AJC > Sports Thrashers > Blog > Archives > 2008 > March > 09 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USThree Points, Three Questions From The Weekend
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Friday night the Thrashers were able to dust off the column under the “W” and change the 29 to 30. They had been waiting three weeks to do that. Much like that last win in New Jersey, it took a shootout following a last minute tying goal by Atlanta. This time it was Ilya Kovalchuk notching his 44th of the season with 44.9 seconds left in the third to send the game to OT. Back then it was…was…flipping through notes…this guy named Marian Hossa. Remember him?
Again the Thrashers were outshot…to the tune of 39-26. However this time it didn’t matter, as the home team was able to steal one away from the Wild.
The Moose was loose Friday as he stopped 37 of the 39 shots he face. The two that got by him were on power plays, the first being the 5-3 variety and the second following an atrocious hooking call against Joel Kwiatkowski. Even the Minnie-SO-tah TV guys found the call “questionable”.
Colby Armstrong notched his first goal in Thrasher blue and Erik Kristensen accounted for the only goal of the shootout, bouncing the puck off the pipe and having it ricochet off Wild goalie Niklas Backstrom into the goal. Just the way Erik drew it up!
Yes, the losing streak is over! The world is right! What’s next? Jews and Arabs embrace, Republicans and Democrats dance arm-in-arm, Stendec and Kari Lehtonen…well, let’s not get crazy. But, the losing streak was over.
Until…
Then there was the game in Sunrise, Florida the next night where the Thrashers blew an early 2-0 lead against the Panthers.
WAIT…the Thrashers HAD a two-goal lead TO squander? Yup, not since…flipping through notes… Marian Hossa, (there’s that name again), put home an empty netter with 40 seconds left in the February 2nd game in Washington had the Thrashers even possessed such a margin. So I guess they are just a little out of practice in that regards.
Atlanta eventually fell to Florida 3-2 in overtime. All five goals coming via man advantages. In fact…the Thrashers did not allow an even-strength goal in either game. This is good!
In the end, it was 3 points earned in back-to-back games. Given the poor showing this season in such pairings, not bad…not bad at all.
The Town Hall Meeting
Before the weekend’s games, there was this little chat that Don Waddell and Bruce Levenson had with the Season Ticket Holders. It was a much needed Q&A session that was called to try and defuse the tension stemming from raised ticket prices, poor play of the team and doubts about the management of the team. Apparently, it had not gone un-noticed by the two.
From it, one could surmise that there have been lessons learned from last season. Then, they were over anxious to cut a deal and try and make the playoffs even at the expense of the future. This year they were cautious to not mortgage the future to get someone like, say, a Brian Campbell type.
OK, I can dig that. I can dig it even more if the two are indeed serious about targeting such a top-flight defender this summer…or two. If so, it would indicate that the front office has begun that paradigm shift towards placing the emphasis on defense.
There will be plenty of room under the cap to spend on such upgrades. Time to open up the checkbook, boys.
Bruce Levenson acknowledged the fact that keeping Don Waddell behind the bench was not the correct move to make. Many here have said that for a while…why, even Brendan has recently come to this realization.
But this is now water under the bridge. Whether or not Don should/should not have stayed there so long is no longer relevant. What is important is that there WILL be a new coach for next season and it appears as though John Anderson is still on the top of that list. I would support that whole-heartedly.
It seems a though Don Waddell came across to those in attendance as one who is very aware of some problems the team is facing, (see also: defense). He was also said to have been very sensitive to the fact that he was in a room filled with some less-than-happy paying customers.
Bruce Levenson, on the other hand…from the accounts I have read, not so much so.
Now, Some Questions For You
Lastly, even though there are a great deal of questions that remain, the fact is I think everyone would agree that this was the right thing for Don Waddell and Bruce Levenson to do. It’s too bad that it took a near revolt from the paying customers to bring it about. However, I applaud their willingness to do so.
But ultimately there are 3 big questions that stem from Friday’s pow-wow that you need to answer, and this includes the lurkers out there:
Would you like to see more THM like this, say 2 or 3 times a year, especially during this period of transition?
If you were of the thought that Don Waddell should be removed as the general manager of the team, has your mind been changed?
(And this is, after all, the most important question)…did the THM convince you to re-up your season tickets for next season?
Comments
Commenting is now closed for this entry.
By Thrasher Ryan
March 9, 2008 8:30 AM | Link to this
Rawhide—I hope you mean John Anderson, not Mike Anderson. Mike plays on the Denver Broncos I think.
I’m gonna stick with my guns on this one, Rawhide. Waddell has to go. He had his chance. A whole decade.
I think Waddell’s Entire “System” is flawed. His “System” of signing older, journeymen type players no other teams want is just not gonna put a product on the ice that can win consistently in the new NHL. We are the 2nd oldest team in the league, and the 3rd worst team in the league. See the connection? And whose fault is that???
Defense Wins Championships, and we have all seen Waddell cannot spot Defensive talent to save his life. Come on, you know he just got lucky with Enstrom.
Rawhide—I must give credit where credit is due. I think it was blogger Bob that came up with that April 6, 2008 Waddell firing date. He posted that around October or November I believe. Sounds good to me!
The Town Hall Meetings are good; but at this point it’s too little too late. Seems like they were doing a little scrambling to “fix” their little PR nightmare.
I have a new question for everyone though…. “Should we trade up our 2 1st rounders and grab Stamkos? Or would you rather save both picks?”
By Plenty Of Empty Seats
March 9, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this
Good Morning Bill,
My answers to your questions - in reverse order.
3. No. I’m finished as a STH. I look at results, past actions and the general disarray of the organization as factors influencing my decision. You know… things like winning games, the players on-ice effort, the quality of the coaching staff, management’s personnel decisions - and a collection of disconnected owners.If I choose, then I’ll see plenty of hockey next year, but instead of paying >$90 a seat, I’ll pay half that - just like the fans in my section did this year, last year and the year before that.
Ultimately, getting seats will not be a problem. Getting wins will be the problem next season and that’s what I’ll pay to watch.
2. No, but solving the issues goes much go much deeper than changing the GM. 1. This point is irrelevant to me as I will no longer be an invited guest.By Alan
March 9, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this
I’m currently watching a game from the Deutsche Eishockey Liga. Ingolstadt against Frankfurt. Ingolstadt is currently leading 2-1 in the second intermission. But just before that, the Ingolstadt goaltender made an amazing save on a Frankfurt breakaway.
Yesterday, I watched Modo and Skeleftea play in the Svenska Elitserien. Also a great game of defense on both sides. The score at the end of overtime was 0-0. No shootout or final deciding round.
I’m enjoying watching these games, no matter who wins, because I’m watching something that Atlanta doesn’t have - good defense.
Having read all accounts from the townhall meetings, I think Levenson should be fired instead of Waddell. What a dick Levenson was at that meeting. I’m not sure about Waddell, though. Do I think he should be fired? Not really. Do I think he will be fired? Yes. Someone’s got to take the fall for this season, and I doubt the owners will admit responsibility.
I’d like to hear about more townhall meetings taking place, Rawhide. I think there needs to be better relations between the fans and the folks who run this organ-i-zation.
Lastly… Thrasher Ryan - What do we need worse, defense or centers?
Well, the Ingolstadt-Frankfurt game is back on again. I might check back later.
By Rawhide
March 9, 2008 11:51 AM | Link to this
TR - Uh,…yeah….looks like I needed that extra hour of sleep last night :o) Thanks.
By stendec
March 9, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this
Good old Letemin. What a pile of Finnish crapola! Moose shows fire and grit to get two points. Letemin looks like prima donna with 2-0 lead then folds up like cheap toilet paper in overtime! What an oxygen waste. Want to see this loser allowing soft goals someplace else next season. Moose only Thrasher with inner fire fit to wear uniform. Perhaps Ilya Kolvachuk. Rest are completely expendable. Disposable better word! Send all the untalented quitters packing. Let good old Letemin lead the exodus! Bring in some players with heart, pride and toughness. GO FLAMES!
By Brendan
March 9, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this
“A Waddell ‘divided’ cannot stand.” I thought he could do it. And I was wrong. Dead wrong. Instead of being scared straight, with the boss standing over their shoulder, micromanaging their every move, these players downloaded porn. This is clearly the “effect” of a “Player’s Coach.” Bygones.
Since owners can’t be fired, our next best course of action is to have a new GM offer a fresh perspective. This one, Don Waddell, has more than had his chance. The results speak for themselves, as we look squarely at the bottom third of the Eastern Conference for the 7th time in 8 years.
By The Other Bob
March 9, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this
Looks like that punk Jerko Ruutu is gooning it up again versus Washington today…he’s pointed out Ovechkin to “keep is head up”…as the NBC guys in the booth said.
Of course, seeing that the league wussed out after his attack on Kovy 6 weeks a go, I’m sure he feels like he can head hunt all he wants with no need to fear accountability.
By kracker
March 9, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this
I’m hoping for a smart use of our #1 pick (I am hoping for no worse that drafting 4th, so go easy on the points the rest of the way Thrashers) to get either Stamkos (not too likely) or a ready to play d-man. That and shopping well on FAs this summer can get us back in it next season.
To that end, perhaps DW gave us a big clue in the STH meeting by saying they were moving away from the policy of bring in “experienced” (old) FAs. That may have been because of the owners’ orders to “win now.” A poster elsewhere said it may have been because DW was filling the roster with the vets Bob Hartley wanted to play…Or it may have been entirely DW’s doing.
Whatever the case, having expensive vets won’t get it done unless you also have a nice corps of talented, cheap younger players, which means having superior drafting skills and a solid player development program.
As for whether to try to move up in the draft by trading our two firsts, it’s too early to make that decision. It Atl wins too much and falls several drafting spots and also if the Pens make a deep playoff run, we prob have to try to trade up. OTOH, if we do as we should and secure no worse than the 4th draft spot (by finishing the season in the 28th position) and if the Pens fall quickly in the playoffs and give us maybe a 15-20 pick, I would go for getting two first rounders.
By ThrasherNY
March 9, 2008 1:34 PM | Link to this
Answers in reverse order.
3.) No longer living in atlanta I dont have to struggle with this decision. I did re-up after last season just before I left town but that was mostly because the of allstar game and not the ‘beleive in blueland’. If I were to be living in ATL I dont think I could bring myself to shell out for this product in leu of the all-star perk.
2.) NO! NO! and more NO! how could anyone who wanted DW to be fired have changed there mind at this point. We are back to the bottom of the league and looking at our roster there is not even the shell of an improved team to come. We have Kari, Kovy and Enstrom. X looks to be heading backwards in progress. Slater is a DUD. I would continue but that is the entire list of home grown talent we have. Help will not come in the summer either as no top UFA’s want to sign with us. We talk about Hossa forcing our hand because he didnt ‘believe in Blueland’ but no one ever mentions that the only reason we had Hossa was because Heatley didnt ‘believe in Blueland’ either. He just had a great excuse to point to as his reason to request the trade.
1.) I really use to enjoy the THM’s but started to question there value as they are just ‘spin’ control. In last years meetins at the end of the season we heard about the youth and signing Hossa. It was likely the secondary reason for most STH’s to return after the all-star game. It was all ‘spin’. Hossa walked and only Enstrom lasted on the team.
Standec: Kari is not the problem my friend. He saw 40 shots last night. Goal tending is 75% talent and 25% a numbers game. 40 SOG per game automatically starts us on the wrong side of the fence for the numbers game.
By kracker
March 9, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this
Oh, let me stress that by finishing the season in the 28th position we also have a good shot in the draft lottery at maintaining the 3rd draft position or even moving up to the 1st or 2nd pick. Drafting 4th is just the worst case senario of finishing 28th.
By volgrad1985
March 9, 2008 2:26 PM | Link to this
Hi Rawhide and all other fans,
I am a “lurker” that was finally compelled to write. I am a first year STH and attended this THM. I get it that alot was spin control, but I also know that alot was truth.
I think the THMs are important, not just for the STHs, but also for the owners and GM. Thus, I believe having 2-3 per season is vital to all involved, I highly recommend it in future seasons.
Apparently unlike most readers here, I am, unfortunately, not a billionaire hockey team owner, so I don’t have the luxury of deciding to hire or fire the GM. Do I think Don knows what has to be done? Yes. Has he been able to do it yet? No. Does he want to succeed? Certainly. Is he capable of doing so? I still want to say yes. Is there another prospective GM out there that is competent and available? I dunno.
I was on the fence about renewing, but the THM did convince me to renew for next season. Granted, I won’t be happy if we do not get the 2-D and 1-C that Don said we would get, but that, along with an actual system or philosophy of play from a new coach, should make a huge difference.
Face it, I love hockey too much not to attend every game I can. Surely, we have had mediocre-to-bad hockey for 6 of 8 seasons, but how would you like to be a Columbus Blue Jackets, Arizona Cardinals, Vanderbilt football, Chicago Cubs, or LA Clippers fan? Or worse, a Hartford Whalers or Quebec Nordique fan?? I want my team to win, and I want my team to stay, so I will continue to support them positively.
By Thrasher Ryan
March 9, 2008 2:45 PM | Link to this
Alan—It depends on the context of your question. Are you talking about the draft, or Free Agency? Or just overall team needs?
For the draft, I would go with Stamkos, because everything I have read has said he is NHL ready NOW, whereas I have read that Doughty would need a year or 2 of deveopment before he is NHL ready. With Stamkos, you could give Kovy the elusive #1 Center, and lock him up for years to come.
I would like to address DEFENSE via Free Agency this summer. AFTER we lock up KL and our other RFA’s. Like I have said previously, I would start with Campbell and work from there.
But to answer your question Alan, IMO our biggest problem is DEFENSE, or lack of. That was a gimmie :) We’ve all known that all season.
Everybody—See how much closer and exciting the games are when Zhitnik is not in the lineup? Just sayin…
I agree with stendec too, this team is TOO SOFT. Atlanta needs to become a big, punishing team that all teams should fear coming to ATL to play. As it stands now, we are a joke and other teams look forward to bullying us around.
By Alan
March 9, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this
ThrasherNY - Telling stendec that Kari is not the problem isn’t a way to use your time wisely. We’ve all told him, countless times this season already.
By ThrasherNY
March 9, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this
Alan: Good heads up I wont waste my time again.
This is what concerns me about the ‘spin’ Rawhide so gratiously paraphrased above. Early in the season I speculated that the placement of DW behind the bench after the firing of BH was our ownership requiring the GM to be accountable with the assets he thought were being mis-managed under BH. It appears I have assumed to much.
When BL says he knows it was the wrong move, to leave DW behind the bench, it signals to me that no such expectation was in place. From this i conclude that it was about saving cash not about testing the merit DW’s roster. I am now resigned to the fact that DW is going no where. He will remain as our GM so that ASG can run a fiscally responsible business. As a capitalist I cant say I blame them but as a hockey fan this realization if a crushing blow to my competitive spirit.
By B. Hartley
March 9, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this
Once again —-> DW is not the problem >>>> THE ATLANTA SPRIT GROUP of MORONS is the problem!! BLAME OWNERSHIP!! Turn the team over to BELKIN!
By LAC
March 9, 2008 5:33 PM | Link to this
Well, we need more defense, That is first concern…
Look at New Jersey, We have outscored them by 6 goals… 186 to 180.
But… We have given up 230 goals (fifteen away from total of last season) and they 159. A 71 goal against swing.
They have a Hall of Fame Goalie sure, but I bet if he had the defense we have this season he’d retire…
Two things, we need 1 or 2 puck handling defensemen, and we need TOUGHNESS on defense, some guys who will knock guys on their butts in our end… No question, we are a creampuff team… Time to change !
Then we need BIG forwards, and guys who can win battles in the corner, and out muscle the other defense and STAND IN FRONT OF THE NET !
We need more scoring from our forwards, simply put our offense needs to be a LOT better.
Question is… WILL this team do it ?
I wonder if waddell will do anything, yeah nice guy… over his head… We will see.
I see next season as a critical one for this franchise. They need a BIG winning season and need to make a BIG leap in the east, enough of this coasting, which I believe most here will agree has taken place a lot of nights this season.
Lastly, NO MORE RETREADS, no more over 30 guys, that has failed here and does NOT need to be repeated…
Finally try to move up in draft to get #1 pick, would be NICE to see a Crosby type young player here…Real nice.
Lastly, We ALL need to understand bruce levenson is nothing more than a Potty Mouthed Lying Little Punk.
This man is NOT to be believed about anything. From reports, this RAT has no respect for the fans of this town, for all intent he is like all the rest just a bunch of LIARS, like one blogger put it, must be Daddy’s money, because when you come across like a Potty Mouth Punk it is a Real Sad State of affairs here in Atlanta.
Best solution… NEW OWNER Who Wants To WIN !!!!!!!!!
By sisu
March 9, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this
stendec, what are you smoking??? Can you share it?
Seriously, Kari had two goals that were fluky, one off of Klee’s skate the other off his behind! He made many quality saves…
As to renewing, once you heard BL caal season ticket holders smart A*******esses it was the final straw that broke the camels back. I wonder how BL even made any money in his life time??? There is something to be said about respecting your customers! DW may just resign before the season is over with these clowns as owners! His body language indicated that at the meeting!
By Thrashy Thrashy
March 9, 2008 5:36 PM | Link to this
Belkin doesn’t want to own the Thrashers (he desperately wants to be an NBA owner and couldn’t care less about an NHL team), so my guess is that he’d sell them to someone else.
That’s certainly something to ponder…
By Dave
March 9, 2008 5:51 PM | Link to this
Levenson was a joke the other night. I was very unimpressed with his lack of understanding that people are upset to be paying more for a consistently deteriorating product and his use of borderline swears during his interaction with the STHs. His attitude stunk and he was defensive, sometimes insulting.
Giving DW credit, he was very honest, forthcoming, and tried to inject a little humor into a situation where he walked into the lion’s den. An approach totally different to that of the ASG rep.
There were some good implicit admissions though: Holik was the wrong choice as captain, the veteran leadership has stunk, the Zhitnik deal was not a good one. These are the things that are endearing to hear. But I tell ya, not a chance I am giving my hard-earned money to a guy like Levenson when he seems to have contempt for the people most loyal to a crappy product. I’ll take my couple thousand bucks and invest in a nice and big HDTV and Center Ice for next year. It’s not like tix are impossible to get anyway…
By PJ
March 9, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this
RH- Allright already, I will stop using the previous blog, Are you happy?
Q1 - Not a STH, didn’t go, can’t say. I would however be interested in sneaking into the next one. Who’s with me?
Q2 - DW seems sincere in his passion for this team, however lacks the skills to be a great GM or Coach. Maybe they can find a niche for him in another department removed from the players. Perhaps a position more involved with corporate sponsors, media relations or marketing. (Now I know I’ve just insulted a few of you - sorry.)
Q3- I’m not a STH and won’t be this year because of other obligations, not because of mis-management by ASG. I pay as I go, get comp’d or discounted tickets. This just works out better for me right now.
My final comment is this. If they are serious about making changes and moving forward then they will purge the negativity from the locker room right now.
1.) Anyone who is not working their tail off gets sent to Chicago regardless of their paycheck.
2.) Reward the players who do work their tail off, regardless of their paycheck as well.
3.) Rebuild the trust - by saying what you do, doing what you say.
By WW5
March 9, 2008 6:45 PM | Link to this
I AM ALWAYS ACCUSED OF BEING TOO HARD ON LETEMIN, SO I WILL COMMEND HIM FOR HIS PERFORMANCE IN FLORIDA. HE DID NOT GIVE UP THE .18 GOAL THIS TIME!!
By STH
March 9, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this
3 - NO - I have had enough. The miniscule discount offered for paying for the whole season up front is not enough. I can buy tickets throughout the season for less.By Bob
March 9, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this
Would you like to see more THM like this, say 2 or 3 times a year, especially during this period of transition?
No, they have been doing these town hall meetings and chalk talks since the first year promising us this and that. Talk is cheap, it’s way past time for action.
If you were of the thought that Don Waddell should be removed as the general manager of the team, has your mind been changed?
Uh, no. Waddell should be a politician, he spins with the best of them and has a good personable nature. Mabye they should put him in charge of PR for the club or something, just get him away from the GM chair.
(And this is, after all, the most important question)…did the THM convince you to re-up your season tickets for next season
Uh, no. I’m with stroz, it’s Missouri time. Show me.
By Rawhide
March 9, 2008 8:52 PM | Link to this
Plenty Of Empty Seats, ThrasherNY, Volgrad1985, Dave, Sisu, STH - Thank you all for your input! For those of you that posted for the first time, I hope you join in on the conversation more often.
“B. Hartley” - I agree whole-heartedly in regards to the ownership being part of the problem. That and Waddell is not soley to blame for the problems facing the team. However, DW cannot be held unaccountable for the situation the team is in. He has been in on, and a major part of, the decision making process.
PJ - regarding your Q2: As one of his job titles indicates, he also holds the Executive Veep position. The team could allow him to retain that position and find a new GM as well as a coach….sorta what the Falcons did to Rich McKay.
Personally I’d have no issue with that but I don’t this Waddell would go for it. He would resign if asked to…especially after the other night.
By D
March 9, 2008 10:53 PM | Link to this
I honestly couldn’t care much about THM, it’s nice to see the team show some simblance of caring though. Should DW go? I question his ability to do his job right if he can’t get a team together that will win championships. Will I reup? Well, I only have the 7 game pack the last two years and I will certainly reup. Winning or not, the THRASHERS are my team and even if they went 0 and 84, I would be there supporting the THRASHERS
By 12345
March 9, 2008 10:53 PM | Link to this
Been a STH since the start…
The THM was a joke, I wanted to really blast Levenson, but felt he was doing a good enough job all by himself.
I am sorry, but if the other “owners” are as dumb as this guy, we have no hope, none !
He came across as snot nosed know it all. The type person you do not like the moment you first meet him.
He seems to have no knowledge of NHL hockey, and is a PR Disaster…
Just found it hard to not call him a $OB to his face, he needed it too.
When folks left, reaction was Waddell came across as a guy with his hands tied, and Levenson as a complete jerk.
Just how did this guy get the $ to get involved with the Thrashers ? He just seems like a guy nobody would want to do business with at all. Just a complete mindless goob from my account, just hope I never meet him again, not worth my time.
I will NOT be renewing my ST’s next year, Bad product on the ice, questionable GM, and owners who are just out of their minds and they are killing The Atlanta Thrashers !
It would simply be best to sell the team as these owners are a complete joke !
By Midfield
March 9, 2008 11:33 PM | Link to this
Does anybody know what the status of Belkin’s law suit is at the moment?
By JLB
March 9, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this
I took a gamble last season and chose not to renew my season tix for this season because I just had a feeling that the wheels were going to fall off. Boy, was I ever right! I had every intention of coming back as a STH. But after the sheer embarrassment and disgrace that BOTH the ownership and GM are guilty of, I will never step foot into Philips Arena again until either one or (preferably) both Don Waddell has been removed from his position as GM and ASG has gotten their act together. I’ll just continue to get NHL Center Ice where I spend about $150 a year and get to watch up to 70 games a week! What a bargain!
By rockdr99
March 10, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this
I am out of town and just read the blog — I missed the THM for the same reason but have attended most —My question would have been, how would you describe our team’s style of play? — It defies description — We are not European, we can’t control the puck — We are not North American, we are way, way too soft — Until, we can answer that question, we will remain “unorganized rabble” — DW was asked after he took over from BH, could this team win with the present personnel — He said “Yes” — — “Wrong again”
I’ve been a STH for the Flames and Thrashers both since day one — I have already renewed — Why, I’m hooked on NHL hockey — I attend half the games in my regular seats and obtain cheap seats and move down for the other half — I enjoy the friendship of my hockey friends near my seat location —
DW must go — I’ve had enough — The team has no definition, spends money at the wrong time (Could we try the summer once for a quality FA), and can’t possibly win giving up the goal differential that we do —
THM are fine as long as the attendees realize they are getting ASG spin — I’m sorry that BL is a jerk too — It makes the ASG complete — If they couldn’t afford the poker game, they shouldn’t have sat down at the table — I’ve never heard of playing poker “not to lose” — If you do that, you know what happens, “you lose” — The other 29 owners must welcome these pigeons with open arms —
Other than that, things are just peachy —
By scott
March 10, 2008 7:52 AM | Link to this
1) This was the second THM this year. I couldn’t make either. I asked my rep to suggest that they videotape them and make the tape available to STHs who could not be there. But yes, I’d like them to continue. Even though they are total PR events, there is much to be said for getting the people in charge “On the Record”.
2) I’ve been on the fence with DW all season, and at various times jumping to either side. My initial reaction when BH was fired was that they fired the wrong guy, I am no longer sure about that. I am not sure what goes on between DW and ownership. He may in fact be doing the the best possible job given ownership’s mandates. On the balance I think he should go, or at the very least remove the GM title mainly because I think that staying on as GM will make it very hard on a new coach. Too easy a back door to good ol Don for the players, which will undermine a new coach.
3) What will get me to renew is the fear of losing the team to another city. I’m not sure how real that possibility is, but I’d rather go down and watch this team play, than have to see all the games on Center Ice - as good as the games are in HD, it doesn’t come close to actually being there.
By trlblzr
March 10, 2008 8:35 AM | Link to this
BL was a complete dick. if only he could be fired… you don’t treat your customers like that. i’ve been a loyal STH for 3 full yrs (and partial before that) and his attitude alone makes me not want to renew. what a fsckin d-bag. The Thrashers are in serious trouble with people like this running the show. Go Belkin!
By Nikita
March 10, 2008 8:56 AM | Link to this
scott, good point (#2)
DW was asked after he took over from BH, could this team win with the present personnel — He said “Yes” — — “Wrong again”
Please be more specific, ‘cause I don’t believe this. The team could probably win with its current roster, if that roster were correctly coached and motivated. And even keeping in mind certain glaring deficiencies, the team on the balance is capable. In fact, a good portion of the team was perfectly capable elsewhere, suggesting that strategy/coaching is the major issue.
By Lew318
March 10, 2008 9:36 AM | Link to this
RAWHIDE
By timthebrave
March 10, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this
stendec, you always blaming Kari cracks me up. Your like a guy at a baseball game blaming a pitcher for letting up 3 runs when his team made 9 errors. As far as the questions… 1. I think it’s necessay to let the fan base know the direction of the team but if they have it 2 or 3 times a year it would be 1 or 2 times of blowing smoke up our asses 2. My position stays the same. I think he is a decent GM but a terrible coach 3. I buy tickets to a game on an individual basis because I work for a company where I get about 10 free games a year
By AJ
March 10, 2008 9:56 AM | Link to this
Yes, I would like to have more THM throughout the season. Yes, I still think Don needs to go. He has been here since the beginning and he has OVERSTAYED his welcome and his usefulness. I would love to renew-but just can’t afford it right now :-(.
By Rawhide
March 10, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this
Yes, Lew318??? Did you call for me?
By AuburnZ
March 10, 2008 10:05 AM | Link to this
1) In past seasons, we had several chalktalks/town hall meetings. I would think that they were avoiding them this year, but in talking with my ST Rep it makes sense that Don has just been too busy. It was a new twist that an owner showed up, but would have had more of an impact if more than 1 showed up. It showed that they really don’t care about the Thrashers. I would like to see the owners and the GM participate in the questions of these meetings going forward. This meeting seemed a bit more disorganized as the microphones were not being passed around, not sure if that was to save BL from having to face too many questions.
2)I have gone back and forth on DW this year. After the THM, I feel like he is doing the best he can with the constraints on him. I don’t trust ASG to hire someone competent in the GM or the head coach position so I think I am not be calling for DW’s head at this point.
3) We took our ST renewal sheet to Friday’s game with the intention of turning it in. BL at THM made me rethink this and we did not hand it over. We decided to see how long it takes for our ST rep to contact me for the paperwork. My guess is 2 weeks since I currently sit on the upper level.
We will renew and may even try to get some better seats, but for now will let them wait on the funds. Heck, I asked my ST rep for seat options a week ago and he has not asked if I liked any of them and would like to try them out for a game. It would seem a logical follow up step, but it hasn’t happened.
BL’s attitude to the fans was horrible. I understand that ticket prices go up and don’t have a huge problem with this. What I have a problem with is the ticket deals (including the one posted recently for 75% off). Each year, benefits have gone down to the point where they are non-existant while tickets can be bought for so much cheaper. What is the benefit to being a STH?
I will be composing an email today to BL (per his request at the THM) just to see if he will answer all of the questions posed by STH or if they will edit the questions to only answer those that he feels are safe to let everyone see.
With where the team is and the comments posted in these blogs and in forums, I would have liked to see a majority of the owners last Friday. I know the hockey team was not what they really wanted (they wanted a basketball team and an arena), but they got the team and should show support to their fan base.
Interesting note, with this ownership group they changed the customer service group’s name to customer retention. This should have been the writing on the wall as to how they felt about us.
By Lew318
March 10, 2008 10:12 AM | Link to this
RAWHIDE
I was at the Town Hall meeting on Friday evening so let me provide my “limited” view of things and try to answer your questions.
I was somewhat impressed with the candor of Levenson and Waddell. They both admitted mistakes were made and both admitted they never expected the veteran players to be contributing as little as they have.
Waddell’s first comment about the defense was “thank God for Toby Enstrom”. He didn’t mention other names but said there was a void in that part of our team.
As far as the Hossa issue was concerned he made it clear to all of us that there was more to the negotiations that he couldn’t and wouldn’t expose. So, we will have to let that issue go and wait, as Don put it, till he writes his book.
I asked a question during the session; I stated that this team has never come together as a team and the Hossa issue was a debacle and a total distraction. I asked how we were going to not let that happen when Ilya’s contract came up for renewal. Don’s answer was a simple one. Waddell looked over at Levenson and said I have told Bruce to get his pocket book ready. Waddell also stated Kovy has never said he wants to go elsewhere, he is focused on winning and has grown to become a leader. This is Kovy’s house as one other person put it.
Waddell also mentioned in an effort to reinforce what an attiude Kovy had that the Doctors had told him when Kovy injured his knee that he should be out for three of four weeks. Kovy wanted back sooner and the Doctors gave him medical clearance and said he could play if he “stand the pain”. The rest is history, although not at full strength, Kovy was back after being out for two games.
A question came up on ownership’s willingness to spend money. I was pleased but also surprised at the answer. Levenson said the Owners have “never said no” to any request from Waddell. I interpret this two ways; first, the owners are willing to pay to get a winner. Secondly, Money is not the reason we cannot obtain players. Clearly to me this is a Waddell issue. I had always felt that Waddell might have been inhibited and limited by the owners unwillingness to spend $$$ and therefore it wasn’t all his fault we didn’t have other players; obviously this is not the case.
As for the dialog around rising season ticket prices, the cost of running Philips and the team are not remaining constant, they are increasing. How can we expect (winning team or not) for the owners not to raise prices. We certainly want a winner and feel less pain if prices are raised under that scenario.
One young threesome sitting to my left brought up the issue of trading Kari because he has never matured. After all “it’s been three years” and he still is not consistent. A majority of the crowd was not simpathtic to their views. How can they say Kari is not better. He is out there night after night with no defense in front of him blocking 40+ shots a night.
Now to answer your questions: 1. Yes to more of the Town Hall Meetings 2. Waddell should remain as GM but get the hell away from bench. He is not a disciplinarian and we need one. By the way, nothing was said about bringing in John Anderson specifically. However, for my two cents, we need a coach that will force and discipline these well paid prima donnas to produce. I think the Beast may be out!! 3. * GO THRASHERS* I had already subscribed my season tickets for next year.
By Midfield
March 10, 2008 11:19 AM | Link to this
Barring the off-chance that McCrimmon himself had turned down the Head Coach offer, he was put in a terrible situation. You can’t expect him to project the authority with “Head Coach” Don constantly hovering about. And now, fair or not, he is contaminated with the team’s protracted slump.
By Lew318
March 10, 2008 11:46 AM | Link to this
Midfield:
Agreed but ray Charles could see McCrimmon was the only one trying to discipline this team. I would give him a shot if he wanted it
By Brendan
March 10, 2008 11:50 AM | Link to this
Many thanks to all those who attended the Town Hall Meeting and reported back to us.
By Rawhide
March 10, 2008 12:32 PM | Link to this
D, 12345, JLB, Rockdr99, Scott, trlblzr, AJ, AuburnZ, Lew318 - Thanks, all of you!
By Alan
March 10, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this
Agreed but ray Charles could see McCrimmon was the only one trying to discipline this team.
Childish rage and temper tantrums is not discipline. I don’t want McCrimmon within a hundred miles of this team next season.
By Rob
March 10, 2008 12:52 PM | Link to this
Ahahahhahaha. I love it, DW talks about 2 dmen this offseason. Hmm, did this just dawn on him? We haven’t had a solid D man since the team left for Calgary. ahahha. beautiful, it takes these clowns 9 years to figure out what we have known all along, no kidding we need D. And heart. Enstrom is the only player drafted and developed in 9 years as a D man. Pitiful. And DW got lucky with him. Levenson is a jerk, but we can’t fire him. DW is the goat and has had his chance, time to move on.
By Nikita
March 10, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this
Our defense is three players — Enstrom, Havelid, Klee. They all have limitations, but those limitations would be mitigated if they were within a team in general that played defensively as a whole, and if the remainder of the D were competent.
Enstrom is too small, and gets overwhelmed. He also makes rookie mistakes occasionally. But overall he is a wonderful two-way defenseman and we are lucky to have him. Havelid is a defensive defenseman whose scoring production is way down from his peak. He injures frequently. But he’s exceptionally good at the role he is meant to play — 2nd line D. Klee is slow and old, but generally scrappy, in position, and game. He belongs on a third pairing where he can work with another dependable defenseman (instead of getting saddled with the two worst defensemen on a regular basis).
By Bob
March 10, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this
DW is the goat and has had his chance, time to move on
I think you’re spot on in the biggest indictment of his lack of ability as a GM, and that’s the litany of dmen he’s signed over the years, and look where we are today. But he’s not a goat, he’s the reason for where we’re at.
You could look around the league at our former dmen that Waddell thought weren’t good enough to keep, yet are playing great for other teams. How much better would we look with a D of:
Kaberle-Coburn Staios-Clark Dipenta-Foster
It gives me headaches to see all the litany of bad dmen that Waddell goes out and gets every year, Reardon, Smehlik, Burt, Modry, Klee, and on and on and on.
It would be pure insanity to look at past results and to then think that Waddell could go out and sign two dmen this summer and expect them to anything more than this summer’s UFA dman signing of a Uwe Krupp
It’s my understanding that McCrimmon has responsibility for coaching the defense over the years, right? Get him away from this club asap, signing him as Coach would be pure comedy gold. This team needs an enema. But fret not, this thing gets turned around and quick, IF they get the right GM in here.
By hckyfnatik
March 10, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this
THM have the same thought and meaning as a half-dead dandelion someone picks from somebody else’s lawn to give their significant other as a peace offering for that fight last week - too little and way too late. Picking more in the same condition with the same timing just underlines the contempt the GM owners and players have for the fans. They’ve got their money for last year - but they ALL think they should get raises.
It’s also a clear indication that they don’t care to give the very best. It’s the same type of ‘motions” they’ve been going through all year with the team/coaches and the players. They get paid and paid well for the insult. For some reason unbeknownst to me, they seem to think the fans will not only happily put up with this lack of performance (through pure lack’a’wanna - not because they just can’t give anymore) - but these same enabler fans will actually pay more for it than last year for less performance.
Well, not THIS fan. I’ve been a STH throughout the Knight’s/Fire Ants and Thrasher’s seasons to date. NOT anymore.
By Smoothie
March 10, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this
Regardless of DWad’s credentials / capabilities etc, it does not matter at this point. As bumbling as the ASG managment / ownership has been, they are fooling themselves if they think Don can pull them out of this mess. DWad has had nearly a decade to get the job done so any margin of error he used to enjoy has eroded. And I reckon he will be hesitant to ask for the moon when it comes to FA in light of his many high-priced FA busts in recent years. A fresh perspective is needed and DWad should be let go in the best interests of the franchise.
And it seems painfully evident to me that he has lost his power to some extent. Chances are, even if BL publicly states that he has never denied him anything (are we really foolish enough to think they still give DWAd full autonomy when it comes to all personnel decisions?), the ASG forced Don to fire Bob Hartley in a last ditch effort to maintain positive momentum for another successful playoff season.
I honestly would not be surprised if Don steps down on his own accord at the end of the year…it would be a very smart move if you ask me.
By ToF
March 10, 2008 3:22 PM | Link to this
If DW were to step down this summer, he needs to unleash on the ASG. It would be awsome to hear the guy rip apart his former employers for being completely incompetent. If only…
By Archie
March 10, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this
I’ve been riding the fence for months about whether I think Waddell should get canned or not. Sometimes I’ll jump all the way over to the “Fire Waddel camp” only to climb back on the fence. It’s an entire organizational problem for the Thrashers. Ownership, general manager, coaching staff and player leadership are all to blame, I don’t know how much to put on each. Waddell could very well have the largest share of the blame, but not necessarily the majority. As we see with these primaries, sometimes you can win an election with less than 50% of popular vote, well sometimes a GM could get fired with less than 50% of the total blame.
I think Don’s in a tough spot because of the poor player development system within the organization (I don’t know if that’s his fault or not, or whether it matters whose fault it is). I honestly think that every draft pick we take either has to make the team right away, or end up hitting a brick wall in Chicago where John Anderson runs an entirely different system from the Thrashers. Because of that, we get no home grown talent to fill the role playing positions on the roster, so we end up having to fill those spots with over-priced free agents. A free agent, by defintion, is an overpriced player who’s being paid for previous accomplishments instead of current ones. So instead of having our own homegrown 3rd and 4th liners who are 2-3 years in the league and still on their rookie contracts (like Buffalo or Ottawa), we have to overpay for ours in the free agent market. The contracts like Holik’s and Rucchin’s are prime examples. IMO, the lack of player development from Chicago is a huge anchor tied to the tail of this franchise and it’s keeping us from moving forward.
I kinda think Waddell is a bright hockey mind who’s not getting the chance to do what he wants to do, he’s working with one hand tied behind his back so to speak. Either way, excuse or not, he isn’t getting the job done. Surely as GM, he’s within his power to change minor league affiliates. So I really don’t know if another GM could do any better. I guess I just hold out hope that all will be better when the lawsuit ends. If I had the choice, I wouldn’t want the ASG or Steve Belkin as the owner, but it’ll be nice to see what the owners can do when they’re not paying legal fees that surely mirror that of Alex Ovechkin’s new annual salary just to keep control of their team!
By bustinplayoffs
March 10, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this
I’ve spent three years as a an STH, and split seats with an STH who’s been there from the start. Personally, I believe we have the best building, the second-best mascot (the lion from LA is best - loved him at the All Star Game), the best announcer (Darrin Eliot), and the best music in the NHL. It’s just a crying shame that the hockey team sucks. I don’t profess to be as studious as most who’ve written here but can report that I suffer from grave depression after attending loss after loss at Blues-land. We sit behind the 1st and 3rd shoot at goal. I now bring binoculars because the action’s always at the other end of the ice! In response to your questions: 1. Yes, THMs seem to provide a forum for answers not always provided to the media. 2. DW is a nice guy - probably too nice to be coach, actually. I blame him for the lack of on-ice talent, though. He should get the axe, but if retained, he must be restricted to GM duties. I am of the opinion that the ownership is THE biggest problem here. I’ve been in a lawsuit myself and can report that the only winners are the lawyers. Until Belkin is in the rear view mirror, ASG will never be able to focus all energy on victory. 3. Nope - I’m planning to buy my periodic game seats seats at 75% off on the net. Thanks for the tip, Craig!
By Get The Puck Out
March 10, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this
Do you really think we would be this bad with Hartley? I don’t think so, but if we were i bet Hartley would have done left for the good of the team. How about it DON? How about it BRUCE? Heck, while i’m at it how about it ASG?
By ranallo10
March 10, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this
Alan — How were you able to watch those Euro League games (Deutsche Eishockey Liga and Svenska Elitserien)? I need to get on that hockey plan!
By PJ
March 10, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this
Rawhide Apparently at the meeting BL said that he would answer any reasonable question via e-mail since they ran out of time. Can you please post Bruce Levenson’s e-mail address on this blog??
By Rawhide
March 10, 2008 8:22 PM | Link to this
PJ - I think that e-mail address is bruce.levenson@smartass.com
By PJ
March 10, 2008 8:27 PM | Link to this
RH Hey, that’s just the report I got. Don’t shoot the messenger!
By The Other Bob
March 10, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this
PJ - I don’t know if it was here, Craig’s blog or the nasty nest site…but last week someone posted an e-mail address to BL,….
I’m not sure, but I think it was bruce.levenson@atlantaspirit.com
Of course, Rawhide may not be too far off on his….
By PJ
March 10, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this
OH SO THAT’S ………….
bruce.levenson@atlantaspirit.com
I wanted to make sure NASCARDave could read it.
By ranallo10
March 10, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this
Bob — This season’s stats and cap hit for the former Atlanta defenders you mentioned above:
Braydon Coburn (65GP 7G 25A 32PTS 16 58PIM) — $0.785M ($1.3M extension next season)
Brett Clark (57GP 5G 16A 21PTS 5 33PIM) — $1.5M ($3.5M extension next season)
Kurtis Foster (52GP 7G 11A 18PTS 0 35PIM) — $1.025M
Frantisek Kaberle (69GP 0G 18A 18PTS -3 26PIM) — $2.2M
Brian Pothier (38GP 5G 9A 14PTS 5 20PIM) — $2.5M
Steve Staios (69GP 7G 7A 14PTS -16 105PIM) — $2.7M
Joe DiPenta (22GP 0G 4A 4PTS 2 16PIM) — $0.7M
Total (7 players): $11.410M, 372GP 31G 90A 121PTS 9 293PIM
07/08 ATL D (7 players): $10.988M, 411GP, 11G, 69A, 80PTS, -64, 305PIM
Just in case you wanted some statistics to back up your assertion.
I’d classify these players as follows:
I. Wasn’t/wouldn’t resign (Foster, Kaberle, Staios, DiPenta)
II. Did not blossom until SEVERAL years/teams later (Pothier, Clark, Foster)
III. The ones that got away (Coburn, Clark)
By Alan
March 10, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this
PJ - It wasn’t in all caps. He might not be able to read it.
By HookyBob
March 10, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
hckyfnatik: Are we “Enabler fans” is so true it hurts. However, the my conflicting question is “Do you want NHL Hockey in Atlanta?” For the record, I have renewed (but not without trepidation and nashing of teeth).
Blogger comments have led me to think the franchise problems are less Waddell’s and more the ownership. That’s not to relieve Don of all blame. Answer me this: Would Don Waddell be a better GM with more supportive / knowledgable (less litiguous)ownership? I have to think so. The current owners make me miss ol Ted. He may be a loose cannon but he will support his staff, and open the check-book. Not much a fan can do about who owns the team. Or is there?
Wrong time..wrong place. I think the time has gone for Don to go,..at least as GM. I believe he is a good hockey man, respected in the hockey busniness, and I would hope the Thrashers would find a place for him.
It is now time for the organ-I-zation to hire a GM, and then coach (in that order), who would give us instant credibility. I don’t necessarily like this but believe it is needed if we are to convince any quality UFA to come to Bluland. It might give us fans a reason to believe in Blueland too. (Hear that ASG…it means ticket sales.)
My hope is that they look at someone who has come up through the Montreal Canadians system. The connections to hockey knowledge alone make this worhtwhile. It will be interesting to see who is available this summer. These new folks need to be in palce well before July 1st.
Let me close with a Mike Huckabee quote. When told it was mathimatically impossible to win enough delegates for the nomination he responded with,..”I didn’t major in math,..I majored in miracles.” Go Blue,… make the 1980’s Olympic team look average.
By ranallo10
March 10, 2008 9:06 PM | Link to this
Come on guys, stop interrupting my statistics course…jerks
By Rawhide
March 10, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
Thrasher Statistics 101… Prof. Ranallo10 at the lecturn…
Everyone, pay attention to the man!!
By Wealthy Old Man
March 10, 2008 11:30 PM | Link to this
Speak up Sparky, its hard to hear ya with this Austrian woman sitting on my lap.
By ranallo10
March 11, 2008 12:10 AM | Link to this
Wealthy Old Man — That’s not an Austrian woman, that’s Pucks-N-Snot…now stop playing with the farm animals and get back to class.
By Hockey Biltong
March 11, 2008 1:43 AM | Link to this
I never get to my email invites fast enough.The THM meetings fill up in mere moments. I gotta say after reading this blog and many of the recent ones that I will re-up for a half season. I want the Hockey team to stay in Atlanta. However it would make me feel a whole lot better with a new coach and gm. This team needs a fresh start, and so do my wife and I as loyal fans.I can allow a new system some time to take effect.The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different[better] results.This current bunch have used up all the credits they were given . So having said that I will expect my Trasher Rep to extend many discounts for every night I have tickets to a discounted soiree.
By woody
March 11, 2008 11:58 AM | Link to this
You wouldnt need a THM if your team was any good. Why would you want to have more?
This is it WADDELL GO back to CANADA and let us start fresh.
This is like the the Clayton County school board refusing to resign even after the decrididation.
By Brendan
March 11, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this
This team IS NOT RELOCATING. If you believe that, you’ve into some “swampland” in Florida. They CANNOT get out of this lease, without cutting their own nose off in the process. In 12-13 years time, you can “begin” to talk about relocation. There is NOTHING WRONG with Atlanta’s market. The only things “wrong” are the bad decisions made by bad decision-makers. Fix it, and our market will flourish.
The team … is … not … relocating. Your 5-year old will be off at college if/when the Thrashers relocate from Atlanta, if they ever do. I don’t think they will.
By Not surprised
March 11, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this
As a former Bruins fan this is not a new scene.
The ownership needs to sort itself out first of all. Even if they do that, they own the Thrashers for one reason and one reason only. To make money.
Now I know if we go deep into the playoffs, sell out more games, etc. etc. there will be more money coming in. The problem resides in the fact that it will cost more money to get there. It’s all about the profit margin.
If I tell you to give me $100 and in return I’ll give you $200 That’s pretty good right? So what if I tell you I’ll give you $1000? that’s more than $200 right? Problem is you need to give me $750.
You still make more than $100 but the profit margin is not high enough. What if you find 10 ventures and can invest that $750 into all 10 doubling your money in each one instead? ($75 = $150) You walk away with $1500 instead of the one venture where you walk away with $1000 and you started both with $750.
That is the issue. They make more money by being average than they would by being good. Winning, losing, none of that matters to them except the profit margins, and not one of them is a true fan of hockey. Sadly that’s the case with most franchise owners.
This team will NEVER win the cup until it is owned by a fan of the game. Take the NE Patriots. Regardless of your opinion of the film scandal and how they won and if you like them or not. they were bought by a fan. That fan invested money because he wanted to win more than he wanted to make money.
The problem in Boston is the same thing, Jacobs wants to sell his hotdogs and popcorn more than he wants to win a cup. The best thing htat franchise did was let Ray Bourque go to a real team, which is what we are going to have to do for Kovy at some point.