Hawks

By DAP01

October 16, 2008 9:31 AM | Link to this

Why is Morris not getting ANY playing time? Is MW so shortsighted trying to win in the preseason that someone who like Morris don’t even get a couple of minutes.

By doc

October 16, 2008 9:40 AM | Link to this

just like last year even in preseason chills would have blocked it or changed its trajectory and slammed it home on the other end to win the game. woe is me/us we are lost without him.

By MannyT

October 16, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this

Ariose My bad on the Salim link yesterday. If you recheck that post, I accidentally put the luggage link in both places.

Here is your Salim link. About 1/3 of the way down, check the bullet that starts with Portland. Salim may also be well enough to get a little court time tonight when the Spurs play Cleveland.

I realized that Woody probably intended to play Morris but he has been confused by some blog speak. Let’s help him out.

Flip Mo squad is the smaller guys (Murray & Evans).

RandMo is the big guy all by himself.

WitPro is short for witness protection. That’s where we happened to find AC this summer. Fortunately, the case that put him there went away, so he could be seen on the court this season. Unfortunately, we still have seen it used for Gardner and Morris…aka RandMo.

Glad that Mo Evans has that defensive aggression that should help us in long run to slow down some of these scorers.

Sounds like OH is the more physical version of Chills around the basket. If he can bring that no plays called for me scrappiness, I’ll be a fan.

I hope some of those people that had faith in Solo are still around. I questioned his summer plans, but they seem to have been the right thing for him to develop. I am glad for him. Now that Woody has RandMo to suppress, maybe Solo will get some regular season playing time as situations dictate that he can help.

Sekou While I wasn’t there last night, I promise you that the public scrimmage was not free. You would think they would use the fake 8 games to try some new marketing ideas or pass freebies to groups that might draw them more business in the future. You know they won’t sell out preseason games, so get the kids or college students in there to fill some seats. Complete an online marketing survey, get a 300 level ticket.

BWAF

By Sautee

October 16, 2008 10:31 AM | Link to this

doc

To echo Ray from last week:

Do you need a bigger spoon to stir that pot?

By mavid

October 16, 2008 10:36 AM | Link to this

Sekou, enjoyed your audio commentary with Lang Whitaker.

Question: When are we gonna get a story about Al Horford´s summer?? In one blog, you said in passing that some of the Redeem Team said Al was the most impressive player on the practice squad of younger guys. Can you divulge any more than that??

Also, what´s your take on Hollinger calling Chill the Hawks 3rd best player (behind Joe and Smoove)? And yes, Hollinger actually said that recently.

By doc

October 16, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this

sautee, could not resist and obviously very much tongue in cheek.

mavid, by the plus minus numbers, chills on court was the third best player for the hawks last year ending up in positive territory behind jj and smith at about a plus three. that was also why he was in games at the finish because he had the capacity to make that difference. it probably means he was on the court when comebacks were accomplished. of course some may argue well those numbers dont mean anything and it may not even be the reason the pundit gave his opinion but that is more than opinion but something relevant just like ppg, rpg, etc.

had one of those horrid nightmares last night about punctuation only to wake up and find out it was real life. thanks ray, but you been talking to the alpha mutt too much. heh heh yeah that’s the ticket the alpha mutt. i just copyrighted that one for my use only.

By Dan

October 16, 2008 11:14 AM | Link to this

After attending the game on Monday and last night, I am ready for the regular season to get here. Sekou is right. Last night it was easy to see that the teams were kind of going through the motions. Things did pick up in the second half, though…

Not only are we left to wonder why Randolph is not playing, but what about Gardener? I know the guy is not likely to make the All Star team, but he could, potentially, help out. If he is as good of shooter as everyone seems to think he is, why not get him some preseason minutes? You can never have enough shooters, right?

By ray

October 16, 2008 11:40 AM | Link to this

Doc, you lost me….

MannyT, I agree on Hunter. I’ve been a fan already though. Just something about the guy that makes me think we got a diamond in the rough. But we’ll see. RandMo has to find a niche. But I don’t know if he can if he doesn’t start showing something on defense and on the boards. I mean…does Woody see anything else in a big man? I don’t think he does. I’m sure RandMo can get us a handful of baskets down on the low block…but again, he’s never going to get a chance to show us that if he doesn’t ramp it up on the other end of the floor. I could be wrong on this one, but…

That spoof “A typical Day at the Blog” from last blog nailed my butt big time. Funny as $hit…now who might that be…going to have to gather the BCU on this one.

Great article by Sekou on Flip Murray. We have certainly not had a backup guard like this. I especially like the comments Josh Smith made about him right towards the end of the article. One, it shows that Murray is a leader, and a vocal one. Something we’ve been lacking, even from our best player. Two, it shows that Josh Smith is listening to his veteran peers. You know what else? Good veterans are the guys who can bridge the gap between players and coaches, identifying with the players while also understanding, translating, and promoting the philosophies of the coach. This is what helps teams to really refine their chemistry.

I’m glad we picked up guys like Flip and Mo. They could turn out to be the glue…an even stronger glue than Childress was. I have no doubts Childress could not grow in or even maintain that role, as his respect for Woodson had to be fading.

So while we argue about whether or not he’s replaceable on the court by two older guys…consider what they bring that I think Childress could not…the glue…and the experience of playing for other NBA head coaches, on other teams. Like I’ve maintained, these guys aren’t replacements, they’re additions. And they bring more than can be seen on paper.

Whether this translates into more wins or less wins is yet to be determined. But I am hopeful all the same.

By doc

October 16, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this

ray, if it wasnt you someone has you pegged and only emphasizes the amount of talent here

this team is much better than the one who took the court last year at the beginning of the season. it will determine how good it is once the real season begins. everything is conjecture until then.

By ray

October 16, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

Yes, but we are in love with conjecture here.

I’m pleading the 5th…

By Astro Joe

October 16, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this

The talent on this blog has improved significantly also. I have tremendous hopeandexcitement as we take on trolls from other teams this season. I’d be more than happy to assume the Lo Wright role on the blog… if I could just find some freakin’ popcorn at Phillips!

By chuckw/deadjournalist

October 16, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

good to see the stinger is back with the hawks …

By doc

October 16, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this

yes that is our purpose and motto … conjecture on.

aj we are well armed in numbers. now if our team will support their end of it. no question that flip mo and the 2nd year version of acie are huge improvements over aj, lue and salim. one slow and 2 smurfs one easily dinged dont get it for fire power.

By Sekou K. Smith

October 16, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

Thanks Mavid. I don’t know if I’m going to scribble anything about Al’s summer but I’m trying to write a story right now for tomorrow’s paper about Al.

As for Hollinger’s comments, let me preface this by saying that he’s someone I like and respect. He and I will have to agree to disagree about Childress being the Hawks’ third best player (I ranked ‘em Joe, Josh, Al, Chil and Marvin last year). But it’s a non-issue at this point.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 16, 2008 1:48 PM | Link to this

Don’t get me wrong, I’m a Childress fan and I was p-ssed when the Hawks let him go for nothing. But I don’t like or respect Hollinger’s opinion, and he’s an idiot for saying Childress is better than Horford.

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

ANDO:

FROM LAST NIGHT. Jealosy is a terrible thing to waste. Ha, ha. Maybe WE can meet in the spring and enjoy that double-header together with doc. Sorry I don’t have enough money for a trifecta. More laughter. You are a funny man H.B. Peace. Thanks for the query, but don’t deflect BA’s rightous indignation with a post to me. Heh,heh.

BA:

BA and I have history don’t we my man.? Enjoying your banter with H.B. and his retorts. He’s a counter-puncher so lead with a second shot in mind after his response. Just remember, you can pound on him all day, but you’ll never put him away.

TYPICAL DAY AT THE BLOG:

Come out, come out whoever you are. O-o-o-o-o. Hurt me. I’m a WIZARDS fan.? They suck because they can’t keep anyone who’s decent on the court, and the ownership doesn’t have the flexibility of intellect to counter the problems when they arise. Color me gone. GO HAWKS.

By MannyT

October 16, 2008 2:27 PM | Link to this

Astro On Monday, they had the real (freshly made) popcorn on the first level by the smaller merchandise store. That’s the one that is closer to section 112. Stop trolling around for that discount stuff that gets made in China 2 weeks in advance and shipped over on a boat ;-)

Najeh Hollinger’s just running his numbers. Even if you use Sekou’s view and put Chills 4th, he was still a significant contributor. I’m not making a case for giving him $20mil over 3 years, but I do believe that a different negotiation style could have kept him here for less $$$. Then add the new vets and it would be easy to say that we are one trade away from something special.

ray I can live with the RandMo needs to find his role statement, HOWEVER, in the fake 8, you give a guy time to see if he plays the same way he practices or not. You don’t roll out the You are who we thought you were line until he plays in game. Don’t play him the whole 48, but get him more than DNP-CD. Anyone can get that stat line. What is the risk to spread a few minutes around in October? Is JJ going to scream at Woody because he didn’t average 40 minutes a game during the fake 8?

There are a maximum of 384 minutes available for a player in the fake 8. No one should wear himself out, but everyone should get a slice of that 384.

BWAF

By jhan

October 16, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this

Anybody think that next year Marvin/Bibby become Chills/Big Man? Seems like the money would work out.

By Astro Joe

October 16, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

jhan, Rasheed & Chill?

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

Typical day at the blog was, IMHO, the most creative, spot-on, post in the history of this forum. Whoever it was has been around long enough to know all the targets/characters, to a T.

If I really sound like that, no wonder so many of you get tired of reading my posts. Thankfully, the real season is about to start, and there will be 8 months of evolving events to discuss.

Ready for something new. I assume Sekou’s prediction blog will be forthcoming, so we can all get our shot at pointing at a projected win total.

For previous predictions, please review dissertation #26, from 2005, chapters 11-14 (footnoted for additional clarification). Additionally, thesus #17, from fall of 2006, sections 79-84, cover irrefutable projections, written in sanskrit, to further validate my unfathomable intellect.

If anyone needs me to interpret myself, feel free to send a request to my agent/bodyguard (Ray). If anyone has questions about my belief system, I refer you to my false idol, doc, who is just as likely to agree with anything you feel about me (and your freedom to believe it).

Gotta love a country where speech, this nonsensical, is free.

Ready for games that count, and 8 months of armchair quarterbacking……..

By Steve Finley

October 16, 2008 3:28 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the tip, RichBrave. andy has become a nice sidekick for me.

Law, Pachulia, Murray and Evans are going to make a big difference this season- along with Solo. I can see about ten more wins- good enough for the 5/6/7 seed. Barring injuries, this is going to be some kind of squad.

If the season EVER starts.

By MannyT

October 16, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this

richbrave As you jump off the good ship Wizard, can you bring Eddie Jordan with you ;-)

jhan I think the tricky part of your equation is that we need a center, not a PF. A guy like Boozer could be available, but he doesn’t fill the 5.

Unless we have the inside track on a magic beans deal (Gasol/Camby), the available players are either going to be projects or old. The targets are likely the next round of teams looking for cap relief or rebuilding. Want some Brad Miller? Possibly a good fit if he’s got enough left in the tank.

BWAF

By doc

October 16, 2008 3:50 PM | Link to this

i have just gone to the book of revelations by none other than the apha mutt himself that i have been storing the last four years to know what is coming. that is after i got and downloaded the ray anti-viral decoder ring. what he says is believable in the context of the whole of all of hawkdom. agree with him and you will be restored and free of antipathy. we are one. heh heh

By cp

October 16, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

SS you are not alone with your thoughts about Hunter. Ray, myself and a few others have been talking about the kid since the summer league. I think the kid will be a big contributor in the future. Like someone asked earlier, why is Gardner not playing more? I thought he would get more minutes to show what he could do. The guy can really shoot the ball. I like Mario but I would probably take Gardner over Mario if given a choice.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 16, 2008 4:01 PM | Link to this

Wow, I just read the “typical day” post… baahahahahahaha funniest post EVER.

I must say though, I am a little p-ssed that I was not included in this post. What, am I not a regular enough poster?

By Daniel

October 16, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

Please take a look at the Top Team Blog Contest hosted by www.LABallTalk.com

I would like to have you enter the contest that gives the public an opportunity to vote for their favorite NBA blog that covers their respective team.

You can e-mail me at LABallTalk@gmail.com with any and all questions.

Thank you,

Daniel

By Eric

October 16, 2008 4:20 PM | Link to this

Solomon Jones is a better player than ZaZa. He’s the second best shot blocker on that team, and he’s a solid rebounder. This is where I question Mike Woodson as a coach, he doesn’t trust his bench. Everytime he puts Solo in the game he gets a block or a dunk and Woodson takes him out.

By doc

October 16, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

najah you were asleep at the wheel and over on the falcon blog maybe a little too much ….. or maybe just not obnoxious enough bro. heh heh

careful, you just put the target on your back. as you know there is a no prisoner approach here including anyone we might call a “friend”. why have it any other way.

By I.MUS WRITE

October 16, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this

Okay ….. Gotta give it up to who ever wrote the “typical day at the blog” post.

That actually made me LOL….funny stuff

Whoever wrote that definitely knows the regulars. ith all the bickering going on lately that was much needed…

Ludacris and AI -HAHAHAHAHA…..

By I.MUS WRITE

October 16, 2008 4:27 PM | Link to this

Okay ….. Gotta give it up to who ever wrote the “typical day at the blog” post.

That actually made me LOL….funny stuff

Whoever wrote that definitely knows the regulars. with all the bickering going on lately that was much needed…

Ludacris and AI -HAHAHAHAHA…..

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

doc, isn’t there an over-the-counter, topical ointment, that quickly cures a nasty case of antipathy?

Always looking for a way to help…..

By Astro Joe

October 16, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

Ando! WTF, have you become a day-walker? I thought that you only came out with the moon, freaks and infomercials? Seems our childish banter was well-captured by a mystery blogger yesterday. Oh well, here’s a digitial spit-ball… in vintage 4th grade form.

Manny, one of my favorite childhood memories is watching Sanford & Son (followed by Chico & The Man) on Friday nights with my father and a big bowl of the greasiest, saltiest, best tasting popcorn. I’m sure that had a little to do with his high blood pressure, stroke, heart attack and diabates. But the old man raised me on the kernels so I’m forever addicted. And I have passed that along to my boys. That’s why I almost went postal this past Saturday.

Doc, what sized microwave do you think Lo used when he pulled off his prank last year? (Oh and no self-respecting popcorn eater uses a nuke-machine to cook the snack of the gods).

By I.MUS WRITE

October 16, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

“Typical Day at the blog”…….Okay now that wuz funny. It actually made me LOL………….

Whoever wrote that definitely knows the regualrs. You should be writing for SNL

With all the bickering going on lately,that was much needed

Ludacris and AI HAHAHAHAHAHA!

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 4:53 PM | Link to this

MANNY:

Would that I could MANNY, would that I could.

By I.MUS WRITE

October 16, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

My fault for the double posts……….didnt think the first one took…Sekou get your equipment together LOL

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this

Joe, that post was a virtual mirror that everyone mentioned should take a long look into.

Cracked me up……

You know I once predicted someone would write a great, satirical blog, exposing all of our personality quirks. It was back in 2005……………..blah blah blah.

Good way to end the summer, and the preseason. And posted at the stroke of midnight. I think I turned into a pumpkin (or was it a bumpkin, I forget).

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 5:48 PM | Link to this

BA, are we Steve and Andy now? How familiar….

Rich, it’s always nice to hear, from another man, that I shouldn’t be expected to go down. THAT may be the most solid bet of the year.

Your frustration with the Wiz is understandable. Do you want me to make a virtual trip to your local beat blog, and offer up a healthy heaping of Ando “doomanddismay”?

My ability to bum people out is not limited to the Atlanta area. I can go ‘Debbie the Downer’ anywhere there’s a forum and a team worth ripping.

Just don’t send me to a good NBA city. Many of you would struggle to cope with a positive outlook from Ando (3rd person, oh yeah).

By al

October 16, 2008 6:30 PM | Link to this

Where did former analyst Steve Smith go? Did he get fired?

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 16, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this

Steve Smith now works for NBA TV. He has been replaced by Dominique Wilkins. I don’t think it was a firing, more of a step up for Smitty. Sucks for the rest of us though, I thought he offered a lot more during the games as far as insight and analysis than Nique did after them.

By Joshua Bagriansky

October 16, 2008 7:12 PM | Link to this

Steve Smith is with NBA TV now.

By The Truth

October 16, 2008 7:15 PM | Link to this

This is a dirty job but somebody has to say it: Sekou, I think sometimes, responses to your thoughtful commentary about the Hawks get lost in translation. Your blog is filled with so much of personal feuds and dialogs unrelated to basketball that participants can easily lose track of your main points and themes. This seems to be more than a coincidence.

Here is a solution; email is a nice way to communicate one-on-one for topics other than basketball.

By cp

October 16, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this

I was thinking today about how much further along Solo would be right now if we had sent him to the NBDL when he was just sitting on the bench chewing gum. I think we even brought it up a few times. He would have gotten valuable minutes and would probably be even better now than what he actually is. Im glad the work he put in during the summer seems to be working out ,but I cant help but think how much better he would be if we would have sent him down to let him play. Are we sending Hunter down this year? If he isn’t going to get many mniutes this year, I think he would be better served playing actuall ball rather than sitting at the end of the bench doing nothing.

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 8:23 PM | Link to this

CP, what a coincidence, I was thinking, just today, how much further along the Hawks would be if we’d taken Roy, Foye or Gay, instead of Shelden. We still could have taken Solo in the second.

Woulda, coulda, shoulda……

At least Billy is finally gone, though his (draft) presence will be felt for another decade.

Shelden Williams. WTF?!

By ant banks

October 16, 2008 9:02 PM | Link to this

hb andothe most tellin’ thing when the hawks drafted shelden was the let the secret out!! word got out arround the league that the hawks were takin’ sheldon 5th and everyone laughed!! they could have “pokerfaced” the deal and gotten more. i don’t blamed sheldon for his short comin’. he didn’t draft himself at 5.

cp solo didn’t have to go down the the nbdl. as many games as the hawks were blown out last year, they could have put him in the game in the last qtr. if you are gettin’ beat by 20pts with 5 min left in game chances are you will lose. this would be perfect for solo to play in…better nba competition

By blue hawk

October 16, 2008 9:14 PM | Link to this

if woodson wants an inside-then-outside game then it would make sense to develop morris right?

why the hell is he not giving the guy some burn? morris has got offensive skills and has shown an ability to get to the foul line.

woody, wake up! the preseason is his chance to get some PT, give it to him.

By doc

October 16, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this

oh dear truth is playing bad cop. truth if you had been reading some of those observations have been topics of conversations here, there is also more to discuss than just the topic of what at times has been the topic of the week. you are welcome to participate in any form but dont you think othello, shels, solo, randmo, mo and acie havent been very much a part of the conversations here that to comment further is to simply repeat it? t.

By A Typical Day at The Blog Author

October 16, 2008 9:31 PM | Link to this

Najeh Davenpoop,

An apology is due to you for not being mentioned in “A Typical Day at The Blog**. Know that you are definitely considered one of the many in this wonderful crew. Be on the lookout for your name in other “contributions.”

Thanks to everyone for not taking offense to your characters or the representation thereof. The main purpose of the post was to ease the tension on this blog. Tension that the author of the post himself helped create, and therefore wanted to help atone for.

Know this: *No amount of individual talent is a substitute for the brilliant, kleidoscope-like combination of personalities here. Without them, or rather YOU ALL, that post would not exist. The talent on this blog, as Astro Joe says, has increased. But it has increased because it is self-cultivating.

Finally, the philosophy that this author follows: One can never make fun of another unless he is willing to take some hard shots at himself.

Glad you enjoyed it.

By cp

October 16, 2008 9:32 PM | Link to this

Lol@Ando. Trust me I feel the same way. I was just saying we should have taken advantage of the NBDL. ant we have been hollering why didn’t Woody put so and so in when we get blowed out for years around here. It’s been times where we had injuries and he still refused to play guys. I know the NBA is better competition I was only saying he would have been better off at least playing instead of sitting on the bench.

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

ANDO:

You’re welcome. Just statin’ what I see.

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 9:36 PM | Link to this

Anybody watching the BOSTON-TAMPA BAY final tonight.? 5-0 top of the fourth. Not over ‘til its over, but surely looks like a wrap to me.

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this

Oh and ANDO:

I don’t post up on any other blogs. Also, I don’t hide behind any alias’s. I prefer to stand behind what I write here. Learn more that way.

By ant banks

October 16, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this

anyone interested in joining a fantasy basketball league? i have one set up on yahoo.

the league name is flipmo squad

the password is atlantahawks

paste this link to your browser http://basketball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/nba/95877

need 11 more teams.holla atcha boy

By ant banks

October 16, 2008 9:56 PM | Link to this

cp i feel ya’. whateva we need to be a significant team in the league. i got us pegged to win 44games

we play miami, charlotte, washington, orlando 4 times each-miami is garbage (3-1), charlotte garbage (4-0), washington (2-2)wit’ out gilbert, and orlando (2-2)we play them well. we should be 11-5 against the south east conf.

another thing,lookin’ at preseason data: portland game we shot 37% from the field, 20% from 3pt, and only 31 reb. and 80 pts. we can’t do this nightly!!

if we can shoot 40% from the field, 35% from 3pt, get 40+ reb, get 20 ast per game and minimize turnovers to 12 or less, we can make some noise in the league

By ray

October 16, 2008 10:33 PM | Link to this

Nice article by Sekou on Horford. Seems Woody finally agrees that running a greater part of the offense through Horford is a good idea. Interesting. But will he follow through on it?

Suprisingly decent article by Mark Bradley on Acie Law. Tells everything you would suspect: Law was hesitant, not un-talented…we know what the real problem was…

By ray

October 16, 2008 10:42 PM | Link to this

RichBrave, you do TOO post on other blogs…Falcons blog for one. You scurvy knave you. Well, I imagine you don’t have the scurvy…

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this

ray:

The WOODEN-one.

By doc

October 16, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this

sweet, ando and bradley on the same page in regards to bibby’s future.

By HB Ando

October 16, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this

Rich, sorry, I don’t recall suggesting otherwise. But as a man of a million words, I’m not saying I didn’t. Please refresh my memory, and let me know what you’re referring to.

Doesn’t matter to me what names people choose to use here. Please clarify, my friend.

By The Truth

October 16, 2008 11:00 PM | Link to this

Doc, I know the shoe doesn’t fit you, so you don’t have to wear it. Do you?

Incidentally, I attended this Hawks-Phoenix game and I was able to get up-close high-dollar seating. I couldn’t help but to notice how unengaged Morris was. He always seem to be distant from the group even in group huddles. I didn’t play at all. I was so close, I could read his body lauguage. Since he is also a hometown boy, he got to be embarrass. He is not hiding his lack of love that well. I am not sure what’s going on between him and Woody. If Woody is not careful, he could be planting some pretty bad seeds that may leap bad fruit later.

By doc

October 16, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this

truth, thanks to the graces of jhan and his seats i have had some of those up close looks into the way things are run. you are so correct to make those types of assumptions based on what you see. we commented on it when zaza went to the dog house (not sure lorenzen didnt have something to do with it), some of the body language of woody towards acie as acie came offf the floor, shels being trounced, smith, etc. the list goes on. do think in this case randmo better get over it though i dont agree with the coaching strategy, it is always going to be you better be a better practice player than game player or you dont play.

btw, i guess a thanks is in order for not putting me in the group you were speaking of however, i know i tend to wander from the topic at hand when things slow down or my focus changes. so yes, i included myself as an offender and am guilty of wearing a shoe of distraction.

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this

ray:

Well, you’ve got the knave part right. Whither MV7 ray.? I just posted up with LEDBETTER about that.

ANDO:

Possibly I misread your response. I thought you inferred that I participated on WIZARDS or REDSKINS blogs which I don’t. The alias was for BA, at least I think he’s BA. You seem to have fathomed the only sense from the post addressed to me by STEVE FINLEY. Maybe that’s BA’s real name. I was clueless as to who STEVE or andy were. So I was just sayin’ be straight and don’t post up with alias names.

And thinking of that, I wonder what has become of my counterpart, DRMARYB. Could she have an alias.? Her pungent style does seem to be missing here though.

Good to see the HAWKS gathering strength for the opening of the regular season. I do get the sense that they are stronger at this point than last year. Unfortunately, I missed the start of the season, and began posting in early December while recouperating after my stents were inserted. It is obvious the only entity that the WIZARDS could contribute to the continued success of the HAWKS would be JORDAN. GRUNFELD over-rode POLLINS ambivalence regarding EDDIE and locked him up with a fat contract extension. Too bad the GM doesn’t own the team. The WIZARDS might suddenly become relevant in the NBA instead of an afterthought. This year WILL BE THEIR NADIR, AS THEY SLIP TO THE BOTTOM RUNG OF THE PLAY-OFF LADDER SUPPLANTED BY THE RISING HAWKS.

And ANDO, You make cogent points, and prognostications. If they were all 100% correct, you should take up residence in LAS VAGAS. Good to see you participating. When you weren’t, the SEKOU blog took on a drab existance. You were missed at least by myself - mot speaking for others. So keep it up. I like a little controversy.

By ray

October 16, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this

Manny,

Consider the source. The thought never occurred to him, because he puts such emphasis on practice. Close-minded-ness at it’s best.

The Truth, it wouldn’t be the first time Woody has planted bad seeds like that. Recall Salim? How about Childress? Uh huh…

By richbrave

October 16, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this

NYTOL.

By ant banks

October 16, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this

i gave the wrong info for the fantasy league

http://basketball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/nba

league id is: 95877 password is: atlantahawks

By ray

October 16, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this

Richbrave, it’s a tad too late to feign innocence at this point, don’t you think? Did you not just say that you and BA have a history? Or did I misread, eh?

If indeed his real name is Steve Finley, then which shall we call him?

As for your girl drmaryb…I thought you knew where she was. Noticed she hasn’t been around in a while. But then neither has Honest Abe, Matt (changed his name anyway), Volman (schooling it up right now), and a host of others. I suspect our friends shall return when the real games begin. Meanwhile there are others mostly missing who can stay the hell gone for all I care.

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this

Rich, you misunderstood my comments about offering to travel to other cities’ blogs. I was simply making light of my reputation for negativity and my willingness to travel, virtually, to support the frustrations of fans like you who have their own local disappointments.

As far as the ‘Steve/Andy’ comment, my obvious conclusion was, based on his direct response to your advice on dealing with me, that BA is Steve Finley, and he failed to change his user name, when posting back to you. Combining the fact that he referred to me as Andy, mine was just a light-hearted jab at the idea that the BA-Ando battle had suddenly shifted to two real people, named, ostensibly, Steve and Andy.

No more to it. No biggie, as this is all nothing more than cyber-babble, anyhoo………

By BA

October 17, 2008 12:40 AM | Link to this

As ando said, the “Steve Finley” post was me. But that’s not my name; Finley was a centerfielder for the Astros in the nineties. He used my ip address to post up on the award-winning DOB Braves blog last night. Apparently something was said that hurt Steve’s feelings…

Anyway, I’d like to think that the lack of RandMo has more to do with the standout camps from Solo and Pachulia. But we’ll be watching for that body language, doc.

I’m with you, RichBrave. Nothing wrong with an ando-laden blog. I’d say the same for yourself, doc, Ray, Ariose, Manny, Poop, cp, and this Ant Banks guy. Oh yeah, and the reigning mvp Raymond. This may be a small group of regulars, but a solid group. It’ll get more crowded here as this team picks up steam this season.

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 1:05 AM | Link to this

Yup, BA, it should get much more populated as the regular season begins.

I think that’s a testament to what a truly cool, and open, forum Sekou has cultivated, as much as the largely anticipated improvement of the Hawks.

‘Course some early season success should make this a hard place to get a word in, edge-wise (but I’m guessing most of the regular big-mouths will still find a way to get themselves heard).

Amazing how last nights’ clever mocking seems to have made everybody remember to take themselves a tad less seriously. Good way to say goodbye to the summer, and welcome a fresh start, for the Hawks, and the loyal followers of the blog.

I’m still chuckling……….

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 17, 2008 1:09 AM | Link to this

I honestly wasn’t impressed by Morris at all in the scrimmage last weekend, so it isn’t surprising me too much to see Woody playing the other big men ahead of him. That said it is preseason, and Morris does deserve a chance to at least compete against the 3rd stringers on other teams to show what he can do.

By BA

October 17, 2008 2:09 AM | Link to this

If you guys haven’t read the new piece on Horford, check it out. You’ll like what you hear.

Give Woodson credit (he doesn’t get much) for actually holding back on Horford. It must have been tempting, especially at times during the first half of last year, to look to big Al for more than he might have been ready for (i.e., the feeding him in the post). Whatever Horford or Woodson did last year, it was a HELLUVA rookie season, by anyone’s standards.

Where is the ceiling for this kid?

And if everything we’re hearing about Solomon Jones is true, could he become a starter in this league, say, at the five? The kid looks long to me (on TV) but is he actually big enough to hold down the five?

If Marvin Williams is the weak link that many think he is, could our elusive center already be on the roster, in the form of Solo or the resurgent Georgian?

This is going to be an interesting year, and for the first time in a decade, interesting for good reasons.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 8:12 AM | Link to this

Hey Ant, I joined the league man. Hey everyone lets join this league just like the good ol days. We’ve done this once before remember?

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 8:51 AM | Link to this

Well, lets play devil’s advocate for a second and pretend we are going to get rid of Bibby this year… If that’s the case(in pretend) lets also get rid of Marvin in a deal with bibby to get a good low post guy, or point guard. what do you guys think?

By doc

October 17, 2008 9:03 AM | Link to this

ba, that was the person i associated to the name, felt maybe you had a man crush or something. ;-))

finley was one of the pros i liked to watch, gave 110%, played the complete game. bet he has some tales about roids and greenies to tell in the era of performance enhancement or baseball in general.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 9:13 AM | Link to this

BTW, thanks Doc for that advice on my mouse wheel finger. It’s much stronger now, and I don’t think I’ll be having the same problems in this blog… ;)

By doc

October 17, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

speaking of that ab, i just took on a moment of dementia forgetting how things are on the falcons blog and casually visited. whooee people talk about how testy and uncivil we can be here. that is downright murderous, i dont want any of that on me. talk about stripes not changing.

did see a few familiars … najeh, if we take up a collection to buy you a jersey whose name do you want on the back?;-)) heh heh be careful that man crush might come back to haunt you now that you have that target on your back for our man in the cape masquerading as the blog satirist.

guess i’ll go float onto the mib blog to check out what steve finley got upset about.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

I dont personally care about the Brave, or Falcon blogs. I do love the teams, but only get passionate about basketball and MMA.

By ray

October 17, 2008 10:28 AM | Link to this

BA, one of the best centerfielders on the Astros club. Solid threat on the basepaths as well.

AaronB, no need to play devil’s advocate. That could actually happen, although it may not happen exactly that way (or then again, it might). Consider that Sund will be constantly evaluating the situation (as much as Gearon allows, anyway) as he goes along. Notice he hasn’t said much in the way of excitement about this team. In fact, he has made some comments regarding the team’s win total from last year and what not. As much hope as we have, if there is trouble competing at a higher level than last year then something will change. And it will change quickly.

Having said that, big fellas that are proven are hard to come by (how many times have we said that?) and sometimes you have to look harder at “potentials.” As good as Horford is, I have to think that Sund, who is known for acquiring rather tall centers, has to be hankering for another one. Furthermore, he has to know that big Al makes an even better PF. We’ll see if Woody is serious about getting Al the ball in the post. He’s our most reliable low post threat, which means he’ll be guarded as such. And since he’s our center, he’ll be guarded by all of the other teams’ biggest guys, most of whom are 6’11 to 7’2” or so.

Not saying Al can’t do it, because we know he’ll bust his hump every night. But one night it’s trying to score against the 7’1” Dalembert. The next night, it’s going up against 6’11” twins O’Neal and Bosh. 7’1” Bogut the next. 6’11” Dwight Howard after that. 6’10 Perkins and 7’ Garnett in Boston. Detroit will put 6’11” ‘Sheed and 6’9” McDyess on him in Detroit. Indiana? 7’ Nesterovic and 6’11” Jeff Foster…or 7’2” Hibbert at times. Two 7-footers in Cleveland in big Z and Varejao, with Ben Wallace to help out. Looked at New Jersey’s roster? They have a plethora of guys easily 6’10” or bigger to throw at him. Meanwhile, I don’t think Chicago, Charlotte, Washington, or Miami present the same challenge, although Okafor is always going to be a hell of a matchup in Charlotte. I like Noah in Chicago, but Horford knows him and probably knows how to beat him (besides, he’s not strong enough).

My point is not that Horford will fail. It’s that he’s still out of position and for this to work, he has to work twice as hard. Not only that, but our offensive scheme as a whole has to be better. In other words, we don’t need to do what I fear Woody would do: throw the ball in there and isolate the guy against the opposing team’s defense….sound familiar? Call it the ISO play and substitute Al for Joe. See what I mean? Teams will key on Horford. And because he’s really more of a power forward, they will be able to stop him with either a big enough player (with some skill) or with a big help defender. That is when it is paramount that we have a reactive offense that is successfully potent.

Horford will have no issues with passing the ball back out of the post when the defense collapses on him. But the guys on the receiving end have to be ready and able to make the play. It can’t always be the guards, either. You still want to shoot from mid-to-high percentage shot areas. And you want to be able to draw that other big help defender. Hence the idea of the big who can shoot from 15-18 feet or so. That way Al gets to work one-on-one, not one on two or three, which has been the issue that JJ has faced…for years.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

I really like the idea of getting Marcus Camby. I think getting the number 1 shot blocking guy to help out Josh would be nice. Then who could get in the paint with those two blocking shots all day in the paint? If I were the clippers I would trade camby for both Bibby and Marvin.

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 10:58 AM | Link to this

ray, ba, aaron b i have been sayin’ that for the longest that we need to move horford to the 4.

why do we not run the pick and roll to perfection like new orleans? i mean cp3 and tyson kill that play nite after nite.

also, guys, someone on the blog said that the spirit ownership feud will be resolved in feb. what if the gearon’s lose, the direction of the team would change then

By Clyde

October 17, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this

Ray that’s what I’ve been saying about Al all along. He’s a good player, but you need length in this league to play center night end and night out. Just imagine if we had Noah,Sean Williams, Solomon and Zaza on our roster as our bigs.

ROLL TIDE!!! Alabama Is The Real #1 Team In The Nation

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this

I still am not sure about Al at the 4 just yet, however it seems a good player of his caliber could do either.

My only fear about the ownership feud is that I believe that Belkin will move the team out of Atlanta the moment he gets the team. Even though the Geardons are struggling to get fans for their power plays, I still believe they want to win with this team, and still have our best interest as fans at the forefront of their minds. Belkin looks at the team as a cash cow that he can exploit.

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 12:38 PM | Link to this

aaron you think that belkin would move them team? wtf? omg!! every year during the ncaa tourney and nba playoffs, atl ranks in the top 10 nba markets as far as viewership. why would he want to move a team out of this market? where else would he move them to?

i hope this is not true.

By Steve T

October 17, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this

If the coaching staff is concerned that Morris is not that skilled as a defensive player, they can surround him with great defensive players. Check this line up out: Josh Smith at SF. He can give us some shot blocking at SF. Al Horford at PF. Do I need to say more. Morris at Center. JJ at PG. JJ does not have to score, but just play good D. He can D most of the PGs in the NBA. Mo Evans at SG.

I think this line up with give us scoring down low as well as defense all ove the place.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 1:03 PM | Link to this

Belkin is a shady dealer, and I got the impression way back when this crap started that he hated Atlanta. The only reason he bought this team was because he wanted a team period. I wish I could remember what exactly he did that made me distrust him so much, but I do remember that I felt strongly about it at the time. If I wasn’t so busy at work right now I would go look and dig up all that stuff on him again.

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 1:36 PM | Link to this

well, come february he could be the sole owner. the issues i had with belkin was the fact the he was an owner of the hawks and had season tix with boston. seems like a conflict of interest

i did like how shrewd he wanted to play the jj trade, which led to this fracture…

top nba markets:

http://www.hoopscorner.com/links/media_links.html

By Mike is back

October 17, 2008 1:36 PM | Link to this

New Page 1

MannyT, we are still around, been busy finishing up my last two graduate courses, haven’t been able to blog much, but I still ready daily.

I am as proud as can be of Solo. I remembered how hard he worked in the off season  the year before, then he had one of the worst summer camp of anybody on the team. I felt that may have been a factor in his decision. However, I was puzzled like everyone else about his decision not to participate in summer league, but I felt he would come back and compete for his spot on the roster. I’m just happy he got a chance to redeem himself. I’m hoping same for Salim with Spurs.

I like your acronym about Morris, Woody has to give this young kid a chance to play. Like everyone, especially HB ANDO MAN has said, "IT TIME TO MOVE AL TO THE 4."   I think with the improve play from ZMan and Solo, that move can now be facilitated now. That could also free up some playing for Morris. You can hear it AL voice, he’s ready to make the move. I think Al and Smoove are hybrid player that you have to alternate base on match-ups. Now that’s scary, considering we are talking about Woody. Clearly, Woody has to realize that when we play teams with Bigs that can bang, we will need all five of Morris fouls to help keep Al, Zaza, and Solo out of foul trouble. If we can get consistent production out of ZMan, Solo, and Morris…Al and Smoove can soar like eagles.

Doc, no way we miss Chill with the FlipMo combo, CMON Boooooooooooo, give it up. 

Sekou, I emailed Yo Boy Orlando LedBetter, he told me you had a Lock Down Corner in the family. I told him how much I enjoy reading his articles on the BIRDS. He reminds me a lot of you, he got some juuuuuuuuuuuuuuuice!!!

GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Ariose

October 17, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

Sekou, Great piece, But you know draft status more often than not, doesn’t mean much in the NBA….I prefer to believe that BK secretly had a man-crush on Bibby’s game all along and had this plan in the works for some time. (Whatever helps your average Hawk Fan sleep at night hehehehehe…..)

Manny, Thanks for the link. I had head of the story before but never really looked into it. OH=New Chills Acie Law only vacationed in WitPro, but Speedy Lives there (as confirmed by my fellow BCU spies who have found out that speedy did indeed purchase a WitPro Premium Platnum Senior Citizen retirement membership plan.)

Ray, we have been in the Virtual Forensic Labs trying to decode the electronic footprints left behind by our “spoofer”. So far we have some leads, but no concrete evidence yet.

…………..On to other cases, we have no new information on the whereabouts of I.MUS’ (celebrity filled) Work headquarters but, we have reason to believe it resembles Hugh Heffner’s Grotto.

Sekou, How has Mo-Mo fit in offensively with the guys? How has he adapted to our system? I know after the Orlando game he has kind of struggled…….what are his strengths/weaknesses on the offensive side of the ball. I ask these questions because out of all of the players on our squad who are probably going to play the most minutes, I probably know the least about Evans. Where does he lie to spot up? Does he usually hover on or does he like to be in constant motion trying to get open? In L.A they used him as a slasher and in Orlando he was used as a spot-up shooter. Here in Atlanta I’m sure he’ll be able to mix it up more and show off his entire offensive arsenal as opposed to just being a one-dimensional role player like he was in his previous stops no?

I’m excited though, this is the best squad we’ve started the season with in years!!!!

~SalimFan Sir Links A Lot~

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this

One question I have is ; Is josh really trying hard lately. I know his game has to have gotten better over the summer, and he hasn’t really exploded during the preseason. You figure with all these teams showing their least, to try and shore up bench positions, that Josh would be able to dominate at will. I know that he can do it physically if he truly wanted to.

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this

aaronthere is no real “need” to dominate durin’ the preseason. i would hate to see smoove go down wit’ an injury goin’ all out in preseason.

during league play dude is beastin’. he is in the top 3 in the league wit’ blocked shots. i think that he is the number 1 shot blocker of the hawks after 4yrs and the hawks have been around for 40 yrs.

so, to ans your question, i think that he is dominant for a 5th yr player. other teams think thrice about drivin’ to the lane when he is around.

he needs to quit shootin’ beyond 15ft, that ain’t his forte, yet. to me, this is his only flaw.

By ray

October 17, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this

Aaron B, I think the reason none of us can remember what Belkin did that was so shady is because we don’t have one damn clue if he did anything at all. What we did have was propaganda. The Spirit said that he wanted to run the team on the cheap. None of us liked the sound of that. But look who’s been running the team on the cheap. I don’t think there’s a need to bring up all the evidence on that, either.

As Ant Banks said, what reason should Belkin have for moving the team? Is there a more lucrative spot to have one, other than say Las Vegas? I don’t see that happening, and the ATL is a top flight market for this business. Belkin bought in with the rest of the guys not just because he wanted a team period, but also because David Stern convinced him to. It was Stern that brought the entire package together.

Ant Banks, no way does Belkin move the team. What he might do is pull an Arthur Blank. In other words, change the organization from the top down. That’s assuming he actually won and got to keep the team. Moving out of Atlanta isn’t an option unless a very, very lucrative situation pops up. And with the economy the way it is right now, where’s that going to be? No, better to stay put where there’s already a fan base and an arena. Move, and you have to rebuild all of that. Now’s not the time….

As for Horford moving to the 4, we’ll see if Sund is committed to the idea or if he wants to see how this squad goes with the way it is now. Even then, he would still have to be evaluating the effect of the coach on the team, regardless of personnel.

By Astro Joe

October 17, 2008 2:57 PM | Link to this

Aaron B, Josh is historically a very slow started. I’m pretty sure that if you charted his performance over the past 3 seasons, you will see that he picks up his pace in the first 2 weeks of December. I noticed that he faded toward the end of the regular season but that may have been associated with Bibby’s arrival and the team learning how to play with a new lead guard. I too have noticed that Smith has been quiet during the preseason. But again, history tells us that once he digests his Thanksgiving Day turkey and starts his Christmas shopping, that he usually becomes an ultra-productive player.

By Aaron B

October 17, 2008 3:36 PM | Link to this

I figured the “slow starts” that he seemed to have were a product of him being young and green. But at this point, we need to start viewing him as a vet. Don’t get me wrong, he is one of my favorite players in the whole league. I just wish he would start proving me right.

By Ariose

October 17, 2008 3:38 PM | Link to this

Manny, I was a little bummed thet “Double S” didn’t play last night, but i’m sure he’ll play before preseasons end defenetly.

Hopefully we’ll have a RandMo sighting tomorrow….

Looks like people are starting to remeber “the incinent”…….It just reminded me of how much I wanted to pound the announcers into the ground for OVERRACTING……yes, that includes Van Gundy and Marc Jackson…..Idiots….Anyhoo…

~SalimFan Sir Links A Lot~

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 3:40 PM | Link to this

Joe, good catch on the “josh as slow starter” point. From a fantasy hoops perspective, he’s underperformed his early draft position, each of the last two years, in the first months, leading a lot of folks to sell low. Folks who made the buy cheap ended up getting massive stat stuffing the remainder of the year.

With the Hawks facing a tough, early schedule, and the obvious need to justify his big contract, Smith MUST start fast. He’s been judicious, so far, in not launching a bunch of 3’s this pre-season.

If you’ll remember last year, he started jacking them like he was Reggie Miller, from the opening bell. If he shoots 37%, from the floor, and 22% from behind the arc, in November, like he did last year, we’re going to get off slow.

Love to see him start this season like he ended the last.

I think we’re very near, on the calender, setting an over/under, on Bibby being dealt, of 100 days. That would make it around late January.

If we’re not re-signing Bibby, and the Heat aren’t re-signing Marion (given folks believe he and Beasley play the same position), and the Heat currently have Quinn and Banks at the point, why not a swap of expiring contracts, that would make both teams better, for the season, and free to clear cap space for the summer? Just a stream-of-consciousness idea……….

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 3:42 PM | Link to this

so who is stern pullin’ for this year? boston/lakers series or does he want lebron in there?

By The Truth

October 17, 2008 3:52 PM | Link to this

As much as I like Al. I’m not sure he is ready to man the 4 position on a permanent basis. Threw no fault of AL, he was asked to play out of position at the center last year and he did a’Yeoman Job’. But the down-side of that decision has disrupted his NBA development at his natural 4 position. It takes 3 years for most rookie to transition from college to NBA properly. That’s why so much is expected of Marvin this year. He is that 3rd year discounting his injured year. If AL went to the 4 position now, it would amount to him starting his first year all over as a rookie. I don’t doubt his rebounding ability at the 4. I would question his scoring ability at this point in his career. The power forward most score more points consistently. Below is a list of the NBA’s top power forwards:

Tim Duncan Kevin Garnett Elton Brand Carlos Boozer Chris Bosh Amare Stoudamire David West

You would have to ask, is AL ready NOW at the power foward position to produce comparable scoring numbers as these guys? What would his learning curve cost us during the regular season.

By Ariose

October 17, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this

Mike Bibby and Acie Law BOTH need to seriously up their game…….

If Mike still jumped like he did (at the 1:49 Mark) back then, I think we’d be super solid lol.

~Sir Links a Lot~

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

the truth either way we are done. compare him against the centers that he would face. i think that we should leave him at the 4.

can someone explain why we don’t run the pick and roll like new orleans do?

By Ariose

October 17, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this

Ando, I’m going to have to disagree with you there. The LAST thing we need is another forward. Besides, what has Law proven yet? We’d be no better than we are the preseason without Bibby. We’ve needed a point for so long and now we’ve finally got one. Not to mention our offense runs A LOT better with Bibby on the floor.

Since both deals are going to end after this season, why trade for something we already have lot’s of?? Also, We all know Marion is no where near the outside shooter that Bibby is and like I said, we have enough forwars so why swap them??? I don’t think he makes us better WITHOUT Bibby. But if Miami wants to give us Marion for a bag of skittles and a Pop Tart, i’m pretty sure the Marion/Bibby combo would defenetly make us better.

Truth, I agree. Spot duty? Yes Full Time? No.

~Sir Links A Lot~

By Astro Joe

October 17, 2008 4:19 PM | Link to this

Ando, one of my worries (and it was before he got the contract) was how would Smith handle a big deal and long-term security. So while I agree that he really needs to change his pattern and start the season in high gear, I’m not going to hold my breath. I’ll wait until mid-December before wondering if he lost his hunger/drive/determination/eye of the tiger when he signed that contract. But no doubt, with the team hitting the road and with him having 300+ games in the league (he ain’t no young player in game-time terms), he needs to be that 18/10/3 guy that he was from December-February last year.

By tbhawksfan

October 17, 2008 4:39 PM | Link to this

Bibby for Marion. That’s very interesting. Would Miami want to do that deal. I’m thinking Marion will get you more than Bibby.

Now; why would the Hawks do it. If I recall correctly, one of Ando’s biggest grips with BK was not getting a balanced team. No Center, no PG, the two most important positions in BBall, the rant went.

Now that we have Bibby and he inarguably helped led us to the playoffs last year, Ando proposes to move our starting, former all-star PG for an under-sized PF;

BRILLIANT!

I’m all for moving Bibby if; Acie becomes a good NBA PG,and we get something very good back, like a solid back up C or a #15 type pick with a serviceable player.

Bibby for Marion. You should run that one on a trade board and see what the response is.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 17, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

Marion? Don’t we have enough tweener forwards already? I’m all in favor of trading Bibby after the season starts if Acie shows that he can run the team, but not unless the Hawks get back either a dead-eye three point shooter and/or a big guy who can play defense on opposing centers, not to mention draft picks. I like Marion’s skills but I don’t see how he would fit on this team without significantly cutting into other good players’ playing time.

By ant banks

October 17, 2008 5:11 PM | Link to this

hey y’all, join this nba fantasy league. its free, automated draft. this will add to the excitement!! need 10 more teams.

http://basketball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/nba

league id is: 95877 password is: atlantahawks

By tbhawksfan

October 17, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this

Aaron B: Bibby/Marvin for Camby !

For Bibby, I’d expect something like an upcoming young PG or C and a short contract ($) or an short contract (second-third string big/PG) and at least a mid-first pick.

Marvin is a decent NBA starter at 22. He shows signs of having skills that could soon evolve into at least an above average NBA starting SF/PF.

For a 34 year old often injured Camby, I would think about Marvin or Bibby straight up, never both. Then I’d say no to Marvin for Camby and OK to Bibby for Camby if Acie was ready to start.

Clyde: Are you proposing a front-court of Noah/Sean Williams/Solo/Zaza?

And are you saying you’d take Noah and Williams over Horford/Smoove?

I really like Williams and Noah, but neither would fetch a Smoove or Horford.

By tbhawksfan

October 17, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this

ray: You were talking about Horford playing the post and the necessity of being able to pass out to the short jumper. That is Bball. If you feed it inside and draw the double/triple you want to have the option of outlets that optimaly would be ready to lauch a high percentage jumper. The inside players feel the shot and rotate into rebounding position after making the pass.

For this to happen, you need mouvement, spacing, players that know each others moves and tendencies and players that can hit the shot with a good percentage. On the inside, the bigs need to take advantage of the opportunity of the pass into and then out of the post to slide around their D-man and get rebounding position.

If our team can routinely do these things, we will win more than we lose. Oh, and they need to play D too.

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 5:34 PM | Link to this

Said it was stream-of-consciousness. But the idea has to be taken in a certain context. Yes, I want an outside shooting big, to allow Al and Smith to slide to the 4 and 3, respectively, while creating a better shooting front line. But, since folks here still want to argue about Horford playing the 4 or 5, and since there are not many bigs who fit the “legit outside shooting” bill, then, right now, I would say that a front line of Al, Smith and Marion, with JJ and the Flip/Law backcourt, is better than Al, Smith and Marvin, with a JJ/Bibby backcourt. Better rebounding, better defending, better in transition, better in the passing lanes, and, unless Marvin becomes a consistent 3-point shooter, a better overall shooting front line.

The “ifs” for the idea are: if we are going to trade Bibby anyway, and if Miami is going to trade Marion anyway. And it leaves the Hawks with some options, as far as re-signing Marvin (which I don’t think they’re going to do unless it’s for far less than the market set by his draft slot peers).

Marion is one of the best rebounders and defenders in the NBA. If one (me) believes that the Hawks will move Bibby, and plug in a combination of Law and Flip, then the Hawks, if they are serious about making a push for the playoffs, could do much worse than swapping the expiring contract of Bibby for the expiring contract of Marion.

TB, just because the creativity of the idea is beyond your comprehension, or just because you don’t see it, doesn’t make it a bad idea. You’re pretty much the pot calling the kettle black, as far as arrogance, if you think the only good ideas are the ones you agree with.

Some things never change. I still can’t come here and just engage in a little brainstorming without a couple of the same guys always looking to start a big personal war of words.

Nobody ever joins your brigade. It’s the same old petty attacks. Seems like you’d get tired of wasting your energy taking shots at me, when I don’t leave, I don’t change, and no one else ever joins your angry little club. What, exactly, is the point? If I was really wrong as much as a few of you try to paint me, would so many people here generally respect my opinions (even if they don’t agree with them)?

How much fun can it really be?

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this

And TB, for the record, my conversations with guys like Ray have actually highlighted the exact same expectations for a trade of Bibby. Based on the belief that moving Bibby will be primarily a financial decision, getting short contracts, potential in the form of reasonably price rookie contract(s), and the future cap value of a pick(s), all combine to minimize actual cash outlays this season, which is the heart of my ongoing position that the ASG will not end up spending much more (maybe $3 million, max) than the $55 million they spent last year, by the time it’s all said and done.

The Marion post was just for a little fun.

But God-forbid I be allowed to engage in a little mindless exchange of basketball-related ideas without you or BA looking to tear me a new one, for the millionth attempt.

Don’t know if your efforts are more funny or sad. Either way, sure seems fruitless.

By tbhawksfan

October 17, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this

No war of words from me. Just find your trade proposition very unrealistic from both teams perspectives.

Then, as I said, I remember you calling for a PG and C and saying that BK was a joke for not realizing that those are the two most important positions. We get Bibby, a very respectable PG and you propose to trade him for an under-sized (but talented) PF.

You can call me arrogant, I’m just trying to follow your arguments and finding some interesing questions.

“the creativity of the idea is beyond [my] comprehension”

So, my thinking you’re often full of it only is a result of my limited facilities of comprehending you. I love to talk about the Hawks , but I just couldn’t resist.

By tbhawksfan

October 17, 2008 6:10 PM | Link to this

I was also very interested in your recent remarks about trading Bibby before the deadline. I resisted getting into it, but since we’re talking again…. I am so for a Bibby trade; IF, Acie steps up AND we get a nice young player at C or a deal that gets us a nice pick.

What gets me (correct me if I’m mistaken) is that you’re arguing that the main reason they will trade Bibby is to cut pay-roll. This despite the fact that we made the play-offs and likely will again this season. Do you really think that the ASG will trade Bibby to shave some dollars off the pay-roll sacrificing another Hawks play-off run?

By Jody

October 17, 2008 7:06 PM | Link to this

The season is coming up and I can’t wait for it to get started. I think The Hawks should continue to use the starting lineup of Zaza, Horford, Smith, Joe and Bibby going into the regular season. Al Horford is CLEARLY in a better position to be more effective in the post on both ends at his natural position. He knows it and Mike Woodson knows it otherwise, they would’nt be going to this lineup like they are know. Al Horford is the centerpiece of this front court and they need to put him in a position where he will succeed. It’s just not worth it to play him out of position just so Marvin can start. No offense to Marvin but, his game is not game changing. Horford at the 4 is. The Pheonix game would be just a preview of how much of a load he would be in the post at the 4.

By ILL-Logical

October 17, 2008 7:47 PM | Link to this

Mark Bradley’s Acie Law column revealed a lot, especially about how he and others,really feel about the current incumbent Hawks coach.

There are fewer doubters among NBA observers about the Hawk’s talent but there is almost universal agreement about their coach;and it ain’t good.

It appears that there is a very, very narrow opportunity for the current coach to win and if ( make that when, ‘cause this guy will not change to save his life career wise) things do not go well early, then changes will be made swiftly.This team may have deficiencies but a good coach should and can use the existing talent to overcome/ mask them.That is not happening under the current regime and it is unacceptable to the fan base as well as the players.

So, in the words of the immortal Sam Cook: A change is going to come!

By Ariose

October 17, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this

Ando, I knew what you meant by “stream of conciousness” and that you were just throwing the idea out there without much analysis, but I had some free time so I took the bait lol.

Flip is a great passer but i’d rather have his as a scorer than a facilitator. Even though we have a decent passing TEAM so it really won’t matter much.

BUT i’d love Flip as the backup PG if we were dealing for a better shooting guard. Like:

Bibby for Mike Miller…..now I know the salaries don’t match up well b/c Miller only makes 9-Mill this season but i’m sure we can get Minny to throw something else in there.

This would really help us b/c Evans and Miller ar interchangeable at the 2/3 positions. Actually though, Miller would probably force Marvin to the bench (Flip,Mo,Marvin……not bad).

Miller is a vet who doesn’t need to be on a rebuilding team, he also has another year left on his deal so if were succesful(after the trade), this might persuade Marvin to take less money in order to stay here.

Since the Wolves don’t REALLY need Bibby, and since their rebuilding, the might waive him (to clear cap space) and he can sign with us for the remainder of the season (ahh……fairytales lol.) Shoot if they can give away KG then why not Miller?

More than likely though, it would take a third party to make this deal work.

Thoughts?

~Sir Links A Lot~

By ray

October 17, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this

tbhawksfan, all that about ball movement and such: my point is that Woodson doesn’t endorse or implement that style of play. What you stated is what should be known as common sense. Instead, I fear Woodson will try to run Horford ISO when he’s not running JJ ISO. Actually, I’m praying that this is just an exaggeration on my part. Really praying….

As for your comments per a Bibby trade. Your stipulations about a young center and/or draft pick actually mirror none other than those of Ando ….from months ago. Hey, it’s a good idea if it can be pulled off.

On the payroll issue: would you pay 10 million dollars more this year for almost the exact same team as last year? And I don’t think 37 wins gets us in the playoffs this year. More like 39 to 41. Which I actually think is doable, but we have really got to exploit our advantages or it ain’t gonna happen. We got in last year partially because Indy choked more than we did. Who will we be fighting for a seed this year?

I noticed you mentioned some player combos as well. I’d not mind having a Sean Williams or Joakim Noah next to Horford. Williams is the more likely possibility if such a pursuit is to happen. I’d take neither in place of Horford. I don’t know if we could even get Camby. But I’ll say this: our chances of getting a good piece may link Bibby and Marvin in a trade. But I’d also be expecting a decent draft pick in that equation.

I have mixed feelings about the Marion idea. I don’t think Miami will do it unless they are convinced they can’t get a big for him.

There’s nothing wrong with getting another forward, however, depending on what that forward can do (and is proven to be capable of doing). I’m in favor of either getting another big forward (Al’s size at 6’10 or even bigger) or a guy who’s that size, but is a shooter. Getting a more traditional center? Chances are slim to none.

By ray

October 17, 2008 9:29 PM | Link to this

Geez….Indiana is deep this year. Deep enough to waive David Harrison and not even twitch…

By richbrave

October 17, 2008 10:18 PM | Link to this

Half-time. NEW ORLEANS up by 18. Came in with 6 min. to go in the second. Not one offensive rebound by WASHINGTON. Shoot-around offense with brick after brick after brick. JAMISON and BUTLER the only ones to score. SONGAILA lost and wandering in the wilderness. OMG I give the WIZARDS one win against the HAWKS this entire season. Well MAYBE two. How many wins for the HAWKS is that ANDO.? 37 is looking pretty good this go ‘round. GO HAWKS. Course it is pre-season, but only eleven days to the opener and NO sense of urgency on the part of the WASHINGTON team. Careless turnovers every three trips down the court. Occasionally they haven’t been able to even clear the defensive end after a rebound. JORDAN looks like he could bite the head off a nail he’s so tense. He is NOT a happy camper. But as a new convert to the ATLANTA camp I am a dispassionate observer. Just scouting the competition for the HAWKS.

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 10:27 PM | Link to this

TB, the answer is yes, I do. I’ve been saying for months that I don’t believe the Hawks will substantially increase their payroll, from the $55 million outlay of last year. And I believe they are hoping that the Law/Flip combo will allow them to trade Bibby, without sacrificing results.

At the foundation of our difference is the opinion of Bibby. I don’t think he’s even a top-ten PG, when taking defense into account. And if he’s not a top-ten PG, then he’s hardly worth a top-20, overall, NBA salary, of $15 million.

I’ve outlined, in detail, a range of reasons why I don’t believe the Hawks will end up spending anywhere near what their current payroll projects to. As some folks have asked that I not repeat myself, I suggest that you go back and check any number of posts, over the summer, in which I explain the math (in my opinion, of course). The current economy, and the severely restricted credit market, as well as an evaporation of the investment banking industry, only add to my opinion. I believe (and I think this is pretty well established) that the ASG have been losing millions, annually, and that they are viewed as cash-strapped. No less than David Stern, who just laid off 9% of the NBA workforce, highlighted an expectation that, due to the economy, the league anticipated across the board decreases in both season ticket, and single-game, tickets. Advertising revenues are down.

So, I think that the more confusing perspective is believing that a historically underfunded ownership group, who’ve never committed more than $55 million to annual payroll, who still has an unsettled 8-figure buyout battle, with their former partner, who project to have, at best, flat revenues this year, if not lower, would increase payroll, by $10-12 million, for a team that won 37-games last year.

As far as wanting a PG, what the heck is Acie Law? What is Flip Murray? There’s nothing about expecting Bibby to be traded, in light of both his salary, and the presence of viable replacements, that goes against my long-standing desire for a PG. But that was addressed some time ago, when Law was drafted.

Still need a center, who can shoot from deep, if Horford and Smith are the future of your front court (which they are).

I think neither Bibby nor Marvin, will be on the Hawks, by the beginning of the ‘09-‘10 season. I think the long-term financial commitment necessary, to keep Smith, Horford and JJ, unless there is a change to a better funded ownership group (or the resolution with Belkin creates a massive influx of capital), will require that the supporting cast of the Hawks be comprised of an ongoing mix of rookie contracts, and value-priced veterans, who complement the core 3 players.

I think both JJ and Horford will command near-max, if not max, contracts. And, combined with Smith annual salary of nearly $12 million, those three will account for somewhere between $40 and $45 million a year. Based on a historic cap of $55 million, that doesn’t leave very much for guys like Bibby and Marvin.

This overall issue is at least a year away, and will come up after the Belkin/ASG issue is expected to be resolved.

For another opinion go back to the October 14th post by ‘Flash’, who is very familiar with the legal battle, and is, himself, a lawyer. He sheds some light on the issue that I was not even aware of.

If the ASG lost money last year (my understanding is that they did), and it is anticipated that revenues will be flat this coming season, why would anyone believe that they intended to commit to a payroll that would see them lose an additional $10+million?

By HB Ando

October 17, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this

Rich, I have to admit, that when I spent the summer suggesting the Hawks would end up around 10th in the East, I expected a healthy Zero and Haywood, with the Wiz projected to just edge us out in the 8th/9th range. Looks like that’s pretty unlikely, which definitely works in the Hawks’ favor.

I still think that a couple of teams, in the East, who are being outright dismissed, could surprise. I genuinely don’t believe that the Bucks, coached by Skiles (who usually infuses improvement when he arrives, followed by a rapid tuning out by his players, after a few seasons), with a starting line up of Ridnour (with a Calderon-like Sessions waiting in the wings), book-end wings of Redd and Jefferson, versatile, if maddeningly inconsistent, Charlie V, and an ever improving Bogut, will be bad. I think the Nets can be better than folks think. I don’t believe that Riley, who never stands pat, will fail to seek some trades, in an effort to support Wade and Beasley, and return to the playoffs right away.

Boston, Detroit, Toronto, Orlando, Cleveland and Philadelphia will all be better than us (in my opinion). That leaves us competing with the rest of the East for the 7th and 8th seeds. I see us falling just short, unless I’m dead wrong about the financial outlay the ASG will actually make.

I’d be OK with being wrong. I’m going to be watching a lot of games, so it would be a lot more fun if we’re better than .500.

I’ll trade constant reminders that I was way off in my expectations for the pleasant surprise that the Hawks are better than I thought.

Don’t doubt that for a second…..

By richbrave

October 17, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this

One caveat on the WIZARDS. JaVALE McGEE. 15 tonight and reminds me of BIG AL in the #5 slot except he is a legitimate 7’0” 240-245. As I stated from my personal obversations at the open scrimmage two weeks ago Saturday, he is mobile, finishes around the basket, has a real nose for the ball, but as a 20 year-old raw, raw, raw. Little defensive ability. Allowed stroll after stroll down the lane by whomever had the ball. Terrible foul shooter, but good technique. So,so mid-range jumper. Great right-handed jump hook. Won’t take long for the league to force his left hand. All in all, he’s a three year project, and he will become an impact player inside. And finally my old buddy PETCHEROV had some flashes both offensively, and around the interior defense. Still gives no help D, but I would have to say the coaching staff has worked wonders with this guy. on both ends of the floor. Gee, I still sound like a WIZ fan don’t I.? Only game in town forces me to watch, and learn. But an inside game consisting of McGEE 20(7’ 0”), PETCHEROV 22(7’ 0”) and BLATCHE 22(6’ 11”) are three years away from being effective in any way. Meanwhile, the HAWKS are off and flyin’. POLLIN should have cut his losses with JAMISON and ARENAS, and started over from the inside out. That’s the only way to build a great NBA franchise.

By richbrave

October 18, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this

ANDO:

No need to apologize for your takes on the HAWKS. They’ve been accurate more ofter than not and well reasoned. I don’t think anyone here begrudges your baroque manner, to use a term.

Certainly no one doubts your sincerity toward the ATLANTA team. If you didn’t care, you assuredly wouldn’t waste the voluminous time and effort you expend on this blog.

So I reiterate, keep it coming H.B. and GO HAWKS. DRMARYB’s BIG AL and the THREE SURVIVORS are gonna’ soar this year - provided they are handled properly by MIKE W…..

ray:

You know I really would like to post up more on LEDBETTER’s blog, but the racists fools there really turn me off. ORLANDO even attempted a smackdown yesterday. I think the only solution is to just not post that trash, but hey, that’s me.

By Clyde

October 18, 2008 4:21 AM | Link to this

tbhawksfan I’m saying Noah and Sean Williams instead of Horford.

ROLL TIDE

By tbhawksfan

October 18, 2008 7:29 AM | Link to this

“Noah and Sean Williams instead of Horford.”

That is an interesting idea. We trade the more talented player(by far) and recieve two first/second string type players in return. It would definately round out our roster and complete our BIG rotation.

Tough call, hate to lose Horford.

By ray

October 18, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this

RichBrave, some of those idiots over there give idiots a bad name. Freedom of Speech. Ain’t it a mutha…Of course, somebody is probably saying the same damn thing about me. Heh.

By richbrave

October 18, 2008 8:53 AM | Link to this

ray:

Probably.

By Lacsho

October 18, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

Man it feels good to be back in the A

RAY

It takes two to tango. I had a meltdown and I took some things personally. Sometimes the blog can be tricky, and it’s hard to figure out where a person is coming from. Live conversations you can tell by ones tone or gestures. It’s all good!!!!

Your comments from Bradley’s blog:

“Whatever reason” is Woody, and nothing else. Besides injuries, and Law’s injuries weren’t that bad. Simply look at quotes from Wood himself: “when a player is in and out with injuries like that, he needs about a month of reprogramming”. No Woody, you flaming moron, he needs support.

I was thinking the same thing. I know I’ve said some crazy things on this blog me against the world baby, but Woody just made an ignorant azz statement. If that’s his philosophy, I think he needs to be canned. A month of reprogramming (SMH) that sounds ignorant as hell. I was trying to give Woody the benefit of doubt (thinking that he changed), but that statement took me back. Thus, I might have to say Kens assessments on Woody were rather accurate. I just hope Woody gets fired if he starts showing glimpses of the previous years. We have a very talented team, and we should go deep into the playoffs…

Man what’s the deal with Randmo? Seven minutes of preseason time, that’s ludicrous. I’m hoping he didn’t get on Woody shyt list. We all know what happens once you get on that list (say goodbye to your future with this team)… I digress

Me Against the World Baby

Typical Day

Nice

By tbhawksfan

October 18, 2008 12:10 PM | Link to this

Is Bibby more valuable as a trade asset at the deadline or at the end of the season?

He’s more valuable at the deadline. He isn’t only as $15.6M expiring, he’s also a quality PG that could boost some PG needy team on a late season playoff run.

The question is; is he more valuable to us as our starting PG or as a trade asset?

Next season is another matter. I don’t see any reason to even think about bringing him back next season unless he’d sign for about a third of what he’s getting this season.

Acie needs to step up, or we will have a PG issue next season.

For this season; do we keep Bibby or do we deal him at the deadline and , if so, who or what would you want in return?

What do you guys think

By MannyT

October 18, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

I recognize that Chills is unlikely to return to the Hawks. However, it is still a weak argument to say Flip Mo is better. The argument is weak because it did not have to be a Chills OR Flip Mo situation. Who does not believe we could have put Chills, Flip, and Mo Evans on the floor at the same time? Who does not believe that if Chills were offered the mid level exception on July 1, that he would have taken his Olympiacos journey? That’s on your boy Rick, quite likely with an assist from your boy Mike Jr.

All that said, I hope I am willing to sit in the OH ZONE and watch Othello Hunter scrape up the loose balls.

Ariose Salim gets another chance tonight as the Spurs play Indy. Even though they are the only major pro sports option in San Antonio, notice how they have chosen to use the fake 8 to get some folks in the building.

Do we really need Noah and Williams instead of Horford? I think not. We have plenty of players on the roster right now. The idea is to get better. I would take Zaza & Horford over those 2 in the short term and possibly Solo & Horford over those 2 in the long term. As the zany person standing next to Howie Mandel often says…No Deal!

Bibby should stay at least until January. If we are doing well with him, he could be here the entire season. His trade value will probably increase as the season goes on. If he plays well, he is worth more. If he plays poorly, his cap value becomes more attractive as we get closer to the end of the season. Patience will pay off.

Star Trek fans, Woody is the anti-Borg. You will not be assimilated. In fact, if you don’t easily fit in, meet Woody’s pal WitPro. You will be on the bench, but no one will see you. Fortunately, Solo went his own way over the summer…and got better. AC will have to find his mix of Woody vs non-Woody to be successful. Notice that Josh did several summers ago.

Will RandMo get at least 5 minutes tonight? hmmm

BWAF

By Ariose

October 18, 2008 1:59 PM | Link to this

Hopefully it will work out for us. I really cn’t see us getting better from trading Bibby. Either we get another PG or a center(who?) but you never know…

~SalimFan Sir Links A Lot~

By Clyde

October 18, 2008 3:32 PM | Link to this

tbhawksfan I am not saying trade!! I’m just wondering would we be better off if we drafted Noah and Sean Williams instead of Horford and Law. Our front line would include Smooth, Noah, S.Williams, Solomon, and Zaza. Clearly this lineup gives us more defense which we need.

The more 7 footers the better if I were in charge of the team. It gives you more more bigs and more fouls to control the lane. That’s why New Jersey will suprise people this year.

And yea I said it. If Horford were playing for New Jersey he would be a reserve. Horford is good right now while he still has his athleticism but as it starts to fade he won’t stand a chance because he’s just not tall enough.

Roll Tide!!!!

By ray

October 18, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this

Lacsho,

Glad to have you back, bro’. Glad your trip was safe and what not, too. I hope all went well with the new job training. Those things can be rocky at times. It’s all good between me and you. I’ll go in with Ant Banks and we’ll get your first two or three Coronas when we are able to catch a game at the same time. As for “A typical day at the blog”, I’m glad you didn’t take the punchlines the wrong way. Besides, I couldn’t take any shots at you or anyone else without taking several at myself!

I agree steadfastly with you on Woody. I’m still convinced that he’s a “good” guy, and a guy who inherently, generally has a good bit of class about him. But as an NBA head coach…I’m still having serious issues in that corner. Like you, I’m very willing to take my venom back if he proves to be a good coach. But you’re right, those comments caused a relapse for me.

If I had to guess, I’d say RandMo is on Woody’s sh!t list. I mean, it’s funny that Othello Hunter is getting mention from Woody and RandMo isn’t. Interesting, I’d say, but then I have good hopes for Hunter. Sekou did a nice article on him, if you haven’t seen it. Flippin’ back to the other side of the coin, Woody is old school, which means that any rookie that isn’t standing out big time, is gonna get small burn, no matter how hard he works. I’m not in love with that philosophy. But I ain’t the coach…

Peace!

By ray

October 18, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

Manny,

My feeling has never been that it was an either/or situation. And I’ve never argued it as such. Management could’ve done better, but they didn’t. But people keep on talking about Flip and Mo as replacing Childress. I say they are additions, not replacements. If you ask me, the whole idea of arguing about whether or not they are good enough to be his replacement is what’s “weak”. They’re not replacements! But if somebody is going to insist on taking this tack, then fine…yeah they are more than adequate to replace him. Why? Two proven, fully capable veterans who are capable of playing two positions apiece beats one young, talented but not all-star caliber player who is not playing a critical position.

So I guess it depends on what a person’s individual argument is. If the argument is Chill vs. FlipMo, then FlipMo wins in my opinion. If it’s whether or not to use the Chill vs. FlipMo concept to justify what management did, then NO, it does not justify managment’s moves. They bungled it, and that’s all there is to it.

Clyde,

I disagree. If Horford is playing in New Jersey, he’s NOT a reserve. He’s their starting power forward. Some of the guys on that team fit the more traditional “mold” of a center. Somebody on that team may one day become a better actual center than Horford. Nobody on that team is a more talented or dedicated low post player than Horford. And he’s hardly any older than any of their post players, so how is he going to lose his athleticism before they lose theirs? I’m just sayin’ man…

Having said that, I wouldn’t have been opposed to trading up or down to acquire acquire Noah or Sean Williams along with having picked Horford at #3. Although, we still would’ve been in dire need for a pg. Preferably not one that costs 15 million a season (although we didn’t know we were getting Bibby at the time anyway). However, soon enough Acie may make us forget about all of that. People say he needs to step up….I’d say he’s been doing JUST THAT here in the preseason.

By MannyT

October 18, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this

Clyde, it sounds like someone switched your bottle of Alabama pride tide for the soapy stuff in the grocery store regarding Horford. While he might not be the starting center, who on that Nets team would be the starting PF in front of him?

Watch out rookies, Al is getting some inside scoop on fashionable popcorn tricks at LZ’s cafe.

queueing the happy music Nice to hear ray & Lacsho getting along…unless this is all a diabolical plot with Ant Banks to use public intoxication as a blog weapon. Olive branch or poke in the eye…we’ll see on the Colbert Report…hmmmm

Shame on me. This is what idle minds do during the fake 8. Instead I should put a big ditto on the Woody assessment. Nice guy, questionable coach.

Game on at 7PM. Get that audio via NBA Audio League Pass.

BWAF

By Clyde

October 18, 2008 5:09 PM | Link to this

But Ray answer this question for me. Last summer did we need a center or power forward? Hell even today do we need a center or a power forward?

If you need both you need to draft a guy that can play both positions. And in the today NBA he has to be 6’10-7’0.

For a while now we haven’t had a legit 7-footer on our roster, and for a while we have been one of the worst teams in interior defense. Is Al Horford helping us with our interior defense? Answer that for me.

ROLL TIDE!!!! 24-3 AT THE HALF

By hawksfan

October 18, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this

To all DirecTV users: The game will be on NBA League Pass tonight (free preview)!

By doc

October 18, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this

lascho, let me know if you and your son could use the tix on monday for the preseason game that night?

By ray

October 18, 2008 7:27 PM | Link to this

Manny, you ain’t right……

Clyde, true, true. But I’ll answer by asking a question. Who was the best low post talent that we could draft last year at number 3? At number 3, I don’t take Sean Williams. The only guy at center worth taking that high went at number 1, and deservedly so. I have nothing against Sean Williams. I like the guy. But why is it that Al is a starter and Sean is fighting hard right about now for back-up minutes?

Even taking Williams and Noah, while kind of nice, would’ve been a bit of a bad idea. We’d have a center and power forward, but we’d also have only one guy in our frontcourt who could score consistently…Josh Smith. And don’t tell me with those two “5 feet within the basket only” players taking up all the space down there that Josh wouldn’t stay outside and jack jumpers all day long. Balance, man. Balance. Now Horford and Noah? I’d take that combo all day long. They know how to play hi-low post.

By ray

October 18, 2008 7:37 PM | Link to this

To be honest, Clyde, if any of the low post guys we’ve mentioned is living off his athleticism alone, it’s Sean Williams. Horford works on his game on both ends, and will show himself to be a consistent offensive threat (he can pass quite well, take it up the court, shoot the 15-foot jumper, and score inside). Williams, as crazy athletic as he is, needs to work on those skills. One day those jump-like-Amare days will be done with. Still, something to be said for his defensive and rebounding capabilities when he can keep his head on straight. Can’t say a single bad thing about him on the defensive end.

By cp

October 18, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

Lol I remember us having this same argument about Sean Williams this past season. The guy blocks shots but that is about it. He is a poor rebounder, takes bad shots, and seems to have a low bball iq. He wasnt even starting for the Nets near the end of the season. If Horford were on the nets we are looking at an 18 and 10 a night type guy. They dont have a big on their roster that would start over big Al. I like Sean but as ray said, he has to keep his head on straight. Im finally glad to be seeing a game on tv. I did not know it was on tonight so I will be back to break down what I have seen. I have caught it in the second half though so I missed the first quarter and a half.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 18, 2008 8:06 PM | Link to this

“I’m just wondering would we be better off if we drafted Noah and Sean Williams instead of Horford and Law.”

Simple answer: No.

By cp

October 18, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this

It’s under 3 minutes before the half. The Hawks had a lead but lost it. They are playing real sloppy right now. They have a lineup of Horford, Joe, Evans, Flip, and Bibby on the court. Woody has the classic “huh” look on his face. Not much intensity from what I can see out of the Hawks but like I said I missed the first quarter and a half. I will be back later for the guys who cant see the game.

By MannyT

October 18, 2008 8:15 PM | Link to this

ray while you have not made the Chills OR Flip Mo argument…others have. Earlier in this blog (in a more general way) there is the how good was Chills for this team thing based on Hollinger’s numbers.

I think we agree on the management mangling of the situation. I’ll even concede that Flip & Mo bring some things that Chills did not with Woody as coach. Give the Hawks a coach that was more willing to exploit the strengths that the 07-08 team had and Chills versatility was an excellent fit for what we often said, but rarely did…play an uptempo game. Chills did bring intangibles, but they did not mesh as well with Woody. I think Chills would be a much better fit with Phil Jackson and his Zenlike hoopology.

…and you are quite correct. I ain’t right. Probably why I appreciate the oddity of Chills as a hoopster that cares a lot about non basketball things. My favorite read of the summer was about Chills & Marvin penny pinching on the road.

Clyde I can live with the roll tide stuff, but don’t sniff/eat too much of the laundry detergent before you post opinions on Horford. You may get a Sean Williams in ATL one day. Not a top level free agent, but an attainable big man if we lose Zaza or Solo next summer. I suspect Josh Boone and Brook Lopez will consume many of his minutes this season.

Besides, why does your 6-10, 235 lb guy get so much more respect than out 6-10, 245 lb guy? At least bring me a 7 footer, when you preach 7 footer. Where is that Robin Lopez!

doc You should get a kick out of this as you keep those gold bars tucked away in the Sampsonite ;-)

RandMo…RandMo…time to show-RandMo.

Sounds like the Bobcats are having trouble with the scoreboard operations. Glad it’s them and not us.

BWAF

By cp

October 18, 2008 8:19 PM | Link to this

Alight we have the lead going into halftime. I think Flip is going to be huge for us this year. He is playing pretty well from what I have seen so far.

By ray

October 18, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this

CP!! What channel is the game on??? I’ve been following via YahooSports.com. Help a brotha out!!

By cp

October 18, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this

It’s chanel 650 on direct tv

By ray

October 18, 2008 8:33 PM | Link to this

CP, Flip is definitely going to be huge for us. I see woody’s been tinkering with the lineup. I wonder will he have the kahones to do it during the regular season, though? Hmmm….

Manny, I agree. Nothing changes on that, huh? The exploitation of our mismatches, the use of our players….all leading to one source…the make or break for a team that has talented depth for once.

By ray

October 18, 2008 8:39 PM | Link to this

thanks CP

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 18, 2008 8:40 PM | Link to this

The entire starting lineup is in foul trouble at the beginning of the 3rd quarter? That kinda sucks…

By cp

October 18, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this

We are shooting lights out from behind the 3 point arc. Horford is looking great on the offensive end. Bibby is still shooting as if we are still playing against Boston. Joe looks like he is ready for the season to begin. He is knocking down shots and getting to the hole. Law looks like a different player from last season. He took a 3 with no hesitation and hit it.

By Clyde

October 18, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this

All I gotta say is we have Horford on our team but yet we still need a strong defensive force in the middle. I keep stressing this because its been our weakness for years but we keep ignoring it.

Ray how can Horford work on defense when taller players can just jump right over him? You can teach skill but you can’t teach length.

cp Sean Williams may only be able to block shots but its exactly what the Hawks are lacking. Strong deense in the middle helps teams run more.

ROLL TIDE!!! 7-0 BABY!!!

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:09 PM | Link to this

JJ is going smooth off. Meanwhile Horford is grabbing every board in the building (he’s leaving some for Okafor). I like the way Acie is playing. Under control, not missing a shot, dishing the ball, handling better than last year. That, and he’s actually taking and hitting the 3.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:19 PM | Link to this

Clyde, what you got no love for big Al? Come on, man. Guys don’t just jump over him. He bodies up to them and fights ‘em. I’ll agree that length makes a difference. But with both guys listed at 6’10” I guess you’re going to have to convince me that Williams has a much better wingspan. I don’t know about all that. What I do know is that he doesn’t start on his own team. Al gave us a double double all year long playing out of position. Al is out right now scoring inside and hitting 15 and 20 footers for us. I don’t see Sean doing all that, though he could play center for us.

I still want to see us get a guy that lets Al move over to PF. But where is this guy? In the meantime, I firmly believe that we have the better overall player in Al. I still believe we took the best guy available in the draft. He’s done wonders for us.

The Tide is the Truth

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

CP, this is the Acie we drafted. The guy with the killer instinct. I was thinking last year “no way does a guy hitting that many jumpshots in a 4 year career forget how to shoot all the sudden.” Looks like he’s breaking free of the Woodson Effect. Show me more, show me more! You’re right: when Bibby’s shot isn’t falling, he looks like crap. With the weapons we have he should be getting 8-10 dimes, whether his shot is on or not…

Gardner got in for like, 21 seconds. Heh. Big O got in, grabbed a few boards, blocked a couple of shots. Keep it up young fella, the offense will come. Still no RandMo…

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

Man, Flip is a killuh. Say what you want about the FlipMo Squad, but that’s 30 points and 7 rebounds off the freakin’ bench. When have we ever had that in the last several years?

How about the old Zaza comin’ back to us? He’s been playing well so far this year (albeit preseason…call it practice, but you play like you practice most of the time). How about big Z and Horford sportin’ double doubles? Yeah!

By cp

October 18, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

Yea ray when Bibby is not hitting shots he is pretty much just out there. His defense is pretty bad out there tonight. He is missing shots and is not setting up guys as a pg should. Hopefully he will get it turned around for the regular season. So far he is looking like the Boston playoffs Bibby and that is not a good thing. Pachulia is playing like the guy from a few years ago though. Its nice to see him play with confidence again.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:35 PM | Link to this

Although both guys are fouling like they’ve been possessed by the spirit of John Edwards…

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:37 PM | Link to this

Ah hell, Bibby’s heating up. We’re stinking it up on defense though.

By cp

October 18, 2008 9:38 PM | Link to this

Wouldnt you know that as soon as I say how bad Bibby has looked he scores 9 straight points lol. We need Bibby to be consistent if we aer going to make the playoffs. He was hot and cold a lot after we got him. Luckily this year we have a confident Law and Flip backing him up so if he struggles we have some other guys who can get it done.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this

Bibby saved it for the end of the 4th quarter. Nice aggression. Only problem is that this is how Bibby is used to playing the entire game, and that’s just not his role here. Still, at least he turned it on during clutch time. We allowed the ‘Cats to hang around too much.

Like Bibby’s clutch shooting (he was crappy as hell up until now) but his defense is never going to be solid for us. That’s the disadvantage we suffer when he’s in the game.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

Yeah, Flip is the difference. He kept us in the game, competitive, and actually ahead while Bibby struggled. Hell, Flip damn near gave us 20 off the bench. Gotta love Flip…

Damn!! Look at Law hit that 3 with ice in his veins! Hell yeah, the real Law is here!

By cp

October 18, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

Law with the 3 point dagger. Yea this is the guy we drafted.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:48 PM | Link to this

What the….do we forget how to play defense every time we play the ‘Cats? I swear…

By Melvin

October 18, 2008 9:49 PM | Link to this

AC with a dagger 3 to put the Bobcats away. Another good performance from the bench tonite. Hawks get 40pts from the bench.

By ray

October 18, 2008 9:56 PM | Link to this

How about that. Acie hits the big shot, coming right off the bench in the last 30 seconds or so. No way does he even take that shot last year. I think he’s arrived. Not reached his full potential of course, but this is the real Law that we drafted. Hell yeah. Preseason or not, I’m excited about that.

Zaza had a heck of a game. I’m really glad to see him playing well and with confidence (as CP said). Welcome back, big fella. This is the same guy who put that Euro breath all in Garnett’s face back in the late spring. Just kiddin’ Zaza, don’t hate. We love ya. LOL.

Nice to see big O get some burn.

Still no RandMo…..

We’re going to have to make that a signature line or something….

By Ariose

October 18, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this

Great Game. Everyone had a solid night…..Although smoove was only 1-6 with 3pts, and a Tech. Woody got a Tech too.

Bibby Worries me……

~Sir Links A Lot~

By ray

October 18, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this

Hell yeah, Melvin, CP. The thing is, he’s been pretty consistent so far. From game to game, he’s hitting his outside shots, not just driving to the basket or giving up altogether. The bench was off the chain.

JJ did his thing, but he sure had a pile of turnovers…

Speaking of which, here’s a testament to Horford: He battled Howard to pretty much a standstill. Howard is currently torching Miami for about 26 and 15.

Then I saw the damage Wade was doing to Orlando….yowch…29 pts, 7rebs, 8 assists…WOW.

Peace out y’all…

By Ariose

October 18, 2008 10:11 PM | Link to this

Zaza with 12 and 10…….gettin’ it done Big Fella, yeah.

By doc

October 18, 2008 11:01 PM | Link to this

man by the numbers bibby has a pretty decent game and you guys are banging on him, what gives?

good stuff many t, sad that paulson is one ot the guys he must be describing and he is leading our cover up er bailout. fox in the hen house syndrome.

By cp

October 18, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this

doc up until that fourth quarter Bibby had pretty much done nothing. His defense was bad as usual but he came through during the clutch.

What is up with Josh Smith? I know it was said earlier about his slow starts but tonight was horrible. He has to learn to keep his emotions in check and play better defense. He was gambling a lot out there.

Our perimiter defense is just flat out awful . The Bobcats were getting to the hole with no type of issue. This is where we could really use Speedy. He is a great defender on the perimiter. Like ray said earlier, Bibby is just not going to give us solid defense. He was getting beat something terrible out there.

By ray

October 19, 2008 7:23 AM | Link to this

Doc, you have to look at the game as a whole.

cp, I agree-Josh Smith didn’t show up for that game. Disappointing, but several of his teammates did quite well.

By doc

October 19, 2008 7:36 AM | Link to this

he is streaky and that is the problem and why he continues to fire. in the end not too bad for 27 minutes. live by the sword die by the sword. pretty good production from the point guards combined. acie seems ready to translate it into the real season, proud for him.

By fudd21

October 19, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this

CP, Ray, Melvin In looking at the box acore I saw where Josh fouled out while playing only 16 minutes. What’s up with that. Were there a lot of ticky fouls? Was he guarding Wallace and struggled? What gives.

By Lacsho

October 19, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

I think Zaza has been playing well; I wish he was more focus mentally. By increasing his mental focus he’ll decrease some of those stupid mistakes he makes during crucial times. Overall I believe he played well.

Acie, Acie, Acie I feel this is the guy I’ve been waiting for. I watched him in college, and I thought his game would translate better in the NBA. One day he’s going to wake up and say this is my team, and then he’ll exceed expectations. He’s a stronger player when he’s in leader mode.

Bibby bothers me too. I must admit he came through in the clutch; however, Doc said it best, with Bibby you have to take the good with the bad. His defense is so suspect, but when he’s on he’s on…. I think the Flip acquisition will allow us to trade Bibby in January. Acie and Flip are interchangeable. They can play both guard positions. Furthermore, Speedy should be able to play spot duty…

JJ is the man, but he commits some bone head turnovers. His mental focus is suspect at times. I wish JJ was a vocal leader, but he’s not that type of guy.

Still trying to figure out why Randmo doesn’t get any burn….

By Ken Strickland

October 19, 2008 11:55 AM | Link to this

Fellows, don’t get upset when certain players underperform during a gm. In the past, that would’ve spelled instant disaster, especially if it was JJ or Bibby. This yr, we are so deep and versatile it will be much less of an issue. There will be gms against certain teams that will require a total team effort. Otherwise, don’t sweat it.

I’m more interested in the makeup of the final roster, especially the active roster. We know who the starters will be. We also know PG-Acie, C-Zaza, G-Murray, G/F-Evans amd C/PF-Solomon will make the final cut. That leaves 2 open spots on the final roster for G-West, F-Hunter, C/F-Morris, PG-Speedy and G-Gardner to compete for. The way things have gone so far, it looks like Morris is going to get ignored by Woodson just like he did by Knicks HC IThomas. It also looks like Hunter has done enough so far to earn a spot. I believe the final active roster spot will go to a backcourt player, which means the competition will be between West, Gardiner and Speedy for that final spot. WHAT DO YOU THINK?

By terrell barron

October 19, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this

I see you guys are finally showing some love for Billy Knights draft picks. He nailed it in 04(Chills/Smoove and 07(Al/Acie. Give him his props. lol! You cant expect a guy to get it right every year. Maybe he was out walking the dog in 05 and 06?

By terrell barron

October 19, 2008 12:19 PM | Link to this

I see you guys are finally showing some love for Billy Knights draft picks. He nailed it in 04(Chills/Smoove and 07(Al/Acie). Give him his props. lol! You cant expect a guy to get it right every year. Maybe he was out walking the dog in 05 and 06?

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this

keys to the hawks season:

1. they have to score 100 or more pts/game. they avg. 98 last yr. they score 100 pts or more in 28games last yr, about 28% of the games. they coulda won about 8 more games if they had scored 100pts.

2. they shot 44% from the field, 42 reb/game, had 20assist/game and 15to/game. these numbers are bad, but 3pts was 35%. if they can get this up 5% and maintain 40 reb/game this should be the diff in gettin’ 100/game

3. woody can’t keep players in dawg hse. gotta let them play thru it. jj never sat in dog house and he had some horrible games last yr. gotta use that bench!! 82 games will burn guys out and then the players gotta step up, too. smoove had 3pts last nite. wtf?!

4. asg need to make a concerted effort to sell out philip’s nightly! make tix for lower level 25 bucks!! the energy durin’ that boston game was sick!! the crowd willed them to victory!! don’t get it twisted!!

5. hawks shot 77% from ft. need this up to 80% or more!! this does several things: you gettin’ the other team into penalty and foul trouble, make pts without time comin’ off, increasin’ overall pt total.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 12:27 PM | Link to this

ken they need to cut speedy, but what are the implications of that tho? havin’ young players watch this guy sit on the bench for 82games can’t be good.

By terrell barron

October 19, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

Ken, Are we only going with 12 players? I thought we could have more than that? At least 13-14? Am I wrong? Your’re right though, Hunter is definately a keeper. Woody loves hard workers. Thats how Mario made the team last year, basically on EFFORT alone. And I thought Morris signed a guaranteed 1 yr deal? Did he not? Looks like Gardner and Mario wont make it.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

oh yeah, need 2 more teams for nba yahoo fantasy league team:

league id: 95877 password: atlantahawks

lacsho welcome back to the A. like dorothy said, “there’s no place like home…”

ray FLIP/MO SQUAD gettin’ 30pts and 7 ribbies of the bench is sick!! if our startin’ 5 can get 70 pts and 35 ribbies, it will be hard to beat us every night

By Ariose

October 19, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

Ant Banks, I think Ken meant “who is going to be the eleventh man off of our bench.”

Honestly, I don’t think Gardner or Mario Will get any Burn this year. Let’s face it, everybody on a roster is not going to play. I Say Gardner b/c of his offense will get more time than Mario.

But that eleventh spot goes to Othello if you ask me……We’re going to get into some foul troble in the frontcourt sooner or later and we’re going to need his hustle.

On to more IMPORTANT news lol. Salim played 20 minutes in his first preseson game with the spurs. He had 8pts, 4ast, and 2stls…….yes he was playing point…

~SalimFan Sir Links A Lot~

By Ariose

October 19, 2008 1:04 PM | Link to this

He wears numer 23 now hehehehe….

~SalimFan Sir Links A Lot~

By ray

October 19, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this

Yeah, he kind of had a frustrating night. Those will come from time to time. Part of it is too much gambling on defense as CP said. He has learned that being patient on offense is a good thing, and he’s shown improvement there. He also knows that when his offensive game is not on, he can still have a heck of an impact on defense. But he has to learn patience on that end as well.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 1:38 PM | Link to this

for Colin Powell, a major piece in the Republican cog, to support Obama was huge. his case against McCain was tellin’, which makes me scratch my head as to why so many people have mccain/palin signs in their yards.

i haven’t seen many obama signs in the yard.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 1:55 PM | Link to this

st. louis beatin’ cowboys 21-7 in the 1st qtr. WTF!!

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this

guys the season kicks off in 10 days. i have to agree that we look betta’ than last years’ team. gettin’ 30 pts off the bench will be huge!!

with the injuries in washington, and problems in miami, charlotte and us usually ownin’ orlando, how do you think we will do in the conf? and the east?

poop i no you usually have a legit negative view of the team but you have to admit we look good now. how do YOU think we will do in conf/div?

personally, i see 40+ wins with a 6th or 7th seed

By cp

October 19, 2008 2:07 PM | Link to this

I think last nght showed why Josh Smith is not suited to play the sf position. He really struggles when asked to play the 3 position. It might have been Ando who brought this up I might be wrong but whoever it was said that when Kirelenko (spelling) played great for the Jazz he was at the 4 spot. When moved to the 3 he struggled. I think that is the case for Josh. He might have some good games here and there at the 3 but he is better suited playing the 4.

I love our bench right now. Lacsho makes a great point. If Law keeps this up it will be a lot easier to trade Bibby. Law and Flip looked good on the court together last night. I would like to see Randolph get some minutes but I dont think its going to happen. Speedy was suited up last night but I did not see him get in.

By Ariose

October 19, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this

Bibby needs to get smoove the ball. When Bibby creates for Smith early it fuels Josh’s offensive game and gets him comfortable. They need to run that screen and roll that Steve Nash and Amare used to run under D’Antoni.

I saw the Highlights from the Game last night……We look good, but giving up 96 points to the Bobcats Worries me. Even though our offense is more potent now, why are we still having close shootouts at the end of games??? Our Defense Needs to step it up big time.

~Sir Links A Lot~

By doc

October 19, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this

lascho you might have missed it … can you use the tix to tomorrow’s game with your son?

By terrell barron

October 19, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

Ant Banks, This just in: Wade Phillips will be fired. Jason Garrett will be named new Head Coach. Nah, just kidding. For now, that is. Let em lose next week.

By doc

October 19, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

as far as colin powell, last time i trusted his judgment was regarding the weapons of mass destruction. i like him a lot, only hope he gets it better this time.

By fudd21

October 19, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

Terell We can keep up to 15 on the roster but only 12 dress for each game. I think that was what Ken was referring to as to who will dress on a nightly basis.

By Ken Strickland

October 19, 2008 5:14 PM | Link to this

Unless there’s a trade or training camp pickup, our 15 man roster seems set. I was talking about the 12 man active roster. Speedy can make the team and still not sit on the bench. He’ll just be one of the 3 inactive players. The way things are shaping up, it looks like Speedy or Morris will be the 12th player on the active roster. Both can be very valuable to us in the long run. Morris has to be given a chance to play meaningful mins. He’s known to have very good OFF skills and can provide a lot of physical play. Speedy has to remain relatively healthy. His speed, quickness, pressure DEF, vet leadership and opencourt ability can win us a few gms.

I still see comments referring to JSmith as a natural SF. I just don’t see it. Sure he can play the position, he played it his rookie yr, but how is it his natural position? We all know this will be Bibby’s last yr as a Hawk. We also know Acie would likely be his replacement and he’s not prolific or consistent enough as an outside shooter to compensate for Josh’s erratic outside shot. Moving Josh to SF and Acie to PG simply can’t compensate for the loss of both Marvin and Bibby’s outside shooting ability.

With our opening season schedule being so strong, I doubt if we’ll have any problems getting our young players motivated. We just have to hope we don’t get off to a rocky start and force Woodson to revert back to his slowdown, halfcourt, control oriented OFF style. I also hope he doesn’t invent excuses for not playing certain players so he can avoid having to manage players mins.

By Lacsho

October 19, 2008 5:28 PM | Link to this

Doc

Yessir I could use those tickets. Just let me know what kind of arrangements I need to make. That would be a great surprise for my son….

CP

Thanx, I think you may be on to something about JSmoove playing the 3. I think he has more of an advantage at the 4. Smoove may have problems defending the three, which will lead to early foul trouble.

Banks

I agree the BASG needs to keep Phillips full. I know we’re a tough home team; however we need to be more focus on the road. I think the flipmo squad, A to the Z plus Solo will be the key to our road success. Woody needs to plan for the marathon, not the 100 yard dash…

By doc

October 19, 2008 7:00 PM | Link to this

lascho i will be at my office tomorrow by 9:30 until 2 or 4 to abut 5:30? my office is on century blvd at i-85 and clairmont. can that work for you?

By doc

October 19, 2008 7:02 PM | Link to this

of josh cant play the three then we may have three power forwards in josh, marvin and al.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 7:08 PM | Link to this

terrell quit playin’ yo!! when i read this ish, i thought it was real!! i hit my boys up and they was like dude what you smokin’?

doc you are so correct. i watched it again and all the mccain camp needs to say about colin is how he was sooo off on wmd’s and iraq that his word ain’t no good regardin’ him supportin’ barack

lacsho i will have extra tix to the nov. 19th game and the nov. 21st game, so if you want to take your son holla back.

By ray

October 19, 2008 7:23 PM | Link to this

Doc,

Acie is doing pretty much what he’s supposed to do. Saying that he’s not good enough at shooting from the outside to overcome Josh Smith’s erratic shooting is detouring from the true problem.

For one thing, if Acie isn’t good enough, then what is Mike Bibby? What I’m seeing from Acie is consistency (including solid shooting from the outside) and the ability to penetrate and get his points that way. Was it not you, in your 7:36 post that said that Bibby is “streaky” and therefore has a need to keep firing to be effective? So how does that compensate for Josh’s erratic outside shot, eh? What’s bad about it is that Bibby doesn’t compensate for himself by driving to the hole.

Look, Bibby is still the better pg. For now. Here’s the real problem in my opinion: Bibby has to keep firing to be effective at taking the pressure off of Joe. There’s more than one way to take the pressure off of Joe. Another way is to get the other guys involved in the offense. Isn’t that what a pg is supposed to do? If Bibby gets out there and starts getting the ball to guys like Horford and Smith where they can do the most damage with it, then we won’t have to bark as much about guys like Smith going for outside shots. Get him easy buckets, particularly in transition. He can do it all day or night long. Guaranteed.

Part of this falls on Woodson, and the type of offensive plays he implements.

But I’ve been saying this for months now (pardon me while I go into Ando mode): Bibby is a guard who has always played with the need to be a featured option on offense. On this team, that’s what is not needed from him. His ability to facilitate and distribute well will determine the effectiveness of this team’s play more often than not. All the great (or very good or just plain good) point guards know how to do it. They know how to keep giving their teammates the ball when they’re hitting shots. And they know how to score when needed, without having to fire up 10 or 15 shots before hitting a few. Is Bibby one of these guys? Season will tell. I can tell you this: I believe that Acie is one of those guys, in the early development stages.

Again, it is early, and Acie has yet to do in a regular season game this year what he’s been doing in the exhibition games. And Bibby has yet to do what he has not been doing in the exhibition games. He may play in a way that makes the organization say “what did we ever do without him?” Or he may play in such a way, and Acie play in such a way that the organization says “Hmmm, now what can we get for him?”

Don’t know. But I know what I’m seeing right now…

By ray

October 19, 2008 7:38 PM | Link to this

Sorry, Doc. That post was actually me talking to Ken. I remembered your reference to Bibby being a streaky shooter and sure as hell, I typed your name up. My bad.

Ken, another thing I meant to say was about Josh Smith playing at the 3. I think he can be just fine there, but it’s a matchup thing more than anything else. If his shot improves (and I figure he’ll work like crazy on it…especially with Mark Price around to help), we won’t be saying anything about his shooting for long anyway. But with the options we have now, if we want to go to a bigger, more rebound/defend-capable lineup, that’s where you put him. Marvin is already getting lost in the mix. He hasn’t played super well, although he now seems capable of hitting the 3 once or twice in a blue moon. Not to say that he sucks…but here we go again (so far). One decent game where he scores 19, the rest of it forgettable or also-ran, and a minor injury (which means missing time). On top of that, the veteran Mo Evans who is a superior defender…getting a good chunk of minutes. Yeah, Marvin is still almost sure to be in the starting lineup come opening day. No reason to think otherwise (yet). But mark my words: we will see Evans play significant minutes, and most of them will be at the forward position. Especially if Marvin doesn’t take off into this 19-point, 7/8-rebound a game character that people keep forecasting him as…or if he isn’t getting it done on defense. Lest we forget who’s coaching….

And we definitely have to get better at defending. Having a shootout every other night isn’t going to cut it. Exciting losses get old after a while.

By doc

October 19, 2008 7:54 PM | Link to this

ray it is always cool but i was a little surprise my limited comments got such a long response. i just took it as somone wanting to increase my bball iq so i could keep up.

By ray

October 19, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this

Yeah right, Doc. Pretentious I may be at times, but presumptious not so much. Your comment was dead on target. Bibby is streaky. I think that not being the featured scoring guard makes him moreso. But what is it they say about the good veterans, they find ways to score? Bibby found a way to catch fire at the end of that game against Charlotte and we may not win that one without him being the one to do so. And at the same time, it was Law’s dagger that iced it. Perhaps a portent of things to come? I like to think so, if nothing else.

By ray

October 19, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this

Haven’t seen Law shoot like this since A&M. He’s taking as many shots as anyone else, but hitting 52% of them, including a whopping 60% from beyond the arc. I realize he’s only going 9-15 from that range, but this is a far cry from last year. High hopes, high hopes….

By Lacsho

October 19, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this

Doc that works for me. I can be there in the morning. Just let me know the exact street address and I’ll be there.

Banks

Good looking out. The only thing I turning down is my collar….

Ray

I feel the same way about Bibby. I don’t want to p** anybody off, but Bibby is not a perfect fit for this current team. Like JJ said in Sekou’s recent article, we have so many options this year. If you double JJ, we have several players who can make you pay. I don’t know if you remember, but as I stated when we first got flip (now I’m pullin an Ando) Flip is the truth, I’ve seen this guy light up numerous teams when he played for Seattle.. Ray went down, and the Sonics didn’t miss a beat. Finally, I feel this team has enough shooters and scorers. We just need to get them the ball, and play pressure defense to force turnovers. In turn that will lead to more fastbreak points. I still feel we’re at our best running, yet I feel confident that we can be successful in a half-court offense…

By Samuel

October 19, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this

On Bibby and Acie:

Acie is having a good preseason. I hope he continues to improve then we may be able to talk about trading Bibby for a starting center and Backup PG. I need to see this in the regular season and the playoffs. There are three speeds: 1) preseason 2) Regular season and 3)the Playoffs. Bibby has proven he can get it done in all three. To this point Acie can boast only one.

On Colin Powell:

It’s pretty much a safe, band wagon move by a man who is not all that much trusted in the Black community and the World as a whole. After doing the dirty work for Massa who really cares what he thinks. I put him in the category of a Condy Rice. Smart but on the wrong side of history. We’ll take the endorcement but we really don’t need him at this point.

By doc

October 19, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this

lascho, 1950 century blvd, suite 4. if you come from clairmont rd it is on the left, if you see the marriot you are close if you are at the marriot you have gone too far. the name of my practice is to the left of the door.

again i will be there by 9:30. if i am with a patient have a seat and chill, good place to do it. look forward to meeting you.

chills sucks, go flipmo. heh heh

By Lacsho

October 19, 2008 10:54 PM | Link to this

Doc, sounds like a plan. I look forward to meeting you tomorrow morning.

By ant banks

October 19, 2008 11:05 PM | Link to this

there is no way that we keep bibby past the feb deadline!! flip/mo, law, jj, speedy can all do what bibby does or better. if we can get a few draft picks for him do it!!

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 19, 2008 11:17 PM | Link to this

“poop i no you usually have a legit negative view of the team but you have to admit we look good now. how do YOU think we will do in conf/div?”

Haha I never knew I came across as negative… I thought I was cautiously positive, but willing to point out flaws, but I guess not. When I look at the East I think Boston, Philadelphia, Detroit, Toronto, Orlando, and Cleveland in that order are gonna finish 1-6. Everyone after that could be a playoff team or a lottery team depending on whether they get breaks or not. Miami has injury issues and is too reliant on Wade for offense, Same goes for Washington, except Gilbert and Haywood are gonna be out for a significant amount of time so it’s even worse for them. Indiana is revamped and who knows how well Ford and Nesterovic will fit with the existing players. Chicago is gonna need a great season from Derrick Rose to contend and although I like Rose a lot I don’t see that happening. Milwaukee has some new pieces but I’m not a huge fan of any of them. I don’t think any of the other teams in the conference have a chance of contending with a relatively healthy Hawks team.

So based on all that I see us finishing between 7 and 10 in the conference, depending on injuries and team chemistry. Of the so-called “swing” teams I mentioned above Miami is the one that I think will most likely finish ahead of us. I don’t think Washington, Indiana, Chicago or Milwaukee is quite there yet as far as team chemistry is concerned. I’d say an 8th place finish is most likely, with somewhere between 38 and 41 wins.

By Steve T

October 19, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this

I know everyone keeps looking for a starting center, but the truth is we may not get one. What are you going to trade to get a top notch center or close to it. The way I see it, we may have enough people on the team to get the job done.

Did anyone look to see what the Z-man did in his last game… 4-7, 4-6, 10 rebs and 12 point which is pretty solid. If we could get that from him every night, the hawks can play with anyone in the NBA. He did all that in only 24 minutes which means it leaves 24 more for someone else. We could let Solo get 18-20 minutes and let Morris do the clean up. The best situation would be if Morris could develop, he could split time with SOLO.

The hawks could have 15 fouls to through at other teams which means we can play tough in the paint. These guys should go after anything that comes in the paint hard. They need to set a tone.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 19, 2008 11:45 PM | Link to this

I’d also like to mention… Tampa Bay Rays son! What! Ever since the Braves got eliminated I’ve been pulling for this team… they are a LOT like the ‘91 Braves.

By HB Ando

October 19, 2008 11:55 PM | Link to this

Ken (and everyone who continues to take the position that Josh is a four, and Al is just fine at the five). I ran across this quote, on Foxsports.com, Hawks’ team site, roster report (and I had to chuckle, because I’d never heard it before, despite the fact that it’s pretty much consistent with what I’ve been saying since we drafted Horford, and handed him the five-slot):

“C Al Horford will continue to play out of position until something is done to insert him at his more natural power forward spot (moving Smith to his more natural small forward). In the meantime, Horford will continue to post double-double numbers and play his role.”

Now I don’t, nor have I ever, worked for Foxsports.com.

But I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night……..

This position is not radical. Again, look at some of the most dominant PF’s in the league, who have, or can, succeed at the five: Duncan (always provided a center to ease his work load on the defensive end), Stoudemire (Shaq is in the house), Garnett (anybody remember Perkins eating up boards against the Hawks, during the playoffs?), Gasol (loving getting to play the 4, with Bynum behind him), Bosh (Rasho), J. O’Neal (historically guys like, Foster, but now he has to be Bosh’s caddy), etc.

The most dominant 4’s in the league can all play center. Players play. Lebron can play point. Doesn’t mean you want him wasting his energy bringing the ball down the court. JJ can play point. But it ruined his 3-point shooting %, and he was outmatched, defensively, which is why Billy’s bad idea was scrapped after less than a season.

So, look at the FoxSports.com scouting report, consider that they might be right, ponder the implications of the primary limitation, for the team, if Smith and Horford play “their natural positions”, and come to what I think is a fairly obvious conclusion:

We need a complementary “big”, who can body opposing fives, on defense, and, on the offensive end, draw his defender all the way out to the 3-point circle, so Horford can deal with single coverage on the low block, and Smith can drive to an unclogged hoop.

Folks don’t see Smith as a 3??! Why, because he can’t shoot from deep? What’s more legitimate about that perspective than highlighting that he’s clearly not a “4”, since he has absolutely no low-post game? Last time I checked, there isn’t a single, upper-tier, power forward in the league, who can’t post up.

Dude likes to face the basket. He likes to float on the perimeter. He’s at his best driving to the hoop. I don’t see how that makes him a power forward.

I’ve been saying for almost 3 years that before it’s all said and done, either Smith or Marvin would end up moving on. Because they both see themselves as small forwards, regardless of how many opinions, here, want to assign either the responsibility of being a power forward.

This coming summer, that prediction will come to fruition, as Marvin moves on to a different franchise.

By HB Ando

October 20, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this

Sam, while I believe we’re going to trade Bibby, the idea we could get a starting center AND a back up PG, for Bibby, who’s current, average draft position, on ESPN live fantasy drafts, is as the 17th (17th!) point guard (90th overall), is plain silly.

I can’t understand why so many folks here continue to overvalue his skill level, at this stage in his career, and fail to acknowledge how grossly disproportionate his ‘09 salary is, with what he projects to produce, combined with the obvious implications of his salary on the ASG’s likely financial situation.

When a guy has the 17th highest salary in the WHOLE NBA, and he’s, not coincidentally, viewed as the 17th best PG in ESPN fantasy hoops, there has to be at least some level of acknowledgment the guy may not be worth his contract (not unlike Marbury).

And please, anyone who’s knee-jerk reaction is to remind me that there’s a difference between fantasy hoops and the real NBA, please save your breath.

That point is obvious. But we’re not talking about a small discrepancy in salary and production/value. We’re talking about a huge gap. And if the owners were the Dolan’s, it wouldn’t be much of an issue.

So Law doesn’t have to prove he’s Bibby’s equal, to justify trading Bibby. He and Flip have only to represent a reasonable alternative, at 30% of the cost, for the ASG to seek a Bibby trade for the first reasonable offer (and in a straight salary dump, “reasonable” takes on a much more flexible definition).

By Ken Strickland

October 20, 2008 12:37 AM | Link to this

RAY-why would Marvin have to perform at a 19PPG, 7/8RPG to keep Evans from taking his job? After all, Evans started 47gms for Orlando last yr and in 24mins managed 10.8PPG, 3.2RPG, 1.2APG and 0.7 STLS. In 34Mins Marvin averaged 14.8PPG, 5.7RPG, 1.7APG and 1.01STLS. At this stage of his career, Evans isn’t likely to improve very much or provide much more than his starting numbers from last yr.

Evans’ overall gm and experience makes him a perfect compliment to Marvin off the bench. However, he’s never been, nor will he likely ever be, a better scorer or rebounder than Marvin.

Besides, with the increased depth, versatility and experience we have on our bench, no starter will have to score more than they did last yr for this team to improve. We just have to see improvement from Woodson.

By HB Ando

October 20, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this

For folks who have mocked my suggestion that Bargnani might be the complementary piece, missing, from the anchor front line of Horford and Smith, as I hope for a 7-footer who is a legitimate outside shooting threat (from Hoopshype.com):

“Ask Lawrence Frank to list the game’s best shooting big men, and he lists the usual suspects — Dirk, Elton Brand, Chris Bosh, Andrea Bargnani, Rasheed Wallace, et al.”

As I’ve mentioned, Bargnani will be forced to come off the bench, in Toronto, since it’s implausibly unbalanced for the Raps to start Bosh, O’Neal and Bargnani. 3 seven-footers clearly can’t match up, defensively, most specifically against opposing small forwards.

How much better would Marvin Williams fit there?

Cat calls and scoffing won’t change my opinion that a Williams-Bargnani trade would make sense for both teams.

Seems like it’s the same folks who want to dismiss Bargnani’s upside, that demand patience for Marvin, despite the fact that Marvin has been in the league a year longer than Bargnani…………

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 20, 2008 1:35 AM | Link to this

“Cat calls and scoffing won’t change my opinion that a Williams-Bargnani trade would make sense for both teams.”

I can’t speak for others, but I’ve never denied that Bargnani is a good shooter. Pretty much everyone who comes here from Europe seems to shoot well, except for Andris Biedrins (coincidentally the only Euro big man whose game I like).

But isn’t the problem for the Hawks that they don’t have a 7-footer to ensure that Horford doesn’t have to defend opposing 5’s?

How would Bargnani solve that problem? Every time I have seen Bargnani play he has been nothing short of horrible on defense. Not just bad, straight up horrible. He has no clue. He makes Zaza look like Mutombo by comparison.

It’s nice that Bargnani can shoot, but every time you bring up the MW-Bargnani trade you mention that Toronto is overloaded with 7 footers and we are overloaded with swingmen. If solving the position imbalance is one of the main motivations for this trade proposal, I’m assuming you would want Bargnani to start if he was brought here. What little positive impact Bargnani would have by stretching the floor and opening up room in the post for Horford would be more than cancelled out by his cluelessness on defense.

And while I’m all for being patient and allowing players to develop, I’m not gonna overlook a player’s obvious tendencies in order to do that. Existing skills in a player can be developed, but tendencies that never existed are very unlikely to be cultivated at the NBA level. Bargnani has consistently shown an unwillingness to bang in the post and play defense throughout his NBA career. That is not the kind of player I want starting at center. The Hawks need a center. They do not need one of these Euro pseudo-centers who are really shooting guards trapped in center-sized bodies.

I agree that between Josh and Marvin, it makes sense to get rid of one, and Marvin being the less talented and less versatile one he would be my choice as well. I also agree that long-term the Hawks would get the maximum production out of Josh and Al if they were at the 3 and 4. But trading MW for Bargnani would be a clear step back for this franchise. If the Hawks want to add shooters they should get it from their guards and from the bench.

3.8 boards in 24 minutes for his career. That is pathetic for someone who is supposedly 7 feet. I’ll stick with Zaza, thanks.

By Najeh Davenpoop

October 20, 2008 1:37 AM | Link to this

And for the record, I’m not and have never been a big Marvin fan. If you want to trade him for someone who can play center, I’m all for it.

By BA

October 20, 2008 2:13 AM | Link to this

I HATE that I missed the Bibby/Marion thing two days ago. Now that is creativity, ando. My first reaction was “that’s ridiculous” but the more I rolled it around, the idea IS intriguing. However, I’ve seen a lot of the Matrix over the years (all those Suns playoff games and a recent Heat preseason game) and I don’t think he “stretches the floor” much more than Marvin. Seems like he bricks about ten threes a game. Plus we still wouldn’t have a five.

I think Miami would do it in a heartbeat, it would improve their team. Not sure if it would make us better, though- and I’m not entirely comfortable with an Acie/Flip platoon- but lets see some real games first.

I beg to differ on Smith’s “lack” of a post game. Last season I saw a number of developing post moves, and while he’s not an elite post-up player right now, I believe he has the most upside of any of Atlanta’s players. Give the young man time- hard to believe he’s only, what, 23?

As far as Bargnani, do you mean as a center? Or a four? I’m not throwing flames (today) but I honestly can’t figure this theory. As before, with Marion, I think for Toronto it would be a great move. For us? Seems like Bargnani is a natural three or four, and of the two I still see Horford as a better (if imperfect) center.

By richbrave

October 20, 2008 8:42 AM | Link to this

SAM:

My take on COLIN POWELL is that of a private man who did his job well in the military and shunned the news spotlight. ‘JOE the PLUMBER’ wishes he had also. And the dude only asked a question of a presidential candidate. I have been praying he comes out and endorses OBAMA. That would be the coup-de-gras for the REPUBLICANS in ‘08.

The fascists in my neighborhood destroyed my yard-sign Saturday night. Its fine to have a million McCAIN-PALIN signs, but let a democrat put up one and there’s he!! to pay.

By Samuel

October 20, 2008 9:15 AM | Link to this

Don’t get me wrong, I believe that Powell is very smart and knows his stuff about Defense. I believe he just got in over his head and hoodwinked with the Bushes. Maybe he has learned. He would be a good advisor. This just in, Barack has offered him a position in his administration.

Ando, Bibby can bring a starting center and back up PG. It just depends on who you trade with. I believe the Knicks would go for It. Also, Miami, if they had a center, Sac.

There we go with that scrub Bargnani talk again. He’s a jacker. We all know that but how would that allow us to move Al to the 4 since Bargnani can’t guard his own shadow.

I still say we should keep Bibby the rest of the season. I have always said that Marvin would be my choice to move.

I also say that Josh’s best position is at the 4 spot. His last game pretty much proved that didn’t it.

All in All, we don’t need to do anything but play. Then we can see what we need to tweek.

By mateo

October 20, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this

Scary analogy:

2004 Atlanta Hawks = 2008 United States: Both are/were complete messes. Both were hiring new people to lead them.

2004 Woodson = 2008 Obama: Both will be hired with ZERO experience.

At least Woodson was a player & assistant in the NBA.

Obama has been a senator for approximately 250 days. Many of which have been spent campaigning instead of being an actual senator.

Let’s hope & pray Obama has a better record than Woodson after his first 4 years!!!

By mavid

October 20, 2008 10:16 AM | Link to this

Interesting idea about Bargnani

While I tihnk it could pay off big and cause some crazy mismatches (basically taking the form of Utah´s front court). But, the difference is, while Okur is decent at guarding the longer 5s of the league, Bargnani has not shown that yet. Im just not sure who we would have him guard. The 3, 4 or 5 of the other team.

I guess it would depend on the matchup, but I would be worried about a) Bargnani´s defense in general and b) sticking Smoove on the best 3s in the game to play on-the-ball D, which is somethnig he isnt great at.

By Ariose

October 20, 2008 11:07 AM | Link to this

From Micah Hart….Hawks.com Blog

(Before the Bobcats game in Charlotte…)

“I did still manage to make it down to practice today, where I was treated to a three-point shooting exhibition put on by Marvin Williams after scrimmage was over. First of all, I think any worries we have about his thumb should be put to rest soon. I don’t know that he will play tomorrow night, but he was out there in practice today (though he didn’t scrimmage) and his shot certainly didn’t seem affected by the contraption he wore around his thumb.”

“Marvin was hitting at least 3 of 5 from every 3-point location around the court, and doing it with ease. It’s actually very interesting to watch him shoot from distance, because while I always think of him as a jump shooter in the midrange, he takes a set shot from behind the arc (or at least was today). He looked incredibly comfortable, so much so that it just seems inconceivable that he took so few last year. I’d say his development as a long-range shooter is perhaps the single most intriguing subplot to the beginning of the season for me.”

I think you guy’s may be moving a bit too fast on the 22yr old. Just give him time.

If we do make a trade it’s gotta be….

Mike Bibby For Mike Miller in 09’!!!

It works out for both teams, Flip Moves from SG to Backup PG and Miller takes his SG spot……and of course Acie get’s the pressure put on him and starts……..just for the record, I am a Mike Bibby fan…….

I wonder what it would take for us to get our hands on Marc Gasol? I think he would be a perfect fit. Zaza and Speedy?? Marvin and Speedy??? That’s probably premature on my part though. He does seem ale a better coordinated Zaza though….Just Sayin’…There about the same height.

~Sir Links A Lot~

By MannyT

October 20, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this

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