Hawks

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:01 AM | Link to this

By ray

December 14, 2008 7:14 AM | Link to this

Mac-Town,

I hear you. Josh Smith is definitely more made for the run-and-gun, fast break type of offense. However, he is still managing to succeed in the half court offense (supreme athletic ability and a willingness to pass/share the ball will do that for you). Marvin is more suited for it as well. And this is actually the kind of team that Billy Knight was trying to build. What makes this all the more confusing is why in the world did he pick Mike Woodson to coach it? Well, he did try to fire him. Obviously Woody doesn’t like to run. Obviously Woody is more suited to veteran players than young players. His offensive strategies bother me.

Yet here we are, 14-9. Hard to argue against if you just look at this season’s record. However, there’s a saying: every GM wants to eventually bring in his own hand-picked coach (unless he has a curretnly successful Hall of Famer type). I’ll leave it at that.

Back to the players: Josh is a finisher. Marvin can be at times, but rarely in traffic. However, he does get to the line more, and I question whether or not there is a better free throw shooter on the team. Marvin is much better on the perimeter. I watched him try to post up last night against much smaller guys, and it was…well, it was embarrassing. He got continually pushed off the block by Delonte West. Delonte West??! Dude is nowhere near Marvin’s size! And then there was the time Marvin tried to post and drive on Wall Sczerbiak. Oh that was just all wrong. He got tied up some damn how and next thing you know, it was nothing but flailing arms and legs, elbows, and a$$ all over the place. The ball went one way, Sczerbiak hit the floor, and Marvin got called for the foul. Oh, it was ugly. And to top that off? The camera pans to Mike Woodson, who is straight up laughing his a$$ off. I’m talking you could see my man’s teeth and gums, he looked like a horse he was laughing so hard. And who cut Marvin’s hair, man? Dude looked like Chad Johnson and Matt Barnes were trying to cut his hair at the same time and got in a fight in the middle of it.

Okay, I better quit clowning my man Marvin, he had a damn good game, but that shiz was too funny…

I was talking to my man Lacsho last night, and he suggested that we might be successful playing JJ at the 3, and Marvin at the 2 on offense. I say why not? It may prove to be quite the matchup against certain teams. Either way, you’re right: dribble/drive is not the forte for either Marvin or Josh, though Josh needs it due to a suspect jumper. We’ll see what happens.

By Show me state

December 14, 2008 9:02 AM | Link to this

Wonderful game. Anything’s possible at Phillips arena. If the Hawks play the way the played tonight, every night, they’re going to be hard to stop. I think they finally got their chemistry back from before Josh Smith was injured. The plus side of everything is that the Hawks defense is back.

Go Hawks!!!!!

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:02 AM | Link to this

By ray

December 14, 2008 8:17 AM | Link to this

This gets to be more amusing by the second.

I haven’t heard any requests to trade Bibby in a minute. Have y’all? And it would appear that the same source still can’t grasp the concept that a trade was mentioned due to finances, not personal dislikes. Same said source ignores all the overwhelmingly positive comments about Bibby’s play from the people he can’t stand. If love is blind, then hate has no eyes. Oh well, some people just aren’t happy if they’re not b!tching about other fans. Go figure. :)

So no trade Bibby talks recently, but the one who complained the most about it digs it back up as an answer to a question he had the opportunity to answer a long time ago (but failed to do). Talk about distortion. But hey, whenever you manage to talk yourself into a corner yet AGAIN, you can always just fall back on the idea that it’s just The Ruling Rules. Funny, there’s only one clown using that term, and nobody else seems to notice this vast conspiracy….

More distortion: Anybody who was willing to discuss possible Bibby trades offered up ways of making the team better for it. Anybody willing to acknowledge the possibility, talked of how we could come out ahead, acknowledging that any such trade would have to be for someone who could make us better for the future as well, not just temporarily, while also acknowledging that it make take a little while to re-knit some of the chemistry one loses in such a situation. So this right here:

Mention Smith instead of Bibby and suddenly we get demands that any replacement makes us better and recognition that fit is important.One wonders why the differing standards for either player.Ruling Rules perhaps.

…is bull$hit. Yeah, I call it like it is. And I’m still waiting on a cohesive, credible answer as to how we’re just fine with or without Smith from the source who brought that up this past summer. I hear no player names of who we should go after. I’m listening. Either you have an answer or you don’t. If not, then better to leave the subject alone, yes? Hey, you dug it back up, not me. Dramanator.

A few more cut and pastes to finish this off:

Yes I continue to comment on the striking negative tone of the blog while the team is winning. I will continue to do so because, well because it’s so darn bizarre frankly.

And disappears during losses. Fair weather, anybody? Where’s the support during losses? Call the rest of these fans what you want, but we’re here win or lose. You can’t say the same. Huh. Oh, I can only imagine the twisted reply to this. I think Mac-Town and Ken Strickland said it best: to be good, you have to critique yourself constantly. That means acknowledging what you do right and what you do wrong. This is the first year in so many that we have a team with a winning record, and the season is still not halfway over, so the winning team record is not a guarantee (though we fervently hope it comes to fruition). But let’s keep it as real just like the players are: 14-9 is a winning record, not a winning season.

Fans should pump each other up. Feed off positive energy like the team does at home from the crowd.

Oh, I agree. But this from the one guy who keeps bashing other fans? This from the guy who wants to call people “self-styled analyzers” and say that he questions their ability to analyze anything (when all they are doing is offering an opinion on an opinion-driven blog)? This guy, who condemns the entire blog? Where’s the positive energy? Oh wait, I forgot. He says “Go Hawks” at the end of most posts. That must’ve been the positive energy he was talking about. Like putting a bandaid on a bone-deep laceration…heh!

They do after a win on the Falcons blog, the Braves/MIB too, heck even the Thrashers and college teams get excited about a winning team.In other words you can savor a win.

Okay, this begs for a call-out.

Kirk, either you are an incurably pathological liar, or you have never read even half of a Falcons blog in the last several years. That place is one of the most negative blogs, with some of the craziest bloggers I’ve ever seen. There are guys who show up every game, just to root against the home team. There are guys who bash the same players over and over, regardless of their performances. There are guys who cannot get over Mike Vick. There are racists and vehemently nasty racial comments regardless of whether the team wins or loses. This blog is nothing like that blog. It’s hard to even talk about football on that blog. And D. Orlando Ledbetter has repeatedly had to come on and try to re-focus people’s attention on football.

I’m on there every Sunday, and sometimes in between, trying to talk football, and continuously trying to pump up the team. I’m still critical of what goes wrong (though it’s not very much these days…the team is well-owned, well-managed, and well-coached) because I have a brain and like to use it.

The two blogs are nothing alike, and you are flat-out wrong for saying so. I can’t speak for the Thrashers (as I have no interest in hockey), I don’t follow the college blogs, and I haven’t messed with the DOB. Why, because I don’t like baseball? No, though it’s true that I don’t like it quite as much as basketball or football. No, I heard you are one of the Ruling Rules over there. Wouldn’t want to come up against the unstoppable force of such a vast conspiracy. :)

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:03 AM | Link to this

HappyHawk,

It’s crazy isn’t it? I think Horford sets some good screens, too. I think there’s a reason Bibby sets the best screens. He doesn’t choreograph them. Our other guys make it obvious. Bibby is so fluid with his and catches the person he’s screening off guard. Hell, Woody should let Bibby teach that in practice….

-This comment is close captioned for the visually impaired. If you didn’t want to see and admit to it’s existence, then it doesn’t exist-

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:04 AM | Link to this

Also, I like how Bibby responded in an important game against the Cavs. Rather than repeat a lackluster performance like the one he had against Cleveland earlier, he put up similar numbers to those put up by Law in the last contest. Sure, it took him 41 minutes to do what Law did in 25, but that’s not the point. The point is that he bounced back, and when we needed him.

-This comment close captioned for the visually impaired…you know why-

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:04 AM | Link to this

You know, the Cavs were riding high before running into us.

Damn good record and all. Winning like crazy. And yet…the conversation about Lebron being a free agent and leaving for New York (or someplace like that) never stops. Why? Because everyone knows this cat wants to win it all. And everyone knows Cleveland gets knocked out by somebody, somewhere in the playoffs. So, despite all the WINNING, the possibility still exists. And until Lebron signs his name on whatever contract he gets then (from whomever), it will never stop. Unless of course, Cleveland wins the NBA championship between now and then.

And somewhere in the vicinity of Cleveland or Akron, there is probably a blogger named KirkinOh (as in “Ohio”) who is losing his mind and going absolutely bat-$hit crazy over the fact that someone mentions that it is a mere possibility that Lebron might leave….

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:05 AM | Link to this

I think I’ve had too much coffee..

By richbrave

December 14, 2008 9:06 AM | Link to this

MAKERS MARK hangover. Pasty-mouth syndrome. Yuc. But I liked that “V” the HAWKS hung on “KING” JAMES didn’t you.? GO HAWKS. The reason I post up most of my comments on the WIZARDS and not the HAWKS is due to the fact that I rarely see the ATLANTANS while the miserable WIZARDS dance before my eyes constantly. Then its a bad-mood MAKERS MARK cure for sure.

By mountain_jim

December 14, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this

Nice to read up on this game this am. I look forward here in NC to getting to see an actual national tv Hawks game this week. Hope the Celtics lose their streak to Atlanta as well.

By ray

December 14, 2008 9:26 AM | Link to this

RichBrave,

Keep the ice pack on, it’ll get better, lol! By the way, I did read your stuff on the HBCU (did I spell that right?) and replied to it about 2 blogs ago. Hope you saw it. Sorry for the delayed reaction, I was out of pocket at the time.

By mavid

December 14, 2008 9:48 AM | Link to this

Nice write-up Sekou. I think we’ve all been wondering for awhile why Smoove doesnt go hard at the rim like he used to (and the way Chill always threw it down too). Once he learns that he’s basically impossible to stop when he’s attacking the rim all night (like guys like Lebron and Gerald Wallace know), he’s gonna be real tough out there.

Great win tho. Nice to see Marvin getting to the FT line so much. Him and Smoove need to be in attack mode going at that basket and getting to the FT line (which is the one thing I think we miss most about Chill).

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

Marvin feeling like a little dude? Please! Better check the mirror. Sounds like a lack of confidence to me. Even if he felt like that, he did’nt have to make it known. And Ray, I mentioned that we should try Marvin at the 2 sometime last year. Larry Drew said it a couple of years ago. But of course he probably has no input in the offense. Great win though. No negative comments for me today! lol!!

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

And oh yeah, Cheeks got f*******. Do they not know that it takes time for a team to gel? Brand does’nt fit what Philly likes to do. Not Cheeks fault. He had this team in the Playoffs last year, for crying out loud. What a shame! And btw, why are all the 5th year players struggling. Smoove, Iggy, Deng. Players seem to take a step backwards after they get paid. Smoove had a decent game last night though.

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this

Philly shoulda signed Smoove instead of Brand. Glad they did’nt. Just sayin.

By doc

December 14, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

a quote form another article: “Team president Ed Stefanski said he fired Cheeks because the 76ers were not successfully running the fast-break, up-tempo style of play they used at the end of last season to make the playoffs.” if he had wanted a running team then why did he get who he got in the off season?

terrell, you know i agree with you because i have high lighted that a bit this year. mo cheek got fired because of the gm’s mistake. the guy he wanted and needed was j smash. stepfanski let it go to his head when he thought brand’s past could come anywhere close to the stats of josh over the life of the contract as well as make an impact the way josh would have.

between stefanski and brand the hawks have new life and were as lucky with this deal as getting horford last year. both players essentially fell into their laps and was not due to any proactive movement on the teams part, sad to think. if this hadnt happened i would feel safe to say it would have been woody gone by now rather than mo.

again, i say my gratitude is to brand and stefanski that we are sitting where we are today at 14 and 9. without josh though he has struggled to get back to form, and who wouldnt, we have seen how ordinary this team is without him. i think that record could easily have been reversed and be the same as philly has right now.

By Emily Lutilla

December 14, 2008 10:48 AM | Link to this

48 Hours, Again?

Yet another Eddie Murphy film discussion?

I just don’t think that’s what we ought to be discussing on a basketball blog. And that Eddie Murphy is just foul-mouthed.

What?

Never Mind

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

Ray, but Law did it ON THE ROAD. Not taking anything away from Bibby’s performance last night. Just sayin.

By PD

December 14, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this

Great game last night. I was in the house and it was rocking. Wednesday is going to be insane.

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this

I still cant get over the fact that Acie and Solo got DNP’s. What’s up with that? Can someone please explain that one?

By clarkekent

December 14, 2008 11:10 AM | Link to this

Sekou can you find out some things for me? ..lets start here: why Mike Woodson doesn’t coach to their strengths which is to run and play up-tempo. Why isn’t Bibby running off picks like Rip Hamilton and Ray Allen or for our ol’skool hawks fans-Randy Whittman. Woody seems to be a good defensive coach but he is offensively challenged. Bibby’s on ball defense if average at best but he plays the passing lanes well. If he can tighten up on the “D” he will be fine. Next -* Why is Joe Johnson not aggressive… a reluctant superstar.* He does not get foul calls because he is not aggressive. Can you remember the last time he dunked on anyone yet alone on a fast break? I understand he still may have that fall in PHX on his mind but he needs to get past that if he wants to carry this team to the next level. He could avg. an extra 5 to 7 pts a game if he were more aggressive. Marvin.. Wow where do I start? Ok… I like that fact he has improved his shoot but well need him to be more aggressive and drive the ball. He just doesn’t seem athletic enough the play SF. He’s a step slow on defense and self-checked if his “J” isn’t falling. His post game is horrific and for a guy 6’9 240 that is a shame. I could go on but i wont. Josh is the key to our entire team.* Why doesn’t Woody make it a point to get him jump started early in games. When his offense is going he is a beast on defense; when his shoot is not going he is just good. His energy feeds the whole team. *Why don’t Woody run plays for him like they run for A. Stoudamire in PHX. Quick dive plays and back screen alley-oops. *We should post J. Smoove on the left block all the time instead of running guard to guard pick and rolls clear outs and have him standing out at the 3 point line and then get mad when he shoots from there… and we know we don’t want him shooting from there. He is a 1 or 2 shot a game from the 3 guy; not a 4 or 5 shot from 3 and that is only when he’s open. Al Horford is doing a good job. He is rebounding, playing good defense and he plays hard every night. Nuff said. All in all 14-9 is not bad. Considering where we were last year. As for the bench, they are doing a good job. * Why isn’t Acie Law should be getting more PT and Solo. ZaZa is doing ok.. I just wish he would just make a strong move instead of looking to get fouled every time he has the ball.* Why doesn’t he stop pump faking and just make a move.* Mo Evans and Flip are doing what i thought they would do. Also the team will become more consistent once the rotations get back in order. I knew it would take sometime for everyone to get back to their usual playing time after josh got back. It just took longer than I thought. I was thinking a week but it took two. I still believe we need a coaching change but again 14-9 is the 4th best record in the East. Just think we are one game better than D-town(DET).

By terrell barron

December 14, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

Well said Doc. Brand has thrown off the chemistry of the Sixers. Smoove woulda added to it. Thank God for Awful GM’s. As my man Bill Walton would say. “Horrible, just horrible”.

By sc

December 14, 2008 11:31 AM | Link to this

smooth needs to work on his handles, when he puts the ball on the floor it is a turnover waiting to happen.

By jhan

December 14, 2008 11:49 AM | Link to this

terrell, there is NO valid excuse why Acie & Solo continue to ride the bench.

Maybe Samuel or Kirk can shed some light on this subject.

Awesome game last night. Philips was almost full. The crowd was loud & really into the game.

Looking forward to a nice homestand this month.

By richbrave

December 14, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this

ray:

Sorry I missed it. Was the response with LEO or SEKOU.? Thanks in advance. I appreciate it. I don’t want to be extreme or off-base when I try to relate to HBCU’s and their financial problems.

By ILL-logical

December 14, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this

Imagine you are a coach of a 5th grade basketball team. You try to tell them about how the game as you played and how they should play. But they continue to run up and down the court all willy nilly.

This is may be the view of the current incumbant head coach and partially explain his actions.

The net net is that this collection of first round thoroughbreds has a coach who may not have the perspective to take them to the winners circle.

By A Thinking Fan

December 14, 2008 1:00 PM | Link to this

Good win!

By ray

December 14, 2008 1:08 PM | Link to this

RichBrave, I believe I replied on Sekou’s blog. Again, sorry for the delay making you think I disagreed to the point of not answering.

Terrell,

That’s right, you did say that about Marvin. I forgot you came up with that idea first. And you’re right about Mo Cheeks. He’ll get another job. Sad to see Philly cut him like that, but GMs do what it takes to save their own hides. Imagine if Billy got the chance to save his….

And your comment about Bibby’s performance vs Acie’s is on point. But we’ll try to keep that quiet. Might rattle some people, ya know? Lol..

Doc,

Right you are. And here’s what’s funny. Lacsho said the exact same thing on the phone last night when I told him Cheeks got the axe. Now what would Cheeks do with a team like this? Oh crap, I forgot we’re not supposed to say things like that because we’re 14-9. Damn my eyes!

Jhan,

You slick devil you….I caught that…lol!

By ray

December 14, 2008 1:13 PM | Link to this

Ill-logical, now there’s a thought.

Well, time for me to move on over to the wonderful Falcons blog, where the fans always pump each other up and support the team with unceasing regularity. If I can find this place that Kirk speaks of….

By richbrave

December 14, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

doc:

Your December 10 post re: JCRIT. To my knowledge he hasn’t sniffed the court during a game. But I’ve missed one, and really don’t pay strict attention lately. Hell, if the WIZARDS are not interested in the game why should I be.? He may have picked up a few garbage minutes. BUCKHANTZ and CHENEY were discussing him near the end of the last loss. Can’t remember the team. They were conjecturing as to why he hadn’t gotten minutes. CHENEY said he talked with TAPSCOTT and that JAMES ran in a system in N.O. similar to the one TAPSCOTT uses so was somewhat familiar with the offense whereas, CRITTENTON did not and had no working knowledge of the sets and the flow of the game. Consequently, he’s not playing at all and will not for awhile.

By Da Real Real

December 14, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this

Good point Sekou about Smoove trying to proove a point with his offensive game. The thing about great players is they do what they do BEST. Smoove hands down is at least one of the top 5 finishers at the rim when he’s attacking the rim and throwing it down. I’ve watched him since he’s gotten back and its been jump shot after jump shot and if he does get to the rim I can’t think of nothing but the one throw down in a guys face and that was against the Spurs I want to say. I don’t want to sound like I’m complaining because not upset or anything but it’d really be nice to see my boy return back to doing what he does best - get to the rim and posterize somebody. But that point about “proving themselves” has happened to a lot of atheletes. Off the top of my head I can think of Donovan McCnabb and Michael Vick who were a lot better scrambling…especially MV7 but he constantly felt he had to proove a point to people that he was not only a scrambling QB. Don’t know why these guys feel they have to do that…just do what you do best and let the haters hate. I doubt you’d ever see Nique, Jordan, heck JJ do anything out of their box because they know what they do best. Good blog, Sekou….time to get ready for Celts. First thing we got to do is beat CHA Monday.

Oh yeah, how good does it feel to be a fan of our Atlanta teams right now. Big win for the Hawks last night and the Falcons big win. Looks like things may be turning around for our sports teams in Atlanta!

By doc

December 14, 2008 4:45 PM | Link to this

richie, you might have missed it bro but i gave some cudos to your spiders, didnt hey win a game that got them into a bowl? i caught the news very peripherally.

By doc

December 14, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this

ray i have been counting that blessing more than once here on the blog as i watched the sixers fail to gel. seems to me they sort of gelled later in the year last year too, no?

By happyhawk

December 14, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this

ray i think it’s something he learned back in sacto when he was with c-webb and vlade (plus the flopping defense lol). i think we should make a living with this kind of offensive game. we’re hell good a it why not use it often. i mean we have good passing big men. and two shooters in our backcourt. why not use that play to dominate the game? i don’t understand why woody keep on giving more minutes to flip than acie. i don’t hate flip but i think acie deserves more PT time than him. i also think acie has a potential of becoming a tony parker type of pg. woody should put acie with evans in place of flip. he should try experimenting having acie play alongside with bibby and JJ, acie playing 2 while JJ 3. the two pg combination worked for the goldenstate with davis and ellis for 2 seasons why can’t we?

By ES

December 14, 2008 6:46 PM | Link to this

Great performance against the Cavs. The Hawks really showed up defensively even though Lebron still got his. But I still wonder about Woodson and whether he can lead this team effectively to a playoff series win. I know that the “fire Mike Woodson chants” are not as loud right now given the two game win streak, but can we just overlook him for his coaching errors? I think it’s time for Mike Woodson to go

By Ed

December 14, 2008 7:01 PM | Link to this

Couldn’t agree with you more Ray…Woody is simply impeding Acie’s progresss by not playing him. This is December & Woody goes to an eight man rotation, & this on the second night of back to backs. Acie & Solo are being deprived, & in the long run the Hawks will suffer for not using these talented players.

By cp

December 14, 2008 7:02 PM | Link to this

SS welcome to the “Josh needs to attack the rim like he used to” club. jhan, ray, doc, and myself were wondering about this for the last few blogs. I actually noticed this last season. In his first two years I don’t think anyone was posterizing as many players as Josh besides Amare and Dwight. Josh started the I’m more than a dunker talk and has been doing that fingeroll and layup crap since. I want him to go back to dunking on cats like he used to. I was watching old highlights of him on youtube and he was straight up embarrassing cats with the dunks. Its time to stop the cute crap and get back to throwing the ball down like he used to.

Da Real Real great points man. I think these cats listen to the criticism too much and it affects their game. If you are a qb who scrambles well scramble if you have to. If you can dunk then dunk. Its time to sit Josh down and show him clips of his old dunks. I ain’t seen him throw down a monster dunk in a while.

By MannyT

December 14, 2008 7:59 PM | Link to this

Where is mykhalc when Bibby is showin’ out? You defend him in bad times…enjoy him in good times!

ray Can you ship me some of that morning brew you use…it seems mighty powerful!! Please ;-)

Funniest thing from last night was PE—premature (d)efensulation. Everyone knows there is no D in Wally Szczerbiak. Every guy that he guarded suddenly lost his mind trying to post him up. Woody needed to pass out pills to those guys so they would calm down, then take him to the hole. Josh & Marvin just made a mess in the post and left embarrassed.

doc I haven’t seen you guys in some time at halftime. Have you relocated to a new pretzel stand? By the way, the town hall is before the Warriors game on Friday. If you have not gotten an invite, check with your account rep. Time to see how SUnd chats with the season ticket holders.

The Cheeks thing highlights the dilemma of the average coach. Cheeks was probably better with the uptempo, scrambling team. Give him a better player that does not fit his coaching style and things get worse. Very good coaches adapt. Average coaches react…usually not well.

Sund gets credit for bringing in perimeter players that fit Woody. No comment on the bigs…especially if Woody was a Kwame Brown fan.

Suggestion—After Wednesday’s game versus the Celtics, Flood the NBA TV Fan night vote for the Hawks during the next 2 weeks. If successful, Hawks game would be on TNT that next Tuesday.

These are your best chances to see more Hawks games nationally this seaon (before the playoffs.)

ES Even if Sund was the secret uncle of (your choice) Mo Cheeks, Eddie Jordan, Sam Mitchell, PJ Carlessimo, Randy Whitman, etc. do you really think the ASG would want to drop Woody when he has a little momentum? Are you putting in cash to pay for 2 coaches? While I’m not a Woody fan, I recognize that you have to be in an extremely unique position to dump a currently successful coach. Woody should have more credibility with ownership than Sund right now.

..Now if Sund can get David Mc David to kick $200 mil + into the ASG coffers, then he might have a bigger voice in the smoke filled room.

BWAF

By Ken Strickland

December 14, 2008 8:23 PM | Link to this

As soon as Philly signed EBrand, everyone saw them as vastly improved and was quick to list them as one of the teams to beat in the East. I said his signing definitely improved their roster, but not necessarily their team. I also said that adding a dynamic player to your starting lineup often creates chemistry issue. I used Philly and Toronto as possible examples.

The rift between Woodson and BK came about primarily because BK had a vision of the type of team he wanted, as well as the style of play, and Woodson didn’t share that vision or embrace the type of players BK was giving him. The Philly GM brought in an Allstar calibur halfcourt type of player that isn’t geared to playing the uptempo OFF he prefers. On the other hand, BK brought in a bunch of quick, fast and athletic young players that aren’t geared to playing the controlled, methodical halfcourt style of OFF HC MWoodson prefers.

I BELIEVE THAT IS THE ROOT OF ALL OF THE ISSUES THAT HAS EXISTED BETWEEN WOODSON AND BK, AS WELL AS SOME OF HIS PLAYERS. The players who’s talents, attitudes and abilities are best suited to playing an uptempo style are the one’s that have had the biggest problems with Woodson. Consider how uptempo, open court players like Acie, Smoove and Salim have had to kiss Woodson’s butt and/or make up with him and/or suffer through his doghouse tactics.

By E. G.

December 14, 2008 8:26 PM | Link to this

Da Real Real and CP

I also looked at the dunk videos on youtube, but I notice they we mostly fast breaks. You are right, however, that Josh Smith needs to be more aggressive. It looks like JS will never be Smooth around the rim without dunking; he just doesn’t have the Chill (Childress) in him.

All I expect Josh Smith to do is play smart and stop playing outside his game. That’s all we need from him is consistency and intelligence so this team can go to the next level.

I will tell you guys ONE MORE TIME; if Josh Smith play only to his strenghts and stop making back decisions on offense, we can be the 2nd best team in the EAST. That’s right; the 2nd best team in the EAST, even with Woody’s bad coaching.

By Got to like the Hawks

December 14, 2008 8:43 PM | Link to this

Sekou man, I have to give you some big ups for running probably the best blog on the AJC site. I haven’t commented much on Hawks blogs because there hasn’t been much to comment about until last year in the playoffs but I have been reading what guys talk about and for the most part you appear to get the more knowledgeable guys compared too the Falcons and Braves blogs that I comment on.

I have to agree with you on just about all of your points. Like some of the guys said…I’d like to see Josh get back to attacking the rim and just get nasty with it and stay within himself. Every since he came back from his injury he looks like he’s trying to do too much and it was really evident last night at the game after Lebron posterized him.

I actually like Josh when he’s posting up download. I think he has a pretty good hook shot…in fact he, and Horford does. The only difference is Horford uses his often and Josh doesn’t. I understand the whole idea about having a well rounded game and if Josh could knock down that little 12 ft jumper that Horford is knocking down then thats all he needs. Forget that three Smoove and get back to that hook & dunk.

By ant banks

December 14, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this

i was at the game last night and i was p** off at how many people were cheerin’ for lebron and cleveland. the same thing will happen when the celts come to town too.

it’s like everyone was ridin’ lebron’s jock. i mean he is good, but if you are livin’ in atl, you need to cheer for the home team.

watch when boston come to town, biotches will come out wit’ there green jerseys cheer everything that garnett does and don’t even know what state boston is in.

atl is really a bandwagon city. 5 yrs ago, they didn’t even come out to the boston game, let alone cheer for them, now look at these fans…OUTRAGEOUS!!

GO HAWKS!!

By darrell starks

December 14, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

I was at the game we won BUT IM UPSET WITH WOODY COACHING STYLE this is going to be A LONG SEASON and i would rather sacrifice a couple of game by developing my bench early in the season than to have your starters at the end of the season burned out and your defense intense is not there sometime i think woody just dont get it. GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By doc

December 14, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this

got to like … dont let kirk see what you wrote, he thinks we think too much and are negative. some like to think they are being constructive. you know as i was growing up i learned if the coach wasnt yelling at you, he didnt care about you. to be ignored was real bad though it didnt hurt your feelings. well we just care about the product and the guys, so, some might think it is hate while others say ….. tough love. besides atf, ando, ray, myk, aj, jhan, honest, flash and some others here can attest that the first year you could be on this thing all by yourself after a loss or even a win. nice to have so many on board with differing contrasting opinions rather than say the same old things.

manny t, i have been looking for you but i guess have missed you. i have also tried to spy you in your seats but i havent been able to spot you. i am not sure i can get there tomorrow but definitely there on wednesday. i am in the handicap accessible seating on the top row, so if you walk inside rather than outside the arena to the pretzel stand you walk right by me.

might have missed it but our columbia s.c. member was supposed to check in after the game he saw saturday. where you at melvin?

By doc

December 14, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this

btw i may be included in the negative group but i want folks to realize i expect them to be at least 19 and 11 before the end of the year. said it earlier in a blog so i am repeating myself just for emphasis. i guess that is real positive the way i look at it.

By JerryWest

December 14, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

Sekou,

Deke is looking for a team.

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/articles/2008/12/14/noneedtojazzuphisrecord/

He is a perfect fit for the Hawks. We can give him immediate playing time that other teams can’t. He is exactly what we need. Currently, he is looking at 7-8 teams before he makes a decision. He is in Atlanta now. Please write a column on Deke.

Bloggers - please push for Deke. We need his inside defensive presence badly. Thanks.

By ES

December 14, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this

Manny T

Do I think that the firing of Woodson is a realistic possibility? I think its doubtful that the ASG or Sund would give the thumbs up on it. Although I think anyone with a brain can see that there are some disturbing patterns emerging with Woody. Mainly his unbalanced substitution patterns, horrendous play calling, and failure to connect with his players. You’re right, it wouldn’t be the smartest “financial” decision to cut bait and hire someone else. But if this team goes through a couple of more lethargic stretches where they lose four or five games in a row, it wouldn’t surprise me if it was at least considered, giving Woody an extremely short leash starting next year.

• ES

By JerryWest

December 14, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this

sorry wrong link. posting from another blog:

Once Dikembe Mutombo passes out his gifts, he hopes to return to the NBA for a final season, possibly with the Celtics.

The 7-foot-2-inch, 260-pound center said last week he hopes to sign with a team after spending Christmas with his family in Atlanta. The four-time Defensive Player of the Year said among the teams that have shown interest are Boston, San Antonio, and Miami. The former Rocket also said Houston has “not answered me.” The 42-year-old, who has blocked 3,278 shots during his 17-year career, said he is in “good shape” from working out three hours a day with spinning classes, yoga, and weightlifting.

“You’ll see me in the next two weeks,” Mutombo said. “I will be somewhere. I really need to go back to playing. I’ve just got to make sure that I go to a place where I can be happy. There are about four to five teams that I’ve been looking at and about seven teams that have shown interest. It’s up to me to make my decision.”

The Celtics have the maximum 15 players and would have to waive one to make room for Mutombo. While Boston’s starting center spot is solidified with Kendrick Perkins, his backups include seldom-used Patrick O’Bryant and undersized Leon Powe and Glen Davis. The Celtics have not replaced the veteran experience and length that free agent P.J. Brown brought late last season and have interest in Mutombo, but have not offered him a contract.

“The way Boston is playing right now with [Kevin Garnett], Paul Pierce, and Ray Allen, the team is heading in a direction toward winning another championship,” Mutombo said. “It will be interesting if I made the decision to go there. It would be very good. I’ve been to the Finals twice [with Philadelphia and New Jersey]. I got close, but I walked away empty-handed. Maybe going to Boston would give me a chance to win.

“I would love to play until July and then retire after this season,” added the eight-time All-Star. “My plan is to play this season. If my mind is set to play basketball, why not?”

http://www.hawksquawk.net/community/index.php?showtopic=334472&pid=356476&st=0&#entry356476

By HB Ando

December 14, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

cp, saying there’s a club, built on “Josh need to get to the rim”, is kind of like joining a club for “the world is round”.

Just sayin’…..

Speaking of clubs, am I the only one who is a little confused at who is joining Kirk’s? He might as well be talking to himself in a four-wall, padded, world (and the thought that he is, with internet access, is not lost on me). But, like I’ve always said, the freedom to speak your mind, however splintered it may be, is what makes this country, and blogs like this, great.

doc works in a soup kitchen, and some of you humor Kirk. Charity comes in all forms……….

By doc

December 14, 2008 9:56 PM | Link to this

maybe if one of the hawks reads this he can pass it on. here is a quote saying that a team can both play a stifling defense and run offense.

shoot maybe woody himself can read it.

here is the quote: Rondo’s development has led coach Doc Rivers to tweak his team’s style of play. No longer content with a ball-control offense to go with a suffocating defense, the Celtics are running more than since their 1980s heydays — and Rondo is the reason.

here is the link: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/celtics/2008-12-14-rondo_N.htm

By HB Ando

December 14, 2008 10:07 PM | Link to this

I used to be a vocal believer in the upside of Patrick O’Bryant. But if a 7’1 black man, with an Irish last name, can’t get motivated to play for the World Champion Celtics, then waiving him, to let the “finger wag” back up Perkins, makes a lot of sense (especially when you project a Finals’ rematch with the Lakers, and think about dealing with Bynum and Gasol-do the Celtics really want to have Perkins go out early, due to foul trouble, during a rematch game, and look down the bench at a bunch of 6’8 guys, like Powe and Big Baby?).

Speaking of rematch, is it too early to talk about Wednesday??

By HB Ando

December 14, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this

doc, is that the same Rondo that was chosen with one of the Hawks’ previous first-round draft picks, that Billy Knight unnecessarily gave away in the Johnson signing (yeah, I still get a chuckle out of anyone who believes that Sarver would have signed their fourth option, after he publicly stated he didn’t want to be a Sun, or have his sheet matched, $70 million, over five years-regardless of whether it would have been money well spent, in retrospect)?

For the record, that’s more money that Josh Smith makes, to be, after this season, the SECOND-highest paid Hawk (if Bibby does, somehow, end up re-signing, it will be for less-ditto Marvin)….

Heard Paul Pierce publicly politicking for Rondo to be their fourth all-star this season (I’m not sold on Allen being their third, but with their record, they have a solid argument, based on Detroit getting four in a couple of years ago).

Hawks stay 5 games over, they’ll get two on the team (but not three, so will it be Bibby or Smith?).

By Najeh Davenpoop

December 14, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this

It’s also the same Rondo who got picked 16 picks after Shelden Williams…

By HB Ando

December 14, 2008 10:30 PM | Link to this

Najeh, LOL.

Well, there is that, too…..

By Da Real Real

December 14, 2008 10:35 PM | Link to this

I agree with you EG. I guess what I’ll say next can be said for most talented teams…If our guys play within themselves and play to their roles that we could easily be one of the top 5 teams…I think at least as high as 3 in the eastern conference, and I think we also would have as good as shot as the Magic to win our division. We’re starting to get back to that team that went 6-0. We got that huge game Wednesday that if we win it could mean huge things for this month. I’m just hoping that in the case of a lost Wednesday that it does not send the Hawks off track as the heart breaker did in Bos. I don’t think it’ll happen because we for the most part appear to be a pretty mature team.

Ando that’s a good question about who would be the 2nd all star if the Hawks could get to that point. I just dont know if we will…..I’m almost willing to even through Big Al into the Bibby, Smoove mix to be honest with you. It’d be a tough call

By richbrave

December 14, 2008 10:37 PM | Link to this

doc:

Yeah, that’s what the MAKERS MARK hangover came from. CHATTANOOGA here we come. Its the FCS FINAL. MONTANA and RICHMOND. Lets get it on. Going.? We can meet.

By The Truth

December 14, 2008 10:50 PM | Link to this

Kudos, to the Hawks for the Cav Win. I too was at the game and the place was rocking. I really appreciated receiving the complimentary Hawks sweater cap because I really needed it. Because of the sold out crowd and since I had to walk far to my parked car it really came in handy. The “Hawk” was out last night. By the way, that’s “Hawk” as in COLD WEATHER.

On a previous blog I mentioned I was attending the Cav game and hoped I was not going to be disappointed. Well, guess what. I was not disappointed. The Hawks played to their strength and defended well. The offense was provided by committee and not a one-man show. They closed down driving lanes for King James and left him with bridges to “no-where”. He still got his point but he had to work and it didn’t come easy. Marvin did a nice job defending him. I notice Cav played playoff style defense early and may have just run out of gas near the end. They may have gotten exhausted throwing bodies at JJ. Most of the time JJ was one-on-two or one-on-three. Bibby shot with a lot of confidence and showed his veteran leadership attributes. I have been critical of his streaky school yard play, but as I also said, when he is on his game, he can be a game changer.

In general, I liked this version of the Hawks aggressive style of play. In a previous blog I mentioned the Hawks is a tweener team and their greatest asset is their quickness. When they are running, defending, active sharing the ball and focused, we are hard to beat.

By doc

December 14, 2008 10:54 PM | Link to this

dude rich ill be putting up a tree with my daughters. i have been there to see a soccer match with our world cup women when i was toting my son to all his soccer tournaments. nice venue in chattanooga.

najeh thanks for putting that one to rest as if bk couldnt have found a 6’8” forward to pick with that slot if we had had it. still think jj is the man and i dont think that was the throw in pick in question anyway. ando is such a rabble rouser.

By HB Ando

December 14, 2008 11:11 PM | Link to this

doc, that was ONE of the throw-in picks. The other turned out to be Robin Lopez, who will take some time to develop (evaluate).

I think you perceive Najeh’s post in a very different way than I did. Seems to me he was offering yet another accessible version of just how ridiculous the Shelden pick was, like we REALLY needed another 6’8 forward. Far as I can tell, Rondo is another example of just how awful the Williams pick was (and, bizarrely, how mind-boggling it is that the Hawks could have set their future by drafting, that summer, both Roy and Rondo).

Maybe, if I had a had a copious amount of thin needles sticking out of the expanse that is my body, I would have understood correctly.

Then again, maybe not.

Damn, I love comma’s………….

Has anyone, on this blog, or any other forum, accessible by the general public, ever loved a comma quite as soundly, or as passionately, as me, HB Ando?

Maybe, maybe not.

By cp

December 14, 2008 11:12 PM | Link to this

Good point Ando lol.

By MannyT

December 14, 2008 11:51 PM | Link to this

ES Typically when a coach gets run, he’s underperforming or there is a special circumstance.

Woody’s record says he isn’t underperforming. While we have our opinions as to how he could perform better, the team is on track to win about 50 games.

In special circumstances—his star likes him, I don’t think we see Pat Riley replacing Paul Westhead here. The new GM isn’t the 800 lb gorilla of influence, so we won’t see Pat Riley taking over a good team while VanGundy goes to take care of some personal stuff.

For all of the questions about the positivity or negativity of posts, I think even Ando would agree that his preseason wagers are looking a bit shaky right now.

Even if you take the money out of the decision, you don’t fire the man whne he is having his best season, by far, as a pro coach. Remember, he got a short extension. Unless the bottom falls out this season (below 500 without significant injuries), he’s not going anywhere.

Ando, It’s not too early for bloggers to get pumped up about Wednesday, but remember that the team has to do this one game at a time. Charlotte usually plays us tough. If the Hawks overlook them, we could be in for a long Monday night.

You and Najeh can rehash the 2006 draft, but be real for a moment…would Woody want or play a rookie PG that could defend, but could not shoot….wait for it….don’t you remember (Woody sez—BK, not another Royal Ivey)

Sure you want the pick, but that draft was not the one that would have made a big difference if we had that pick. It would not have been used on Rondo. Josh Boone—maybe. Your boy Rick had the insight to use #11 on Saer Sene. Lot’s of misses in 2006 draft.

With all that self love, you must be reading the comma sutra ;-)

BWAF

By Mike

December 15, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this

Nice blog…

SPEEDY UPDATE?

By HB Ando

December 15, 2008 1:31 AM | Link to this

Manny, if we’re going to start splitting hairs:

-Sund isn’t, and has never been, “my boy”

-As far as my pre-season wagers, we have 6-0, 6-9, and 2-0. Seems like we’re susceptible to the loss of a primary cog (Josh, retrospectively, and anyone else, looking forward). If ever there was a bet I’d be happy to lose, the Hawks making the playoffs would be the one.

-I’m not buying the argument that Woody is a rookie killer, given the roles that both Josh’s, Marvin and Horford all had, in previous years. Yes, Law is behind a better player. But Rondo was too, behind Cassell, and he took the job and led them to the finals (he was absolutely viewed as the major question mark, going into last season, when folks pondered how far the “big 3” could go-he answered that).

-I’ll always be more into rehashing the ‘05 draft, as all other future draft slots would be relative to taking Paul over Marvin. I said, before Marvin ever played a minute, that his best outcome would be Al Harrington (underscoring the confusing decision to draft him instead of Paul).

As Paul continues to be one of the five best players in the league, conservatively, and Harrington is putting up numbers that Marvin will never approach (even if he is somehow traded to a D’Antoni team), the equally depressing decision to draft Shelden will always represent, arguably, the worst back-to-back lottery picks in the history of the NBA.

By dap01

December 15, 2008 7:41 AM | Link to this

Give Deke a contract!

By Mike

December 15, 2008 7:43 AM | Link to this

all i see is as coach that doesnt know how to develop his players, put to together a decent and consistent rotation, and utilize his young bench. no reason why acie or solo should be riding the bench after both doing well in the absense of j smoove. and why get morris and dont use him at all as bad as we need a inside presence.

By Mike

December 15, 2008 7:44 AM | Link to this

all i see is as coach that doesnt know how to develop his players, put to together a decent and consistent rotation, and utilize his young bench. no reason why acie or solo should be riding the bench after both doing well in the absense of j smoove. and why get morris and dont use him at all as bad as we need a inside presence.

By BA

December 15, 2008 7:47 AM | Link to this

Let’s get all the rehashing out of the way early…

So at the ripe old age of 22, you’ve decided Marvin will “never approach” Harrington’s numbers ando?! Marvin’s on a team with (potentially) two All-Stars, as opposed to Al being the big fish in the dirty little NY pond. And for their career averages, Marvin’s has not only “approached” Harrington’s numbers, he’s virtually matched them already. At 22. Millions of dollars cheaper (with more upside), and Williams is a much better defender.

Ray, why do you continue to humor this guy with this Bibby/ Josh Smith stuff? I look forward to reading your posts after a long weekend, and your wasting time on this one-trick pony. Anyone with any sense knows even ando’s position on trading Bibby. Just like we all know that certain people (who must not watch the cat play) think Smash is overrated.

I get that the dead horse (er, Bibby discussion) was about payroll. I never thought it made much sense (unless you can move him for a better point, but why would another team do that). Saving half a year of the dude’s salary to move him would backfire with a fan backlash.

Anyway, the original theory was predicated on Atlanta falling out of the playoff hunt, which certainly isn’t going to be the case.

And ando, don’t come at me with Paul and Sheldon Williams. It’s ancient history anyway- I like this roster, and it’s somewhat irrelevant (at this point) what could have been. I was arguing Marvin vs. Harrington.

What a game against Cleveland…

By BA

December 15, 2008 8:02 AM | Link to this

Morris doesn’t play because he ISN”T an “inside prescence”. He’s a young, under-developed big with the defensive awareness of a foot stool. We won the Cleveland game. They had won 11 freakin’ games straight! Would we have lost with Solo and Acie logging significant minutes? Who knows. There are a lot of DNP’s every night around the league. Woodson is NOT a trendsetter in this regard. Don’t you folks think if these young cats were lighting it up in practice they would be playing?

If Woodson can’t develop players, how about Williams and Smith? Marvin was afraid to touch the ball when he came in the league. Smith was a babe, and neither one of them could handle the ball. Look at them now, and tell me Woodson can’t develop players. Look, I like Solo and I like Acie. But Acie is not even close to being as effective as Bibby, and Solo just doesn’t match up with a team like the Cavs.

Everybody thought Knight was a moron. Except we have a playoff roster thanks to him. A lot of people wrote Woodson off. Except he’s coached this team back into prominence in this league. He has the full support of his team, and even players that have had it out with him (Smith, Pachulia) are playing hard for him now. The man has respect around this league.

Basically what I’m saying is, BWAF will make you shine- give him some love!

By hawks_4_life

December 15, 2008 8:38 AM | Link to this

BA I FEEL YOUR SENTIMENTS….PREACE BRO!!!

By Astro Joe

December 15, 2008 9:42 AM | Link to this

Yeah I think a few of us have been asking for a “back to the future” signing of Dikembe Mutombo. I don’t see how it could be a bad thing, considering his ability to impact a game defensively and his remarkable performance last season when Yao went down with his annual injury. In 8-10 minutes of game time, he would be ideal to shut down half-court points in the paint and trigger many fast break opportunities. Deke is not just a shot blocker but an above average rebounder and outlet passer too.

I’d love to see the starters chilling on the bench tonight with about 6 minutes remaining in the fourth quarter. Last week’s Bobcats trade made them better defensively but unless Diaw becomes more aggressive on the offensive side, I think that they will struggle to score 90 points must nights.

By doc

December 15, 2008 9:49 AM | Link to this

ba, maybe we can switch it to SDWAF that stands for shiny dome woody arm fold to emphasize the shine.

ba like your post, clarity.

as far as bibby going anywhere i doubt it unless there is an unexepcted swoon between now and february due to injury etc. he is back to the guy that we wanted when the trade was made. between jj, bibby and josh there is the promise of a playoff position with home court advantage and maybe even advancement. bibby has answered all his detractors including me wondering if he would get his shot back among other issues. is he too expensive for the total package, maybe to absolutely but he is a really good fit for this team. i imagine if given orders from the top he could ratchet it up another notch to be a running team. it seems when we do that there is the concern the defense lags. if there is one thing to be focused on it is defense as defense probably keeps you in any game of ball whether it is basket, base or foot ballin.

By Sautee

December 15, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

BA

Everybody thought Knight was a moron. Except we have a playoff roster thanks to him.

I for one do NOT think BK was a moron. He did a good job early on of ridding the Hawks of some ridiculous contracts.

That said, however, he was given FIVE lottery picks, 4 of them top six picks. You or me, or over half this blog could certainly have acquired the talent he did. He did make a good pick with Josh at #17, or whatever that pick was.

So, to me, the “thanks” go to those horrible teams that “earned” all those lottery picks.

And then this:

But Acie is not even close to being as effective as Bibby, and Solo just doesn’t match up with a team like the Cavs.

BA, I don’t think anybody here thinks for a minute that Acie is better than Bibby, but you’ll have to admit that when he was given the opportunity to play with the first team (last week), he was effective. And all that earned him was seemingly more bench time.

And isn’t Solo basically Ben Wallace without the steroids? Why would they not match up?

And all those Josh haters would argue that Smith is still undeveloped after 5 years. Does Woody get the credit for that?

By Tiger Woo

December 15, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

Acie Law really needs to improve his outside shot before he can become a real factor in the NBA. He is quick and can effectively penetrate into the paint, but most of the really effective penetrating point guards (Parker, Paul, Nash, D. Williams, Rondo - to name a few) have developed nice perimeter games, so defenses can’t back off and must respect their jump shooting abilities.

Can Acie prosper without a consistent jump shot? Only if he is able to get into the paint and finish around the basket with a variety of crafty moves (ala Tony Parker) or consistently break down defenses and dish off the ball to JJ, Marvin, etc.

By one66soul

December 15, 2008 10:17 AM | Link to this

The Hawks Organization was promoting the Bos game and overlooking the game tonight against CHA. I sure hope the Coaches and Players are not overlooking tonight’s game.

By Sautee

December 15, 2008 10:20 AM | Link to this

Ando

Has anyone, on this blog, or any other forum, accessible by the general public, ever loved a comma quite as soundly, or as passionately, as me, HB Ando?

Maybe, maybe not.

Maybe not, but I know a gastroenterologist who definitely loves colons more than you! ;-)

MannyT

Comma Sutra - ROFLOL!

By doc

December 15, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

ba as a follow up, before i get on the dark side of ando i think it is relevant to point out what you might have purposely overlooked for the sake of argument that it is not as much as how much marvin will continue to grow but that we picked a guy who was four or five years away form being what we already had at best. i think paul, jj and al harrington would not have been a phenomenal. collection to begin a reconstruction. throw josh in the mix and it is mind boggling. my belief is management didnt want it to happen too fast by how they spent there efforts and money.

By Astro Joe

December 15, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

Doc, have you noticed how well Bibby is attempting to play defense? I noticed it in the Cavs game, he was really moving his feet to try to deny Delonte West dribble penetration. And he was successful, West often had to dribble back and either pass it or settle for a long shot. I’m not saying that Bibby was looking like Jason Kidd is his prime (perennial all-defensive team selection), but he was clearly putting forth the effort to defend his man. Too bad there isn’t local TV of tonight’s game because I would like to see if Bibby steps up his game after Augustin played very well during the last meeting.

Again NO LOCAL TV of the BOBCATS GAME.

By ES

December 15, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Tiger Woo: Agreed on the Acie Law point for the most part, but is Flip Murray a good outside shooter? Yea, he’s better than law, but really, is he that much better? And Flip can’t attack the rim the way Law can do so on a regular basis

By doc

December 15, 2008 11:01 AM | Link to this

aj, bibby’s defensive effort is missed often. yes people blow by him as he has lost a step or never had one to begin with. they also get beat on pretty good as he continuously grabs and being crafty he does the small things. he also helps his teammates. some folks miss the subtleties that he brings to the defensive side.

By HOME GROWN aka E.J.

December 15, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this

Man I had to watch both games from the house this weekend (I had my little one at the house), but we got our popcorn and apple juice and cheered until she went to sleep. These games show that when we have strong “D” and get out and run, we are a totally different team that can win 45-50 games and come out 4th or 5th in the East.

I will however be at the game on Wendesday against Bos., and i will look for some of my fellow bloggers to say what’s up. I have been a Bibby fan from the start, but I do see that he does have some “D” issues with smaller pgs. We will see what he will do with Rando and if that effects his offense. It was good to see JJ match LeBron on Sat. Everytime down the court he was going to go shot for shot. Bobcats then the rematch!! We must protect this house!! (I’m sorry I had to) Yes sir!

By terrell barron

December 15, 2008 12:30 PM | Link to this

No TV? That’s b******.

By terrell barron

December 15, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this

Where can I listen to the game online?

By richbrave

December 15, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

BA:

You da’ man. I tol’ jah’, you da’ man. Props to you. Great takes. Honey beats vinegar every time. What a difference a year makes.

By Astro Joe

December 15, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this

tb, if you haven’t done so, register at nba.com (for free) and you can listen to every game… all teams, on-line… FREE!

By terrell barron

December 15, 2008 12:49 PM | Link to this

I think I forgot my password Astro. I registerd a long time ago. lol! I’ll have to register again. I thought it my be on 790 or something? Thanks man.

By hawks

December 15, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this

Quite complaining about no TV come out and support. Tickets range from $10 and up! and there are several ways to get free tickets.

GO Hawks!

By one66soul

December 15, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this

Why are most of the Home games in HD, and the road games are not, Now That Sucks especially for season ticket holders…..

By one66soul

December 15, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

who said Acie was better than Flip. I think not, Acie may have potential to be better than Flip. Acie needs to put in more work and develop a jump shot and make the right decision when he drives. As of today Flip is a better player and much better jump shooter.

By one66soul

December 15, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

Would said Acie was better than Flip. I think not, Acie may have potential to be better than Flip. Acie needs to put in more work and develop a jump shot and make the right decision when he drives. As of today Flip is a better player and much better jump shooter.

By ray

December 15, 2008 1:08 PM | Link to this

BA,

Sorry, lol! You’re right, I shouldn’t humor Kirk. After all, beating the hell out of a retard is probably just as bad on the internet as it is in person….

But how are you going to accuse me of beating a dead horse when you’re engaged in flailing away at the fossil remains of the Billy Knight conversation? LOL! I’m just sayin’…Also, look how long it took the guy to get a decent pg after claiming that no pg was necessary. Oh yes, he was quoted as saying such.

I give Woody some credit for the development of our players. Can’t give him all of it though, and I disagree with some things where his coaching style is concerned. As you say though, we have a 14-9 record. I think Woody isn’t the best match for this team, and I’ll leave it at that. Give him what works in his own personal system and you’ll probably see a record like this on the regular. Don’t, and it takes you 5 years to get to this point…and the season ain’t even over yet. It seems to me that as the team got older, and more vets were added, the better we got.

On the subject of Acie, all I’ve begged for is the man to get 20 minutes a game. That’s all. Having to explain this over and over is getting very old. Never have I said that he should start over Bibby. I’ve said plenty of times that if Bibby is hot, then leave him in. If he can’t get a shot off, then put Acie in there to change the tempo of the game. When the opposing team gets tired of Acie penetrating, then bring Bibby back in and he can resume spreading the floor with his shooting. But if you can’t get the man open for some jumpers, he just can’t give you much. You have to design things to a guys strengths. And if tonight ain’t his night, you must adjust.

Case in point: We beat Cleveland behind Bibby’s 24 points, 5 boards, and 6 assists in 41 minutes. The time before that, Bibby was off and recorded 10 points and 1 assist. Meanwhile, Acie put up 20 points, 6 boards, and 7 assists in 23 minutes. You can call it luck. You can call it garbage time. But I watched the game. I know what it was. Quality performance during a tough game.

23 minutes. Is that too much to ask? Besides, would you want Bibby playing 38-41 minutes a game all season? I’m just sayin’.

But you’re right, Acie isn’t close to being as effective as Bibby. How could he? Dude plays 11.5 minutes per game. Bibby plays about 33. No contest.

But I have to echo Doc. Your post was sharp.

Wouldn’t argue Harrington vs. Williams. It’s not a fair comparison right now. However, Harrington’s game was more complete at this point in his career than Marvin’s is…aside from the defensive aspect.

By BA

December 15, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

Sautee, I seen a lot of good things from Acie this year. And he should get more pt. But at this point in his career, he doesn’t compare to Bibby’s current level. That was more my point, not to take away from Law. And in regards to Solo, I think Big Al’s recent propensity to stay out of foul trouble has kept him off the floor more than anything.

And be fair. I bet Solo (and his mom) are better shooters than Wallace, ‘roids or not.

doc, I think Williams will ultimately be a better overall player than Harrington is now. Can’t prove it, just a difference of opinion. And yeah I haven’t missed Bibby’s defense- he’s been giving it hell and it’s only the speed guys (Harris, Augustine) that blow past him. Plus he’s been the benificiary of good help defense lately as well.

By Sautee

December 15, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this

Tiger Woo

Excellent comments on Acie.

But you ask if he can prosper without a consistent jump shot? No. Not truly prosper.

He (or any other young player) won’t be consistent at improving their jumper if they are pulled immediately after missing.

It’s got to be a confidence thing for Acie (see his A&M days, for example).

When Woody, and the vets begin to encourage his jumper, you’ll see a big improvement. Rondo went through the same thing until last spring, when the Celtic vets began to put him in position to succeed. Add to that, the fact that Doc let him play though some bad shooting nights.

Of course the flip side is that Acie has to show a willingness and stop turning down outside shot opportunities.

Just for reference, Billups shot below 40% for his first 4 years.

Acie is already better than that, (barely) though his outside % must be abysmal. But you cannot have growth without some growing pains. Invest in this kid. Or trade him for someone you are willing to invest in.

By BA

December 15, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this

I think you’re giving ownership too much credit with that one doc- they didn’t do it to save money. Marvin WAS the “concensus” #2 pick, and he was a pure Billy Knight type of player…

That’s as far as I’ll go with that. I’m not going to be caught on the wrong side of a cp3 argument.

By doc

December 15, 2008 1:23 PM | Link to this

aj, i have two tix available for tonight’s game at the last minute. if you want them i need your e-mail so i can send them to you. i dont really like them to go unused especially if someone is going to pull for the home team.

By terrell barron

December 15, 2008 1:30 PM | Link to this

Theus is out in Sac-town. Wow!

By doc

December 15, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

ba ownership developed their model of reconstruction which was to break it down to its most elemental components and build up that way. very few if any teams have done it that way. chicago tried and failed with its twin towers. so for that reason it started at the top when all members were in and starting out. from that i give them credit for the choice of marvin . i also give them credit for the snails pace of reconstruction i.e. through the draft preferably and with a lower cost. that is not my imagination but quoted many times over as their goal by them.

it seems our braves are stuck in the same mentality. in both cases it may be necessary for the owners. just like i wasnt concerned when they didnt get curry, and i think most except samuel felt that way; i think all braves fans will be pleased that burnett didnt come along for the ride. he is cut more from the jaguar model rather than an indestructable mercedes.

By Melvin

December 15, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this

Doc, I’m back. The ATL has too many distraction for a guy my age to come straight back to the blog after the game… heh,heh. I may be at the Rockets game later this month but I will be back for sure to attend the Big Weekend in March for the Lakers and Celtics. I’ll keep ya posted…

Anyhow, I didn’t bother by going to the spot since I knew you wasn’t going to be there. As for the game, I think the bloggers & Sekou did a pretty good job of recapping. So I won’t be repetitive. I would like to add that the atmosphere was good (not a good as the playoff crowd). I agree with most bloggers that I would like to see Woody use more of his bench. I was disappoint that AC and Solo didn’t get any mins. I thinks Lebron gets too many touch fouls. Also, to expand on the JSmoove (who is my favorite player) debate. I think if he could develop his ball handling, he would get to the rim easier & more frequently. I would like to see him improve his dribble with his strong hand therefore he could at least go stronger and consistent to that side (similiar to Lamar Odom).

On another note, that big boy from Georgetown (Greg Monroe) may be the next great big man in line from that School. Ya heard it here first….

By doc

December 15, 2008 2:24 PM | Link to this

melvin glad you survived the big a.

By Tiger Woo

December 15, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this

ES

I think the main difference between Flip and Acie is probably experience and confidence in their abilities (like Sautee said). Flip is not afraid to step up and take the big shot - when he has struggled, he’s not hesitant to come out the next game and fire away.

Thanks Sautee

You make some good points as well. I think Acie needs to prove to Woody that he can knock down that jump shot. He simply hasn’t shown that he can in the opportunities that he’s had. He has shown that he can penetrate and break down defenses - the next time he gets some minutes, he should showcase his outside game.

I remember Tony Parker had no outside shot when he came into the league - he has put the work in to improve and he’s a real threat from the perimeter now.

By HOME GROWN aka E.J.

December 15, 2008 3:14 PM | Link to this

DOC and anyone else, if you have tickets and want to give away or sell them, just let me know, put me on that list. I would be glad to try and get them when you have them!!!

By doc

December 15, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

home grown, i hear ya but i dont know you even as a regular here so i will not just send them on. i hope you understand and will continue to come back on the blog a bit so we get to know you. maybe if i get a time where i share the seat next to you to get to know you then cool, just not tonight as for all i know you just turn around and sell them. nothing against you just dont really have a clue as to who you are. you could be home grown from charlotte for all i know. heh heh ;-))

By Najeh Davenpoop

December 15, 2008 4:13 PM | Link to this

This is the 3rd or 4th game this year I think that hasn’t been carried on local TV. This is really starting to p-ss me off. It’s not like anyone wants to see reruns of the Best Damn Sports Show Period or extended interviews with Jeff Francoeur’s family, which is pretty much what they have on FSN and SportSouth whenever Hawks or Thrashers games are not on.

By Left knee hurts

December 15, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this

I enjoyed watching the game Sat night in HD. That was cool. I am tired of hearing Nique say multiple times a game - “that will pretty much almost maybe seal it”. He is getting a little better though.

I was disappointed not to see Acie. Mo Williams was keeping them afloat in addition to King James. I understand what Marvin said about feeling small. Late in the game, he got knocked down 2 times by Lebron all in about 8 seconds. He got up both times then ended up with teh 2nd rebound. I would like to see Marvin drive against Lebron with the only purpose to draw a foul. Don’t even worry about making it - just do like Pierce - drive straight into him while he’s moving and get the call. I watched a couple of Lebron’s big-time moves to the hole in DVR slow motion - I promise he gets 3 huge steps after he picks up the dribble. They call Zaza for travel just standing there. LBJ gets to walk across China and gets the AND1. The stars get a double standard.

Joe started out hot hitting those first couple of Js then disappeared until some crucial 4th quarter knockdowns. There is a star who does not get the calls. I think he is so strong and balanced he doesn’t get knocked down as much as Lebron and Pierce so they don’t make the calls as often. Do you guys think some starts flop after the shot and get the call? Lebron flopped all the way to the corner 1 time and was way late getting back on D. The Hawks did not attack 5 on 4 but should have. Go Hawks! Don’t let DJ Augistin hit 7 threes again.

By HOME GROWN aka E.J.

December 15, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this

* Doc*

I understand what you are saying. I have been on here since the beginning of the season, so I know that I am a newbie, but I do TRY to blog after every game. I guess I will have to come with more passion for some to read what I have to say. Rest assured that I am a Hawks fan since the Omni and the “gold rush” arcade I used to beg to go to after the game. I asked where ya’ll boys sit so I could introduce myself, but again I guess very few read people they don’t know. Anyway, I will be at the game on Wendesday and for the record, Doc I have too much character to do something like that to you or anyone else. Nothing personal taken HEH Heh h…..

By AJW

December 15, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this

Thanks Sekou for putting this in your latest article.

“After dealing with injuries and playing the second most road games of any team in the first quarter of the season (Utah played the most), Hawks coach Mike Woodson prefers his team take the business-like approach the rest of their season.”

Here is another one for you to figure out. How many more games are not going to be on tv this year? What is the ratio around the league of no local tv broadcast? And I bet Every local broadcast for Chicago, LA, Cleveland, Boston, and New York are in HD. This lo-def crap is terrible.

By doc

December 15, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this

home grown give me your e-mail. i will send it to you if the system works and meet you wednesday. deal?

By Astro Joe

December 15, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this

doc, I appreciate the offer and I hope “Home Grown” uses them well. I’ve got extended “Daddy duty” tonight… so I will probably check in on the box score after half-time (and the rugs rats are in bed). Thanks again.

By HOME GROWN aka E.J.

December 15, 2008 5:16 PM | Link to this

Doc, cool just let me know what to do. errol_wade@hotmail.com

By Astro Joe

December 15, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this

Not the least bit surprised by the Thues move… he was grating on his players from the day he landed in Sac-town. I wonder if the Maloofs will allow their GM to make the next hire or if they will continue to hand-pick their coaches (Theus was picked by the brothers as I recall with Petrie having no say-so).

By doc

December 15, 2008 5:39 PM | Link to this

home grown, they should be in your e-mail in basket by now if the system works as planned. run them off on a printer and you should be good to go.

get me a W that doesnt end in a bush. no excuses.

oh yeah report back. heh heh

see you for the C’s.

go hawks!!

By Josh

December 15, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this

Hey Sekou. I know it’s early, but have you heard anything about Sund looking at some trade options. Possibly some frontcourt help or a real backup PG since Woodson refuses to give Law consistent minutes. I think for the Hawks to make noise they need another piece and I think that needs to be a decent center to get Horford back to his right position. Anyway, just curious if you’ve heard anything from the Hawks in regards to looking for a deal lke this.

By richbrave

December 15, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this

I still do not believe BIBBY will carry the HAWKS to an NBA Championship. He was beaten like a tom-tom by PIERCE and RONDO in the playoffs last year. They cut off his passing lanes and shot over him at will. Where’s his “D” on the other end.? But most of you guys have seen him mucho this season, and alas, I only twice. So you’ve piled on his bandwagon and what you’ve been telling me here is that the injury is gone and he’s adapted to WOODSON’s style of play VIZ. EFFECTIVE PG. I still have my doubts and I’m not a quick study. As you know I’m a historian. We move toward new positions with the speed at times of being brain-dead. I’ll let you know after this season’s over. ‘Till then I still have my doubts about MB, and my reservations about MW. With an expiring contract, I still feel he’ll be gone AFTER the season. If the team falters, it’ll be by the trade dead-line. But they won’t. DR. MARY B’s group, Al HORFORD and the SURVIVORS, are playin’ the music I knew they could last year this time. The ASG and SUND can’t all be historians can they.?

By richbrave

December 15, 2008 7:09 PM | Link to this

doc,ray,BA et.al.

Have you seen the current disclaimer at the end of D. ORLANDO’s blog.? Check it out. Previous article “superbarrio” called LEDBETTER out. This is the result - I guess. I was intrigued to see what type of response he would give. At least, its worked so far. Nothin’ but football. Haters, and liars beware.

By Melvin

December 15, 2008 7:36 PM | Link to this

Doc, I need more of you ATLiens at the game tonite. The game is blackout in SC….

By kirkinga

December 15, 2008 7:43 PM | Link to this

beating the hell out of a retard is probably just as bad on the internet as it is in person….

Surely talking about playing with yourself is bad form even for bitter senior citizens.

It’s good to read positive comments about our winning team. It’s a very nice change.

If agitating for positive energy makes me a “one-trick pony” in some fan’s opinion, then I’m ok with that.I’m going to say what I want to say how and when I want to say it. Whether it meets with approval or apathy bothers me not.

Someone needs to be a cheerleader type on this blog that features too much from too few,and Ill accept the role(and the predictable ridicule).

Hawks down early.

Go Hawks!!

By hawks_4_life

December 15, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this

The hawks seem out of it tonight for some reason. Well all of you who pushed for Law getting early playing time, he got it and did nothing with it. Right now im so frustrated with the hawks because they are becoming a jump shooting team.

By Sekou K. Smith

December 15, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

new blog up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By hawksta

December 15, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this

doc is funny! “Homegrown from Charlotte”! That’s a good one! hee! hee!