Opinion Talk

By Copyleft

April 28, 2008 8:10 AM | Link to this

I see we have a new euphemism: It’s not torture, it’s “enhanced interrogation.” Lovely.

It’s still wrong, and it’s still an indicator of how far America has fallen under the influence of neocons like the Bush crowd. America used to be better than this.

By TORTURE

April 28, 2008 8:12 AM | Link to this

If we can get information out of a terrorist or other proven person to be a threat, then torture the hell out of them. If it saves innocent lives or leads to stopping a threat I support it 100%. It needs to be controlled and reviewed as well. I do not think God is going to punish someone who tortures another person if it saves lives of other human beings. Get a life!!!!

By zeke

April 28, 2008 8:12 AM | Link to this

Anthony Lewis is obviously a liberal left wing socialist who would rather see millions of innocent people, Americans and others, killed by a terrorist action than to make a terrorist “think” he is going to die by using methods that ARE NOT TORTURE to gain valuable information! Personally, I say use every available method to obtain that information! Oh, but then our soldiers will be subject to the same! IDIOT, what does he think happens to our citizens and soldiers already!??”

By James

April 28, 2008 8:13 AM | Link to this

I am a U.S. Marine Corps Vietnam combat veteran, retired Federal law enforcement officer, Southern Baptist Deacon, Republican and about as conservative as one can be. That said, we have lost our soul as a nation if we condone torture of any kind. What’s worse is that we will have lost the approval of almighty God. I would rather have His protection and favor than some elicited statement or confession from a tortured terrorist.

By Willis

April 28, 2008 8:35 AM | Link to this

Those who remember Nixon’s “I am not a crook” declaration found out otherwise.

Bush’s “we do not torture” declaration is the same.

A lie is a lie, no matter who tells it.

By JD

April 28, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

Western democracies are at war. It appears to me that the biggest problem we face in that war is that the majority of our citizens refuse to recognize that fact.

With that said, I don’t condone torture - although I admit that it would be a form of personal torture to allow the death of a single innocent because I have problems with forcing an enemy combatant to give up information that would prevent that death. I don’t even want to think about the nightmares I would have for the rest of my life should my inaction result in the death of an innocent.

In any case, what I do condone (strike that) what I expect is for the US to engage the enemies who have declared war on us with every conventional weapon available to us. Put another way, it is time for the Western democracies to stop fighting on our enemies prepared battleground. Specifically, in this asymmetrical war our sworn (by their own words and actions) enemies’ number one weapon is, via the media, to use our own sense of right and wrong against us. For example, I submit that we care more about our enemies civilian population than our enemies do. Accordingly, we tie ourselves in knots trying to prevent harm to any of those civilians while our enemies blantantly use those same people as cannon fodder.

By Niceguysfinishlast

April 28, 2008 9:07 AM | Link to this

Torture? You mean like bamboo shoots under the fingernails, red-hot pokers, bodily harm. No they mean like sleep deprevation, water boarding, loud music and other non lethal means. Hate the administration if you want but lets be real here, this isn’t true torture. True torture would be like cutting their heads off while their still alive, heck lets record it and show them we mean business. This whole “torture” conversation is liberal spin, wake up folks.

By GW

April 28, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this

Torture! Torture, you proclaim! I’ll show you bunch of wussies torture. Let’s see. Where is that Luckovich toon. Oh yes, there it is. Now, what did it say. Four More Wars! I wonder how he knew. I never told anyone my plans. All I ever did in public was talk about harmless stuff like an Axis of Eeeeeevilllll.

Torture!

By JD

April 28, 2008 9:21 AM | Link to this

Niceguysfinishlast:

Agreed. To extend your point, changing (or blurring) a word’s definition to advance your purpose is another weapon being used against us.

By Lets serve tea

April 28, 2008 9:34 AM | Link to this

To all you morons who think torture is wrong, lets serve them tea and cookies instead. That way we can feel good that we treated them so nicely. Hey Copycrap, yes, Bush started torture methods in the US. YOU FREAKING MORON LIBERAL I see these idiots spew thier liberal garbage on every blog, the underlying message is always Bush’s fault. HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

By kp

April 28, 2008 10:23 AM | Link to this

This guy is simply an anti-military, UN worshipping, liberal idiot! His kind are not happy unless they’re slandering our country and those that lay down their lives for our freedoms! The worst documented “abuse” is Gitmo pictures of guys being stripped and embarrassed; they weren’t mutilated and handed their heads like those that declared war on us!

By Dan

April 28, 2008 10:37 AM | Link to this

Quite frankly the mere fact there is a discussion as to whether or not waterboarding or isolation is torture, is proof of the countries moral leadership. True despots and vicious societies are laughing at what some here call torture. And many european countries who enjoy their freedom only because of the protection we provide. Demonstrators in D.C. actually waterboarded themselves to show how aweful it was. If it was really torture do you think they would/could do that. I know maybe if we take these people who have no qualms about cutting and innocent persons head off on video to make a point, well learn a lesson if we put them in timeout!

By JackLeg

April 28, 2008 11:15 AM | Link to this

You have to be an idiot to think that George W was the first president to use torture; he is the first to acknowledge it. Nixon was not the first illegal wire tap, remember Obama’s buddy, Ayres? This goes on like a game of hot potato it is just who got caught when the lights came one. ALL of our government officials are corrupt, out of touch old timers. It is time for regime change that means everybody that is in office, vote them out, we need fresh blood! That goes for both parties.

By Copyleft

April 28, 2008 11:17 AM | Link to this

I see that the ideals America stands for mean nothing to a lot of folks who call themselves “patriots” these days.

Sad, how far we’ve fallen.

By The Truth

April 28, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this

IF millions of lives or even hundreds are saved then torture a muslim terrorist. Does not bother me one bit if it means a nuke is not going off in my city. I could care less if Katie Couric or Keith Olbercrap gets p** off. Political Correctness is killing this country in the name of tolerance. I love the libs argument for tolerance when they themselves hate anyone who disagrees with them. I don’t see Arianna Huffington getting angry when innocent Americans are beheaded by Iranians. Liberalism equals Communism.

By The Truth

April 28, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this

For all of you who are saying that we are losing our soul. Tell that to all the people who died on 911.

James, I understand your concerns but I don’t see how you can sit here and say that we should never torture to get info that could save lives. What would you say if 10 million people died in NY from a nuke blast but if we’d tortured some sleeper cell to get info we could have stopped it from happening?

By Dick Cheney

April 28, 2008 12:09 PM | Link to this

Heck, torture should be perfectly acceptable for quashing dissent from leftist ideologues carping about the current administration’s policies.

By Trojan Horse

April 28, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this

The AJC is more torture to read then any other types of torture that I know of. GO read Cynthia Tucker. My eye sockets are in so much pain from her rhetoric.

By Ben C

April 28, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this

The big difference between nukes and torture… we can verify/know when nukes have been used… we never know when torture has been used unless the victim tells us. Many times the tortured are not the most respectable folks in the population, why would we believe them… but that is just the way it is. It would be wrong-headed to use either.

By Logical Dude

April 28, 2008 1:31 PM | Link to this

just too many stupid people defending toture… we are an America that is no longer recognizable as a just nation.

The enemy has become us.

By Gold standard

April 28, 2008 1:40 PM | Link to this

Do unto other as you want done to you. Now all the people who so say they love Jesus that what they should. Now Bush 12 commandment say do them before they do ! I am saving American live. The Bible Say’s you reap what you sow. so if you torture look to be tortured. You reap what you sow america!

By James

April 28, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

To “The Truth”:

My point was that I believe as a Christian that God’s protective Hand is worth more than anything we could gain by torture. Once we lose that -we’re in big trouble. I would rather have His protection than all of the intelligence to be gained from torturing another human being. I can put a bullet between their eyes on the battlefield (it’s right to fight evil) but I cannot condone torture.

By American

April 28, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this

Hey logical dude and gold standard, save your selves; America is going down the tubes, you have the freedom to LEAVE; and take your friends with you.

By Copyleft

April 28, 2008 1:54 PM | Link to this

We understand perfectly, TheLies… you have no honor, no principles, and no regard for anything better than “might makes right.”

What’s sad is that you call yourself an American, and that so many fools agree with you.

By Atheist

April 28, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

“God’s Protective Hand” ha ha ha ha ha That’s just about the funniest thing I have ever read…….

Torture the snot out of the enemy…. I agree 100000000% with Niceguysfinishlast.

By Atheist

April 28, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

“God’s Protective Hand” ha ha ha ha ha That’s just about the funniest thing I have ever read…….

Torture the snot out of the enemy…. I agree 100000000% with Niceguysfinishlast.

By Copyleft

April 28, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

Why should WE leave Amurriken? We’re the REAL Americans and the ones who actually belong here.

You’re the one stinking up the place. Why don’t you go join a torture-friendly society, like Iraq or Saudi Arabia? You’d fit right in there with your backward savagery.

And we’ll do Bush one better—we’ll gladly leave you alone to rot their in your primitive hellhole of a culture! America was meant for better things… and better people than you and TheLies.

By The Truth

April 28, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this

Copyleft, Shouldn’t you be serving coffee? Again, you bring nothing to the table and you resort to cut downs. I’m more American than you’ll ever be.

James, I understand fully about God’s hand being taken off this country but we still have every right to protect ourselves from muslim terrorists. I’d rather have one injured terrorist than 10 million dead people any day.

By The Truth

April 28, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this

Copyleft, I’m guessing you got a lot of beatings in high school. Right? How is wanting to protect yourself unamerican? I’m sure you hate guns as well. It’s you who should want to move to Iran because you hate America so much.

By American

April 28, 2008 2:40 PM | Link to this

I am an American Indian, and you are trespassing, so please leave. How can who tell me I am not an American?

By CopyRight

April 28, 2008 2:56 PM | Link to this

I smell something, smells like rotting lies and deceit, maybe rotting brain cells from lack of use; no that is just CopyLeft. Fabreze will not clean up that stench.

By DEMSMUSTGO

April 28, 2008 3:06 PM | Link to this

You left loones think sending your to bed with no tv is torture.If you can come up with some other way to get info in a timely matter than the floor is all yours!If you respond please note how many family members are now serving!

By His hand

April 28, 2008 3:29 PM | Link to this

James, God gave us a brain to use against the enemy. Where was his hand on 911? Where was his hand at all the other bombings and innocent blood shed? God gives us ability and we are supposed to use it. If we can stop it, God will not punush us for torturing an individual to help save innocent lives. We will actually be saving him from more sin by committing these acts. You will not torture another human but you will put a bullet in his head? That makes sense moron.

By Filster

April 28, 2008 3:31 PM | Link to this

I don’t know who Richard Halicks is, but I’m guessing he never served in the military or put himself in harms way for his country. Like it or not, we are engaged against a foe who thinks it is his devine glory to blow up women and children. To behead “infidels” on video. To make and keep women as second, no third, class citizens, little more than property of their families or husbands. Like it or not, you cannot take the high road with this foe. You do not take a knife to a gun fight. Mr. Halicks, you talk about torture, diminishing America’s international standing, and w hole bunch of wonderfully “ideal” principles. But if waterboarding one of these thugs saves numerous lives from a suicide bomber, thwarts another 9/11 or worse, or removes a regime so oppressive of the very rights yo hide behind to write your op ed, then so be it. Why should you be so safe to criticize, hiding behind the freedoms you enjoy, but you deny it to the rest of the world. You’re a coward, without the guts to do what has to be done. Why, I bet you’re even concerning that some mudered might suffer a little pain from lethal injection, even if he butchered, raped, mutiliated, etc. his victims. Switch to sportswriting Halicks. And stop criticizing what you’re not willing to risk your very life to defend.

By big surprise

April 28, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

Filster - you are so right. The bleeding hearts in this country do not seem to get the fact that these radicals do not embrace the Geneva convention.

What we do to elicit information is child’s play compared to their MO. This overly PC, overly sympathetic whining is part of what has gotten this country into the pitiful state it is in today!

All of these people who cry for rights of the terrorists, the murders and rapists on death row would be the first slaughtered by the terrorists, but they just don’t get it.

By Jo

April 28, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this

You nicey-nicey, touchy-feely liberal morons: ACTION, not some pie-in-the-sky sob sister IDEAL saves innocent lives. Maybe YOUR lives are worth less than terrorist scum’s but mine sure isn’t. Tell that to the murderer slime while they’re busy beheading your sons & daughters. Oh, that’s right. Two wrongs don’t make a right and all the rest of that outdated hippie slop. I take that to mean we should allow having our entire civilization wiped out while we have useless candle-light vigils & pray for forgiveness for the killers???

By moderator

April 28, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

From Richard Halicks: Just for the record, I’m not taking a position on this issue. I’m just reporting what the two writers had to say — one who opposes aggressive interrogation and one who believes the president needs to have as many options as possible to prevent terrorism. Both pieces are linked from the introduction above.

By The Truth

April 28, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

Richard Halicks, You must have a problem when people call you out as a liberal. You did the same thing last week with a slavery book blog. Self-Conscious? Why else would a so-called writer do this? Cynthia Tucker rarely lets anyone debate her as most libs don’t. Why? Because they are usually wrong on the issues. Go back and write the obituaries for a change. At least dead people can’t debate you.

By AFnPC

April 28, 2008 5:15 PM | Link to this

America hasn’t fallen because interrogation techniques have gotten worse…What has changed is that these sort of techniques are now in the mainstream media, and left for all the couch politicians to debate. I would hope people would get over themselves and realize that the security of our freedoms lie at the heart of the information received. There is an inherent need for these sort of techniques in order to gain information from a very clever enemy of the State. The President should have all powers necessary to gain this information.

What sort of interrogation techniques do we use on our children when we want to know where they’ve been the night before, etc? I know most won’t waterboard them, but locking them in their room, witholding things they want, and giving them harsh punishments are all techniques. The problem is politicians have their hands in millions of pots, and simultaneously try to make them all happy no matter what side of the aisle they fall on.