Rick Badie / My Opinion

By The Cold, Hard Truth

August 30, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this

“Wilbanks brought Taylor on board specifically to rid the system of ambiguities in discipline matters.”

So, instead of using taxpayer money to pay for teachers, textbooks, and classrooms, Wilbanks adds another layer to the bloated central office staff.

“James Taylor, who oversees discipline for Gwinnett schools, said during the meeting that disproportionate discipline of minority students is a problem for school systems everywhere in the country except Idaho.”

Disproportionate discipline is not the problem. The problem is the disproportionate amount of misbehavior and rules breaking by minorities.

Of course, once these young blacks graduate with their worthless diplomas, they can go on to be disproportionately represented in our penal system.

…and the NAACP will still be running around blaming everyone but the blacks who actually commit the infractions.

By Cindy

August 30, 2008 10:54 AM | Link to this

I’d like to take a moment to commend Badie on his blog. LT5000 might not think they’re relevant enough or represent enough of Gwinnett’s real issues at hand, or contain the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth so help me God…HOWEVER…I have noticed that Badie is the only one who actually updates his regularly. Even if we don’t particularly care for one of his stories, he’s giving us things to discuss and a few days later, yet another article to follow. I appreciate it. Good job Badie!

Pssst!…don’t forget the ride-a-long idea. :)

By Michael H. Smith

August 30, 2008 11:02 AM | Link to this

Well said, Mr. Badie.

Many of the discipline problems in our schools today are good kids who need the right opportunity to do something great. When that opportunity does not exist they generally act-out or drop-out. I have my J. Alvin problem like many others but this time it is not that old Superintendent , that old teacher or that old school that is in need of attention. I don’t want sorry apologies for sorry failures, I want learning experiences that lead to successes.

Kids Build Soybean-Fueled Car

By NOWICUNVME

August 30, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this

Okay, I’m convinced LT, The Cold Hard Truth, and Jais are cut from the same sprout. Nobody is saying that discipline should not be handed down in the schools. If you read the transcripts and focus on the WHOLE story, you would realize that different or lesser diciplines for the same infractions should not be based upon race. Plain and simple. Same goes for the penal system. All anyone asks for is fair and equal treatment, not “special” treatment. To stereotype all black students collectively is undisputably biased as well as offensive and ignorant. To Cindy and Michael though I may not always agree with every position or thought you hold, I respect you for handling yourselves in a decent manner. For this is a world of diversity and everyone is entitled to their own opinions. I also would like to extend props to Badie on his blog. It seems he tries hard to play both sides of the fence. Which is exactly what you have to do to survive in todays world.

By Steve

August 30, 2008 12:57 PM | Link to this

I have an idea to solve this. Let’s just also punish an equal amount of non-black kids regardless of if they did anything wrong or not. Maybe they can draw names from a hat or something. Then everyone will be happy.

By Michael H. Smith

August 30, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this

I don’t believe that you can know the “WHOLE” story by reading the “TRANSCRIPTS”. I also so don’t believe it is stereotyping to notice the particulars involved or the biased hogwash of this “cultural sensitivity” crap that definitely goes to not only to asking for “special treatment” but demands a superior unfair unequal right over that of others. Though, I don’t buy into the belief of a “one size fits all educational system”, it is totally wrong to ever think that bad behavior, unacceptable conduct, in school that takes away from the eduction of others should be tolerated for “ANY REASON”.

When talking about U.S. citizens and the legal immigrants who came to this country lawfully for the purpose of becoming an American (without hyphens or ancestries attached) there should be “NO FENCES” to side on or straddle upon. The education of our children is the imperative objective no matter what avenue we must build for them to reach the obtainable goal - Anyone or organization for whatever reason that serves any other mission or any other agenda should be completely dismissed and ignored entirely.

By Stone

August 30, 2008 5:22 PM | Link to this

Badie, great article today! Thanks for saying what many of us think. So many people sitting around waiting/wanting to be offended and then reacting and so few people reacting to the real problems in our schools. Ga is consistently next to last in test scores, yet this doesn’t offend the masses. However, the superintendent makes a goofy comment and all of a sudden these folks are offended. I’m offended by our sorry schools, lack of parental involvement and consistently low test scores. Where is the moral outrage when you really need it?

By Dr. Craig Spinks

August 30, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this

Well written, Mr. Badie. And might I suggest a solution to the problem of the distrust of the accuracy of the GCBOE disciplinary data: (1)Put video cameras with audio capabilities in each classroom;(2)run them all the time or at random intervals; (3)collect the visual and audio data; (4)analyze them; (5)analyze the teacher-generated disciplinary report data;(6) compare the frequency of disciplinary breeches by Blacks in each analysis. If there is a statistically significant, substantial difference between the disciplinary breeches documented on the electronic equipment and those documented on the teacher-made DRs, “…we have a problem, Houston.”

By NOWICUNVME

August 30, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this

So…I guess the consensus is that when students of different races commit the EXACT same infractions, the minority students should get the harsher penalties?? Does that spell out “fair” to anyone? Is it me or is it simply too much to ask that ALL the students face the same punishments? This is the ONLY goal that the organizations should be trying to reach. Surely know one of any reasonable amount of intelligence thinks that only minority students have bad behavior. Of course not! Which is exactly why Alvins comments even caused a ruckus. Not that Alvin MEANT to offend anyone but fact is the statement that he made DID insinuate that if there wasn’t a high percentage of black students in the schools, the discipline problem would be non existent. Get it? No blacks, no problems. Whether that’s the way Alvin meant it or not, that’s the way it came across. If you haven’t lived it, you could never really speak on it and truly know what you were talking about.

By Michael H. Smith

August 30, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this

Yeah you really are guessing incognito. I certainly disagree with you on a great many things. Particularly that “different races” garbage.

By Cindy

August 30, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this

Not that Alvin MEANT to offend anyone but fact is the statement that he made DID insinuate that if there wasn’t a high percentage of black students in the schools, the discipline problem would be non existent.

I don’t think that’s what he said nor meant. It did however clarify that a state without many black children wouldn’t have comparitive numbers with what was being addressed.

By Cindy

August 31, 2008 8:15 AM | Link to this

http://www.gwinnettdailypost.com/main.asp?SectionID=6&SubSectionID=84&ArticleID=49790

Now this is enough to get my blood flowing.

**Research shows the disparity is caused by four key areas: socioeconomics, a father’s presence or absence in the home, having a zero tolerance policy and cultural miscommunication, said Jim Taylor, the district’s executive director of academic support.

While the former two are factors beyond the district’s control, the latter two are areas in which the system has taken strides, Taylor said. The school system works to heighten awareness about cultural differences, which is important in a county as diverse as Gwinnett, he said.**

So behavior and personal responsibility really doesn’t play a part in any of this??? This has real potential to cause problems if some kids get a free pass when they shouldn’t, to keep numbers down…or some could receive inappropriate punishments to reach some unspoken quota.

By Michael H. Smith

August 31, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

And now you know why I have a very big problem with this non-sense of “cultural sensitivity”.

What is wrong with the culture of right?

What is right about the culture of “Baby’s Daddy”?

If you haven’t lived it, you could never really speak on it and truly know what you were talking about?

Wanna bet!?

And I’m darn glad I never lived it and neither did my children!

I don’t have to live wrong to truly know right when I’m talking about it.

By Jim

August 31, 2008 9:09 AM | Link to this

Gwinnett County, since Superintendent Alvin Wilbanks took over, has risen to be one of the best school systems in Georgia and as a retired Gwinnett County teacher it was my pleasure to work at Brookwood High School and benefit from the guidance that Mr. Wilbanks provided our school system.

I find it interesting that people will protest or demand the dismissal of Alvin Wilbanks because he asked a question about the racial makeup of Idaho.

These protestors talk about sensitivity and at the same time some demand his firing. Where is their sensitivity? Where is their caring? How can a question drive them to destroy a man’s career? What kind of people are these protestors? If anyone is out of line, they are.

They need to go back to their caves and reflect on the type of people they are.

Mr. Wilbanks’ question was a legitimate question. In the black community over half of all births are to single mothers. Bill Cosby and Barak Obama have addressed this issue and the need for black fathers to step up and raise their children.

This problem had led to dysfunctional families in the black community and this has caused a decline in academic progress in the black community. It probably explains why blacks receive more discipline in school.

When school systems are compared, or when state educational performance is graded, it is a legitimate question to ask about racial makeup. There is no question, on average; the black community pulls down test scores.

Mr. Wilbanks’ question was a fair question. It might have been insensitive but those protesting against Mr. Wilbanks are not interested in sensitivity. If they were, they would not be out to get him fired.

Being too sensitive, when it comes to education, may actually help continue the disparity in educational performance of the races. It is time to face facts and act on them

By NOWICUNVME

August 31, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

If you read my last posting carefully and with some sensible thought, you will see that I totally agree with discipline and a zero tolerance policy. AS LONG AS ALL DIFFERENT RACES RECEIVE THE SAME PUNISHMENTS FOR THE SAME INFRACTIONS. Geez what is so hard to understand this? No wonder this is such a major controversy. One track minds and demeaning comments are just an obstruction in getting to the bottom of it all. Why was it necessary to go there to the “Baby Daddy” comment. Yes, I do believe that too many young black mothers are having babies with absent fathers. HOWEVER, this does not mean they are the only mothers actually getting pregnant you see :) This is my field okay? Unprotected sex and birth control is a problem amongst ALL individuals. Do you know what the abortion rate comparisons are among white mothers and black mothers? That’s right. They’re all having sex recklessly. Check vital statistics on the abortion rates. Then get back to me on that one. Don’t get me wrong, it is a womans right to choose, but just know it’s a historical fact that white women kill their babies at much higher rates than black women. Thus the reason why there are many black woman that choose to keep their babies and let God handle the rest. You see, racism, hatred and bigotry get you nowhere except nowhere. Which is why you can’t see the forest from the trees. I would like to think and believe that all American families want the best for their children. Stable home life, college education, nice communities to grow up, fair and equal treatment. Unfortunately and realistically this is not the case. This whole story has been blown out of proportion just on this blog. Yet the one question has still not been answered. The school administration must keep a zero tolerance policy. Okay. We are crystal clear on that. Should the disciplines handed down for the students who commit the SAME infractions be based upon race OR the actual infraction itself?

By Michael H. Smith

August 31, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

If you agree with the policy of zero tolerance you are totally non-sensible. Zero tolerance only makes children outcast and domes any possibility of a future they might have. If your stance/answer is zero tolerance then just shoot’em all and let God sort’em out. It’s alot cheaper than building more prisons and sentencing someone to a life of poverty, grief and misery.

And you want to talk about a disproportionate severity of punishment being inflected?

Incognito, are you in a mental institution playing around with the computer while the staff is sleeping?

The very last thing these children need is a zero tolerance policy. They need a 100% motivational policy with a father in their house. At the very least a father in their life continually, even if daddy cannot make a commitment to Baby’s Momma.

By mom4

August 31, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this

NOWICONVME You must take the statement in context. What was being discussed was the fact that every school district in the nation, except Idaho, had a disproportionate number of minority students facing discipline. You can’t have a disproportionate number of minorities facing discipline if you don’t have any minorities. Granted, he probably should have said minorities rather than blacks.

Also, how do you find out that minorities are receiving different punishments for the same infractions as non-minorities. When I called to see what punishment was given for something a child did at my kid’s school, I was told they couldn’t give out that information due to privacy rules. Can you find this info in a report? If so where can I find it? Thanks

By NOWICUNVME

August 31, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this

Wow! Zero Tolerance means the school lays down strict rules and guidelines that should be followed and a outlined progressive discipline system. Do you have any children in school in Georgia? This is what I’m being told by the administrators in my school of what “zero tolerance” means. I’m not incognito nor in a mental institution as you very well know.LOL My signature is an acronym for “now i see you envy me”. Get it? Anyway, sorry to have ruffled so many feathers as this was not my intention. I have a date with the one and only “judge and jury”. Sounds like a few of you could use some inspirational wisdom in your lives. Have a blessed day.

By Michael H. Smith

August 31, 2008 11:11 AM | Link to this

You got it wrong incognito, the progressive discipline system of zero-tolerance far too often means expulsion or compelling students to drop-out of school. That is the very reason Mr. Taylor ended the zero-tolerance policy.

Of all the people I encounter you would not be someone I would envy and should I need any inspirational wisdom I would at least find someone - unlike you - that actually possessed it.

No need to bless me. God took care of that by giving me five children (now successful adults) and five grandchildren.

By Educated Black Woman Raised by a Single Parent

August 31, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

Not sure why I expected more from you, but as I have been told time and time again: Do not put your faith in people because they will surely disappoint you. For someone of your station (I am only assuming you have a college degree and have traveled the country), did it not strike you as odd that Wilbanks asked if there are blacks in Idaho? Just think about that for one minute. Now, ask yourself: Where can you go in this country and NOT see a black person? It is amazing that the media has reprinted the comments several times over the past few weeks and no one understands the ignorance behind that question. Wilbanks has earned the moniker of being the longest serving superintendent in the country. As such, shouldn’t he know that there are black people everywhere? Better yet, shouldn’t he have the wisdom to know not to ask such an idiotic question, at least out loud?

If GCPS wants to know how to solve the disparity of disciplinary problems with African Americans, why don’t they just pick-up the phone and call APS and ask them how they deal with students from single parent homes and those who ‘don’t care about education.’ Yes, I am being sarcastic in case you did not pick-up on that. Idaho should have never been mentioned because it is in no way similar to Gwinnett County, or Georgia for that matter. Anyone with a basic understanding of educational research and statistics would have known not to compare Idaho’s apples to Georgia’s oranges. But I digress because after all, this is Georgia.

Food for thought: Did the young man who set fire to school trailers come from a single parent home? What does that incident do to GCPS’ discipinary statistics?

By Educated Black Woman Raised by a Single Parent

August 31, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this

Not sure why I expected more from you, but as I have been told time and time again: Do not put your faith in people because they will surely disappoint you. For someone of your station (I am only assuming you have a college degree and have traveled the country), did it not strike you as odd that Wilbanks asked if there are blacks in Idaho? Just think about that for one minute. Now, ask yourself: Where can you go in this country and NOT see a black person? It is amazing that the media has reprinted the comments several times over the past few weeks and no one understands the ignorance behind that question. Wilbanks has earned the moniker of being the longest serving superintendent in the country. As such, shouldn’t he know that there are black people everywhere? Better yet, shouldn’t he have the wisdom to know not to ask such an idiotic question, at least out loud?

If GCPS wants to know how to solve the disparity of disciplinary problems with African Americans, why don’t they just pick-up the phone and call APS and ask them how they deal with students from single parent homes and those who ‘don’t care about education.’ Yes, I am being sarcastic in case you did not pick-up on that. Idaho should have never been mentioned because it is in no way similar to Gwinnett County, or Georgia for that matter. Anyone with a basic understanding of educational research and statistics would have known not to compare Idaho’s apples to Georgia’s oranges. But I digress because after all, this is Georgia.

Food for thought: Did the young man who set fire to school trailers come from a single parent home? What does that incident do to GCPS’ discipinary statistics?

By Keeping It Real

August 31, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this

If the Black, Asian and Latino students are treated the same, then I have no problem. But, it is difficult to believe that one third of the populace can produce 50% of the reported offenses. The key word here is “reported”. I would be interested to see how many white students were not reported for committing the same offenses. History is full of instances where actions and numbers are manipulated on the basis of race.

By NOWICUNVME

August 31, 2008 1:46 PM | Link to this

Just what I thought. No kids in the Georgia school system. Hopefully your five successful children and your grandchildren will “walk by faith, and not by sight”. And I will continue to pray for you, and people like you every single day. I DO hope you have a blessed day and even better tomorrow.

By NOWICUNVME

August 31, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this

BTW, Zero Tolerance was implemented specifically for drugs, alcohol, weapons and violence. This is the zero tolerance I was referring to. Some schools tried to take it a little further to mean giving a student ISS or OSS because their pants were too low or their blouse was too revealing. I don’t think “I got it wrong”, I think you did. :)

By Cindy

August 31, 2008 2:54 PM | Link to this

NOWICUNVME-Please pray for me too. I need all the help I can get, and then some.

Michael-about the mental institution comment, that was funny, and I mean laugh out loud funny. I had to stop laughing before I could tell my husband and daughter what I was cackling about.

Educated Black Woman-You commented that: Idaho should have never been mentioned because it is in no way similar to Gwinnett County, or Georgia for that matter. Anyone with a basic understanding of educational research and statistics would have known not to compare Idaho’s apples to Georgia’s oranges.

The fact that Idaho’s numbers were so much different than Gwinnett County’s numbers, Georgia’s numbers and numerous other states numbers, was the actual reason Wilbanks asked the question. If what’s being compared has such a remarkable contrast, isn’t it reasonable to ask why?

By Michael H. Smith

August 31, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

I certainly have not been disappointed by the myopic who are dependent on the phoniness of race to either explain everything, condemn everything or dismiss the entirety of the subject as out of hand.

Read Rick Badies words again please:

He could of course squash the controversy by uttering two simple words: “I’m sorry.” But frankly, I fail to see the need. How can you hold a discussion about the disproportionate number of minority children who are disciplined without mentioning the race [ethnicity please Rick] of the group you’re trying to help?

That’s beyond political correctness. It’s asinine.

And it blows my mind.

Mr. Badie and Mr. Taylor have been right on the money in this totally blown out of proportion affair all along. The selfish people involved in this thing who for whatever reason or agenda, have missed what is important - The children who are not getting an education. The most affected children who need the most help in fact, are the real losers in what has become a negative sum game.

Back to Idaho and comparing regions of this country. Several years back I made my first trip to New York. I was told something by someone from the North. The comment agitated me. I didn’t like what was said and feared even greater that it might be true and I didn’t like what that represented. The comment as best I recollect it: The further North you go the lighter the skin color.

In Georgia I expected see blacks very frequently most anywhere. As I went North I did see blacks with less frequency in areas that if compared to Georgia, I should have seen a greater number of blacks in the countryside.

Is there an ethnic conflict in all of this or a simpler less sinister reason behind the disparity. Yes there is: The South is home to blacks that is the only real bias outside of any possible small amount of ethnic based conflict that might exist somewhere else.

To the incognito Educated Black Woman Raised by a Single Parent. I don’t expect to see the number of blacks like I see them in Georgia or the South anywhere in this country outside of major cities.

If you got a sarcastic solution consider me Ross Perot ( I’m all ears) till then Mr. Taylor is the best game in town. An apology from J. Alvin is not a solution, firing J. Alvin is not solution (implanting Sloan Roach in J. Alvin’s jaw… now that has potential) but please don’t trumpet the single parent victories. I have seen too many single parent failures, including too many black men say to me: What that child needs is a man in the house.

The Brothas’ ain’t lying.

By Cindy

August 31, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this

Basically, instead of using the “copy & paste” method of being offended by certain words, if what was actually said was left in it’s contextual meaning and entirety, there would be no problem and everybody could just focus on their Labor Day barbecue and football game.

Refocus that energy on spending time with your kids and enjoy shaping them into the kind of adults you can be proud of.

Don’t let them bear witness to you being cynical about the school system and its’ administration. Teach them to respect the system. That will always serve them well, and their behavior and beliefs might actually rub off on their peers at school who don’t have like-minded parents and aren’t being taught to respect authority. Our kids do in fact influence other kids. Do we want the influence to be good or do we want it to bad?

The fact is, it starts with us.

If you think I don’t know what I’m talking about, try an experiment. Whatever your child currently looks forward to, that you do together…I’ll use church as an example…while you’re preparing to go, gradually make comments about how you wish you didn’t even have to go…or how you would rather lay up in the bed and sleep. Within one month, your child will have began demonstrating the same behaviors.

Once tainted though, that one’s not simple to reverse. So instead, try another experiment. Whatever you’ve been negative about, whether it’s sincere or not, begin a positive attitude with it, show excitement towards it. See what follows with your childs actions.

Anyone can do this. Single moms, single dads, nuclear families, extended families, wealthy, poor, middle-class, black, white, hispanic, Asian, European.

Happiness and enthusiasm knows no boundaries. It’s a learned behavior and it’s never too late to begin.

By Stone

August 31, 2008 6:21 PM | Link to this

Well said Cindy!

By Keeping It Real

August 31, 2008 6:57 PM | Link to this

Cindy

You sound like someone who has lived a very good life. Your simplfication and generalization of guiding young people and encouraging them to respect the system is interesting. The issue is that both single parent and two parent families in the minority community recognize dual standards that favor the majority. Once the minority becomes the majority, you will understand.

By Cindy

August 31, 2008 8:04 PM | Link to this

I wouldn’t characterize myself as living a very good life, but I am honored that you associate “good” with me. Thank you.

There are dual standards for just about any situation you can imagine, not limited to ethnic background. It’s up to us how we approach it. It can be discouraging to say the least.

By Sam Snelling

September 1, 2008 5:21 AM | Link to this

Another excellent column, Rick. Thank you!

By Michael H. Smith

September 1, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

Ah well, just guess I gotta. In the interest of serving at least some semblance of the truth in the face of reality, after beating up on poor little incognito (under several different aliases), a shred of evidence does exist to make a case against ancestral/ethnic discrimination in the disciplinary actions taken against black students. (everywhere but in Idaho)

This one if for you Brucie - a freebie - School discipline tougher on African Americans

Beyond this discrimination to whatever degree that it may exist in the case of GCPS remains the underlying majority of the problem of addressing the four main areas of cause and effect Mr. Taylor identified: socioeconomics, a father’s presence or absence in the home, having a zero tolerance policy (as in not having one) and cultural miscommunication.

By Keeping It Real

September 1, 2008 12:06 PM | Link to this

Michael H. Smith,

Thanks for the information. The Superintendant is not the problem. It is the system. We must stay vigilant and understanding of how the system works to the detriment of some.

By LT5000

September 1, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this

Blubbering Badie Strikes again

How can you hold a discussion about the disproportionate number of minority children who are disciplined without mentioning the race of the group you’re trying to help?

That’s beyond political correctness. It’s asinine.

I trust we all remember Badies asinine article because a T-shirt had a monkey on it and the name “Obama”.

Oh The irony.

LT5000

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this

What we need to see, is some records from Gwinnett County showing the discipline records that are:

1.) similar in nature, from beginning to current.

2.) comparing different ethnic backgrounds with comparible home life.

3.) similar infractions.

4.) same teachers and principals that determined the punishments for the kids involved.

5.) same school.

I’d like to see those factors side by side to see what the standard or lack-thereof was that each used with each student. Then I would like to compare that with similar situations with a different socioecomonic class. After that is determined, I’d like to compare it a school in a different part of the county. Then to different counties. Then with other states.

Numbers and facts can be manipulated/skewed to fit needs. Numbers and statistics are derived by the information requested. ADHOC reports can get different results from the same datebase, variances based on exactly how the information was queried.

By Michael H. Smith

September 1, 2008 1:15 PM | Link to this

Very true Keeping It Real. The detriment of some usually finds its way to the detriment of all.

By Mark

September 1, 2008 2:33 PM | Link to this

Where ever you find blacks, you will find illiteracy, thievery, higher murder rates, drugs, home invasions, fatherless babies, oh the list goes on. Take off your rose colored glasses, and realize the facts.

By reader

September 1, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this

Add to the criteria: first time offenders vs. repeat offenders. Another thing, it’s just not simply a father in the house that makes a difference, but male & female role models who can guide. There is a difference. Too many parents/adults are enablers, making excuses instead of figuring out why the kid did what he/she did in the first place and then holding the kid accountable.

By Carnac the magnificent

September 1, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this

McCain/Palin 08: They go together like a hockey mom and a puck.

Carnac, the Magnificent will devine the answer to the sealed question: (camera to Carnac holding the sealed envelope to his temple)….. “Sarah Palin, Britney Palin, and John McCain”.

(Camera to Carnac opening the envelope and reading aloud the question)…. “Name two hockey moms and a puck.”

. . . I really am the best, aren’t I?

McCain/Palin 08: Two hockey moms for the price of one. See if you can tell them apart.

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

reader, if your comment Add to the criteria: first time offenders vs. repeat offenders. was in response to my post…yes that’s exactly what I was trying to say. Because an infraction for one of them might not be the first one…or anything…I want to see a trackrecord to compare. Oranges can only compare to oranges and get the desired result.

By Butt Geyser

September 1, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this

A: Sarah Palin, Bristol Palin, and John McCain

Q: Name two hockey moms and a puck

By Mark

September 1, 2008 5:35 PM | Link to this

Butt Geyser

It wasn’t even funny the first time, imbecile.

By NOWICUNVME

September 1, 2008 6:51 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the link. You know we really didnt need your link to show what we’ve known all along. Several different aliases??? Beat up on me???what are you talking about? You’re watching too much CSI…Hey did anybody ever get those abortion statistics? How about what the zero tolerance policy is all about? I don’t know what kind of sheltered life some of you live in, but I see illiteracy, drugs, filth, trash, petty larceny, grand larceny, pedophiles, rapists, murder, serial killers in EVERY type of ethnicity. Probably the most heinous of crimes and most serial killers committed by whites. Let’s see, Gary Michael Hilton, Scott Petersen (oh he was a real beauty this one, all american anglo saxon male, kills not only his beautiful wife but his beautiful unborn son full term) Jeffrey Dahmer, Son of Sam, Martin Tankleff (he grew up rich with all the money in the world but was mad he had to drive the cadillac and not the mercedes). Real beauties huh??? Want some more?

By Freddie

September 1, 2008 7:14 PM | Link to this

Right on, LT. I’m so glad to see you finally posted. For a while, I thought maybe something had happened to you. I just don’t what I would do without your words of wisdom to start out my day with a laugh!!!! You really are a funny person, however, you should probably tone it down a bit. Some folks may think that there are actually people out there that think that way.

Take Care, Freddie PS and keep the laughs coming.

By Freddie

September 1, 2008 7:18 PM | Link to this

Hey, that’s a riot Butt. Puck you!!!!!

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

NOWICUNVME,

I didn’t realize we were going to take it there…but ok. I love a thought provoking discussion.

Here you go:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8gYc5fvMQ0

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this

I thought I had to leave but I have a few more minutes.

So to be fair, and show that I am open-minded and try to make comments based on reality, I will throw in the fact that drug use is very high in whites. Whites make up a ton of the meth users. I don’t think that’s true for black people. You don’t really hear so much about black meth heads.

By Sa-Pa

September 1, 2008 8:23 PM | Link to this

Cindy, your xenophobic and racist undertones make me cringe. You couch them in colloquialisms, but they are transparent—you may as well put your Confederate flag on the back of your pick up.

Honestly, you are the creepiest person on this blog.

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 8:34 PM | Link to this

Sa-Pa, Your ignorance and inability to use regular words, thinking it will make you seem less intelligent make me wonder if you even had a point you wished to make, or if you simply didn’t like my opinion and wanted to anonymously attack me.

See here, we normal people…we discuss things. Sometimes we might even change one anothers views. You…you attack and offer nothing.

Don’t stereotype me with your southern, racist, insults. You only insult yourself by using that angle.

Next.

By Michael H. Smith

September 1, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this

Oh yeah you really did need my link. Anyone hiding behind an aliases has zero credibility when making big claims in statements that requires bigger evidence; and I’m still watching a zero person.

By Stone

September 1, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this

Sa-Pa? Sad-Pathetic! Actually Cindy is one of the few posters that has something constructive to say. I may not always agree with her, but she makes a strong argument and makes you think, what’s so threatening about that? Try it sometime!

By Michael H. Smith

September 1, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this

Cindy don’t forget to insert Darfur into that interesting discussion. Edi Amin seems like an interesting mass murderer too. Wait a minute, Edi and Jeffery were practicing cannibals, they only killed for survival.

By Sa-Pa

September 1, 2008 9:42 PM | Link to this

My original response seems to be slow to post:

Cindy, Southern Racial Stereotypes R U. I bet you live in a rancher in a semi-rural area, have a car/truck with a “Support your troops” ribbon and a blue stripe. Your pick-up drivin’ kids get in a bit of trouble with the law.

How far off am I?

By Bruce Wilcox

September 1, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

Smith you bigot, I was in Southport, N.C. all weekend for a wedding, matter of fact left on Friday and just returned and checking the blogs you paranoid turkey.

btw…I asked in the earlier column what was the ratio of White teachers to Black teachers In Gwinnett County, guess that didn’t fit into Rick’s viewpoint or facts.

Carry on.

By LT5000

September 1, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this

Abortion Statistics for NOWICUNVME

*The most recent data from the Centers for Disease Control indicate that while 56 percent of all women who obtained legal abortions were white, the abortion rate (the number of abortions per 1,000 women aged 15-44 per year) for black women was 2.9 times that of white women. For every thousand black women, 32 have abortions, as compared with 11 for every thousand white women. *

Wrong again. Whites make up a greater percentage of the population and therefore account for most of the abortions.

However, as a group, blacks have higher abortion rates than whites.

Just to counter your idiotic claim of “just know it’s a historical fact that white women kill their babies at much higher rates than black women.”

Just the facts.

By Michael H. Smith

September 1, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this

Yeah, yeah. You calling me a bigot is laughable. Who believes like the KKK in multiple races despite blaring science facts the human species is to closely related to require a Race? Sees a Racist behind everything but Jesse Jackson?

And your viewpoint, other than your blather absent of hard facts, that is suppose to fit in anywhere? Nah.

GCPS needs to look at the evidence they have, which most likely they will never release for public pilfering to see where it leads and let the chips fall where they may. I got a strong hunch Mr. Taylor already knows what part is ethnic conflict based and what is based on the other reasons he has stated previously.

Rick did mention some of this issue probably is ethnic based conflict. Obviously he didn’t dwell on it to the satisfaction of those who thrive on that aspect beyond proportion.

By Cindy

September 1, 2008 10:25 PM | Link to this

My original response seems to be slow to post:

*Cindy, Southern Racial Stereotypes R U. I bet you live in a rancher in a semi-rural area, have a car/truck with a “Support your troops” ribbon and a blue stripe. Your pick-up drivin’ kids get in a bit of trouble with the law. *

How far off am I?

That’s right Sa-Pa, when you have nothing to contribute to the topic at hand, change it to fit your needs. I’ll even play along.

Yes on the ranch, Yes on the semi-rural area. No on the ribbon or strip. Yes if you had guessed an American flag. So far I have one pick up driving kind and thank GOD, so far he hasn’t been in any legal trouble. But if he does, I hope he gets it out of his system before he’s 18, and I won’t be an enabler.

It’s actually kinda cool that you took the time to analyze me. Makes me think you find me interesting. haha. Perhaps you should rethink your motives. Notice I haven’t stereotyped you or tried to head shrink you. It’s just not my style, sir.

BTW…anyone who reads these blogs could list the same details you did and do just as well. Law of averages combined with things I’ve previously said.

By NOWICUNVME

September 1, 2008 11:41 PM | Link to this

Centers for Disease Control?? You mean the Government? Talk about a numbers game. Look, I already told you this in MY area of expertise. For the past 15 years, young white women have been coming in for abortions while the young black women have been opting to keep their babies. I know its hard for you to believe, but its true. The missing baby daddy comments is why I shared this with you. As, a matter of fact, a great deal of the white women are aborting babies fathered by black men. How’s that for a statistic? Yeah they love the dark meat. That’s why there’s so many bi racial children. I KNOW that really burns you up, but it’s true. I don’t know whence or where you came upon your copy and paste statistics, but mine are in black and white every day, for the past 15 years. My dearest Michael, I have posted under one screen name only. Is your REAL name Michael H. Smith??? Do you want to take me out on a date or something? Why do you keep saying I’m “incognito”? You wanna get together, have a few laughs? What? Is it really that serious? Relax, we’re just getting to know each other! Cindy, I had actually googled black serial killers also and came across your link. It was very interesting. Please be mindful of the fact that I did not say ALL serial killers were white. I, unlike a great deal of other people, do not stereotype. I said the majority of the serial killers and heinous of crimes have been committed by whites. You know the ones who spurred infamous movies like, monster, texas chain saw massacre, jeffrey dahmer, ted bundy, scott petersen and soon to be Georgias own, Gary Michael Hilton who lived on Clairmont Rd in Chamblee. Actually, I only went here because Mark blogged racist, bigoted and mendacious comments referring to blacks. I dont know what type of sheltered life you’ve been living Mark, but there are ghettos and slums, filth and drugs, prostitution and crimes amongst EVERY race and ethnicities. This is a blog for opionions. It’s okay to agree to disagree. But, let’s leave the prejudice and hatred to the ignoramuses and the feeble minded. It will forever be a controversy when judgements are made based solely on the color of ones skin, ethinicity or national origin.

By Michael H. Smith

September 2, 2008 12:19 AM | Link to this

Yep that is my real name and I don’t want to know you.

By Lateesha

September 2, 2008 1:51 AM | Link to this

The problem is wilbanks and other racist white administrators running these school systems and other government agencies, saying this nonsense to keep the black people down in this city. It never stops. Until Obama gets elected, we’ll still have to put up with this racism. When Obama’s group gets to washington, things will be different, and black people will be telling white people what to do for a change. They will not like it.

By Cindy

September 2, 2008 8:02 AM | Link to this

Lateesha,

I seriously hope you don’t base your vote on the color of a persons skin. If so, that’s very sad.

btw…you said Until Obama gets elected, we’ll still have to put up with this racism. When Obama’s group gets to washington, things will be different, and black people will be telling white people what to do for a change. They will not like it.

How exactly do you define racism? It’s not a one-way street.

By LT5000

September 2, 2008 9:14 AM | Link to this

NOWICUNVME,

I will take the CDC’s statistics over yours any day.

Can you point out any datasets to confirm your ignorant statements?

Perhaps you are too busy proving Popeye’s is putting infertility drugs in the fried chicken or the CIA is making crack and shipping it to the ghettos?

Hey, why didn’t the government blow up the levees in New Orleans with Gustav?

What a joke.

LT5000

By Facts

September 2, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this

The new report the Centers for Disease Control released this week about annual abortion figures in the United States shows abortions continue to target black women more so than other ethnic groups. The 2004 report also shows about 10 percent of all abortions in the United States are done with the dangerous RU 486 abortion drug. The CDC shows a majority of women who get abortions are white (53 percent) compared with 35 percent done on African-Americans, 8 percent on women of other ethnic backgrounds and the race of the woman was unknown in four percent of the cases. However, the abortion ratio for black women (472 per 1,000 live births) was 2.9 times higher than the ratio for white women (161 per 1,000). Examined another way, nearly half of all pregnancies among black women end in abortion while just 16 percent of pregnancies among white women end in abortion. The abortion rate for black women (28 per 1,000 women) was 2.8 times the rate for white women (10 per 1,000) — meaning a much greater percentage. Those statistics continue to worry pro-life leaders in the African-American community. On 27 reporting areas adequately obtained abortion stats by ethnicity and those areas showed that 19 percent of the women getting abortions were Hispanic — with a low of 0.6% in Mississippi to a high of 50% in New Mexico. For Hispanic women in these reporting areas, the abortion ratio was 211 per 1,000 live births, and the abortion rate w as 26 per 1,000 women. However, only 46% of Hispanic women in the United States resided in these reporting areas.

blackgenocide.org

By Bruce Wilcox

September 2, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this

Let’s see Mr. Smith were you around when the Civil Rights and Voting Acts were passed? If so did you feel and act that we are all brothers? If so, where did you march?

It’s a typical Southern bigots cop-out that really doesn’t fool anyone.

By Michael H. Smith

September 2, 2008 11:36 AM | Link to this

Brucie you are such a lying bigot I’ll not waste any more of my time on trash like you.

By Bruce Wilcox

September 2, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this

So Micky you cannot give me an honest answer, didn’t think so, like I said, typical.

Micky, just remember who started the childish name calling.

By Keeping It Real

September 2, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this

After reading the posts on this blog(including my on), I have come to the conclusion that self love of our knowlege and individual prose is all that matters. We are indeed a sorry bunch.

By John

September 2, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

I just find it interesting that there are about 150,000 less blacks in Idaho than in……….. Gwinnett County.

By Mark

September 2, 2008 1:08 PM | Link to this

Lateesha

The role of a president is being the commander and chief of the armed forces. the president doesn’t tell anyone what to do. There are other branches of Gov’t to go through ( ever hear of congress?). I guess they don’t teach that in inner city schools. And BTW, I’d slap yo mama for giving you that stupid name……

By KIM

September 2, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this

Thank you for an excellent article.

By Pompano

September 2, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this

Has anyone bothered to cross-reference the crime statistics in Gwinnett by race versus the disciplinary statistics found in the school system? If there is a discrepancy between the two, then I’d be inclined to dive into the GCPS disciplinary process. If the two numbers correlate, then the school system is a victim - not a scapegoat.

By South Gwinnett 07

September 2, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this

I attended Gwinnett County schools for every year except 8th grade. I can honestly say that in my days in the halls of South Gwinnett minority students were about the only ones fighting and pushing teachers and spray painting and whatnot. If it’s not “proportional” the only way to make it proportional is to either not report as much or get “majority” students in trouble somehow. WHY DOES IT EVEN MATTER WHAT THE PROPORTION OF PEOPLE GETTING IN TROUBLE IS ANYWAY? Isn’t this just putting more of a divider up between the races making an issue over this? Leave the guy alone.

By Ajamu

September 2, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this

The AJC/Gwinnett needs tostart using better judgement as to what NEEDS to be printed on its blogs. Freedom of speech is one thing but allowing obvious racists such as Jais to use racial slurs is allowing a free forum for the spreading of hatred. There are far too many articulate, well written comments sent in for the AJC to help some Nazi wannabe gloat over who he may have offended. As the only paper in town you appear to be enablers. What was the real purpose of printing racist drivel?

By Cindy

September 2, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this

Ajamu, Good luck with that. A year or so back there was someone commenting about how cops needed killed. When I read that, I was all kinds of upset and nearly in a panic. Scandalized, that’s what I was.

So I wrote the ajc and basically was told that it’s allowed because it keeps people reading.

Now to give Jais a little credit, he is doing much better with his wording lately. It’s not exactly love letters or anything but he’s spoken to me much worse, and I’ve spoken to him much worse, and we both lived through it and can post on the same blog here without scratching each others eyes out too badly.

He and I will probably verbally duke it out again soon, but it would be kinda boring without him…or without you.

By Airborne

September 5, 2008 2:12 PM | Link to this

Hi,Mark,it’s your old friend Airborne.I’m back.No i was,nt in jail like your backwards mind would think.In response to your comment on Sept 1st.If you check out the statistics,you will find that wherever you have whites,you have racism,you have constant complaints,you thumb your noses at those that don’t have,the biggest liars and thieves are in your race,and drugs and murder and not having a babies daddy is partially due to societies failure as to being treated equally,but you can pass a law to carry a gun,for what,to make it easier to take a life and we all know whose life we’re talking about.It’s just another way of genocide,but hidden under a law.Iadmit the crime rate is high,but you just open the door for all people to have a license to kill.When prayer,corporal punishment,and pledging the flag was taken out of the educational system,the gates of hell was open,and that goes for all races.So before you start blaming Afro-Americans for being where they are,check out the statistics on who has the highest suicide rate,the most serial killers,the most pedophiles,the most white collar crimes,domestic abuse,incest,alcohol abuse,child abuse,yes i worked in Child Protective Services as an investigator,so i have seen what you do as a human to children.As you say the list goes on,but what bigger crime can you commit as a leader of a country,that starts a conflict by false means just to gain oil and keep your friends pockets full of money at the expense of young men of all races dying for what?So you tell me who the criminals really are.This comment is not meant to offend any one,but as usual mark just thinks of himself and refuses to do anything about it but put the blame on others.

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March 24, 2009 3:09 AM | Link to this

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March 24, 2009 3:09 AM | Link to this

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