AJC > Sports Thrashers > Blog > Archives > 2008 > June > 27 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USThrashers Department Of Defense Needs Upgrading
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
I have to say, the lineup exercise from earlier in the week really brought out some excellent suggestions for putting the team together based on who is currently on the roster. What it also did, I believe, was highlight some serious deficiencies that will need to be addressed over the next few weeks, (DUH4).
So, well done one and all.
Today I want to focus in on the defensive concerns. There is the need to bolster the blueline that let up more goals and more shots per game then any other team. I think two additions are in order to properly address the situation. Two obvious choices are, of course, Brian Campbell and Wade Redden. However, no one here is delusional enough to think that both are going to land in the ATL…if for no other reason then those two players would eat up somewhere in the neighborhood of $15-17 million in cap money alone.
But, let’s just say Don Waddell does land one of those big fish… and either will do fine. Who else could we bring in to firm up the defensive corps? There are several options out there… Michal Rozsival or John-Michael Liles definitely come to mind…but to get the conversation rolling I’ll suggest someone like…oh, let’s say… Brooks Orpik, the 6’-2” 21p-pound native of the bay area who played in 78 games for the Pens last season netting a goal, 10 assists and finished a +11.
Thus, the Thrashers defensive would look something like this:
Campbell or Redden paired with Orpik…Havelid with Enstrom…Bogosian with XLB and Boris as the 7th man.
Ken Klee’s $1.25 million hit to the cap could be freed up via trade to help pay for such a move. Of course, Exelby could be substituted here as the trade-bait with his $1.4 mil salary, but I’ll say Klee goes simply because Exelby is familiar with new coach John Anderson, (There is something to be said for that, ya know).
Now some may point out that Orpik might not be a top line defender, more like second line…and I would agree. But I just hate the idea of splitting up the Swedes. However, if forced to, I could see Enstrom pairing with Campbell/Redden and Orpik with Havelid.
Again, Rozsival, Orpik and Liles to me are all viable options. I’m sure there are others you’d like to share.
Oh by the way, if you’ve taken the notion that my assumptions here all begin with Zhitnik being waived or bought out…you would be correct!
Weekend Reading Assignments
Speaking of defenders on the market…there is this particular piece by Adam Proteau reposted in The Hockey News from last May. Besides the five players he focuses on, what caught my eye was how he describes Don Waddell’s mindset regarding the Zhitnik/Cobourn deal.
Scott Niedermayer and the Ducks agreed on a deal that will return the defenseman to Anaheim for the 2008-’09 season.
Sean Avery has found an interesting way to spend his summer.
I plan on taking the tax exemptions to see Mike Myers in “The Love Guru” over the weekend. As I’m sure you all know, it is set around our beloved sport of ice hockey. Well, recently Adam Proteau, (again), put out a list of the best and worst of all hockey movies for ESPN.com. “Youngblood”….YUCK!
Mike Brophy thinks that the Bolts still have a long way to go before returning to contention…even with the drafting of Steven Stamkos.
Soccer great Pele being mugged in Brazil? That’s like Wayne Gretzky being held up anywhere in Canada! Kids these days, I swear…absolutely no respect at all!
And finally… I have a feeling I know where Jethro, Cuzin’ Cletus and Jim Bob will be hangin’ out this weekend.
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By Sara
June 27, 2008 8:56 AM | Link to this
No making fun of the Dukefest now…that was a Southern institution until Jessica Simpson and Co. ruined it.
I honest to goodness don’t know what the organization intends to do on defense. We have a corps of seven already if both Valabik and Bogo get the call. Since they obviously aren’t willing to do buy-outs, how do they intend to get someone off the roster to make room for an FA?? It could be presumed that Bogo and Valabik need one more year of development before becoming NHL regulars - thus giving time for the contracts to Zhitnik and Klee to expire. I don’t necessarily have a problem with Bogo getting another year of seasoning in with his OHL club, but I think to send Boris back down again would be a mistake a la Coburn. Get him up here, get him some regular ice time and development time, and get him going.
By Wings fan in Ga.
June 27, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this
On my way back to Georgia from Myrtle Beach last weekend, I saw a General Lee broken down on the side of the road. For some reason, that made me chuckle a little bit. … Sara, I agree with your Jessica Simpson comment. Now, she is out ruining country music too, along with all of the other pop music rejects and American Idol rejects.
By The Other J.B.
June 27, 2008 9:07 AM | Link to this
Not only do I think it will take obscene amounts of money to bring one or more of those defenders to Atlanta, I’m in favor of it as well. Got to spend money to make money. People will come back to blueland, some even in the form of STHs, to see that wall of high profile hockey names in front of Kari or Moose.
As far as Zhithead goes, DW said they’ve never talked about buying him out or trading him, so that probably means he’s gone for sure. (See the pre-draft John Anderson hire denial example.) Im always inclined to think the opposite of what that guy says is often the truth…
I CANNOT WAIT FOR JULY 1st!!!!
By R. Stroz
June 27, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this
Completely off subject, however, I saw a picture of Jessica Simpson wearing a shirt which had the following printed on it;
Real Girls Eat Meat
Only Jessica could wear a shirt like that and say, “I don’t why everyone is laughing.”
By five_hole
June 27, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this
Sara Jessica Simpson didn’t ruin the movie, it was the writers, the directors, a lot of acting careers were destroyed making that movie. Perhaps the only reason to watch it is Jessica Simpson; pretty much like any movie Jessica Alba is in. I don’t think either will ever win an Academy Award, but both will be in lots of movies.
Rawhide - if you’ve taken the notion that my assumptions here all begin with Zhitnik being waived or bought out…you would be correct! - from your lips to DW’s ear. Also, agree with not wanting to split up the swedes; but don’t believe on counting on Begosian just yet. And I think Klee would have some value as a 7th man. A veteran who maybe plays every couple of weeks; I’d be comfortable with him in that role.
I believe that before the cap increased was announced, we were something like $25.5 mil under. With the $6.4 increase in the cap, we have some serious money to spend. We have the money to overpay for both Redden & Campbell, if DW wanted to, and still have cash to sign some forwards.
By Bob
June 27, 2008 10:05 AM | Link to this
Just curious, what makes you think they’re going to buy out Zhitnit and trade Klee?
By Hip Czech
June 27, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
Campbell, Redden, Roszival, Hainsey, Streit, Liles…any of them would be welcome here.
I think Redden might be the least return for the bucks, but still it would show the fan base that we are at least half-heartedly serious about assembling an NHL team here.
I would be OK spending big bucks on 2 of the 6 D listed…Kovalchuk might not be happy but I’d rather ‘build from the back’.
Work out some sort of trade for either a C or RW to fill out the roster, or sign a cheap FA RW, or give the ‘kids’ a shot.
By Jethro
June 27, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
I hurd Jessica likes tube steak :D
By PuckedUp
June 27, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this
The Zhitnik/Coburn deal was a monumental failure of a deal. It was a desperation move that elicited a 4-game a* whoopin, while losing a top 4 d-man. One who was routinely blasted in the media and on the nest. And it turns out the problem was with the coach, not the player. There are some days when I feel bad for DW will all the crap he has to deal with from ownership. Then I recall moves like this one, and think, of the following in terms of ownership and DW …
the movie Dumb and Dumber… phrase “blind leading the blind”… Star Wars quote “Who’s the more foolish, the fool or the fool who follows the fool?”
By Cuzin' Cletus
June 27, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this
Dukefest…WOO-HOOOooo!! You betcha Cuzin’ Rawhide! I’ll be thar!
An That thar Jessicer Simpson…MY, my! Boy, I sure do wish I could meet that fine, outstandin’ actress one day!
Why, I’d give up all my velvet Elvis paintings fer one date with THAT one!
Course, I’d have to get one of my Camaros in the front yard a-workin’ fer that outin’…woman like that don’t need to be picked up in no Ford pick-up…
By Smoothie
June 27, 2008 10:30 AM | Link to this
Oh contraire mon frere, Youngblood is an American classic!! Eventhough the movie was set in Canada. How dare you blaspheme about a movie with Keeanu Reeves playing a knuckle-headed French-Canadian goaltender!!
By Sam
June 27, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this
This is all quite simple. A Campbell will turn the D into a decent unit. No Campbell or other signing means the same old thing. Thank you Rawhide for the link to the Brophy article. I think he missed a key point and it has absolutely NOTHING to do with new ownership or Melrose. The Lightning may have an average to above average NHL goaltender in Mike Smith. When was the last time they had even an average NHL goalie? They haven’t since the Cup season. That means at least a 10-12 point swing right off the bat. Add a healthy Boyle, #1 pick Stamkos and any FA signings and you are now looking at playoffs again. Torts didn’t play net and neither will Melrose. The Lightning were not your typical last place club last year with glaring holes everywhere. The major pieces are there unless Melrose has totally forgotten everything. I seriously doubt it. Looking forward to Thrashers/Lightning games this season as always. It’s a decent rivalry for such a short life in the NHL.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this
Bob - I believe it’s purely speculation. The last day for buyouts is Monday, after all. I believe we can waive some people on Monday and issue the buyout Tuesday, once everyone has passed on them. Which, if we’re talking about Zhitnik, it’s guaranteed that everyone will pass on him.
By Rawhide
June 27, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this
Bob - Yeah, it’s purely spectulative…I have no idea what’s up their sleeve. However, I believe…hope…pray…that they will indeed make some bold moves this offseason.
They certainly have the funds available to do something something this summer. If not now, then when?
Wings Fan - Now, she is out ruining country music too….uh, country music CAN be ruined???
Whodathunkit??
Smooooothie - “Youngblood”??? You kidding me? I once thought about using that movie as a means to punish my boys when they misbehaved buy forcing them to watch it.
However, if there are those who seek to outlaw water-boarding as a means to gain information from terrorists, then surely I would get in trouble for THIS type of agonizing disciplinary tactic.
And I don’t need DEFACS knocking on my door.
By GatorGuy
June 27, 2008 11:06 AM | Link to this
Say what you want about Youngblood but seeing Cynthia Gibb’s butt when I was 13 was a life changing event for me! It made me feel kida funny.
By Smoothie
June 27, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this
Oh yeah, I am a FACKING ANIMAAAL!
Just want to see if this will go through un-edited for vulgarity.
I could watch Youngblood 3 times in a weekend on TBS if they let me!
By Alan
June 27, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this
It looks like Ottawa might be out of the Brian Campbell sweepstakes.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 11:18 AM | Link to this
Oh, also, here’s an interesting take on the rise of the salary cap to its current level.
By Tim
June 27, 2008 11:20 AM | Link to this
PuckedUp agree about the coburn deal. however let not forget, Coburn didn’t fit at all in our system. when called up, he never play the way he played in Philadelphia. And when we send him back into the AHL, he wasnt the most hardworking guy over there neither. Maybe the trade was a wake up call for him asking him to play and that he needs more then talents if he want to stay in the NHL. Some player are like that you know. Just like it was the case for a certain Marc Savard.
By Smoothie
June 27, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this
RH — I agree with you about Jessica “funny mouth” Simpson and country music getting watered down more and more. Thank goodness for acts like Dierks, M&G, B&D, Leann Rimes, Gretchen Wilson etc…they keep the real country fans happy.
On Youngblood, I admit that it isn’t a great movie, but neither is ANY hockey movie outside of Miracle and perhaps Slapstick. At least it had some solid sexual innuendo, brief nudity (thank you Gator Guy for remembering her name), decent hockey scenes and a guy name Rackli to get his a$$ kicked to Thunder Bay as the exciting climax. Ha!! Certainly a lot better than Mighty Ducks!!
By silverpork
June 27, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this
I can’t say I’d be thrilled about Redden. He seems to be on the down side of his career, and from what I’ve seen he is really soft around his own net, something we already have in spades.
Then again, sometimes a change of scenery can do wonders.
By Jethro
June 27, 2008 11:33 AM | Link to this
Maybe we should higher Jessica Simpson, put hur behind tha goal, and tell hur ta jump up ana down when the uther team is abouta shuut tha puck.
Thats whatcha call a nontradishunal defense.
Sure would be an impruvemint over the Rapid fan drinkin beer.
By Jim_Bob
June 27, 2008 11:57 AM | Link to this
Howdy doody there Rawhide and Jethro, and Cousin Cleetus. How you fellers doin’ today? Now ima gonna tell you fellers what, that Jessica Simpson is one fine piece of American @ss! Now that’s justa too darn bad she’s with that Loser from the Dallas Cowgirls. She needs to dump the Romeo feller and come get her a piece of some Jim_Bob lovin, yessirree, I guarantee!
I justa mighta have ta’ call up the other fellers and heada on up there from Valdosta to check out the Dukes Festival. Lemme tell you fellers what, that there was one of my favorite shows back in the day. Us country boys love us some Dukes!
Boy I tell you fellers what, its hotter than hell down here in Valdosta right now - I broke a dang sweat walkin on down yonder to the crabapple tree to get me somethin’ to chew on this fine morning.
Now you listen here feller Rawhide, see whatcha you can do about gettin us that Erin Andrews lassie back yonder here workin with the Thrash. That woulda be a mighty fine day in Blueland, yessirree, I guarantee, oh yeah come on now!
By GaVaHokie
June 27, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this
I don’t know if we want Jessica Simpson. Her father is worse than Carl Lindros.
We could just have the Ice Girls jump up and down… why else to we have them? :)
By GaVaHokie
June 27, 2008 12:07 PM | Link to this
Here’s Eklund’s latest article. Interesting points being made on St. Louis’ strategy to sit back and wait for the dust to settle. Would you be upset if Atlanta did the same?
By Alan
June 27, 2008 12:38 PM | Link to this
Hokie - I’m not seeing a compelling reason for Atlanta to “wait.” Maybe that’s just me.
By B. Thenet
June 27, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this
The Ducks just waived Bertuzzi
Is this a good fit for Atlanta, I think he is a RW? Perfect linemate for Ilya IMO.
1 year left on his deal, and we would only be on the hook for $2 million.
By Jethro
June 27, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
We could just have the Ice Girls jump up and down… why else to we have them? :)
Heck, we could call our new defense
THE RACK ATTACK
By Hip Czech
June 27, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this
The only merit I see to the waiting game is that takes the ‘don’t want to come to Atlanta’ thing out of the equation.
We would basically punt on any top line FAs, wait for the salary cap fallout and then trade for players that teams can’t afford under the cap.
Of course the downside to that argument is we have to have commodities to trade, which I’m not sure we have any, unless you want to deal Pavelec or Lehtonen.
I say we go after 1 top flight FA, one 2nd or 3rd tier FA and try to make a trade for a forward (Jarret Stoll anyone?).
By polskidawg
June 27, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this
Rawhide - I think most would be thrilled to see a player like Campbell/Redden on line 1.
However, that will only happen if a) the player is SOLELY focused in $$$ (Campbell might be, based on leaving a good, young team last season that will be back in 08/09) and b) the player is signed for a team-breaking, overly salaried amount (like 4 years @ 8.5mil).
History, specifically DW free agent history, suggests that what is more likely to take place is that players that were either “never was” or “has been” will be signed and the DW will “sell” them as solid, veteran, up-and-coming, etc.
I expect one or more of the following to sign with the Thrashers: Mara (not bad - not great, $$), Malik (same), Tverdovsky (underachiever), Kalinin (always hurt), Eaton (SLOW), Miller (Klee, again), etc.
I’d like and duo of Orpik and Hainsey (both 27, a couple of years in the league, upside, $$$ vs. $$$$$, good speed and size). Can’t a man dream??
By R. Stroz
June 27, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this
Everyone - Call your sales reps and tell them your not buying tickets unless the Thrashers get rid of Zhitnik.
By GaVaHokie
June 27, 2008 1:45 PM | Link to this
Of course the downside to that argument is we have to have commodities to trade, which I’m not sure we have any, unless you want to deal Pavelec or Lehtonen.
At this point, team would be looking to shed salary for the high-priced UFA’s they picked up. So, we might be able to part with prospects and draft picks.
By GaVaHokie
June 27, 2008 1:50 PM | Link to this
I’d grab Bertuzzi in a hearbeat.
He’s exactly the kind of player (at the right price) we need for Kovy’s line… a big body to stand in front of the net.
I think it’s worth the risk at $2 million for one year.
By R. Stroz
June 27, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
GaVaHokie - Agreed, we need a bonafide goon with some talent that is willing and able to screen the goalie.
By The Other J.B.
June 27, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this
I agree. I think Bertuzzi would be a great pickup for the price, though his age gives me a little reservation…
By Lanny McDonald
June 27, 2008 2:02 PM | Link to this
Thrashers Department Of Defense Needs Upgrading
Why not bring up this guy Rawhide?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JBQiFtvSG_U
By JB
June 27, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this
polsidawg, if we sign Brian Campbell to a 6 year, 8.5 million dollar contract it is NOT team breaking, over salary maybe but not team breaking. In case everyone forgot we have a little over 20 million in free salary this summer, it would benefit us to at least spend some of it.
By polskidawg
June 27, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this
Lanny McDonald - I’d be more in favor of Kulda having a shot this season over rushing Bogo. By the way, it looks like Danny’s “Anger” got the best of him…or I should say, Kulda’s.
JB - I don’t completely disagree with your point. I just think using the Detroit/San Jose/Buffalo method of great drafting, low-level coaching to improve your team while keeping your cap moderate works best.
Use UFAs for specific needs - not an overhaul, like the Thrashers need.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 2:28 PM | Link to this
polskidawg - With the cap rising, the floor also rises. While keeping our cap moderate, I would especially favor being above the cap floor.
So on 1 July, let’s get Campbell. Any other top tier players we manage to woo to our franchise is icing on the cake.
By Bob
June 27, 2008 2:43 PM | Link to this
Bertuzzi is owed $4m for this year, but we do need a RW
By polskidawg
June 27, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this
Alan and others - I’ll be very happy if Campbell is a Thrasher. I just don’t see it happening.
I believe the Rangahs will be looking to make a splash, especially if they don’t resign Roszival/Mara.
I still expect less out of this UFA season, rather than more. Call it, 10 years of broken hopes (Burt! Reirdon! Krupp! Slegr!! White!!!).
By Rawhide
June 27, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this
Lanny McDonald - I think with Anderson as coach, “Woulda”-Kulda will defenately get his chance during camp and pre-season. Same is true with all the Chicago guys.
I guess the question would be is if he is better than a proven UFA if such player can be had.
B. Thenet - As for Bertuzzi…I would love to have him for a year or two if the price is right. I guess one would have to consider if he is a good replacement for Recchi or not.
polskidawg - I think you’re right about the mindset of a player coming here. But that’s the position the team is in. Thus, we will have to out-bid other teams.
Hokie - The “waiting” logic is sound for the Blues…but here, I think we have to be the aggressors on the market.
Jim_Bob - Erin Andrews, eh??? Gotta agree with ya there.
GatorGuy - LOL @ Cynthia Gibb’s butt comment! I’m sure she made several such 13 year old boys feel….funny.
Jethro - “The Rack Attack”?….sigh
By Sara
June 27, 2008 2:59 PM | Link to this
Orpik just shot down Pittsburgh’s offer <— Linkage!
By Alan
June 27, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this
I believe the Rangahs will be looking to make a splash
They are.
I’ve been saying this for a while, now.
By Stan Drulia
June 27, 2008 3:18 PM | Link to this
Shame on you Smoothie! Slapstick?!?! I believe you meant Slapshot…. hands down the best hockey movie OF ALL TIME!!!!!
By GatorGuy
June 27, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this
Smoothie I thought the line was “He is f*** an-knee-mul” Referring to Ricki. I could be wrong. That was his only line in the movie!
By B. Thenet
June 27, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this
If we claim Bertuzzi we have to pay him the full $4 million.
However, being 33 and heading into a contract year he will have everything to play for.
If he gets bought out with Anahiem two things happen, he can sign with whoever he wants(probably not Atlanta), and he will likely sign a multi-year deal.
I’d rather have him at $4 million for one year than $3 million/year for 2 or 3.
By Sara
June 27, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
Awww someone cleaned up my mess! Do I thank you RH, or Trixie? ;)
By Nikita
June 27, 2008 4:02 PM | Link to this
I’d love to see Roszival and Campbell. I’m not sure we’re willing to pay for them, though.
As to Klee, he’s not going anywhere. a) he’s cheap, b) he’s a team player, dependable on the ice, mentally steady, and willing to jump over a cliff if he thinks that’s what the team requires, c) he has declared his intent to play fewer minutes, which is pretty easy given the ridiculous number of minutes he pulled last year. Therefore he’s an ideal 7th man.
We have a few other probable 7th man/occasional scratch candidates — X, Valabik, Kwiatkowski, Popovic. I think we should lose Popovic and play the others as they earn it.
Which would leave us with… Top Tier Guy 1, Top Tier Guy 2, Enstrom, Havelid, Klee, Ex, Wolves call-ups, and Larsen. Oh, plus Zhit if we keep him. Knowing DW, I suspect we will.
By Tony C.
June 27, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this
The following is from our favorite hack eklund:
*The main two names associated with Calgary talking to folks today are Jay Bouwmeester and Mike Green.
The Oilers are also believed to be working up major offer sheets for these two. I am very curious to see exactly how this plays out. The Oilers also are said to have interest in Koistinen and Vermette.
Meanwhile the Lightning and the Wild are two teams to look to when it comes to MAJOR UFA and RFA offers. Darcy Tucker and Brooks Orpik are both STRONGLY rumoured to Tampa by my sources. Makes sense given that both are definitely Melrose type players and Tucker’s former agent, Brian Lawton is now working in Tampa. Another team that may surprise us is the Nashville Predators. The Preds also have interest in Vermette and Ryan Clowe.*
By volgrad1985
June 27, 2008 4:10 PM | Link to this
Regarding the backlog of signed defensemen, I wouldn’t expect the Thrashers to make any moves (such as waivers or buy outs) until AFTER they have successfully signed a FA or two. Why make room for the new guy(s) if you don’t have them yet? Not to sound pessimistic, but just in case the FA signing period doesn’t go as planned, you will need to have those already signed players available in a pinch.
By ranallo10
June 27, 2008 4:16 PM | Link to this
Nikita — Kwiatkowski and Popovic are UFAs, and Kwiatkowski has signed in Russia.
Larsen is not a defender, but rather a winger (he even played center for a few games).
Just some minor corrections for your post.
Also, when did Klee say he was willing to cut his minutes? I recall several times last season when Klee and Zhitnik both were heard commenting about not getting enough minutes because they felt they were not able to get into a groove. Both felt they needed consistent ice time because 10-15 minutes wasn’t enough for them to be settled and play consistent defensively.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 4:29 PM | Link to this
I’d love to see Roszival and Campbell. I’m not sure we’re willing to pay for them, though.
We pretty much have to, if we want to make it above the cap floor.
By ranallo10
June 27, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
We pretty much have to, if we want to make it above the cap floor.
As I’ve been saying for a while now…
There aren’t enough roster spots available to fill with entry-level contracts, $7M needs to be spent on 6 players, which likely means one $3M+ player will be signed to adhere to the bare minimum.
By Rawhide
June 27, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this
Sara - It’s all part of the service, ma’am.
By Dixie (Rstroz secretary)
June 27, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this
Excuse me Mr Stroz? Sorry to interupt you on the 19th hole sir but you have an important e-mail.
By Nikita
June 27, 2008 5:25 PM | Link to this
Nikita — Kwiatkowski and Popovic are UFAs, and Kwiatkowski has signed in Russia.
I didn’t know about Kiwi — I assume that’s recent? It doesn’t matter with Popovic — he’d play for us again if we’d sign him, and I don’t want to sign him. Stevie Mac is in the same category, but I don’t even want to think about him. (Popovic I like — Stevie Mac I don’t like.)
Larsen is not a defender…Just some minor corrections for your post.
Those aren’t minor — what kind of crack was I smoking?
Klee say he was willing to cut his minutes?
Klee and Recchi both declared their intent to play fewer minutes in mid-season interviews last year. Klee pulled a lot of minutes per game for the last half, at least till he got sidelined. Which is another reason why I think he’ll be back — I think DW set him aside because there wasn’t any point ruining him in meaningless games, given everyone we needed to audition and his age. Plus, again, he’s cheap insurance.
By five_hole
June 27, 2008 5:47 PM | Link to this
Nikita agreed that Klee would make a great 7th man (I said so up towards the top of the blog) but since when do players get to say how many minutes they get to play? I always thought that was the coaches decision.
My guess on the situation is we’re going to see at least a couple of Chi Wolves make the roster (Anderson’s guys) and maybe 2 or three UFA’s. If that’s the case, we can make Campbell’s eyes bulge. I say we ask him what he wants and give him a million more than that.
By Smoothie
June 27, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this
Sign Bertuzzi for 1 yr at $4 M!!? Are you kidding me!? We’d be much better off over-paying for Tucker who would prolly cost a little less than that. Bertuzzi is a washed-up bum who didn’t deserve a second chance in the NHL after that egregious face-smashing he committed in Vancouver a few years back. How old is the guy? 37, 38, 39? I say pass on anyone who is ready for the geriatric ward other than Tucker or Rolston.
Gator Guy — I believe you’re right about the quote, but I think Keeanu was referring to the dude on the team whose false teeth they used to prank that girl in the bar. But I could be remembering wrong. At any rate, “facking aneemuul” is fun to say whenever possible!
By Thrashers27
June 27, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this
I’d rather see Kiwi stick around than Stevie Mac. Look at the offensive numbers he puts up.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 6:14 PM | Link to this
Smoothie - He was waived. It wouldn’t be a signing, it would be more like a contract acquisition.
Having said that, I don’t know if I want him here. He doesn’t exactly have a sterling reputation on the ice, after all.
By Sara
June 27, 2008 6:50 PM | Link to this
If mgmt is waiting to fill roster spots before letting guys go, they may end up in bigger trouble that way. The buy-out period expires before FA begins, IIRC. So the only choice after that is to waive players and pray to the hockey gods that someone takes them off your hands. Otherwise, we’ll be paying Zhitnik an a*******load to play for the Wolves next season (which I’m sure the new coach down there will so appreciate).
We can absolutely get at least one of the FA d-men to come here by overpaying if need be - even if it isn’t Campbell. So at least Zhitnik’s spot could definitely be filled and we have enough to go on to fill out the remaining spots.
By HookyBob
June 27, 2008 6:56 PM | Link to this
What do you bloggers think of signing a veteran defenseman, say Soupy, Redden, or Roszival, and pairing him with Bogasian? (Seems like Hatcher did a good job mentoring Coburn in Philly.) I’d think there’d be some value in getting Bogo a good mentor.
Another good option with Redden might be X. Then our defensive lines would be ,1)the Swedes, 2)the prairie Canadians, 3)and a US pair of Klee and Bogasian (maybe Klee would be a good mentor?). I still feel that X, given a decent partner, remains a good, solid, D-man.
Smoothie, I agree,.. stay away from Bertuzzi. Too expensive and seems like teams that give him a tryout soon get rid of him. (He may fit well with the “Melrose model” though,…and that sort of worries me. I wouldn’t want to face him 8 Xs a year.) Still, for $4M/yr, me thinks there has to be a better, younger option out there.
Is Calgary talking to RFAs? Maybe this is something whose time has come? I’d really like to see Green in a Thrasher uniform.
Puckedup,..I offer up my favorite movie line,.. “Why that is soooo stupid, ..there’s nothing to compare it to.”
Correct me if I’m wrong but, only 70-some hours til free agency, and we have to spend several millions of $s just to get to the league minimum. While that is pretty cool (ignoring we have so many signed),…how did we get in that situation?
By LAC
June 27, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this
Remember The buyout period ends at midnight 6/30. So little time left, while other teams are helping their teams, STUPID asg will not buyout because it will make them look weak or something, problem they are ALREADY CHEAP and STUPID… so we are stuck with zit/klee/white/larsen all dead weight worth nothing to the Thrashers.
Just shows the FANS asg does not care one damn bit about us THE FANS !!!
By Gator Guy
June 27, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this
Smoothie Looks like I am going to have to watch the move again!
By shoot it
June 27, 2008 8:48 PM | Link to this
I like rosival and think streit would be a better bargain the campbell.
By Tony C.
June 27, 2008 9:30 PM | Link to this
shoot it You say you want Rosival… Even though Rosival will be coming off of hip surgery??? I mean, sure it’s probably by one of the 10 best guys on the planet that does that sort of thing, but uhhh… Do we really want to take a chance on a puck moving defenCeman with a bad hip?
By UpperDeck4Life
June 27, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this
Rawhide, what about Jason Smith from the Flyers. I’d take him over Orpik any day. Both are defensive defensman, but Smith has leadership and defensive awareness that Orpik doesn’t and Orpik and XLB before last leason were almost the same player. I agree with you on Liles though. If we can’t get Campbell and Smith, I would be happy with a Liles-Smith pairing to go with Enstrom-Havelid as our top 2 defensive pairings.
By Alan
June 27, 2008 11:38 PM | Link to this
Dave - Remember a few blogs back when you suggested the Thrashers should bring in Lil’ Jon to do the announcements? Maybe he should be a locker room presense instead. :D
By ranallo10
June 27, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this
Smoothie — Bertuzzi is 33…but I understand your point. I don’t agree though, as Tucker scored less points (34 compared to 40) in more games (74 to 68) and is small comparatively (5’10 178 to 6’3 242). Recchi (48pts, 72GP, 5’10 195) is older but was more productive.
If we’re going to sign or acquire any of them, why not just re-sign Recchi?? Statistically Bertuzzi is the next best, and physicality wise he is a piece missing from this lineup.
Recchi makes sense chemistry wise and production wise, Bertuzzi makes sense as a potential big bodied linemate for Kovalchuk or on the second line, but Tucker trails both in production and potential line placement. Not discounting Tucker’s offensive potential, but I don’t think he fills a need MORE than the other two players mentioned.
If any of those three are signed/resigned, I’d take Recchi, then Bertuzzi, then Tucker. Personally I’d rather see the role filled by Holzapfel or Machachek, or if more money is to be spent I’d like Ryder or Huselius.
Nikita — Kwiatkowski signed in May with Severstal Cherepovets of the Russian League. Whatever you were smoking must’ve been STRONG.
UD4L — Smith is 34 and Orpik 27. Both produced equally throughout the year, and both are physical presences. Based on age alone I’d take Orpik first, but Smith would be a good person to pair with Enstrom (though I don’t want to break up Havelid and Enstrom). Smith’s leadership might also be good for Bogosian (and the rest of the defense). But signing a physical 34 year old defender is risky, as the body breaks down on those types of players far sooner than other style defenders.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 12:14 AM | Link to this
ranallo - Bertuzzi has turned the lights off and left the “physicality” room. Ever since the incident, he hasn’t quite been the physical force he once was. Understandably so.
By ranallo10
June 28, 2008 12:46 AM | Link to this
Ever since the incident, he hasn’t quite been the physical force he once was. Understandably so.
And yet, he still outperformed Tucker last season…what’s that say about Girls Name Tucker?
By ranallo10
June 28, 2008 1:42 AM | Link to this
A little snippet from a story about Bryan McCabe.
“The Atlanta Thrashers, New York Rangers and New York Islanders all expressed interest in the 33-year-old at varying points last year and the belief is Toronto could find McCabe a new home relatively quickly if he softens on his contract.”
By Tim
June 28, 2008 3:57 AM | Link to this
LAC, why would we buy out Zhitnik. I mean this is his final season with the Thrashers. He may or may not finish the season with the Thrashers but thats another story.
If I understand the CBA correctly:
If a Player’s SPC has been terminated and bought out by a Club pursuant to the Ordinary Course Buyout provisions set forth in the SPC (which SPC also eliminates the concept of the “lump sum” buyout), the money due and owing to the Player pursuant to the buyout shall be paid out in accordance with the terms of the SPC (e.g., one-third or two-thirds of the remaining Player Salary due and owing, to be paid over twice the remaining years of the terminated and bought out contract), and the amounts paid under such Buyout agreement shall be included in the Actual Club Salary and Averaged Club Salary (as set forth in this Article 50) of the Club that bought out the Player during any League Year in which the buyout is paid, and the amounts paid under such buyout agreement shall also count against the Players’ Share for any League Year in which the buyout is paid (an “Ordinary Course” Buyout).
So if I understand correctly, because of Zhitnik age, we will owe him 2/3 of the value of the contract. Not only that but that would count toward our cap this season and next season even though if he do not play for the Thrashers anymore. So why would we buy ghim out when there is several other way to get rid of him without being penalyze for next season. Other teams buy out people because they need to free their salary, Thrashers don’t. Then again, maybe I misinterpret the CBA. If that the case, please ignore me.
By Tim
June 28, 2008 4:53 AM | Link to this
Just reread the example from the CBA and here is the calculation (if you want to see an example, that would be on page 207 of the CBS).
Original SPC amount Year 1: 3.5$ | Year 2: 3.5$ | Year 3: 3.5$
Original Average Amount Year 1: 3.5$ | Year 2: 3.5$ | Year 3: 3.5$
Buyout amount (2/3) Year 1: 0$ | Year 2: 0$ | Year 3: 2.333,333$
Buyout amount over twice lenght of original SPC Year 1: 0$ | Year 2: 0$ | Year 3: 1.166.666.67$ | Year 4: 1.166.666.67$
Bonus saving ( which is line 1 - 4 ) Year 1: 0$ | Year 2: 0$ | Year 3: 2.333.333.33$ | Year 4: N/A
Amount inclued in club average salary (cap hit which is line 2 - 5 ) Year 1: 0$ | Year 2: 0$ | Year 3: 1.166.666.67$ | Year 4: 1.166.666.67$
So in other words, by buying Zhitnik out this season, we would save 2.333.333.33$ this season on our cap. However, next season, there would be a 1.166.666.67$ that will count toward our cap. If we play Zhitnik out this season, we would paid the whole 3.5 millions instead of 1.166.666.67$ but we would be done with his contract. Even better, submit him to waiver and if someone claim him, depends on the situation, either we get his salary out of the book if someone claim on on his way down, or half his salary if someone claim him on his way up, or in worst case, we paid his whole salary and done with it without having a 1.1666.666.67$ count toward our cap next season.
More important is we have room in our cap this season so Zhitnik salary is kinda non factor in our situation. However who knows if the cap will be increase or decrease next season? If it decrease, then the 1 millions dallars hit can be a huge factors when come time to sign RFA/UFA.
Sound complicated uh? I myself not sure if I understand everything, but that’s how it calculated.
So there is a lot of thing need to be checked. Buying someone out is easy to say, but do involve a lot of calculation obviously. I just want to see how much Toronto have buyout salary hitting on their cap since they seems to buyouts a lot of people lately.
By Tim
June 28, 2008 5:25 AM | Link to this
And just a list of RFA/UFA that needed to be sign next season if you are interested:
RFA: Colby Armstrong Erik Christensen Jim Slater Chris Thorburn Jordan Lavallee Tobias Enstrom Boris Valabik
UFA: Eric Perrin Brad Larsen Alexei Zhitnik Nic Havelid Ken Klee
So as you can see, some name worth mentioning up there.
And just for fun, I made the calculation with the 4 players LAC wanted to buyout and here id the total cap hit for all the 4 players should we bought them out:
Season 2008-2009: 2.594M$ Season 2009-1010: 2.514M$ Season 2011-2012: 0.597M$ Season 2012-2013: 0.822M$ Season 2013-2014: 0.822M$ Season 2014-2015: 0.822M$
Todd White contract have 3 years left. that mean if we buy him out, we will have a buyout hit to carry for the next 6 season. And just remember, those are dead salary against the cap.
You gotta love the new CBA, make those GM work harder! hahaha
By BigAl
June 28, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this
Give Zhitnik a chance to play 18-22 minutes a game and ALL you Z haters will be eating your words!
He might not be “young” but he’s a heck of a lot better than all of our D with the exception of the Swedes.
Oh and by the way, its BOGEY not BOGO!
By Smoothie
June 28, 2008 9:54 AM | Link to this
Wow Tim that was impressive. I’m glad there is someone out there who can understand all of the legalese of the league’s CBA. Me thinks bumbling Donny won’t be able to understand any of that! ;-) Hope he has some good attorneys working for him.
ranall0 — thanks for correcting me…for some reason I had it in my head that Bertuzzi was older than 35 but he’s still 33. I checked after I posted but was too lazy to come back here and admit I jumped the gun. If it weren’t for the fact I hate him so much, I would welcome that big body here as protection for Kovy. But alas, I can’t forgive him.
At any rate, you’re points are duly noted and make a strong case. Strangely enough, Rex might just be the best value among the three (Tucker, Bert & Rex) RW when you weigh all of the criteria. For my money, I like Rolston at 4.5 mill or Ryder at 3.5 mill. And we’d still have enough left over for Kari and Campbell if the ASG spends 47-48 M.
I know, I know, don’t count on the ASG to spend that much, but I fear if they don’t, the whole thing will begin to seriously unravel.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 11:25 AM | Link to this
We already know this, I’m just hoping the ASG does. From Eklund’s new blog:
July 1 salaries are always high for many reasons, but the one reason that is always overlooked is the fact that season ticket renewals go out mid July. Trust me when I tell you a team with dwindling season tickets is ALWAYS going to be far more aggressive on July 1.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this
Nikulin update:
Article
Babelfish translation:
Ilya Nikulin: “Into the contract they introduced the point, on which “[Ak] the panther” must let go me in [NKHL]” The defender “Of [ak] of panther” and team Russia Ilya Nikulin stated that yet he was not determined with the fact, in which command the following season will be conducted. “On July 26 us they wait in Kazan on the first collection. But I thus far do not know, where I will play in the following season. There is a proposal from “Atlanta”, club of Ilya [Kovalchuk]. In my contract from “[Ak] panther” they introduced the point, on which me they must let go in [NKHL], if there they call. Exactly now my agent is occupied by this question. In any event thus far it is still far to the new season. I want already two weeks not about which, besides leisure, not to think”
So Nikulin has an NHL out clause and he will be hanging out for two weeks while his agent negotiates. C’mon, get on it, Waddell.
By Sara
June 28, 2008 12:46 PM | Link to this
God that would be such a boon if we could finally get Nikulin over here. And now is really the time for him because not only do we need him but this off-season likely would render his best contract offer. My question is, how much would his contract be limited since he would technically be an NHL rookie? I’ve always felt like that was a sticking point, that the limited dollar figures of a rookie contract couldn’t compete with what he could make in Russia. When do we lose his rights anyway?
By Alan
June 28, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this
ranallo - You mistake me for someone who actually wants Tucker here. Seriously, I don’t want Tucker here. But to say Bertuzzi is, overall, a physical force is being disingenuous if you watched him at all in the past two years.
I’d take Bertuzzi “for the right price” (no more than 1.5m/yr, bonuses can be added). But not at his current contract. Anaheim waived him for a reason, after all, and that reason appears to be that his production didn’t merit a $4m price tag.
Same reason Zhitnik should be waived.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this
Sara - I don’t think we do lose his rights, being that there’s no transfer agreement between the NHL and Russia.
Everyone - This is in French … but Zhitnik has been waived! Oh, happy days!
By Tony C.
June 28, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this
Here’s google translation:
Ilya Nikulin: “In a contract made item on which” Ak Bars “should release my NHL” Defender “Ak Leopard” and Team Russia Ilya Nikulin said that has not yet been determined so as to what the team will hold next season. “We are waiting for July 26 in Kazan at the first assembly. But I still do not know where will play next season. There is a proposal from the “Atlanta”, the club Ilya Kovalchuk. In my contract with “Ak Bars” made item on which I should release in the NHL, if there pozovut. Just now my agent is addressing this issue. In any case, until the new season still far away. I want another two weeks about anything except rest, not thinking “, - leads words Nikulina
By kracker
June 28, 2008 1:28 PM | Link to this
C’mon, some GM pick Zhit up on the way back up, if not going down.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this
Babelfish:
C’ is with the turn of the defender Alexei Zhitnik of Thrashers d’ Atlanta to see itself showing the door. Its team decided to submit her name to the ballot with an aim of repurchasing her contract s’ it n’ is not claimed by l’ one of the 29 other formations of the Bettman circuit. L’ last year, Zhitnik marked three goals and obtained five master keys in 65 parts. In career, it adds up 96 goals and 375 master keys in 1085 meetings with Kings of Los Angeles, the Sabres of Buffalo, Islanders of New York, Flyers of Philadelphia and Thrashers. It had been a choice of round fourth of Kings in 1991.
Hilarious…master keys lol!
By kracker
June 28, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this
Bad news. Malone And Roberts traded To Tampa Bay!
Thrashers board
The link listed there is bad but the article text is posted in post #3. “The Tampa Bay Lightning have acquired the rights to left wings Ryan Malone and Gary Roberts from Pittsburgh in exchange for a conditional draft pick in 2009, owners Oren Koules and Len Barrie announced.”
By Alan
June 28, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this
That doesn’t mean anything unless they’re signed. I would be worried if it was Campbell they acquired negotiating rights to.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this
Confirmation of waiver action from TSN:
“The Atlanta Thrashers made a move on Saturday, placing defenceman Alexei Zhitnik on waivers. The 15-year veteran was acquired from Philadelphia for defenceman Braydon Coburn on Feb. 24, 2007.”
By Brendan
June 28, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this
“Alexei Zhitnik will be a big part of our upcoming season. [The idea of buying out his contract] “We never discussed that.” — Don Waddell
By Alan
June 28, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this
Brendan - You’re indeed correct. And it really looks like he is becoming a big part of our upcoming season, doesn’t it?
Everyone here should be more than aware that Don will say stuff just to save face, even if he goes back later and does something different. This should be clear evidence of that, and should come as no surprise to anyone that he would say something one minute, and do something else the next.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this
That’s true Alan, they have bought the exclusive rights to negotiate w/ them. But these new owners sound serious, don’t they, and I’m jealous. The ASG better get on it if the Thrashers hope to keep up.
By Sara
June 28, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this
Thank the hockey gods for small favors regarding Zhitnik. No one is going to pick him up of course, but it still means we can buy him out on Monday.
Kracker I feel like you do re: Tampa. Those owners definitely mean business. That club is likely going to be scary. Malone had said previously it would be a waste of time and picks to trade for his rights since he fully intended to go the FA market on July 1. I wonder, though, if he meant it was a waste for Columbus. Tampa would look much more attractive than Columbus.
I’m getting antsy waiting for July 1. Waddell better do something awesome and with a quickness.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this
Interesting prospect analysis on
Ilya Nikulin
I’m ready if he is!
By five_hole
June 28, 2008 3:00 PM | Link to this
YES!!!! Happy Day!!!!! Thank you **Alan!
Waddell gave the infamous “You’re doing a heck of a job, Zhittie”! So far, Waddell’s had a pretty decent June.
As our D (now deserves an upper case) stands:
Havelid Enstrom Exelby ? Valabik ? Klee
Having been a #1 pick a few years ago, and having a bit of a nasty streak in him, I think Valabik makes the roster this year (3rd pairing). Klee has value as a 7th man, so X by default gets the 2nd pairing. Begosian is an outside chance (a right handed D-man is really valuable) but I’m hoping he gets a half year at least in Chicago first. Next year Havelid is a UFA and Zack can have his spot.
Larsen is dead weight on the roster, but at league minimum, he can be the 13th or 14th forward, for all I care. Now the question is what to do about Todd White.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this
five_hole - It’s impossible for Bogosian to go to Chicago. He either comes here or goes back to the OHL. I fear he has exceeded the talent level of the OHL, and has nothing else to learn there. He is, however, too young for the AHL.
So to further his development, he must come to Atlanta.
Also, I must be the only person who doesn’t give a damn about the Tampa Bay story. So they acquired the rights of someone who would do better in a retirement home, and someone whose full intentions is to go to free agency. Looks like the owners are giving empty promise to their fans while attempting to scare the rest of the division.
By Sara
June 28, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this
five_hole Bogo won’t get any time in Chicago next season - he isn’t old enough to play in the AHL. It’s either here or back to the Petes. Hopefully it’ll be back to the Petes as we’ll have a shiny new FA D-man to insert into Zhit’s place.
I feel kinda bad for the guy - he’s a friendly, funny guy. Spoke to him for a bit at Casino Night. Makes it harder when you meet these guys and know what cool people they are - but it doesn’t change the fact that he’s a detriment to this club in more ways than one.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 3:17 PM | Link to this
Personally, I feel the same as you do, Sara. Zhitnik was my dealer on Casino Night. He was funny and let everybody win if possible, looking at the next card and not hitting you if it would make you bust.
By Smoothie
June 28, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this
Woo hoo!! Thanks be to Jesus! Don’t let the dasher board hit you on the a$$ Zhitty!! Seriously, sorry it didn’t work out but this is a very good sign. Now it’s time to ante up and sign B Campbell! Oh, and while we’re at it, trade White to the Sens for the rights to Vermette and trade Ex to anyone for a draft pick next year. Then there’s plenty of money to sign 2 of the following: Rolston, Ryder, Vrbata or even Huselius. Time to get down on my knees and pray!!
By five_hole
June 28, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this
Alan and Sara - Bogosian was born on July 15, 1990, which will make him 18 in a couple of weeks. Why is that not old enough for the AHL? I googled and found an age limit jumping from the OHL to the AHL, but I thought I was reading something about if the player is 18 by September of that year he was eligible - then my browser crashed (this PC has problems with .PDFs). Given a choice of having him or Zhit on the roster, I’d rather have Bogo. As I said, he’s a right handed shot, which we need.
I frankly won’t shed a tear for Zhitnik. We paid him $3.5 million dollars last year to stink up the joint. I’m sure he’ll find some other team to take him, either here or in Europe or Russia. The only thing I’m sorry about is that we have nothing to show for giving Coburn away.
By Hockey Jesus
June 28, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this
Smoothie - You’re welcome.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this
five_hole - A player must either be 20 years of age or must have completed four years of junior hockey to play in the AHL. This doesn’t include AHL tryout contracts, which a junior player can play in the AHL once their junior team has been eliminated from the playoffs (or doesn’t make the playoffs).
Therefore, Bogosian must play in the OHL or NHL this year. No in-betweens.
By five_hole
June 28, 2008 4:08 PM | Link to this
Thanks Alan. Well, I wouldn’t want to ruin the kid by jumping him to the NHL too early, but on the other hand, as you said, he’s outgrown the OHL.
By Thorburn's Thugs
June 28, 2008 6:06 PM | Link to this
Nikita Question. Are you friends with Klee? Married to him? Are you his agent? Seriously. Because i’ve never seen anyone so worried about defending and sticking up for himhim. The way I see it, when he was paired with Zhitnik, they both stunk. When he was paired with Exelby, it made Exelby suck. He and Zhitnik could never seem to make the transition to the New NHL.
Thank god we waived Zhitnik! That is one serious monkey off our back. We should waive Larsen too because I think somebody would pick him up. We don’t need him here because we don’t have room for him. Klee I would also waive (unless he is tradeable to somebody).
Exelby, White, Slater should be shopped around. And Brian Campbell needs to 1st Priority on July 1st. Overpay if you have to - it may be your only hope. I think the fans could deal with us overpaying to get him - I know I can.
By Tim
June 28, 2008 6:49 PM | Link to this
Thorburn’s Thugs Because unlike some other Thrashers, Klee actually earned his salary last season. He did what we asked him to do which is to be on third pairing. Now XLB did have a off season last year but can that be blame on Klee? I believe the Falconer actually have some numbers to show that Klee was one of our most effective defensement last season whererever XLB and Mac have been among the worst.
Also it is nice to have Bogosian up here with us in the NHL but he need a veteran mentor and Klee can play that role, just like Havelid did to Enstrom. Remember Coburn? He didnt have that mentor with the Thrashers but found his in Philadelphia with Hatcher and he did say himslef that Hatcher help him improve his game. I believe the fact that he bing trade did help also.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this
TT I am none of the above on your list of Klee associations. Just a fan who thinks Klee is servicable as out 6/7 Dman on a rebuilt Thrashers roster. I doubt he goes anywhere. But put me in the Thorburn camp, I hope he reports in super good conditioning, he can help us.
By Sam
June 28, 2008 7:33 PM | Link to this
Well I would be very worried about Malone being a Lightning signee. They just didn’t give away a 4th round pick for pure speculation. Roberts is a leader in the locker room, something Tampa Bay lacked since Andreychuk retired and Tim Taylor was lost to injury. Maybe Roberts wouldn’t fit here in Atlanta but our rivals could be a lot stronger as their new owners promised. Must be nice…
By Vince
June 28, 2008 7:47 PM | Link to this
That’s right Sam. Tampa is making a statement that they are serious. Wadell and his cronies better keep up!
By Brendan
June 28, 2008 8:22 PM | Link to this
Back in April I posted that we must measure ourselves against Tampa Bay, for the purposes of accountability. Both clubs essentially got dismantled. We lost Savard, Hossa (come July 1st, barring a miracle,) Kaberle, Coburn. The Bolts lost Khabibulin, Richards, Fedotenko, Prospal and a few others, plus Andreychuk retired. We both finished at the bottom of the league in 2008 and went into the lottery draft together. The Bolts kept Feaster as GM and changed Head Coaches, firing Tortorella in favor of Barry Melrose. The Thrashers kept Waddell as GM, and Waddell stepped aside after replacing Bob Hartley, and was replaced by John Anderson. On Draft Day 2008, the Bolts took Steven Stamkos and we took Zach Bogosian.
Last time this happened … it was 2001. Tampa finished 30th and Atlanta finished 29th. In 2003, the Lightning made the playoffs and won a round, then lost to the eventual Cup winners, New Jersey. In 2004, Tampa Bay won the Stanley Cup. Meanwhile, Atlanta missed playoffs in 2003, 2004, 2006, etc., and still haven’t won a playoff series. Or a playoff game.
By kracker
June 28, 2008 9:04 PM | Link to this
Well, Brendan, maybe it’s our turn to rise up.
By Sage of Bluesland
June 28, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this
Or, maybe, we will continue to hear the bluster from the highest offices of the organization while other teams rise, fall, and rise again while the sheep continue to make excuses for our consistently unacceptable performance…
(If you can even call it that)
Well, here’s to the next ten-year ‘Five-Year Plan’ and ‘Building Through the Draft!’ (part II)…
By ThrasherNY
June 28, 2008 10:05 PM | Link to this
Brendan: you cant post the above comment about comparing us to the Lightning enough.
I still want to puke when I meet people who think DW deserves to keep his job. They all bring out the laundry list of excuses about the ‘accident’ and the goalie injuries etc as if these things only effect our franchise.
The other common trait they all seem to have is they dont feel that fans deserve better than to watch a team that may make the playoffs. We deserve to watch a team that could win the Cup!
I have no doubt that Tampa will come out of this off season with a team that can contend. I wish I could say the same for us. DW has only fielded a Cup contending squad once (‘05-‘06). Even that season our blueline was questionable but at least we went into the season thinking we had a chance.
DW is not only a proven failure as a GM but a liar. Just the other day we heard about how Zhitnik was going to play a big part of our future. Just like last year was a “youth movement”. This year we all bought into the line about signing big names in the offseason. While I hope to god he lives up to his word this time I can only doubt it as he has a consistant track record of lying.
By Alan
June 28, 2008 11:07 PM | Link to this
Tampa Bay acquired negotiating rights! Everybody panic!
Get a grip, people. 1 July and the start of the season just can’t come soon enough.
By Sara
June 29, 2008 12:22 AM | Link to this
Sage, get over yourself. Detroit once had a five year plan too - the year they drafted Yzerman. Five years to win the Cup - it took them 14. Sometimes, stuff happens.
I am SO OVER all the Waddell bashing. Yes, the team sucked bad last year. Yes, Waddell has screwed some stuff up. But guess what - he’s still here and that’s not changing at the moment and I really don’t feel like spending the next 3 months until the season starts hearing about it. New topic…please.
Alan it isn’t so much that Roberts or Malone are a guaranteed signing that I’m looking at - it’s how agressive these new owners are about spending money and being proactive in the market. I’m just not amused to see a division rival getting busy.
FA worries me because even throwing money around doesn’t guarantee we’ll get a player. I do not think there can be any question that DW will make a run for Campbell but it doesn’t guarantee we’ll get him. He may get better offers from teams that are stronger right now. That’s the problem with rebuilds…top-quality NHLers looking for championships often want no part of them. While I hope Don is busy on the market, I’d also like to see him focus his efforts on some of our RFAs and also Nikulin. We need to get these young guys here, playing, and getting up to the NHL level. We’ve squandered too many years not developing our young talent either here or in Chicago and it’s killing us in terms of depth and having young, cheap players.
I’d rather bring in a Tier-II defensive d-man at this point than blow a load on Campbell (who isn’t as sound in his own end as he ought to be for the money he’s potentially going to get) and mostly assess the talent we do have. Enstrom is a solid two-way d-man, Bogo is an offensive d-man. What we need is a really good veteran defensive d-man to mentor Bogo, Kulda, and Valabik, possibly Nikulin as well. Those 5 are the ones we need to focus on the most…they should be our future. The rest is just veteran filler to help get these guys where they need to be.
By Alan
June 29, 2008 12:29 AM | Link to this
Sara - It’s counting chickens before eggs are hatched. I think I’ll be more worried when they start actually signing top-tier free agents. This? This is nothing but posturing, and it worries me that everyone seems to be getting so panicky about a couple of people looking to make a name for themselves.
Before panicking, wait until free agency.
Having said that, don’t be surprised to see Malone sign in Tampa. And even having read that, I’m not worried or in a state of panic. It’s hockey. And while we all want to see our teams do well, we aren’t going to get ahead (or have peace of mind) if we keep looking to our south.
By LAC
June 29, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this
Hey tim… what is YOUR issue with my observations of the Thrashers ?
Mine are a mirror image of many who blog here, but you the all knowing, all seeing one, singles me out for your snide little worthless comments.
From where I sit, you know very little about professional hockey, pillow fighting seems more your style.
By ranallo10
June 29, 2008 12:54 AM | Link to this
Alan — I didn’t confuse you with wanting Tucker, I was merely saying that if Bertuzzi has lost it but still outperformed Tucker, then perhaps neither are a good option.
I was simply responding with a jab at Tucker, not at you.
Smoothie — Rolston is 35, are you sure you want him signed in Atlanta?
Sara — I agree somewhat with Alan, it’s not worth worrying about. They can trade picks for a 40 year old and a young powerforward winger. They’ll also have to overpay that winger and still be completely lacking in the net (Mike Smith? I’m not sold).
Personally I’m more worried about how the money will be spent by Atlanta to achieve the salary floor.
Re: Zhitnik — I’m surprised Waddell finally did something with him. We’ll see if he actually buys Zhitnik out. He may just bring him back through waivers so another team can claim him at half cost…costing Atlanta far less in the long run.
By Brendan
June 29, 2008 1:05 AM | Link to this
ThrasherNY, until Zhitnik is either claimed off waivers or bought out, or something close to permanently stashed in the AHL, it’s not over ‘til it’s over. But feel free to hope that Zhitnik will be gone when training camp opens in the Fall. Or, at least, when the team takes to the ice for “Opening Night” in October.
Sage, I think a lot more people do realize what has happened, and is happening, with the Atlanta Thrashers hockey club. Sage, one must look at the comments posted just above by ThrasherNY, they dont feel that fans deserve better than to watch a team that may make the playoffs. We deserve to watch a team that could win the Cup!, then look to Vancouver—who fired GM David Nonis over a winning record over three (3) seasons. Before I move on, ThrasherNY’s comments are taken a bit out of context—he’s referring to certain fan’s sentiments, rather than the ownership’s stance, but I think it’s apt to cite the comments, since this ownership didn’t fire Waddell after a rather infamous track record of wins and losses over eight seasons. Remember, folks, Vancouver won a playoff series over Dallas, 4-3, in 2007, before they ultimately were eliminated by the Stanley Cup Champions, Anaheim.
Alan, I agree that people shouldn’t freak out over contract signings that haven’t happened yet. Whether it’s Kari Lehtonen or Tampa’s attempts to improve their hockey club. The only thing that matters is what actually transpires. Does Tampa, a team housed within our division, better itself substantively over this and next season? Time will tell. Kari will be re-signed before training camp. Whether that’s a one-year or two-year, or three or more-year deal, is anyone’s guess. A one-year deal opens a lot of speculation for the future. But, it also might be Don’s way of saying, “Kari, it’s up to you to push your dollar value higher. We’ll give you that chance, rather than low-balling you with a contract you might regret down the road.”
As a side note, many teams are trending towards six-year deals when their higher quality players hit RFA status, provided that the club has “faith” in said players. Giving a player a 3-year deal, at the RFA point, means the GM is just extending an audition, and the player will have to jump through these contract hoops all over again relatively quickly. Three years down the road, the player will either get a huge pay day or already be on the decline, pay-wise. Egos being what they are, some players will be insulted and offended by a 3-year deal, in RFA status. I don’t think that necessarily applies, here, to Kari, however. Stay with me. I truly think Waddell wants to give Kari a big, huge contract, in the five million plus dollar ($5M+) range. Such a salary would justify his position in the draft, 2nd overall, 2002, and reflect Kari to be a “franchise” type player upon which the organization has hung its hopes. Trouble is … Kari’s numbers aren’t there for big $$$. So, Don would look like an idiot with some 7-year, $45 million contract offer. That’s over $6 million in cap hit, for a player with recurring groin problems and mental focus issues, whose best season featured 34 wins. Kari will be restricted for three (3) more seasons. Don doesn’t fear losing the player, outside of an RFA offsheet, which is entirely another matter. So, I do think that a one-year deal isn’t meant to punish Kari, but rather, to energize him into his best season yet, so that Don can offer him a big-time contract, both in salary and length, that keeps boths sides happy for a good long while.
Sage & ThrasherNY, remember something else. Don and ownership may well be on an extended “rebuilding” project that could feature landing John Tavares in next year’s draft. Stop for a minute to chew on this nugget. If the ownership’s true goal is to sell the team. What BETTER set of circumstances to do that … than with a team, 2-3 years down the road, stocked to the rafters with high-end draft picks and prospects, with very low overhead, salaries right at the floor of the cap, to the new owners? It just, CHA-CHING!, drives up the price tag on closing day. The Atlanta Spirit Group stands to make a killing in 2010 or 2011, if they sell this club, by staying on this course.
“Yes, but Brendan, the fans will revolt!” I doubt that they take that seriously. In the worst case scenario, fans of the other teams will pack Philips Arena, to the tune of 8,000 a night. Keep in mind, payroll is at a bare-bones minimum. The ASG is “breaking even” before the revenue-sharing dollars kick in, so they don’t even suffer any financial losses en route to their monster pay day when it’s time to sell.
Actions speak LOUDER than words. If the ASG “greenlights” Don Waddell to spend to $52-$53 million on “Opening Night,” I’d retract most of this post. That’d be a sign that they CARE about winning, CARE about the fans, and WANT to improve their image as owners. I’m going with an “Opening Night” budget of $43-46 million, which is still $10 million below the cap limit. They are REQUIRED to field a team with at least $40.7 million in cap hit salary.
By ranallo10
June 29, 2008 1:19 AM | Link to this
That’s one helluva post to submit twice.
By Alan
June 29, 2008 1:20 AM | Link to this
ranallo - Sorry, I read that wrong, then. Thanks for clarifying.
Brendan - That’s what I mean. People are making Tampa out to be a very big deal. They’re not. Time will tell whether the moves everyone makes this off-season improves any team.
Don’t worry about Tampa, worry about Atlanta. Tampa is the least of our worries, as is Florida, Washington, Detroit, Anaheim, or Edmonton.
…Well, Edmonton might be. They like to go poaching for RFAs, after all.
By Tony C.
June 29, 2008 1:20 AM | Link to this
You have to figure Prospal is headed back to Tampa
By ranallo10
June 29, 2008 1:28 AM | Link to this
Tony C. — Prospal’s already there, now he just needs to re-sign.
Alan — I agree, we should worry about Atlanta and not other cities.
By Brendan
June 29, 2008 1:34 AM | Link to this
I got a message that said that the AJC site wasn’t responding, and that the post had “timed out.” I didn’t hit refresh. And I didn’t hit it twice. I simply went back to the main sports page of ajc.com and found it double-posted. Total apologies. Let’s see if this one double posts???
By ranallo10
June 29, 2008 1:43 AM | Link to this
Trixie is good at fixing that stuff, I’m sure she’ll get to it sometime soon.
By Brendan
June 29, 2008 1:57 AM | Link to this
God bless Trixie! And well, all French maids. Mais oui, tu peux revenir a ma chambre, n’importe quand tu voudrais. Pour, emmmm, l’arranger .. ou bien … la nettoyer … ou, un peu plus, si t’en as envie!
I can’t help myself, I think of the NHL TV commercial where the couple is “fantasy role-playing,” and the wife is decked out as a French chambermaid and the husband comes into the room, in full goaltender attire, including mask, waffle pad, stick, and goalie pads, with a Philadelphia Flyers jersey on. The wife looks at him, incredulously. He takes off his mask and says, “What? You said, ‘fantasy.’”
Well truly, Doc Emerick, “Hockey fans aren’t like other fans.” And while we’re on the topic, if Hossa winds up in Montreal, after all, we’ll all look at that NHL TV commercial with the two Habs fans remarking that a ‘certain player’ doesn’t play for Montreal yet, but will by ‘10:45 PM,’ as “Nostradamus” like.
By Tony C.
June 29, 2008 1:58 AM | Link to this
From Burnside’s RFA Column:
Minnesota forward Pierre-Marc Bouchard will be unrestricted a year from now, and the Wild aren’t crazy about paying him only to see him walk next summer, so he could be had and at a reasonable amount.
By Brendan
June 29, 2008 1:59 AM | Link to this
God bless Trixie! And well, all French maids. Mais oui, tu peux revenir a ma chambre, n’importe quand tu voudrais. Pour, emmmm, l’arranger .. ou bien … la nettoyer … ou, un peu plus, si t’en as envie!
I can’t help myself, I think of the NHL TV commercial where the couple is “fantasy role-playing,” and the wife is decked out as a French chambermaid and the husband comes into the room, in full goaltender attire, including mask, waffle pad, stick, and goalie pads, with a Philadelphia Flyers jersey on. The wife looks at him, incredulously. He takes off his mask and says, “What? You said, ‘fantasy.’”
Well truly, Doc Emerick, “Hockey fans aren’t like other fans.” And while we’re on the topic, if Hossa winds up in Montreal, after all, we’ll all look at that NHL TV commercial with the two Habs fans remarking that a ‘certain player’ doesn’t play for Montreal yet, but will by ‘10:45 PM,’ as “Nostradamus” like.
By LAC
June 29, 2008 6:04 AM | Link to this
Found this in The Sporting News NHL section.
We are REBUILBING for the how many times now ?????????
Young core ??? Maybe 3-5 players.
Yet another example where a team should be much better after 9 seasons then we are… But with worthless idiot owners and a GM who is now a BALD FACED LIAR… what in the HELL do you expect ???????????
Where to start? How about on defense? They have money to spend and could pursue a top-notch blue-line player. Trouble is, will an elite defenseman want to come to a struggling team? Rebuilding continues in Atlanta, and leadership and character are qualities this team needs as it constructs around a young core.
By Alan
June 29, 2008 6:56 AM | Link to this
LAC - We’re not “officially” rebuilding for the any’th time. We’ve been in a constant state of rebuild since 1999.
By LAC
June 29, 2008 7:19 AM | Link to this
Alan, depends on various publications and points of view.
But the fact remains, we should be a contender and NOT a pretender as we have been. This team has shown NO solid commitment to the players OR THE FANS, which a damn shame to say the very very least.
By Trixie (Rawhide's Secretary)
June 29, 2008 7:35 AM | Link to this
Brendan - There you go, young man….I swear, you and the double posts!!!!
Now…I’ve got to get back to posting Mr. Rawhide’s new blog.
By Brendan
June 29, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this
For what it’s worth, LAC, I think DW does feel very bad about how things have gone in his Administration. I think it’s his goal to rebuild this team PROPERLY this time. At least this way, when he does leave, he can say, “I fixed what I broke. And now, it’s up to someone ELSE to take the team to the next step.” Which will be in 2011-12, assuming there isn’t another lockout.
By Tim
June 29, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this
LAC - I have no issue with your observation. But that do not mean that I have to agree with you. I simply point out how much it would cost us in dead cap space should we buy out all the 4 players you mention. Period.
By LAC
June 29, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this
Ok Tim, point taken, BUT… Why keep players around who are not contributing to the team , that’s my point. Sure the $ hit is one thing, but to have a younger/faster/stronger player in the departed players place would be a plus.
Brenden, we have all addressed or commented on the defense needs.
But what about offense ? We need more offense. Who is available ?
Would UFA or trades be better ?
How about Malone ? Just looking for some scoring since defense has been the main topic lately.
By Rollie
June 30, 2008 10:55 AM | Link to this
LAC, why would we buy out Zhitnik. I mean this is his final season with the Thrashers. He may or may not finish the season with the Thrashers but thats another story.
Tim ask DW that. He’s the one that did it.
By Brendan
June 30, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this
LAC, I would look at Kristian Huselius, as a UFA. At the draft, like Hokie said, I think it was worth talking to the Flyers about Jeff Carter or RJ Umberger. If the Flyers would have taken our #29 pick for Umberger, I think that was a reasonable trade. Bygones.
But I’ll add this … we really don’t know if Leveille will turn out to be something good … or be the second-coming of Jim Slater. I hope for the former, not the latter. I think the CCHA is fertile ground for producing future NHLers, and that Michigan State, which won the National Championship in 2007, is as good as any school in the CCHA for developing talent.
LAC, I don’t mean for this to be a copout answer, but if I were Waddell, working for the Atlanta Spirit Group, whose presummed goal is “re-sale,” I wouldn’t go looking for some $6-8 million “solution” from FREE AGENCY. I’d bring up players from Chicago and pay them on the cheap, while I tried my best to get John Tavares in next year’s draft.
Keep in mind, a team whose payroll is at the floor of the salary cap, that is stocked with high-end draft picks, is a “wet dream” for a future buyer who is ACTUALLY SERIOUS about winning a Stanley Cup. I think the ASG will sell the team in 2011. At that point, the contracts of Don Waddell and John Anderson will be expiring.
Meaning???
Well, new owners could hire a serious caliber GM, who could install a high-end Head Coach, and spend what it takes to compete with the Detroits and New Yorks of the league. In the meantime, Waddell’s job is safe. He is doing PRECISELY what the ASG has directed him to do. Not even a 30th place finish would get him fired. There are enough fans from other markets who will go to games to see their hometown club when it visits Philips Arena. There are also enough people and corporate sponsors who will fork over money, “no matter what, no questions asked,” in BLIND SUPPORT of this club, to keep its head above water.