Hawks

By Chikara

March 27, 2008 1:28 AM | Link to this

Hey guys! Long time no hear…great to see the Hawks take charge in the third as opposed to letting the other team take charge after the halftime break.

While the other teams may want to beat the Hawks and take them seriously, Atlanta has a horrible habit of playing well against teams that are above them (Washington and Orlando) yet not show the same effort against teams like the Nets and Bulls.

I’d like to say the next three games are winnable, but for some reason they can’t shoot against the Bulls. This team is way more talented than the teams chasing them and some teams ahead of them like the Sixers and Wizards.

Hopefully Bibby’s thumb will be a go for Friday night. They are 11 games away from the playoffs and can’t afford to slip for any reason!

GO HAWKS! Ciao ;)

By BA

March 27, 2008 2:24 AM | Link to this

Ando: I like Rudy T. And I’ve got to think that if they were willing to take on the Bibby contract then they will be willing to resign the Joshes. I just can’t see losing the first two players you drafted after their first contract. Call me an optimist, but I’m going to have to see a move that awful before I’ll believe it. On a side note, your work here this week has been excellent. Straight talk, sounds free flowing, pleasant reading.

Ray: You stole all my thunder, as far as in game analysis tonight. But I will add that while I don’t HATE Pachulia (He really could be servicable) I just don’t think he’s a fit anymore, post Bibby. I think this guy is maybe your opportunity to move somebody this summer.

And can anybody tell me why Richardson never even gets a LOOK?! I’m not saying he’s the next big thing, but when you’re up 17, why not give him some minutes?

By BA

March 27, 2008 2:51 AM | Link to this

Anybody catch that HUGE woman with the grey pants behind the Hawks bench?! Those slacks were stretched so thin, she looked like some sort of half Rhino! Only in this city…

By Matt

March 27, 2008 2:57 AM | Link to this

Ray & co.,

Too tired to re-post it here, but check my comments at the end of the last blog.

By Pinball34

March 27, 2008 4:42 AM | Link to this

Yo, BA… Only one part of that woman was huge. I didn’t know fabric could do that. I bet Sekou saw her. What was your take, Mr. Smith?

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 27, 2008 5:04 AM | Link to this

Between Woody and Byron Scott, I wonder who can keep their arms folded continuously for the longest period of time.

By mykhalc

March 27, 2008 5:58 AM | Link to this

DOC, ANDO, JHAN, just one question…is SALIM’s game as hyper in person as it is on the tube???? man!!!???!!! i never followed the cat in college so i have nothin’ to compare him to. but he is soooo jacked up while he’s jackin’ ‘em up!! outta control…PERIOD!!!! but i know playin’ for WOODSON can make anybody have issues!!!

By smartguy

March 27, 2008 6:33 AM | Link to this

I was hoping that when I came home from Easter that Gearon and Levenson would be replaced by Belkin, that BK would have learned that there is more than one position in the game of basketball, and that Woody would somehow have forgotten where Phillips arena was.

By doc

March 27, 2008 7:17 AM | Link to this

nice comments from last night. will sat as far as the crowd, it was so quiet i could hear the ref say to coach k if you want to stay then sit down after his first tech, he quietly stared for a while said few words and then sat to see a very terrible team finish the game in a very uninspired way. their body language is terrible as a team.

ba i will take exception to your comments by getting bibby the hawks management have shown they arent cheap. remember, they have brought in no players to make up for the obvious holes and the trade required they unload salary as well as take it back so they are not making any significant increase outlay for this year alone and still remain at the bottom of the pay salary structure for the league i.e. the minimum they have to pay. only their actions this summer declare where they really stand as far as what they are willing to do salary structure wise. do they move to where most competitive teams are where hey move to a layer just below he penalty line or do they remain just a notch or two above the minimum. if they dont move up then they dont sign the joshes without getting rid of payroll so bibby or jj have to go if they do. a long time ago the contract signed by jj made him good trade bait for players and draft choices for teams that want to be competitive. remember he plays like a 14 to 16 mil guy for relative peanuts now of what 10 mil. some team wanting to go to the championship level with a known quantity will jump at the chance. this is the crucible year for the basg to show hey have some cash moxie otherwise continue to follow the money.

manny t i left philly and the wiz out of the seveerly flawed group but were firmly placed in the pretender category because neither one will go too far as they are set up now as good teams playing at their best with each other and a coach that can coach them. without the team play and coach they both easily fall into the severely flawed group. those teams have not lost the games they should win recently and have surprised folks that have underestimated them. the latter doesnt occur in playoffs and which is why they will be exposed when the bell rings for the real season.

By doc

March 27, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this

i just hate it when bradley steals the essence of what i say. wasnt it a few months ago he was giving back a bit of cred to bk and giving the some love? boy, wishy-washy.

By Chikara

March 27, 2008 10:22 AM | Link to this

Just got through reading the Bradley article and he makes some great points.

Has anyone on this blog thought about the possibility of the Hawks moving Bibby next year since he will be in a contract season? What about the possibility of moving Josh Smith if they can’t resign him since they will keep Woodson should they make the playoffs?

I know future thinking isn’t a staple on this blog, only complaining, but some of us who care about the long term success of the franchise would like more information.

Rudy T. isn’t coming to this situation, so forget that. Woodson will be signed to an extension should Atlanta make the playoffs so no need to worry about some other coach coming here. BK might leave, but it won’t fix the overall problem.

Atlanta does need to pick up someone who can play in the low post and can supplant Horford. Zaza will be in the last year of his contract and Atlanta may need to move him.

By jami$$ion

March 27, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

THIS GOES OUT TO ANDO,DOC,RICHBRAVE,DECDAWG,UGA,CLYDE,MARY JANE,AND ANY OTHER POOR,,TORTURED,LOST SOUL.TRAPPED INSIDE THIS FAUX MIRAGE OF A LABIRYNTH KNOWN AS THE ATLANTA HAWKS. first off nothing built on Earth is perfect to the point that it will not crumble,except the pyramids built by my ancesters in Egypt. second my comrads there is no such thing as a sure shot in life(mike tyson over buster,pats over giants,falcs over vikings,bowie over mj,kwame brown,mike vick).so all the things in the past,in the words of kiesha cole let it go.we can only learn from our mistakes,we will not get anywhere dwelling on them. ANDO i read a comment the other day you posted.it was in regard of resigning the joshes.and why we would not be able to.Ando i know yu know the expression.sh!t rolls down hill.and our hawks are at the bottom of the septic tank,with a over flowing compost pit at the apex of the mountain side.but in my opinion scared money don’t make money! it’s plenty of teams that have four & sometimes five guys recieving double digit millions.and the majority of these teams are playoff championship caliber teams.for example lakers,suns(shaq,steve,amare,barbosa,diaw makes 10 mill),gs(baron,jack,al)dallas(kid,josh,dirk,dampier,jt),i can go on and on even weak teams like ny(qtip,zack,starbury,jamal,jerome james,curry,)indy(jo,dunleavy,murphy,tinsley). my point is if they want to win.and they think the core of the joshes,jj,bibby,and horford can do it with a little extra help.it can be done.no doubt about it. our organization is just so imbalanced,uneducated,thrifty,unethical,and down right ignorant to the business of operating a profitable ,enjoyable product.and i hate to blame anyone,because the organization from the ballboy,fan,harry the hawk, to the ceo is responsible for participating in this fiasco. Did BK get it right?No .but i can live with the few missteps he has made.it”s just the missteps he has made are crucial ones.being it marvin oveer deron(my choice)and paul,or signing speedy.i can actually live with shells cause he was a need,that didn’t get a chance to pan out under woody.for all yall whining,we still turned him into bibby.a 5th pick for bibby aint bad.it’s better than what boston gave up for an even older ray allen (a fifth,and three players.roy is a good player,but we had him already in jj.and do you guys ever notice whenever we play chicago or philly chills outshines both guys who you think he can’t compete with?jsut because woody doesn’t see him as a starter doesn’t meanhe is not one.just as just because bk drafted a benchwarmer.it doesn’t mean he’s better than chris paul. in closing aint nothing gonna change,until we reconfigure the make up of this team. we can have a clean home without having to clean house.we have the players a vet here and there a work wonders.and a provide the proper guidance for our young troops.since there is not anyone to lead them.boys can’t raise boys into men!a greg anthony,kenny smith,or mark jackson would make a good coach ,or gm for this organization.since i don’t see the broke spirit leaving anytime soon.at least we can up lift it.thank you

By DeacKillsaDevil

March 27, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

Marvin needs to be traded. Another BK bust.

By Ken Strickland

March 27, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

Isn’t it amazing what our bench can do, individually and collectively, when given a chance? Does anyone, but Woodson of course, think they might have had a simular impact on the Bulls gm if given a chance. It’s truly amazing how little common basketball sense Woodson possesses. If Bibby’s injury prevents him from playing, what is Woodson going to do, force him to play anyway. No, he’s going to replace him for the entire gm, that’s what.

WHY CAN’T THIS RIGID NARROW MINDED FOOL THINK LIKE THAT WHEN IT COMES TO GIVING HIS KEY PLAYERS A REST. AT LEAST WHEN HE’S RESTING THEM HE HAS THE OPTION OF REINSERTING THEM AT ANY TIME. THAT ISN’T AN OPTION WHEN A PLAYER IS INJURED. NOW, COMMON SENSE TELLS ME IF YOU CAN REPLACE AN INJURED PLAYER FOR AN ENTIRE GM, YOU SHOULD CERTAINLY BE ABLE TO FIND A WAY TO REPLACE HIM FOR 10-15MINS WHEN HE’S TIRED. NO HAWK PLAYER SHOULD HAVE TO PLAY ALL BUT 8MINS OF BACK TO BACK GMS, ESPECIALLY THIS LATE IN THE SEASON.

EVEN IN LAST NIGHTS GM, IT TOOK AN INJURY AND FOUL TROUBLE TO FORCE WOODSON TO USE HIS BENCH. TALK ABOUT THE PETER PRINCIPLE AT WORK.

By Steve T

March 27, 2008 10:59 AM | Link to this

BA, you need help!

This stretch of games may be the best thing for Marvin. He has set the tone by saying this is a fight. Therefore, I expect for Marvin to come through in a big way for the Hawks.

We got some good play from the bench last night. The Hawks need to get this kind of play every night from the bench. The only thing that might make an improvement is Zaza need to finish strong around the basket. If you go strong and get a foul, it could be an 1.

By EJH

March 27, 2008 12:03 PM | Link to this

I continue to read on this blog about how the hawks need to get rid of Marvin Williams. To me that is just stupid, He is the only one on this team who besides Josh Childress can average in double digit in points with taking only 10 to 12 shots per game. Last night he had 16 points on 7-9 shooting from the field that almost 80% from the field if you morons can not do arithmatic. Why would you want to get rid of a guy who is only going to get better shooting the ball with consistency from mid-range and is going to develop a 3-point shot and who is going to be able to post up with his back to the basket (can anyone say David West; N.O Hornets), this guy is in his 6th year and look at his game now whomever would have thought this guy coming out of Xavier would be this good of an NBA player. Did anyone see waht David West did to Kevin Garnett the other night, how about 37 points on 15-27 shooting with 16 rebounds, Garnett could not keep up with this guy. Marvin is a keeper. Also you can not move Josh Smith to the three untless he improves his out side shot and becomes more consistent with it and improves his ball handling abilities. “Josh you can not dribble the ball high or standing straight up, you have to get low, take notes from Josh Childress, that is why you turn the ball over so much.” If the Hawks can find a good physical center that can give them some offense and good defense, and if J-Smooth can improve on the areas that I sated above then you can move marvin williams to the bench and this now strenghthens your bench with acie, childress, marvin, pachula, jones etc. because marvin and chills can be instant offense and energy off the bench.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 27, 2008 12:14 PM | Link to this

“Has anyone on this blog thought about the possibility of the Hawks moving Bibby next year since he will be in a contract season? What about the possibility of moving Josh Smith if they can’t resign him since they will keep Woodson should they make the playoffs?”

I actually think it’s almost 100% certain that Josh Childress or Marvin Williams (more likely Childress because he’s an unrestricted free agent) gets traded before the draft for a first-round pick. I don’t see the Hawks trading Bibby unless they are out of contention at next year’s trading deadline, and I have a feeling Josh Smith is the one guy Atlanta Spirit will be willing to pay.

By Astro Joe

March 27, 2008 12:40 PM | Link to this

Najeh, Chill and Smith are both restricted free agents this summer. Hawks can match any offers made to either (or negotiate a sign & trade agreement). And Marvin is eligible for a long-term extension.

By terrell barron

March 27, 2008 12:43 PM | Link to this

I think Chills is restricted.

By HB Ando

March 27, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this

Unless this team comes out of the gate as a serious contender in the East, next year, Bibby is gone. He’s way more valuable as an expiring contract, to another team, than as a $14 million point guard on a team with no real title shot. One only has to look at the trade of Gasol to understand the logic that if you losing with a guy getting paid that much, you can lose without him. And Bibby isn’t worth $14 million, when compared to other point guards around the league. You’re also assuming he’ll want to stay. At 30 (I believe), he’s looking for two things: one, last long-term contract, at optimal market money, and a chance to play for a legit contender.

If Woody and Billy are still here next year, I have no doubt that Bibby will be looking to move on. He’d have to take a substantial pay cut to stay here, given the expectation that we’ll want to re-sign Johnson and Josh Smith, and that, in the coming years, Horford will command major money. This team doesn’t have the kind of money necessary to have 4 guys making $12+ million, annually, in the next few years.

And why does every argument against trading any player, be it Marvin or anyone else, neglect the basic understanding that we’d be looking to get a productive player in return? If you trade Marvin, and his production, isn’t it inherently expected that you’re going to get a viable player in return? There are very few players in the NBA whose production is not replaceable. It’s about balancing the roster AND the realistic budget.

By Ken Strickland

March 27, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

All players coming off their rookie contracts are restricted FA’s. In the beginning the Spirit Group announced that BK would be given full autonomy in making basketball decisions. Then they take away his ability to fire the HC he hired, even though the HC is clearly under utilizing the talent he has. After the way these clowns have mismanaged this entire operation, who knows what they’er going to do about Woodson, BK, Bibby or both Joshes.

If BK had been allowed to replace Woodson with LDrew, I guarantee the Hawks would be no worse off than they are now. Drew would’ve been an upgrade, and the Hawks would have been a much better team, if he just managed the roster and mins better than Woodson.

EJH-I agree with your assessment of Marvin. Have you noticed how he’s picked his DEF up the last 2 gms? While he does need to be more consistent, he’s improving. Marvin’s value to the team can be seen by noticing how we pull away from teams when he’s on his gm. Instead of waiting for him to create and/or involve himself in the OFF, Woodson should design an OFF/plays that creates and involves him. The results speak for themselves. If Bibby is affected by his injury, we’ll need Marvin to make the Bulls pay when they double JJ. Another 3gm winning streak would put a great deal of pressure on the other teams.

By Lil E

March 27, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

I would love to get a first round pick for Josh Childress or Marvin Williams. This draft could possibly have a lot of centers (depending on if players stay in school or enter their name in the draft) available in the first round. We could go get us another young center in free agency (A guy like Diop or a project like O’Bryant) to add more depth at the C position.

By HB Ando

March 27, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this

E, I’ve brought up O’Bryant’s situation since pre-season, when it was announced that GS wasn’t going to pick up his option, making him an unrestricted free agent this summer. I continue to believe that his lack of playing time is as much, or more, of being completely ill-fitting for Nellie-ball, rather than an indication that he can’t play. And I suggested that we throw them anything, in trade, to give GS something for a player they’ll get nothing for this summer (Solomon Jones would seemingly be the kind of athletic, transition-style big favored by Nellie). I simply don’t understand why we didn’t take a shot at him.

Now, come this summer, even if we’re interested, we’re competing with every other team looking to take a chance on a project of a center. Why leave that to chance?

Ken, I said since Sekou first reported it, that the Spirit’s unwillingness to allow BK to fire Woody, suggested to me that they were not going to let Billy use Woody as a a scapegoat for his poor general management job. I still believe they both get shown the door this summer. I don’t think it’s a matter of not letting Billy do his job, but, rather, an acknowledgment by the Spirit that Billy’s long-standing, and now previous, autonomy, to do as he saw fit, was a failure. He hired a coach that was, and continues to be, a bad fit for the roster he assembled. He made draft decisions that set this franchise back a decade. And Woody has shown that he’s not capable of doing a consistently acceptable job of running this team he’s been provided.

There is, and always has been fair blame to be assessed to all three components: ownership, Billy and Woody. We can’t fire the Spirit, so our best hope is the Spirit change the other two mistakes.

As far as whether a quality coach, like a Rudy T, would come here, depends largely on who would replace Billy as GM. Bring in a respected GM, and I think a lot of quality coaches would take a shot at what this roster can be reshaped into, with solid front-office decisions.

And I’m still waiting on anyone to address the $150 million question I’ve now posed several times: what person, or group, would invest that kind of money, understand clearly how dysfunctional the Spirit group has been, and not want exactly the same type of organizational control that Belkin had, which ended up in what was essentially akin to a group of 8 kids jumping one kid, in the school parking lot. I’m not defending Belkin, but where are you going to find a guy with $150 million that doesn’t have a reasonable concern that he could end up being treated the same way. It’s a question I can’t find a sound answer to. And by the lack of any response, from anyone here, I assume no one else has a sound theory either.

Time will tell.

By terrell barron

March 27, 2008 2:32 PM | Link to this

Maybe its a good thing the fans show up late. We usually struggle after halftime, so maybe everyone should arrive just before they come out of the locker room, so they’ll see that we’ve got their back in the 2nd half. I’m talking about being as LOUD AS POSSIBLE. Something happens to these guys in the 3rd quarter, so maybe this will help.

By BA

March 27, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

This team WILL come out as a contender next year, IF they resign the Joshes. An offseason with Bibby (And hopefully a new coach with an actual offense) and this team will come out of the gate winning in this weak conference. As good as Big Al has been, he’s going to get better. Marvin has improved at a steady rate as well. Doc, if ASG is that cheap, they wouldn’t have done the deal with Sacramento because those other guys (with the exception of Mr. Candace Parker) were expiring deals. I agree, if they come out and stink it up, by all means, move Bibby. Then get underway with Ando’s rebuilding theory, which I would really hate to see. I just don’t see that happening. Correction: I HOPE that doesn’t happen.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 27, 2008 3:30 PM | Link to this

Yeah my mistake… I thought last year was Childress and Smith’s restricted year, never mind.

Either way I still see Childress or Marvin getting traded for a pick.

By doc

March 27, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

ba nothing this organization has done means it is a foregone conclusion that they will spend money is all i am saying. time will tell, dont be surprised if your assumption doesnt turn out correct. for the last two years there has been a tremendous lack of funds put into this team and by adding bibby hasnt changed it unless they resign josh and josh. neither can be used as trade bait for a draft pick this year so unless a player comes and not draft picks ala the al trade that turned out to be acie then it will be status quo. the final number for their payroll will be the leading indicator come next season. until that number is up above the mendoza line we are relegated to the back of the pack.

By richbrave

March 27, 2008 3:45 PM | Link to this

BA:

You’re sounding good in cyberspace dude. Got off that hatin’. Keep up the good work, and pray Ando’s rebuild is not a done deal.

By Astro Joe

March 27, 2008 3:47 PM | Link to this

Ando, I think it is unlikely that you will find any one person who would accept a limited role for such a healthy investment. But they may be able to find 3 people (at $50M/piece) to buy-in and fall in line with the other part-owners. We can only assume that the eventual winner will learn from the flawed design of the initial partnership and ensure that the language and governance process is crystal clear before signing any legal documents.

The one wild card (for the Gearon-led group) is their linkage to one very wealthy man who has an Atlanta stadium named for him and who would certainly have no ego-based need for power within the partnership.

By richbrave

March 27, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

OOOH ASTRO JOE:

MY EXACT WORDS LAST MONTH. YES-S-S!!!!

By cp

March 27, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

Before Law got hurt the last time and Woodson took him out of the doghouse he actually played well when he got minutes but he got hurt again. When Woody learns to trust the kid I think Law will be better than most think. As far as O’Bryant I really have not seen anything in this kid in the limited minutes to make me think he will be very productive. I could be wrong but I just dont see it. He really wasn’t that good in college. If you want a project then I guess why not. The most frustrating thing about the Hawks is that they play down to their competition in most games. They should beat the Bulls Friday but it depends on which Hawks team shows up.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 27, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

I personally think if all the rappers who sit courtside when the Hawks play good teams would pool their money together and buy the team, the Hawks would be much better off than they are with ASG.

By jami$$ion

March 27, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

I would like to say.Why LI’E do you,or anyone else for the reason want to trade marv and chills for a pick? Over the last four years we have only two picks,that have shown they can play this game at a high level of play on a night in night out basis.And one’s a rookie and the other one,a good pick out of a exceptional draft class is the subject of trade fodder by you guys everynight. Do any of you guys peep other team’s blogs?If so you’ll see that playoff teams such as the LAKERS,SPURS,GS,PORT,WASH to average teams PHILLY,TORONTO,to sad teams,CHARLOTTE,MIAMI and such salivate over our talent.Chills and al were studs in highschool,jr.high,&college.And no matter what you say their fundamentally sound & are studs now.You don’t trade what you know for the unknown,that’s stupidity!I call it like I see it. Draft picks are like lotto tickets.you may play your number today,but it may come tommorrow.And some players are fools gold,they’ll never shine.Meaning a player might not develop in your system,but may blossom in someone elses.Good teams don’t sweat picks.Bad teams think of picks like JESUS.Waiting on a savior,that may be decades before he comes.Then if you are lucky you still have to develop the pick.Something our staff does not do well at all(smoove,marv,shells,salim,solo).So all this potential that’s wasting. Do you think all these guys are this terrible?Or is it the teacher and not the students.I probably won’t get a new owner,gm,or president.But i guarantee if i receive a new coaching staff,to develop these guys.We’ll take off. PEACE

By BA

March 27, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this

Jami$$on called it. Why would you trade a first round player (Chills/Marvin) for another first round pick? Maybe if they had attitude problems, or weight problems. Not applicable to these guys. Do we need a big? YES. We probably need two more. Big Al has went toe-to-toe with some of the league’s best this year, remember Gasol? HOWARD?! The kid can do it, height is overrated. Chills’ skill set is strange(a baseline guard?) but has proven to be valuable.

I said I like Rudy T, it doesn't have to be him. But for the right price, you can have your pick. And does crazy Ted like basketball too? I'm not sure if he does, or if he still has that kind of scratch.

By doc

March 27, 2008 6:15 PM | Link to this

ba using foxfire?

By Don!

March 27, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this

I used to be an optimist regarding this team. But after the events of the past few weeks, I no longer think they’re capable of being any better than an 8th seeded team in the weakest NBA conference I can remember in the last 30 years.

The biggest improvement we can make for this team is to get new ownership, new management and (most importantly) a new coach.

Until we get those three things, this team will not improve substantially.

Later,

Don!

By jami$$ion

March 27, 2008 6:31 PM | Link to this

LOOK BA.These folks around here talk foolish.I think they are foolish.Y all wanna keep getting lottery pciks.FOR WHAT?YOU CAN’T DEVELOP WHAT YOU HAVE!THEN YOU HAVE TO ON AVERAGE WIAT TWO OR THREE YEARS FOR A GUY TO BEGIN TO COME INTO HIS OWN.I don’t have the patience for that sh!!t!I’ve been patient for the last 10years.You want me to wait another three or four years.HELLNAH!! And what happens if whoever the new gm is f’s up this pick?Or the staff does’nt translate this picks talent into success?Do we crucify him like we did shells after one year.One year we gonna say this man is a bust cause he can’t play under WOODY?THE MAN DOESN’T EVEN HAVE A PLAYBOOK FOR CHRISTS SAKE!!Believe it or not there are teams that are better than us,with less talent than your hawks.The reason coaching,conditioning,player development,training,organization structure ,and personel. GIVE THESE CATS A SYSTEM TO THAT FITS THESE GUYS SKILLSET,A COACH THAT IS CAPABLE OF MAKING ADJUSTMENTS NOT OFF STATUS BUT OFF GAME SITUATIONS,SOME TRAINERS,AND DEFINITIVE ROLLS TO PLAY.

By Ken Strickland

March 27, 2008 6:55 PM | Link to this

ANDO-I don’t think making a point was the issue when the ASG blocked BK’s attempt to fire Woodson. However, if your opinion is correct, it makes things even worse. What does it say about owners that put their personal agenda ahead of the team. If I’m reading your comments correctly, you’re saying the ASG is punishing BK(the team and its fans)for mistakingly hiring Woodson, rather than allowing him to correct the problem by firing him?

Your take just doesn’t make sense to me. Remember, these same owners collectively approved every draft pick and/or personnel move BK made, except Belkin in the JJ trade. So why take revenge out on him for making decisions they previously supported? It would make more sense to believe the ASG’s actions against BK was an attempt to appease Belkin and/or clear the way for a settlement with him.

By drmaryb

March 27, 2008 8:27 PM | Link to this

Hey Jami$$son

What an awesome post-up at 10:26 today. Great stuff maane! You stole the exact words right off my lips. Great insight and points well made.

I like where we are at this point with the HAWKS I do give BK his props when due and the mistake on CP3-MVP was a hard miss to swallow, but two other teams made the same mistake.

Ala MJ & Bowie. Well since we can’t change the Past - We do need to move on from that and continue to build this team up here.

No more draft picks please. NO more projects, we are already 23 years old as a team and we hold the #1 spot in this youth movement!

I believe Portland is only team a little older than us. My point is we need veteran role players now! I hope we have enough window dressing to make this team look pretty & attractive to a veteran FA and get somebody like that to come here & help this team learn how to win.

With the ASG and Lame-Ducks we have as GM & HC? That my friend - may be - AH! TRICKY to say the least.

If we re-sign our core and keep Bibby,we should be good, our bench really isnt that bad when they get consistent PT. Oh My Bad! (The bench has never gotten consistent PT.) Darn! How will they get better?

Look at the Celtic’s Bench & tell me why they are better than ours? I double dare you!! ;o

It sure is nice to talk Basketball on here again. I tell you what - winning sure does make the haters stop hatin’

AAAh AAAh! The birds are singing ;)

By ray

March 27, 2008 9:24 PM | Link to this

From Yesterday

By ray

March 27, 2008 12:43 AM | Link to this

Today in the News

Zaza Pachulia got more minutes than he has in a long time. During the interview at the half, I got the distinct impression that he’s not happy here. I wouldn’t be either if I was in his position, but then…there is a matter of his performance. He didn’t have too bad of a game tonight, and contributed some key rebounds, baskets, and even played some decent defense in stretches. But more on him later…’cause you know I gotta make fun of somebody…

Do you ever notice that when we’re winning, the camera doesn’t show Mike Woodson very much? I wonder what he looks like when we’re winning? I know what he looks like when Joe Johnson comes to the bench for a rest…oh wait…that never happens…Okay, I know what he looks like when Bibby comes to the bench. Woodson starts crying, hugging, and snottin’ all over him. Maybe that’s why Bibby didn’t want to come out of the game against Orlando.

Joe Johnson has gotten on a real tear here. And his defense has been good too. The minute we got smart and put him on Michael Redd, Redd got shut down. The problem is, it’s much harder to defend a guy when he’s already hot. Woodson you numbskull, the idea is to put a stopper on a guy before he torches you for 19 in the first quarter! Unfortunately, Woodson isn’t the only one to blame. Josh Smith repeatedly let the pick and roll beat him, putting Joe up against Villaneuva. Josh, get your head in the game.

Speaking of Josh Smith, he made some bad passes, but also made some good ones. I think some of his bad passes are coming from him expecting a teammate to go to a certain spot or be paying attention when he passes it. I watched this very closely. A couple of times, he shoveled a pass toward Pachulia while either in the air, or driving to the basket. Each time, Pachulia turned away and was looking towards the basket for a rebound. The third time, Pachulia caught the pass, but couldn’t convert it. Also, Josh gets himself into the air too soon, and doesn’t know precisely what he wants to do with the ball. It’s all well and good when he makes one of those long passes to a teammate in the corner or outside the arc. But in traffic, it always gets stolen or deflected. Somebody should be teaching him this….Dominique!…tell Jerome Jurenovich to get off of his knees so that you can get back to work…and teach Josh something meaningful!

Getting back to Zaza (you knew it was coming)…what is dude’s problem? I swear watching him when somebody throws the ball into him is like watching a cheap horror movie. You know ahead of time that something bad is going to happen, and that it’s going to be both ugly and cheesy. Not just that, but it’s like he can’t play in any sort of tense or competitive situation without falling down. He fell down with nobody anywhere near him, looking for a foul (from who?). Dude falls down more than the girl in the recurring opening scene of “Little House on the Prairie.” Maybe we should start a new show and call it “Little Georgian on the Hardwood”….

Andrew Bogutgot whacked in the face by Marvin Williams. If you saw the game, you saw it happen. Look, I know it was a foul and that Marvin deserved to be called for it. But I don’t feel the least bit guilty by saying that Bogut deserved at least one good shot. All night long, he was hammering Zaza, Al, and Solo. A couple of times, I saw him practically shoving Zaza away from the basket while he went after a rebound. His forearm was practically in Zaza’s throat. He did the same thing to Solo a few times, along with Childress. And then it seemed that anytime one of our guys so much as sneezed in his direction, we got a foul called on us. Gimme a damn break! The officiating SUCKED. So when Bogut went down, I thought…hmph…you get what you give. ‘Nuff said. Besides, you pansy-a$$…Josh Childress’ narrow a$$ got thrown to the ground and got up faster than that…I’m going to start calling Bogut, “Bogus.”

I’d still like him on our team though. He’s smart guy with skills and knows how to maximize his abilities…

We won! But here’s something to think about: let’s say we make it to the playoffs. Let’s say that this causes both Billy AND Woody to retain their jobs. Is this a good thing or bad thing? Would you rather us lose and Woody and/or Billy be fired (remember, we’re going to get beaten like a drum in the playoffs anyway), or win and retain both? It could happen…

And that’s all for now…

By new jersey faithful

March 27, 2008 9:32 PM | Link to this

That was a nice post Jami$$on! Portland is younger than the Hawks, and before the Bibby trade the Hawks were the 3rd or 4th youngest team I believe, not the 1st. I really hope the Hawks make the playoffs cause Im very interested to see what happens with Woody, as we all are. I just pray that they dont reward him with a new contract just because they make the playoffs with a sub .500 team! BEAT THE BULLS!!

By Murphy

March 27, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this

Come on Guys and Gals have faith. We can win in the playoffs. We can beat Boston

By dakid

March 27, 2008 10:16 PM | Link to this

I for one have to say that if Woodson would play the bench we would be above .500. Think about all the games we had double digit leads to have them come back to beat us. He has to go, Playoffs or not

By ray

March 27, 2008 10:17 PM | Link to this

BA, Jami$$ion, I asked that person the same question about trading a productive player for a draft pick.

As I recall, the person suggested that we trade Marv or Chill for a first round draft pick…not a lottery pick, not a top 5 or 10 pick, just a first round draft pick. The same person suggested that we trade Josh Smith, but then couldn’t say who or what we should trade him for. When I questioned this further, asking for specifics and perhaps players that the person had in mind, I was met with nothing but venom and vague answers that really weren’t answers. Good luck with getting any sort of real or credible answer…

By ray

March 27, 2008 10:33 PM | Link to this

Talking more about trading existing players for draft picks…

If I’m trading any of our productive guys for a draft pick, it ain’t gonna be for just any old pick. I’d want a lottery pick. Maybe a top 15 at worst. And in that case, somebody better be giving us a player along with it. Why?

Who’s going to be in the draft this year? Yeah, you can say that there might be an abundance of centers in the draft, but when has that been the case, and are you willing to bet the farm on “possibly?” And remember, the higher the pick, the better. If you can’t get your need filled in the draft, then you better draft for talent. Tradeable talent, or at least talent that will help. Again, this usually requires a rather high pick. Unless of course, your GM is Billy Knight, who is just as likely to bypass a very good talent as one of us is to pass somebody who’s driving too slow in the left hand lane.

Since the draft is an inexact science, you better be really careful when trading a productive existing player for a draft pick. Furthermore, you better get a HIGH pick, unless it is a truly DEEP draft of talents. I’m talking the kind of talent that either becomes an asset you can use in trade, or the kind that is so good…you end up keeping them and they turn other players that you have into assets (for trade, etc).

For instance, you draft a guy like Michael Beasley and if he turns out to be as good as he looks (and he looks PHENOMENAL), then suddenly one of your existing guys turns into an asset that you can use to pick up something else you needed.

Besides, why the rush to get younger…AGAIN? Sounds like rebuilding to me, eh? Again, it’s not that I’m against getting a pick. I’m for it…as long as it’s a very good pick. Even then, if Billy Knight is around, can anybody feel secure in the idea that he’ll make a solid, if not spectacular draft choice? Yes, I know this last draft was a success. But we got REALLY lucky, and passing on Horford would’ve been as stupid as it gets. Although Noah wouldn’t have been a bad pick…

By doc

March 27, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this

uh oh, i just read the last two posts by jami and understood what he was saying.

what has happened to my brain?

good points … i think. maybe the same thing i have been saying a bit here and there.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 27, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this

Andrew Bogut is a bit of an a-shole anyway… don’t know if anyone caught the borderline racist comments he made in the offseason, but I’m definitely not unhappy to see him getting whacked in the face. As much as I dislike Zaza the player, at least he seems like a decent guy… he seems like he would be a funny drunk anyway.

For the record, I said I think the Hawks will trade Marvin or Chills for a draft pick, not that they should. I don’t think the idea of trading one of them for a draft pick is necessarily bad, but it has to be a high enough pick where they can draft a guy who will contribute immediately. Let’s just say I don’t entirely trust Billy Knight and his ability to draft a guy who will immediately contribute. I’d rather see one of them getting traded for an established veteran big guy, but I am a little doubtful of the quality of big man you can get in a trade for either one of them.

By ray

March 27, 2008 11:03 PM | Link to this

Najeh, that wasn’t in any way directed at you. I saw clearly what you said, and it makes sense. Also, I see that you and I are saying damn near the exact same thing, if not exactly the same thing. No, my comments were about someone else entirely…who shall remain both nameless and clueless…

By ray

March 27, 2008 11:09 PM | Link to this

drmaryb, I’ll tell you why the Celtics bench is better than ours: Because they play, and are therefore more confident…and no doubt feel like they’re part of the team.

That’s why our guys aren’t as good as they could be. Woody, Woody, Woody…

By HB Ando

March 27, 2008 11:10 PM | Link to this

Ken, you’re not reading my opinion correctly, and, as a result, it doesn’t make sense to you (which is different than your not agreeing with my position). What I had been told, by more than one owner, in previous years, is that Billy had complete autonomy for player personnel. One told me that there had been more than one offer on the table, that several of the owners liked, that Billy rejected. This was several years ago, but his opinion, at the time, was that Billy’s decisions had turned out to be correct, and thus, they were committed to letting him run the personnel side of the team.

You misunderstand my point by characterizing the situation as the Spirit “punishing” Billy, or putting their collective, “personal agenda ahead of the team”. What I believe is that, over time, the Spirit have come to recognize what everyone outside of Atlanta, as far as the NBA goes, has known for some time: that Billy’s draft mistakes, in passing on the last two ROY’s, were atrocious, and may well have caused irreprable harm to the long-term fortunes of the franchise. I believe that they know quite well that Woody is not the coach to take this team to the top. But I also believe that they correctly hold Billy as largely responsible for putting an already underwhelming head coach, who he chose to hire, in an absolutely no-win situation, by creating a roster that has been as imbalanced as any in the history of the NBA.

So, when Bibby was acquired, giving the team the best balance it has had during Woody’s tenure, I think the Spirit was unwilling to let Billy scapegoat Woody, who was his mistake to begin with, and, rightly, felt like the season, and the future of both Billy and Woody, should hinge on whether this team, with Bibby, could be guided to the playoffs, by the coach Billy hired, who was finally given a lineup with a realistic chance of being competitive.

I also think, pretty obviously, that the Spirit believed that firing Woody, when the team was, for the first time in years, within spitting distance of the playoffs, sent a message to the fans that the past 4 years were a failure, and that ticket sales, for the remainder of the season, would suffer.

Billy’s desire to fire Woody, this late in the season, at the very moment Bibby was acquired, with the recognition that it would be nearly impossible to rapidly integrate both Bibby AND a whatever new system an interim coach would bring, while still having a shot at the playoffs, simply underscores that it was not the ASG who sought to put its agenda in front of the teams’ best interests, but, rather, Billy, who was willing to dash any real hopes for a playoff slot, this season, by scapegoating Woody on the very same day that he finally put a compelling team on the floor.

The ASG did the right thing, buy giving Woody a fighter’s chance at leading this team, with the addition of Bibby, to the 8th seed. He’s been coaching a roster void of a truly, NBA-caliber, starting point guard AND center, for over 3 years now. There’s not a coach in the league who could have made this screwed up roster a legitimate contender in the East.

My prediction stands: the Hawks miss the playoffs, by a hair, and both Billy and Woody, rightfully, are fired. Hopefully, their replacements are qualified NBA guys, with track records for sound decision making. And they face quite a few tricky decisions. But there are assets here, and with a couple of solid moves, this team can emerge, in the coming years.

Instead of arguing points that cannot be proven, let’s see what happens in the coming months.

Ken, do you, now, still misunderstand my position, or do we just disagree? I don’t have a problem with disagreeing. But I don’t want you to mischaracterize what I think is happening, behind the scenes. Billy’s desire to fire Woody, at the very moment when he’s finally provided the team with a legitimate point guard, after years of well-publicized failures, speaks volumes about his self-serving agenda, even if it’s ultimately clear, and fair, that Woody will not be retained after this season.

Most all of us know that Woody is not “the guy”. But, if you really understand the game, you also know that he never had a chance.

As of today, there are 3 teams, in the East, with a realistic chance of overtaking us for the 8th seed. One, NJ, dumped a hall-of-fame PG. Another, Indiana, has been missing both it’s mercurial point guard, and it’s supposed “top” big man, in J. O’Neal, for what seems like years. The third, Chicago, has some how taken a roster, that, seemingly yesterday, looked prepared to take control of the East. But Paxson, who has to take his well-deserved place next to Billy Knight, as one of the five worst GM’s in the league, inexplicably turned a mis-used Chandler into a $60 million, over-the-hill steroid machine, and traded the rights of Aldridge for Ty Thomas. Chandler’s struggles were clearly, even before he was traded, the result of an over-bearing Scott Skiles (and let us not forget that Chandler was obtained, in a draft day trade, for Elton-freakin’-Brand).

The Bulls have, maybe too little/too late, righted some of these wrongs, by going to a front line of Gooden (finally playing up to his potential after being underutilized in Cleveland) and Noah. While the Bulls are 3 games back, with only 11 to play, I still find it plausible that they can overtake the Hawks for the 8th seed.

It will be Fool’s Gold, indeed, should the Hawks hang on to the 8th seed, and misguidedly rationalize that we are on the fast track, with both the front office, the head coach, and the convoluted roster, to continue an unlikely ascent in the East.

By drmaryb

March 27, 2008 11:38 PM | Link to this

Hey RAY

My point exactly:

PLAY THEM’BENCH-BOYS-TO-MEN!

Just-DO-It! Give Em’ a Chance - maane!

By HB Ando

March 27, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this

Joe, the only thing more unlikely than finding one rich fool, who would pony up $150 million, agree to assume a completely passive role, and place his trust, and his financial investment, in the hands of a partnership group which seems to have redefined the construct of “dysfunctional”, is finding 3 slightly less wealthy idiots, equally agreeable to throwing away $50 million each, while the ASG continues to blunder its way through the rarified air of professional sports’ owners, losing money at every turn.

And, Joe, don’t you think that if Daddy-in-Law “Warbucks”, Ted Turner, had any interest in solving this problem, for the ASG, he would have already done so? How many family gatherings do you think have passed, since this partnership disintegrated, where Captain Outrageous and Rutherford have stood shoulder to shoulder? Not only is absolute silence on the issue measurably telling, his history as an entrepreneur is defined by his absolute independence. Ted Turner as part-owner/investor of the Atlanta Spirit? If you think Belkin had issues with his intent to be the lead dog, how can you possibly even hint at Ted Turner signing on for a submissive, $150 million role?

Joe, you’ve described yourself as a career, corporate manager. And I take that self-description at its face value. But it’s hard for me to reconcile even the vaguest parameters of a lifetime role in the corporate world, with your suggestion that there is even one, much less three, individual(s) who would throw $150 (or $50) million bucks at an investment, in a partnership, where the group he/they would be joining has both consistently hemoragged cash, AS WELL as showing no shame in plunging a knife into the back of one of their own (whether justified or not).

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 12:07 AM | Link to this

Hey Doc

Is my RichBrave O.K.? Did you make that house call? :OOO

Hey Ray-Star Your’e the Man - I got nothin’ but love for you! (that’s your new name - by the way - it’s time for a new-name make-over!)

Time to UPDATE - Your Package!

BA - I love you too! Because you bring the passion and the heat!

Your Grade:B+

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 12:28 AM | Link to this

ANDO-your point was well stated and understood.

By ray

March 28, 2008 12:32 AM | Link to this

Alright. That’s it. This is officially the War On Trolls.

Today In The News:

ASG propaganda has reached epic proportions. The troll known as Terrance Moore has gone and done it again. This time it’s an article about not only reaching the first round of the playoffs, but beating the Celtics in much the same fashion as Golden State defeated Dallas last year.

Now, before you say I’m acting like I’m not a Hawks fan, let’s look at a few things. I want the Hawks to win. However, I have reasonable expectations. There is no comparing a team like Golden State to us. Why, you say?

1)They have a coach who knows what he’s doing. Need I say more?

2)Their OWNERSHIP IS INTACT AND AT LEAST FAIRLY COMPETENT. This filters down to actual management. They’ll spend the money to do what is needed when the time comes. Again, need I say more?

3)They have the proper and necessary weapons to play their style of game. It fits with the coach’s philosophy. The roster has most of what it needs to get the job done. The team has an identity. OUR team has no identity STILL, and the coach’s philosophy doesn’t even closely match what the team is capable of. Even then, we don’t have the weapons we need, and only recently added one of the most necessary weapons.

4)Their bench is involved, active, and is able to contribute consistently. Ours? They’re thinking of trading in their jerseys for cheerleading outfits just to have something to do!

And so, a team that isn’t capable of consistently playing out it’s best possible performances is thinking about a first round upset? THAT koolaid has arsenic in it. Or maybe it’s “White Oleander” in your milk….

This is nothing more than ASG propaganda, trying to get you to believe something like that when your team is barely scratching the door to the playoffs as it is. Look, I’m not down on our team. I’m realistic. They are trying to distract us from the true problems, which are inescapable: something has to be done in the offseason. Management has to be addressed, as does coaching. As do player contracts.

Stay Tuned, the WAR ON TROLLS continues…

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this

Thanks, Ken. I’m glad you didn’t feel I was trying to diminish your perspective. I just wanted to clarify (to my typical, overly-detailed level, how I perceived the situation). We’re all just speculating, so what will be, will be…….

Ray, I just got wind that NAFTR (the National Association for Troll Respect) is quickly coordinating a picket and rally, in Savannah, to defend their members against your unwarranted, and egregious, comparison to their culture, and Terrance Moore. All indications are that they are mystified by you’re uncalled for association to Mr. Moore and his fellow AJC spin doctors. In a related issue, rumors that Mr. Moore has a well-disguised Cayman Island account, which was recently funded by unknown sources, coinciding with his sudden role as ASG cheerleader are swirling with light-speed momentum, though these claims remain completely unsubstantiated, and in no way should be construed as actual accusations of some financially-driven propaganda.

By ray

March 28, 2008 1:11 AM | Link to this

Today In The News continued…

This just in: Blog Crimes Unit Special Undercover Agent Ando has unearthed evidence that may explain the most recent garbage articles by Troll Terrence. Apparently, large sums of money have been deposited into his previously undiscovered offshore accounts. Well, not too large…after all, the ASG is pretty broke….

Troll Mark has been rather lonely lately, what with Troll Terrence having found a newer and more expensive bridge to live under. Hell, Troll Terrence doesn’t even chase Billy goats anymore…Anyway, Troll Mark has gotten bored and resorted to petty blog theft…as usual. He states that Bibby has made the Hawks better, but not good. Really? We’d have never figured that one out. I mean, who would’ve believed that Bibby would be better than Lue or AJ? Who could’ve known that the Hawks would still not be able to win consistently with a crappy coach, an unbalanced roster, and no starting center/big power forward to help Al Horford out?

You know Mark, writing articles the way you do (and syphoning the contents from our blog) is like taking some old guy’s used spare set of dentures. It’s disgusting, you can’t use them to any good effect, and it’s STILL STEALING!

Team doctors have consulted some behavioral scientists in reference to Salim Stoudamire’s frenetic play. Apparently, the answer is quite simple: he plays like he does because he’s trying to maximize the amount of time he’s in the game. He figures, the faster he plays, the more he can get accomplish in the game.

Upon interview Salim had this to say: “Hey man, I’m just trying to get stats. I’m usually not in there long enough to get much of anything to even show that I was on the court. I mean, I could be on the court 30 seconds or 6 minutes. I’m trying to get some kind of stats, whether it’s shots taken, a turnover, ANYTHING! Do you know what it’s like to look at the player efficiency rating or Lenovo stat and see nothing but a goose egg? It’s crazy, man! I’d rather at least have some minus signs instead of looking like the invisible man!”

By the way, he said all of this in 2.2 seconds and we had to slow the tape back down and replay it several times to get it right…

Solomon Jones feels somewhat bitter about his nickname. He had this to say: “Solo? Yeah they call me Solo…but I bet you don’t know why! But I’ll tell ya. It’s not a flattering name…they call me ‘Solo’ because I’m the only 6’10” athletic guy in the league with any potential that can’t get off the bench!” Tell us how you really feel, Solomon…

Hawks center Zaza Pachulia won’t talk to us after the last headliner. We don’t understand why. Something about us calling him clumsy…We don’t hate him, really we don’t. He’s a likeable guy. One Ray-Ray daily news reporter tried to interview him after practice. Zaza deliberately ignored him, turned around, and headed for the lockerroom. He flopped and fell twice on the way…

And that’s all for now…

By BA

March 28, 2008 2:01 AM | Link to this

Ray, this is TOO much! Put this guy on the AJC staff TOMORROW! And please, Ray, leave Moore alone, he’s no match for you. Not a fair fight…Is that a typo, or did I just get some POSITIVE feedback from a certain someone?! Like I said before dmaryb, when you post Hawks, it’s solid. And this bench thing intrigues me, but I got the answer. What’s the difference between say, Eddie House and Salim? All those years of experience. The best weapon the Celtics have on the pine, in my opinion, is James Posey. The guy can slide between the three and the four, shoots threes, and he’s a lock down defender. And again, the experience, this guy(Posey) has a ring. Even if Woodson used a reasonable rotation, Solo/Salim etc. just haven’t done their time, no chance to learn on the job. I am one of the more positive bloggers here in regard to the Hawks, but even I have to concede that we have NO CHANCE against the Celtics. We are not Golden State yet. And K.G. and company are not soft like that Dallas team. Seems like we could’ve had Doc Rivers… And I need to hear some opinions, Ray, Ando, Jami$$on, etc. What’s the verdict on Acie Law? Is this kid legit or overmatched in this league? I can’t decide, maybe I just haven’t seen enough yet. He seems timid at times, afraid to take open shots. Any thoughts?

By SalimFan

March 28, 2008 3:53 AM | Link to this

Ray you deserve an oscar lol.

By SalimFan

March 28, 2008 4:01 AM | Link to this

BA Acie is just like Jordan Farmar was his first year. Timid and afraid to make mistakes. Summer leauge and more time around the guys should cure him of that though.

But for now, I say put in the man whose not afraid to pull the trigger.

By ray

March 28, 2008 5:22 AM | Link to this

Yes, it’s true. Like the city of NY, I never sleep.

Thanks guys, for the accolades. I’m just doing what I can to help keep it live. And mixing truth with exaggerated fabrication is just one way to do it.

BA, Acie is not a bad player. In fact, I think he’s better than he is allowed to be. Woodson is not good juju for rookie pgs. Case in point? Look at how much more effective of a player Royal Ivey is in Milwaukee. I mean, the guy can take threes and make them! We all knew he could play “D”, but he can penetrate and score some too. He didn’t do a lot of damage this last time, but the game before that? He was hurting us whenever he was in the game.

Acie is not a timid shooter by nature. His college career tells us that. He needs to be cut loose. He needs a coach that will re-instill confidence rather than tear it down. You may as well consider next year as his rookie year. Woodson has destroyed the guy’s intro to the league. Look at some of the games he had where he really came out and did some damage. I’m not saying he’s the savior. But he’s better than he seems…it just remains to be seen how MUCH better…

By Astro Joe

March 28, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

Ando, so in an attempt to make sure that I am not misinterpreting you, are you saying that if the Gearon-led crewwins the divorce, that they will not be able to find incremental partners? And if that is the case, how will they be able to pay off Belkin, because I am assuming that if they had enough money from day 1 to purchase these properties without Belkin, they would have done so. So it terms of outcomes, what are you predicting if the judge rules in favor of Gearon and crew?

And yes, I do think that the lure of being an NBA owner (even if that means you own 3%) will be a nice sales pitch among those younger members of the yacht club. I offer Beyonce’s boyfriend as example A (lucky SOB).

By MannyT

March 28, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

Ken and Ando I am catching up this morning on bloggery. I think I am more in Ken’s camp on this one. While I don’t know the first time that BK went to the ASG with half of a Clyde t-shirt to fire Woody, it brings an interesting management dilemma.

First—Woody definitely stays for the rest of this season. It is too late to try something new. However, if he had been let go with 25 or more games to play, that would have given Larry Drew or whomever was chosen as interim some time to be evaluated as a future candidate for the permanent role.

If you don’t take that opportunity, the ASG loses. If you don’t like the roster that BK put together, the ASG can make a case to let him go outside of the coaching question. If the problem is indeed a style mismatch between the coach and players, this gives you a chance to see how it might be different. Not so much to save BK, but to get a live evaluation of what someone else can do.

I do not think it is the best course of action to link BK & Woody completely from an evaluation perspective. There is definitely some overlap, but there are also pieces that do not. How they work together regarding roster ideas is important. I think about this question—Was that something they both agreed to or did BK dictate that to Woody? for the following:

-Think back to the JJ will be the point guard chatter when he first arrived. -Drafting Marvin over a PG when he was highly rated -Running an uptempo offense or a half court one that goes against the player style -Can Shelden Williams contribute or do we draft another smaller player -Do we fill out the roster with available players (i.e. center from D-League) after the Bibby trade to see if they can help plug the middle on D.

I have weighed in before that I think BK has done a better job than most here would say. Not great, but decent and MUCH better than Babcock. However, I don’t have that inside perspective that Ando mentions. If I did, I might know who has been making things happen more so for good or bad behind the scenes.

WAF

By MannyT

March 28, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

doc I will try to find you guys tonight at half time. I’ll probably have on a lightweight white & blue jacket with a big snowflake on the shoulder. No fashion commentary needed from the blog—it will make me easy to pick out in a crowd.

As for that Philly & Washington thing from the other day, I think they both have a good chance of winning a 1st round match up against anyone that isn’t Boston or Detroit.

WAF

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 10:38 AM | Link to this

ASTRO JOE-I too have both envied and hated her lucky(SOB)boyfriend for some time. I have a special appreciation for her beauty and presence. Her uncle use to be the bus driver for my high school football and basketball team. Man, talk about the difference between night and day, right and wrong, good and evil. However, I hope she inherited her uncle’s kindness, jovial personality and sense of humor.

We should win the next 2gms, but it’s up to Woodson to determine if we’ll be successful. Woodson’s habits have given teams a strategy that’s worked very well this season. Teams know Woodson won’t rest his key players, especially JJ, so they try to keep the gm close until the 4th qtr. Then they double an exhausted JJ, cover the lane and leave an exhausted JSmith and Bibby open to hoist long jumpers.

At any rate, GOOD LUCK TONIGHT YOU HIGH FLYING HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Lil E

March 28, 2008 11:05 AM | Link to this

Jamison and BA, The reason I said trade Chillz or Marvin Williams (or even Smoove) is because we need a center desperately. That is our teams glaring weakness, and our team has 3 good SF that we could put on the market to fill that hole. We don’t need all three of them, do we ?

I think a player like Josh Smith is worth a top 10 draft pick, but players like Chillz and Marvin Williams might not be worth a lottery picks. These are my very unprofessional opinions. Scouts and GMs might value our three SFs differently then what I assume they will. We can get a good big at almost every spot in the first round of the draft, and I think almost anyone would be a defensive upgrade to what we already have. The reason I don’t name specific picks is because the NCAA tourney is still going, and there’s no telling who could rise or fall. Robin Lopez, Roy Hibbert, Javale McGee, Marreese Speights, and Trent Plaisted could all be available after all the lottery teams pick. I think any of those guys would be solid picks, and would add much needed depth at the C position. Young centers like Diop or O’Bryant might be available in FA, but it’s all about whether or not they want to come play in Atlanta. Because nothing is definite and since both the NBA and NCAA seasons are still going strong, it’s not exactly easy to predict offseason moves. We could try to package Marvin (or Chillz) to Portland for Pryzbilla and their first. We could send Josh Smith to Milwaukee for Bogut and their first. We could send Chillz/Marvin and Solomon Jones for our 1st back from PHX. We have options that we definately need to utilize.

ray, you started by attempting to bash me first, and then you started asking questions when I proved that your previous talking points were based on misquotes. I don’t waste too much time and effort stubborn people with personal vendettas. So yeah, I noticed your cheap shot in this blog. Nice one. It made me laugh for about 5 seconds.

By richbrave

March 28, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this

drmaryb:

Doctor(not doc) says I have to be early to bed and early to rise. Won’t be too many posts after 9:00 p.m. for awhile. Will be back full-time trying to piece together Wizards strengths-weaknesses against the Hawks after June.

I think this Hawks team is too quick for the Wiz. IF Arenas comes back at 100% we match up well because Haywood excels in spots against Horford and we pick up Gil’s perimeter shooting and quickness. Daniels is a quality PG, but no Arenas. D is about the same with either, not particularly good.

I have posted here with the supposition that the Hawks will break up the FAB FIVE dealing two(Horford excepted) shortly after the Hawks are done for ‘08 in trade or for another high draft pick in an attempt to get a dominant center. I also agree with Ando that Bibby will go during the next year. I think Acie will develop into a fine PG, but must be give opportunities to do so. Woodson is probably not the nuturing coach needed for this team. This thesis based upon the insightful information denizans to this blog have provided me thus far. My first FIRE WOODY supposition.

That said let me share an observation from the last Wizards-Hawks match-up. Hawks tried to work inside early in the game. Wizards tried the same tactic. Haywood came out the winner until he tired as he always does. BUT Woody adapted a new offense. He stationed two shooters in the corners and penetrated the middle then looped passes to the corners. The Wizards were too slow to cover. I said too SLOW, not REACT. Their reaction was on que in most cases, but they could not get out on the shooters fast enough to bother the shots. Of course, I only know what I’ve seen where basketball knowledge is concerned, but that appears to be good coaching to me.

I think the ASG tries to get the dominant center this team needs, and retains BK and Woody for next year. Failing in that final attempt, the ownership reinvents itself, secures new GM AND Coach, brings in new players, retaining Horford and whomever else the new ops guys feel will fit a new system, and the Hawks start over. For our sake I hope this sceanario doesn’t play out.

Anyway girl, gimme’ some feed back if you read this.

By terrell barron

March 28, 2008 11:45 AM | Link to this

Soft a* Hibbert wont help. Horford can do a better job at Center. Are you kidding me? Just because he’s taller, does’nt mean a thing. He could’nt even dominate against a division 2 team. Never even heard of those other cats, so no way I trade for one of em.

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 12:25 PM | Link to this

Not saying that at all, Joe. But I am saying it would take a heck of a lot of “increments” to cover $150 million. And I don’t think the league is going to be too supportive of a plan that makes an already too-many-cooks group even larger. I’m saying what I keep saying: Less owners is more functional, but I doubt there’s a qualified/quality option out there, who’d pony up the 27% share that Belkin controls, without wanting the same type of authority that Belkin demanded, and wielded, which ultimately led to an ego-driven ouster. And if the remaining ASG members didn’t want Belkin to have that kind of control, why would they turn around and give it to someone else?

This group loses money, and has so far proven to be poorly run, from a competitiveness standpoint (resulting in ongoing financial losses). So who risks $150 million, without wanting the requisite control to affect change, to ensure that their investment makes them a profit, rather than causing them to immediately start to lose money?

I’m sure there are a couple of “Jay-Z’s” around Atlanta, but how would such an addition improve the situation, if the remaining ASG members continue to exhibit either an unwillingness, or the lack of financial resources, to make these teams viable?

Leaving Billy and Woody out of this discussion, how do you envision this ownership issue being resolved in such a way, realistically, that the organization comes out better funded, better managed, and more competitive on the court (or ice)?

I think you’re confusing questioning the logic of my points with shooting the messenger. I’m suggesting that I don’t see many likely outcomes that make things better, in the near future. And if the GM and coach remain, status quo, I can assure you this team remains one a small number of head-scratching disappointments to David Stern and the other NBA owners.

Maybe the ASG can get that guy from Portal, GA, who lived in a trailer and won about $100 million, net, to buy out Belkin. That would be aprapo to this absurdist, reality show we call the Atlanta Hawks.

In fact, maybe the ASG should do an owner search styled after Bret Michael’s “Rock of Love”. Each week Rutherford Seydel could boot one of the prospective partners off the show, while asking the remaining hopefuls if they’ll stay another week at the party house, and “rock his world”……….Or let Flava Flav make the weekly picks on who gets kicked off the island.

Hell, why isn’t Donald Trump stepping in to buy the team. According to him, he can turn anyone into a millionaire. The ASG should pony up $200 bucks, each, and attend one of his seminars. And the Hawks would immediately become profitable, with a championship caliber roster. He can teach them how to buy out Belkin with no money down. They should just “flip” Belkin and this would all be over with………….

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 12:39 PM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star TROLLING the BEAT again? Great combination of humor and compostion skills! LMAO! Keep it comin’ maane.

Hey RichBraveGlad to see your’e up and at ‘EM this fine day. Follow Doctor’s orders and get your rest - puh-lease. I’ll fill in the gaps when your’e not on here.

About these Hawks? I beleive they will keep the new Fab-Five in tact: JJ, SMOVE, CHILLS, HORFORD & BIBBY.

When it comes to the ASG all LOGIC goes out the window for me.

Starvin-Marvin is on the outside lookin’ in now. However, I have not given up on him yet, he & his team just hasn’t had the benefit of proper coaching to hone his skills and put him in positions to be sucessfull consistently enough to make a fair evaluation.

That said, everyone outside the Fab-Five is - JUST-DESERTS! Even ACIE. If we could improve our team? I could see letting MW go as long as we can package SPEEDY too! Maybe even ACIE too! I am just having a hard time with evaluations of the supporting cast because I just haven’t seen enough playing time to be fair. Nothing against JJ but look at what Boris Diaw did when put in a different system?

Still, I would make that trade again & again. I’m Just Sayin’. Until we get a better HC I am not prepared to start giving up on promising talent for the unknowns of the DRAFT.

Look at Portland with that #1 Pick? The World-Scouts said take Oden at #1! Didn’t anyone know this guy had the knees of an 85 year old man? Look at this man’s face? Are you kidding me? Are you sure he is only 19 YOA? Would Portland, (with their bad-luck!) - Make that same Pick Again? Why are they not catching the same hell for that pick - like the Hawks are for not taking CP3-MVP?

Maybe Oden is from the Dominicain Republic, Hell he looks as old as Julio Franco - If you ask me?

I just don’t know! I can’t predict what this team will do if we do or don’t make the PLAYOFFS! I do know something will change though. I think it will be easier to change the HC than to trade a promising player.

By jami$$ion

March 28, 2008 12:42 PM | Link to this

I feel you LI’E.It’s three factors you need to win.1st a structure.MEANING A FOUNDATION.the organization has to be stabilized on one accord.from the ballboy to the ceo.we do not have that.especially the coaching. 2nd a floor general.a facilatater.some one who can direct the team. 3rd a post presence.some one who can protect the post & attact the post.a power forward a do.some times you can use two players to fill this need. The rest of the parts you fill in as needed.so pleasew let’s stop the wishing.we aren’t gonna get beasly,or hibbert.unless you’re gonna give up the house for him? WE HAVE THE 2nd COMING OF TIM DUNCAN(WITH BETTER HANDLE)GIVE THIS CAKE TIME TO BAKE.JUST CHILL AND PRAY MANAGEMENT DON’T MAKE ANY SUCKADUCK MOVES. yall like rashard lewis?you have a better version of him in marv.you like ginobli?we have a unorthodox player like him(minus the dirtiness) in chills.you like maron?we got the shot blocking highlight film one in smoove.like roy?we got the advance version in jj.you like bibby?we got bibby.NEXT YEAR IF IF WE GET A CAPABLE COACH WITH A SYSTEM.I GAURANTEE WE GET THAT 3rd SEED.WE BETTER THAN ORLANDO NOW,JUST LACK A SYSTEM & COACH.LET THE CAKE BAKE. PEACE

By doc

March 28, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

hey richie lifestlye changes are a beaitch. thinking about you bro.

manny t, wont be there this evening. jhan speak up if you are going and look for what sounds like is a lost member of the atlanta ballet nutcracker cast wandering around the phillips.

By richbrave

March 28, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

drmaryb:

Hey girl. Go over to Chop Chick’s blog and see what I dealt the haters trying to infiltrate that venue. Everybody’s guessing on here with the possible exception of ANDO. he seems to have some type of connection to members of the AJC. He does put out some logical info. And he’s begun to cut through the verbage making his posts easier to decipher. He used to make my head hurt. I’m an old man. Lost too many brain cells to deal with all that. I know he’ll get a charge out of that last sentence if he reads this post. Later girl, time to go back in time and work on my thesis.

By richbrave

March 28, 2008 1:06 PM | Link to this

doc:

Thanx my man, and for the info. You should have seen the pause when the cardiologist was presented with the myochondrial nerve-damage issue regarding Statin drugs. Oh yeah.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 2:11 PM | Link to this

The only center in this draft who will fit in an uptempo offense (like the one the Hawks should be running) and also solve the Hawks’ problems with interior size is Hasheem Thabeet. (I will admit I have never seen JaVale McGee play, so the jury is out on that one). Brook and Robin Lopez are OK but neither one is physical enough to bang with players like Dwight Howard, and Robin in particular doesn’t have much of an offensive game. Roy Hibbert is the black Zydrunas Ilgauskas, he would be a terrible fit for the Hawks. None of the other guys are significantly taller or bigger than Horford. And I am making these suggestions based entirely on size, not even considering the fact that half these guys are never gonna be as productive as Chills or Marvin on this level (for real, Trent Plaisted? Are you serious?)

Thabeet, with his athleticism at 7’3”, is the one guy who could pay center for this team if they were running an uptempo offense, and slide Horford to PF. But the problem is he has next to zero offensive game. Are the Hawks willing to wait 5 years for him to develop an offensive game, if he ever does at all? He looks like Sam Dalembert to me, and as nice as Dalembert’s stats are in fantasy it is painfully obvious in real life that he is not an offensive option. If the Hawks should trade Chills or Marvin for anyone in this draft it’s Thabeet, but I’m very skeptical about that too.

When you trade a player it’s never about how good he is, it’s about how good you can convince other teams that he is. As frustrating as Childress and Marvin may be to Hawks fans, both are worth more than a late first-round pick in a trade. I’d much rather see the Hawks try to pry an established veteran big guy away from a team if they are gonna trade Chills or Marvin. It may seem farfetched, but if Pau Gasol can get traded for Kwame Brown, is it out of the question that one or both of these guys can be packaged in a trade for Jermaine O’Neal?

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this

DOC-why would you think any of us would come down on your choice of fashion attire. You certainly don’t think in a traditional manner, so why should you dress traditionally, heh, heh. I’ll be looking for that shirt on the big screen.

MANNY T-there seems to be enough craziness going on behind the scenes with the ASG to make a soap opera series. I’m not certain I even want to know what’s going on. Exactly what basketball/Atlanta Hawks related reasons could they possibly have for wanting to retain Woodson?

LIL E-yes, we could use another center, but we aren’t in DESPERATE need of one. As a rookie, Horford is performing as well, if not better than over half of the centers in the league. What we’re in desperate need of is a HC that can relate to, and get the most out of, the players and the teams potential.

By I.MUS WRITE

March 28, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this

LIL E - Hibbert= Will Perdue or Michael Olawakandi…… Soft slow and he does’nt rebound well….. I would try offering up Marvin for a draft pick and then try and get B.Lopez-I think he can develope into a Rik Smitts type.

O yeah - whoever it wuz that was holding marvins jock strap for shooting 7-10/ 16 points……………..YAWN!!!

Thats a good shooting night, but come on if he shoots 70% once every 12/13 games how effective is the guy, ……. I can see it now two hot games and disappears for the next 10-pulleez I’ll pass…………….

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 2:42 PM | Link to this

Rich, no connections to the AJC, just way too much time spent analyzing this franchise and seeking to read as deeply between the lines as possible. Most everything I type is based on Ando logic and subjective assessment.

I’m spending the same two cents as everyone else here. I just like to make sure I get my money’s worth…..

Jhan is going to the “town hall” meeting tonight, with Billy Knight supposed the featured speaker. It was discussed that I might join him, but prior dinner plans quashed that possibility. Shame, really, as I figure I was even money to get escorted out by security.

Hopefully, there will be some folks there who ask the tough questions that need to be addressed, though I doubt there will be a straight answer in the house.

My favorite question for the night would have to be “Billy, would you mind resigning?”

I’m not sure if that’s as much a question as a request. But it sure would be fun to watch what ensued, once it was said.

By I.MUS WRITE

March 28, 2008 2:44 PM | Link to this

Forgot about H.Thabeet- he would be a good center if we could get a draft pick….. He is raw offensively but rebounds and blocks shots well……………………………………..Thabeet/B Lopez

By doc

March 28, 2008 3:04 PM | Link to this

ken it isnt my atire but manny t’s haberdashery selection. i have no prob with it and he knows it, got some myself.

rich no kidding man get yourself some coq10 from someone legit like allergy research or maybe more common jarron’s or now. it is not woo woo stuff but well grounded in science and proven effective with cardiac disease and those with statins. it might even benefit the legs tremendously.

coq 10 for the body hyaluronic acid for the face and joints.

By Astro Joe

March 28, 2008 3:09 PM | Link to this

Ando, I have no freakin’ idea how this ownership situation gets better in the near term. Hey, even Sterling evenutally ponied up money to keep some of the Clippers. But how long did it take, 2 or 3 decades?

Truthfully, what they need to do is hire a President of Basketball Ops, give him a budget that is $1 short of the luxury tax threshold and stay the F out of his way. Maybe the owners maintain the authority to hire/fire a GM, but that Prez gets the sole authority to hire/fire the head coach. We don’t need owners deciding who can best manage a set of 15 players and an 82 game schedule. Some how, in the next governance process, the performance of the GM and head coach need to be distinct and not grouped together. Philly fires GM, keeps head coach. Team repsonds well. Chicago fires coach, keeps GM, season gets slightly better. Hawks, do neither, performance improvement linked to ease of schedule. ASG does nothing and contracts expire on June 30. There’s a theme here, ownership does nothing and nature takes it’s course.

So again, the only way I see this getting better is hiring an exec, let’s give him a pseudo name, say, Gerald Colangelo. Hire him, fund him and stay out of his way. And if he sucks, fire him immediately. Don’t keep him “because he is linked to the failings of an underling”. Let him select 2 GM candidates and work with him to choose the best fit. Then let the new GM select his head coach and stay the F out of the way.

I can’t think of any other way to see this thing turn sooner rather than later. But if Sterling learned after 2-3 decades, then I am every bit as comfortable that Gearon will likewise learn, in 2-3 decades.

By MannyT

March 28, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this

doc,Ando,Ken Sorry you will miss my fine jacket. Jhan can tell you about it if he happens to look around in the town hall meeting. I’ll be there and now easy to ID.

Ken, while my vote might not be to keep Woody, here are some reasons that may work for others.

1. If you see BKs roster as an impediment to Woody, you might give him an extension now that he has a PG. If you choose to deconstruct the long lean interchangably sized roster for a defensive minded, half court focused, non-running team—Woody could be a much better fit.

2. Follow the money or possible lack thereof. If you are hoarding cash to pay off Belkin, how much would an extension cost? Maybe less than the original annual salary.

3. Continuous, yet small improvement. Each year, he wins more games. If you can live with the pace of improvement, it could be a tolerable situation.

4. Pictures—Woody’s got pictures or someone or their calling records. If Eliot Spitzer had a dark side, don’t we all?

In any case, without some hopeful moves for the 2008-09 season, the financials could get ugly. The ASG may have to use those air cannons to shoot concert tickets and cash into the seats.

WAF

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 4:11 PM | Link to this

Perspective evoking question of the day:

“Was she forced to remove her nipple ring?”

You can really learn a lot that way It will change you in the middle of the Day Though your confidence may be shattered It doesn’t matter

All the great explorers are now in granite laid under white sheets for the great unveiling at the big parade

You can really learn a lot that way It will change you in the middle of the Day Though your confidence may be shattered It doesn’t matter

All the Bush League Batters are left to die on the diamond In the stands the home crowd scatters For the turnstile For the turnstile

-Neil Young (from HB Ando to the ASG)

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this

Allow me to give my take on this ownership situation. It doesn’t appear as if either side is in a position to buy the other one out or reach a separate settlement. So, maybe both sides have finally realized that the only solution is a possible remarriage. However, Belkin will never approve such an idea unless BK is completely out of the picture.

Wouldn’t it be a tremendous jesture to Belkin if the ASG turned its back on the very GM he hates, and that’s staunchly supported them. If they fired BK, they’d still be obligated to pay his salary for the remainder of his contract. None of them would want to pay two GM’s, and Belkin would certainly balk at the idea if one of them was BK. So, by blocking his ability to fire Woodson, they’ve effectively let BK know he no longer has their support. They’ve also let him know where they stand if there’s a choice between he and Woodson.

They want to force him into quitting, thus terminating their financial obligation to him. I’m certain BK is now aware of this, and he seems content to sit, do nothing, and draw a check. Why make it easy for those who are trying to stab him in the back. JUST MY OBSERVATION.

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 4:34 PM | Link to this

Man, now that’s the Astro Joe I miss. No hair splitting. No Ando agenda. Just layin’ out there with a blunt assessment.

But isn’t the role you’re describing the very role Belkin had before being forced out? Sure, he did seek to intercede, on his belief in what was the best interests of the team, as far as Billy’s unnecessary asset dump for Phoenix’s 4th option. But if there’s no oversight, whatsoever, don’t we end up with a Dolan/Isiah situation?

Maybe, as you suggest that the autonomous GM must take on the kind of accountability that gets him fired for screwing up, was exactly where we would have headed, had Belkin’s ego not been outnumbered by his “partners”.

Who knows?

Both your Philly and Chicago analogies are subject to correlative conclusions just as easily, if not more, than cause-and-effect. Chicago not only fired Skiles, but they dumped Big Ben, who took their $60 million and promptly pulled a Webber/Francis. Philly’s improvements were, arguably, no different than the subtle improvement in the Hawks, given the youth of their team.

But the Hawks are near-unique (with the Knicks turning what is 3, for us, into two, for them, with Dolan and Isiah; though Walsh’s entrance forbodes the longest of overdue change in New York) in their triumvirate of cluelessness: owners, GM and head coach.

We are special, these Atlanta Hawks, in all the most wrong ways…..

By cp

March 28, 2008 4:40 PM | Link to this

We need to take care of business tonight enough said.

By HB Ando

March 28, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

Guess I need to ask D. O’Brien how to post lyrics and have the stanza’s maintained…..

By Astro Joe

March 28, 2008 5:13 PM | Link to this

Ando, Belkin is/was an owner. And I don’t think it is a good idea for an owner to be that involved in the team’s operations. The model I suggested is essentially what the Braves have in place, with corporate owners. Scherholtz is the king, Wren the deal-maker, Cox the coach. Owners are invisible bank-rollers. No need to see them in the stands, read quotes or have them invloved in what’s going on with the team. If Braves suck, suspender-man is ultimately responsible. I don’t see why a multiple ownership group can’t work any differently than corporate ownership. All it takes is for the owners to realize that their knowledge of running a business and their ability to read a ton of websites (or even attend ownership meetings) does not give them the same insight as a “basketball man”. Imagine a corporate god thinking they know as much baseball as suspender-man. Laughable. I don’t care how many Celtics or Hawks games have been personally attended by Belkin or Gearon, I don’t want either of them doing anything other than writing a check every month. The NBA Governor should sign off of the economics of any transaction (to avoid sending the franchise into potential economic distress) but not on the merits of the assets being exchanged (e.g. draft picks). If Belkin was concerned that the owners couldn’t meet payroll because of the JJ trade, then he should have vetoed the proposal. And I cringe when I hear that Mark Cuban is making deals (as much as I would LOVE to have him as our team’s owner), because if Donnie Nelson doesn’t know more about building a team at this point, then why is he still on the payroll? Owners need to stop playing fantasy basketball with their teams. Think that the owners of the Spurs or Pistons or even Dr. Buss are making trades in their private jets? Uh, I doubt it. They hire the right exec, give him money, stay the F out of the way and collect gold trophies at the end of the season. That’s the proven model.

By THE Hawks Fan

March 28, 2008 5:17 PM | Link to this

Coach Woodson wants to relay a message to the great People of Atlanta:

Yes, there were times, I’m sure you knew When I bit off more than I could chew But through it all, when there was doubt I ate it up and spit it out I faced it all and I stood tall and did it my way

I’ve loved, I’ve laughed and cried I’ve had my fill, my share of losing And now, as tears subside, I find it all so amusing To think I did all that And may I say, not in a shy way, “Oh, no, oh, no, not me, I did it my way”

For what is a man, what has he got? If not himself, then he has naught To say the things he truly feels and not the words of one who kneels The record shows I took the blows and did it my way!

Yes, it was my way

Yep he did it His Way. In his defense though I heard that NONE of the starters like to get pulled from the game. I also have heard that these players have a real good relationship with him. I have sit behind the bench at games and witnessed him tear into all of these guys from Joe on down. If B. Knight couldnt get him fired, i’ll bet the farm he is back next year. Playoffs or not. Looking at the Big picture, its probably the right thing. Woodson is a quality person, trying to manage young wealthy men is no easy task, for anyone. We are not going to get a new team, we have no draft picks and no MONEY. If we can squeeze a Big from somewhere, somehow and get BIBBY 100% healthy, I could see another 20 wins added to this years total. If all that works outs, he will be singing Frankie at half court for real! Goooo Hawkks!!!

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 6:18 PM | Link to this

Just Win Baby!

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 7:04 PM | Link to this

Thirty mins to showtime. Come on Hawks, show the Bulls what a HIGH FLYING HAWK can do. If you claw a Bulls eyes out, he will be defenseless.

By honest_abe

March 28, 2008 7:36 PM | Link to this

aj: no doubt that model is the “right” way to run an organization.

ando: i don’t know if “scapegoat” would be the appropriate term to describe the situation. if you read the article you would’ve read that bk tried to fire woody two times prior to even obtaining bibby. i can’t speak for the man but it seemed to me that everything bk was building (or supposedly trying to build) was meant to culminate this year in a successful season. the players individually as well as the team was supposed to have grown and woody was expected to progress as a coach. the wretched month of january proved that woodson was still as inept as he was his first year of coaching. i’ll be the first to say bk has made his share of mistakes, but he amassed enough talent this season (no matter how unbalanced the roster is) to at least play .500 ball in the eastern conference. hey he made a last ditch effort to get a new coach to hopefully make a serious playoff run. scapegoating? sounds more like a gm just trying to do his job.

By Steve T

March 28, 2008 8:13 PM | Link to this

The run for the play off is what the Hawks need. Marvin came on with some fire. The reason why so many people are high on Marvin upside is the jumper he hit off the pass from Bibby. He was smooth as silk and he will only get better over time. Just think what he will be able to do when he develop a 3 point shot.

The 7-3 guy that someone mention would be a good pick up for the Hawks if he can play defense. He can play back up for Horford.

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 8:18 PM | Link to this

Notice how they started losing the lead right after JS took that long jump shot….then threw a bad pass while driving towards the basket?

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 8:23 PM | Link to this

Looks like those heavy minutes are catcing up with joe and he still doesnt have a breather.

By ray

March 28, 2008 8:25 PM | Link to this

Astro Joe,

I agree with your idea of implementing a team president with that kind of authority and ability. However, didn’t we have a guy like that at one point in time? I think his name was Bernie Mullin….Actually, do you recall my assessment of what actually happened with ownership (Belkin vs. everybody else)? I think Mullin fell victim to the same thing: egos. And that’s why he’s gone. And that’s why I’d be surprised (pleasantly) if your idea ever went into effect. Understand that I’m not criticizing your idea at all. A team prez with control and a reasonable budget is a great idea. But I get the feeling that the egos that started this war have a major problem with “control” in general. It’s like we have several replicas of Jerry Jones. Only…much poorer and less significantl less intelligent…

Najeh, That’s what I’m talking about. When you start talking about trading existing players for draft picks, you need to have names and scenarios in mind. Names, in case you have the opportunity to get who/what you need (a good center). Scenarios, in case your first target is not available, but a greatly talented player IS. Then you can either take that guy (and keep him), turning one of your existing guys into a trade asset, or you can use the pick as a trade asset or part trade asset…or draft the guy and use his rights as a trade asset to get what you want. Also, good analysis of which centers that might be available actually are a good fit. You’re definitely on point there.

I.Mus, Hibbert is the answer you get when someone throws a vague idea out and has no damn clue what they’re talking about (and then tries to weakly defend themselves by falsely accusing you of misquoting them-preposterous). That’s the kind of thinking that got us in this mess and left us with a very talented, but mis-matched roster. As you and Najeh stated, Hibbert is NOT a good fit for us. Not if we expect to run, and maybe not even if we did nothing but a half-court offense. It would have been like drafting Aaron Gray (which the Bulls did). I’d rather have Thabeet any day. You know what else? I’d take Beasley. Is he a center? No. But having him allows a great many options. This is where drafting for need meets drafting for talent and then exploring the many options that have suddenly popped up. Then you can move a player this is more likely to get you the player you want/need.

Ken, we DO need a center, but here’s the thing: A while back (and several times since) I suggested that an actual “stand alone” prototype center is not absolutely necessary. If you put a talented, tough, sizeable power forward in there with Horford, you don’t have to have that prototype center. How long has Detroit done it like that? They even won a title that way, and they’re still the team to beat in the East, despite Boston’s talent. Look at Utah. Is Okur a prototypical paint dominator? No. He has outside shooting talent and can grab some boards, and is an average defender at best. Meanwhile, Boozer does the heavy lifting (although he’s no stand-out defender either). But he too has inside-outside scoring capability and rebounds like a madman. Boozer is 6’8”-6’9”, while Okur is about 6’10”, maybe 6’11”. Yes they have Deron Williams and what not.

But the point is how the guys down low are used. Several teams are successful without the 7-foot guy in the middle who owns the paint and doesn’t play outside of it. We can be one of them, but we have to have a guy who’s tough enough, and who can shoot the outside shot while Horford does his work down low. And, the guy needs to be able to grab some rebounds and play a little “D”.

drmaryb, I’m just doin’ my thang. What you up to? Hey, I recall you said something about specializing in limb adjustment. There’s a blogger in here who is suffering from “the shoe fits” syndrome. Apparently he’s got one on each foot, and one in his a$$. But the problem is this: the two on his feet also happen to be in his mouth, forcing him to bounce around on his a$$ for transportation. Makes it hard to understand what he’s saying. If he’s a “he” that is….I know you’ve come across people like this before, but I was wondering if there was anything you could do for them, LOL!

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 8:25 PM | Link to this

I like these games when some alien force hijacks Zaza Pachulia’s body and temporarily turns him into a productive player.

By Matt

March 28, 2008 8:38 PM | Link to this

3 turnovers and 4 bricked free throws for Smith, and it’s not even halftime yet. FOCUS, SMOOVE!!!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 8:47 PM | Link to this

Im tired of seeing joe kneeling down the whole game while the entire team except him gets a rest, it makes the dude unproductive and it cant be good for his health

By ray

March 28, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

Matt, something’s up with him. He’s not been playing so well lately. You gotta wonder whether it’s just him or somebody telling him to play a certain way…which obviously isn’t working.

Najeh, makes you believe in MIB, doesn’t it?

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 8:53 PM | Link to this

I wanna give props to marvin he was shooting it really well im surprised he didnt get more looks, and he was a demon on the glass.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 8:59 PM | Link to this

LOL the bearded wonder

By Big Red

March 28, 2008 9:00 PM | Link to this

I agree with you hawks fan. I don’t get it. They have two good shooters on the bench that woody won’t play for some reason. If they make the playoffs, joe is going to be to wore down to really be productive.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:05 PM | Link to this

WTF THOSE ARE THE WORST CALLS ON JOSH

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 9:08 PM | Link to this

Mike Bibby is lights out 2nite!! These refs are really a joke…as usual!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:11 PM | Link to this

THE RESSURECTION OF AL HORFORD

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

With the big lead back, JJ should get some rest.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 9:13 PM | Link to this

The previously mentioned alien force clearly has taken over the entire Hawks’ team… when was the last time they actually had a scoring run in the 3rd quarter? Impossible!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:16 PM | Link to this

Yes finally joe gets a breather

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:18 PM | Link to this

ROFLMAO @ drew gooden the spinning turnover

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 9:33 PM | Link to this

Hey Richbrave

I need a newsapaper and a golden toilet seat before I can read a HANDO post.

It takes quite a while to get to the point you know! Anyway - I am heading over the chop-chik post to see what you told them’ haters over there.

Hey what is the topic for your thesis? Have fun with all that research. Go Hawks! End of third quarter.

By Rob

March 28, 2008 9:40 PM | Link to this

Smith’s stat package in tall company

Since the NBA started keeping track of steals and blocks in the 1973-74 season, only three players in league history have averaged at least 17.0 points, 8.0 rebounds, 3.0 assists, 1.5 steals and 2.8 blocks per game in one season with a minimum of 68 games played. What’s more, it’s only been done seven times.

Player, team (year) Games PPG RPG APG SPG BPG

Josh Smith, Atlanta (2007-08) 68 17.3 8.2 3.4 1.6 2.9

Hakeem Olajuwon, Houston (1995-96) 72 26.9 10.9 3.6 1.6 2.9

Olajuwon, Houston (1994-95) 72 27.8 10.8 3.5 1.8 3.4

Olajuwon, Houston (1993-94) 80 27.3 11.9 3.6 1.6 3.7

David Robinson, San Antonio (1993-94) 80 29.8 10.7 4.8 1.7 3.3

Olajuwon, Houston (1992-93) 82 26.1 13.0 3.5 1.8 4.2

Robinson, San Antonio (1992-93) 82 23.4 11.7 3.7 1.5 3.2

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:43 PM | Link to this

Why is it that when a guy is on fire he barely takes any shots but when one is not, he takes a helluva shots

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 9:46 PM | Link to this

WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:47 PM | Link to this

WTF……

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 9:49 PM | Link to this

I knew something wasn’t right.

Instead of sucking in the 3rd quarter and frantically trying to come back in the 4th, the Hawks seem to have decided to switch their strategy. Today they dominate in the 3rd and decide to suck in the 4th. Brilliant.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

Why are we reverting back to the go joe offense….woody, woody, woody answer me!!!

By Ken Strickland

March 28, 2008 9:52 PM | Link to this

And the ASG insisted on keeping this moron as the HC. His players are visibly exhaused and he still won’t give them a break. Explain to me why this fool wouldn’t rest his key players with a 22pt lead in the 3rd qtr? If we lose, I’ll bet Woodson will blame the players for getting tired.

By Matt

March 28, 2008 9:53 PM | Link to this

What the hell is wrong with Josh Smith?!?!?!?! He is NOT a point guard - why is he trying to take it coast to coast when Bibby is right next to him? Got stripped AGAIN! ANOTHER turnover. Jesus Christ!

Steve Holman and Dennis Scott just lost their temper at Smith. That boy needs to be benched in the fourth.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

Lol najeh…

By Joe Bling

March 28, 2008 9:54 PM | Link to this

One of these days you guys are going to understand what I’ve been trying to tell you about Josh Smith.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this

I gotta say, I am very impressed with Andres Nocioni. He is quite the Oomgowaye. I used to think he was just a dirty player, but he actually has some skills. Stats don’t really show it, but he’s kept the Bulls in the game.

By Matt

March 28, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this

And he just missed his fifth free throw of the night. Nice.

By Steve T

March 28, 2008 10:00 PM | Link to this

JS needs to play his game. He wants to be an all star so bad that he plays beyond his talents. He is not a PG so do not try to take people off the dribble. JS you can not go behind your back with the ball.

JS needs to do what they taught everyone who ever play, if you get a rebound, pass it to the PG.

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this

MAKE THE FREAKING FREETHROWS!!

By Steve T

March 28, 2008 10:01 PM | Link to this

JS needs to play his game. He wants to be an all star so bad that he plays beyond his talents. He is not a PG so do not try to take people off the dribble. JS you can not go behind your back with the ball.

JS needs to do what they taught everyone who ever play, if you get a rebound, pass it to the PG.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:02 PM | Link to this

YES thank god we drafted al horford

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:04 PM | Link to this

YES JOE!!!

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 10:08 PM | Link to this

Go figure…the rookie makes all his freethrows. I really hope these guys learn something from the Rookie!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:09 PM | Link to this

WTF mario almost fouled gordon…and joe misses the first frethrow and he makes the second

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this

Wow ben gordon is special when he is hot he almost made that. BUT AL HORFORD ROY!!!

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this

HORFORD SAVES THE DAY!!!!!

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this

Exciting finish and a good win, and I don’t mean to be a Debbie Downer, but that was a potentially fatal mistake by Al Horford. Go watch the tape from the Eagles-Cowboys game from last year Al — when you have a lead, and you can either score and stay up by one possession or run the clock down, you ALWAYS run the clock down. He should have stood under the hoop and waited for Chicago to come down and foul him.

By Matt

March 28, 2008 10:14 PM | Link to this

Who would’ve thought that it would be Marvin who came up with the big steal to save the day?

By Joe Bling

March 28, 2008 10:15 PM | Link to this

JS is on the bench because he doesn’t understand the first thing about how you win basketball games.

Horford, on the other hand, sure does. Bibby put up some big numbers, but the rookie gets my player of the game. What a winner that guy is!

By mrprozach

March 28, 2008 10:15 PM | Link to this

WHEW!!! The Hawks almost snatched defeat from the jaws of victory…AGAIN

By jami$$ion

March 28, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this

WOODY NEEDS 2 BE FIRED.WHEN OUR 6THMAN PLAYS MORE THAN THEIR STARTERS YOU HAVE A PROBLEM

By Joe Bling

March 28, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this

Najeh,

Of course you are right, and I was thinking the same thing, that he should have just run out the clock. But we’ve got to give the kid a break on that one. Would’ve taken a hell of a lot of self-control to pull up when you’re looking at a wide open slam like that. He was so psyched to throw that one down that he almost tripped over his own feet.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:22 PM | Link to this

Lol matt, wonderboymarvin saves the day, but najeh, i was glad that horf dunked it, i mean it was a one point lead and what if he misses one free throw or even both, i like my chances of him dunking rather then taking freethrows although he is a clutch freethrower..

By new jersey faithful

March 28, 2008 10:25 PM | Link to this

nice mrprozach!!! aint that the truth

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 10:26 PM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star

You are freakin’ incredible between the ears! Your brain is mapped out quite cleverly - you can thank God for that. That my friend - is a Gift!

You should seriously consider becoming a publisher and write some children’s book. Seriously, with your creativity and imagination you could single handedly change the WORLD! Why Not?

I have a machine called a Uni-Binder. This company is based out of Alpharetta, GA. (I actually own one of these). You can type, purchase the Hard-Back books, and insert up to 500 pages. The machine has a heating element which will melt the resins in the spine of the book. This will seal and glue the pages onto the spine of the book.

I am an at home publisher myself as well. I have made tons of proposals and have wowed many people in my business this way. I paid $350 for this machine valued at over $800

(I got the hook-up if you are interested)

You can publish at home and sell on E-bay! Think about it!

Anyway, about the A S S - Hopper, Absoulutely - I can fix this very perplexing problem!

This happens to be my area of Speciality! Let’s see - MMMMH! We have to be careful not to damage any useful and vital organs.

I recommend we leave the two feet firmly placed in the mouth - That’s a good start! That will prevent this Dumb-A S S from saying something STUPID in the future!

Next, we have to leave the other foot stuck in his Dumb-A S S too - (since this is his only means of transportation). Otherwise, we can’t tell him to take his Dumb-A S S home!

So, you see Ray-Star - Sometimes the best treatment is to do nothing at all!

Why don’t we just leave well enough alone and let this Dumb-A S S roll around and bump into Smart-A S S people? Like, Well - Like Us! ;O

If he get’s kicked around So - Be - it! My Mother, always told me A Hard Head makes a Soft Behind….Now I finally know what she meant.

Maybe, the next time he get’s his foot out of his mouth - He will keep his Big - A S S MOUTH SHUT!

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure! LMAO!

You are crazy man & I LOVE YOUR STUFF!

By Steve T

March 28, 2008 10:29 PM | Link to this

Thank God we had Bibby. JJ had an off night. JS almost blew the game. But Bibby was hot tonight. I do not know why Marvin did not take more shots. If we can get Marvin to score 30 every other game, we would be in better shape. Marvin had a double double and was perfect from the free throw line.

By terrell barron

March 28, 2008 10:42 PM | Link to this

Hey Woody, you know why Chills and Joe struggled from the line at the end of the game? When you’re up by 20, late in the 3rd, you should REST YOUR STARTERS. They were tired. IDIOT!

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 10:44 PM | Link to this

It is just me, or does Al Horford appear to be hitting that proverbial Rookie-Wall?

I noticed he was in early foul trouble tonight, but maybe sub-consciously he was fouling to get a little rest! I know, I know, this kid is a battle tested Warrior and a Back-To-Back CHAMPION!

But to battle against Gargantuan and Bohemoth Iconic Centers each & every night would wear down the best of us!

But keepin’ it REAL? That kid is asked to do a lot. I see he was 8 for 8 at the chairty-stripe, Shooting 4-7 from the field, for a total of 16 points - That is giving his team what it needs to win the game. Reminds you of anyone?

Yep - MJ or you can say Sir-Charles, Here’s my point! This Kid is So Very Special! I am So Happy that He is a HAWK! This may be the BIG-TICKET#2 - That salvages BK reputation.

BK had the Big A S S Balls to select another Power Forward One More Time! And that my friend - takes MOXIE and COURAGE and ARROGANCE and FAITH! In my opinion? BK put his job on the line with this pick after the FATAL ERROR of not taking CP3-MVP!

Reminds me of Dan Reeves drafting all them’ Tight-Ends! You know the Tight-End for the Chargers? Yeah the Pro-Bowl guy - I can’t think of his name, but Reeves drafted him for the Falcons and the following year took another TE remember? Algernon Crumpler! Everbody went crazy mad about this & Well, the rest is History! (we actually had two pro-bowl TE’s on one team at the same time & this guy went on to the chargers once we got Crump)

The Moral of this story is -

If at first you fail? - Then Try, Try and Try AGAIN!

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 10:47 PM | Link to this

This GAME my friends - went TO THE WIRE!

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 10:53 PM | Link to this

WOW HEADLINE NEWS

Im watching nbatv right now and this peter vescey guy says that win or lose woody is going to be fired. He also says that if larry brown doesnt go to memphis, he will go to atlanta to try to make them a solid team. He also says that alot of people want to coach the hawks. Dude i am loving this right now, pretty good news for the hawks…

By Big Red

March 28, 2008 11:02 PM | Link to this

Al Horford is da truth!

By SalimFan

March 28, 2008 11:11 PM | Link to this

I don’t want larry coming here though, but I like the news from vescey. How about a Hawk-Fratello reunuion?

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 11:15 PM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star

I didn’t actually see the GAME, I am here at the office - still billing the Insurance Companies. I listened to the Game on my NBA League Pass! And I just sensed that HORFORD might be hitting that Rookie-Wall we always hear about.

Well I just copied and pasted this line from the AP - from the Bulls-Hawks game notes:

Qoute:

The Bulls got one more chance, but Gordon missed. Horford bowed down on the court, looking exhausted but thrilled that the Hawks had escaped.

Do you feel the same way I do that Horford is running out of gas?

I don’t know if he can finish this year with a DOUBLE-DOUBLE as an average! I hope so - It’s the only way he has a chance to win ROY out-right!

Even if he doesn’t win ROY - He will always be a WINNER in my BOOK!

I’m thinking possibly he wins Co-Rookie like GRANT HILL who shared this same award with - AAAAH! Who did he share that TROPHY WITH?

Somebody - Help me out here!

By doc

March 28, 2008 11:22 PM | Link to this

hey ando, sure wish we could spend your words as you get your moneys worth. if i had a dime for every one of the words of yours on this blog that i have read we could share it and still have enough for ray and to repay jhan for his kindness.

geat to see the hawks held curt tonight. missed the game save the las two minutes and the wrap up of the first quarter. geez they make it hard on themselves.

is it true that marvin was sighted laying defense and rebounding or did the blind squirrel find the nut tonight?

By Joe Bling

March 28, 2008 11:24 PM | Link to this

Dude, Horford wasn’t even close to running out of gas tonight. Everybody else was on empty, but The Rookie kicked on the afterburners and toasted da Bulls.

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 11:28 PM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star

Isn’t The Big-Ticket really a #4? Who plays center for Boston?

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 11:33 PM | Link to this

If Salim had a ROLE? - He would probably calm down - and PLAY!

Poor kid - he never knows when and if he will ever see the floor!

Woody is a Dumb-A S S! He’s like that guy who’s been on the job so long he has tenure and seniority - so the new people just know they will never be promoted!

Your’e like - How does this GUY keep his job?

It’s called P O L I T I C S - People!

By drmaryb

March 28, 2008 11:47 PM | Link to this

Damn ROB Is that true? Wow! what a great research job!

You know what really strikes me? Didn’t Josh spend the summer with Olajuwan and Calvin Murphy trying to hone his low-post game and ball handling skills?

Wow! what an incredible stat!

Folks - Fans - Pipe Down! Please - about J-Smooves short-comings! This kid came out of HIGH-SCHOOL! And he has heart! You can’t COACH two things:

HEIGHT and HEART! Josh Smith has a little of one and a whole lot of the latter! How many teams will take this kid off our hands? ALL OF THEM!

Be Careful with your expectations - Be Reasonable People!

America - Atlantans - Don’t Count Your CHickens Before They HATCH!

Remember BRETT FARVE? J-Smoove is growing, he is special and he will IMPROVE! For now? - YOU CAN BLAME THE COACH & the ORG! You just can’t blame the Kids - It’s bigger than that!

Let’s Build Something Here in Atlanta - that will Last. Look at SA & Detroit, et.al. These teams stay together and they have chemistry & Oh Yeah a HC too! But remember this - These teams STICK-PILE talent , they don’t ship it out to the competition!

Leave BK alone and lets get a HC Next!

By SalimFan

March 28, 2008 11:48 PM | Link to this

Ament to that sister.

By hawksfanfordawin

March 28, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this

Aaagh, i dont totally agree with that, if we get a really good player for smith than i would do it. My point is that the kid is just plain dumb, i mean he dazzles us with his athletism but the leaves us scratching our head with his turnovers. I thought by now that he would learn to pass up the ball when leading the break but yet he still thinks that hes magic johnson. And if hes going to ask for max money i definetly dont do it hes cancer and is going to mess up the make up of the team in the years to come. I dont know if we could even sign horford if we sign smoove to max.

By Najeh Davenpoop

March 28, 2008 11:59 PM | Link to this

I think fatigue is an issue for all the Hawks right now, not just Horford. If he had a rookie wall he would have hit it a month ago. Today Marvin played a great game in defense and rebounding, and attacked a lot of the boards Horford normally gets.

Josh Smith played a bad game offensively, yeah, but he played a very good game defensively. They counted 5 blocks, but he altered at least 5-6 other shots as well. Like I have always said, he is a rare bundle of talents — a good coach will harness those talents, and until then he will continue to make some of the stupid mistakes he made today.

drmaryb: Dan Reeves didn’t draft Antonio Gates. Gates was undrafted, and came into the league after Crumpler. The guy you are thinking of is Reggie Kelly, who last I saw him was getting his a* super-glued to the Bengals’ bench.

Woody reminds me of Burrell from The Wire — too bad there isn’t a Carcetti to come in and kick him out, or a Daniels to replace him.

By drmaryb

March 29, 2008 12:19 AM | Link to this

Hey Najeh

You are absolutely right man! You definitely read my mind. Reggie Kelley is the TE I was confused about. Yep, he went to the Bengals - I think he went there before they got that real-HC…AAAH! is it LOVIE_SMITH? No that’s the Bears-HC! Is it HC- Marvin Williams in Cincinnati? (wait a minute - are there two marvin williams?)

Anyway, Antonio Gates was un-drafted? I thought Reeves selected him - My bad! But you get my point! Sometimes, like BK is in love with Power Fowards and Dan Reeves with them’ TE’s? You lose sight of the Big-Picture, But you have to give credit for consistency and philosophy - at some point! You are bound to get a HIT! And HORFORD my friend is a HIT!

By ray

March 29, 2008 12:39 AM | Link to this

drmaryb, thanks! I don’t think Horford’s running out of gas, but he is definitely doing things that we didn’t expect from him, and he hasn’t hit the dreaded rookie wall. In fact, he smashed right on through it. However, you know it’s taking a toll on his body. It’s just that he has so much HEART. Wow. We are so fortunate to have him. Good thing the ping pong balls bounced the way they did. Good thing Billy wasn’t too stupid to pick him. He would’ve been gone with the next pick. He’s a keeper, no matter how you slice it.

Matt, I don’t know what the hell is wrong with Josh. He has been playing this bad lately, but was doing quite well before. It’s crazy. He’s dropping in nearly every stat category-points, rebounds, assists…everything. What’s worse? He knows it and probably feels like he should be contributing more. Which is why he’s trying to force things and only forcing turnovers. Look back 10 games and he wasn’t having this problem. Thing is, his stats have been dropping since the all-star break.

I stand firm behind the belief that a better coach would be a huge effect on him. The way I figure it, if he couldn’t do significantly better with a good coach, then I’d say he’s nothing more than a talented wash. But I’ve seen Woody’s influence ruin so many players. The only ones he couldn’t ruin were experienced veterans with talent (Bibby, JJ), and special players like Al Horford. And even then, I believe Horford would be a 15/10 guy if Woody had used him properly. The guy can score, but Woody doesn’t know how to use him. Only NOW is he starting to get a few touches. And I don’t think Woody means for it to happen.

I don’t think Josh is a cancer either. Not anymore so than Marvin. The fact that we have both guys who are rather flawed on one end of the floor or the other is the problem. One makes a ton of mistakes but does have some offensive capability, but is great on the defensive end. The other has limited, but good offensive capabilities…but is nearly non-existent on the defensive end.

Do we pay Josh max money? No. Do we trade him? For the right person…yes. Why? Because paying him max money isn’t worth it right now. And because we can’t keep this lineup the way it is.

It’s a catch 22. You let Marvin go, you are committing to Josh most likely. That means you get damn good defense, but offensive liability unless and until you bring in a good coach who can work with and use Josh properly. You let Josh go, you are committing to Marvin. Which means you have no defense at that spot, spotty rebounding, and limited offense. Unless or until you bring in a coach who can help him along. If he can be helped along. That goes for both guys.

Good to get a win tonight.

By ray

March 29, 2008 12:42 AM | Link to this

drmaryb, I think you mean Marvin Lewis.

By drmaryb

March 29, 2008 12:50 AM | Link to this

Hey hawksfanfordawin

You can’t be serious! Thank God you are not a - GM. J-Smoove is like Ben & Jerry’s Ice Cream:

Sweet-Unpredictable-Unforgettable!

BK took a chance on him at #17 in Round #1. Do me a favor and name what player selected ahead of him that you would rather take? Or any player taken behind him for that matter? Now don’t name the obvious #1 or #2 taken …. On second thought have at it and name all the players in his draft class that you would trade him for!

I am very curious to hear your hind-sighted selection - and I will be waiting - my friend!

MMMMMMHH! Who is on that short list?

?DUMB? That is a very strong word. How dumb can a millionaire really be unless he throws away all his money ALA: MICHAEL VICK?

J-Smoove can’t be that dumb and fill the stats sheets the way he does. He has a motor, he never quits, his basketball IQ will come with experience.

I am sure Tiger Woods beats himself over the head sometimes too! Hell even he can’t win them all!

Some days are really really good - and that’s right! You guessed it - Some days are really really bad!

Haven’t you ever had a Bad-Day and did something STUPID! Of course you have - haven’t we all?

But to call the man dumb is not fair.

He is learning the game the same way MJ did and the same way KOBE is - even KOBE as great as he is has been very very very very very very DUMB at times - acutally - MOST OF THE TIME!

Remember Colorado?

Got White-Milk?

Didn’t Kobe demand a dumb a s s trade this summer and included CHICAGO of all dumb-a s s places he wanted to play?

Ever wonder why no team bothered to trade for his Dumb-A S S?

You guessed right - he’s a perenial - head case! He single handedly drove Phil Jackson to take up Pot-Smoking!

J-Smoove is just YOUNG - Not DUMB! He will learn and get better! Ask any GM out there & they will tell you the same thing!

PEACE - OUT hawksfanfordawin ;o

By Joe Bling

March 29, 2008 1:06 AM | Link to this

What’s crazy is that the Josh dilemma shouldn’t even be a dilemma at all. He’s nuts on defense, and when he’s throwing down a tomahawk jam. Why can’t he learn to just stick to that?! Jeez! Is it that hard to figure out? Just quit taking the stupid shots and trying to run the ball down the court like you’re Magic. Just stop the stupid stuff, please. I’m beginning to think that there’s more than one reason he skipped college. The kid just won’t learn.

By drmaryb

March 29, 2008 1:07 AM | Link to this

Hey Ray-Star

Absolutely right! Marvin Lewis. However, I beg to differ on J-Smoove.

His numbers are dropping dramatically since the All-Star break for one good reason - Bibby! And I predicted this in an old post. You see, Bibby changes everyone’s role on this team.

He is the GENERAL now. Before, the ball was brought up the court by whom-ever snagged the rebound. Usually, Josh Smith therefore he had an equal number of assists and TO’s.

It was a wash! 50/50 assist to TO ratio. Now, his assists are way down thanks to Bibby, relative to that his TO’s are also down.

Do you remember when AI lead the NBA in TO’s?

AI eventually grew out of that habit too ! (he’s just tryi’n to do it all by himself and tryin’ to do too much - But at least he is TRYIN’)

We have got to be patient - We can’t REBUILD forever?

It’s just that now, everything is amplified because of the PLAYOFFS and where we are as a growing team. They are still getting used to playing with Bibby. Tonight - Bibby took over the team and willed this victory.

But back to J-Smoove, I would not move him, he still has value even if we sign him to a MAX he is worth it!

And at least ONE other team will think so too, If you still want to package him later on down the road.

Hell, if you want to talk DUMB hawksfordawin? What about DeAngelo Hall? Now that guy? My friend - Is as DUMB as it GETS!

By HB Ando

March 29, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this

Brother Doc: after a couple of decades as a vascular surgeon, should you really need a dime for everyone of my words?

Just sayin’, with nothing but respect.

And on another subject, doc, tell me about Triphala. Heard from my boy, Pete’s new friend, that it was an excellent complement to the probiotics I have been taking. Thoughts?