Political Insider

By ATLLIBERAL

September 24, 2007 10:57 AM | Link to this

It was still the lowest political moment in recent history. Chambliss should be ashamed of it rather than taking credit for it. Wonder what the ads against him will look like next year?

By RL

September 24, 2007 11:17 AM | Link to this

For Republicans it is ALWAYS party first country second. They don’t care who they smear or what lies they tell… all that really matters is winning and having power. What is right for American always takes a back seat to what is right for the Republican party.

Disgusting…

By Emily

September 24, 2007 12:15 PM | Link to this

Max Cleland a war hero??? THAT’S FUNNY!! There was nothing wrong with that ad. It was factual.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 12:20 PM | Link to this

Chambliss is another “law school” draft-dodger. According to Wikipedia he finished business school in ‘66 and immediately started law school and got married - like Cheney and Gingrich needing to pop out a kid to beat the draft. He took the law school rathole to make sure. A man without honor, Chambliss is most comfortable with the Washington toilet-stall crowd, rubbing elbows with the Bush traitors who committed 9-11.

PS. Giuliani’s phone stunt at the NRA was just to give the false impression that he is straight.

Hillary’s no good…Obama or better.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 12:26 PM | Link to this

Cleland was awarded the Silver Star, among other decorations. How about you “Emily,” or your brother, husband, father, grandfather? Give us the details of your “heroism” you contemptible slattern.

By Jeff

September 24, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this

Medals do not equal battlefield heroism. The stories BEHIND the medals MIGHT, or MIGHT NOT.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this

From Wikipedia: The Silver Star is the fourth highest military decoration that can be awarded to a member of any branch of the United States Armed Forces. It is also the third highest award given for valor (in the face of the enemy).

‘nuff said. LBJ obviously didn’t deserve his Silver Star…If that is what you mean to imply in Cleland’s case, I suspect you’re mistaken. Please substantiate such a potentially scurrilous charge. Default position on medal distribution by Dept of Army is positive.

By Jeff

September 24, 2007 2:01 PM | Link to this

Well, Kerry got his “medals” for running and hiding while his boat-mates were getting shot and killed…

By Craig

September 24, 2007 2:15 PM | Link to this

The irony from that ad is the fact that Max actually volunteered to serve. Saxby faked some bum knee high school football injury. When his country called on him he ran and hid as well. So he runs and hides when his country calls on him but he has no problem with rubber stamping the White House and forcing other men and women longer deployments etc. Saxby doesn’t mind pointing out the flaws of others who actually DID serve but can he say he served his country and answered the call when given? No. Coward. I could care less about Max’s history. The fact is a coward used a trashy ad to win.

By Abomi Nation

September 24, 2007 2:27 PM | Link to this

How about you Jeff? Aren’t you in your 20’s? Why don’t you serve? You are just a plain coward. At least Cleland served.

Why are you hiding?????

By Jeff

September 24, 2007 2:44 PM | Link to this

Abomi:

The simple answer is “fate”.

It wasn’t my intention to hide. Matter of fact, in January 2006 I came to within 12 hours of signing up for a trip to Parris Island.

Then fate intervened. Gave me a chance to become a teacher instead. Teaching didn’t last very long, but it led me to where I met the woman that in 19 days becomes my wife. It now wouldn’t be fair to her to convert to Marine after she met me and fell in love with me as Jeff. (I know all too well what PI would do to me. It would make me the consumate Marine’s Marine, with all that that entails - both good and bad.)

Oh, and in another ironic twist of fate, I’m now being recruited for a civilian DoD job on a local Marine base.

I don’t run from the military. I actively sought it, even against the wishes of EVERYONE around me.

But my life is no longer about me. I have a family to look out for.

You can bet though that when my kid is growing up, he (or she) will know that I would never force them into the Marines, but neither am I one that says it isn’t a valid option. In fact, many of my standards/ SOPs are based on theirs.

By Abomi Nation

September 24, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this

JEFF, YOU ARE A COWARD OF THE WORST KIND!!!!

Thousands upon thousands of American soldiers have put their lives on hold. Many have been injured and killed!

“It now wouldn’t be fair to her to convert to Marine after she met me and fell in love with me as Jeff.”

That is the biggest load of CR@P I have ever read on these blogs. And you have some nerve to criticize Kerry and Cleland or moveon.org for that matter.

How many people out there support Jeff and his form of cowardice? Lets here it. Is Jeff the new American patriot????? I’m going to be sick.

By Craig

September 24, 2007 3:11 PM | Link to this

Came within 12 hours of signing up? Like an hour of missing Osama? So when your country called you chose another path. Those 12 hours gave you time to decide whether you should serve your country in the Marines or teach?

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 3:33 PM | Link to this

Jeff - Stop the marriage if you have any honor or family name to protect. If your intended is a woman of virtue do not defraud her by presenting yourself as a man…for you have not yet become one.

Go Army or find wisdom elsewhere and return to her as a man. Settle for the Marines if you can’t get into the senior service.

By Jeff

September 24, 2007 4:05 PM | Link to this

Abomi and Craig:

It went down more like this: I graduated college in May. I had only been taking 1 class my last semester (I had been scheduled for the equivalent of 5, but dropped 4 of them), so I had been working part time jobs, trying to figure out what I was going to do with my life, since Feb. I had already taken the PRAXIS II tests and had I not withdrawn from the one class (student teaching), I would have graduated with two degrees: One I loved, and one that I could make a TON of money in. Teaching was the one I loved. So I fought the rest of the year to find a teaching job. I literally criss-crossed this entire Great State, and the only part that I didn’t touch in my 120+ interviews was the NE corner, where I had previously worked as a Wilderness Counselor, and the Metro Area, because honestly I was trying to get AWAY from Atlanta.

In Sept, I walked into the Marine Corps Recruiting Office, Rome. SSgt Barfield and I had a great talk, but something came up that I THOUGHT was a PDQ. (Old injury from a car wreck - I have the x-rays to prove it. The wreck wasn’t the PDQ though, it was one of the drugs they had put me on temporarily because of it.)

I kept looking for a teaching job.

In late December, I learned that I only needed a letter from the Doc saying that I hadn’t been on the particular drug in more than a year, and that I was perfectly capable of becoming a Marine.

I got that letter on January 3 of the next year. I scheduled an appt with SSgt Barfield for the 5th.

On January 4th, I was eating lunch with my grandmother when a principal called me and asked me to come to an interview on the 5th. I called SSgt and rescheduled for the 6th - I had been let down by principals FAR too often not to go ahead and plan a back-up plan.

At this point, I was ready to take the first job offered me. And I was to the point that I HAD to have a job - I was still living with my parents and working part time jobs 6 months after college graduation!

The principal offered me the job practically as soon as I walked through the door on the 5th.

That began a process that led me out of my parents house and into South GA. When things began to turn sour in South GA, I immediately started getting in shape to once again be prepared for a trip to PI.

And then two things happened almost simultaneously. I met this chica on yahoo personals, we started talking and quickly fell in love. And I got offered a job in Central GA - within a LONG commute of her in South GA - just as my job in South GA was coming to a close.

As I said, she has never known the side of me that led me to the Marines, though she has seen aspects of it. Going to PI and letting it change me the way I know it will would not be fair to her. Nor would uprooting her from the place we both LOVE - SOUTH Georgia. Therefore, I put my own dreams on hold, knowing that by putting on that titanium ring in 19 days, I will never put on the title that I wanted so desparately for so many years - United States Marine.

Will:

A) The Marines are better fighters. B) The Marine spirit is the true heart of a warrior. C) If I wanted it easy, I’d flip burgers.

I like the way the Marines put it on their current media campaign: We don’t accept applications. Only commitments.

I look at the services this way: If you like high-tech, go USAF. If you like the water, go USN. IF you like beauracracy, go Army. And if you like challenges and getting the job done, go USMC.

After all, it aint the Army that goes in first. Marines conquer. The Army occupies.

See, I already fit in with the Pentagon’s service rivalries! :P

By RL

September 24, 2007 4:23 PM | Link to this

Jeff, You are still a coward… just like Saxby and “W” and Newt and Mitt (and all five of his sons) and the list goes on and on.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 4:27 PM | Link to this

Talk’s cheap, punk. You better stay out of Atlanta. You couldn’t handle it.

By Jeff

September 24, 2007 4:44 PM | Link to this

Will:

Ah, but I ALREADY handled Atlanta. Been there, done that. Old hat. I’ve achieved things that every power broker in Atlanta wants to do, but I did it in more private ways. Honestly, I decided that even the taste of the power that I got was so disgusting that I would rather walk away than live that life. So I decided to retire, live the slower life that I grew up loving. Indeed, it was this exact situation that drew me to teaching in the first place. (Little did I know…)

It is sad that I can say that at not-quite 25, but it is the truth.

See, that’s one of the reasons I can walk away from becoming a Marine: I’ve already fought my wars. Were they as public as Iraq? No. Were they just as viscious? Believe it.

By Abomi Nation

September 24, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this

This is what gets me about the Bush supporters. You all go ape sit over the moveon.org ad but people like Jeff get ignored.

Has anyone ever seen a mainstream media column on cowards like Jeff that think they can spout off with their nonsense all day while hiding behind their mothers apron?

First he says he couldn’t join the Marines because it wouldn’t be fair to his soon to be wife. Now its some mysterious ailment.

I’m sure our real American heroes appreciate the fact that cowards like Jeff aren’t on patrol next to them because they couldn’t trust them to cover their backs.

But this “pretend” support of the war from many of you is so easy to see through. No wonder you attack a stupid ad from moveon.org. its sooooo easy. And cowardly.

Come on regulars, where is your love for Jeff?

Hey Political Insiders, how about you interview Jeff. Show the world how the neo patriot acts all tough, calls Purple Heart and Silver Star recipients unworthy, while hiding under their own beds.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 5:26 PM | Link to this

Maybe you had no father, Jeff. Forgive my bluntness above. No doubt you have good qualities. I wish you the best…as in many cases the good wife makes the man…perhaps you’re to be blessed. You’ve spelled out your life for all to read, is it only you who fails to see the obvious? If you are able-bodied and support the homosexual draft-dodger in the White House, you really are morally obliged, as an American male adult, to go to wherever the recruiting station is now, and take The Oath. Even if your delusional fantasies or spoiled circumstance cushions you, anyone of integrity will know the truth: you will never be anything but a wannabe lying to yourself. All American Men know that of Bush, Cheney, Giuliani, Romney, Larry Craig,Richardson, Clinton, Reid, etb. Be a Georgia Man. Look in the mirror and quit kidding yourself. A small percentage get killed. If you hink Bush’s cause is just you owe to any blood in your veins you think is American to go suit up. The fact is Bush did 9-11 and is a lying treasonous closet-queen whose father killed John Kennedy and whose grandfather was Hitler’s banker. You want to be a teacher? Go learn something first, player. Speak no more of the military until your action makes you worthy.

By VoR

September 24, 2007 6:47 PM | Link to this

Max Cleland dropped a grenade on himself in Vietnam. Because of that, many Democrats believe he should never be questioned about how he voted on issues important to the security of the United States.

It is interesting to note that Cleland referred to 6 of his Republican colleagues as “a bunch of chicken hawks who never went to war, never felt a wound, but are so quick to criticize a man who went to war and got wounded doing it.” Five of these 6 Republicans were combat veterans and the sixth spent 30 years in the U.S. Army Reserves. Among the 5 Republicans who served in combat, one was Congressman Sam Johnson (R-TX) who flew 62 combat missions in Korea and flew 25 missions over North Vietnam where he was shot down and spent 6 1/2 years being tortured as a POW. Another of the 5 was one of only 2 Navy Aces that were produced from the Vietnam War.

Democrats worship a man who had an unfortunate accident in Vietnam—a man who calls his distinguished Republican combat veterans “chicken hawks”. That same man doesn’t have the class to respect decorated combat Veterans simply because these men are Republicans. Expressed differently, Max Cleland takes advantage of the fact that he had a terrible accident to hold himself unaccountable.

As Ann Coulter said, “apparently none of these men had the dauntless courage to drop a grenade on his own foot.”

By Craig

September 24, 2007 7:11 PM | Link to this

VoR - I really don’t care how Max hurt himself. He had the courage to go. Your boys - Saxby, Cheney, Dubya, Rush, Boortz, and on and on - chose to cower at home.

By Bill

September 24, 2007 7:51 PM | Link to this

Ref VoR and his friend in slander, Ann Coulter - Sen. Cleland was injured by the explosion of a grenade that fell from the belt of a young soldier as they were both jumping off a helicopter during the Tet Offensive in 1968. The incident has been documented for several years in interviews with an eye-witness (a former Marine, now living in the Baltimore area). Sen. Cleland picked up the fallen grenade thinking it came from his own belt. The young soldier, who had just arrived in-country, had anxiously and nervously straightened the pins in each of his grenades prior to exiting at the LZ. The Marine eye witness was the first to reach both men. A medic arived almost immediately and told the Marine to take care of the young soldier as he began trying to stabilize Cptn. Cleland. The Marine later stated that the boy kept shouting “it was my grenade, my grenade!” and he realized all the remaining grenades on the belt each had a straightened pin. He stabilized them and then discovered that the blood covering the boy’s uniform….was Cleland’s. Sen. Cleland would not know that it was another soldier’s grenade for over 30 years when he met that eye witness. The former Marine had seen a documentary on Army Medics and Navy Corpsmen on the History Channel. The documentary contained an interview with Cleland about his injury. It was then that he realized Sen. Cleland did not know what had happened. That’s the documented truth. As for Sen. Cleland’s Bornze and Silver Star commendations, they are among our nation’s highest medals and Sen. Cleland was awarded these several weeks BEFORE his injury, for outstanding bravery in combat….but that’s another story. Folks like Ann Coulter can criticise Cleland’s positions, statements, votes…but they have no right to cast dispertions on his sacrifice and service. The Chambliss ad, regardless of who wrote it, will stand the test time as among the very worst in legalized slander. It will for ever say more about those who wrote it, condoned it and produced it, than it does about the man it attacked.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 8:16 PM | Link to this

To think slanderous draft-dodging scum like Saxby Chambliss, “in bed” with the homosexual draft-dodger-in-chief, represent the Great State of Georgia - home of Ft. Benning and the Infantry School; Ft. Stewart, great installations of squids, jarheads, and proptops, and the finest men (and women) who ever served Our Armed Forces. Mighty fishy…like a snake.

By Churchill

September 24, 2007 9:29 PM | Link to this

Will, since you are such a homophobe you should move to Iran. I hear that they don’t have any of those over there.

By Will Jones

September 24, 2007 9:48 PM | Link to this

It’s Bush hypocrisy - an evil to any free people - not his perversion that’s troubling. “Out” gays, at peace and fulfilled, are not inclined to engage in the nefarious activities and treason twisted Bush pursues. Once the pedophile priesthood, its practices, faction, and deviant stain is removed from Our Nation the Spirit of Righteousness, Annuit Coeptis, shall once again prevail.

By Craig

September 24, 2007 10:49 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the explanation, Bill.

By VoR

September 24, 2007 10:53 PM | Link to this

Bill,

It is interesting that you think the Chambliss ad is “legalized slander” [do you even know the definition of “slander”—no you don’t] but are silent about Cleland’s “chicken hawks” comments.

I said that Cleland’s wounds were caused by an accident and you said that his wounds were caused by an accident as well. I’m sorry he was hurt and appreciate his service to the United States, but that gives him no license to smear other veterans, does it? No it doesn’t.

You take no umbrage at Cleland’s despicable comments about his distinguished colleagues. Just why is that? You didn’t mention that, did you? No you didn’t.

The takeaway is that you think it’s OK if someone makes distasteful comments about a Republican veteran. We differ in that I believe it’s wrong to criticize the honorable military service of anyone. I criticized Cleland’s comments.

And the word is “aspersions”. “Dispertion” isn’t a word just like your comments aren’t cogent. But if common sense and decency don’t matter to you, then why should grammar matter?

To believe that Cleland’s comments were proper would “require the willing suspension of disbelief”—to borrow the words of your Democrat presidential nominee-in-waiting. You’ll remember that she used these words about General Petraeus. You can see the convergence: it’s alright for Democrats to disparage Republican veterans and Republicans in uniform—but you can never question a Democrat who voted the wrong way on a Homeland Security measure if that person even looked at a military uniform.

I guess Ann has no First Amendment rights because she wasn’t a Navy Seal or something.

Max lost the election because he stopped representing the interests of Georgia voters. Both you and he should accept this and stop criticizing veterans.

By Will Jones

September 25, 2007 8:06 AM | Link to this

Google: “Cleland Barnes Diebold” for some “interesting” takes on how the “vote” went in Georgia to put draft-dodging lawyer and a flying veterinarian in office in the state with more than likely one of the best demographics for active duty, retired and veteran military. …and GOP Karen Handel just can’t manage to come up with a paper trail. yeah…right.

“VoR” Back up your “chickenhawk” charge: all I found is a reference to Cheney and the Bush WH…and that is absolutely fact: Bush and Cheney are Chickenhawks…lying, traitorous, pervert Chickenhawks requiring Justice be done to them by an outraged citizenry.

By that_guy

September 27, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this

A*******hats like Will Jones et al don’t deserve much attention, but the argument that people who don’t join a volunteer force are cowards needs addressing. The Army (Marines, etc) isn’t for everyone. the rigorous basic training and constant mental assault are designed to break people down and weed out the weak recruits. Some who do join are admirable and truly deserving of this country’s gratitude and go on to serve valiantly and successfully. Others are criminals, low-lifes, deadbeats, and mouth-breathing simpletons without any employable skills. Simple fact, military service doesn’t equal good citizenship, high moral fiber, or any other laudable quality. It can, but it doesn’t in and of itself. If it did, then why wouldn’t former servicemen and women be first round picks for employers or voters. Just look at the number of servicemen and women who commit crimes, or better yet, those who drop out because they didn’t take the time to realistically assess their chances of success before signing up with some silver-tongued recruiter. The whole “you have to serve in the military to be worth a damn” is silly.

Anyhow, there are many ways to serve one’s country. Dodging a draft and forgoing military service in a volunteer army are far from equal. This isn’t really to defend Sen. Chambliss or downplay Sen. Cleland’s service, but rather to say valor, or plain bad luck, on the battlefield doesn’t translate into good policy-making and skillful negotiating and policy-making doesn’t mean one would make a good soldier.