Tech

By Ralph

November 10, 2006 04:01 PM | Link to this

Mark,

True on all counts, but you have to peel back the onion on those numbers:

1. Since 1999, there was a coaching change. Things happen in coaching changes.

2. You have to count for folks like Joe Burns who left school for the pros. Chris Bosh too.

3. I still think any student-athlete at Tech has a great opportunity to make on on the field/court and then in the classroom. The value of a Tech degree is second to none. I am sure the student-athletes are aware of this. The Institute needs to give them all the tools for them, but it cuts both ways.

I do believe a lot of the football players at least on back on campus getting their degrees.

By Ralph

November 10, 2006 04:02 PM | Link to this

Mark,

True on all counts, but you have to peel back the onion on those numbers:

1. Since 1999, there was a coaching change. Things happen in coaching changes.

2. You have to count for folks like Joe Burns who left school for the pros. Chris Bosh too.

3. I still think any student-athlete at Tech has a great opportunity to make on on the field/court and then in the classroom. The value of a Tech degree is second to none. I am sure the student-athletes are aware of this. The Institute needs to give them all the tools for them, but it cuts both ways.

I do believe a lot of the football players at least on back on campus getting their degrees.

By Ralph

November 10, 2006 04:04 PM | Link to this

Mark,

True on all counts, but you have to peel back the onion on those numbers:

1. Since 1999, there was a coaching change. Things happen in coaching changes.

2. You have to count for folks like Joe Burns who left school for the pros. Chris Bosh too.

3. I still think any student-athlete at Tech has a great opportunity to make on on the field/court and then in the classroom. The value of a Tech degree is second to none. I am sure the student-athletes are aware of this. The Institute needs to give them all the tools for them, but it cuts both ways.

I do believe a lot of the football players at least on back on campus getting their degrees.

By Steve

November 10, 2006 07:17 PM | Link to this

I am proud of Tech’s recent success on the atheletic field and court. I am especially enthusiastic about the incomng recruiting classes in both sports. However, I truly feel that Tech should improve their graduation rates even at the expense of some of their recruiting targets. Although, I’d probably be one of the first to criticize the coaching staffs if the team results decrease, in all honesty I believe that the graduation rate is more important.

By Knute

November 10, 2006 10:28 PM | Link to this

Steve,

I couldn’t agree with you more. It is appalling that a school with Tech’s academic reputation could tolerate subpar graduation rates. Winning football games is insufficient excuse to be the laughing stock of the ACC. If you’re going to compete in that company, compete in the diploma race as well as on the field or court. Thanks, Steve. You said it better than I.

By Knute

November 10, 2006 10:29 PM | Link to this

Sorry, I forgot my manners. Mike, it’s a very good article, very provocative. Well-done.

By JR

November 11, 2006 12:31 AM | Link to this

You say the curriculum of most other ACC schools is challenging. Prove it! Show the most popular major for the athletes that have degrees from the other ACC schools.

By LizellaJacket

November 11, 2006 01:04 AM | Link to this

That 96 hour Sociology degree at Duke is back-breaking. Resource, Housing, and Apparel MGT at VPI is challenging as well……………….right

By Jeff

November 11, 2006 01:38 AM | Link to this

This is the same school that used to have the orienation speech involving “Look to your left, now look to your right. Only one of you will graduate from here.”
Tech is a gritty school. It has always been hard to get a degree from here. The Institute cuts no corners and makes sure that if you get a degree you EARN it. I SERIOUSLY doubt there are that many schools where avg. graduation rates for the student body as a whole is that low, and I am also certain that not many have that same kind of prestige.
And for the record, I have full confidence that our current coaches and AA staff have all that it takes to get our fine student athletes to succeed. And I also am certain that our S-A’s understand that getting a degree here is going to be SOOO much more worthwhile than getting a pseudo degree that can only lead to flipping patties for a living. It can be a challenge, but that’s what we’re used to here at Tech.

By LongBeachJacket

November 11, 2006 03:47 AM | Link to this

There is no question that Tech is as (if not more) committed to the academic success of its student athletes than the vast majority of other institutions. Getting a degree from Tech is very difficult. No easy majors. ALL the other ACC schools have “easy” majors. That doesn’t mean all their athletes choose the easy ones, but some do. It’s always considered newsworthy to compare the straight up stats (as the NCAA) does, but the numbers-only institutional comparison is never a truly valid statistical comparison. Tech doesn’t make excuses; doesn’t recruit kids with “no shot” at getting a degree (as some schools do), and continually strives to help them complete the task. A lot of ex-football players complete their degrees after the 6-year statistical window. Examples that have been profiled: Nick Ferguson (of Denver Broncos) and Joe Hamilton (currently completing his degree). In this case, the straight up statistics be “darned”. What’s the point?

By jjgrogan

November 11, 2006 07:58 AM | Link to this

There’s an old expression: “Statistics can be presented to prove ANYTHING”. The point of the article is well taken, however, there is not sufficient statistical analysis to prove it. Do more research, as LongBeachJacket suggests and THEN write the article. How ‘bout them Jackets!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Robber

November 11, 2006 11:21 AM | Link to this

WHO CARES ABOUT THOSE D-MN STATS!!!!!! That’s that they are and many things have changed since 1999 anyhow. The stats are like the BCS ratings. FULL OF SH-T!

By stony

November 11, 2006 03:20 PM | Link to this

just finished watching the game. All I can say is, “that was about the most uninspired and uninspiring 60 minutes of football(?) I have had the displeasure of watching since the Bill Lewis years. This could have and should have been a statement game. Well, it was, but not the statement we wanted to make.

By ramblin_wreck_ce

November 11, 2006 11:22 PM | Link to this

Remember the mess that Chan inherited regarding academics from O’Leary? He didn’t exactly leave the program tidy.

This was also from the period of the much-documented suspension.

As the beat-writer, why not do just a little more leg-work and describe how The Institute has changed things as opposed to just saying there is hope for the future? If there have been no changes, that is noteworty as well.

That’s what I want to know about.

By Wreck

November 11, 2006 11:51 PM | Link to this

It seems the AJC will write anything it can to be negative about Georgia Tech. It’s always been that way. Georgia Tech could win the national championship in every sport and graduate every athlete and the AJC would still find something wrong. Thanks for at least keeping up the consistency with this article.

By dizzle

November 12, 2006 09:14 AM | Link to this

Mike -

This is the second year in a row where I need to call you out. Did you go to Tech? NO…you did not. Therefore, to have anything to say about how Tech is tough…”but other schools in the ACC are tough” is not an accurate assessment coming from you. As I explained to you last year when you wrote another stupid article on Tech grad rates, we are happy with the fact that the graduation rate at Tech is low. We want our student athletes to struggle in their attempt to manage a top notch education and a 40+ hour a week job (i.e. their scholarship sport requirements). This is not an easy thing to accomplish but what it does is prepare them for LIFE much more than you can imagine. When I know that everyone who shows up at TECH will not get a degree, it only strengthens the degrees of others who have made it to graduation. I commend all TECH student athletets who graduate and excel in life. I mean…anyone could drive through Athens with a window rolled down and have a degree thrown into their car…. Get a clue Mike. This situation is not going to change at TECH. How many presidential scholars did you compete against in your early math classes??? What was the average SAT score of those in your engineering program? The numbers at TECH are off the chart. Please don’t confuse TECH with other schools and also stop confusing TECH to schools like Duke and BC…Last time I checked, both schools combine for 1 National Championship (BC 1940). TECH has 4 and has an excellent bowl record. Take the time next year to think about what you are writing. Everyone in you journalistic reach is well aware of how hard TECH is. What you need to explain to people is how the heck athletes fail to graduate from UGA when they don’t even have to attend class to get an A or B and their basketball program graduated 9% of its players. That is a story Mike…

By JustMe

November 13, 2006 07:32 AM | Link to this

A major contribution to Tech’s “poor” graduation rate is the number of atheletes that jump to pro before graduation. These types are considered “failures” by the NCAA in their calculations. Bosh really hurt Tech by jumping to the pros after only one year of college.

Their calculation is not a true representation of what they claim it represents. I am ashamed of the ajc and any news media that publishes these numbers without really knowing what they are and what they represent.

By coach

November 13, 2006 09:56 AM | Link to this

Why don’t you write an article about the former Tech players who did graduate and went on to outstanding careers without having any professional sports involvement at all? Kim King and Jim Breland are but two examples. It takes a special type of person to balance a sport that requires a full time job work load with the demanding academic load at Georgia Tech. Sure, many schools provide good and perhaps great educational opportunities; but, when you graduate from Georgia Tech you are prepared to keep a lot of balls in the air and deal with what life throws at you. Yes, the degree is worth more than a conference title. But, being able to compete and win that conference title while earning the degree is really special. The young men and women competing for Georgia Tech today are exceptional.

By NGJacket

November 13, 2006 10:53 AM | Link to this

Low graduation rates are a consequence of academic prestige - so I honestly see no story here. Most schools are proud to only graduate a quarter of their students because it serves a reputation of exclusivity and competitiveness. Athletes are admitted at lower academic standards as regular students and are expected to perform just as well in the classroom. Also, students at Tech are more often averaging 5 yr terms. With athletic eligibility up after 4 yrs, you have more incentive for athletes to leave (either for the pros or something else) before they graduate.

By Scooter11

November 13, 2006 12:04 PM | Link to this

Mike, your headline says what the tekkies will be saying after they lose to Weak in Jax. It’s the ultimate fallback - even when all we’re discussing is sports. It’s a denial thing.

By HelluvaJacketFan

November 14, 2006 08:44 PM | Link to this

I come from three generations of Tech ball players - beginning with my great-grandfather who played under Heisman. This became a rivalry early on in the two school’s meetings because of their close proximity to each other. Later, when both were in the SEC, it was as bitter a rivalry as you could imagine. When Bobby Dodd pulled Tech from the SEC because he refused to lower the academic standards of his athletes - a very public withdrawl I might add - his stinging comments added more fuel to the fire. Now, it’s more or less about pride for both - unfortunately for me, my UGA neighbors have gotten the better end of that deal here lately. Yet, we still see the legacy of Dodd in the academic accomplishments of our athletes. It’s a trade off that many Tech alum - and I’m talking about former players here - feel was the right thing to do. It’s a tradition that we see again in again and will witness once more this year when Calvin Johnson elects to stay on for his senior year to finish his degree - that’s how much our academics mean to our athletes. We’re not an open admissions sports program. Things are especially sweet when our “nerdy” players beat the hell out of those damned dawgs from Athens …

and yes, I drink my whiskey clear! Go Jackets!