Hawks

By new jersey faithful

May 5, 2008 7:33 PM | Link to this

1st? really? What Sekou said! lol

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this

Sekou You are tight.

First, do whatever evaluation that has to happen regarding management quickly.

If there is a choice between the coach and the GM, I say keep the GM for now. He does have to show that he can do a better job of picking his lieutenant to run the squad he put together. Thus he is on notice for next season.

As far as the Joshes, yes you have to pay them, but what is the number? If I were them, I’d not sign anything from the Hawks until I got some offer talk from my agent. Why run the marathon and quit once you are inside the stadium for the last lap?

On the Hawks side, you have to figure out what makes fiscal sense. I understand the JJ lesson when he left Phoenix. I also see what the Cavs did w/Varejao. We need to be somewhere in between. If we find we cannot afford one of them due to an outrageous offer, see if the sign & trade is a viable option to fill a need.

Except for JJ & Al, I doubt anyone is close to untouchable on this squad. We may experience some additions and subtractions if a team has it’s lasers set on one of our Joshes. That is how we got JJ!

The Campaign for Responsible Athletic Professionals is on!

CRAP

By Mel

May 5, 2008 7:47 PM | Link to this

Finally! lol, I was worried about you… you never take this long to post a new article..nice to have you back

By CRYSTAL

May 5, 2008 7:53 PM | Link to this

I AGREE 100% COULDNT HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF U MADE ME PROUD HAWKS LOVE YA ESPECIALLY U JOE SMOOCHES!!!!!!!

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this

My focus for the summer regarding the Hawks keeps laser focus on answering the two questions that my summer CRAP is built upon.

This all comes under reasonable efforts to improve the team.

a. What are we going to do to raise the overall level of the team, i.e. better players at key positions.

b. What are we going to do to maximize the usage of the players we have, i.e. play to their strengths.

CRAP

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 8:03 PM | Link to this

SEKOU Is there any chance that whoever the GM is when teams are allowed to start signing and trading will attempt to acquire Chris Bosh from the Raptors?

Would mgmt be willing to sign and trade JSmith and Salim, with Marvin thrown in to match salaries, or a future pick, assuming Toronto would listen to the offer?

If so, does he play out of position at the 5 or does Mr. Horford stay there with CB at the 4?

If JSMith is traded who becomes the 6th man, b/c they’ll need to keep Chills and start him at SF?!

I hear that CB wants return to Atlanta, so I had to ask your opinion!

Go HAWX!

By Lewis

May 5, 2008 8:07 PM | Link to this

I think you hit it right, lets not make a mess of this there is work to be done. Lets put our hardhats on and get to work, we should not be in this jam in the first place. As a team you are the first to know what you have,have you ever known the pay to go down the next year after everone else find out what you have. pay up and shut up keep this team togeather

By Astro Joe

May 5, 2008 8:16 PM | Link to this

The question, which frankly I am frustrated no one from the AJC has provided an answer to is, can they do something quickly? To do something quickly, would require terminating the contract before it expires 6/30. How many owners does it take to agree to terminate a GM/Head Coach? Do they have the votes? OK, let’s say they don’t, then they have to wait until contracts expire. Then the question becomes, how many votes does it take to hire a new GM/Head Coach? Do they have the votes? If not, then what? Do you extend the status quo until such time as a decision regarding ownership is complete? Or do you “negotiate” with someone to swing their vote to your side? And what is the expense of gaining that vote?

Calling to “do something now” assumes that the ownership group (as it is currently constructed and governed) has the power to “do something now”. The Thrashers 7 month head coaching vacancy leads me to think that is not the case.

Don’t hold your breath for anything to happen quickly. Thrashers fans have passed out and are comatose waiting for their coaching savior to be hired.

By EJH

May 5, 2008 8:17 PM | Link to this

Yes, Sekou the season is over, but the business begins. I have know idea how the hawks are going to move forward with player contracts and the salary cap, which will be a big issue. To improve this team maybe adding by subtracting is the way to go. I think the hawks need to move Bibby for Iverson if they can, this gives the hawks another bonafide scorer who can drive the ball, and there is no way teams can double team joe johnson with Iverson with the ball in his hands. If I am the GM I am making some bold moves this off season that makes the Hawks contenders next year and keeps the majority of their youth. But this team needs more veterans. Being that the Hard Cap for salaries next year looks like it is going to be about $75 million dollars the hawks will have to contend with it for two years but the rewards will be huge if it works. (1) Trade Bibby (14.5 million) and Marvin Williams (4.5 million); total 19 million) giving us back Iverson (19 million).(2) If Jermaine O’neal (19 million) is healthy, try and obtain him by signing Childress (5 year 50 million which would be 10 million per year, Pachulla 4 million and David Anderson if he comes over at 4 million per year and the 1 million dollar trade exception; total 19 million) to the Pacers for O’neal. And then sign Josh Smith to a 5 year 60 million dollar deal. This give the Hawks that mix of veterans and youth. Plus it gives you more flexability with the salary cap the next two years because, Iverson contracts expires at the end of the 09 season giving the hawks back 19 million in cap space. Then at the end of e 2010 season O’neal’s 19 million is off the books along with Joe Johnson’s 14 million and Speedy Claxton’s 6 million, that is almost another 40 million dollars of cap space, but these moves also give you a chance to be a title contender for the next two years and the future, because you are still young with Acie Law, Al Horford, Josh Smith, Solomon Joes, Mario West, Jeremy Richardson, and it allows you the flexability to bring in top free agents after the 2010 season or sign your own. 2008 - 2009 starting lineup; Iverson, PG; Joe Johnson, SG; Josh Smith, SF; Al Horford, PF; Jermaine O’neal, C. Also sign Jamal McGlure or Diop as a backup center. Welcome to the NBA 08 - 09 NBA Champions the ATLANTA HAWKS, but only if these moves are made.

By ItsMeMann

May 5, 2008 8:19 PM | Link to this

All that said just please get rid of Sorry Williams I met Marvin Williams.

By Sautee

May 5, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this

Ding!

By mayhew

May 5, 2008 8:37 PM | Link to this

gotta keep the two players, however, i think woodson has to go. i think a coach earns his jack in the regular season where he is the main motivator. this team CLEARLY has more talent than the 30+ wins they mounted this season. i think the playoffs (and the home crowd) were the motivation that got them to 3 wins in the postseason. this just proves my point. woodson has had plenty of time to show his worth, and I think he has none. as for knight, i have ALWAYS been a skeptic of his, however, you must admit he has assembled some young talent here. (the draft aside) i think last year’s draft he finally went with best talent available and brushed aside temptation to draft for need (connelly) i saw woody gone and knight back, and sign the young studs.

By terrell barron

May 5, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this

If we hire D’Antoni, it would be like when Larry Brown left Detroit, and they brought in Saunders. Less defense, a little more offense. I’m not comparing Woody to Brown, but they have basically the same philosophies.

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 8:47 PM | Link to this

EJH I like the way you think. AI STILL amazes me with his skills.

The main reason I say keep Bibby 1 more season, is b/c he could continue to be very valuable as a MENTOR to young Acie Law.

I am by no means an “expert” but being the son of a …. coach (what did you think I was going to say), I’m sure he learned something about teaching others how to approach the game.

I could be wrong. Hope they do something faster with Hawx than they’ve done with the hockey team’s coaching vacancy!

GO HAWX!!!!!

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this

Astro Joe I believe one could release a statement thanking Woody for his service and dedication to the game. That same statement could also state that he will not be signed to another contract and is welcome to negotiate with other teams effective immediately.

I would have a meeting with him first, but you really don’t have to wait if the contact will expire.

If I’m not mistaken Mr. Thomas was not fired in NY, but they did say he wasn’t coming back as coach. Their search is well under way.

EJH I think you spent an awful lot of cash at 8:17PM, but none for a paragraph break ;-)

Your deal looks like a massive rebuild. Do you take the chance on JO’Neal’s knees? I think Iverson is happy in Denver and doesn’t fit the personality type they like here. Not my personal knock, just an observation. We may need a value player or two in that mix. Diopp is a good choice, but McGliore is way past his prime and probably looking for a PJ Brown ring deal next season.

Pulled from your friends in Philly.](http://www.philly.com/inquirer/sports/20080504WhostaysWhogoesWhogetsdrafted.html) AN interesting look as they are in a very similar situation to the Hawks.

CRAP

By EJH

May 5, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

The Hawks also have so many youthful assets that they are going to have to eventually convert that into veteran players. The hawks do not have any draft picks this year, but they will have 2 picks in the 09 draft and 2 picks in 2010, that would add more youth to an already youthful roster, this is not what the Hawks need with an already youthful team.

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

Would Avery Johnson be a good fit? I know that his TALENTED teams kept getting bounced early in playoffs, so MR Cuban fired him.

Would he be willing and able to cultivate the HAWX young talent?

As you guys are aware, Woody exhausted the vets. After acquiring Bibby, was the rest of the bench bad enough to support his fear of playing more dudes? I thought SS, MW, and SJ were capable of providing some depth, but I ain’t no “expert!”

Go HAWX…BEAT EM UP NEXT YEAR!!!

By EJH

May 5, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this

Manny T, Iverson maybe happy in Denver, but he has a house here in the ATL, and his best chance of winning a championship before his career is over will be somewhere else. Denver got swept in the first round this year and did not make the playoffs last year. The experiment with he and Carmelo Anthony is not working out. And as far as J.O. he was one of the reason the Pacers almost got back in the playoffs instead of the Hawks. You only trade for him if he is healthy. The most important thing is continuing to improve and win, because others teams like Miami, Chicago, etc., are not going to sit back and not get back into the playoffs. The Hawks may not even make the playoffs next year if changes are not made.

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 9:21 PM | Link to this

Oops on that Philly in a similar situation link. If at first you don’t succeed…

CRAP

By Horford Rox Still Rox!

May 5, 2008 9:22 PM | Link to this

Maybe I shoulda said Woody exhausted the STARTERS!

GO HAWX!!

By Steve T

May 5, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

The people who want to play GM are killing me with the players they are going to get. Iverson can score, but will he be a good fit for the team. I mean I notice one thing about this team is everyone is willing to play a role. Will AI do that?

I wouuld like to get Shaq and great 3 pt shooter, but I do not think it will happen.

By woodsonsucks

May 5, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

The Atlanta Spirit will mess this up. If they think their free agents are going to resign if this mess isn’t cleaned up. Would you resign with a team if you don’t know who your coach is or your GM? Sekou, made the best point other NBA teams think that both Joshes can be much better players in a better system. Woodson’s lack of any adjustments on the offensive end in Boston was amazing for 4 games. When the Hawks ran they won as simple as that. By the way, Mike Bibby sucked on both ends of the floor and Smith and Horfod avg. the same amount of assists as him. Woodson still only saw to play Acie Law 9 mpg. Salim looked good yesterday. I wonder how much better the team would of been if his shooting helped spread the floor for Johnson & Smith. Great Job as always Woodson.

By greenvegas

May 5, 2008 9:31 PM | Link to this

fire woodson. Anyone that has played basketball at a high level realizes he is in way over his head. Sign Smith, but let childress go if we can find a shooter to replace him. Use that money to get a big man that can rebound and defend. The lack of shooters on the team kills our half court offense and childress being on the floor really hurts in this area. He has his good qualities, but his limitations really hurt our current makeup. We need some shooters and a big man

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

EJH is onto something. If they get a decent coach, tha’ BULLSsss will be AWESOME next season. They have WAY TOO MUCH talent on their roster. What happened to them this year?

Trading the aging B Wallace was brilliant! How much longer can he Rbd and Defend at a high level?

Folks in Chicago were disappointed in his play and BIG $ contract this season. They drafted J Noah, but I don’t seem him having a consistent impact. That being said, they are not restricted by Wallace’s deal. At his age, that’s a plus!

GO HAWX!!!!

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 9:38 PM | Link to this

Steve T…I love to play GM, but would HATE to get Shaq!!

You’re right about Hawx needing 3 pt shooter, but the present day O’Neal ain’t half as good as he used to be!!!

GO HAWX…HATE LESS, Dude!!

By **EJH???**

May 5, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this

Jermaine O’Neal was not a factor for the Pacers playoff run. Dunleavy & Granger were carrying the team. O’Neal played in 12 games and was in double figures ONLY three times. Where are you getting these salary figures? The ASG was too cheap to fire their coach and you want them to take on 40 million in salary.

By richbrave

May 5, 2008 9:42 PM | Link to this

Sorry Sekou. No detailed plans and no action until Belkin and the boys get things ironed out.

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 9:43 PM | Link to this

EJH I won’t doubt your words, but I do doubt that the ASG will go from 28th to top 5 in salary which is over the luxury tax threshold. Even if Belkin was happy, I can’t envision that much of an investment even if my new 999 seat was priced at $1,999.

If Bibby stays and both Joshes are resigned, I see a mid level exception Center. That price tag fits even if the center is acquired via trade. Now if someone goes, you can spend more on a center.

CRAP

By THE Hawks Fan

May 5, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this

Thanks HAWKS for a FUN RIDE!! Now to Coach Woodson. He aint that bad. People are talking about Avery Johnson Mike Danatonio Jeff van Gundy. All are worthless to me. They LOST with LOADED rosters. What are they going to do here??? Draw up plays? The real question will be if Drew and Fiz will or want to come back. Look in the NBA players make coaches. Red had Russell Jacskon had Mike Shaq AND Koby Riley had Majic Pop has Duncan. It takes alot to get through to a young RICH man. I think Woodson finally got through to these guys. Losing on the Road is still a youth thing. Something that shouldnt be mentioned AT ALL next year. I dont wannna hear it. That being said if he gets All the blame for losing, hell let him get some for Winning! B Knight has made some good and bad moves. But as a whole to this point he did ok considering. If he and Woody can co exist through this Playoff run they can chill for another year. I want both JS and JC to come back. But only 1 will WITH a new deal and thats Jchill. I see Josh Smith balking at anything less than Max money to test the market next year. Any WAYYSSS I LOVEEEE MY HAWKSSS. Cant wait till next season. GOOOOOOO HAWKS!!!

By doc

May 5, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this

sekou, i couldn’t agree with you more and said the same thing in my post after the game yesterday was history. i also noted that the son in law of ted said on 790 after the win on friday that the basg had not given any thought to what to do after the season was over that all the energy was gong into supporting the present season. that comment scares the heck out of me and suggests continued incompetence form the BASG. a quick decision based on pre-planned contingencies which should have been part of the regular meetings that are done as a routine part of the on going management of this team that stern referred to last week is one thing that would give me the most hope going forward for this organization NO matter what the decision made and that a new form of stewardship and it was based on overall performance vs egoistic concerns as well as there is a true sense of cooperation among all the owners. the longer they wait only suggests continued INCOMPETENCE.

By EJH

May 5, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this

For people who think the hawks are not going to have to pay to be competitive, you are out of your mind. When the hawks do not make the playoffs next year because other teams went out and made deals, do not complain as a fan, the NBA is a business, and the business is about winning, check out the Celtics and the Lakers. If ASG do not want to play with the big boys sell your teams. And let the fans of ATLANTA know that you are not about winning a championship. To keep Josh Smith and Josh Childress you are going to have to add between 20 and 25 million per year to your payroll, and then if you are going to add other free agents preferably a backup center and shooter be prepared to add another 10 million or so, whether 1st tier or 2nd tier. So the ASG is going to have to spend money anyway just to stay competitive. That is the nature of this business if you want to win. If your goal is not to win just keep on with what you are doing and you will find yourself back at the bottom of the eastern conference.

By Reality Check

May 5, 2008 10:04 PM | Link to this

Do NOT sign the league refuse of used, burned and churned players (read O’Neal, Iverson, etc.). Once you start a core you build from within.

It’s time to harvest what you’ve grown — don’t give it away. The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence - until you get there.

Case in point look at the Indiana Pacers in the 90’s. They were the 80’s laughing stock, but Donnie Walsh was given time to patiently built them up starting with a non-point guard nobody respected at the time - Vern Fleming. A too skinny shooting guard - Reggie Miller… two PF’s that also had to take turns at the 5 Dale and Antonio Davis… A stiff 7’4 Rik Smits (usually referred to as Reek) but they were a team and they made it to the playoffs. (And traded away me non-complimentary players - Detlef Shrempf, unathletic players - Chuck Person, etc.)

Walsh continued to build finally bringing in a real point guard - Mark Jackson - and they became legit. Still Walsh was not content - he traded Jackson for Jalen Rose and the Pacers fell back as Larry Brown wouldn’t play the new pieces his friend and GM got him. Ultimately they got Jax back, Brown left, Bird arrived with Carlyle coaching offense and Dick Harter coachin defense and they returned to the playoffs and even hit the NBA Finals.

What’s my point? Net, net - instead of mortaging their future with someone’s damaged goods - Jermaine O’Neil or non-complimentary players - AI they made subtle moves to improve and compliment their drafted core by bringing in team oriented veterans - Mark Jackson, Derrick McKey, and Chris Mullin, as well as underated Jalen Rose (a good complimentary player but not a star). The key work happened between 1993-2000 when they made the NBA Finals.

Oh and by the way — guess which future NBA GM was cutting his teeth with the Pacers from 1994-2000. Yep - our own anti-PR minded Billy Knight. Like him or hate him you cannot deny that he had a plan (you finally saw the type of basketball he promised four years ago during the three home games), he has had only one bone head draft pick - Shelden Williams, and one mediocre head coach pick - Woodson.

For perspective - the highly respected - Donnie Walsh went through seven coaches before he hit it with Larry Brown and it wasn’t until he hired his eighth coach Larry Bird that he made it to the NBA Finals. His coaches between 1987-2000 averaged just under 2 years with Larry Brown staying the longest @ 4 years. How long has Mike Woodson been here?? Yep that’s right too long. He’s a good defensive minded Assistant, but he’s not in the mind set to be the ATL’s Head Coach. Maybe his next stop….

In the meantime sign the Josh’s and find a coach that will play to the strength of his team.

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 10:06 PM | Link to this

The best thing we have going for us regarding restricted free agents is that there are a lot of good, but not superstar players available.

The Bulls have to deal with their own RFAs—Deng & Gordon.

Also Duhon is a free agent. Chicago could be starting over again…

mykhalc wasn’t Patrick O’Bryant high on your list of value centers?

Here is the 2008 free agent list.

OK, I just can’t resist this one… ASG expose yourself to better things, let your Woody go.

CRAP

By travis

May 5, 2008 10:09 PM | Link to this

As a fan, I will be committed in supporting this team if ASG shows that they are committed to putting together a good team. I am not sure that they are:

1. ASG still has not found a coach for the Thrashers and their season ended early April.

2. ASG traded away valuable pieces on the Thrashers side, showing that they were more money conscious than a championship.

3. I think that Sekou is right in that you should not wait too long. Dallas, Phoenix, Charlotte made decisive moves on their coaching. Will ASG drag this out until June 1st. All of the good coaches will be gone by then.

4. Chris Bosh wants back in ATL? Do it!! What is the deal with Speedy? Is there still a chance at Amare? What about Camby?

5. Track record shows that ASG will not spend any money, so going over the luxury tax is def. not in the making.

6. Manny T I feel you, bruh!! I have gotten my tix for next year, too. $1998 was my price. They cheated you out of a dollar!! LOL!!!

By travis

May 5, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

REALITY Excellent points!! Who out there do you suppose the Hawks get as a pg? Who do you suggest they bring in for center? Who do you suggest as a coach? And can they stay under the salary cap?

By EJH

May 5, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

Here is a link for you guys who would like to know players salaries, team salaries, and everything about the NBA bargaining agreement: http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/

By Another Hawksfan

May 5, 2008 10:20 PM | Link to this

Acutally Sekou, I absolutely agree with you. Why we didn’t seal up the Josh’s last offseason really p** me off when it happened. And for that, I believe BK needs to be gone. In reference to Woodson, if you are going to change the coach, do it today while there are some good coaches available. This organization currently has a lot of momentum going into this offseason. They need to keep this momentum by making calculated and expedient management decisions. If not, as indicated by you and everyone, all the good will be lost and fans will become disillusioned with the franchise all over again.

By Astro Joe

May 5, 2008 10:26 PM | Link to this

MannyT, you’re right, they could certainly announce that Woody will not be retained as Head Coach and let him look for a job during the last 6-7 weeks of his contract.

Interesting to see that Sekou defined the terms on BK’s deal, an option year. So I guess they don’t have to pick up the option and that would be different than firing him. Of course, that begs the question, how many votes does it take to either pick up the option or let it expire?

By the way, I did say last week that anything longer than 48 hours is too long to make these decisions. That was before I remembered that Thrasher fans have been waiting more than 480 hours since dumping Hartley.

Don’t hold your breath.

By Ken Strickland

May 5, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

Don’t get too comfortable with the idea that Woodson won’t have his contract renewed. Ownership has already supported him on 3 occasions when BK requested that he be fired. And that was when the team wasn’t doing well at all. If they fire BK, Woodson will likely remain. If they retain BK, Woodson will likely go. Let’s hope they retain BK and he can get the PG we need to go along with Acie.

We all know the Hawks don’t have a pick in the first 2rds. If we can’t resign JSmith or match a FA offer sheet for him, we do a sign and trade. We could do the same with Bibby. Those 2 moves could give us high picks in both rds. As far as having a chance to sign Calderon, if BK wants him he wouldn’t be afraid to go after him. Just remember how we got JJ. BK could make it very difficult for Toronto to resign Calderon just like someone could make it very difficult for us to resign JSmith. We could use JSmith, and maybe Bibby, in a sign and trade with Toronto for Calderon and additional compensation.

By MannyT

May 5, 2008 10:29 PM | Link to this

Reality used to be a friend of mine but Reality Check lays down the law…and I like it!

So not unlike dating, it really doesn’t take 4 years to figure out that He’s Just Not Into You.

Was this series the beginning of the next phase or a positive blip that had less to do with coaching than the euphoria of a rocking Philips arena?

I won’t throw Woody under the bus, but they got blown out every game in Boston. Doesn’t coaching make the games closer if you keep playing the same team?

Just like at my house it’s cool when nice people come to visit. If they hang around too long, either we’re married or you gotta go.

We are going to miss Rick Carlisle, so on to the next person on the list of candidates.

doc Good management always looks ahead. Even mediocre management looks ahead. I think you can get that from a fortune cookie if you skip business school. Let any of those ASG folks go to their pre-Sports jobs and say I’ve got no plan for the future. You will be able to hear the stock price drop.

But this makes sense. Ando this is why BK isn’t fabricating anything. His bosses haven’t bothered to think about what happens this summer. Maybe they are hoping Phoenix will throw one of those Kurt Thomas deals our way. If they are ready to give up on the Shaq experiment I think we would be willing to take him and a few 1st round draft picks and some cash for a suite at the next Widespread Panic New Year’s eve gig at Philips ;-)

CRAP

By Ramon

May 5, 2008 10:40 PM | Link to this

I feel anyone who thinks we shouldn’t resign Chillz, can’t possibly understand the game of basketball. Including Horford, Chillz is the BEST offensive rebounder on the team. Never in his career has ONE play been called for him, yet he always makes the right play at the right time.

I’m curious if Speedy’s contract or Marvin could equal Mike Miller in a trade. I think his shooting could go great at the 3 spot, with Chillz coming off the bench. Then with JJ, Bibby, and Miller you have 3 great perimeter shooters. With this lineup, it will be very hard to help out on Horford (who’s underrated on the block) and Smoove.

Or trying to make a trade for someone such as Battier would be great to me. Because when Smoove’s is in the game, without a shot blocker the next best thing is someone WILLING to take a charge.

I think if a power forward and at least ONE TRUE 7 footer is added to the bench, then the roster will be pretty deep. You have 2 great shooters in Salim and JRich. A hustle player in West, and Mr Everything in Chills. Acie Law will end up being the best point guard in the draft last year. And if Speedie ever does come back, he will be a great 3rd option at pg for pressure d. His defense would’ve had a huge impact on Rondo.

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 10:47 PM | Link to this

Travis, no chance at Amare or Camby. IF they wanted AS, they would have gotten him from PHX on draft day, instead of selecting Al and Acie.

Mark my words, (or just continue to mock…I don’t really care) CB wants to be back in ATL!!! Don’t know if GM/ mgmt can or will do it. Building from within is a nice philosophy, but Hawx need to supplement this roster with some added fire power. Gotta be honest, though. If they trade the house for Bosh, I don’t know how they will find cap space to fill remainder of roster.

As far as PG? Keep Bibby 1 more year and let him continue to mentor Acie Law. T Lue is a valuable role player and available option off bench IF he is willing to come back.

Don’t know what they’ll do for C! It’d be nice if they would find a glass eater/ good interior defender to play along side Horford, but I don’t think it will happen! (Would cost too much ASG $!)

Say NO to Corporate Ownerships in Pro Sports!!! GO HAWX!

By BosnianBaller

May 5, 2008 10:54 PM | Link to this

The hawks better bring back chill and smoove. How stupid do the suns look the last couple years letting J.Johnson,marion,deng,sergio rodriguez all go for basically nothing

By Astro Joe

May 5, 2008 11:04 PM | Link to this

Of course, the most logical course of action is to dump both of them. But the owners are probably so elated counting the money from 3 home playoff games that they likely feel inclined to keep one. If you keep BK, then he hires a new coach. But BK will likely fall on his face within 18 months and will have to be termminated. Now, you have to likely allow the new GM to hire his coach. Keeping BK results in 3 firings and 2 owed salaries.

Scenario 3 (the first scenario says dump them both) you keep Woody and fire BK. New GM comes on board and is told to leave Woody alone. Within 40 games, Woody falls on his face and new GM hires either an interim until season’s end or a Fratello-type from broadcasting booth. That scenario likely means only 2 people get fired with only 1 contract to be paid out long-term.

Here’s betting that ownership takes the safest route, rewards Woody for playoff run and dumps BK. When of course, the best move is a Fitzsimmons/Fratello combo that could be announced on 5/8.

Follow the money (but don’t hold your breath).

By mykhalc

May 5, 2008 11:07 PM | Link to this

Reality Check, thank you for such a sane post!!! all good points!!!

MannyT, i think O’BRYANT is worth a look. in the few games he actually got burn with GSW i actually liked what i saw. but once WEBBER was signed he didn’t see the court much after that and NELLIE definitely wasn’t too fond of him or his game, not sure which one.

By ray

May 5, 2008 11:18 PM | Link to this

Sekou is right. Move/Speak now or forever hold your peace.

I’d say that out of Woody and BK, one MUST go. The relationship probably won’t work, no matter how many peace pipes they smoke.

I grow weary of arguing which needs to go. I want to see ownership make some quick, solid decisions. What they do from the coaching and GM standpoint will determine the direction in which this rabbit hole goes. Until the moves begin…I wait. No more arguments. Tired of that.

MannyT, your CRAP and PAIN stuff is off the chain. Too funny. Keep it up, bro’.

By mykhalc

May 5, 2008 11:18 PM | Link to this

MannyT, i also like what i see (in limited clips of course) from the AUSSIE kid…ANDERSEN. now is he a 4 or 5 or combo??? but the cat is nimble, nice touch and moves. the question is does he wanna bang???

if both JOSHes are re-signed and ANDERSEN is signed then the first thing i’d do is check out MB, JJ, JS, AH, and DA as a startin’ lineup to see what it brings!!! of course this is assumin’ we keep most of the cats already here.

By Cats already here

May 5, 2008 11:32 PM | Link to this

Meow, dude.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 5, 2008 11:36 PM | Link to this

I may be in the minority here, but I think the most reasonable way for the Hawks to be competitive next year and beyond while having a manageable payroll is to trade Bibby and make Acie Law the unquestioned starter. Some people have suggested bringing in Calderon, but you’re not gonna get him for less than $10 million, and there’s no chance Toronto lets him walk anyway. Maybe my opinion of Acie is higher than others (I was hoping the Hawks would draft him even during the regular season of his senior year in college) but I think the Hawks will be just fine with him starting 82 games.

Sekou is right though… the Hawks have to make whatever moves they are gonna make as soon as possible. The longer you wait, the more qualified candidates you miss out on for your coaching and front office positions.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 5, 2008 11:43 PM | Link to this

As far as Billy and Woody are concerned, obviously it would be great if both get fired, but if you put a gun to my head I’d probably rather keep Billy mainly because it’s so painfully obvious that Woody is holding back this team right now. But like I’ve said before picking between Billy and Woody is like picking whether you want to live in Iraq or Afghanistan. Hopefully the DASG (Dumb Azz Spirit Group… has anyone come up with that yet? I hope not) comes to their senses and fires both of them.

By Malone

May 5, 2008 11:46 PM | Link to this

What about Cenk A?

What exactly is the Anderson (sp?) situation?

By ray

May 5, 2008 11:50 PM | Link to this

Mykhalc, Andersen does not want to bang. And if he does….be looking for a version of John Edwards. I’m not excited about this guy. I want to see what he’ll do against NBA competition. Attitude is everything. I’ve seen better. But then, I’ve seen worse too…

Najeh, that makes two of us. I don’t see why Acie can’t put up Devin Harris-like numbers. And nobody can tell me the dude can’t shoot. He did it plenty at A&M. We already know he can go to the hole rather effectively. He’s already a better defender than the guy who plays in front of him. And like you, I don’t think we’ll get Calderon. But we don’t necessarily have to have him either. We could’ve done well with a guy like Earl Watson and Acie still learning until he’s the unquestioned starter. Hmmmph. We’ll see what happens. I’m waiting on the ASG to make a f’in move already.

And for the millionth time in a row, I gotta give some love to CP3, who’s team is beating up on San Antonio again. I will not resist the urge to state the obvious….

By doc

May 5, 2008 11:53 PM | Link to this

well everyone can watch the hornets and only think of what might have really been. just think; paul, roy, smash, chills, jj, downright nasty.

myk, having heard one of the senior scouts at a sales event before the game friday we were given a chance to ask questions. i asked about anderson and the thoughts were; they like him, see him as complimentary to smash and horford because he is a big that doesnt have to stay under the basket to do his job where the two studs need to “camp out” (“my words”) to do his job, can score from the outside, he has a game similar to okur and are going to pursue him this season.

i am going to have to find time to go back and read some of the posts from the last segment, may take a while before i can come up for air.

By Horford Rox

May 5, 2008 11:53 PM | Link to this

Well said Najeh. Although I believe Acie could still learn a lot from Bibby, it would clear some cap space if Mike’s salary was off the books.

Who would you bring in to back up Acie?

Go HAWX!

By Daniel

May 5, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this

This team is built for D’Antoni basketball. Fire Woody but keep BK - might as well as he built the team and will appreciate the running game. I would rather get rid of both BK and Woody but as long as BK built it he might as well stick around. The coach is the mose econimical path to better play in my opinion. We might need a few extra pieces but we have some gems on the team (Salim) who will do great under D’Antoni’s system.

Just one simple change!

Sekou - what do you think? Would the players respond to that?

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this

MannyT, i also like what i see (in limited clips of course) from the AUSSIE kid…ANDERSEN. now is he a 4 or 5 or combo??? but the cat is nimble, nice touch and moves. the question is does he wanna bang???

if both JOSHes are re-signed and ANDERSEN is signed then the first thing i’d do is check out MB, JJ, JS, AH, and DA as a startin’ lineup to see what it brings!!! of course this is assumin’ we keep most of the cats already here.

By BosnianBaller

May 6, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this

Anderson is a 6’11 guy from cska moskva.shoots outside jumpers.a solid player.he is treated like a king in moscow.I heard his apartment over there is bomb proof.not that anybody is trying to get at him it’s just that they treat him like a king.cska has a payroll as big as some nba teams.tranjon langdon also plays there

By ray

May 6, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this

Ah yes, funny how so many thought San Antonio’s run would finally be cut short by their nemesis, the Phoenix Suns. Well, it looks more like that will happen at the hands of none other than the New Orleans Hornets, if things keep going the way they are.

And who is at the head of it all? Byron Scott and Chris Paul. Paul had 30 points and 12 assists against the legendary Spurs. Another blowout. Wow. Gosh, good thing we drafted Marvin instead. His upside is clearly higher…..

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this

my bad on the double post…

By O'brien

May 6, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this

3 years ago, these Hornets won 18 games. And look at them now. First of all, they have Chris Paul (30 pts, 12 assists tonight). Second, when the get a rebound, they look for Chris Paul (Smoove anyone), 3rd, they have a well defined/balanced team. PG in Paul, low post presence in Chandler and West, shooters in Peja and Mo Peterson, and a bench, and of course, a really good coach. I hope the Hawks do whatever it takes to take the next step. And that includes “Fire Billy and Woody”.

By Ramon

May 6, 2008 12:25 AM | Link to this

Does anyone know about the recovery of Etan Thomas?? Although he missed the year, I still love his game. And think he could be a good banger off the bench to go with Zaza.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 6, 2008 12:34 AM | Link to this

“Who would you bring in to back up Acie?”

Chris Duhon’s contract is expiring and apparently he’s not gonna be re-signed. He’s a career 35% 3-point shooter, has always posted a good assist/turnover ratio, and from what I’ve seen is a pretty smart player and a good defender. I think he’d make a fine backup PG and would probably not come at a very expensive price seeing as how he is coming off an off year. I’m sure there are other options too… someone mentioned Earl Watson who I also like. But Duhon is one guy who immediately came to mind.

By doc

May 6, 2008 12:35 AM | Link to this

if the american dollar keeps going in the direction it is we might see more players deciding to go euro or to stay in europe rather than play in the us of a. it is a serious problem in getting young hockey stars to com because they have to accept a salary cut to make the bucks in the us. anderson is well thought of in europe and by the announcers he is a player deserving of the distinction. he might prefer the money in the us but if it is not significantly more why bother?

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 6, 2008 12:41 AM | Link to this

Etan’s a nice rebounder and banger but he has 2 years left on his Wizards contract and is pretty overpaid considering his offensive skills (or lack thereof). There are probably equally good big man options available who are not paid nearly as much.

I gotta co-sign other folks’ comments about the Hornets. CP3 (my pick for MVP, no disrespect Kobe) and Byron Scott really have that team playing out of their minds. Peja Stojakovic should buy CP3 a new car or something for resurrecting his career. I wasn’t the biggest CP3 fan when he came out of college — I wanted the Hawks to pick a Williams in ‘05 but it was Deron, not Marvin — but CP3 has really grown on me.

By DecDawg

May 6, 2008 12:43 AM | Link to this

I’m just trying to understand why anyone would say that Woodson deserves a new contract. This is the same guy who HAS NOT installed an offensive or defensive system in FOUR YEARS. Do some of you really believe that if given a new contract, Woody would finally install something in his 5th year?

One thing that’s obvious from attending and watching games all year is that NO ONE (including the players) knows what our purpose is on offense or defense. They run two plays…both for JJ and if he doesn’t have an opening, he’ll pass the ball with 7 seconds on the shot clock and whoever ends up with the hot potato…excuse me, ball when clock is about to expire gets to shoot.

We are not effective in a half court offense or defense. The coach has to take the responsibility for this. I really hope he lands as an assistant somewhere because I would hate for the man to be unemployed but this situation is not working.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 6, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this

Doc, the highest paid Euroleague player is Sarunas Jasikevicius, getting paid 4.2 million Euros per year. David Andersen is 9th at 1.8 million. Euros are worth more than dollars but the NBA’s highest paid is easily worth more than the Euroleague’s highest paid. I don’t see an immediate future where American ballers go overseas to get paid more even despite the currency difference. At the end of the day the number of dollars an NBA player gets paid is still way more than the number of Euros a Euroleague player gets paid. But it does make sense that a guy like Andersen, who is a star there but probably a bench player here, wouldn’t want to make the trip across the pond.

By Ken Strickland

May 6, 2008 12:45 AM | Link to this

I did a little research and was supprised at what I found. Joe Johnson’s $13.49M salary places him 2nd behind Bibby’s $13.98M. SClaxton’s salary is $6.3M. If we do a sign and trade with Bibby and Speedy’s contracts, we can resign both Joshes and make a serious offer for Calderon(currently $2.47M) as well, if we add our cap space. If we load our offer sheet to Toronto for Calderon, like we did with JJ, it could initiate a sign and trade. That’s where JSmith, and Speedy’s contract, come into play.

We should also consider trading with Portland for(C)Przybilla, who is a glass eating center with 8.4RPG and 1.2BPG. His salary is $5.76M and he could be expendable when Oden returns. A starting lineup of PG JCalderon, SG JJ, SF MWilliams, SF AHorford and C JPrzybilla with a bench of C’s Zaza and Solomon, PG Acie, SG/SF Richardson, SG/SF West and SG/SF/PG Chills would be a very formidable team.

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 12:51 AM | Link to this

Just a bit of PAIN reality…if you dump both BK & Woody to start clean, that leaves you with the ASG to find a GM to negotiate on the fly while finding a new coach. How likely is it that you get 2 good RFA contracts done, a good coach, and add pieces w/o draft picks that will contribute?

Your just begging to bend over and Shawshank yourself…if you know what I mean.

Najeh, Horford Rox, ray just keep in mind that you probably get players back if you trade Bibby. First you have to settle the coaching situation. If the coach won’t play an inexperienced PG, AC gets jobbed. Depending on who you get for Bibby, that’s likely where you get another PG. If not, and the situation is right, go get Duhon.

Malone the Hawks have David Andersen’s NBA rights. He was in the Euroleague finals in the 6 degrees of separation championship playing against Esteban Batista & Will Bynum.

I think Andersen can contribute, but I don’t know if he starts. Cenk Akyol probably isn’t a factor this off season.

Not to put too much PAIN into the mix, but JRich, MWest, Salim (likely) can all walk as free agents.

If you allow me to Atlanta Dream for a moment…focus…

What if Rocky Pachulia toughens up for his contract year. That allows him to be a more likely starter than Andersen. Horford at the 4 and y’all can debate the SF all season depending on who is here and ready to roll in the fall.

I do enjoy the TNT show. Those guys are a blast! I need to sleep, but I want to see what they do with that trampoline and fire ring.

CRAP

By doc

May 6, 2008 1:05 AM | Link to this

najeh not yet but fringe or role players may be harder to come by to fill out rosters and the quality will go down. the comments were specifically to the situation of anderson being the savior that some folks want. multiply that 1.8 mil by 1.45 and that is the minimum the hawks have to pay and that wont include the chauffuer and bomb proof home he lives in as as a perk. i dont know if this organization is going to put 3 to 4 mil out there to bait him to come here as a back up. if they are sure he is a starter or a player for signficant minutes alongside of smash and horford then go for it. can they make the decision without billy who they say has been TOTALLY in charge of ALL DECISIONS or is their collective ego strong enough to think they can do it without a gm ….. stay tuned?

By cp

May 6, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this

Great blog Sekou. Good points made by everyone on here. I think a lot of us were wondering why they didn’t lock up Smith and Chill when they had a chance and the price tag was a lot lower. I will not be shocked to see this D.A.S.G. (thanks Najeh) sit on their hands and wait till the last minute to do anything. I really wish we had one owner who cared about winning.

As I said in the last blog, I love Calderons game but Toronto is not going to let him go. With Ford’s injury history and salary they would rather ship Ford and keep Calderon who is a better pure pg although I like Ford’s game. A guy that has been mentioned by a lot of people on here who I think would be a good fit is Peitrus. He is a good defender, can hit the 3, and finishes well at the rim. The thing is would you rather have him or Chill. I don’t know if you would have both..

Yea watching Chris Paul is exciting as a fan but frustrating as a Hawks fan. I really hope Marvin gets in the gym this summer and works and works. I think they will move Bibby because of his contract. I dont know what he could get us in return but I think that his expiring contract is very valuable. Hopefully we dont have a summer where we do nothing to improve this team but with this front office you never know.

By bp

May 6, 2008 3:43 AM | Link to this

What is the word on a coaching decision? Have ASG made any statements?

By kirknga

May 6, 2008 4:03 AM | Link to this

As someone said on another thread, there is more than one way to build a contender.

Boston had some young “core” players people were excited about and they chose to use them as pieces of trades for veterans and you see the results.

I don’t think D’Antoni would work here because we don’t have Steve Nash, and we don’t have players who shoot well. Phoneix does run, but they make their shots from all ranges as well.

If you have players who shoot well it does not matter much what offensive system you run so long as it gets players open. If the Hawks shot 5-6% better, we aren’t talking about firing the coach.

At least now people are interested in the what the Hawks do. They should make bold and cold hard basketball decisions based on whatever style of team they want to have. That means trading Smith if it brings back a player(s) that makes the team better.

As much as I like the guy, I do not believe Josh Smith is worth a max contract now nor will he be in the future.

By richbrave

May 6, 2008 6:19 AM | Link to this

Chills is one knee injury removed from ordinary. Without his fantastic rebounding and abilities at the rim, you can’t keep him. And in the NBA its bound to happen. Sooner rather than later. Sign and trade for some serious help for HORFORD, or a 1st round pick from Seattle.

By Raptors fan in TO

May 6, 2008 7:51 AM | Link to this

Horford Rox: CB4 has been playing out of position most of the year with Toronto, so you need not worry about him playing C if he came to Atlanta. And that is a BIG ‘if’. As am American raised and schooled down south, he’d probably want to go back no doubt. But based on his comments after Orlando beat us —- and he rarely says much —- he only wants to be on a team that will contend. That means in order to get him, the Hawks have to show the following:

1). They are taking big steps to building a winner. That means agressive deals and signing.

2). They are completely free of lame-duck coaching and management. Bosh had to suffer through mediocre GMs and coaches in Toronto before Mitchell/Colangelo steadied the ship. Given the way some of you are calling for BK and Woodson’s heads, that needs to be addressed.

3). The coach has to have a solid system in place. And Bosh plays best in a half court set.

4). He is the no. 1 guy and calls the shots in the locker room, period. Bosh is not an ego-maniac (actually he is refreshingly humble), but he was also counted on to be a leader from day 1, and every other Toronto player checks their ego at the door when it comes to him. Can Bibby/Johnson co-exist with this?

5). You need to lure Calderon or Ford to join him.

That of course, if Colangelo even entertains the idea, which is another big if.

By travis

May 6, 2008 8:08 AM | Link to this

i hear alot of you split down the middle as far as what should happen to either gm or coach. you have to get rid of both, because their philosphies don’t match. billy has stocked the team with young, athletic runners, but woody, due to his bobby knight days at indy and coaching with larry brown, has a half court mentality.

if you must keep one, keep billy. he did pick this team and every one in the league talks about how young and athletic we are, so give him props on that. woody just can’t coach these guys up. he takes things personal with these guys. salim must have made a pass at one of his daughters because i don’t understand why he leaves him on the bench so long

By ray

May 6, 2008 8:24 AM | Link to this

Najeh, it was me that mentioned Earl Watson. I’d go for Duhon as well. Forgot about his contract status and the fact that he probably isn’t going to remain in Chicago (although the coaching situation is most likely going to affect his decision). I’d take him in a heartbeat: solid on offense and defense. His struggles have really only been a result of playing in a “midget” backcourt with either Hinrich or Gordon.

MannyT, already thought of that. Trading Bibby most likely means getting players back, unless a fairly decent pick is involved, and I don’t see that being the case (and depending on the pick…probably not the smartest of moves, because that’s a rook coming in…not a vet). Nope, players are more likely. But needs to be either players that are useful to the team or useful as assets to leverage something we need.

David Andersen is a question mark. Watched him play. I’m sure he wouldn’t mind shooting some jumpers for us, but does he want to come here? Euro players are usually difficult to come by if they’re any good and aren’t all revved up to come to the NBA. The biggest problem is usually their current contracts (can you say buyout?). We’ll see. Question is how well does his game work with ours. And depending on the coach, what exactly is our game?

Starting over with new GM and coach (or either one) is a risky, scary thing. But nothing compared to continuing with the same two guys. Doing nothing out of fear of change is foolhardy at best. I won’t say what it is at worst. It will speak for itself if it happens.

By oldmike

May 6, 2008 8:25 AM | Link to this

A co-worker opined that since the Hawks had shown improvement in each of Woodson’s 4 years ownership would be hard pressed to not extend him. All fine and dandy. But. I think this squad could have done far better under anothers’ tutelege. And as my son said the game 7 performance in and of itself should get Woody non-extended. Watching Hornets and Magic it’s amazing what shooters do to a defense. If the Hawks had established any of their role players (Salim, Richardson) we might have been able to open up the floor and get better looks. At some point you have to be able to make a shot. MWilliams is willing but not able. And Woody killed his starters with burdensome minutes all year. All I can hope for is any sense of direction for this team. Most of what they need is in place to make a decent run over the next 4-5 years. But that would take an engaged ownership team. Is the ASG capable?

By Matt

May 6, 2008 9:00 AM | Link to this

Ray,

I think I read at some point that Andersen’s contract expires at the end of the current Euro season. Thus, no buyout would be necessary - which is, I assume, why Knight expressed an interest in bringing him over this summer.

By RB

May 6, 2008 9:24 AM | Link to this

Once the court decides the owner, then the owners can decide the GM, who can then decide the coach. At that time the fans can decide if they want to pay the increased price for this product. Marvin Williams over Chris Paul, OUCH!!!!!

By Hawks fan

May 6, 2008 9:37 AM | Link to this

Hawks should still look for a pg. Unfortunately, I don’t think MB is the player he used to be anymore. JJ is the only consistent player in this team. If JJ had someone like AI or CP with him in Boston in game 7, the result would have been different.

By Hawks fan

May 6, 2008 9:38 AM | Link to this

Hawks should still look for a pg. Unfortunately, I don’t think MB is the player he used to be anymore. JJ is the only consistent player in this team. If JJ had someone like AI or CP with him in Boston in game 7, the result would have been different.

By Sautee

May 6, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this

Najeh

Excellent points. I’ve been in Acie’s camp all along (as many here will attest) and I could certainly live with a Duhon/Law combo at the 1.

I WOULD, however like to see Acie extend his range a little. If he could consistently knock down 3’s, with his penetrating ability, he’d be a load. And I think that will happen.

By GT80

May 6, 2008 10:29 AM | Link to this

The very first thing that needs to be done is cutting loose Billy Knightmare. How can anyone think this guy is the GM to take us to the next level. I don’t thing we have to go back and repeat all the screw ups he’s made in the draft, in free agent signings, in not resigning the Josh’s yet. Get a new GM and let him weigh in on the head coach.

Now, any ideas out there of who the new GM should/could be? Sekou?

By ray

May 6, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

Matt, I didn’t know that. Well, that’s one thing out of the way….

Sautee, it can happen. Proper coaching is needed, of course. I’d like that more than paying Bibby a ton of cash to be an occasionally healthy, occasionally offensively brilliant, and nearly always defensively crappy.

Waiting for something to happen. But that’s like waiting for 9 cooks to decide on how to cook the main course. I hate this….

By doc

May 6, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

the longer the wait the more it says about BASG not the relative worth of woody or bk. plenty positive and plenty negative can be said about either one. havent we all discussed that ad nauseum? that is not the issue. the issue is decisiveness of management to have their plan ready to move forward. if they are not gong to keep either one that is an easy decision, waiting only makes it more difficult to make the next right decision. if they delay an then make a move it only shows how unprepared this group is to make any moves at all. right now it isnt as much the what of the decision as to when of the decision. procrastination on this guarantees a poor outcome and further consternation from the remaining players and fans.

By doc

May 6, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

the longer the wait the more it says about BASG not the relative worth of woody or bk. plenty positive and plenty negative can be said about either one. havent we all discussed that ad nauseum? that is not the issue. the issue is decisiveness of management to have their plan ready to move forward. if they are not gong to keep either one that is an easy decision, waiting only makes it more difficult to make the next right decision. if they delay an then make a move it only shows how unprepared this group is to make any moves at all. right now it isnt as much the what of the decision as to when of the decision. procrastination on this guarantees a poor outcome and further consternation from the remaining players and fans.

By Dark Karma

May 6, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this

Mike D’Antoni is a player-friendly coach who does better with teams that have several veterans and are easily self-policed. So it says in a Hoops Hype article. So Mike D’Antoni = not a good fit for this team. Joe Johnson himself feels like this team is not self-policed, although one would wonder why then it is that he supports the coach, the very person who should be policing this team. Joe begins to sound like a teacher’s pet. Only he and Mike Bibby listen to the coach. But then, why would Bibby not listen to the coach. After all, the coach lets him do as he pleases, and said as much. Another teacher’s pet. What a ridiculous organization this is that allows such grade school foolishness. Get rid of that imbecile of a coach.

The GM should be fired. One reason alone should be enough to fire him, and that is refusing to draft point guard Chris Paul. This young man is clearly the best to come along in a long time. A backcourt involving him and shooting guard Joe Johnson would be the most prolific in the NBA, let alone the eastern conference. Any cheaper frontcourt could play along with the strengths of these two. The New Orleans roster is a perfect example of this. Instead, the GM picked another forward, of which he already had three. A forward who is no better than average on a good day. A man who has far more hindquarters than he does heart.

The second reason for firig the GM is also a glaring gaffe. When picking a combo guard or even yet another small forward was clearly the better option, the man chooses a clumsy, mal-adjusted career back up power forward high in the lottery, to play center in the NBA. What utter foolishness. This high pick is now not even able to get playing time behind other average players on a bad team. That was an entirely wasted pick. The GM is clearly also an imbecile.

His drafts have been convoluted, confusing, and stupid. Now the team is forced to choose between forwards, while still missing many of the parts that could have been filled in the draft without the need for free agency or trade. On top of that, his free agency and trade efforts have been both dismal and deluded. Thirty million dollars for a man who was historically an injury magnet. A man who has probably not played more than a half season’s worth of games in two or three years. And then there was the supposed veteran center. This fool hasn’t been worth anything since he left the L.A. Clippers.

And so many think this is the man to bring this team into the next level. The next level of struggling mediocrity, I suppose. What a goal to have. Keeping the GM here is a committment to such things. The man once laughed at the idea of needing a point guard on an NBA team. This is yet another stand-alone reason not to employ this ridiculous, idiotic, buffoon. He gives insult to the name of fool.

By Melvin

May 6, 2008 11:08 AM | Link to this

I see many bloggers are blasting the Hawks repeatly for not picking Chris Paul (rightfully so). However, do you all think the Bucks are jumping for joy with the Bogut Pick. Maybe Utah is scratching their heads as well (no disrespect to Deron b/c I like him two). Why are the Hawks the only team catching heat for not drafting CP3? There were two other teams that could have pick him as well. What’s done is done. CP3 is not and will not be a Hawk.

By richbrave

May 6, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this

AGAIN, nothing significant can happen until the ASG gets their sheet togetner. All these financial decisions about GM and COACH, about signing players, acquiring new blood, improve the team will continue to be done on a haphazard, emergency-crisis basis until the ASG ownership is settled. How can you smoothly run the HAWKS with fundamental financial questions regarding ownership constantly unresolved??

By Horford Rox

May 6, 2008 11:27 AM | Link to this

Toronto fan, good post. I’m no expert, but there’s absoulutely NO CHANCE the Raptors would entertain a deal involving CB4 AND Calderon or Ford. Hawx have a good core, but that would require some SERIOUS compensation. Just for Bosh, the price will be huge. (Don’t know how to make it fit under cap, either).

I don’t know who would be the right choice as new coach, if Woody is fired. There have been some good opinions posted, though.

If BK is gone, who replaces him? I don’t like some of his moves, but…I WAS of the belief that both Joshes would be busts. I WAS WRONG! I can live with that.

Mgmt does need to act fast and prove to ALL OF US and most importantly, the current Hawx players that they are financially committed to winning some rings! JJ is practically begging for some additional veteran leadership. CB4 fits that mold and YES, wants to be back in ATL. (No 1st Rd Pick this year does complicate the matter a bit).

Like I said on Bradley’s G7 blog….To mgmt: GET IT DONE!!

Go HAWX!!!!!!!!!

By Horford Rox

May 6, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this

Hawx were afraid to draft CP3 b/c he punched a man’s stones while playing for WF. It turned out to be nothing but “1 isolated incident.” Therefore, this is NOT a good enough reason. CP3 ROX!!

That being said, they don’t disapprove of Horford’s physicality… or Marvin’s newly found fire! (I don’t either).

Yo mgmt: GET SOMETHING DONE!!

Go HAWX!

By doc

May 6, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this

melvin, for that draft you are missing the fact the bucks had their guard tandem at the time of the draft that year and have kept it intact, mo and redd, no? they were in need desperately of a forward or a big. the bucks were the team with the decision to make not the hawks between a big or a forward as they had neither for the future. the hawks took the foolish gold between a forward and a point guard which the latter was clearly the bigger need as there was not a big left in that draft unless bynum was just cant remember if it was that year.

i can say i was not objecting to it if they thought williams was clearly going to fill in for what they had in harrington by the time al was headed out the door. if acie develops to be in that class then fine, it works out in the end as a was acie ultimately. it only set the team back and income in by about two years. not a good investment.

By Horford Rox

May 6, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

Good point richbrave.

By Dark Karma

May 6, 2008 11:48 AM | Link to this

No other team needed a dynamic point guard as desperately as Atlanta. Milwaukee had T.J. Ford, then Mo Williams. Adding a good center is always a good bet. Bogut may not be a bonafide star, but he is more than solid. Being decent at point guard is reason to now solidify center. Look at the teams who passed on Chris Paul and you will see that only Atlanta’s GM was without a doubt an utter fool in not picking such a man as Chris Paul. Utah is well pleased with Deron Williams. His production results are nothing to have contempt for. The team is successful, and will be for years to come.

Chris Paul will never be a member of this team, true. But that is not the point. Many say that what is done is done. Few realize how much we will suffer because of it. It is not over, because we continue to suffer for such unbelievable blindness. Have we not suffered already? We have suffered through the extreme inadequacies of Craig Claxton, Tyronn Lue, Anthony Johnson, and Mike Bibby. How many dollars have gone to waste to try and make up for the one largest mistake? The one possible solution that may begin to rectify but never truly make up for this lies in Acie Law. And yet, this is not possible while the imbecile of a coach continues to treat this young talent like a red-headed stepchild. He does not even attempt to develop and instill confidence in the young man. He does not play him, claiming that all those who do not play, do not do so because they are not ready. Perhaps this coach should apply such philosophies to his job. He is clearly not ready to coach, so he should not be allowed to. All of this, and this is who the genius of a GM picked to lead this team. If such things were ever to be considered criminal acts, both men would be serving life sentences.

By SSI Fan

May 6, 2008 12:05 PM | Link to this

The hawks continue to be hamstrung by the ownership situation. What quality general manager or coach would come to Atlanta not knowing whether Belkin or the non-Belkin group owns the team a year from now. Unless ALL the owners agree I don’t think the team can sign a coach or player to a long term contract.

It is easy for we fans to say sign the Joshes, but the reality is the ASG is losing at least 20 million dollars each year, and remember that Belkin now has no obligation to contribute to the operating losses. If your payments were more than your income every month would you go out and incur more debt so that your monthly deficit was even higher? That’s what happens right before people file for bankruptcy.

By Dark Karma

May 6, 2008 12:05 PM | Link to this

Marvin has no fire. He is best used as a trade piece or by coming off of the bench. A trade piece is preferrable, as he either gets in the way of Alfred Horford moving to power forward or Joshua Smith moving to small forward. He is also proof that Dominique Wilkins is not be listened to when it comes to player evaluation. Dominique Wilkins is on record as saying that a player like Marvin Williams comes only once every ten years. I think not. More proof that being able to play the game once upon a time does not mean being able to evaluate talent. Michael Jordan is also proof of this. He thought Adam Morrison would be the next Larry Bird. How ridiculous.

Acie Law is a possible solution with more skill than he has shown in his first season. Unfortunately, his current coach follows the path of his mentor in regard to point guards. Larry Brown excelled at breaking point guards down and building them into something special. He positively influenced both Allen Iverson and Chauncey Billups. However, his protege Mike Woodson is only good at breaking players down. He knows next to nothing of building them up. He is a directionless task master who does not know his trade. He is useless to this organization. His role is clearly that of top lackey to any head coach, not head coach itself. To be rid of him is likened to removing a cancerous growth from the body. To be rid of the GM is likened to being rid of a surgeon who could not recognize a cancerous growth when seen.

There is no doubt that several fools that call themselves owners are the architects of such insanity. One could only hope that some sort of financial disaster would force them to sell the franchise in order to maintain their individual lives. Else this futility shall continue, for no tiger changes it stripes, nor does a leopard cast off its spots.

By Ryder

May 6, 2008 12:18 PM | Link to this

Sekou I see you working on this issue, however I don’t think anything will happen due to the ASG mess. That issue is bigger than people think, and since it won’t be resolved until February at the earliest, you’re looking at them signing Woodson to a one year deal. Same with BK.

I see the Joshes signing for one year deals as well, knowing they could be unrestricted the year after.

Once those deals are done, take a look at the contract status of the major players on the Hawks in summer 2009.

Josh Smith/Childress (unrestricted) Marvin Williams (restricted FA) Zaza Pachuila (unrestricted) Joe Johnson (entering final year) Mike Bibby (unrestricted)

The major issue will be if they can get a center at the mid-level exception.

That said, the Hawks’ front office is going to have a lot to prove to the fans that they are serious about winning.

But don’t hold your breath, we’ll revisit this issue again 12 months from now.

By HawkHeat

May 6, 2008 12:28 PM | Link to this

I agree Marvin Williams does have a new fire to him. But instead of trying to bring that fire to next year you use that as a reason to trade him. A lot of teams would look at Marvin William’s post season spurt of enthusiasm and talent and use that as a good reason to take him. Everyone in this city agrees that what Atlanta needs right now is a center. If we get a center we throw him down on 5 and put Al at 4 where he belongs. With Bibby, Johnson, and Smith as our obvious starting 1,2,3, where does that leave Marvin? Do you take Marvin and move Chilldress down to a 7 man? No Childress has proved throughout the year that he is a phenomenal 6 man but no other team would want him. Teams want Williams and he would be a very good building block for our Hawks to trade and get a real center. Not a big swull power forward playing center. Josh Smith needs to get his jump shot down and he can not do that as a 4.

By joejohnsonwtf

May 6, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

JJ You say you need veteran leadership. What are you there for? This guy shot 40% for the playoffs and never figured out a way to beat the trap by the Celtics. His idea of offense is him dribbling 24 seconds and shooting the ball. He made those shots in game 4. God bless him and missed them in every other game.Sorry, he did make the big three in game 6 which arguably was a luck shot over KG. Also, let’s stop saying he is a good defender. Woodson nor Johnson made any adjustments to the Celtics defense. They ran the same thing and Woodson did the same thing. LIKE HE ALWAYS DOES.

By Ken Strickland

May 6, 2008 1:08 PM | Link to this

The Hawks need to make a statement and go after a quality FA PG. We’ve had enough serviceable PG’s(Speedy, TLue, AJohnson, RIvey, etc, that didn’t work out). It’s time to elevate this team by securing a PG of the future, like Calderon. I know, a lot of you think he is untouchable and Toronto won’t let him go. But I beg to differ for the following reasons:

(1)He has to share the responsibility of running the team with TJ Ford, who has to play significant mins because Toronto has $8.2M invested in him.

(2)I have no doubt Calderon wants to be the man and run his own team, which is the main reason we ended up with JJ.

(3)I doubt Toronto would jump at the chance to sign Calderon to an $8-10M contract, which would commit more than $16-18M to a pair of PG’s. They’d likely do a sign and trade, and that’s where Speedy’s and/or Bibby’s expiring contracts come into play.

If we resign JSmith, Horford would have to continue playing center. If we don’t, we’d need to acquire a starting center, someone like Przybilla. When Oden returns, Portland will have a lot of money tied up in 5 players that are 6’11” or taller. Aldridge, Frye and Oden are young, athletic, versatile and less expensive than LeFranz and Przybilla. LeFranz’s salary is over $12M, which would make him much harder to trade. That would leave Przybilla as the odd man out.

With some astute moves, we can get everything we need to compete for a championship. Of course, that would entail getting rid of our albatross, currently serving as HC.

By SCOTTYMACK

May 6, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

First of all,congratulations on the HAWKS taking the CELTICS seven games.I was a very interesting series.A good wake up call for the CELTICS.

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 1:37 PM | Link to this

Ryder if everyone goes for the 1 year tender, this gets VERY interesting. Ypu, the Joshes could walk for nothing, but there is still a small chance of a sign & trade. Look at the salary structure, if you have slots for Josh, Josh, Zaza, & Bibby, a MAJOR free agent is within financial reach (especially if you don’t tender Marvin.) Not trying to bust up the team, but 2009 could be like a fantasy league. If it works, JJ re-ups the next season, if not—he’s gone.

I could tolerate Woody for a one season extension if there was a promise from the courts that the ownership questions would be resolved.

joejohnsonwtf I’ll be kind and say I strongly disagree with your assessment of JJ. TO say JJ is the part of this team that needs fixin, is like saying I wish Beyonce, Raquel Welch, etc were men.

JJ is the hardest working man in Hawksville. Also the best value (after Josh gets his new contract.)

Can you blame Joe for holding onto the ball if no one else moves on offense. That’s on Woody. Now if you pull a Cassell and just chuck it up regardless, then there is a fair concern.

PAIN

By Astro Joe

May 6, 2008 1:52 PM | Link to this

Ken Strickland, word is that TJ Ford is out and Calderon will stay. In fact, media and fans have come down hard on Ford and he likely will be kicked out of Canada as soon as they can work a deal.

I’m hoping Ford doesn’t end up in Orlando, because that would be really, really bad news for the Hawks (and other SE Division foes). If he stays commited to his rehab and stays healthy, I like his game and his passion more than what I’ve seen from Calderon. Ford seems to play with a sense of urgency that Calderon doesn’t yet have.

By SalimFan

May 6, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this

If jannero pargo is any indication, a guy like salim will land somewhere nicely on a REAL team with a REAL coach and no management poblems this offseason……yes i’m angry about the situation.

By SalimFan

May 6, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

Ford is not coming here. The last thing the hawks need is another speedy claxton. Besides you guys are all complaining about how you’re going to pay Bibby? Now you wanna pay (Injury-Prone) TJ (Not gonna be cheap) and he doesn’t even shoot threes? He’s baisically and over-priced Acie Law.

Calderon is just a younger Mike Bibby (sorry to burst your bubble).

Why would you get rid of an expensive PG just to sign another???

If Acie Law is going to be the guy (He Will Be) then he is going to need a backup. A cheap on who doesn’t command a starters sallary.

Sekou, Can I get a Stoudamire Interview? I wanna know what his plans are.

By fudd21

May 6, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

Ken Colangelo has already said that Calderon will be back in a Raptor uniform. He questioned whether Jose and TJ could coexist. (ESPN rumor mill Wednesday) Which to me says TJ is probably gone. SO as much as I would like to see Jose here, I don’t think it is going to happen.

I regards to trading Bibby, I would like to trade him and let AC take over but I’m not sure AC is ready. I think this year was to inconclusive to determine his game. However, unless we get another shooter on our team turning the reigns over to AC puts us right back where we were pre-Bibby with only one outside shooter.

I still say our top priority would be to get another shooter/scorer. We thought Bibby was filling that needed role as a shooter but he has been very inconsistent. Unless another shooter is brought in JJ still gets the double and triple teams.

By Melvin

May 6, 2008 2:21 PM | Link to this

Doc, I’m speaking from hindsight just like alot others on here. Recall, many draft experts projected Marvin as this player with tremendous upside. Yes, the Bucks did have TJ/Mo at the time. But If that Draft was tomorrow I bet they would draft Paul and trade/get rid of one those guys. Maybe even Utah would draft Paul if he’s still available at 3. Uh, that means Billy would pass on him again… lol

By cp

May 6, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this

If it wasn’t for Ford’s health issues I wouldn’t mind seeing him wear a Hawks uniform. I like his game but you never know when that next hard foul will force him to leave the game. Everyone is right, until this ownership steps up to the plate we will be talking about the same thing next year. I really wish we had 1 owner or that this group had their stuff together. I want to build on what we just did not take steps back.

By SalimFan

May 6, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this

Shooter!! SHOOTER!!!

I’ve had it!! I’m done. Somebody stick a fork in me.

By Raptors fan in TO

May 6, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

Ken: Astro Joe is correct. Like I said earlier, Ford is being unfairly villified as a ball hog by sports writers up here. Calderon, with a big ethnic Spanish following in Toronto, is like an adopted son here. Colangelo will give him whatever he wants or else there will be a lot of empty seats in the arena next season. But I can definitely see your point as to how Calderon would be a good addition to the Hawks if BK could pull it off.

Salim: so you think Calderon is a younger Mike Bibby? Well, Bibby was pretty good during his younger days with the Kings… but if you mean to say the two guards are comparable in value right now, I beg to differ with you.

As for injuries, Ford has been hurt, yes. But he has also bounced back from two neck injuries that would have retired most players. I would say he is worth a look from BK, before other stronger conference foes try to acquire him…

By Jeff D.

May 6, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this

1. Fire Billy Knight. He has been buying the groceries and the cookin hasn’t been good. If he was a baseball player he’s have a lot of strikeouts and no home runs. We need a guy like Dimitroff for the Hawks. A proven talent man. Knight has failed here.

2. Keep Woodson. Get him some help on the bench with quality veterans. The guy deserves more weapons which equals more wins. The young lions need some smart veterans for leadership and maturity.

3. Sign J-Chill and JSmoove. Do it. We have to keep the talent we have.

4. Show the fans some love. We really bought into these Hawks and most nights at the Highlight Factory are fun. Last Friday was amazing. Keep improving the team and the arena environment. Make us an offer we can’t refuse for 41 nights a year.

5. Get Dominique on the floor. Ah, the practice floor that is. He can work with these guys and share his moves and knowledge of the game. (I stole this from I.J. Rosenberg but it makes sense.) These guys need to improve to be their best.

6. Can the Hawks design a cool dark blue fitted hat with a simple Hawks logo on it? I wanted one all year.

7. And finally, I agree with you Sekou, the Hawks need to get their asses in gear and hop to it. We all want more of that feeling from Friday night.

By SalimFan

May 6, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

Younger Mike Bibby in a positive way as far as being a dead eye shooter and driving to the basket not being a strong suit.

Value wise no, but salary wise yes because of calderon’s expected salary next season. I’m not sure if it will be in the range of Bibby’s but it will be pricey.

As far as TJ, He’s not a strong peremeter shooter, which is what the hawks desperately need (Salim Stoudamarie……management sucks) we have slashers in Acie law, and Speedy if he ever gets healthy.

I personally think they should just let Acie go through his growing pains like CP3 and Deron Williams were allowed to go through theirs.

By Ken Strickland

May 6, 2008 4:25 PM | Link to this

If what you guys are saying about Toronto’s committment to Calderon is true, we should do what Detroit once did to us. After KWillis went down with a knee injury, Koncak took over his PF position and had a strong finish. Detroit then signed him to an offer sheet that was way too much. The Hawks panicked because Willis was missing rehab sessions and meetings in an attempt to force a renegotiation of his contract. They matched Koncaks offer sheet, which blewup our salary structure, and we’ve regretted it every since.

It’s funny how some people create excuses to justify their preferences. Like, we shouldn’t mess with Ford because he’s another Speedy waiting to happen. Well, so is Bibby. Someone even suggested we trade Chills because the was just a knee injury from becoming average. Couldn’t that same thing be said for JSmith, Horford, JJ, KBryant, etc. Look at what happened to Oden, and he didn’t get to play a single min.

Like I said before, I’d gladly take Ford and his $8.2M contract over Bibby’s inconsistency and $13.98M contract. Trading Bibby and taking the $5.78M salary difference and adding it to JSmiths current $2.2M salary($7.98M subtotal), plus Speedy’s $6.3M($14.28M total)expiring contract, could allow us to resign both Joshes without increasing our current payroll. We certainly have enough cap space to absorb a $5.76M contract like Przybilla’s.

Acie hasn’t reached the level needed to consistently lead this team over the course of a season. For that, I blame Woodson. He was more concerned with himself and addressing his own issues than trying to develop players, especially our PG of the future.

By JB

May 6, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

Amen, Jeff. Amen.

I’d prefer to see if they can mediate a truce between Knight and Woodson, but, if someone has to go it has to be Knight! Otherwise, I think Jeff has hit the nail on the head!!!

By ET

May 6, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

“But I want to believe that someone has a detailed plan of action in place long before now as to how the franchise plans to proceed from here.”

If you’ve watched this team for four years then you have to know that no plan is in place. I don’t think anybody knows who is piloting the ship much less where it is going. To wait until the trade deadline this year to finally get a serviceable point guard shows you that the GM doesn’t have a plan. Plus waiting until you actually get that point guard to try to fire the head coach proves my point even more.

Billy didn’t want Woody to win with the new point guard because he knew that it would be harder to fire him when they made the playoffs, so he chose to get rid of him before that happened. The owners, as clueless as they are, even saw that for what it was.

Then you’ve got the ownership group, or as I like to call them, “The Gang Who Can’t Shoot Straight”. Except for refusing to let Billy fire Woody at the most inopportune time, they haven’t done one thing that shows me they have a plan. They don’t even know which one supposed to pick his nose next.

By SalimFan

May 6, 2008 4:59 PM | Link to this

T.J doesn’t shoot threes. awks need peremeter shooting.

All of the great guards were thrown into the fire. Once a bench PG, always a bench PG. He’s never going to learn how to handle he pressures o being a starting PG from the bench.

By Sautee

May 6, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this

doc

I’ll be damned!

Just for amusement, I went back and checked the archive of this blog after last year’s draft. I wanted to see what the reaction from the regulars was.

I found an entry from you that I had obviously missed or I would have responded back then. In it you mentioned growing up with Chuck Dowdle.

I was at Briarcliff with Dowdle in the 8th and 9th grades, and then went to Lakeside. Were you at Briarcliff then?

Email me off list at: estarleft@yahoo.com

By Dark Karma

May 6, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this

All brilliant thoughts. None of which will be considered or employed. Billy Knight’s idea of creativity and cleverness more often than not include nothing more exciting than the acquisition of an expiring contract in exchange for other, lesser expiring contracts. How very exciting. This is what a rebuilding franchise does, not what a building franchise does. Billy Knight has once again proven that his grand plan is merely a continuing rebuilding project. His incredible gaffes are both cause and effect of the organization’s inability to rise significantly above a certain level. Making the playoffs was an accident and indirect result in a race that depended on what Atlanta’s opponents did. This team was unable to determine its own destiny, though that can be attributed to the idiocy of the coach among other things.

By kevin

May 6, 2008 5:32 PM | Link to this

Bibby to portland is the only trade that is sitting there for the hawks. Portland needs a vet point that can shoot outside. They have another expiring contract ofr a big that they do not need ( raef Lafrentz ) and jarrett jack who could team with Acie to form a good 1-2 punch. Portland has a glut of picks that they do not have room to sign as they already are short on slots to bring over sergio from spain.

mike bibby in exchange for raef lafrentz, jarrett jack and 3 2nd rd picks gives you depth, very little drop at point and still an expiring contract you can move. I think raef is an upgrade from pachulia. This would also leave pachulia to package with marvin Williams ( can any one say mike miller and hakim warrick ) to memphis. This would fill your team up with extra shooters, not take on any albatross contracts and still leave you room to sign the joshes. Memphis get talent and relief from longer term contracts and portland gets a vet point to lead a very talented group of young players.

By Malone

May 6, 2008 5:45 PM | Link to this

I would love to get Jarrett Jack and Raef and 3 2nd rounders for Bibby. Sounds smart to me.

I think ownership is more to blame than BK. Keep BK, get a new coach who can maximize the obvious talent we have… that is a result of BK.

By Dark Karma

May 6, 2008 5:59 PM | Link to this

There shall be no truce between GM and head coach. What is lost is lost and to even say otherwise would surely be a lie.

Acie Law may never be the player that he can be if the current coach is allowed to stay. The man is not able to do anything for young players. They evolve despite him. The difference between Acie Law and players like Josh Smith and Marvin Williams is that the coach is not forced to play him, while he is forced to play the others. That is how they are able to develop what they have. If Acie Law was given the amount of time they have been given, then the team would be better off. Instead, he is forced to the bench behind whatever veteran point guard happens to be healthy and able to play, while being let out every now and again like a dog on a leash. This is what Mike Woodson does for the young players on this team. Small wonder that young veterans like Joe Johnson and Mike Bibby like him, while young players do not. And yet the young players drafted to this team have known no other head coach, and this convolutes their view. A change of coaches would enlighten them.

The owners of this team are more concerned with not losing in a business battle. Surely each has his own personal agenda, mocking the term of “ownership group.” One can only assume that none are equally financial to each other, making the stakes different for each person. This means that trust has to be hard to earn and maintain. Anything agreed upon would have different levels of consequence for each person. Small wonder that decisiveness is rare commodity among these men.

One can only imagine why it is that David Stern has allowed this farce to begin its existence, much less continue it.

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 6:07 PM | Link to this

We are all one major slip in the shower away from brain damage. Don’t y’all go bohemian hippie on me to save your minds. Then again some may have already had that tumble ;-)

Everyone has injury risk, that’s why actuaries are paid so well. Sometimes you have to take a chance. Especially when so many free agents have been begging to come here! LOL

JeffD & JB Are you saying that the groceries are no good, or that you don’t like the way they’re cooked?

I know CP3. Conceded-next point.

Resign the Joshes—sounds like good groceries. hmmm

We gave up 3 locker room vets (AJ, Lue, Wright) to get Bibby. Not a major loss on the court, but the type of guys you use for team leadership. Sure we need to get another guy or two like that, but you don’t get them after the All-Star Break unless you are a good shot at a ring parade like Boston or Detroit. Notice Sam the ring hound wasn’t getting out of Clipperland to come here.

The Hawks like everyone else have a budget. You don’t get Tough Juice if you can only afford BK Hater-Aid.

SWAG NOTES richbrave do you have a Tough Juice T?

Back to the BK haters…

What responsibility do you put on Woody? Skip the records in past seasons. Just limit it to the fact that his core has been growing for a few seasons. This season he committed to running in October. I think he misremembered that deal 90% of the time.

Offense—stagnant.

Bench development—limited.

Innovation—not at this station.

Maybe a light turned on during the playoffs. It was a fun ride in Philips…but what happened in Boston. The Hawks got 4 sessions of you look like Rodney King and I’ve had a bad day.

Blending this with a related thought…SalimFan et al do you believe or just hope that this team belongs to AC Law down the road. His first season might look a little worse than…uh…what’s his name-gotta love this link…uh oh.

Will Woody develop him or park his career under the bench bus…just thinking OUT LOUD.

Sorry folks, this one is all PAIN

By SB

May 6, 2008 6:14 PM | Link to this

Those of you who want to move J.Smith are crazy, he needs to be locked up long term. I’ve heard all the exscusses, he dosn’t lissen to Woody, he needs to work on his jumper, he needs to work on his ball handling.. guy’s he will he’s 22. As far as Woody goes, every time you go to J.Smith in the post some thing good happens. All season he played well in the post, and woody didn’t go to him enough, in game 7 he went to Smith 1 time the whole game in the post and out of that one time came a double team and A wide open Johnson for three. If you’re the boss and you ask guys to work on something but yet you never use them, how much would you listen. My biggest problem with Woody is that the players have grown, but he has not grown with them.

By caz1158

May 6, 2008 6:20 PM | Link to this

Me,my thoughts are that the Hawks should keep Josh (but not at a max deal!),sign and trade Childress (good on “D”,but HORRIBLE on Offense). Maybe package him for a serviceable “1” or “5”. As for Woody & Knight,really I think both should go. Knight only believes that there is one type of player (6-8 and athletic),but a team needs more!!! Woody is an Ok coach, but he wont be able to take a team any farther than he did for this team ( he’s a good assistant coach). The Hawks need to address the main needs,and there are three glaring ones! A true point guard,a big man so Al can play the “4”,& another scorer to take the pressure off Mr. Johnson. Now the question is How to achieve this?

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 6:24 PM | Link to this

Dark Karma the real reason you have to resign the Joshes.

If they leave and learn that the grass is not only greener, but smells better, has more money, and a better environment to develop their games, they might tell Al, AC, Marvin, & Solo. What will we do then?

We caught a break because Shelden didn’t find better times until the end of the season. Check his April stats.

I’m not saying he was a great #5 pick, but it does look like he’s starting to find more success in Sactown than here.

It’s not like you look at the Sactown coaching staff and see a bunch of guys with long NBA coaching tenure.

Reality can be a PAIN

By glw

May 6, 2008 6:37 PM | Link to this

Without a doubt, this will be avery important offseason for the Hawks. They must also choose an identity, do they become an offesnive minded team that relies on its athleticsim to outscore people or do they make a commitment to becoming an all around team that relies on tough team defense and solid decision making. The problem is if they choose the latter, they dont really have the pieces. Bibby is an offensive minded pg, who helps you best by being a scorer. Josh Smith, is a freak of nature at forward and is best when he is out running.

I wish the Hawks would make a run at D’Antoni at Phoenix. I think his style would work well with our athletes. If that fails, I can live with Woodson for another year, but he needs to be kept on a short leash.

Josh Smith should definitely be resigned, should have been done last year.

I am kind of iffy about Josh Childress. He does a lot of the little things that your team needs…loose balls, off. rebounds, play multiple positions. But then you have Marvin Williams. I think either Marvin or Chills should be moved. I think you need to add another shooter. Mike MIller or Jarvis Hayes type who can loosen up defenses who try to gang up on Joe. We knock Josh Smith for taking jump shots, but if u ever notice, he did seem more willing to take one than Childress and Williams were. With another shooter added to the wing, that might inspire Josh to become the slasher/ scorer that he needs to be.

As far as a backup Center, I think ZAza gave a good account of himself in the playoffs. If he carries that toughness over to next year I am happy. Centers are hard to come by, maybe add a guy that can give you 15-20 minutes a game would be ideal, but forget Lafrentz, he is awful!!!

By SB

May 6, 2008 6:41 PM | Link to this

If I’m Hawks brass, I would probably let both of them walk( Billy&Woody). Locking up Smith and Chill’s(if affoardable)long term would be the priority. If I could move Marvin for a draft pick high enough to draft D.Rose I would. I’d go hard after a starting center( Diop, Pryz, Okafor), moving Al to power forward, and Smith to small forward. Talk to A. Johnson, P.Silas, and J.V. about coaching this team. I’d keep Bibby around so that my young point gaurd can learn from him. My rotaion Starters PG-Bibby, SG-J.Johnson, SF-J.Smith, PF-A.Horford, C-Diop(Pryz or Okafur). Sub’s D.Rose(or A.C.Law),S.Stodamire, J.Childress, S.Jones and ZaZa.

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 6:43 PM | Link to this

MannyT, thanks for that SHELDEN post. i said, under THEUS, if given the minutes, he’d become a 10/6 guy. looks like his APR stats are comin’ close!!! mark my word!!! he wasn’t the best pick, no doubt. but he suffered under WOODSON!!

all this BIBBY trade talk is givin’ me a headache!!!LOL we get a legit 2nd scorer, the cat plays injured the first 2 or 3 weeks, has bad games up in BOS, and suddenly he’s run outta town. like i said previously, you think JJ went off at the start of last season in the article…if BIBBY goes, watch JJ’s rant!!! and i’m out ‘til order is restored!!!

kevin, your POR trade is the ONLY one that makes sense if BIBBY is moved!!! but to me, it’s all about signin’ the JOSHes, bringin’ a legit 5, movin’ MARVIN to the bench, and rollin’ with that for this next year!!! if BK is kept, then this team will NOT be blown up like some want. IMHO, in BK’s mind, he’s a 5 away from havin’ what he wants!!!

By Raptor fan in TO

May 6, 2008 6:49 PM | Link to this

That’s cool, Salim, and I hear your concern about TJ’s shooting range. But remember that a trade can be worked out for someone else too —- Toronto is loaded with outside shooting and if we get some more defensive help, we might also be willing to part with one of those guys (say a Delfino or Moon). We need a defensively strong, rebounding SF THAT badly

By Don!

May 6, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this

Can we fire Woody now?

That’s all I want. Okay, I want the Joshes resigned. And then Woody fired. I wouldn’t mind if we went ahead and signed Marvin to an extension like we should have last year with the Joshes, and then firing Woody.

Another good idea would be seeing what’s available in the mid-to-late first round as far as serviceable bigs. From what I understand, a few franchises are willing to part with their pick for straight cash — money we could save by not paying Woody next year after he’s fired.

I also think we can ask Bibby what it would cost for a two or three year extension. We should also fire Woody.

I sincerely hope the Atlanta Spirit situation gets resolved soon, and then they can do all that fire Woody.

That’s all I want.

Later,

Don!

By Don!

May 6, 2008 6:59 PM | Link to this

Can we fire Woody now?

That’s all I want. Okay, I want the Joshes resigned. And then Woody fired. I wouldn’t mind if we went ahead and signed Marvin to an extension like we should have last year with the Joshes, and then firing Woody.

Another good idea would be seeing what’s available in the mid-to-late first round as far as serviceable bigs. From what I understand, a few franchises are willing to part with their pick for straight cash — money we could save by not paying Woody next year after he’s fired.

I also think we can ask Bibby what it would cost for a two or three year extension. We should also fire Woody.

I sincerely hope the Atlanta Spirit situation gets resolved soon, and then they can do all that and then fire Woody.

That’s all I want.

Later,

Don!

By Ken Strickland

May 6, 2008 7:15 PM | Link to this

SALIM FAN-you’re right about Ford not shooting 3’s., but that’s not a problem. Salim and Richardson shoot 3’s very well, Woodson simply refused to utilize there skills. Even Chills shoots 3’s well when he’s open. Ford’s speed and quickness could create a lot of open shots for them.

We need a PG that can consistently push the ball, penetrate and create easy shots. Ford has the speed and quickness to be a one man fast break, much like Iverson and Parker. He could pressure the ball and help eliminate that 9PPG increase in points allowed we incured after Bibby’s arrival. He could also maintain, or increase, the corresponding 9PPG increase in scoring OFF Bibby’s acquisition created.

Acie needs at least another yr playing under a HC that gives a dam about his development. Woodson will forever be coaching to avoid getting fired and trying to prove he can be successful doing it his way. Bibby has lost a lot of his former quickness and speed. As we’ve all seen, he can be rattled when pressured by bigger PG’s. His loss of speed and quickness has him relying primarily on his outside shooting ability. Again, as we’ve seen, when his shot is off, he has a tendency to disappear. That’s the reason for his inconsistency. After all is said and done, I still like him and what he did for this team. But, we need to upgrade.

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 7:22 PM | Link to this

mykhalc glad to share the ongoing young players are better once they leave here theme. Just make sure the Joshes don’t read this ;-)

Imagine if Shelden had gotten minutes here defensively with the assignment to lay some biceps on anyone in the lane. Learn from LoWright how to hold shorts or whatever guys like Oakley did to get rebounds and keep other guys off the glass.

I’m not saying he was the man, but there was a way for him to contribute at certain times. If you are aggressive on the offensive end, no one plays 40 mins/night…so you needed the bench to keep up the pace.

I don’t mean to toss Bibby under the bus, but I do recognize that he has a big contract that expires in 2009. I’d listen to offers, but AC didn’t get the keys to the team often enough to let him drive solo in November.

The thing that I appreciate about Bibby is what doesn’t show up in fantasy leagues. Once you moved your other vets to get him, Josh Smith, Al & Bibby bring the fire/swagger/confidence to help the rest of the team. I’m weary of people telling JJ to be more vocal and act like the QB of a football team. He’s more of a Chipper Jones type…he produces, but doesn’t do all the yakking. That’s fine if there are others to do it when appropriate. Al & Josh are young, Bibby is the guy to speak up. TLue might have been filled this role before the trade.

Like someone mentioned a few blogs back, when JJ went off in game 3, it was Bibby still pumping him up in the post game press conference. I believe he called Joe a (expletive) assassin.

I’m glad he did it and I’m fine with him calling out the Boston fans. Less attention on the young fellas. Even though Bibby didn’t have a good series, I think we benefited early in the series from his comments. Guys like Reggie Miller & MJ could play and talk…that’s not JJ’s way. He needs a Bibby. If Bibby goes, another vet will need to fill the role of the assassin’s mouthpiece!

Compare Bibby’s fire to Woody’s pregame and halftime words. He could have been the Sarge on Hill St Blues. Let’s be careful out there. Real inspirational. I’m so fired up, I probably won’t slip in the shower and be brain dead by Thursday—which would impact my next blogger contract ;-)

CRAP

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 7:42 PM | Link to this

MannyT, i’m back ONLY because you make soooo much sense!!!LOL good post and great points!!! we’ve have SEEN for 4 yrs (pretty much) what happens when these young cats try to lead themselves!!! it does NOT work!!! BIBBY may not have been the ‘all everythin” that cats want but be brings/brought confidence, game, and a 2nd scorin’ option. BIBBY’s presence eased ‘some’ of the opponents pressure on JJ…PERIOD!!! that ONLY happened after his arrival. ACIE started to regained confidence in his game ONLY after BIBBY’s arrival!!!

HORFORD’s play elevated this team early and thru-out the year. BIBBY’s presence and play, despite what some say, elevated the confidence and play in this team late…PERIOD!!! and yeah, i saw the BOS series too!!!

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this

MannyT, also JJ became more vocal after BIBBY’s arrival. I remember one camera shot after a HAWKS turnover durin’ the BOS series where somebody FU’d, the camera was on JJ as he sat on the bench, and he was just startin’ to light into somebody’s a$$ before the cut to commercial. so JJ’s cry for ‘quality’ seasoned cats has at least been answered with the trade to get BIBBY.

right now, as i said, the PG position is in place for the next year…quality players too. we need to take care of the positions that are NOT solid, not create a hole that does not exist nor take away chemistry just established!!! BIBBY’s salary issue will and should be addressed when it NEEDS to be…next year…PERIOD!!!

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 8:12 PM | Link to this

Sekou Why is it that most of the AJC end of season clear out your locker pictures look like guys taking out their trash?

If it were trash, they would not be taking it out of the building.

I know there have to be some decent looking equipment bags that these guys can use. I’d rather see Santa’s long, lean helpers (with nice bags) than Atlanta tallest janitorial staff.

Just to show I am open to opinions with which I disagree, Hawksquawk has a thread on what makes Woody a better candidate for this job than the names that are floating out there.

Go get your Woody on!

CRAP

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 6, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this

What really stood out to me about those Shelden stats is that in increased playing time, presumably against starters instead of scrubs, he only managed one blocked shot the entire month of April.

For a guy nicknamed the Landlord, that is pretty pathetic.

I’m sure some of his sucking here was a result of Woody failing to utilize him properly, but looking at that game log only makes him look like even more of a bust to me. Keep in mind he’s already like 24 or something, it’s not like he’s getting a whole lot better than what he is right now.

By MannyT

May 6, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

Najeh be real. You know Shelden’s NBA game has nothing to do with blocking shots. The nickname was there long before he got to the NBA. Your argument is akin to me saying Solo needs to just push Kendrick Perkins fat a$$ out of the lane during the Boston series.

My summer CRAP only has two main points. The second one is What are we going to do to maximize the usage of the players we have, i.e. play to their strengths.

What I take from Shelden’s April is that he put up about 10 pts and 6 rebs in 24 mins a night in the western conference when he couldn’t find court time here.

Analogy 2 - You can’t get a game in summer league, but you are a valued contributor for a SEC or ACC squad.

I get that Horford is better, but Woody could not find a way to use Shelden. It’s not like we were winning so many games that you don’t want to mess up the team chemistry.

Notice that the Hornets are not drawing up dunk plays for Peja. Ray Allen doesn’t spend much initiating the Celtics offense. Even though he hit one in the last series, I doubt Timmy Duncan will be pushing Horry away from the 3 pt line, so he can get his treys this week.

What you are ducking and weaving around is that Shelden is playing better there against better competition than he did here.

Yeah, but…welll uh…CRAP!

By O'brien

May 6, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this

Guys, I’m a big Hawks fan, and not much of a Thrashers fan. However, I was bored, so I was checking out one of the AJC hockey blogs. I dont know how true this is, but maybe one of you hockey fans can shed some light. One of the bloggers said that the Thrashers GM Don Waddell, has been in charge for 10 years (8 seasons). In that time, they’ve had two #1 picks, two #2 picks, two #8 picks, a #10 and a #12 pick. They’ve also had only 1 playoff appearance (in year 7), and they got swept. He has fired 3 coaches (including the coach who took them to the playoffs last year). He fired him 6 games into the season, and the GM coached the team for the rest of the year, and they finished 28th out of 30. The Thrashers do not have a good record when it comes to developing their draft picks, and one of our best players (Hossa) asked to be traded because he didnt like the direction the franchise is going. Despite all this, the ASG is still confident that Waddell is the man for the job. Now tell me, where is the accountability? And will the lack thereof carry over to the Hawks?

By Matt

May 6, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this

Looks like LeBron has a shot at a quadruple-double tonight. Unfortunately for him, the fourth statistical category for him is not blocks or steals, but turnovers.

I don’t think I’ve ever seen a single player commit 10 TOs in a game. Smoove has hit 9 a couple times I think, but wow…

By Ken Strickland

May 6, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this

MANNY T-Woodson wouldn’t find a way to use not only Shelden, but Acie, Richardson, Solomon and Salim. There was a time during the season when he limited Zaza’s mins. We not only paid for it as a team, but the players were done a disservice as well. We gave up big leads in the 2nd half because Woodson refused to give his chosen 6 enough rest. Bibby started fading near the end of the season due to fatigue. The 1st things to go when you’re fatigued are DEF and shooting.

I have wondered about the reason the SAASG refused to allow BK to fire Woodson. What if they thought a new coach wouldn’t have made a difference in the teams chances to make the playoffs. Therefore, you keep what you have and send a message to BK in the process. Just a thought.

By ray

May 6, 2008 11:12 PM | Link to this

MannyT, please. You are not telling the whole story. I will give you another analogy that you have either forgotten or not noticed.

First, Sheldon was drafted to play good solid defense and to rebound. He was routinely out of position on defense because he has bad footwork. He doesn’t block shots because he doesn’t jump well and short-arms all of his shot-contesting attempts. Did I mention bad footwork and timing? That also prevented him from bodying up to opposing players on defense (like Horford does). He was always giving up position. Always.

Here’s another one for ya: he also had very similar stats last April for us. Yet he was unable to get anything done or have good playing time throught the season…until then. Just like in Sacramento. Hmmmm.April is the month when bad teams usually know for certain that they aren’t making the playoffs and have very little else to play for. April is when scrubs get the most playing time, especially on teams that are bad and are somewhat in rebuilding mode. And “coincidentally”, April is when Sheldon has gotten the minutes and the production. It’s called garbage time. It’s when garbage players players (or simply less-talented, more end-of-the-bench guys) get to play….against other players of similar….”talent”.

No CRAP, just PAIN my friend. Just PAIN. When Sheldon makes the starting lineup or cracks the regular (and productive) rotation next year, then you can say we’re all wrong about him. Don’t hold your breath. You’ll pass out…

By ray

May 6, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this

Matt, now what does that tell you, hmmm? Because anybody with an ounce of sense would take Lebron over anybody on this team. Bar none.

By mykhalc

May 6, 2008 11:48 PM | Link to this

BIG RAY, for the most part i think your statement is accurate. however, lemme add…since SAC sells out there bldg nitely and their fans EXPECT effort regardless, then i ‘think’ we can say THEUS was still out to win!!??!!! now whether their opponents nitely were doin’ the same, we can’t say without lookin at nitely boxscores. but what i’m willin’ to surmise is that since SAC is a western conf team and we KNOW how strong that conf is, we can still expect that SHELDEN faced formidable opposition nitely and received better coachin’ in ‘this past’ APR then his APRs in ATL!!!

but again, without lookin’ at APR’s nitely boxscores, we can deduce or spin things any kinda way we choose…IMHO!!!

By doc

May 7, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this

reality time when it comes to getting a real head coach with a pedigree … has anyone heard some of the figures that d’antoni is geting as an offer to coach? it is about 6 mil a year. who thinks the BASG is going to pay that much for a coach to come in here and turn things around? now just wonder how much it will take to get a gm to pay the money to a guy below him. guess it would be north of 6 mill a year. so what does the basg do but to keep the cheaper coach and play the game they know as much as a gm would and do it themselves. frightening huh?

By Dan

May 7, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this

Dont laugh but he has to be ready now !!! I say bring Kwame Brown home to Atlanta and sign Desagna Diop. We will have 2 big men that can rebound and block some shots. They dont have to be the main scores just somebody to fill the lane and play some decent defense. They are both young 26 and so they can grow with the rest of the team. We can then keep our core players including Bibby and resign the 2 Josh’s

By HB Ando

May 7, 2008 12:14 AM | Link to this

Hmm, where to start?

I’ve been having computer problems since my late Sunday night Andro session, so let me start there:

Matt, in general, you point, regarding my impolite tone, was accurate. However, I’ve been listening to Steve T blather unsupportable man-love for Billy, for what has to be 3 years. And, as Ray said, there is an element of the theatrical here, as I’ve been through clarifying the difference between the person I am, and the persona I have created here, since the blog’s inception. Additionally, I appreciate Sautee pointing out that neither Steve T, nor anyone else, of dissenting opinion, has chosen to tackle my spin on the financial and performance-based issues (referring specifically to Steve’s statement that no other team has done a better job of rebuilding, during the same time frame, than the Hawks).

That being said, your points on civility are fair, and the line that it creates, be it subjective (I don’t think it can be anything but) or clearly defined, have a place in this forum (I’ve gone on record more times than I can count, that this is a completely open forum, in support of that construct).

For the record, I have neither a God complex, nor delusions that I am God.

I just genuinely have never believed that Steve T was anything but a Hawks’ employee, who’s sole purpose here, over the years, was to counter negative opinions on the Hawks front office.

(Geez, Joe is going to rightfully call this a “novelette”, and that was not my intent; but it never is).

In trying to say both concise, and non-repetitive, let me generalize that almost every idea, here, has been covered in previous posts. Whether it be possible player targets, trade scenarios, financial implications of keeping this team together, or the ongoing arguments related to either keeping Billy and/or Woody.

I will say two things to Ken, as one addresses his “let it go” post on Billy’s draft decision, and the other refers to Calderon:

first, I’m not so impaired that I don’t realize that the past can’t be changed, as it relates to Billy’s mistakes. It’s not a matter of letting it go. It is, and has always been, about seeing him held accountable for his mistakes, and replaced, as he has soundly failed the franchise and it’s fans, by repeatedly taking inferior players, at every, single opportunity, save for Al Horford (gift of the NBA lottery Gods), and Josh Smith (gift of gun-shy GM’s who shied away, despite him being projected to go as high as 7th).

Second, as you are onto something with this Calderon thing.

Wait, this e-mail I’m going to cut-and-paste is so long that I’m going to post it as a separate submission…….

By HB Ando

May 7, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this

OK, Ken, this is mainly for you, because I know you question my loyalty, and I honestly think you’re one of the most committed Hawks’ fan around.

This is a cut-and-paste from an e-mail I exchanged with one of the owners. It was sent on 5/1:

“Tough, but fairly predictable outcome this evening. Rondo’s continued, statistical domination of Bibby merely confirms my pre-series projection (someone asked, and my first point was that Rondo would not give Bibby room to breathe). If I’m right that you guys have no intention of supporting a $68 million payroll, next season, then off-loading Bibby’s expiring $14 million is a priority. What you can hope to receive, in exchange, is seemingly diminished by each subsequent outing, as Bibby continues to look like a rapidly declining PG, who’s a defensive liability, and who requires screens to get his shot off. Additionally, if you guys hang on to Marvin for another year, I’m afraid an emerging consensus, amongst other franchises, will be increasingly solidified, that he’s never going to be the multi-dimensional player that so many folks projected. As a result of both this conclusion, as well as the challenges of next years’ salary implications, I have a couple of suggestions.

First, fire Woody and hire Avery Johnson. If there is anyone who can expedite your realistic expectations for Acie Law’s future with the team, he’s the guy. Second, rapidly match whatever term sheet Josh Smith signs, so your hands are not tied for your own offering, for restricted free agents. Submit an offer sheet for Calderon, which places Toronto in a very tough position. They have significant money tied up in Ford, and absolute uncertainty about his health. Additionally, Ford is not pleased to be sharing his job with Calderon. Knowing a match creates both financial, as well as chemistry issues, offer them Bibby, and his expiring contract, and Marvin, in exchange for Calderon and, say, Anthony Parker. On paper, it looks like a very solid value for the Raps. Bibby becomes one-year insurance against Ford’s health, and either steps in if Ford has another career-threatening spinal injury, or frees up $14 million at the end of the year. Marvin, riding his increasingly unlikely upside, looks like a steal, in exchange for a “journeyman” like Parker, even though Parker would provide a more rounded game, and legitimate 3-point shooting, to compliment Smith and Horford.

The Hawks go into next season with a significant upgrade at the head coaching position, a significant upgrade at both the PG position, as well as improved wing play and 3-point shooting, and keeps it’s core future intact, with Johnson, Horford and Smith. Chills is a wild-card, who’s continued future here comes down to how much he demands, in a term-sheet match, versus how much he could bring in a sign-and-trade, versus whether he ultimately is the difference between an acceptable team salary, or is simply too expensive to keep. If he has to go, he should bring some value, in either picks, or depth, especially if packaged with Zaza. And a guy like Parker (or Delfino) could pretty much off-set his productivity.

The Bibby issue seems like it will play out (if you don’t pull something like this off) as kind of a domino scenario. If Arenas bolts Washington, to join, say, the Clips, then Bibby gives the Wiz a plug in, to maintain their competitiveness, while freeing them up for the ’09 free agent market. His number, and its expiring status, is clearly of more value than his rapidly declining skills. And you guys can’t go into next season with a $28+ million backcourt, AND lock up Smith for what will likely be somewhere in the vicinity of $15 million a year. And Horford’s monster re-signing looms in the not-too-distant future.

Bring in Avery, re-sign Smith, highlight Horford’s emerging role as the power forward of the future, and you’ve got a strong pitch to keep JJ when his deal expires.

My final, stream-of-consciousness idea is to approach Jerry Colangelo about buying out Belkin, hiring both his son and D’Antoni, making the aforementioned Calderon move, and really turn this franchise into the “Phoenix of the East”, filling seats, and generating the revenues to compete with the big boys, and truly aspiring for the very greatness I pined for when I first sought your attention, back in ’05.:Tough, but fairly predictable outcome this evening. Rondo’s continued, statistical domination of Bibby merely confirms my pre-series projection (someone asked, and my first point was that Rondo would not give Bibby room to breathe). If I’m right that you guys have no intention of supporting a $68 million payroll, next season, then off-loading Bibby’s expiring $14 million is a priority. What you can hope to receive, in exchange, is seemingly diminished by each subsequent outing, as Bibby continues to look like a rapidly declining PG, who’s a defensive liability, and who requires screens to get his shot off. Additionally, if you guys hang on to Marvin for another year, I’m afraid an emerging consensus, amongst other franchises, will be increasingly solidified, that he’s never going to be the multi-dimensional player that so many folks projected. As a result of both this conclusion, as well as the challenges of next years’ salary implications, I have a couple of suggestions.

First, fire Woody and hire Avery Johnson. If there is anyone who can expedite your realistic expectations for Acie Law’s future with the team, he’s the guy. Second, rapidly match whatever term sheet Josh Smith signs, so your hands are not tied for your own offering, for restricted free agents. Submit an offer sheet for Calderon, which places Toronto in a very tough position. They have significant money tied up in Ford, and absolute uncertainty about his health. Additionally, Ford is not pleased to be sharing his job with Calderon. Knowing a match creates both financial, as well as chemistry issues, offer them Bibby, and his expiring contract, and Marvin, in exchange for Calderon and, say, Anthony Parker. On paper, it looks like a very solid value for the Raps. Bibby becomes one-year insurance against Ford’s health, and either steps in if Ford has another career-threatening spinal injury, or frees up $14 million at the end of the year. Marvin, riding his increasingly unlikely upside, looks like a steal, in exchange for a “journeyman” like Parker, even though Parker would provide a more rounded game, and legitimate 3-point shooting, to compliment Smith and Horford.

The Hawks go into next season with a significant upgrade at the head coaching position, a significant upgrade at both the PG position, as well as improved wing play and 3-point shooting, and keeps it’s core future intact, with Johnson, Horford and Smith. Chills is a wild-card, who’s continued future here comes down to how much he demands, in a term-sheet match, versus how much he could bring in a sign-and-trade, versus whether he ultimately is the difference between an acceptable team salary, or is simply too expensive to keep. If he has to go, he should bring some value, in either picks, or depth, especially if packaged with Zaza. And a guy like Parker (or Delfino) could pretty much off-set his productivity.

The Bibby issue seems like it will play out (if you don’t pull something like this off) as kind of a domino scenario. If Arenas bolts Washington, to join, say, the Clips, then Bibby gives the Wiz a plug in, to maintain their competitiveness, while freeing them up for the ’09 free agent market. His number, and its expiring status, is clearly of more value than his rapidly declining skills. And you guys can’t go into next season with a $28+ million backcourt, AND lock up Smith for what will likely be somewhere in the vicinity of $15 million a year. And Horford’s monster re-signing looms in the not-too-distant future.

Bring in Avery, re-sign Smith, highlight Horford’s emerging role as the power forward of the future, and you’ve got a strong pitch to keep JJ when his deal expires.

My final, stream-of-consciousness idea is to approach Jerry Colangelo about buying out Belkin, hiring both his son and D’Antoni, making the aforementioned Calderon move, and really turn this franchise into the “Phoenix of the East”, filling seats, and generating the revenues to compete with the big boys, and truly aspiring for the very greatness I pined for when I first sought your attention, back in ’05.”

Now, Ken, I ask you: are these unreasonable ideas? And is 5/1 not a proactive date for expounding on them?

I don’t tire of looking for the ways the Hawks can be the team I hope for. I just continue to believe that replacing Billy (without going into another tome about the accurate issues of accountability and impact that the ownership situation imposes on all of these issues), is a must.

I’ve believed it since he took Josh Childress. And I like Josh Childress’ game. But he is neither Igoudala or Deng, and he didn’t project to be, when I was sitting at ESPN Zone, watching that draft. Billy has passed on a literal all-star team in the last 4 years.

Time for him to go.

By doc

May 7, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

alpha boy the suspense is so overwhelming, you are such a tease.

btw i was going to grant you a ticket for the championship final no matter what anyone would say. sorry to say we cant regale in a victory and an nba championship. guess we can wait another year.

By HB Ando

May 7, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this

Couple of other things:

Sekou says re-sign both Josh’s. Cool, but where is his reciprocal acknowledgment that doing so, and keeping Bibby, means $65-68 million in payroll, next year, which ain’t gonna happen?

I see folks mention both Calderon and Duhon here. I ranted to an owner, during the tail-end of Duhon’s rookie year, that I still didn’t understand how Billy took Royal Ivey over Duhon (go check where Duhon went that draft). Now, after Billy has released Ivey, we’re supposed to go seek out Duhon’s services?

Calderon? I was suggesting we should trade Al Harrington for him, before the trade deadline, years ago, when Billy froze, left himself with no leverage, and gave him away for the pick (please don’t tell me that Billy knew that Indiana, with top-ten protection, was going to end up in the 11th pick slot; it’s as weak of an argument that Billy planned, when he traded Joe, and only had top-3 protection last year, that we’d end up with the fourth-worst record, and blind-a*-luck into keeping the 3rd pick during the draft lottery).

The point is that a layman like me could see the potential of a Calderon, 3 years ago. And now we’re reduced to getting into a league-wide bidding war for a guy like that.

The O’Bryant suggestion is pretty nice, too. I recommended we go offer a loaf of bread for him, right when the season started, after GS failed to exercise his option for next year, making him an unrestricted free agent this summer. I figured since they weren’t going to get anything for him, this summer, they’d take just about anything for him, this season.

Solomon Jones, anyone?

By HB Ando

May 7, 2008 12:41 AM | Link to this

doc, another year is good. Hopefully, my daughter will be healthy and a year old by then. We’re waiting, semi-patiently, for her arrival (official due date is Thursday, but not looking like she’s quite ready).

Appreciate the sentiment, brother….

By MannyT

May 7, 2008 12:57 AM | Link to this

ray I hear ya, but I think this one doesn’t get resolved at least until next season. Much of Shelden’s time in April was due to Brad Miller going down for the season. Shelden never started, he just got more minutes off the bench.

I don’t expect Shelden to be a force. I’m saying that he’s contributing there more than here.

For all the garbage time comparisons, the teams that the Kings played against were in a very tight playoff race. They needed to win games. The Kings brought in the last 10 at 6-4 playing for nothing against a bunch of teams contending for playoff position. Shelden was a contributor in those games. The Hawks finished 5-5 when they needed to win games.

Even in our last regular season game against Miami when there was nothing to decide, 4 of our bench guys were DNP-CD.

Yes, there was PAIN when he was here. It looks like there may be less PAIN and a little glimmer of CRAP for him in Sactown.

By Harry Hawk

May 7, 2008 12:59 AM | Link to this

Ando,

I appreciate your knowledge of the Hawks’ situation, but if I were one of those idiot BASG owners, I’d just have my secretary’s secretary’s illegitimate son of a b*** delete it for me. BK and Woody will stay forever. We’ve made the playoffs once. It don’t get no betta.

Holla.

By doc

May 7, 2008 1:28 AM | Link to this

good stuff ando.

though he might be given the keys to drive the car for another year, the lack of true development by woody of lesser players and his continued game of not letting the younger players play is enough of a reason for woody to go. dont think it will happen but wasnt woody a rook and wasnt he allowed to make a few mistakes along the way?

cheapest way for the BASG to go will be to keep woody, let bk go and pretend to be able to be gm’s among themselves. that outcome wouldnt surprise me at all.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 1:34 AM | Link to this

Ando, did the owner you sent the e-mail to reply? I’d be really interested to see what they thought of your assessment of the team.

MannyT, I was under the impression Shelden was called the Landlord because he owned the paint. My definition of “owning” the paint is to prevent easy buckets and crash the boards. If you are not getting blocked shots chances are you are not doing a great job of preventing easy buckets.

Shelden’s 8 and 6 in 24 minutes seems like an improvement, but now would be a good time to point out that Kwame Brown averaged 9 and 6 in 24 minutes per game in April of his rookie season. If you look at Shellhead’s per-minute stats and percentages he’s really not doing much more than he did as a Hawk… he’s just getting more playing time. Sure, Woodson probably held him back like he does every other player, but that doesn’t mean Shelden’s ceiling is very high. Maybe he can be a contributing player in the league — I’d be surprised if he doesn’t at least become as good as Zaza — but I don’t see this improvement you seem to be seeing. Like Ray said, he put up even better numbers last April for us.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 1:44 AM | Link to this

Oh yeah, I kinda forgot… can you tell me what CRAP and PAIN stand for again?

By doc

May 7, 2008 2:06 AM | Link to this

i see once again the goats or the trolls are reading in here and drawing some conclusions or inspiration for their missives. maybe they are just late to comment but it is all of their own volition. at least for the most part i agree with jeff schutlz just it is that i have been saying it since mid-season that this is the off season to remember and a defining moment for the bball franchise. we already see how they took the ball of momentum from last year for the thrashers and made the best of that, botched it. now we get to see if they bat .500 in reaching further heights or are 2 for 2 and taking another dive like they have done with the thrashers.

btw, i am not impressed that sheldon once agan becomes mr. april. i am looking for someone to be mr. may and june like robert horry has done. it is just meaningless what shels has done.

By ray

May 7, 2008 2:12 AM | Link to this

MannyT, not trying to continue an argument, but Sheldon got Player of the Month in April of last year as a Hawk. He got plenty of playing time, or there’s no way it would’ve happened. I really don’t see how he’s gettin more playing time and producing more within the same month in Sacramento. If you’re talking season splits, then overall….he got about a minute and a half more in Sacramento than he did here. That translated to a half rebound better and about 2 points better. Pardon me while I’m not impressed.

Seriously, he can be useable to a point. And Woody has damaged him and everyone else on the roster that’s not a tested veteran of some sort. The sad fact is that he was drafted way too high. I don’t even think he was first round material (yes, I know…harsh). Woody can’t develop anything but a bad attitude towards young players. Sheldon needed and still needs major help from a major big-man oriented coach, specialist, or consultant of some type. Even a bad coach doesn’t explain the lack of heart, toughness, and footwork. But as it stands…I don’t really care anymore. Which sounds mean…but I never was a Sheldon fan….sorry. Like I said….just PAIN.

Doc, you know what’s messed up? You’re as likely to be right as anyone else. And while some will probably accuse you (and me) of wearing tin-foil hats…there is still some chain of reasoning to follow here. Remember when Gearon, Jr. talked of “getting more involved” in the daily and inner operations of things? It was right when they canned Bernie Mullin…perhaps that was the first step. Who knows.

What’s worse is I kinda don’t see how they can do worse than Billy…but at the same time, not sure how they’d go about doing better….of if they can…oooooh, this is going to give me nightmares…

By RealSquawk

May 7, 2008 2:24 AM | Link to this

I jumped on this blog way to late to comment

ah well thats what finals will do to you, but I must say i am going to miss the daily updates that went on during the playoffs

and having no draft picks is a bummer, but we don’t need to get any younger

so i guess i will focus on player contracts and management issues.

Few topics

the players; who to me usually show no affinity for Mike Woodson now asking him to return (was it public policy or do they really feel that way)

Josh Smith and Josh Childress contract signing

Knight which i really have no problem with as long as I block Chris Paul out of my mind and as far as Sheldon goes lets see I think he was drafted for Mike Woodson more than anything

thatsaboutit

By ray

May 7, 2008 2:35 AM | Link to this

Doc, agreed.

By Raptors fan in TO

May 7, 2008 7:56 AM | Link to this

O’Brien,

I’ll answer your post about the Thrashers. Your Thrashers got a lot of attention up here in Canada with the whole Dany Heatley car accident a few years back.

That tragic accident de-railed a lot of the Thrasher’s progress. Heatley was a budding superstar at the time, and not too long after the accident he was traded to Ottawa for Hossa, an older (and not better) player. Now, Heatley is a league superstar(see the hat trick last week for Canada in the World Championships) while Hossa was peddled away to Pittsburgh in a salary dump, leaving Atlanta with no hope of the playoffs this year.

While Waddell had little choice but to deal Hossa, you are bang on about their draft woes. One of those #1 picks you mentioned turned out to be Patrick Stefan, who was a bust by top pick standards(basketball comparison: not as good as Andrea Bargnani, slightly better than Kwame Brown). Better players available that year: both Sedin twins, Tim Connolly, Mike Comrie, Ryan Miller and Martin Havlat. Their firing of Bob Hartley —- the October after they made the playoffs —- was laughable from an outsider’s standpoint.

If Waddell made those same moves as GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs or New York Rangers, he would have been fired after two seasons. Only the owners know why he is still in charge of the Thrashers

By JSS

May 7, 2008 8:02 AM | Link to this

Ando thanks, please check out some of the Toronto blogs on their guards From the Doug Smith’s Toronto Star blog on the RAPS **B Jose Calderon

Made himself a lot of money, and likely earned himself next year’s starting assignment with a fine season. Needs to improve defensively.

B Carlos Delfino

If Parker was Mr. Consistent, he was Mr. Inconsistent but when he was going good, he was all over the stat sheet. Tough off-season call.** http://www.raptorblog.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2143

I made my feelings clear on the two Joshes. I just can’t understand the seeming desire to implode the core of this team excluding Marvin. Players 1 through 7 should be here (excluding Marvin). The clearer questions are solving the five spot, my suggestion is to come; and the need for shooters taller than 6’1” to take pressure off Horford inside and JJ outside. In addition, JChills needs true help in creating a real cohesive 2nd unit. This will make a lot of our road woes go away. I think a camp and a summer of rest will aid Bibby. People really underestimate what being injured did his skills and you don’t recover in-season.

Now, let’s throw me under the bus… I say that we go after someone who has become an afterthought on a team full of active and improving big men. He’s spent two seasons around the greatest big (non-Shaq) to throw up a shot from either side of the lane. And only the greatest thievery of the modern era kept him from finally getting some PT. That guy is Chris Mihm with the Lakers. He and Bynum banged everyday under the tuteledge of Kareem Abdul Jabbar. This team needs a big to bang and aid Horford. Josh is a sporadic defensive boarder, Marvin is an adventure, and Zsa, well he’s gone… Having lived in L.A., Phil speaks glowingly of him, but others had greater upside. He is a UFA, you can sign him for the exception and in the worst case scenario, he replaces Zsa and gives you a real big body cheap…

Sekou, on a serious note, I’m not trying to put you in a difficult professional position, but has anyone tried to put this Schultz vendetta against Woodson to bed? Woody has very little friendly banter, most of it justly earned. Still for a “professional journalist” to keep picking at this wound is scary. I thought I’d never see something like this again in Atlanta after Denberg committed career suicide in taking down Fratello…

By Raptors fan in TO

May 7, 2008 8:14 AM | Link to this

JSS, good choice of Raptor blog. Doug Smith is one of the better NBA writers up here. Would beg to differ with him on Delfino, though —- Delfino’s inconsistency was a little exagerated for a guy who comes off the bench. The Raps might try to deal Parker before him, due to Parker’s contract.

By JSS

May 7, 2008 9:08 AM | Link to this

Thanks Rap fan, 41 years since the last Cup… Punch must be rolling in his grave… I try to keep on Toronto, say “Hi” to Queen Street and all of my working class friends out in Oshawa and Whitby for me… Are they running the IRL race there this year? i was planning on coming to Caribana either this or next…

By Astro Joe

May 7, 2008 9:19 AM | Link to this

I assume you guys saw the headline… Billy Knight resigns effective July 1.

At least someone can make a decision.

By d .mc

May 7, 2008 9:32 AM | Link to this

I think Woody deserve an extension Bilyy should resign he is the one that draft these players should have had a pg long before now WE made the playoffs people we are on our way back to respectability

By Sautee

May 7, 2008 9:41 AM | Link to this

Ding Dong, the Witch is dead!

Now if we can just pull the curtain on the “Wizard”.

Although I’m quite afraid that doc is right and that we’ll have GM by committee and Woody back for at least a year (ugh).

Ando, are you surprised?

By St. Bernard

May 7, 2008 9:45 AM | Link to this

BK’s GONE!!!!

Maybe the owners will finally do something smart: Get a gm quick, and let him make the decision on Woodson and the Joshs. We need an outsider’s view of the state of things.

Maybe they won’t do something dumb, as someone mentioned before and play gm themselves!

By fudd21

May 7, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

One down (BK), one to go (Woody). I’m glad it happened early. Sautee I just hope you’re wrong about the GM by committee. There are too many decisions to be made this summer for nonsense like that.

By Raptor fan in TO

May 7, 2008 9:53 AM | Link to this

Wow, BK actually resigned… now that changes things, doesn’t it? Whatever you guys do, do NOT let Isiah Thomas apply for the vacant job…..

JSS: I take you are from the area! (or at least visited). Yes, do come back up for Caribana! Whitby is nice —- lots of new development there. Queen Street is the same as it always was, except for the big fire that ravaged three buildings a month back. And as for the Leafs, they are one reason why I am a Raptor fan…..

No, I don’t think the Indy race is going to happen this year (though I don’t know for sure). Seems interest in the event wasn’t what it used to be. We need to get NASCAR up here so we can cheer on Carpentier!

By mykhalc

May 7, 2008 10:21 AM | Link to this

ANDO, i can feel you celebratin’ all the way to san fran!!!

the post-season drama has officially begun!!!!

By Macaroni Tony

May 7, 2008 10:24 AM | Link to this

NOW is the time for the HUMAN HIGHLIGHT to take the role for GM, and for Steve Smith to try out to be the head coach.

By Astro Joe

May 7, 2008 10:40 AM | Link to this

Mike Gearon, Jr. is being interviewed on 790 and it sounds like ‘Nique absolutely WILL NOT be the GM. Gearon basically said that he does not want to be in a position where the Hawks have to fire ‘Nique (which is inevitable for most GMs/Coaches). He also gave every indication that Woody will return. And lastly, he said that he tried to get BK to reconsider his resignation.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 10:44 AM | Link to this

Mark Jackson for Head Coach and GM.

By phar71

May 7, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Sekou,

I know the dust has not even setteld from this AM’s news, but what are the rumblings/if any on who the new GM will be.

Joe,

What good GM would want to come here if he is not going to be given the chance to hire his own coach. If Gearon JR is already making that choice without a GM, good luck finding a solid GM.

By Sautee

May 7, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this

Ray

Let the nightmares begin now that the Knightmare is over.

Do you really see the BASG going all out for a new GM any time soon?

No offense doc, but I could do without that scenario being played out.

And I know you could too.

Ando

Can we go after Duhon now that it won’t hurt BK’s feelings (since he drafted Ivey before Duhon)?

I’d be very happy to trade Bibby for a Mike Miller type and live with Duhon / Law at the point.

By ignition

May 7, 2008 10:47 AM | Link to this

Mike Gearon doesn’t want Dominique as a GM or Coach for the Hawks.. Just listened to him on 790. I think Billy is taking over with the Knicks. They are going to try to resign both Joshes and look for a GM.

I hope they fire Mike Woodson, that would make me happy..

By mykhalc

May 7, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this

JOE, thanks for the post. if the BASG really thinks WOODSON is their guy then this franchise is doomed…PERIOD!!! let’s hope that a new GM brings in his own, NEW HC!!!

By CJ

May 7, 2008 11:13 AM | Link to this

can someone tell me why Woodson is still around? This is ridiculous!

By ray

May 7, 2008 11:22 AM | Link to this

Wow. Now I wonder how much of this is Billy’s decision and how much is “encouragement” by the ASG. Doesn’t matter, we’ll likely never know.

ASG definitely is squarely in the crosshairs now, with no GM to blame and the coach not being a good scapegoat at this point. So what’s the plan, ASG? You’ve gotten rid of the Afro Ayatollah, which I give you credit for…assuming you actually got rid of him…and he didn’t just get sick of working for you. Either way, he’s gone, and the things he’s been blamed for are gone with him. Someone else now has the job of directing the ship toward calmer waters. So, are you going to do it yourselves or are you going to find another guy who’s supposed to be an expert and professional at this?

Sautee, Doc’s conspiracy theory is indeed scary, but could still be true. Notice no statement has been made yet on that front. Hmmmm. Stay tuned. This has more drama than TNT after 5 p.m. Things will become rather interesting. Let’s see if Gearon Jr. knows what he’s doing, since he seems to talk the most. Let’s see if the cooks in this kitchen can show some gumption or continue to make this look like a retarded version of an IRON CHEF competition.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 11:37 AM | Link to this

Woody is more of a problem than BK ever was! He was’nt the best GM, but he was a better GM than Woody was at Coaching. PERIOD! If they give him an extension, it just shows how stupid they really are when it comes to making good decisions. That pre-game speach in Boston alone, should get him the AXE. lol!

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this

Woody is more of a problem than BK ever was! He was’nt the best GM, but he was a better GM than Woody was at Coaching. PERIOD! If they give him an extension, it just shows how stupid they really are when it comes to making good decisions. That pre-game speech in Boston alone, should get him the AXE. lol!

By Astro Joe

May 7, 2008 11:59 AM | Link to this

BK was making the draft choices (and clearly failed) but I’m guessing Gearon has his hand in virtually every trade (or non-trade). So I personally think that Gearon is the defacto GM this summer. There will be someone else with the title, but if that person doesn’t have the power to hire a coach, consummate a trade or push the payroll just short of the luxury tax threshold, then where’s the authority?

I’d put my money on Gary Fitzsimmons as our pseudo-GM.

By kwooden1

May 7, 2008 12:01 PM | Link to this

Looks like a smart move my BK, his team finally makes the Playoffs (competes very well), which could offset his draft mistakes in some peoples minds. I think this makes the HAWKS situation worse because now management has to find a GM and/or decide on the coach. I thought it would be smart for Woodson to resign, so he at least has a Playoff season on his resume. But with Knight leaving it’s probably a good idea for him to wait it out and put pressure on Management, especially if Management is saying right now that they want to keep him.

I still think the HAWKS should get a new coach, trade Chills (not that I want to) and keep Bibby for one more year at least. In two years the team is going to have to pay Horford big money, so the Big 3 of Johnson, Horford and Smith will be taking up most of the teams salaries. You really only can pay 3 guys very well on an NBA team and I think that AL, Joe and Josh are a very good core. That core could potentially be good for many years and with some luck win a Championship. (Wishful Thinking, but everyone has to have Hope!) Chills is the odd man out because he’s the best trade bait they have. I still don’t think Bibby is trade-able, why would Toronto take him, its cheaper for them to keep Jose and trade TJ in a year. Bibby’s next contract is going to be considerable less and he still’s a good mentor for the team. Marvin is still the X-factor, because if he can take his jumper to the 3-point line and drive a little stronger, he instantly becomes a much more effective player.

Looks like the next few weeks are going to be very interesting!!

GO HAWKS!!

By MannyT

May 7, 2008 12:23 PM | Link to this

OK, BK is done and that’s that. He wasn’t perfect, but a heck of a lot better than Babcock. While I disagree, you won’t find my name on the signature line of any paycheck’s over there, so I move on from that topic. Hopefully the next guy will improve the team.

Ando this is where you can look your reasonable argument in the mirror. Who replaces BK? Would a clearly better talent come to work for the ASG? I think that is similar to the argument you used regarding keeping BK and letting Woody go.

If Astro Joe is correct and Gearon, Jr. fancies himself as a Dan Snyder type with a smaller budget, I guess this is his time to shine. Few worries about draft talent evaluation unless you pull off a significant deal in the next 6 weeks.

Lot’s of negotiations for free agents. Let’s hope Fitzsimmons can keep the ship afloat until new GM arrives.

I’d call this PAIN, but many would not. I hope I’m wrong when we look back at this a few years from now.

By FUNK DAT

May 7, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this

So it begins…first Billy Knight, then Mike Woodson. Let’s get things moving and get a new coach, re-sign some Joshes, make trades, or pick up free agents. The time is now ASG. Take advantage.

By MannyT

May 7, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this

Najeh, ray I’m willing to let the Shelden thing die out. My primary point was that Woody hasn’t really developed players. You see it moreso with those who leave because you can do some before and after comparisons.

Najeh, for this summer, the quickie version for me CRAP (campaign for responsible athletic professionals) is good-moving toward a more responsible and hopefully successful organization. PAIN (Professional Athletics Ineffective Normalization) is bad—stuck in old bad habits.

Easy enough to look at all decisions with these two thoughts in mind.

a. What are we going to do to raise the overall level of the team, i.e. better players at key positions.

b. What are we going to do to maximize the usage of the players we have, i.e. play to their strengths.

Changing GMs comes under a. The question will be was it a change for the better.

At this point, I’d be surprised if the Woody decision falls on the new GM. If he goes, new GM has lots of work to do unless ASG, pulls Dan Snyder card and hires new coach before GM. If Woody stays, how much say does GM get to determine his fate in future seasons…sticky situation.

Clyde wherever you are, do the shirts go on 1/2 price sale ;-)

Can’t really call this one CRAP or PAIN…just an odd posting moment. In a pinch go freestyle.

WWDJ (Watch Woody Dance a Jig!)

By Ryder

May 7, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this

No question Gearon will be the interim GM this summer, which will be just as the Joshes enter restricted free agency.

I sincerely doubt they will hire a new GM barring a miracle. This way they keep Woodson for at least another year while signing the Joshes to one year deals.

They know that if another coach comes in here they will want a say so in personnel matters. What happened earlier this year shows that the ASG will not allow that since they know they can keep Woodson on the cheap.

I also doubt you will see Atlanta obtain a veteran center for a one year deal since they don’t want to commit too much money with Bibby still on the payroll. They won’t be able to trade him unless some other team is willing to give up scraps.

By richbrave

May 7, 2008 1:05 PM | Link to this

HB:

BIBBY and CHILDRESS should go. You are not going to get any more for BIBBY than the Wiz are for ARENAS. As far as I’m concerned, a swap would have to include a real player besides BIBBY, notwithstanding Gil’s broken knee.

GILBO goes nowhere on his own. I can’t see him opting out at this point. He’s got too much to prove, and the Wizards can’t afford to turn him lose for a BIBBY. Besides Ernie Grunfeld is no fool. And his job is secure.

They need a serious #5 like 80% of this league, but can’t pony-up for one. The good old days of ELVIN HAYES and WES UNSELD are just that as far as the Wizards are concerned.

CHILDRESS has value, but is too slender to play good “D” inside in my estimation. Of course, I’ve only seen him in one regular season game and the play-offs. But as I said before, I believe he’s just a knee injury away from mediocrity. His game is intensity, leaping ability and quick hands. But chest-stoppin’ inside defense—no. And that’s the NBA.

Frankly, if I were the HAWKS GM(there was one?) I would secure HORFORD and SMITH then put everything else on the table with the possible exception of LAW.

By jhan

May 7, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

No way Woodson & staff only sign for one year. The ASG will have to offer three years minimum.

Resigning Josh Smith has to happen. After that all bets are off.

Work out the best trade/resign scenarios for Chills, Marvin & Bibby.

Let’s see what Gearon can do!

By GLid

May 7, 2008 1:35 PM | Link to this

Great, espn.com’s Marc Stein is reporting that the leading candidate for our new GM is Billy King.

That’s a downgrade, and a bad one at that. The only thing King did at Philly was…nothing. For all of Knight’s bad moves the only terrible things he was involved with was Shelden and Marvin, and lest we all forget all the expert’s were picking Marvin over either CP3 or Deron Williams.

If Knight couldn’t get the ownership to release Woody, the new GM won’t be able to either. Woody will stay because he never badmouthed the ownership situation. Apparently this is worth more to the ASG than someone who can actually coach.

The Hawks will not make any more of a drop in the NBA than they did this year until the ownership situation is resolved. It’s as simple as that. And it sucks.

By ILL-logical

May 7, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this

Before everyone breaks out the Edwin Hawkins Singers(Flatt and Scruggs for the members of the order of the scarlet nape ),lets see what we have left and whom is going to run the show from here on out.

First,and foremost, the Spirit is still in the dark,literally and figuratively. They are after all are the people who hired the dearly departed GM.

Second, who would want to come to work in this enviornment with the fiscal and legal issues swirling about?

Third,be careful what you pray for; you just might get it!

By lex luther

May 7, 2008 1:45 PM | Link to this

A yo SEKOU., if you got any connects..talk to the people over at Atlanta Spirit and “MAKE” them hear what you are saying. For the sake of all the past, present and future “HAWKIES”…..PLEASE!!!!

By Harry Hawk

May 7, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

BILLY KING?????????????????????

F***!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

Okay. Let me regain my…

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All I know is that Mo Cheeks is actually a pretty good coach. The Sixers fired the right guy when they let Billy King go. King will take any job he can get now. He’d even keep a crappy coach if ownership tells him to. That’s not the kind of GM any organization should have.

So, to put it plainly, “BK II: Electric Boogaloo” is not the kind of movie I wanna see. Marc Stein better be very wrong about this.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By mykhalc

May 7, 2008 1:52 PM | Link to this

jhan, i agree. if WOODSON is offered a 1 yr extension then that is the BASG sayin’ we really don’t want ya. but it’s semi-loyal lookin’, with a wink!!!

By Harry Hawk

May 7, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

I’m reminded of this whenever I think of Billy King.

By Daniel

May 7, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this

Another good Atlanta sports blog is back up: http://redwhiteblackblue.blogspot.com/

By Daniel

May 7, 2008 2:12 PM | Link to this

Another good Atlanta sports blog is back up: http://redwhiteblackblue.blogspot.com/

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this

Billy King drafted Iverson, Iggy, Carney, Louis Williams, Thaddeous Young, Jason Smith, Samuel Dalembert, and Willie Green. He also acquired Andre Miller, who lead the young Sixers to the Playoffs this year. Also, he had the guts to trade an All-Star player, even though he knew the fans would’nt like it. Turns out, it was the right thing to do. He’s not as terrible as you guys think. I also heard that Donnie Walsh wants him in NY, so he must not be all that bad.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 2:25 PM | Link to this

I’m not too sure if he drafted Iverson, but he’s a pretty good GM. I do know that he was in Philly for 10 years.

By Billy King

May 7, 2008 3:23 PM | Link to this

The Hawks have no draft picks this year. How will I improve the team? After all, I cannot be trusted to be reasonable (e.g. not vastly overpay) in my contract offers to current roster players and free agents. I was terrible at these things in Philly. The Hawks are at the point now where they need someone to adjust the roster through trades (no AI to trade here, so it won’t be easy for me to maximize a deal) and free agency. Why hire a guy who has shown a propensity for ineptitude in such matters? Please don’t hire me.

Donnie Walsh (who is an overrated NBA front office guy) is considering me for the Knicks’ GM job because that team needs to dump salary and do a better job in the draft. The Knicks can’t expect to get much of anything for players like Marbury, Eddy Curry, etc. That’s right up my alley. I’ll blow that roster up very quickly. Since I’m a solid evaluator of young talent, I should be able to make some good draft picks. By the time the Knicks are ready to compete, I should be shown the door. I’m the kind of guy you want when you’re rebuilding, not when you’re trying to consolidate gains and move a team higher up the playoff food chain.

I’ve also heard Walsh is considering Billy Knight, too. Knight is also good at blowing up a team, but he’s not quite the drafter that I am. I’d love to take the Afro Ayatollah down in a battle of resumes. It’ll be big…

BK vs. BK

Sponsored by Burger King

By Astro Joe

May 7, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

Billy King, you’ll be working with a bottom 5 payroll in Atlanta. So as long as you can evaluate talent, you won’t have to worry about overpaying free agents. You won’t find an owner to sign off on any contract with an annual salary with double-digits (other than Smith). And more than likely, Gearon will negotiate that contract. Just find us a competent head coach, a few good draft picks and let Gearon worry about the contracts.

By Sautee

May 7, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this

I see that one of the trolls has already raided the blog for a column.

The other two are bound to be close behind.

Thank You Sekou, for your accurate reporting and your caring attitude toward our Hawks.

By infamouskrs

May 7, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

what is the owner(s)’s fascination with GMs named “Billy” ? is it some kinda strange man-luv going on…..

let’s go with a change of pace…and follow in the footsteps of the Red Soxs and hire a young, innovative GM that is looking to make a name for himself. GMs don’t always have to be 50 years old+, do they? i just think that b-ball has PROGRESSED incredibly since the 80’s….the league has outgrown alot of the “older” ways of assembling squads and bringing in the right kind of leaders! start fresh…..

while we’re at it…let him lure 1 of the younger, promising college coaches to come in and get this boat floating in the right direction!

seems like this is the new way teams are labeling pink slips…”HE RESIGNS”. get real now…i’m sure he was told he wasn’t being brought back…but for his tour of duty…he would not have that ugly word “FIRED” on his resume! instead it looks like he goes out with a bang (first playoff series since 99’) ! fitting exit for an arragant person.

and “GLID”…either way you look at it, Billy should not have (if he was) been “listening” to all those “experts” that were saying MARVIN WAS A CAN’T MISS TALENT. this team had a MAJOR HOLE and it was his job to fill it…and he failed@!

the 2005 “SAM BOWIE BONEHEAD DRAFT PICK AWARD” goes to Billy Knight!

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 4:17 PM | Link to this

First of all, I gotta co-sign Ray… I kinda doubt this was a “resignation”. Now comes the hard part. As we’ve seen in recent Atlanta sports history, firing someone is the easy part and hiring someone better is the hard part. (You may stand up now, Bobby Petrino).

Which leads me to this…

Jesus Christ Muhammad Abraham Vishnu Buddha Laozi Confucius, PLEASE do not hire Billy King. Please. Well at least SalimFan will be happy, because Salim will be guaranteed to get that 6 year $42 million extension.

By SalimFan

May 7, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this

Without BK, who is going to make the deal to bring David Adersen State-side???

I really hope they don’t Re-sighn woody to another deal. He has to be one of the most incompetent head-coaches in the history of the NBA. Bashing players in the media, and not utilizing the talent give to you. There is no excuse.

I hope the players refuse to sighn deals if woodson comes back. Thet would really send a message.

By SalimFan

May 7, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this

Poop????

What do you mean??

I don’t care who signs him or what they sign him to just as long as he gets tons of playing time…

By Billy King

May 7, 2008 4:38 PM | Link to this

Astro Joe,

Bless you, my son. Your belief in me is well-founded.

Najeh Davenpoop,

Salim Stoudamire will receive a 6-year, $45 million extension. The extra $3 million (which Gearon has already signed off on) will go to Salim’s boy (SalimFan). Jeremy Richardson has been offered a 4-year, $21 million contract. His veteran presence in the locker room has paid huge dividends for this organization.

Don’t get too excited now, but Jamaal Magloire, Smush Parker, Stromile Swift, and Kevin Ollie are also being targeted in free agency. We must exhibit patience this offseason. It is very crucial to our development.

By SalimFan

May 7, 2008 4:50 PM | Link to this

………yayfullness, Execept all of those “Targeted Players” coughcrapcough

I get how much??? Well I guess….. But I kinda wanted to add a grotto to my mansion that I will be buying…. oh well.

By Astro Joe

May 7, 2008 4:52 PM | Link to this

Billy King, didn’t you hire Larry Brown, Jim O’Brien and Mo Cheeks? Yeah, you can window shop for free agents all you want. But you won’t be able to buy. But feel free to bring on board our first legit coach since Lenny Wilkins was trading ‘Nique.

By infamouskrs

May 7, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

how about this…..we trade Bibby to the Cowboys (who will take anyone) for a Cowboy’s cheerleader and 3 future cheerleader projects to be named later! this way if Woody does stay….the guys with “the real upside” won’t be so disappointed with next year’s 3-5 mins a game or the usual DNP’s (coach’s decision) while ridin’tha pine (think bench eye-candy, REAL MOTIVATION)! coloring books just aren’t cutting it, WOODY.

By chuckw/deadjournalist

May 7, 2008 5:07 PM | Link to this

i haven’t posted under this handle on the hawks blog (i was a regular a couple of years ago as the camera) …

astro joe, ray, mykhalc, doc, ando, najeh - i still enjoy readying your posts as they make the blog worth reading regularly.

without being overly redundant, last year’s draft was the most important of the last five for the hawks. but this off season will make or break this franchise for the next 10 years.

with no picks, the pending free agency of its core, and few trade-able assets, this organization has zero room for error.

a name i have floated here for the last two years, and will again now, is that of david anderson - the austrailian center whose team just won the euroleague championship.

if you read the espn converage of the game (masked as an article on trajon langdon), you’ll notice the high praise anderson received … and also that the hawks were already working on bring him over. this has to get done for ‘08-‘09.

if he finally does make it to the hawks, he helps solidify the front court with both depth and the ability to push horford to the 4. while he might not be a future all star, his skills seem to be a good match for the team.

all this to lead up to the point that ando made in his email to an owner: bibby and m. williams are, at this point, diminishing assets. maximize their value for player(s) who best fit the system the (new) coach and organization will be running.

the hawks have a solid, but still raw core with johnson (still learning to lead), horford and j. smith (if resigned). finding the right pieces to both improve and accentuate their skills is critical.

it can be done - the question is - will it be done?

that’s the 68 million dollar question.

By Billy King

May 7, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this

Astro Joe,

Are you s** me? I’m not going to be able to buy any free agents? You mean to tell me that Gearon, a man who’s never run a basketball team in his freaking life, is going to be handling the contract negotiations for players? He’s one of, what, fifty different morons running the Hawks? Do you really think I want to play the role of “neutered GM” after I saw the way Afro Ayatollah got clipped? You must be out your damn mind. Don’t you think I have even a modicum of self-respect? You think I’d stoop that low to take a GM job in Atlanta?

Look. You’re still cool with me, Astro. You did point out the fact that I have hired some decent coaches in my time. I’m just thinking that I’d rather go to the Knicks and handle that mess than deal with being a GM with no real power. I have a rep to uphold.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 6:01 PM | Link to this

SalimFan, it was just a joke dude. Billy King is good at giving players gigantic contracts that go above and beyond anything they could have got in free agency. Kyle Korver might still be laughing on his way to the bank.

By Billy King

May 7, 2008 6:02 PM | Link to this

I read this little tidbit a few minutes ago:

• Signing Speedy Claxton to a $25 million deal in summer 2006.

After passing on point guard after point guard in the draft, the Hawks pursued Paul’s backup and paid him a King’s ransom. He has played 42 games because of an assortment of injuries.

Sekou, a “King’s ransom” would have been at least $30 million. Give me some credit.

By cp

May 7, 2008 6:34 PM | Link to this

Can’t say that im sad to see BK go. He drafted some good talent but he also passed on some greater talents. If the rumor about Billy King is true then we might as well have kept Billy Knight. Well King does have a good eye for talent but he is terrible when it comes to giving out contracts. I hope Woodson is next to go.

By SalimFan

May 7, 2008 6:36 PM | Link to this

Oh, sorry I didn’t know that my bad lol.

By SalimFan

May 7, 2008 6:39 PM | Link to this

I think were going to regret BK leaving. Espically if we get another person like Babcock.

By cp

May 7, 2008 7:10 PM | Link to this

It seems like we might be keeping Woody. What gm would want to come here and deal with these type of owners? A new gm would want to hire his own guy. I really hope the D.A.S.G. does not drop the ball on this but you never know.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 7:21 PM | Link to this

Harry Hawk, that lists also includes Kupchak. Everyone thought he sucked too, but look at him now.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this

Enough with the role playing!

By infamousrks

May 7, 2008 7:40 PM | Link to this

as long as people are “resigning” (being FIRED)….what are the chances the NBA fires (or resigns) this ownership team? seems like it’s the perfect time…Stern you attended our games in the playoffs….i’m sure you like the rest of us would’ve loved to see more competition in Boston’s home games (it’s PRIME-TIME TV, big guy) !

ATLANTA is the “motown of the south”. known for it’s “Ti-Ty” clubs….it’s scorchin’ summer weather (OLYMPIC board thought it was a “hot” spot)……and LUDACRIS!

Davey Stern-1, my man….are you OK with this team of owners running a product like this within your “family” ? are you wishing you could have went back on that “league vote”? if only you had the magic 8BALL that ANDO posesses! this dude has been able to tell the future….

By Billy King/Harry Hawk

May 7, 2008 7:45 PM | Link to this

Harry Hawk will continue to be me until he gets the contract extension he wants.

Okay.

5 years, $62 million oughta do it.

Harry Hawk is back. Booya.

By Ken Strickland

May 7, 2008 7:49 PM | Link to this

ANDO-come on now, I might question you on something you’ve said, but I haven’t questioned your loyality, or anyone else’s for that matter. Mostly, I’ve questioned your continued bashing of BK for not drafting, trading or trading for, certain players you have a preference for.

You support the team in ways that matter most. You spend the time, effort and money to attend gms. I find it hard for anyone to question that kind of support.

DOC-I just saw an interview with Gearon about replacing BK and DWilkins was suggested as a possibility. Gearon was against the idea for the same reason you mentioned previously. He don’t want to tarnish his status and reputation as the franchises icon. He also stated that he saw nothing that would prevent Woodson from returning as HC. He commended him for doing a good job.

That’s bad news for Acie, and it means Salim won’t return. I don’t know if Bibby will hold up an entire season in Woodson’s restricted rotation. He suffered from playing extended mins in his limited time with the team and his production and consistency were affected.

By BosnianBaller

May 7, 2008 8:00 PM | Link to this

I want steve smith gm.and mike”stinger” glenn to get his old job of analyst back.

By Macaroni Tony

May 7, 2008 8:06 PM | Link to this

I know that we will cut Speedy first to free up some money, and I would like to see Steve Smith as our GM if they will not hire DW. We need to take this franchise to another level and get some veteran help. We need also to keep both Josh’s on. We still can make some moves with FA, and I’m happy that we don’t have any picks in the draft no more rookies. That is what killed us in the playoffs “too many rookie turnovers.” With one or two vets, along with our core we would be just fine.

By Jay

May 7, 2008 8:10 PM | Link to this

Billy King ? I’d rather have Billie Jean King! even Coretta Scott King would do a better job! Let’s go after Dennis Lindsey from the Spurs or someone from that ilk. Then fire Woody, and trade Marvin for a big and/or vet.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 8:35 PM | Link to this

If Woody comes back, it wont matter who we sign in free-agency. It’ll be the same o same o.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 8:36 PM | Link to this

If Woody comes back, it wont matter who we sign in free-agency. It’ll be the same ol same ol.

By terrell barron

May 7, 2008 8:38 PM | Link to this

Same ole same ole!

By doc

May 7, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this

if you look back to my 1:27 am post today you can be rest assured that i am not surprised. just say i called the first part of the “transition”.

next up a quick deision on woody. if they keep him then they dont get a gm because most gm’s wont come and not be able to hire a head coach unless it is by a short leash. colangio did it in toronto so it can be done, however i dont think the owner there fashioned themselves as gm’s caliber and i think the gearon’s may consider themselves capable.

havent we done that with ted turned, then blank and now the fandom of atlanta might have to watch it one more time with the hawks and the thrashers? if anyone were to really look at the atlanta sports scene i think the charge that atlanta fans are not worthy would change to the fans are discerning.

ando are you happy now? you know the recording is going to have to change.

By ray

May 7, 2008 9:19 PM | Link to this

Man, look at all the long faces and sour grapes on this blog. You’d think that Billy “we don’t need a pg…ok let’s sign a broken one” Knight was related to some people here. It’s possible that Billy “left” because the deal Gearon and Co wanted to work out wasn’t to his liking. Kind of like the “deal” Isaiah was getting in NY, perhaps? But you know what? I’m not going to go into all of what I feel about what Billy has done (or not done), and what it means for him to be gone. He’s gone, time to move on. Whew

Having stoked that fire…

I’ll say that I’d really like to see Woodson gone, too. But here’s my thought: Woodson was one hell of a yes-man. Why wouldn’t he be? First chance as a head coach, you don’t bite the hand that feeds ya, because that hand could keep you out of such a job again…for a loooong time.

Looks like Woody will stay. However, any new GM, if given proper authority and inspiring trust from the ownership group, will get rid of Woody if he continues to perform the way he has. Maybe even before then. Right now, though I’d say that Woodson’s “yessir” attitude and Joe Johnson are what he has to thank for having what looks like a pretty good chance at keeping his job (to my chagrin).

Look guys, sooner or later “he gets them to play hard” isn’t going to cut it. We may have to suffer through Woody for a while yet. Few people hate that more than me. One thing is for sure. If we have a decent pg situation next season and then some…and Woody keeps doing the same damn things (not using the bench, holding back young players) then you’ll see him gone. Remember, coaches are easy to fire. Good coaches lose their jobs every year. And there’s always somebody to replace them. Always.

I will say this: it’s possible that Woodson is a totally different person while not working for Knight, and working with a more experienced and better balanced roster. Do I think so? We’re not going to go there, but I really don’t like to deal in absolutes, not when there are so many factors involved. However…there are still two absolutes to deal with. If Woody remains, either he will become a better coach….or he won’t. No way around it.

I’d be fine with seeing Steve Smith as a GM. This Newton (or whatever his name is) is known as a very good talent evaluator. That’s something to look at. I understand why Gearon doesn’t want Dominique to get into GM-ing. He must see what others see: Dominique was a hell of a player, enough to be a HOF. Indeed, why tarnish that by showing how much you don’t know? (Ahem…cough, cough…Michael Jordan…cough, cough). Love Dominique, but I seem to recall him saying that Marvin was the kind of guy that only comes along every 10 years…..uh….no, Dominique. You were pointing to Chris Paul when you said that…weren’t you?

How many times must this be said? All the experts had US taking Marvin at #2. WHICH IS DIFFERENT FROM HAVING HIM AS THE 2nd BEST PLAYER. After all, do you really think Andrew Bogut was the number one talent in the draft? NO! He was the best center available by far and therefore a hot commodity. Even more so, center was the greatest need of the team with the top draft pick. The draft is mapped out based on a few things: who’s the most talented, who has the most “potential”, what team has what pick, what team needs what the most, and how much info about their pick each team has leaked. It’s just that freakin’ simple. Marvin fit two or three of those categories: he had some of the highest upside, Atlanta had the #2 pick, and somebody withing the organization leaked it all over the place that Billy Knight was in LOVE with Marvin Williams. Stop twisiting this foolishness. Trust me, if it leaks out from fairly reliable sources that Memphis has the top pick in the draft and they will select Derrick Rose, then you will see all the experts rank Rose as the top pick in the draft. Simple as that. Geez!

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 9:20 PM | Link to this

The newest troll article (no comments allowed) makes me laugh.

A small sample:

“Woodson had zero say in personnel decisions, by the way. He just kept his mouth shut and did the best he could with a starter out of high school (Josh Smith), another just a year out of college (Marvin Williams), a power forward playing center (Al Horford), no point guard worth mentioning before Bibby, no depth on the bench beyond Josh Childress and a dearth of shooters.”

Hmm… I wonder WHY there was no depth on the bench, a dearth of shooters and no point guard worth mentioning beyond Bibby?

Ah, forget it, we all know the answer anyway.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 7, 2008 9:34 PM | Link to this

“He must see what others see: Dominique was a hell of a player, enough to be a HOF. Indeed, why tarnish that by showing how much you don’t know? (Ahem…cough, cough…Michael Jordan…cough, cough). “

This doesn’t just apply to Jordan. Nearly every “great” player sucks as a coach and/or GM, because they can’t understand that every talented player doesn’t have the intangibles/will to win that they did. This applies to Elgin Baylor, Isiah Thomas and to a lesser extent Larry Bird too. Jerry West is really the only example I can think of off the top of my head that contradicts this rule. I’m pretty sure Nique saw a lot of his own talents in Marvin and made that comment, not realizing that Marvin doesn’t have nearly the passion and intensity on the court to succeed the way Nique did.

By ray

May 7, 2008 9:39 PM | Link to this

terrell Barron, you do make a good point. Billy King did do some bad things as far as contracts, but the team he put together, particularly post-Iverson has been better balanced. Not more talented than ours overall, but then between here and New York, we see what a thrown-together collection of talent gets you. Here’s another fact: Philly, despite having less overall talent than us….routinely whipped our butts. And at least they have a decent starting center and pg to build off of. Two anchor points. We’ve had guys playing out of position to make it look like we had that balance.

But here’s the thing that I really think separates us: Maurice Cheeks is a good coach, and he coaches intense…yet relaxed. He clearly is a good guy and has his players’ respect. He uses his bench and develops his young guys. Look at the confidence and enthusiasm that guys like Carney, Williams, and Young play with. If only we saw that same opportunity and attitude for guys like Stoudamire (yes, SalimFan, that’s for you), Richardson, Zaza (not so much a young’un..but you get the idea), Acie Law, Solomon Jones.

I say if Woody stays (hold on while I reach for a bucket to barf in),then he has to prove immediately that he can develop young players. That he can develop and use the bench. Maurice Cheeks and Nate McMillan don’t have this problem. Hell, nobody has this problem. Nobody but Woody, that is.

But what befuddles me is Gearon,Jr saying that he wants to evaluate whether or not players are being developed. I hope you mean that, Mike ol’ buddy. Because the answer should be obvious….three playoff wins or not….

By drmaryb

May 7, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this

If I may JumP in here - How would you bloggers like if you were fired because the jack-azz working next to you took too many cigarette breaks and - production fell off?

Not to mention - You yourself don’t even smoke cigarettes?

That is Just WRONGE! So, why should Woody lose his Job? Please explain this to me? He just got a decent PG it seems like - three weeks ago!

Can you ..(cough cough CLYDE) bake a cake without flour? Or better yet - can you print a T-Shirt without a T-Shirt?

(nothin’ personal CLYDE I haven’t read any of these bogs for weeks now…I just know that You like to fire people! from your season long chanting!)

I’m Just Sayin’ BK is GONE so Let’s Scroll On!

By mykhalc

May 7, 2008 11:13 PM | Link to this

if you thought the foundation was bad before with BK, somehow i feel it just got worse!!! hope i’m wrong tho!! but if WOODSON stays, then i’m NOT wrong. hey on the bright side…maybe the BASG is gettin’ ready to sell!!!??? ok i’m awake again. and why sell…they can always rebuild!!!

By MannyT

May 7, 2008 11:21 PM | Link to this

drmaryb No need for me to do my why I prefer BK to Woody lines, because that deal is done.

People get deep sixed because of others often. It is called layoffs. Not a function of individual incompetence—then you get fired. In group incompetence or executive incompetence, we lay folks off to artificially stimulate the stock price or show that there is a plan to recover from the mistake made.

I really hope Woody does a better job of developing the guys he has/gets. Regardless of who runs the deal, I still want the Hawks to do well.

Don’t hate, but YES I CAN bake a cake w/o flour and PRINT a T-shirt w/o a T-shirt. Sometimes you just have to break the problem down in different ways I got skillz. LOL

I get your point, but this may be the most interesting news of the entire offseason w/o draft picks.

PAIN

By MannyT

May 7, 2008 11:30 PM | Link to this

mykhalc I agree, but I hope we are wrong. Woody is in like Flint.

Similar words in many articles across the internet.

I doubt they are getting ready to sell. To messy given the Belkin situation. After that is resolved, who knows.

PAIN, PAIN, PAIN.

By drmaryb

May 7, 2008 11:39 PM | Link to this

Hey MannyT

If you can bake a cake without FLOUR? & Print a T-Shirt without a T-Shirt?

Then I would love to meet you someday to see if you can get me pregnant without having sex! Because I would really love to have a baby without getting reamed! You may be the most amazing man ever & I would die to have your baby! LOL! LMAO! LMBoobiesO too!

I’m just sayin’ BK tried to fire Woody (a nice guy) to cover up for his own ineptness! And that my friend - Is Just WRONGE!

We need what we always needed a #1 and a #5! Not 15 #4’s!

We don’t need no more draft picks..NONE!…we need some veterans and some damned help in here! No more youngin’s PUH-Lease!

Go MannyT I love your intellect and enthusiasm … I always will!!!

By ray

May 7, 2008 11:40 PM | Link to this

Najeh, Jordan was just one example. The most recent one at that. Most of these “legends” that do this manage to hold on…and eventually get better. Well, sort of. In the case of Isaiah Thomas, I don’t think there’s anybody in the field of psychiatry or psychology that can figure that one out.

Uh, what did Dominique see in Marvin that reminded him of himself? Dominique’s mindset was “I’m going to the basket now. I’m going to dunk. You’re either going to get out of the way, or get your arm broken, and I’ll shoot a free throw as well.” When has anyone ever seen Marvin do that when he wasn’t wide-a$$ open? Just askin’…..

drmaryb, if you REALLY must ask that question, kindly ask the league office (or the ASG) for copies of each game he’s coached since his hiring. After that, read the last 458 blogs. Of course, you could e-mail or interview Solomon, Salim, Josh, Zaza, Mario, Acie, and some others. You might have an idea after that….heh, heh, heh…here’s a small hint: it ain’t got a whole hell of a lot to do with Knight.

By DecDawg

May 7, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this

Even if Woody had zero say in personnel decisions, he does not get a pass. I’m not a big fan of BK but why should Woody have a say since he has not even implemented a SYSTEM in 4 YEARS? We still do not have an offensive or defensive system.

And for the record, Woody had 100% say in player development and his current grade is a “F”. JJ’s game is the same as it was when he was in Phoenix. The only difference is that he’s matured on the court. JJ does not have any moves he didn’t already have and he still scores from the same spots on the floor (the perimeter). Woody hasn’t even helped the guy develop a post-up game and he’s one of the biggest 2-guards in the league. I could go down the roster but for those of us who follow this team, it’s easy to see that NO ONE on the team plays smarter after being coached by Woody.

I know many of you complain that we could’ve had CP3, Deron Williams, Roy and several others but in reality, the best thing for their careers was to NOT be drafted by the Hawks and coached by Woody.

By DecDawg

May 7, 2008 11:52 PM | Link to this

Even if Woody had zero say in personnel decisions, he does not get a pass. I’m not a big fan of BK but why should Woody have a say since he has not even implemented a SYSTEM in 4 YEARS? We still do not have an offensive or defensive system.

And for the record, Woody had 100% say in player development and his current grade is a “F”. JJ’s game is the same as it was when he was in Phoenix. The only difference is that he’s matured on the court. JJ does not have any moves he didn’t already have and he still scores from the same spots on the floor (the perimeter). Woody hasn’t even helped the guy develop a post-up game and he’s one of the biggest 2-guards in the league. I could go down the roster but for those of us who follow this team, it’s easy to see that NO ONE on the team plays smarter after being coached by Woody.

I know many of you complain that we could’ve had CP3, Deron Williams, Roy and several others but in reality, the best thing for their careers was to NOT be drafted by the Hawks and coached by Woody.

By mykhalc

May 7, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this

MannyT, the sell statement was definitely tongue-n-cheek bro. a dream only!!!

BASG foundation crumblin’… 1) owners’ rift (how may years now?) 2) THRASHERS coach fired, GM fills in 3) MULLINS leaves, no replaced 4) WOODSON outster attempted 5) BK re-signs (wink wink) 6) FA signings comin’ up soon!!! 7) GEARON JR, head bball evaluator now??? 8) WOODSON????

yep, if it was my corp i’d be real comfortable with my front office in this kinda state/shape!!!

hey, good drama tho!!!LOL

By drmaryb

May 8, 2008 12:00 AM | Link to this

O.K. Ray-Star

I know Woody probably need to go, for the sake of change and a new direction. And, I guess at the end of the day, it really doesn’t matter WHO is the owner of this dysfunctional franchise.

But, come on ray-star, What could you have done with Woody’s roster?

One with whom you have no INPUT or SAY as to who will be drafted? What other coach Jumped UP and offered to come coach here? NONE! They all laughed at us - but not Woody! He took it like a man and never complained once. His wife and kids were murdered in the streets - and this man never cried once!

I feel sorry for him really. I try to put myself in his situation - being bashed, called names and laughed at every where he go! I’m Just Sayin’ He deserves a chance to at least even his record to somewhere close to .500

That bench is a JOKE! No one over there plays any defense except MarioW. But the pressure was on this man to win NOW…So he ran the starters to DEATH. (i.e. Lenny Wilkens)

Anyway, we’re moving on now and let’s see what color the wall will turn next!

By MannyT

May 8, 2008 12:01 AM | Link to this

drmaryb we’re good., but if you laugh off all the good parts, no babies arrive ;-)

I agree that Woody & BK was a mismatch that would ultimately lead to a divorce.

Woody is a nice guy. I know nice guys that should have been fired—they did not do their jobs well. I just hope he develops some talent. Remember, a big part of BK’s fall was picking the wrong young-uns.

If you’ve ever seen the movie Gattaca, that’s where we are headed. Artificial insemination for most. I’ll leave that between you and others. Don’t want Mrs. MannyT collecting life insurance on me from a strange accident ;-)

in other censored thoughts…

I had a whole rant on Gearon and his comment in the ESPN article.

Gearon said he had no list of candidates to replace Knight “because this was unexpected.”

It kept getting edited out. It suffices to say I find this comment 90% unbelievable.

I think Bernie Mullins would agree w/me…but that’s for another time and place.

PAIN, PAIN, PAIN

By mykhalc

May 8, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this

my bad on the typos…

By MannyT

May 8, 2008 12:19 AM | Link to this

ray here’s the next question. I get that Woody gets an extension or another contract. He will be here for awhile.

What about the assistants? Do they feel more or less secure now. If I recall correctly, Fitz had an offer with the Cavs and Drew with the Lakers?

Maybe I’m delusional, but I think it’s a lot easier to go from 15 to 30 wins than it is to go from 35 to 50 wins. Do you stay here to get a winning record or go to a team that has a winning record…hmmmm

I also noticed that Fitzsimmons name wasn’t on the AJC list of candidates. This may mean nothing, but another thing to make me go hmmmmm.

PAIN

By Harry Hawk

May 8, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this

I just read an interesting John Hollinger article on ESPN.com about the Hawks’ situation. I think he’s wrong in his assessment of Knight drafting Acie Law (How could picking Law over Stuckey be a similar blunder to picking Marvin over Paul/Williams or Shelden over Brandon Roy????), but Hollinger has a pretty good handle on where the Hawks are right now.

By MannyT

May 8, 2008 12:38 AM | Link to this

Notice the difference between the Hawks and a team in a similar situation.

It will take a few years to see if Stephanski is better than their BK, but I’m watching. Take note of Cheeks contract situation.

They need a power forward and a shooter, we need a center and maybe a PG. Not saying Bibby is or isn’t the answer at this time.

…and didn’t someone question if a star player had major sway over the status of a coach? Remember how folks here were questioning JJ’s support of Woody? Less than a week later it is clear that Woody gets a new/extended deal and BKs gone.

What say you now!

Sixers - CRAP (good)

Hawks - PAIN (not so good)

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 8, 2008 12:52 AM | Link to this

An entire John Hollinger column that doesn’t mention PER? I am shocked.

By MannyT

May 8, 2008 12:56 AM | Link to this

SI Article challenging JJ

All I’ll say is this be a visible, vocal leader goes against who he is. Let him play to his strengths. We need someone on the team that likes to be the vocal guy. It it’s not Bibby or Al, he ain’t here yet.

I also missed Marvin’s suspension. Where have I been the past day or two?

ray you gotta news me up.

SBLHAO (Steve Belkin laughing his a$$ off)

By MannyT

May 8, 2008 1:08 AM | Link to this

Harry Hawk I saw that article. I didn’t mention it because that comparison leads me down the same how is the coach developing the players question that makes my head hurt.

Najeh He’s just waiting for a stat besides wins and losses that he can tag on coaches and GMs. He needs to check his info though. Horford and Law should have the same option year on their contracts.

mykhalc grasshopper needs guidance and calm. Must resist Woody rant. Will look like sour grapes. So I’ll have to settle for news headlines like

Woody Solidifies Position

PAIN

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 8, 2008 1:13 AM | Link to this

Steve Belkin made hundreds of millions of dollars sending junk mail. He should be laughing his azz off regardless of what happens with the Hawks.

By cp

May 8, 2008 1:13 AM | Link to this

If I remember correctly, Mike Brown of the Cavaliers said he thought he would get the Hawks job but didn’t. I really don’t understand why they would keep Woodson. I think one blogger nailed it on the head earlier, the ownership let those 3 wins against Boston overshadow 4 years of incompetence. It’s just like DecDawg said earlier, it has been 4 years and I still see no system. He is still making the same mistakes now that he was making as a rookie coach. He might be a nice guy but we really need someone else who can really help these younger guys develop into better ball players. I just dont see Woodson doing that at all.

By Harry Hawk

May 8, 2008 1:24 AM | Link to this

CWER

Coach Win-Expectancy Rating

by John Hollinger - ESPN.com

This is a new metric I’ve come up with to rate NBA coaches and their positive/negative impacts on their respective teams’ wins and losses. I’m still working the kinks out on the stats, but I believe this will eventually be a very accurate measure of pure coaching ability. Home wins will count blah blah blah, while road wins will count more. Home losses will equal something or other, while home losses mean you suck a*. Let’s get this party started, b***:

Woodson, Mike - ATL

-9.8 CWER

Dudes, Woody musta cost the Hawks at least ten games this year. Dude sucks, man. I mean, he REALLY sucks. Heard he’s gonna keep his job. I wish I had those kinda pics on my bosses. I’d have Bill Simmons’ job, dudes.

The end.

By BA

May 8, 2008 1:28 AM | Link to this

Woodson deserves another year. I’m proud for him that this has worked out the way it has. And I know my saying this goes against some of the brighter minds here. But you all know, I was saying this before the playoffs anyway. And I’ll say up front: the no bench thing was RETARDED. But dmaryb is right, he was working with his back against the wall. Like I said before, I think if you give the guy a little breathing room (and the Hawks get off to a good start of the season) you’ll see more use of the bench. However, it concerns me to bring in a GM with a coach in place already. Not very conventional. I’d say bring a Detroit guy down here, somebody Woody’s familar with.

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 8, 2008 1:33 AM | Link to this

Baahahahahaa. The funny thing is if Hollinger reads that he’s probably gonna try to come up with some stat to rate coaches too.

cp, Mike Brown is nearly as bad as Woody. His “LeBron 1-on-5 offense” is even worse than what we run.

By BA

May 8, 2008 1:46 AM | Link to this

In spite of the fact that we run an unimaginative offense, Woody has the Hawks playing better defense than I’ve seen in my years as a hardcore Hawks fan(close to twenty years). Which makes sense, since beyond Joe we don’t have anybody that can consistently light it up. But the thing that really conviced me was reading Johnson stick up for Woodson. If the best player on our team says Woodson is the best coach he’s played for (remember, this guy played under D’Antoni) that’s good enough for me.

By Matt

May 8, 2008 2:46 AM | Link to this

First off, while I still think Woodson is more of a problem than Knight ever was, now that the die is case, I realize that Knight’s departure is for the best. Knight got us a great, young talented roster - same as he did for Memphis. He probably wasn’t the right guy to mold that talent and potential into an actual contender, though.

That leads me to point number 2: Our next GM should NOT be someone whose primary talents lie in scouting and talent evaluation. It should be a player personnel guy who knows how to field a winner, a guy who can A) recognize players with the intangible qualities, not just the tangible ones; and B) someone who is smart and savvy at signing and trading players.

Finally, I’ll close off with one last defense of BK’s most controversial pick by contesting a point that Ray tried to make. Ray, it simply isn’t true that Marvin was projected as the “#2 pick” and nothing else. He was projected as the most talented player in the entire draft and the player with the highest ceiling - Bogut included. I’ll cite once again to the USA Today article (Link 1) that listed Marvin as a “Future superstar” while listing Paul, Deron, and Bogut all as simply “Immediate starters.” Similarly, Rick Majerus, who coached Andrew Bogut, said that Marvin would turn out to be the best player in the Draft - (Link 2). That’s why lots of articles (Links 3 and 4) speculated that Marvin could actually go #1 rather than #2.

I’m NOT saying that the pick looks good in hindsight, or that Marvin will ever make that pick look like anything less than a disaster. Frankly, I probably would have have tried to move down 1-2 spots and taken Paul or Deron instead. But it’s just not true that the only reason Marvin was projected to go #2 is because the Hawks wanted to take him there. It was because he was the consensus “best chance to be a superstar” player in the draft.

But now the book is closed on BK. Let’s see what the next GM writes in his.

By cp

May 8, 2008 3:06 AM | Link to this

Trust me Najeh I wasn’t saying Mike Brown is a good coach lol. I was only responding to the person who said every other coach turned us down. I think a lot of young assistants were interested in the job when it was available but it seemed to me that BK hired a friend instead of a basketball mind. I guess even BK realized that Woodson is just not the guy we need leading this team but was not able to fire him. I hope this all works out but with the D.A.S.G. one does not know what to expect from these clowns.

By Sautee

May 8, 2008 8:34 AM | Link to this

Najeh

From your 9:34 post:

“Nearly every “great” player sucks as a coach and/or GM, because they can’t understand that every talented player doesn’t have the intangibles/will to win that they did. Jerry West is really the only example I can think of off the top of my head that contradicts this rule.”

How about Joe Dumars?

I’d take him in a heartbeat, but he’s not leaving Detroit. And you DID say “nearly”.

BA

From your 1:28 am post:

“Like I said before, I think if you give the guy(Woody)a little breathing room (and the Hawks get off to a good start of the season) you’ll see more use of the bench.”

Hey BA, didn’t the Hawks get off to a 15-12 start last year? Was Woody using his bench then? Only when he absolutely HAD to.

Put me squarely in the doubter’s camp.

Ando

We wish you well if today is actually the day. Let us know when the happy event happens.

By corey

May 8, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this

THANK GOD BILLY IS GONE

By ILL-logical

May 8, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this

Woody survives only because Sam Mitchell is not available. Once he/ Chris Bosh are available: Goodbye Woody, ZaZa,Salim(if he is still here) and Marvin.

BK left because :1)Donnie Walsh kept a light on in the window And 2) The Spirit told him he still could not fire Woody.

By The Flash

May 8, 2008 2:39 PM | Link to this

Several years ago, when Billy Knight created that false crisis by insisting, against all reason, that the Calangelos would match what the Hawks were willing to pay JJ, and therefore that Diaw and two number ones were required, I wrote that he wzs doing Gearon et al’s bidding—that is, he was creating a false confrontation in a move to oust Belkin, who being a sane and principled guy would never go along with throwing all those assets to make a deal after he (the Hawks) had already bought the pot.

Then, when Billy refused to shake Belkin’s hand, that solidified in my mind that he had sold his soul for three pieces of silver. I wrote here, on Sekou’s board, repeatedly that Billy should beware, “that he who lies down with wolves, … .,” that getting to “call the shots on the JJ deal was the last shot he’d get to call, except maybe whether to call his MaMa.”

Mr. Bradley had a decidedly different take on the whole JJ thing, the Spirit, Gearon, and the guy that everybody in |Gearon’s pocket, which included Mr. Bradley at that time, loved to hate.

Seems that I was exactly, 100 percent right. That became apparent to me when they didn’t resign Al or trade him, but rather let the season ride out without making a move.

People will still disagree with me about the lack of trust that the Spirit infuse into the teams that Gearon runs, that has its roots in the manipulations to oust Belkin and the cost to the Hawks’ franchise that needlessly giving away assets cost the Hawks and will for years to come. People will still say that the issue of TRUST, the one single ingredient that you MUST have to have a TEAM (even Kobe will say that now), is absent from the irronically named Spirit and the teams that they run; people will say that, everyone around here except Billy—having lied down with wolves, Billy, like Kobe, now gets it too.

By Jimmy

May 8, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this

Hey guys, i’m one of those bandwagon fans that jumped on during the playoffs. Nice blog. I had no idea there were so many intelligent hoops fans in the Atl. I’m not one of those(intelligent hoops fans) myself, but I do know this-The Hawks are doomed w/ Gearon leading the way. I truly hope he was lying when he said he didnt have a list of possible replacements for GM after BK left because he said he never thought BK would leave, or something to that effect.

Any worthwhile exec, in charge of a pro sports team, who is responsible for picking a GM(or player personel guy, etc) knows that you’ve got to always have a list of possible GM’s or coaches, just in case said dude decides to leave. Not only do you have that list in the top of your desk drawer, you constantly update it when different teams hire differnt people. I truly hope for the Hawks sake that Gearon really does have one of those magical lists handy.

By Jimmy

May 8, 2008 2:53 PM | Link to this

Here is a name for consideration for GM: Kenny Smith. Before you laugh, listen to my argument. If you’ve ever watched him on ‘Inside the NBA,’ dude knows his basketball. Forget half of the crap he says because he’s also there to entertain us. He played for Dean Smith at UNC and won two championships playing w/ the Rockets in the mid 90s as an important role player, so he knows how winning teams are put together. Plus he knows the Atl, having to work here a lot. Plus besides Steve Smith, what other retreads out there would do much better? Having said all of that, he might not even want it if asked. I heard he might interview for the Knicks GM position, being a NY boy and all?

By honest_abe

May 8, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this

like aj has been screaming for the past several years “follow the money”

woody = cheapest option.
he ain’t going nowhere.

i feel weird saying this but damn i hope belkin takes over the team. gearon and the 5 million other owners are bunch of douche bags.

By The Flash

May 8, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

Jimmy: Great idea. One problem, Smith is not a yesman. Gearon would never offer it, and Smith would never take it.

By the way, I have not followed the details of this, but I wouldn’t unpack my bags if I were Mikie. Gearon might just have wanted BK to leave on his own; this way, no severence package for the guy who did his bidding.

If Gearon hires a real GM, and he might, then I think Mikie is gone. Gearon is slick.

By The Flash

May 8, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this

Addendum Mikie is gone even if Gearon hires himself a yesman, which he probably will. Mikie was just a pawn to be played, and he served that roll well.

Now, when a new GM comes in, Gearon will have to be oh so sorry but he really does have to stand behind his GM on such matters. I forget for a second, when was the last time we heard that. I know, let’s ask Billy, or we can just check the video tape and see it was when Gearon moved on Belkin. Same gambit. Remember where you read it first, and when. Two years plus ago!

Later boyz.

By Dumbfounded but not Dumb

May 8, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this

I’m having difficulty grasping the “resignation” concept. Isn’t BK’s contract expiring on June 30th? Isn’t his “resignation” effective July 1st?

Isn’t that akin to George W. Bush resigning, effective January 20th, Obama’s inauguration date?

By The Flash

May 8, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this

addendum to the addendum By the way, it don’t matter which way this turns out.

If a new GM decides to keep Mike, then we know who made that decision and we know that it was made before the guy was hired as a condition of the guy’s stating after he was hired that Mike is his guy. If that happens, the guy is either brain dead or a sellout.

I’m picking the latter.

I refer you again to the video tape, in which Gearon et al swore, literally, that they just had to try to oust Belkin because how could they not stand behind their GM, how could they not let the GM do precisely what it was that they hired him to do.

They had no choice, they said, and the media to a man bought that, hook, line and sinker. So, what has changed. Nothing, is the answer.

By Astro Joe

May 8, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

Where’s Sekou? I assume working on the definitive interview with BK (I hope).

My vote for the next GM is someone whose name I didn’t know a month ago. I don’t want an ex-player, studio host, game commentator ao anyone like that. I want a Thomas Dimitroff-type guy, someone who lives and breaths evaluating talent, coaches and how to build a winning franchise. Someone with 10+ years of experience working as a scout, team exec or even a former coach. Anyone but someone who most recently spoke into a microphone.

By richbrave

May 8, 2008 6:21 PM | Link to this

OMG remind me to take ERNIE GRUNFELD’s brain out of the freezer. He’s sayin’ like an ARENAS parrott, we gotta’sign JAMISON, we gotta’ sign JAMISON. DAMM. Let both go. Time to reload with some chest-thumpin’ defenders.

By Nate ArchiBALL

May 8, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this

I was thinking along the same lines Astro Joe….and would like to throw out the following name - Harold Ellis. I know the question is “Who is Harold Ellis?” Harold is currently the minor league coordinator of the Atlanta Hawks. Harold has worked in the Hawks organization for 6 years and has an extensive professional basketball background. It includes playing time in the NBA, CBA, USBL and Greece. Coaching experience includes assistant jobs in the D-League, IBL, CBA and as the Head coach and General Manager of the Rome (GA) Gladiators, back to back Champions of the World Basketball Association. Born and raised in Atlanta, Harold is a graduate of Douglass High School, Morehouse College, holds a master’s degree in sports management and is currently working toward a Ph.D. in sports psychology. Very familiar with the current staff and team. It would be nice to see him get a shot at the GM job. Check out his bio on the Hawks website.

By infamousrks

May 8, 2008 7:55 PM | Link to this

hey Flash….speaking of “bought the pot” (your 2:39PM post) ! this http://www.ajc.com/multimedia/content/multimedia/video/index.html?clip=85667 is disturbing ! Josh Howard homeboy…..

By He is where?

May 8, 2008 7:56 PM | Link to this

Somewhere soakin in the rays with some ladies and unlimited top shelf margaritas?

Sekou!

Sekou, where are you?!

(Marsha, Marsha, Marsha?)

Who needs Sekou?

AJC do.

Sekou where the dadgum jimminy leyritz are you?!!

By Steve T

May 8, 2008 8:09 PM | Link to this

Someone keep asking for the falcons type GM. Let us becareful of what we asked for because as it turns out the Pats may not have been as great as you think. It is rumored that they may have recorded the Rams walk through before the super bowl, and as anyone who played football knows, the walks is your whole game plan for the game. If that is the case, the Pats barely won the game with all that help. If it was not for the tapes, you may never heard of the guy.

I think Steve Smith will make a great GM because he knows that game. He was not the type of player who did not have the most talent, but the found a way to raise to the top.

By infamousrks

May 8, 2008 8:27 PM | Link to this

this team needs direction (in more ways than 1) ! the GM has got to be someone who “a chip on their shoulder”. he’s gotta want to prove that the ATL is a basketball city to the world (and David Anderson).

you have to please the fans first….and ownership second! without us…..this team is up for sale with a substantial loss for the “BS”-ASG!

not to mention…the guy that thought of puttin’ the word “SPIRIT” in the ownership’s title should be in the unemployment line with Billy on Friday!

why own a team IF YOU’RE NOT PROMISING AN EFFORT TO CREATE A CHAMPION FOR YOUR CITY, year in…year out ?

By infamousrks

May 8, 2008 8:30 PM | Link to this

“where in the world is SEKOU-SAN DIEGOOOOOOO” ?

By He is where?

May 8, 2008 8:41 PM | Link to this

619 makes sense.

Hopefully, J Hamilton ain’t traveling with him!

By He is where?

May 8, 2008 8:46 PM | Link to this

619 makes sense.

Hopefully J Hamilton ain’t traveling with him!

By He is where?

May 8, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

Sorry bout the double post.

By ray

May 8, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

Today In The News

Okay, so the Afro Ayatollah threw his favorite fro pick down and stomped on it. I’m not cryin’. He probably isn’t either. Woodson is probably singing to himself while idly stroking a can of Rogaine.

Let me tell you I thought for sure that the fateful no-handshake with Belkin had earned Knight another decade with the 9 rings of doom (oops, sorry…wrong movie)…ahem..with the Spirit Group. Welllll….no. As I said before, apparently ol’ Mike Woodson is the better yes-man. For now. All we need is a new GM. The madness will stop.

Speaking of which, DrMaryB asks me what would I do with Woodson’s roster? Well now Mary ol’ gal, do you mean the Hawks roster, or the roster that Woody recognizes on a regular basis? No seriously, I’ll tell you precisely what I’d do with them: win 4 games all season. Why? Just a two reasons:

1) Injuries. Injuries, you ask? Injuries, I say. Injury 1: Marvin Williams misses several games due to surgery recommended by somebody to remove whatever the hell it is that makes his a$$ stick out so far and unbalance him when he’s driving to the basket. Injury 2: Josh Smith misses several games due to a repeated leg injury. The injury occurs every time he shoots a 3-pointer in transition. Cause of injury? Somebody hires Tonya Harding to run out and hit him in the leg with a stick each time he does it. I can’t imagine who’d think of something like that… Injury 3: Joe Johnson misses several games due to blunt force trauma to the head. Cause of injury? Hawks point guard Acie Law was instructed most repititively by former Hawks coach Mike Woodson to immediately pass the ball to Joe Johnson the very second he gets across the half court line. He was practically brain-washed with the concept. So, during a game, he suffers a flashback. As he crosses the half court line, he suddenly fires a pass right to Joe Johson, who has his back turned. Johnson goes down in a heap. Veteran NBA referee Dick Bavetta gets confused and calls a flagrant 2 on Acie Law. Law tries to explain that Joe is his teammate and gets T’ed up by referee Joey Crawford for arguing. The review of the tape and the calls go to the League Office. Stu Jackson and David Stern suspend Law for 60 games.

And the other reason I could only win 4 games? Simple: regardless of what I do know and what I think I know….I’m not an NBA coach, and the Holiday Inn Express was booked full last night. I stayed at the Hampton Inn.

And I’m out….

By ray

May 8, 2008 9:44 PM | Link to this

Matt, there is no defense for that. We had three or four guys like that already and were in absolute desperate need of a pg and/or center. Milwaukee did the smart thing and drafted the only true and good center in the draft. They had a pg or two that were more than solid, so no need to pick Paul or any other pg. But since we’re still on this argument, here’s a couple facts/opinions:

1)Those links you mentioned in your post aren’t links. They’re typed words. Was there a purpose to NOT providing links to articles that are supposed to support your argument?

2)I don’t recall every bit of media outlet available on the players in the 2005 draft, to be honest. I’m still not buying that Marvin was projected as the best talent in the draft. The most upside? Possible, but that is not the same as the best talent, nor is it the same as calling somebody a future superstar. I just don’t remember it that way. Which leads to #3: 3) If you’re suggesting that Billy drafted him based on this “best player in the draft” concept, whether it meant potential superstar or otherwise…I’m not buying that either simply because Billy has NEVER drafted like that. Otherwise, there’s no way he’d have drafted most of the guys he did draft. Hell, Billy doesn’t even go off of the idea that you draft the best available talent left when it’s your turn. How else do you explain picks like Sheldon (when Roy, Foye, and Gay were available), Chill (when Deng and Iggy were available), Donta Smith (Donta Smith??), Solomon Jones, Cenk Aykol (who?), etc….

4)I could be wrong, and you could be right. I don’t mind being wrong. But posting “ghost” links isn’t the way to go about it.

5)I don’t seem to recall anybody even mentioning trying to trade up and get this marvelous wondrous talent known as Marvin Williams. Not one peep. Of course, that wouldn’t have anything to do at all with the entire planet KNOWING that Billy Knight was going to draft the same kind of guy he seemed to fall in love with every time he had a draft pick in his hands….nahhhh

By MsDee

May 8, 2008 9:45 PM | Link to this

Hey Sekou, why dont u have a picture of u like Terrence Moore and the others do?? Just curious..

By ray

May 8, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this

Whatever’s coming next from Sekou has got to be pretty juicy, ‘cause he’s been rather quiet…

My vote is Steve Smith for GM…

By NCBravesFan

May 8, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

I hope the Spirit will be patient and play with the nice hand they’ve been dealt. They’ve got a young team with a lot of good pieces. Their playoff performance no doubt got them some attention with this year’s crop of free agents.

They need a GM who is a good talent evaluator who can come in and sign a couple of key players via free agency, and continue building the team with the draft picks they still have the next couple of years.

It’s an attractive opening for somebody, and the Spirit needs to ACT that way by being selective.

By HB Ando

May 8, 2008 11:29 PM | Link to this

Well, it’s about four years too late.

But you know what they say is better than never.

I think my work here is done…………..

By The Flash

May 8, 2008 11:49 PM | Link to this

There is only one guy me and the rest of you could possibly trust to do the job with integrity, decisiveness, and an ability to make and adapt a strategic plan that will make all of us proud.

No, your work, my friend, is not done, it only just begins. Ladies and Gents, I say, your friend and mine, ANDOMAN, MUST BE THE NEXT GM!!

By eric

May 8, 2008 11:57 PM | Link to this

HEY RAY

YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY YOU’RE NOT FUNNY

By Matt

May 9, 2008 12:05 AM | Link to this

Ray,

I honestly have no clue why the links didn’t post. I tried posting the links in a separate post right after, but I guess it didn’t go through. I’ll try them one at a time, in order. Here’s link 1: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/draft/2005-small-forwards.htm

By terrell barron

May 9, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this

Watching CP3 against the Spurs, makes me sick to my stomach, thinking how we passed on him for FUMBLING, TUMBLING, STUMBLING, Williams. Damn,Damn,Damn!

By Matt

May 9, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this

And here’s link number two: http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=328897

By Link 3

May 9, 2008 12:08 AM | Link to this

Yup, I’m still going: http://www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/draft/2005-06-28-marvin-williams_x.htm

By Matt

May 9, 2008 12:15 AM | Link to this

And last, but certainly not least: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/10/sports/basketball/10williams.html?_r=1&8hpib&oref=slogin

I don’t appreciate the suggestion that I was somehow ducking my arguments. I’m sick of arguing all this BS anyway. Feel free to interpret the 2005 draft however you want, Ray. I’m done arguing about it.

By MJ3

May 9, 2008 12:28 AM | Link to this

Ray,

You hear any talk about people trading up to take Durant or Oden this year? Or LeBron/Darko/Carmelo in 2003? What about Yao Ming in 2002? Of course not. I guess based on your stupid-a*******ed logic, that means no other GMs wanted any of them either, right?

The general rule is that no one is stupid enough to trade down when they have a chance to take someone projected to be a franchise player. When you have that chance, you don’t draft for need - just ask the Blazers GM who drafted Sam Bowie over MJ or the GMs who picked Olowokandi, LaFrentz, and Traylor instead of Jamison, Carter, or Pierce. And no matter how much you and Ando and Clyde try to rewrite history, Marvin was projected to be a franchise player.

By MJ3

May 9, 2008 12:55 AM | Link to this

I’ll also point out one thing from the first link Matt sent out: “If Williams is not picked first overall by Milwaukee, Atlanta could entertain trade offers for the No. 2 pick, but that would affect Williams’ destination, not his draft position.”

So your BS about how Marvin was only projected to go #2 because Billy wanted to take him there is just that - the biggest load of revisionist BS that’s ever been posted on here.

By MannyT

May 9, 2008 12:58 AM | Link to this

W/o trying to sound schizo. Yes Marvin was projected to be the best player in the 2005 draft. No he didn’t turn out to be the man.

Could be worse. Check out this draft summary about Bill Russell in 1956.

Matt don’t stress about it. Sometimes when I get my link on, the editors/censors just put their scroll on and skip my entire post. Just don’t let them call you the missing link ;-)

PAIN

By BA

May 9, 2008 1:00 AM | Link to this

Thanks for the links, Matt. The thing I don’t get about the widespread dismissal of Marvin Williams is this: he’s only 22 freakin’ years old. How can you say definitively how good he is or isn’t at only 22? He’s a 22 year old third year player that was set back by an injury. And in spite of that he’s improved at a steady clip every year. We know two things for a fact: he’s a hard worker and a good kid. I think he’ll be a fixture at the three for the Hawks for a long time. Maybe he’s not as intense as Horford and Smith. Maybe he’ll never have their rebounding numbers. He’s a different kind of player. Glavine never pumped his fist like Smoltz. They’re both going to the hall of fame.

By Matt

May 9, 2008 1:23 AM | Link to this

There is one thing I will say though, after watching CP3 put up 35 and 9 against the defending champs tonight (in a loss, but still): Even if Marvin does have an unlikely breakout season next year, he will go down as one of the biggest busts in draft history because he was taken right before not one but two likely Hall of Famers.

Far more amusing (gotta love schadenfreude) is the sheer number of busts from that draft. Gerald Green (who was originally projected as a top 5 pick), Ike Diogu, Charlie Villanueva and Channing Frye (both of whose stats have actually gone down every year). Obviously, Bogut hasn’t lived up to his billing either, Among the top 15 picks, only the top 5 plus Bynum have shown any signs of life. And there are as many future All-Stars outside the top 15 (Danny Granger, Monta Ellis, and future DPOTY Maxiell) as inside (CP3, Deron, and Bynum). Kind of like the 2001 draft, where JJ, Gasol, and Battier were the only Top 10 picks who came even close to living up to their draft position.

By MannyT

May 9, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this

Which of these things should I take away from the Marvin postings.

a. Marvin’s potential is a lot lower than the professional scouts thought. I guess BK should have known.

b. Marvin still has a lot of upside, but is not developing in Atlanta. Is Marvin a trouble maker that doesn’t listen to the coaches? Never ever heard such a thing. Developing players IS a part of coaching.

hmmmmm

PAIN

By terrell barron

May 9, 2008 8:48 AM | Link to this

I dont understand why nobody wants to give BK credit for last years draft, when half of yall were screaming for Conley or YI at #3. Thats laughable! Some even wanted Brandon Wright or Joakim Noah, for crying out loud. PLEASE! He made some mistakes, but he got that one right. Give him credit!

By Melvin

May 9, 2008 9:55 AM | Link to this

There are reports on Hoopshype that the Hawks are interested in Bernie Bickerstaff (Bobcats) and Dennis Lindsey (Assist GM Spurs) to fill the vacant GM position. If this is true, I think this is good signs b/c I prefer they hire a GM versus allowing one of the owners to play double duty to fill that position…

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2008 10:09 AM | Link to this

MannyT, we all know that of the 3 ways to acquire players… draft, free agency and trades, the draft is the most risky by far. We entered last season with 9 players on rookie contracts. 9. Yes, BK made several draft day mistakes, but he also was forced to build the team via the most risky of all methods. When you ask someone to drive an AMC Pacer with 3 working cylinders and 1 flat tire, you shouldn’t complain when he doesn’t get to the airport at the same time as the guy driving the new Maxima, Accord or in some cases, Lexus. Yes, he needed to go. But so does Woody (who decided to drain the car’s oil & coolant in hopes that the car’s reduced weight would allow it to go faster). We can’t let go of the owners who have us operating with a bottom 3 payroll and usurped the authority of their GM. I just wish they would get lucky enough to hire a competent GM, give him a $65M budget, allow him to hire a competent head coach and STAY THE F OUT OF HIS WAY!

By doc

May 9, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

bernie bickerstaff is a cheap copy of bk ….. i. e. a loser, or maybe better put a guy with a checkered past as a winnnng gm. he has been bad enought to end up doing the waddel or isiah thing having to coach the team he put together, no?

i would take my chances on someone from an organization that knows how to get it done. the problem again remains to be whether the owners are willling to step up and become an nba team budget wise or a wanna be nbdl team with the pretense to only shoot as high as the playoffs every five years or so. i still think the bk vs/and/or woody argument is a moot one in that it all started at the top with the divorce and has gone downhill since then.

anyone know who leaked the story about bk wanting to fire woody? hmmmm, maybe one of the owners to put the heat somewhere else and get the controversy off their square shoulders for the responsibility for this mess? just asking.

as aj said bk was given the reins to manage this team by the trickiest of ways through the draft which no other organization has done exclusively to date since chicago can now be considered a failure. unfortunately he misjudged on some huge blunders. the first is well documented if we were drafting for need as marvin was considered a potential as number one that year ahead of bogut by many experts. paul nor d will were in that class so many missed the boat there. see above as i guess that is matt’s point for sending the links. the biggest faux pas for bk was to the next year REACH for need instead of going the roy route. who did that appease management to keep it cheap or woody to get the best big available under a cheap azz budget? this year he might have blown it with acie instead of stuckey but he was going the safe route hoping his coach wold handle it from there.

a rookie has to do it for woody in spite of woody is my impression from what i have seen. ergo the continuation of the problem unless you give woody his hand picked vet folks. if this a failure then you will have to start all over a huge penalty as you will have contracts for the vets to manage.

By KevinM

May 9, 2008 10:50 AM | Link to this

Enough of the CP3 debate….he wasn’t BK’s 2nd choice either…what is funny is that he ended up signing CP3s backup, Speedy, and that should have caused his demise much earlier than it did. I didn’t like the Rasheed trade, I didn’t like the Harrington trade for Stephen Jackson, who has had some big moments and I didn’t like how he handled the Shellhead draft. He didn’t even work him out before he selected him? He brought in Rondo, Roy & Foye and didn’t see it. Face it, BK does not know guards when they are right in front of his face. He would like to be considered the bb expert (what a joke!), but the only thing he does know how to do is quit when he knows he can’t control everyone. Glad he’s gone, no more non-quotes and we now have a draft where we aren’t a factor at all. Nice.

I know BK could go up to New York and ruin that franchise…oh wait, its already ruined! Well, he can’t lose up there can he?

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2008 11:03 AM | Link to this

Doc, but let’s also admit that Roy had injury problems in college. And guess what, he hasn’t been much healthier in the pros. Shelden was a reach but I agree with the approach… draft an interior defender. I will always believe that one of the reason Shelden was selected had to do with his agent… Arn Tellum. I find it hard to believe that JJ really wanted to play for the Hawks and not take a comparable offer from the Suns. I think Tellum pushed him our way and in return, BK “owed him one”. And that “one” was Shelden, another Tellum client. I think Tellum likely leaked the “Hawks will draft Shelden at #5” rumors early in the process… likely to try to create some marketplace excitement for his client. Shelden clearly was a bust at #5 (keep in mind he was the 4th big chosen that year), but I can’t blame BK for passing on Roy… an oft-injured wing, when we clearly needed a big-ugly to protect the rim. Trading down and getting another bust like Sene, Armstrong or Simmons may have been another alternative… since ownership likely would not have allowed him to trade the pick for an actual veteran. Bottom line, we needed a big in the draft and it looks like the best ones selected (after Aldridge) were chosen at #23 (Josh Boone) and #47 (Paul Millsap).

By I.MUS WRITE

May 9, 2008 11:26 AM | Link to this

Im really proud of our guys for their showing in the first round- Way to compete against a far superior team -ouiii !!

Jesus man -Iz Coach x really going to be extended……… Wow the sun went away and the storm clouds are rolling in.

I had this sick feeling that he would return because of our first round performance- If you have followed this team all year,you know that X had little to do with those 3 home wins. If X is resigned this will negate any moves made in the off season…………. Y -offense will be the same, the bench will still not be used, and josh will still be jacking up those 3’s…… dam it this is disgusting.

I think the wrong guy got fired -I was 50/50 on Bk but Woody @#$%#@*&&^%%^&^. First order of bussines is to Resign the Joshes and find a coach right away.

Is Bibby really the answer for us at point…… he looked horrible …… not because his shot was off-the guy is a terrible defender. Maybe we could do a Marvin for Calderon. Sign Diop to start at center and bring in james Jones or a Bonzi wells type. I would use zaza/bibby as trade bait to strengthen the bench and gain sum cap space. I would prefer solomon as our primary back up center, the guy is athletic and plays hard around the rim.

PG Calderon SG JJ SF JS PF Horford C Diop

Bench-Law,Chillz,Solomon,J Jones,D Anderson I think this line up is better, Horford goes to pf, we get a defensive 7 foot center and a pg who plays both ends.

Bibby jj marvin JS Horford

By The Flash

May 9, 2008 12:02 PM | Link to this

BK didn’t pick MW instead of CP with disregard for need! That is a flat isstatement of fact. BK and Gearon and the pundits repeatedly said that the Hawks had their star point guard for the future. His Name—James Johnson—and they were flat wrong, as I said at the time.

If that entire JJ thing had been assessed and handled professionally in the best interests of this club, CP and JJ are here, as is at least one other first round draft choice, to me, it should and would have been both.

JJ was supposed to be the Hawks Magic and if you have Magic, who needs Zeke. It was this gross misperception of JJ’s ability to lead and distribute, create for others, that drove the bus on the selection of Marvin over Paul.

By Raptors fan in TO

May 9, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

Newsflash from Toronto for all you hopeful of a Calderon-in-Atlanta scenario: Calderon just stated on his blog that he wants to be a starter next year. This is significant since Ford said the same thing two weeks ago. I feared this day would come, but it does indeed look like the Raps will have to deal one of them….. and (a wild guess) one of them will land in Atlanta or Milwaukee. I still think Calderon will be the one staying up north, though

By ray

May 9, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

Matt, I wasn’t suggesting that you were ducking your arguments, or I would’ve said as much verbatim. I seem to detect a bit of that “courtroom presence” in your statement. I wanted the proof you said was there and didn’t understand why you were posting links that just weren’t links. Fact is, I read each one you posted and am impressed at the fact that you went back and got all of that. As I said, I don’t mind being wrong, and your first link was the only one necessary to prove me wrong. I even looked to see what DrafExpress.Com had to say. Similar things. Again, you made your point.

Unfortunately for us, my being wrong and your being right is nothing in comparison to Billy Knight’s being wrong…

As for continuing to argue this point, I believe it was you that came after me (your 2:46 a.m. It must be the lawyer in you, lol!). AGAIN, you were right. Point made, point taken. And you’re correct, we don’t need to argue it anymore because it IS what it IS. We don’t have to converse at all if that’s what you prefer. No problems.

MJ3, it’s as simple as this: I said one thing that was wrong and Matt corrected me with proof. Decided to chime in after you saw the proof in the links, did ya? LOL!!You can call it revisionist BS if it makes you feel like you’ve won some something. I know what your real problem is with me, but we won’t go there. Fact is, you’ve never made a comment in my direction that wasn’t an argument, so continuing to attempt to discuss any of the points you made in your 12:28 post are probably just a waste of time. After all, you hate my a$$ so bad, you’re not going to agree with a single damn thing I say (which is actually amusing at times), especially if it has anything at all to do with Marvin. Ah well. I deal with lots of people like you every day. All part of the job….

By The Flash

May 9, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this

The reason that they did not choose Paul was because BK and Gearon were oh so sure that JJ was the answer at “the point—that his first name was really **MAGIC. If you have Magic who needs the next Zeke, so you take the best player available.

It was clear to me, and I said so at the time, that JJ could not play the point on a regular basis.

So, missing on Paul was of one piece with the fiasco surrounding the give away to get JJ. Those are the facts.

By mykhalc

May 9, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

LARRY DREW welcome to CALI (only a matter of time). i’m sure bein’ a year late won’t really matter once you’ve landed with a class act franchise such as SAC. THEUS did a great job with that young team and i’m sure you’ll only add to the knowledge. too bad the BRAINLESS TRUST didn’t give you a shot to run things here. but then again, MAYBE somebody was tryin’ to give you a shot this past season!!!hhhmmmmm, i bet he’s on his way to someplace else also!!!

By ray

May 9, 2008 1:41 PM | Link to this

Flash, the man said that he laughed when people suggested that we needed a point guard. I remember him saying that in an article. I couldn’t believe my eyes when I read it (and no I don’t have the link, ask Matt, he’s good at that…when the AJC isn’t screwing with the blog AGAIN).

In his twisted little mind, he didn’t draft disregarding “need.” He denied the “need” altogether. On his revolutionary new NBA team, no pg needed. Delusional. Crazy. We won’t even go into why it worked with Magic Johnson’s team. It would be pointless because of three reasons: JJ isn’t Magic (and couldn’t ever be), our coach is nowhere near the level of Pat Riley, and our roster set-up is nowhere near what theirs was.

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2008 2:09 PM | Link to this

Flash, I don’t think he thought JJ was Magic, but I do think he thought of him as a bigger Billups. I personally think that problem was that Harrington wasn’t good enough to be the leading scorer, which forced JJ to have to become a primary scorer. But if you look at JJ’s 6 dimes a game in his first year with us, he really did serve as our “lead guard”. It’s just that Harrington was far too inconsistent to become a legit #1 scoring option.

By mykhalc

May 9, 2008 2:24 PM | Link to this

JOE, thank you!!! problem was supportin cast…PERIOD!!! JJ can play 1, 2, 3…EASY!!! now we can debate all we want about his ‘best’ position but had JJ had a supportin’ cast like that in PHO, where he did back NASH up at times, i doubt we’d be havin’ this discussion!!!

we can hate on whomever we choose but let’s keep it real!!!!

and just to keep it real, 2 yrs after the fact, JJ DID ADMIT that he did NOT wanna go that route (PG) again!!! so obviously, he NOW KNOWS that is NOT his best position!!! but before then, JJ wanted the ball in his hands…PERIOD!!! thru the 1 or whatever position put it there!!!

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this

mykhalc, Harrington quickly went from a promising offensive player to an after-thought in about 3 years. I don’t know if he was simply exposed with more playing time or if his knees have limited his production. But I know that I was hugely disappointed in his tenure with the Hawks. Maybe I was hoping for too much, especially after watching him torch us for 40 the previous year when he started a game with the Pacers. I really thought we were getting a Mashburn/Glenn Robinson type scorer. Boy, was I wrong.

By infamouskrs

May 9, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

they may have wanted him to play the 1…but be honest now…do you really believe he is capable of guarding the TParkers and the CBillups of the league, night in and night out? and still be the guy that was going to set up the offense on the other end?

he is NOT A VOCAL LEADER (PG requirement in my book) !

he’s always been that guy that’s been open on the wing that has killed teams after receiving that first pass. only during the roller-coaster playoff stint…did i see JJ possess that attack-first kinda swagger….and damn, it was nice to see! but he is not the kind of “general” needed to do that every game!

just thinkin’ out loud now…but how would a Bibby/Smoove for AMiller/ Iggy deal sound? heard Iggy turned down an extension..and Miller is debating another scenary change@!

go after a Diop, Nesterovic, LaFrentz, a Doleac ..or my sleeper, Earl Barron ( all unrestricted centers) from around the league!

like i said…just thinking out loud!

By cp

May 9, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

I understand the reason BK gave for drafting Sheldon but it was clear to me after seeing Sheldon at Duke that he was not really that good. He got the benefit of a lot of calls being a Duke player. His last year at Duke Sheldon was torched on the defensive end on a routine basis. Guys like Alexander Johnson were putting up career highs against Sheldon. When the draft camp measurements came out it really should have made BK rethink drafting him. Sheldon turned out to be a lot shorter than listed at Duke and he did not have great length. Throw in the fact that he had terrible footwork and bad hands and it is clear why nobody else was thinking about drafting him in the top 10. If BK would have worked him out or just looked at film he would have seen all of those issues.

By cp

May 9, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this

There is a report that the Nuggets are listening to trade offers for Melo. Do you guys think he would be a good fit here?. I really havent thought about a trade that would work or how he would look on our team. I just read the article so im throwing it out there. What do you guys think?

By Najeh Davenpoop

May 9, 2008 4:09 PM | Link to this

Sautee — yeah I knew I forgot someone.

cp — No.

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

infamouskrs, Billups? Definitely. The little PGs would have given him problems on their end of the floor, but likewise, what would Jameer Nelson (to use someone in our division) do in the low blocks with JJ? Folk act like BK was suggesting that JJ could have played center or something. The experiment failed but not because it couldn’t be done but because it sub-optimized JJ’s talents and the team’s ability to score points.

By infamouskrs

May 9, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this

sorry AJ…but Nelson doesn’t need to go low in the blocks… EVER…

reason is obvious (DHoward)..just a bad example, i understand!

the last part of your post…echo’s mine…..a big 2 guard experiment at the point equals “sub-optimizing JJ’s talents”.

By Harry Hawk

May 9, 2008 4:51 PM | Link to this

We need a new blog. Sekou’s gotta give us something to chew on.

Come on, Sekou! We’re freakin’ dyin’ here, man!

By mykhalc

May 9, 2008 5:03 PM | Link to this

JOE, i think you hit on both points about AH. he was not who we thought he was nor did his knees let him become what maybe his ‘potential’ said he could be. AH has landed on the bench out here in NELLIE-ville also. and i’d say for the same reasons you mentioned.

infamouskrs, good ‘keepin’ it real’ post man.LOL i say JJ could cover BILLUPS all-nite, no problem. the PARKERS, CP3’s etc, the speed-demons, yeah they would be a problem, no doubt!!!

By The Flash

May 9, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this

JJ is not a distributor of the ball, he does not run an offense; he does not help his teammates create by getting them the ball with space and rhythm.

Pete Carrill once said that, if you think of doing other things first, it is not a pass.

JJ can play anywhere on the court and will be the same player, a scorer.

To be sure, he understands the game and is multitalented; he can do spot duty anywhere. However, to earn his money, he has to play the game with the perspective of a scorer which is what he is.

Assists are the most misleading statistic ever. Scorers who do not have high assists are ball hogs, like Big Dog Robinson was. The fact that a guy who draws the attention of the entire defense can find an open guy is unexceptionable and unremarkable, and does not make someone into the Big O, or Magic, or even Billips.

As for Al, once they let things get more than a month into the season without resigning him, he was playing not to get hurt. Both sides knew that and it served both sides’ interests. How can you move damaged goods.

If Al disappointed as a scorer (I have to say that that was not my impression, but I defer to you guys on that one), it was only because the Spirit didn’t pay or trade him. Instead, they kept him and the team in limbo. Why? Because the Spirit didn’t have the cash to run the team. They couldn’t pay him, and they couldn’t pay anyone who they would have traded him for. So they threw the season away. Almost killed by boy Andoman in the process.

By Dave

May 9, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this

SEKOU CAN WE GET AN UPDATE PLEASE? COACHING CANDIDATES? GM CANDIDATES? SMOOVE’S THOUGHTS ON WOODSON’S RETURN?

By The Flash

May 9, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this

Joe Johnson is at bottom a scorer plus. He has tremendous assets, including his gripe on the game, and can play anywhere in spots. But, he is worth the big bucks as a scorer, and he sees the game through a scorer’s eyes.

Pete Carrill is fond of saying that, if you think of doing other things first, it is not a pass. Joe doesn’t pass very often under that definition.

If Al disappointed somewhat as a scorer (that was not my understanding but I defer to Astroman on this completely), I have to think his spottiness in that regard came from having to play in limbo.

The Spirit had to resign or trade him. Because they did neither, it was in everyone’s interest that he not get hurt. Al’s playing not to get hurt almost killed our boy Andoman. It created a lost year for the franchise.

By drmaryb

May 9, 2008 6:44 PM | Link to this

Knock-Knock Who’s there? R R Who? R’nt You Glad we didn’t draft GREG OGDEN? HA HA HA HA! That guy is a super bust for LIFE!

Hey Richbrave The season is over, Now what are we gonna’ talk about?

The Braves? The Thug-Falcons? or the Mess over there at Phillips Arena?

Nuff’ Said!

By Sautee

May 9, 2008 6:52 PM | Link to this

Sekou told it like it IS in his grading of the Hawks.

Acie was not developed properly this year!

And whose fault would THAT be? Hmmmmm….

By infamousrks

May 9, 2008 6:53 PM | Link to this

if the current ownership situation is a clue of how multiple people have to agree on mutiple decisions…we can all rest better knowing that the NBA will “hopefully” never approve another sale like the one we all are suffering through!

gotta let the Jerry Jones’s, Red McCombs’s, and Paul Allen’s run these professional sports teams. less headaches………”BS”ASG members should all be ashamed of what they’ve put this city, the fans, and this franchise through!

“FIRE, THOSE BS-ASG CLOWNS” ! Clyde i’ll cut you in 60-40 if you print the shirts. get at me………..

By infamousrks

May 9, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this

again….i will ask the question….”WHY ARE THESE A**WHOLES IN THIS IF THEY ARE NOT WILLING TO DO EVERYTHING IT TAKES TO BUILD A CHAMPIONSHIP SQUAD…EVERY FREAKN’ YEAR” ?

someone please enlighten me…and don’t use the divorce as an excuse! they are the current owners and whatever you may post saying..”they don’t have the authority”…or “the court says this…the court says that”….i can name all kinds of moves (free agents+coach replacements+gameplans) that would have made the regular/post season(s) much more respectable!!

please save my eyes the reading time…i’m outta VISINE!

By infamousrks

May 9, 2008 7:16 PM | Link to this

again….i will ask the question….”WHY ARE THESE A**WHOLES IN THIS IF THEY ARE NOT WILLING TO DO EVERYTHING IT TAKES TO BUILD A CHAMPIONSHIP SQUAD…EVERY FREAKN’ YEAR” ?

someone please enlighten me…and don’t use the divorce as an excuse! they are the current owners and whatever you may post saying..”they don’t have the authority”…or “the court says this…the court says that”….i can name all kinds of moves (free agents+coach replacements+gameplans) that would have made the regular/post season(s) much more respectable!!

please save my eyes the reading time…i’m outta VISINE!

By tyger

May 9, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this

Another Perspective

Josh Smith - still an enigma, a wonderful selection at #17, but undersized for PF spot, but plays better near the hoop. Off the charts athleticism, but mentally limited. Brought along too quickly, so has little respect for the purity of the game.

Al Horford - robbed of ROY, needs to move to PF and expand his game offensively. He is the rock of this team.

Joe Johnson - shows flashes of super stardom but isnt the Kobe - Lebron franchise player you expect to see night in, night out. Too often, settles for Big Pass Joe rather than Olympic Joe that we paid for.

Marvin Williams - He will be forever burdened with comparisons to CP3 and Deron Williams. Forget that he was injured his 1st two seasons, he will likely blossom for another team down the road.

Mike Bibby - 3 pt. miracle shot sent Hawks to the playoffs; but cashed it in for the playoffs. Not worth $13M per, needs to be traded for better pieces.

Josh Childress - a wonderful baseline player that scores w/o the ball. High hoops IQ, but lacks strength and effective jumpshot. Good but not great.

AC Law - skilled but injury prone; needs to find his shot and take it, tried too hard to fit and passed up too many shots. Summer league will do him good.

Solomon Jones - suffers under Woody’s system; all he does is block shots and provide energy, yet cant get off the bench.

ZaZa Pachulia - has size and good inside offensive game but still flops too much to be a contributor. Can be an asset when paired with Horford, but coach doesnt see it.

Salim Stoudamire - a pure waste of talent that falls squarely on the shoulders of Woodson.

Mario West - who? what? why?

Jeremy Richardson - another waste of talent that could benefit from new coaching.

By infamousrks

May 9, 2008 7:52 PM | Link to this

everyone on this blog….remember Tyger’s last post quote’s ending words(CLASSIC), “could benefit from new coaching” !

THIS ENTIRE ORGANIZATION would benefit from new+”sane” coaching!

By kwooden1

May 9, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this

The Flash, I hope your right about Gearon because I really don’t want Woodson to get an extension. I think Woodson would further stunt the growth of JS, Marvin and Law. I think this is the summer that Marvin can really improve. He’s not a smooth player so he’ll never be able to finish like Lebron, but you would hope that he can become that type of player. I think he’s going to finally physically mature, which will help him drive with more power and finish better. He has to start taking more 3-point shots, because he should have the range.

With that said its good to hear that Management is actually looking for a GM. Looking at the salaries it really looks like they really need to do something with Speedy, his salary could really be used to either pay Chill’s or a Free Agent. Sekou, anything new on Speedy, has anyone seen him working-out?

By wtf

May 9, 2008 8:44 PM | Link to this

Can someone explain to me why Al Horford would be a better scorer playing the pf position? Seems to me when they actually fed him the ball and let him work he scored fine at the center position. So why would he put up these better numbers if he moved from the center position. Im really confused on that. If anything he has an advantage over most centers because of his quickness he just has to learn to use it. Marvin Williams will not be this great player if he leaves this team. Marvin is a role player at best. He is a 18 and 6 a night type player. He will never be this big scorer or big rebounder. He just does not have it in him.

Chris Paul is first team all nba. Second in mvp voting.. Deron Williams was second team all nba and should have made the all star team. Marvin Williams is not better than Josh Childress who is our sixth man. Time to admit Billy Knight dropped the ball on it and stop waiting for Marvin to turn into something he is not.

By infamousrks

May 9, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this

with the recent trend of “buying” players out….would SPEEDY GONZALEZ not qualify for an immediate “moving-on” type plan?

another heated subject..”KWOOD” , nice !

we’ve got lots to “chit-chat” about…………AAAALLLLLLLLL OFFFFSSSEEAASSSONNNNNNN !

By mykhalc

May 9, 2008 11:18 PM | Link to this

FLASH, no disrespect but i don’t think you watched enough HAWKS games this year.

BILLUPS is NOT a distributor of the ball either for that matter. he can just ball and he makes the right decisions…PERIOD!!!

and there was NO offense to run if that’s an argument!!! help his teammates create??? what teammates could ACTUALLY create???

now JJ might not be the things you’d look for in a PG but he OBVIOUSLY did ALL those things you said he didn’t, especially when you consider the lack of seasoned skills the rest of the team brought to the court…until BIBBY!!!

NBALP next year bro!!! then we can really talk!!!LOL

By ray

May 9, 2008 11:26 PM | Link to this

This is becoming not only stale. Still talking about Woodson’s ineptness. Still talking about superstar-in-the-waiting Marvin. New blog, please…

By SalimFan

May 9, 2008 11:44 PM | Link to this

What are the requirements for becoming a GM? I should apply, and you all could be my board of advisors.

We’d have this francise set for the next 20 years.

By ray

May 9, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this

Mykhalc, the problem is that JJ really doesn’t consistently excel at making his teammates better as a consistent and primary function. What Flash is saying is that his primary function is clearly scoring. It’s what he’s best at. The minute you make him the primary ball distributor and initiator of the offense, he suffers, and so does the team…simply because we need him as a scorer first and foremost, not as a facilitator.

Nobody is denying that he can facilitate. But he won’t do it as well as a guy more naturally suited to it. Reasons? Again, because he’s really a scorer who can do spot duty at that position. Also, because once he assumes that job/responsibility, you must have another primary scorer on the floor to make up for the scoring he won’t be able to do while he’s busy facilitating and distributing. So running JJ at point was not a good idea, unless you have that other scorer that picks up the slack. Basically, the one guy we had as a consistent, potent offensive threat was being double and triple-teamed already. Then they put the ball in his hands and asked him to score and get the ball to the scorers. Ridiculous, because he was the scorer. So where was that second scorer?

We haven’t seen that guy since Al Harrington left town (and others have already explained his fall-off in production). So let me guess, this wonder of a guy named Marvin was drafted. He wasn’t this off-the-ball scorer. Still isn’t. I don’t see any evidence that he ever will be. How about one of the Joshes? Nope. One works the baseline, the other is learning to shoot. Our offense revolves around JJ. But wait, you just made him the point guard. Hmmm. How about the center? Oh, we don’t have one. Nevermind. See? *This is why some of us were so pi$$ed about not drafting a point guard, or at least a guy with similar skills to JJ (like Roy or Foye). Then we would’ve had two guys with facilitating capabilities, but neither would be the sole bearer of either scorer or facilitator.

Either that, or get a good freakin’ point guard (by draft or otherwise) to take the pressure off of JJ. What’s funny is that it finally took Bibby coming in here for us to get a chance to see what JJ could do in his primary role as featured scorer without having to worry about initiating and distributing. Had JJ been capable of making his teammates that much better, there would be no need…but only if there were other true scoring threats besides him. There weren’t, because of the GM. There aren’t now, because of Woody.

No seriously. Who’s the secondary (or even third) scoring threats? You could say Josh Smith, but he doesn’t play within the flow of the offense. He can’t, because it’s a one-man offensive set-up. Horford doesn’t get the ball near enough. Marvin lacks the aggression, drive, whatever…Bibby gets the ball whenever JJ gets double-teamed. Woody hasn’t instituted a clear offensive strategy to take advantage of anybody’s strengths. I’m about done with harping on BK’s place in this because he ain’t here anymore (although his roster is). Pretty soon, we should have somebody else to blame in his place…

By ray

May 10, 2008 12:01 AM | Link to this

SalimFan, If you think we fight on this board now…imagine a handful of us with some actual authority. Hell, some wouldn’t make it out of a meeting alive….

By richbrave

May 10, 2008 12:04 AM | Link to this

drmaryb:

Just wrapping up another long session on this thesis and caught your post. Gotta’ finish corrections, print it and submit the final draft for approval.

Don’t know much about the HAWKS. I think BIBBY and his salary should be gone. This based on what I saw in the Boston series. Every time the greenies wanted him, he was rented. Shucks naw, they OWNED him. Maybe its bacause he didn’t have experienced players to pass to, but man his defense…..They would just post him up on the foul circle with Paul Pierce or Rajon Rondo and it was an automatic 2 or 3. I can’t see the $$$ for that type of play based on what ANDO says about the payroll and the ASG. And I think your man Josh Childress should slide as well. He’s too light to survive inside against those big dudes. Once he’s blown out a knee, he’ll be ordinary at best and a liability in my book.

Head’s reeling, my lady. Time to shower and hit the rack. Excuse me. Post me up tomorrow morning about 8:30 a.m. if you’re stirring.

By mykhalc

May 10, 2008 12:10 AM | Link to this

BIG RAY, i hear ya and to a certain extent do agree. but as you stated, where were the REAL options before BIBBY?? even with BIBBY’s shot MIA he still commanded attention!!! who else on the team really commanded ‘offensive’ attention. nobody really, at least not on a consistent basis!!

JJ is no doubt a scorer first but before i go doubtin’ his distribution skills, i’ll go back and look at tape with him at PHO when he relieved NASH at times, where he DID HAVE REAL OFFENSIVE OPTIONS and a team and coach loaded bball IQ!!!

By SalimFan

May 10, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this

Ray, I hear ya lol. We could use close balloting like on survivor.

I thinks with all of us voting we could come up with the correct decisions…..of course there’s a no tolerance clause on salim. All salim decisions will be decided by me hehehe.

By ray

May 10, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

Myk, he’s got the skills. That’s just not his natural role. In fact, he helped Phoenix keep right on rolling while Nash was out. But like you say, he had the scorers out there to get the scoring job done. One thing I had mentioned earlier is that JJ isn’t and will never be Magic Johnson. But if he were to come close, he could only do so on teams like Golden State and Phoenix. You see how much he like it in Phoenix (he hated it). That was one reason he came here. He did say that he wasn’t much interested in assuming such a role here….yet they tried it anyway….

Here in the ATL, he never had that. As you know, he has been the only consistent and true scoring threat here, so making him the facilitator took even that away. In fact, he b!tched about it (rightfully so) a few times. That’s where the blame spreads. You can blame HE WHO IS NO LONGER WITH US for not getting him the help he needed, and you can blame HE WHOM WE ARE STILL PLAGUED WITH for not helping to develop what we did have. Or you can just blame one, or just blame the other, or just copy and paste the last million blogs to save time…

By MannyT

May 10, 2008 12:33 AM | Link to this

I’m guessing that Sekou might be on vacation. There have been several twists and turns on this blog. Face it, now that we are in the off season, this is the type of stuff we will get unless there is a hiring/firing/trade/free agent pick up.

There are only so many what are you doing with your summer articles Sekou can write.

MEANWHILE, lot’s of topics have bubbled up here that could take us for a few weeks.

Woody future—short extension or real 2nd contract.

The next GM—Who? Is (s)he an innovator or owners’ yes man?

What happens to the Joshes?

What happens to the other free agents (Salim, Mario, Jeremy)?

What are the expectations for Bibby? (Assume he gets healthy during the offseason.)

Might blogZville actually have an official gathering?

BCU polls — 1. Who would make a good owner to replace the lawsuit loser(s)? Trying not to take sides here.

1. Pick the order of events. A. Hire GM B. Add new player via trade or free agency, not counting summer league C. Change in coaching staff (including assistants) D. ray says enough of this & gets his own blog

While I’m sure I’m in the minority here, at least there is some Atlanta Dream basketball for the summer.

Still WWDJ (Watching Woody Dance a Jig)

By mykhalc

May 10, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this

BIG RAY, loud and clear my friend…loud and clear!!LOL

By ray

May 10, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this

SalimFan, I hear ya. Heh, heh. Surely the board of directors could grant you that.

By MannyT

May 10, 2008 12:53 AM | Link to this

ray, mykhalc All I know about coaching could be written on a post it note. However, it seems to me that our PG challenges would benefit from that offense that Adelman ran in Sactown plus a touch of the Phoenix aggressiveness that fits our athleticism.

Move the darn ball in the half court!

Push the ball to the front court even on makes. Just pressure the other team with offensive aggressiveness. It gives you a chance to get more people involved.

Bibby has familiarity with it. I’m sure the fans would appreciate it more than pound that ball, pound that ball, you got to pound that ball…then shoot.

This could be very good CRAP!

By Matt

May 10, 2008 12:55 AM | Link to this

Ray,

Exams and some nagging health issues have been kicking my butt these past few weeks. That’s why I sounded a bit paranoid and snippy - you know how stress makes people do strange things, and my stress has hit a lifetime high in the past 4 weeks.

I do still hope that Marvin has a breakout year in ‘08-‘09, but I’m increasingly doubtful. He should have seen where his strengths are in Game 6 - knocking down open jumpers, using his quickness to get to the rack (and the foul line), and using his length and athleticism to harass opposing wings on D (he has the D tools of a slightly quicker-but-weaker version of Kirilenko). If he bulks up and extends his range by 4 feet, he can be an 18 and 8 guy easy. The extra bulk will give him better body control and allow him to fight through physical contact, and being a trey threat will force defenders to play him tight - which gives him an advantage because of his outstanding natural athleticism.

But all that depends on Marvin recognizing his weaknesses and working on them. And that, far more than anything else has been Marvin’s problem.

By ray

May 10, 2008 12:57 AM | Link to this

MannyT, YOU should get the blog…and then give me a limit on how many arguments I’m allowed to instigate or engage in. Besides, your tag lines are worthy of Clyde’s T-shirts. I keep waiting for the next one, and you don’t disappoint. You should get a copyright on the WAF. That’s where it all started….

By Matt

May 10, 2008 1:35 AM | Link to this

Just did my part by emailing owners(at)atlantaspirit.com and begging them not to hire Billy King.

Everyone else please do the same? Thanks ;-).

By MannyT

May 10, 2008 1:52 AM | Link to this

ray my ADD won’t allow me to blog on one topic all the time. That’s why I’ll reference movies, songs, old TV shows, etc to make a point. I do exist in another place in the blog universe, but I am far too inconsistent to make it useful.

Maybe I will make a T-shirt of silly acronyms. With respect to Dave O’Brien & as long as Paul McCartney & Wings doesn’t sue me…

You’d think that people would have had enough of dumb acronyms.

But I look around me and I see it isn’t so.

MannyT wanna fill the world with dumb acronyms?

And what’s wrong with that?

I’d like to know, cause here I go again

New G M, need a coach, New G M, need a coach,

Enough of me for the night. I gotta start working on that t-shirt design.

WAF, BWAF, CRAP, & PAIN with a little WWDJ to go with the lyrics above.

If I would only take the time to work on a video that would do this with some Hawks owners and coaches.

By ray

May 10, 2008 2:19 AM | Link to this

Matt, ain’t no problems, brother. I don’t envy you with those exams. Law school is NOT a joke, but well worth it when it’s over. Amen on that letter to the ASG.

As to Marvin, I too hope that he will expand his game. Even if he does so in another uniform. Hate to see him be less than he should be. Of course, I’d be more than happy to say that he may actually do so under another coach (gotta include that in the letter to the ASG). Well, here’s to another hot and listless summer, wondering how things are going to play out and wishing it was minicamp or preseason already…

MannyT, do you write jingles for a living? You should try it. Oh, and I like that song. Sounds a bit hokey at first, but the tune is catchy…

By BA

May 10, 2008 3:26 AM | Link to this

To really have a legitimste shot at winning it all in this league, I’m convinced you have to possess an embarasement of riches in terms of personnel. Marvin is going nowhere. Josh Smith is going nowhere. We’re going to need both of them, and Big Al, and even a couple more big euro-dudes to play with the big boys, east or west. We’re gonna need Bibby, Acie, Joe, Richardson, Childress, and maybe even another vet shooter. Speaking of Childress, I got to contest my boy RichBrave. I think Chills is a lot better than you have claimed and I certainly hope to retain him. When he started being (inexplicably) played at the point, I chalked it up as a dumb move by Woodson. Like everybody else. But if you think about it, in some scenarios he’d be damned handy to insert at the point, for two reasons. One: he almost never turns the ball. Two: he gives you a solid post defense option on some of the bigger points of the league. Oh, and one question, Rich- is Josh Anderson as fast as Otis Nixon was? My favorite Braves leadoff hitter of all time.

By BA

May 10, 2008 3:46 AM | Link to this

Ray, the ironic thing about Joe is this: now that he knows he’s not the point guard, he’s become the best point guard on the team. This past year Joe’s ball handling was excellent, I’d swear he’s gotten better. Didn’t he average more assists than Bibby anyway? In your line of work, I bet there’s quite a few things you don’t like to do. But I bet you’re damn good at doing them anyway. And hey, look at it this way- this will be the longest summer in awhile, and that’s the best news. Our team is good, and has a shot at being better than that next year. I’ll take that kind of extra long summer any year!

By infamousrks

May 10, 2008 8:29 AM | Link to this

being that we’re all on the outside looking in (Round 2)….i’ve got to say that i really am enjoying DeRon and CPaul announcing their arrival in the playoffs. DWill and Boozer are giving those “Utes” their first promising hope since Stocks & the Mailman! and damn…do they look good!

oh yeah…Kobe was ridiculous as well. tell me someone saw that dunk he did last night off the backboard!

gotta a feeling that Sekou’s gone deep undercover. He’s purchased some “TomCruise” spy gear….and he’s been gathering inside information from the inner walls of the BS-ASG Headquarters.

that or he’s “secretly” married (damn you, Nick..that was my girl) some R+B singer and is kicking up his heels on a beach on some remote island….sippin’ umbrella drinks!

ANDO…don’t you have your “SEKOU GPS LOCATER” on your blackberry?

By mykhalc

May 10, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

ANDO, any new additions to the family yet??? all the best to you and the mrs as time approaches!!!

By He is where?

May 10, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

Mexico?

By Horford Rox

May 10, 2008 12:50 PM | Link to this

Where is Sekou?

I believe Sam Cassell’s alien brethren snatched him and took Sekou to their home planet.

Blackberries don’t work from the Cassell Family Galaxy.

To Cassell’s Alien Kinfolk: Let our Sekou GO!!!

(If this posts twice, I apologize. My CPU ain’t playing nice today)

By Horford Rox

May 10, 2008 1:12 PM | Link to this

Yo CAK…Give Sekou back!!!

By ray

May 10, 2008 6:08 PM | Link to this

I got the new blog bluuuuuueeeeessss….

By infamousrks

May 10, 2008 8:30 PM | Link to this

nice what 18 holes can do your a guy….but to come home and only see a couple of enteries today is blaaahhhhhhhhh! i’d like to think that some of you are doing “better” than me! i can still walk a straight line………………….

By richbrave

May 10, 2008 8:50 PM | Link to this

BA:

My man. Didn’t say Chills wasn’t great whenever he’s on the court, or as an interchangable. I was just thinkin’, with the financial parameters ANDO(who’s in the know) says will apply to this team’s future, if he every loses his jumping ability, he’s dog-meat in the front-court in this league. So sign and trade for a front-court banger.

Of course, PG sounds interesting. If he can handle, distribute, and shoot well why not. That way, his ability to sky is not as important. He does have quick hands. Some steals would be great to go with the ones already being stolen by this club.

By Horford Rox

May 10, 2008 8:55 PM | Link to this

Any chance Craig Claxton would show up if I threw him a retirement party?

We could talk about the good times…before he came to ATL and started stealing $$$$$$$$$!!

Do us a favor, Craig (that is your name, right?) RETIRE!!!!!

By Horford Rox

May 10, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this

Do your broken down kneecaps a favor, Craig (Isn’t that your name?) RETIRE!!!!!!!

By richbrave

May 10, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this

BA:

Josh Anderson and Otis Nixon in the same breath. Shame. Go wash your fingerrrs out with soap.

Actually, It doesn’t seem that way to me. I’ve only seen his twice in person. None of his chances in those two games were really spectacular. I heard(on the radio) several times when a fly-ball went over his head to the base of the center-field wall. Maybe he misjudged, and maybe he’s just not fast enough to get there. Otis almost always was.

You know, he’s made some spectacular plays in the outfield this year shagging flys. Sometimes they’re spectacular because there’s no Andruw Jones in his prime or Otis Nixon cruising under them and making the play seem easy.

By doc

May 10, 2008 9:26 PM | Link to this

all one has to do is look over at the sibling organization and realize all is not well on the western front either. it is quite a trial to make headway of the muddy water of the entity called the BASG.

i need some proof that there is something called competence before getting too giddy about the expectations going forward with the present team and coach. one simple injury and this team is going to the bottom again and it could be back to the past with a team gaining less than thirty games with a salary collective of 57 mil if people are signed that should be signed. wasnt that where we picked this thing up with a we are going to blow this up and rebuild the smart way through the draft? YIKES!

By drmaryb

May 10, 2008 10:47 PM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star

I loved your response to me a few days back re: What you would do with Woody’s Roster?

You are a stone cold NUT You are so damned funny and ridiculous man - it ‘s a shame how your sick AZZ mind is wired. I gotta’ get you an agent and PIMP your AZZ - So that I can diversify my INCOME and buy and extra beach front mansion or two!

LOL! LMAO! LMBoobiesO too!

Where do you get all your stuff from? Maybe like KOBE said about AAAAH! who is that perimeter defender for the SUNS? anyway, when he close-lined KOBE in the playoffs a couple years back?

Kobe said, “Maybe he did’nt get enough hugs as a kid.”

Ray-Star? Did you get enough HUGS when you were a Kid?** smile

Who is that GUY who plays perimeter D for the suns? I can’t sleep now for tryin’ to remember - his name starts with a R …AAAAh! I’m Stuck now, anyway

I LOVE ME SOME RAY-STAY yes STAY!

RichBrave Who Ya Wit! You better still be WIT - ME! Man I have been so darned busy with my football team. I just left The Roswell High School Stadium where we play. The Atlanta - Xplosion just defeated the West Palm Beach - Punishers 37-0 We Look like a Pro-Set.

Our Defensive Coor. is Andre Jones - He was drafted by the Detroit Lions and played with Barry Sanders and for Bobby Ross. He has a Super Bowl RING I think with the New England Patriots and also played for the Minnesota Vikings He is a pretty impressive guy. He is so cool!

This was our first home game and we are now 2-2 on the season. We are rebuilding with 22 rookies this year! I love my team. So, I don’t get to blog as much for now, but I miss you so much…Soon that THESIS will be written with a GRADE A+ smile!

Hey doc how’s my favorite doc? The season is over - but not the DRAMA! That will last forever it seems! This ASG is a stone cold trip! What are we gonna’ do? I’m like Ray-Star I like Steve Smith for GM. He’s so bright and classy, and I genuinely believe he would embrace the media and talk to the FANS at least a little bit! I like him a lot - he’s a philanthropist!

I just wanna give a shout-out! to: MannyT NajehD SalimFan
Clyde Ando & Mykhalc These are just a few of my favorite things!!!

By drmaryb

May 10, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this

Hey HorfordRox

I feel U man on that Not-So-Speedy CRAIG Claxton That Bi-atch needs to get the hell out of atlanta! I’m so sick of his WARD-ROBE

If i see him wear that purple velvet-rope jacket - One more time I am gonna take it and Hang him with it!** One arm of his sleeve should be just long enough to wrap around his thick-azz neck!

He is not different than the Bust #1 Pick - Geraldine OGDEN! I mean come on man, if you need micro-fracture surgery the minute you sign the contract?

That is Just WRONGE! If your knees are that bad? You know it - before you De-Plane at Hartsfield International Airport! There has to be some LEMON-LAW for players too!

That is just showing up at the bank with a SKI-MASK & a OOZIE! There has to be some penalty for that! At least Alan Hindu- Henderson finally had the balls to QUIT before someone threw a Ron-Artest Beer on him.

What do you think about that? LOL!

By drmaryb

May 10, 2008 11:20 PM | Link to this

Hey HorfordRox

Close your eyes and imagine Speedy backing up to the teller window and slipping her a note saying: Put The Money in the Bag!

He Should be arrested or shot in the parking-lot at the bank! LMBoobiesO!

By Horford Rox

May 10, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this

DRMARYB that sorry fool. It may sound strange but I almost feel bad for him. Almost. Ole Craig better quit or he’s gonna be that dude at the Ryan’s buffet with hand brakes on his walker!

By Horford Rox

May 11, 2008 12:23 AM | Link to this

DRMARYB Hope y’all beat em up! I was on a roster once. In fact, my story reminds me of QB Bobby Reid. He says the OK ST coach embarrassed him by putting him in games just to take a knee.

I was the last dude off the bench. I wasn’t third string…I was LAST string/emergency use only. When coach said, “I don’t want no scrubs,” I didn’t understand why he was looking at me.

When I FINALLY got into the games, I thought, here’s my chance to make a play. Then the ref would join our defensive huddle. “Listen, fellas. They’re just gonna take a knee. We don’t want any cheap shots,” the dude would say.

Take a knee?! Now that, Bobby Reid is embarrassing. To get put into the game, just to WATCH your opponent take a knee!!

We finished 0-8 and scored 1 TD the entire season. Our HB broke 2 million tackles and ran about 45-50 yds for the score.

We missed the PAT.

(Where’s that Florida Evans soundbite when I need it?!)

By mykhalc

May 11, 2008 2:45 AM | Link to this

D’ANTONI to the KNICKS!!??? ya know, life just gets funnier by the day!!!

By roberta

May 18, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

get the Joshes signed fast-and get T Lue back! Get a true center, and we’ll be set. Keep the coach-he’s proven that he is effective in improving this group.

By roberta

May 18, 2008 11:29 AM | Link to this

get the Joshes signed fast-and get T Lue back! Get a true center, and we’ll be set. Keep the coach-he’s proven that he is effective in improving this group.

By Calvin

June 23, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this

We don’t get a draft pick this year but we’re not considering resigning both of the Josh’s. I don’t get it! Both are vital parts to this team and it’s chemistry. DUDE!

By Calvin

June 23, 2008 11:45 PM | Link to this

We don’t get a draft pick this year but we’re not considering resigning both the Josh’s. I don’t get it! Both are vital parts to this team and it’s chemistry. DUDE!

By cskqdwv wukczirfs

December 14, 2008 7:39 PM | Link to this

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