MOMania

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 8:14 AM | Link to this

This will not come as a surprise to anyone but I am thoroughly opposed to home schooling with the exception of a few circumstances.

WHY? One reason is because of the enormity of the task and the fact that I have met several folks who have tried it and then decided it was way too hard. Is this why we require formal education to teach?

DUH…I train teachers all over the country. I am considered an expert in early literacy. I do not know enough about science, math, social studies and foreign languages to begin.

This is kind of like: I can cook…I should open a restaurant. I will order a kit to show me how and then VOILA I am on my way.
COULD it happen…YES but the chances are slim. I love to work with wood, I will build my own house…get me the kit and I am on my way!

You are practicing on your child who needs social skills and to understand how to mesh into a routine that perhaps is not his/her favorite ( at school and with teachers who may not be on his/her top ten list) BUT THAT IS LIFE.

I have heard ( from teachers) that the transition back to the classroom is hard. Perhaps catlady can give us a few tips here.

Here are the exceptions:

We knew someone in the military ( DOD SCHOOLS) that was stationed in a remote place with ONE middle school man teacher who was gay. THEY were opposed to it and had a son, so they home schooled for religious reasons that I understood ..this was 20 years ago.

When we first moved here to Atlanta, there was an article about a pilot’s wife who took her kids out of school in middle school and they traveled all over the world to observe things and glean first hand knowledge about places such as Egypt, Russia, Europe, and all of the historical places in the U.S. This was an awesome opportunity. Few would be able to match this chance the mother gave to her boys.

If you live in any metro area, me thinks that you could find a suitable school for your child. By the time you spend 40 hours per week preparing and teaching, anyone could work a job and pay the tuition of most schools.

I have other things to say and know I will be blasted by some but I will wait to see how the other posters feel and then chime back in later today!

Of course, I am an educator and that may give me a slanted opinion but I am also a Mother and have met those who home school too!

FYI middle school is tough…get ready!

By DB

February 17, 2009 8:31 AM | Link to this

Poor Theresa — she’s had a hell of a week! We all hope you feel better soon!

Re: Homeschooling. Oh, boy, have you opened a can of worms on this topic! Homeschooling is such a commitment on the part of your family (because, hopefully, you wouldn’t be doing this alone!) I have known many families who have homeschooled for various reasons. Some worked out very well, and others, not so well. The ones that worked out well had academically strong kids who picked up things easily, but also had a talent that needed a wider scope for development (dance, music) than could be provided in a traditional school setting. The ones that didn’t work so well had kids whose parents simply didn’t have the skills to identify and adapt to issues such as learning disabilities, etc. until it was almost too late, or who failed to take advantage of home school resources to augment weaknesses in their own skill set (i.e., I would never presume to teach calculus, but I’m hell on wheels when it comes to history, social studies and statistics.)

The proponents of homeschooling will say that keeping kids OUT of school during the middle school years is probably good for them, because it allows you to raise them within your own value system without negative outside influences. Those against will decry the lack of opportunity to develop the necessary social skills and cope with a variety of social situations.

Don’t kid yourself — you won’t be able to easily keep up with your current friends if you decide to homeschool. Their parents will take it as a slap against their beloved school, and you daughter will be gradually be forgotten for after-school get togethers, birthday parties, etc. The onus will fall on you to maintain those relationships, because they won’t — it’s definitely a case of “out of sight, out of mind.” And, sooner or later, your daughter is going to find out about an event that she was inadvertently let out of, and feelings will be hurt. Friendships are so volatile at the age anyway. Plus, keep in mind that many of her friends’ social activities will revolve around their school — concerts, sporting events, dances, clubs, etc.

I have friends whose kids have reentered the school scene after being homeschooled when family circumstances dictated that the mother return to the workforce. Even within one family, the differences were huge, depending on the child. One found high school too confining and graduated early. Another did beautifully and graduated with high honors and participated in dual enrollment their senior year. And yet another sibling had learning issues that are beginning to cause problems because when they enrolled in school, they had to enter at a level a grade behind where they would have been age-wise — socially, its been difficult.

So — depends on the child, depends on the parent. You might choose to do a combination — traditional school, with enrichment at home, such as field trips, etc. to accompany the school curriculum. Tha’s what we did, even with our private school — spring break and vacation trips always included historical places based on their history/social science curriculum, science interests were encouraged with science museums and outside workshops, etc.

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 8:51 AM | Link to this

DB…your thoughts were well executed and I enjoyed reading them.

I AM SORRY that I went into such a tirade without letting Theresa know that my thoughts and prayers are with her and we hope she sees sunny days soon!

By JJ

February 17, 2009 10:13 AM | Link to this

My thoughts and well wishes are with Theresa today too. I am home with my kid today. She was home yesterday with the stomach crud, and today it seems she had either the flu or bronchitis. She has a nasty dry cough (almost croupy) that seems to be coming from her chest, as opposed to a tickle in the throat. We were up ALL night. She hasn’t been this sick in YEARS.

I’m not going to comment on the home school topic. I wanted to send my well wishes to Theresa and family, and say “hi” to Keith, and thanks for filling in for Theresa!!!

I’ll pop in later.

By Homeschool Mom

February 17, 2009 10:37 AM | Link to this

All the info that you can read and the opinions from other people (especially ones who have never tried homeschooling) can’t tell you how it will work for you and your family. Everyone and every situation is different. I taught in public school before I had children then in a private Christain school when my children were in first grade and K4. After seeing that the Christain school actually wasn’t much better than the public(at the time that is-public has drastically gone down hill since then)I chose to homeschool. There were several families in our church and neighborhood who were already involved in it so I had them to go to for advice. But, as with alot of things, you have to find your own way and do what works best for you with your teaching style and your children’s learning styles (and who knows that better than their parent.) High school is more challenging than lower grades obviously, but there are so many great resources available that you can do it well if you put forth the effort(and you’ll be amazed at the things you’ve forgotten that you ever had to learn!)My sons love it because it gives them more time to pursue the things that interest them.

By FCM

February 17, 2009 10:51 AM | Link to this

I think that Middle/High school are more important for kids to be in a School environemnt instead of home.

Much of this is due to the social aspects and the controlled situation in which to make choices.

Inspite of requiring ‘formal’ education of teachers and the undoubted talents of the lecturers (like MJG) I do think children can get ‘book learning’ from outside of school.

By Cammi317

February 17, 2009 11:01 AM | Link to this

I cannot stand this “middle school” concept in general. Why separate 6-8? In Chicago elementary schools were and I believe still are K-8. If I could afford to stay home for her 6-8 years, I would home school. My daughter is in 5th as well. People have made mention of the socialization issues, but she would still continue to participate in Girl Scouts, Her science program at Fernbank, dance and tumbling classes. She would still keep in touch with her friends, go to parties, movies, etc. I think those opinions are based on the thought of home schooled children living on some sort of compound and isolated from the rest of the world. I guess that may the case in some families, but I would like to think they are the exception rather than rule.

By Jenny

February 17, 2009 11:01 AM | Link to this

I have three children: almost eight, almost six, and almost three.

We have always homeschooled.

motherjanegoose, you say you are “thoroughly opposed to homeschooling” but then give a few exceptions that were positive. Are you just oppposed in theory, and consider the positive examples to be “exceptions”? Or have you actually known many homeschooling families that were doing poorly? If the latter, I would be interested in hearing about your negative experiences/observations.

You give the analogy that homeschooling is like a good cook deciding to open a restaurant. But this is not an accurate way to describe what homeschooling is or what we are doing.

Homeschooling parents are not trying to open a restaurant (or open a school). It would be a more accurate analogy to say we are like a good cook who decides to cook for their family instead of taking them to a restaurant every day.

You also say, “By the time you spend 40 hours a week preparing and teaching, anyone could work a job to pay for school.”

First of all, it does not take nearly forty hours a week to “prepare and teach” when you homeschool.

But even the time it does take is very different that if I was out working a job.

For example, I have a two year old. If I worked 40 hours a week to pay for my older children to go to private school, I would also have to pay for the two year old to go to day care.

But since we homeschool, instead the two year can sit in my lap, or in the high chair with a snack, or playing at our feet, while I work with the older kids. Not only is he home with me instead of day care, but it’s free!

Another example: this morning my second grader was doing her math. After I got her started, I went in the next room and did laundry.

Often she works in the kitchen while I cook dinner and wash the breakfast dishes. I can easily answer her questions or check something for her when she needs me.

But if I was away at a job, I couldn’t be cooking dinner and doing dishes and laundry during those hours!

I often get comments from various adults that my kids are so smart, well-spoken, have a good vocabulary, have very neat handwriting, etc. My second grader has won a local writing contest.

I know the topic is more about middle school and my kids are still young, but so far that has been our experience.

By Keith

February 17, 2009 11:07 AM | Link to this

Hi JJ! Thanks, I’m happy to be here today. I hope your daughter feels better soon. I had bronchitis for nearly 6 weeks (Halloween to Christmas), and it was awful. Your whole body gets exhausted and sore from the coughing. I ended up on strong antibiotics, albuterol inhaler and lots of OTC decongestants. I hope it doesn’t get that bad in your house!

Thanks for the info Homeschool Mom! I’m still looking at all options and trying to decide what will be best for my daughter. Are your boys in at the high school level now? Was it difficult for you to home school more than one at a time?

By Jenny

February 17, 2009 11:21 AM | Link to this

motherjanegoose, I just re-read your post and do see that you do know homeschooling families who quit because it was “way too hard.”

Could you possibly elaborate? I am just curious. How long did they homeschool before quitting? Anything is “hard” when it’s brand-new to you.

Although obviously it takes effort, I would not describe homeschooling as “hard.”

If it is “way too hard” for a family, my guess is that they are either taking on way more than necessary, and/or approaching it in a way that does not fit their family.

By Homeschool Mom

February 17, 2009 11:29 AM | Link to this

My boys are 2 years apart so in elem/middle school we did several subjects together (Around the World in 180 Days is a great Social Studies curriculum for multi grades). Once we hit high school we had to do separate subjects but by that age they are more able to do alot on their own with just your guidance. Mine are currently in 10th and 12th. The Senior is going to Faith Academy this year(so he could get an official transcript.) They give you weekly work which you do at home then turn in to them. You take exams with them, do labs there and have tutoring if needed. He will be attending Georgia Southern next year. The younger is a computer/video game expert(his opinion) and is dyslexic so it has worked well with him to have my one-on-one attention and ability to accomodate his strong abilities in some areas and inabilities in others.

By mg2

February 17, 2009 11:41 AM | Link to this

Homeschooling - YES !

My daughters went to private school for K-8 and then we homeschooled for high school. My husband was an educator at the college level and the grandparents were educators at the high school level. This was a well thought out decision on our part - not just a quick jump.

We kept our girls active and they stayed in touch with their friends. They also worked and got involved in various public service efforts all of which taught them a lot more than they would have learned in a classroom. Even with all this I don’t think it was any harder than having them in a “regular” school.

My oldest got a phenomenal scholarship from Agnes Scott (and she even took a couple of advanced classes there in high school) - she’s now contemplating medical school. My youngest has decided to be an architect and she’s working her way though school…..and has just been nominated for a statewide education award. Obviously these girls aren’t suffering academically from the decision we made….and based on the friends they’ve got I don’t think they suffered socially either.

I think my girls actually got more out of being homeschooled than they would have if they had been stuck in a classroom. They learned to be self-motivated and organized. They didn’t just “wait for the bell” they got their work done and often went beyond the requirements of the class because something caught their interest.

I told friends that I wasn’t sure I could have done this in elementary school but by the time they reach Middle and High school they are at a point where they can follow instructions and need less one-on-one assistance.

By sd

February 17, 2009 11:43 AM | Link to this

I am not usually a big fan of homeschooling, but as someone very familiar with middle schoolers, I see your point.

Middle school aged children, are, for the most part, horrible people.

They are only concerned with themselves and not the welfare of others. I can see wanting to shelter your child from these monsters.

I believe Perry Ferrell said it best when he wrote,

“”Children are innocent, Teenagers fed up in the head, Adults are even more Fed and that is why, I like children.”

By GW

February 17, 2009 12:10 PM | Link to this

I can understand a child getting bored at school because the curriculum is too easy. How then will that child not be bored at home unless the parent can present a lot of “stuff?”

By Jesse's Girl

February 17, 2009 12:21 PM | Link to this

I have said before…..I would gladly give up my musical abilities to be able to homeschool my children. Alas…I have neither the patience nor the constitution to be an at-home educator. We are having some minor difficulties with middle school as well. These girls are vicious, near-satanic little creatures that for the most part….love nothing more than a good fight. I dislike them all. I would love the opportunity to pick up and travel with the children!!! What a fabulous experience for the whole family!!! We just keep telling our daughters to keep God close. Keeping your pre-teens and teens in church…in my humble opinion…can give them the amunition to stay above all the crap that goes along with middle school. There isn’t enough money in the world that could convince me to repeat those years!!!

By V for Vendetta

February 17, 2009 12:27 PM | Link to this

Don’t usually post here, but I’m a regular over at Get Schooled.

Mother Goose and Jenny, you each present very interesting versions of the home schooling decision. Though I’m naturally inclined to agree with the Goose, I do see Jenny’s point. Allow me to do what I do best over at Get Schooled—be blunt.

Homeschooling works just fine for families with well adjusted kids and parents who are in the upper echelons of intelligence. That’s it. Although professional teachers DO receive training that few parents have, much of that training is for educating in the context of a classroom environment. The home can be very different. An intelligent, motivated parent can make for an excellent teacher.

That having been said, Goose has probably met more than a few homeschooled kids whose parents were mouth-breathing idiots. I’ve met my share as well. For every smart, well spoken, and engaging homeschooled student, there are at least three more fools who don’t have basic grade level skills. I’ve seen two cases that were so bad DFACS was called in because it was considered neglect. (The child was in high school and couldn’t read, write, or work with numbers.)

Forgive us, successful homeschooling parents, for being jaded on the issue. We really don’t mean to be. The bottom line is this: If you are smart, and your kids are smart, then homeschooling will probably work just fine. However, if you’re an idiot, and your children are dumb, then it will be a monumental failure.

By Caroline

February 17, 2009 12:28 PM | Link to this

Will a homeschooled child get accepted into Georgia Tech? The answer is probably no. A parent (who likely does not have a college education) cannot provide the type of education that a school can. They cannot challenge a kid the way advanced placement classes do. I feel sorry for homeschooled kids. They don’t have the same types of friendships as those that go to school. Plus, what about interacting with the opposite sex? Dating? All of these things are normal and exciting high school things.

By V for Vendetta

February 17, 2009 12:42 PM | Link to this

sg and Jessie’s Girl, how does sheltering your child from something prepare him or her for handling it in the future? That’s precisely the type of attitude I DON’T want to hear from homeschooling parents.

By Richard

February 17, 2009 12:49 PM | Link to this

As a former public school middle teacher and the state that modern education is taking in the “new math” curriculum, as well as, the general nature of poor middle school academics, I can understand what you are talking about.

If you are interested, there is a way to fund a private school education in Georgia through the GRACE Scholarship. Go to www.gracescholars.org and read the info there. It seems like a great program to make private education more affordable. It couldn’t hurt to look at it. After all, as the parent, you have total control over where your kids learn what they learn and how they learn it. You are the final authority in that area.

By new mom

February 17, 2009 12:52 PM | Link to this

Personally, I have mixed feelings on homeschooling.

There are aspects of it that I think are very attractive, such as the flexibility to customize your lessons and the freedom to GO to museums, historical sites, etc. easily, and not be confined to a classroom nearly every day. I like that you can speed up the lessons based on your child’s abilities, and not be held back with the rest of the class. As a former teacher, I can see the ‘sky’s the limit’ potential of challenging your kids.

However, there are several aspects that can be negatives too. During the 10+ years that my husband and I were middle and high school youth workers in churches, we knew roughly twelve different children who were homeschooled. And sadly, only one of them seemed socially well-adjusted. Most of them had difficulty interacting with their peers, couldn’t find anything to talk about with them, and obviously felt uncomfortable around other kids. They hovered near us adult workers, where I suppose they felt safe. One girl had been in public school until her 7th grade year, and all she talked about was how much she wanted to go back. There were a couple of high school boys who were seriously awkward. They couldn’t relate to the other boys at all. When they would describe their ‘school’, they always said they just watched videos. What?? One said he’d go to his father’s office and sit in a back room and watch video lessons all day. No wonder they were so awkward!

I’d like to think that these experiences were exceptions, but they were the norm for the homeschooled kids we knew. All sweet kids, but just socially backward. I would imagine that homeschooling the right way, plus the effort needed to keep them interacting with their peers, is not easy. Like I said, I really like the positives that can come from it, but it seems that based on kids we knew, the negatives far outweighed what they could be learning.

By parentof4

February 17, 2009 1:12 PM | Link to this

I was a little skeptical of homeschooling, but it depends on your connections. (When it appeared that all schools were failing the CRCT I started looking for options) There are a lot of great groups that compensate for your lack in areas. — None of my children are actually homeschooled. Although I do have them in a private school which utilizes the Homeschool programs.

Apparently some, MJG included, have no idea what programs are out there for homeschoolers and their parents. They have a GREAT computer program Switched on Schoolhouse, that already prepares the lesson for the child and grades all test. In fact the child takes a test and can take higher grades. The lessons require the children to THINK, they are not spoonfed answers. Futhermore, they are also taught some college information, more than the public school classes. This helps for the bored child. This is also good for the well intention parent who has a lacking education background. The parent themself is not entirely relied on for the education.

ABEKA also has video learning, with a certified teacher in Florida, where you can also send all test to them and they will grade them. A degree from ABEKA will allow a child to be accepted into GA Tech or even Harvard. But I believe Keith was just opting to do the middle school years and re-enroll in High School, so it does not matter.

Education is all what the parents put into it and what the child takes out of it. There are some horrible teachers, as there are some horrible parents. There are some horrible private schools also. As a parent you have the responsiblity to watch both arenas.

By Jesse's Girl

February 17, 2009 1:20 PM | Link to this

V….I do not think that any child can learn how to properly navigate through life without going through teen-trials first. To be more specific, trials that come with middle/high school experiences. That is PRECISELY why my children go to school vs homeschooling. I simply stated that I wish I had the aptitude to do it…see what its like…test the waters. Trust me, even if I homeschooled, my children would learn how to overcome the venom injected by middle school girls. Many in my immediate family embrace this mentality as adults…they’d be covered:)

By Bob

February 17, 2009 1:22 PM | Link to this

We have homeschooled our children from the beginning, but our primary commitment is not to homeschool, but to providing the best possible training in academics and needed living skills and habits possible.

The usual drivel about sheltering and socialization really is nonsense and about as ignorant and backward a view as one can find these days. Talk about ridiculous stereotypes.

Obviously, you can always trot out extreme examples of abuse in any setting, and homeschoolers are no exception, but the results for both academic excellence and preparedness for the challenges of life are overwhelming, if you care to do a little research.

I highly recommend you give it a try. The amount of help available is tremendous, should you find yourself in the unlikely position of feeling beyond your ability to teach. Homeschooling parents often employ tutors in technical subject areas, and band together to defray costs.

As for socialization, our children spend more time around people from all walks of life, and engage in all sorts of daily activities, rather than being penned up in a concrete cube with 35 kids the exact same age, and supposedly corralled by one lone “teacher.”

So, you tell me who is being socialized properly.

I wish you well.

By HB

February 17, 2009 1:24 PM | Link to this

Just a note on what new mom said about social awkwardness: did you know these kids before homeschooling? I only ask because the kids I grew up with who homeschooled also were extremely awkward. However, I knew them through school before they began homeschooling, and they struggled then too. In fact, that seemed to be one reason for the homeschooling — they were picked on, bullied, or at the very least just didn’t fit in and had few friends. I’m not saying this to defend homeschooling — I can’t make up my mind either as I totally agree with the pros you listed but do worry about the social aspects. When I think about it, though, I’m just not sure that homeschooling is necessarily the cause of the awkwardness.

By Melissa

February 17, 2009 1:32 PM | Link to this

I was home schooled along with my four siblings. I didn’t attend college because it didn’t appeal to me, though I did graduate from massage school. I also started my own business ( not massage related) that is doing fantastic even in this economy. One of my brothers started his own successful lawn business and one sister is about to graduate from the University of Tennessee and then start on her masters degree. None of us were socially awkward, but I attribute that to attending weekly homeschool groups and mingling with other homeschoolers our age. Also, I heard an interview with the president of the University of Tennessee who was saying that they love home schooled kids coming to their school, because statistically their grades and test scores are much higher than public school kids. He himself had 5 grandkids who were being homeschooled.

By new mom

February 17, 2009 1:39 PM | Link to this

HB—you could be right. We typically didn’t know the kids very well until they reached the program we volunteered with, and I always tried NOT to listen to the other leaders’ discussions about who is what way, etc. I found that doing so could cloud your opinion of a young person, and affect how you thought of and interacted with them.

Honestly—most of them, we didn’t know how long they had been homeschooled. But I would wager that they were always pretty awkward kids. Perhaps their parents were trying to help them by taking them out of school, but for the ones we knew, I never saw any improvement. We’d watch as other teens grew up, matured, developed solid relationships, and these kids just stayed the same. So I don’t know that homeschooling was the cause of the awkwardness, but I doubt it’s the cure either.

I am trying very hard not to generalize, because—we did know one lovely young lady who was outgoing, friendly, and confident. I know that every child is different, and I’d hope that every parent choosing this path is making as much of an effort as this girl’s parents did.

By me

February 17, 2009 1:51 PM | Link to this

on the awkward social skills comment. none of my children (4 of them) are shy with adults or children. they are actually more outgoing than most of the kids that they meet. also, regarding extra activities - look around, there are lots of choices including science lab classes at fernbank. and thanks bob, it’s true that homeschoolers are outperforming even private schoolers. i don’t see how the academics are even debatable and on socialization - if it is a concern, just get involved. homeschooling doesn’t mean sitting at home 8 hours every day. homeschoolers can actually do more because of scheduling freedom. volunteering, extra classes, sports, etc. all easier on a homeschool schedule because of less time constraints. if someone hasn’t done it themselves, it’s just an outside opinion colored by personal bias. listen to the veterans or the currently enlisted, read and pray and then decide for yourself.

By Rachel

February 17, 2009 1:56 PM | Link to this

Richard-Thanks for the info at gracescholars.org. Does anyone know of other organizations that fund private school education?

By new mom

February 17, 2009 2:01 PM | Link to this

I just want to reiterate—I think there are some wonderful advantages to homeschooling, many of which ‘me’ listed. And I think the successful homeschooling parent is doing those things…

Unfortunately, I just don’t think all parents are. The parents who aren’t making the effort to involve their kids in the extracurriculars aren’t going to be the ones to notice or care if their kids aren’t comfortable around others.

To those of you who are doing all the right things and have well-adjusted kids (judging from the posts, apparently a lot are) then I say awesome! Keep it up! But I haven’t heard any parent come on here and admit that they aren’t trying to keep their kids involved with others, or that they sit them in front of a video all day long…But there are kids who told us that was all they did.

So, as in every situation, there is the good, the bad, and the ugly. And if you’re the good, please don’t be offended!

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February 17, 2009 2:06 PM | Link to this

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Article for the Mew Mexico Journal of Reading (ed. of 4/09)

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By Ann

February 17, 2009 2:27 PM | Link to this

I’ve sucessfully sent 2 girls through GA public schools and into good Universities. My other two children are still in local schools. GA has great programs for academically advanced children, if your kids are doing well in a standard classroom setting they should be tested for Target and then offered Honors and Adv. Placement classes. GA has great educational programs and one doesn’t have to break the bank or sacrifice sanity to access them; your child just has to qualify academically.

By me

February 17, 2009 3:02 PM | Link to this

Excerpts from New York State Teacher of the year John Taylor Gatto’s book Underground History of American Education. Gatto, who taught for almost 30 years has a website where you can read his entire book, as well as a forum for discussion (johntaylorgatto.com)

Excerpts:

Until his death in an accident a few years ago, the president of Macmillan Publishing company, one of the largest school material suppliers in the world, was a third-grade dropout. Actually, like other children in his (Russian) village, he received seven years of schooling. He was also president of Berlitz Language Schools. Did you know that Lear of LearJet fame was a dropout? Pierre Cardin, Liz Claiborne, the founder of McDonald’s, the founder of Wendy’s, Ben Franklin, one in every fifteen American millionaires?Every principal institution in our culture is a partner with the particular form of corporatism which has began to dominate America at the end of WWII. Call it paternal corporatism, wise elites can be trained to provide for the rest of us, who will be kept as children. Unlike Plato’s Guardians whom they otherwise resemble, this meritorious elite is not kept poor but is guaranteed prosperity and status in exchange for its oversight. An essential feature of this kind of central management is that the population remain mystified, specialized dependent, and childish.

The school institution is clearly a key partner in this arrangement: it suppresses the productive impulse in favor of consumption; it redefines “work” as a job someone eventually gives you if you behave; it habituates a large clientele to sloth, envy, and boredom; and it accustoms individuals to think of themselves as members of a class with various distinguishing features. More than anything else, school is about class consciousness. In addition, it makes intellectual work and creative thinking appear like distasteful or difficult labor to most of us. None of this is done to oppress, but because the economy would dissolve into something else if those attitudes didn’t become ingrained in childhood.A century ago mass production began to stifle the individualism which was the real American Dream. Big business, big government, and big labor couldn’t deal with individuals but only with people in bulk. Now computers seem to be shifting the balance of power from collective entities like corporations back to peopleIt can only be a matter of time before America rides on the back of the computer age into a new form of educational schooling once called for by Adam Smith, that and a general reincorporation of children back into the greater social body from which they were excised a century and more ago will cure the problem of modern schooling. We can’t afford to waste the resources young lives represent much longer.

Empty Children

Not far to go now. Here is my recipe for empty children. If you want to cook whole children, as I suspect we all do, just contradict these stages in the formula:

I once had a thirteen-year-old Greek boy named Stanley who only came to school one day a month and got away with it because I was his homeroom teacher and doctored the records. I did it because Stanley explained to me where he spent the time instead. It seems Stanley had five aunts and uncles, all in business for themselves before they were twenty-one. A florist, an unfinished furniture builder, a delicatessen owner, a small restauranteur, and a delivery service operator. Stanley was passed from store to store doing free labor in exchange for an opportunity to learn the business. “This way I decide which business I like well enough to set up for myself,” he told me. “You tell me what books to read and I’ll read them, but I don’t have time to waste in school unless I want to end up like the rest of these people, working for somebody else.” After I heard that I couldn’t in good conscience keep him locked up. Could you? If you say yes, tell me why.

By Jenny

February 17, 2009 3:07 PM | Link to this

“Will a homeschooled child get accepted into Georgia Tech? The answer is probably no. A parent (who likely does not have a college education) cannot provide the type of education that a school can.”

Why would a homeschooled child not be able to go to GA Tech?

I have heard of homeschooling kids going to MIT, or starting college at age 15, or currently working on their doctorates, so I don’t see why GA Tech would be a problem. Do you know someone who works there who says they won’t accept homeschooled students?

I find it amusing that a homeschooling parent “likely does not have a college education.”

Why in the world would you even think that?? I personally have a Master’s degree. Why would you assume that I’m uneducated just because my children don’t attend traditional school?

By Andrea

February 17, 2009 3:12 PM | Link to this

Well, I had a good chuckle reading all of the comments. I found some of the anti-homeschooling comments to be quiet true… i.e. If you are an idiot and your child is dumb, homeschooling is going to be a monumental failure (the problem is the parent will have no idea that they are an idiot). However, many of the comments missed the mark completely. For example, Homeschoolers can and do get into GA tech. In fact, my homeschool son plans to go there. He will need to get high test scores on the SAT and ACT, but seeing how bright he is, (and I am not too stupid either), we are not worried.

Now to address the questions actually asked:

Was the transition from one type of school to another a difficult one for your student? We transtioned our kids from public school to homeschool in the 2nd and 4th grades. We had also purchased our home for school district, but ended up disappointed. My kids were eager to homeschool and so they thrived in the environment. I strong believe that a child should should not be forced to homeschool.

Is there a good (or better) time in a child’s academic career to explore the home school option? I think the most important year for child are the once when most parents tend to get comfortable… middle school. This is a time of character training and so an ideal time to homeschool.

Did you get to a point where the curriculum was beyond the scope of either your background or your means at home and you placed your child back in school? yes and no. I felt for a while that my kids needed more accountability and had them attend a homeschool-school, also called a hybrid programs. There are numerous such programs in the area that kid go to 1 to 3 days a week, have classes, make friends, and all that good stuff.

Any advice - pros and cons - that you want to share on the idea of home school - especially the older grades?

Cons: My son is socially awkward. This happened pre-homeschool. Getting attacked on a daily basis can do that to you. Of course there will always be people who will blame you and homeschooling for any shortfall your kids has.

Pros: Both kids will be ready for college by 16. This gives them a year to take off and have some great experiences.

Take care. Andrea Hermitt Education Headlines Examiner (Examiner.com) Atlanta Homeschool Examiner (Examiner.com) Families.com homeschool blog.

By DB

February 17, 2009 3:19 PM | Link to this

V for Vendetta took the words right out of my mouth (we tend to agree over at Get Schooled, too :-) - homeschooling works well if you have intelligent parents and reasonably intelligent kids. It’s a disaster if the parents are lacking sufficient education and self-awareness to not know where their own deficiencies are and pass them on to their children.

I will point out that the only ones that will come to this blog advocating for homeschooling are the ones that have been successful at it. And that’s great. The ones that tried it and whose kids couldn’t get past 900 on the SAT, or who were so badly behind that they didn’t pass the GED until they were 20 aren’t hanging around, y’know? (and yes, I know those two kids.)

I’ve found it interesting that so many homeschooled kids are winning national contests such as the spelling bee and geography bee. Such kids are held up as examples of the efficacy of homeschooling, without noting that the kids spend inordinate amounts of time — hours a day — prepping to go after those $30K and $40K prizes.

But, as I said in my first post, and as V concurred — if you’ve got a basically smart kid to begin with, it’s hard to screw it up too badly. It’s hard to generalize kids socialization, too, in school or out. I’ve know a lot of smart kids, homeschooled or not, who simply think differently than their peers — their jokes are often more subtle and mature, their observations are more intuitive, and they prefer to be around adults because they relate to adult thinking better.

Homeschooling is just one option. Public schools is another, and private schools are yet another. I personally think that, with a smart kid, you’ll get a pretty well- educated kid either way. It’s the kids who are marginal that concern me, the ones that struggle under parents who are not proficient teachers. You’ll get a lot of passionate opinions either way, but frankly, someone who has homeschooled a child their entire academic career really can’t speak dispassionately to how their child would have performed in a more traditional school setting, either.

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 3:26 PM | Link to this

V for Vendetta and newmom have presented some great points.

As I said previously, I do see some exceptions to my hard and fast rule of no homeschooling.

I have seen several parents whose children have learning issues and they yank them out of school because they do not like what the teachers are telling them. How in the world would an untrained parent know what to do in this situation?

When an educator sees hundreds of kids, he/she has a feel for what looks and acts right. There are also resources (such as school psychologists) who are able to assist.

Most parents are way too focused on their own children to see that their may be something wrong or look at the bigger picture.

YES, extremely educated and devoted parents ( who are not throwing in a load of laundry or rocking the baby) CAN be affective teachers. Sorry but most of the parents I have known do not fall in this category.

When my son was 5 he asked me…”Mommy will you bring ( his new sister) to school with you?” He was about to enter Kinder and I had a newborn. I laughed and told him that I could not ever teach school with my baby in the room with me. That still holds true.

I consider being a teacher a responsibility that is great. I would need to focus on my students, not the baby I am related to.

Homeschool mom… I am going to say this delicately, because I hate it when others ramble on grammar etc, when we are just sharing thoughts on this post.

You are not teaching spelling are you? Christian is not spelled the same way you have spelled it twice. I hope you are not teaching grammar or writing either…do you know when to start a paragraph? Your sentence structure is interesting. I would not be picking on this but you do say that you are teaching older children.

Jenny, I would love to hear it from professional educators that it does not take 40 hours per week ( you have 2 different grades here) to prepare and instruct children. Your ideas seem ridiculous to me. I cannot imagine teaching 2 children and running around the house doing household things at the same time.

This is why I would not be a candidate for homeschooling.

I am saying it loud and clear, even though I AM an educator …I am not intelligent enough to begin to think that I could teach my own children the skills they will need to be academically sound and ready for college…maybe it is just me!

TRUE…there are some doozies for teachers out there but there are doozies in every neighborhood and at some point, we need to learn how to navigate around them, not just run away and hide or protect our children from anything that could be difficult.

By Momx3

February 17, 2009 3:33 PM | Link to this

We homeschool our three children - some people here are suggesting that if you school without a teacher’s certificate that you are somehow people out in the wilderness trying to do a real man’s job - not so. There are many online academies for older children and they provide teacher support too. There are many ways to homeschool and not all of them have to be so hard or treacherous. Good luck and feel better:)

By Jenny

February 17, 2009 4:15 PM | Link to this

Jenny, I would love to hear it from professional educators that it does not take 40 hours per week ( you have 2 different grades here) to prepare and instruct children. Your ideas seem ridiculous to me. I cannot imagine teaching 2 children and running around the house doing household things at the same time.>>>>>

motherjanegoose, I think this is the core of why you are against homeschooling:

You are picturing a homeschooling parent to be duplicating the job of a full-time classroom teacher.

We are not classroom teachers. We are not professional educators. (Even the ones who have a teaching background.) I am not juggling the job of teaching second grade with the job of teaching kindergarten. I’m not trying to be. I don’t need to be.

You’re right, a classroom teacher would not bring their two-year to class every day. But I am not a classroom teacher.

You brought up the meal/restaurant analogy, so I’ll use one as well:

If someone ran and owned their own restaurant, they would surely need a babysitter for their two year old while they went to work at that restaurant.

But do most women (or men) hire a babysitter so they can cook dinner for their family? Not that I’ve ever heard of.

Here’s another point: You think it is “ridiculous” that I prepare dinner while my daughter does her work two yards away from me. But I am available in two seconds any time she has a question or needs something. When do public schooled kids ever get the teacher to come answer questions for them the instant they have one?

Similarly, how often does a public schooled child get one-on-one (or two-on-one) time with the teacher? I don’t know, but I would be surprised if it was more than 30 minutes daily (if even that).

My kids easily get more than two hours of it every day, and obviously that still leaves a lot of time left over for doing laundry.

Homeschooling and being a classroom teacher are not the same animal.

By Keith

February 17, 2009 4:43 PM | Link to this

Thanks to everyone for the great comments — pro and con — on the subject.

Ann — My daughter has been in the gifted/advanced program since first grade. The days she has those classes are much better (ie challenging and interesting) for her. However, in her school, the gifted kids still spend more time in the regular classroom than in the gifted classes.

By New Homeschooler

February 17, 2009 4:57 PM | Link to this

I would like to respond to the comment about meeting parents who are “mouth-breathing idiots” and shouldn’t be teaching their kids. The reason I am teaching my kids is because I have met several teachers in my child’s public school that I would describe in the very same manner - and they are getting paid! There is SO MUCH support out there. But it does take a commitment - definitely putting your children’s needs above your own, and not everyone who homeschools does that. Be sure you are ready to be teacher, parent, coach, and principal at any point during the day!

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 5:01 PM | Link to this

Jenny…respectfully, you are one of the reasons I am against home schooling. Some folks cannot see the forest for the trees.
You are not a classroom teacher and so you cannot understand my points. I am not a homeschooler and so I cannot understand your points. Thanks for sharing, you have made it perfectly clear…to me.

By morning train

February 17, 2009 5:23 PM | Link to this

JENNY. don’t argue with a theorist. personal experience trumps biased opinion anyday. even john taylor gatto, an EXPERIENCED (30 years, new york state teacher of the year) EDUCATOR describes the current educational model as a supreme failure and recommends that people do whatever they can to keep their children out of it.

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 5:38 PM | Link to this

Morning train…I taught Kindergarten and Second grade…I am not a theorist…I have experience, just not in homeschooling.

I train Kindergarten teachers and the personal experience of being in the classroom shows many folks that Kindergarten is NOT for the faint of heart. Many teachers who go to Kindergarten thinking it will be a breeze,,,get their keisters right out ASAP!

Some folks are facilitators and some are teachers.

You are correct, there are certainly bad teachers and bad schools out there…just as there are also bad parents. I do not know Jenny and she may be a wonderful parent.

Where is Jeff today, I would be interested in his take!!

By FCM

February 17, 2009 5:43 PM | Link to this

My most recent ‘friend’ was a GA Tech grad and was homeschooled from 2nd - 9th grade.

Both of his parents (and grandparents) are highly educated. They found that this worked better as he traveled for sports competitions.

By motherjanegoose

February 17, 2009 5:43 PM | Link to this

Without hard work…nothing grows but weeds…Gordon B.Hinckley

Jenny:

“I would not describe homeschooling as hard.”

By Jenny

February 17, 2009 5:52 PM | Link to this

motherjanegoose, what is it about kindergarten that kicked the keisters right out of them?

My guess is that many or most of those things aren’t applicable to a homeschool setting. That is my whole point; comparing classroom teaching to homeschooling is like comparing apples and oranges, and yes, I have done both.

BTW, I would like to know what the “forest” is that I cannot see. Could you please elaborate some more? I am really enjoying your comments … they make me think.

Also —- and I don’t know if you have already answered this — but have you actually known homeschooled kids who seem to be doing poorly? You mentioned some who did great, and then cited some parents who quit because it was “way too hard.” But have you personally ever seen a homeschool family who was happily doing it but made you cringe?

BTW, I was surprised you didn’t address my comments about one-on-one time.

By fk

February 17, 2009 6:52 PM | Link to this

Hope you are up and around and feeling better soon, Theresa!

I’m not going to argue for or against homeschooling. I’m just going to state our experience. Not sure as to why you are contemplating pulling your daughter out of public school at this point if she is flourishing?

The gifted program in middle school is nothing like the ridiculous routine in elementary school. Your daughter will be attending school with a lot more students than just her peers from the local elementary school. My son was always at the top of his class. He worked above grade level. In middle school, he was in all TAG classes. Yes, those classes are more challenging and they move faster. He met a lot of kids who were just as smart him, and then some. If you stay with the public school system, you will witness the weeding out process that continues thru high school. He participated in three high school sports and writes for the school paper. He was even in the concert band. He was able to experience whatever interested him academically and socially. My son is graduating this year…ranked in the top 10% of his class. I’m not so sure he would have been as motivated if he did not have his classmates as gauge in which to compare himself. Plus, he had fun and socialized with his peers.

By catlady

February 17, 2009 7:04 PM | Link to this

Quick question: Keith, do you live anywhere near the Atlanta Girls’ School (or whatever it is called)? Your daughter sounds like a prime candidate to me.

Secondly, perhaps it is not helpful to worry about your other kids (paying for private schoolf for the others). Save tomorrow for tomorrow and its worries. Each child is an individual, and the situation in the future may be different from this one.

As for me: I have three gifted kids. Gifted and advanced classes helped them in middle school, and once they got into high school they could more easily follow their interests (one daughter took every science and English course there was, another did the same but also took every math course and 4 years of drama, and my son followed the music/tech/arts track.)

That was several years ago. For my granddaughter, I think her mom will look into the abovementioned school or something similar. I know her parents will look at the options carefully. Maybe they will let me teach her—I should be retired by then. Haha!

By catlady

February 17, 2009 7:23 PM | Link to this

mjg—my experience as a teacher has been generally negative concerning home schooled kids. I know of a FEW cases where the motivation was good, the parents were well-prepared, they had given careful consideration to the what and why, and the child succeeded highly in the academic arena. Socially, something of a disadvantage for even the best situations. If Keith feels good about the public school (academically and behaviorally) I’d feel pretty good about going with that. But if she has a school with lots of difficulties, maybe the tradeoff would be good. I think there is also the option to use some of the public school offerings in addition to home school. Not sure how that works; we have had one special ed mom who has done that. Her son, however, is not aware of the kind of social nuances that Keith’s daughter would probably notice in terms of her “drop-in” status.

Keith, have you thought much about why you want to do it? Is it an attempt to hold her close so she doesn’t change too much? I think answering that question would be important.

Sorry this is written kind of dipsy-doodle. I am doing too many things at one time tonight! Nothing I have written is meant in any way negatively toward any particular person; it’s just the somewhat distracted musings of mine this evening.

By catlady

February 17, 2009 8:10 PM | Link to this

To some of those commenting on what they can accomplish while they are home”schooling”: Well, it is true that teachers sometimes don’t even have time to go to the bathroom. However, it is because we are doing “direct, explicit” instruction and “needs-based” instruction to individual and small groups. Go to school sometime this year. Stay for a week. Don’t assume it is like it was when you were in school (for the good or for the bad). We sure aren’t parking the children in front of the computer while we do the laundry!

On the socially awkward comment: Frequently, some of the socially awkward kids have socially awkward parents, as well, who cannot carry on a conversation with a stranger without long pauses or alcohol. They don’t recognize social awkwardness unless it comes with a chain saw murderer.

It is like the parents who think their kids are bright because they have never been around genuinely bright kids. They think that their 3rd graders being able to read on first grade level is an indicator of brilliance. It’s called the perspective of experience.

I am not talking about any of you on this blog. I am recounting what I have seen in 36 years of teaching, especially the last dozen years. I DO NOT live in a upper middle class, highly educated area as some of you probably do. I am only speaking based on my experiences with kids coming to school from local homeschooling, not the children of the blog respondents.

By motherjanegoose

February 18, 2009 7:44 AM | Link to this

Thanks catlady…your points are good ones ! A voice of reason and experience…even though I do not ALWAYS agree with you, your perspective is refreshing!

Since I have no experience whatsoever (personally) homeschooling, I will refrain from commenting any more on this subject.

Some folks simply have a different opinion on a subject and cannot be swayed…that includes me too! We base our opinions on what we seen or experiened…I have not seen as many successfully homeschooled children as perhaps there really are! I have not met as many highly intelligent parents who are prepared to do an awesome job homeschooling.

In reality, my world does not present me with too many highly intelligent parents period ( I think their ranks are diminishing) . I have already said that I am not intelligent enough to consider the magnitude of homeschooling my children. When a parent tells me that “of course, I know what is best for my child…” this is a red flag for diminished intelligence. sometimes, we need to check in with those who have seen way more children than just the precious peas in our pod.

I will leave physics, calculus, latin and statistics to those who are trained. I will allow my children the anxiety of social situations in our school system as they will need to know how to navigate these same dilemmas when they enter the work force or move into their own neighborhood…even drive on our roads.

I will stick with what I know… language acquisition and development: making sure children are ready to read!

Opposite opinion illustration: I have a dear friend who abhors sweet tea and thinks it is awful. We can still be friends…imagine it….LOL! Too each his own! Have a nice day all!

By motherjanegoose

February 18, 2009 8:08 AM | Link to this

OOOPS I forgot to add: Intelligent people know that keister is slang word for buttocks.

I mentioned folks getting their keisters out of kindergarten and was asked why Kindergarten

“kicked the keisters right out of them”

Is this like laughing your butt off…can you actually kick the keisters out of someone…did I miss something?

Just wondering…I am thinking forest and trees here.

Have a nice day all!

By Jenny

February 18, 2009 8:41 AM | Link to this

I was really enjoying this discussion yesterday, but now it seems to have fizzled out into mild insults.

MGJ, I asked you several times for specifics examples of some things you mentioned. I asked you to clarify what you meant by saying I “couldn’t see the forest for the trees.” I asked you your thoughts about the idea that homschooled kids get way more one-on-one time than any schooled kid.

I was looking forward to what you (or others) had to say and to continue this discussion.

But instead of answering any of it, it seems like you’re simply saying, “Well, I’m done,” with some parting snide insults:

“you are the reason I am against homeschooling.”

“some people cannot see the forest for the trees”

“intelligent people know that …”

Do you make comments like that about and to your friend who like sweet tea? Methinks not.

I’m still up to discussing this more, if you or anyone else is up to it. I really enjoyed the challenge, and it makes me think.

BTW, I don’t know if I mentioned it, but I have a Master’s degree in Education and worked in the public schools for years.

So we are actually speaking colleague-to-colleague, if that entices you more to continue the discussion.

By enough of the arrogance. . .

February 18, 2009 8:43 AM | Link to this

Intelligent people also know the difference between the words “affective” and “effective” and can use them properly.

But let me guess, your mistakes are typos, and everyone else’s are due to a lack of intelligence.

By motherjanegoose

February 18, 2009 9:11 AM | Link to this

enough of the arrogance…you are correct…affective is absolutely wrong and effective is what I meant to say. I WAS WRONG and I apologize.

Yes, I razz my friend about sweet tea all the time. We both moved here from Texas and she constantly reminds me that they do not drink sweet tea in Texas. I call (from Texas) to tell her that they DO have sweet tea and that I am ordering it LOL..

I AM done, because I will not change your mind nor will you change mine. Those children are your children and honestly, it is none of my business how they are educated. Please do what is best for you . Off to schools…

By motherjanegoose

February 18, 2009 9:14 AM | Link to this

Extremely intelligent does not describe me…which is absolutely why I am not home schooling. I cannot be an EFFECTIVE teacher if I do not have the intelligence to know what I am teaching.

NOW, off to schools…

By Andrea

February 18, 2009 10:52 AM | Link to this

Oh look, a conversation on homeschooling turned into nothing more than a series of insults. Go figure.

Yesterday when I mentioned that there are numerous hybrid homeschool programs in the area where a child can go to school part-time, I neglected to name them.

Check out: Artios Academies Masters Academy of Fine Arts Classical Conversations Heritage Academy Veritas

Like I said, these programs allow homeschoolers to have a classroom experience one to three days a week, while maintaining the freedom of homeschooling.

Best of luck.

One more comment. To the person who ridicules homeschoolers for cooking or doing laundry… Have you ever heard of a lunch break or a crock pot? That’s how I do it. I throw food in the crock pot when I wake up, or later in the day when we take a break.

As for laundry… It doesn’t get folded very often, but if teachers can take cigarette breaks, a homeschool mom can definitely take a laundry break.

Andrea Hermitt, Examiner.com

By HB

February 18, 2009 11:23 AM | Link to this

Yeah, I am confused as to why people think during 5-10 minutes of desk time working on a math problem or reading a short story that Mom can’t throw some clothes in the dryer. Leaving a well-behaved school-aged kid or two alone in another room is not a big deal. Teachers have to keep an eye 20+ kids, use that time to give a little one-on-one help to a kid falling behind, etc. I don’t see how it could require just as much time to educate a kid or two as it would a classroom full (plus grade all those papers, plus stop to discipline kids who are acting up, plus lunch and bus duty…). Homeschooling parents can make more efficient use of time simply because they have the flexibility to do so — classroom teachers don’t.

By Suzanne

February 18, 2009 1:32 PM | Link to this

I started homeschooling a month ago due to school difficulties. We enrolled our son in GVA (Georgia Virtual Academy) which is a public online charter school. It goes through the end of Middle School. It’s a great progam for kids who need extra challenge and they have an advanced learner program. Our son has a teacher who works with him and looks at some of his schoolwork. It takes up a lot of my time, but it’s worth is because our son is happy and learning again. I would not do it with our other child, because he is very successful in the local public school.

By Marie

February 18, 2009 5:44 PM | Link to this

I too am in the process of deciding whether or not to send my daughter to middle school, which begins in fifth grade in our district.

On middle school/jr. high socialization… there aren’t too many adults I interact with on a daily basis that act like jr. highers. How will it help my daughter to deal with the hormone-crazy individuals, when she will have a more mature setting when out on her own as an adult?

If she currently has public schooled friends, as well as home schooled friends, does it honestly matter if she attends a school building? Could there be some value in allowing her to become a woman in a safe environment, then to emerge as a mature young woman, ready to work with others in the work force?

These are the things that weigh on me as I consider the options. The decision is so much tougher when you realize that there is more than one way for a child to be educated.

By catlady

February 18, 2009 8:18 PM | Link to this

Thanks, mjg, and same backatcha.

Here is the problem: if you are a homeschooling parent, you have seen its effects on your 2 or 3 kids. So it is 100%. I have taught over 1000 kids. Probably 3% or maybe 4% have been involved in homeschooling—it is not very common around here. So that would be 30-40 kids. My evaluation of 100% successful homeschool instruction is close to zero. Pretty darned successful: maybe 10%. Averagely successful: another 15%. Unsuccessful or a plain old disaster: 75%. Now, on the public school: more than 25% successful. So, as far as the chance a homeschooled child around here will have a markedly successful experience, it does not make much sense. But if it is YOUR child and it is successful, it is 100%. See the difference? I can only say what I have observed in the bigger picture.

As I said, my area is likely a great deal different from the area most bloggers live in.

I think the motivation is highly important, as well as the parent investment of time and energy and parent education. I have seen homeschoolers divided into several camps/motivations, and these have a significant impact on how successful your homeschooling experience is, IMHO. For example, I have seen mamas who insist on homeschooling so they don’t have to get a job outside the home! “I can’t work. I have to homeschool, you know.” That sort of thing.

I would much rather see these same parents be the strong, vocal advocates for addressing the problems in public schools (which are many), of course. But if your child is in a dangerous situation (you define), you should get them out of there! Be sure, when you define dangerous, to think long and short term.

I am thankful for all parents who THINK seriously about their childrens’ education, no matter what form it takes.

By motherjanegoose

February 19, 2009 8:47 AM | Link to this

catlady…I am addressing this at you… your points are once again good ones and the very reasons I feel that many mamas do not see the bigger picture and many daddies will not argue with mama ( they know better…LOL)

I cannot, for the life of me, understand why parents of young children especially ( in most areas…not all) would not send their children on to school as I AM IN MANY of these schools and see dedicated teachers presenting information in bright colorful classrooms, with wonderful social opportunities.

There are not many children in K-3 who are actually bored, as some parents think. My son was gifted and scored very high…he loved school here in Gwinnett County Ga.

BUT

He had a terrible social situation in 5th grade ( we had just moved) and the teacher actually called us in to tell us that the entire class was being mean to him. They had all started that school in Kindergarten in a brand new school ( a little pow wow …no offense meant) and thus he was an outsider.
Did I yank him out…NO…we navigated the waters together and YES it was tough. By the way, it was then considered one of the posher schools in the county and this is why we moved to the area. WHOODA THUNK IT…LOL! ( later, at church camp, one of those boys came to him and apologized…when they were teens…he told us with tears in his eyes…what a learning experience!)

Sorry for the run ons…I am trying to finish this up.

As I have mentioned before, I have personally been in every state but Montana…which I will visit this summer. I AM TYPICALLY NOT IN DANGEROUS SCHOOLS. If a child is in danger, I agree with you…you must protect your child.

Children are resilient but if mama coddles them then they will expect to be coddled…this is where I have problems.

Too many Mamas want too hold their children close and as you mentioned in your “here is the problem” paragraph…they only see their own child and not the bigger picture.

I am with you, in that I have worked with a LOT of children. I have been in the classroom with children from New Jersey to Alaska, from Minnesota to Texas. Most folks do not have a picture frame big enough to hold that picture.

Thank you for being a voice of reason!

Here is what I know for sure…I AM NOT THE SHARPEST KNIFE IN THE DRAWER…there are so many ( including my neighbor across the street) who are extremely intelligent.

I cannot begin to tell you some of the things my own children are learning now…they are more intelligent that me in many areas!

I know what I know and I also have been blessed to have a broad amount of experience with children, due to my work. SOME of the brightest folks with educational accolades ( I respect and admire) are not as sharp as some of the others who have walked the sidewalk of common sense and personal experience BUT this is how the world is.

I hear this from my clients all the time, they tell me; “you are a real person with real experiences that validate what you know…not just someone with a degree and an office…” I know I can sound sharp on this blog but I am passionate about education and those who know me personally will validate the fact that I love what I do.

Would you completely trust a Pediatrician who has no children of his/her own and told you things that you know will not work ( as you HAVE been there with your own child).

The intellect and education is certainly there but the personal experience may not be.

No one parent can be effective for every subject…just like there are no teachers who are certified to teach all subjects…unless we are talking about a one room school house and we have come a long way since then.

catlady, your last 2 paragraphs are wonderful and I once again thank you for adding your wisdom.

Sorry if I offended anyone but I have not met many of the extremely intelligent parents who would be suitable candidates for homeschooling, this is why I may not be able to see the bigger picture that other posters know about.

If you can look yourself in the mirror and say, “YES, I am extremely intelligent in the subjects that I plan to teach my child..I am the best person to do it” Then perhaps you should give it a shot! Have a good day all!

By Laurie

February 19, 2009 9:14 AM | Link to this

As a former sixth grade teacher, and a current homeschool mom, I think homeschooling is an excellent choice for middle school. I just couldn’t believe the things I had to tackle with sixth grade children. And, as for the academic excellence, I taught at a school in Texas, rated Excellent for academic achievement, full of sixth grade students who read on a first and second grade level. As a homeschool mom of a fourth grader, my daughter, with learning disabilities has far surpassed 90% of my students. Students being able to have one-on-one instruction changes everything. As for the social aspects, my daughter is dear friends with girls in public schools, private schools, and homeschools. You do not have to end your friendships because you choose to homeschool. I wish you the best of luck for your family.

By Crimson Wife

February 19, 2009 11:13 AM | Link to this

Doesn’t anyone else find it a wee bit ironic that “motherjanegoose” keeps going on and on about how she’s not smart enough to homeschool but she is training the men and women going to teach in government-run schools?

By Elizabeth

February 19, 2009 11:33 AM | Link to this

I agree with you Crimson Wife.

If our schools are manned by extremely intellegent teachers, much more intellegent than the average parent, why are our kids failing the CRCT?

By me

February 19, 2009 11:33 AM | Link to this

motherjane

you are a theorist about homeschooling because you’ve never done it. if you’d done it you’d know that teaching a class of 15-30 tiny people is totally different to teaching 1 or 2 or even 6 or 7 little people. there were tutors before there were classrooms. the beauty of homeschooling now is that where you are weak, someone else is strong. if you are weak in teaching math, there are tutors and classes that homeschoolers can take advantage of. like i said, jen, don’t argue with a theorist.

By Pam

February 19, 2009 2:41 PM | Link to this

Angry teachers are one of the main reasons I homeschool.

By catlady

February 19, 2009 2:55 PM | Link to this

Pam, that’s sad.

me: no one said it is the same.

crimson wife: MJG is being modest. Most people should try that.

By Penguinmom

February 19, 2009 3:28 PM | Link to this

Theresa, hope you get better soon.

First, I happen to know a homeschooler who is currently attending GA Tech. We are looking at Tech as a possibility for our oldest son.

I currently homeschool a middle-schooler. I also teach upper level math to about 20 homeschool middle and high schoolers in Gwinnett. They are typical in many ways - talk all the time, text whenever they can, love American Idol, etc.

There are many ways they are atypical as well. There is not a strict grade/age separation between them. If you want to be friends with someone who is 4 or 5 years younger/older than you, that’s fine. They are also in general accepting of each other’s differences and abilities. If one kid doesn’t read or do math as well as others, that’s no big deal. If someone is very smart, they aren’t singled out as a geek. In general, the kids I teach are very enjoyable to be around.

Homeschooling today is very different than even 10 years ago. There are more opportunities available than one family could possibly do. My son is in a play this week through a homeschool arts program. There are support groups, co-ops, museum homeschool days, sports teams and a lot more.

I do not believe you have to be extremely intelligent in order to homeschool. I have a friend who was a stereotypical cheerleader. She is currently homeschooling 7 (3 natural, 4 adopted). Her oldest recently took the SAT through the Duke TIP program. If there are subjects that she’s not comfortable teaching the older kids, she finds someone to help tutor or teach that subject.

My mother was an elementary teacher for many years. I know she did an awesome job, loved all of her students and was loved by them in return. She stayed up preparing for class and grading tests many nights during my childhood. Homeschooling and teaching in school are not really comparable. Preparing lessons for 3 children that I have known since birth is so vastly different than preparing for 20 students with varied backgrounds and abilities. I think the Teachers have the hardest job in so many ways.

Homeschooling can be hard and it can be draining, but the rewards of being with your child to help them through their rough spots are enormous.

By Penguinmom

February 19, 2009 3:54 PM | Link to this

newmom, I think the homeschool awkward teenager is mostly a thing of the past. There are still some obviously, but most of the kids I know are well-adjusted and fun to be around. Is there some awkwardness around other teens. Yes, but not a lot more than public school or private school students feel when they are around kids from a different school.

My son isn’t up on all the latest trends but that’s fine with him and aboslutely fine with me. Yes, he likes Hogan’s Heroes better than SpongeBob but who wouldn’t? On the other hand, he loves the Mario Brawl on the Wii and Star Wars. So, he can usually find a topic of conversation with whoever he happens to be around, public, private, homeschooled kids, adults or even young kids.

All of my kids find friends wherever we are irregardless of age or gender. My youngest (5) makes adult or teenage friends as easily as kindergarten friends.

If you are involved in the youth program at our church (I believe we attend the same Snellville location), then you are around a lot of homeschoolers possibly without knowing it. They get up on stage and sing, hang out with friends and act like typical teenagers.

By Penguinmom

February 19, 2009 4:11 PM | Link to this

Sorry for so many posts. This is truly my last one because I’ve got to go put stage makeup on my 13-yr-old boy. Not fun for any of us.

Keith (or anyone else interested in homeschooling middle schoolers.) Artios Academy’s Homeschool Middle School drama club is presenting ‘Tales of Beatix Potter’ and ‘Trumpet of the Swan’ at Lucerne Baptist on Hwy 78. There should still be some tickets left for the evening shows Thursday, Friday and Saturday at 7pm. (no guarantee). I think the tickets are $10 for adults, $8 for kids.

As a reporter you might even be able to get into the sold out Friday Morning show at 10am.

By new mom

February 19, 2009 4:26 PM | Link to this

Hi Penguinmom, I really hope you’re right, maybe there are a lot of teenagers who are homeschooled that we didn’t realize. That would definitely help to increase the ratio we had observed over the past years. (our church is HUGE, and we didn’t know nearly all the teenagers. And lots of the kids we observed were at our previous church… Plus after 10 yrs, we ‘retired’ when our baby was born and now help in the nursery…)

Basically the kids I was referring to were the ones we knew personally, knew their situations, and developed a relationship with. It sounds like you have a successful experience and, most importantly, CARE! The situation that still bugs me the most is the teenage boy who watched videos all day, every day…Those “homeschooling” parents aren’t writing here, defending their lack of teaching…

By Penguinmom

February 19, 2009 5:01 PM | Link to this

In every group of people there are always some slackards. It bothers me as a homeschool parent when others don’t do a good job. However, that isn’t indicative of homeschoolers in general. I try not to judge all public school parents by those who are not doing a good job raising their kids. With the smaller number of homeschoolers there’s more of a tendancy to generalize.

In Gwinnett, last I heard, there are as many homeschoolers (across all grades) as in one of the large high schools. Small percentage wise but still a pretty big number. At our church, there are more kids who are homeschooled than kids who go to any one particular school.

By motherjanegoose

February 19, 2009 5:03 PM | Link to this

Alas….some folks make comments based on their own false assumptions.

I have never ever said that I train educators in government-run schools…I train in all sorts of academic environments…many schools are private and the parents are paying hefty bucks for their child’s education. Imagine it…they hire me???

Those who blame the teachers for poor test scores also have no idea. Research indicates that parental involvement is one of the biggest predictors of school success. Take a moment to check out how involved the parents are of those children who are failing tests…before you just ( easily) blame the teachers. Hats off to the PTA Mamas and the Band Booster Dads!

Of course, there are exceptions but parents play the biggest role in academic success.

Many parents today do not give a toot and it shows. Kindergarten students who are falling asleep in school because a parent did not realize they needed a bed time or children who come to school in shorts when the temp. is 40 degrees. A tip of the iceberg is the large portion of children who come to school without brushing their teeth and/or even having a bath. Perhaps teachers should take over personal hygiene too?

Should we hold teachers accountable here if the children are too tired, dirty or cold to learn…in your world maybe! Not in mine.

Elizabeth and Crimson Wife: I know what I know and that is NOT everything. Would you ask your allergist ( an intelligent Doctor) to deliver a baby…me thinks not. would he/she consider it…NO for the same reason why I cannot teach all subjects with confidence.

Those who are specialized ( myself included) know their field and also their limitations in other fields. Typically, you will want to hire an expert in the field…that has been my experience.

Can an ( intelligent) Dermatologist take out an appendix…would you want one to? Yep, he/she is a doctor!

Once, I was asked to teach middle school and was on my way taking classes for certification. I was then teaching early childhood. In the midst, we moved here to GA. I was in WAY over my head in the graduate classes with others who already were teaching middle school. I had taught Kinder and 2nd for 5 years…it was hard for me and I was an educator, with a K-8 endorsement but not in Texas.

Those who think they know everything…really show that they do not, as soon as they open mouths.

While we are at it… a parent cannot always possibly know what is absolutely best for their own child. Yes, we WANT TO KNOW but those parents who can look at the bigger picture, also know that there is so much more to life than our own little nest and other experiences can be an advantage.

I have a dear friend who is 60 plus with 4 children in their 30’s… I call her all the time to ask her opinion about own my kids… I mentioned the very idea that no parent can always know what is best for their own children to her this week and we both chuckled over it. She is a retired teacher.

Angry teachers may be dealing with children whose parents are a pain in the behind ( for so many reasons) and perhaps are relieved when those parents pull their children out of school. They just forget to thank them LOL.

I have learned a lot and some of the posters DO appear to want the best for their children and homeschooling is perhaps a good option for them. My hat is off to you folks. Other posters are the reason why I opened with my statement in my first post.

Here is what I do know…folks who do not have a clue can read and re-read and still not understand what in the world everyone is saying and when they post…it shows.

Lastly, newsflash NOT ALL teachers are extremely intelligent…anyone who is a teacher will tell you this BUT teachers have a certain mastery of their subject and are usually required to maintain proficiency in order to keep their job. They are reviewed for performance by peers and their employer on a regular basis and hopefully this will weed out the bad teachers but not always…we know this to be true!

By HB

February 19, 2009 5:59 PM | Link to this

MJG, I think where your arguments sometimes fall off the rails is when you make the assumption that teachers are the experts on how to educate children. That’s just not necessarily true. Teachers do study pedagogy — so did I, for my museum studies degree, but I’d be overwhelmed if you dropped me in a classroom. Most teachers I’ve known are great at what they do, but what they do is teach in a formal classroom setting. They are experts at formal classroom education, not in the best way to educate all children everywhere.

Good example — I worked for an academically intense travel education program in DC. The teachers had a variety of backgrounds — all had bachelors or masters, most were not long out of school, but we did have some instructors who had spent years as tutors, engineers, policy wonks — you name it, we had it. The absolute worst educator we had on staff was a former teacher who had won awards and came highly recommended. He was a great guy and cared deeply about the work, but while he was great in a traditional classroom setting, he just couldn’t cut it in our program. The educational settings just weren’t the same — that’s not to say one is better or worse, but this teacher clearly was not an expert when it came to our particular, very effective methods. Likewise, a parent or tutor can be great options for some kids at home and in small groups, and many kids may thrive in such a setting with what you call “nonexpert” educators where they may have just floated along in a traditional school. When nonteachers give an opinion, you shouldn’t assume it’s less informed because they’re not in a classroom. What a lot of homeschooling parents are rejecting is the idea that the traditional classroom is the best place for their children to learn. A teacher can only speak to one side of that issue — what things are like in school. Homeschooling parents, informal educators, and parents considering homeschooling because they’re not convinced that the traditional classroom is best for their own child, whom they presumably know well, are just as qualified to speak to these matters as formal educators are.

By Kristina

February 19, 2009 6:24 PM | Link to this

catlady: Here is the problem: if you are a homeschooling parent, you have seen its effects on your 2 or 3 kids. So it is 100%. I have taught over 1000 kids. Probably 3% or maybe 4% have been involved in homeschooling—it is not very common around here. So that would be 30-40 kids. My evaluation of 100% successful homeschool instruction is close to zero. Pretty darned successful: maybe 10%. Averagely successful: another 15%. Unsuccessful or a plain old disaster: 75%. Now, on the public school: more than 25% successful. So, as far as the chance a homeschooled child around here will have a markedly successful experience, it does not make much sense. But if it is YOUR child and it is successful, it is 100%. See the difference? I can only say what I have observed in the bigger picture. The problem is that your 100% is mostly homeschoolers that are back in school because their homeschooling was failing, or their parents thought it was. So, you’re not seeing even close to 100% of the homeschool population. You don’t even come close to being able to observe the bigger picture. And, I was just wondering, do you know any homescoolers who are in the process of homeschooling, or only those who have gone back to public school? Also, what do you consider 100% success? Because, I don’t see many high school graduates of the public school system that I would consider a 100% success. To me, 100% success means that they are competent in all subject matters. Most public school high school graduates are not. Homeschool parents are able to see the big picture because they don’t just see the failures. They see the failures, the successes, and the just-getting-bys. They talk. They observe. Sometimes a homeschooler is failing. I was when my oldest was in 3rd grade. I had several homeschool moms tell me that it was okay to put him back in school and encouraged me to do so. Can you imagine how happy I was to find out that what I considered failing was average in school? For example, I have seen mamas who insist on homeschooling so they don’t have to get a job outside the home! “I can’t work. I have to homeschool, you know.” That sort of thing. LOL, seriously? I can see it. After all, staying home and keeping house is not a valid job anymore. So, of course they use whatever excuse they can come up with.

By Kristina

February 19, 2009 6:29 PM | Link to this

Ugh! I copy and pasted that and there are no paragraph breaks. I’m sorry it is so hard to read!

By Kristina

February 19, 2009 6:39 PM | Link to this

MGJ:”Children are resilient but if mama coddles them then they will expect to be coddled…this is where I have problems.”

Ah, when my parents pulled my baby sister out of school in 6th grade, they didn’t know she had been suicidal until months after they started homeschooling her.

Yes, coddling is such a problem. I expect my 11 year old to be able to think for himself. I expect him to be able to cook for himself. I expect him to be able to handle himself in social situations. Yup, I’m protective. But, I wouldn’t say I’m coddling him. In fact, I’ve met few homeschoolers who coddle. I love all the assumptions you’re making about homeschooling when you’ve admitted to know very few people who have homeschooled.

My boy had some major issues because of his 1st grade teacher. Am I bitter? Probably. Am I still resentful? No. We overcame the problems through intensive instruction while homeschooling last year. Did we try homeschooling for 2nd grade? Yes. Did it work? No. We put him back in school. We are homeschooling, again. We started at the beginning of 5th grade. He’s mid-way through 6th grade. Well, that’s his age, anyway.

MGJ:”While we are at it… a parent cannot always possibly know what is absolutely best for their own child. Yes, we WANT TO KNOW but those parents who can look at the bigger picture, also know that there is so much more to life than our own little nest and other experiences can be an advantage.”

Well, this is true. That is why we talk to other people, JUST LIKE YOU DO. I’ll give you a personal example. My 11 year is an intelligent kid. He’ll be ‘done’ with high school by the time he is 13. I don’t want him to go to college when he is 13. But, I don’t want to hold him back, either. I did not know what the solution to this was. So, during a parents’ night out, I talked to another homeschool mom and her husband. She is a geneticist. He is a physics professor at our local university. Through that conversation, we were able to come up with several ideas. This is the plan at this point: mentorships with university professors and local historians, college abroad for high school students, intensive language instruction, and other things that he won’t have time for once he starts college full time. You see, I know I don’t know everything. And, I am leary of putting my son in college when he is 13. This physics professor told me not to worry about it. If he wants to go to college, let him. If not, these are some options.
Now, if I can just figure out how to keep the 8 year old from being ready for Calculus at 10. If I can’t figure out that answer, I’ll figure out how to get a teacher for him. It’s really quite simple. The schools would not give them instruction in Calculus at 10, anyway. And, if they are high school age, colleges are more than willing to do the instructing. So, I really don’t see the problem. MGJ:”Research indicates that parental involvement is one of the biggest predictors of school success.”

I love it when this one gets rolled out during homeschool discussions. It is almost always rolled out by teachers who are anti-homeschooling. Yet, if I get completely involved, I’m not coddling or hurting my child.

By motherjanegoose

February 19, 2009 7:18 PM | Link to this

HELP catlady…Kristina has so many ideas stuck together and it is in one big pile. I cannot skip back and forth.

Will you please tell me what is going on and give me the main points that you and I are both missing?

Guess I will stick with Kindergarten…hahaha!

By Kristina

February 19, 2009 7:26 PM | Link to this

LOL I am not sure WHY my second comment was all jumbled up like that. I tried so hard!

Here are the main points: I think you don’t know much about homeschooling. I think you don’t know many homeschoolers.

I think people who don’t know about the subject they’re talking about should refrain from making a judgement on that subject.

By luvs2teach

February 19, 2009 10:14 PM | Link to this

I have a been a fairly regular poster to Get Schooled for a couple years now (although it’s been pretty ugly lately and I’m staying away for awhile). I often lurk here - ocasionally I post under my “mom” name.

Anyway, I don’t understand the animosity between homeschool vs nonhomeschool folks - it reminds me of the SAHM vs working mom wars - stupid and uneccessary.

Fact is there are public schools that are great and a good fit for some children - there are public schools that are terrible and you wonder why the state doesn’t close them. There are private schools that are worth their weight in gold and those children go on to great things - there are also private schools that take your money and run. There are committed homeschool parents with successful children that end up at GT and there are lazy parents who homeschool for all the wrong reasons (like not wanting to be hassled by the school social worker over the child’s attendance) and whose child ends up back in public school years behind…

Everyone’s experience is valid and true - to discount what one has seen isn’t a fair argument on anyone’s part.

I for one always “homeschooled” - I reinforced at HOME what my children learned in SCHOOL. I never left the job of my children’s education solely to the schools - as someone who did most of my learning on my own, outside of the school system, I only ever expected the minimum from the schools - the rest was up to me. That’s what was right for me and my famly. Your famly may have a different choice - and as you as you make a conscious, committed decision, and set out to do the most with it possible, then who am I to say it’s wrong? By the same token, you would have no right to criticize my decision - my kids are well-adjusted - one’s about to finish college, and the others about to start - both are already proving to be contributing members of society - give your kids wings instead of crutches, and they will soar - no matter what path they take.

Last food for thought - profoundly gifted (IQ 160+) students are just as “special” as those with an IQ of 70. Regular education doesn’t do a particularly good job with either of those groups - PG kids can really achieve in a good homeschool environment - they often seem weird to others because of how quickly their brains work - ask yourself, did homeschool make them “weird,” or were they “weird” to begin with? There is a private school (can’t remember where) that caters to PG kids, and most say one thing they like best is that they are with other kids like them.

By FCM

February 20, 2009 7:13 AM | Link to this

The I get to know my school system. The more sure I am that the folks who say the schools just want to raise non thinking sheep are correct.

We have crappy schools in Georgia. We have crappy teachers.

On the other hand we have really good schools in Georgia. We have some really good (and a few awesome) teachers too.

I think in the end each PARENT has to decide what is best for their child(ren) and do it.

For instance, I moved to a smaller home with higher rent to give my children the school system we live in. Private school and homeschooling were what I wanted to do for my children but with my budget situation (and being a single mom) that was not an option. Finding a well performing school in an area I could afford to live in was my solution.

By kat

February 20, 2009 12:59 PM | Link to this

MGJ: “Research indicates that parental involvement is one of the biggest predictors of school success. Take a moment to check out how involved the parents are of those children who are failing tests…before you just ( easily) blame the teachers. Hats off to the PTA Mamas and the Band Booster Dads!

Of course, there are exceptions but parents play the biggest role in academic success.

Many parents today do not give a toot and it shows.”

Exactly. I AM an involved parent. I am so involved that I sacrifice most of my day so my children will be educated, that is why I homeschool them. Our oldest is currently in 5th grade and has always been homeschooled. I taught in the local public schools and decided NEVER to put my children in one- I was repelled by the ignorance of many of my fellow teachers, the lack of discipline, the dumbing down of the curriculum, the emphasis on materialism and popularity, and the repression of learning for learning’s sake.

However great those PTA moms are for the school, we all know that they don’t have any say in making their kid’s school better. Many parents, teachers, and politicians have tried to fix the system, but it is broken and homeschool parents are doing what they need to do to rescue their own children. We tried to help solve the problem, but it is too big for us and we aren’t going to sacrifice our children’s future to help prop up “the system.”

Most ps teachers only see the kids who come back into the system because parents thought it would be fun or easy and gave up, they never see kids like mine and my friends who are smart and well adjusted. My mother was one of those teachers and I constantly heard, “Put those children in school. You need time for yourself.” She finally told me how she could see the difference in their schooling and behavior after I said, “I’m not putting them in, I want smart and kind children, not like those horrible kids you complain about every day!”

By Crimson Wife

February 20, 2009 1:06 PM | Link to this

MJG wrote: “newsflash NOT ALL teachers are extremely intelligent.”

Research has shown that the average newly credentialed teacher has SAT scores that place him/her in the BOTTOM THIRD of all college graduates.

Given that 85% of all children in this country attend government-run schools, perhaps MJG should be worrying a whole lot more about the intelligence of the individuals teaching them and worrying a whole lot less about the intelligence of those teaching the 5% of kids who are homeschooled.

By Stephanie

February 20, 2009 2:49 PM | Link to this

I am one of those who tried homeschooling and thought it was too hard. But, I am still very pro-homeschooling and will likely homeschool again next year. The year I tried it (for my 4 year old)I also had a newborn who was extrememly needy. I decided it was too much and my daughter goes to a Methodist kindergarten this year. (Her current school does not have 1st grade or higher)I have decided I am up to the challenge to try again next year for a few reasons: One, the ‘baby’ will be 2 and a half and not nearly so needy. Two, I have decied to do one of the hybrid schools along with having a teacher that teaches at the public school that my daughter is slated to attend come tutor her twice a week. (she is a friend of mine) So while I will still work with her a lot myself, not all of the instruction will have to come from me. I think this mix will be a good fit for OUR family.

Also, a word about socialization. The year we homeschooled, we joined a group and made many great friends. These friends are still close with my daughter and I feel that she knows them in a way that she does not know her current classmates. She has been to their house, knows their parents and siblings, and has spent many hours visiting lots of cool places with them. Their is one girl in her current class that we get together with outside of school, but the rest she sees only in class. So I actually think that while she may not know as many kids while homeschooling, she will have deeper friendships with those that she does- a plus in my book!

By Stephanie

February 20, 2009 3:11 PM | Link to this

By the way, I am aware I made many typos- trying to do other things while commenting!

By MamaBear

February 26, 2009 2:06 PM | Link to this

I’m new to this site, a fairly new parent, and trying to determine if homeschooling is right for me too. Luckily, we’ve got another year to decide if we’ll start now, or wait a few more years.

I have a good friend that was pulled out of public school in the 7th grade, re-enrolled in 11th, and graduated 2nd in her High School class. She graduated Suma Cum Laude from her University, in her Discipline, and is now a mother of 2 herself.

I believe that education is what we as parents make of it. Regardless of whether that ends up being public, private, or home-school, WE as parents set the course for our children.

If we send them to public school, excited for them, accentuating the positives about the building, the curriculum, the educators, the children, then our children will be excited and look for the positive things themselves. If, however, we think to ourselves that school will be lousy, the teachers inept, the children mean, the curriculum inadequate, then that will be translated to our children.

If your question is “will your daughter benefit academically from being home-schooled during the Middle years?”, only you can answer that question…you must determine, as the parent, if you are up to the challenge of interacting with, stimulating, and educating a hormonal pre-teen in ways that they can look past you as the parent, to you as the educator, and begin that transition between “Dad, the boss and parent” to “Dad, the boss, the parent, and now my friend.”

If you are simply concerned about the socialization, and the upkeep of her friendships, then leave her in school. Let her know that you expect her to give 100% to her education, and set the bar for her. Find things that she can do at home, on her own, outside of school that will still help to further her knowledge and education.

My own experience growing up, is that every thing we did was turned into learning. My folks were sneaky about it, in that I never realized until expecting my oldest that they were doing it…LONG after I had left home and become an independent adult.

My husband and I want to provide the best education, ethics, habits, and instill the values we hold in our children.

If that means I home-school them, then I will, and I’ll do the best that I can at it.

The best thing about home-schooling, in my opinion, from observation, is that it is at your own pace. The worst thing? It is at your own pace! The very things that are wonderful about it, are those that make you cringe…

This isn’t a decision to be made lightly, but only a lot of introspection, conversation with other parents, and the staff and teachers in your district can help you truly explore your options, and provide food for your decision.

I wish you the best, and plan to come back and read more on this site.

By Brian

March 9, 2009 2:46 PM | Link to this

Homeschool? It depends on your vision. We have 2 in college now, ACT of 33 and 34 in reading. Both on scholarships, one partial, the other full. You cannot depend on others to deliver the goods.

By Stephanie Terral

March 11, 2009 10:01 AM | Link to this

I am also trying to research and get all different opinions and options in regard to possible homeschooling my 5th grader next year. I wanted to know if anyone knows of any “creative” alternatives to homeschooling—-For example—to possibly coordinate instruction with a teacher on an individual basis a couple of times a week? Not really sure if there is anything “creative” out there, but I want to make sure I am checking all possibilities and options that are available. Thanks to anyone out there who may have some input or suggestion as to where I could look to try and find this information.