Political Insider

By Jeff

June 17, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this

BAD idea.

MUCH BETTER idea: Year Round Schools on a 9-week-on, 3-week-off basis.

Oh yeah, that pesky tourism industry… Guess what? Go to YRS and you DON’T HAVE A NON-TOURIST SEASON. Meaning PROFITS SKYROCKET.

By Teacher on Vaction

June 17, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this

Please pass this now. The benefits would be enormous. From no child left behind we have learned that we are leaving students and teachers out of the equation. A more traditional summer would give students and teachers a true break. As it stands now with a week of post planning, and a week of pre planning that is two more weeks cut out of that vacation time.

Jeff With the 3 week off scenario? What would working parents do with their children? Day care is anywhere from $100 to $250 per child, per week. Do you have an answer for that?

By Jeff

June 17, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this

Teacher:

Daycare centers would adapt. They would HAVE to in order to stay in business.

Where do you send the kids in the ‘normal’ summer? Either way you’re talking about the same thing. At least with the 9on/3off scenario, you’re only paying for 3 weeks at a time, which I’ve GOT to assume is easier on the day-to-day budget than having to spend that money over the course of 3 straight months.

Besides that: The ‘daycare delimma’ brings to the forefront what parents REALLY think of schools as: daycare centers.

By ~Ashley Joy~

June 17, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

We do not have a shrinking summer vacation. When I was in school, I started the 3rd week in August and got out the 2nd week in June. Today, kids start the 1st week in August and get out the 4th week in May. It’s still the same number of week out. How is that shrinking?!?!

By Matt the Brave

June 17, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this

We’re already talking about a school system here in Georgia that is almost to the point where we would have just three weeks off during the summer anyway! (It stands at about six to eight weeks, depending on the system right now) Furthermore, you wouldn’t have to review nearly as much with the younger children (i.e.:K-5) as you do now at the beginning of the year, and you would also have a better chance of building up on previous knowledge.

Oh, and teacher, your precious No Child Left Behind is a joke. Nothing like being able to just teach to a test now, huh? No room for academic achievement or for children who are higher to achieve even more. It’s a joke of a system that is fatally flawed so that the Federal Government can control on a local level. It’s time we get back to academic achievement rather than test results.

By cpate

June 17, 2008 10:28 AM | Link to this

The only people who will oppose this are parents who want their kids out of their hair. This is a terrific idea! Each year, the start of the school year had crept earlier and earlier. What happened to beginning in the Fall? Certainly the earlier beginning hasn’t equated with higher test scores.

By Dave

June 17, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

No change is needed. The tourism industry can just as easily benefit in early June. Good changes in education are rarely made when the consideration is crunching test scores. Under the current schedule, some systems end 1st semester before winter break, with exams as the last 3 days of a semester. This increases time on task. Pupils are in serious academic pursuit, and not wanting free time before a vacation. This has been a cost effective way to increase instructional time. There are advantages for pupils in the current schedule which should be considered.

By downsouthteacher

June 17, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this

Would changing the school start really make a difference in testing? Most likely not. Why? Because problems with test scores have nothing to do with when you go to school. Why are some students successful, no matter what, and some are never successful, no matter what?

By jc

June 17, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

Working parents need to come up with a plan…….

By Parent

June 17, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

Jeff, Are you even a parent or someone who “knows it all about everything”. Real parents have to deal with real issues and that does not mean that they think of school as day care. We have to make plans for kids who are not in school and while you say “Day cares will adapt” the day cares are not adapting now why should they start? There are many year round schools now in Atlanta and day cares are only offering care solutions during the summer and possibly at Christmas break. Day cares now are overflowing with requests for infant care and are phasing out older student camps. They don’t need the older kids to “stay in business”. You are right about one thing, 3 weeks to pay at a time is easier than 3 months as I am struggling to pay for this summer.

By ATL80

June 17, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

It seems like most schools around the south start back in early August now. When I was growing up we didn’t start until the last week of August, but then we didn’t get out until the first week of June. It is nice to have schools out by Memorial Day, but going to school in the August heat is not the best idea. I was always fortunate that my parents had enough vacation to route weeks off in the summer so one of them was always home with us except for maybe a week when we went to camp. It was difficult on them but much better than sticking us in daycare all summer.

By Gwinnett Educator

June 17, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

Im going to agree with Jeff on this one (gasp..lol just kidding Jeff).

Honestly, I feel that if we can’t have YRS, then let’s do the late start.

Also, those daycares and everyone involved (church camps, etc) would adapt. They would have to if they expect to still reap the financial benefits of keeping children.

By DumbAmericans

June 17, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this

You know communism has arrived when a state official wants to meet federal standards.

The federal government has no business in education.

These folks have no idea how to educate your children. They simply want to test the heck out of them all day long.

This is wonderful for the current slave system.

Nothing is worse than having a smart educated slave questioning why he/she is underpaid and master has all the wealth.

By Dana Kling

June 17, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

AUGH!

Summer is not SHORTER. It MOVED. 180 days is 180 days.

A schedule based on the academic calendar is sound planning…

STOP using the rhetoric of “shrinking summers” - it’s simply not the case.

A frustrated teacher.

By Who Cares

June 17, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

Well, of course teachers are all for extending summer. More paid time off courtesy of the tax payers. I’m very lucky in that I reveive 5 weeks of PTO annually, but I have also been with my company for 23 years. I know that there’s more to teaching than “classroom time”, but come on, isn’t the government inefficient enough already without adding more “getting paid for doing nothing” time for teachers? But then again, that’s how government works in the first place!

By Dana Kling

June 17, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

AUGH!

Summer is not SHORTER. It MOVED. 180 days is 180 days.

A schedule based on the academic calendar is sound planning…

STOP using the rhetoric of “shrinking summers” - it’s simply not the case.

A frustrated teacher.

By improvement

June 17, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

**This would great for us here in Clayton County as make strides for improvements on our school board and within the school system.

By MOT

June 17, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

No one should ever ask “what will we do with the kids when we can’t send them to school”. It so totally shows what the majority of people really use public schools for—-certainly NOT education. If they happen to get educated in the process of babysitting them, wow, what a bonus, but the expectation is as a drop off for kids to be raised in the absence of the parent.

If it isn’t then there is NO issue with “where do the kids go when school is closed.”

For those single parents who have little options: make every effort to not use nor think of school as your daycare. When you have primary care resources in place, and you use school for simply education, everyone will prosper.

As far as the later start date: with the energy crisis, we should resolve to schedule our schooling around the most economical/earth friendly times: spring and fall. We did it in the early days: farm kids were let out to help with planting in spring and harvest in the fall. We can do it now. Let the rest of society’s scheduling fall in step to the true education of our kids.

By Trazey

June 17, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

This Needs to be passed. Starting school in the beginning of August is almost Child Abuse! My children have to sit on an un airconditioned bus for 1 1/2 hours! Not to mention there is always A/C problems with the class room and they end up sweltering! I have to work to stay off of welfare so I can’t transport them myself or I would. And alot of the summer baseball teams are still playing until the end of July…Remember the Ga Little League Team that was playing on TV while everyone else was in school!

By anotherteacher

June 17, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

Regardless of when the school year starts, the students in Georgia go to school 180 days a year, just like they do everywhere else. The problem isn’t when school starts, the problem is the curriculum. Expecting teachers to teach and students to learn a year and a half of curriculum in 8 months (they test in April) is a set up for failure in my opinion. 9 weeks on and 3 weeks off sounds good, but the curriculum is the real issue any way you slice it.

By Native

June 17, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

Very interesting. Just about two week ago Ms. Cox was right in the middle of the CRCT fiasco. It should of meant the end of her career. But we citizens in Ga. just don’t have what it takes to hold a public official’s feet to the fire. We accept a lot. However, I’m sure that she’s heard much complaint and criticism. These AJC blogs were filled.

So, now she feels that she needs to appease the voters. Give them something good to defuse the CRCT time bomb. And here it is…a longer summer vacation.

From the CRCT debacle we learned that Ms. Cox is a lousy education administrator. From this move we learn that she is a seasoned politician.

By kitty

June 17, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

The summer vacation would not shrink. Students go to school 180 days in Georgia and teachers go 190. So, the vacation would not shrink. God forbid to think of testing or helping a student — instead of football. Does football and practices have anything to do with the early start of school?

I like the idea — it would be cooler and to go into June would be cooler as well. June is a much cooler month than August. It would save energy.

kitty

By Fred

June 17, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

YRS has been a very unpopular idea that has nontheless been creeping up on us for a decade. The school year (180 days) has not lengthened, yet kids were only planned for a 2 month summer vacation this summer.

It’s about time school moved back to its traditional start time.

By JK

June 17, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

Clearly some of the posters here are not parents of school-aged children. I am. These early-August return dates are RIDICULOUS! Yes, please, push it back to the end of the month! This absurd schedule was adapted when the semester system was adapted. We used to have quarters, start around Labor Day, and end the first week in June.

Now they start early to have exams right before Chirstmas. Guess what, parents? If your kids can’t retain what they’ve learned over the holiday break, they haven’t learned anything!! (Are you really okay with that?) And many could use the extra study time. As it is now, kids have the first week in January off, and many parents have to take their first week’s vacation of the year to do what? Sit around the house in January, buried under holiday bills, instead of using that week in the spring or summer for a meaningful trip.

Also, children of divorce can spend summers with the other parent, or with grandparents in the country or in another city. This is good for family relationships!

For athletes, the early start dates mean training starts when it’s 100 degrees outside with red alert smog. And we wonder why they drop dead on the football field? Yes, please get back to the traditional schedule!!!

By janice

June 17, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

i thought with georgia schools were already on a bascially 9-13 week on, week off deal with the fall, winter, holiday, spring etc holiday weeks they get. all those centuries ago when i went to school, you got week between christmas and new years, the thursday and friday before easter (went to private school, so you were expected to be in church, and that was it. no winter breaks, no week before thanksgiving, just the day after, and when it snowed, we went until the snow was atleast 6” deep. if you had snow and they cleared the streets and they were clear to pass on, you were back in school the next day.

also this crap with the logic of starting in early august as kids forget what they learned and they have to get back into the mindset of school…..crap!!! we never did that. you were expected to hit the ground running when the monday after labor day came.

By educator

June 17, 2008 10:45 AM | Link to this

Folks, Let’s get down to the real issue here. I am an educator and parents now think schools are their babysitters. People you had the fun making your children, now take the responsiblity and rear them too. Stop sending them off to be reared by other people, then complain when it is not done like you want.

By momof4

June 17, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this

Why I don’t send my children to public schools: They are just glorified daycare centers! All parents care about is their own selfish desires and their pocketbooks.

By Lee

June 17, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this

Only in America, when rest of the world’s students goes to school year around and work hard to earn their degrees, we are worried about hotel-motel-tourist industry and energy savings on air-conditioned schools and buses. We need to get our priorities in order or our future generation will be a lost cause .

By Jeff

June 17, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this

Parent:

The problem with the systems you mention is that the daycare providers in your area still get plenty of business from systems on the traditional calendar. Therefore, they do not need to adapt. Indeed, if MORE of their business comes from places on traditional schedules than on YRS, it would make NO SENSE for them to adapt to YRS.

Conversely, if EVERY system in the area was on YRS, then it would make NO SENSE NOT to adapt to YRS, because they would see shrinking profits otherwise.

Gwinnett Educator:

Eh, it happens. The funny thing about me is that because I try to take a common sense approach to everything - even when my ‘common sense’ is different from the norm - it just so happens that every once in a while even my worst critics come around to at least seeing my point, if not exactly agreeing with my proposal.

By HP

June 17, 2008 10:53 AM | Link to this

I am all for year round school. It’s too hot here in the summer to really enjoy being outside. The fall and spring are the best times to enjoy here in the South. I am all for year round school.

I do believe if we can’t have that we should start school later. I have a wonderful conference that I attend every year at a family friendly hotel in FL. We are encouraged to bring the kids. It is always scheduled for the first week of August. It now has always been the week school starts so I can’t bring my family and I have to be away from home the first week of school.

By working parent

June 17, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

Jeff, Your comments about parents thinking schools are daycare centers were way off base and offensive to me. Year-round school WOULD help two-working parent households, which, though hard to believe in some parts of Atlanta, are the majority of families. I would much rather have my kids learning throughout the year and pay for extended care three weeks at the time than try to create their “summer vacation” for 8 or 9 weeks by stringing camps together so I can work. I have to pay in excess of $400 a week during the summer to keep my kids occupied and with their friends, who are going to these camps even if they have a parent at home! Speaking of work, I need to get back to it

By FCM

June 17, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

YES YES YES! Make it happen. Also do all those ‘Teacher Training’ before the school year starts instead of these crazy half days.

I would much rather they attend past Memorial Day…like the rest of the country then get them ready for school in Aug. The out of town family doesn’t get it as our school schedules are STUPID and don’t mesh with the rest of the country.

Can we get school uniforms to go with it? Please!

By bake

June 17, 2008 10:55 AM | Link to this

Who Cares your stament “of course teachers are all for extending summer. More paid time off courtesy of the tax payers” is about as uneducated a response as is possible. I’m not a teacher but most teachers get 3 vacation days during the school year and I know my wife typically works 10-14 hours a day, not counting any grading at home, during the school year. I’d be more than willing to be that her hours tally up to more than what you or I do during a whole year. And that’s not mentioning the time put in by teachers for required meetings and classes during the summer. Now every teacher may not put in the time that my wife does but your statement is still a pretty ignorant one.

By bake

June 17, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this

Who Cares your statement “of course teachers are all for extending summer. More paid time off courtesy of the tax payers” is about as uneducated a response as is possible. I’m not a teacher but most teachers get 3 vacation days during the school year and I know my wife typically works 10-14 hours a day, not counting any grading at home, during the school year. I’d be more than willing to be that her hours tally up to more than what you or I do during a whole year. And that’s not mentioning the time put in by teachers for required meetings and classes during the summer. Now every teacher may not put in the time that my wife does but your statement is still a pretty ignorant one.

By Involved Teacher

June 17, 2008 10:57 AM | Link to this

For teachers involved in extra curricular activities like marching band, and sports like football, our summers HAVE been shrinking. I know about 180 days for students and 190 days for teachers, but not all teachers are afforded that luxury and give their time and energy many days more than that. I know we get paid for it, but still - let’s start later so we are not out in the July and August heat so much! It’s terrible.

And as for you, WHO CARES, and your statement about teachers wanting more paid time off at the expense of tax payers?? People always talk about how poorly teachers get paid - well that’s why we get paid so low…we only work 9 -10 months out of the year. If we all worked 12 months a year, we would be getting paid a little more on par with the corporate world.

By Maude

June 17, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this

180 days of instruction is 180 days of instruction. It doesn’t matter when the 180 days start, 9 weeks on 3 weeks off or if they finish the 180 May or June it is still 180 days of instruction. I see no reason to change school calendars at this time of year. These calendars were set months ago. Starting three weeks later will not make the kids any smarter.

By Eayzr

June 17, 2008 11:00 AM | Link to this

Gwinnett Educator,

You and Jeff are right…year round education or late start.

By parent of teacher

June 17, 2008 11:00 AM | Link to this

Dear Who Cares, Teachers are not being paid in the summer to do nothing. Their pay is divided by 12 instead of 10. Teachers work 190 days and spread the pay over the entire year. This has not always been the case in Georgia. At one time a teacher could chose to be paid in 9, 10 or 12 installments. Teachers receive the same time off if they have worked 1 year or 30 years.

By dondee

June 17, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this

Really, they are not proposing more than 180 days, which how many days we already go to school. Not really sure what the benefits would be of moving it back…..actually, there would be less time to prepare for the test, if we gave it in the same testing window….The problem is NCLB and its unrealistic expectations on schools and not taking into account they myriad of other factors that can affect a child’s performance. A much better solution would be to measure if a child has made gains…..I believe that every child can learn and make strides during the school year.

As far as YRS, the models I have heard of are 9 weeks on, 3 for breaks and 6 weeks for summer. That might actually work and help the kids retain their knowledge, while giving everyone a break to recharge their “batteries”. Will it happen? Not so sure.

A Teacher

By tomiswho

June 17, 2008 11:04 AM | Link to this

to WhoCares: Sorry to disappoint you, but teachers get NO paid time off. We are contracted for 190 days of work and thats all we get paid for. NO PAID HOLIDAYS, NO PAID VACATION. Is that clear enough for you? You probably buy into the drivel that we have “teacher’s unions” here in Georgia too…. HA! They are not legal. We have a couple LOBBYING ORGANIZATIONS…. GAE and PAGE, but that’s ALL they can do, lobby.

By kassie

June 17, 2008 11:04 AM | Link to this

I agree with Janice. My husband and I always are wondering why there are so many breaks(spring break, fall break, coffee break, afternoon break, etc…) Everytime I turn around my children are on break! What would be the difference with the 9 wk 3 wk deal. I welcome any change because what is happening now to our kids is shameful. Thank goodness I believe that my child should be taught at home and what the teachers do is supplement that education. Change!

By ryd

June 17, 2008 11:04 AM | Link to this

I do not understand how this will help anyone. If they start early or later. Georgia is still 49th or maybe 50th with all the kids waiting on buses to go to summer school. It looks like the kids need more quality time in school. Forget summer vacation if your child can not read. I think they need to go as much as possible. Some kids don’t get a hot meal if they are not at school. If the Federal Government wants to help they need to help the children that are left behind not leave them behind.

By Home-schooling mom For a Reason!

June 17, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this

I am with what dumbamericans said! Hitler knew it best you can’t take over a country and have total control till you take over the schooling of our children ..they will be government puppets and never question a thing!

By David

June 17, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this

Just a question: You have stated the need for a real vacation !! Don’t you think 84 days off is enough. Just ask the average person how many vacation days they get. And another thing. Teacher pay always comes up as in we don’t get paid enough. Really ! What you are paid is for work done on 190 day contract not a 12 month contract. So looks like the average teacher pay is in line if not above average for the number of days worked.

By A former student in Georgia

June 17, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this

Don’t most of you realize that logic is illogical at times?

If our school boards gave a flip about the kids, it would be a shock.

All the bureaucratic mess has gotten in the way of actually learning.

Moving the start of school on the Tuesday after Labor Day is a good idea for a number of reasons.

From a safety standpoint, our kids aren’t likely to get heat stroke or some other illness caused by 95 degree temps. I would not want my child to become extremely ill from sitting in a classroom for hours roasting like a turkey.

The “eggheads” and bureaucrats would benefit to “crunch” the number of their hallowed CRCT or Full Of C—- tests.

This is a win-win for all parties concerned.

But again this is logical and that is illogical.

By JK

June 17, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this

One more consideration: Summer camp and Summer jobs! (even better: summer jobs at summer camp!) These are still good things that help kids grow, interact outside their usual bubble, become responsible and independent, and yes, stay out of their parents’ hair! How is a teenager supposed to work all summer and save money if they only get summer three weeks at a time? Good grief. Parents of small children: look beyond your current day-care bills to how things will change. Non-parents: really, go bother someone else; you have no idea.

By Artie

June 17, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this

Yes, indeed…year-round school is where it’s at!!!! Keep those rugrats occupied and not give them a chance to be out and about vandelizing property!!!!

By Bad Move!

June 17, 2008 11:11 AM | Link to this

My kids are in Cherokee County where we start early, have one week in Sept, one week in November, 2 wks in December, one in February and one in April. It is almost perfect! Jeff is correct - year round school. Teachers, if you don’t like it, find another profession. Everybody else works 12 months, you should too. I learned from my daughter-in-law who is from Germany. They are so far advanced in math it makes me sick! We are losing in education and we better be the smart ones and buck the old traditional system - it does not work any more. Kathy Cox should be fired for what has happened and she is way below the bar if she wants to postpone starting school and thinks this can solve problems she was responsible for. I am writing Dr. Pettruzio, Cherokee County Superintendent to make sure he does not change our schedule! I love it!

By JB

June 17, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this

Parents don’t get fooled. It’s still 180 days for your kids whether they move it up or push it back or make it year round. School for students is scheduled around the 2nd week of school and she’s suggesting it move a week. It will not mean a thing, buses still need to run, daycare and afterschool care will still run the same. They are trying to make it seem like it’s a big deal and they’re doing something when all it sounds like to me smoke screens.

By Mike

June 17, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

If we had not all tried to keep up with the Jones. Daycare would not be a problem. Give up the Big Screen TV the Lexus,and live in a home you can actually afford. Stay home and raise your own children. No Daycare needed!Mom and Dad are suppose to raise thier children not some stranger at a Daycare center. We are doing it wrong.

By catlady

June 17, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

I am with you, JK, on the “they will forget it over the Christmas holidays” lament. If they DO forget, they didn’t LEARN it. How else to explain why I can still do algebra 2 and Spanish after 40 years away?! It is called MASTERY, something we don’t emphasize anymore (we “expose”). I moved “up north” to Alabama when they still had “cotton pickin’ schedule” in many of the county schools. Now THAT seemed strange. We have become SO inflexible, so entrenched in lockstep, one grade per year thinking. Anyone know the name of the German efficiency expert who gave us the 12 years of schooling idea?

I have been a single parent for over 20 years.Before I had children I knew what the school year looked like, and I knew that my job, and my husband’s, would have to take that into account. It should not be a surprise to ANY American parent that there is a summer break time. I get real impatient with the cry of “What will I do with them in the summer?” You plan ahead. Novel idea, huh? Even after the birth of your child, you have YEARS to plan how you will handle it. It would be the same no matter how the school year is configured. I am tired of so many decisions about school scheduling revolving around parental work schedules (we can’t start at 8:30. What about the parents who work?)Or about high school football season, or about SACS accreditation, for that matter. Our decisions need to be driven by real analysis!

On YRS, I don’t know if it provides the “benefits” it is touted to provide. Seems like it would be more time to “forget”, more times to have to review. I can tell you that the kids we have that do summer school don’t come back 5 weeks later needing any less review than those who had the “entire” 9 weeks to “forget”. Just my personal experience. Concepts mastered are not forgotten.

By Tony

June 17, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

This is an excellent example of the cart driving the horse. Testing should be the cart and here we have a proposal to modify our school calendars based on testing. Let’s do away with NCLB requirements that are doing nothing more than undermining our ability to provide a quality education.

By Cateyes

June 17, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this

I agree with Kathy Cox…move the date! I know that the kids are still going to school 180 days, but they are getting extra days off like Fall Break, and extra “teacher’s work days” thrown in there. Not to mention the half days! When I was in school (and I graduated in 1992), we started school at the end of August, and the last day was always the first week in June. Starting the first week in August is just too hot…and the schools will have to pay extra to run the AC in schools and buses. Besides, it’s also too hot for the football players, etc to be out there practicing in 100 degree heat! It usually (but not always) cools down a tad towards the end of August.

It just makes more sense.

By Grandfather

June 17, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this

A lot of the problem here is that we do not expect or require the kids to take responsibility for or ownership of their education. If fact we are not requiring that they take responsibility for anything…and the same goes for you parents. We home schooled our kids until the education that we could give them went beyond us and then we sent them to a private, self paced accredited school. We put the responsibility on them we did not transfer responsibility to the teacher. The teacher already knows the information, the kid is the one that must learn and retain it. Did any of you know that in Japan that no school employs a janitor. The kids do the cleaning after school and on Saturday. That is what I mean by taking ownership…how much grafitti do you think is in their schools….I bet none because the kids themselves would have to clean it. But God knows we don’t want little Johnny to have to lift a finger to take the responsibility for his school. Lets pay someone to do it while Little Johnny sits on his bum all day and plays video games. That is the approach we have taken and you all see where it has gotten us…just look at the Clayton County mess….that is what happens when nobody takes ownership of education….thank God my kids are out of college and are productive citizens.

By JohnBurningham

June 17, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this

Maybe the state needs to convert to a BOARDING SCHOOL system where students leave home in the fall and stay the whole school year at school and return home for the summer.

By K

June 17, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this

Clarification to Who Cares re teachers getting paid for doing “nothing” over the summer: Teachers are paid for 190 DAYS — PERIOD. The total pay for those 190 DAYS is divided up into 12 (once a month) or 24 (twice a month) payments over the course of one YEAR (which runs from July 1 to June 30) in most cases. And before you start talking about teachers “doing nothing” during the summer, take a tour of every education department at every college/university in this state. I guarantee you’ll see it populated with teachers sitting through classes for continuing education credits. Classes which, I might add, are usually at exorbitant prices, taught by the teachers themselves (because most professors see themselves as “facilitators”), filled with totally unrealistic activities that contribute NOTHING to student learning during the school year, totally ineffective toward addressing the REAL improvement needs of teachers, and are mandated by a state department of education that can’t seem to make up its mind what to do, when to do it, and whether the mandates it already came up with are even relevant. So don’t talk to me about doing nothing during summer “vacation”, buddy!!! Another Frustrated EDUCATOR

By Past Educator

June 17, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this

Maybe we should change the schedule to be 190 days for kids and 200 for teachers. No half days for teacher workshops. Use the extra 10 days for all the CRCT ^&(@!# that the government requires. Use the other 180 to teach meaningful material. When I taught I had to use my summer vacations to take additional classes for a master’s degree and special certifications. Now teachers can complete much of that through on-line classes. Up their pay and add the days. Also, if you think all kids came ready to start where they left off before summer vacation, you are dreaming. The first few weeks of class are always review. A real waste of time.

By Up here in Ellijay

June 17, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this

I’m all for starting after labor day and going into June! It seemed work just fine for us, I don’t remember ever having that much trouble passing tests, we studied, went to bed early the night before, had a good breakfast and brought our pencils with us the morning of the test. I have never considered school daycare. I have, however, felt that they should stick to teaching academics and stay away from trying to force pc behavior and ideas on them. My kids could both read and write before starting school.

By Middle School Teacher

June 17, 2008 11:24 AM | Link to this

The on/off idea is a great idea. It would mean that students could be remediated on their weaknesses after each 9 week period as opposed to only two weeks in the summer. As it is now, pushing a child to learn more complicated material after they have obviously not grasped the previous material is a waste of time. It’s too late to catch them up on 180 days of material during 3 weeks of summer school. With this alternative scenario, those that need extra help have 4 opportunities to catch up versus the current one.

And as far as our salary goes… We don’t get paid for summer work. Our pay is based on 190 days and it is divided up over 12 months so we can have pay during the time we don’t work. Just as your salary is divided by 52 weeks and not the 48 - 50 (after PTO) to compensate for your vacations. You don’t get paid to sit at home… and neither do we!

By Will

June 17, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this

Setting the school calendar is a function of the locally elected school board, not the state or federal government.

Isn’t it amazing how politicians run as candidates for “local control” and “less government” and then try to conrol local issues with more government!!

Want a great example? The General Assembly passed a law this session mandating that twins not be separated in school if parents don’t want this. If you are going to argue that separating twins is bad, you are missing my point. Assignment of students to classes is usually delegated by the local Board of Education to the building level administrator. In any case, it is not the function of state government.

What’s next, the state dictating to locally elected BOEs when the school day begins and ends? Where students may sit in a classroom if the parent wants the child to sit in the front (or back)?

Yes sir, these “small government”, “local control” politicians are a hoot!

Rather than dictate to locally elected BOEs, maybe Ms. Cox needs to spend more time figuring out how to analyze and report testing data in a more timely manner.

By jujubeed

June 17, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this

By CRCT

June 17, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

Testing has it’s benefits. However it is sad that all of the education system must revolve around it. The data should be used to see each individual childs progress and help them. Not punish everyone involved. My school system is on a balanced calander and I love it!! I love teaching and I love students. Everyone is responsible for the education of our children- Teachers, Parents, STUDENTS, Administrators, and elected officials.I am tired of hearing all the criticism, and complaining. I know in my school everything possible is done to teach students and to help the ones that need extra help. Teachers work hard, stay late, tutor for free and we meet AYP. Starting earlier or later will not change this.

By Dick

June 17, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this

If a child really really wants to learn they have no problem as to when school starts. The problem with education was pretty well summed up in local news article saying some school were paying children when they learned, passed, etc. Schools should place the material before the children and the children SHOULD BE MATURE enough to learn. Our schools tough? Go to foreign countries and see waht their children are learning at different ages. Face it we have a bunch of spoiled parents raising a bunch of spoiled children who has an edcuation system headed by department heads in Atlanta and Washington who are scare to death of the spoiled parents and children. Cox is nothing more than a career politician.

By Past Educator

June 17, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this

Grandfather, you are correct. Back in the day I could keep kids after school, make them clean the bathroom if they made a mess in there, patrol the school grounds for litter or clean tables in the cafeteria as punishment. They were taught responsibility for their actions. K, you also are correct. I actually had a college professor go back to teaching elementary school for two years, and when he returned to the college classroom he apologized for giving us theory that did not translate into practical classroom advice. All educational professors should have to return to teaching once every 5 years to see what teachers really face every day in schools.

By concerned mom

June 17, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this

I just spent 20 minutes reading this conversation and I have to say what in the world has happened. Teachers, concerned parents, and taxpayers alike. We’re spending time talking about short summer vacations and daycare. Based on the test scores the GA schools are producing these kids should be in school 360 days a year. The children are ill prepared for school in any other state let alone college. Our national education ranking is in the toliet. Cathy Cox if she were employed by anyone other than the government would be unemployed. Her performance is absolutely unacceptable. Instead we send our kids to summer school to make sure we don’t lose funding. Our kids are spending an entire year preparing for a test. Here’s an idea; properly educated our children then testing would not be an issue. I have such a hard time believing our children are the problem, it’s the system and the faciliators. What GA needs in our education system is competition (vouchers). We as parents/taxpayers should be demanding results for our bucks!! Then maybe just maybe we could bring recess/specials back to our over weight kids. We’re no longer focused on educating the kids of the future, the state is focused on keeping their funding. So sad…

By Trazey

June 17, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this

Start later! Many good points have been made….July and August are too hot to have kids on buses, marching band, and Especially Football, the coaches think the kids are young and can handle it, but if your body can’t cool, it will overheat! Have you ever had to sit on a hot school bus, and then with the Smog alerts, they don’t even get fresh air while they sit in their bus line with all the engines running…thats why they can’t test right…we fry their brains with exhaust fumes that can’t move through the thick humid Ga Summer air.

By CORRECTION!!

June 17, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

Cathy Cox was the former Georgia Secretary of State, highly-praised and effective in her job. She ran for governor, but Georgians apparently are not ready for a qualified, proven effective manager at the helm. Kathy Cox is the State School Superintendant who oversees our abysmal graduation rates and test scores. Please do not confuse the two!

By SAL

June 17, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

Concerned Mom and Tony, and several others have said it all best!! Thank you!!! I personally am for YRS, I have a 10 year old boy going into 5th grade, and we have had nothing but a roller coaster of school years. I think the testing of these kids multiple times a year is for the birds. I was actually glad to see that CRCT test scores bit GA in the rear this year… in my opinion it just totally proved that making the core curriculum based on that test, is not the way to provide an education to our kids. I saw stress in our teachers eyes and the kids eyes this year. Where did the fun of learning go?? Anybody from the government/school boards want to answer that?? It’s all about funding.. and that damn CRCT… I could go on and on because my son was bumped out of EIP math this past school year because of the CRCT in 3rd grade (he passed under resource guidance), when it was clearly evident he still needed to be in the small class setting this past year, but was not eligible because of the CRCT. But next year he is eligible again because he did not pass the math portion. It is such a convoluted mess. I’d vote for YRS in a heart beat and then vote to do away with these big tests as well!!!

By SeeSpotRun

June 17, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this

Then let us FIRE Kathy Cox !!!!

Let us fight for local control!!!

We need to break it all down to the basics and start over in all aspects.

By Howard Roark

June 17, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this

Kathy Cox is pandering to seacoast legislators. This is not best for students. Having the midpoint (semester break) end at Christmas break is good for high and middle school students is good for education.

If Kathy Cox trusted school systems to scan and report their test data as they do in North Carolina this would give systems more instructional time because testing could be completed just before the end of the school year.

*BTW school teachers are under contract to work 190 days. They have 3 days of paid vacation. *There is a monthly hold back in their checks so they receive their held back pay over the time off in the summer. Thanksgiving, Christmas and summer is not paid vacation.

By Mommy of 3

June 17, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this

To Who Cares: I can’t believe you actually thought that teachers get paid for the days they are not teaching!! Wouldn’t that be nice!! If that were the case, then everyone would be a teacher. Yes, as mentioned by others, we work 190 days and get paid for 190 days. The salary we earn is then divided into 12 equal checks that we receive at the end of every month.

By dondee

June 17, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this

Grandfather,

You are right about kids not owning their education. There are some who care, but many others who really don’t.
NCLB was a noble idea, but not grounded in reality. It made the schools completely responsible for the education (which we are, as well as other things), without considering outside factors, ie parent involvement, natural ability, student and parental apathy, society…blah, blah.

Kids today need to care about their education and the place they receive that education. Kids need to experience consequences for their actions or lack thereof,in all facets of life. Then, we might see some improvement.

By Cindy

June 19, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

The state has NO business telling my city schools what our schedule should be.

I LIKE the early August start. And I’m a SAHM, so it has nothing to do with “day care”.

By Kelly

June 20, 2008 4:11 AM | Link to this

Okay, stop blaming the teachers…the state decided to change math curriculum this past school year. This curriculum was a whole grade level past what these kids had been taught the previous year - hence the “gap” in their knowledge! Imagine teaching children these days…kids who can’t or won’t sit quietly and LISTEN…worrying about weapons, drugs, fights, bullying, symptoms of various abuses (outside of school)…school systems afraid to discipline behavioral issues…unbelievable pressure from the top down for these CRCT scores to be as high as possible - and the pressure doesn’t stop with the teachers, the kids feel the pressure, also.

Everyone is missing the point…yes the time frame of school beginning/ending affects parents. BUT NO MATTER HOW WELL YOU RAISE YOUR CHILD, THEY ARE STILL BEING EXPOSED TO ALL SORTS OF THINGS ON BUSES AND IN THE SCHOOL.

YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR RAISING YOUR OWN CHILDREN IN AN APPROPRIATE MANNER. BUT IF YOU’RE NOT DOING YOUR JOB AS A PARENT, YOU MAKE IT HARDER FOR TEACHERS, AND OTHER PARENTS, AS WELL.

By alice

June 20, 2008 8:33 AM | Link to this

Everyone has a solution for the Education Department. Parents need to think back to the year NCLB came into effect. Parents wanted to hold teachers accountable. I believe it needs to be rewritten and teachers should be able to hold parents accountable. I am all for delaying the start of school. We have three year old students starting prek in August. We have four year old students in Kindergarten. These babies need to be at home playing,resting and just being a child. Once they start school they are not allowed to play due to student progress.
Teachers are always being put down. It is time for the people to realize that teaching is not the same as before. Teachers want to be treated just like you. You would not like to hear your boss talk bad about you, so don’t talk bad about teachers. Kathy Cox is doing a great job. Our state is in an education reform. It will take aleast three years to show the gains. You can help your child by being a parent and encouraging them to study. You can become a part of your child education by educating youself by finding out what your child is expected to learn. You need to try to attend PTSA meeting and schedule a parent/teacher meeting on your days off. We do not keep secrets. You can ask what is expected of your child.We want all children to succeed. Just remember, you are the teacher. We just try to give them information they need to succeed in an ever changing world. If you do not educate your child at home, you are setting them up for failure. We are not leaving a child behind. When a child is at school the teacher works with them. When they go home, the parents are pushing them away. You are leaving your own child behind. Once you have children your job as a teacher begins. The first test your child takes at school is like the CRCT. We can tell how much you taught your child. The person that commented about Georgia being behind needs to be an advocate for parents as educators. Together we can help our state raise the test scores. Teachers can not do it alone. LEANING BEGINS AT HOME!

By A highschool student

June 24, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this

Honestly, students need a break most of us have had a very stresful school year and an elongated summer wouldn’t be such a bad idea. And even if the summer ends two weeks later, we still get the full 180 days of instructional learning. Honestly i know this whole ordeal is about raising test cores, Which should be noticed as a top priority, but what about the kids and how WE feel…

By jennie

July 7, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this

GIVE OUR KIDS A CHANCE TO BE KIDS!!!!!! AUGUST IS THE HOTTEST MONTH!! LET OUR KIDS ENJOY PLAYING AND STOP WASTING SO MUCH ENERGY AND CAUSING MORE SMOG!!

By Alesha

July 12, 2008 7:49 PM | Link to this

I think making students go earlier every year is not helping anyone. I come from a year around school system and all my friends and I hated it. In my opinion the students are so put out with school after going for so long they just get tired of trying. I also do not think making them go more days is going to make the state test scores any better. That is on the teachers and parents and how they use their time with the students they are given. I know it’s hard to help all students; however we should not give up. I thought three year olds this past year and with the parents help they could all write their own name and some of them could read. If anything schools should make it optional for parents to start sending their children to pre schools at a cheaper cost. I have observed that when children go to pre schools before entering grade school they are more advanced in their education and social skills. So I think waiting to have the children start at the end of August, or even the day after Labor Day would be a great idea.

By fellenf

July 18, 2008 5:50 PM | Link to this

This is far past due. The South, with its heat and humidity, seems to lead the way in states that send their students back to school during the most oppressive month of the year. In my school system, we have equipment that fails due to the heat, not to mention the scores of heat-related ailments for students and adults. Afternoon bus rides home in August? What fun! Despite all the yada-yada I hear from district superintendents about needing to begin so early so they can have standardized test scores on a timely basis — hogwash. The real reason is FOOTBALL, every high school’s biggest moneymaker. Districts are scared to death to fall behind other counties’ football schedules, heaven forbid. Seeing as how Georgia’s CRCT scores still rank among the lowest in the nation, I don’t see that beginning school in 98 degree heat and ending the third week in May is helping us any. ALL of Georgia should start school no earlier than the third week in August and continue into the 2nd week in June, the way it used to be, and the way it was better!

By Educator

July 25, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this

Most public school classroom educators are contracted for 190 days. The school year is divided into 2 semesters, 18 weeks each. Starting the school year in August costs the school systems a fortune in energy and fuel. It is time that we stop being “stuck on stupid” and explore methods in which to save energy and live to learn. The days of draining our energy reserves and teaching to the test should leave our thought process forever!

By steve

August 20, 2008 12:16 PM | Link to this

Look at how Georgia ranks among other states, the current system evedently is not working. YRS is stupid, other states have tried it and junked the system, you need a start and a finish to a school year and a summer break. Starting school in early August is costing a fortune so why not do something to save a little money instead of wasting it. There is a reason that many other states around the country are passing laws to keep schools from starting before Labor Day, because it works better for everybody.