Mike Luckovich

By Andy

November 11, 2005 07:41 PM | Link to this

While we have brave men in the field of honor risking their lives for the defense of this great country, it is a shame that we also have spineless pinkos hard at work to defame them and their mission. May God Bless our troops on their day of remembrance and may they know that we will never forget their sacrifices.

By Midori

November 11, 2005 10:16 PM | Link to this

Hmmmmmmm

Andy — I don’t see any troops in that toon.

Only the VP and POTUS doing what they do best.

Maim, kill, defame and lie.

By RW-(the original)

November 11, 2005 10:40 PM | Link to this

Hey Midori,

Wow, has it been a week already?

I’m guessing that you see the villageperson/batman/Cheney figure maiming and the Bush thought bubble as a lie.

If so what depicts the killing and defaming?

By Scooter

November 11, 2005 11:13 PM | Link to this

Midori is the mayor, Andy and RW are Mike Luckovich.

By grant

November 11, 2005 11:20 PM | Link to this

Re: Keep the noise down…If B.S. were music, the President would be a Brass Band! Good “toon” !!

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:23 PM | Link to this

I love how you guys dont have any legitimate argument in favor of Bush or Cheney so you do what they do… you act like the troops and the president are the same people- you’ve been duped guys-

“It is always simply a matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

-Herman Goerring- Minister of Propeganda 3rd Reich

By RW-(the original)

November 11, 2005 11:32 PM | Link to this

luckovich,

Do you consider this a form of torture??

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:38 PM | Link to this

this forum?

By RW-(the original)

November 11, 2005 11:40 PM | Link to this

the link

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:42 PM | Link to this

I thought you made a joke RW haha

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:43 PM | Link to this

urg… is this that lady who drowned her kids?

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:45 PM | Link to this

i think you and I might be the only people in here who actually debate issues…isnt that sad?

By getalife

November 11, 2005 11:48 PM | Link to this

Very sad.

By TrueConservative

November 11, 2005 11:53 PM | Link to this

well if this picture is what i think it is… it is a very torturous way to die if thats what you mean… its horrible to have to make a choice like that but I think its better to abort an embryo than to sentence a child with thoughts and emotions and memories to a long agonizing death…

By RW-(the original)

November 11, 2005 11:59 PM | Link to this

Doesn’t that car look a little older than that?

That’s Ted Kennedys car with a very dead Mary Jo Kopechne inside, by most accounts she suffocated when the car was abandoned by Kennedy in 4’ of water.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:03 AM | Link to this

TrueConservative,

I don’t get involved in the abortion arguments, but in those terms this would be a 119th trimester abortion.

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:04 AM | Link to this

Wow, Ted Kennedy and abortion. Very desperate. Impeach Bush and Cheney.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:06 AM | Link to this

most cars in the rural south look like that… well he’s been on my Democrat @#$%! list for some time- there are regrettably very few statesmen in washington on either side these days- almost all of them have blood on their hands

there have been times when I really went after the Dems hardcore but the current administration has my ire at the moment

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:10 AM | Link to this

I kinda like the old system where who ever gets second place in the Presidential election becomes VP- make the bastards work together McCain & Obahma- theres a winning combo

I (like the founding fathers)hate 2 party system- I mean you got 2 parties- the winners and the losers, the winners are divided into democrats and republicans… next thing you know you get an election like last year where bothe canidates are members of Skull and Bones…

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:11 AM | Link to this

there have been times when I really went after the Dems hardcore but the current administration has my ire at the moment

Hello Mike.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:14 AM | Link to this

well…Im not Mike but I like his toons (usually)I wouldnt be suprised if he was in here alot the French thing cracked me up god I hate mimes haha

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:15 AM | Link to this

I’ve got no problem with that, all the politicians can make your blood boil over something.

The reason I linked to this was that luckovich is always bringing up the torture angle in the paper and Kennedy has a bizarre fascination with complaints about torture almost always involving water.

I might be giving him too much credit, but maybe he actually thinks about what he did to her.

Then here you guys come with Susan Smith!!

/makes me want to give my best Howard Dean scream

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:19 AM | Link to this

Mimes are funny like your cartoons.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:24 AM | Link to this

Ted looks like hes been trying to drink himself to death for years… I dunno enough about that one

but I cant help but think the whole Susan Smith thing… it would have been so much better if she never had kids… this is one of the things that really terrifies me about the whole ‘pro life’ thing (i hate that term- Frank Luntz is a monster)

id much rather the middle schoolers have condoms availible and abortion be legal than to have dozens of forced mothers do something like that…

Watch the Howard Dean scream…that will kill your ratings heh

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:25 AM | Link to this

dude Im not mike haha

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:27 AM | Link to this

dude Im not a dude haha

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:31 AM | Link to this

i want to clarify- I hate the term ‘pro life’ cause its one of those polarizing emotional advertizements Frank Luntz comes up with ‘Clear skies initiative’ ‘no child left behind’- I hate that

instead of actually discussing issues people are screamin at the guys who are ‘anti life’- nobody is ‘anti life’ they just differ on what the best course of action is- the whole democratic system is reduced to ‘wheres the beef?’ or ‘coke is it’ vs. ‘the pepsi generation’- it just stupefies people into complacency

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:31 AM | Link to this

TC,

I think when I addressed my queation to ml and you answered somebody tagged you. So you’ll have to be luckovich for awile.

That 1st place 2nd place thing serving together is hilarious.

Did you see any of the SNL skits after the 2000 election where Bush and Gore were co-Presidents?

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:33 AM | Link to this

well that wasnt dude as in youre a dude- it was dude as an explative

DUDE!!!

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:36 AM | Link to this

yeah that was great haha…

seriously though the 1st 4 or 5 elections thats the way it worked- they went to pres and VP on same ticket in 1810 I think

It was prolly Ben Franklins idea- he was always tryin to get those bastards to work together

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:41 AM | Link to this

I wonder who Mike posts under or if he just reads this…

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:43 AM | Link to this

Damn, you are drunker than I am. Bush Kerry ticket? It is bad enough as it is.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:46 AM | Link to this

haha President Crap Sandwitch and VP Giant Douche… well thats a bad example… washington and madison were from opposing parties tho… i think if it had stayed that way we wouldnt be so divided now…

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:50 AM | Link to this

How about a third party to mediate and come up with a solution?

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:54 AM | Link to this

well historically it has been people who stepped out of party ranks that have held the nation… i been voting mostly Dem recently but I like Howard Dean alot cause he is closer to the middle- I dont know if you watched ‘The Greatest American’ but I couldnt believe Reagan beat out Ben Franklin- the man basically forced the founding fathers to start a country heh… without people like that there could be no democracy

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 12:55 AM | Link to this

‘held the nation together’ ahem

By getalife

November 12, 2005 12:58 AM | Link to this

Government was set up for the people and not the rich who contibutes to the election process.

By getalife

November 12, 2005 01:00 AM | Link to this

uh oh, maybe I am drunker than you. I met contribute.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 01:02 AM | Link to this

well thats why they got advertisers like Frank Luntz choosing their words for them- its all rhetorical politics and emotional phrases meant to make you support this guy or hate that guy before you think about it… as long as nobody talks it out the ticks in washington drink lots of blood and nobody notices… thats why i get annoyed by paople like Andy who just come here to call people a commie

they dont contribute to any kind of debate cause that would involve thinking

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 01:03 AM | Link to this

heh…well its late i gotta sleep

have a nice evenin and read up on Frank Luntz… hes the guy in Washington I love to hate

By getalife

November 12, 2005 01:07 AM | Link to this

Goodnight Mike.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 01:07 AM | Link to this

To be fair read up on George Lakoff to.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 01:09 AM | Link to this

haha Im not Mike- Ill do that RW… ive only read a lil about him its hard to keep up with all these bastrds- good night all

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 01:11 AM | Link to this

tc, typing MOSTLY without caps is what probably gets you tagged as ml.

By P. W. Nickles

November 12, 2005 01:33 AM | Link to this

Can’t vote. The Firefox browser is not recognized by ajc.com.

By Brett

November 12, 2005 01:43 AM | Link to this

ANDY - why is it that mindless white trash such as you and your little friends always invoke the name of “God” in your pitiful diatribes? Jesus Christ would both weep and vomit at the very sight of you gutless intellectual thugs.

By tex

November 12, 2005 01:50 AM | Link to this

Right on Brett! Keep up the accurate cartoons, Mike L. Those goose-stepping goons just can’t tolerate reality & truth.

By Jay

November 12, 2005 02:29 AM | Link to this

Great toon’ mike. You are a good mootbat!

Where is Dusty?

By Jay

November 12, 2005 02:35 AM | Link to this

11:11

By Neil Manimala

November 12, 2005 06:08 AM | Link to this

Brett…you shouldn’t insult Andy, for he is defending legitimate beliefs. The same goes for many of the other people in the thread and their beliefs. However, one person who should be insulted is Joebob the redneck. Then again, he may not read your comment since he’s out hunting coons and making roadkill.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 06:38 AM | Link to this

I like the argument you pinkos have for abortion; that liberals are so stupid and incompetent that they can’t use birth control or restrain themselves, it is easier for them to kill the baby and it’s better for the baby too.

That’s almost as good as quick change Cheney Man, VP at large, sniffing out innocent prisoners for a session of torture.

Life in the fever swamps…..

By Neil Manimala

November 12, 2005 08:22 AM | Link to this

Oops sorry wrong thread

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 09:20 AM | Link to this

Wake up and cause strife Andy- that isnt what I said once again… I said that Birth control and legal abortion is better than forcing people who do make those kind of mistakes into a situation where they might do something crazy like drown their kids… if you had you way there would be alot more atrocities like that- and yes there are alot of PEOPLE (not liberals, people) especially young people who are pretty ignorant of the consequences of their actions- especially with extremists like “Doctor” Bill Frist who spend billions of taxpayer dollars lying to kids in sex ed to try and scare people into abstenence and make sure that contreception is unavailable… WHICH NEVER WORKS not to metion the extremeist families who force their daughters to have babies… the legislation you so vehemently support causes abortions and death- thats why its called ‘pro life’ youre so caught up in the pollitical rhetoric that you have no idea about the real issue-

Ultimately i support a womans right to choose because its not your right, the governments right. the church or the courts right to choose for her- take that away and there will be alot more Susan Smiths in the poor miseducated opressed parts of the nation-

at least some of us can discuss issues even if we dont agree… youre just a white house policy spouting tool

By Andy

November 12, 2005 09:34 AM | Link to this

O.K. TrueConservative, I’ll play along: Revise my statement (policy?) to say “it’s better for them to kill the baby and it’s better for the baby too.”

Let me guess… you’re an abortion “doctor,” aren’t you?

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 09:44 AM | Link to this

no i just put living breathing thinking feeling kids… before embryos

better she aborted the EMBRYO than to sentence a CHILD with memories and dreams and asperations to a long torturous agaonizing death -while he thinks about how mommy abandonned him and he will never see disney land or be an astronaught… see what im saying here? all that money thats going to fight stem cell research and protect embryos in the name of ‘life’ could be helping kids in orphanages and curing people with all manner of disease…

you made that out like i was advocating abortion as birth control- I was talking about Susan Smith… and how policies like the extreme right advocate dont curb abortion… but they will result in more Susan Smiths

By candide

November 12, 2005 10:14 AM | Link to this

The most patriotic thing our GI’s and JarHeads can do is to shoot their officers and come home.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 10:31 AM | Link to this

From today’s WSJ more about John McCain (RINO-AZ) and the made torture situation.

The McCain Amendment is driven by the so-called torture narrative: the proposition that CIA techniques for questioning high-level al Qaeda detainees somehow “migrated” to Iraq and caused the Abu Ghraib abuses. But the irony is that Congress is proposing this remedial overreaction at the very moment the evidence has become overwhelming that the torture narrative is false.

A ‘TORTURED’ DEBATE

By Andy

November 12, 2005 11:26 AM | Link to this

So TrueConservative: You want to deprive all babies of life so that they don’t have to endure the horrors of dying, am I nuancing this correctly? What if a baby accidently got caught in a paper shredder? What if a baby was eaten a kitty cat? We need to kill everybody before they suffer!

By Daniel

November 12, 2005 11:26 AM | Link to this

This is a great cartoon. Once again Mikey rings the bell. Andy: What we’re trying to do is shove our beliefs down the throats of others. And, when they protest, we kill them. You’ve been watching way too much TV. Ta Ta, I’m off to my workout.

By Jay

November 12, 2005 11:50 AM | Link to this

Good link RW, obviously Lucko and his calvary would not miss out on any opportunity to slander the administration as well as the military.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 11:55 AM | Link to this

Jay,

Here’s a better link, but completely off topic.

By Jay

November 12, 2005 12:02 PM | Link to this

Que?

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:29 PM | Link to this

Jay,

AQUI

or, the word link in my last post.

By Bobbie

November 12, 2005 12:31 PM | Link to this

Andy: Would you be willing to share with us just what your profession in life was. I assume you must be retired since you seem to have unlimited free time. I am recently retired after 35 years working for Dept. of Children and Families in Florida. I have seen the underprivileged first hand and also some who abused the system. I would NEVER consider an abortion for myself but I would never try to control what another woman decides is her best choice. That is between her and her God. I am not her Judge.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 12:41 PM | Link to this

I appreciate the Lucovitch free speech visual on the tortue issue; am very tired of any public talk of factual dissent or opinion dissent being labeled, “UnAmerican/Unpatriotic,” or “not supporting our troops,” “terrorist-lover.” Hooey.

Folks who publicly dissent are the true American patriots who represent our real national morality. Troops are supported with great respect and honor; their boss does not deserve the same becuase the troops are doing what they are directed to do and do so for all of us, while the boss is doing whatever - who knows anymore?

By Jay

November 12, 2005 12:43 PM | Link to this

Yes, she is pretty but I think your first link is better concerning Lucko’s attempt at slandering Bush and Cheney. It appears he will stoop down to any level.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:49 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

I have yet to see anyone labled any of the things you listed for factual dissent. The key word being “factual”.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:53 PM | Link to this

Bobbie,

You might want to use imagine instead of a-s-s-u-m-e, ml has quite the blog censor. You can’t even use the word a-r-s-e-n-a-l.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 12:56 PM | Link to this

By RW-(the original)/Cherri, I have yet to see anyone labled any of the things you listed for factual dissent. The key word being “factual�.

Do you need a shopping list? Or just pick one subject or headline and we’ll discuss the nature of dissent, factual/opinion, and the name-calling on that; okay?

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:56 PM | Link to this

Jay,

You’re right, but facts aren’t usually appreciated here. Maybe Cherri should scroll up to 10:31AM and read the link.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 12:57 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

OK, torture.

By Jay

November 12, 2005 01:00 PM | Link to this

True sir, I doubt she would be able to make it through it though as if looking into the “sun” of reality.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 01:05 PM | Link to this

Torture, good. Dowe discuss allegations and what is known/not known, or, the controversies of pending legislation? Or even, how do you feel or what do you think about Geneva Convention substance and torture in the modern world by any nation, and then by our nation?

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 01:08 PM | Link to this

RW, btw, the loudest outcries about being Un-American, not helpful to our troops, not patriotic relevant to torture began with the first public awareness of Abu Ghareb.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 01:10 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

I thought we were discussing how people get called unamerican/unpatriotic etc. for making factual statements.

I say that doesn’t happen when the statements are true.

Here’s a good example from a conservative blog. This block quotes very untrue statements from prominent politicians and they aren’t being called names for that Just irresponsible.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 01:29 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

Abu Ghareb (I’ve seen about a dozen spellings so I’ll go with yours) had lots of people saying the actions of those involved was un-American.

Comments were certainly made about people like Ted Kennedy, who tried to paint the entire military as a bunch of deranged psychopaths.

So we’re back to the fact/non-fact problem.

By L. Brant

November 12, 2005 01:39 PM | Link to this

Who cares if we have to resort to torture to gain information that will save American lives? We certainly are not using the same methods Hussein and bin Laden used and are using and these are not innocent citizens we have in custody, they are terrorists, criminals against their own people and against the US. The ‘torture’ we are having to use on these terrorist criminals does not fall under what consitutes real torture. You who are aghast at the prospect of using deprivation and humiliation to gain very valuable life saving intel are living in la-la land. These terrorists we are battling do not care one whit if the persons they are torturing or killing are children, women or men, only that they are Americans. These terrorists view all who disagree with them as infidels, mere animals to be used at will and as wanted, they do not value life the way Americans do. We cannot hope to fair and compassionate with these people who have no concept of compassion or fairness, they only have one thing in mind to kill, torture and destroy that which they deem evil. I am shocked that those who show outrage at the US’s methods of ‘torture’ show no outrage over the beheadings of innocent civilians, or the rape, torture and continued practice of women and girls being used as chattel. Where is the outrage over Hussein’s decades long tortures or bin Laden’s? Sometimes to stop a bully you have to stand up to him and if that takes deprivation, whippings, beatings, guns being shot off near their ears to scare them, threats or any other methods then so be it. None of those terrorist criminals lives are worth one American life and until you understand that there will be far more American lives taken.

By C. Ellerton

November 12, 2005 01:50 PM | Link to this

Mike Luckovich has yet to do a ‘cartoon’ showing outrage at the way Hussein and bin Laden for decades tortured, raped and murdered their citizens much less the innocent civilians working to help the peoples of Iraq. More and more information is coming out that Hussein and bin Laden had a very close relationship and money changed hands on numerous occasions and the probablity of Hussein having a hand in 9/11 is becoming more and more a concrete reality despite the Democrats trying very hard to sweep it under the rug. How many cartoons has Luckovich drawn venting his outrage at the murders on 9/11? Bottom line Mikey doesn’t like anything or anyone conservative or Republican and he is using the AJC’s practice of looking the other way to push his own political agenda. I find it ironic that the AJC doesn’t not offer opposing views on a regular basis as they do liberal views. AJC needs to take a good look around, their circulation has fallen and perhaps its time they learned why…most people in theis nation are conservative or moderates and they are sick and tired of getting only a one sided view to all issues…the liberal view. If the roles were reversed and this was a conservative biased media then the AJC would be screaming censorship, partisan politics and conservative bias. Mike’s cartoon is much like Mike, stupid, insensitive and inaccurate…but whoever said the liberals were anything but.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 01:58 PM | Link to this

Hi, L Brant (RW, not leaving the discussion).

There are many statements you’ve made that appear to make some huge assumptions, and assumptions are, from my perspective, always huge mistakes; for example, “I am shocked that those who show outrage at the US’s methods of ‘torture’ show no outrage over the beheadings of innocent civilians, or the rape, torture and continued practice of women and girls being used as chattel.”

I have always felt great sadness at the actions of some in our military whose actions are so opposite of the morality we embrace as a nation; I am also greatly disburbed by the actions of others in other nations who devalue the life of those they torture. But we should never, ever become the enemy we work so hard to dismantle. Those who speak out against our nation using torture, those I know and have read about, also speak “loudly” in actions, words, and voice against the brutality of others in our world.

Other statements you made assume that all persons in our government’s custody are guilty, and such has been proven to be just not the case. I do believe that all are innocent until proven guilty and proven with the same judicial rules applicable to you and me. We, as a nation, simply cannot espouse one value for some people and other values for other people; who would trust us?

By Andy

November 12, 2005 01:58 PM | Link to this

Bobbie: I’ve come to accept TrueConservative’s premise that the sole purpose for this life is so that mothers will be able to drown their children in the bathtub and we must kill the children before this happens. With this revelation, I am feeling kinda low and do not wish to participate in society. Why must you pile on?

Actually, I’ve been all over town this morning practicing my God given right to keep and bare arms, with the purchase of two new shotguns. One is going into my collection, the other I will use to blow away any innocent forest creatures that happen to walk close enough while I am hunting next week.

Isn’t Bobbie a true lib though? She bangs on about “choice” and a “right to privacy,” but then sticks her nose all into other people’s business.

The offer still stands if she wants to join my harem.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:03 PM | Link to this

Hi, L Brant (RW, not leaving the discussion).

There are many statements you’ve made that appear to make some huge assumptions, and assumptions are, from my perspective, always huge mistakes; for example, “I am shocked that those who show outrage at the US’s methods of ‘torture’ show no outrage over the beheadings of innocent civilians, or the rape, torture and continued practice of women and girls being used as chattel.”

Who would these people be? I have always felt great sadness at the actions of some in our military whose actions are so opposite of the morality we embrace as a nation; I am also greatly disturbed by the actions of others in other nations who devalue the lives of others in torture or other forms of human degradation. This is exactly why I believe that we should never, ever become the enemy we work so hard to dismantle. Those who speak out against our nation using torture, those I know and have read about, also speak “loudly” in actions, words, and voice against the brutality of others in our world.

Other statements you made assume that all persons in our government’s custody are guilty, and such has been proven to be just not the case. I do believe that all are innocent until proven guilty and proven with the same judicial rules applicable to you and me. We, as a nation, simply cannot espouse one value for some people and other values for other people; who would trust us?

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:05 PM | Link to this

how strange, the word assumption was removed from my post; maybe I should spell it “asumption” and then it would pass the word police.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 02:12 PM | Link to this

Cheri: The censor program on this blog has some serious liberal tendencies. It censors the wrong words and it is easily fooled (a-s-s.)

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:16 PM | Link to this

Andy, hah-hah, that’s good. I will have to remember to not use a double (s-s) in any word. lol

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:21 PM | Link to this

Uh, Andy…if liberals are tied to the use of bad language in public (from your perspective), then what would that (a-s-s)umption make Dick Cheney when he uttered some really naughty words in the U.S. Senate?

By Andy

November 12, 2005 02:28 PM | Link to this

Dick Cheney has a torture chamber in the U.S. Senate?

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 02:31 PM | Link to this

Andy,

LMAO

Don’t give ml any ideas.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 02:39 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

Why do you feel the need to say “in the U.S. Senate”?

If I told somebody to do the same thing Cheney told Lehey to do, would the building I was in be relevant?

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:39 PM | Link to this

That was really funny, and would probably make a good ml cartoon…Dick Cheney’s tortue chamber in the US Senate, the only place the famous bean soup is not served. hahahahha. thx.

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:45 PM | Link to this

RW, would the location be relevant? Sure, in this case anyway. The floor of the US Senate is not a place for any elected official to use the language Cheney did in the manner that he did; that was just wrong. If he wanted to say that outside on the street or other, non-government public place, then he’s just bad-mannered and wrong, but in the Senate? While in session? That’s just wrong because it’s disrespectful to all of us, all Americans and our system of governing - my opinion, my belief.

Anyway, torture got away, but then ml’s cartoon is still good. now get outside, beautiful day. I’m stuck inside working, but I do love my work, so not stuck. bye bye.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 02:51 PM | Link to this

Cherri,

How do you know I’m not outside?

looks around the windows for Cherri

On the Floor of the Senate refers to officially recognized comments that can be found in the Congressional record.

I’m sure there have been private conversations that were much worse. In any case, my respect for Cheney grew. Lehey has had that coming for a long time!

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 02:57 PM | Link to this

I did try to locate Cheney’s remarks in the record; nope, not there. So what if anyone is “deserving” of bad language (and when would that be when so many other words are available that cut so neatly into one’s ego without the use of uglies)? In the Senate, on the floor, in a chair, under the breath, if the bad language is heard, and it was, and it comes from an elected official, that is just wrong, wrong, wrong. I would like to have washed his mouth out with soap and then have told him to have gotten his act together or stay home.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 03:06 PM | Link to this

Who would have taken Cherri for a prude?

Go figure!

(I still want to know how you can see me through this thing)

By Dusty

November 12, 2005 04:32 PM | Link to this

Well, what do you know? Another Luckovich hallucination. As usual—not funny, not true, not patriotic, not well drawn, not intellectual, just a real ol’ nothing. I can’t believe he even lives in this country, much less appreciate it. As to torture, just looking at his cartoons is more than enough. Help!Help! I confess. PLease! Please! Don’t put his cartoons in front of me again!! No! No! The torture is too much.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 04:52 PM | Link to this

Anyone interested in a good laugh should read Cynthia Tucker’s 1950s era Soviet manifesto. After dispensing with the complimentary anti American screed, she goes on to advocate the virtues of bankruptcy.

I wonder if these pinkos will ever figure out that their failures in life might just be their own fault? And that waiting for government to bail them out isn’t the road to success.

By RW-(the original)

November 12, 2005 05:22 PM | Link to this

Andy,

You’re not kidding. I love how she tells us the GOP is in the pocket of BIG BUSINESS right after saying we had no business left.

Marx,Engels,Tucker manifesto

By Cherri

November 12, 2005 05:31 PM | Link to this

Dusty, if ml’s cartoons are not to your liking, why look at all? You can read anything on the two pages of Ed/Op Ed and concentrate on not looking at his cartoons. You must look at them enough to come on line and comment on them.

By Bobbie

November 12, 2005 05:39 PM | Link to this

Andy: Just returning to blog and read your comments. I guess I really hit a nerve as you wouldn’t answer my question about what you have contributed to society during your work years. No, I don’t think I want to join your harem as I have a wonderful husband that I spend time with. Guess you don’t have a wife since you are always recruiting for your harem. If you didn’t carry such a chip on your shoulder you might find someone. Good Luck.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 06:50 PM | Link to this

Bobbie: It appears that my spell is taking hold of you. There is no point in further resistance. You will be perfectly happy here amongst my bevy of lib women. You will soon forget about your “wonderful husband” as all of my women have.

By Bobbie

November 12, 2005 07:06 PM | Link to this

Andy: Since you continue to avoid answering my question I can only guess that you must be incarcerated with access to a computer.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 07:23 PM | Link to this

Bobbie: I am a member of Dick Cheney’s inner circle. How do you feel about being tied up and do you like whips?

By Bobbie

November 12, 2005 07:35 PM | Link to this

Goodnight Andy. Crawl back under your rock.

By Dusty

November 12, 2005 08:26 PM | Link to this

Ah, Cherrie, Luckovich is like a sore thumb. You just keep looking and hoping it will go away. Luckovich continues to distort the truth to the detriment of this country. Maybe you like that. I don’t.

By Andy

November 12, 2005 08:32 PM | Link to this

Anyone interested in a good laugh should read Cynthia Tucker’s 1950s era Soviet manifesto. After dispensing with the complimentary anti American screed, she goes on to advocate the virtues of bankruptcy.

I wonder if these pinkos will ever figure out that their failures in life might just be their own fault? And that waiting for government to bail them out isn’t the road to success.

By Brett

November 12, 2005 10:35 PM | Link to this

ANDY - great white-trash hunter. I shall join your harem as is your frequent invitation. And the first thing I shall teach you is how to pick your teeth out of your rect—.

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 10:36 PM | Link to this

I love how the people with all of the opportunities always say the poor are responsible for their lot in life, like they have any idea…

its their fault half the country doesnt have insurance, and when they get medical bills they cant ever possibly pay because some factory paid the politicians to turn a blind eye while they poured mercury in the water, its their fault their daddy didnt give them a trust fund that payed for a college education so they could make more than minimum wage, of course its their fault those medical bills ruin their credit, so they cant buy a car which means they have to work at the QT and go to whichever super wal mart is within walking distance because its their fault theres no public transportation and they have to pinch pennys to eat which makes sure they have no choice in the products they buy-also their fault- of course if they have a few kids they can get just enough of a tax break to eat and enough corporate beer to drown the pain of the life you chose for them which of course starts the whole cycle over again ahh the ‘culture of life’ ‘no child left behind’ ‘clear skies initiateve’

is this what you have to tell yourself to justify huge tax breaks for the guy whos flyin to the bahamas in the lear jet while his countrymen starve? preach to me some more about how you apriciate ‘all life’

By TrueConservative

November 12, 2005 10:46 PM | Link to this

I used to live in town lake… you know how many times I had to listen to people in 300k dollar homes who had yachts and drove jaguars when they werent by the pool or vacationing in hawaii go on and on about how the system wasnt fair to them…

while 10 miles away there were people who had been surviving on ramen noodles for generations…

“let them eat cake!” you say… I know I put that Guilotine around here somewhere…

By Midori

November 13, 2005 12:09 AM | Link to this

Hey Fellas — sometimes a girl just can’t resist.

‘We Do Not Torture’ and Other Funny Stories.

Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2005 03:05:05 GMT

From The New York Times, 11/13/05: http://select.nytimes.com/2005/11/13/opinion/13rich.html?pagewanted=1&hp

‘We Do Not Torture’ and Other Funny Stories

By FRANK RICH

IF it weren’t tragic it would be a New Yorker cartoon.

The president of the United States, in the final stop of his forlorn Latin America tour last week, told the world, “We do not torture.”

Even as he spoke, the administration’s flagrant embrace of torture was as hard to escape as publicity for Anderson Cooper.

The vice president, not satisfied that the C.I.A. had already been implicated in four detainee deaths, was busy lobbying Congress to give the agency a green light to commit torture in the future.

Dana Priest of The Washington Post, having first uncovered secret C.I.A. prisons two years ago, was uncovering new “black sites” in Eastern Europe, where ghost detainees are subjected to unknown interrogation methods redolent of the region’s Stalinist past.

Before heading south, Mr. Bush had been doing his own bit for torture by threatening to cast the first veto of his presidency if Congress didn’t scrap a spending bill amendment, written by John McCain and passed 90 to 9 by the Senate, banning the “cruel, inhuman or degrading” treatment of prisoners.

So when you watch the president stand there with a straight face and say, “We do not torture” - a full year and a half after the first photos from Abu Ghraib - you have to wonder how we arrived at this ludicrous moment.

The answer is not complicated.

When people in power get away with telling bigger and bigger lies, they naturally think they can keep getting away with it.

And for a long time, Mr. Bush and his cronies did.

Not anymore.

The fallout from the Scooter Libby indictment reveals that the administration’s credibility, having passed the tipping point with Katrina, is flat-lining.

For two weeks, the White House’s talking-point monkeys in the press and Congress had been dismissing Patrick Fitzgerald’s leak investigation as much ado about nothing except politics and as an exoneration of everyone except Mr. Libby.

Now the American people have rendered their verdict: they’re not buying it.

Last week two major polls came up with the identical finding, that roughly 8 in 10 Americans regard the leak case as a serious matter.

One of the polls (The Wall Street Journal/NBC News) also found that 57 percent of Americans believe that Mr. Bush deliberately misled the country into war in Iraq and that only 33 percent now find him “honest and straightforward,” down from 50 percent in January.

The Bush loyalists’ push to discredit the Libby indictment failed because Americans don’t see it as a stand-alone scandal but as the petri dish for a wider culture of lying that becomes more visible every day.

The last-ditch argument rolled out by Mr. Bush on Veterans Day in his latest stay-the-course speech - that Democrats, too, endorsed dead-wrong W.M.D. intelligence - is more of the same.

Sure, many Democrats (and others) did believe that Saddam had an arsenal before the war, but only the White House hyped selective evidence for nuclear weapons, the most ominous of all of Iraq’s supposed W.M.D.’s, to whip up public fears of an imminent doomsday.

There was also an entire other set of lies in the administration’s prewar propaganda blitzkrieg that had nothing to do with W.M.D.’s, African uranium or the Wilsons.

To get the country to redirect its finite resources to wage war against Saddam Hussein rather than keep its focus on the war against radical Islamic terrorists, the White House had to cook up not only the fiction that Iraq was about to attack us, but also the fiction that Iraq had already attacked us, on 9/11.

Thanks to the Michigan Democrat Carl Levin, who last weekend released a previously classified intelligence document, we now have conclusive evidence that the administration’s disinformation campaign implying a link connecting Saddam to Al Qaeda and 9/11 was even more duplicitous and manipulative than its relentless flogging of nuclear Armageddon.

Senator Levin’s smoking gun is a widely circulated Defense Intelligence Agency document from February 2002 that was probably seen by the National Security Council.

It warned that a captured Qaeda terrorist in American custody was in all likelihood “intentionally misleading” interrogators when he claimed that Iraq had trained Qaeda members to use illicit weapons.

The report also made the point that an Iraq-Qaeda collaboration was absurd on its face:

“Saddam’s regime is intensely secular and is wary of Islamic revolutionary movements.”

But just like any other evidence that disputed the administration’s fictional story lines, this intelligence was promptly disregarded.

So much so that eight months later - in October 2002, as the White House was officially rolling out its new war and Congress was on the eve of authorizing it - Mr. Bush gave a major address in Cincinnati intermingling the usual mushroom clouds with information from that discredited, “intentionally misleading” Qaeda informant.

“We’ve learned that Iraq has trained Al Qaeda members in bomb-making and poisons and deadly gases,” he said.

It was the most important, if hardly the only, example of repeated semantic sleights of hand that the administration used to conflate 9/11 with Iraq.

Dick Cheney was fond of brandishing a nonexistent April 2001 “meeting” between Mohamed Atta and an Iraqi intelligence officer in Prague long after Czech and American intelligence analysts had dismissed it.

The power of these lies was considerable.

In a CBS News/New York Times poll released on Sept. 25, 2001, 60 percent of Americans thought Osama bin Laden had been the culprit in the attacks of two weeks earlier, either alone or in league with unnamed “others” or with the Taliban;

only 6 percent thought bin Laden had collaborated with Saddam;

and only 2 percent thought Saddam had been the sole instigator.

By the time we invaded Iraq in 2003, however, CBS News found that 53 percent believed Saddam had been “personally involved” in 9/11; other polls showed that a similar percentage of Americans had even convinced themselves that the hijackers were Iraqis.

There is still much more to learn about our government’s duplicity in the run-up to the war, just as there is much more to learn about what has gone on since, whether with torture or billions of Iraq reconstruction dollars.

That is why the White House and its allies, having failed to discredit the Fitzgerald investigation, are now so desperate to slow or block every other inquiry.

Exhibit A is the Senate Intelligence Committee, whose Republican chairman, Pat Roberts, is proving a major farceur with his efforts to sidestep any serious investigation of White House prewar subterfuge.

Last Sunday, the same day that newspapers reported Carl Levin’s revelation about the “intentionally misleading” Qaeda informant, Senator Roberts could be found on “Face the Nation” saying he had found no evidence of “political manipulation or pressure” in the use of prewar intelligence.

His brazenness is not anomalous.

After more than two years of looking into the forged documents used by the White House to help support its bogus claims of Saddam’s Niger uranium, the F.B.I. ended its investigation without resolving the identity of the forgers.

Last week, Jane Mayer of The New Yorker reported that an investigation into the November 2003 death of an Abu Ghraib detainee, labeled a homicide by the U.S. government, has been, in the words of a lawyer familiar with the case, “lying kind of fallow.”

The Wall Street Journal similarly reported that 17 months after Condoleezza Rice promised a full investigation into Ahmad Chalabi’s alleged leaking of American intelligence to Iran, F.B.I. investigators had yet to interview Mr. Chalabi - who was being welcomed in Washington last week as an honored guest by none other than Ms. Rice.

The Times, meanwhile, discovered that Mr. Libby had set up a legal defense fund to be underwritten by donors who don’t have to be publicly disclosed but who may well have a vested interest in the direction of his defense.

It’s all too eerily reminiscent of the secret fund set up by Richard Nixon’s personal lawyer, Herbert Kalmbach, to pay the legal fees of Watergate defendants.

THERE’S so much to stonewall at the White House that last week Scott McClellan was reduced to beating up on the octogenarian Helen Thomas.

“You don’t want the American people to hear what the facts are, Helen,” he said, “and I’m going to tell them the facts.”

Coming from the press secretary who vowed that neither Mr. Libby nor Karl Rove had any involvement in the C.I.A. leak, this scene was almost as funny as his boss’s “We do not torture” charade.

Not that it matters now.

The facts the American people are listening to at this point come not from an administration that they no longer find credible, but from the far more reality-based theater of war.

The Qaeda suicide bombings of three hotels in Amman on 11/9, like the terrorist attacks in Madrid and London before them, speak louder than anything else of the price we are paying for the lies that diverted us from the war against the suicide bombers of 9/11 to the war in Iraq.

By RW-(the original)

November 13, 2005 12:47 AM | Link to this

Now, won’t this be interesting to see what happens with the AJC illegally posting copyrighted material on a blog.

Thanks, Midori

By RW-(the original)

November 13, 2005 01:33 AM | Link to this

On the off chance that Midori’s 12:09AM post stays up it begs for a little background.

This is a column from the New York Times select web access. It is supposed to cost $49.95 a year to read these articles. The New York Times would like you to believe that this is because their writers are of such a high quality that this is a fair price.

In reality it is so they can spout these half-truths, innuendos, and outright lies and not be challenged in real time by fact checking blogs. They have already threatened suit on several conservative sites for excerpting these columns. Now we have a liberal cartoonist for a liberal paper allowing a full reprint. Will the New York Times sue mike luckovich and the AJC?

Let the fun begin!!!

By tex

November 13, 2005 02:28 AM | Link to this

Good stuff, FRANK RICH. Nice to see a bit of real intelligentsia hereabouts.

By Andy

November 13, 2005 06:33 AM | Link to this

What is it with these pinkos and the lowercase typing? Cartoon boy and TrueConservative? Are they holding something with their left hand?

By Andy

November 13, 2005 06:51 AM | Link to this

-Anyone interested in a good laugh should read Cynthia Tucker’s 1950s era Soviet manifesto. After dispensing with the complimentary anti American screed, she goes on to advocate the virtues of bankruptcy.

I wonder if these pinkos will ever figure out that their failures in life might just be their own fault? And that waiting for government to bail them out isn’t the road to success.

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 07:57 AM | Link to this

you make me laugh Andy- you cant ever seem to refute anything I say with a legitimate debate so you change what I say and respond to that or you b*** about grammar. I’d love to debate you face to face- but you cont want to have your a* handed to you…

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 08:00 AM | Link to this

Ill save you the trouble- thats ‘don’t’

By Andy

November 13, 2005 08:04 AM | Link to this

TrueConservative: You dream of a socialist utopia, a worker’s “paradise,” and I don’t. We have nothing to debate.

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 08:06 AM | Link to this

I love how the people with all of the opportunities always say the poor are responsible for their lot in life, like they have any idea… its their fault half the country doesn’t have insurance, and when they get medical bills they cant ever possibly pay because some factory paid the politicians to turn a blind eye while they poured mercury in the water, its their fault their daddy didn’t give them a trust fund that paid for a college education so they could make more than minimum wage, of course its their fault those medical bills ruin their credit, so they cant buy a car which means they have to work at the QT and go to whichever super wal mart is within walking distance because its their fault there’s no public transportation and they have to pinch pennies to eat which makes sure they have no choice in the products they buy-also their fault- of course if they have a few kids they can get just enough of a tax break to eat and enough corporate beer to drown the pain of the life you chose for them which of course starts the whole cycle over again ahh the ‘culture of life’ ‘no child left behind’ ‘clear skies initiative’ is this what you have to tell yourself to justify huge tax breaks for the guy who’s flying to the Bahamas in the Lear jet while his countrymen starve? preach to me some more about how you appreciate ‘all life’ I used to live in town lake- do you know how many times I had to listen to people who inherited 300k dollar homes from daddy who had yachts and drove jaguars when they weren’t by the pool or vacationing in hawaii go on and on about how the system wasn’t fair to them… while 10 miles away there were people who had been surviving on ramen noodles for generations… course none of them work as hard as the rich- riiight you have no idea what work is- work is going 80 hours a week at a 3 dead end jobs so your kids can eat “let them eat cake!� you say… I know I put that Guillotine around here somewhere…

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 08:13 AM | Link to this

i dont dream of paradise- i dream of a country where all men are created equal- you know- ‘of the people for the people by the poeple’- not ‘of the corporations by the corporations for the corporations’

i just want you to take a deep breath… and realize…. youre a Fascist Plutocrat

By Andy

November 13, 2005 08:22 AM | Link to this

TrueConservative: Answer me this, pinko. Do you have a car, a home and a job? Do you take all of your excess wealth and give it back to the government? Why aren’t you out on the street right now, correcting every social ill? What gives you the right to spend time on this blog while others suffer?

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 08:44 AM | Link to this

actually i stop in here in the mornings and in the evenings between my 2 backbreaking jobs that barely pay the bills but uncle sam still gets his share of my tiny paychecks… its taken me about a year to save enough money to get another car since the last one broke down… if there was adequate public transportation I could get a higher paying job to get me out of this hole I inherited from my poor family and nobody on this side of the tracks have ever heard of this ‘excess wealth’ you speak of and if I had any Id be doing even more for my fellow Americans instead of doing even more for myself and calling it ‘christian family values’ ‘no child left behind’ or ‘Patriotism’

Im glad youre daddy had enough money to isolate you so thoroughly from the poverty and opression in your own country

how is it that you can wave your flag and say you love America while you clearly despise most Americans?

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 08:55 AM | Link to this

before you go berating poor people who you leach off of again i would reccomend you read a history book and see what happnens when wealthy fascists like you opress the poor and then wave your opulence in their face or try to take their liberties away

By Andy

November 13, 2005 09:24 AM | Link to this

Anybody want to bet: Hillary Tucker, I’m just using her as an example, lives in a 4 story loft in Midtown Atlanta that offers her a premium view of the area’s homeless? That, in occasional fits of compassion, she tosses out table scraps to them from her 3rd story kitchen window? That when she pulls the Escalade out from the covered underground parking lot, she wishes they wouldn’t offer to clean her windshield, so she gives them a dollar before they can touch it?

That when she writes her pinko columns she dreams of row after row of slum houses, built over by the city landfill and wastewater treatment plant, where the poor can be kept safe and out of view? Where no one has a car, those terrible wasters of natural resources and spoilers of the environment? And all the other wonderful things the democrats did when they were in charge?

TrueConservative: Deny for me the fact that welfare reform, a conservative initiative, has lifted more families out of poverty and given them financial stability than all of the “great society” social programs put together. Or do all you know how to do is whine and moan?

By Andy

November 13, 2005 09:36 AM | Link to this

So I’m the only one who has noticed, since Bush has taken office, all of the new houses and condos sprouting up everywhere and the fact that fewer people are living in the projects now? I’m sorry that everyone else is blind and can’t see all of the inner city renovations that are taking place. It is quite a breathtaking sight.

By Andy

November 13, 2005 09:55 AM | Link to this

The only reason these democrats carry on like they do is so that they don’t lose the vote of the poor black minorities. It is really a shame, a disgrace. Point to one thing the democrats have done over 40 years of power that has amounted to anything in the lives of these people.

I’m off to church, I’ll see y’all later.

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 10:01 AM | Link to this

i never whined and moaned… and I never asked anybody for anything but a fair shake… never on welfare or any of that crap… i just wanted you to know that while you TALK about poverty I have actually LIVED it you fascist p******. So dont condescend to preach to me about whats best for the poor. youre talking Democrat Vs Republican…Im talking rich VS poor

oooh new condos in the inner city… to bad the poverty stricken cant afford them, but those homeless people are out of sight and that makes it all better. What about the other 99% of America? You know all those rural people who have to walk for an hour to work at a minimum wage job that doesnt pay the bills… who hack and wheeze for months before going to a Doctor only to have those huge medical bills drive them back into a poverty they just worked for years to get out of… but you wouldnt know anything about that would you?

As far as the environment goes… do you really think the extreme right has helped? When they want to destroy the forests, they call it the Healthy Forest Act; when they want to destroy the air, they call it the Clear Skies bill. They’ve put polluters in charge of the agencies that are supposed to protect Americans from pollution. The head of the Forest Service is Mark Rey, probably the most rapacious timber industry lobbyist in American history. The head of public lands is Steven Griles, a mining industry lobbyist who believes public lands are unconstitutional. The head of the air division of the EPA was Marianne Horinko, whose former job had been advising corporate polluters on how to evade Superfund. Of course they just disolved superfund so now when Oil refineries dump crude in the earth our taxes pay to clean it up.

Im not the one who needs to wake up Andy

By TrueConservative

November 13, 2005 10:10 AM | Link to this

when you get back from church heres a verse for you… 9Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.

41”Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44”They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45”He will reply, ‘I tell you the truth, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

going to church doesnt make you a Christian

By Tony

November 13, 2005 12:53 PM | Link to this

IN response to the keep the noise down cartoon, Mike should be ashamed of himself, he knows full well that american troops do not use torture, if you want true torture go to any muslim controlled country and you will find beheadings, suicide bombers, women torture, etc. Mike is just a bush hater and will go to any links to picture this adminstration in negative tersm, get a clue you red diaper baby. This newspaper might sell a few papers outside of metro atlanta slums, if you would run editorals and such that represent the conservative base of this state , that voted twice overwhelmingly for Bush

By Andy

November 13, 2005 12:55 PM | Link to this

TrueConservative: How can you even know how low I’ve been in my life or what I am doing for others now? You’re an awfully pompous little pinko, thinking that you are better than others, just because you tell everybody how good your are and how they should do their good works.

You pinko lib democrats had 50 years to put your money where your mouth is. All we got out of you was talk. The Conservatives are in charge now, we are lowering tax burdens, providing affordable housing, creating jobs, growing the economy, providing people ownership of their retirements and freeing the Middle East from religious persecution. I cite these things from all of the factual evidence that anyone can see if they so choose to look for it. I don’t provide my facts by quoting directly from Cynthia Tucker’s socialist column as you do. Maybe you are Cynthia Tucker?

By candide

November 13, 2005 04:01 PM | Link to this

John Edward has finally admitted he was wrong about supporting the Iraq war. So has John Kerry. Better late than never. It is time to throw out Bush and all his deceitful clique.

By Andy

November 13, 2005 04:17 PM | Link to this

I wonder if these pinkos will ever figure out that their failures in life might just be their own fault? And that waiting for government to bail them out isn’t the road to success.

By sct

November 13, 2005 04:41 PM | Link to this

At least we know why Gannon/Guckert was spending the night at the White House so often. The current administation sure seems to like the S&M/torture crowd.

By getalife

November 13, 2005 04:57 PM | Link to this

That is a great idea TC. Let all the Bush lovers sign up, go to Iraq and fight his war.

By Andy

November 13, 2005 05:24 PM | Link to this

I did my time in the 2nd Battalion, 8th Field Artillery, I was a forward observer. During my hitch in the service, the camel jockeys hadn’t yet come up with the idea to knock over our skyscrapers. I wish I was young enough to serve now, I would not get weak kneed and weepy like you pinko libs are doing. I would enjoy killing these savages. From what they have told us, they would enjoy me killing them too. It would be mutually satisfying experience for all involved.

By getalife

November 13, 2005 05:33 PM | Link to this

Go getem b-a-d-a-s-s. You are never too old because the Army can’t get recruits so they will let you go.

By Joe Roman

November 13, 2005 08:00 PM | Link to this

If this torture edict was being perpetrated by veterans embittered by some psychotic flashback, it would only be embarrassing. But the fact that it is being kept alive by documented, draft dodging cowards like Dick Cheney is absolutely outrageous. It is certainly no reflection of what we as a people are all about. If it were, we’d have dragged Cheney out into the streets by now, lynched his murderous butt and set fire to his body, and not necessarily in that order. The only thing worse than a sadist is a stupid, hypocritical sadist. These people have no shame!

By Joe Roman

November 13, 2005 08:07 PM | Link to this

It’s no wonder we have a government like this. Making fun of Ted Kennedy in an effort to avoid facing the FACT that our government is torturing people like some banana republic is just sickening. This is real stuff happening, folks. It is not a pre-adolescent slumber party giggle session. You smug neo-conservertive slime are the ones who should have electrodes attached to your private parts.

By Andy

November 13, 2005 08:14 PM | Link to this

It’s always good to hear from the peace loving libs. They are always ready to fight, kill and torture, unless, of course, it is in defense of the country that they live in.

By Joe Roman

November 13, 2005 09:47 PM | Link to this

Andy, are you really as stupid as what you write on this forum? This isn’t about liberal and conservative. It’s about humane and inhuman.

By Brett

November 13, 2005 11:23 PM | Link to this

ANDY, you mindless runt, you never wore a uniform in your life. Stop the lying, lest someone hand you your scrot—- on a brick. Speaking of “life,” seems you finally found one on AJC. Never had a job. Someone bought you a baseball cap, a used cell phone to pretend importance, a truck, and directions to the nearest sports-bar-for-sports-bores where you intertwine w similar tiny lifeforms and sip your life support.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 12:49 AM | Link to this

To recap todays talking head shows: Jay Rockefeller said Democrats were tricked by Bush, Howard Dean says Bush fooled us, Joe Biden says todays polls show Bush was wrong when he mislead us.

Of course they all say President Bush is the stupidest man on the planet.

So is the new Democrat slogan:

Vote for us, the dumb guy outwitted us last time

By Andy

November 14, 2005 04:55 AM | Link to this

Where as Brett spent the day at the strip club? Right to privacy is just another slogan y’all don’t even understand but spew at everyone you see?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 04:58 AM | Link to this

Alito doesn’t think abortion is a God given right! If I were you pinkos, I would never stand for this! Filibuster this guy!

By Andy

November 14, 2005 06:22 AM | Link to this

The vent refers to a “draft dodger” giving a speech on Veteran’s Day. Where did Bill Clinton speak?

By Bill

November 14, 2005 07:31 AM | Link to this

Andy, Andy, Andy, how do you ever find time to jerk off?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:46 AM | Link to this

Bush risked his life piloting jet fighters in the guard, logging some 1000 hours of flight time. This is something you pinkos would do only if Playstation had a game for it.

Bill Clinton went and hid in Russia during Vietnam.

By Ronnie

November 14, 2005 08:29 AM | Link to this

Yeah Andy, risking his life drinking scotch and smoking dubes with his Yale buddies at Kennebunkport.

By Pngy

November 14, 2005 08:29 AM | Link to this

Now that’s not entirely correct there Mr. L. You don’t sterilize the instruments before you torture someone. Where’s the fun in that?

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 08:39 AM | Link to this

Well, gentlemen, I see Luckovich has accomplished exactly what he wanted to do with his anti-war, anti-administration cartoons. His poison has you, Americans, calling each other names instead of the terrorists we are fighting. He pictures Chaney as a torturer and Bush as stupid. Neither is true. Chaney presented the idea that the CIA might be held back by some provisions of the prison rules. It was open for debate. Bush has said always “No torture.” The military book of rules says quite clearly “No torture.” People all over the world are trying to get to America for its freedom, lack of torture and generous benefits. Yet, here is a cartoonist from a large newspaper passing on political propaganda that works against our own country. Why do you believe it when it is obviously a political ruse? You are working aginst our sons and daughters in the military whether you want to believe it or not. Think! Think! Have you no loyalty to your country? Honest dissent is one thing but what is going around now is neither honest nor patriotic. So decide right now. Do I want to be an American or not?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 09:12 AM | Link to this

Dusty: Don’t get weepy on us, son. We can’t let these pinko libs get away with all of their lies. We need to smack them around like their mothers didn’t. Did you ever consider that Bush’s approval is down because he won’t stomp their wormy little guts, like he should?

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 09:27 AM | Link to this

I’m not your son, Andy. Why don’t you try a little more civilized approach. I understand your feelings of disgust. But you put yourself on Luckovich’s level with the “wormy little guts” stuff. Try something new and different. We get enough tripe from Luckovich.

By Jesus

November 14, 2005 09:28 AM | Link to this

IMPEACH BUSH NOW!!!

By Andy

November 14, 2005 09:48 AM | Link to this

Dusty: These liberals are sniveling, spoiled rotten, college campus socialists who’s whole purpose is rooted in anti Americanism. Name one of their ideas that does not harm the United States. And you want to have tea with them?

When is Ted Kennedy going to shut his anti American mouth and offer an olive branch? You can trace this incivility in politics right back to him and the Bork nomination.

By Eroc

November 14, 2005 09:49 AM | Link to this

I think it is really sick that though we KNOW America is running torture camps in Europe and possible Egypt, that Bush supporters hear him say “America does not torture” and you believe him!!! Like that great man from Georgia Jimmy Carter said, “No president republican or democrat has EVER acted like this president in the last 100 years.” And if there is a God, we will never have another like him to destroy America’s good name. What these people have done to not only America’s reputation, but to the stability of the world is terrifying. And yet the ultimate irony is that the “Christians” are Bush’s base!!!! WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE!!!!!!!

By Mike L. Worshipper

November 14, 2005 09:51 AM | Link to this

Andy & RW-(the original):

Would it offend you if it was suggested that you take your silly a** comments to a blog where your ramblings might be appreciated? For two peeps who do not like Mike, you sure spend a lot of time on his blog. Perhaps Jim Wooten needs to write a blog for folks like you.

By Ben

November 14, 2005 10:04 AM | Link to this

What is so amusing about this debate on torture is that the person pushing it in the Senate is a decorated Vietnam war HERO who actually suffered torture at the hands of the enemy. He knows FIRST HAND the effects of torture and its usefulness as an information gathering technique. Against him is Chickenhawk Cheney who did all he could to keep from actually fighting in the war. Of the two I know who I would trust on this issue. and it aint Cheney.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 10:08 AM | Link to this

M L W

Is worshiping a cartoonist some new religion? And what part of multi-tasking don’t you understand?

I know people like you only like to spread your lies in an unchallenged vacuum, but until ml bans me that isn’t going to happen.

By Mike L. Worshipper

November 14, 2005 10:37 AM | Link to this

I worship the man behind the pen whose cartoons anger folks of your persuasion.

Just curious, is there a conservative political cartoonist working for a major newspaper anywhere in the US?

Spreading lies in an unchallenged vacuum? You’ve obviously confused this blog with the Bill O’Reilly show. No wait! I mean the Rush Limbaugh show! No wait … . .

By Eroc

November 14, 2005 10:39 AM | Link to this

ANDY DRANK THE KOOLAID!!!!!!! LOL!!!!!!!! You actually posted that Bush logged 1000 flight hours. Its too bad his son logged 100,000 hours flying HIGH!!!!!! LOL…….what a joke. To bring up military service as being important defending the chicken hawks. Not one of them in this administration has fought a war. But they are sure quick to torture someone. WOW

By hewhoasks

November 14, 2005 10:47 AM | Link to this

ANYBODY

I see, Bush, Cheney, a lectern, a Presidential seal, aknife, a torch, and a torture victim in the cartoon. I see nothing that indicates anything about the military. Can you explain why Luckovich is accused of being against the military when they don’t appear in any way in the cartoon?

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 10:51 AM | Link to this

MLW,

I’ll give you credit, you should be working in marketing for the Democrats.

New Democrat slogan, per MLW:

Vote for us, we’re better with cartoon characters

or maybe Eric’s is better.

Vote for us, we’re nicer to terrorists

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 10:52 AM | Link to this

hewhoasks,

His body of work.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 10:53 AM | Link to this

Why can’t you pinkos answer my question: name one liberal idea that does not harm the United States? Why are your replies so weak and childish?

Eroc: We didn’t have jet fighters in World War 2, moron, in which the elder Bush flew. His son logged 1000 hours in the guard, which I don’t expect you to know since you obviously get all your news from the AJC.

By This Justin

November 14, 2005 11:04 AM | Link to this

Ummmm Andy, the reason nobody is replying to you is they never get to the part of your post that asks a question. Two sentences from you then we realize, its all the same. “You’s guys is pinko libs”, “Ted Kennedy is drunk” gets a little boring. Even the conservatives have stopped reading your posts, lol.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 11:16 AM | Link to this

Well, Andy, perhaps it is better not to generalize, even about Democratic liberals. I have some friends who are against the war because they believe it is wrong from personal and religious views. I disagree with them. The difference here is: we don’t call each other names. We try to act like adults and not throw rocks and use invectives. Political misinformation, such as Luckovich puts forth, is dishonest. And Eric saying we have “torture prisons” in different countries. There is no factual evidence that there is “torture” or even that there are such places. Jimmy Carter is no longer president and does not have all the information that Bush has. Carter seems to be more political than thoughtful. So it goes. But we are all Americans. I don’t want a tea party but neither do I want a hate fest such as those Luckovich tries to place in our minds.

By kimberly

November 14, 2005 11:23 AM | Link to this

Dusty, they are totally calling you names behind your back. Trust me. And they don’t have a smidgen of guilt about it either, ‘cause they know you, and how much hate and contempt you have for human beings in general.

By mb

November 14, 2005 11:29 AM | Link to this

You are doing a heck of a job Bushie!

By Andy

November 14, 2005 11:35 AM | Link to this

Funny how you don’t read my posts but you know everything I say. You libs are so sophisticated.

Dusty: Let me quote from Hillary Tucker’s columns: “Right wing jihad” or maybe “Right wing religious extremists.” How does my invective differ? These people don’t understand any other language.

I guess you’re not tired of reaching out to these pinkos and getting run over for it. I am. There is nothing that you or Bush could do to bring them to the table. You know why they can’t answer my question; it’s because democrats don’t have any ideas. Their whole political platform is based on obstruction.

By Rich

November 14, 2005 11:47 AM | Link to this

Bush is Dumb!

By JB

November 14, 2005 11:48 AM | Link to this

hmmm, Dick Chaney as the master torturer and interrogator? Nah, don’t see it. He doesn’t have the stature for it. His ticker ain’t the best in the world.

Apparently all you good politically correct people aren’t very good students of history. It’s the most committed who wins. Those who are willing to torture and engage in the wholesale slaughter of their enemies gain an upper hand and pschological edge in warfare. This isn’t convential type warfare and don’t bring in Nazi Germany (that was torture and murder of innocents they rarely killed POWs). Take for example, Afghanistan and Russia, Vietnam and the United States and even back to ancient warfare. This country has become too sanitized and are stupid enough to believe there is a civilized form of warfare. Not true on the battlefield. We will lose in Iraq and Afghanistan just as we did in Vietnam because our government is not committed to the total destruction of our enemy.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 11:49 AM | Link to this

Andy, here’s your answer straight from the donkey’s err.. mouth, when Tim Russert asked him yesterday.

DR. DEAN: Right now it’s not our job to give out specifics.

FULL TRANSCRIPT

By Joe

November 14, 2005 11:57 AM | Link to this

“DR DEAN”!?!?!!? That has to be an honorary degree. No, I’ve got it, he’s got a doctorate of physical education like that idiot Bill Cosby.

By sct

November 14, 2005 12:04 PM | Link to this

Gotta love the first guest from the Meet the Press transcript.

*KING ABDULLAH II: Yes. Good morning, Tim. Hours ago, the security services managed to apprehend the fourth suicide bomber, the female bomber that was identified by the Zarqawi group. She went in with her husband, into the Radisson SAS. We believe that her suicide belt, her device did not work. She left the hotel, and she’s in custody as we speak.

MR. RUSSERT: Is she Iraqi?

KING ABDULLAH II: She is Iraqi, yes. All the four bombers are Iraqis.*

Just great! This war has now made Iraq a verifyable exporter of terror. Thanks Bush.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 12:06 PM | Link to this

Andy, what made you think I wasn’t reading your comments? I get just as upset as you with the AJC and the editorial writers in particular. Why don’t you tell them? I do quite often. But nasty name calling, the body parts implications, the unprintable words, etc. just don’t cut it. As to comments behind my back, Kimberly, I don’t worry too much about that. I’m stating my opinion, not running a popularity contest. And by the way,Rich, Bush is smart.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 12:11 PM | Link to this

Joe: It’s worse than what you think; Dr. Dean is an abortion “doctor.” “First of all, do no harm…” Yea, right.

Dusty: I’m sorry, I was replying to “By This Justin” and his kindergarten hit and run.

By Smug Canadian

November 14, 2005 12:14 PM | Link to this

spot on, Mike. Great cartoon. “We don’t torture” sounds like “I am not a crook”.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 12:16 PM | Link to this

sct,

I’m glad you’ve seen the light and admitted that President Bush was right. Do the math only three out of four splodeydopes blew up, so we are putting quite a dent in their capability.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 12:40 PM | Link to this

Here’s a little perspective on torture

By sct

November 14, 2005 12:40 PM | Link to this

Yes, RW, George HW Bush was right not to go to Baghdad. Bush W, dead wrong to go to war.

Brent Scowcroft before W’s Iraq invasion: “”It would have been no problem for America’s military to reach Baghdad, he said. The problems would have arisen when the Army entered the Iraqi capital. “At the minimum, we’d be an occupier in a hostile land,” he said. “Our forces would be sniped at by guerrillas, and, once we were there, how would we get out? What would be the rationale for leaving? I don’t like the term ‘exit strategy’ — but what do you do with Iraq once you own it?”“”

What do ya do?

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 12:48 PM | Link to this

sct,

When you make the argument that George W. Bush was “dead wrong” to go to war, why don’t you also make the argument that we should release Sadaam Hussein, restore him to power, and leave?

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 12:52 PM | Link to this

It seems that almost every person denying we torture are using the argument “Where’s the evidence?” If there’s no evidence that we torture people then we don’t torture people. Period. What a shallow argument. Hundreds of years ago Louis Pasteur hypothesized that infectious diseases were caused by unseen organisms. He was laughed at in his day but time proved him correct. While there is certainly no evidence that we DO torture either, there is evidence to support us favoring humiliation, fear and deprivation to gain the info we want. So what happens, if in the future, it is discovered that we had tortured, or in fact, murdered, enemy combatants and POW’s. What then?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 12:55 PM | Link to this

sct: Just ask the Iraq Sunnis your questions. They are talking about us leaving them with their country, a freely elected democracy, no later than the summer of 06. Three years and gone is not that bad considering we are still in Germany, Japan, Korea and Kosovo (Billy’s “war.”) I’m pretty sure this is going to make George W Bush some kind of national hero.

By Les

November 14, 2005 01:02 PM | Link to this

Do you think that Iraqi woman was really just trying to get rid of her husband? Perhaps she had no intentions of blowing herself up but convinced her husband to.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 01:16 PM | Link to this

The president that started this quagmire is out of office 5 years….

Washington — The year 2006 will be “a crucial year of decisionâ€? for Kosovo and the Balkans, with intense negotiations set to start in January that – if all sides cooperate – could end Kosovo’s status as a U.N.-administered protectorate, says a top State Department official.

“The Albanians and the Serbs of Kosovo are going to be given a chance to define their own future,� Nicholas Burns, under secretary of state for political affairs, told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee November 8.

By JoeBob

November 14, 2005 01:24 PM | Link to this

Pull your head out of your behind. So what if we torture prisoners? It’s not like wonder woman is going to show up with her lasso-of-truth. Terrorists are like cue-balls, the harder you hit ‘em the better their english gets. Besides, they probably need a good old fashioned country @$$ whoopin as badly as “sickoftheneocons” does.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 01:31 PM | Link to this

sickof…

When we find out someone crossed the line we prosecute.

Why would you want our enemies to have a detailed of every little thing we could or could not do?

Most of these stories turn out to be false anyway, read about this Kerry wannabe.

By Maggie

November 14, 2005 01:32 PM | Link to this

Andy Don’t you have a job? Or are you paid by the RNC to do all this blabbering? If you are employed, just remember that your employer is saving all your e-mails. The Bill of Rights ends the minute you walk through your boss’s door. That’s why we call it wage slavery.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 01:43 PM | Link to this

Joebob: So what if we torture prisoners?

You are a fool. The reason why I ask “So what?” is because our government condemns others who DO torture. How hypocrtical would we look if we told someone else not to do it, then we discover that we, in fact, torture? How does that make us look?

RW - our enemies already have a list of all the things we can and cannot do, it’s called the Geneva Accords. I agree with you that violaters of that Accord should be prosecuted but then we get involved in this whole quamire again of “Did senior officers command “grunts” to torture or did the “grunts” do so of their own initiative. Bottom line is that even if they are commanded to do so by superior officers, those officers are not going to be brought to justice because again, if we are discovered to be torturers (is that a word?)then we are going to tell the world that it was just some “grunt” acting on his own intiative because the U.S. doesn’t torture so it had to be this one guy acting on his own.

By Buff

November 14, 2005 01:45 PM | Link to this

Maggie, wage slavery? No one is “forced” to work for someone else in this country. You are free to seek the highest wage based upon your skills and the job market.

By DrT.

November 14, 2005 01:46 PM | Link to this

JB, if you are still here, please give us your formula for the “total destruction of the enemy.”

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 01:47 PM | Link to this

See what I mean? If, in fact, we did torture someone, the higher levels of government are going to pin it on the guard or soldier who actually committed the torture. If that is the extent of it, that’s fine. But if he’s COMMANDED to do so by superior officers, that will NEVER see the light of day because the government will ALWAYS deny the use of torture.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 01:57 PM | Link to this

Maggie: Posting to this blog is really not the monumental project for me as perhaps it must be for you. I don’t have to consult the dictionary, nor do I have to research the AJC archives looking for my response. Plus, liberal postings are childishly immature making them quite easy to rebuke. Thanks for asking!

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 02:01 PM | Link to this

sickof…

If we already have this limitation, why do we need the McCain amendment?

What does your “see what I mean” mean? I don’t see anything between your posts that unmasks some coverup.

By Moderate

November 14, 2005 02:09 PM | Link to this

Do Andy,RW, and Dusty sound like Limbaugh-Hannity echos to anyone else here?

By TrickyDick

November 14, 2005 02:11 PM | Link to this

It’s called “plausible deniability” for those of you who did’t study or weren’t alive during Watergate. Of course our government tortures prisoners and denys it. What planet did you just drop in off of? Same thing as when Regan wanted to help his little commie fighting friends in central america. He made his wishes clear and as long as he didn’t get involved in the details, he could deny involvement. Same thing that got us into WWI with the Lucitania; that got us into WWII; that got us into Vietnam (Gulf of Tonkin incident). Old Dubya can say that our country doesn’t torture with a straight face because he’s not aware that somebody below him just gave the order to plug mr. I hate america into the wall socket for info.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 02:20 PM | Link to this

History major err…TrickyDick,

The communists were the Sandanistas, and what did President Reagan’s Chief of Staff Donald Regan have to do with it?

World War II. Let me guess you believe FDR knew in advance.

How much tinfoil do you go through?

By Chris

November 14, 2005 02:26 PM | Link to this

I’m sure Dick and W are the masterminds behind all of this! Give me a break!

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 02:26 PM | Link to this

RW - the “see what I mean” was just a clarifyer. Personally, I don’t think we need the McCain bill because if we can’t enforce it anyway then what good does it do? I think this is one of those times when America has violated the “spirit” of the law rather than the “letter” of the law in respect to the Geneva Accords. I personally don’t think we do torture people but obviously our methods of persuasion cast us in a particularly nasty light in the eyes of the rest of the world. As we continue to become a more “global” society, how does it help our future to be known the way we are known. I’m sorry to say it but in 30 years, we will not be the only world superpower and it would be nice to know that our friends are still our friends when that day comes and it wouldn’t hurt to make some new ones in the process. It makes it that much more difficult to cultivate these friendships and maintain old ones when we may or may not be secretly torturing (as Bush likes to say: “The jury’s out either way”)people.

By TrickyDick

November 14, 2005 02:33 PM | Link to this

only superpowr in 30 years? In 30 years this country will be so weak, we’ll have to worry about being overrun by Grenada!

By Chris

November 14, 2005 02:40 PM | Link to this

TrickyDick-How dare you speak of our nation like that? I don’t care who you think is at fault, what your religious or political beliefs are, you people still need to support this nation!

By Ben

November 14, 2005 02:46 PM | Link to this

I’m trying to figure out how conversation over a cartoon about torture and the administration has somehow morphed into Ted Kennedy, abortion and Susan Smith. Seems if the Republican attack dogs can’t defend their Pres they have to come with some “straw man’ to attack to take the heat off Bush.

By Bobbie

November 14, 2005 02:51 PM | Link to this

Andy I almost feel sorry for you. You’ve had your a-s-s whipped so much today. I am glad that you shared with us that you are just an old fart too old to serve. You are weakening, that was the first glimps you have shown of your previous life. I was also intrigued that you went to church yesterday. Will there be another episode tomorrow?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 02:59 PM | Link to this

Bobbie! You can’t stop thinking about me, can you? Tell me, am I not just so adorable? Can I call you at home or is your “wonderful husband” there?

By Les

November 14, 2005 03:00 PM | Link to this

Ben, if you have followed this blog for very long, the discussion on every cartoon somehow morphs into abortion at some point.

By Bobbie

November 14, 2005 03:10 PM | Link to this

Andy: You are on the minds of all of the southern usa since you stay on this blog from 5:30 a.m. until ll:30 p.m. This is not a good thing.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 03:31 PM | Link to this

Ben,

It would certainly seem like throwing around allegations with little or no evidence day in and day out is much more of a “straw man”.

When did this “prove he didn’t do it” mentality take hold? Chairman, Governor, Dr. Dean says we should consider Bin Laden innocent until proved guilty.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 03:36 PM | Link to this

I stay online ‘cause my mom won’t unlock the door to the basement an let me out.

By TrickyDick

November 14, 2005 03:40 PM | Link to this

Chris, How’s the weather on your planet? In case you haven’t noticed, our economy is not doing so well these days. Manufacturing jobs are leaving so quickly I don’t think the Dept of Labor or Commerce Department really knows. Service economy!!??!? You bought that line? When our economy goes, so will our super power status. China could crash our economy at will and their economy grows stronger while ours contininues to weaken. Blame Bush, Clinton and others. When China has strengthened to a point they no longer need us you’ll see who the real superpower is and it won’t be the good old USA.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 03:42 PM | Link to this

RW, it works both ways because the mentality on the right is “prove that he did do it” for all the divisive issues affecting us today. Unfortunately, this is the type of thinking that has completely paralyzed this country. Everyone thinks everyone else is a far-left wingnut or a far-right wingnut. There is no, nor can there ever be, any consensus on anything as long as these two extremist voices are heard over everyone else.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 03:47 PM | Link to this

sickof…

That is an absolutely absurd statement. Our entire system of justice is based on having to prove an act was committed, not that it wasn’t and the standard shouldn’t change based on what you think of the accused.

Oh, and TrickyDick, why don’t you go back to calling yourself Daniel?

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 04:03 PM | Link to this

RW - tell that to the next accused child molester that walks into a courtroom. Our “system of justice” has already tried and convicted that person before he has sat down at the defense table. Face it, for many they are guilty until proven innocent. Is it right? No. Is it typical? Yes.

By John

November 14, 2005 04:06 PM | Link to this

Any right winger who can only defend Bush by personally attacks is stupid. Dumb. An idiot. Are you people so dense, so devoid of any intelligent arguments to counter the legitimate questions of a democratic society? I guess you are cafateria partiots.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 04:12 PM | Link to this

HALLELUYAH! sickoftheneocons, you just said it all in a nutshell! The middle can take this country away from those wingnuts with a viable 3rd party with strong, moderate candidates. But as we all know, the wingnuts get the big bucks from their idiot constituencies because the fringe lunatics have a lock on special interest issues. If a strong 3rd party movement ever rears it head, you can bet that the fringe lunies from both parties would band together just long enough to kill it and solidify their hold on our lame 2 party system before going back to the same old smelly issues and the same old smelly candidates.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 04:13 PM | Link to this

Tricky-Dick, in case YOU haven’t notice, people from China and everywhere else are doing their best to get into our country. Is it your depression or your lack of appreciation of this country that you express? Whatever. I love this country, the sky is not falling, and if you can do better—go for it.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 04:14 PM | Link to this

sickof…

I know that happens it just shouldn’t and the best way to change that is not to change the rules every time you don’t like someone. (That’s you as a general rule, not you personally.)

John,

???

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 04:19 PM | Link to this

RW - so what would you say about the Republican push to end filibusters, a 200-year old tradition, if the Dems try to block a judicial confirmation of Alito (sp?)They have already threatened to do so once. They will also try to change the rules if they don’t like the outcome.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 04:20 PM | Link to this

Cafeteria Patriots. That’s a good one! But more like little Limbaugh-Hannity bobble head dolls. If Rush or Hannity says it their little heads bobble up and down in agreement.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 04:22 PM | Link to this

sickof…

You might want to research that 200 year tradition thing a little.

Once it took 67 votes, that was changed by Democrats to 60 votes.

Once you could filibuster anything, that was changed by Democrats to eliminate the filibuster for budget bills.

When Robert Byrd (D-W.VA.) was the senate majority leader he proposed and fought to end the filibuster for any bill.

By TrickyDIck

November 14, 2005 04:24 PM | Link to this

Strong 3rd party candidate? The closest thing to a strong 3rd party candidate was H. Ross Perot (remember him)? Clinton should thank him for wrecking the vote that year. Other than that, who else has made a strong enough push? Ralph Nader? PLEASE! Micky Mouse probably had more write in votes.

By Buff

November 14, 2005 04:24 PM | Link to this

Does anyone know what economic, social, and defense plans that they have articulated?

By Buff

November 14, 2005 04:25 PM | Link to this

Hey, Jimmy Carter, former Prez. SHUT UP. You were a disgrace and an appeaser of radical Islam.

By John

November 14, 2005 04:26 PM | Link to this

“I cannot support a failed foreign policy. History teaches us that it is often easier to make war than peace. This administration is just learning that lesson right now. The President began this mission with very vague objectives and lots of unanswered questions. A month later, these questions are still unanswered. There are no clarified rules of engagement. There is no timetable. There is no legitimate definition of victory. There is no contingency plan for mission creep. There is no clear funding program. There is no agenda to bolster our over-extended military. There is no explanation defining what vital national interests are at stake. There was no strategic plan for war when the President started this thing, and there still is no plan today� -Rep Tom Delay (R-TX)* “Victory means exit strategy, and it’s important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is.� -Governor George W. Bush (R-TX)

By John

November 14, 2005 04:27 PM | Link to this

“You can support the troops but not the president.� -Rep Tom Delay (R-TX)

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 04:29 PM | Link to this

John, as a “dumb idiot” and all those other names you called us, do you have a legitimate question? I haven’t heard one. Most of it is name calling, accusations of torture, Bush & Chaney conspiracies, and other miscellany from the propaganda heap. Try hard now and think of something that is a question and not an accusation.

By Buff

November 14, 2005 04:30 PM | Link to this

Any of you Dems out there: Give me a policy reason to vote for a liberal

By John

November 14, 2005 04:32 PM | Link to this

BUFF. SHUT UP. You repeat the RNC talking points like a good LITTLE BUSH YOUTH member. It amazes me how your kind can pick and choose the parts of the constitution to fit your twisted ideas. Dont forget, when you see Jorge on the TV, your right arm should be straight out in front of you.

By Buff

November 14, 2005 04:36 PM | Link to this

John, you are a liar and/or a fool, or have me mixed up with someone else. I did note you never answered my question about why I should vote for a lib.

By Mad As Zell

November 14, 2005 04:38 PM | Link to this

Hey Buff: There is no reason to vote for a liberal, just be sure to vote for a traditional conservative that is COMPETENT!

By John

November 14, 2005 04:38 PM | Link to this

QUESTION, and this serious. Who would Jesus Christ, the Prince of Peace torture?

By TrickyDick

November 14, 2005 04:39 PM | Link to this

now children. let’s be civil.

By Buff

November 14, 2005 04:41 PM | Link to this

Hey, Mad as Zell, AMEN to your post

By TrickyDick

November 14, 2005 04:41 PM | Link to this

there are certain words that should never be placed together. Example:

Competent + Politician Military + Intelligence

By The KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 04:42 PM | Link to this

Hi my name is the “KKKonservative”. I am n ew comer to these Luckovich blogs. Boy some of these post are down right cantankerous!

Nevertheless, I stand for the great “Red, White, & Blue”, Apple pie, and Vanna White! Any viewpoint that differs from mine shall be considered, foreign, unpatriotic, socialistic in nature, and immoral. My quest is to denounce anyone who offers a viewpoint that differs from the beliefs and ideas held by many red-blooded Americans.

To all who who stand with me let us recite the Great “KKKonservative” Oath:

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 04:44 PM | Link to this

Daniel,

You pop in with your blame America first conspiracies, follow up with your sky is falling economic theories, and then tell everyone to be civil.

By Daniel

November 14, 2005 04:54 PM | Link to this

Hey RW! There you go again! But thanks for remembering. I work for a living so I don’t have the time like some of you sitting on your ample duffs. Here is my thought today: Why are no Members of Congress in Military Service? Also, none of their kids, No Bush family member. No one from the Senate is there. No rich kids are there. We are not being asked to sacrifice. This is a “Rich man’s war and a poor man’s fight. ” We are not on a war footing. Why hasn’t the president asked us to sacrifice? Why hasn’t he rallied the nation to tighten it’s belt, put the shoulder to the wheel, and sacrifice to aid the war effort? RW: No leadership.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 04:55 PM | Link to this

RW - Sorry bout that, the filibuster started in the 1820’s so it’s only 180 years old. Also remember that Henry Clay, a Republican, tried to end the filibuster power of the Senate in 1841 to block a bank bill.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 04:59 PM | Link to this

Daniel

I was actually talking to your alter-ego TrickyDick.

Here’s what one of our lovely Senators did for the war effort

Gee, do you think telling Syria in advance of the war might be one reason we haven’t found too much wmd?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 05:00 PM | Link to this

Daniel: I did my time in the 2nd Battalion, 8th Field Artillery, I was a forward observer. During my hitch in the service, the camel jockeys hadn’t yet come up with the idea to knock over our skyscrapers. I wish I was young enough to serve now, I would not get weak kneed and weepy like you pinko libs are doing. I would enjoy killing these savages. From what they have told us, they would enjoy me killing them too. It would be mutually satisfying experience for all involved.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 05:01 PM | Link to this

KKKonservative, are we supposed to fall for all that phony stuff you posted? You even got your name wrong, It is QQQalqueda. Don’t be cute now, al.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 05:06 PM | Link to this

I thought this didn’t work….

OTTAWA — The beleaguered Liberal government will promise significant cuts to personal income taxes and a sprinkling of corporate tax reductions today in a pre-election mini-budget that offers something for everyone.

Finance Minister Ralph Goodale will promise to lighten the tax burden on Canadians, reiterate an earlier plan to cut billions from corporate taxes and introduce other business tax changes as part of a broader plan to boost the economy, sources say.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 05:07 PM | Link to this

So Andy, let me just ask a quick question, will you be satisfied once all the “towelheads” and “camel jockeys” are dead and buried? Wait, I forgot, you also want all the whiney, pinko libs dead, any woman who has an abortion dead and throw in all the Democrats too. Will that be enough? Just how much will it take to satisfy your bloodlust? Or will you not be happy until everyone is dead except all white Republican males?

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 05:09 PM | Link to this

Andy, if you’re not over 40 they’ll take you back. Sign back up Andy. Kill some camel jockeys before that IED gets you.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 05:11 PM | Link to this

A French Jimmy Carter! He’s anti American, too!

France- Speaking at the Elysee Palace in front of the flags of France and the EU, Mr Chirac said the wave of violence had highlighted a “deep malaise” within French society.

“We are all aware of discrimination,” the president said, calling for equal opportunities for the young and rejecting suggestions of a US-style quota system.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 05:13 PM | Link to this

sickof… 4:55PM post

So I guess we agree it’s not a tradition after all.

I don’t know whether to be happy or petrified!

By Andy

November 14, 2005 05:14 PM | Link to this

sickoftheneocons: Just those who have sworn to kill us, sweetheart, that’ll do it for me.

TheTruth: It’s 35, I checked.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 05:18 PM | Link to this

Be happy, we don’t see eye to eye on a number of things but, at least we can agree about something maybe there’s hope for the rest of the country. tear

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 05:19 PM | Link to this

RW - Be happy, we don’t see eye to eye on a number of things but, at least we can agree about something maybe there’s hope for the rest of the country. tear

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 05:21 PM | Link to this

You know the deal sickoftheneocons. The ones that talk all the “kill em all, let God sort em out”, BS know there’s no possibility that they’ll have to be the ones getting blown to bits by IEDs. Anyway, the recruiters will keep the doors open for all the dream warriors.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 05:25 PM | Link to this

AJC Celebrity Birthdays. Laura San Giacomo, Reverand Run, and Patrick Warburton.

[HAPPY BIRTHDAY CONDI]http://tammybruce.com/archives/2005/11/its_condoleezza.php)

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 05:27 PM | Link to this

Hey!! Where’s my link?

HAPPY BIRTHDAY CONDI

By Andy

November 14, 2005 05:35 PM | Link to this

Isn’t it amazing the way Chirac disses the libs and their racial quota system? Doesn’t he know the way they swoon and carry on over him and his country? Can’t he see people like TheTruth trying so desperately to kiss his rear end? Talk about your abusive spouse…

The French are lucky I wasn’t Roosevelt. I would have gave their country to the Soviets. Let’s see them bad mouth America from Siberia.

TheTruth: You do bring up a good point about roadside bombs. Now that we have our ranks loaded down with females what do you think our soldiers are thinking about all the time? They are so stupid with lust now they drive right down the middle of the road getting blown up by… roadside bombs. Thanks for bringing this up.

By Daniel

November 14, 2005 05:39 PM | Link to this

Andy, Andy. Please. Calm down. I’m VFW. I wanted in to the First Gulf War but the recruiter said: No. I’m a father and grandfather. I work for a living and pay taxes. There are Democrats on the front line today in Iraq. Your name calling does you a disservice. I would like to believe you’re intelligent. But, when I read “weepy pinko libs”; I am given pause to wonder. Are you having a bad day? The issue with the government is not political. The issue is: Incompetence.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 05:45 PM | Link to this

Dad gum Andy! That’s cold. And you said it to a guy that won’t even allow a bottle of French wine in his house.

By sickoftheneocons

November 14, 2005 05:47 PM | Link to this

I’ll bet you that if Andy found out if any of those female soldiers killed by an IED had had an abortion prior to service, he would be just as happy as a pig in sh—, right Andy?

By hewhoasks

November 14, 2005 05:49 PM | Link to this

JB:

Google for “Lidice.” The NAzis wiped out an entire Christian town, killing all the men, in retaliation for the assassination of one top Nazi.

By buff

November 14, 2005 05:50 PM | Link to this

As The Kimmer says “AJC aka Al-Jazeerah Chronicle”

By buff

November 14, 2005 05:53 PM | Link to this

Andy, you were a FO? Tough job

By Howie

November 14, 2005 05:57 PM | Link to this

The Washington Post reports that “the Democratic National Committee under Howard Dean is losing the fundraising race against Republicans by nearly 2 to 1,”

AAAAARRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 05:59 PM | Link to this

Andy, I know that you support the troops. A private that drives a truck gets about $20,000.00 a year for it and gets to be a human mine detector as well. A civilian that drives a truck for HALLIBURTON gets $80,000.00 a year or more. HALLIBURTON gets the Lion’s share of NO BID government contracts and we, the tax payers get to pay a truck driver $80,000.00! Does something get a little smelly here? What makes driving a truck worth that much more with a Halliburton employee driving it?

By Andy/ Howie

November 14, 2005 06:07 PM | Link to this

TheTruth: It’s a volunteer army.

Buff: They told us our life expectancy was 13 seconds after the shooting started.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 06:11 PM | Link to this

Daniel, you say the issue with the government is not political but incompetence. I assume you mean the war in Iraq. Since you are VFW, could you site a war that went along perfectly? Were there not low points, battles lost, too many troops killed, time to go home, etc. etc.? What SHOULD have been done? Or Katrina—are you blaming local, state and national alike? Hindsight is always good. You can see the past solutions so clearly. Not political? I wonder.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 06:13 PM | Link to this

TheTruth?

Have you ever heard of the emergency services contract. The government bids it periodically, (I think it’s every five years) so that we don’t have to go out for bids in any emergency.

During that time there has only been one no bid contract given to Halliburton when they didn’t hold this contract.

Hint: It wasn’t in the last five years, but was in the last thirteen.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 06:15 PM | Link to this

Excellent point Dusty. We lost 200,000 troops in France, all so they could bad mouth us at will. It’s safe to say, we won’t be losing that many in Iraq and we will be leaving behind a free, grateful nation.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 06:20 PM | Link to this

Warning to all: Don’t mess with the Dutch!

At least if you’re a sparrow

They take their dominos seriously!

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 06:32 PM | Link to this

So that makes the Halliburton VOLUNTEER’S life worth more than the GIs?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 06:38 PM | Link to this

Let’s put 2 and 2 together: The US army releases an enemy detainee in Fallajuh because of “lack of evidence.” This came after the pinkos started whining about “holding foreign detainees without charges.” So what does Mr. Freedom do? Goes to Jordan and kills 38 people in a wedding party.

I must ask, and I would like to see y’all register your preference: A few nights in a miserable jail for a cold blooded killer or the lives of 38 people cut short on what should have been their most joyous night?

Come on libs, speak out. What would Geena Davis do?

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 06:38 PM | Link to this

I bet if war were less profitable there would be less war.

By Daniel

November 14, 2005 06:39 PM | Link to this

Dusty: Thanks for asking. I supported Bush1 in the First Iraq War, I supported Bush2 in Afghanistan. I wanted to believe Bush2 in Iraq. I tried hard but I must confess; I do not believe him. You are right no war goes perfectly. I enlisted when DDE was prez. My heart is with the grunts. If we are to send our troops into war we should do so only with the best plan, in the best of circumstances. In short, the conditions should be ideal. There was a way to have done this without troops on the ground. Remember the first President Bush, who chose not to take Baghdad. I supported him. You are probably too young to remember Douglas MacArthur. He said American troops should never, NEVER be involved in a land war in Asia. In a Democracy it is essential that the government have the will of the people to make war. This government does not. Critical mass has passed. Don’t demonize me because I can’t believe this president.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 06:43 PM | Link to this

Andy! You want to kill a few “camel jockeys”? Volunteer to work for Halliburton. Bank some big bucks and maybe you get to run over one of the bad guys with your truck. And when you get out of the truck to take a John Wayne picture with the carcass and step on an IED, your wife and her new husband will sing your praises when they vacation in France.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 06:47 PM | Link to this

TheTruth: You misunderstand me, when I joined the service it wasn’t about the money. I wanted the discipline and maybe a chance to kill some Sandinistas (there’s an age hint for you Bobbie, hun.) It’s much the same way today. You can’t deny that you’ve heard of people who joined because of 9/11. It is about nobility and honor, these people know what they are doing. Their rewards are much greater than a paycheck.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 06:53 PM | Link to this

But Andy. Halliburton is a way for you to get to Iraq. You said that you would love the opportunity to kill some camel jockeys. I hear Halliburton hires gunslingers as well. If you really want to serve in this war and support Mr. Bush, it is an opportunity your age can’t take away.

By getalife

November 14, 2005 06:56 PM | Link to this

Amen.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 07:04 PM | Link to this

Daniel, I don’t demonize you. But how can you say the country was not behind going to war? Citizens remembered 9/11, Intelligence services from USA & Britain said WMD in Iraq, our congress of our elected officials and the elected president decided war was necessary. Where were you then? NOW is not the time to stop support. If you stop now, you are not supporting the troops. I can see no other way to present that. Sorry that you have changed your philosophy. I don’t stop support when things get tough.

By KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 07:04 PM | Link to this

Dusty, I didn’t want you to fall for all “phony stuff” you say i wrote. I just wanted you to recite with me the KKKonsertive mantra. You know from one KKKonervative to another. By the way al qiada could carelees about our thoughts on domestic American issues. They just want us to stay out of the Arab world, and there crazy enough to strap a pound of C4 on there chest to make that point.

Nevertheless, Dusty you did help me create another point for our oath and that is:

Collectively we as KKKonservatives do not have the intelligence to argue our beliefs on the merits of a particular issue, so we resort to things name calling like ooh your a socilaist! or oooh you pinkie! or oooh you sound like a an al queda sympathizer! Well Martin Luther King Jr was called all those names while he walked this earth by the conservatives of his times. So I consider it a badge of honor, when conservatives call me those names too.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:12 PM | Link to this

TheTruth: The most dangerous enemy the United States has today is located within it’s borders. These leeches suck away all that is good about this country without contributing anything back to it’s well being. You know them, they make themselves perfectly clear with their talk of our “unchecked power” and how we harm others in the world. They ignore our statesmen like Colin Powell who said that America asks nothing for freeing other countries except for a place to bury our dead.

These are the people that I have chosen to fight at this stage in my life. I only wish that they would take up arms in pursuit of their stated cause. The U.S. Army can take care of the terrorists.

By HobnailedBoot

November 14, 2005 07:12 PM | Link to this

Don’t mess with Dusty like that. You didn’t know that he is a finalist for the Rush Limbaugh-Oxycontin Neo Con of the year award? The winner gets a lifetime supply of those little W stickers and the spouse gets an I’m with stupid T shirt for everyday of the week.

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 07:13 PM | Link to this

What a great line from today’s “Best of the Web” column.

Zarqawi is the head of al Qaeda in Iraq, or, as the Democrats call it, al Qaeda Which Has Nothing to Do With Iraq in Iraq Which Has Nothing to Do With al Qaeda. Some news organizations have taken to calling AQII “al Qaeda in Mesopotamia,” apparently counting on their readers’ being too ignorant to know Mesopotamia is “Iraq” in Greek. Click the link where it says “al Qaeda in Mesopotamia” to see what the AJC will soon be writing.

Best of the Web

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 07:20 PM | Link to this

Andy that is a very eloquent way of saying that you are much too busy down at the hardware store. I’m really disappointed. I thought maybe you would want to walk the walk after talking the talk about your desire to kill a few “camel jockeys”.

By Pat Buchanan

November 14, 2005 07:23 PM | Link to this

Speaking in Pennsylvania to the troops, Bush said that the pro-war Democrats like John Kerry saw the same intelligence he did and raised the same alarms, and that Democrats now accusing him of faking intelligence are undercutting our fighting troops in Iraq.

Translation: Democrats are giving aid and comfort to the enemy in time of war. We are one step away form the T-word. Treason.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:29 PM | Link to this

I’ll make it simple for you TheTruth: Why don’t you take up arms against the Bush Administration? You go down to the White House and start shooting; I’ll go to Iraq and start shooting. Deal?

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 07:35 PM | Link to this

You’re a sick little puppy, Andy. Quite, quite sick. You’re the type of person who would be the first one in line to sign up to be a VOhr at a GULag. Look up what those words mean.

By Daniel

November 14, 2005 07:35 PM | Link to this

Dusty: You and I are on the ground. Nobody told or called me about anything. I wasn’t much happier when LBJ trumped up the Gulf of Tonkin, either. 58,000 lives later. Colin Powell has admitted regret for his testimony before the UN in the work-up to this war. The country was behind the government at 9/11. The country is not now behind this war. That is what I mean when I say we have passed critical mass. You are right. Congress and the President wanted this war. Although, I had doubts. At that time I trusted them. I believed the president. Now, I do not. It has nothing to do with philosophy. It is about belief. I can’t pretend. It has nothing, at all, to do with toughness. In a Democracy toughness follows the truth. Yes, I can hear you. We can’t go back and change things. But if this war were truly about Andy’s “nobility and honor” all of us would be in it. It is not. And, we’re not. Good night.

By buff

November 14, 2005 07:37 PM | Link to this

That last comment by “buff” was not me, the original buff, but, oh well. He said 13 seconds, hmmm, they told us a 2nd Lt. had fifteen seconds. Haliburton also got no bid contracts from Prez. Clinton. And, read former VP, albert Gore’s “Remaking America” speech where he praised Haliburon and Bechtel (sp?). One of the things that runs me nuts about you leftists is your double standard.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:41 PM | Link to this

Here’s a thought for you liberals to sleep on. Why does NPR, National Pinko Radio, need government funding to survive, while Rush Limbaugh draws just as many people that pay, on his website, to hear him?

By buff

November 14, 2005 07:42 PM | Link to this

Right on, Andy, about the Frenchy Frogs. My late Father landed at Normandy on June 6, 1944 (admittedly, he was in the 9th Armored Division, so, the beach was mostly cleared) and he said that GI’s bodies were stacked like cord wood. And, the leftists want us to “understand” the Frogs. In the 1950s they started embracing leftist ideas, became anti-American, and a military embarrassment. I would not pull their chestnuts from the fire again. I have been to the stinking country twice (they do have some good museums), but vow never to return again.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:45 PM | Link to this

Daniel: You can’t stand to see those 25 million people living a free life, can you? Let me guess, we are being cruel to them, forcing them to make decisions all by themselves on how they want to live. America is so heartless.

By TheTruth

November 14, 2005 07:45 PM | Link to this

So Andy, you really have no desire to kill “camel jockeys”? You’re not alone though Andy. Don’t worry. There are millions more chicken hawk dream warriors standing tall in their support for those who are killing the “camel jockeys” and stepping on the IEDs. And I’m sure Mr. Bush will pin the Medal of Freedom on you for your courageous fight against those who happen to disagree or dare excercise their 1st amendment rights to free speech. Goodnight Andy. May God grant you the strength to kill millions of “camel jockeys” in your dreams tonight. Happy hunting Andy!

By buff

November 14, 2005 07:45 PM | Link to this

And, Andy, whiel Rush, Boortz, Hannity and others are PAID for their shows, Air-America PAYS stations to carry their crap. And, I listened to Airhead-America, it is just bad radio. Finally, leftists think that NPR is non-partisan. One of the things that p—-es me off abou the GOP is that they do not have the stones to do away with govt. funding for NPR, the NEA, etc.

By KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 07:48 PM | Link to this

Why hasn’t rusty Dusty responded yet? I guess these leaves me with only one other option and that is to pick on the other mental midget Andy.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 07:51 PM | Link to this

Check this out Dusty: NPR is the real “opiate of the masses.” The Cons know that they have to keep the pinkos sedated, make them sleepy with their pacifist ideas so that they don’t strap on suicide belts like their Middle Eastern brethren. It’s money well spent.

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 07:52 PM | Link to this

Easy, Andy. NPR needs public money for the same reason most quality things do. And Rush attracts millions for the same reason Ashleigh Simpson keeps pumping out #1 records: appealing to the lowest common denomenator is by far the easiest way to go. No one has ever gone broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public (or any public, really). On average it’s a lot easier to listen to pre-packaged crap than to listen to something quality.

By DrArt

November 14, 2005 07:53 PM | Link to this

Andy certainly made himself an easy target tonight, did he not. You might as well finish him off. He got crushed in that last exchange.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:03 PM | Link to this

rushncap: National Pinko Radio would be off the air if it wasn’t for the “neocons.” Funny, isn’t it? It is full well their choice to continue it’s funding. They find it more important to reach out to the liberals then to do away with one of the biggest sources of treason the United States has ever faced.

Rush Limbaugh changed America, making truth a commodity that is available to all who want to hear it. It is no wonder he is so polarizing. People do not know how to deal with reality.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:06 PM | Link to this

My question stands open but unanswered. Name one idea that the democrats have that does not harm the United States. I stand here among liberals, why can’t you defend your turf? Are you going to turn on it like you have your country?

By KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 08:12 PM | Link to this

Andy the only reason why conservative radio has a mass following right know is because their listners believe that is the only way to escape the so called liberal mass media.

Hell they brodacast on the AM band. Who in the hell listes to the AM band besides those Americans who live in cities where the livestock outnumbers the people, and exciting Friday evening consists of ordering the #2 at the local Hardees.

By DrART

November 14, 2005 08:14 PM | Link to this

Yeah boy! Ol Rush was peddlin all kinds of truth to the mindless, while doctor shopping for his next hit of oxycontin.

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 08:14 PM | Link to this

Retard-o (Andy). NPR funding has nothing to do with neocons. They would do away with it if they could (as well as with civil liberties, religious freedoms, Social Security, etc). They don’t have the clout. They’ve already tried to cut NEA funding, and failed. There are enough people in America who care to think just a little bit. Limbaugh certainly changed America. So did McCarthy, Nixon, Al Capone, Benedict Arnold, Jeffrey Dahmer and Jefferson Davis. That, in and of itself, is not something to be proud of. What Limbaugh didn’t do is change America for the better.

By Joe Roman

November 14, 2005 08:14 PM | Link to this

Here’s a Democratic idea that “does not do harm to the Unided States”. Getting gutless hypocrites like Bush, Cheney, Runsfeld etc. out of positions of power by any means necessary. Name one way this country is better off since they got in, Andy.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:21 PM | Link to this

rushncap: The Cons control the White House, the Senate, The House of Representatives, the majority of State Governorships, AM radio, FM radio, Cable TV and the Internet. Libs control the free stuff: broadcast TV and NPR. That’s it for your side of the ledger. The masses are on my side. You lose. Any questions?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:23 PM | Link to this

This is getting to easy….

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 08:26 PM | Link to this

No questions. Yes, you control all that. And you STILL can’t get rid of NPR. See, in this country (USA) minority also gets a say. Don’t like that? Move to Saudi Arabia. I mean, once you change your religion (and, hell, it’s the same god anyways) it’s your paradise. Minority speaks up? Stone em! Neo-con heaven!!

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 08:27 PM | Link to this

Well, QQQalQueda/KKookonserv, I don’t usually respond to your type. Mostly I have better things to do and also I was watching Lehrer News Hour. But you have brought M L King into this and he was a man of peace. But he fought for civil rights as you seem to know. Do you not realize that the Iraqis have had no “civil rights” or any rights for decades? But that doesn’t bother you. You are so busy tearing down the president that civil rights for others are the last thing on your mind. That will be just one of the accomplishmnets of this war. There are others. I support our troops and their commander in chief. You should try it yourself. They are your troops and your president ,too.

By KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 08:34 PM | Link to this

Tisk, Tisk , Tisk, Andy with each and every post you strengthen my arguument concerning the feableness of your intelligence. Your question about how democrat ideas are ultimately harmful to the United States is down right stupid! For instannce, I can always point out the potential harm in something that has good intentions. For instance, dinking milk is inherently good for your body, but drinking too much can possibly cause cancer (according to some medical experts.

The point I am trying to make Andy every idea that either Republicans or Democrates have from their perspective has good intentions, but in every case you can point out something harmful about that idea under different conditions

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:35 PM | Link to this

Oh, the power of the unelected minority. From now on, we in America are just going to disregard the results of election day. Let’s make this country into some Soviet satellite, where the “paradise” belongs to the workers.

Come on y’all. While you weren’t exactly doing your home team proud, at least you had a little substance. Now all you can do is punk out, falling back on the socialist propaganda?

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:39 PM | Link to this

I think only of the United States, nothing of your personal grievance. I am smart enough to understand that if we strengthen our country it will support all of us. If we weaken it, it will take us all down. And your choice is?

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 08:41 PM | Link to this

Dear VOhra — we are not ignoring elections. If you bothered to study our Constitution, even a little bit, you’d figure out that the whole point of it is the protection of the rights of the minorities. Think (get someone to explain to you what that term means and how it’s done) just a little bit: majorities do not need protections. They have power which comes from sheer numbers. It’s the minorities which our Constitution goes out of its way to take into account. And you should be thankful — after all, they used to just leave mentally retarded people to die, or killed them off. You owe still being taken care of to that document. Maybe you should study it a bit, huh?

By Teresa

November 14, 2005 08:43 PM | Link to this

RW, I heard what you did last night!

You broke out of your straitjacket and then broke Dusty out of hers, you two drank a few from the bottle you hid under your bed, and you had your way with her. Of course, this morning when you woke up, you took one look at her and all of her wrinkles, and screamed “What have I done?”

Not to worry, though. The heavy duty straitjackets will arrive shortly.

By Andy

November 14, 2005 08:46 PM | Link to this

You pinkos have nothing for your country but complaints. After you do us in, where will you go to next? Which nation are you going to ruin with your demands? When are you going to grow up and contribute to the society that you childishly expect everything from?

By RW-(the original)

November 14, 2005 08:51 PM | Link to this

Teresa,

I told you I knew how to get out of those things.

It’s suppossed to get cold later this week, make sure mine is lined. Thanks!

By KKKonservative

November 14, 2005 08:55 PM | Link to this

Hell Dusty, there our 181 countries in this world that the United States defines as sovereign nations. More that half of these countries, mostly in Africa, are considered by the international community to have governments that have abhorrent civil rights records. Some the worst include: Somalia, Sudan, N, Korea etc.. The list goes on and on. So if this is your justification for going to War in Iraq because of civil rights, you need to write your President concerning invading those other civil rights challleged nations.

By buff

November 14, 2005 08:58 PM | Link to this

Hey, rushncap, research shows that talkj radio listeners are in the upper incom ebrackets, are better educated, and more likely to be politically savvy. Y’all can bash el-Rushbo, but, he has a good racket going. He reads and plays transcripts, then gives his opinion. NPR sucks, but so does Sean Hannity. And, for whoever made the dumbest statement on this idiot blog today about “minority rihgts” and “NPR” shoudl 1. never vote; 2. be neutered. How dare you evoke the Constitution

By rushncap

November 14, 2005 09:15 PM | Link to this

Buffy, I “dare” to envoke the Constitution because I happen to be a U.S. citizen. And I do vote, and if someone tried to neuter me, he better come with a hearse and a driver. As for NPR, it does not suck. I listen to it all the time, if for nothing else than BBC.

By Dusty

November 14, 2005 09:16 PM | Link to this

QQQal/KKKook—Don’t get confused. I said that civil rights were ONE of the freedoms this war will bring about for Iraqis. Not the reason for going there. Keep your eye on the ball. Our troops. Our president. Our support. Iraq!

By Robert

November 14, 2005 11:44 PM | Link to this

We know, ANDY, you were never in the military. Stop the BS.

By the way, that’s CHRIS LYDLE talking too.

By KKKonservative

November 15, 2005 10:10 AM | Link to this

Rusty Dusty you probably never served in the military. I went to service Academy and served my 5 year commitment. I also have very close friends who I graduated with me and our still our flying F-15s, C-130s, C-141s in that hot sandbox. So don’t lecture me about the support of our troops. Most of our troops can care less about the political reason for us going into war. The reason why they fight is for that war buddy of theirs who is also watching their back so that they can serve the tour,and go back home alive to their precious families.

Again both you and Andy strenghten my argument that your intelligence is equal to a swarming ball of Gnats:) It is difficult for you to mentally distinguish the critique on the politics for war versus support for oour troops.

By KKKonservative

November 15, 2005 10:11 AM | Link to this

Rusty Dusty you probably never served in the military. I went to service Academy and served my 5 year commitment. I also have very close friends who I graduated with me and are still our flying F-15s, C-130s, C-141s in that hot sandbox. So don’t lecture me about the support of our troops. Most of our troops can care less about the political reason for us going into war. The reason why they fight is for that war buddy of theirs who is also watching their back so that they can serve the tour,and go back home alive to their precious families.

Again both you and Andy strenghten my argument that your intelligence is equal to a swarming ball of Gnats:) It is difficult for you to mentally distinguish the critique on the politics for war versus support for oour troops.

By Dusty

November 15, 2005 10:36 AM | Link to this

Well, KKKonserv, I support our troops and act like I do. You, by your “name” alone indicate that all conservatives are in the KKK and need to be insulted. Conservatives are the ones supporting the troops while liberals, such as Luckovich, push anti-war efforts even as we are at war. I do not believe you can separate politics and troop support. Not at this time. Your service in the military is admirable. Members of my family have done the same for many generations. They may have had great camaraderie but they KNEW what they were fighting for —THIS COUNTRY. So take your free speech and call us names. Doesn’t matter. I and many like me support the troops and love this country.