Is NO crime infested, you bet it is. Does the city have crooked politicains, you bet it does. With that said, it also had tousands upon on thousands of good solid hard working Amercian people of all colors and all walks of life that were dealt a helluva hand that no one deserves to go through. Our corportae office is in Atlanta, we have offices in NO also and we had people who stayed in the work place there for twenty-four hours a day trying to get basic services restored to the city, they refused to leave. We had looters and crimminals doing bad things and that makes for good news, we had wonderful God fearing and law abiding folks too that risked life and limb to help out others at the same time, but thats less of a news story to some people. Some people are still down and out because of the storm, let us not kick our fellow man while he/she is down and trying to get up. Not everyone bouught Gucci purses with their emergency money; many, many bought milk, eggs and bread.

By frank123

August 28, 2006 04:22 PM | Link to this

The portions of N.O. under sea level should not be rebuilt at all. N.O. continues to sink. It is a money pit that should be abandon. It will be underwater again. Just use it as a shipping port.

By Retroactive Flashback

August 28, 2006 04:26 PM | Link to this

Timeforthetruth still cant seem to comment without really bad manners. He does not blog or play well with others. He is the emblematic, stereotypical poster child of a sociopath.

Imagine posting all day every day with a boiling rage in your soul? Unbelievable.

Timefortruth: you’re quite mad, you know.

And I think it’s a damn shame. This is usually the result of aggravated incest, so we cant hold Timeforthetruth responsible, but I sure wish he would disappear.

By Jim Wooten

August 28, 2006 04:26 PM | Link to this

Susan, the answer is that Atlanta is unprepared for any disaster. As of last fall, it had a 180-page loose-leaf notebook with disaster plans, but it’s mostly standard language handed down from the Georgia Emergency Management Agency.

By Eniska Scott

August 28, 2006 04:30 PM | Link to this

Dana- The time for pointing fingers is over, There were a lot of government officials and agencies that should be held accountable, but how much more time are we going to spend on blaming people, when there are still people of all ethnic backgrounds that need assistance! I lost everything that own, but I had the difficult task of trying to locate 698 employees that my company couldn’t account for, and my own child was missing, but I did not lose sight of the fact all of my people needed help, white, black,blue, green or yellow! Fortuanately, I only lost material things, I can’t say the same for many people that lost thier love ones.The people that have submitted some of these nasty comments, are the same people who would be seeking the same aid if it were to happen to them, and they would not want to be treated this way, Kudos to you, for whatever assistance you provided, I am sure you did it out of the love you have for humanity! I was taught to think before you let stupidity spew out of your mouth!

By Realist

August 28, 2006 04:32 PM | Link to this

Every spring and summer, especially in the south, tornados destroy entire communities, and violently kill grandma and grandpa, children, moms and dads, and leave entire towns with NOTHING. They are delt a terrible horrible blow in the blink of an eye.

But they dont loot. They dont take advantage of each other. The hold church services under a tent next to the rubble that was thier church. They help each other rebuild. They dont move to another state and stay with friends or relatives, they rebuild and start over right there, at HOME.

This is what took place in the gulf coast region of Miss. and Alabama where devastation was actually worse than in NO.

Why is this not happening in New Orleans?

By Scooter

August 28, 2006 04:36 PM | Link to this

It still amazes me that we as “free” individuals allow our government to get larger and larger, we become more and more dependent on it, and we still expect it to operate efficiently. Not only operate efficiently at one level, we seem to want three different levels to be capable of meshing together and operating efficiently as a cohesive unit. The more government bureaucracy we demand to provide for us, the slower the provisions will be realized.

Katrina was one of the nation’s worst natural disasters and I don’t see sincerity in anyone who uses it as a political hatchet to attack any specific bureaucrat, or political bureaucracy maker. More often than not, government is the problem and those who don’t look to government can survive and rebuild without it. Unfortunately the “Great Society” we live in looks to government.

By James

August 28, 2006 04:37 PM | Link to this

Van,

I was working and didn’t get to answer your confusion with my career. Grand fluid engineer or environmental engineer…I’m a civil engineer. Never heard of a fluid engineer but if one existed she would be a civil engineer. Environmental engineer are civil engineer with a focus on guess what…environment (erosion control, waste water treatment.etc) I specialize in site development where have to do all of that. Fluid engineering (part of Bush’s and your Department of Strategery I guess) would be the Hydrology/Hydraulic aspect (flood control) and environmental would be the impact on nature. I also dab in retaining wall, foundations, and bridge design but I’d rather leave it to the structural engineer (yet another civil engineer).

By James

August 28, 2006 04:41 PM | Link to this

Dammit..

Oh yeah Van…the Corp of Engineers are Civil Engineers with a few Landscape Architects mixed in to make sure they don’t build everything out of 6 in thick concrete and #3 Rebar.

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 04:42 PM | Link to this

@Realist,

You make these statements about looting during Katrina and it does not happen when tornados occur; are sure sure about that? When the tornado strikes, does it leave 15 feet of water, no sewer system, no fresh water, no electricity, no natural gas, no food? It seem that you have a sever hole in your argument. Mississippi and Alabama had property damage from the hurricane and the storm surge, but, there was no standing flood waters. Should everyone have rented a boat and floated around so that they could “stay in place.”

By Eniska Scott

August 28, 2006 04:42 PM | Link to this

Realist- How many families did you open your home up to? and for your information, 80% of the city was under water so most of the people had no choice but to leave and go elsewhere, to other states,mostly to families! You don’t own the state, maybe the property you live in, people are free to go where they please.Nobody expected not to be able to return home!Again, if it didn’t happen to you, stop suggesting what people could’ve did, that’s easy for you to say when you were not caught in worst natural disaster in the 21st century!

By Dana

August 28, 2006 04:45 PM | Link to this

Eniska,

Thank God you found your child! I cannot even begin to understand the horror that must have been!

Yes, the nasty comments are comming from the very ones who would push to be at the front of the line for aid if this happened to them. Luckily for them, they have no idea what that means. And thankfully for the rest of us, there are FAR more compassionate people than today would show in this blog. At times this blog seems to be an outlet for spewing stupidity.

By Redstaters R Retards

August 28, 2006 04:45 PM | Link to this

Now slow down James - that’s an awful lot of technical terminology you’re using around people that believe God created the universe in seven days…

By James

August 28, 2006 04:45 PM | Link to this

Realist,

I’d love to educate you on the difference in distruction in the two disasters you reference, but I must leave. I think you understand them…I know you are intelligent. You surprise me sometimes, then sometimes you don’t!

By Redstaters R Retards

August 28, 2006 04:46 PM | Link to this

Now slow down James - that’s an awful lot of technical terminology you’re using around people that believe God created the universe in seven days…

By James

August 28, 2006 04:46 PM | Link to this

Realist,

I’d love to educate you on the difference in destruction in the two disasters you reference, but I must leave. I think you understand them…I know you are intelligent. You surprise me sometimes, then sometimes you don’t!

By jbmlaw

August 28, 2006 04:48 PM | Link to this

Hypothetical case, everyone. We rebuild NO, with state of the art levees and Dutch-like seawalls, spending $1 trillion in the process, and next year the New Madrid earthquake changes the flow of the Mississippi, to run through the Atchafalya Basin. Faced with a total loss of shipping jobs - no export business, will we then expend another $1 trillion to re-route the river?

Alternatively, another category 5 hits NO dead on - is there any seawall or any levee that can never be breached by tornadoes spawned by a hurricane? Would the residents not have a valid claim against the Feds for “failure to warn,” for inducing them to move back into the idiot zone?

I think Frank123 @ 4:22 got it right - no amount of money can do the job. Cut our losses, and build Katrina nature park.

By James

August 28, 2006 04:48 PM | Link to this

Redstaters…

Hey you know even the “Jesus walked on water” crowd can be taught 2 + 2 = 4.

By Realist

August 28, 2006 04:49 PM | Link to this

wow, I ask a simple question and I get attacked.

No, I didnt have to open my home up because of all my freinds and family that live in New Orleans (and i have several) they all were able to make arrangments closer to thier home (they wanted to be as close by as possible as you can imagine).

To Jackie, yes tornados do leave no sewer, no water, no power, no gas, no food, no nothing.

Im not trying to take away from what the people of NO went through. Im simply asking why is the gulf coast of MS and Ala rebuilding faster and working together while the NO mayor is still on national tv being a racist divider awhile things arent getting done in NO?

By Van

August 28, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

James,

No one was really questioning your occupation or qualifications. With so much written, that the public sees, there are many different opinions.

Thanks for helping my aged mind, as to the type of engineers. My only experiance was with flood control, back in the 60’s.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:52 PM | Link to this

on behalf of rednekkks NAMBLA and the other dishonest cowardly racebaiters I’d like to thank you realist for making an excellent point. Unfortunately they aren’t intellectually honest enough to answer it - so I will.

Its essentially down to the ingrained gimme gimme culture that the corrupt leftists have rammed down many poor black folks throats with their cynical racial vote buying scams since the late 1960’s. Now that those days happily are largely over in much of the rest of the country its hold outs like NOLA that are painfully coming to terms with the modern world. In one sense its the local black folks fault in that they didn’t have the vision to see beyond dem vote buying welfare/housing etc and have rejected many of the educational opportunities provided locally.

In another sense its the local black/liberal politicians’ fault for not telling them that its time to change and ensuring local opportunities were provided for things other drug dealing, gang banging and hustling tourists etc. Either way its a long long way from being Bush’s fault or Republicans’ fault. After all the GOP is happily nowhere to be seen in NOLA politics.

Obviously now that much of the city is still destroyed the welfare, gimmee gimmee habit has moved on to TX and GA and elsewhere, which has caused friction locally. Though clearly by no means are all Katrina refugees are like this - though way too many are. And happily many more are getting beyond it and moving on with their lives.

hookers and gucci handbags with FEMA money anyone?

By Redstaters R Retards

August 28, 2006 04:52 PM | Link to this

Realist, who wants to loot a bunch of flattened mobile home, beer cans, and old trash American cars up on cinderblocks?

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:54 PM | Link to this

REalist … the difference in MIss and NOLA is blindingly obvious - the folks in MIss are much tougher, less spoiled and selfish and less whiny!!

By Dana

August 28, 2006 04:55 PM | Link to this

TFTT, you are a total jackass.

By Van

August 28, 2006 04:57 PM | Link to this

James,

I should have said exposure, not experience, to the Army Corps of Engineers.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 04:57 PM | Link to this

dana shows up the innate moron again …

By Liberal

August 28, 2006 05:04 PM | Link to this

Realist-I didn’t think that it was a dumb question—maybe a little cliche but not dumb. The thing is that New Orleans was almost completely flooded and its infrastructure completely collapsed as it was submerged under water. New Orleans is a major city with a high population density that is located below sea-level, so the problems there were magnified. I drove down to New Orleans in April just to visit and the level of destruction is unbelievable. There are no words for it. That said, it will take a long time for New Orleans to rebuild. Mississippi isn’t really in good shape either with whole towns disappeared.

The people all along the Gulf Coast, from New Orleans to Alabama, are some of the toughest SOBs that I’ve ever seen. The ones that are allowed back into their homes and neighborhoods live in front of their homes in little trailers while they rebuild. Truly incredible indeed.

All I can say is that you have to go down and see for yourself in order to get a more accurate perspective of the scope of this catastrophe.

By Dana

August 28, 2006 05:05 PM | Link to this

come ON tftt! Is that the best you can do? Call me an inate moron?

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 05:05 PM | Link to this

jackie is still a complete moron

a great many houses were destroyed in MIss all along the coast -my wife’s cousin who was a dentist down there had his office and home trashed - he lived about three blocks from the seafront. many of the good folks in MIss were living in tents for months because their hosues were destroyed or uninhabitable - they stayed - they didn’t leave.

others in her family in MIss lost everything too , their houses were destroyed not just blown about a bit as in Pensacola the other year.

a huge storm surge is often just as devastating structurally as flood waters to bricks and mortar and even worse for chipboard and vinyl siding. its not as deep into the miss coastline - but it extends for many many miles along the coast ..

By Gerald

August 28, 2006 05:07 PM | Link to this

Lately, as I have read Mr. Wooten’s columns I have grown more curious about Mr. Wooten’s true philosophical attachments. Today’s post concerning his idealized New Orleans redo piques my curiousity all the more.

Mr. Wooten, what exactly do you mean by “easy loans” for home ownership and start up business? What’s the difference between an easy loan and a hard loan? Is that kinda like the lending practices of major banks in the 60’s and 70’s… Whites got “easy” loans and blacks got “hard” loans, if any at all? Why not just allow the private capitol markets to make a decision about who does and does not get money? Isn’t that the best way to evaluate the risk of rebuilding and restarting? “Easy” sounds like a code term for government subsidized loans.

What does parental responsibility have to do with rebuilding New Orleans? Sure parents need to be held responsible when they are negligent in raising or controlling their children to the extent possible. But such an absolute. If a person has a claim against a negligent parent, bring it in court. Let the market determine when such claims are reasonable.

Faith based organization indoctrination for homeownership and business management. While faith I think has imbued in me certain character traits that I think valuable, faith based groups do not hold a monopoly on good character. If there is a market for indoctrination or character building, then the faith based groups can respond to the demand just like any other group. They should get a monopoly and government support as you suggest.

Insurance of any kind is a subsidy of sorts. Insurance allows an individual or company to take a risk through the contracted for support of many others should some contingency occur. Government subsidized insurance allows folks to take risks that no company would willing bet on. Regardless of where a home lies, we need healthy insurance companies making calculated bets without the support of the goverment. Why special treatment for the Katrina water line? As earlier hurricanes have proven, they seldom follow our preset formulas.

As for the levees, why should the burden fall on the state and local government? Why not find a private company to build and maintain the levees? If you want the protection you can pay. If not, find another place to live.

New Orleanians and the people of Louisiana have always had a certain character that draws them to the city and state. Being raised in Louisiana myself, I know that folks have endured the hardships and welcomed the joys of living in a special place. Louisiana has contributed mightily to the cultural heritage of this country and fueled the economy with its oil and river. What the people of Louisiana do not need right now is an Atlantan who flinches at the aftermath of their storms telling them when they should and should not evacuate from their homes, when they should and should not return, and how to rebuild. Why don’t you get Atlanta straight before you start playing God with someone else’s city?

Conservative as Mr. Wooten defines it seems to be more and more about telling other folks how to live with every column he writes.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 05:09 PM | Link to this

dana I actually called you an “innate” moron …

look love … my points in that post @ NOLA were very sound again… I simply mirrored back your petulant unwarranted abuse!!

By Jackie

August 28, 2006 05:11 PM | Link to this

@Realist,

If you remember, Haley Barber, the governor of MS came on TV and stated that he was going to get things moving immediately in Washington. MS had tremendous amounts of debris and the MS National Guard was in place the next day because they were not deployed in Iraq. Keep in mind, the victims in MS were not corraled into a building and held against their will by a military unit with loaded firearms. How many folks in MS were moved to other states, often times without their children.

By getalife

August 28, 2006 05:26 PM | Link to this

Good post Gerald,

Conservatives think they know how to live and show the rest of the the way to live.

Looking at our own country, I would say they are full of sh-it.

Anything a conservative says to do, do the opposite and it will be the right way to live.

They are pathetic hypocrites and should ignored.

By jbmlaw

August 28, 2006 05:36 PM | Link to this

One more item of curiosity: how many of our leftist friends would move into the idiot zone in NO if the government gave them a rent-free, but ground-level apartment, along with a firm “no support in the event of disaster?”

By jbmlaw

August 28, 2006 05:38 PM | Link to this

Obviously no conservative would take the deal I listed, I just wondered about our leftist friends.

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 05:40 PM | Link to this

Anything a conservative says to do, do the opposite and it will be the right way to live.

OK get a tinybrain … I’ll take you up on that!!

do NOT jump under a bus or truck tonight!!

smirk

By getalife

August 28, 2006 05:42 PM | Link to this

Put some clothes on lies

By time for the truth

August 28, 2006 05:42 PM | Link to this

jbm

on behalf of rednekkks NAMBLA I accept your kind offer!! But only if its near a badly cracked levee and a pump that’s broken.

By Class Picture

August 28, 2006 06:02 PM | Link to this

Time for the Truth and Realist have a class reunion.

By Howard

August 28, 2006 06:02 PM | Link to this

First of all, liberals scream and moan if anyone dares mention showing what happened on 9-11 and commemorating that date…they protest it’s too soon to refresh people about what a group of terrorists did…why? Because that would reflect on the great job Bush did and has been doing in protecting us from these evil savages. Having silly anniversaries about katrina fuel their template about the GOP and Bush hating blacks and poor. Second…why do you not see the mainstream media talking heads go back and do stories about what Katrina did in Mississippi and Alabama and how the people there are recovering?? Again it wouldn’t fit the template that Bush and the GOP aare cold-hearted racists. Third…New Orleans should have been a virtual paradise and utopia!!! The place and in fact, the entire state has been ruled by liberal Democrats for over 30 years. There should have been no racism, poverty, slums, violence, etc. Fourth…my blame game rankings?? Number one goes to Ray “School Bus-Chocolate” Nagin…number two goes to Gov. Kathleen Blanco…number three goes to FEMA…and number four to Bush. I fault Bush for one thing…he still is too naive or stupid to think that the liberals and the media types will ever give him a free pass on anything!!! He still tries to get along with the jerks!!! Finally…remember the kid that stole the school bus, after he saw how he and others were going to be stuck in New Orleans when Katrina struck? He climbed over the school bus barn fence, got the keys and took a bus out and ended up rescuing and taking 75 people to Houston. Oh, he was black…but his story has somehow disappeared from the planet. Why? Because it showed people that used their minds and determination could have survived that storm…and not depended on big government to bail them out. Again, it wasn’t in the media’s template!!!!!!

By Howard

August 28, 2006 06:03 PM | Link to this

First of all, liberals scream and moan if anyone dares mention showing what happened on 9-11 and commemorating that date…they protest it’s too soon to refresh people about what a group of terrorists did…why? Because that would reflect on the great job Bush did and has been doing in protecting us from these evil savages. Having silly anniversaries about katrina fuel their template about the GOP and Bush hating blacks and poor. Second…why do you not see the mainstream media talking heads go back and do stories about what Katrina did in Mississippi and Alabama and how the people there are recovering?? Again it wouldn’t fit the template that Bush and the GOP aare cold-hearted racists. Third…New Orleans should have been a virtual paradise and utopia!!! The place and in fact, the entire state has been ruled by liberal Democrats for over 30 years. There should have been no racism, poverty, slums, violence, etc. Fourth…my blame game rankings?? Number one goes to Ray “School Bus-Chocolate” Nagin…number two goes to Gov. Kathleen Blanco…number three goes to FEMA…and number four to Bush. I fault Bush for one thing…he still is too naive or stupid to think that the liberals and the media types will ever give him a free pass on anything!!! He still tries to get along with the jerks!!! Finally…remember the kid that stole the school bus, after he saw how he and others were going to be stuck in New Orleans when Katrina struck? He climbed over the school bus barn fence, got the keys and took a bus out and ended up rescuing and taking 75 people to Houston. Oh, he was black…but his story has somehow disappeared from the planet. Why? Because it showed people that used their minds and determination could have survived that storm…and not depended on big government to bail them out. Again, it wasn’t in the media’s template!!!!!!

By Redstate Trash

August 28, 2006 10:05 PM | Link to this

Wooten’s blog has become a white supremacist site. As Gomer would say - “Surpise, surprise!”

By Slotl

August 29, 2006 08:45 AM | Link to this

The first thing I would do to rebuild New Orleans is rebuild the infrastructure. The levies and dikes need NEW 2006 technology, not the rebuild of 1940’s technology and putting a finger in the dike and pray for no Katrina repeat. Electricity, gas, sewers need to be restored, but most important—-the dikes and levy system. Our politicians traveled to Amsterdam to see how they secure their city. Venice, Italy is spending money securing their city from the raising water. Our politicians did and continue to do nothing (except travel to these places for “fact finding”).

I can totally understand the frustration of homeowners rebuilding, when there has been no long term “infrastructure solution” initiated by the US government.

FEMA and this administration have been a disgrace. We can spend BILLIONS rebuilding Iraq, spend $800 million building a new embassy there, but put bubble gum on our internal infrastructure and “spin” criticism and patriotism to make us look and feel better.

Americans…..we have been let down by our government. These are YOUR tax dollars. Would you spend YOUR money in the way this adminstration is?

Where are the fiscal conservatives of the Republican Party?? All I see are the social conservatives who think abortion, Terry Schivalo, stem cell research, God in our schools, and gay marriage, are more important issues than the growing deficit, health care reform, children’s education, and the lackluster economy and shrinking pensions.

We are bankrupting the future by our inactions of today!

By BM

August 29, 2006 08:56 AM | Link to this

Fire the idiot Nagin, hault rebuilding the ghetto ninth ward, all it is is a crime infested area of multiple welfare recipient generations of people living in delapidated sub-standard housing and make them move out to other areas and not cluster together in grandma’s house in poverty, barely getting by with a g’ment check on the third of the month. I would teach individual responsibilty to people and wean them from the government dependency menatality rampant in New Orleans. In the long run leaving the ninth ward may be the best thing that happens to the younger generation is to be forced to leave and have better role models.

By Jackie

August 29, 2006 09:33 AM | Link to this

@BM

What role model would you have those ghetto-dwellers in the 9th ward use?
It hope it would not be the facists low-life, cromagnum man , morally deficient pond-scum like yourself. What purpose would that serve to lower these citizens standard of living and morality?