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Home > Opinion > Mike Luckovich > Archives > 2008 > June > 04 > Entry

Celebration

By Mike Luckovich | Wednesday, June 4, 2008, 07:09 AM

The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Permalink | Comments (190) | Post your comment | Categories: Editorial Cartoon

Comments

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 8:04 AM | Link to this

Ladies and Gentlemen, The Dhimmokrat Nominee has been sElected!

~~~~~

Aahhh, yes, thee loser of thee dhimmokrat nomination for president wins another primary in a landslide against the, uh, winner of the dhimmokrat presidential nomination, how weird is this?

Well, I guess we are talking about thee dhimmis.

{{{{She could take this fight all the way to the convention. She could fight the decision that Democratic National Committee’s Rules & Bylaws Committee made over the weekend, which gave Florida and Michigan each a half-delegation, by appealing to the full Credential Committee.}}}}

{{{{Obama’s campaign is built around a nebulous narrative of “change.” He promises a break with the past. To Obama’s most enthusiastic supporters, Hillary Clinton is emblematic of the past they’d like to leave behind.}}}}

{{{{The Obama Democrats are through with the Clintons. But that doesn’t mean the Clintons are through with them.}}}}

~~~~~

The good news from Iraq that the AJC/DNC seems to have missed:

{{{{Iraq ‘stepping back from abyss -“There is new hope that the people and government of Iraq are overcoming daunting challenges and working together to rebuild their country.” On security, optimism has been growing in Iraq that progress is at last being made, with ceasefires in Sadr City and Basra still holding, and the Iraqi government claiming some success in clearing al-Qaeda from the northern city of Mosul.-BBC}}}}

Better start paying attention, Urinal, or you’ll miss the………..celebration.

But now that the lib media has lost the Iraqi war, the battle against America and her armed forces can begin anew:

{{{{Fort Benning: More stress for vets?- Soldiers try to heal: Some PTSD victims sent to Georgia base to recuperate say weapons training near barracks rekindles fear, anxiety, blah, blah, blah-Urinal/DNC}}}}

The army is mean and terrible, don’t join them!!!

Buried in the story:

{{{{Lt. Col. Sean Mulcahey, who recently took command of the Warrior Transition Battalion, where wounded soldiers are assigned, said: “No soldier has talked with me about the ranges.” If it is an issue, “we will address it,” he said, stressing that the battalion’s mission is “getting those soldiers to heal.”}}}}

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 8:07 AM | Link to this

GOOD MORNING MR. PRESIDENT

AND

BABIES FOR OBAMA

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

6/3/08

200 people see McCain speak

“couple hundred” see Clinton speak

17,000 people see Obama speak, 15,000 more stood outside

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 8:21 AM | Link to this

WOO-HOO!

The ‘toon’s beautiful, Lucko! Obama will make the best President ever!

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 8:24 AM | Link to this

Lots of analysis out there about why Hillary could not “close the deal” way back in February. Clinton politics will not work so well in the 21st century, because America is ready for what’s new and hopeful, not what’s fearful:

3. Presidential campaigns are always about understanding voters fears, but then asking them to vote their hopes. Clinton did an unbelievable job speaking to voters fears but she never crossed the bridge to speak to voters hopes. She got stuck in the fear equation and voters needed her to move to hope at some point.

Hope— not fear!

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this

Aahhh, yes, turmoil and chaos:

{{{{With the final primary concluded barely hours before, top Democratic Party leaders in Washington early this morning ratcheted up the pressure to force all remaining uncommitted superdelegates to make their choice of candidate known by Friday — and thus end the now hopeless, one-time frontrunning campaign of New York Sen. Hillary Clinton.}}}}

Thee Dhimmokrat Party Grandees have sElected a presidential kandidate and so have thee dhimmokrat voters:

{{{{South Dakota results- Bruno 55% Thee Grandest Ombambi 45%}}}}

Bwahahahaha.

So who’s in control of this political party?

And do they even care about their voters or democracy or fairness or honesty or non coercion or………

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

TWO PICTURES TELL THE STORY

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

{{{{She just urged her supporters to keep the dream alive, and talked privately about what she would settle for. She has told some Democrats recently that she wanted Obama to agree to allow a roll call vote, like days of yore, so that the delegates of states she won would cast the first ballot for her at the convention. She said she wanted that for her daughter.}}}}

Yeah, right, like the dhimmokrat party would allow their superdelegates to make a public decision, instead of choking on them in the basement of headquarters.

How could they control that?

It’ll never happen.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this

AJC/DNC Management

Link: [South Dakota Voters Approve First All-New Oil Refinery in 32 Years]*(http://www.siouxcityjournal.com/articles/2008/06/04/news/top/4e608d46402d5adb8625745e00110beb.txt)

Progress. But don’t count on some other states to follow suit.

BTW - during May, for the first time since 1992, the Ford F-150 pickup truck was not the best-selling vehicle. The Honda Civic was. The times have changed.

ITN

Just wondering - are your websites in a lather over Obama not releasing his medical records? Or giving any reporters access to them? Like McCain did?

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this

I think Obama should offer Hillary the next Supreme Court appointment — he can find a better VP candidate than the Clintons…

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

Goldie,

We need to start designing our “Mission Accomplished” banner for the White House fence!

I thought Hillary’s speech was good last night - good FOR HER - I’m really disappointed in her. My hunches about her have all played out - she cares more for her than our country.

I didn’t hear McCain’s speech last night, but apparently, I didn’t miss anything - the REPUBLICAN strategists last night on CNN were talking about how abyssmal the speech was.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this

Paul,

I saw that on the news last night - about the Honda - this was NBC - and they said that GM is closing four SUV/truck plants. That’s pretty drastic. Good bye jobs - hopefully the next administration, whoever it is, will make good on their promise to train workers for new technology jobs. We’re gonna need it.

I saw this car prototype last night on the news that looked like a bug, not a VW bug, but a real bug - it had a “pod” center and then two extensions that looked like legs - it was cool - if that’s the future - I’m ready!

By Ed

June 4, 2008 9:10 AM | Link to this

Hey Mike, How about fixing your webpage so the cartoons don’t bleed off of the right edge. Is that so hard?

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 9:11 AM | Link to this

Paul,

They have been released. Are your websites in a lather over it? Wouldn’t that be the way they are supposed to react? BTW, what are your websites?

I still however have questions about McCain’s health.

Ambien?

February surgery?

Mayo (miracle whip) Clinic trip last week?

Not to mention how “odd” he looked last night. What’s with the chesire grin? Creepy.

Funny thing, being a chick does not hamper being president, nor does being black. Being 72 can.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 9:14 AM | Link to this

Talk about dwindling support for your campaign

geez

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 9:22 AM | Link to this

{{{{Miss Jessen is an exquisite example of what anti-abortion advocates call a “survivor.” Well into her third trimester of pregnancy, Gianna’s biological mother was injected with a saline solution intended to induce a chemical abortion at a Los Angeles County abortion center. Eighteen hours later, and precious minutes before the abortionist’s arrival, Gianna emerged. Premature and with severe injuries that resulted in cerebral palsy. But alive.}}}}

{{{{Had the abortionist been present at her birth, Gianna would have been killed, >>>>>>perhaps by suffocation.<<<<<< As it was, a startled nurse called an ambulance, and Gianna was rushed to a nearby hospital, where, weighing just two pounds, she was placed in an incubator, then, months later, in foster care.}}}}

{{{{Gianna survived then, and thrives now (see for yourself here), because, as she told me recently with a laugh, “I guess I don’t die easy.” Which is what the abortionist may have thought as he signed his victim’s birth certificate. Gianna’s medical records state that she was “born during saline abortion.”}}}}

{{{{As an Illinois state senator, Barack Obama twice opposed legislation to define as “persons” babies who survive late-term abortions. Babies like Gianna. Obama said in a speech on the Illinois Senate floor that he could not accept that babies wholly emerged from their mother’s wombs are “persons,” and thus deserving of equal protection under the Constitution’s 14th Amendment.}}}}

Sick.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 9:23 AM | Link to this

Paul @ 8:58 — shame on you. Are you still only viewing Fox Noise for your Obama information? You know, the cable TV station with the banner across the bottom saying “OBAMA WATCH”?

Obama has already released his medical records — why would you or anyone else be “in a lather”???

Obama releases medical information: “excellent health.”

[

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 9:28 AM | Link to this

ITFS,

Obambi released a one page note from his doctor saying everything was cool. Is that change you can believe in?

He did say he was going to stop the ocean from rising. Strange campaign promise but I guess the cult doesn’t care.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Obama also said McCain was stuck in Iraq and out of touch with America. He said if McCain would travel with him to Iowa he could meet the college student that went to class all day and then worked the night shift, but still didn’t have enough money to pay for his/her sister’s health care.

On the off chance that story is even true, is that ^^ what Obama thinks is the typical situation in this country and what he wants to make policy based on?

By LCC

June 4, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this

Oh well, we out lasted Rome by 220 years maybe we will survive the next four.

By I gotta a $1 make me some change Obama

June 4, 2008 9:33 AM | Link to this

Hey Goldie,

Obama released ONE PAGE statement from his Dr. and McCain release his ENTIRE FILE. There is a huge difference between the two and how they were covered in the biased press especially the NYT. I guess this is affirmative action for the Office of President.

By gadem

June 4, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this

Oh Republicans are so out of touch with reality. Still supporting a failed agenda…they do say that 28% of the US has mental illness…we get a glimpse of it everday on this site with RW, Andy, and the rest of the multiple personalities…RW how is that booming Ebay business of yours?

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 9:48 AM | Link to this

Mr. McMultiname is playing around again this morning.

I think it’s a result of his despair over the future of his masters.

One page vs. 1100 pages

DAMN STRAIGHT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO!

Seems one guy is healthy…. One guy has had lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of health issues.

How many illnesses, infections, biopsy’s,surgeries,removals,procedures, drugs do you have to have to fill 1100 pages?

It’s gonna be like Cheney and his traveling medical corps.

By Mikey Lucko wants to have Obama's Baby

June 4, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this

Mikey,

It is quite clear you and Cynthia and most of the AJC editorial board are in the bag for Obama but could you at least try to make some mocking cartoons of Obama. The only thing your “brilliant” mind can come up with is Obama carrying Rev. Wright as a cross as if that is his “cross to bear”. As if this is a noble thing to belong to a racist church for 20 years and then throw the congregation under bus like his white granny because it is politically expediate thing to do. You must want to be the Obama boy and post your video on youtube.

By IN THE NEWS

June 4, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

ON ANOTHER NOTE….

Have you noticed the body language between the candidates and their spouses?

I watched the Obama’s last night. I liked what I saw.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this

AJC/DNC

One more time:

Link: [South Dakota Voters Approve First All-New Oil Refinery in 32 Years](http://www.siouxcityjournal.com/articles/2008/06/04/news/top/4e608d4640

ITN 9:11

My understanding is that McCain made the original medical records available to reporters and then had a conference call set up with doctors for any questions.

I understand Obama released a summary, kept the original records… oh, what’s the word… secret? and issued only a summary through the doctors.

The websites I usually go to are international news, financial, wire services (for a trackback to original sources) - and yours, of course!

I liked your last line. Could add “Mormon” to that, too. Which is why the hay the Dems would make of a McCain/Romney ticket is a problem (McCain could pass on, Romney couldn’t get nominated on his own, you sure you want this man as President?). It’d be the Dem primary coverage with noun switches all over again.

Goldie 9:23

Hey! I’m just having fun. I got my info from Googling “Obama releases medical records” and the most recent I found was that he’d released a summary and has not given reporters access to the source material. NY Times even had this information.

Your link states “Sen. Barack Obama (D-Ill.) is in “excellent health,” according to a summary of Obama medical records released on Thursday. The 276-word summary was written by Dr. David L. Scheiner,”

A summary is not a source.

Not nearly on the same scale, but the same concept as “VP Cheney issues statement, says “I have reviewed CIA Interrogation Methods and Find They Comply With Law.”

While I agree the health of someone McCain’s age is more of a concern than someone Obama’s age, age has not been cited - it’s just been openness, secrecy, disclosure, etc etc etc. Personally, I’d trust the doctors to make a professional evaluation and call it okay. Remember what I said happens when one presses for voyeuristic information? It comes right back atcha’.

Bosch

GM’s introducing a volt car soon (all battery to 100 miles, then gas) which will compete with Toyota’s hybrid (electric to a certain speed, then gas) and Honda’s hydrogen. It may not be like the BlueRay/HD DVD winner take all but a shared market.

By @@

June 4, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this

A celebration with “Twinkles” ml?

So it doesn’t really matter to democrat(ic) supporters that every vote be counted? The celebration comes when the party tells you that your votes will count as half. Slaves counted as three-fifths.

Your party has come full circle. I’m not convinced that’s something that should instill pride.

No doubt about it….John McCain sux when it comes to delivering speeches. Maybe he can send us all a transcript in advance sparing us the agony of watching.

Obama’s speech however, was the same old “rearranged” rhetoric. In his mantra “YES WE CAN” I’m often struck by the word “WE”! Then he goes on to talk about how the government can do “this” and “that” for the voters. So who is this “WE” that Obama keeps mentioning?

In his speech last night Obama credited McCain’s service, but then added that McCain gave Obama NO credit for his service. I tell you what…it brought tears to my eyes, TEARS from laughter. Will this guy ever stop with the whining?

If you ever wanna know what kind of conservative I am you have only to watch Dennis Miller. My Dennis enjoys a diversified group of friends, left and right. About Obama he said:

“My lack of support for Obama has nothing to do with the color of his skin, but rather the “thinness” of it.”

BooHoObama.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

gadumba$$,

My business is just that, my business. Rest assured I won’t be looking for any government handouts.

After three years you still can’t come up with a better wisecrack than ebay?

I hope that changes.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Goldielox,

Thanks for the link. Just a cursory look at the one page shows three interesting things.

Obama has a chemical addiction

During the entire stressful campaign and while attempting to break this addiction he hasn’t been seen by this doctor.

It’s highly unlikely this doctor is qualified to make the blanket statement of physical as well as mental fitness for the office of President. I doubt the doctor has the training to make that mental diagnosis and I also doubt he has any idea what the actual stress level of holding that office entails.

Sounds like Obambi is hiding something.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this

Anybody else notice how the Repugs are joining the rush to run Bruno out of the election?:

{{{{Bush Congratulates Obama on Clinching Democratic Presidential Nomination}}}}

{{{{MCCAIN: THE GENERAL ELECTION BEGINS}}}}

They got the one they want.

By RB from Gwinnett

June 4, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

AJC, Paul, @@, Dusty, RW et all,

We should start an “office” pool every day to guess what time of day ITN will accuse everyone of using muliple ID’s. She made it to 9:48 today. I think yesterday was close to that. We could put in $1 a day; winner takes all.

What’s with the obsession, ITN? As others have said, the AJC has my permission to disclose the truth on my ID. Run across the hall to IT and ask them.

I wonder if the early states who voted for Obama would still do so? Based on the poor showing of late, I suspect not. I guess based on the whining from you libs about the 2000 election, you’ll all claim he stole this nomination from Hillary, right?

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this

Hillary said last night that she’ll make no decisions yet. Who cares? She stays in the race - her party will eat her alive - the superdelegates for her will change their minds.

She said last night that she wanted people to email and tell her what to do. WTF? She’ll use that - “see, all these people want me to stay in.” Please. Hillary - news flash: these people aren’t delegates sweetie. She is really disappointing.

Hillary Clinton - narcissism at it’s best.

If I were Obama - I’d block calls from her campaign folks and start looking elsewhere. There are plenty other people who would be a better VP.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 10:06 AM | Link to this

AJC/DNC

Aw, nuts. Won’t let me cut/paste the link. Else I screwed it up. Just Google “North Dakota voters approve oil refinery” for some good news.

By @@

June 4, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

(((Scheiner described Obama as “lean and muscular with no excess body fat.”)))

Did they look at his brain?

That’s where they’ll find the fat.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

Paul and RWanker— because you can’t read English, here’s a sentence at the beginning of the article about Obama’s medical information. You both seem so concerned that the information was released by “some doctor”, but in fact the reporter announced early on that:

“The 276-word summary was written by Dr. David L. Scheiner, the Chicago doctor who has been Obama’s personal physician since March, 1987.”

I hope your concerns are allayed by the fact that this is Obama’s personal doctor for the past 20 years…

By mm

June 4, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

RW,

I know you are dense but it has already been made public that Obama’s chemical addiction is nicotine.

Stop the presses. It’s a conspiracy.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this

Bosch @ 10:03 — I agree… I was just about to post and ask you what you thought Obama should do with Hillary. She and Bill would not be good for VP — maybe there’s a cabinet position for Hillary, and Bill can go back to his office in Harlem.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this

I sure hope you libs remember this new lesson that the popular vote winner in meaningless in November.

Obama was less than two hours late starting his AIPAC speech. Not bad for a Democrat.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

Paul:

S Dakota votes for nation’s first new oil refinery in over 30 years!

The problem is the environmental terrorists do not care what the voters want:

{{{{While conceding defeat, opponents vowed to keep fighting the controversial project on every imaginable front, pressing on with a lawsuit it filed against the county over the zoning procedures and opposing Hyperion as it applies for a bevy of state and federal permits.}}}}

When it actually happens, it will be good news.

400,000 barrels a day of Canadian tar sands converted to gas, diesel and jet fuel, it is exactly what all of America needs, especially low income families, and that is why the libs are so upset.

They hate the poor and needy.

By Shawny

June 4, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

Should be interesting to watch over the next few months. The young/inexperienced upstart that is dynamic and appealing against the older, experienced yet not so exciting candidate.

Latest rage from the left is to brush McCain as McSame/McBush, but that only works if you haven’t been paying attention. he has a far longer, far more substantive record of forging bi-partisan consensus — and of resisting the demands of party loyalty — than does Obama. On the environment, energy policy, campaign finance, tobacco, torture, pork-barrel spending, immigration and more, McCain has repeatedly worked against his party or his President, or both.

By Concerned American Citizen

June 4, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

By @@ June 3, 2008 6:49 PM (((Ted Kennedy is receiving optimum care because he can AFFORD it.))) Damn straight Concerned A! He’s a politician who secures his tax-free money in offshore accounts. He’s one of yours. There will be no cutting edge anything under nationalizedhealthcare. We’ll lose some of our best and brightest, the doctors who have left their own countries (nationalized healthcare) due to government restrictions and low pay there for more progressive medicine here. There are those who are suing the government in the U.K. for the “right” to secure private healthcare. Should any human being have to sue their government for better healthcare? You libs are a dangerous and illogical (I was gonna say ignorant but decided to be nice) bunch.

*As a Concerned American Citizen, I was a bit surprised when scanning past delirium yesterday, to learn that I’m an advocate of off shore accounts! To quote Gomer Pyle, SHAME, SHAME, SHAME. And I thought we were bein nicey nice. I also thought the Kennedy family’s wealth would ensure the best of health care!! *@@, so we’ll lose many of our best and brightest who came to this country because physicians receive low pay in other countries? OoooKaaaa, IMHO we have THE BEST AND BRIGHTEST right here in the good ole U S of A. Some who can’t get into medical school because they don’t have the RIGHT (bad word) connections. I’ve no problem with doctors earning big bucks. They go to school long enough to warrant a good living. But what’s going on is rediculous! Let’s train our BEST AND BRIGHTEST!!! *I’d be interested in knowing what percentage of the population in the UK are suing for better medical care? How many can afford better than they have? A workable solution for the somewhere between 45 and 50 mil in this country who don’t have health insurance would be nice.
*Yep, those who can afford it can get the best of medical care rite here in the USA. Now we’ll go into the old tirade that no one is turned away at emergency rooms. And they (hospitals) aren’t trying to correct this little problem(?) are they??? Bottom line is no one has all the answers, but what’s here and now must be fixed.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

{{{{Stand up with Hillary today and send her your message of support}}}}

Heh, why not?

{{{{Don’t give up, Bruno! Yours truly, AJC/DNC M}}}}

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

Didn’t Kansas approve a new refinery too only to have the Governor veto it because of “global warming?”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There is also the matter of judgment, and the roots of his political character. We were among those inclined at first to downplay his association with the Trinity United Church. But Mr. Obama’s handling of the episode has raised doubts about his candor and convictions. He has by stages moved from denying that his 20-year attendance was an issue at all; to denying he’d heard Rev. Jeremiah Wright’s incendiary remarks; to criticizing certain of those remarks while praising Rev. Wright himself; to repudiating the words and the reverend; and finally this weekend to leaving the church.

This excerpt from the Wall Street Journal misses the point of what this timeline really reveals. It’s Obama’s negotiation skills in a microcosm.

He’ll start with his heals dug in and then drip by drip give up every shred of our interest to the person across the table. Is this what we want negotiating with our enemies right off the bat?

By getalife

June 4, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

Clinton’s “concession” speech last night was hilarious. Heads exploded all over Obama’s blogs.

McCain’s speech was just awful but the gop have this:

“For about 30 minutes, Michelle Obama launched into a rant about the evils of America, and how America is to blame for the problems of Africa. Michelle personally blamed President Clinton for the deaths of millions of Africans and said America is responsible for the genocide of the Tutsis and other ethnic groups. She then launched into an attack on “whitey”, and talked about solutions to black on black crime in the realm of diverting those actions onto white America. Her rant was fueled by the crowd: they reacted strongly to what she said, so she got more passionate and enraged, and that’s when she completely loses it and says things that have made the mouths drop of everyone who’s seen this.

The “tape” is a DVD that Trinity United sold on its website, and possibly offered free for download up until March 2008 when Trinity’s site was scrubbed and the DVDs were no longer offered for sale.”

The Obama’s hate whitey.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

Thee choices for thee kult (and remember, death is not an option:)

1) Make Bruno your vice presidential kandidate, thereby confirming that you are a spineless weakling who can be coerced and extorted into making decisions against your own best interests, inflicting yourself with a mindless parasite who’s entire goal in life is to get your job.

2) Reject Bruno and have the KKKlinton White Power Machine working behind the scenes against your kandidacy so that if you lose, Bruno will have the door open for her in 2012.

Do tell us, dimwits, which poison shall you be taking?

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 10:45 AM | Link to this

Shawny, though we disagree on numerous ideas, I believe that in some ways we are not very far apart.

And I like your reasoned passion.

To wit: {Latest rage from the left is to brush McCain as McSame/McBush, but that only works if you haven’t been paying attention. he has a far longer, far more substantive record of forging bi-partisan consensus — and of resisting the demands of party loyalty — than does Obama. On the environment, energy policy, campaign finance, tobacco, torture, pork-barrel spending, immigration and more, McCain has repeatedly worked against his party or his President, or both.}

Absolutely a bulls eye!

And this should prove to be yet another arrow in the heart of the non-conservative conservative Bush/Cheney agenda and ideology.

And that is why unless Nader gets on the ballot here, I will be voting for a Republican White House for only the second time in my life…

By Hunkenbane

June 4, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

@@,

This morning our Madam Secretary of State, after congratulating senators Obama and Clinton on their “historic” races for the Presidency, stated quite clearly her fond intention to return to The Farm. I mean, is that OK with you now? Has she yet won your permission?

Look, ‘throb o mine, what I bin sayen allong is, this country needs a visionary university president far worse than it needs a colorfully unprecedented Vice President occupying the corner office of the Old Executive Office Building.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 10:49 AM | Link to this

Goldie,

If Obama does decide to ask Hill to be VP, they’ll need to find Bill a woman to keep him occupied. :-)

I really hope they don’t decide to ask her - it will make him look weak and he really doesn’t need her - there are other options.

In my opinion, that would be the same as giving a spoiled child/adolescent who screams loud and long enough the prize they want.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this

{{{{By getalife June 4, 2008 10:40 AM The “tape” is a DVD that Trinity United sold on its website, and possibly offered free for download up until March 2008 when Trinity’s site was scrubbed and the DVDs were no longer offered for sale.”}}}}

al-Gitmo: Would you like to buy a copy? I’ll sell you one cheap.

Or you can wait for our planned general release to the public.

By Concerned American Citizen

June 4, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

By AJC/DNC Management June 4, 2008 10:42 AM Thee choices for thee kult (and remember, death is not an option:)

Listed below are three (Loser) choices.

The Republican nominee The Democrat nominee Loser(s) running as Libertarian

All of the above are losers, and I disagree that death is not an option. Death may not be an option for me and thee, but what will likely happen to the children and grands is another story.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 11:00 AM | Link to this

I would like to take this time to thank Hillary Clinton, getalife, and others for a rigorous and challenging campaign this spring. I look forward to working with all of you.

Obama/Clinton in ‘08!!!

By Paul

June 4, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

ITN 10:16

Thanks for the first link - a site worth watching for a while.

Your second link - didn’t someone who’s just a blogger point this out a couple months ago - and get castigated for it?

Wanna bet if either candidate applies the same principle of “real deficit” by including Social Security/Medicare? Gets a bit scary.

Goldie 10:17

Key word is “summary” in reference to medical records. Critical difference is, McCain gave reporters access to actual medical records and allowed reporters to question the doctors about what they found. Obama gave reporters access to a summary provided by his doctor, not the actual medical records. Big difference.

RW-(the original) 10:20

“sure hope you libs remember this new lesson that the popular vote winner in meaningless in November.”

Do you mean a couple Novembers ago? As in Bush vs Gore?

AJC/DNC Management

Thanks for getting the link correct. Your other comments - perfect illustration of academic, ideological theory vs reality and its impact on everyday Americans.

getalife 10:40

Looks like she punked Drudge, too.

This is the first detail I’ve heard of the Michelle Obama tape… it’s gonna get lively. I wonder… is this the kind of break Hillary was waiting for regarding the superdelegates?

Just put in a buried soaker hose, doing my little bit for conservation. Now it’s off to the pool - hey, it provides water evaporation to what, offset all the CO2 I contribute?

By mm

June 4, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this

The wingnuts are in a tizzy this morning. I guess they are worried because Operation Chaos didn’t work out so well.

Bummer.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 11:12 AM | Link to this

I have written exceptionally little about him, but now that he may be residing at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue next January, I’d like to add some thoughts about Senator Obama.

No doubt he is charismatic. And eloquent.

And, for me personally, the first attribute means nothing and the second is also fairly meaningless.

Look at Ronnie. The Great Communicator. He gave more silver-tongued speeches than three or four presidents! Yet he was a mixed bag, to say the least, and gave the nation a ton of screw ups.

And certainly was a very mediocre president in many ways and in fact, irrefutably started this “conservative” debacle that has absolutely decimated the GOP.

King George II on the other hand proves that being a professional mangler of his native tongue is also nothing to sneeze at.

He will certainly go down in American history as the worst president ever. Bet on it.

But Obama IMHO is simply not yet ready. His experience is glaringly lacking, though this is not necessarily a deal breaker in and of itself, as Georgie was touted as having MUCH experience and look where that got us!

But I simply feel that he is not tough enough. In a world that now may require a lot of guts. And though she had many faults (who among us doesn’t?) Sen. Clinton is one tough bird. And even the nuts in the neo-con right wing knew it.

BTW, getalife, you should be proud of her as a candidate. Though it makes the lunatic fringe slobber with hatred, her husband was damn good president in many regards. And she may well have been even better.

Nor has Obama demonstrated the ability to historically surround himself with excellent people. And again GWB proved what a gigantic liability that can be.

For evidence, look at these religious nut jobs he has chummed around with for years. It makes me absolutely cringe to think of some new left-leaning Falwells, Robertsons, et al hanging around the White House.

But in his defense, completely unlike our current CIC, he does appear very bright, by presidential standards, and is intellectually curious.

But as supposedly the most liberal member of the US Senate, how is he going to build any alliances and bi-partisan support among the still rabid right?

It smells of yet more gridlock.

But, should he win the White House I will offer my support and will not be terribly apprehensive. Unless and until he gives me reason

By @@

June 4, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this

(((This morning our Madam Secretary of State, after congratulating senators Obama and Clinton on their “historic” races for the Presidency, stated quite clearly her fond intention to return to The Farm. I mean, is that OK with you now?)))

Is ^^^ that you Glenn?

Of course it’s O.K. with me. When have I ever said I wouldn’t honor Condi’s decision?

I MUST!!!!! out of the great respect and admiration that I have for her.

I’ve often wondered why Democrats are eager to define “WHAT” a candidate is rather than “WHO” he/she is.

Condoleeza Rice is AN EXCEPTIONAL ——>AMERICAN<—— WITH AN IMPRESSIVE RESUME.

Now I’m preparing a post from Stratfor. The Middle East is indeed, being transformed.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 11:21 AM | Link to this

AmVet,

With all due respect, if your assertions concerning Obama were correct, he wouldn’t have won the nomination. He had to be tough and had to have chosen the right people in order to endure the Clinton machine and the media.

You people kill me with giving most of the credit to the loser.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 11:23 AM | Link to this

{{Sen. Clinton is one tough bird. And even the nuts in the neo-con right wing knew it.}}

AmVet — I do understand your concerns about Obama’s baggage, but to me, the Clintons’ baggage is even greater… they both supposedly have all this “experience” and yet they could not stand up against Bush & Cheney’s drumbeats to invade Iraq? I can only imagine what the world might be like today, if the Clintons had used even half as much energy leading the Senate in fighting against Bush, as much as they used against a fellow Dem in a primary campaign! Now that to me would have been REAL LEADERSHIP… where were they in 2002, going with the prevailing Neo-con mood of the moment???

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this

What were you guys serving at the celebration last night? I think Obama just unilaterally declared war on Iran.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Paul,

One often overlooked thing is that in the days before the 2000 election polling data indicated that Gore was going to win, but lose the popular vote. For most of those last two weeks of that campaign he added a lesson on the electoral college and why the popular vote didn’t matter to his stump speeches.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

Amvet,

Another observation about Obama - he isn’t tough you say? How do you account for him rising from Illinois State Senator to Democratic Nominee for the President of the United States in what three/four years? Anyone who can do that is tough as nails in my book.

People call that inexperience, but I consider it brilliant - and Devastator is right - to beat the mighty Clinton political machine - yeah, that goes without saying.

Good leaders hide their toughness under their robes - then pull out their knives and kill when only necessary.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this

Also AmVet,

Throughout history, good leaders are those who know their limitations and surround themselves with experts in order to make the best decisions.

And not invade countries based on falsified information - you know, that was either criminal or just plain stupid - either way, not the qualities of a good leader.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 11:39 AM | Link to this

Bosch,

Who do you have in mind for his running mate? I’m cool with Clinton, but she needs to lighten up a bit.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this

D,

Point taken. And it is a god one.

But for me, campaigning toughness is irrelevant. Or at least insignificant. It is always about who has the most poison arrows in their quiver. And the biggest purse and the most cronies.

It generally has little to do with selecting the most qualified candidates.

However, this campaign, on both sides, has been extremely transformative and illustrative. And just perhaps things are really changing. At least temporarily.

Almost all in part probably to the nation having endured this Republican debacle called the Bush administration.

But I contend everything up to this point is all pure politics.

And of course, one has to be hard nosed, very hard nosed, to play in the ofttimes very dirty business of it.

And that does take thick skin.

But does any of the flowery “speechifying” and posturing translate to impending effective, much less excellent governance?

Methinks not.

I stand my what I said. He appears to be a good man. A good American.

But again IMHO, not presidential.

And given the chance to prove me wrong, I hope he does…

By Paul

June 4, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this

RW-(the original) 11:25

Thanks for the best laugh of the day!

Kinda illustrates the difficulty of situational ethics, doesn’t it?

AmVet

As usual, much to ponder. Thanks.

By DUBYA

June 4, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this

Finally, finally, finally, after nearly 8 years of filthy silence and deceit, a tiny shard of truth and decency works its way up thru the dark, bleeding soil: thank you, SCOTT MCCLELLAN. God Bluss Murcuh. Allah Akbar. We r winning!

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

Devastator,

I was cool with Clinton until last night.

If Obama negotiates with her - which it will be negotiating, not buddy buddy, she is going to have to know her place (sorry, ladies, not trying to be sexist) - but she’s going to have to get over losing and get on board with no billsh!t or hillsh!t if you know what I mean.

I have some ideas, but I’ll get back to you.

By Hunkenbane

June 4, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

@@, you’ll recall, I’m sure, the period during which you insisted that Dr. Rice do her duty by joining the Republican ticket. I took that program as a somewhat profane misuse of a former colleague I know as a fine lady and, like you, a rare born educator.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this

getalife,

I highly doubt that “whitey” tape even exists. If Republicans had the tape you wouldn’t have heard a peep about it until October. The only person it could help right now is Hillary and if it really existed it would have been released already.

Since it appears to be only a rumor campaign let’s look at who the rumor could have benefited. I’m afraid the “whitey” tape is just another Clinton dirty trick.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 11:58 AM | Link to this

Bosch,

You’re right. I’m ok if he picks her, but she needs to stop behaving like a child. This is not going to be a co-presidency.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this

RW,

For once, you have added substance to this blog with your response to getalife. Congrats!

By Paul

June 4, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this

AmVet-Bosch

If I may tag on - couple of concerns about McCain:

I’ve said in the past a key issue will be: look at their advisors. Several of the foreign policy guys he’s enlisted give me the willies - part of the prior cabal.

Creativity on domestic issues: seems reasonable on some conservation and environmental (there’s a difference between the two) issues, but the health care leaves me wondering. Seems to be one of those issues where the train has left the station, so does one want to cobble on a locomotive or design a maglev train?

Age: factor inasmuch as he may be a one-term Pres. Not a bad thing for anyone. BUT, brings up the criticality of the VP. Imagine three years out, says health isn’t good, invokes 25th Amendment, VP becomes Pres and sets up for the next election. That’s the VP issue, to me. And some of those being discussed… well, I wouldn’t vote for them for Pres.

And on Obama’s med records: assume they’re released and they show he did x, y, z and a few other letters. So what? Don’t like his personal conduct as a youngster? So what? Don’t like his choices in his younger years? Anyone here want your history up for all to see? I don’t expect perfection in a candidate - but if xyz happened, it’s good to see growth and transformation. Obama said he’s had a Christian conversion - well, to apply a little Christian doctrine, if that means turning away from a past life and following a new path, involving repentance and God forgives… then who is anyone who professes that same (or similar) faith to say “I will not recognize repentance and forgiveness but will continue to remember what he used to do?”

Aw heck, I think I’ll hit “Post” with no revisions -

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 12:20 PM | Link to this

Dhimmistator,

I often add substance to this blog, you just don’t happen to agree with most of it.

I also never cut and paste press releases to clog up the board.

Has Obama settled on a new mosque yet? <—a joke

By Paul

June 4, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

ITN 12:15

I think that goes under the “no kidding” category.

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

@@ says:

“So it doesn’t really matter to democrat(ic) supporters that every vote be counted? The celebration comes when the party tells you that your votes will count as half. Slaves counted as three-fifths.”

Gee if i remember correctly and i know you GOP lovers have a memory span of a goldfish, i dont think all the Florida votes were counted in 2000 and the Supreme court told us who was President not the voters.. Brush up on your history or come to the plate with a better argument.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

Goldie, for me personally, Sen. Clinton’s vote to OK Bushco to invade Iraq was a fatal flaw.

And that was, more or less, the case with me for the other 23 Dem senators who did so as well.

Yet, I believe there were some Democrats AND a precious few Republicans who honestly rue that decision. They admitted their mistake in believing the unbelievable, and I, rightly or not, bought it as an honest admission of a f&ck up. A huge one to be sure, but I am willing to forgive those who, man (or woman) up and admit they made a mistake.

There were however others who it seemed to me, simply changed their minds after the incompetent Bush and the evil Cheney bot completely blundered their way through one screw up after the next.

And had things gone swimmingly, would have been content to march happily along with Bushco to the end of time to those utterly misguided war drums.

And that reeked of political expediency. Did Sen. Clinton fit that description? Obviously, I can’t be sure about ANY of this, but it looked that way to me…

By @@

June 4, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this

(((@@, you’ll recall, I’m sure, the period during which you insisted that Dr. Rice do her duty by joining the Republican ticket.)))

Am I gonna have’ta smack you Glenn?

I never insisted on any such thing.

I said I would enthusiastically support her candidacy if she chose to submit her name as a potential running mate.

Concerned American:

(((Bottom line is no one has all the answers, but what’s here and now must be fixed.)))

Agreed Concerned A. I am 100% opposed to Hillary’s healthcare plan whereby everyone is covered. Obama’s, at least leaves it open for individual choice - private or government. Bottom line is you and I will be paying for both regardless of our choice. The fear I have of anything proposed by a leftist is their historical “first steps” that result in unintended consequences. Take abortion for instance.

First it was to protect women from back alley abortionists.

Then it became a cottage industry to shore up a political platform.

Then it went to a method of birth control for convenience sake.

It “progressed” to live-birth abortions which if denied, Obama felt would jeopardize all of the above. Kinda like sacrificing a few LIVE BIRTHS on behalf of the MANY POTENTIAL LIVES already being sacrificed.

A public’s response to the U.K.’s healthcare.

My Stratfor puzzle will have to wait. Something shiny in the sky and pool beckoned me.

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 12:26 PM | Link to this

RW,

I’m going to make it my business to bring you over to the Obamanation before November!

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this

Paul.

“Which” McCain would preside is the penultimate question for most swing voters, I dare say.

I truly believe the Bush-McCain comparisons are barely, if at all, valid.

For evidence, look at the endless gum gnashing by the neo-con “faithful”. They detest him (always have) and that, for most of us, is an absolutely great indication of his qualifications and character!

As I’ve noted before, he CANNOT name a neo-con or even a neo-con lite as his running mate.

It WILL cost him the White House…

By Dusty

June 4, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this

Oh oh…..unbelievable…(as she fans herself frantically with her palmetto fan).

AMVET IS GOING TO VOTE FOR McCAIN..

When I recover from my “dead faint”, I will then ask the REFORMED AmVet to please refrain from further Bush bashing. Thank you and congrats on your “awakening”, an experience soon to happen to many sleeping Democrats.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this

Wsfw,

I’ll be interested to see @@’s take if she bothers to address your drivel, but the reality is that most of the 2000 Florida votes were counted so many times it’s amazing the cardboard even held up.

There were, however, a few votes that were never counted even once. Would you like to know which votes those were and who hired the team of lawyers to keep them from ever being opened?

By GreenJeans

June 4, 2008 12:33 PM | Link to this

“And given the chance to prove me wrong, I hope he does…”

Wow, did I just get a case of deja vu.

Amvet, this was my ongoing hope in ‘00 and ‘01, and the reason I’m leary of rolling the dice again.

President Bush’s “cowboy” image was carefully crafted, bottled and sold. Now Obama’s packaged product is on the shelves - pretty and pretty likeable.

But Getalife’s above description of Michelle’s DVD jives with what my gut is telling me about the actual contents (of the Obamas’ hearts).

A bad thing? Who knows. It is what it is.

It’s just that this time around I’d like an honest and complete list of ingredients before buying.

I’m looking at YOU, media!

By Fly_on_the_Wall

June 4, 2008 12:38 PM | Link to this

For some that think that Obama doesn’t have the toughness or experience look at his record versus Hillary’s. She worked for years as an advocate, so did he. She represented the poor and helped organize programs in poor neighborhoods - so did Obama. Hillary has been a U.S. Senator for a few years - so has Obama. Other than being first lady what other items does Hillary have has experience? I find they past experience to be pretty close and in fact Obama may have more as he was elected at the state level which Hillary never did. So, who really has more?

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this

Amvet,

The neo cons don’t like McCain because he’s soft on social issues,i.e. gay marriage. His foreign policy is almost identical to Bush’s and he has voted approx. 95% of the time the same as Bush.

The AJC has an article today comparing him to Obama on the issues. He’s ventures away from true “conservatism” socially.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 12:41 PM | Link to this

Dhimmistator,

Go right ahead, but I rejected Marxism long ago and Obama is a dyed in the wool Marxist, so you’ve got your work cut out for you.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 12:47 PM | Link to this

Devastator

Depends upon what you’re including in “foreign policy.” If by foreign policy you mean Iraq, well, he and Obama want out with combat forces. Timetable’s different.

Under certain circumstances, Obama will respond to an Iranian nuke attack on Israel “with all appropriate measures” - gotta assume, reading the transcript, that means nuk’em.

Jihadists? He’s different from, not Bush, but Obama, how, exactly?

China? India? Foreign implications of energy? Doesn’t seem too similar. Africa? Hope he is the same - with aid. South America? Absent Chavez, they’ll likely be on the back burner. Russia? Europe? It seems there’s a different attitude on engagement.

“Foreign policy” covers a pretty big world.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 12:48 PM | Link to this

AmVet @ 12:21 — the Clintons’ vote in Oct. 2002 was the deal-killer for me! And I do have a lot of respect for those 23 other Senators who stood their ground…

By Devastator

June 4, 2008 12:49 PM | Link to this

RW,

Lesson 1:

Every Democrat is not a marxist, communist, gay, or anarchist.

It is important for your first step to remdemption that you recognize the absurdity of namecalling.

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

I do believe that if McBush continues to go on the TV to give his speech before Obama gives his speech, it will be a huge landslide for the Dems in November! Did y’all see McBush looking like ole grandpa staying up past his bedtime last night?

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this

Geez, the great unwashed mass of dimwits that are thee kult:

{{{{By Goldie June 4, 2008 11:23 AM I do understand your concerns about Obama’s baggage, but to me, the Clintons’ baggage is even greater… they both supposedly have all this “experience” and yet they could not stand up against Bush & Cheney’s drumbeats to invade Iraq?}}}}

Uh-huh:

{{{{Yesterday, Clinton signed into law HR 4655, the “Iraq Liberation Act of 1998.” In a presidential statement, issued by the White House, Clinton said, “This Act makes clear that it is the sense of the Congress that the United States should support those elements of the Iraqi opposition that advocate a very different future for Iraq than the bitter reality of internal repression and external aggression that the current regime in Baghdad now offers.}}}}

Where were the shrieks of terror from Goldilocks back then, hmmmm?

~~~~~

{{{{By Bosch June 4, 2008 11:34 AM Another observation about Obama - he isn’t tough you say? How do you account for him rising from Illinois State Senator to Democratic Nominee for the President of the United States in what three/four years?}}}}

A total creation of the drive by media, just waiting to be undone by the new media:

{{{{Obama lets opponent do talking- Republican U.S. Senate nominee Jack Ryan’s ex-wife, TV actress Jeri Ryan, accused him of taking her to sex clubs, according to records released from the couple’s divorce file.- Chicago Tribune}}}}

Oooohh, he took his wife to a sex club, what horrors.

Anybody can view the pages of the pinko media and just take a wild guess that they are in the bag for DukaKerry.

Enjoy it while you can.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

Daisy,

So you can understand standard written English!! I’ll be damned.

Granted, it takes beating you over that thick head of yours with a two by four at least ten times for you to comprehend what has already been repeatedly said, but THERE is yet hope for you!

Congrats, milk cow!

So reform yourself, traitor. Or better yet find some redemption in that mythology of yours.

GreenJeans, I mean no disrespect here. Honestly, I don’t.

But for me, even considering that Texas buffoon as presidential was beyond my wildest imaginings.

Ignorant and arrogant.

Not exactly a winning combination. Even for the neo-cons.

And yes the PR spin machine for ALL of these candidates blows chunks. Image is prized above all else. Substance is secondary. And the media is in a no win situation. They simply air what the airhead viewers want.

I just have a sneaky suspicion that given his VERY long track record of NOT being a GOP apparatchik on a WIDE variety of issues, McCain is now not going to just magically change and become one of the “conservative” Bushbots…

By Goldie

June 4, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

This from Richard Engel, who really knows about the occupation of Iraq:

Bush admits to Engel that going to war was a decision based on his personal instinct and not on any long-range strategy for the Mideast:— “I know people are saying we should have left things the way they were, but I changed after 9/11. I had to act. I don’t care if it created more enemies. I had to act.”

Get that, trolls — Dubya DOESN’T EVEN CARE that he’s created more enemies in the Middle East.

Al Qaeda appeaser.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this

Dhimmistator,

Obama’s policies are Marxist philopophy of government. It isn’t name calling, it’s the description of his politics. Instead of staring at that shiny object that alternately says HOPE and CHANGE you should try a little reading. First go read up on Marxism and then go read Obama’s first book.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this

I think the people who say they don’t “know” Obama are getting that from the same folks who give out the “that’s not the Scott we knew” memos.

Come on, you “know” Obama just as much as you “know” Hills and McCain.

Paul,

I think it’s kind of hilarious that McCain went on that “global warming” tour. It really shows how far behind he is on the issue - he was like a bull in a china shop - he was basically acknowledging that global warming exists. Well, that’s like acknowledging gravity exists at this day and time.

If he’s just now willing to acknowledge that global warming exists, like he’s just now having the global warming epiphany, then he’s got a loooooonnnnnggg way to solving the problems and I don’t see him getting advice from experts - I see him getting advice from people like Andy.

And healthcare:

John McCain Will Reform Health Care Making It Easier For Individuals And Families To Obtain Insurance. An important part of his plan is to use competition to improve the quality of health insurance with greater variety to match people’s needs, lower prices, and portability. Families should be able to purchase health insurance nationwide, across state lines

Sounds like the same old bullsh!t to me.

I wonder how the doctors, hospitals, and insurance companies will feel about this plan - oh, I know - THEY’LL LOVE IT!!!!

I think his age and health are really significant issues - I forsee a Dole de ja vu. I thought Reagan was wicked old when he was president, but McCain is even older than he was. His health worries me too. While I know it’s the law and all that, I don’t like to think about someone becoming president that the people didn’t primarily vote for - on either side. Gerald Ford comes to mind.

By Copyleft

June 4, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

By that same logic, McCain’s platform can also be described as Marxist. After all, he talks about using government to benefit citizens—and if that’s not commie-pinko socialism, then I guess you right-wing loons haven’t been making yourselves very clear.

Big surprise. (snicker)

By GMAN

June 4, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

Somebody please wake grandpa up and lift his head out of the mash potatoes before he suffocates. Did you hear his snoring/speech last night. He can stay awake in meeting and what he ate for breakfast this morning, much less run a country. Please put his dentures in the glass and put him to bed.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

D,

Trust me. I am not thrilled about voting for McCain. There are many reasons to be concerned.

But unlike the gutless, I refuse to sit out ANY presidential election just because the candidates don’t exactly match my intolerant litmus tests.

And yes, it is beyond ironic that I may well for vote for the candidate with whom I utterly disagree regarding the biggest issue of our time IMHO - the deceitful, mismanaged invasion and occupation of Iraq.

BTW that is why I am such a big fan of Senator Hagel. Integrity and valor are exceptionally hard to find in this “new” GOP.

But looking at this pragmatically, there are MANY other very important, even critical, issues facing us besides the farce of an American-imposed Talabani/Maliki government.

I am hoping McCain can be someone who commands respect, from Democrats and Republicans alike, conservatives and liberals, independents, moderates and progressives, by earning it, unlike the current fool who simply expected it, regardless of performance.

And who can build sorely needed and long missing bi-partisan bridges to actually accomplish the goals of effective governance.

And he seems to me, the best capable of doing that…

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 1:30 PM | Link to this

Bosch,

The idea of opening up insurance companies to real competition and allowing consumers flexibility to tailor their coverage needs probably does sound the same old, same old to you, but the fact is we’ve never allowed it so there’s no way you can claim it doesn’t work with any historical fact to back you up.

Let’s say you wanted an AM radio to listen to that would cost you about ten bucks, but the government said it had to be made in your state and had to include FM, CD, MP3, weather alert, and police/emergency bands. How much would it now cost?

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 1:34 PM | Link to this

RW:

My drivel? I didnt know facts are drivel. I notice you talk about Obamas substance abuse but it is off limits for king George. I hope you kiss you picture of Bush every time you fill up with gas or have to buy groceries that are sky high.. Thank your boy for that….

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this

Wsfw,

Saying that the Florida votes were never counted is pure drivel. They were counted multiple times, some of them four or five times.

I didn’t chastise Obama for his chemical addiction, I merely pointed out that it was one of the bullet points in his doctor’s note.

What was the price of gas when the Democrats got elected with the promise of making lowering them a top priority?

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this

RW,

It’s not universal health care - which is what I want to see.

I like Obama and Hills’ plan better.

By Hunkenbane

June 4, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this

You mis-remember, @@, but no, don’t smack me. Just don’t.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this

Bosch,

That’s one that we may as well not bother to discuss because I’m afraid there’s no middle ground for us when it comes to government health care vs free market alternatives. But I’ll give it a shot.

Where do you suppose the Europeans and Canadians will go for care once ours is “free” too?

It just seems that using the excuse that the free market won’t work so we must turn to government would be a better argument if the free market approach had actually been tried first. Once government takes over a part of your life you’ll never get it back.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 2:04 PM | Link to this

OOPS, he did it again…..

“Maybe” You’ve heard this before

{{{{{Once again, Barack Obama gets exposed as an empty suit. Maybe if Barack Obama would do more than just visit the Senate but hold hearings on Afghanistan, pay attention to Iran, and really investigate the upcoming entitlement crisis, he’d be a better candidate for President. At least he might be able to generate an original thought or two rather than regurgitating the Democrats’ Greatest Flops.}}}}}

By Paul

June 4, 2008 2:15 PM | Link to this

ITN-Goldie

Excuse the lack of link but this is pretty momentous. You know I like words - what they mean - and I think Obama’s pretty precise. So when he says he would do “everything” it means there is nothing he would not do.

That, plus his declaration to not take military (nuke?) options off: gee, if this was Bush or McCain would you be linking to sites about “warmongering” and “fear?”

The differences, they are diminshing-

Briebart: Democratic presumptive presidential nominee Barack Obama vowed Wednesday he would work to “eliminate” the threat posed by Iran to security in the Middle East and around the globe. “There’s no greater threat to Israel or to the peace and stability of the region than Iran,” he told the powerful pro-Israel lobby, the American Israel Public Affairs Council (AIPAC).

“The danger from Iran is grave and real and my goal will be to eliminate this threat,” he said, adding loudly to add emphasis that he would “everything” to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon.

“The Iranian regime supports violent extremes. And challenges across the region. It pursues a nuclear capability that could spark a dangerous arms race,” he told AIPAC’s annual meeting in Washington.

Calling for “aggressive, principled diplomacy” to tackle the problem of the Islamic regime in Tehran, he also warned he would never take the military option off the table in guaranteeing US and Israeli security.

“As president of the United States, I would be willing to lead tough and principled diplomacy with the appropriate Iranian leader at a time and place of my choosing — if, and only if — it can advance the interests of the United States.”

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this

RW,

Yeah, it’s probably best we don’t. Where health care is concerned, yeah, since it affects everyone, and the free market approach leaves out a huge segment of the population, and is a total sham, that’s one area where I think the government needs to take control. Left up to corporations making a profit off the sick? Nope, don’t like that plan.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this

Look at this little nugget buried in another snooze inducing diatribe and not naming names.

{{{{{But unlike the gutless, I refuse to sit out ANY presidential election just because the candidates don’t exactly match my intolerant litmus tests.}}}}}—by Blowfish

Speaking of gutless, who are you talking about Blowfish? I don’t recall anyone here on either side EVER saying they were going to sit out a Presidential election.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this

Hmmm, I just noticed in that post - Obama says Iran’s pursuing a nuclear program that could spark a dangerous arms race.

Where’s his proof? Why is he trying to whip up war hysteria by saying Iran is trying to develop nuclear weapons? This is Bush and Saddam all over again. Iran’s leaders have constently stated they are developing only a peaceful nuclear program. Where does Obama get off making these baseless charges, simply to curry favor with the voters?

Again, where is Obama’s proof?

By GreenJeans

June 4, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this

Good day everyone:

BTW - ya’ll make lunch at my desk much more fun these days :-)

RW says: “The idea of opening up insurance companies to real competition and allowing consumers flexibility to tailor their coverage needs probably does sound the same old, same old to you, but the fact is we’ve never allowed it…”

RW if you’re still around: I’m curious and need an education moment here. I does sound to me like the same old, so how is what you describe above different from what we have today? What would foster competition and choice flexibility?

TIA for your thoughts.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this

Paul,

Don’t forget the NIE that said Iran had given all that up. If the fever swamp bloggers had read the speech he gave to AIPAC without knowing who had spoken there would banner headlines of some warmongering neocon trying to jump start WWIII.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this

Green Jeans,

Right now you generally can’t buy insurance across state lines and there are lots of mandatory coverages that have to be provided which means you have to pay for them weather you want/need to or not. Individual policies also are treated differently under the tax code than employer placed policies.

I’m heading out, but I’ll try to be more specific if I get back for Happy Hour.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this

Apparently, this is the best they got:

{{{{By GMAN June 4, 2008 1:24 PM Somebody please wake grandpa up and lift his head out of the mash potatoes before he suffocates. Did you hear his snoring/speech last night. He can stay awake in meeting and what he ate for breakfast this morning, much less run a country. Please put his dentures in the glass and put him to bed.}}}}

Oh, yeah?

{{{{Edward Moore “Swimmer” Kennedy (born February 22, 1932) is the senior United States Senator from Massachusetts}}}}

That’s 76 years old!!

WTF?

Old man, get his as-s out of there.

By Bosch

June 4, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this

GreenJeans,

It may be what RW defines as “free market approach” and what you and I define as free market approach.

I too, consider what we have now a free market approach - and it doesn’t work for all - hell, it doesn’t work for most.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this

RW-(the original) 2:26

Which is why I exect yours will be the only response to that post.

Unless someone else can also see the irony -

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this

Ooops, looks like I hit a nerve!

If the term gutless is apropos, it is bound to evoke some unsolicited response.

Guaranteed.

And shonuff, BINGO! We have a winner…

Speaking of paranoid and idiotic chickenhawks:

CONFEDERATE FLAG CONTROVERSY IN TAMPA FLORIDA I-75

http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-30889

By R Reynolds

June 4, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

A lying CLOWN!!! That is Bush.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this

Blowfish,

Keep in mind that not naming names is YOUR definition of a chiceksh!t.

Self abuse?

Later!

By GMAN

June 4, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this

AJC/DNC Management “Edward Moore “Swimmer” Kennedy (born February 22, 1932) is the senior United States Senator from Massachusetts”

One small thing you failed to mention is that Ted Kennedy is not running for president. I’d let grandpa play with the kids but not let him have access to the BUTTON!

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this

chiceksh!t?

Self abuse, indeed.

I was referring generically to the tens, even hundreds of thousands, of Bush apologists who voted for him and for whom McCain isn’t nearly virulent enough.

You know the typical Southern knuckle dragging neo-con.

That you apparently include yourself in such company is illustrative.

Not newsworthy, mind you, but highly entertaining.

Maroon…

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 3:15 PM | Link to this

RW:

How do you know all the Florida votes were counted? Because Bush said so, you are so naive my friend. Let see i was paying 1.22 when W took over in 01, now im paying 3.83. And if i remember correctly the GOP held all 3 branches at that time. Want to try and blame this on the dems again? They werent the ones giving blank checks to Halliburton and KBR nor having secret energy meetings where they wont even release who was there. I hope you had alot of ENRON stock…

By Paul

June 4, 2008 3:34 PM | Link to this

W stands for worse

Association is not causation. Price rise is worldwide - not just US. What could a Dem Pres and Dem Congress have done to prevented any gas/diesel price increases? Realistically?

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this

{{{{By Paul June 4, 2008 3:34 PM What could a Dem Pres and Dem Congress have done to prevented any gas/diesel price increases? Realistically?}}}}

Paul: The dhimmokrats could have gotten out of our way:

{{{{Democrats do not mention the past four Democratic votes against increased domestic oil production in US. Dating back to June 2007, Democrats consistently vote down domestic oil production in favor of foreign dependence.}}}}

{{{{Dems rejected the “Gas Price Act” on June 13, 2007 which planned to improve domestic fuels security. On June 14, 2007, Democrats rejected Sen. John Warner’s (R-Va) proposal to authorize the State of Virginia to petition for authorization to conduct gas exploration and drilling activities in the coastal zone of the State. On June 19, 2007, Democrats denied Sen. Jim Bunning’s (R-Ky) proposal to provide standards for clean coal-derived fuels.}}}}

{{{{Sen. Pete Domenici (R-NM) and Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-Ky) sponsored the most recent domestic energy proposal in Senate. The Senators’ plan, titled “The American Energy Production Act” (S.2958), projects a production of 24 billion barrels of oil domestically as well as opens up the potential of oil shale and coal-to-liquid technology.}}}}

Republicans care about the poor, dhimmokrats don’t.

By oj

June 4, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this

Bosch, if you have your guy J.E. Carter’s passport, would you please give it back? The great patriot needs to leave the country again…

By Paul

June 4, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

AJC/DNC Management

But I thought all that exploration, drilling, manufacturing for the parts, processing, trucking, etc. provided jobs?

Which pay wages they could then tax?

So where’s the downside?

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this

Paul,

The answer to that is very easy.

1st- Dont invade a Middle eastern counry like say Iraq who was the #2 supplier to the world.

2nd- how about no secret energy meetings where your buddies like Enron can manipulate the energy markets to line their pockets.

By Just Saying

June 4, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this

The deeper truth is that Democrats vote down domestic oil production in favor of conservation, higher efficiency, alternative sources….

It’s the greed and obstinance of Big Awl and folks like Andi and Cheney that get in the way and keep us sucking at the teat of foreign oil.

Wasn’t GM in the headlines yesterday introducing vehicles with higher efficiency? Gee…wonder how long that technology has been sitting on the shelf.

By Inadequate White (She)male

June 4, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this

Yep. My new screen name.

Thank you Harriet Christian.

Kisses,

Andiduh

By Paul

June 4, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this

W for worst,

I rather thought back then Iraq was outproduced by Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Mexico, the US (you read that right), Canada, the UK, Norway, Russia… you get my point.

I don’t doubt the oil companies are exploiting the situation - but exploitation is not the same as your contention of causing through “secret meetings.” The action that resulted from those meetings was …?

AJC/DNC makes a point that our lack of domestic production expansion has contributed. Just the other day in front of Congress George Soros (appeal, hear, to leftwing idols) said speculators were the prime movers. Kinda funny, he agrees with o’Reilly on that.

So do I.

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this

W stands for Worst:

(((Gee if i remember correctly and i know you GOP lovers have a memory span of a goldfish, i dont think all the Florida votes were counted in 2000 and the Supreme court told us who was President not the voters.)))

I didn’t whine about it. The Democrats did then, but aren’t now. Pray tell, what’s the difference? I believe the rallying cry then was “NEVER AGAIN” and here you are…

George Bush beat Al Gore by only 543 votes in Florida. Gore needed Florida’s electoral votes in order to win the presidency. He didn’t get ‘em. End of story!

Twelve percent of Florida Democrats (over 200,000) voted for Republican George Bush. If one percent of those Democrats had stuck with their own candidate, Al Gore would easily have won Florida and become president. In addition, half of all registered Democrats did not even bother going to the polls and voting.

Don’t complain if a bunch of “Pregnant Chads” couldn’t deliver the crying baby Al Gore into your loving arms.

You diehard dems are averse to looking at the failings of your candidate or the voters who failed to show up.

Heck, Al Gore couldn’t even win Tennessee, his home state. Now that’s a humiliating defeat.

Glenn:

(((Mis-remembered?)))

I recall something about a petition which I agreed to sign. A petition is not a mandate…it’s a request. My comments on the subject can be seen here and here.

In that last link someone claiming to be “The Real Glenn” showed up.

So which one are you Glenn? Better yet….who are you Glenn, and how many of you are there?

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this

Just saying,

I found that hilarious about GM, the same company that built the electric car and then scrapped it for no reason. And the battery inventor made a better battery for the car and Texaco bought that and never sold that batter, gee wonder why…….

By Paul

June 4, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this

Just Saying,

Both sides want all or nothing. Production, alternate forms, fuel effeciency - there has to be give and take. So much lofty talk, but in the details say “no nuclear, no wind, no clean coal, no mileage standards” and you have the mess we have now.

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:33 PM | Link to this

Ready for Stratfor anyone?

Flush with cash, the Saudis make their move.

(((The Saudis are hosting an interfaith conference June 4. Four hundred Islamic scholars from around the world will be there, with one day devoted to interfaith issues. Saudi King Abdullah will open the conference, over which Saudi Shura Council head Saleh bin Huma will preside. This is clearly intended to be a major event, not minimized by the fact that Ali Akbar Hashemi Rafsanjani, Iran’s most influential leader — who heads Iran’s Assembly of Experts, the body that elects and can remove the Supreme Leader — will be attending as well. Rafsanjani was specifically invited by the Saudi ambassador to Iran last Wednesday with the following message: “King Abdullah believes you have a great stature in the Islamic world … and he has assigned me the duty of inviting you to the conference.” We would not have expected to see a meeting on interfaith dialogue even a year ago.)))

(((Rafsanjani is viewed as a pragmatist, a familiar and well-known man on the Iranian political scene with whom Washington could actually hold a conversation.)))

(((Rafsanjani has warned his colleagues to beware of the American “wounded tiger” and not be too brazen in their battle against the United States over Iraq.))) to be cont’d.

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this

Al Qaeda’s response?

(((For its part, al Qaeda condemned the conference. Its spokesman, Abu Yahya al-Libi, said of Abdullah via videotape that “He who is called the defender of monotheism by sycophantic clerics is raising the flag of brotherhood between religions … and thinks he has found the wisdom to stop wars and prevent the causes of enmity between religions and peoples.” He went on to say “By God, if you don’t resist heroically against this wanton tyrant … the day will come when church bells will ring in the heart of the Arabian Peninsula.” In the past, the Saudis have been very careful not to push al Qaeda, or the kingdom’s own conservatives, too far.)))

(((One reason for the change might be the increasing focus by conservative Saudi clerics on the Shia, particularly Iran and Hezbollah. Twenty-two leading conservative clerics issued a statement condemning the Shia as destabilizing the Arab world and hostile to Sunnis. More important, they claimed that Iran and Hezbollah are only pretending to be hostile to the United States and Jews. In a translation by The Associated Press, the clerics said that “If they (Shiites) have a country, they humiliate and exert control in their rule over Sunnis. They sow strife, corruption and destruction among Muslims and destabilize security in Muslim countries … such as Yemen.” This view paralleled statements by al Qaeda No. 2 Ayman al-Zawahiri a few weeks back.)))

(((The Saudis are engaged in a massive maneuver to try to pacify the region, if not forever, then for at least as long as oil prices are high. The Saudis are quietly encouraging the Syrian-Israeli peace talks along with the Turks, and one of the reasons for Syrian participation is undoubtedly assurances of Saudi investments in Syria and Lebanon from which Damascus can benefit. The Saudis also are encouraging Israeli-Palestinian talks, and there is, we suspect, Saudi pressure on Hamas to be more cooperative in those talks. The Saudis have no interest in an Israeli-Syrian or Israeli-Hezbollah conflict right now that might destabilize the region.)))

So their motivation is money? Following where it does in the Middle East’s sequence of events, who’s to say this peace can’t be permanent.

Not me!

Money talks.

Powers walk.

Drill now! Pursue fuel-efficient cars! Renewable energy sources, and let China and India deal with the Middle East. They have radical extremists in their mi

By Paul

June 4, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this

W for worst 4:24

The reason GM scrapped those cars were multi: if they had sold them, by law, they’d have been responsible for all the warranty/emission costs (they were lease vehicles, no purchase). Batteries weren’t all that hot. GM invested a billion and saw it as a money-loser.

Going for utopia is always easier with other peoples’ money. But they kept their program going and in two years will produce a viable electric car. There’s a market, and a profit, on the horizon.

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this

Well damn!!!! they cut me off with three little letters.

“dst”.

Tah dah!!!!!!

By Paul

June 4, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this

@@

Thanks. Looks like some opportunities - hope they don’t get frittered away.

You sure that was Stratfor? Not MSNBC? ThinkProgress? Huffington Post? You sure?

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this

Positive Paul. I haven’t really checked to see if the conference was covered by anyone else but what the hey….let’s look further:

(((Finally, the Saudis have had enough of the war in Iraq. They do not want increased Iranian power in Iraq. They do not want to see the Sunnis marginalized. They do not want to see al Qaeda dominating the Iraqi Sunnis. They have influence with the Iraqi Sunnis, and money buys even more. Ever since 2003, with the exception of the Kurdish region, the development of Iraqi oil has been stalled. Iraqis of all factions are aware of how much money they’ve lost because of their civil war. This is a lever that the Saudis can use in encouraging some sort of peace in Iraq.)))

(((It is not that Saudi Arabia has become pacifist by any means. Nor are they expecting (or, frankly, interested in) lasting peace. They are interested in assuring sufficient stability over the coming months and years so they can concentrate on making money from oil. To do this they need to carry out a complex maneuver. They need to refocus their own religious conservatives against the Shia. They need to hem in Iran, the main Shiite power. They need to reposition themselves politically in the United States, the country that ultimately guarantees Saudi national security. And they need to at least lower the temperature in Middle Eastern conflicts or, better still, forge peace treaties.))) to be cont’d.

By Dusty

June 4, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

Oh bother….someone is at it again..like RedNeck is for real…”typical Southern knuckle dragging neocons”…thank you, AmWet.

You think Sen. Kennedy would agree with you? Soon as Massachusett’s doctors said “brain cancer”, Kennedy jumped in his plane and flew south to find the experts. The South is where you find them.

Keep preaching, rejects and runaways from the north who can’t take it there anymore. We put up with you because we know what we have is that which you never had….brains,’manners’ and sunshine. But I might add, putin’ up with you aint easy! Try to absorb a little SOMETHING! Phleeeeze!

By @@

June 4, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

(((The Saudis don’t care if these treaties are permanent, but neither would they object if they were. Like any state, Saudi Arabia has interests to pursue; these interests change over time, but right now is the time for stability. Later is later. It is therefore no surprise that Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak visited Riyadh for talks this weekend. The discussions weren’t theological in nature. Mubarak shares with the Saudis an interest in an Israeli-Palestinian peace. Mubarak fears the spread of Hamas’ ideas back into Egypt and he wants the radical Palestinian group kept in its Gaza box. A large cache of weapons uncovered in the Sinai last week, including surface to air missiles, is as much a threat to Egypt as to Israel. Mubarak has been in no position to conclude such an agreement, even though he has tried to broker it. The Saudis have the financial muscle to make it happen. Clearly the Egyptians and Saudis have much to discuss.)))

(((We are not at the dawn of a new age in the Middle East. We are in a period where one country has become politically powerful because of mushrooming wealth, and wants to use that power to make more wealth. A lasting peace is not likely in the Middle East. But increased stability is possible, and while interfaith dialogue does not strike us as a vehicle to this end, hundreds of millions in oil revenue does. Peace has been made on weaker foundations.)))

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

@@,

Your post was to say that the Dems dont care about all the votes just the ones that matter to them. So i was reminding you of Florida not whining, big difference there.

Paul,

Well since those meetings we have had record spikes in gas, utilities and natural gas. We will never know what happened in those meetings to see how we were manipulated. On the electric car, those points you made were good but what i was getting at is GM created the car and instead of improving it for the future (which could be now) they scrapped it, and the big reason is the huge amounts of money they make off of selling SUV’s. If they would have tried to improve the electric car we might all be better off….

By @@

June 4, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this

W stands for Worst:

(((So i was reminding you of Florida not whining, big difference there.)))

We can assume then that Democrats are selective whiners depending on the circumstances.

Alrighty then….

We agree!

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 5:13 PM | Link to this

@@,

Let me give you a lesson, if you think one party is better than the other at anything then this country has lost. Both parties are to blame for this mess, so my point is both parties have manipulated votes for years as well as this country. So you and your party have no high road to take on this issue….

By MorningStar

June 4, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this

All the hullabalooo about vote counting again (and again, and again, and again). We are not living in the 19th or early 20th century folks. What we had and have is obsolute, with a few CRAZY, and I do mean CRAZY, changes implemented along the way. The only fair way to conduct an election is via the popular vote. Everyone’s uncle, auntie or cousin twice removed may ‘run’ for office. The PEOPLE go to vote in the primaries (both on the same day to avoid additional craziness), and out of the pool of genuine good (smile) candidates, the PEOPLE chose their candidate. The two winners may debate, point fingers, foam at the mouth like rabid dogs until the general election, at which time the PEOPLE will go the polls and chose who the PEOPLE wish to have run THEIR country. At least at one time it was THEIR country. That is debatable at this point. All electoral colleges, caucuses, and other drivel may go hide themselves in the mullberry bush, howl at the moon, or simply find a JOB. The people elect who they want, and the person winning the MOST votes WINS!!! Only an educated idiot or a genuine idiot would think this system would be unfair.

By AmVet

June 4, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this

Daisy, are you STILL fighting the Civil War?

Goodness…

The Yankees are not here because lame brains like you “put up with them”.

They are here to claim what is rightfully theirs!

@@, your post about Florida Democrats and Al Gore was spot on.

And frankly, the best case I’ve ever read as to why the Dems couldn’t hold the White House in 2000.

Rather than face the facts they blamed Nader.

And lost a lot of people like me in the process…

By Paul

June 4, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

@@

“It is not that Saudi Arabia has become pacifist by any means.”

I’m amazed they had to put that in. But some would interpret it that way.

” Nor are they expecting (or, frankly, interested in) lasting peace. They are interested in assuring sufficient stability over the coming months and years “

Remind you of China? Amazing what happens when you strip away the ideologies and look for underlying patterns.

“these interests change over time,”

There’s a succinct answer to the “but, but, we were stupid and supplied Osama in Afghanistan” comments. Bottom line: as Kissinger said, states don’t have friends. They have shared interests.

W for worst

I’m suspicious of such meetings - candor in advice-giving is one thing, but darn it, this was government employees with private industry. Does anyone think these oil guys were going to reveal their future business plans or compromise their shareholders?

I think the technology lags. Lots of these companies don’t do all the subsystems, like batteries. Toyota wanted to bring out an all-new Prius for the coming year but can’t get the (lithium?) battery right. Sometimes you just have to put stuff on the shelf until the component researchers catch up. Not saying that’s what happened here, though.

About the oil production: second or seventh, they’re still a major player. And as @@’s article showed, the instability is more than price-related.

We would have been better off. But oil was cheap and Americans wanted bigger. But in May, for the first time since 1992, the Ford F-150 pickup wasn’t the top seller. The Honda Civic was. Honda Accord and Toyota Camry beat it, too.

When peoples’ wallets get devastated, they don’t need a government program to help them figure out how to spend their money.

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this

Paul,

I couldnt agree more with your post. Our business are driven by profit not by making the consumers life easier, especially the car companies. As long as we depend on oil we are tied to the Middle East, i just read the other day were Dubai has realized that oil will not last forever and are creating a solar grid to supply their country with solar power. and guess where one of those plants will be…. the United States…..

By @@

June 4, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this

(((The rift in Iran is spilling out into public view. Ahmadenijad has shut down the media Fars news agency because they wrote an article embarrassing his regime.)))

Uh Oh!!!!!

W stands for worst:

Policy preferences, not party preferences. If the Democrats put forth more conservative policies, I’d be voting Democrat. They don’t so I’m not.

(((So you and your party have no high road to take on this issue….)))

I beg to differ! We conservatives don’t whine. WE ACT.

Morningstar:

After having witnessed what I have of radical leftists, I’m in favor of the electoral college. The prospect of radical leftists and government dependent voters choosing our leader is terrifying. Having them do so would relinquish complete control to the government. We’d all lose any incentive we had to work independent of….

They’d take away our guns and then we’d have no recourse but to submit to their will.

Couldn’t protect ourselves. Nope….nope….not a good thing.

By We're Winning

June 4, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

This is a special day. I think it calls for another heroic, patriotic McCain shopping spree in downtown Bagdaddy.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this

W stands for worse

The plant will be in the US? Don’tcha just love it? That shows another problem with the oil producers in the ME - what do they do to diversify their economy with their petrodollars? And provide jobs and a future for the upcoming generation? That place is an ongoing powder keg, and as my new repetitious comment is becoming, I’d be happy if we had the same amount of political, economic and military involvement with that part of the world as we do with Botswana.

Bingo on the profit motive. Seat belts? Air bags? Fought because of cost and “wouldn’t work.” Now people are paying for extras like side-impact air bags. But then again, that’s a profit line, too!

By @@

June 4, 2008 5:40 PM | Link to this

(((Rather than face the facts they blamed Nader.)))

(((And lost a lot of people like me in the process…)))

Not a fan of whiners either AmVet?

W stands for Worst:

I forgot about the votes not counted…the ones RW mentioned.

Military ballots weren’t counted. Bush asked Gore why they were of no concern to Al. Maybe you can tell us.

Shameful!

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this

Change we can count on:

{{{{(CBS) A federal jury has found a prominent political fundraiser for Sen. Barack Obama and Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich guilty of 16 of 24 counts in his Illinois corruption trial.}}}}

{{{{Rezko has known Obama since he entered politics and was involved in a 2005 real estate deal with the Democratic presidential candidate, although testimony barely touched on their relationship. Most of the focus was on shakedowns prosecutors said Rezko arranged when he was a top adviser to Blagojevich.}}}}

~~~~~

wsfw: Gm will sell you anything you want as long as there is a demand for it, right now people want something that will only drive for a few hours at a time until the battery needs to be recharged, better hope you don’t have an emergency while it is on E, and will make their electricity bills skyrocket instead of their gasoline bills.

This in turn will put more demand on the electrical grid, causing more coal to be burned, thus more “greenhouse” gases and smog to be released into our atmosphere.

I wish I could remember the process for creating the batteries but from what I recall, it produces twice as much carbon as a typical gasoline engine does over a ten year life cycle.

Not to mention the hideous toxic mess that the batteries will leave in the landfills once they start getting deposited there by the millions.

Do you really believe that GM gives a F about this^^^, hahahaha.

As long as your money is “green,” they’ll be laughing all the way to their……bank.

Moron.

By Glenn

June 4, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this

@@ (5:40): But then, you’ve been a loser all your life!

By Scoreboard

June 4, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this

94 degrees in Atlanta today. Not even summer yet. 90’s all week. Smog alerts too.

Global warming…..not fun.

By getalife

June 4, 2008 5:47 PM | Link to this

Yup, change is here not from Obama but from oil demand. Boone Pickens predicts 150 a barrel and invested billions on wind power. Silcon valley is heavily invested in green energy.

The oil men in WH are on the way out and that is a great change.

By Hunkenbane

June 4, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this

That must be Mr. Wooten’s hired sleezebag talking, @@, ‘cause it sure weren’t moi truly.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 5:52 PM | Link to this

Change we can count on:

{{{{“There’s no greater threat to Israel or to the peace and stability of the region than Iran,” he told the powerful pro-Israel lobby, the American Israel Public Affairs Council (AIPAC).}}}}

{{{{“The danger from Iran is grave and real and my goal will be to eliminate this threat,” he said, adding loudly to add emphasis that he would “everything” to prevent Iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon.}}}}

Hey, cool, we’re going to get the third term of McBushie no matter what.

Are all you Code Pinkos quivering in your booties now?

And what was it you surrender monkey’s called it, let me think, “dangerous rhetoric?”

DukaKerry doesn’t care about our troops.

By @@

June 4, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this

(((By Glenn June 4, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this)))

(((@@ (5:40): But then, you’ve been a loser all your life!)))

Not possible unless —->I<—- so declare or can be convinced by politicians in Washington.

Nope….nope….not possible without my permission.

By MorningStar

June 4, 2008 5:57 PM | Link to this

By @@ June 4, 2008 5:30 PM The prospect of radical leftists and government dependent voters choosing our leader is terrifying.

Radical leftists? I know no democrats who are radical leftists; however, they are out there. In fact, they have ‘preordained’ some of the problems we are going to face, just as the Jerry Falwell types ruined the republican party. Who are the radical leftists @@? Don’t bother to answer. I know who they are. I read your previous epistle regarding the abortion issue. Golly gee! Do we have to go through this again? I (and none of my D friends) believe in abortion any more than you, except in extenuating circumstances. We just don’t wish to have you and George in our daughter’s bedroom! Yuk! Can you imagine…don’t…you’ll be sicko. And it (the abortion situation) coulda been changed….but let’s not let that little doggie hunt again….We know you and others don’t wish to change this from a national level. Yea, and who was born yesterday! Personally I wish we had a Democrat with guts who didn’t feel compelled to be President, who would totally commit to changing the laws regarding abortion. Regardless of how I feel, this is not a point that should be a ‘hot one’ at this time. We need someone who is concerned with: education, health care, social security, jobs. Oh yea, and don’t forget defense. I’ll always be one to maintain we need a strong defense. We just don’t need idiots running the show. Radical leftists….those who don’t work? And who don’t work? Personally I went to work at age 17 and sent myself to college (a VERY good university I might add). No more information is needed, but ‘don’t work?’ Huh? Ain’t that what we grow up to do? Nope, I didn’t go to work at age 23, I went to work at age 15 and continued…….Workers Unite. We need change. We need a popular vote to decide the presidency! We are NOT living in 1890.

By getalife

June 4, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this

Hell Andy,

McCain was comparing oilbama to w for voting yes on cheney’s energy bill.

Not much change from both pathetic candidates.

Much ado about nothing.

By Paul

June 4, 2008 6:10 PM | Link to this

AJC/DNC Management 5:45

Some of these alternate systems may be more expensive. And pollute a bit more. But if it gets us separated from the Middle East I’m for it.

On another note, McCain just preempted Obama:

Link: McCain Challenges Obama to Town Hall Meetings

“Come to Iraq with me.” “Debate me.”

Kinda overcoming that slow on his feet old guy image.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

Look, I found a dimwit that doesn’t know that it gets hot in Hotlanta in June:

{{{{By Scoreboard June 4, 2008 5:46 PM 94 degrees in Atlanta today. Not even summer yet. 90’s all week. Smog alerts too. Global warming…..not fun.}}}}

Gee, who would have thought that June temps in Atlanta would average nearly the same as July does, other than anyone who has a brain:

http://www.cityrating.com/citytemperature.asp?City=Atlanta

DukaKerry supporter, eh, Scoreboard?

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this

@@:

Your post:

“Policy preferences, not party preferences. If the Democrats put forth more conservative policies, I’d be voting Democrat.”

So you are saying that if the Dems pass ed more policies toward what you want than the country then you would vote for them? That is idiotic. That is why Bush was able to destroy this country, because he was a Christian and he was going to restore Christian values.. Your comment is why the country is in the state it is in, its all about ME and not the country. Glad you clarified that for me…

By Glenn

June 4, 2008 6:21 PM | Link to this

On the topic of abortion again, eh? Gee, I see so many Wingnut names and thoughts here that SHOULD have been aborted. Is it too late???

By @@

June 4, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this

I’m embarrassed for you liberals…truly I am.

Is it OK to cheat on your taxes? A total of 57 percent of those who described themselves as “very liberal” said yes in response to the World Values Survey, compared with only 20 percent of those who are “very conservative.”

(((Ponder this scenario, offered by the National Cultural Values Survey: “You lose your job. Your friend’s company is looking for someone to do temporary work. They are willing to pay the person in cash to avoid taxes and allow the person to still collect unemployment. What would you do?”)))

(((Almost half, or 49 percent, of self-described progressives would go along with the scheme, but only 21 percent of conservatives said they would.)))

(((The World Values Survey found that those on the left were also much more likely to say it is OK to buy goods that you know are stolen. Studies have also found that those on the left were more likely to say it was OK to drink a can of soda in a store without paying for it and to avoid the truth while negotiating the price of a car.)))

So how the heck are we gonna pay for all of Obama’s proposals if you liberals are evading payment or stealing tax dollars?

By Scoreboard

June 4, 2008 6:23 PM | Link to this

Excuse me AJC/DNC Management, but according to weather.com the avg high temp for todays date in Atlanta is 84 degrees.

We are a whooping 10 degrees over avg.

Wow, global warming is sure getting worse.

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 6:26 PM | Link to this

So @@ what policy that the Dems dont support that you think is vital to our country are you talking about? Give me an example, Abortion? Gay rights?

By Hunkenbane

June 4, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this

@@,

See my 5:51, please.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 6:29 PM | Link to this

Where are all the moonbat(ic)s® rushing in to tell Snoreboard that you can’t judge the macro in the micro?

By @@

June 4, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this

W stands for worst:

(((That is why Bush was able to destroy this country, because he was a Christian and he was going to restore Christian values)))

He won election….TWICE! Maybe it was the voters that wanted to see Christian values restored.

I didn’t vote for Bush because of his faith. I knew the minute he publicly professed it, the liberals’ anger and hate would ensue. Their fear of the unknown overwhelms them.

Now I’m going back to that Pew poll on liberals and their lack of ethical behavior. There was lots more…I think I’ll bring it back.

Wanna see?

By MorningStar

June 4, 2008 6:33 PM | Link to this

TYPO at 5:57Pm before some wingnut needs a change of depends. Went to work at age 15 (cleaning, babysitting, greasy spoon etc.) , and with a BIG ORGANIZATION at age 17(workers permit of course). Now ain’t that nice lazy wingnuts? Isn’t that what we are ordained to do? We are born, we grow up, and we work (unless disabled or other issue).

By Scoreboard

June 4, 2008 6:43 PM | Link to this

Just last weekend on the wooten blog, ajc management and rw said nothing when Rufus was bragging that it was only 69 degrees, thus dispelling the global warming theory. Not one of you jumped in and claimed the micro/macro theory.

Funny, that it was 94 today- 10 degrees above normal and swoosh, here are both of you clowns chiming in to to discredit my post. IN RECORD TIME!

LMAO!

By the way idiots, it got up to 87 on Saturday!

This is just too easy!!!!

LMAO

By Dusty

June 4, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this

AmWet is such a loser. He is obviously from up north with that “Yankees come here to get what is rightfully theirs!”

So take your rotten disposition that is rightfully yours and head for the hills, the place from which you came.

Southerners love people who come here and love this place like we do. They are special. Our “folks” have been here for centuries. When we visit the rest of the USA we don’t call others “names” and tell them how backward they are (even if they are). Get the message??

I doubt that AmWet would get along anywhere. His specialty is being obnoxious.

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this

{{{{By Scoreboard June 4, 2008 6:23 PM Excuse me AJC/DNC Management, but according to weather.com the avg high temp for todays date in Atlanta is 84 degrees.}}}}

You really are a dhimmi, aren’t you?

Atlanta 98° on June 4th, 1911

By the way, the high was 90 today, we’d better start belching some carbon into the atmosphere if we ever hope to catch up to……1911.

Dimwit.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this

MorningStar,

Don’t sweat the typo, nobody is going to read a screed like that 5:57 unless you use some paragraph breaks.

Besides, I haven’t seen a wingnut mention a typo today. I made one at 2:50 when I pointed out that Blowfish had once again called himself a chickensh!t and he freaked out in a mere ten minutes. And over the typo….can you imagine that? Somebody that gets upset when you don’t properly spell what he thinks of himself.

Wow!

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 6:50 PM | Link to this

@@:

Well since your looking up unethical behavior im sure it will take you about 5 years to get thru the W section. You know handing out govt contracts with no bids. Being charged 45 million for big macs that werent delivered to our troops. Or how about the 300.00 for a ash tray and 900.00 for a hammer under Reagan. Once again you are to simple minded to stroll down history’s lane and reveal what your party leaders are all about. Pop Quiz: Name the only President to resign?

And if you want Christian values restored then do it in your church. I can see you dont care about the economy just what is good for you. That is why McCain wont win the election. Because the bottom line is the economy will trump all your values you hold dear to your heart…

By AJC/DNC Management

June 4, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this

{{{{By Scoreboard June 4, 2008 6:43 PM Just last weekend on the wooten blog, ajc management and rw said nothing when Rufus was bragging that it was only 69 degrees, thus dispelling the global warming theory. Not one of you jumped in and claimed the micro/macro theory.}}}}

Amwet: Rufus was referring to an earlier post I made that posited correctly that May was going to be one of the coldest in recorded history on AVERAGE.

If it hangs at 94 degrees all this June perhaps I will change my mind.

Until then……

By Midori

June 4, 2008 6:56 PM | Link to this

Wingnuts are the biggest crybaby idiots.

Ever!!

By MorningStar

June 4, 2008 6:56 PM | Link to this

By RW-(the original) June 4, 2008 6:46 PM MorningStar, Don’t sweat the typo, nobody is going to read a screed like that 5:57 unless you use some paragraph breaks Don’t sweat the typo, nobody is going to read a screed like that 5:57 unless you use some paragraph breaks. Besides, I haven’t seen a wingnut mention a typo today. I made one at 2:50 when I pointed out that Blowfish had once again called himself a chickensh!t and he freaked out in a mere ten

OHMYGOSH! Can you believe? No problema. Take a break! Actually, it’s 6:56PM, take the evening off and enjoy life.

By N-GA

June 4, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this

Paul,

When do you think that the media will start calling Obama “a white male candidate”?

Don’t you think that may be just as accurate (or inaccurate?) as describing him as a “black male candidate”?

By N-GA

June 4, 2008 7:01 PM | Link to this

BTW Paul,

What did you think of that far, far right web site that listed the names of Jews who are traitors to Israel?

Who came first, the Swiftboaters or the HebrewHaters?

By W stands for worst

June 4, 2008 7:01 PM | Link to this

Well @@ i hope when you are filling up your car at 4.00 a gas and travel overseas and see the hatred against our country, or pay more for groceries or watch your house get reposed, i hope your values are of real comfort to you…

By @@

June 4, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this

W stands for worst:

(((So @@ what policy that the Dems dont support that you think is vital to our country are you talking about?)))

The dems have never supported conservative spending but then neither has Bush. I do believe McCain has and will.

Abortion is not something that the federal government should be supporting OR advocating but they do. Not only at the risk of the unborn, but at the risk of those children alive and doing fine. Sends a bad message as to the value they hold in society.

I support a woman’s right to choose. I reserve the right to use my voice in defense of those who have none. If the government weren’t involved, my voice would be silenced. Government should not stand between a woman and her physician. I agree with the ban on late term abortions as it runs the risk of ending the life of a viable infant. Regulations are essential to maintain ethical behavior by physicians. Otherwise, it’s a free-for-all with life in the balance.

I’m a big fan of Ellen DeGeneres. I enjoyed her exchange with McCain the other day. Ellen wanted to know why gays had to be made to feel different. I haven’t done anything to make them feel “different”. They’re different simply because they are. Different rights for different folks. Take the civil unions and be proud to declare the difference I say.

When the World Values Survey asked a similar question, the results were largely the same: Those who were very liberal were much more likely to say it was all right to get welfare benefits you didn’t deserve.

Now ^^^ that one really bothers me. If liberals are so concerned about those in need, why would they advocate stealing from them. There’s only so much to go around.

By RW-(the original)

June 4, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this

Polly,

If you’re going to quote me please try for a little accuracy.

TYIA

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