By Michael 30 nyear pilot.

Apr 29, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this

Supply and Demand has gotten us where we are now. It would work in a regular world where all the airlines are never going to charge less than overall cost of the operational seat mile. That means as long as nobody ever charges less than cost then supply and demand would work with competition. But that the problem. the competitive environment is allowed to do whatever it wants to get passengers. That is they charge less than the other guy in order to get a passenger. They charge less than cost. The can't survive like that even if you are selling lemonaide on the street corner. But the silly airline executive justifies this by saying to themselves in their college un-educated unrealistic business model that they will call the bharging less than cost for a ticket just an investment in that they are going to keep charging less until those other airlines fold up and are out of the picture then they will be on top and start charging profitable again. But thats just the thing. there is always going to be someone else to make a new airline startup out of ill found money and investors that have too much money and need a loss leader or pension funds that the por investor somehow beleive this new airline is going to be able to make it work. There will always always always be another airline startup so that first airline charging under cost seats is never going to have a chance to be profitable again. Its a a terrible vischous circle and it will never work in a unregulated market. The airlines need to be regulated to make at least cost or there will continue to be government subsidizing the industry through at the very least unemployment for workers and every one else those workers were buying goods for. But what do I know. I'm just a caveman pilot who's co-pilot is being subsidized by the government because his pay is so low that he and his wife and one child get food stamps, well fare and section 8 housing. So I guess the government in that way is in a round about way subsidizing the airline by the govt making up whats missing in the the pay for its copilots. I wonder if the government execs could figure out that they would save so much by re-regulating that they would be actually making a windfall for the government by not paying out hidden subsidization. But they can't see the forest for the trees. Sorry for the long post but its just makes your head shake watching from the flight deck.

By Michael 30 nyear pilot.

Apr 29, 2008 6:11 PM | Link to this

Supply and Demand has gotten us where we are now. It would work in a regular world where all the airlines are never going to charge less than overall cost of the operational seat mile. That means as long as nobody ever charges less than cost then supply and demand would work with competition. But that the problem. the competitive environment is allowed to do whatever it wants to get passengers. That is they charge less than the other guy in order to get a passenger. They charge less than cost. The can't survive like that even if you are selling lemonaide on the street corner. But the silly airline executive justifies this by saying to themselves in their college un-educated unrealistic business model that they will call the bharging less than cost for a ticket just an investment in that they are going to keep charging less until those other airlines fold up and are out of the picture then they will be on top and start charging profitable again. But thats just the thing. there is always going to be someone else to make a new airline startup out of ill found money and investors that have too much money and need a loss leader or pension funds that the por investor somehow beleive this new airline is going to be able to make it work. There will always always always be another airline startup so that first airline charging under cost seats is never going to have a chance to be profitable again. Its a a terrible vischous circle and it will never work in a unregulated market. The airlines need to be regulated to make at least cost or there will continue to be government subsidizing the industry through at the very least unemployment for workers and every one else those workers were buying goods for. But what do I know. I'm just a caveman pilot who's co-pilot is being subsidized by the government because his pay is so low that he and his wife and one child get food stamps, well fare and section 8 housing. So I guess the government in that way is in a round about way subsidizing the airline by the govt making up whats missing in the the pay for its copilots. I wonder if the government execs could figure out that they would save so much by re-regulating that they would be actually making a windfall for the government by not paying out hidden subsidization. But they can't see the forest for the trees. Sorry for the long post but its just makes your head shake watching from the flight deck.

By Michael 30 nyear pilot.

Apr 29, 2008 6:10 PM | Link to this

Supply and Demand has gotten us where we are now. It would work in a regular world where all the airlines are never going to charge less than overall cost of the operational seat mile. That means as long as nobody ever charges less than cost then supply and demand would work with competition. But that the problem. the competitive environment is allowed to do whatever it wants to get passengers. That is they charge less than the other guy in order to get a passenger. They charge less than cost. The can't survive like that even if you are selling lemonaide on the street corner. But the silly airline executive justifies this by saying to themselves in their college un-educated unrealistic business model that they will call the bharging less than cost for a ticket just an investment in that they are going to keep charging less until those other airlines fold up and are out of the picture then they will be on top and start charging profitable again. But thats just the thing. there is always going to be someone else to make a new airline startup out of ill found money and investors that have too much money and need a loss leader or pension funds that the por investor somehow beleive this new airline is going to be able to make it work. There will always always always be another airline startup so that first airline charging under cost seats is never going to have a chance to be profitable again. Its a a terrible vischous circle and it will never work in a unregulated market. The airlines need to be regulated to make at least cost or there will continue to be government subsidizing the industry through at the very least unemployment for workers and every one else those workers were buying goods for. But what do I know. I'm just a caveman pilot who's co-pilot is being subsidized by the government because his pay is so low that he and his wife and one child get food stamps, well fare and section 8 housing. So I guess the government in that way is in a round about way subsidizing the airline by the govt making up whats missing in the the pay for its copilots. I wonder if the government execs could figure out that they would save so much by re-regulating that they would be actually making a windfall for the government by not paying out hidden subsidization. But they can't see the forest for the trees. Sorry for the long post but its just makes your head shake watching from the flight deck.

By DSC

Apr 14, 2008 11:50 PM | Link to this

Great Idea! Not! Just look at how many problems the TSA is having under government control.

Airline tickets are the highest taxed item in the US. Just imagine what re-regulation would do....more money in taxes to Uncle Sam and less to the airlines, vendors, suppliers and the workers.

Oberstar is completely out of touch with the economic reality of $100+ oil. Maybe he should be held accountable for the loss of jobs overseas, weak dollar and rising living costs for us Americans.

FAA over reacted with AA due to thier failure with Southwest and one agency should not be charged with both promoting aviation and regulating safety!

By fcvnyc

Apr 11, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this

There is a US Citizen sustainable aviation movement that has solutions; it has ten sustainable aviation demands to US Congress which can be found at www.us-caw.org and www.metronyaviation.org. They are based upon similar demands in Britain where citizens play a far more proactive role in aviation matters. cf.www.airportwatch.uk.org

Know that things will get worse when the airline industry will be forced to cap its emissions in these troubling times of the climate crisis.

By former widget

Apr 10, 2008 7:31 PM | Link to this

Sound on: Laurel Hardy begins;
'Well, Well, Well. Here's another fine fix you've gotten US into'.
And so goes the once great American Aviation industry thanks to deregulation, abolishment of the CAB, and any sense of how to run an airline.
Greed has taken over on both sides.
Speculators a chance to make a quick dollar and the consumer wants low fares. Guess who loses? The established airlines and consumer.
OK folks cry in your beer, but you asked for it,...now you've got it.
With an apology to business travellers. You will get a kiss to go along with your skymiles.

By CW

Apr 10, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this

If the government and its supporters (i.e. taxpayers) are going to have to continue to consume resources to monitor the airline industry, I say regulate it...and aren't we already doing that?

By bru

Apr 10, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this

I have worked for an airline for 30 years--we have given and given and given--we also work 24/7/365--we get yelled at and spit on for the slightest problem--ergo the "flying public" is not of the same caliber it used to be--I/we would love to see the level of service you expect and need--however with the "Low cost airlines" forcing down the ticket price for a few years and a quick profit for the shareholders we have got to compete to stay in business--it is a mess--to many planes in the sky--but ya want cheap ya get cheap--enjoy!!!!!!!!

By Fred

Apr 10, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

If we re-regulate the airline industry, fares will double. Are people ready for that? If you don't believe it, look at fares in the 1970's. They were the same as they are today. I would gladly pay double, to bring the level of service and safety back to where they once were.

By Joan

Apr 10, 2008 12:15 PM | Link to this

Airline industry management has failed in almost every area.
Here's what congress needs to do immediately:
1) make it illegal for the airline to charge the passenger before the "service"(flight!) is delivered.
2) make it illegal to hold passengers on a delayed (grounded) plane any more than 1 hour.
3) Penalized airlines that overschedule flights out of busy air traffic areas (ie NYC).
Until we see elightened policy and smart management -- we need to demand strict oversight.