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DEL.ICIO.USVoting: Rights is wrong.
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Politicians were expected to be at their worst on Wednesday as the U.S. House of Representatives was to debate whether to continue for another 25 years discriminatory, and allegedly temporary, provisions of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. Decency would dictate that, at a minimum, its provisions be modernized. But no action. Debate was postponed.
An amendment to be offered by U.S. Rep. Lynn Westmoreland (R-Ga.) would base requirements for preclearance from the U.S. Department of Justice for any election-law changes on a rolling formula that starts with the last three presidential elections. Now states — mostly Southern states — are being punished for elections held in 1964, 1968 and 1972 — the most recent one being 34 years ago. Westmoreland proposes to update that to the 1996, 2000 and 2004 elections — which would, of course, include the ones Democrats won’t turn loose: Florida of 2000 and Ohio of 2004. Who could object? Other than, that is, politicians from states not covered by the old rules, which is a majority of the Democrats and Republicans in Congress.
The Voting Rights Act grew a racial spoils system. Black Democrats get safe seats and a “cause/threat” to goose-up turnout. Republicans get the rest, which translates into winning majorities. It’ll not be modernized. Both parties have a political stake in preserving the status quo.
Under Section 5, due to expire in 2007, prior approval must be obtained for any change in voting standards, practices or procedures in Georgia, South Carolina, Alabama, Louisiana, Mississippi, Texas, Alaska and Arizona and a handful of counties and townships elsewhere. Georgia’s actually ahead of non-Southern states in voting participation by blacks: In the 2000 election, black registration was 66.3 percent, compared to 61.7 outside the South. White registration was 59.3 in Georgia and 65.9 outside the South.
My belief is that the act concentates blacks in safe districts, which tend to be more liberal than mainstream Georgia, and pull the Democratic Party leftward — making it more difficult for the party to win statewide. The Voting Rights Act provisions should apply nationwide or, as Westmoreland argues, be based on more current election experiences.
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Comments
By ByteMan
June 21, 2006 08:09 AM | Link to this
Both parties have a political stake in preserving the status quo.
Same reason that “Fair Tax” proposal won’t ever happen. Current tax law benefits the few who contribute heavily to re-election campaigns.
Same reason that true immigration reform won’t happen. They need the votes from BOTH Hispanics and anti-immigration folks, so they’ll talk out of both sides of their mouths and do nothing and point fingers across the aisle.
Same reason that true ethics reform in Congress won’t happen. It’s easier being bent if no one really pays attention.
Only thing that will change the situation is to make it easier to have more than two entrenched parties. And changing the laws to let that happen also won’t happen any time soon, because it’s not in the ruling parties’ interest to open up election registration requirements laws.
By just passing through
June 21, 2006 08:31 AM | Link to this
2006, not 1964. I’m ready to do away with raced based initiatives that don’t make sense anymore. If you cannot compete, get out of the way. Look what those “safe seats” have gotten us — McKinney and Jefferson to name two incomptent incumbents — and we have no hope of getting them out because the idiots that elected them think they do a fine job of “truth telling”.
Clean the HOUSE and the SENATE. Tell those do-nothing elected officials it’s time to go, and thanks for playing.
By One of the Majority's Voices of Dissent
June 21, 2006 08:35 AM | Link to this
Poor article for its dearth of information, Jim. My high school students would be lucky to come away with a “C” if they had turned in what I just read from you.
By greg
June 21, 2006 08:53 AM | Link to this
Majority’s Voices of Dissert,
Go easy on Jim - he’s a product of public schools.
By Vatican Lectures
June 21, 2006 09:09 AM | Link to this
“Fair Elections” is an oxymoron in any democracy. Polls close at 7pm. People get out of work at 5pm. Polls are restrictive. Voter’s papers must be in order. Are your papers in order? Let me see your papers.
Districts pander underhandedly to gerrymanderers. Police, and Dogs, and Barricades -oh my- are used to scare away the bitter, disenfranchised pedestrian voters who have the most to gain from their vote. If it weren’t for the absolution bestowed upon correct votes, the souls of citizens would gain nothing.
Until we clone a million Jimmy Carters to observe a million districts in a million elections we’ll just be creating ONE big c**-and-bull story of hogwash, chicken little, and fish tales (oh my)….
AND IF the American Taliban should last a thousand years, let them say, THIS was their Divinest Power.
By Zeke
June 21, 2006 09:11 AM | Link to this
The voting rights act is an abomination! It is totally unConstitutional and if the Supreme Court were to do it’s duty it would be thrown out as such! Any of the politicians who vote for this should be kicked out of office at the first opportunity! All this gets us is imcompetent politicians like McKinney and Jefferson just to name two! There are many others who are elected just because they are in a gerrymandered majority black district! Don’t misunderstand me, there are many incompetent white, woman and Hispanic elected officials! But, why guarantee the election of a minority, that is unAmerican!
By Eric
June 21, 2006 09:14 AM | Link to this
When it comes to our elected officials… how do you pick the biggest turd from the massive field of dung we get to choose from?
By Get to the point
June 21, 2006 09:17 AM | Link to this
To Vatican Lectures - What kind of senseless drivel is that???? State your point clearly without all the “noise”. At least Jim presents a clear problem with a well presented and CLEARLY communicated alternative solution to spark debate. Your post just makes no sense. And Lord help the planet that has to deal with a million Jimmy Carters (whew!!)
By GodHatesTrash
June 21, 2006 09:23 AM | Link to this
Westmoreland knows about as much about Georgia’s long history of manipulating voting rights of black people and poor people as he does about the Ten (not three, Lynn, you stupid redneck) Commandments. The Voter ID bill is just the latest attempt to discourage and marginalize black and poor voters, which is the most important reason for the Voting Rights Act - some 600,000 Georgia registered voters don’t have drivers’ licenses, most of them black and/or poor.
Jim is right for a change - the representation and redistricting provisions of the VRA have resulted in entrenchment in Congress. Bumping up the number of minority reps and elected officials has also caused an increase in redneck extremists in Congress - clowns like Norwood, Westmoreland, Lindner, etc. have their stupid ideas go unchallenged, since they end up representing people just as buffoonish as they are.
One possible solution would be more parties - not just 3, but 5 or 6. That would require a change to a more parliamentary type system with proportional representation, as opposed to winner takes all.
Another solution would be computerized districting - come up with a Federal algorithim/formula that would be used in each state to draw district boundaries from the Census, (determining each state’s House representation is what the Census is actually for), taking that function away from the statehouses.
Of course, this would probably eliminate the majority of current black reps from Congress, but most redneck extremists would have a harder time holding on to their seats, too.
My bet is that Westmoreland is probably fine with leaving the minority representation aspects of the VRA alone, since the byproduct of having a Cynthia McKinney in the House is that 4 or 5 silly rednecks like Westmoreland end up with “safe” districts.
An uninformed, ill-informed, stupid electorate is what Westmoreland needs to keep getting re-elected. He’s found that in his district.
By Pearl
June 21, 2006 09:42 AM | Link to this
“Just passing through” you are kidding right? What about disgraced ex-congressman Duke Cunningham from California that took 2.4 million in brides, to include a yacht, rolls royce and the 19th century Louis-Philippe commode and as early as yesterday, Bridgeport, Connecticut mayor John Fabrizi who admitted to heavy drug use. Corruption know no color, it just knows money and deep pockets.
By time for the truth
June 21, 2006 09:45 AM | Link to this
@ GodHatesYankeeTrash
The new sensible and practical Voting Rights Act in GA is decades overdue!! Dead people shouldn’t ever vote but they do!! Illegals shouldn’t vote DemoNcrat, but they do - ask Bob Dornan. Multiple voting shouldn’t happen but it does!! Convicted felons shouldn’t ever vote -but they do in FL - happily Bush still won the state TWICE!!
Your anal anti-southern obsession is actually getting funnier and funnier everyday you ventilate your irrational hateful bile. Please don’t ever change that new experimental psychiatric prescription, its working fine. Just double the dose - once a month!!
The only legitimate reason to clone a million Jimmy Carters would be to finally clear Afghanistan of all its remaining minefields with (almost) human leftist goosesteppers!!
ALL black/minority pandering needs to stop immediately!! The playing field is as fair as its ever going to get now and this systematic racism against whites is cynically pushed by the racist/bigoted left to enable vote buying!!
By Jeff
June 21, 2006 09:54 AM | Link to this
Amen T4T!
By just passing through
June 21, 2006 10:06 AM | Link to this
Pearl — corruption is fed by safe seats. If there were no “safe seats” for people of color there would far fewer “safe seats” creating the huge advantage of incumbency. Every safe seat for a person of color also creates safe seats for bigots. Competition and accountability would reduce corruption in all districts. However, the real key to ending corruption is holding all representative accountable for their actions.
By Not Lovin the Haters Here
June 21, 2006 10:22 AM | Link to this
Jim, I’m sorry, but I’m confused. What EXACTLY is your problem? You think it’s WRONG for the Federal government to ensure that everyone gets to vote? Perhaps you should move to Florida where, if you share a name with a convicted criminal, you are automatically purged from the voter rolls without verification two weeks before a major election (with the help of Alpharetta’s own ChoicePoint, Inc. known mostly for collecting and selling our personal data.) If you think protecting our rights is wrong, what do you consider right?
From Wikipedia: The Voting Rights Act of 1965 outlawed the requirement that would-be voters in the United States take literacy tests to qualify to register to vote, and it provided for federal registration of voters — instead of state or local voter registration which had often been denied to minorities and poor voters — in areas that had less than 50% of eligible minority voters registered. The act also provided for DOJ oversight to registration, and the Department’s approval for any change in voting law in districts whose populations were at least 5% African-American. It was signed into law by President Lyndon Johnson on August 6, 1965.
By Jim Wooten
June 21, 2006 10:23 AM | Link to this
Responding to One of Majority’s Voices of Dissent, I’ve added more background information — hoping to raise my grade to a gentleman’s “C.”
By Mike
June 21, 2006 10:38 AM | Link to this
I live in the 8th Congressional district in Newnan. If Westmoreland is proposing any type of bill in congress you may be sure that someone else wrote the bill and he signed off on it without reading what it said just the same way he bravely co-sponsored the 10 Commandments bill. Westmoreland is simply a photo op junkie who gets his ego stroked by having a title to attach to his name, state-rep, U.S. Congressman, etc. Sadly he will most likely be re-elected because “he’s a local boy” and never mind the fact that he never accomplished anything during his term other than cashing his pay check.
By G
June 21, 2006 10:52 AM | Link to this
Bias is bias, no matter who it’s for/against. If the law does not apply throughout the US, there’s no equality, and it’s voting wrongs, not rights.
By deegee
June 21, 2006 10:54 AM | Link to this
To say that southern states and some counties in northern states where voting rights were abused no longer need the protection of Amendment 5 is idealistic. The reason for the Voting Rights Act and particularly Amendment 5 is due to a pattern of abuse. It’s like a restraining order, you don’t assume that you don’t need it because the perpetrator stays away. Lift it and you put yourself in danger. And you don’t initiate a restraining order for everyone you know, only for those who are known to be a problem.
By Artemus
June 21, 2006 10:59 AM | Link to this
Until the immigration issue came up this year I probably would have agreed with alot of you on this issue. But I am convinced that if laws such as this are changed or done away with, states like Georgia would be back to the days of Jim Crow at warp speed. When any issue that involves race or ethnicity comes to the front burner it becomes clear why these laws exist to begin with. Xenophobes, racists, and bigots are still alive and well. Issues such as immigration expose that fact.
By Van
June 21, 2006 10:59 AM | Link to this
When it was first passed the Voting Rights Act . corrected and remedied many wrongs. Over the last 41 years Georgia has made strides forward.
Section 5, that Wooten mentioned, should be allowed to expire.
At the core of the issue, the unequal application of the law should not be allowed to continue.
Even if it is phased out, or removed at one time, the need of these provisions are no longer needed.
By TechFella
June 21, 2006 11:01 AM | Link to this
I think federal oversight of local election laws isnt such a bad idea, considering how many scandals we’ve had across the country in the last few years. I think we could also benefit from a little nation-wide standardization (or perhaps guidance) on issues such as voter eligibility, voter registration, and polling hours. Wasn’t congress supposed to take action on this after 2000?
Anyway, of course the South and the rest of the country should be on the same page here. There is no longer any need for the DOJ to investigate only Southern states… we’re no longer the most racist or radical. Any attempt to keep this law in place as is stinks of anti-Southern prejudice.
By Jim Wooten
June 21, 2006 11:14 AM | Link to this
Debate in the U.S. House on this legislation is now scheduled to start about 3 p.m.
By Van
June 21, 2006 11:14 AM | Link to this
TechFella,
Only thing wrong with your post is that the Constitution does not give Congress the power to decide how a state registers voters or how they run the elections. Voter eligibility has been decided, you must be a citizen, 18 or older, without any convictions that would bar you from voting, or you have had voting rights restored by your state.
Personally, I would like to see the polls open the Saturday before the Election Tuesday through that Tuesday.
I would like to see purple ink applied after you vote.
By
June 21, 2006 11:22 AM | Link to this
Good point, Van! The federal government should stay out of how private business, I mean um, the states decide who can vote in any given year. The laws should be allowed to change willy-nilly at the discretion of the Republican majorities. Afterall, those are the only people whose opinions really matter. RIGHT, MISTER WOOTEN?
ChoicePoint’s board and executive roster are packed with Republican stars, including billionaire Ken Langone, a company director who was chairman of the fund-raising committee for New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani’s aborted run against Hillary Rodham Clinton. Langone is joined at ChoicePoint by another Giuliani associate, former New York Police Commissioner Howard Safir. And Republican power lobbyist and former congressman Vin Weber lobbies for ChoicePoint in Washington. Just before his death in 1998, Rick Rozar, president of a Choicepoint company, CDB Infotek, donated $100,000 to the Republican Party.
By What's the Fuss?
June 21, 2006 11:26 AM | Link to this
Good point, Van! Even if there ARE recent accounts of voting rights being subverted or denied, the federal government should stay out of how private business, I mean um, the states decide who can vote in any given year! Forget checks & balances! The laws should be allowed to change willy-nilly at the discretion of local and state Republican majorities. Afterall, those are the only people whose opinions really matter. Right, Mister Wooten?
ChoicePoint’s board and executive roster are packed with Republican stars, including billionaire Ken Langone, a company director who was chairman of the fund-raising committee for New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani’s aborted run against Hillary Rodham Clinton, and another Giuliani associate, former New York Police Commissioner Howard Safir. *Republican power lobbyist and former congressman Vin Weber lobbies for ChoicePoint in Washington. Just before his death in 1998, Rick Rozar, president of a Choicepoint company, CDB Infotek, donated $100,000 to the Republican Party.*
By J Tom
June 21, 2006 11:36 AM | Link to this
My take on this is broader than simply the Voting Rights Act: all states should be treated equally and subject to the same laws, rules and regulations. If you want the VRA, then apply it to ALL states. No state should suffer “second-class” status amongst the other states. It’s a clear violation of ‘minor’ concepts such as equal protection and equality under the law. To those of you whining about poll hours, dogs (what country are you from?), intimidation at the polls, etc.: it is so easy to vote early at centralized locations or absentee that these should be non-issues. Further, with everyone carrying video cameras and camera phones, any voting intimidation would be instantly shown on TV. The only need for Federal oversight MIGHT be in the drawing of legislative boundaries.
By TechFella
June 21, 2006 11:37 AM | Link to this
Van,
But we’re forgetting here that the Constitution also didn’t set up the system of government that we use today, i.e. direct election of Senators and President. Local election laws work fine when we’re electing local officials, but it quickly becomes a confusing mess when we’re dealing with national elections. Notice that whenever we have an alternative political party run a presidential candidate they end up spending the majority of their resources simply getting on the ballot in all 50 states. Should it be that difficult? National elections call for national standards.
By Dick
June 21, 2006 11:49 AM | Link to this
Don;t trust your politicians? Think they will tell you what you want to hear just to get (re)elected? Well, I am the new person hoping to have a career in politics. Why should I have to work,when I can stay in Washington and have the time of my life on your dollars. If you will elect me as your Senatror, I am telling you up front that I will: A- abuse my power to my advantage, B-carry on an affair with as many of your wifes as I can; C-will answer roll call an average of once a week; D-Vote the way the highest contributor ask me to vote; E-will not swap vote, which means I vote for yours if you vote for mine—I will vote which ever way it puts more money in my pocket, F-Continue to hold office regardless as to my health both physcially (can use wheelchair) as well a mentally (smarter than you as you keep putting me in office. Now that you know my intentions, please put me in office. You won’t be shocked.
By Monique Harris
June 21, 2006 11:55 AM | Link to this
Monique Harris 8482 Plumtree Dr. Riverdale, GA 30274 770-603-9840
Investigative Reporting Department;
I am writing to you because I feel that this story needs public attention; My husband of 20 years, age 46 expired on July 17, 2005, due to a chain of events, initially with the ingestation of a McDonald’s hamburger that he purchased in a ATL downtown McDonald’s restaurant. I’ve hired an attorney to handle the case, however, to date the McDonald’s corp. has not responded to the laboratory results, sent to them, 2 months ago. I have attached those results along with this letter, as well as the cover letter sent to me from my attorney’s firm. We have not filed suit against the McDonald’s corp., hoping that the company would atleast have a sit down talk with us; the company has not responded to any of my attorney’s calls according to my attorney. The hamburger that my husband ate was fatal, it was the last hamburger that he ever ate. His death was ruled accidental. According to the death certificate and the final autopsy report recorded here in Clayton County Court House. As you will see, my husband death was the result of a chain of events; he ate the burger, he the got sick, Tony went to our primary physician, our physicians office then told him to see a GI specialist, the GI specialist punctured his colon on May 12, 2005, emergency surgery was preformed in which, my husband had an ostomy preformed, 2 short months later he died. This is another story within itself. My goal in this story is to make these large corporations accountable for their role in the death of my husband; as well as not honoring their comments to the consumer. To date these corporations have not responded to my attorney’s repeated calls. For your conveince I have included a copy of my late husband’s death certificate, a copy of the test results from the foriegn substanced found in the Mcdonald’s hamberger along with a cover letter sent from my attorney, a copy of Tony’s obituary . Thank you very much for listening to my story. There is much more to this story, my husband death was ruled accidental, but CIGNA life insurance and it’s affiliates have not honored the double indemity policy to this day. Please I need help, I’m reporting this to all local television stations as well as radio, in hope that someone will see the injustice of these major companies in which we the consumers are subject to on a daily basis, it could be anyone of you or your loved ones having to deal with the heartache of this very difficult situation. THIS IS NOT A HOAX, I AM A UP STANDING MEMBER OF MY COMMUNITY, I AM A MEMBER OF DIVINE FAITH MINISTRIES IN CLAYTON COUNTY, A LICIENSED MINISTER OF THAT SAME ASSEMBLY UNDER THE DIRECTION OF PASTOR, DONALD E. BATTLE.
I can be contacted either through my attorney Mark Thomas and Associates, or at the name and address above.
Sincerely,
Monique Harris
By Jack
June 21, 2006 12:05 PM | Link to this
Where did that come from?
By GA Peach 3
June 21, 2006 12:07 PM | Link to this
Keep the part about jumping through hoops to get a voter registration card illegal, lose the part about requiring states to get the ok from mommy and daddy before changing registration laws. Goodness knows none of us agree on much these days anyway.
On a tangent, would it be so bad to require people to read English in order to be productive members of American society? Ducks to avoid flying rotten food and boos
By Blog Goddess
June 21, 2006 12:15 PM | Link to this
Not only “where did that come from” - but, what does “Pastor Harris’” husband’s death from a “fatal” McDonald’s hamburger (in my opinion - an oxymoron) have to do with Voting Right’s Act of 1965?
By Marie Harris
June 21, 2006 12:18 PM | Link to this
Two comments - I live in North Fulton County and I have never walked into a voting location where I was NOT asked to show my drivers license. I don’t see what all the fuss is about. If you are an American citizen and have nothing to hide - why not show ID. This isn’t black/white or rich/poor - I have to show my id several times a day and it has never offended me. I have to show it at my own bank using my own money - I have to present ID at the airport, the bank, stores, etc. I find it incredible to believe that “many” people don’t have a photo id - how can you live in this country without one. This is ridiculous!
The other comment is to Ms. Monique Harris who is trying to get money from McDonalds’ - also ridiculous. Why not sue the doctor who punctured your husband’s colon.
By realist
June 21, 2006 12:22 PM | Link to this
Monique is nutty. That has nothing to do with voting…. It sounds like she’s looking for some FREE money and doesn’t have a case.
By Vatican Lectures
June 21, 2006 12:33 PM | Link to this
APOLOGY
I’m sorry, sir. I thought I was crystal clear: We vote for the best fairy tale.
Straw polls enflame emotions and throw water on sweeping change. Candidates pay no attention to the man behind the curtain at the polls.
Long lines, tithers, and barriers, (oh my), of crowing goldbrickers scare the tin hearted and the cowardly, (and the little bloggers too).
We need to change, but these things must be handled…delicately.
But you might be right……and a million flying monkeys might shave a million arses…..
By C H Atlanta
June 21, 2006 12:39 PM | Link to this
Ms. Harris, you are among the priviledged people in this country and you have taken much for granted. I’m not saying you did something wrong because YOU DIDN’T… But many poor and extremely poor people know nothing of the things you take for granted. Owning a car, a house or paying rent for housing without rats and roaches. Wow. Try what Judge Panos does; volunteer! With feed the hungry, habitat for humanity and Boys or Girls Clubs, meals on wheels. Then you just might meet people who have never in their life had a photo ID…
By Markus
June 21, 2006 12:43 PM | Link to this
Not totally on topic, but why is it that only neomarxist left-wing liberal RATs and minorities complain about a mandatory voter ID plan? Oh, that’s because they know about all the cheaters (dead votes, multiple votes, illegal alien votes in Kalifornia, etc. etc.) that helps put/keep the bottom-feeding voter franchise that the RAT party counts on from being disenfranchised.
Since when did having to show a FREAKING ID to prove WHO YOU ARE become the chain around a voter’s neck? Not ONE PERSON seems to complain that you have to show ID to:
o Write a check in a grocery store o Rent an apartment o Buy a car o Open a bank account o Prove that you are a licensed driver o Make a credit card purchase in some stores
Oh yeah, all that is fine and dandy with the bottom-feeding neocommunist liberals on the jackass left, but damned if you ask for that at a vote booth!
Finally, why is it that the neomarxist left only complains about voter fraud WHEN THEY LOSE? NObody from the filthy RAT left said a WORD about the Washington governor election where more votes came in than were registered (the RAT candidate won, naturally). Nobody questioned the narrow victory of John “those weren’t my medals I tossed over the fence” Kerry in Wisconsin (11,000 votes out of over 3 million cast). No, the morons on the wackjob left only sit around and lie that people were prevented from voting by police roadblocks and other BS that not ONE PERSON ever testified under oath actually happened to THEM.
Idiot liberals.
By deegee
June 21, 2006 12:47 PM | Link to this
I don’t see anything wrong with showing ID when voting, and where I vote they actually look at me and look at my picture to make sure they match. However, given that this is a new process I would feel less cynical about it if there was some organized effort on the part of the people that enacted it to inform the public and facilitate compliance. Apparently there are an estimated 600K+ people that are not in compliance. Maybe I missed something but I don’t remember any campaign on the part of State leadership to inform people of the change and how to obtain a voter ID card. After that, it’s up to the individual to inconvenience themselves for however long it takes to get the proper ID.
It is interesting that in other parts of the world people will stand in line for hours and days in order to vote. We won’t stand in line 20 minutes and if it’s raining, forget it. If 50% of eligible voters actually vote then it’s considered a big deal. No wonder we get garbage for representatives.
By Van
June 21, 2006 01:06 PM | Link to this
TechFella,
Sorry to burst you bubble, but the Constitution and the amendments do describe the form of government we have, the 17th amendment made Senators directly elected, and we do not have direct elections for President.
The Constitution states that you must be 18 and a citizen to vote(26th amendment), the 24th amendment guarentees the right to all citizens to vote.
There is federal law covering elections for federal office, but the states determine where you vote, establish local requirements for local elections.
The Constitution also grants to all states a republican form of government and to tell a state that any change to its election laws or districts must be approved by the Justice Deptment, seems counter to that concept.
All laws must be enforced equally. This is the bases for our laws and justice systems.
Now, the marxist would desagree and they will say that the federal government know better what we all need. They would suggest that big brother is going to take care of us - RIGHT!
By Cletus Snow
June 21, 2006 01:13 PM | Link to this
If you can’t show identication to prove that you are who you say you are,that you live where you say you do and are a citizen of this great nation,why should you be allowed to vote?
By Hill Billy
June 21, 2006 01:19 PM | Link to this
Van the man is right again! The Federal government should NOT be intervening in state’s rights!
And if they TRY, why… why… we’ll just SECEDE! Yeah! We’ll form our own country! And then they won’t be able to tell us what kind of rules we can make or how to treat our minorities! Heck, we can just appoint the people with the most money to be our leaders, make all the laws, and FORGET ‘bout those stupid elections. Only rich, white, land-owning men should be able to vote anyway! Otherwise, you get these lazy, no-good, godless LIB’RULS squawking about what’s fair. I’ll tell you what’s FAIR: All you people who want fair should shut up! That’s what’s fair!
By Maria Harris
June 21, 2006 01:20 PM | Link to this
To C H Atlanta
Overprivileged is absurd. I lived in an orphanage because my mother could not afford to keep us - we did return home to our single mother raising four children. I worked my a* off for everything I have and no we didn’t have roaches or rats - probably because my mother also worked her a* off to support four children with no alimoney or child support. You can call me “hard working” not “privileged”.I still don’t get what poverty and photo id have to do with one another. If you are getting government assistance - don’t you have to show an id to apply? To cash a government assistance check - do you not have to have Photo id? Because I have to show mine everyday in this “over privileged” life I am leading. Please don’t lecture me about volunteering - even us “privileged folks” up here in Fulton County volunteer…girl scouts, boy scouts, church, PTA, etc. and some of us even work a 40 - 50 hour week - each and every week then go home and cook and clean, monitor homework, and all the other things that “hardworking” people do… and most of us have been doing this since we were old enough to work. My children were not given BMW’s for their 16th birthdays or a Gold American Express card. They - like us - will work hard for whatever they have - they will pay taxes, write checks and vote - and they too - WILL HAVE TO SHOW A PHOTO ID!
By Van
June 21, 2006 01:23 PM | Link to this
Hill Billy,
You jest, but if you re-read the Declaration of Independence and the Preamble of the Constitution, you might see that we do have the right to change the Government. In 1913, the states lost a lot of their power. This lead us to the greatest power grab ever done. FDR, effectively neutered the states.
By TechFella
June 21, 2006 02:00 PM | Link to this
Van,
Once again you missed the point. The Constitution was amended to provide for direct election of Senators, and it can be amended in the future to provide for whatever other changes we so desire. It is not a ‘sacred’ document.
As for the President, I hope you are aware that the system we currently employ today is in no way identical (in fact barely related) to the process used at the founding of the Republic. Once again a process was found to be lacking and we subsequently changed it.
Looking at the modern electoral system, let us not look at the problem and say that this or that cannot be done because it isn’t in the constitution. Let us decide what would enable our electoral system to function at the most optimal level, and then if necessary the constitution can be amended.
Regarding state sovereignty, I hardly see it as an intrusion into the independence of states to require national standards in national elections. Otherwise the process becomes infinitely complicated, allowing only parties with enormous resources to field candidates.
National oversight of local processes, far from being ‘Marxist’ as you claim, is a fundamental part of how our Constitution operates. If you read the Federalist Papers (or other documents, I’m sure) you’ll discover that the founding fathers were deathly afraid of local ‘factions’ taking over states and enacting radical laws… such as the Jim Crow laws of the South decades ago.
Balance of power between the federal government and the states is vital to our Federal Republic, to be sure. But do not be so afraid of even minor federal oversight that you let the pendulum swing in the opposite direction.
We have a problem to fix here with our electoral system. Debating the Voting Rights Act will hopefully encourage real debate to take place within the Congress, so that in the future we do not have such controversies as the 2000 election. It is fair to say that the nine states originally listed in the Voting Rights Act no longer deserve to be singled out, but we must also take steps to ensure that such problems do not arise again in the future. If we throw out the Voting Rights Act, we have to replace it with something else. To leave a void would simply invite future abuse.
By Hill Billy
June 21, 2006 02:02 PM | Link to this
In 1913, the use of beating, lynching, and fire were common ways people with power handled the minorities (known then by a different term) who wanted to assert their Constitutional right to VOTE. Do you miss those days?
BTW, I can think of A LOT of examples of “power grab,” but I’d prefer to let other readers, or perhaps Mr. Wooten, post their favorites.
By R@
June 21, 2006 02:14 PM | Link to this
What most of you here don’t know is that Lynn Westermoreland was a Black Panther in an early life - mid 60s. (he went to Therrell H.S. in southwest Atlanta - we were all Black Panthers - our mascot ;-)
Seriously - the VRA should be updated and any U.S. elected official knows this in his heart. It is the right thing to do. Will it change? No. Why? Because real, true leaders these days are hard to find. We no longer have “public servants” - we have career politicians and bureaucrats. When we place term limits on legislators and judges, you will see change. You will see the “public servant” return. Until then, we’re flapping our lips into the wind.
By Yari
June 21, 2006 02:17 PM | Link to this
Time for the Truth says that systematic racism against whites exist: interesting. How is one ever systematically racist against oneself?
By kb
June 21, 2006 02:30 PM | Link to this
Political correctness aside, everyone who wants to vote should have to pass a simple competency test to do so. The welfare of our nation is too important to let people vote who can’t name the President of the US, identify our flag, or find their own state on a map. Trying so hard to be nice and inclusive should not act to the detriment of this country.
Oh yeah, and you should definitely have to show ID. If you complain about that then it is likely that you cannot obtain a valid ID for whatever reason.
By Artemus
June 21, 2006 02:43 PM | Link to this
Hill Billy’s 2:02 is exactly why fed trumps state. Left to their own devices some states would regress 100 years.
By Everyone Counts
June 21, 2006 02:48 PM | Link to this
Yari,
You demonstrate one of the greatest misconception perpetuated in America today, as shown by the VRA among other laws and concepts. This misconception is that the definition of racism is “anti-black” or “anti-minority.” Actually, racism is any decision or differentiation that is based upon an INDIVIDUAL’S race. If a white individual is treated differently than a black individual simply because he/she is white, that is RACISM by definition.
By MClark
June 21, 2006 02:48 PM | Link to this
Although I disagree with you at times, Mr. Wooten, I do want to thank you for this blog. I enjoy reading the debate it engenders and looking at other viewpoints. Just in the short time I have been reading I believe I have learned a pretty good number of things from both sides of each issue. And the fact that I do learn from both those on the left and those on the right brings me to my (admittedly utopian in nature) point. I wish that the flame throwers would stay out of the discussion.
There are a lot of Democrats out there, my elderly mother is one. In no way is she now or has she ever been a DemoNcrat. (time for the truth)It’s just absurd.
My father-in-law is a staunch Republican. He is neither a right-wing hack nor a Hillbilly. He’s a good man who worked hard to raise a good family who happens to be a Republican.
I tend to be somewhere in the middle. (I believe I am actually part of a silent majority.) But to those on the right I am mostly considered an “idiot liberal” (Markus). Just the other day I expressed that it was lunacy to place the blame for the division in this country at the feet of “liberals”. My point being that the division is attributable to extremists on both sides being intransigent in their positions. For that I got attacked by a writer named “Dusty” and called a name that I considered to be a rather offensive and inaccurate. Now I know that names never hurt anyone and my “feelings” are fine. I’m not whining, I just don’t understand why it has to happen.
Isn’t it possible to have these debates and be able to read them without all the nasty name calling and attacks. Regardless of the excellent point you are making as soon as one of the generalizations or stereotypes fly out I stop reading. And I suppose that is the only solution; to self “filter” and pass by the flamethrowers who’d rather act like children than debate like adults.
My utopian nature just got the better of me today and I thought I’d throw this out. I’m sure I’ll get raked over the coals by the very ones that prompted me to write, but I just couldn’t sit on this any longer.
I’m going to try and do my part. From this point forward, I am promising all here that I will do my dead level best to stick to the issue of the day and stop with the overgeneralizations, stereotypes and the name calling. Maybe a little at a time those intelligent ones on the right (Van and JW), the left (GHT and TechFella), and the middle (I’ll take that spot) can work together to help this discussion, one that I have come to enjoy so much, a little more civilized.
By deegee
June 21, 2006 02:53 PM | Link to this
That sounds good, kb. Let’s make sure that Lynn Westmoreland is first in line for that test and let’s televise it.
By GT
June 21, 2006 02:59 PM | Link to this
A universal problem is people see themselves differently than what others see them. A guy speeding down the highway eating your bumper thinks you are the problem not his wreckless driving. Lester Maddoxs was not a bigot it was those damn blacks and liberals that made him look like one or at least in his mind that was the case. What the internet has done is help some of these sick minds find like kind friends and now sick people all over the world think they are nomal because they have a union of sickcos to confide in. Our social problems and mean sprit has taken legs and become the fashion. For this reason if none along I think we should revisit our past to remind us where sick thinking gets us. Watching red faces and veins sticking out of the necks of these protestors of the illegals, reminds me of the hate we saw in the 60’s. A gay gets beaten to death and the killer is a hero. I lived in the 60’s and the 50’s and what passed as educated people, thought like cavemen. We are ready to lynch the Dixie Chicks for their comments against our way of thinking. We should give anyone a metal that has the guts to go against the meanest and self rightousness.
By Jim Wooten
June 21, 2006 03:08 PM | Link to this
Thanks, MClark, for approaching the discussion with an open mind — and for your efforts to promote civility in debate.
Incidentally, to all, the House leadership has now postponed debate on this issue until an unspecified time — and the change may affect the Senate’s plans to take up the issue next week. Republicans from the nine affected Southern states may be picking up converts. Stay tuned.
By Stupid Idealist
June 21, 2006 03:19 PM | Link to this
MClark, I’m feelin’ ya. If you use the same name all the time, you’ll get attacked by people who’ve already made up their minds they don’t like you, and will never let you express an opinion or ask a question without trying to belittle you. If you stand anywhere to the left of Ann Coulter, you’ll get attacked. Ask for reasonable discourse, you’ll get smeared for even suggesting compromise. Point out inconsistencies, you’ll get remanded for being a malcontent. Ask questions, you’ll be asked why you hate America. And if you’re one of the hang-right, berate anyone even remotely liberal crowd, you’ll find some on the left will fling it back. That being said, I have little hope that our house divided will ever unite. I just haven’t seen that many people who actually care about anything beyond their own bank accounts, and the thrill they get from proclaiming, and then “proving” that they’re right — facts be darned. As an idealist, I’m compelled to keep trying, but I honestly don’t ever think it will matter in the end.
By Dick
June 21, 2006 03:25 PM | Link to this
Those fussing about “voter id” would walk 30 miles one way if it was to sign up for a free government program. Dead beats are the ones fussing. I think you aught to have to show last 3 years tax return as well.
By GT
June 21, 2006 03:32 PM | Link to this
Dick, it sounds to me like you’re one of the fussers. How do you tax returns look?
By kb
June 21, 2006 03:53 PM | Link to this
Dick is right-on with the voter id comment!
By deegee
June 21, 2006 04:05 PM | Link to this
Hello Jim, I think we all know that the meaning of “unspecified time” is after the Fall elections. I don’t know why they all don’t just go home, campaign and be done with it. Oh, wait, the distinguished representative from south Florida just finished spending time on the floor of the House giving praise to the Miami Heat for restoring pride and dignity to the people of her district.
By Just Say It
June 21, 2006 04:13 PM | Link to this
Here’s why they don’t want poor people to vote in sufficient numbers or blocks to actually be represented in Washington. Once again, the Republican-controlled government ensures the continuation of the modern feudal system.
By Southern Democrat
June 21, 2006 04:15 PM | Link to this
Here, here, MClark! I look forward to reading your posts. I, too, will try to ensure my posts are non-venemous and constructive. Hopefully everyone else will follow suit and we can have a respectful political debate, something that is sorely lacking in our great country.
By Vatican Lectures
June 21, 2006 04:23 PM | Link to this
The vitriolic tone on this board is not partisan based. It comes from minds who have no idea where they fall on a spectrum of right, left, and middle. People just want to sound off and mark their territory like leaking hyenas.
Proof? The lip-synched W speak from the right concerning the mission of our troops in Iraq: Not one poster has been able to avoid the circular logic of W’s argument. SO either everyone on the right is oblivious to truth, or they just want to wet something.
By Just Say It
June 21, 2006 04:32 PM | Link to this
Republican critics [of the bill to raise the minimum wage] said the minimum wage was a job killer, not the boon to low-wage workers portrayed by Democrats.
Hmmm… I thought the ongoing TAX CUTS for the wealthiest among us, and for corporations (corporate welfare) were going to create jobs and stimulate the economy! But yet, employers cannot AFFORD to raise the hourly wage for those who toil most for the least? How can that BE? When will the money trickle down to those whose pay has not does not increase, but their bills certainly do?
By Rich
June 21, 2006 04:46 PM | Link to this
It’s hard to believe something as simple as showing a picture ID would spark such a conversation. Just shut up and prove who you are and vote!
Dick: I think they would walk 60 miles one way.
By Rich
June 21, 2006 04:48 PM | Link to this
The employers do not decide you idiot!
By GT
June 21, 2006 04:59 PM | Link to this
The poor people’s 60 mile walk, now we are getting somewhere. I guess lobbyist flying 2,000 miles for a tax loophole wouldn’t count in this grassroots movement.
By Rich
June 21, 2006 05:14 PM | Link to this
They will walk 60 miles for a handout. Your missing the point.
By Just Say It
June 21, 2006 05:17 PM | Link to this
Excuse me? The Senators voted down the wage increase saying it would cost jobs because employers can’t afford to pay higher wages to their employees, YOU IDIOT. If that’s the case, as they say, then I guess those tax cuts to the wealthy aren’t working, just as your smart pills aren’t working today, doofus.
By GT
June 21, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this
Oh dumb me, loopholes aren’t handouts.
By Rich
June 21, 2006 05:35 PM | Link to this
That is a very simplistic view…..good luck!
By Rich
June 21, 2006 05:38 PM | Link to this
The “Senators” voted down the wage increase…….My point exactly
By Van
June 21, 2006 05:43 PM | Link to this
Just Say It,
Do you have any idea how few people are working at or near the minimum wage? Raising the minumum wage will not have an impact of the servers at restaurants.
Do you realize that there are more white men working for or near the minimum wage?
According to the Bureau of labor Statistics, there are about 752,000 full time employees working at or near the Federal Minimum wage?
Another interesting fact, “The proportion of hourly-paid workers earning the prevailing Federal minimum wage or less has trended downward since 1979, when data first began to be collected on a regular basis.”
Follow the links and read the data, this is an empty argument.
Just Say It, so if you are still earning minimum wges after a year on the job, I would look for another job, or the problem lies elsewhare, because you make up 2.5 percent of all hourly-paid(not salaried) workers.
By Dick
June 21, 2006 05:55 PM | Link to this
GT My return looks like a lot of others, if line 19 is larger than line 18 pleae make check payablet to Dept of Revenue, sign forms and return. Been that way for somw 27 years. So don’t label me a cheap, lazy, no good citizen, drain on society citizen. I am sure you get refunds as sif GT stands for Georgia Tech, you are flipping burgers at Mcdonalds, did you serve up burger for Harris?
By Rich
June 21, 2006 06:01 PM | Link to this
I want to know why the people who do not pay taxes do not see the impacts of the tax cuts. This is an abomination!
By bubba99
June 22, 2006 08:53 AM | Link to this
By Not Lovin the Haters Here
June 21, 2006 10:22 AM | Link to this
I hate to tell you this, but Choice Point has screw up more that a Florida election. They screwed with my sister employment profile, and she was escorted out of the building, and lost a job due to their imcompentence. Their data collection is a joke, but no laughing matter if you are on the receiving end.
By bubba99
June 22, 2006 08:54 AM | Link to this
By Not Lovin the Haters Here
June 21, 2006 10:22 AM | Link to this
I hate to tell you this, but Choice Point has screw up more that a Florida election. They screwed with my sister employment profile, and she was escorted out of the building, and lost a job due to their imcompentence. Their data collection is a joke, but no laughing matter if you are on the receiving end.
By Nja
June 22, 2006 11:17 AM | Link to this
For all of the people who are complaining about the poor/minority that don’t have photo ID: Instead of sitting here complaining how about you organize yourself and your friends who think the way you do. Volunteer to drive people who don’t have ID to the motor vehicles to get a registration card. In most places Non- Drivers ID cost under $10! Take your time and your financial resources and help them out! By the way- I’m black. And I say this is a crock! Unless you are cut off from society you have to show ID on a regular basis. And if you are that cut off from society- are you really voting anyway??
By Harbin
June 22, 2006 05:45 PM | Link to this
Mike, I agree with you that Westmoreland is a sorry hack of congressman. I voted for Dylan Glenn for that seat, but my fellow Republicans in the Coweta area weren’t about to elect a young Black man, even though he had Washington experience and was supported by George Bush. Oh, well, I’ll just vote Democratic until we can someday dump Mr. Westmoreland.