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DEL.ICIO.USDemocrats’ soul on line in two races
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Republicans don’t have a dog in either fight, but two nationally significant races on Tuesday’s ballot will tell us a great deal about the mood of the country — and the future of two-party politics.
The one, of course, is Georgia’s 4th Congressional District, where incumbent Rep. Cynthia McKinney is in the final stages of her political career. But for an out-of-district white guy who sapped 5,253 votes, most of which otherwise would have gone to challenger Hank Johnson, she would be walking around in stunned defeat now. Johnson may not beat her Tuesday, but the end is near. Her political salvation — and it is only remotely possible that she is psychologically equipped to do it — is to move from the fringe.
In this contest, Republicans and conservatives have nothing to gain from her defeat and a fair amount to lose. On legislation, Johnson and McKinney will vote the same. They’re both liberal Democrats. The difference is that Johnson is less likely to do and say things that strike reasonable people as nutty. That’s not a good swap for Republicans.
The more significant race nationally is in the Democratic primary in Connecticut, where three-term U.S. Sen. Joe Lieberman, the party’s 2000 vice presidential nominee, is headed to defeat at the hands of anti-war activists who are waging their own jihad for the soul of the national Democratic Party. A July 20 poll by Quinnipiac University gave Lieberman’s challenger, cable TV mogul Ned Lamont, a 51-47 lead among likely primary voters. By Thursday that lead had grown to 54-41, according to Quinnipiac’s sampling.
Said poll director Douglas Schwartz, “Sen. Lieberman’s campaign bus seems to be stuck in reverse. Despite visits from former President Bill Clinton and other big-name Democrats, Lieberman has not been able to stem the tide to Lamont.”
The Lieberman-Lamont race, as Schwartz notes, is a testament to the growing power of the blogs, which emerged as a political force in Howard Dean’s 2004 presidential campaign. “Three months ago,” said Schwartz, “Lamont was virtually unheard of, except perhaps on the blogs.”
Blogs, for the uninitiated, are Internet Web sites — Thinking Right is one — where people gather to debate or discuss issues of the day.
Lamont, like Johnson in DeKalb County, offers a prospective voting record that’s likely to be indistinguishable from the incumbent he’s trying to beat. In that sense, then, neither holds much interest for conservatives.
The only interest in both is what they will tell us about the direction of the party here and nationally. If McKinney loses this cycle as opposed to next, it’ll be because the black middle class finds her style slightly embarrassing.
She’s the black middle class’s Confederate battle flag. They may be drawn to her emotionally and see her confrontational style as a part of their valued heritage, but she’s become a symbol of a bygone era.
Maybe “bygone” was last week. Maybe before the war, Maybe before people came to think seriously about the divisions, which have grown more pronounced.
This runoff, then, says more about the perspective of the black middle class than it does about partisan or racial politics. The district is 59 percent black and just 33 percent white — and a fair portion of that 33 percent includes Republicans who have primary runoff interests of their own.
This is a pure play for black Democrats. They’ll be the ones to decide whether she stays or goes. This year. But if she remains the fringe Cynthia, the mainstream black middle class — somebody like DeKalb CEO Vernon Jones — will take her out.
Lieberman is a sad case. Except to speak moderately on the Iraqi phase of the war on terrorism, much as Southern Democrats once did with the nation at war, and precisely as Southern Democrat Jim Marshall, the Macon congressman who represents Georgia’s 3rd District, still does, Lieberman has committed no offense against the left.
As with the 4th District’s black middle class, a Lieberman defeat would tell us volumes — in Lieberman’s case, about the rise to dominance of the anti-war left within the national Democratic Party. His is the proxy contest. A Lamont win Tuesday fixes the party in Congress and probably for the 2008 election as well.
Republicans and conservatives have no dog in these fights. But on Wednesday morning the country will have a lot clearer idea of where the national Democratic Party’s soul has landed.
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Comments
By Mid-South Philosopher
August 5, 2006 08:04 AM | Link to this
Good morning, Jim,
Once again, you have focused on the heart of the issue with respect to the McKinney and Lieberman races. I am going to go out on a limb here. I believe in the American people, whether they are from the 4th Congressional District of Georgia or the sovereign State of Connecticut. I believe that enough publicity has been generated about these two races that the citizens involved will have sufficient information to make the correct decision. “Lo, I prophesy,” come Wednesday morning, Joe Lieberman will be the Democratic nominee for Senator and Cynthia McKinney will be filling out job applications.
By DD
August 5, 2006 08:15 AM | Link to this
Hey Wooten…focus more on the do nothing Republican controlled congress and their pathetic 23% approval rating.
That’s what selling ‘your soul’ to special interest and Abramhoff will get you.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 08:35 AM | Link to this
I vividly recall Joey LIEberman’s systematic cynical lurch to the left when he was the Albore’s defeated running mate. His tone and his attacks on Bush and Cheney and the GOP were much more strident. Then, magically he shut up a lot, when he deservedly lost his chance of being VP. But LIEberman’s voting record is pretty liberal, although he has been relatively sound on the war on terror/WW3, supporting Israel and the excesses of Hollywood. Bottom line — he’s as not as poisonous as the average DemoNcrat but still not really acceptable.
If he loses, as the polls seem to show is likely, it will serve to further paint the demoncrats into a far left corner which is a very good thing. They cant win nationally on such a stark ‘manifesto’. The disproportionately influential moderate swing voters wont swallow feminazi Pelosi and the likes of Fwank and Murtha running the house. Equally the far left, often treasonous senate left - which is most of the dishonourable opposition these days will find it hard to amass the seats they need to take control.
So if LIEberman goes, its not that big a deal. It will undermine the moderate dems, make fundraising for them harder and nauseate many involved swing moderate and GOP voters. His defeat will also end the congressional voice double of ALF’s ‘father”. LIEberman does whine and simper a lot.
If McKinney wins the status quo endures and the race baiting far left anti-semitic lightning rod will have two more years to acutely embarass GA and itself. If Johnson wins - then she may find coming back from that all but impossible. Johnson should find winning any McKinney primary challenge much easier. If he wins and retains the seat once then she is finished.
Majette stupidly got way ahead of heself when she beat the beast of Dekalb and her misplaced arrogance cost GA and her own career dear. The rabble who unflinchingly vote for her will sullenly accept the glorious change and move on - their emotional attachment to McKinney is not that strong for most of them.
McKinney’s defeat will not say much or offer any opportunity for rune reading about the DemoNcrats nationally. Its too local an issue/race.
A McKinney loss will be a time for great rejoicing, joy will be unconfined in much of GA. Allah will indeed be praised on Tuesday evening if we are finally rid of the McKinney curse!!
By Markus
August 5, 2006 08:54 AM | Link to this
I am so torn on the McKinney debacle I don’t know which way to turn. Half of me wants to see that arrogant, pompous, no-bill passing circus sideshow of political cenematography be thrown out on her weave. However, the other half of me wants her to remain in congress so Republicans can continue to use her as an example of Democratic Washington boondoggling along with the occasional snap of that hot head of hers (inherited from her “J-E-W-S” father). It would be so dreadfully boring without at least one arm flailing, big-mouthed tyrade a year from Ms. Tight Braids in Washington/Ms. Ghetto is Dekalb.
One of the best AJC Vents all year:
“Cynthia McKinney is the Republican gift that keeps on giving.”
Lieberman is a tragedy. He was one of the few Democrats I had respect for. The modern Democratic party, which used to be mostly moderate, has gone the way of far left liberalism with the likes of Dean and Pelosi. I actually applaud that. I hope the mainstream Democrats continue to shift further left in an attempt to find their niche. Lieberman is toast. He’s an outcast now. Even though his vote record is something like 90% yea-Democrat, it’s just not good enough for the loon liberal left. About the only thing CT voters and other Democrats have a problem with Lieberman on is his stance on Iraq and vocally supporting Bush over it. Hillary is playing it much smarter, by supporting the war effort yet trashing the wa the Bush administration is handling it.. she’s in the safe zone, right where she wants to be.
By Markus
August 5, 2006 08:56 AM | Link to this
@DD
Blow it out your communist liberal @ss. When we want your opinion, we’ll shove it down your throat.
By Murray
August 5, 2006 08:57 AM | Link to this
The fact that Joe Lieberman called upon “Lying Willy Clinton” to come to his aid is a bad sign, as it was Joe L. who criticised “lil Willie” during the Impeachment hearings…The fact that Cynthia embraced Louis Farrakhan is a bad sign.!!!
By Larry
August 5, 2006 09:04 AM | Link to this
Democrats? Souls? All Democrats who run for office first have to check their souls at the door. It’s a party requirement.
By Mid-South Philosopher
August 5, 2006 09:08 AM | Link to this
The bitter truth for my Republican friends is that, with the exception of the “War” on terror, the record is not all that positive for the past five + years. We have discovered that a lot of Republicans are NOT fiscal conservatives and, quite honestly, not efficient crooks…to wit the Abramoff scandal. The President of the United States never met a spending bill that he didn’t like, and he is about as ept at controlling the southern border of the United States as I am at conducting a weightwatchers seminar!
As we come to the 2006 elections, while tax cuts have spurred the economy…with lower paying jobs…we now enjoy the highest health care costs in my life-time (and that covers a lot of years), the highest energy costs in my recollection (especially gasoline), and the perception that government is about as efficient as the proverbial “mammary glands on a boar hog.” And I haven’t even begun to discuss the illogical administration of (what could have been an excellent piece of legislation) No Child Left Behind!
All of these criticisms aside, the thing that scares me the most is that the radical left will come into power. While many of their domestic ideas may be good for the country, none of those are going to be worth the proverbial “tinker’s d*mn”…if there is no country! And, like it or not, if we don’t destroy the Islamists (not to be confused with the Islamics), we run the great risk of having our nation substantially weakened or even destroyed. It is just a matter of time.
In my judgment, it would be well to encourage the resurgence of some “blue dog” Democrats, but I am not sure that there are that many out there to be “resurged.”
By Jim Wooten
August 5, 2006 09:09 AM | Link to this
Well, Murray, you are correct that Lieberman criticized Bill Clinton — but when it came time to vote on impeachment, he was there with the rest of the Senate Democrats.
By Jim Wooten
August 5, 2006 09:18 AM | Link to this
Philosopher, you’ve put your finger on it. Precisely. Dead on. Lots of conservatives, and certainly fiscal conservatives, have reason to be unhappy with much of what this administration and this Congress have done, or not, but would walk over hot coals to keep the radical left from coming to power in what, to us, is unquestionably a time of war.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 09:18 AM | Link to this
LETS ALL LAUGH AT THE ALBORE …
this free 2 min film - The AlBore’s Penguin Army is very funny … enjoy
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=al+gores+penguin+army&search=Search
By Jim Wooten
August 5, 2006 09:22 AM | Link to this
Morning all. Good group assembling this morning. Try to stay here and not get in traffic since I hope to be heading to the South Georgia watermelon patch shortly and need a clear highway.
By Alex71
August 5, 2006 09:40 AM | Link to this
At least we know that the Republican Party’s soul is not on the line. It was sold long ago to the highest bidders.
By Jake
August 5, 2006 09:45 AM | Link to this
While I’m not a die hard Neal Boortz fan, his notion that the up coming mid-term elections are a golden opportunity to give the Republicans a kick in their proverbial butts is “dead on”…. For all the reasons that Mid-South Philosopher gives in his post above…… While I, too, fear the extreme left wing of the Democrats, this administration had been a monumental disappointment and things are worse for 98% now than they were when they took office.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 09:47 AM | Link to this
Ned Lamont is a fighter Joe Lieberman is a kisser. The kiss of death along with Tom DeLay supporting him and supporting of the Iran er Iraq war, it is a no brainer. Bye Joe, Good riddence.
By Jim Wooten
August 5, 2006 09:51 AM | Link to this
Yea, you can deliver the proverbial butt-kick, Joe. But the reality is that next-in-line to the ousted Republicans is Nancy Pelosi Democrats, not some more desirable alternative.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 09:58 AM | Link to this
Ned Lamont and Hank Johnson are a good start. I do not see very many incumbents I would vote for. The GOP will not even raise the minimum wage without attaching some enormous tax break for the wealthy. Enough is enough for the rich. What about the middle class?
By lee smith
August 5, 2006 09:58 AM | Link to this
I cannot understand, why in god’s name, anyone who was really a conservative would care one wit about the defeat of Joe Liberman. Wooten makes the mistake, again and again, of automatically associating conservatives with the Republican party.
There are a lot of us out here who have some very conservative views, and we are disgusted with the Republican party, which in our minds has been corrupted to its very soul by neo-cons like Wooten who every day spew out the most mindless and dangerous nonsense. We don’t want to be involved in all of Israel’s wars. We don’t want to “go to Tehran” and we don’t want our country overrun by illegals. What is conservative by constantly exhorting the government to extend more and more corporate welfare while spending your time defending corporate giants like Wal Mart, who are having a destructive effect, not just on American communities, but on the American psyche? BTW, plenty of us remember Liberman’s vote for the seditious Senate immigration bill and we will take great pleasure in seeing the neo-cons favorite Dem go down in flames.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 10:06 AM | Link to this
Religion can hold power across borders.
The Shia Superstate can exist without redrawing the maps. Shia itself can rule Jordan, Egypt, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Syria and Lebanon, and many many more.
It’s like when Ghandi made the British just leave. Shia has the influence to make each country’s leader abdicate the way the British did. Just leave.
So these elections are important because whoever is elected will have to deal with the new era of a Shia Superstate, which is going to have profound effects on every person on the globe.
The alternative in Iraq is we side with the Kurds and commit genocide against the Shia. This should send the Sunnis scrambling to Syria. Into Lebanon. It’s on. It’s on, and anyone that cant see it, will become obsolete (dead ahead).
(Anastasia screamed in vain)
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 10:13 AM | Link to this
Lee … you seem to be something of a typical head in the sand isolationist which is even less of an option than it was in the 1930’s.
Your post smacks of leave us alone rhetoric which wont work, there’s too much at stake for America’s enemies and whilst your sentiments are sound enough you are being rarher naive to just assume/hope it will all go away. The illegals will keep coming unless the house bill is enacted which sadly it wont be in its current form.
Even more pressingly if no one even tries to visit Iran with a harsh message/sanctions package (which likely wont work at all) and then a large well targeted hefty bombardment, soon enough Iran will visit them, with perhaps catastrophic results. The current relatively small scale IDF chastising of Hizbollocks is merely the (initial) curtain raiser, unless commonsense real politik prevails and the usual self interested appeasers in the EU + Russia and China actually bite the lets confront Iran bullet.
Neville Chamberlain over for tea - anyone?
By getalife
August 5, 2006 10:18 AM | Link to this
Barney,
Yes, it is true that the Iraqi Shiite clerics support Iran and Hezbollah. Iran has won the war in Iraq for the ones who can’t figure it out. Our effort in Iraq was a waste of lives and money. They did not understand their culture until now. Not even close.
The sad part is, the scared Americans will happily give up the rest of their freedoms because they think W will protect them.
Nothing is further from the truth. This administration can’t be trusted for anything.
By Curious Observer
August 5, 2006 10:22 AM | Link to this
Lieberman’s wounds are self-inflicted. His transgressions extend much further than supporting Bush’s approach to the war in Iraq—supporting reactionaries like Scalia and Roberts for the Supreme Court, for instance. While I have little use for the extremism of Pelosi, I wouldn’t mind seeing the Senate deadlocked on practically every issue. At least we might have a chance of avoiding budgets that plunge us into debt with their vote-buying earmarks. Right now, the extremists control both major parties.
McKinney crossed the tolerance line when she slugged the cop. That act offended the majority of every major constituency, black, white, brown, or red. She demonstrated that she lacks self-control, and I will be amazed if she wins the runoff on Tuesday, even with her last-minute ad blitz. Ideologically, the race’s outcome will have no effect in Congress, but it will say a lot about the voters in her district.
By Markus
August 5, 2006 10:30 AM | Link to this
Lee Smith.. nice rant! You don’t understand why conservatives would be concerned about Lieberman? Hell only about three posts here including the starter by Jim describes why in detail. Can’t you read?
Regarding “corporate welfare,” ou do realize that it entails government incentive programs for corporations, correct? You do realize that these incentives entail corporations to offer things like insurance, healthcare, retirement, low-interest loans, and continuing education benefits to their employees, correct? Hell that’s right up a liberal’s alley!
You comments like “neocon” and “corporate giants” hardly paints you as a conservative, so don’t even pretend to be one, liberal troll.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 10:33 AM | Link to this
Did some of you forget that Lieberman is an honest man? Did you forget that the honest man/woman is an honest senator? He may not vote a straight party line because he may think that line is not the best for the country. Don’t tell me that honesty is a lost “art”. It isn’t.
Lee Smith, would you tell us how to stop terrorism against America, recover from 9/11 and natural disasters and stop illegal immigrants without spending money? Your valuble advice would be appreciated. Yes, indeed, STOP everything and it will not be expensive.
Also L. Smith, if WalMart is affecting your psyche, you have a problem and it isn’t WalMart. We still have freedom to shop or not to shop in this country. Tell your psyche that.
Oh Jim, give one of those watermelons a thump and bring it back to us. We’ll behave better if you do that.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 10:34 AM | Link to this
The Shia superstate cant expand much beyond where it is now. Clearly you are very poorly informed about the sunni/shiite divide. Its utterly absurd to suggest Sunni Egypt would/could become shia… nor will Jordan Syria or S Arabia. . Not unless they are physically conquered and none of these states will be - at least not by shias. Iraq is the only one on that list seriously at risk, but it would be much more of a rump state, not the full blown IraQ as it stands today.
And we Brits did not just leave India because Ghandi “made us”. This is simply liberal propaganda stemming from that vile inaccurate travesty of a film about the pervert Ghandi. The Empire had largely served its purpose, we had a new very leftist Labour Govt after Churchill and the new commie/western world order after WW2 was quite different.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 10:39 AM | Link to this
Markus,
You do realize the GOP gave tax breaks to send jobs overseas. How about the lobbyist controlled legisalation? Read up on that and while you are at it, check out the NAFTA superhighway and tell me, how is this good for our country?
By getalife
August 5, 2006 10:41 AM | Link to this
Oh, and check out why the minimum wage did not get increased. If you are rich, I can understand your support for the GOP, if you are not, wake up and read.
By Markus
August 5, 2006 10:45 AM | Link to this
The “middle class squeeze” is a c**k-n-bull liberal crock. We’ve had robust durable goods and home sales for the past several years post 9/11. Anyone been to a mall lately? Best Buy? Who the hell is buying all this stuff? The “rich,” all whopping 5% of the US population that they comprise (according to Democrat standards)? The “poor” with no money? Once again the emotinalism of liberalism shoots before aiming.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 10:50 AM | Link to this
Markus,
It is called credit cards and bankruptcy. Why do you think they made it harder to declare bankruptcy?
By Markus
August 5, 2006 10:52 AM | Link to this
Getalife, much to your pleasure on this beautiful day, my time here is short lived. I’ve got a boat to launch.
In any event, if memory serves me correctly, your hero Clinton signed NAFTA, so you have no dog in that fight.
Second, we’ve already run the “minimum wage” issue into the ground here. I think it’s fascism for the government to shove wage mandates down company throats. I also think one is a loser JACKKASS to still be working a minimum wage job after age 21. You will not waiver on your stance, and neither will I.
Have a nice boring day trashing conservatives here. If I can get a wireless signal today, I’ll pipe back in.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 10:56 AM | Link to this
Look what Israel is doing to Lebanon.
The Muslim Brotherhood, (Egypt’s Hezbollah) can invite similar destruction upon Egypt if the Sunnis dont abdicate. Ditto Jordan. Ditto Syria. A shia superstate is upon us, and there’s nothing that can stop it.
We deal or kill ourselves killing them.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:00 AM | Link to this
Markus,
We agree to disagree.
Keep reading and you just may learn something besides your ideologic mind set.
Have fun at the lake.
By Markus
August 5, 2006 11:00 AM | Link to this
Getalife, I close witht one more thing before leaving: consumer debt is nothing new and has always grown with the economy. Take a looksie for yourself:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releases/G19/hist/cchistsa.html
By Susan
August 5, 2006 11:09 AM | Link to this
I think instead of all the big talk and hot air, I will simply look to the elections in November to see who believes in which party.
It will be interesting. Given the prevalence of frenzied hot air coming from the conservative side, it feels like the last gasp of a dying ideology.
Meanwhile, the cooler heads, such as getalife, continue to quietly, without bashing anyone else, tell the truth.
Thanks, getalife.
I enjoy reading your comments.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 11:09 AM | Link to this
I never knew geo-political analysis like that was possible.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:09 AM | Link to this
Markus,
I know, the deficit really is not all that bad
Check out the latest bankruptcy figures.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 11:10 AM | Link to this
Barney,
Look what Lebanon’s Hezbolla did to Israel? Invasion, killing and capture of soldiers, and shooting rockets indiscriminately into Israel. Did you not notice that?
Are you raising a white flag for Israel and other mid-East countries? I don’t think that Israel has any white flags in mind. What are you suggesting? Cut & run for all of the Middle East or what?
By lee smith
August 5, 2006 11:12 AM | Link to this
The other day Bill Bennett had Mitt Romney, Gov.-Mass., on his radio show. He was asked by Bennett what leverage we had to compel China to help in the “War on Terrorism.” Bennett thought that China had an interest in seeing us tied down in the Middle-East. Romney said that he thought that that leverage was China’s desire for access to our markets. Romney is a smart guy, and after listening to him I think I might have a candidate in 2008 after all, but he is wrong on this. This country is so addicted to cheap consumer goods that politically it would impossible to deny China real access to our markets. People have come to see shopping as a recreational activity, and cheap consumer goods, as an entitlement. This, Dusty, is an example of how the Wal-Mart mentality has damaged this country’s psyche. The other day I took a I took my niece for a ride through rural Georgia. We came upon a small town and my niece remarked, “think how far they have to go to Wal-Mart.” This, Dusty, is an example of how the Wal-Mart mentality has damaged this country’s psyche. The poor child believes that Wal-Mart is essential to human existence. Some of these posts should be put in a museum under glass with a sign that reads “How the Neo-Con Mind Works.” These people are so deluded by Neo-Con Radio they have absolutely no idea what American Conservatism is about. If you really think it is time to “go to Tehran” or “go to Damascus” then I hope you will be offering your services, or those of your children, for this “noble cause.”
By joell
August 5, 2006 11:12 AM | Link to this
Mckinney may lose but its been enjoyable watching her rock the boat.
Why are black “leaders” remaining silent on this election just like they did in 2000?
They’re afraid to back Mckinney because it would anger “Mr Charlie”; they’re afraid to back Johnson because they would be viewed as “toms” by many in the black community.
So these “leaders” remain silent.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:15 AM | Link to this
Thanks Susan,
Markus thinks that I am a Democrat but actually I am an American who is strongly in favor of government reform. I have way too much time on my hands and read way too much about out current situation.
Bottom line, we are definitely heading in the wrong direction.
By Reconstruct Georgia
August 5, 2006 11:22 AM | Link to this
I like the part about Cynthia as the black’s rebel rag, Jim. Well put.
Middle-class blacks in the USA are forced to be more pragmatic than their suburban white counterparts, who have the luxury to pretend their is no racism in their country, and the hatred from the redneck element regarding McKinney is uncomfortable. The “high tech lynching” of this woman makes decent people, white and black, nervous, knowing the propensity for racial violence amongst certain elements of Georgia “society”.
Let’s face it - given the mediocrities that infest the Georgia congressional delegation, that McKinney should receive such an inordinate amount of attention is proof that white racism is alive and doing well in Georgia.
By Moses (Black Jew?)
August 5, 2006 11:26 AM | Link to this
Getalife,
Those polls are very telling, thank you. I didn’t think it was that skewed across all polls.
By Claude
August 5, 2006 11:29 AM | Link to this
Jim,
I very much disagree with your comment:
“In this contest, Republicans and conservatives have nothing to gain from her defeat and a fair amount to lose. On legislation, Johnson and McKinney will vote the same. They’re both liberal Democrats. The difference is that Johnson is less likely to do and say things that strike reasonable people as nutty. That’s not a good swap for Republicans.”
Replacing a nut with someone who’s not a nut is always a good swap.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 11:36 AM | Link to this
Well, Lee, just maybe your “poor” child’s family does a lot of shopping at WalMart because they can get more for their money there. You may be amazed that people with low and middle incomes find economical shopping attractive, even if it Walmart. I don’t believe their psyche is telling them to do it. Their pocketbooks are.
I haven’t heard conservatives say “go to Tehran” or “go to Damascus”. Don’t believe everything you read on blogs and hear on radio. And for goodness sake, don’t fall back on that tiresome rhetoric “offer your services”.
As I have mentioned before, my father, husband and oldest son have all served honorably in the military, two of them during war time. You may find that your views are the ones under the glass case at the Cut & Run Museum.
By Too Many Bigots
August 5, 2006 11:40 AM | Link to this
Good points, Reconstruct.
After all, blacks were denied the basic right of equal protection under the law in Georgia until the 1960s - not that long ago! I believe that was in Mr. Wooten’s lifetime, but so many people like to forget or pretend.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:42 AM | Link to this
McKinney did vote against the Iraq war but saying W knew about 9/11 before it happened reeks of a conpiracy theory that some believe but I an not buying it.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:45 AM | Link to this
Dusty,
Say it with, Murtha was right about Iraq. So you can save the cut and run rhetoric, it makes you sound silly. How many more of the troops do you want to see killed for nothing?
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 11:49 AM | Link to this
the mohammedan brutherhood are SUNNI!! It is actually a vastly more fractious division than papist vs proddie in christianity.
The MB in Egypt are closely watched and harshly controlled by the Egyptians when they get too uppity. Mubarak is one of the more benign dictators in the middle east, but still a dictator.
You clearly know litle about the middle east … you seem like a typical ignorant News Max moron. Either that or you are a poorly contrived, obtuse troll - at least try and manage some kind of meaningful point next time!!
as for lee … forget your puerile neo-con labels bubba and just look at the real world. You can keep your smug holier than thou I’m a real conservative label - it will be utterly irrelevant as and when the real war in the middle east starts. What is to be determined are the sides, how many sunni dictator states will the Iranians peel away? Probably not too many as they are more self interested in their own fiefdoms.
Its not about “going” to Iran - its about the inevitable consequence of Iranian aggression which sooner or later will have to be dealt with.
as for your walmart porch wisdom - most every country likes cheap goods, china trades with most of the world, but at a huge growing cost to their ‘productive’ environment and people. For now that’s a cost they can/will bear, but sooner or later it will catch up with them and devastate their economy, the only question is when and will/can the effects be staggered and thus managed?
as ever susan’s emotive factless drivel entertains wonderfully. nice to see the conservative side retains your ire - I simply wouldn’t have it any other way dearie!!
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 11:52 AM | Link to this
getalife … your continuous theme and anti-GOP tone on here smacks of liberal Bush bashing. surely even you wont deny that. If not for your frequent denials, no one would think anything of calling you a leftist Bush basher … whatever your political ‘motives’.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 11:54 AM | Link to this
I’m recommending the Sunni/Terrorists Uprising/Insurgency cut-and-run. (sorry). They started it. We couldn’t contain it. They’ve got to try to get to the Syrian Border before we wax them. They go first.
Shia is merely responding to the Sunnis grab for power. The 52 card deck. It had a joker. George Bush.
The horn of Israel’s dilemma is that they cant risk a larger engagement, which seems imminent and moot.
SO why shouldn’t Israel fall back and regroup and figure out where everything falls while they collect their wits.
If Israel doesn’t cut and run now, then the Islamic Jihadistd run amoung us and upon us.
They hear a clarion call in their zeitgeist, (that they have been zeitgeist-trained to hear): “Become the lion!”
Look what happened to Ziegfried unt Roy. Ze lions surrounded him unt blitzkrieged!!!
This is why we needed to separate church and state. The church is easily manipulated by foreign ideology nuances.
But dont ask why me. We all got it comin’. (We all got it; second coming). We allowed a deacon wannabe to be our president and now we’ve the devil to pay.
But show that ALBORE penguin cartoon. I love cartoons. It’s fitting that we watch them together as we remember our distant childhood, where predictions of such a world we face now would have brought a straight jacket. (and a bar of soap….dont ask)
By Reconstruct Georgia
August 5, 2006 11:54 AM | Link to this
time reveals the “conservative” strategy for the Middle East - kill them all, let God sort them out.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 11:57 AM | Link to this
lies,
If you think it is W bashing, well he is our glorious leader. Please get religion out of politics, it is a very dangerous combination. Especially for born again Christians who were drunks and drug users. Destiny for disaster, if you will. I have no political motives. I do not get paid to post, do you?
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 11:57 AM | Link to this
Getalife,
Murtha is the poster boy for cut & run. He has ruined a record of service and is now considered more a kook than an astute thinker.
Your question about wanting troops killed also goes under the kook category. I prefer to consider less brain-washed comments than yours. Au revoir to you Getalife. Go smoke a cigar but don’t direct your babble to me.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 11:58 AM | Link to this
I must be off lovies, I have tea and spotted dick waiting for me. Reconstruct, you sound alot like Redneck with all that dribble.
I have no life…
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 12:04 PM | Link to this
Dusty,
I bet you have a pretty mouth! You sound alot like Ann Coulter, I wouldn’t boink her with Barbara’s dick.
Has anybody ever wondered why white women are conservatives? They’ve benefited from that damn tragesty of Affirmative Action more than blacks have. I guess they are just mindless followers of their men. Good for them governor!
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:04 PM | Link to this
Dusty,
You are right. You are blind to the facts. Iran won the war in Iraq and you want more to die for that fact.
Disgusting.
Good riddance.
By lee smith
August 5, 2006 12:06 PM | Link to this
Reconstruct Georgia is wrong if he/she thinks what we are seeing in the Middle East is a ‘“conservative” strategy. What we are seeing there is the playing out of the fantasies of the Neo-Con usurpers who have hi-jacked conservatism for their utopian and idiotic dreams.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 12:08 PM | Link to this
the id stealing wanker is back again … how sad is that!!
tiny lobotomizedbrain … your trademark dishonesty is hilarious - nobody “wants” troops killed … how ever all the signs are that a massive conflagration is coming sonner or later in the middle east… unless the world decisvely acts to confront Iran. The Iranians are pushing the envelope everyday and building up their military with a shiite mushroom cloud as their avowed aim!!
you cant even admit that your posts consistently LOOK like leftist Bush bashing - in tone and content!!
you must be drunk again - to post the rest of that bollocks!!
the conservative strategy for the middle east is simple - confront and permanently stop terrorism, state sponsored and all other kinds!!
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:12 PM | Link to this
The problem is that most americans dont understand the difference between the words, “ethnic” and ” sectarian”.
The difference is the age of those two different tribal ties: over 10K years (ethnic), and over 1K years (sectarian).
The two different subsets of ancestry intersect in a evolving subsets of population control that knows no border.
The Iraq border arbitrarily split these older ethnic liasons so that when they rejoin, it becomes a defacto invasion of one country over another. (like a global coup, but the conspirators are countries)
Persians…Kurds… Arabs… Turks…. Metro-mullahs: Those are the old ethnic geneologies. It’s too complicated for me to explain it to a non-klingon-dilithium-crystal-abuser, okay?
Now remember, I just told you that you weren’t one of those.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:13 PM | Link to this
The neocon plan failed. We need a new plan and new leadership. They have created a bigger monster by their actions. There will be hell to pay for these neocons failures and they should be held accountable.
I feel bad for our future generations. They will not see peace for a very long time. I think we should presure the clerics, preachers, ministers, etc… to promote peace and stop inciting violence. Like General Pace said the other day, we must love our children more than we hate the enemy.
By Susan
August 5, 2006 12:14 PM | Link to this
“as ever susan’s emotive factless drivel entertains wonderfully. nice to see the conservative side retains your ire - I simply wouldn’t have it any other way dearie!!”
Nope, feeling mighty calm these days.
It will be awesome to read your ranting and raving after the elections in November.
Instead of spotted dick, how about hooking up with Rusty Dusty?
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:18 PM | Link to this
THe sunni/shia civil war in Iraq is only in Iraq. Sunni/shia peace is the fact of life in every country in the middle east. Shia is a 10% minority, Sunnia a 90% majority. They live peacefully side by side, because 90% of Shias live in Iraq/Iran.
However, the sunnis will accept a shia superstate if it means that Islam rules the middle east and all foreigners or seculars are evicted.
That includes USA and Israel and Nato and the entire non islamic world.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:23 PM | Link to this
Cartoon Idea. Show bush ripping apart the original Teddy Roosevelt Teddybear from the turn of the century. no reason, he’s just a little boy who got some box cutters.
I always wondered how the British felt after we gained our independence when they realized their King was insane.
King George needs a bath.
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 12:23 PM | Link to this
Jim W said yesterday he would find out who was doing the id stealing. Here’s a response to the email I sent him:
“The multiple name changing has caused posting to the blog embarrassing to some, and AJC has provided me with these findings. The person known as Realist (to my surprise) is the culprit. As I have re-read some of his posts, I see now that trouble is what he loves to start. Inform your peers that he posts with the same email sometimes while he changes the names. I am working on a way to have a registered site. Jim Wooten”
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:24 PM | Link to this
lies,
I guess you are too stupid to recognize the Iranian rhetoric is not real, it is political to incite the masses. It is working and they are getting more support.
Their political rhetoric is aimed at the US and Israel to show us as evil and we played right into their hands. There are over 1 billion Muslims and most hate us.
Once again, W is the leader of the neocon failure and I will point out the failure for the slow and stupid like yourself.
By Reconstruct Georgia
August 5, 2006 12:26 PM | Link to this
Alas, Susan, be careful gloating. Never ever underestimate the stupidity of the red state voter.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 12:27 PM | Link to this
Wanker aka coward,
I’m beautiful. Every year I win the Mrs. America contest. But you are as ugly and vulgar as they come.
Black and white women are often conservative because they are smart. They know a good thing when they see it. You, for instance, do not fall in the category of anything good.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:29 PM | Link to this
I told you Realist is a fake.
It happens all the time at Luckovich’s blog but the culprit has never been outed.
It is probably a conservative over there like Andy.
By Reconstruct Georgia
August 5, 2006 12:29 PM | Link to this
It looks like Realist gets his ideas from the Roger Ailes/Lee Atwater playbook.
Silly little bigot that he is.
By Reconstruct Georgia
August 5, 2006 12:31 PM | Link to this
So smarrt women are conservatives? Tell us why you are then, Dusty.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:32 PM | Link to this
Is that the real Barbara?
Or is it the wanker again?
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 12:33 PM | Link to this
Thank you Dusty
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:35 PM | Link to this
Now the fun part. the Kurds remember the end of Desert Storm when our F-16’s circled overhead while Saddam’s Helicopters annihilated their army. (and granny and sister sue).
Remember 2 years ago, we armed the Kurds. We reinforced their ideas about holding on to the resources they were squatting on.
The Kurds are digging in. They are imploring us to help them set up a barrier to fend off the Shia.
If we dont get the hell out of dodge in a few weeks or tommorow, we will get sucked into the 10K year old civil war that we just put our flag in front of for no reason other than george bush/cheney did what the Saudis told them to do. The military industrial complex cant run one mile without oil. The saudis lobbied legally and won our country.
I want it back. now.
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 12:36 PM | Link to this
getalife,
I would enjoy debating the topics with you today. I have a prior engagement. I am not fake, just the target of the “wankers” ire.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:39 PM | Link to this
Getalife, if you’re going to pretend to be a liberal, in the larger conspiracy of trolls who each occupies a place on the partisan spectrum, then stop embarrassing liberals by using terms like, “you’re slow and stupid”.
You embarrassed the liberal side. We dont want you unless you edit yourself one last time before you post, and remove all and each tongue lash. Just dont do it.
It’s embarrassing.
By Larry
August 5, 2006 12:43 PM | Link to this
All,
WSB is showing the Mkinney/Johnson debate. McKinney is a joke.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 12:44 PM | Link to this
Low life on the loose. Hi, Susan. Bye, Susan.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 12:45 PM | Link to this
Google the Kurds before you post about the middle east again.
Read for two minutes. That’s all I ask.
Then you’ll know what’s dead ahead in Iraq/Iran/Lebanon/Jordan/Egypt/Syria.
We are at the end of an era..the era of CIA carved hegemony in the middle east.
That power structure is obsolete.
We bought ourself a half century with that, and that aint bad. (sarcasm)
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:47 PM | Link to this
Barbara,
It is hard to tell but I think it is Realist too.
Barney,
Just call him like I see them. I am not a liberal I am an American who is paying attention. I do not pick sides, it is silly. There are major problems facing America and worrying about sides is not one of them.
By Susan
August 5, 2006 12:48 PM | Link to this
So Realist is the troll and the trouble-maker. I think rarrringt and I caught the fakery within hours.
I find it interesting that I received a weak public response when I stated that I have only posted under one name and with the same email the entire time I have been on the blog. Jim posted a rather ambiguous response. Not upholding that I was one person under one handle and one email.
But when a conservative sounding troll like Realist is the culprit, we find out only because Barbara quotes from a private email she received from Jim.
Jim, I think it’s beyond time that you insist on some form of security. Aside from the joking and good-natured sniping, everyone here, regardless of what part of the political spectrum to which they adhere, takes their beliefs and opinions seriously.
I think you see with more honesty what each side really believes, and that is to me the epitome of free speech. And this form of free speech is further aided, when honestly used, by anonymity. I know for a fact that most people here would not dare say in public the thoughts they reveal on this blog.
Now, I would have no problem doing so, but I am in a uniquely secure position and have nothing to lose. But I can also appreciate that there are folks on this forum who have jobs and professions in which they cannot openly express their political beliefs. They stuff it down at the office and use the blog as a means to blow off steam. I think that is a healthy thing to do, and as I am not their boss or supervisor, if they are free to spend hours every day at work on this blog, more power to them.
So, Jim, I would really appreciate any efforts you might make to thwart trolls.
If that was indeed you and it was indeed Barbara who posted the quote from your email.
Or maybe I’ve been punked by “Barbara“‘s email. Jim, please let us know directly what is going on. Thanks!
By getalife
August 5, 2006 12:55 PM | Link to this
Barney,
Too late, there is civil war in Iraq
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 01:10 PM | Link to this
@get a lobotmized brain …
the Iranian rhetoric is “not real” … just as Hitler’s and Eichman’s rhetoric wasn’t real - eh?
PHEW!!! that’s alright then, presumably their current quest for a shiite mushroom cloud aint real then - nor is their $100 million plus a year support for Hizbollocks, nor was their holocaust denying convention, or the Iranian instigated murder of argie jews many years ago … or the US Marines in Lebanon etc etc … none of the Iranian rhetoric or actions are real … getatinybrian says so!!
as for the ID STEALER … such small minded cowardice will be rewarded by Allah himself!!
I think 500 public lashes at a Kerry for President rally so there’ll be no media coverage and almost no one there at Six FLags, followed by a nice long ride on a three legged camel with acute irritable bowel syndrome through a large Afghani minefield would be a suitable punishment -for starters!!
kicking him/it/her off would stop the need for individual extra log ins which might just put other ‘new’ folks off joining in the fun - we already log in here to the ajc any way to even get to post/read the liberal news.
By Dusty
August 5, 2006 01:10 PM | Link to this
The Braves are getting ready to play.. Go go go Braves..
See you later, gladiators.
By Jim Wooten
August 5, 2006 01:27 PM | Link to this
The 12:23 Barbara is an imposter who misrepresents her and me. The alleged e-mail “quoted” is phony.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 01:29 PM | Link to this
@get a lobotmized brain …
Barny,
This is another reason why I call him slow and stupid.
lies,
No silly, Hitler was serious and your genocide plan like Hitler’s will fail and is ridiculous.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 01:33 PM | Link to this
Thanks Jim.
It did not add up but I still think Realist is a fake.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 01:49 PM | Link to this
Okay, I cant take anymore. I did it!! I DID IT!!!! Yes, it was me. I was the troll. I did it, and I’m glad. And I’d do it again.
I was trying to take over the blog…and I almost got away with it too….if it hadn’t been for you brat journalists!!!!
Oh what a world….all my beautiful wicknedness…gone forever….what a world…what a world……
I’M SPARTACUS!!!
I’M SPARTACUS!!!!
What a bunch of fallguys. i love it!!!
Jim, you’re a genius.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 01:52 PM | Link to this
Barney,
Please give me the bullets to your gun before you shoot yorself again.
Go get Otis, he is drunk again.
By time for the truth
August 5, 2006 01:59 PM | Link to this
re: ID stealing … its getting to the point where one cannot trust another post from certain of the familiar id’s.
its just a game for some sad moron - but it spoils the blog for those who are actually participating.
Realist might of course just be a lefty of some sort who is deliberately trying to inflame folks with far right patter, or he could be for real and is just winding up (particularly) some of the black folks on here. There’s so many possible scenarios…
By Jane
August 5, 2006 02:06 PM | Link to this
The 2008 election will be similar to the 1972 election in the Dem will nominate an unelectabe anti-war candidate who will polarize the party, but not move the general electorate.
By Barney Fife
August 5, 2006 02:16 PM | Link to this
Just a joke. (I’m not the troll).
ID stealing is a big who cares. If you’ve got an insight to offer, what does it matter if the ID is getalife or Ugottabekidding or barbara?
you all act like your id is valued, like AJC readers are going, “Oh look, honey, Getalife just made this amazing insight about the middle east and he made barbara look like a fool, wow, he is a genius, man oh man, i love that getalife.”
That aint happnin’ anywhere for anyone, anyhow.
Just post and STFU about imposter IDs and try to stay under 10 posts a day.
Remember a troll is defined by the quantity of posts and 50 plus a day is the biggest giveaway.
By getalife
August 5, 2006 02:31 PM | Link to this
See if you think this is funny Barney
Please God,
Do not speak to W again so he will not push the button in your name.
Amen.
Insane!
By getalife
August 5, 2006 02:50 PM | Link to this
Talk about terror, a President wanting the rapture to happen is very scary.
Lord help us.
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 03:20 PM | Link to this
Hello. This is the real Barbara, checking in for the first time today. None of the prior posts are mine. I generally don’t read or post often on the weekends. Imagine my surprise at seeing that someone has been posting as me all afternoon. Getalife, I don’t agree with you, ever, and the imposter has even gone so far as to offer reasonable exchange with you to try to fool you. I’m sorry about that. The only thing they said, that is true, is that I do enjoy debating with you. I do appreciate the fact that you saw through it and asked if it was the real Barbara. You are learning my character. I look forward to debating with you again soon!
Dusty, TFTT didn’t specifically defend himself, so I’m going to do it for him. He has never, nor do I believe he will ever, make that kind of lewd comment about women, and I know that’s especially true with me. He would not say something like that about me, so you know he didn’t write that to you.
Barney Fife, yes, we do value our IDs. This is not a one time blog. Many of us read Jim’s blogs every day, and we do value our IDs and they help us to understand each other and debate each other on serious matters. We take it seriously. If you don’t, then move on.
While I don’t agree with Realist on everything, I would never sell him out. I agree more with him than I do with some of the liberals who post here.
And Susan, for the record, I would never post a private email from Jim on his blog. I know Jim won’t be offended if I say this; I’ve shared private emails with him before. I trust he wouldn’t share mine, and I wouldn’t share his private communications. Barney, this is the point I was making - our IDs do identify us to our fellow bloggers on this site.
I probably won’t post again today, so all of you have a good day.
By Jim
August 5, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this
Does anyone think that Mr. Wooten would support, endorse or vote for Joe Lieberman if he were running for a US Senate seat in Georgia? Of course not.
It really doesn’t matter what position on the Iraq war that any local or national Democrat takes — as it simply isn’t good enough. You must also have a “R” by your name to qualify as a reasonable choice for Mr. Thinking Right.
Frankly, the idea that one party’s plan and vision for America future should be endorsed as the only option is not a healthy direction for the country.
By Susan
August 5, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this
@Barney
Who appointed you the troll-identifier or arbiter of this blog?
Oh, as you have posted 12x already today, I guess you have already broken your “stay under 10 posts a day” rule!
Hypocrite.
You, my good man, have no more right to as you so eloquently say, “STFU” than I do!
And just for the record, getalife is one of my favorites, so yes, I can give him a shout out whenever I please.
@Jim Wooten
I truly (and no sarcasm, none at all) appreciate your email.
@Time
And heaven forbid, for once I completely agree with TFTT, his 1:59pm post that is.
Time and I both have no problem with a good debate. We’ll snipe each other and we’ll disagree til the end of time about most issues, but I would like to know, for crying out loud, that I am debating English Time, not some faux weasel fronting as English Time.
Is that too much to ask?
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 03:30 PM | Link to this
Okay, me again! I didn’t think I’d come back, for I do fear the ID stealer, but I couldn’t help saying Susan, Oh My Goodnes, girl! Mark the calendar. This is the first (and oh, please God, the last!!!!) time, but I agree with you 100%. I think they’re serving Ice Water in Hell right now :-)
See Jim Wooten, both sides want you to stop this stupid ID stealer. Can you set the blog up so that there can only be one person posting under a specific name, and that name has to be associated with one email address? That might be an option that doesn’t require a password. Can you look into that?
By Barbara
August 5, 2006 03:34 PM | Link to this
Oh, and Susan, if you care for my opinion, I really do think Time