MOMania

By FCM

January 10, 2008 7:48 AM | Link to this

The current way that GA school rules read the Mother would be allowed 6 weeks…because she would not return to school without a note from her doctor (presumably at the 6 weeks PostPardum checkup)….so that would be excused absence.

As far as who should take care of the child while Mom is at school….that is NOT the schools role nor their concern, that is the ‘new’ grandparents worry—especially if Mom is not an emancipated minor.

However, the more pressing question these counselors should be addressing is how to help the girls NOT get pregnant in the first place!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(yeah I am sure to get flamed on this one).

By Katie

January 10, 2008 8:08 AM | Link to this

I agree with FCM, it’s not the job of the school to worry about pregnant teens and maternity leave. As a tax payer, I want my dollars going to teaching kids English, Math, Science and History, not worrying about allowing girls to extend their education by 6 weeks or counceling teen mothers. What’s next, day care in high schools?

By FCM

January 10, 2008 8:09 AM | Link to this

@Jeff—-you were in the system…the more I think about it, yes it would be an excused absence but much more likely due to Federal Money rules/regs the school would have the new mother disenroll from school…..is that what you think too?

I know they do that (disenroll) at my children’s schools when a family takes a ‘vacation’ more than 2 weeks long.

Theresa, I disagree with your idea that time off won’t encourage a girl to get pregnant. Most teens don’t think long term…some dumb girl is going to think having a baby is great idea, or think its a good way to get time off…my 13 yo cousin thought so! That baby was miscarried but at 17 she had first and at 20 she has 2. My ex’s sisters were both very young mothers. It is SCARY!

By Julie

January 10, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

Just one more reason children shouldn’t be having children. Maybe if we as a society made it less socially acceptable they would think a little longer and harder about the consequences. I don’t know.

By astro

January 10, 2008 8:12 AM | Link to this

If we followed the same logic that we use to teach our kids about sex, then we would approach the problem of kids being hit by cars by sending them to classes on how to dodge the cars better. After a couple of years of these classes, we’d wonder why kids were still getting hit by cars.

Now, if we taught them not to play in the street..

By Julie

January 10, 2008 8:13 AM | Link to this

Oh, and I meant to say, no they should not be required to return straight to school. That is just ridiculous.

By madisons mom

January 10, 2008 8:18 AM | Link to this

Personally, I agree with the FCM and Katie. I don’t get a paid maternity leave - I have to save and get ready for it before-hand. Why should taxpayers have to foot the bill for extended school for these people being irresponsible and having children while they are still in school? If my daughter gets mononucleosis, I have to go to the school daily and pick up her work and turn in the work from the previous day’s lessons - she doesn’t get six weeks off in order to take a “break”.

By sarah

January 10, 2008 8:21 AM | Link to this

We are already going to pay for the child for the rest of its life. We shouldn’t allow the mothers maternity leave. If we would quit catering to these children that screw up then maybe we wouldn’t have so many out getting knocked up. It’s too easy to have kid, reap the rewards, and not even take care of the child.

By zeke

January 10, 2008 8:23 AM | Link to this

What idiots! They should be expelled for being a bad influence, negative influence, disruptive influence on the other students!!!

By FCM

January 10, 2008 8:29 AM | Link to this

@ Katie “Several districts have special schools with child-care services for new moms” <——this is directly from the article that Theresa linked. SO no that is not what is next..it is already here.

By Baby Daddy

January 10, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this

At first I was outraged as were some of you who responded before me. Then I thought it is a good idea but only if it includes a statute for PATERNITY leave for the baby-daddies also. This way the new baby, mom, and dad could bond together and maybe the dad will be more likely to stick around and actually be a DAD instead of just a sperm donor.

By Plainly Spoken

January 10, 2008 8:37 AM | Link to this

Another sign of the decline and impending death of Western civilization … .

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 8:40 AM | Link to this

FCM:

What Jeff were you referring to in your second post? I looked and saw no one posting under the ‘Jeff’ name thus far on this topic… just curious!!

Now, for my response to the topic:

A) We need to get government out of the education business in the first place. Government has ZERO Constitutional business in this arena.

B) The more you reward a behavior, the more it will happen. By giving recent teenage moms an excused abscense, we are ENCOURAGING teenage pregnancy. As has been said, teens aren’t exactly known for thinking long term. They’re going to see it as an excuse to have some fun and get 6 weeks out of school - allowing them to have more fun. At that point, nothing you can tell them about how awful childbirth and the immediate few weeks after is is going to matter. It will go in one ear and out the other.

Similarly, we see the same thing happening with illegal immigration. Our laws are set up so that they in effect ENCOURAGE the problem, and therefore the problem continues to grow. Ending of birthright citizenship would go a LONG way to stopping this problem.

C) As I just alluded to, instead of making life EASIER for problem people, the HARDER you make life, the less desireable the problem behavior is and the LESS likely it is to happen. This goes for everything from teen pregnancy to illegal immigration.

For example: Know why alternative schools are such a good deterrent to many behavior issues in school? Quite a few factors really, but among them: the social stigma (a MAJOR deterrent to teens!), the fact that they will have to be in school anyway, AND the fact that alternative schools are known for being FAR more restrictive and strict on discipline issues than mainstream schools. In other words, life is made FAR harder than at the mainstream school, so why bother doing something that would get you sent to the alternative school?

By sue

January 10, 2008 8:41 AM | Link to this

A school quarter is 9 weeks. Any student that is gone 6 out of 9 weeks should not get credit for being there.

I don’t think that anyone should be forced to go back to school/work the day after they are discharged from the maternity ward, but there are other options. The article stated, “that normally Colorado public schools use specialized programs or individual education plans to deal with pregnancy.” It seems to me that means they make allowances. Perhaps home study, special courses, or even withdrawing from class and graduating late or making it up during summer school.

In this country, we have the right to free education, but no where does it state that the right extends to marching and graduating with the same peers we started school with.

Why do parents try to litigate away any consequence that a child may have for their choices?

By Katie

January 10, 2008 8:44 AM | Link to this

FCM, are you serious? I didn’t know that. I hope they are not funded by tax dollars (please don’t tell me otherwise). That is sending the wrong message to young girls. They need to keep their thighs together and stop having babies at the cost of the public. I agree with Julie as well, we should make it more socially unacceptable.

By Leigh

January 10, 2008 8:50 AM | Link to this

That’s why God made the GED. Stay home and get one while you are nursing.

By Leigh

January 10, 2008 8:55 AM | Link to this

And by the way, if I was sitting in Algebra next to a girl who was balancing a baby in her Juicy backpack, spouting milk from her chest, and questionalble fluids from other areas - I might just think twice about f. my boyfriend that night. Now that’s education.

By One

January 10, 2008 9:11 AM | Link to this

I agree with just about everything that has been said here already!!! Make teen pregnancy unacceptable, make it as hard as possible for them to get that diploma, make their little fast azzes living examples of birth control!!!! Then, and only then, will they think twice about such stupidity!!

By jeed

January 10, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this

Take the whole nine weeks/semester, or YEAR off and come back the next year - repeating the grade level, of course.

What am I missing?

By One

January 10, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this

So in answer to the original question, HELL NO!!!, no maternity leave for high schoolers? How ignorant does that sound when said aloud………hellz, when typed!!!

By FCM

January 10, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this

@Jeff….it was to you my dear (provided of course that you are the adoring husband to ‘T’). I had a feeling this topic would strike a cord and you would be on at some point. Forgive me if my presumption overstepped the bounds of ‘blog friendship’.

@Katie, that quote was from the paper.

@Astro, I never said what part of sex ed we should have. Abstinence is still my preferred method for teens….however if they insist on doing the deed they should be covered up and other measures in place….including understanding that it will be THEIR responsiblity for providing remedy for any consequences occurred (pregnancy or STD).

@Baby Daddy—I wondered if Paternity leave would come up. I have various thoughts on that (primarily that Daddy should be in school getting his diploma so he can provide for the baby/he can bond while caring for the child while Mom is in school so she can get a diploma and provide for the baby)…however I do believe (as stated above) that if a teen (regardless of gender) choose to engage in the activities that lead to these situations…they BOTH should understand they will responsible for the solution to the outcomes of their actions.

Additionally the article points out that alternative arrangements are made to help the girls keep up with their studies. Further, while my job is secure through the Family Leave Act…there was nothing indicating that the girls ‘spot’ in school was in jepordy…presumably if she left 10th grade she would be welcomed back into 10th grade. With regard to the childcare—-I have been blasted many times for stating that I would love to see the cost deferred (it is outrageous what is charged for GOOD care) and the STATE step in and govern the rules/reg better—-however my employer is not responsible for the care of my child, I AM. I pay for it, I find it, I secure it, and I proactively keep track of it. That is part of being a good parent…guess what girls, that is what you are now a PARENT not a school girl

By madisons mom

January 10, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this

It just drives me nuts that people (of all shapes, sizes, and colors) think that when they get “in trouble” it’s the responsibility of someone else to change the rules to make it easier for them. I would prefer it if we changed the rules for the people that FOLLOW the rules and work hard and try to make something of themselves instead of always catering to the worst of the group. When you lower standards to accommodate the the worst of the bunch, you always end up with mediocre results instead of raising standards and ending up with excellent results.

By 31yroldmother

January 10, 2008 9:23 AM | Link to this

You guys must not know much about the law. By law, ALL women get maternity leave the only difference is that your job does not have to pay you for it. Those of you who were fired for not coming to work right after pregnancy could probably sue your job. Believe me, your job would never tell you that they fired you for having a baby and needing to be home during a certain period of time. You should try it sometime.

Also, An insane person is one who contines to do the same thing over and over and expects different results. Guess what, High School students have never gotten maternity leave and they are STILL GETTING PREGNANT! Yet for some reason you ignorant folk believe that not getting maternity leave will prevent this. Has it prevented it thus far?

It is the not the job of the school teachers to teach your children about pregnancy and sex. Guess what that’s your job yet for some Odd reason parents want to keep pushing sex education. Do you not know how to teach your own children about sex and pregnancy?

Last but not least DON’T YOU GUYS WATCH MAURY believe me after they have the child and have to stay at home and listen to it scream and holler all day, stay up all night, and changing diapers. (Which the parents are supposed to enforce by the way). They won’t get pregnant again or in the first place!

P.S. - Help me on this? Since when do tax dollars go towards paying for students to be out of school? Tax dollars go toward the salaries and upkeep of the school not the students. How are you wasting your tax dollars for someone to take time off of school? Maternity leave doesn’t mean you get paid to be off.

By zoe

January 10, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this

I have a student currently on maternity leave, I have been requested to provide SIX WEEKS of alternative assignments for this student. I already teach three different classes during the day and my class activities are very involved and detailed. I can’t just send home whatever I do in class to the student. This is placing an extra burden on me because someone couldn’t keep her pants on.
If a student wants to be home for six weeks with baby, she should apply for the hospitalized/homebound service. That is what it is there for.

By zynhova

January 10, 2008 9:31 AM | Link to this

My mother-in-law gave birth to my husband when she was 15. She was expelled from school and not allowed to return because of the “influence” she might have on other girls. She was shunned from society and so way her baby.

So, she had a baby and had no way to support herself and that baby. Of course, she went on welfare. She got a GED and then got a job. But she could only get jobs that paid her about 10K a year so she was still on welfare.

When my husband graduated from high school they both qualified for pell grants and went to college.

I met and married my husband in our last 2 years of college.

In December of 1998 all 3 of us graduated from college. My mother-in-law with a BS in Accounting. She went to work for the state. My husband and I went to graduate school.

Now, my mother-in-law makes 65K a year. She’s 48. My husband is 33 and is a professor. We have a 6 year old son who benefits from having a young, financially comfortable grandma.

They made it, the two of them. With some help from the welfare system and a lot of grit and determination, despite obstacles from a society that decided my mother-in-law was a trashy slut and could be mistreated at will and that my husband was a b******* who was destined to become a criminal.

Perhaps it’s their experiences that make them sympathetic to the plight of the poor, disadvantaged, and marginalized - no matter how that person got where they are.

Knowing them and becoming family with them is one of the best things I have ever done to open my sheltered and short-sighted eyes to life.

We all agree that no matter how bad a choice someone has made they should be given a chance to turn things around. Society is obliged, for its own health and welfare, to help its weakest members to become stronger.

So, for high school girls who become pregnant and choose not to have an abortion we should help them complete their education so they have the best chance to raise themselves and their child to be a strong member of our society. As a mom I remember how physically hard it was to get around in the early days after giving birth. Painful, leaky, bloody, exhausting, scared.

Give them 4-6 weeks to adjust. Let them enter into a cohort of learning that ignores traditional semesters and allows them to catch up within a year.

This discussion is about what to do when the horse has left the barn, not about keeping the horse in. That’s for another blog. They’re equally important discussions.

By Mat

January 10, 2008 9:31 AM | Link to this

This is the most ridiculous request ever. They should be ashamed to even think about doing this. It’s not suppose to be easy being a teen mom… that is why you don’t have a baby. Forget maternity leave, they should not be in school when they start to show. As a high school teacher, I see students in the halls getting their stomachs rubbed by their peers. They show off their sonograms; they give out baby shower invitations. Each time I see this I want to vomit. Pathetic.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this

FCM:

Oh, ok! Just checking, you had me confused! :P

As far as my experiences in the system:

From a student who wound up IN an alternative school, what I said above about the reasons they are (mostly) effective is accurate.

From a teacher’s standpoint: What I said about making life harder for them is what I believe. The only students I had that had kids had them before they were in my class - never had one out for pregnancy reasons. (Change that, one senior was 3 or 4 months along - with her second - when she graduated. But I never had a student dealing with third trimester/ just delivered issues.)

Regarding state involvement in child care: My own limited government (some would say EXTREMELY limited government) proclivities are beginning to be fairly well known here and on the other AJC blogs. I’m going to say that the state needs to butt out - from EVERY perspective of it. As you said, part of being a good parent is finding, securing, and keeping track of quality care for your children.

Regarding Paternity leave: Don’t just give him paternity leave, EXPEL HIM. Force him to get a job and support that kid he helped to create. It’s called MANNING UP. He thinks he’s ready to be a man - by creating the child, he is automatically stating that he is a ‘man’. So make him BE a man and do the right thing by his kid.

Re: Sex ed: The single BEST thing we can do from a Sex Ed perspective is PUBLICLY crack down on teenage parents. Make their lives a living HADES - and put it on National TV in primetime. Message being: So you wanna have sex? Well, if you make a baby, you’ll face THIS. Do you REALLY want to do that?

By steve-o

January 10, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

It’s funny how everyone on here has never chased after the opposite sex as a high schooler, never had sex before marriage, and were able to pray away every temptation. You guys are truly God’s chosen people. Gimme a freaking break!

Abstinence only education is a complete and utter failure. Kids will have sex…always have, always will. Instead of going for pie-in-the-sky initiatives like abstinence only, maybe we should teach our kids about birth control and condom use in case they may find themselves in the throes of passion. It happens. Maybe we should also hammer home the ocnsequences of sex, both emotional and physical, and promote accountability and respect. I guess that makes too much sense. Anyways, we can always revert to stoning our daughters to death once they get knocked up.

By John

January 10, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

When I was in school pregnant girls just “disappeared”.

By FCM

January 10, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this

@31yoMom—-who said they got fired for maternity leave? How will allowing maternity leave for HS students help lower the rate? (We argue it might increase but we don’t say the current methods are working). I said that the counselors should be encouraging them not to get pregnant…I also said it was the ‘new’ grandparents job to take care of things…so how does that imply its not the parents of the teens job to also encourage them not to get pregnant/be responsible for their choices/look at long term consequences/etc? No I do not watch MAURY I am busy providing for my children…I do not have time to watch that stuff…and if the teens are in school they shouldn’t have time either. Besides most kids think it ‘will never happen to [them]”. I believe Zoe responded to your PS much better than I ever could.

By jamie

January 10, 2008 9:44 AM | Link to this

At least they are allowed to finish school in this day. I thought I knew it all when I married at 15. By 17 I was a senior and pregnant. I had straight A’s all through school but the system refused to let me continue my education due to my precnancy. Fortunately, I accomplished the GED program and proceeded to college but with no help from Georgia’s public school system. That was Rockdale County in 1980.

By Pen

January 10, 2008 9:47 AM | Link to this

What a bunch of self righteous folks you all are. I had my first child at a young age. Now, I realize that the pregnancy was mine to deal with and I did. Without the help of the taxpayers or my parents thank you very much. Yes, taxpayers do have to foot a lot of bills but the truth is we foot the bills of A LOT more adults than we do teenagers. Adults that refuse to work and keep popping babies out so the checks get bigger. Do I think teenagers need to be having babies?? No I don’t. Was I too young? Yes I was. But I had my child and I worked and I raised that child to the best of my abilities as most of these girls will hopefully do. And yes, I did get my GED, thank you Leigh for making that sound so trivial, I was very proud of myself that day just so you know. What you are all doing is assuming that you know not only the whole story but also the way it will turn out and you do not. If you honestly think that allowing pregnant teens in school or having in school daycare centers is going to make teens want to get pregnant than I would say that in most cases you are wrong! These teens will take one look at those girls being shunned by most of her “friends” and then also take a look at those screaming babies and think twice! If the “maternity leave” in any way costs the taxpayers or hinders the rest of the students then of course, it’s a dumb idea. But if it means this horrible, bad, loser of a teen Mom (not my opinion, what you all seem to think based on the above comments) has her child, bonds and sets up proper care and then finishes getting the education that MOST true welfare recipients never bothered to get then I applaude that girl and I go to bed at night knowing one more child in the world is safe , loved and has a bright future.

By Pen

January 10, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

What a bunch of self righteous folks you all are. I had my first child at a young age. Now, I realize that the pregnancy was mine to deal with and I did. Without the help of the taxpayers or my parents thank you very much. Yes, taxpayers do have to foot a lot of bills but the truth is we foot the bills of A LOT more adults than we do teenagers. Adults that refuse to work and keep popping babies out so the checks get bigger. Do I think teenagers need to be having babies?? No I don’t. Was I too young? Yes I was. But I had my child and I worked and I raised that child to the best of my abilities as most of these girls will hopefully do. And yes, I did get my GED, thank you Leigh for making that sound so trivial, I was very proud of myself that day just so you know. What you are all doing is assuming that you know not only the whole story but also the way it will turn out and you do not. If you honestly think that allowing pregnant teens in school or having in school daycare centers is going to make teens want to get pregnant than I would say that in most cases you are wrong! These teens will take one look at those girls being shunned by most of her “friends” and then also take a look at those screaming babies and think twice! If the “maternity leave” in any way costs the taxpayers or hinders the rest of the students then of course, it’s a dumb idea. But if it means this horrible, bad, loser of a teen Mom (not my opinion, what you all seem to think based on the above comments) has her child, bonds and sets up proper care and then finishes getting the education that MOST true welfare recipients never bothered to get then I applaude that girl and I go to bed at night knowing one more child in the world is safe , loved and has a bright future.

By Pen

January 10, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

What a bunch of self righteous folks you all are. I had my first child at a young age. Now, I realize that the pregnancy was mine to deal with and I did. Without the help of the taxpayers or my parents thank you very much. Yes, taxpayers do have to foot a lot of bills but the truth is we foot the bills of A LOT more adults than we do teenagers. Adults that refuse to work and keep popping babies out so the checks get bigger. Do I think teenagers need to be having babies?? No I don’t. Was I too young? Yes I was. But I had my child and I worked and I raised that child to the best of my abilities as most of these girls will hopefully do. And yes, I did get my GED, thank you Leigh for making that sound so trivial, I was very proud of myself that day just so you know. What you are all doing is assuming that you know not only the whole story but also the way it will turn out and you do not. If you honestly think that allowing pregnant teens in school or having in school daycare centers is going to make teens want to get pregnant than I would say that in most cases you are wrong! These teens will take one look at those girls being shunned by most of her “friends” and then also take a look at those screaming babies and think twice! If the “maternity leave” in any way costs the taxpayers or hinders the rest of the students then of course, it’s a dumb idea. But if it means this horrible, bad, loser of a teen Mom (not my opinion, what you all seem to think based on the above comments) has her child, bonds and sets up proper care and then finishes getting the education that MOST true welfare recipients never bothered to get then I applaude that girl and I go to bed at night knowing one more child in the world is safe , loved and has a bright future.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 9:51 AM | Link to this

steveo:

This may shock you, but I was GREAT at being a Southern Boy. I was having sexual experiences at TEN. I was a virgin until 16, but other stuff was happening much younger. After 16, about once every couple of years or so I got more ‘experience’. This happened until I met my wife, and we didn’t exactly wait until that night in Tampa to start.

Difference between me and teenage dads is that I was smart about it.

I like the analogy above: You can teach kids different ways to avoid cars, but if they jump in the road, eventually they WILL get hit.

Another example is speeding: Do it all the time, and eventually you’ll get caught. Doesn’t matter how ‘safe’ you are about it. Doesn’t matter how many strategies you know for not getting caught. The only way to absolutely know WITHOUT A DOUBT that there is NO WAY for you to get caught speeding is to not be speeding in the first place.

By Monica

January 10, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this

What idiots! They should be expelled for being a bad influence, negative influence, disruptive influence on the other students!!!

Would you rather they have an abortion?

Teenage girls who get pregnant still have a right to an education. In the state of Georgia, there is a program called “Hospital/Homebound.” Most new teen moms are enrolled in that so they can keep up with their studies at home while they adjust to motherhood. A teacher (already paid by the county) visits with hospital and homebound students about once a week to deliver, collect, and assist with assignments. There are a variety of reasons students go on H/H, from surgery to cancer to broken bones to pregnancy. Tax dollars are not wasted on a new teen mom.

I am saddened at the high rate of teen pregnancy, but I am even more saddened by the attitude and lack of compassion that is exhibited here today. Put yourself in the place of a teenage mom for just a few moments. How scary that must be! She made a mistake (like every other teenager) that has huge consequences, but that should not keep her from getting an education.

By FCM

January 10, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

@jeff—don’t EXPEL him, let him work after school instead of hanging with his friends/playing ball. The family he created needs him EDUCATED…I have no issue with continuing to educate the parents.

@steve-o—OK so I had sex at 19, in college, & before marriage, but I was very aware of the possible outcomes, fully discussed them with my partner and fully prepared to accept (although with 20-20 of hindsight I can say not fully prepared to ‘deal’) with them. Perhaps it is because of this I stopped having sex in my 20s and turned my life and thinking into another direction? Now at my present age, I would consider sex outside of marriage (admitted yesterday I had) but again, I am fully aware of what the consequences might bring and that I would have to deal with them. These kids are NOT looking at it that way, they see it as another mess and they are ‘just kids’….nope when you decided to drop your drawers you decided you were old enough to face the consequences….and yes, I am aware my children may have sex as teens (SCARY!!!!), it is something I pray about everyday…as well as educate them (and they are young) and advise against their doing.

@synhova—while I can agree with that having compassion for these people is the right thing, that does not mean we make it ‘easy’ to the point that they have no responsiblity. I applaude your MIL but would bet she is the first to say that teen pregnancy is not a good idea.

By Pen

January 10, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

Just wanted to say……not sure why my comment got posted that many time, computer error I suppose. Sorry about that. Carry on with your “witch hunt”

By Todd

January 10, 2008 9:59 AM | Link to this

As a teacher, I have seen pregnant freshmen and pregnant middle school students (when you have girls who are as young as 11 and guys who are 17 still at middle school here in Georgia—easily happens).

This homebound program is nonsense. People use and abuse it. I had a 9th grade student tell me once that she got pregnant solely to get welfare. We reward these girls for getting pregnant.

Should they be able to stay in school and take maternity leave? NO. They need to learn their lesson. The parents of these 11 and 12 year old girls walking around with a baby in their wombs need some punishment of their own.

These girls didn’t get pregnant by the married guy at the neighborhood party because your little girl was playing with dolls in her bedroom.

Stop rewarding these morons for getting pregnant—they then allow their kids to get pregnant in middle school.

By Monica

January 10, 2008 10:01 AM | Link to this

Okay, so you don’t want the girl to get a tax-provided education because she got pregnant and had a baby. I’ll agree to that only if the boy who got her pregnant is not allowed to attend school either.

By steve-o

January 10, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

Jeff & FCM,

Thanks for your stories…they were insightful and both of you made your points well.

My point is that in addition to teaching kids to wait, we should also have are kids prepared for the moment, because let’s face it, nobody knows exactly when it is. In that regard, it would be foolish not to teach kids about condoms and birth control.

Teens in Western Europe are just as sexually active as American teens, if not more—yet they have much lower teenage pregnancy rates. The reasons for this include the fact that sex isn’t as taboo in Europe as it is here and that they openly discuss and promote condom and birth control use.

By georgia peach

January 10, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this

yes katie, what FCM said is true. They already have high schools with day care. Matter of fact there were 2 high schools that had day care when i was in high school and that was 29 years ago. I don’t agree with it. I also do not agree with giving young ladies maternity leave. I can see it now, gone for 6 weeks and come back pregnant again!!! leave is not the answer. There is NO excuse for getting pregnant. There is free birth control given out everywhere, some schools dispense it, some pass out condoms. If they valued their lives they wouldn’t have unprotected sex!!!!

By Pro-choice

January 10, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this

This is a prime example why abortion needs to remain legal.

By Monica

January 10, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

There is NO excuse for getting pregnant.

There is also no excuse for hitting a teacher, but children who do this don’t have to quit school. There is no excuse for bringing a knife to school, but children who do this don’t have to quit school. There is no excuse for selling or taking drugs at school, but children who do this don’t have to quit school. They are sent to alternative school for a while. I would suggest an alternative school for pregnant girls and new moms, but then your tax dollars would fund it, so you wouldn’t like that either.

BTW, condoms are not 100% effective. Sometimes people who have protected sex can still get pregnant…trust me, I know!

By Monkey lover

January 10, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

PEN, you are absolutely correct, however, this blog is about maternity leave for teens—we’re not talking about useless adults. But I’d love to go off on that subject as well. —-ending thought—— If you have a voice you can work, if you have arms you can work—no excuses!!! 99% of people on welfare should not be, they should be forced to get a job.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 10:18 AM | Link to this

steveo:

Ever worked with a group of teenagers?

I have, in a variety of settings from alternative schools to mainstream schools to church Sunday School classes to even college classes. (I’ve been both a student and a tutor/teacher in each of those environments.)

Teens don’t pay a bit of attention to ANYTHING an adult says about sex ANYTIME it is brought up. Matter of fact, I can practically gaurantee you that a 13 yr old will learn more in 5 minutes talking to his 16yo best friends’s brother (the bro is 16, not the best friend, although that also happens!) than in sitting through 4 yrs of sex ed in high school.

Church is little better. At least there most of them know that if they make too much ruckus, the teacher will probably talk to their parents. And when I was growing up, you learned REAL quick you did NOT want that to happen!

By madisons mom

January 10, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this

I don’t think people should have to be kicked out of school if they get pregnant, I just don’t think it is the responsibility of the teacher or the school to change everything just to make it easier for the girl.

If parents were doing a better job of teaching their children instead of putting their heads in the sand and saying, “not my child” this discussion wouldn’t be as necessary.

Again, like I said, I am tired of catering to the lowest man on the pole instead of making the lowest man live up to high expectations.

By Pro-choice

January 10, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this

This is one of the reasons that it is imperative for abortions to remain a legal option.

By Dee

January 10, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this

Does anybody remember when a young girls biggest issue in High School was dressing out for gym class. I just find it amazing that the girls that are most likely to get pregnant are the ones that are already in a household where medicaid and welfare are a way of life. and these are the same young ladies that can go to the clinic and get birth-control and everything else for free. so I say HELL NO!!! to maternity leave for high school students, let them get their GED. Half won’t go to college anyway.

FCM- No heat darling, I agree with you 100%.

By Monkey lover

January 10, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

Actually, yes, I would prefer they have an abortion. Babies raising babies does not make this a better world. Teens aren’t capable of raising a child properly. Their children will probably never go to college. They are hurting us in the long run. They are a drain to society.

By One

January 10, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this

This is a prime example why abortion needs to remain legal. DITTO!!!!!!!!!!!! If they make a “mistake”, don’t let it continue, abort and move on!!! Then we won’t have a whole generation of knuckleheads born to teen moms and dads who are just knuckleheads themselves!!!!

Think about it, this (teen pregnanacy) was quite popular/regular in the early/mid to late 80’s………….now what do we have, a WHOLE generation of ignorant young adults (upper teens to lower/mid 20’s), who can’t seem to pull their pants up and speak proper english. Anybody see a connection here? Anybody?????????

By Chandsie

January 10, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this

I unfortunately became pregnant my Junior year. I was very fortunate that my school offered a Parenting Class. If enrolled in the cass you received FREE in-home child care from a State Lic. individual. I was given a list of homes and was allowed to choose the right one for me. They allowed for 4 weeks of leave time. I was ready to give birth by the time our Winter Break arrived, so I left like all the other students. I ended up having my child the day after Christmas. So my four weeks began then, I returned to school after my 6 weeks,I had 2 extra because of the break. All this allowed me to stay in school and receive my diploma. There were other girls in the class with me, but they still chose to drop-out. I didn’t ask for what happened, but I am glad I had the support. I think its only fair the the unborn babies that there be help for those students

By zynhova

January 10, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

Why is everyone still talking about trying to keep the damn horse in the barn????

You are ignoring the discussion topic which is how to handle things WHEN and IF the horse gets out of the barn.

Why does no one want to be prepared? We should be sophisticated enough to remain clear-headed to handle things when they go wrong. But that’s only possible by discussing the possibilities and how to solve them. There’s more to the solution than just making sure the barn door is locked!

By ANN

January 10, 2008 10:34 AM | Link to this

@ Jeed ** I agree with you. Maternity Leave will only encourage them to do it again and again and AGAIN at the expense of the tax payers !! Some parents strive so hard and do teach their children about sex, however, they take their hot tailed behinds out there and fall into pregnancy anyway! They fail to realize they are not ready emotionally, physically, or psychologically to deal with the care of a baby thereby putting many parents in the position of HARDSHIP ! Many of these teens and tweens feed themselves sex all day via porn, cable TV, sexually explicit videos right in their residences and where their friends live… you will become what you feed yourselves kids - now suck it up and stop blaming people for your wreckless behavior and KEEP YOU OWN KID (S) !!!

By steve-o

January 10, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

Jeff,

So if a teen doesn’t listen to anything that and adult says, by your reasoning, then why bother to teach abstinence only? Doing that is taking too large of a gamble and leaves them completely unprepared for the moment they choose to have sex. You have to prepare kids and teach them all of the ways to have safe sex. It works in Western Europe.

Bottom line is that kids will always have sex. It is utterly foolish and reckless to depend solely on teaching abstinence.

By FCM

January 10, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

@Monica—-who (other than Jeff’s comment to expel) said we don’t want to give them tax free education? Most everyone on the board has said that an education is what these parents need most…whether its a GED (I applaude PEN for getting hers she should be proud of it) or a diploma…it is where/how/when they are entitled to get it that we are questioning….Night school, homeschool, alternative school (is that the same as the first 2 I mentioned) repeating the semester they missed, private tutoring (paid by the granparents), the Homebound/Hospital bound, there is probably even an online option, programs are all valid and good options. These should be encourgaged and utilized. Baby factory welfare (multi birth no job/no education being sought) should be stopped….and penalizing parents (by stopping welfare)who are working (but barely make enough)should be stopped too. Compassion for the situation is one thing, but taking steps to accomadate it is a whole different ballgame. I fully believe that pregnant girls should ‘disappear’ into the aforementioned programs rather than walk the regular school halls.

No the teen Daddy should not be off scott free either…he should be at McDs or wherever earning money to pay the bills on that child, including the daycare.

By Pen

January 10, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Monkey lover: Thank you, I appreciate that but yes, I know what the blog is about. I was simply following along with the rant that everyone above me went off on. It is obvious that most of the people on here are very opinionated and although that is a wonderful thing and should be respected, I felt that having been a teen Mom myself that the teens that are actually trying deserved a voice. It is obvious to me that most people on this blog have never had to make a hard decision, mistake being the cause or not, because if they had, then they would understand. You are all right because you are saying what you believe. The problem……. what is right for the ones you are speaking for? I guess at this point all I can say is this, I hope none of you have a teen that becomes pregnant or gets another pregnant because most of you have shown the type of support (by this I mean emotional so PLEASE, do not start a rant about parents raising grandchildren, we ALL know that it happens) you would give and THAT is when we, the taxpayers, will be making up for your slack.

Thank you all and have a wonderful day!

By Katie

January 10, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this

Steve-O,you are right, teens will always have sex. But, they need to know that there are very harsh consequences if they do. For example, if society says that they cannot return to school, at least the teens will know in advance what the outcome will be. If they choose to have sex then they choose the consequence—simple as that. We baby our teens too much. We need to teach them that their actions do have consequences and they may be harsh ones.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

steveo:

Schools (government) need to get out of sex ed all together.

This is one area where it is CLEARLY the PARENT’s job.

By Jesse's Girl

January 10, 2008 10:56 AM | Link to this

Aaah. Remember the days when young boys and girls had a little shame for such things? I’m not saying they should be hissed at and have condoms and Bibles thrown at them…..but for the love of Trojan….can’t they show something other than prideful indignance at getting pregnant (or getting someone pregnant) in high school??!!! I find this just as insane as prisoners screaming about the injustice of no cable TV, weights, or books….and no, I’m not comparing the actions of the two parties, just the attitude. What happened was by choice. These girls chose to give their bodies away and they chose to see the pregnancy through. That is the joy of living in the USA….choice. Schools have the “choice” to not give MATERNITY LEAVE to pregnant teenagers. This really burns by biscuits. If GOD FORBID one of my daughters got pregnant as a child…cause’ thats what these girls are….I would not expect the school to do anything for her. And I would be hot if she had that expectation. It boils down to accountability. Life is about choices and there are consequences to everyone of them. This particular consequence is….you do not get special treatment if you get pregnant in high school. This is not a place of business with benefits….this is an educational institution. The end result is (hopefully) a diploma, not a benefits package.

By zynhova

January 10, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this

Jeff:

How is sex ed any different than art ed or science ed? Parents are not always the best equipped to teach certain subjects to their children.

I am a mathemetician. I can better teach my child math than his first grade teacher can. But I couldn’t do a better job teaching how to read and write than she can.

Why is sex ed so special? Is this because our society still views sex as something secret and shameful rather than a normal function of a human being?

Pregnant children should be assisted until they reach a level of self-sustainability.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this

Parents, by the very definition of the word, have enough experience with sex to be able to pass knowledge on to their children.

This in particular is the HIGHEST of intimate subjects and as such should NOT be taught by the government.

By FCM

January 10, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this

@zynhova — ans to the horse out of the barn:

1- As far as who should take care of the child while Mom is at school….that is NOT the schools role nor their concern, that is the ‘new’ grandparents worry—especially if Mom is not an emancipated minor. (my first post) 2.Perhaps home study, special courses, or even withdrawing from class and graduating late or making it up during summer school. (sue 8:1 post) 3.Take the whole nine weeks/semester, or YEAR off and come back the next year - repeating the grade level, of course. (jeed 9:12) post… There are answers in the first hour. The remaining posts reiterate that this is a compound issue: teach personal responsiblity up front, encourage no sex/safe sex at home & school, the families of the baby need to be held accountable (grandparents and parents—-and yes, I believe if they are not emancipated teens then regardless of whether the granparents like it or not they (granparent) should be held legally responsible for the baby—-they would be legally responsible for other actions that teen takes). Abortion was mentioned, and I personally favor adoption…but that is a WHOLE different can of worms that adds NO VALUE to this discussion.

Now what do you mean we are not addressing it?

By steve-o

January 10, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this

Katie,

I agree—we should absolutely teach the consequences of sex, both physical and emotional. However, “babying” our kids would be to naively preach “abstinence only” and “true love waits” while ignoring the fact that as maturing teenagers their bodies are changing.

If we wanted to really treat our kids as responsible young people, then we would teach them responsible behavior such as condom and birth control use in addition to abstinence.

Jeff,

Schools are places to learn—and yes, it is the school’s place to teach sex ed because it is reality. What place better for kids to learn about STD’s, pregnancy, and birth control than school. It’s up to parents to teach the emotional side of sex, as well as it’s place in regards to spirituality.

By Monica

January 10, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this

FCM, Katie at 8:08: As a tax payer, I want my dollars going to teaching kids English, Math, Science and History, not worrying about allowing girls to extend their education by 6 weeks or counceling teen mothers.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this

steveo:

Religion is also reality, yet schools in the US are banned from teaching it…

By FCM

January 10, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this

@Monica—that indicates Katie wants to educate them, just not counsel them.

By justme

January 10, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

It truly saddens me that people think that these problems with teen pregnancy only exist in lower class families. Truth of the matter is that theses issues are occuring at an alarming rate to teens from all classes and walks of life.

Who are any of you to condemn these kids or render the iron fist upon them. To all of you bloggers that believe explusion will cure the problem you’re in for a rude awakening. Not only will we have more uneducated teens, but it means that they will grow into uneducated adults. Which will come back to bite all of you hypocrites in your fannies.

There is no easy way to change the minds of teens and prevent them from exploring sexual options. No matter how much you talk to a teen about sex and the consquences that could follow doesn’t mean that they’ll take your advice. I wish that you people see there is no remedy to this problem.

Instead it’s a complete lifestyle change. Take it back to the time when movies featured on televison didn’t show sexual acts during the hours that children could even view them. Now there sex in cartoons, sex on the radio, sex topics on the magazine covers, and sex talk in the school, and don’t even mention the internet. What on earth did you think was gonna happen? This sex talk was gonna be ignored.. of course not. Now that the real culprits have found a way into lives of the lazy american people; we’ve managed to do what we do best blame others and look to other to cure this problem.

Don’t see you going after major networks askin them to pull Sex and the City off the air because teens may be viewing this show, or desperate housewives. Want to ruffle some feathers go after the ones who keep make this garbage available. Cozmo, and everyone else.Wake up America, take action against the real culprits not the children.

By Ann

January 10, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this

** @ PEN - Teen moms will always stick together. You all want sympathy for the “mistake” you made…Got news for you - taking your clothes off, getting in bed with someone you are not married to, getting pregnant for someone else to take care of YOUR child IS NOT A MISTAKE !!! Its called FORMICATION !!! Sex outside of MARRIAGE !!! Get it ! A mistake is accidentally picking up someone else’s sweater or something….stop calling your wreckless behavior a mistake - its fornication !!!

By steve-o

January 10, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this

Jeff,

Religion is reality to those who believe in it. It is not the school’s place to teach religion—especially when the school has students of man different faiths. However, it is the school’s job to teach human growth and development, biology, and anatomy. There are aspects about the human reproductive system, as well as aspects about phychological urges and impulses, that I would rather my kids learn in school.

By Matt

January 10, 2008 11:36 AM | Link to this

I think it is a great idea to offer maternity leave. If they girls don’t get the time off, truth is many drop out of school. That’s why around here some of the schools have daycare. They know that it will be more expensive if these girls drop out of school and become welfare moms. Then people will be b*** about that use of taxpayers money. It’s better for them to have a baby and a diploma then to have a baby and not have a diploma.

By Jill

January 10, 2008 11:36 AM | Link to this

If the mother- and father-to-be are both in school, both should temporarily drop out (or become homeschooled if that’s an available option) so they can prepare for having the child, have the child, and take an extra 6-8 weeks to get used to things and make daycare arrangements. If all that can be accomplished, then they can go back to school. If there is an option where parents can pick up their schoolwork, perhaps they could stay on pace to graduate. If not, they should be held back. Another option is not going back and getting GEDs.

By Jesse's Girl

January 10, 2008 11:40 AM | Link to this

I think, unfortunately, it is indeed very neccessary for sex ed to be taught in our schools. Its a sign of the times people….we can either take heed or get blindsided with the reality that is teen pregnancy. All of us will be affected in some way by this. Whether it is one of our sons or daughters that directly deals with it or one of their very close friends…or even one of our neices or nephews. You cannot get away from it. Like it or not, its a bitter pill that must be swallowed.

The problem is we have our PE teachers delving into health issues. At least in our public district they are required to teach a subject other than PE. Even when I was in school, this was the case. Most of these teachers do not take it seriously and the students certainly don’t. I would love to see former teenage mothers and fathers come in and speak to these classes…giving a real world view of what its like. Statistically, a great portion of today’s parents still have trouble speaking to their kids about sex and its consequences. If moms and dads can’t muster the courage to say ” Do not have vaginal, anal or oral sex. Getting pregnant is the very best outcome to hope for when messing around. You could get any number of STD’s; some of which lay dorment for years before waking up to kill you!”. But they also need to be taught that when the time is right…ie marriage…its a beautiful and satisfying experience.

By Monica

January 10, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this

FCM, I meant that someone who didn’t want tax dollars going to provide special services to teen moms probably wouldn’t support the idea of an alternative school for teen moms.

Another aspect of the issue is the graduation rate and Adequate Yearly Progress. By 2010, one of Georgia’s educational goals is to graduate 100% of its seniors each year in 4 years (which is absolutely ridiculous, btw). If girls who get pregnant drop out and then re-enroll, they become a statistic against the school. Also, attendance at school is mandatory until the age of 16. Legally, a 15-year-old teen mom can’t drop out of school. A 16 year-old who drops out can’t get his or her driver’s license until the age of 18. Forcing teen moms to drop out is sentencing them to welfare, since they would not legally be able to drive to a job.

In no way do I condone teen pregnancy or pre-marital sex. I just think that once the damage has been done, we do need to be more compassionate and accommodating to those who need help. I don’t think that it will be viewed as a reward system. I can’t imagine a girl getting pregnant on purpose because she can miss school for 6 weeks. She will still have to do the school work.

By Jeff

January 10, 2008 11:47 AM | Link to this

steveo:

Every single person out there has a religion. Even atheism is a religion.

Therefore, since religion is going to happen - it is a simple fact of life that everyone will have SOME form of religion - why shouldn’t schools teach it as well?

By Katie

January 10, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

Let me clarify. I am not a bible thumping abstinence preacher. I am a person who would like all people to accept personal responsibility for all their actions. And as I said, I want my tax dollars to go to teach Math, English (and how to properly speak it), History and Science. Not for counceling teen parents or about sex education. I want abortion offered as an option for these young pregnant women—having a child dramatically changes their life. At such a young age they aren’t even old enough to realize that choosing to keep a baby may not the best choice. I’m sick and tired of the wishy washy attitudes our society has picked up. You can be firm without using biblical terminology or practice.

By Old Physics Teacher

January 10, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this

We’re forgetting one simple thing. No one should care about maternity leave, paternity leave, extra vacations, etc. The children are supposed to ATTEND a certain number of days. They are supposed to LEARN very specific information. I personally don’t care if they ever come to school. That’s not my problem: that’s their parent’s and their problem. If the student can pass my test and not attend my classes, then either my test is too simple, or the student is that smart. Now the State of Geor