AJC > Sports > Columnists > Archives > 2008 > February > 13 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USClemens the biggest loser of Steroidgate
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Terence Moore
There were a couple of winners after baseball’s latest trip to Capitol Hill on Wednesday for Steroidgate. None was named Roger Clemens, by the way, whose arrogance at the end of the hearing resulted in the committee chairman gaveling the desperate pitcher into silence.
And those winners?
Bud Selig and Barry Bonds, in no particular order.
Let’s start with Selig, the frequently blasted commissioner, who ignored public giggling to hire former Senator George Mitchell to investigate the use of performance-enhancing drugs in baseball and issue recommendations for the future. Mitchell’s findings weren’t definitive, which they weren’t meant to be, but they were impressive, especially since he had no subpoena power and zero cooperation from baseball’s players association.
Consider, too, that after Wednesday’s four hours and 41 minutes of testimony between often warring Republicans and Democrats on the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform, both sides came to a consensus: Selig, through the release of the Mitchell Report, provided exactly what Congress wanted when it summoned baseball officials and players to Washington for the first time three years ago to turn their steroid crisis around.
The Mitchell Report gave examples of baseball’s issues with performance-enhancing drugs, offered ways to solve them and watched the owners join the usually defiant players in accepting the report’s suggestions.
As for Bonds, he wins, because he suddenly is invisible. Nobody is talking these days about how he surged past Hank Aaron last summer for most home runs in a career by using juice more than adrenaline during his latter years. That’s because everybody is talking about the guy who has replaced Bonds as the poster child for the steroids era, and that’s Clemens.
It’s about time. While Bonds was doing all sorts of unnatural things in the batter’s box after reaching 40, Clemens was doing the same on the mound. It’s just that while Bonds had critics in stereo when it came to his alleged use of performance-enhancing drugs, Clemens’ critics were in mono. The contradiction was unfair, and it also was unseemly, but committee member Elijah E. Cummings spoke for many over the past few months when he said to Clemens during the hearing, “You’re one of my heroes, but it’s hard to believe [you].”
Actually, it’s impossible to believe Clemens, and this goes beyond the testimony of Brian McNamee, Clemens’ former trainer who joined Clemens at the hearings as the congressmen’s primary guests. Backed by syringes and other medical paraphernalia, supposedly saved from his days with Clemens, McNamee said calmly and strongly that he injected Clemens with performance-enhancing drugs on several occasions. Clemens denied as much, and he was bolstered by McNamee’s shaky reputation with the truth. “I view you as a [former] police officer who was a drug dealer,” committee member Christopher Shays told McNamee.
Shays mostly is correct about McNamee, but Andy Pettitte is among Clemens’ closest pals. He’s also a former teammate and noted straight shooter. He supported many of McNamee’s claims in a deposition. So did Chuck Knoblauch, another former Clemens teammate. There was even a deposition from Clemens’ former nanny who suggested that McNamee is more believable than Clemens on a crucial matter surrounding Clemens’ possible appearance at an event hosted by Jose Canseco, among the kings of steroids users during that time.
In response to Pettitte’s deposition, in which Pettitte also said under oath that Clemens admitted to HGH usage in conversations, Clemens said of Pettitte that he either “misheard” or “misremembered.”
Those are the clever words of the guilty. In fact, it was apparent early into Clemens’ frequently bumbling testimony that he should have pulled his version of a Mark McGwire or of a Sammy Sosa. In March 2005, McGwire kept telling this same committee that, “I’m not here to talk about the past,” and Sosa kept pretending that he couldn’t speak English.
Said an irritated Henry Waxman, who banged that gavel after Clemens kept interrupting the committee chairman’s closing speech, “The only reason we held this hearing today was because Roger Clemens insisted on it.”
Looks like this accomplished but tainted pitcher just flung a fastball over the backstop. You know, by showing up.
Permalink | Comments (74) | Post your comment | Categories: Braves / MLB, Terence Moore
Comments
By Wrong
February 13, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this
Don’t see it that way at all. McNamee is indeed a proven liar -I put no creedence into what this guy has to say. Waxman is a power-drenched a-hole who needs his ego knocked down a few pegs.
Bonds is and always will be the poster child for the steroid era —and he still could find himself doing some time in the federal pen.
By Famuan
February 13, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this
So if McNamee is a liar…does that mean we can’t believe Pettite and Knoblach or what the nanny said too? Naw, Clemens is just cold busted. Bonds doesn’t have something on record saying it was me, me, me that stuck him in the butt (and his wife too). And who are they trying to fool with that “we can’t test these syringes, its too old” stuff? The CIA can test a piece of dust and match it up to a terrorist in Syria but they can’t test some 8 yr old syringes? SURE THEY CAN.
By JANIE
February 13, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
I know nothing about baseball. I know nothing about Roger Clemens. But when I watched him on the news today at the hearing and his lawyers kept jumping up and whispering in his ear, I know he is probably lying.
By JANIE
February 13, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this
I know nothing about baseball. I know nothing about Roger Clemens. But when I watched him on the news today at the hearing and his lawyers kept jumping up and whispering in his ear, I know he is probably lying.
By fanofRoger
February 13, 2008 10:39 PM | Link to this
I think Roger did ok… not a great speaker… but McNamee is a liar.. slimmy kinda guy.. didn’t like this article, didn’t think it was like that at all… I think Roger did win something, just not sure what.. and in the end the Mitchell report may do some good. It wasn’t handled very well by baseball.. and Mitchell could have done better but at least everyone is talking about it instead of Britney..
By David J.
February 13, 2008 11:08 PM | Link to this
There will be serious racial overtones if Roger Clemens goes free after lying to Congress and the Feds, while Marion Jones and Barry Bonds are the subjects of perjury investigations and punishment. Rogers story was absolutely laughable and his guilt quite obvious and well documented by Pettit and Knoblach’s depositions. Roger lied under oath today with impunity as he knew the Republican Congressmen and women he visited last week were enthralled to have his autograph and pictures taken with him. What an absolute travesty of justice…!
By jes
February 13, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this
If R.C. had just told the truth initially like his bud Andy P. this wouldn’t have gotten to be that big of a story.Instead pride and arrogance got in the way and his reputation will be forever tarnished. He got what he deserved.!
By steve
February 13, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this
The reason we weren’t sure about Clemens is that his head didn’t blow up like Mr. Met like Barrys did. If Roger’s hat size increased like Barrys it would have been more evident.Sorry Terence, race has nothing to do with this. It is all about CHEATING. Joe Jackson, Pete Rose, Mark Maguire, Sammy Sosa, Rafael Palmeiro, Barry Bonds and now Roger Clemens. Al these guys will never be in the Hall of Fame but ALL will be in the Hall of Shame forever. Terence, you missed the point entirely.
By backlineguy
February 13, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this
It doesn’t matter how many columns are written about this, or who writes them. Pettite is the key here, and words like misremembers are only invented by someone not telling the truth. Period. Keep your rediculous insults for your bowling alley pals. Act like you’ve got a pair.
By ATLplayer
February 13, 2008 11:41 PM | Link to this
Folks as much as you want to believe Clemens and keep his legacy as the greatest…you must give Bonds the same due, because if you don’t then you are a true hater! There is no difference between Bonds and Clemens! They both cheated!!!then got caught and lied to save themselves. So if you are still JUST busting Barry’s chops…you are a true hater!
By Gris
February 13, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this
It is amazing to me that those of you that have persecuted Bonds for his alleged use of steroids are looking for every reason/justification possible to believe Clemens isn’t a LIAR. I really believe that it come down to the simple fact that most people will give a white person the benefit of doubt in such matters; while on the other hand, they view any black as “guilty until proven innocent”. I don’t expect any white person, here or anyplace to agree with my comments…my experience tells me you don’t know how to seek the truth in matters that involve race. In my opinion, investigation steroid use by an athlete does not deserve the attention of Congress and all the media attention.
By HerbG
February 13, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this
It’s ironic that a committee selected from the world’s biggest liars’ club is questioning anybody about telling the truth! What a bunch of self-serving bums!
By mark
February 14, 2008 12:16 AM | Link to this
“Don’t see it that way at all. McNamee is indeed a proven liar -I put no creedence into what this guy has to say. “
He was right about everyone else, and pettitte also said clemens did steroids. You’re either an idiot or you can’t read.
By Zo
February 14, 2008 12:47 AM | Link to this
Do anyone have the date and time of Roger Clemens perjury trial? My Dad would say “if you lie too much you will start believing it” I think that is what has happen to Clemens.I must add though that when the racially charged spearheaded attack on Barry Bonds started I knew some great white hope would be revealed. See, being ugly(racially charged)NEVER pays off in the end.
By BBX
February 14, 2008 1:18 AM | Link to this
Why does anyone even care if he used performance enhancing drugs. Seems like the fans want to see maximum performance whatever it takes.
By Zo
February 14, 2008 1:29 AM | Link to this
Do anyone have the date and time of Roger Clemens perjury trial? My Dad would say “if you lie too much you will start believing it” I think that is what has happen to Clemens.I must add though that when the racially charged spearheaded attack on Barry Bonds started I knew some great white hope would be revealed. See, being ugly(racially charged)NEVER pays off in the end
By cab
February 14, 2008 1:38 AM | Link to this
What I see is this writer and many others including some of these commenting that are judging a man (Clemens) based on hearsay. Anybody who flatly says he can tell Clemens is lying, or telling the truth, without having witnessed what really happened or heard recorded evidence of Clemens incriminating himself is basically declaring himself or herself God. And in doing so they are an abomination. Everyone who “knows” Clemens is guilty or “knows” Macnamee is lying should themselves have to experience being judged guilty by a public that can’t discern the difference between hearsay and factual evidence.
By Zo
February 14, 2008 1:58 AM | Link to this
Don’t get all sentimental now. When all the unfavorable things were directed toward Barry Bonds, he was assumed guilty and asterisk was stamped next to his great accomplishment. I don’t care how you twist it or shake it Roger Clemens damaged himself in front of the world. Again when is the perjury trial for Roger Clemens? See, being ugly(racially charged)NEVER pays off in the end
By Roger
February 14, 2008 4:09 AM | Link to this
Clemens and Bonds are both guilty of using performance enhancing drugs, i.e. HGH/Steroids. End of story.
By tbones
February 14, 2008 4:27 AM | Link to this
To all the idiot Clemens supporters before and after my post, He’s as guilty of uing performance enhancing drugs as the sun is hot. Let’s say McNamee is lying or not credible, but is Knoblauch and your best friend lying Pettitte, as well. And if that’s not enough, Clemens own wife admitted to using HGH supplied by McNamee. So your telling me that another man injected HGH into his wife’s bare a* and he didn’t know? How did she know to go to McNamee for the HGH..hmm..even you Clemens supporters can’t discount Knoblauch, best friend Pettitte, and his wife.
By roy hobbs
February 14, 2008 5:52 AM | Link to this
beware the hooker in a white dress she is a seductive lady much like performance enhancing drugs in b-ball if u ever popped a viagra to stick it to your lady u a cheater in the game of doinking
By haha
February 14, 2008 6:34 AM | Link to this
Surprise,surprise…..
Another racist rant by T. Moore.
Get over it dude! When is the last time you wrote anything relevant?
By Matt
February 14, 2008 6:55 AM | Link to this
Why should we care if he’s on the juice?? If you’re asking that question, you’re not a Braves fan. Greg Maddux was WIDELY considered the greatest pitcher of his era until the late 90’s when Roger started juicing and winning more Cy Young awards. And NOBODY would accuse Mad Dog of using steroids — he’s got a pot belly for chrissake.
And come on you frieking rednecks, race has nothing to do with it. Bonds and McGwire and Clemens and Sosa and Palmeiro are ALL guilty — there is no racism in this area — catch up with the 20th century anytime you’re ready.
By Paddy
February 14, 2008 7:00 AM | Link to this
If this had been a trial and not a hearing, what we heard today would result in a guilty verdit for RC.
By No Dawgs Here
February 14, 2008 7:02 AM | Link to this
Roger Clemmens has a lot more to lose. I believe is is lying. I think that any player that has subjected themselves to performance enchancing drugs like steroids needs to be banned from their sport. Whether it be baseball, football, hockey, basketball, etc;. A cheater is a cheater plain and simple. Cheaters are not based on thier gender or race. They are based off of their actions. T. Moore just called a cheater out. I may not agree with Mr. Moore all the time. And we can agree to disagree. However; justice needs to prevail. Has America become so diluted with hate and racism, when a truth is spoke, it’s automatically a racist comment? Wow!! I feel sorry for the next generation of children… How pathetic.
By Big Ed
February 14, 2008 7:07 AM | Link to this
The only difference between Bonds and Roger is that Barry’s trainer went to jail for him. Brian M. cut a deal. Neither player will go to jail for using drugs. They will share a cell for lying to the federal government. Hey that would be the start of a pretty good prison team.
By tennisbum
February 14, 2008 7:20 AM | Link to this
Roger received what he asked for and it did not turn out well for him. The number of inconsistencies in his version of the truth were glaring - Petite’s deposition, the nanny’s recollection, “I really would have spoken with the Mtchell Committee but I never knew they wanted to speak with me”, Clemen’s wife received HGH but he didn’t know about it, abcess on his butt, etc. His strategy of speaking loudly and forcefully to protest his innocence when his inconsistencies were questioned only reinforced his guilt. Sad to see when a simple admittance that he took steroids and HGH could be be forgiven.
By LJ
February 14, 2008 7:20 AM | Link to this
Anybody who watched the hearing ,and supports Clemons, needs to visit their shrink more often. Maybe He and Bonds will be Cellmates Some of you who come on here and start calling names are complete LOSERS.
By big daddie
February 14, 2008 7:25 AM | Link to this
Perhaps we should waterboard him to see if he’s telling the truth!!
By lawrence
February 14, 2008 7:55 AM | Link to this
All I know is it is obvious nobody on this comment page is a baseball fan. It is not spelled Maguire(like Al or Paul for those non-fans) it is spelled McGwire. Get it right before you talk like you know something. Idiots!
By lawrence
February 14, 2008 7:56 AM | Link to this
All I know is it is obvious that nobody on this comment page is a baseball fan. It is not spelled Maguire(like Al or Paul for those non-fans) it is spelled McGwire. Get it right before you talk like you know something. Idiots!
By Ross
February 14, 2008 8:42 AM | Link to this
I think a perjury indictment is coming for Clemens, of the “make an example” sort. Ordinarily there probably isn’t enough evidence in this sordid mess for that, but I think the JD will make an exception, precisely because of Bonds. The tipping factor is Bellichek’s spying, which has been comprehensive and long-lasting (CNN headline). Specter is now heavily involved with both Selig and Goodell. I’m betting he’s p**. Time to clean house.
-drl
By DirtDobber
February 14, 2008 8:46 AM | Link to this
I do not know who lied among all the previously mentioned persons because, quite simply, I cannot read the minds/hearts of these persons.
Anyone who thinks you have this power is mighty sure of yourself. I certainly wouldnt want you sitting on my jury !
Please rethink your position because you simply do not know what you are talking about.
By timmythebrave
February 14, 2008 8:54 AM | Link to this
Barry Bonds and Clemens are both the poster boy for the steroid era. If you believe a word he says I have 1 question. Why would Pettitte throw him under the bus? He was one of Roger Clemens best friends in baseball. He did it to stay out of jail. You don’t say a friend was doing drugs and talked about steroids unless it was 100% True. You don’t have to believe Mcnamee but you are stupid to believe Roger.
By Sensible
February 14, 2008 8:55 AM | Link to this
COME ON PEOPLE EASE UP A LITTLE. WHAT YOU HAVE BEEN WATCHING FROM MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS HAS BEEN JUICE BALL. LOOKS LIKE PRETTY MUCH EVERYONE OF THOSE GUYS WERE DOING THE CRAP. SO IT WAS PERTTY MUCH EVEN STEVEN, YOU KNOW IF THE PITCHER IS JUICING, WHY SHOULDN’T THE BATTER BE JUICED?? KIND OF EVENS THING UP TO ME!!! SO AS IT APPEARS THERE REALLY WASN’T ANYONE GETTING THAT BIG OF AN ADVANTAGE OVER THE NEXT GUY BECAUSE THEY WERE ALL JUICED. KINDA MAKE YOU START TO WONDER HOW MANY OF THESE GUYS USED THE JUICE TO EVEN GET TO THE BIG LEAGUE’S IN THE BEGINNING. THEN YOU START TO GET AN UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THE RACIAL DIVIDE THAT HAS COME ABOUT OVER THE YEARS REALLY OCCURED (NOT A LOT OF INNER CITY YOUTH CAN AFFORD THE JUICE AT SUCH AN EARLY AGE).
NOW MAYBE YOU IDIOTS WILL TAKE A SERIOUS LOOK AT THESE ATHELETES/PERFORMERS THAT WE CHOSE TO CALL OUR HEROS AND FIND SOME REAL HEROS TO LOOKUP TO “aCTUALLY I WOULD RATHER LOOK UP TO THE GARBAGE MAN AS LONG AS HE IS HONEST, HUMBLE, KIND AND CONSIDERATE OF OTHERS”.
SO MUCH FOR THE GREAT AMERICAN HERO - SHAME ON ALL OF YOU!!
By timmythebrave
February 14, 2008 8:57 AM | Link to this
Roger Clemens is so full of $hit that the hearings should take place in the Senate bathroom. I know a liar when I hear one
By Keeping It Real
February 14, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this
Right On Terrence. Clements is lying through his teeth just like the other players whose numbers suddenly went into the outer space. I am glad to see him get the same treatment as Barry received. He appears to be even more obnoxious. I only hope that he gets indicted for purjury just like Barry. If not, then drop the indictment. The playing field is now level.
By JarHead
February 14, 2008 9:12 AM | Link to this
Hey Gris, I am a white guy who does agree with what you say. If someone has persecuted Bonds for his alleged use of steroids and are looking for every reason/justification possible to believe Clemens, they do have racist tendencies. However, doesn’t the fact that you “don’t expect any white person, here or anyplace” to agree with your comments, and your statement that white people (all of us) don’t know how to seek the truth in matters that involve race, show that you have racist tendencies as well?
By anotherdamnjack
February 14, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this
If Barry Bonds was white, then this column by Terence Moore would have never seen the light of day.
By Keeping It Real
February 14, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this
Jarhead,
History has taught black people to be aware of the race factor. Are black people subject to racial biases? Absolutely!! They are just like everyone else. By the way, thanks for being open minded.
By GT
February 14, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this
Shouldn’t somewhere in this soap opera something be said for Dale Murphy and how he is not making it into the Hall of Frame. We preach about this guy and that guy having no character and shouldn’t deserve the hall and on the other hand we keep one of the finest characters in this town’s and baseball’s history out because he couldn’t hang on long enough to hit 400 homeruns. And Bond cheating to beat Hank is not the story there either. We build these idiots up long before we know they are juiced. We let these big headed and I mean that literally and figuratively swagger around baseball. We “holier than thou” ourselves that we kept that sorry Rose out of the hall as if we have proven something about character. There are some very fine men in baseball, but like any sport I have ever been around there are some real bums too. I would love to interview the reporters that vote on the hall inductees. I don’t expect the former players to understand, I dealt there are too many deep conversations on character in those locker rooms that they spent their careers. If there were the steroid thing would have stopped there. It is the reporters I want to hear from and why they didn’t vote for Murphy and who they did vote for. I think you will find a pattern of dull doesn’t sell newspapers and scandal prints money underneath the surface of their excuses. If this is not true show me and put Dale Murphy into the Hall of Frame as a shining example to our youth what a man can be. It might not make you popular with your fellow reporters but it is the right thing to do and the reason they allowed you to vote on inductees in the first place.
By Political Foreskin
February 14, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this
Clemens used steroids, but only for a short while, and only a few times. He is right to try to lie his way out of the consequences, because it’s just not fair to take his accomplishments away when he really didn’t take steroids, except for the handful of times over one summer that he did.
Think about how you’d feel if you only cheated once or twice on pop quizes, but made a 100% on the final exam honestly, and then some teacher gave you an F for cheating on the pop quizes. Pop quizes dont count for more than 10% of your grade - everyone knows that; it’s simply not fair.
Cheating in moderation is the key. Cheat a little, punish a lot? No, that’s not baseball or apple pie, or Mom.
Besides, how do we know his wife didn’t make all this up? She took the steroids, (and laughed about it), and now they’re threatening to take her beauty queen status away. So she may have made a deal with Hugh Heffner for a photo shoot for all we know.
No, sir, Clemens is innocent, in a white-lie sort of way.
By Whatever
February 14, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this
This is all soo unbelievable! Why is the US government even involved. They cant even run this country, and they are sitting in judgement over someone that is obviously a liar! If baseball wants to make steroids illegal, then make ALL the players accountable. This is such a joke. Who cares if grown adults want to take performance enhancing drugs. They are professionals that are paid based on their performance. If they can find a way to enhance their abilities, then so be it! They are the ones who must face the adverse effects these drugs may have on their bodies. The only problem I have with Roger Clemens is that he is obviously not man enough to admit to the truth.
By Whatever
February 14, 2008 9:52 AM | Link to this
Political Foreskin,
With that kind of logic, you have got to be a liberal democrat! Good grief, GET SOME HELP!
By Triple KKK
February 14, 2008 10:13 AM | Link to this
Clemens used steroids about as many times as that duplicate post by BBX.
Barry is still a cheater also. Maybe both can become atheltic directors at a local high school since some people don’t have a problem with it.
By Mike Toto
February 14, 2008 10:21 AM | Link to this
To ALL baseball fans……
I am deeply concerned over the controversy with baseball and steroids. Being a baseball fan many things have impacted me of late with this topic. But I seem to wonder if the writers and congressman and general public are missing a KEY element of perspective in this whole matter??
There are ONLY 1200 Major League Baseball jobs currently on the teams rosters. 6,650,531,316 live in the world, 303,435,25 live in the United States. Do you NOT think that a professional athlete is going to do whatever it takes to maintain and enhance his career? At the time of these investigations using HGH was NOT illegal, it was a moral decision. Perhaps it was not the correct choice taken by the athlete BUT it was not an illegal choice. The athlete was doing what he believed was best for his career and team in increasing his performance and value.
My take on this is I appreciate Jason Giambi’s comments to the public, MLB and congress in his decision making process. He admitted to the use, apologized for it’s current impact and has asked to move on. EXACTLY!
It is a sad time we live in when a panel of corrupt politicians are going to drill an athlete over his moral decision on maintaining his career. Perhaps I can drill a congressman over his voting records when it comes to dealing with lobbyists and his moral decision making.
These athletes DID tarnish baseball, but baseball has looked the other way for years. MLB should admit its lack of insight and find corrective measures for the integrity of future record holders. Do NOT put all the blame on the players, MLB is equally to blame.
I do not condone the the use of HGH, but understand the impact the usage could possibly have an an athletes career. All I ask is…tell the truth…face the music NOW.
Thank for letting me vent….
Mike Toto Alpharetta, GA
By Zo
February 14, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this
* Hey Whatever you must just be all smart a%%, because Political dude is on point with his view. We need to start thinking out of the box. No one agree with Clemens, but we all understand/or know why he went to this extent of trying to clear his name. And if we want to say anything about race just let me say I never thought I would see two white men turning on eachother. Look like the brotherhood is getting weak. Peace*
By Whatever
February 14, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this
Well said Mike Toto!
Zo, What???? There is one in every group!
By David Duke
February 14, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this
Today’s topic, Roger Clemens and his steroid use, has resulted in no cries of ‘Uncle Tom” directed toward Terence. Why? Clemens is white and it’s alright with blacks if Terence points a finger at a Caucasian. They just get upset when he takes a black person to task. White folks, on the other hand, objected to his speaking questioningly of the veracity of a Caucasian brother. Terence will never be simultaneously embraced by both groups. It appears to me that, so far as Terence is concerned, racism is in the eye of the beholder. As for Clemens, it’s pretty obvious that there are inconsistencies in what he’s saying. In other words, he’s lying! But it’s more than just lying in this case. He was under oath and failure to tell the truth under oath is perjury. If a case can be made by the authorities it should be pursued. There was a time when baseball players were revered and their accomplishments were the stuff of legend. That was long ago now. Ruth, Gehrig, Mays, Aaron, Mantle, Maris, Ernie Banks, Billy Williams, Koufax, Ted Williams and a whole host of other great players are gone now and their like has not been seen for many a year. When those guys played there was something to cheer about and something to believe in. Now there is little to believe in or trust about the game of baseball. Where have you gone Joe DiMaggio? Our nation turns it’s lonely eyes to you.
By Terence is a moron
February 14, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this
How is Selig a winner in this?
The entire point of this article is Terence being thrilled that a white player has been implicated in the steroid scandal. Great journalism.
By Zo
February 14, 2008 11:22 AM | Link to this
David Duke, I agree with you on the perspective of Moore. Yes, it is so true he will never get both sides on his side. I get upset not that he points out the bad in black players(wrong is wrong), but what I disagree with are things like, when he talked about Hank and Bonds dislike supposely of eachother. Those type of things are not what should be report it appears like black on black crime. From a black man perspective if there is no racial difference(ya right) treat Roger the same way you treated Barry, Sosa, and list go on and on. Quinn just talked bad about homosexuals you haven’t heard anything, Brady knocked up a woman then left her, Football Comm. just destroyed video of Bill cheating to win Super bowl, etc. But no mention, but let Pac Man go to stripe club and yell disrespectful comments its on CNN. We are tired of the BS call a spade a spade or move on. It’s still black/white, but I wish it was like in the olds where you knew where you stood in the white mans perspective But instead we have people like Whatever(fitting name) walking around faking the funk. Peace
By Zo
February 14, 2008 11:22 AM | Link to this
David Duke, I agree with you on the perspective of Moore. Yes, it is so true he will never get both sides on his side. I get upset not that he points out the bad in black players(wrong is wrong), but what I disagree with are things like, when he talked about Hank and Bonds dislike supposely of eachother. Those type of things are not what should be report it appears like black on black crime. From a black man perspective if there is no racial difference(ya right) treat Roger the same way you treated Barry, Sosa, and list go on and on. Quinn just talked bad about homosexuals you haven’t heard anything, Brady knocked up a woman then left her, Football Comm. just destroyed video of Bill cheating to win Super bowl, etc. But no mention, but let Pac Man go to stripe club and yell disrespectful comments its on CNN. We are tired of the BS call a spade a spade or move on. It’s still black/white, but I wish it was like in the olds where you knew where you stood in the white mans perspective But instead we have people like Whatever(fitting name) walking around faking the funk. Peace
By David Duke
February 14, 2008 12:11 PM | Link to this
Some baseball players, those of average or less ability, used drug enhancement to cling to a job in the major leagues. This was not the case with Bonds or with Clemens. These two were great players their entire career. The impetus for Bonds was to become the greatest hitter of all time. Without drugs he would have been, and was, great. He played at a level very few have ever known. Taking the multitude of drugs detailed in his doping calendar allowed him to develop a lot of extra muscle he put to good use in hitting homers. That’s what he had in mind. It was not his intention, in taking these drugs, to merely hang on to a job. Bonds intended to steal the home run record from the first time a needle full of juice found its way into his butt. It’s the same with Clemens. He wanted to be remembered as one of the greatest pitchers of all time. So he took the drugs and pitched effectively well into his forties. Rafael Palmeiro, Mark McGwire, Canseco and others took the juice to be great and not just adequate. It’s greed to the point of avarice, it’s dishonest and it’s illegal. As for Clemens and Bonds suffering consequences I’m all for it. Bonds, and now Clemens, aren’t being pursued for using these performance enhancing drugs but ,rather, for lying about it. Why wouldn’t they lie about it now? Their careers and accomplishments have been nothing but a lie! Why should they tell the truth now and admit that their careers were a sham? It’s simple, if you lie under oath you are subject to prosecution for perjury. Bonds is being prosecuted, and Clemens should be, for lying about their use of performance enhancing drugs. The records they’ve stolen should be returned to their rightful owners and all mention of these two, and whomever else can be proved to have used steroids and the like, should be erased from the record books of baseball. It should be as if they never existed and never soiled the game they have dishonored!
By David Duke
February 14, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this
Zo, I agree with you completely. Justice should be equal for the black and for the white. Bonds lied under oath and so did Clemens. Both should be punished by the legal system and banished from baseball forever. The really crazy thing about these two is they lied to preserve the impression that they are super athletes who don’t need any chemical assistance. In so doing, they have rendered themselves pariahs.
By Kelley
February 14, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this
Martin Luther King, Jr. once said “I have a dream that one day my children will live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character.”
If we use this standard for judgement, Clemens and Bonds are in the same boat when it comes to character, regardless of their skin.
I disagree that Bonds is a winner in all this, two wrongs don’t make a right. He still is, and will always be, a man of questionable character. (as is Clemens).
Both men seem way more caught up in their own ego than being a person of integrity anyway, didn’t Clemens wife get a shot just to appear in SI swimsuit edition? That right there about sums up the Clemens’ family priorities.
The saddest part is are our tax payer dollars paying for these hearings?
Is there really not more pressing issues our country should be dealing with?
Personally, I am sick of seeing these over priced athletes and thier lack of integrity. There is such a lack of character in sports these days, it is very disturbing.
Just b/c someone can throw a ball really fast or hit one really far, doesn’t mean they are a “role model”; regardless if they are white, black, brown, purple, or blue.
I work amongst so many people who should be hailed as heros and role models in the field of education, it’s a shame our country’s principles are so out of whack.
By otrain
February 14, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this
T.Moore- Clemens is getting sent through the ringer. He has taken considerable attention off Bonds. THe difference is that Bonds was going through all the scrutiny as he was about to break the most cherished record in sports. Clemens was hanging on the last two years or so, and probably would have retired this offseason regardless of the Mitchell report. You could have phrased your article differently to avoid the racial overtones. Clemens may yet be faced with perjury, he just testified…….. You call for clemens’ head on a stick while it is in the fire. He’s getting very similar treatment to Bonds.
By otrain
February 14, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this
T.Moore- Clemens is getting sent through the ringer. He has taken considerable attention off Bonds. THe difference is that Bonds was going through all the scrutiny as he was about to break the most cherished record in sports. Clemens was hanging on the last two years or so, and probably would have retired this offseason regardless of the Mitchell report. You could have phrased your article differently to avoid the racial overtones. Clemens may yet be faced with perjury, he just testified…….. You call for clemens’ head on a stick while it is in the fire. He’s getting very similar treatment to Bonds.
By maxsporrz
February 14, 2008 1:39 PM | Link to this
How can a person be accused of perjury when lying to liars? Who has been harmed by this “crime”? The integrity of congress? Moore must love Waxman for “bravely” shutting down Clemens at the end with his gavel. I wonder how that guy would have talked to Clemens without the force of law behind him (ie men with guns). I bet with more respect. maxsportz
By Chad
February 14, 2008 1:48 PM | Link to this
Barry Bonds has got to be loving this. He is finally getting a break and we all knew he wasn’t the only professional baseball player doing steroids. That being said, HGH use will continue until a test is developed…money talks and people will do crazy things to get it.
By GT81
February 14, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this
McNamee was interviewed on the radio a couple of weeks ago, and they asked point blank why he didn’t go to prison for Clemens like Bonds’ guy. He said that he had 2 young kids and a wife and that he would not do anything to jeopardize losing his freedom and not being with his family. He said he intended to tell everything he knew in hopes of putting this behind him and moving on with his life. I believe that’s just what he’s done.
By Chuck
February 14, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this
I don’t think the attacks on Bonds were racist at all. Most every one of them contained a defense of Henry Aaron along with attacking Bonds, so how can that be racist? Terence, one day maybe you will be able to judge someone by the quality of their character and not the color of their skin (heard that one somewhere else, haven’t you?).
By Zo
February 14, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this
**Chuck, that’s the point “attacks on Bond in defense of Hank Aaron with attacking Bonds”
see you used the word attack, but how dare you attack Clemens with defending say Nolan Ryan.
It hasn’t happen in that’s when you have to say its racist or starting with you treat Clemens the same way you treated Bonds as you stated in YOUR STATEMENT, I’m waiting….. Peace**
By Karen
February 14, 2008 3:55 PM | Link to this
I believe Roger Clemens is lying. We have followed Roger’s baseball career and, long before this came out, well, actually, after he went to Toronto from Boston, my husband, son and I noted his change in stature and remarkable turn around, when, in fact, we agreed with Dan Duquette of the Boston Red Sox who said Roger was in the “twilight of his career”.
Perhaps it was those words and the reality of it being true which drove Roger to do what he did, take steroids. Was it wrong-yes, it was wrong. Do I see how this could happen-most definitely. The best thing Roger could have done was to say, yes, I took steroids, I shouldn’t have done it, I regret doing it, and I made a bad decision. I would respect Roger more and, on a human level, would certainly forgive him.
By Chuck
February 14, 2008 4:15 PM | Link to this
Zo, I wish you had written your comment in a form which was clearer to understand, but I think I get your point. You don’t like the word attack, so I will substitute criticize. A true racist would only criticize Bonds while comparing him unfavorably to a white player, which Aaron is not. A racist is someone who believes his race is inherently superior to other races, with no other justification. And I will defend Nolan Ryan in relation to his accomplishments versus those of Clemens, along with defending others such as Ferguson Jenkins. The point is this is not a matter of race, or a chance for bigots to jump in with their flawed thinking. It’s simply a matter of those who cheated, regardless of color of skin.
By Dan
February 14, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this
Right on Terrance! Well written, and well said!
By Zo
February 14, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this
Chuck, You somewhat got my point see I responded rapidly to your statement, so it was hard for you to remember what you said. here’s my point, that’s the cover up to use another black(Hank) like stating how many black friends you have. You made my point, I have yet to see you call Clemens out, attack, criticize, whatever you haven’t done it, but you were quick to call Bonds out. Mean what you say a say what you mean Go back re-read your 3:25pm comment then come back with an criticism on Clemens or attack….I’m still waiting or you proved my point of racist behavior.
By david duke
February 14, 2008 5:19 PM | Link to this
I’m so racsist I won’t even eat a black and white cookie
By girlzgotgame
February 14, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this
Finally, Terrance and I agree on something! Let’s keep it real, this is as racist as it gets. Now that one of “yours” is on the hot seat, we use words like creedence and everyone else is lying. Just stop it! Yes, Bonds is indeed a winner today and so are his fans! Thanks Roger, Mrs. Clemmons and McNamee I got to see you take one for the team!!!
By Maconboy
February 14, 2008 9:20 PM | Link to this
If it walks like a duck & talks like a duck………….
By Terrence Moore is an idiot
February 14, 2008 9:25 PM | Link to this
Terrance, You used to be a good writer until getting on espn a couple times went to your head. The big difference between barry and roger is that roger went on 60 mins to discuss it as well as the hearing that he requested he hasn’t ran from the situation. What has bonds done asked to be left alone. Only took the stand when ordered to (currently waiting to see if he goes to jail for his lies and taxes). Yet you call him a winner, and your other so called winner bud selig are you trying to say that he didn’t know what was going on? Also Andy is reffered to as an honest person. When the Mitchell report first came out he admitted to two times then it suddenly it’s 4 times. I am not saying roger is innocent or guilty (like you), but this is america where you are innocent until proven guilty. (I believe you said something around that with Vick along with numerous other stupid thoughts)
By Chuck
February 14, 2008 11:00 PM | Link to this
Zo, you still don’t get my point. I did call Clemens out when I said I would defend players like Nolan Ryan and Ferguson Jenkins against him and his accomplishments. I believe Clemens cheated just as much as Bonds did, and both should be treated the same. Which is, possible prison time for lying under oath, and banned from baseball for breaking the rules of the game, just as Pete Rose has done. Let me ask you this. How can you tell the difference in Clemens bellowing he didn’t do it to the many years of Pete Rose bellowing the same thing. Their demeanor, facial expressions, and tone of voice are exactly the same. In the criminal world, the louder one screams he is innocent, the more guilty he is. As a former police investigator, I studied many confessions and denials, and went to psychological schools where it was taught by experts that the louder and more belligerent they proclaim innocence, the more guilty they are. A truly innocent person doesn’t feel the need to overwhelm everyone with his innocence, and remains calm and sure that the evidence will back him up.
By Mr.Wong
February 14, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this
Hey,Terrence Moron,You stirr got you Koon @ss on here???? I tol you Wong no rike Brack,especiarry You Brack @ss!!!
By Gris
February 14, 2008 11:47 PM | Link to this
Mr. Wong…what the F… are you trying to say?
By Zo
February 15, 2008 3:07 AM | Link to this
Chuck, with your schooling checkout what Terrence Moore@9:25pm said about how Barry handled the situation. And also you still never just called Clemens out you played on words and included Barry and Rose. Chuck see your 11pm comment. I’m still waiting.