MOMania

By zombieboy

May 20, 2007 11:19 AM | Link to this

Better than ZOMBIES!!!

By Casey

May 21, 2007 7:54 AM | Link to this

Theresa, you ran a similar blog a few months ago. Did you have no new ideas for this blog and your deadline hit?

The last blog about leaving a 4 year old child alone was equally weak - obviously no one here would support that.

Please try and come up with some interesting and fresh material.

By Theresa

May 21, 2007 8:56 AM | Link to this

Casey— Since this column was based on news stories that have just come out it wasn’t done months ago. The leaving your kids alone blog was also based on current news events that have parents talking. Casey, if these topics don’t interest you, please feel free to do your reading and commenting some place else.

By abc

May 21, 2007 9:13 AM | Link to this

I volunteer for mentally handicapped adults. People with Down’s Syndrome are, to me, sweet and funny, and I count them among my friends. Most of all, they’re people.

By scott

May 21, 2007 9:50 AM | Link to this

Theresa,

I am pretty new to your blog and as a father I find it pretty interesting and funny. One topic I would like to see if you have not done it in the past is the topic of nannies. My wife and I now have our second child and she does not want to go back to work until we have her preferred choice of childcare; a nanny.

I am steadfast against it so of course she is still at home. Our daughter is in a school setting that I am comfortable with and they know our family. I just believe in having extra sets of eyes in a public place is better than having someone in my home with a child who can not speak for themselves.

Secondly, my wife tells me, I have not done the research, that nannies are hired by agencies and only cost @ $250 a week. I find this hard to believe someone will take a job for only $1000 a month plus room and board.

So can you or your regular readers share your opionions or insights on having a nannie? Am I being too overprotective and outdated or is having a nanny becoming the norm; several of our friends have or had them. ( I noticed also that each of them went through two or three)

Thanks

By Ms. Jones

May 21, 2007 9:52 AM | Link to this

Thank you Theresa. Casey is a troll and never contributes to these topics…I really even doubt she has kids.

I know not to bite when I see her name. And I warned other posters too.

By jls

May 21, 2007 10:25 AM | Link to this

At the rate the current administrations are going at both the state and national level, this debate will be moot in a few years anyway, because we won’t be able to have an abortion.

By Robin Hall

May 21, 2007 10:27 AM | Link to this

Dear Theresa, I don’t always read your column, but this week’s “Prenatal testing: Will only the perfect survive?” caught my eye. Sometimes, I think we ask the wrong questions. Who decides what is perfect? Is any person really born perfect? What is our motivation for bringing children into the world? These are the questions we must ask ourselves when debating this subject. My opinion is that all human life is valuable, not perfect. God designed each one of us. Am I greater than God? Do I know better than God? NO, NO, NO! There is nothing wrong with prenatal testing in itself as it can prepare us for what is to come. But used to make a decision to abort(kill) a baby is horrid! I teach 4 yr old Sunday School and have had the privilege to teach 2 children with Down’s Syndrome. Though sometimes difficult, they brought joy and empathy to the students and teachers in the class. We must face the fact that life is not easy, nor is it perfect. If someone wants an “easy” or “perfect” life, they should not have children, for none are easy or perfect!

By Jess

May 21, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this

Scott, I don’t know a whole lot about nannies because I am not a parent. However, my uncle and his wife have a nanny for their 3 children. I believe she is hired through an agency and receives around $150 - $200 per week plus room and board. The agency they go through provides trained nannies from overseas. The downside is their nanny is only there for a year…so each year they get a new girl. The first was from Brazil, the second from Czech Republic and the current one is from Germany. The children have adapted well to all of them and I believe the service is like a match.com service. The girls have web profiles through the agency and the parents can email them and find out more.

By Theresa

May 21, 2007 10:34 AM | Link to this

Hey Scott — I will try to run a nanny topic this week or next week.

hey Robin — I think you’re right — who is perfect - no body and that’s the point. Where would it stop? What imperfections would be allowed to exist? Everybody is flawed in some way.

By Jess

May 21, 2007 10:39 AM | Link to this

Also, it is good to know there are safer testing procedures coming available. My BF’s mother went through an amnio when she was pregnant, apparently a standard procedure back in the mid-70’s for pregnant women. He was “hit” with the needle in his lower back and this has caused stunted growth in his left foot and a slight deformation. I don;t have children yet, but that scared the heck out of me.

By Kerry

May 21, 2007 10:47 AM | Link to this

I can’t imagine aborting a child because you found out they have Down’s. The majority of Down’s Syndrome people are regular functioning people. Some eventually live on their own (or at least in a home with others like them)and many hold jobs. I could maybe understand if the diability was going to be one in which the child would be condemned to a wheelchair with no motor function at all and had to be fed by tubes and wear diapers for the rest of their lives. I’m pro-choice but the thought of aborting your child because it won’t be exactly the way you think it should be, makes me sick to my stomach.

By Shaye Breed

May 21, 2007 11:09 AM | Link to this

Have any of you lived with a child with Down’s syndrome? It’s easy to criticize the hypothetical decisions of others when you have not had to deal first-hand with the reality. My nephew has Down’s, and while he is a wonderful child and I would never consider him not worthy of life (which is ultimately where these arguments must inevitably lead), I also do not know if I could do what my brother has done.

Since my husband and I are considering having a child (and I am approaching 33 already), we have sat down and had a heart-to-heart about just what we would do in many situations and when/if we would abort (anencephaly? no doubt… severe mental disability… not sure). It is a vast gray area and ultimately only each individual (as with abortion in general) can make for him/herself what is never an easy a decision. There is a huge difference between “not perfect” and severely disabled which I don’t think some of you get.

By Richard

May 21, 2007 11:14 AM | Link to this

Um, Theresa, hate to say it but I’ve got to agree with part of what Casey said.

You did hit on this topic a couple months ago - about whether or not you should do all the testing available for a pregnant woman and would you want to know all of that information - would negative information lead you to have an abortion.

Also, for the leaving the kids alone blog: you asked if it was okay to leave kids alone. As you could tell from the response, it was a no-brainer “no.” Not much thought needed there.

Guess now you’ll tell me to get lost too.

By Dawn

May 21, 2007 11:18 AM | Link to this

My daughter just happens to have Down syndrome and she is just wonderful and she is worth living. I really liked your article about “only the perfect being allowed to survive”. We as a society need to talk more about this issue. This is much more that just prolife prochoice issue…this goes much further I think…this goes to the heart of prejudice, discrimination, tolerance and acceptance of diversity. Sometimes I feel like America is slipping into a new kind of Nazism….where we only want perfection.

Check out this winner of the Smithsonian’s portrait contest.-

http://www.portraitcompetition.si.edu/exhibition/PeoplesChoiceAward/EntryDetails.aspx?RID=25

By celloraisen

May 21, 2007 11:25 AM | Link to this

This was a hot topic between my husband and I a few months ago. I am now 32 weeks pregnant and I turned down the testing offered in about my 20th week to test for defects such as Downs. My husband was very mad at me at the time. He thought that if there is a test for it, why not have it? Let’s make sure everything is okay! And my position was and is this - if the outcome of a test could lead to us to more tests and to making the decision to end a pregnancy, I don’t even want to get on that bus if that’s where it would go! And what if we got a false positive?? Why would I want that added stress and worry during a time I want to and do enjoy?? It also makes me wonder how many women choose to abort when there really wasn’t anything wrong? If there is something “wrong” with the baby I am carrying now, I’m going to find out anyway… AFTER he is born.

By Casey

May 21, 2007 11:28 AM | Link to this

A bunch of “holier-than-thou” types in here. As Shaye Breed said, until you’ve actually lived with the situation, you don’t know anything. Anything. Living with a Down’s child is a massive amount of work. Obviously, you love the child, but nothing can prepare you to totally give up your lives for that child. That’s right - give up your lives.

Kerry - you are so far off base you’re not even in the ballpark. You stated: “The majority of Down’s Syndrome people are regular functioning people.” That is a flat-out lie. The majority never live outside of their parents home. What do you think happens to them when their parents eventually die?

My sister has a Down’s baby (8 years) and since she’s local, I see how much she works and suffers for him. Yes, she loves him and would never think of hurting him. But I also know that she often reflects on how much more her life (and her husband’s) could have been. I haven’t seen her truly happy in years. They have two other children (older) and those children didn’t have much of a childhood - never getting all the attention they deserved and having to do more than their fair share of taking care of their brother.

Course Ms. Jones, I’m just a troll and my thoughts aren’t worth spit to people like you. So just ignore this - I’m sure your opinion on the topic is much more valid and correct than mine.

By Teachermom

May 21, 2007 11:32 AM | Link to this

I had the NT scan with this pregnancy since I am over 35. I did not intend to abort, simply to decide if I should do more invasive testing such as CVS or amnio. To me the knowledge of a disability would simply allow me to be mentally prepared for what the future could bring. Many women who get results warranting more invasive testing do not intend to abort unless the baby is diagnosed with a disability such as Trisomy 18 which is incompatible with life. I see no problem with aborting a child who will probably die in utero and definitely within days of birth. Most people who are educated enough to know about the testing are also educated enough to know the difference between a disability and a death sentence.

By Elizabeth

May 21, 2007 11:42 AM | Link to this

I do not want to raise a disabled child. If I gave birth to a disabled child, I would give it up for adoption. If I had the option of aborting, I would do so. If you want to raise a disabled child, then you are welcome to do so. But don’t judge me or anyone else for choosing otherwise. Remember, “Judge not lest you be judged?” Mind your own business!

By Theresa

May 21, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this

hey Richard you know what — I will tell you to blow off since you’re actually Casey just using a different log in — we’re not stupid and we can tell who’s writing — Casey I am happy for you to contribute if you have something constructive to say (your last entry was constructive - albeit I doubt it’s actually true!) I know people use lots of different log ons to protect their identities however you don’t just have different log ons — you have different personalities. I don’t believe anything you or your alter egos say so I don’t want to engage in any type of debate with you. I don’t believe you are sincere in what you write, and I think you are just here to intimidate other contributors. Do you work? Do you have anything else going on in your life? I can’t imagine having the time to create this large cast of characters that you have — you really should head to Hollywood and least get paid for your hard work!

By Teacher's Kid

May 21, 2007 12:11 PM | Link to this

As a Registered Dietitian, one prenatal test that I would DEFINITELY recommend is for Gestational Diabetes! It is typically done around the 27th week or earlier for women who had it in a previous pregnancy. It involves taking a fasting blood glucose level, then drinking a glucose drink called Glucola (I recommend the orange flavor—it’s like a strong orange soda)and then having your blood glucose drawn at 3 intervals afterward. Fortunately, for most women who are diagnosed with Gestational Diabetes, it can be controlled through diet alone and typically resolves itself after delivery, although you are at increased risk for Type 2 diabetes later on. By keeping blood glucose levels under control, it can help to prevent complications in the infant, such as hypoplastic heart syndrome. If you have been diagnosed with Gestational Diabetes, I highly recommend working with a Registered Dietitian who has the credentials CDE after their name. This means that they are a Certified Diabetes Educator and have had to log 2000 hours of clinical diabetes education and sit for a board exam. To find a Registered Dietitian in your area, log on to www.eatright.org and click on “Locate a Nutrition Professional”. There are several RD, CDE professionals in the Atlanta area. Food for thought.

By Ms. Jones

May 21, 2007 12:16 PM | Link to this

Elizabeth You poor, poor baby. I would think that if God gave you a disabled baby, there would be a reason for it. But to flat out state that you would put a less than perfect baby up for adoption or abort it is ludicris. You have no idea what you will feel when the baby you have been carrying inside you for 9 months comes out. You will love that baby more than life itself. But with that attitude, I would not recommend getting pregnant any time soon!!!!

And Casey, I’m with Theresa you have nothing worthwhile to contribute, and you are probably making up the story about your nephew. If it is true, why aren’t you helping your sister, since she gave up her life. Guess what, I gave up life as I knew it when my child was born. It’s a life changing event……

By Casey

May 21, 2007 12:19 PM | Link to this

How dare you Theresa! I wrote a serious - and sincere - comment about my sister. Who the he11 do you think you are here? Just a 2-bit “writer”. Since I have a different opinion from yours, you think mine doesn’t matter? Who made you God?

I didn’t write as Richard and you are one pathetically, miserable woman to ever write what you did about me. And yes, I do work - from home, which allows me access to the computer. Think you’re the only one who can write from home.

You have no soul and should be ashamed of yourself.

By Casey

May 21, 2007 12:26 PM | Link to this

Ms. Jones - I do help my sister. I told you she’s local and I watch her son at least 3 or 4 times a month when she just has to get out.

You gave up your life for your child?!?! Again, you spit on all mothers who have special needs babies. You didn’t give up your life like my sister has, or other mothers have. Do you get to go out with friends? Have alone time? Lead a normal life? Then don’t you dare say you gave up your life for your child. When your child’s 20, they’ll be out of the house. Cody will be with my sister when he’s 30 - 40 - 50 years of age.

You people should be ashamed of yourselves.

By Theresa

May 21, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this

Dear Casey — You better make sure that Richard didn’t steal you’re computer then because amazingly he has the IP address as you! Casey - have you never heard the story of the little boy that cried wolf? —you’ve contributing so many false things under so many false names that we have no idea what to believe — Good day to you sir or madam - I am done talking with you.

By Ms. Jones

May 21, 2007 12:34 PM | Link to this

Casey, Casey, Casey what can I say, those of us who frequent this blog, never get one bit of useful information from you. Now you want us to actually believe your story? Sorry, we aren’t buying it.

Do you know the story about the boy who cried wolf? He cried, and cried wolf, but no one believed him. Then one day a wolf actually was there, and no one believed the boy, because he was lying all the time. You are now the Girl who cried Wolf……

If you don’t like Theresa’s “2-bit” writing, may I suggest you take a good look in a mirror…..

By DB

May 21, 2007 12:37 PM | Link to this

At 34, back in the Dark Ages (1991), I was upset when my doctor strongly recommended pre-natal testing for a couple of issues, because there was no family history of the condition and even if the test was positive, it would not change my mind regarding continuing with the pregnancy. His response was very reassuring and, I thought, very sensible: “I’m not suggesting these tests so that you have to decide whether or not to have an abortion. I’m suggesting these tests because of your age, and because if there IS a problem, I want to make sure that we have every specialist on God’s earth ready and waiting when it’s born in order to make sure it has the best possible start.” That sounded reasonable to me.

However, I can see where such testing would be tempting for those parents who think they cannot stomach the 365/24/7 lifetime commitment some of these disabilities require. I believe that God does not send us any task that we are not up to, but I also recognize that that’s easy for me to say — I’ve been blessed with two inordinately healthy children.

It’s a slippery slope, for sure. When they start identifying intelligence genetic markers, do some Type-A parents start aborting those that aren’t in the upper 5% percentile? Does that eliminate artistic geniuses, or just leave us with those that can do upper-level math?

Life is such a crazy-quilt of people, with all different abilities and talents. We all bounce off of each other during the course of our life, and for the most part, are made richer by the experience. I’d hate to think that such testing would reduce the inherent differences in favor of what we, as imperfect humans, perceive as “perfect”.

By Lisa

May 21, 2007 12:42 PM | Link to this

Theresa, You have a successful blog that is also full of interesting information. If it wasn’t- it wouldn’t be on the AJC home page. There are always going to be the “Caseys” of the world, who for reasons that have nothing do with you - are bitter, angry or jealous or D all of the above. Don’t even waste your energy responding to them. Whether people agree with what you are writing or not - it makes readers think - and obviously fires them up!!!! — And that’s what matters. Blog on Girl!

By Brian

May 21, 2007 12:42 PM | Link to this

Casey, you’re a subhuman idiot that doesn’t know anything. You can’t even refer to your sister’s child as your niece.

Your sister is also an idiot that doesn’t deserve ANY child if all she can do is reflect on how life “could have been” instead of how life is. What if your niece had been born without DS, but developed MS or leukemia at age 2? Would you recommend to kill her because of the burden?

Apparently, your family suffers from its own form genetic imperfection— selfishness. Maybe you and your sister should have been terminated so your niece could have been born into a more compassionate family.

My 5-month old daughter has DS. We knew at 21 weeks gestation. I think it is good to know in advanced in order to deal with it, so you can be ready to take care of your child when born. I wouldn’t call it a blessing or a a curse. It’s called being a parent.

Obviously, no one wants a child that is anything other than “perfect”, whatever that is—but you get what you get. It’s how we react to situations like this that shows our humanity.

Not all children born with DS have health issues or require anything more than loving parents. We’ve been lucky in that regard so far. Unfortunately, there are some that will have a life of never-ending health issues…but so could ANY “perfect” child.

By DB

May 21, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this

Elizabeth, my heart hurt when I read your post about putting a child with a handicap up for adoption, with the blythe assumption that such a child WOULD be adopted, and not doomed to spend their life in an institutional setting receiving minimal care and no love. If that is what you feel is acceptable for such a child, then please, go ahead and abort them, because the alternative is so much worse, IMHO.

Life has no guarantees. You might have a perfectly healthy child who ends up with a life-changing illness or injury. So, when that child ends up a quadriplegic after an automobile accident, are you going to put them up for adoption? When the child is diagnosed with cancer, and is given only a year to live, are you going to wash your hands of them? Of course not, because you are already committed and involved.

One can try to avoid emotional trauma, but it will always be with you, in some form or other, for the rest of your life — assuming that you have a soul and a conscience. The decision as to whether you can live with that is, ultimately, one that only you can make.

By parent of 4

May 21, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this

I had my first child at the age of 21. Everyone said WHOOA that is early to start a family. When I turned 30 I was sad that I was entering into a new era which I would never give birth. Now that I am approaching 34 and people are considering that OLD in giving birth, and start the new testing.

Really when is the best age to give birth. All that to say, I was young and scientifically I guess they believed that amnio and all that was not necessary. But I did have to go through a boat load of test to make sure the pregnancy and development was normal. I even had to take 2 AIDS test (one in the begining of the pregnancy and one at birth). Although I knew there was not a chance that I had AIDS I took all the test they suggested. Just to know if there was anything wrong. I liked being prepared.

I had Church members over this weekend and their child had Autism. I am hearing alot more about Autism nowadays. Sweet child, but a constant handful. The parents never get a break (because it would mess up his routine) and the mother is visably tired. That child will have a special place in her heart, but it takes a special person to raise a special needs child CORRECTLY. Preparation with that is better than thinking your child is normal with his growth and then finding out at a late age that there are problems. When you find out a child’s mental condition young you may be able to help the brain use the other parts and have a semiproductive child.

By Teacher's Kid

May 21, 2007 1:06 PM | Link to this

A-men DB! Having worked with people with special health care needs at Brook Run when it was still in existence and at the Sparks Clinics in Birmingham, Alabama, I saw cases of Mental Retardation at Brook Run that ranged from the severe to the profound. Interestingly enough, quite a few cases of severe brain injury that I saw were due to near-drownings and near-poisonings. At the Sparks Clinics, I worked with several children with special health care needs at Sparks that would require specialized (and expensive!) care for the rest of their lives. Kudos to the parents who can and do take care of these people, but please do not curse those who decide to abort after receiving the news from the doctor that their child may be severely disabled or disfigured. It is a very difficult decision to make and not taken lightly. I think we’re all going to need to agree to disagree on the issue of abortion, since obviously we’re not going to resolve it in this forum!

By Scarlett

May 21, 2007 1:18 PM | Link to this

Theresa thank you for today’s topic. I am just about 16 weeks pregnant and recently had the new procedure, Ultrascreening, to test for Down’s. Although I am on the borderline for recommended testing, my husband and I decideded to have the procedure anyway. It was a piece of cake. All that was required was a small prick in the finger and an ultrasound.

We have been trying to conceive for the past two years. It’s been hard for us. We have been truly blessed with this child. We just want to make sure that he or she is healthy. We also wanted to be prepared in the event that he or she is born with any abnormalities.

I don’t believe that any parent should be criticized for deciding to terminate a pregnancy for health complications. It is a personal decision that they alone have to reconcile in their hearts. Not everyone has the capacity to care for a special needs child.

By Ms. Jones

May 21, 2007 1:37 PM | Link to this

Dawn I bet your daughter is beautiful. How old is she?

I have met numerous people/children with Down’s, and I think they are the most beautiful people. My youngest niece has a friend who has Down’s. She loves that girl, and they have so much fun together. She invited her to her last birthday party, and every one fell in love with that child. She was so sweet. She kept going around and kissing and hugging all the adults, even though she didn’t know any of them. But she had plenty of love to give, and she got it all back that day. I’ll never forget that birthday party.

DB Love you 12:49 post……Very well said!! I hope you opened Elizabeth’s eyes…..

By me again

May 21, 2007 2:14 PM | Link to this

Hmmm…making it legal to murder because someone is not born the way you want them to be?

Can that apply to others as well? lol

This boils down to selfishness. Your child is yours ON LOAN. YOUR life isn’t even yours. Making the decision to choose who is or isn’t born is too much like playing God.

By Jennifer

May 21, 2007 2:28 PM | Link to this

I had the testing done and don’t regret it. I’m glad I have my childbearing years behind me because being pregnant and dealing with the “What ifs” was pretty stressful. Until you have the baby in your arms you will worry about their development and general health. I was glad to have the small reassurances of negative AFP’s, clear ultrasounds, etc. I would rather be prepared and educated on my unborn child’s conditions, regardless of if I would choose to continue or terminate the pregnancy.

By Mom of Two

May 21, 2007 2:48 PM | Link to this

It’s amazing to see the judgement coming from people who have never experienced life raising a severely disabled child.

My best friend’s child was severely brain damaged at birth. The doctors fought long and hard to keep him alive instead of letting him go in peace. While that allowed my friend to have 18 months with her child, it was 18 months of caring for a child 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with only a few hours relief in the total 18 months. It aged her tremendously. The baby could not swallow so his mouth had to be suctioned 24 hours a day. Of course, he couldn’t eat so that meant feeding him through a tube in his nose and eventually directly into his stomach. He would never hold his head up or roll over, much less walk. She had a spreadsheet to keep up with the medications. All that’s just the tip of the iceberg.

Thankfully, she was already a stay-at-home Mom so there wasn’t a loss of a second income. However, the financial drain was extreme. This hurt the entire family, including the older child they already had. They also could not give the older child the attention he deserved. You can’t go anywhere as a family when the baby has to be suctioned constantly, fed through a tube every couple of hours, and can’t sit in a carseat. You can’t leave a baby with those extreme medical needs with someone who doesn’t know exactly what to do. You can’t focus your attention on the older child when you are exhausted and are constantly listening and watching for the signs that your baby needs life or death attention. You have no privacy since there is a parade of therapists in your home - at least 1 every weekday. At some point, Medicaid and other assistance prgrams step in and cover some of the expenses. That means that all of us paid for the several million dollars it took to care for that baby from birth until 18 months.

My friend and I have had several discussions about whether the 18 months of constant struggle and work - and the years afterwards of straightening out all the medical bills - was worth it. It’s a hard call for her to make. As painful as it would have been to lose a child at birth, it was that much more painful to lose him after 18 months. There was never any hope of him getting any better. It was a short, painful life for the baby and 18 months of an emotional and physical drain for the family.

As for the Down’s situation. I have a family member with Down’s, a friend with a Down’s child and another with an adult Down’s sibling. Whomever stated that Down’s children/adults lead close to normal lives is way off base. There may be a select few who are highly functioning enough to get a job and live in a group home, but that is not the norm. For the most part, it’s repeated surgeries and constant therapies. For the most part, they never metally age past a young child. There is overwhelming fear of what will happen to the child (adult) when the parents die - especially if there are no siblings to take care of the Down’s family member.

With one of the families, there was already a stay-at-home Mom. With the other 2, the mother had to quit her job to be able to properly care for the Down’s child. That meant a significant decrease in income at the same time expenses took a significant increase. Down’s children are much more expensive to take care of than an average child. Again, Medicaid and other assistance programs kick in so the rest of us get to help pay for the millions of dollars it takes to sustain a Down’s child through adulthood. Where I live, a Down’s child who is highly functioning enough to be mainstreamed into public schools will cost the taxpayers about $60-70K per school year. They enter the public school system as soon as they have their 4th birtday. Compare this with the average child who cannot start Kindergarten unless they are 5 by Sept 1 and the average cost per child per school year of $6-8000, and the taxpayers are footing a pretty big bill for someone else’s decision to be an older parent and to someone else’s decision to give birth to a disabled child.

Is it all about money? Certainly not. But, the wear and tear on the families of a Down’s child is huge. I’ve seen it first hand. I’ve seen the pressure and the guilt and the stress and the sacrifices and the financial drain ruin one marriage and come close to ruining another. It’s a lifetime of raising a child who will never grow up.

Whomever made the correlation between knowingly giving birth to a disabled child and having a child later become ill or disabled, there is no comparison. None of us makes the choice to be in an accident or to develop cancer. But, it is a choice to give birth to a child who will never have a chance at normal life.

By catlady

May 21, 2007 2:54 PM | Link to this

This is an intensely PERSONAL decision. I wonder if any bloggers have had much experience with very special needs children. If they had, they would also be aware of the terror that parents feel when they realize their totally dependent child will need care long after they (parents) are dead. It isn’t just the here and now of enjoying the special child, but worrying about the kind of treatment that child will be subjected to when there is no one left to care for them. I have known some parents to take a chance and have a sibling for the disabled child, with the idea that the sibling can take over the parental role when the parents are dead. Is that fair to the sibling?

By kristin

May 21, 2007 3:07 PM | Link to this

Well said Mom of Two. All I have heard so far is thump, thump, thump of the Bible.

By landsaf

May 21, 2007 3:12 PM | Link to this

You know, raising a special needs kid is difficult. Making the decision to actually go forward with raising a special needs kid is also difficult. Yes, these kids are beautiful and wonderful in their own way, but wouldn’t you want what was best?

If a person chooses not to raise a special needs kid, so be it. I choose to not risk it as well. But I also choose not to have children all together. I don’t want to subject a normal child to the societal maniac kids of today, nor would I want to subject a special needs child to the same thing. Actions of Parents and kids these days sealed that decision for me long ago.

BTW, yes I am very familiar with living with and helping raise a special needs child. He is a joy in my life.

By JJ

May 21, 2007 3:41 PM | Link to this

landsaf While you have made the decision not to have kids, I believe you will one day regret that decision. Yes kids are tough to raise and ALOT of very hard work, but it the the hardest job you will ever love.

I often feel bad for those who chose not to have children, as they will never feel unconditional love.

I had a friend who did not want kids at all. She said she worked way to hard and did not want to “share” her life with anyone, especially a kid. She said she didn’t want work 40 hours a week, to spend money on a kid, and wanted it all for herself. I think that is very selfish. She is now a very lonely 50 year old woman….

I think people who chose to remain childless, are often selfish. Of course, I can see both sides of the argument, but I for one could not image going through life without my daugther, even as a single parent!!! And I thank god every day my parents chose to have kids, or else I wouldn’t be here.

By Teacher's Kid

May 21, 2007 4:18 PM | Link to this

JJ, please do not criticize landsaf’s decision not to have children and call her selfish or tell her that she may regret that decision. One of my best friends from high school told me that her mother told her to her face that if better contraception were available in the early 1970s, she would not have had children. Which is worse? She did not criticize your decision to have children. The decision to have a child or not is a very personal one and she decided what would be best for her just as you decided what would be best for you.

By SD

May 21, 2007 4:22 PM | Link to this

JJ I know several very happy and well adjusted adults who do not have children. I think having a child is a very personal choice for the individual. On the flip side, I know many parents who are very lonley.

By abc

May 21, 2007 5:01 PM | Link to this

Frankly, if I knew what it was going to be like when they were teenagers, I’d have thought twice or three times about having kids. Four or five even.

By Jane

May 21, 2007 5:25 PM | Link to this

Casey: I know you make valid points-I realize that you do not name your nephew because you also feel a great deal of pain for your sister and your nephew.
I have a wonderful brother-in-law that is currently living on his own will in a group facility. He will never mentally be older than 12 years old. He is one of my favorite people he has a way about him that is a joy to be around and he has more common sense than most college graduates. Don’t give up on your nephew just yet. You may have to try longer with your nephew and you may feel that you are getting no where fast. But you are. These special individuals understand and freely give love—unconditionally. Most of us can not say that—honestly. They believe in those around them to do the right thing and it never enters their mind to do something wrong. Teach them in a loving manner and they will learn. I was also fortunate enough to live next door to a downs syndrome young lady when I was little. We had such fun playing, her house had a huge silver slide in the backyard—the type you see on playgrounds in parks, we would slide, play in the garden hose, catch fireflys, dodgeball, kickball, red light, green light etc. - and I didn’t realize till I was older that she was different and by then it really didn’t matter—she was my friend. As I got older she would bring books outside that her brother had left at home when he got married. Yes, she was 25 years old at the time I was 10 years old. I read the “Hardy Boys” mysteries outloud to her every afternoon after school. After I finished those her brother bought her the Nancy Drew series and I read those to her. I gained a huge vocabulary and the gratitude of her family. I didn’t stop being her friend because I grew up and realized she wasn’t like everybody else she was different but that didn’t change who she was to me. I will not name her either because to do so would cheapen then memory.

When we first started playing her mother hovered and I never understood why—but as she started to trust me not to be MEAN or say something that would HURT her daughter’s feelings (yes they do get their feeling hurt badly—and they can’t say correctly what’s wrong which only makes it worse). Then she would let my friend outside to wait for me to get home from school—I always arrived the same time every day. She knew that I would go inside change clothes, do my homework and be outside by 3:30 to 4 pm. She would wait for me. This gave her mom time to fix dinner for her family without interruptions and also let my mom cook without interruptions. After dinner in the summertime she would come over and we would catch fireflys and our parents would talk on the front porch of our house or on the patio at her house. If I was going to the Dr. I let her know the day before that I would be late. If I knew the time I would be home I told her this let her know that I would be back and she was not being deserted.

It is hard work, yes sometimes it is extrodinarily hard but we all live life one day at a time. We are here for a purpose and we will all meet a variety of people that will change our lives and how we view the world. The choice is ours— is it half full or half empty. If you want to see your sister on the half full side—take your nephew a couple more days a month. Encourage other family members to help, get the older sibling to do something with the child everyday at the same time for 30 minutes to an hour and build from there. You will find your sister feeling happier, your older nephew feeling happier, your younger nephew being happier and most importantly you will be happier because you made it happen.

By Rachel

May 21, 2007 9:15 PM | Link to this

When I had my ultrasound at 20 weeks for my daughter (second pregnancy) I found out that she had a very rare disorder. It caused her brain to not develop correctly. What had developed was malformed and part of it was just missing. The prognosis was not good. Chances were good that she would not make it to birth. If she did, there was only a 10 percent chance that she would live to see her first birthday. If she survived into childhood she would probably never even be able to sit up much less be able to walk or talk. There was also a strong possibility that she would have to be fed through a tube. These are just a few of the problems that we were told that she would have. My husband and I spend days talking about what we should do but in my heart I knew that there was no way I could have an abortion. This was my child and I could not just get rid of it. It was a very personal decision and I would never judge anyone for making a decision different from mine. Continuing the pregnancy knowing what the likely outcome would be was one of the most difficult things I have ever done. As my due date got closer strangers were constantly asking when I was due, was it a boy or girl, etc. Everyone wants to talk to you when you are pregnant. It was very difficult to answer them without bursting into tears. My daughter was born at full term via c-section but lived for only 12 hours. We got to hold her and spend time with her. Her brother and all of her grandparents got to meet her as well. I will never regret my decision to have her because even though we only had her briefly, she is my daughter and I love her very much and I’m glad we got the chance to meet her. Some people might think it is wrong to knowingly bring a child into the world that has very little hope of living a “normal” life but my question is this…what if the doctors had been wrong? They CAN make mistakes and miracles can happen. I don’t regret my decision and would never judge anyone else for any decision they might make in the same situation. So back to the original topic. I think the prenatal testing is a good thing. I am glad I knew what was wrong with my daughter because it gave us the chance to prepare ourselves for what was likely going to happen. We were also able to make more informed decisions about her care in the minutes immediatly after her birth. With the advances in testing some people might make the decision to abort if the baby isn’t what they think it should be but there are also people who will use the information to help themselves prepare for their special needs child and that can only help their child in the long run.

By Jane

May 21, 2007 11:05 PM | Link to this

During my first pregnancy I was given every test known at the time—I had weekly ultrasounds—yes weekly and that was when you had to drink a ton of water and wait. My first child was born in 1978. I understand that the testing isn’t as bad now. I was considered a high-risk pregnancy due to medical issues of my own—I have elipsey. I was also put on bed rest for the last two months of the pregnancy because I had not gained one ounce during the pregnancy—let me tell you laying flat of your back unable to get up to go to the restroom is not only aggrevating, annoying, irritation inducing but I packed on 55 pounds. My Doctor (Thaddeous B. Gaylord) may I never lay eyes on him again. He also insisted on an amnino (I do not like this test and I would not recommend it to anyone) My wonderful doctor forgot to mention that if the needle hit my unborn baby that I would no longer have an infant to bring home. He put 6 needles in the first time and got nothing—he quit trying when I passed out. The second time he tried he got a little amnionic fluid—turned out I had an apron placenta—at least the baby was safe. I eventually went into labor 3 time and they stopped it. then they induced me for 3 days and put c-section paperwork in the chart (again, no one mentioned it to me) On my last day of induction as they were taking me downstairs again I was given the chart—I opened it and saw the paperwork and lost it—I was in the Phillipine Islands and on a Military base with my husband. the base commander had the nurses call my parents for me to talk to and see if they could calm me down. I had the C-section. My wonderful Dr. informed me it would take months to get the weight off because I gained so much—I lost 33 pound of the weight the day my son was born—no one could believe it. Testing is fine when the patient is given the facts and can make an informed decision. Knowledge is power!

By lose this blogger

May 22, 2007 7:50 AM | Link to this

Theresa, sorry, but Casey is right. A lot of these topics are ‘last minute,’ it seems, or ones just put up to make a deadline. It isn’t hard to find an article in the paper, and then write, “So what do you all think?” That’s not hard! I think she/he was saying to come up with original topics! Maybe a few GOOD topics every now and then would be better than a weak new topic every day or two, or however it works now.

That being said, with your little fight, I think you - the blogger - are the most immature here! You are an employee of AJC, and you’re supposed to stand up and be the ‘bigger’ person here whenever this happens. However, you log on as the blogger, and then fight w/ meaner, more immature words than anyone else! I don’t know how much longer you’ll be here, “fighting” like that (like a kid!). I taught elementary for years, and the kids didn’t go on and on like that. Does your boss know you are fighting with your writers? Does he/she know you are telling writers to ‘get a job?’ I don’t think that’s allowed.

By lose this blogger

May 22, 2007 7:51 AM | Link to this

Theresa, sorry, but Casey is right. A lot of these topics are ‘last minute,’ it seems, or ones just put up to make a deadline. It isn’t hard to find an article in the paper, and then write, “So what do you all think?” That’s not hard! I think she/he was saying to come up with original topics! Maybe a few GOOD topics every now and then would be better than a weak new topic every day or two, or however it works now.

That being said, with your little fight, I think you - the blogger - are the most immature here! You are an employee of AJC, and you’re supposed to stand up and be the ‘bigger’ person here whenever this happens. However, you log on as the blogger, and then fight w/ meaner, more immature words than anyone else! I don’t know how much longer you’ll be here, “fighting” like that (like a kid!). I taught elementary for years, and the kids didn’t go on and on like that. Does your boss know you are fighting with your writers? Does he/she know you are telling writers to ‘get a job?’ That you’re accusing writers of having mental problems/multiple personalities? I don’t think that’s allowed.

By Tom

May 22, 2007 10:41 AM | Link to this

I guess to me it all comes down to what would you do with the info. And it is interesting that some feel it is better to abort than to deal with the child’s problem. I know there are some who will say “you don’t know what it is like”. And I don’t. But do you KNOW it is better to have a dead baby than a baby with defects? And how many defects are ok to have? I know people who have had to deal with miscarriages. Do you really think aborting an imperfect baby is easier to deal with? It may be cheaper, but is it better? The next time you see someone with a disability, just remember, you don’t think they should have been born.

By Lose this blogger is casey

May 22, 2007 10:46 AM | Link to this

Could it be any clearer that “lose this blogger” is actually Casey again? If it’s from a different IP address, it’s probably because Casey went to Starbucks to send this entry. If anyone is immature, it’s Casey.

By DB

May 22, 2007 1:01 PM | Link to this

Landsaf, whatever your reasons for not wanting children, fine. I happen to believe that people who don’t want children shouldn’t have children. I don’t think choosing not to have kids is selfish — knowing yourself well enough to know that childrearing isn’t for you is probably a good thing. But to say that you don’t want to expose a child to what you perceive as an imperfect society (name one society that IS perfect) is a cop-out. Just say you don’t want kids, and don’t try to justify with the societal crap. You don’t have to justify your decision to anyone, and the ‘society is crap’ arguement isn’t an effective one.

But I am intrigued that you land on — of all things — a parenting site to contribute your two cents. You don’t want to be a parent, you don’t want kids — what is it about this blog that interests you?

Most of us who have choosen to have children do so as a deliberate or unconscious act of faith in the future. Choosing to have a child is hope in action. To me, not choosing to have a child is a little sad because it seems that that individual has given up on the future. Seems a little dark, to me. :-)

I read an article by a disabled person who commented that when we talk about abortion as a means of quality control, we begin choosing death instead of treasuring life. Such choices diminish us.

By Logan's Mom

May 22, 2007 9:49 PM | Link to this

As a mother of a child with Down syndrome, not a Down’s child or a Down syndrome child, I have to comment. First of all, you are all speaking of these individuals as if they are a different species. Yes, their common attribute is that they share an extra chromosome, but that is where the commonality ends. Individuals with Down syndrome experience the full range of emotions from happiness and joy (which they are unfairly stereotyped as) to frustration and sadness. They have likes and dislikes. They are more like us than they are different, it’s just that so many people are not willing to give them a chance. People see their diagnosis first, and not the person. Why don’t we do this with people suffering from cancer, diabetes, lupus?

Casey, it’s not easy raising a child with special needs, nothing is closer to the truth. But the same is true for children without special needs. I feel badly for your sister that she’s struggling so much. But families should not treat the child with special needs any differently than the other children in the household. This will only cripple the child with special needs more. If he or she can’t rely on their own families to treat them as any other child, how can they expect the greater society to? It sounds as if your family has lost hope because of this diagnosis. You all need to renew your hope because your nephew may just surprise you. If you and your sister don’t have hope for his future, where do you think he’ll end up? Research shows that children with Down syndrome do so much better when they are in an environment infused with love, acceptance and support. Stop seeing the diagnosis and start seeing the child that needs your love.

By nsf

May 22, 2007 10:06 PM | Link to this

I see most are making the assumption that the disabilities being screened for are nothing more than disabilities. I am pregnant now. Before this pregnancy I miscarried a baby that fetal testing showed had triplody. This is a chromosonal defect that is incompatible with life. 100% incompatible. The longest life on record is 10 months. Most are either miscarried, stillborn or die after a few days. I had an amniocentisis with this pregnancy because of that. Amnio technique has greatly improved over the years. A good obgyn is NOT going to prick the baby because he is guided by ultrasound the whole time. Anyways, I would’ve terminated if the amnio showed triplody again. And damn anyone who judges me. I just can’t see bringing a baby into the world when the best I can hope for is to watch it suffer in pain for a few days before dying. Anyone who judges me for that is not a true Christian. I bet those who judge are the same people who’ll take advantage of every medical treatment if they are terminal ill, despite their God’s “will” that they die.

By Jimmy

May 22, 2007 10:40 PM | Link to this

Hi, I am reading all of these comments, and thinking to myself how individuals really cannot relate to families struggling with children that have disabilities. It is not an easy life, and those who do it are saints in my book. I work with children from infants to teenagers with developmental disabilities. All of these parents love their children, but at the same time they have lost so much of their own lives, and the other children in their household take a back burner to the disabled child. If there was a test that would diagnose a disability in the first trimester with even a 70% accuracy, I would recommend that people do it. Do I promote abortion? No, but at the same time I believe that the innocent soul of an unborn child can move to another and still have a chance at life. A normal healthy life, rich with full possibilities and potential, not trapped in a body that has failed such a beautiful soul.

and is it just me or is this site like really right wing?

It seems like many people proclaiming that abortion is murder believe in the death penalty… There seems to be a lot of hypocrisy, and honestly, you don’t know how hard it is til you live it, you have no right to judge any family or their choices.

By Ingrid

May 23, 2007 8:49 AM | Link to this

Someone mentioned the costs involved with a child with a disability and I just want to remind them that we ALL pay for ALL of each other’s ‘problems’. Healthcare costs are rising due to health issues with smokers and the costs for a person with aids is the single most costly problem and is the single most burden on the health care systems of the world.

So, to try to guilt people for having a child with a disability due to the costs, I hope they don’t know of anyone or that they themseves don’t smoke because smoking related illnesses and cancers cost EVERY HEALTH CARE SYSTEM IN THE WESTERN WORLD more than the cost of a child with a disability.

Sexually transmitted diseases being another. I hope no one has sex either because just having sex increases your risk of an STD or Aids significantly and is it fair to people who don’t have sex to have to pay for the illnesses of people who DO?

If I choose to homeschool my child I am STILL forced to pay taxes which pay for those who don’t homeschool their children. Should we kill off any child that is going to school so I don’t have to pay for their schooling?

I know MANY mums of children with DS and I don’t know of a single one that considers any health issues [though there are just as many without the health issues] too much of a problem. They love their children and go to great lengths to fight for them.

The people who have mentioned the parents they know should know those are the minority. Just read some of the Down Syndrome support sites and you will see that they nearly ALL absolutely adore their child and there are MANY MANY who adopt a child with DS.

THERE IS A WAITING LIST OF PARENTS IN THE US AND THE UK WHO DESPERATELY WANT TO ADOPT A CHILD WITH DS.

If you feel you cannot raise a child yourself, you can always be the blessing who gave one of these many parents the answer to their dreams.

By Ingrid

May 23, 2007 8:57 AM | Link to this

Casey, did you forget to log out and relog in as your alter ego? One of Richard’s posts up there appears to have Casey as the poster.

Can we just have a civilised discussion without you, Casey? I live in England and am bored with your taunts of Theresa. If you do not like her topic, don’t read it. If you do not like her, ignore her. If you need psychological help [we all suspect this], please seek it. I think we will all be much happier if you left.

By DB

May 23, 2007 1:14 PM | Link to this

Jimmy, I don’t think there’s any judgement involved, here. We were asked our opinions and gave them. Some of us supported our opinions with our beliefs. You may or may not agree with them, but then again, you are under no obligation to do so.

Given the topic and how close it skirts to abortion (and aware that NO ONE is going to change such a visceral opinion as how they feel about abortion based on what they read or hear), I thought the topic was handled rather well, as a group. It could have gotten quite nasty, given how strongly people feel about the topic. It was definitely a “food-for-thought” blog, and aired several aspects of the issue, as well as giving insight as to why groups of people may think they way they do about this topic. Does it change my mind? No. That wasn’t the purpose. But it does make me more aware of the enormity of the decisions faced by individuals in these situations, and anything that increases our empathy of those around us is not a bad thing.

Labeling a blog as “right wing” — I assume it wasn’t meant as a compliment :-) — and hurling adjectives such as “hypocritcal” just because of the opinions of the people on this topic may differ from yours is a bit … judgemental, no?

By M-Mom

May 23, 2007 3:53 PM | Link to this

What a lot of hoopla! Most of you don’t have any personal experience but wow, a lot of opinion. My daughter with Down syndrome almost 12. She takes ballet, gymnastics and plays soccer all with “typical kids”. She is in a special ed class with 10 other kids so (apart from the smaller class size) no real drain on the school system. We have already planned a p/t job for her in Gr. 10 (seasonal summer work) for which she will probably have a volunteer helper for (me, or someone else closer to her own age, not sure yet) and will probably be managing it on her own after a couple of years. She already wants to work at Silver City (movie theatres) and talks about her own house. I can see her living with another person and a dog of her own. She’s healthy…apart from having her tonsils out, nothing to report on that front. She has pals both in our community and from her class. Jeez! She’s not that different after all! So what if she only gains an academic level of Grade 4. I bet there are lots of kids across North America who can’t say much more. She bugs the heck out of her 8 y.o brother in just the way that an older sister should. He’s already demonstrated that he will grow up to be a wise and compassionate person for having known her. She takes excellent care of her baby sister and can be trusted to watch her for a few minutes while I take care of stuff.

Personally, I wouldn’t trade her for the world!

By M-Mom

May 23, 2007 4:03 PM | Link to this

Oh, and Jimmy? Quote “It is not an easy life, and those who do it are saints in my book. I work with children from infants to teenagers with developmental disabilities. All of these parents love their children, but at the same time they have lost so much of their own lives, and the other children in their household take a back burner to the disabled child.”

What a sweeping generalization!!!! Here’s my anecdote. When my daughter was born almost 12 years ago I remember saying to someone that “There goes my dream of spending my retirement planning shopping trips to Paris”. Fast forward 11 years….I can’t wait for my first shopping trip to Paris with my daughter! We will have a riot together! She travels well, having been around the world twice plus much travel within Canada. She loves shoes and purses and gets a big kick of having a small decaf cappucino with Mom at Starbucks when we have some time together. Paris, here we come.

Moral of the story? I accept her as she is (fabulous shopping sense, but not good with money, just like her mom : ) and look at my glass as half full, not half empty!!!

By Andi

May