AJC > Sports > Columnists > Archives > 2008 > March > 25 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USMature Braves need no big talking
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Terence Moore
As strange as this sounds, the Braves have a better attitude now in regard to October than they did along the way to a record 14 straight division titles. They’ve finished third in the National League East during the two seasons since ending that streak, but for several reasons they’ll return to the playoffs this time around.
Too much hitting. Just enough starting and relief pitching.
A lot of Bobby Cox.
That new attitude.
Well, let’s just say these are mentally different Braves, but only if you join the enlightened in believing Chipper Jones, their prolific slugger who also is their overall leader.
“It’s almost like, in the past, we got satisfied with just winning the division,” said Jones, recalling how the Braves managed only one world championship through the 1990s and the early 21st century, while finishing most seasons during their playoff run with a slew of flips, flops and chokes. Added Jones, “We were just trying to keep the string going each year back then when our belief and our focus should have been a lot higher.”
The point is, according to Jones, the Braves finally get it, and their primary competitors in the NL East still don’t. Just listen to the amateurish words coming from Philadelphia and New York. Before last season, shortstop Jimmy Rollins rushed out of nowhere to proclaim that his Philadelphia Phillies were the team to beat in the division. He said so, despite the Phillies’ reputation as an “almost team” in recent years, and despite the Phillies reaching the playoffs just twice in 25 years, with their last trip in 1993.
The Phillies did take the division, with much help from Rollins as the NL’s Most Valuable Player. It’s just that the Phillies also needed the Mets to do the impossible by butchering a seven-game lead with 17 games left to play.
Speaking of the Mets, center fielder Carlos Beltran forgot this spring that he is normally soft spoken when he boldly said after the Mets acquired the great Johan Santana that his team had replaced the Phillies in the NL East as the one to beat. Teammate Carlos Delgado agreed, adding that he and other Mets have Beltran’s back.
Somewhere, Jones is chuckling between his crooked grins. “The Mets won [the division] in ‘06 and still feel like they should have won it last year, and then you’ve got the Phillies who took advantage of the Mets’ collapse after that, and now everybody is just brimming with this confidence,” Jones said. “My whole thing is, you’ve got all these guys chirping over one division championship, and we won 14 in a row and didn’t say a word.
“Let them talk, but honestly, we’ll set our sights higher. It doesn’t matter to me whether we win the wild card or the division. Been there, done that. We need to set our sights higher than just that.”
There is the NL pennant, for instance, and then there is the World Series, and then there is winning it all after that.
The Braves must settle on making the playoffs first. No problem there, because they have a big three of starting pitchers in Tim Hudson, John Smoltz and Tom Glavine, with nice potential everywhere else. At the plate, Mark Teixeira, Jeff Francoeur, Brian McCann and Jones can rip with anybody. The bullpen has a decent setup man in Peter Moylan and a superb closer in Rafael Soriano.
That means Cox just needs to take the temperature of two players every morning: Soriano, who is recovering from a sore elbow after missing large chunks of three of the past four seasons due to various aches and pains; and Jones, who has spent a bunch of time watching instead of playing for monster stretches since 2004.
“There are just certain people that this team is built around, and if you take them out of the lineup, there’s going to be a major hole,” Jones said. “But, all in all, we’ve got a lot to be encouraged about.”
Yes, the Braves do, and unlike others, they don’t have to yap about it.
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By Philliesuk
March 25, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this
Well put. The Mets and Phillies are full of players who don’t know what it’s like to win. We’ll see what Carlos Beltran has to say when the Braves continue to tax the Mets throughout the season.
By Hank Aaron
March 25, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this
Umm, Chipper… That sure sounds like “yap.” The non-yap is also a kind of yap.
By joebrave
March 25, 2008 9:14 PM | Link to this
The Mutts,and Philthies,should both win a little something before they spout off!!!
By Gene
March 25, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this
It was always irritating to hear Skip and Joe talk about all of the division championships. That run was impressive, but it should not have been the goal. There were times when many of the Braves looked like they wanted to get on the golf course early in October. These guys will be good this year, but we can expect injuries to some of the senior citizens. I think that Hampton may be the key. He is a good guy, and I would like to see him stay healthy and win some games. I don’t live in Atlanta any more, but I plan to see Glavin’s return. He should be and will be cheered and given a proper welcome.
By Metropolitan Man
March 25, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this
You mean after 14 years they realized its better to win a WS than division title??? Sounds like the braves squandered plenty and have finally realize the rite of passage to the postseason is closed to them. Chumper knows it. When he retires he will kick himself for being on a team that was good for 14 years, just not good enough to be remembered as Champs. 1 ring in 14 tries makes the braves a franchise that can never say they didnt have a chance for more.
By Dawg
March 25, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this
Nice article……
By Stew
March 25, 2008 9:56 PM | Link to this
The Braves will not win with Bobby Cox. He is great over the regular season but has touble managing in the playoffs. They should have won the series at least 5 times in the 1990’s.
By ROCHIE
March 25, 2008 10:15 PM | Link to this
I HATE PEOPLE LIKE STEW…U MUST BE A METS FAN!
By Jeff
March 25, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this
Good article!
By GT81
March 25, 2008 10:36 PM | Link to this
nice to hear Chipper getting the big picture!
By Dave
March 25, 2008 10:42 PM | Link to this
Well said, Mr. Moore. I like this team, and I know its your job to go out on a limb, but the Braves haven’t been to the playoffs since ‘05. Nothing has changed this year except losing 96 RBI’s and a gold glove in Andruw, and losing one of the best number two hitters in the game, in Edgar…not to mention Smoltz adding another year to his age. Again, I love this team, its players, and its manager. I just wish I could have the same confidence that you do regarding the post season. I don’t think the wildcard can come from the East because the Mets, Phils, and Braves will beat up on each other all year. So, winning the division…that’s how to get in and after two consecutive years finishing behind those two teams has me reluctant to predict a ring in 2008…but GO BRAVES!!!!
By stew
March 25, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this
This is the other stew. Braves will win because of Yunel the budding superstar.
By Bowie
March 25, 2008 10:54 PM | Link to this
Stew, the Braves can win despite Cox’s managing in the play- off with the right players. Maybe this year we have the right chemistry to do it. Rochie its bad to hate someone for telling the truth, but no one is perfect and Cox is a very special part of this team. God Bless the USA. GO BRAVES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Great job TM Chippers the HOSS.
By geekboy
March 25, 2008 11:05 PM | Link to this
The Braves will only win if their starting pitching holds up, and I would be very surprised if Smoltz and Hampton can for 70+ percent of the season. Glavine could also very easily be lost to a nagging injury. Now, imagine this team without Smoltz, Hampton and Glavine. That is not a team that can compete. That is a team that would finish 4th in the division with a .400 winning percentage. Only time will tell, but I would bet on a younger team.
By Matt
March 25, 2008 11:24 PM | Link to this
Well, Terence, you finally wrote a decent article. Thank you.
By Terence Moore
March 25, 2008 11:34 PM | Link to this
I know a lot of fans like to blame Bobby Cox for the Braves’ failures in the postseason, but consider this:
I’ve never had a current or past Braves player, coach or executive ever say anything negative about Cox regarding the Braves’ inability to win more than one world championship during their run of 14 consecutive trips to the playoffs.
Surely, after all these years, somebody would have fingered Cox — if they thought he was guilty.
You have to blame the players more than the manager. That’s why Chippper’s comments about a change in attitude are encouraging.
By Paul
March 25, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this
Amen!!
By Paul
March 25, 2008 11:43 PM | Link to this
Amen!! Good Article
By Stephen
March 25, 2008 11:45 PM | Link to this
Thanks for your work, Terence.
By Scott
March 25, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this
There were a whole lot of teams who didn’t even win one World Series at all during that great 14 year run.
By tj
March 26, 2008 12:21 AM | Link to this
Did any of you people blaming Cox for not winning more World Series ever think that maybe without him the Braves wouldn’t have had 14 years in a row with a chance to do it. No other manager in the history of baseball has done what he’s done.And he’s done it no matter what he’s been given to work with. As a fan of the Braves since they came to Atlanta, I’ll take that any day over a team like the Marlins, get in by finishing second a couple of years and win 2 world series. The number of wild card teams to win the World series recently proves anything can happen. Maybe baseball could do like the NBA and add a few more teams, let everybody get a do over. As for me I don’t think any team that finishes 2nd after 162 games deserves to be called Champions. I like the old days when there was one American League winner and one National League winner and the winner of those two were truly world champions. Just my opinion.
By Lou Vales
March 26, 2008 1:07 AM | Link to this
Win A CHAMPIONSHIP!!!!!! Bring Atlanta ANYTHING!!! 4 pro sports franchises and ONE!!! World Championship in the last 42 years!!! And that is ONE less than the Florida Marlins have won in the last 11!!!!! Win Something!!!! Quit talking!!!
And anybody thinking that Mike Hampton doesn’t walk on the Braves after this year if he somehow squeezes out an 11-10 with a 4.63 ERA AFTER!!!!!! literally being the recipient of arguably the DUMBEST contract in sports history is a MORON!!!
By Mets Fan
March 26, 2008 1:29 AM | Link to this
The Braves don’t have a chance against the Mets in 2008. Haven’t you Braves fans noticed how well Santana and Pedro have pitched this spring.The big three-Smoltz, Hudson and Glavine- will break down in August and September, and the Braves will make a free fall to the bottom of the division.If you Braves fan agree with Mr Moore’s logic about the Braves winning the NL East this year, then, I have some beach front property in Arizonia that I would like to sell you.
By Billy
March 26, 2008 2:49 AM | Link to this
Mr. “Mets Fan”,
I would like to remind you that, regardless of your fantastic lineup and pitching in the past few years, you’ve yet to accomplish anything in the playoffs…when you actually made it…
It’s so cute to watch people talk trash when they’re still chokers… Were the Braves chokers for 13 out of 14 seasons? Maybe. But they still made the World Series. And the playoffs…
What does that say about the Mets?
By Professor
March 26, 2008 2:59 AM | Link to this
Not to nitpick, Mets Fan, but didnt you say the same thing last year?
Last I checked, The Great Johan can only pitch once every 5 days.
Then what?
By cashmere
March 26, 2008 4:06 AM | Link to this
yup the braves will free like the METS HUH? cause after all it takes a choker to know a choker and ur rotation after johan who is hyped i dun care what they say and pedro the c**-fighter(no homo) is garbage.
By Coach (Lets Go Braves In 2008)
March 26, 2008 7:04 AM | Link to this
Holy sheep Sh** , Terence Moore hit the proverbial nail on the head with that last comment.
He said : You have to blame the players more than the manager. That’s why Chippper’s comments about a change in attitude are encouraging.
EUREKA ! EXACTLY ! BRAVO Terence Moore , somebody else finally gets it.
Cox is responsible for getting all those teams to the playoffs.
But , it is always up to the players to get it done in the post season.
By Elmer
March 26, 2008 7:11 AM | Link to this
The Braves have one reliable starter— Hudson, so don’t expect too much!
By Elmer
March 26, 2008 7:12 AM | Link to this
The Braves have one reliable starter— Hudson, so don’t expect too much!
By old fart
March 26, 2008 7:18 AM | Link to this
Our chances of making the playoffs comes down to pitching. Can two 40 year old arms and another arm that hasn’t pitched in 2 years make it through to October?
By hockeyman3944
March 26, 2008 7:40 AM | Link to this
Hmm…the Chipper sounds like he’s doing some “yapping” himself. Oops, that can’t be! Its the home team where we put our blinders on and only look at what other players say with disdain while not recognizing that our guys are doin’ a little talking too! C’mon, Rollins saying, “We’re the team to beat” isn’t exactly bulletin board material. What are they supposed to say? “We suck, and our hopes will be dashed by the Braves by mid August…if Chipper stays healthy enough to play in more than 2/3 of the games.” Now that would raise some eyebrows! C’mon TM gives us some real story lines…this one was weak, (as usual).
By Bravesfan79
March 26, 2008 8:03 AM | Link to this
I wish the Braves would man up and spend another 10 million or so while the Braves still have a shot to win it all…because once Chipper, Smoltz and Glavine are gone, the Braves wouldnt even be a shure thing for a .500 record Go Braves…common ownership man up to what you said you’d do and spend more $$$!!!!!
By Countbasey
March 26, 2008 8:30 AM | Link to this
Let the lippy New Yorkers flap in the wind. Braves fans know the score.
By endmet
March 26, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this
Metfan: The Braves blogs are not your therapy couch. Your posts seem more like cries for help; Why not share these infantile fantasies with a psychiatrist? The ‘08 Braves are only going to make your situation worse.
By by johnny
March 26, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this
Your on the right track T.M.
By Coxfan
March 26, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this
I remember a playoff game in which Bobby insisted on doing his regular season platooning when he should have stuck with starters. I think his determination to give the whole bench a shot hurts him in postseason. Still, I wouldn’t trade him for any other manager.
By zdawg
March 26, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this
Nice article Terence. Thank you.
By t-roy
March 26, 2008 9:22 AM | Link to this
This might be Chipper, Smoltz, and Glavines last hoorah but, I would not say they are not a 500 team in the future. They have one of the best young teams in the league. They have plenty of guys who competed this spring for the fifth spot. Jurrjens is has number 2 starter stuff (still has to prove it though). As far as Mets fans go, I’m not going to sit here and say the Braves are going to win it all (they do have a good shot though) because they have not proven that they can. Just like if I were a hopeless Mets fan I would save my trash talk til there were less than 10 games left in the season (only if I had a 10 1/2 game lead. OH OH OHOOOOO
By Kelley
March 26, 2008 9:25 AM | Link to this
Good article Terrence and thank you for taking the time to defend Bobby.
Every other organization in MLB would love to have Bobby as their skipper, it kills me to hear morons who don’t appreciate him.
There is no one better than Bobby.
I think it will become painfully obvious just how great he is when he retires. I dread the day, I dread what the Braves will become without him.
By Chikara
March 26, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this
Great comments Terence!
As for the Mets and Phillies, I predict that both teams will be looking for new managers at the end of this year. The Mets’ unrealistic expectations will be too much for Randolph to handle, and Charlie Manuel got a brief stay of execution only because the Phillies made the playoffs last year.
Cox will be the difference. Atlanta has better pitching than Philadelphia, and they have much better chemistry than the Mets.
The people who need to have better attitudes are the Atlanta fans! What we see on the blog this offseason is encouraging in that people are actually caring about them again. What we need to do as fans is bring back some of that 1991 flavor again, when opponents feared to come to the “Chop Shop”. Yes, I know Fulton County Stadium no longer exists, but still when Atlanta gets rocking there’s no other place in baseball that could match it!
I’m going to the game in DC on Sunday and can’t wait to see Atlanta open up a can on the Nationals!
Ciao;)
By dorothy davis
March 26, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this
It’s true Bobby cannot coach a winning post season because he refuses to see when a pitcher is in serious trouble and doesn’t want to hurt their feelings and pull them, so the team gets buried to the point they cannot hit their way out. That is his weakness as a coach, but hopefully this year he will realize his mistakes.
By Lawdog
March 26, 2008 5:55 PM | Link to this
I hate it when people bad-mouth Bobby. I think Mr. Moore is on the money. He’s got enough quallity starters. Smoltz is a pre-season predator. Glavine should be good for some innings and some wins. Hudson could be a future Cy Young winner. Hopefully, Hampton will stay well and win. And the kid, Jair Jurrjens is going to be an ace in time. The bullpen is full of first rate relievers who can do the job. Moreover, Tex is here for a full season. Yunie Escobar is about to break out as an all-star. Francoeur may be on the verge of a break-out season. McCann may be the best at the position the Braves have ever had. Let’s hope we keep the switch-hitting Bryan Pena to back him up. I can’t wait to go to a World Series at the TED in what may be Bobby’s last campaign.
By Hank Aaron
March 26, 2008 7:10 PM | Link to this
That sure sounds like “yap.” The non-yap is also a kind of yap.
By Bob Dent
March 26, 2008 9:20 PM | Link to this
Chipper is just as bad! Why is he yapping? The idea was to let those guys talk, but Chipper is too stupid to just let it go. he has to start flapping his lips. He ought to look in the mirror and just worry about staying healthy.
By Hunter
March 28, 2008 10:24 PM | Link to this
Wow! Great article Terrance! How is it again that you have a job? The Braves don’t have to talk smack this year, is that really your thesis? When was it the ATLANTA Braves were ever known to talk smack? Do you really get paid to write articles on such useless topics? Really? The Braves are great and you are not, that would be a good self reflecting article…