Hawks

By g-thang

January 23, 2008 10:13 PM | Link to this

I was so high on the Hawks in June after getting the 3rd pick in the draft and then following that up with Horford/Law. During training camp, I heard that the players all got together a month before camp begin and worked out together. Then preseason, I was like WHOA! 7-1, then the 1st home game against Dallas and I was like WHOA!! Now the wheels appear to be fallin’ off. The Hawks have been surpassed by Washington, Cleveland which we were ahead of them. Charlotte has caught us and New York is only 3 games behind us. A sad commentary. I doubt very seriously that they make a trade or fire Woody, before the season is out. This team was playoff bound, but I don’t see them winning but 33 games. That means that they will win only 17 games out of the next 53. THE LOW LIGHT FACTORY!!

By mykhalc

January 23, 2008 10:21 PM | Link to this

SEKOU, let’s just hope WOODSON is a part of any change in the works!!!!

By mykhalc

January 23, 2008 10:28 PM | Link to this

man did you cats FINALLY get a filter for your blogs????!!! change REALLY MUST BE comin’!!!!

By cp

January 23, 2008 10:31 PM | Link to this

We can’t hit anything tonight. Josh Smith is frustrated and playing wild again. Marvin is being Marvin meaning he isn’t doing anything since his jumper is not falling. T Lue played pretty well and Solo gave some energy. Woody still is not making any adjustments that I notice. Like mykhalic said, hopefully Mike ‘Gregg Knapp” is part of those changes. I doubt we make a trade seeing how BK is the gm and if we do make one I wouldnt be shocked if we came out on the short end.

By g-thang

January 23, 2008 10:32 PM | Link to this

Woody has been called out by veteran players, such as A.J., now ZaZa. Last year it was JSmoove. I am telling you that players have each other’s back against management. This team doesn’t respect Woody. They hate him and are underperforming, not intentionally, because they are professional, but Woody is not bringin’ out the best in them. I see the Hawks winning 1 out of these 5 games on the west coast. Oh, don’t think that they players are not taking note of Mullin leavin’.

By Astro Joe

January 23, 2008 10:49 PM | Link to this

I’ll believe when I see it. We’ll probably end up trading Salim to Milwaukee for Brian Skinner, or something low budget like that.

Sekou, what’s the Salim injury again?

By new jersey faithful

January 23, 2008 10:57 PM | Link to this

If the Hawks go 0-5 on this trip(i really hope they dont), whoever is making the decisions at the top must seriously consider firing Woody. The talent is totally there, and if they continue to slide the coach HAS to be held accountable. As im sure many have, just look at the Blazers, youth isnt an excuse up there, its a blessing!! To bad its not a blessing for the Hawks too!!!

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 10:59 PM | Link to this

SEKOU

In a way, I hope you are right, and something is brewing. I get tired of seeing the Hawks not make a push to improve this team. I just don’t want to see ATL trade away a lot of the young talent for a one or two year player. That’s how the Hawks got in this mess to begin with. I’m all for improvement, especially with this team….but at what cost???

By rainman

January 23, 2008 11:00 PM | Link to this

This makes me sick to say but I am starting to wish I was black so maybe I could get an NBA coaching job.

By terrell barron

January 23, 2008 11:10 PM | Link to this

Damn Marvin, that was a lazy pass. Down 10 with 5 min to go.

By mykhalc

January 23, 2008 11:10 PM | Link to this

i’m payin’ for NBALP but watchin’ the AUSSIE OPEN (women semi’s)!! that’s how much i despise what WOODSON is doin’ to this team!!! and to top it off, now i’m waitin’ for the FALCONS to start up again!!!

here’s a trade for ya…don’t know if the salaries tho…

MARVIN/ZAZA/SALIM for GASOL!!! probably would have to add SHELDON to match salaries. i think GASOL makes 12mil/year???

By new jersey faithful

January 23, 2008 11:16 PM | Link to this

Check out Horford line 2nite…5 steals and no turnovers, 1 block, 2 assists and a double double. This guy is just AWESOME!!!!! And rainman, why you gotta start trouble??

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 11:17 PM | Link to this

mykhalc No way Memphis does that trade…does look nice though. And nothing wrong with watching the Aussie Open…especially if Sharapova is playing (and I don’t even like blonde’s) LOL

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 11:20 PM | Link to this

those shooting percentages are horrifying

7/21 (JS) 5/17 (JJ) by the way, he’s had too many nights like this so far this season 6/14 (MW)

Not supposed to win when your “Big 3” shoot like that. Yet, somehow, within 4. Not that I expect them to actually come from behind and win…but somehow this team always seems to give you that slight bit of hope and desire before crashing down on you. LOL

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 11:23 PM | Link to this

I could barely post before the went from being 4 down to being 8 down in a matter of a few seconds….

NICE COACHING JOB AGAIN WOODSON…You are on it!!!!!!

Maybe Woodson will get lost on his way home, never be figure out where he is (kind of like his coaching ability), and we’ll never see or hear from him again.

Just a thought.

By rainman

January 23, 2008 11:27 PM | Link to this

Gasol would love that. A smart hard working player comes to the hood and plays for the dumbest coach and gm in the game. He would be gone asap.

By new jersey faithful

January 23, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this

Nice triple double for J. Smith…too many turnovers though

By THE Hawks Fan

January 23, 2008 11:37 PM | Link to this

What can you do? Would a trade even help??? I mean seriously!! Would anybody good enough to get want to EVEN PLAY here??? It would take a SUPERSTAR trade for this team to change. Ie Koby King James D Howard. I mean BONEHEAD just DUMBAZZZ mistakes!!! No life No effort No Defense No running . More assist from the PF than the point guard. Denver is horrible and WILL not make the playoffs in the west. I love My Hawks, but im worn down. Im tired. Things have to change to get better. BUT at the start of the year things were different. We won 5 games straight. Then ALL of a sudden were a great team with great DEPTH. BULLcockamammiestrappnoodleshiet. The OBJECT of the game is to WIN. PERIOD!! Nothing else but to win! Coach Woodson needs to look long and hard at his ROTATION. SHAKE things up, try something, anything!! But the 1 thing missing that was there at the start of the year that is gone now is TEAM DEFENSE. These guys are not playing team ball at ALL. They almost quit tonight, a couple more losses and the will quit. ALL I ask is show some PRIDE. You are still pro’s. Do that and I will always be a FAN. GOOOO HAWKSS!!!!

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 11:48 PM | Link to this

Here’s my thing…and I know people will say I’m crazy. Why doesn’t ATL entertain the thought of trading JJ. I know he’s very solid and most nights dependable. But the trade value for him right now is very high. Give Smith his extension…come one…22/12/10/5…I know 7 TO’s…but you can’t beat his overall importance and value…and his age! We could get a big and a score for JJ, along with a draft pick. Now if you really want Gasol, and I’m not knowledgable on the salaries…but package JJ, Sheldon, ZaZa, Lue…for Gasol, Mike Miller, Hakim Warrick(completely underutilized in Memphis). The only one we would miss would be JJ…certainly wouldn’t miss Sheldon, ZaZa, or Lue. I would have put Salim in there…but I really want to see what the kid has…and not for another coach on another team.

By mykhalc

January 23, 2008 11:55 PM | Link to this

JohnGTFan, yep SHARAPOVA into the finals!!

you are probably right about the trade. but as it stands, for me, JJ, JS, and AH are untouchable…right now. so i gotta be creative with what’s left!!! so maybe LW goes instead of SHELDEN since LW’s contract is expirin’ (i think)!!???!!

anyway, just get me some change damn it!!!

By JohnGTFan

January 23, 2008 11:58 PM | Link to this

Of course knowing the ATL “decision makers”. They will probably trade JJ, Law, Childress, and Smith for Shaq and a 2014 second round pick.

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:03 AM | Link to this

Pau Gasol would be a great pickup. Him and Joe Johnson is a great inside/out duo that easily superior to Brandon Roy/Lamarcus Aldridge….. get them and we can fight Toronto for the 6 spot in the East easily and thats just because we’ve dug ourselves a bit of a hole or else we could get higher.

Hopefully we get a good PG out of this trade too, even Damon Stoudamire would be good to have, he can shoot. Keep Marvin because he would be good in a halfcourt/lowpost offense shooting off of Pau’s double-teams and Joe’s creating open shots for him…. and if Horford is kept that would be a very good big to fill out the frontcourt next to Gasol….. so who are we trading for Gasol and Stoudamire???? Josh Smith and Childress with expiring deals and maybe a conditional pick? SOUNDS GREAT TO ME!!!!

By Clyde

January 24, 2008 12:06 AM | Link to this

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

Gotta give props to my boy Jsmooth. Right now he is the leader of this team. Some people like to lead by running their mouth but Jsmooth is leading by example. I don’t know what JJ is doing. We need to trade JJ for a point guard and a draft pick, give Jsmooth his extention, and build around Jsmooth and Horford. The party at the beginning of the season is over.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 12:11 AM | Link to this

steve, if HORFORD is kept???!!! i must say i have found a couple of your last posts….puzzlin’!!! but hey, keep it comin’!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:12 AM | Link to this

Trade Josh Smith for Pau Gasol, package Childress in with him if we have to. I’d rather keep Marvin in a lowpost offense than Josh because Marvin can play off of Pau and JJ better than Smoove can. Smoove is better for uptempo/running style. Marvin is an absolute stud and would be a great 3rd option beside Pau Gasol as our primary interior option and 20/10 guy and JJ as our primary perimeter option and 22/5/5 guy. Horford is great for the 4/5 frontline spot next to Gasol in every way, and if Damon Stoudamire is in the deal coming here he is a good PG for the halfcourt set that can get everyone involved and can SHOOT to spread the floor…….. Childress is best in uptempo thats why he’s packaged with J-Smoove and the expiring contracts…… we’re good to go!!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:16 AM | Link to this

Josh Smith cant shoot.

By JohnGTFan

January 24, 2008 12:17 AM | Link to this

Steve Not to say that’s a bad trade…but I have to think about keeping JS over JJ. His ceiling is just too d@mn high. He, unlike JJ, plays defense. He has it all.

I think all this talk is all-for-not anyway. I’m sure if ATL makes a trade…it will make absolutely no sense (last year’s lone trade)

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:18 AM | Link to this

To get pau gasol they might want Horford MyhchalC

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this

man, i just looked at JS’ line, triple-double with 5 blks!!! NICE!! 7 TO’s but can’t pick on that effort at all!!!

i really felt like as i watched the start of the game JS was the only one not affected by the altitude!! all the other starters just seemed leg heavy and grabbin’ their shorts early!!!

anyway, congrats JOSH SMITH!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:22 AM | Link to this

Tmac and Yao are NASTY!

By cp

January 24, 2008 12:22 AM | Link to this

You want to trade Josh Smith but keep Marvin Williams? Im sorry but replace Marvin with Josh and im all for it. I just dont see this great talent in Marvin. His defense is horrible, not a good rebounder, wont do much else if his jumper is not working for him. If the only player we are dangling out there is Salim then well we might as well not make any trades. Its hard being a fan of this team. Managment continues to sit on their hands instead of trying to improve this team

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:24 AM | Link to this

Johngtfan I hear you but J-Smoove is just a Shawn Marion type, we’ll be alright, i actually think Marvins ceiling is higher

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

MCGRADY IS SO DAMN GOOD!!!! MCGRADY AND YAO ARE NASTY…… wow, the Rockets may have just came together in front of my very own eyes tonight……. wow. Theyre gonna go on a tear from this point..

I hope we get Pau Gasol and the team around Pau and JJ (Mostly d stoudamire, Marvin, Horford, Law, Lue, Salim, Etc etc.) I can say the same thing about some time down the stretch run.

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 12:27 AM | Link to this

steve, i think you’re right they WILL WANT HORFORD!! but with GASOL comin’ off injury and with what HORFORD brings to the team, no way i’d include him. and that means no deal if he has to be included. the addition of GASOL and the subtraction of HORFORD does not make the HAWKS a better team…IMHO!!!

By JohnGTFan

January 24, 2008 12:29 AM | Link to this

OK…here we go

Trade JJ, ZaZa, Sheldon, Lue and MIKE WOODSON to the………………. Knicks for Stephon Marbury, Nate Robinson, and Eddy Curry….plus, NY pays half of Stephon’s contract. Woodson would be a PERFECT fit in NY…the only more disfunctional organization than ATL. As a bonus for taking Woodson, ATL agrees to wear those horrible orange uniforms when they face each other for the next 5 years.

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:31 AM | Link to this

CP, if we get Gasol Marvin fits in much better spreading the defense and making open shots off of the doubleteams that Gasol creates from the lowpost (Plus open shots off of what JJ creates as our perimeter #1 option)…. he fits in much better for that style of team than J-Smoove does.

J-Smoove wont knock down those open shots, and Horfords rebounding at the 4 is great next to Gasol and Marvin is a good rebounding SF anyways. Defense we have two bigs lockin down the paint all we have to do is stick to the system. J-smoove fits better to uptempo, just like Chllz…… Marvin is much better than Smoove for a lowpost/halfcourt offensive attack.

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:33 AM | Link to this

AND YOU DEFINITELY WANT TO KEEP JJ NO MATTER WHAT IF YOURE GETTING GASOL, he is the best possible guy to have for a lowpost/halfcourt offensive system BY FAR.

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 12:36 AM | Link to this

Pau Gasol is not the solution !!

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 12:37 AM | Link to this

durin’ camp DREW said MARVIN’s longterm/best position ‘might’ ultimately be at 2. now just that statement ALONE lets me know DREW would be lookin’ at this roster in a totally different way. it also ‘might’ give insight into how DREW views MW’s other skills at the 3 spot!!!

i don’t know what MARVIN will become but i’d take a chance on lettin’ him go knowin’ what i have in JS already!!! but of course, that’s provided they’re willing to sign him longterm!!

but i can say that JS longterm and WOODSON WILL NEVER FLY!!!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:37 AM | Link to this

Well, it makes the Hawks better in the short term but definitely not the longterm. I agree, you keep Horford, and JJ no matter what. Marvin damn near no matter what too, they all fit in best with Pau Gasol anyways.

J-Smoove and Childress along with expiring deals for Gasol and Damon Stoudamire is the deal I would go for. That would be a great deal for us for now and we keep our young franchise big of the future in Horford and a great perimeter talent for the future in Marvin (only 21 years old).

How old is Gasol anyways?…… that would be a GREAT deal.

By JohnGTFan

January 24, 2008 12:41 AM | Link to this

Back to reality for a moment…Gasol isn’t coming to ATL. Only on his way through for the Grizz or another team. No way this team makes a “blockbuster”. Just isn’t going to happen.

By JohnGTFan

January 24, 2008 12:46 AM | Link to this

Steve

It’s not enough for Gasol. They’re not the type of “expiring contracts” that teams look for when making trades. They want those types for coming off the salary cap. These are two young guys that, if they would trade for them, would want to resign. And do you honestly think JS would go to Memphis for a tad over a year???? NOT A CHANCE.

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 12:50 AM | Link to this

Steve,

No way I would give up J-Smoove and Childress for Gasol and Damon Stoudamire. Memphis is 12-30 with Gasol - not very good.

J-Chill is the best thing we have coming off the bench and J-Smoove is our best inside scorer. Marvin is more expendable than either of those players, in my opinion.

By steve

January 24, 2008 1:26 AM | Link to this

Gasol would be our best inside scorer, not smoove.

And buddy, the expirings im talking about are our expiring contracts thrown in with Smoove and Chillz to make the deal happen. Obviously smoove and chillz are the substance in the deal that they want to keep around as their acquisition, Smoove and Chillz are not the expirings (Obviously)

By HB Ando

January 24, 2008 1:26 AM | Link to this

If we’re going to make silly, unlikely trade suggestions, I’d look at (given the salary cap requirements for such a trade) offering Joe Johnson, Marvin Williams, and either Shelden or Zaza, for Gay and Gasol. But we’d still need a PG, though I think Acie has to be given a do-over for next year, given his injuries and the coaching staff’s failure to optimize his skill set. But maybe we could throw in Acie for Kyle Lowry, since Conley is clearly they’re PG of the future, and Acie could be their combo guard off the bench, coming in for Conley and Joe.

Of course I think all these ideas are nonsense, since Billy Knight couldn’t pull off a smart trade if his life depended on it.

I think it’s safe to say that we’re at the beginning of the end, as far as this season goes.

Does anyone know, or have an informed opinion, on whether Mullins’ departure was related to either support for, or movement against, the near-term removal of Billy Knight? Any concrete insight into that question would go many miles towards establishing expectations for the rest of this season, and the upcoming summer.

It would be very pleasing to find that the removal of Mullins was the last impediment to changing out Billy and Woody. But I’m guessing that’s wishful thinking on my part.

If anyone wants to put money on whether the Hawks will make the playoffs this season, I’m receptive to placing my cash on NOT.

The kid from “The Sixth Sense” saw dead people. I just see a dead franchise……..

By JohnGTFan

January 24, 2008 1:42 AM | Link to this

HB Ando

I obviously have no inside knowledge…but from what I’ve read and heard, his contract was going to expire and this was more of a “let me resign before I’m told I won’t be retained”.

By jami$$iondadon

January 24, 2008 1:48 AM | Link to this

I luv u guys. I am a sportsfanatic & nothing would make me more estatic than a good trade&woody firing.A Gasol,js,horford frontcourt would b nasty. Steve u usually post well 2nite u on dat glass homey.Smoove&MW r da same age.& r liteyearsapart.Smoove is a jackofalltradesplayer I wouldn’t trade him 4 pau str8up n if smoovedamatrix mw’s a cheapazz quentinrichardson.& where is jj’s jumper everyothergameplayingazz.trade jj zaza &filler 4curry crawford,or kayman maggette,speedycontract&filler 4 bibby or cassel

By Dale

January 24, 2008 1:54 AM | Link to this

Wow, another lost. I agree with most of you, the Hawks DO NOT play with pride, heart, or intensity. Indeed a ot of that has to do with the coaching. Even when we were winning, I hated Woodson’s rotation..when a player is hot, he takes them out of the game. ZAza plays like a high schooler, and as sweet as JJ jumper is, he is so very inconsistent and truly NOT worthy to make the all star team. Yeah, yeah JS makes many turnovers and shots too many jumpers but at least he comes to play each night. I want mention the point gurd situation… a shame…I habe been to six homes this year, each one we have lost…I thought it was me….a bad luck charm but i really do believe it is the lack of heart and coaching….I hate to hate on a brother.

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 2:12 AM | Link to this

The Hawks have to make a trade, and Marvin has to be the centerpiece. The Hawks have to trade Marvin now before the rest of the league realizes that he sucks. Hint: Kyle Lowry is never going to start for Memphis, and Sergio Rodriguez is never going to start for Portland.

If you can get Gasol for a package centered around Marvin, great. Gasol’s not a franchise player and Memphis is gonna look for a franchise player-type package for him, so I doubt the Hawks would be able to make that trade. Trading J-Smoove for Gasol would be idiotic in my opinion. But with this team of athletes, I’d rather see the Hawks get a young, quick point guard who can get to the rim, set people up, and knock down open shots. Joe Johnson is playing so inefficiently mainly because he has to work so hard for every shot. I’d think the Hawks can get either Lowry or Rodriguez while keeping Joe, J-Smoove and Horford, the three best players on this team. Marvin is quite useless but if Billy can sell some team on his “potential” maybe we can get a point guard out of it.

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 2:31 AM | Link to this

unless he does a 180 or somethin’ close, JOSH SMITH is the bright light to this season to date. for a cat that started off like WTF is he doin’, he has totally made leaps and bounds to makin’ his game a given, nite-in nite-out!!! and regardless to what his motivation might or might not be, i really do appreciate watchin’ a cat’s game mature and grow right before my eyes!! and to top it off the cat is 22 yrs old!!!!

his effort has not taken a nite off this season that i can remember!!! his smarts weren’t there in the early weeks but he has more than made up for it since then.

GREG ODEN was in a headset at the POR game tonite and he was talkin’ about how JS changed how POR attacked when they last played. his point was that he felt like he could make the defensive difference that a player like JS makes even if he doesn’t score that much next season.

i really think JS will be the unchallenged leader of this team if/when they sign him longterm.

as much as i luv JJ’s game, i do find it a little odd that now that he has a bit more help, mainly HORFORD of course, and the continued maturation of JS, (MW to a degree) it is his game that has lacked any consistency this year. don’t know what it says other than WOODSON is still in the way of the team’s growth!! (i know there’s no correlation but i’m really sick of WOODSON)

anyway i just gotta give JS props again for his 1st career triple-double!!! keep on bringin’ it big guy!!!!!

By Chris D'

January 24, 2008 5:48 AM | Link to this

The answer for this organization is not a trade under current management. This GM and coach have failed to deliver on multiple occasions. There is no logical reasoning for asking them to make additional changes and/or further be allowed to not develop the players on the current roster.

The roster of this team is not the problem. This roster can compete with anyone in the NBA and has the talent to be a playoff team. There are young pieces that if they are developed right can be very successful in this league.

Instead of trading our young talent and expiring contracts to another team to take advantage of and fully utilize. I have an idea. Why don’t the Hawks take advantage of their young talent and expiring contracts. Not that an another old PG pickup at the trade line wouldn’t be exciting but….

By Daniel

January 24, 2008 6:39 AM | Link to this

I’m usually one to advocate for a Gasol trade but I have come to the conclusion that this is a choice between changing the team or changing how the team plays. I think it is easier at this point to just change the coach. Woody raised this team up but Billy built a team just not suited to this style of basketball.

Let ‘em run

By yessir

January 24, 2008 7:41 AM | Link to this

Fire Clyde

By kevin

January 24, 2008 8:26 AM | Link to this

I think that JS would play well at the 3 as long as the point guard spot was more of a jumpshooting threat. I like the idea of picking up a mike miller as well. If you did this you could play JJ and Chill as points for limited times .

Marvin , Zaza, Lo, Salim and Speedy for Gasol,Miller and Damon S. Contracts that are either expiring / insurance covered or good young talent locked in at good prices. ZaZa and Marvin fit in in Memphis as 4 and 5, Speedy will more than likely be off the books next year for them and Salim is a scorer that if they let him play each night they could probably get flip murray value for him when he is going for 20 each night. Throw in 2nd rnd pick and as much cash as allowed by league rules. I am not totally against throwing in Acie.

By randy

January 24, 2008 8:33 AM | Link to this

The only thing that scares me more than BK doing nothing is BK doing something in regards to trades. After “Gimpy” Claxton and Lorenzon “The Foul Machine” Wright my confidence in his decision making is shot. But if Shelden, Zaza, Salim aren’t gonna ever get playing time, might as well move them if that is who the deal will involve.

3 out of last 11, SAME OL’ HAWKS!!

By preston

January 24, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

lol……..randy, I think you just made the best point yet…….do we really trust BK to do anything at this point….the only thing worst than this current mess with the hawks is to take two steps backwards…..I hate that Salim is not getting his chance, and I would hate to see him traded which is what is probaly going to happen being that he is not being used…….what is going on behind closed doors that would make you frustrate your fan base and sit on a guy that is a legitamate outside threat and is proven scorer?

By SSI Fan

January 24, 2008 9:09 AM | Link to this

On ESPN insider Chad Ford suggests one way to fix the Knicks would be to trade Eddie Curry to Atlanta for Zaza and Tyronne. I’m not a big Curry fan but he would be better than Zaza and Tyronne.

By smartguy

January 24, 2008 9:19 AM | Link to this

Woody makes me vomit. Like, mykhalc, I was also watching women’s tennis last night instead of watching the Hawks. One is enjoyable, one makes me feel like banging my head against the wall.

Yo, DA Gearon, ur boys sure looked seamless last night. The players looked like they had been punched in the gut, and Woody looked like he was about to cry at any moment. Keep lying to yourselves, Spirit, but we ain’t buyin the crap you’re sellin.

The only thing more perplexing to me than not playing Salim is the idea that Smooth would put up 22, 12, 10, 5, and 3, and people would suggest to trade him. Ya’ll must be nuts. For a long time, I’ve been a fan of all our players, and I looked forward to watching them together for many years. But, now I’ve got one foot one the trade joe bandwagon. Joe ran his mouth off on season’s eve, and while every other player has improved this year from last, Joe has gotten worse.

How many times do we have to run the same failed play in order to learn that it doesn’t work. Iso for Joe out of a time out is the worst play in the league. It must have a success rate of between 10 and 25 %, yet that is all Woody ever calls out of a TO. This summer I pointed this out, and got blasted by many people. Now that the season has gone on, I don’t know ow you could argue it. Its not that I don’t want Joe to take big shots, its that I don’t want Joe taking isolated, stagnant, step-back jumpers.

Mike Woodson must be a very slow learner. It took him over three years to change our routine for halftime and the second half. For three years, we were a terrible third quarter team. Finally, this year Woody decided a change might help, and he started giving the players more time to warm up at the half. I haven’t seen any numbers, but as far as I can tell, our third quarter play has been much improved.

Mr. Gearon, you deserve a coach as dumb as you, unfortunately, the rest of us do not. Take out a loan, call a friend, beg and plead… please, please, please get us a new coach.

By Don

January 24, 2008 9:39 AM | Link to this

Why don’t we try a new coach first? Woodson can’t light a fire with a match!

By roan st

January 24, 2008 9:58 AM | Link to this

Davenpoop, you and I feel the same way about marvin “clumsy” williams. If the hawks trade josh smith and keep marvin williams I will be done with this team for life. I have been a Hawks fan since 1977. Some fans keep talking about Marvin’s upside and ceiling but I just don’t see it. The guy is closing in on 3 years of NBA service and still looks like the same old clutz to me. How much longer can we keep up the charade about potential and ceiling for MW? If some team is willing to trade a solid piece that can help our ball club for marvin then its time to pull the trigger. Maybe it’s not to late to fool some team into believing he still has “tremendous upside”. LOL.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 10:02 AM | Link to this

After watching last nights game-its clear that JS and Horford are our future. JJ had another off night- I think thats 12 on the season, ALL STAR- NO WAY, Good player—YES WAY.

Marvin (spring break) Williams did his thing last night, brick after brick after brick-jus terrible

If there is to be a trade Marvin and Chills have got to be the package along with ZAZA or Sheldon.

JS Horford and Gasol would be a monster front line, Then I would feel comfortable playing against big teams like Portland and Milwaukee.

If we could package Marvin,Chillz,ZAZA and Lue for

Gasol and Stoudamire/Lowry

that would be a good start for us. I wiil be really surprised if anything happens but theres still a month left so we shall see….

By GT80

January 24, 2008 10:18 AM | Link to this

To all this trade talk, all i can say is “whatever”. Do any of us trust Billy K to make the right move. I was listening to the game last night and again it struck how badly BK has bungled up this organization. When you look back on the fact that his guy totally missed on the Marvin pick and even worse on the Shelden pick, I don’t see how he cannot be fired. Hindsight is always 20-20 but to think about what a huge superstar Chris Paul would be in this town if we had taken him over Marvin is just sickening. And then BK wasted the #5 pick on a guy who isn’t even seeing the floor.

It just drives you crazy thinking about the lost opportunities.

I’m thinking the best thing that could happen to this franchise is for Belkin to win his case and get ownership. BK & Woody would be gone in a nanosecond.

By Clarkekent

January 24, 2008 10:26 AM | Link to this

FIRE WOODSON!!!

By jgsbirds

January 24, 2008 10:32 AM | Link to this

It’s way past time to fire Woodson! How can we pull the plug on Lon Kruger and Terry Stotts so fast and let Woody hang on soooooooo long? Stotts had no where close to this talent but at the time they fired him he was getting much more from guys like Bob Sura, Matt Maloney and Pryzbilla than Woody gets from JJ, Smoove and Horford.

There’s no way we can think of trading Horford or Josh Smith. We have way too many other guys to deal with than these players.

We have to get a PG—I thought about this last night during the Nugget game—is there a team in the league that plays with a PG worse than Anthony Johnson? NO—AJ had a great December—but his play this month is what you get out of him—a mediocre back up who can’t be depended on for his shot or his assists. Please tell me one team that has a worse starting PG than AJ>

Finally—Woody how can you let a team outscore you 18-2 in about five minutes without inserting Salim? I was wondering this last nite and I found the answer. Salim was in street clothes again—hasn’t played in the last 16 games—dude get him suited up and when your crappy stand around offense goes about six of seven minutes without coming close again on Friday night—please send Salim in and let him go…Please Woody take off the dam* chains.

Bottom line: I think this team with this talent pool can win—they stay in games despite poor coaching. Just think if they had a decent coach there for them at the end of games. The simple solution is to move Woody already and find someone who can run something other than pick and roll for JJ. We’ve got the players—coach has got to go.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 10:33 AM | Link to this

Steve -no way you trade JS for Gasol straight up. I would really have to think hard about a Horford for Gasol straight up. Look at JS line from last night the guy is a stat stuffer and only 22. Even when he is off he still gives you 3 blocks 9 boards and a couple steals. “Marvin is the guy to trade”

Im a b-ball junkie,but even the casual fan can see that MIke Woodson is lost in the sauce. Im watching the game w/h my lady and she says

“Why did the coach take #4 out after 1 minute of playn time”

HMMMM -he picked up 2 fouls but why not let the guy play through it,He only played a couple minutes in the second half anyway ,so it was’nt about the fouls. He inserts the closer who goes 1-4 from 3 pt range.

I mean Acie has to improve his game but how do you get better looking over your shoulder and playn to avoid that quick hook.

Solomon is out playing ZAZA and Sheldon right now -get the yung’n more PT.

Marvin/Chillz/ZAZA for Nate Robinson/E.Curry

Marvin/Chillz/AJ for Brad Miller/J.Salmons

JJ/Marvin/Lue for C.Kaman/Corey Maggette

Sumone please give “rainman” some attention so he can stop with the garbage.His swastika is showing

By #21=Top 50,1stBallot

January 24, 2008 10:35 AM | Link to this

Why are we talking about trading Joe Johnson again? Since when did 22,4,5 become so “disappointing”? I’ll agree with everyone that Joe seems a bit “off” this season, but he is the best we got. Care to actually take a gander at the fact that on almost every play he has the ball he is subject to at least 1.5 men guarding him. Camby stood in no man’s land shaded to Joe’s side almost the whole night. The game before that Joe dropped 37. His scoring is down 3 points, but his assists up 1 so that’s a net 1 pt difference. His shooting % is the main difference so far this year, most other numbers are where they have been or better. Not only that, we have to wonder who would take Joe’s contract seeing as how he can’t single-handedly lead the Hawks to the playoffs. Its hard to pay that kind of $ to who would be a #2.

That in NO WAY is a knock on Joe because, Smoov is not a #1 guy either. The erratic nature of his game and high turnovers do not lend themselves to shouldering such a load, he doesnt score enough (and he is even less efficient than Joe, so shots arent the problem).

The Hawks as built are a team that has no #1 and I want to point out that is not a bad thing at all. All of the top teams in the league share the rock, save the Lakers (and even Kobe’s assists are up).

I agree with most of you that a move needs to be made, but adding Gasol at the expense of either Joe or Smoov is absolutely foolish. Joe is our shooter and Smoov is our heart. I could see acquiring Damon Stoudamire from the Griz being the most likely option.

The best option is giving Woody his walking papers. Watching the game last night(as with most nights) you can tell he doesnt inspire/reach his team anymore. The lackadaisical passes, the defensive rotation lapses, utter lack of X’s O’s are too frequent to be tolerated. I also think it will do some good to have the players see some changes. For a lot of them Woody is the only pro coach they’ve ever known, a shakeup might go a ways to making them realize that mediocrity will not be tolerated.

By newt258

January 24, 2008 10:43 AM | Link to this

GT80 best comment on the board. Until BK and WOODY are gone this franchise is doomed. I have gotten to the point that I can’t watch Chris Paul highlights. Untouchables on this team, JJ,Jsmooth,AC,Hortford,and maybe Chills. This team needs to run run run. Point is a must. BK and Woody must go.

By jt11

January 24, 2008 11:32 AM | Link to this

Thanks for the worthless article you just tolds us everything we alread know

By JimmyCrackCorn

January 24, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

Chris Paul-Nope, Deron Williams-Nope, Brandon Roy-Nope…..Billy Knight is like Dale Murphy on the 0-2 slider. Shelden Williams ahead of Brandon Roy….

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 11:38 AM | Link to this

Myhalc- Good point about JJ,now that he has some help he seems to be less consistent. I notice that when he is playn well he dominates the ball, brings the ball up court,isolations,screen and roll only for him to shoot the fade away J. How good of a player are u if you cant make teamates better or if you are shooting 35 shots to get 22 points??? If we had a good point who got everyone involved you might see JJ’s numbers dip to like 17/18 a game. I would take that anyday over JJ getting 30 and us losing. Maybe this is why Acie caught alot of flack in the beginning of the season.

Im not say’n we should trade JJ but I definitely would for the right peice——- Baron Davis, Gerald Wallace type player. I would even do a Kaman/Ross for JJ/Tlue.

By Matt

January 24, 2008 11:52 AM | Link to this

Sorry to put a damper on Smoove’s performance last night, but I think that last night was the perfect encapsulation of both what’s right and what’s wrong with Smoove as a player. He put up monster numbers in 3 categories, but he also turned the ball over 7 times, shot 8-23 from the floor, and lost his cool at a critical moment in the game.

Oh, and the team missed 7 free throws. None of the misses were in the 4th quarter, so you can’t blame it on fatigue.

Woodson also lost his cool, and this team, once again, seemed to let their guard down for a long stretch in the game. While it’s admirable that they scrapped their way back in it (if this had been a tennis match, the would have won - they won every quarter but the first), the first quarter deficit shows a lack of focus.

And I’m tired of blaming those lapses in focus on this being a young team. That’s part of it, but Woody also shares a large part of it. No doubt. This team is a pure hot-and-cold squad. They’ll win 5 in a row, then drop 5 in a row. That’s usually a sign that the coach isn’t giving a steady hand.

Hopefully, Woody can feel the pressure now after the departure of Mullin. I still think the Hawks can turn this thing around, but they need a win and fast.

By duck3000

January 24, 2008 12:00 PM | Link to this

In reading some of the blogs on here. I couldnt hold my tongue on some issues my ATL HAWKS are doing wrong. 1. Woody has to go for reasons we see on the court. He is not playin the right combinations when certain plays call for different players and schemes. My opinion I would start the same line up but the people coming off the bench would play a different role..here is my take Acie Law(P)or TLue, JChill(SG), move JJ to(SSGF = small shooting guard foward), JSmooth(PF) and Al Horford(C). I want to see this line up in a game for once…As for trade deadline I would love to see Shelden Williams (HE SUCKS), LWright, ZazaP and Speedy Claxton or Salim get traded to the bulls for Chris Duhon or Ben Gordon and Ben Wallace a true (PG)or(SG) and a true rebounder(C). We need beef(an enforcer) in the paint no one is rebounding right now or shooting threes we have JJ and Josh you is not constinct in that range. You’ll let me me know if this works for your line up out there…QUACKS AWAY…GO HAWKS

By Guitar Crazy

January 24, 2008 12:04 PM | Link to this

You guys will think I’m nuts, but JJ and Woody are the problem. As good a scorer as JJ is (most nights), there are far too many games where he dominates the ball dribbling while everyone else stands around. Then he gets frustrated and takes bad shots. The problem with Woody is that he allows this to happen on a consistent basis. If he would hold these guys accountable for playing defense and sharing the ball the way that we did during the 5 game winning streak, this team would be well over 500. And just because JS is extremely talented doesn’t mean that he can’t be coached up to stay more in control. The difference between an all timer like Jordan and Magic was not physical, but in the way that they THINK about the game and their roles on the team. Woody is responsible for making these guys accountable.

By some sense

January 24, 2008 12:13 PM | Link to this

Yes, the talent is there, but it’s not. Two, three, and four are fine, even given Marvin Williams’ and Josh Smith’s wild firing and subsequent frustrations. There is a hole at one and, at best, a work in progress at five, the two most important positions.

Guys who aren’t gonna make it w/ the Hawks; they’re just not: Law, yes Law, Stoudamire, Shelden Williams. Pray for an asset in exchange.

Re. the coach…he deserves to finish the season with a one who can play on both ends.

By BosnianBaller

January 24, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

Marvin and shelden for pau

By thecamera

January 24, 2008 12:24 PM | Link to this

since we are playing “what-if” trades, here are two that will work under the cap, and would address team needs:

1) Wright, S. Williams, T. Lue and Zaza to NYK for E. Curry and M. Rose

Why for Atlanta? Curry would be an upgrade at the 5 his salary is reasonable. Rose would provide leadership and play smart and hard in limited minutes. Rose’s salary would come off the books next year.

Why not for ATL? Curry isn’t exactly a defensive force and has a questionable work ethic.

Why for NYK? Lue and Wright have expiring salaries and could be waved. Zaza has some game and you’d hope that S. Williams can grow with regular playing time.

Why not for NYK? Williams plays the same position as D. Lee. Lue and Wright don’t upgrade the team.

2) M. Williams to Portland for S. Rodriguez and J. Jones.

Why for Atl? Jones is a swing player and has upside. Rodriguez has upside at the point.

Why not for Atl? If they are planning of including Williams in a bigger trade or want to build around Williams.

Why for Portland? Williams is young and, when he is on, can be solid outside shooter. They also have roster issues for next season.

Why not for Portland? Plenty of talent on the roster. Why bother?

By Randy Whitman

January 24, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this

I just hope we don’t trade that Chris Paul, he really has played great for us…oh wait, that’s right we passed on him for yet another 6’8” “athlete” that couldn’t make a 14’ jumper if his life depended on it. Please get rid of Knight, Woodson, M.Williams, the mascot, the owners, the PA announcer at Phillips, the flamer that does the fan contests during timeouts, and the mayor

By The Flash

January 24, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this

A significant scoring presence inside is, how can I say this properly, a meaningless nothing unless a team actually throws the ball inside, as in often and early, which this team does not.

Hire Larry.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 12:37 PM | Link to this

Matt- the 7 TO’s look bad but the shooting percentage is 34% because he took atleast 6 last second shots…. (point guard Play)

Josh is too important to this team, blocks ,steals, boards etc… to even be mentioned in a trade, unless its a major upgrade.

Yeah itz puzzling that JJ jacks up shots at will even when he is off and everyone turs a blind eye.

By Northwest Dawg

January 24, 2008 12:43 PM | Link to this

The Hawks have stockpiled enough young athletes that they need to start thinking more about building a TEAM and team chemistry than strictly talent. Basically, if Horford and JS are your true building blocks as many here believe- what do they need around them to succeed? Unfortunately, the most obvious answer is Chris Paul and anyone but Shelden Williams but the Hawks don’t have a time machine. So the question is, have either Marvin or Shelden shown enough flashes for anyone around the league to take a flyer on either one?

By GC Causey

January 24, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

I’ve been to Hawks games this season. No discipline in ball distribution and any middle level big man on another team is unchallenged. The Hawks have great atheletes available. Non-contributing are Za Za Pachula, Anthony Johnson, Josh Childress, Sheldon Williams, Soloman Jones, Lorenzen Wright and Speedy Claxton. Get what you can. JJ, J Smooth, Horford and Marvin should be the core. Law I think is your point guard. We should be able to get a mid-level big man your some or all of your non-contributors. I think we have tons or cap space

By Tyger

January 24, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

From what I saw last night the Hawks only have 3 keepers: Joe Johnson, Josh Smith and Al Horford.

Everyone else is trade fodder. Pau Gasol is big and soft and plays no defense, he is ZaZa’s twin cousin. How is that going to help? Is he going to play center and defend the paint with the veracity of a Marcus Camby? NOT.

In re. Camby, how can a guy that skinny dominate a game like that? He overpowered us at what 225 lbs.; which is proof positive that not developing Solo is plain stupid both Garnett and Camby are on the skinny side but nobody can touch them. Develop this kid!!!

Thats the main problem that we have. The coach is no in-game wizard and doesnt creatively use his bench. We have everything we need but they DNP more than Dominique.

Nate McMillan came in our house with a black squad and white squad and you couldnt tell which squad beat you, it was a collective effort of young talent coached up into a team.

Woody has this very small view of what works and it does 40% of the time, but doesnt 60% of the time.

i.e. if JJ plays 48 min. and scores 30 pts. Hawks have a chance; if not, then excuse on top of excuse.

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:51 PM | Link to this

I would trade J-Smoove much before I would trade Marvin if we’re getting Gasol. J-Smoove would be so out of place in a halfcourt offense, Marvin would be perfect for that system around a lowpost offense around Gasol.

You guys are INSANE to want to trade Marvin anyways, he has just as much upside and would be much better in an offense around JJ/Gasol than J-smoove would be. His game and strengths are perfect for that type of attack, his jumpshot would spread the floor, pick and pop game, good rebounder at the 3, good length and size, athleticism and driving, and he can knock down the open shots off of the doubleteams o Pau and knock down the open shots off of JJ creating in the halfcourt set, plus off of Damon’s penetrate and pitch (If he’s the pg we land along with Pau).

Marvin fits in perfect as our 3rd option in that system, and J-Smoove just wouldnt AT ALL. Plus Memphis is building an uptempo system around their new coach and suns assistant Marc Iavaroni, where J-Smoove would be the perfect power forward for the uptempo system and thats who they would want anyways. Chilzlz fits in there too obviously for uptempo not halfcourt with us, hopefully we could put some expirings and maybe a conditional pick and get Mike Miller in the deal too so we got a very good 6th man and sharpshooter for our halfcourt set to play off of gasol but that would be pushing it.

I would be pumped if we could make that deal of J-Smoove and Chillz plus expirings for Gasol and Stoudamire and hopefully Mike Miller if we throw in good expirings and a conditional pick with maybe salim, it would be a great move and we could definitely contend in the east just as much as the Orlandos and Clevelands, Washingtons and Torontos and could really match up well against Boston and Detroit (Especially if we get Mike Miller somehow into the deal too with Stoudamire and Pau)……. a lineup of Stoudamire, JJ, Marvin, Horford and Gasol with Miller and the rest off the bench could do some great things……. I WOULD BE EXTREMELY HAPPY and we still got a bright future with it as 6 years from now when Gasol and JJ start to fall off we still have Horford and Marvin turning 27 headin into their prime to take over…………………. I SEE ALL POSITIVES IF WE COULD MAKE IT HAPPEN!!!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this

Marvin is clumsy?!?!?! ARE YOU KIDDIN ME??!?!?! J-SMITH IS THE CLUMSIEST TURNOVER MACHINE I HAVE EVER SEEN, CANT DRIBBLE AND CANT SHOOT.

By steve

January 24, 2008 1:01 PM | Link to this

MARVIN IS CLUMSY?!?!?!? ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!?! J-SMITH IS THE CLUMSIEST PLAYER I HAVE EVER SEEN WHEN HE HAS THE BALL, HE IS A TURNOVER MACHINE, CANT DRIBBLE AND CANT SHOOT!

Roan st he is in his 3rd year and is 21 years old…….. J-Smoove is 22 and in his 4th year!!!! WHAT WAS SO GREAT ABOUT HIM (J-Smoove)IN YEAR 3? SAME NUMBERS THAT MARVIN HAS NOW WITH MUCH LESS TURNOVERS AND MUCH BETTER FG%……. Marvin is averiging 16 points and 6 rebounds a night at SF on 50% shooting and is only 22 years old in his 3rd season, he is developing very well with great size and athleticism and CAN SHOOT and has huge upside!

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 1:09 PM | Link to this

WOODSON has gotta go…PERIOD!!!!

By steve

January 24, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this

Woodson dfinitely does got to go, and Horford needs to move to starting POWER FORWARD and get tons more touches on offense, with either J-Smooth or Marvin moving to the bench to spearhead our 2nd unit as 6th man along with Chillz and move a defender/rebounder/banger into our starting lineup at center to play 20 minutes a night (Nothing special just a Przybilla/Kendrick Perkins type center)

AND OH YEAH!!!! GET A GOOD PG!!!! ONE THAT CAN SHOOT!!!!

By Jhmeid in Downtown Dec

January 24, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this

How about Marvin for Travis Outlaw and Sergio Rodriguez or Jarrett Jack. Why would a team trade 2 for 1? Well Portland LOVES all 15 players on it’s roster, that does not include Oden and 3 first round draft picks stashed in Europe.

Where does that leave them? They can’t trade for more draft picks, they are going to need to trade for Cash or a few two for one deals.

If you saw the MLK Day game, Outlaw is everything Marvin will never be!!!!

By LEA

January 24, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this

Steve you are an IDIOT if you think BK is dumb enough to trade SMOOVE. He’s not that stupis. He means much more to this team than MARVIN who if he’s not hitting his jumpers DOES NOTHING ELSE but take up a spot in the lineup..

By steve

January 24, 2008 1:22 PM | Link to this

Woodson and AJ are easily the worst Coach/PG combo in the NBA. Not even close, everything other than that is playoff-bound roster. Inside presence in Horford (When he gets the ball) and J-smoove, outside shooters in Marvin and JJ, slasher and 6th man in Childress, great young talent, a primary playmaker and go-to guy in JJ, good depth, size, shooters off the bench….. team is built to run uptempo and be near unstoppable with it, plus and dominate a pick/roll game…..

Everything, except the absolute WORST pg/coach combo in the NBA BY FAR in Woody and AJ. They drag this team down in a HUGE way.

By GC Causey

January 24, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

I don’t know how many Georgia Tech games you have seen, but the energy level that Matt Causey brings to Tech is what you need on the Hawks. He may not be NBA material, I think he is. But his level of energy and a middle level center would make us a 50 win team.

By DSLIM

January 24, 2008 1:32 PM | Link to this

This is great! i cant wait for Salim to be traded. I think woodson single handly is trying to ruin Salims career. Salim is not hurt anymore, he has actually been healthy for the past few weeks, excpet woodson does not want salim to dress or play at the momemnt. He is content with losing and not playing Salim. After reading some of the blogs, you all understand what slaim is capable of. He is a fantastic shooter, pushes the ball well, his defense has improved a great deal, but for some reason woodson does not appreciate what salim has to offer.

I think other teams will!

I really hope salim gets out of the ATL, so he can move on with his career. Salim is a very humble guy, that has alot to offer.not that i want to see salim in a memphis jersey, but i think Stoudamire for stoudamire is a good move , excpet damos contract is a lot larger then salims at this time.

Salim is a younger damon with a better shot. Damon has just had the chances to establish himself in the NBA, and had an oppurtunity to do this. Salim hasnt had an oppurtunity to showcase his game. HE DID IN ARIZONA. and he was a STUD in college. Ill never forget when Salim hit 9 threes on senior night. Salim deserves to play!

good luck HAWKS!

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 1:33 PM | Link to this

Steve-does Marvin rebound or play D? The answer is NO. What does he do other than shoot? Not much for a 6’9 forward taken at #2—Come on.

Clumsy is his middle name -never mind his shooting because when its off its really off. When Marv isnt shooting well he turns into his Alter Ego….. Spring Break

Running around aimlessly,looking lost, driving to the hole only to be stripped or blocked-the dude is like a ferrari with no brakes -outta control. If we were to get Curry or Gasol we would definitely need JS around to play defense. Gasol is a good player/scorer on the blocks but he is so Euro when it comes to Defense -man on man or help defense-just not good. DO a pole amongst NBA GM’s where they had a choice of taking JS or Marv and i’ll bet its JS at like 79%-Marvin what a joke. I think he needs to be coming off the bench with salim and solo,insert chills in the starting line up and see more production and all around hustle.

By Please do not let Billy Knight make a trade!

January 24, 2008 1:41 PM | Link to this

Please do not let Billy Knight make a trade. He has set this franchise back several years and should be stripped of all his trading powers.

By Willie Coyote

January 24, 2008 1:44 PM | Link to this

Solomon finally sees the floor and now a trade seems like it’s on the way…interesting. I’m not sayin’, I’m just sayin’.

By Kelvin

January 24, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this

Too bad we don’t have a POINT GUARD!!! Yes, I am still peeved about not selecting Deron Williams or Chris Paul.

By GC Causey

January 24, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this

Is Hawks management against having the Hawks on a strong radio station. To folks that live outside on 285 they might as well the the Vancover Hawks. A strong FM station needs to have an agreement to carry all of 790’s radio broadcasts.

By #21=Top 50,1stBallot

January 24, 2008 2:01 PM | Link to this

speaking only in reference of trading Smoov vs Marvin. Not actually advocating trading either

Some on the blog want to keep Marvin because “he can shoot”, which while true does not account for the other HALF of the game.

Those who watched the Denver game might have noticed a particular play where Duck “fell asleep” after his man swung the ball around and then crept into the lane. Smoov recognized this and flashed over to disrupt the shot, but to no avail. The League Pass broadcast (DEN) mike picks up Smoov yelling at Duck just as the man gets the rock and goes up. Looking lost Duck just turns his head and waddles back down the court.

Lapses like this happened in the POR game as well. This is when Travis Outlaw was killing us and then they switched Smoov on him. When that happened Duck was left to guard James Jones/Webster who proceeded to start knocking them down.
Anthony Parker in Toronto, same story.

It’s true that Smoov has a TO ratio that is twice Duck’s but by that same token he prevents at least 3 less by either blocking these shots (most are high % at the rim) or altering them. Smoov also has twice as many assists as Duck so that’s 2 buckets right there. This does not even make mention of the fact that Smoov scores more a game with only 4% less efficiency. Steals, block, rebounds all favor Smoov. Hell he even shoots 3’s better (makes and %).

Watching the games you can see who impacts the plays, fights for the ball, or energizes his team with emotion. I do not even think it is close with regards to who is the one who would need to be kept.

Potential is great, but even if Smoov never improves his game for the rest of his career, he would still have more value than Duck, even if he scored 20 a game (which he did last night, though you’d never know because it wasnt impactful). I’ll take the TO’s and techs with hustle and heart to Duck’s jumpers and ft’s with club feet and emphatic hand claps of shame.

Seriously people….

By Darrin "The vent King"

January 24, 2008 2:03 PM | Link to this

Whatever deal they make, PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, get us a viable veteran point guard. I like Acie Law and believe he is our future at that spot, but as far as this season goes, we need a point now. Paul Gasol will definitely help down low, but WE NEED A POINT! Get ‘er done!

GO HAWKS!!!

By KeepitReal

January 24, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

May I please add some common sense to this blog

The Hawks Should Not Trade Anyone On This Team….Just Yet!! Why?

Because the players are not the problem…it’s the Coach. A trade at this point in the game would not benefit this team short term or long term. Keep the talent on the team and draft a center and another point guard in June. Also, add an additional veteran PG/G to help Law. At the end of the season, fire Woody and Knight. The reason I say this is because even if we made a trade, the Hawks with not make the playoffs as long as Woodson is still the coach; thererore, why trade away valuable talent.

With that being said….I see an upside with both M.Williams and JJ. Meanwhile, I would re-sign JJ and keep M. Williams, Josh Childress and Salim. However, S.William and ZaZa, Tyrone Lue would be HISTORY.

p.s. for those of you who would even consider trading Horford is straight up stupid and wouldn’t know a potential star if they slept with them on nightly basis.

By jhan

January 24, 2008 2:06 PM | Link to this

Marvin is the one that needs to be leveraged in a trade. If his jumpshot is off then he really brings nothing to the table.

He plays very poor defense & doesn’t rebound well for his size. If you watch closely, his man is typically the one who gets the big rebound or hits the wide open shot. He just doesn’t move his feet.

He also has a very hard time finishing around the basket. How many times does his shot get blocked in the lane? Even when he jumps he barely gets over the rim. He also seems to have a difficult time grasping the basketball. If you watch his drives, the ball is always moving around in his hand. It seems like he can’t really palm the ball & doesn’t have the leaping ability to go up with 2 hands.

A front court of JS, AH & Gasol would be fantastic. JS & AH can help with the interior defense where Gasol is lacking. Gasol can provide inside scoring & passing from the post.

Just my thoughts.

By cp

January 24, 2008 2:10 PM | Link to this

Steve I respect your opinion but I really dont see this love fest with Marvin Williams. As everyone has pointed out numerous times, if Marvin is not hitting his jumper then he basically brings nothing else to the table. It is rediculous for a guy with his height and length to only be getting 6 boards a game. Josh Childress is a better rebounder than Marvin. I think he has small hands or something because whenever he puts his head down and drives to the basket he either loses the ball or gets it stripped. I tried to be supportive of the kid and say he has the potential he will be better but Im not sipping that koolaid anymore. He is terrible on the defensive end. I think Horford and Smith got on him last night for blowing assignments. He cant create off the dribble and has no range. Whats sad is in two straight games we saw two young players who have been in the league about the same length of time as Marvin but show more upside in Outlaw and Kleiza. Granted it could be because they have better coaches but they do things Marvin has not shown. Kleiza has more range than Marvin. Outlaw can actually take you off the dribble and finish at the rim. Marvin has no range and cannot take anyone off the dribble. When the Denver play by play guys brought up how great the Hawks would look with Chris Paul I damn near turned the tv off. Why BK is still here is a mystery to me. I said earlier I would love a trade to make this team better but we have to remember we have BK as the gm. I doubt we come out on top in any trade. At this point I would start Solo at center, Horford at the pf, Smooth at the 3, Joe at the 2 and Law at the one. Woodson is not creative enough to try this starting 5. He has a leash so short on Law that as soon as he missed one shot or picked up 1 foul he would be right back on the bench. Fire Mike ” Gregg Knapp” Woodson and Billy ” Isiah Thomas’ Knight.

By cp

January 24, 2008 2:14 PM | Link to this

I still can’t believe Marvin scored 20 last night. I watched the whole game and probably remember 8 points. #21=Top 50,1stBallot is right. Those 20 points were not impactful at all.

By chris

January 24, 2008 2:16 PM | Link to this

You need two things, a point guard and a center. Anthony Johnson, is a servicable back up for this league and Acie Law is just to green to cut it right now. You have so many forwards its unbelievable. We have a core or players in Joe Johnson, Al Horford, Marvin Williams, and Josh Smith. What is that missing. A center and a point guard. Im sorry but Al Horford is a power forward in this league, and what is Josh Smith. He’s an athletic freak of nature, whose game, while it puts up big numbers is never steady. He’s to slow for a small forward, yet not a post. Marvin Williams given another year will be an all-star. But JJ isnt getting any older here. Make a trade

By capers

January 24, 2008 2:18 PM | Link to this

I’m going to keep on saying this over and over again you need a solid pg to control the tempo of the game, and all i see is a pg injuried and wasting money sitting on the bench , not enough production from the pg spot. You have a opportunity to pick-up some tough pg overseas and in the d-leauge, also had a pg in lionel chalmers that you let slip away,who is playing for benetton in italy, that would have completed a good run for the playoffs, but you are sticking with speedy and tyrone that are just collecting a paycheck, and keeping you where you are ,always behined every other team in there division. Get rid of the dead weight, cut our losses and find the players that are going to give you 100% on the court , i just don’t see it. This is my last time spending my hard earn money to watch the atlanta hawks play the same way year after year, tell me who feels the same way i feel.

By Keebo

January 24, 2008 2:31 PM | Link to this

The Hawks need a veteran leader, with experience winning, who can show these young guys how to win (Do you remember Terry Pendleton?). He doesn’t have to be a superstar, but he does need to be a top defender, preferably one who knows his way around the paint. Antonio McDyess, Marcus Camby come to mind. Ultimately, Woodson has to go. Boris Diaw has proven that Woodson has no clue about developing young talent to their potential.

By Krib

January 24, 2008 2:35 PM | Link to this

Please guys….. all i hear is that we should trade for a point guard. I doubt it any team will be willing to let their point guard go..Please I have looked and cannot find any non- franchaise point guards that are available and will make this team better.

By RealSquawk

January 24, 2008 2:35 PM | Link to this

Sekou can you get us a list of Mike Woodson’s offensive plays??

By RealSquawk

January 24, 2008 2:38 PM | Link to this

Smith shouldnt move neither should Williams or Childress

unfortunatley because of Woodsons poor substitution

habits stoudamire has now become expendable i mean lets look at it we all know Joe needs a shooter around who can hit anywhere and there are only two on the team, but only one pplays the other has a ghost injury

By Melvin

January 24, 2008 2:41 PM | Link to this

CP I watch the entire game last nite as well. MW probably had 4 or 5 break away dunks. But don’t get me started on him. I will just say that he needs to be on the 1st bus/car/plane leaving the ATL. However, I don’t think we will see a major deal (or any) during the season. I do think we will see major changes this summer depending how the Hawks finished the season. So here’s my trade suggestion i would like to see happen now (keep in mind the Hawks won’t consider making any blockbuster deals). 1)ZaZa/Tlue/filler to Denver for JR Smith/Steven Hunter (shooter and inside presence). 2) ZaZa or Sheldon/Lo Wright to Minny for Telfair/A.Walker (decent pg and good 2nd scorer).

By ROD GRIFFIN

January 24, 2008 2:52 PM | Link to this

The time has come and gone coach Woodson see ya.

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 3:03 PM | Link to this

#21=Top 50,1stBallot, good post man. all points dead on point!!!

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 3:20 PM | Link to this

LUE and BOS would be a good match. do they have anyone we could use?? i’ll rephrase, do they have anyone that we could use that we could GET???

By cp

January 24, 2008 3:25 PM | Link to this

I have been talking about JR Smith since the debacle of the 06 draft when the Hornets let the world know they wanted to move up and were willing to trade both their first rounders and JR Smith but BK decided to take Sheldon ” Brick hands, Cement Feet” Williams at 5. JR would be a sg who can hit the 3 and give JJ a rest. The problem is the coach we have. JR would give up 15 one night and Woodson Knapp would have him glued to the benc the next week because he did not do something in practice. I actually like the name Duck for Marvin. For some reason it fits him. Im still trying to see how he scored 20 last night Melvin. I saw 2 fast break dunks but other than that I could have sworn he had about 8 points because the guy was doing absolutely nothing. Can he palm the ball? Im not even looking foward to the trade deadline. If all we are danglign is Salim than we wont get nothing more than a second round pick. Mike Knapp give the keys to Acie. We might as well find out now if he is going to be our future pg rather than killing the kid’s confidence.

By capers

January 24, 2008 3:27 PM | Link to this

If you are telling me it is management that has everything to do witha team losing, where is the ownership with players that are making millions of dollars and giving the city of atlanta what they really need, is every night come out on the court to play hard and get a win, if you a b-ball fan and played the game you can see if a player wants to play for a team and believes in the system that they are playing for, and i just don’t see it .You cannot just ride on one player {j.j} back and coast to the playofffs

By Lameassteam

January 24, 2008 3:33 PM | Link to this

This year has been a terrible waste of talent and a huge indicator of just how badly the Hawks have drafted and used free agents. *Zaza can’t play a lick. Worse, he doesn’t want to play a lick anymore. *Sheldon has been exposed as a decent college player who can’t hold a candle with other bigs in the league. He’ll be out of the league in a couple years. *Marvin is another waste of a top pick. After helping Joe out a month ago by hitting that mid range jumper, the league has scouted him and took that shot away forcing him further back. He can’t shoot and can’t drive because he can’t ball handle. Plus, the head coach has gotten in his head. *Jury is still out on Acie. Last night he stunk up the joint, but he had company. *Wright and Craig Claxton will ride off in the sunset with their saddle bags stuffed with cash. *Solo has energy, but no game. Think about it, there are stretches in the game where Marvin is our only big!

The east has tried everything to HAND the Hawks a playoff spot. But this “team” is going to screw it up.

Perhaps the “resigning” of Bernie Mulins is the just the start, maybe The Atlanta Spirit have a pulse after all. Blow this thing up now!

By cp

January 24, 2008 3:35 PM | Link to this

I doubt it mykhalic. Boston has a short bench as well and I dont think they have any type of draft picks due to the KG trade. Seeing Udrich play some good ball in Sacramento is not a shock either. The Spurs were trying to give this kid away last year and we chose Anthony Johnson although Udrich is younger and has a nice game. AJ has done well but the guy is a reserve pg at best. I wonder if BK even calls other teams to at least inquire about a player. Its frustrating to see other teams make little moves like that while we do absolutely nothing. I think a few guys on here were calling for us to go after him last year. I dont know if it is BK being handcuffed by the ownership or him being so arrogant that he feels the roster he put together works. Im trying to think of a veteran team that could use a verteran pg like Lue and send us some young guys they dont have minutes for but im blank right now. I was reading about the Curry trade idea. Curry is a good offensive center but the guy is the equlivent of Za Za on the defensive end. He doesnt rebound well for his size either. We have enough of that as it is. He could make us a better team. If all it took was Za Za and one of the pg duds then I would probably be ok with this trade.

By Preston

January 24, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

Did anyone else notice how dejected this team looked after last nights loss as they were walking off the court? This is a talent laden team that should not be regressing at this point in the season, and I blame Mike Woodson for this. I think that he is a bona fide confidence killer and he is destroying this group. When we first got Zaza, he was looking like a real steal…..he played with heart, passion and consistency…..and he was a legitamate scoring option for the hawks……now he looks like a circle trying to fit in a square peg…..same with Salim…when Salim was on the floor we saw his potential, and only wanted him to get a good yr under his belt to be a solid guy for this team……now he just comes in the game with a long face trying to get his shots off……and now, I see the same thing happening with Law….he started off the season playing with the energy and passion that Horfold plays with……and now he is looking like a guy that is just trying to find himself and fit in with this team………Billy knight has made some draft gaffes, but Woodson does have a talented group on his hands, but his coaching strategy is terrible.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 3:41 PM | Link to this

Well dam….. top50 1st ballot-just said a mouthful….seriously -why are we talking about trading Smoove and not- Spring Break -

By steve

January 24, 2008 3:43 PM | Link to this

IMUs you are an idiot. Marvins d is fine and getting better and he rebounds well for a small forward, he is MUCH MUCH better on offense than J-Smooth, especially in a halfcourt set around a lowpost offensive attack. And he’s younger, has 1 less year of experience and is still developing (Long way to go before he reaches his prime).

Smooth is one of the worst offensive players in the league. He is a turnover waiting to happen, has no handle, plays to far from the basket, is erratic, has no outside shot but continually shoots from out there, and doesnt use his improving post up game nearly enough. He flat out sucks on offense.

By Melvin

January 24, 2008 3:46 PM | Link to this

CP, I was shock when I look at the boxscores and saw MW with 20pts. Just as someone mention earlier, his points was meaningless. I’m all for trading this guy while he has value. I hope we make some type of move before the trading deadline. Maybe BK will give Woody his walking papers at the end of this west coast trip.

By krit

January 24, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

we could just trade all our junk that never gets any PT for draft picks in next junes draft. even late first or second rounders can give us better players then what we have. as far as i heard kids like memphis´ joey dorsey are second rounders. i would rather have a guy like that coming off the bench and hustle like theres no tomorrow, then watch our #5 pick shelden see the floor.

get a new coach who at least tries a different style once.

By steve

January 24, 2008 3:49 PM | Link to this

Their biggest problem is scoring; Josh Smith flatly sucks on offense. He’s an excellent help defender and a good rebounder, but he’s not good on offense. He takes too many long shots; he doesn’t have a great handle; he doesn’t go to his developing post-up skills often enough… The one thing he does well is draws fouls at over 0.46 FTA/FGA and a DrawF of 18.3%, but he is below league average in TS% and that’s just frustrating because he takes more shots than anyone but Joe Johnson and doesn’t really produce well for it. Marvin Williams should be taking more of Josh’s shots.

Marvins rebounding is good for a small forward and would be very good alongside Gasol and Horfod in the frontcourt plus his size(THAT WOULD BE A MONSTER frontcourt), and on offense the positives would FAR FAR FAR outweigh having Smooth in the halfcourt/lowpost system with that personnel. Marvins defense is also already average and still getting better, his athleticism/length, speed and lateral quickness give him all the potential in the world to be a great defender at small forward. He is already very good on offense and would be a perfect fit in the lowpost/halfcourt offensive system as he would knock down the open shots created by Gasol’s doubleteams, JJ’s creating and our PG (damons) penetrate and kick game, plus for the pick and pop he is great and also can roll with his athleticism, he can drive and finish with his solid handel and athleticism and he can postup smaller small forwards on mismatches….. he is a perfect fit much more than J-Smooth is. If we were a run and gun team talking about acquiring steve nash i would say keep smooth and trade marvin, but that isnt hte case.

By steve

January 24, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

“what is Josh Smith. He’s an athletic freak of nature, whose game, while it puts up big numbers is never steady. He’s to slow for a small forward, yet not a post. Marvin Williams given another year will be an all-star.”

I agree 100% with that Chris, Marvin is a true small forward that is going to be outstanding in this league for a very long time.

By steve

January 24, 2008 4:05 PM | Link to this

Josh Smith, Shelden, Chillz, and Salim for Mike Miller, Pau Gasol, and Damon Stoudamire.

By honest_abe

January 24, 2008 4:18 PM | Link to this

snore…. zzzzzzzz

any of you really think getting gasol will help this team??

as for lowry i’ve been one of his biggest fans since his “nova” days. but looking at his skill set objectively he’s more like speedy than paul. athletic, good finisher, great on the ball defender and one helluva shaky jump shot. i wouldn’t mind trading for him but if marvin and jj are part of the deal i don’t know who on this hawks team is capable of shooting from range.

lets give up jj/marv/sheldon/law for gasol/miller/conley. would that work in terms of the salary cap?

now that’s a starting five that might work. conley/miller/jsmith/horford/gasol.

By randy

January 24, 2008 4:23 PM | Link to this

Steve, your Josh Smith bashing comes at a bad time. He just came off a triple double with 5 blocks and a couple steals. He stuffs that stat sheet every night. And even comparing Marvin Williams to Josh Smith is patently ridiculous. Marvin is far more inconsistent than Josh Smith. Yes, he has a nice jumper, but besides that he is a clumsy mess. Watching him drive the ball makes me cringe. I still think Josh Smith has far more upside than Marvin. Hopefully, if the Spirit aren’t completely braindead they will sign him this summer.

By DSLIM

January 24, 2008 4:32 PM | Link to this

I THINK GASOL SUCKS.. I REALLY DO , I DONT THINK HE WILL BE AN ASSET IN A HAWKIES UNI.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this

STEVE-Come On Dude “Marvin Williams will be an all star next year” Are you kidding me

You cant possibly be serious- Spring break will neva eva make an all star team… and i do mean neva.

Who is he going to replace at sf or 2guard-surely not D Wade or Lebron,and he definitely wont get voted in by the coaches

I think his ceiling is 19pts and 5 rebounds a game maybe 4 assists

Spring break is making BK look more stupid by the minute.

“ALL STAR,ALLSTAR,DONT TALK ABOUT ALLSTARS” cuz that aient gonna happen.. I know we cant go back and get CP3 -but like sumone said earlier-everytime i see paul to chandler for an oop or Paul w/h an ankle breaking move my stomach gets upset… DAM SHAME

By #21=Top 50,1stBallot

January 24, 2008 4:48 PM | Link to this

Steve,

Havent seen you with this big a crush since “Laura”. The sad part is that in order to justify my case, I have to point out Duck’s ample flaws; and I really like him as a player.

First of all, part of what makes Josh so much more a commidity than Duck is his mindset. It manifests itself in the hustle categories of blks, steals, and rebounds. Smoov is relentless and NEVER wants to quite. He might make pouty faces but thats only because things may not be going well for the team and its frustrating- as it is for all of us.

To illustrate my point moving forward, do me a favor and watch their respective positioning when shots go up on either end. Watch how Smoov moves toward the basket and positions himself around someone who will compete for the board. Conversely watch how Duck sees the ball in the air and never comes within 8 ft of the rim. Not only that, in the event he does have position, watch the ineffecutal boxout that ensues. Most of Duck’s boards are off his own misses or when the lane is cleared out of competing bodies.

You may think that is because “Smoov is a PF, he is closer to the basket”. Well if that is the case then why is it that Smoov get’s ample steals at the top of the key/arch. Duck only gets them off deflections and the occasional passing lane entry. Yes, Smoov takes chances by going for them but somehow he goes for the steals, gets the blocks, and gets the rebounds. He IS the help defender, yet his man doesnt always score. In short- he is everywhere (Plastic Man Version 5.0)

Smoov gets what he does not just off shear athletic talent, it is off of heart and hustle. That’s why he blocks shots so emphatically- ask Linus Kleiza, and fouls hard. Clearly when you play off emotion you are subject to losing your cool “he is only 22 years old”. Duck does not display that, no matter how physically gifted he might appear. Defense is all about desire (Mario West), Duck just does not have that in his nature. He does not rebound all that well for a 3, maybe because he “doesnt want to”. Almost 6 boards a game is “ok”, if he were a 2 then maybe, but he his a three- and a big one at that. He and Smoov are the same size height/weight-ish.

I’ll break down the offense momentarily….

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this

Hawks have alot of atheletes,but few basketball players. King & Woodson should both be packaged in any deal. We definately could use some inside presense,but also someone who can consistantaly hit from the outside. The Hawks are going to waste a very good talent in J/Johnson,if we keep abusing him (minutes)the way have up to this point. J/smith is moody and eradic,Jchildress needs to be playing in Phoneix & Marvin is afraid to or go to the basket on a regular basis. So aside from that the Hawks are in pretty good shape. Oh yeah the bench other than Horford (1 pick King got right) sucks. Peace

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 5:00 PM | Link to this

It’s reassuring to see that most people realize that Josh Smith is way, way, way better than Marvin Williams. Steve, I have $1000 in my hand right now that’s saying Marvin will NEVER get a triple-double in his career. Yeah, Josh Smith’s turnover rate is higher, but that’s because he actually tries to PASS THE BALL. J-Smoove’s court vision is one of the most underrated aspects of his game, and if the Hawks had a good coach we could really take advantage of this asset while cutting down on the number of times he tries to force it.

Offensively the ONLY thing Marvin does better than Josh is shoot mid-range jumpers — please show me one instance where Marvin successfully posted up someone or took a man off the dribble one on one and finished at the rim. No, Marvin’s only “move” other than set shooting is charging ahead full speed hoping to draw a foul and awkwardly throwing the ball up at the rim.

I am not a Gasol fan at all, yeah he’s a good post scorer, but he doesn’t do anything else well. He sucked this year until Mike Conley became the point guard, and unless I’m mistaken the Hawks don’t have a point guard to get him the ball. A Marvin-for-Sergio or Marvin-for-Lowry trade would be a little lopsided in favor of the other team probably, not because Marvin is good but because a #2 pick in his 3rd year should have higher trade value. But to be honest, even if Billy made one of those trades, I wouldn’t mind.

At this point I would rather see a team that starts Sergio, Salim, Joe, J-Smoove and Horford that runs on every possession. Yeah, yeah, I know Salim is just as one-dimensional as Marvin, but at least when he stands around uselessly waiting for his shot, he is standing on the 3-point line. Marvin doesn’t even provide the range that would stretch a defense and allow Joe Johnson a wider lane to drive through. Please, please, please trade Marvin.

By The Flash

January 24, 2008 5:05 PM | Link to this

Okay boys, let’s do the math. If a big-time trade is made this season, who makes it? BK alone? BK with input from Woody? BK in consultation with Gearon?

However you slice it, you will have someone making a trade choice based upon a style of play directed by Woody. If you make a trade of a big asset in that context, aren’t you committing to giving Woody one more year, at least? Aren’t you also committing to giving BK one more year, at least?

How does this play out in your minds, those of you who are advocating trade? Trade implies a long term commitment to the player being brought in. If you are considering making a coaching and/or GM change anytime in the next two years, it would seem that those decisions are the top priority.

If you are intent on bringing in talent to either coach em up, or run the personnel show, or both, to upgrade the performance on the field of play, don’t you want those new talents making your choices?

I repeat, Larry is on the air now saying that he wants back in, which has to mean, given his age (67), he can be had at a reasonable price.

Here is a young team that is not playing up to anyone’s highest expectations for them, with a number of moves (resignings and at least one big trade) in the offing. Brown’s expertise is getting teams to make significant progress in two-three year windows, and in tweaking rosters to get pieces that fit.

No one makes counter arguments. I presume that that is because of Larry’s relationship with Woody. But, the guy appears to really, really want back in. Is Woody the obstacle, or is it an excuse for the Spirit to refrain from making the only logical move confronting them because it will lead to a professional’s pressing for making intelligent decisions to follow?

I have to believe that it is the latter. In other words, don’t hold your breath on no trades.

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 5:08 PM | Link to this

“King”? Billy Knight is pretty bad, but he is better than Billy King. Slightly. Come on now.

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 5:12 PM | Link to this

The majority of the Hawks roster is identical (long/athletic & can dunk), but are missing on the basic fundamentals. While all of the above traits are nice, A team can’t win on a regular basis with them. At some point B/king is going to have to change his formula on players or change careers. We don’t have any offensive threats (ie;scorers/shooters) other than J/Johnson on this team. And where the heck is the point guard we’ve been looking for for 6 freakin years!!!!

By I.MUS WRITE

January 24, 2008 5:29 PM | Link to this

Steve- Whass with the name calling dude? why am I an Idiot again?????

Because I see more potential in JS than Marv. If thats the case then we are all idiots with the exception of you i guess. You need to do sum research or watch some games because you have no clue about hoops. You are entitled to your opinion and so is everybody else, so why u upset? maybe because people here are talking over your head and u are the real IDIOT.-SAD

Are u rainman ? posting under 2 names

Whass funny is you really think spring break will actually be an all star next year and he deserves to be here over smoove- just rediculous

Slam your fingers in the car door or smash your keyboard man….#%^&$#@!*&^%^^%

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 5:30 PM | Link to this

Sorry Naj,meant to say Knight. Got in a hurry,boss arround the corner. To bad my boss is’nt KNIGHT, he does’nt know the difference between productivity and inactivity!!!!!

By Chikara

January 24, 2008 5:31 PM | Link to this

It’s time……

What many people fail to realize is that this organization has the personnel to actually make a run in the East this year. The problem is that they lack the coach and the improper management of said talent. I truly believe that should the Hawks go winless on this West Coast swing (a very real possibility) then the Atlanta Spirit will be under serious pressure to do something.

This team has actually two point guards who can benefit today, Acie Law and Tyronn Lue.

Oh one more thing, what makes you think that getting Gasol is going to make the Hawks better? How are you all so sure that Woodson won’t abandon his “all JJ all the time” offense and make things worse. Gasol is a moody player and is not the kind of leader this team needs. Also, who would you sit down, Josh or Marvin? HMMMM, never stopped to think about that one eh?

Besides, outside of Boston, Detroit, and Toronto the Hawks should be able to beat any other squad in the East. The problem is that they try to slow the game down instead of dictating how to run. Atlanta is deeper than Cleveland, Washington, Indiana and Orlando.

The time for a change won’t come due to the inconsistent decision making from up top and they refuse to pay for a lame duck coach. BK won’t take in any major contracts now, he is best at dumping them for salary cap space this team will NEVER use. Set up an offense that involves cutting & passing (which most undersized teams use) and use motion and watch a whole new system open up, not to mention the wins.

Pride also sets in and nothing will be done.

Believe it folks, BELIEVE IT!

By Clyde

January 24, 2008 5:33 PM | Link to this

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By #21=Top 50,1stBallot

January 24, 2008 5:34 PM | Link to this

(WARNING THIS POST IS A BEAST!)

On the offensive end, the two are much closer in value, even though not in skillset.

Duck’s jumper, when on, is a top 15 mid range game. His ability to hit the spot up shot is ever impressive and ever improving. You’re arguement about having a low post presence to kick the ball out to for an open J is spot on- be it Gasol, etc. Furthermore if we had a penetrating guard who could kick Duck would be that much more effective. He does have the ability to take the ball to the rack, but is not quite the finisher he has been made out to be. He doesnt seem to have a natural feel around the rim and often loses the ball with minimal contact or fumbles the pass down low. Though he said himself in an article that he can “get up when he has to, just prefers not to” he would be all the better for it if he did. He will also lose a lot of his dribbles because he doesnt protect the ball well as he dribbles. Note the he only is able to do this when given the ball outside. He has yet to develop any kind of post game, seemingly lacking the dexterity or footwork- though “the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence”. His vision for the pass is usually limited to kicking it back to the PG on a failed spot up or a cross court pass when he is lock up on the wing. To his defense though a lot of scorers do not have high assist ratios because they constantly look to spot up- he just needs to score more to justify that mentality. This confidence however I am hopeful will display itself over time (sooner rather than later…)

Moral of the story is that Duck is completely dependent on his teammates to be in scoring situations. He doesnt take pull ups, nor shown ability to take ball from anywhere but the wing. His finishing desire is often there, but lack the ability to sink the basket- but will make the free throws. He lacks the vision to cut to slash to the basket without the ball and seems content to operate in the 12-17 ft range. He will eventually, presumably, add the 3 ball to his repetoire, thus stretching defenses, but until he does, he can be stopped by slowing him down off screens and keeping in front of him.

Smoov thrives in a fast paced offense that optimally require more reaction than thinking. Since he is often the one starting the break with the ball, he has a propensity to try to take it coast to coast. Often this results in charges or wild passes, but can also yield plays worthy of “the highlight factory”, though has done so less this season (hopefully realizing he needs to save his knees/energy). Like Duck, he too could benefit from a savvy PG to outlet the rock to so that he could be free to roam and wouldnt have to shoulder so much offensive burdern (esp when JJ is out). He does however find himself on the wing too much for someone with a burgeoning post game. There are a lot of instances where he is forced to hoist a “bad” shot because he is fed the ball late in clock and the other players are too deferential (ie Chills, AJ) when Joe is double teamed. He is insistent on developing a long jumper with aspirations of a 3 ball. He is wise to do this because as teams will be forced to respect his shot, they will have to close out on him, allowing for a drive. He has to pick his spots though so as not to just jack for the sake or to even draw a lot of charges on the drives. He is active on the glass and accounts for a lot of deflections and off boards, with ability to finish. He does look for the pass often though more when running than in set offense. When the pace is slowed he can be a bit of a black hole at times, when his mind is made up to score. Through his effort/tenacity though he makes out pretty well and efficiently when he keeps his game in the paint. He is not shy about putting it up when every one else on the floor is being bashful and that contributes to his poor %- the need to force things. Ideally he is the 3rd scorer on the team, but leader in the hustle stats.

The two have VERY different offensive games that actually can compliment each other as they develop in the league. Because of his pure shooting ability Duck has the potential to be a 20-23 pt a game scorer, he just needs to keep gunning and develop his all around game to get there. Could thrive as a #2 option, but appears comfortable as the #3 due to limited capacity at this point. Smoov on the other hand would do well to decrease his volume on the outside until another summer passes to work on his shot. In time however he should develop a decent outside stroke- enough to be respected- making him a more versatile and efficient player.

Clearly Im just a random blogger in cyberspace, but I do watch the Hawks intently. I’d say as far as offense goes, it matters what you are looking for. Both can actually do well either running or half court. As of now though Smoov thrives in the former and Duck matches up better in the latter.

My opinions, take ‘em or leave ‘em

(SORRY FOR LONG POST)

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 5:44 PM | Link to this

I respect the views of those who think J/smith has potential or is a great player. But I just don’t think it will be with the Hawks. He has trade value now and we defineately could use help in the frontcourt (a 5) and Backcourt (a 1) now!!! Pull the trigger,and good luck J/smith whereever You end up. As for Marvin, I don’t if you would get same quality of player or players in return. He just has’nt prooved he’s progressed enough!!!

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 5:56 PM | Link to this

To bad u cant bank on Marvin’s jump shot night in night out. Many a night his box score looks like someone’s that comes in at garbage time. The Hawks need consistancy from someone other than J/Johnson. Someone the other team fears, Tell me one other player on the Hawks that teams fear when they have the ball in their hands? Name one other player on the Hawks that teams double or tripple cover other than J/Johnson when the game is on the line? Answer ZERO!!!!!!!

By caz1158

January 24, 2008 6:17 PM | Link to this

One last thing before I sign out. T/lue, AJ, A/Law, are you kidding!!! this is who you want running your team??? Come on now!! They are nice pieces, but they would’nt start on ANY other NBA team!!! Or for most college Teams!!! Ya listin Mr Knight,We still need a POINT GUARD!!!! I hear CLANKITY CLANKITY CLAXTON might be comin back. Oh no he hurt himself AGAIN playin DOMINO’S, out for the year! LORD HELP US!!!

By terrell barron

January 24, 2008 6:28 PM | Link to this

HB Ando, I like that trade scenerio.

By roan st

January 24, 2008 6:54 PM | Link to this

Steve, you obviously have some kind of fetish for duck that goes beyond basketball skill set. In year three josh smith was second in the NBA in blocked shots. Not to mention he doled out more assists, had more rebounds, played better defense than duck. You’re love affair and praise of duck is mind boggling when almost every other long time blogger here agrees that he is a disappointment. And please don’t dare even mutter the word all-star and duck in the same sentence. Bozo the clown has swifter feet than duck.

By nicholasp27

January 24, 2008 6:55 PM | Link to this

gthang,

what are you talking about? ny is 13-28 and we are 17-21

much more than 3 games back!

and charlotte is 16-26, so they haven’t caught up with us

we are in 7th place

By randy

January 24, 2008 7:03 PM | Link to this

That is what Marvin looks like!! A duck!! haha, i knew he reminded me of something. Marvin the Duck, ahahahahaaha.

By mountain_jim

January 24, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this

Last night’s game made it clear that Woody has sucked the energy out of several Hawks players, JJ number one among them.

He has lost the team, there is little hope until Woody is gone.

By cp

January 24, 2008 7:17 PM | Link to this

I’m over here laughing hard as hell at roan street’s post. Roan you are spot on. I’m baffled just as many of us are as to why Steve think’s Marvin is this good. I just dont see it. He has a nice form on his jumper but other then that he gives the team nothing. I’m sorry Steve but he does not rebound that well for his position. Sekou even mentioned how he should be grabbing more boards. The guy is 6’9 with crazy length yet he only gives you 6 boards a game and not even 1 steal and 1 block to go with it. There is no way a guy with these kind of attributes should be giving this low production across the board. Marvin does not have a back to the basket game, cant drive to the hoop without losing the ball, getting his shot blocked, or the usual flinging some awkward looking shot up. His defense is not good at all. He does not have the foot speed to keep up with most small forwards in the league. He was getting abused last night and Smith and Horford got on him. I was thinking he was a poor mans Antwaan Jamison but Jamison has range and Marvin doesn’t .

By randy

January 24, 2008 7:21 PM | Link to this

No need to respond to Steve. He obviously rides the short bus, either that or a Memphis Fan trying to get JSmoove for Gasol, by telling us how bad Josh Smith is. Obviously, the Duck isn’t in the same league as Josh and lets leave it as that.

On another note, we all been saying we gotta make a trade to make it to playoffs. Then when Sekou writes that something may be cooking we are all nervous as hell waiting for Billy Knightmare to screw something new up.

Everyone around the league wants one thing from the Hawks - Josh Smith. Every team would love to get their greedy claws on this kid, because he is a star. I guarantee Memphis won’t care about “The Duck”, Saleem, Shellhead or Zaza without Josh Smith. Obviously Josh Smith for Gasol would be utterly stupid, but remember we are talking about the cheapskate Spirit and Billy Knightmare at the helm! I am very worried.

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 7:28 PM | Link to this

Steve,

Why in the world should the Hawks trade for Mike Miller, Pau Gasol, and Damon Stoudamire? Memphis is 12-30 with these guys - Stoudamire is a shell of his former self - Mike Miller is one-dimensional - Gasol isn’t all that.

Melvin,

Antoine Walker? Please - we don’t need to bring back Walker, even though he played decent when he was with Atlanta.

J-Chill needs to work on his jumpshot - if he had that outside scoring threat, he would be more effective.

Duck needs to improve his range and his moves in the paint - he will never be an all-star, but he does have some skills to offer.

By mykhalc

January 24, 2008 7:32 PM | Link to this

and be especially worried since GASOL was given to BK in MEM for ABDUR-RAHIM!!!! he’s an ORIGINAL BK pick which means he’d probably luv to get him back…but at what expense is the question!!!???!!!

SEKOU, give us a daily dose here bro. hearin’ anymore eerie silence????

By steve

January 24, 2008 7:41 PM | Link to this

Marvin is ten times the player offensively than J-Smoove is.

By steve

January 24, 2008 7:49 PM | Link to this

Davenpoop you are just an idiot and marvin-basher. He is a great small forward prospect that will be an unreal allaround player at the 3 for a long time, and already at age 21 in his 3rd year has improved tremendously. He can drive, HE CAN SHOOT, HE HAS HANDLE (Both of those unlike J-Smoove), he has great athleticism, is a good rebounder at the small forward, an average defender with the potential to be a great defender with his size, athleticism and length, can post up on the mismatch with his size at the 3, can drive by any 4 tryin to guard him, is great for a pick and pop or pick and roll game and will knock down all the open shots created off of a lowpost presence like Gasol and creation of JJ (Unlike Smoove) and also spread the floor as he improves his range on his silky jumper.

J-Smoove is better for an uptempo system and is a POWER FORWARD, if we trade for Gasol than he is our PF (Plus Horford takes the other frontcourt spot) so Smith is now out of position and its a lowpost/halfcourt offensive system which Smoove doesnt fit into at all so thats why J-Smoove is way more expendable than Marvin (Who is a small forward and his game fits in perfectly to a halfcourt/lowpost offensive system as a great 3rd option)

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this

steve - are you related to Duck or something? - I don’t understand the mindless praise …

Marvin is okay but you prop him up like he’s a superstar … Marvin has a nice mid-range jump shot, no 3 point range, and has trouble finishing consistently at the goal.

By billly b

January 24, 2008 8:11 PM | Link to this

I actually agree with Steve, Marvin has progressed pretty well and has a very long way to go, he is a very talented offensive small forward. his midrange game and jumper is silky smooth and will only improve.

Sure J-Smoove grabbed more rebounds and blocked more shots in year 3 but he is a power forward and Marvins a small forward, Marvin shoots a better percentage, turns the ball over much less and scores more at this point in year 3 than J did at this point in his 3rd year…. Both progressed well for their positions, and both have a very very long way to go and alot more upside to reach.

J-Smoove is much bettter than he gives him credit for, but I see what he’s getting at. Smoove is an athlete, not a basketball player. He has little handle, no bball iq (Long range jumpers and coast-to-coast drives?), and a terrible jumpshot that most backboards are terribly afraid of…….. J-smoove is a defensive BEAST though, a solid rebounding power forward, he’s a Kirilenko or a Shawn Marion except bigger, a power forward for an uptempo/running system. He is a stat-sheet stuffer and has great finishing ability, he would be much better with a good PG.

BUT, Steve is right about Marvin, he is alot better than you give him credit for. Steve is wrong about J-Smoove who is much bettter than he gives him credit for…… the thing is that theyre too different players. Smoove is a power forward that better fits a running system, and Marvin is a small forward that better fits a halfcourt system (Although as an sf he could do well in uptempo as well)……. if we’re acquiring Gasol than him and Horford will fill the frontcourt so Marvin fits in better with that personnel because he’s a natural small forward, and given the style that will best serve us to succeed will be a halfcourt system around Pau Gasol’s lowpost game and JJ as our primary option/playmaker on the wing…. since that will be our style Marvin would fit in better in that system and benefit us more. (Plus J-Smoove would be more wanted by the Grizzlies who are trying to build an uptempo system, and J-Smoove can net us more in return in a trade because of his bigger progress and rep around the league)……

So, both are good. But I agree that if we’re acquiring a lowpost PF/C like Gasol and putting him next to Horford while keeping our halfcourt/slow it down system now around Gasol in the lowpost and JJ as our go-to guy on the wing than Marvin is the guy to keep. His game is better for that system and just fits in better being a true small forward.

By honest_abe

January 24, 2008 8:15 PM | Link to this

might as well chime in on the hot topic of the day… marvin is an avg nba player at best. he reminds me of “big dog” robinson… except i don’t think he’ll ever even be as good a scorer as glen. many have already highlighted his few strengths as well as his numerous flaws. go back to the beginning of the season and i think i’ve already gone on at length about how one dimensional he is. marvin has no offensive creativity, can’t finish, can’t dribble, can’t drive, can’t play defense, can’t rebound, can’t hold josh smith’s jock strap. josh smith is frustrating to watch but at least you can see flashes of greatness. marvin hasn’t shown me a damn thing. except the ability to knock down wide open 15 footers while kicking his legs (am i the only one in here that thinks his form on that jump shot looks corny?)…. final thing on marvin before i mercifully end this bashing. please stop trying to stick that a* out. trying to stick the a* out while waddling around the court seem to give you the image of a camel standing on two feet.

bah, my lame attempt at humor. wake me up in may when the playoffs start.

By Preston

January 24, 2008 8:19 PM | Link to this

I totally disagree with Steve concerning Marvin Williams……I have been willing to live with him a ride the ship out to see him show signs of all of the upside talk and athletiscm, but now I have to admit that I just don’t see it…..it seems that his best asset is his jump shot which is starting to look shaky in of itself. I have never seen him take anyone off the dribble without falling down or losing the ball….hence “no coordination”. He can finish an uncontested fast break with a thunderous dunk…..but what 6 feet plus guy can’t. It is not even worth it at this point to compare him with Josh Smith who is a bona fide game changer, which I cannot say the same about Marvin at this point. And now it seems as if he is starting to play outside of his bounderies…..hoisting up and forcing terrible shot selections which results in bricks. The funny thing is, is that for all of the talk of upside, and athletiscm, and potential all-star in Marvin……I don’t see those attributes in him, but only and for sure in J-Smoove.

By steve

January 24, 2008 8:23 PM | Link to this

No, and I dont hate J-Smoove either I just think that he’s a power forward and so is Gaosl, so if we’re trading for Gasol him and Horford will fill out our frontcourt.

Plus I think Smoove is better served for an uptempo system and wouldnt help us much around Gasol and JJ in a halfcourt/slowdown system because he cant shoot at all. Marvin is still developing with plenty of upside and his game would fit in much better knocking down the open shots off of Pau’s kickouts when he’s doubled and off of JJ creating, plus he’s a true small forward so he can fill out our frontcourt beside Horford and Gasol on that aspect as well. I just think if we landed Gasol and Stoudamire that Marvin would benefit us much more in the now and in the future.

Yes I do think Marvin will be an allstar small forward at some point as well, and I think Smoove will be an allstar PF at some point too.

You gotta understand that you have to give something to get something as well. Boston had to give up Al Jefferson to get KG. Al Jefferson is an absolute stud of a 22 year old franchise player and absolute 25/12 monster in the lowpost at 6’11 that Boston couldve built a contender around for the next 10 years…… that is giving up much much much much much much more than a J-Smoove, and yes they got more than a Gasol too in KG but Im just putting it in perspective.

By steve

January 24, 2008 8:28 PM | Link to this

I have never seen Josh Smith take anyone off the dribble, he has no handle and no coordination. He has no jumpshot at all from outside of 8 feet, he has terrible shot selection (Another 8-23 last night), jacks up 3 pointers that he cant hit, throws some insane passes with no vision or direction, is a human turnover machine, and has no basketball iq.

He is an athlete, not a basketball player. He cant hold Marvins jock when it comes to offense.

By steve

January 24, 2008 8:31 PM | Link to this

AND to make things worse, the things that J-smoove is good at (Finishing on a fast break with a dunk, cutting to the rim without the ball for a catch and finish, rolling to the rim on a pick and roll to finish, and getting deep post position to finish around the rim)…….. the things that Smoove is good at, OUR COACH IS TOO DAMN STUPID TO MAKE THOSE THINGS HAPPEN.. plus we dont have a good PG to make those things happen and really utilize him the right way (Like Shawn Marion with steve nash).

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 8:49 PM | Link to this

Steve,

You say you dont hate J-Smoove - then you proceed to sound like a hater, saying J-Smoove has no handle and no coordination, is a human turnover machine, and has no basketball iq, is not a basketball player.

What a bunch of nonsense!

By Tiger Woo

January 24, 2008 8:54 PM | Link to this

SMITH, TOO? Woodson said Joe Johnson isn’t the only player on his team that should be under consideration for one of those reserve spots on the All-Star team. He lobbied for fourth-year power forward Josh Smith as well, citing Smith’s steady rise the past six weeks as proof that he’s among the very best at his position in the East. “I think he’s played great basketball,” Woodson said. “He’s started to settle down and really honing his craft and just locking in. … [in Sunday’s loss to Portland], he locked in and played LaMarcus Aldridge as well as you can play that kid.” Smith ranks second in the league in blocks (3.3) and is averaging a career-high 18.3 points, 8.1 rebounds and 3.4 assists. He’s also averaging 1.8 steals, making him the only player in the league to rank in the top 12 in blocks and steals.

Steve … No mention of Duck for all-star consideration.

By Preston

January 24, 2008 9:03 PM | Link to this

That’s cool Steve…..we just disagree on our assesments of those two guys…we can go back and forth here, but I don’t think that is necessary……..but one thing is for sure, and I don’t think that you can disagree…..Josh Smith is a game changer, his play has directly caused teams to alter and change their plays…….I cannot say the same about williams….it seems that he is a role player at best…..I have never seen him take over games…I have never seen him make a game changing play on either side of the court, and in that there is no comparison.

By preston

January 24, 2008 9:17 PM | Link to this

and to add….yes Josh Smith does take some bad shots….in particular 3 pointer’s….but the funny thing is, is that some of those 3’s have been big shots for the Hawks, and they were game changing plays for the hawks………Smith also was the one who sanked in 3 free throws early this yr at the end of regulation in Detroit, in front of a very hostile crowd, to give his team a chance to win the game in OT……..when has Marvin come up big for the hawks…….when it mattered the most?????

By Clyde

January 24, 2008 9:23 PM | Link to this

HEY HEY

HO HO

BILLY AND WOODY GOTS TO GO

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 9:57 PM | Link to this

I’m a little confused as to whether Steve is joking or not. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are. But if you are being serious, my offer still stands. $1000 bet that Marvin never gets a triple double in his career. Plus the value of inflation and what not.

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 9:59 PM | Link to this

Steve, your assessment of Marvin seems very accurate. On NBA Live ‘07 Marvin can do all those things. You must be right.

Clyde, I’m a little confused. What exactly is your opinion on Billy Knight and Mike Woodson? I don’t think you have made that very clear.

By Mike

January 24, 2008 10:34 PM | Link to this

I might be in the minority, but I don’t like the Gasol trade. You are getting a guy that scores more than Zaza but plays defense the same way. He will get dunk on and abuse the same way ZaZa did. It will allow Al to play his natural position, but Gasol defense is so weak, he’ll still have to defend the Pivot on defense.

Hopefully this is a smoke screen, if they are going to make trade. I would settle for Jamal Magloire from Jersey. There are some other guys I would consider before Gasol. Gasol price tag will be too steep. If you’re going to make that trade, then why not get Stoudamire from Phoenix? The price tag will be about the same.

Steve what is your point, your mouth should be full of crow by now. Marvin is a promising player, but he doesn’t impact the game the way Smoove does, few people can. Marvin has yet to prove that can shut down anybody on defense. Until Marvin makes a commitment to shut his man down on defense and crash the boards, don’t waste our time comparing Marvin to Smoove.

Marvin has the potential to be an All-Star, Smoove is all ready starting to take his game to All-Star level. Don’t get it twisted, it a big different. It’s all about hustle and effort, you either have it or you don’t.

Solomon looks better and better every time he touches the floor. I hope he is not part of any trade. Once he gets his timing down this guy can really help us out coming off the bench.

They showed some flashes of Salim from last year during the Denver game. It’s hard to believe we got this guy in street clothes the way we struggle to score points.

Woodson is killing this team. The best move for the Hawks at point is a coaching change. Give Larry Drew his shot.

By t_height

January 24, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this

I like Joe Johnson but i think many of the loses come from him. He can score when he want to be he is supposed to be the leader on the team but he don’t demand the ball everytime down the court nor do he know how to control the game. We don’t have a leader on this team yet to do much better than we do. If Joe would just demand the ball more especially down the stretch of the game then maybe the results will be different.

By t_height

January 24, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this

I like Joe Johnson but i think many of the loses come from him. He can score when he want to be he is supposed to be the leader on the team but he don’t demand the ball everytime down the court nor do he know how to control the game. We don’t have a leader on this team yet to do much better than we do. If Joe would just demand the ball more especially down the stretch of the game then maybe the results will be different.

By t_height

January 24, 2008 10:38 PM | Link to this

I like Joe Johnson but i think many of the loses come from him. He can score when he want to be he is supposed to be the leader on the team but he don’t demand the ball everytime down the court nor do he know how to control the game. We don’t have a leader on this team yet to do much better than we do. If Joe would just demand the ball more especially down the stretch of the game then maybe the results will be different.

By Clyde

January 24, 2008 10:46 PM | Link to this

Najeh Davenpoop you must be new. I’ve been giving my opinion for 2 plus years now. Billy and Woody have made bad decision after bad decision and I’m tired of it.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By RealSquawk

January 24, 2008 10:52 PM | Link to this

You know who we should trade is Woodson

he just isn’t getting it done on the offensive side of the ball and it is really hurting the team

he hasn’t given players the same leniency or patience as the ownership has given him for not evolving and just being the benefactor of improving talent

he sat royal until royal left and not only put a dagger in us when we played them. but was guarding kobe one on one not to long ago and taking the ball at him as well

he is sitting salim for i dont know what

he has sat zaza out of playing rhythm

and has never let solomon or sheldon develop until the regular rotation

when shelden was saving the team last year with his consistent play.

go back to the beginning of the season last year when sheldon was starting and playing and i promise you will see about the same level of consistency as al horford is giving

Woodson must go in order for this team to make the playoffs

do you know how bad it is going to look if we don’t make the playoffs this year

even though distributive i think without about five offensive plays this team would be in the playoffs 5 only 5

By Pete

January 24, 2008 11:31 PM | Link to this

WOODSON SHOULD GO!!!!! MAYBE EVEN DO A PETRINO JUST TO LET THE GUYS PLAY TO THEIR STRENGTHS.

By ray

January 24, 2008 11:41 PM | Link to this

This is great! I come here hoping to get right into the nonsensical juiciness of trade talk (you know…rumor, myth, legend…and maybe a single kernel of truth).

Instead, what I find is VERY one-sided argument about Josh vs. Marvin. And a funny one at that.

Steve ol’ boy. Don’t know what to tell you besides “you’re wrong.” If Marvin is so much better than Smith, why are damn near all of his statistics lower? No seriously, go to NBA.com and do the comparison. Josh is higher in every single category except FG%, where Marvin has a 4% advantage. Yet both guys play 36 minutes per game. Marvin shoots 47.1% while Smith is hitting 43.2%.

When’s the last time you’ve seen Marvin take someone off the dribble? He can’t. How about dunk on somone? He doesn’t. Finish a play in which he’s fouled? Rarely. Play active and fairly consistent defense on his opponent? Nope. Josh dunks on people, he finishes plays (as in 3-point plays), he doesn’t have to take anybody off the dribble because his speed and step to the basket is daunting. He jumps over people. And even without a good jumpshot (which is getting a bit better), he’s still better. And please don’t mention Marvin and “post” in the same sentence. He avoids the paint like the plague. You would think with that big ol’ caboose he has hangin’ out there, he’d at least be able to back someone down in the post. Nope, never does it. I tried to find a decent point in your argument. The only thing I could say is that Marvin is a better jump shooter….assuming he’s wide-a$$ open. And I like the guy. But let me tell you why he takes less shots than Smith does: 1)he just doesn’t shoot in the 4th quarter, 2)he won’t shoot most of the time unless he feels he’s pretty much open, 3)he doesn’t have the kahones or the drive that Smith does, and 4)he has no inside game to speak of. So he’s stuck shooting the 15-17 foot jumper unless he remembers to cut to the basket (hoping for an open lay-up or dunk)…which he won’t hit most of the time if fouled.

Did I hear you say Josh Smith was more like a Shawn Marion? Uh…you mean Shawn Marion the 4-time All-Star? LOL! How the devil you can pay a guy such a high compliment and then say that another guy (who is nowhere near that type of player) is better is beyond me, but damn if it wasn’t funny as hell to read!

“Marvin is ten times the offensive player Josh is…Josh couldn’t hold Marvin’s jockstrap offensively.” Again, where’s the evidence suggesting such a crazy idea? Why isn’t he taking over games? Why doesn’t he do anything significant in the 4th quarter, where it counts? You know who I see bringing it hard in the 4th quarter? JJ, sometimes AJ, sometimes Lue, and….Smoove. Even Chills at times. Not Marvin. Gimme a break, dude.

There is only one reason you let Josh go in trade and let Marvin stay: if you are trading Josh for a legit center who is going to be “the man in the middle” for us for years to come. I’m talking someone you can build around, someone who is a focal point on offense AND defense. Otherwise, how do you replace what Josh gives? No offense you say, yet he’s clearly scoring more than Marvin. And he routinely gets more assists. And more rebounds. And then there’s the huge advantage he presents: the guy doesn’t just provide defense, he’s passionate about it. While I have to say that Horford and JJ are very solid on “D”, Josh Smith is our Lawrence Taylor. He’s a game changer on defense. And everybody knows it. Except maybe you, it seems.

I.Mus, right on, right on, right ON! Josh may not be what one would want in a consummate team leader. He would make a good team captain after some more experience. But there is no doubt what he does for this team. You nailed it on the head, without a doubt.

Furthermore, I dig what you’re saying on Acie. Playing while constantly looking over your shoulder has ruined him. Woody may get these guys to play hard, but they do it so they can actually get to play. When it comes to direction, there’s no clue. These guys are playing to stay out of the doghouse more than they are to stay on the court, and more than they are to win. As Shelden, Zaza, Salim, Solo….

Preston, you’re not the only one. I mentioned to a buddy of mine that the team had a very bad look on their faces when they left the court after the game against Denver. I’ve seen that look. Saw it a lot last year. I don’t want to see that look, but I get the feeling that I’ll be seeing it a lot more soon.

Something’s gotta give. It’s gotta give soon.

By HB Ando

January 24, 2008 11:49 PM | Link to this

I’m just confounded by folks who see Marvin Williams developing into an all-star. When we drafted him, I stated, here, that it seemed confusing that we had just drafted a guy who’s game most resembled a guy we already had, in Al Harrington. I believe my comments were along the lines of, “why did we just draft Al Harrington to replace Al Harrington, when we could have drafted Isiah Thomas?”. Now, he’s doing nothing to change my feelings about that comparison. Over time Al has extended his range to beyond the 3-point arc. He’s got a mid-range game, though his post-up is still light years ahead of Marvin’s. If Al Harrington has never sniffed an all-star berth, what is it about Marvin that makes some of you project such lofty improvements? Richard Jefferson is averaging 24 a game for New Jersey. Anybody here him mentioned as a legit contender for a slot on the East team? Gerald Wallace? Rashard Lewis? Caron Butler? Paul Pierce? Igoudala, Deng, Nocioni, Danny Granger, Dunleavy? Heck, LeBron is going to the game as a small forward! He’s not in the same class as any of those guys, right now (and, in my opinion, never will be).

Some of you folks are suggesting that Marvin will an all-star, making him one of the 12 best players in the East. I think you could argue that he’s not even one of the top-12 small forwards in the East. At this stage, he’s a one-dimensional shooter, with sub-3 point range, no mid-range game, and absolutely no heart on the defensive side of the ball, rebounding when the spirits move him.

He’s not a bust, by any means. But right now, if Travis Outlaw was on this roster, the only way Marvin would be playing in front of him was if the front office and ownership demanded it. Hell, I’m not sure Jamario Moon wouldn’t take his spot, given the heart, athleticism and production he provides the Raptors on both ends of the floor.

This is a guy that Dominique Wilkins called a “once in every ten years” player. It’s time to acknowledge that he’s never going to live up to such lofty projections (and simultaneously admit that being a hall-of-fame player does not translate to being a superior judge of talent).

The NBA is famous for teams thinking they can get more out of certain players than their current teams. Marvin is compelling enough for a number of teams to still believe he’s special (unlike Shelden, who cannot have any plausible currency around the league, unless Coach K leaves Duke and takes an NBA coaching job).

If the Hawks are smart (which it’s pretty well defined they are not), they’ll take advantage of that egoistic nature of another franchise, and move Marvin for a PG solution, or an early lottery pick in the upcoming draft.

This isn’t an anti-Marvin rant. It’s an assessment, based on what you see, night in and night out. Given adequate minutes and touches, can Marvin average 17-20 PPG? Sure. But so can 100 other guys in this league (go look up the numbers Kareem Rush is putting up in Indiana, after bouncing around the league and having to go to Europe-or Anthony Parker, in Toronto).

Once again, the idea that this team can reach the upper echelon of the Easter Conference, without trading some of it’s talent, belies the very nature of the NBA. Almost every great player in the league has been traded. What that tells you is that winning is about chemistry and balanced rosters. You can quote tremendous individual statistics, for Joe Johnson and Josh Smith. But you don’t have to go back very far, in Hawks’ history, to look at just how useless big individual numbers are, when playing for a losing team. Anybody remember Abdur-Rahim? You could bank the guy for 20 and 10. And we never made the playoffs once while he was here.

The folks here who suggest that Josh Smith, Marvin and Joe Johnson should be untouchable, based on their statistical performances, are the same folks who couldn’t understand why we moved Abdur-Rahim.

You have to give to get. And this team isn’t poised to take on any of the big kids in the East. You can count on one hand the number of great players who started and ended their careers with the same team. And, for the millionth time, we DO NOT HAVE a FIRST ROUND PICK THIS SUMMER!

Come to grips with the reality that somebody good on this team will need to move on, to better the TEAM. It’s on Billy to maximize the value of the player he moves. And his track record is abysmal.

Stand pat, and we’ll miss the playoffs. Trust Billy to make a blockbuster, and history suggests we’ll be taking another step backwards. If ever there was a case of “damned if you do, damned if you don’t”, this would be it………

(While I’m typing this, I’m watching Monta Ellis go for 17, his season average, in the first half against the Nets. This is a guy that most draft projections had going in the first round. I watched him display a different gear, first step-wise, during the McDonald’s All-American game. I also watched the one-dimensional Salim Stoudamire play at Arizona, where, prior to his senior season, the imminently respected Lute Olsen encouraged him to transfer to another school, due to his attitude. So when Billy had his choice, at the beginning of the 2005 second-round, who did he take? How can a man be wrong so constantly, and still keep his job?)

Folks who call me a hater simply don’t understand. I don’t feel hate. I feel profound depression. Sadness that it would have been so simple to follow general consensus, in the previous drafts, and have a Hawks team LOADED with talent.

If the owners that comprise the Spirit had any real money, they’d simply pay Billy whatever he’s asking for the video he has, of the lot of them, doing some type of (allegedly) clearly (allegedly) unspeakable acts. I’ve got no other viable explanation for the fact that Billy Knight still has a job in the NBA.

Uggghhhhhhh………..

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 24, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this

Mike, you are not in the minority about a Gasol trade. He is pretty overrated. Giving up J-Smoove for him would be insanity in my opinion. Marvin, sure, but not J-Smoove. But Magloire? I wouldn’t trade Cenk Akyol for that dude. The Hawks already have him anyway, except he goes by Lorenzen Wright when he’s in a Hawks uniform.

I still think Steve’s gotta be joking. He can’t possibly be serious with the Marvin dick-riding. If he is, he is the only Marvin dick-rider in history.

Clyde — sarcasm. Although I do agree.

By ray

January 24, 2008 11:54 PM | Link to this

This has to sound like a nutty conspiracy theory, but what else is there these days? It may even sound like a dirty idea, but…

Bernie Mullin is gone. What better time for the Spirit Group to start doing the right things when it comes to managment, coaching, and player movement (trades, free agency, drafts). Why? Because you can blame it all on Mullin. Nevermind why he’s really leaving. Nevermind whether things are really all his fault, partially his fault, or not his fault at all. Use this as an opportunity to change direction and get on the right path. Use Mullin and his departure as a pseudo-scapegoat. Mullin will land on his feet and won’t care about something like that anyhow, regardless of whether it’s true. Chances are, he’s already headed for something else that probably looks like Utopia compared to the Hawks organization. Now’s the time, Spirit Group. You’ve got an alibi. Use it, and begin doing the right things. In the end, which isn’t that far away if you do it right, you’ll make more money and have a better product…which again in turn…makes you more money? What’s not to like?

By ejh

January 25, 2008 12:20 AM | Link to this

I feel the hawks do not need to trade their young nucleus, they are young and are beginning to show signs of how to play together. That being said however they do need to look at a coaching change and philosophy in how they play. This is a young athletic team that is big in size, no team in the league can match up with this team. When you see a guy like Horford who can get out and lead the break, you are talking about guys with a different set of skills, and that goes for much of this team. This team is missing a true athletic point guard; a Jason Kidd, Mike Bibby, Andre Miller. It is not necessarily the Hawks size as well as for how they play. Jason Kidd instantly makes this team 7 games better in the standings, because he is going to make sure everybody on the floor is in a position to be successful. If the Hawks are not going to trade for a point guard, then Joe Johnson is going to have to play the point on most nights. At 6’7” he could be hell in the post for other points to have to contend with, the problem is going to be on the defensive end of the floor where the smaller points are going to penetrate cause problems, but if Josh Smith and Al or allowed to play help defense they might be able to get buy. I know Joe does not want to play the point, but to help this team win he is going to have to. Acie Law will eventually help this team win at that position but not now. Joe Johnson at point and Marvin at the SG with J-Smooth at SF, and Horford at PF with Pachula at Center now gives this team two low Post players with offense on the blocks 3 if you count Josh Smith. If they try and double team Joe Johnson that is actually good because it leaves Horford, Pachula, Smith one on one on the blocks, and wide open looks for Marvin williams or Ty Lue, once these guys make shots teams can no longer double Joe and his game will flourish, because he then can drive and penetrate or pull up and shoot jumpers and plus this puts the ball in his hands almost everytime down court. If the hawks are going to make a trade, trade for Jammal McGlouire, he will be the defensive help in the post that we need.

By Marko

January 25, 2008 2:48 AM | Link to this

SEKOU, the next time you’re in Chicago, go to any J.O.(largest grocery store chain in Illinois)and buy a bag of chocolate chip cookies. It is the best $1.30 you will ever spend. Avoid Chi-style pizza, (especially spinache)—it is way overrated and plays games with ya. Go Hawks, dude.

By Clyde

January 25, 2008 3:18 AM | Link to this

“Folks who call me a hater simply don’t understand. I don’t feel hate. I feel profound depression. Sadness that it would have been so simple to follow general consensus, in the previous drafts, and have a Hawks team LOADED with talent.”

-HB Ando

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By RaJaH

January 25, 2008 4:07 AM | Link to this

Here’s something I find on Yahoo:

“A check with the NBA office this week confirmed that should Shaquille O’Neal announce and sign retirement papers after this season, bypassing the final two years on his contract, his future salary would be wiped from the Miami Heat’s salary cap.

Immediately, that would give the Heat the space to, say, add a Luol Deng or Elton Brand, with enough space left over to address at least one or two additional needs — and still sign that lottery pick.”

Now if that’s possible in Miami, the Hawks should have no problems taking Speedy off the books this season.

By St. Bernard

January 25, 2008 7:17 AM | Link to this

Fire BK and Woody.

Draft and trade by consensus of this blog.

Find a coach with an uptempo offense.

By Jameyan

January 25, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this

Yes, I am back on here. I was a beginning blogger back when this thing first started along with CLyde and HB Ando and others. And for the past three years it is the same thing. I would rather have the 13-69 team because at least you knew they sucked. This team frustrates and depresses me night in and night out. Why have teams who were in the same boat with the Hawks now are legtitmate teams in the league? Over the past three years those teams have done something we have not: DRAFT WELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I admit I was one of those that gave Marvin a chance and not really beat up BK for not taking Chris Paul or Deron Williams.But flat out Marvin is not what we need and he got to go along with the other pick who i would get to in a minute. Because if Mike Woodson was their coach they would suck also. But the drafting of Sheldon Williams really ticks me off. HE DOES NOTHING!!!! then signing Speedy Claxton. FOR WHAT!!!!

Look dumb@$$ decision making with dumb@$$ coaching equal an underachieving team. You might can win with one but if you have two incompetent people in charge then its not going to work.

What really bothers me is that other team back up point guards are better than all of our point guards. These guys I know we could have had at one point and time. Sergio Rodriguez- Jose Calderon- Beno Udrih- Leandro Barbosa- Chris Duhon- Earl Watson- Jarrett Jack- and others.

My hands are up in the air. Billy Knight DO SOMETHING!!!! Or better yet in the words of Clyde

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Hawk fan since Zelmo

January 25, 2008 8:42 AM | Link to this

Trade the Coach. He won’t play Salim and Acie - his two most talented guards.
No one knows what his substitution pattern is. He is killing Joe Johnson - 41 minutes per night. He doesn’t have a clue as to how to fix this team. Why would trading players help?

By yessir

January 25, 2008 8:58 AM | Link to this

Fire Clyde!!!!!!!

By Astro Joe

January 25, 2008 9:50 AM | Link to this

Of all the dunm things I have ever read on this blog, Marko says that Chicago-style pizza is overrated. WTF is that about?

By I.MUS WRITE

January 25, 2008 10:07 AM | Link to this

Okay itz day two,and Steve still has a man crush on Spring Break-oops i mean DUCK.

By randy

January 25, 2008 10:46 AM | Link to this

Marvin has a better mid-range jumper than Smith, but everything else Josh Smith is much much better at. Not only that Josh has more energy, hustle, and passion to win that I never see from Marvin. I just don’t understand how you can even compare the two. Prediction: In 3 years, Marvin will be working at Disney World in a Donald the Duck uniform fulfilling his destined career path as a human duck.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 25, 2008 10:51 AM | Link to this

Good post ANDO- Jamario Moon,Travis Outlaw,Monte Ellis - These guys all came in the league with or after Spring Break and i would take any of them over ol Marv. Throw L.Kleiza in there too- ALL STAR -PULEEZ

By Chikara

January 25, 2008 12:45 PM | Link to this

Chicago-style pizza ROCKS! Must be a NY pizza lover….

….Gasol is very overrated. For those of you riding his jock, just go back to how he disappeared during all their playoff appearances (all losses by the way). He’s moody and is a perfect individual to get posterized on a regular basis because he can’t trap bigger men on the low block.

….Woodson has lost this team, you can tell they don’t trust his play calling, and he hinders their offensive development for a slow down approach.

….I got a feeling they will actually eek out a win in Seattle, but that will be it for this road trip.

Due to the incompetent East, Atlanta may actually slip in with 38 wins.

By preston

January 25, 2008 12:53 PM | Link to this

Oh man, you guys are killing me with the jokes about Marvin, and calling him duck……lol………now everytime I see him walking on the court, I am going to laugh myself to tears!!!

By stinger

January 25, 2008 1:21 PM | Link to this

Everyone keeps talking Gasol and Stoudamire when we should be talking Gasol / Lowry / Juan Carlos Navarro. Gasol isn’t complaining about being in Memphis this year (despite their performance) because his buddy from Spain JCN is with him - it would be ill advised to break up that happy marriage - not to mention that JCN plays great when he gets the minutes.

By thecamera

January 25, 2008 1:29 PM | Link to this

like jameyan, i also found my way back to the blog recently after reading it daily, and posting regularly back when it first launched. maybe it is the perceived state of hopelessness that has leaked back into the hawks this month that bought me back …

to continue with the marvin williams conversation … each draft day my ritual is getting a pizza and a 2-liter and stuffing my face as david stern announces the lottery picks. i literally almost choked when stern called williams’ name during that draft. while the debate had been raging on who the hawks would pick, i was sure (or many just naive) that paul was going to be that pick. i feel sick now just remembering that feeling.

no knock on williams personally, but i still can’t comprehend his pick over paul. i won’t lie - i was worried that deron williams was going to be a bust, so it isn’t like i’m a keen judge of ability, but chris paul was as sure as a sure thing could be. AND he wanted to play for atlanta.

i could defend sheldon williams pick last year, being the next antonio davis/dale davis … but the marvin pick … i still can’t come close to a persuasive argument for marvin’s pick at that position.

there’s no use living in the past, so maybe we should all move on from that pick. but with this team, can you ever really move on?

maybe the hawks could sign paul shirley for a second tour of duty. at the very least, he could an entertaining blog to the mix.

By Tyger

January 25, 2008 2:00 PM | Link to this

2008 Draft

Hawks currently dont own a draft pick in the first round, is it a good idea to get one?

There may be a wave of good centers coming out this year along with the big names: Beasley, Love, Rose, Mayo.

1. DeAndre Jordan, 7-0, 250, TX AM; 2. Brook Lopez, 7-0, 260, Stanford; 3. Roy Hibbert, 7-2, 280, Gtown;
2. Hasheem Thabeet, 7-3, 285;
3. Devon Hardin, 6-10, 240, Cal

Not recommending selling the farm but maybe a do-over on the Shelden pick, not that I’m down on Shelden either, afterall, he was the premier bigman of his class - whether he’s being used properly is another issue - you dont dominate the ACC and not have the goods.

Hawks need a true center and this young crop presents opportunities. I’m suggesting that in any trade scenarios that a #1 pick be included and or maybe we’re better off waiting until draft day, to get back in the lottery to get one of these true centers.

By jami$$iondadon

January 25, 2008 2:22 PM | Link to this

Sheldon,salim,law,&chills r not busts.they r all nice players under the right system & 2 have the right system u have 2 have the right coach & any trade we make will be in vain until we recieve the other most necessary part the head.The body is fine this team is braindead. Woody must go now,then we can make a fair assessment of our talent & make the proper adjustments! Bk later if he makes the wrong diagnosis.

By Jo Bling

January 25, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this

Wow. It’s amazing how long this thread has gotten. Tells me there is still a whole lot of interest in this team. This town wants a winner. I have to say, though, that none, or very few, of you guys see the obvious truth that’s on display each night the Hawks play. Am I really in the minority in believing that Josh Smith is what is wrong with this team?

Yes, he got a triple double. Yes, he can score 35 in a night. Yes, he plays a little defense (although not on Lawless the other day at the end of overtime). Yes, he plays all out. But can’t you see what he is doing to this team? He’s a one-man circus act. His free-for-all approach is exactly what is preventing this young, talented team from developing any cohesiveness. Winning basketball teams function as a unit - everyone knows his role. Josh Smith doesn’t fit within any defined role for this team. And just when he’s about to win you over with some incredibly athletic achievement, he turns around a jacks up an air-ball three at the most inopportune moment. His antics are stifling the development of this team. Doesn’t it seem odd that every time he is the “leader” of the game, i.e., in points and focus, the Hawks lose? Think about it. Why is Josh Smith leading the team in turnovers? Why is he second in fouls? Why is a 23-percent three-ball shooter still jacking it up in the fourth quarter of crucial games? Why can’t Josh Smith make two free throws in a row at key points in the game, or complete an “and-one”?

Josh Smith is what is wrong with this team.

By Astro Joe

January 25, 2008 2:36 PM | Link to this

Tyger, I’m glad that we don;t have a 1st round pick next year. I’m tried of rookies (although Horford is clearly far better in his rookie season than anything we have had during the BK era). I’m too impatient at this point to live thru more growing pains. Yes, we need a center. If we want to take the time to develop one, sign Patrick O’Bryant in the summer. I think Speedy has played more games in the last 18 months than POB. Diop is a UFA as is Kwame. At a reasonable price, either would work here. Heck, I’d take a flyer on Theo if he’d come for the vet’s minimum. I just prefer someone who is experienced as opposed to yet another youngster.

By the way, anyone see that quote from David Harrison (someone I considerd for the above list before reading his interview after his drug suspension). Dude said something to the affect of marijuana can help improve the air in cities with bad pollution. What we don’t need is a 7-foot tall JR Rider.

By Sekou K. Smith

January 25, 2008 2:50 PM | Link to this

Heard a great rumored deal today: Jamaal Magloire straight up for Zaza. The money ($4 million for each guy) works and bringing him here allows you to keep your core intact and add the greasy big man you need to help get this team by in the middle. And the risk isn’t nearly as great because Magloire’s contract is up at the end of the season, so he’ll be motivated to prove his worth and if it doens’t work out, you’re not locked into a long-term deal. Magloire doesn’t play for New Jersey (they have young bigs Sean Williams and Josh Boone they’re going with), so he has to be expendable. But it sounds like a no-brainer deal for both sides. Wish I knew if they were talking …

By Sekou K. Smith

January 25, 2008 3:01 PM | Link to this

I know Mike mentioned Magloire earlier, but I heard it today from a source that indicated Magloire is not only available but that he’s being shopped. Just thought it was pretty interesting.

By cp

January 25, 2008 3:05 PM | Link to this

If Josh Smith is what is wrong with this team then maybe i need a new team to cheer for because I just dont see it. The guy makes foolish mistakes but no one can question his work ethic and heart. I wish half of the guys on this team played with his passion. Sorry Sekou but that trade almost makes too much sense for BK to do it.

By mykhalc

January 25, 2008 3:26 PM | Link to this

cp, what you said!!!!

By Chikara

January 25, 2008 3:44 PM | Link to this

It’s great to have at least one Atlanta blogger with inside information. Thanks Sekou. However I’m not holding my breath on that deal happening. BK is too gun shy and will probably feel that Zaza is worth too much (chuckles).

By Astro Joe

January 25, 2008 3:48 PM | Link to this

Magloire would sit at the end of the bench right next to Lo Wright. I’d consider that a good deal because it saves the Hawks $4M next year. And maybe it gets us closer to signing a free agent in the summer (with about $14M cleared off the books). But that doesn’t sound like a “basketball” move to me. Nets need a greasy big man as much as the Hawks. Sorry, trading for a guy who can’t get time on his current team doesn’t do anything for me. I’d rather have Earl Barron.

By Melvin

January 25, 2008 3:51 PM | Link to this

Sekou, I hope that rumor is true. Can they include Marcus Williams in that package as well.

By Barry

January 25, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

Hey Y’all:

It’s coaching, man. We need a new coach with a fast style to run these young thoroughbreds. Look at Mc Millan with the Portland Trailblazers. He has a style that laet’s these guy play the same way the did in college. He did not try to change their game. He chose players that fi his style of play who were ready to play immediately and feel comfortable doing it. Woodson, on the otherhand, has tried mold these guys into something they are not. He drafted these guys from running teams that shoot and has tried to change them into stand around jump shooters. This process has been long and arduos for the Hawks. Right now they are adjusting to it, but they still fall into their basic basketball instinctive nature which is to run. The coaching philosophy does not fit this team. And the coach is reisitant to change. He needs to follow Nate Mc Millans approach and choose players that fit their scheme. If they would have done it earlier maybe we would have been winning earlier and NOW. But now the players are just starting to understand and play Woodson’s way but I do not think they can do it consistantly. Moreover, I think it is too late for the transition. By the time things adjust, Woodson will be fired due to the inconsistancy in the team.

SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHH!! This is a SECRET from a HAWK FAN!!!! Tell Everybody!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Barry

January 25, 2008 4:03 PM | Link to this

Hey Y’all:

It’s coaching, man. We need a new coach with a fast style to run these young thoroughbreds. Look at Mc Millan with the Portland Trailblazers. He has a style that laet’s these guy play the same way the did in college. He did not try to change their game. He chose players that fi his style of play who were ready to play immediately and feel comfortable doing it. Woodson, on the otherhand, has tried mold these guys into something they are not. He drafted these guys from running teams that shoot and has tried to change them into stand around jump shooters. This process has been long and arduos for the Hawks. Right now they are adjusting to it, but they still fall into their basic basketball instinctive nature which is to run. The coaching philosophy does not fit this team. And the coach is reisitant to change. He needs to follow Nate Mc Millans approach and choose players that fit their scheme. If they would have done it earlier maybe we would have been winning earlier and NOW. But now the players are just starting to understand and play Woodson’s way but I do not think they can do it consistantly. Moreover, I think it is too late for the transition. By the time things adjust, Woodson will be fired due to the inconsistancy in the team.

SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHH!! This is a SECRET from a HAWK FAN!!!! Tell Everybody!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Ken Strickland

January 25, 2008 4:07 PM | Link to this

That possible trade sounds good to me SEKOU. It seems the more this team struggles, the more pressure Woodson feels. The more pressure he feels, the more he seems to retreat into his Bobby Knight impersonation. He refuses to take a player having trouble aside and discuss ways to resolve his issues. Instead he punishes by refusing to play him inspite of team needs.

We’re playing good DEF, but we’re losing because of poor shooting. Salim could be a possible solution. We need a PG that can break down DEF’s and get his teammates uncontested shots. ALaw could be that person. When the season started, that was exactly what he did best. Now he’s lost most of that earlier confidence and swagger. Tell me, how many players have ever regained any measure of lost confidence after being relegated to the bench?

The turn of events with the Hawks players, since the players only meeting, reminds me of a simular situation with the Falcons. After MVick complained openly about the conservative play calling and lack of passing opportunities, OC GKnapp responded. His play calling changed drastically over the next 2 gms against the Steelers and Bengals. As a result, the OFF was awesome in both wins. Then the OC inexplicably reverted back to his previous conservative style and the OFF reverted back to its mondane self.

After that players only meeting we went on a 5gm winning steak. During that span, we consistently ran the ball down teams throats. Since then, we’ve reverted back to our old habits. Players appear to be tired and frustrated and some are trying to take matters into their own hands. That’s why we now have little ball movement, fewer assists and poor shooting.

This team is healthier, and just as capable of winning now as they were during that winning steak. They are simply fractured emotionally and psychologically. Players that showed confidence and potential are now hesitant and playing to avoid making mistakes. Others have been rendered useless to the team for seemingly personal reasons by our HC. After getting 5RB’s in 9 mins., I wonder what’s in store for SJones.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 25, 2008 4:21 PM | Link to this

Preciate the info-Sekou

Okay this seems to be a perfect situation, we can rid ourselves of ZAZA the king of coture and get a certified Goon in the process —

The salaries match so the next question is what are we waiting for?

I dont think the deal will get done but im sure hoping so

By cp

January 25, 2008 4:26 PM | Link to this

Ken that is exactly why i call Mike Woodson the Gregg Knapp of basketball. It is so baffling that its funny at times to see this guy slow it down after we get a lead that came from us running and attacking the rim.

By Astro Joe

January 25, 2008 4:44 PM | Link to this

We all know that Zaza has been injured throughout this season, suspended and in general, ineffective. So what does it say that he has played more minutes this season than Magloire? Sure, the Nets have Sean Williams and Josh Boone but it seems that they were forced to turn to those young guys when Magloire didn’t produce. Again, do the deal because it helps with cap space next season. But don’t expect much production from Garfield this season.

By Jo Bling

January 25, 2008 4:54 PM | Link to this

cp - I would never say Josh Smith doesn’t have a work ethic or play with heart, because there is no doubt that he does. I will say, however, that he is an athletically gifted player who doesn’t understand his role with this team. His performance overwhelms the rest of the team in the sense that it is disruptive to the game plan. His freelance style essentially negates any need for a strategy, and, therefore, his contribution is more of a liability than an asset. That’s why the Hawks lose every time Josh Smith’s performance is at the forefront. His freelancing is distracting to the team effort, an effort that should be built around Joe Johnson.

I find it hard to believe that no one else seems to recognize how Smith’s style influences this team. As a somewhat relevant example, think of how the NY Giants have grown, and Eli Manning has emerged, now that Jeremy Shockey is out of the picture. Dominant personalities and outsized playing styles are detrimental to the effectiveness of a team.

By preston

January 25, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

It is always funny, yet disheartening to hear guys that posts threads on these blogs saying things that make absolutely no sense just to try and prove thier point……….consider the post by jo-bling concerning Josh Smith…..quote.. “Yes, he got a triple double. Yes, he can score 35 in a night. Yes, he plays a little defense (although not on Lawless the other day at the end of overtime). Yes, he plays all out. But can’t you see what he is doing to this team? He’s a one-man circus act.”….. Two things here…..Smith plays a “little defense”?????……lol, if Smith plays a “little defense” then what does that say for the rest of team, and the rest of the league for that matter……and second, Smith played Lawless tight, and Lawless took a 20 plus foot jumpshot over the outstretched hands of Smith, which he hit….it was just a good shot made by Lawless….you can’t fault Smith for that……Smith is at least the second best player on our team offensively, and the best defensively.

By preston

January 25, 2008 5:06 PM | Link to this

And yes you are in the minority…….another irrational quote….Why can’t Josh Smith make two free throws in a row at key points in the game, or complete an “and-one”?………Wasn’t it Smith who hit not 1….not 2….but 3 free throws at the end of regulation this yr. against the Detroit Pistons…in The Palace at Auburn Hills. Those free throws sent the game into overtime giving his team a chance to win the game. Again, I am totally lost with what I am reading from that post.

By Tiger Woo

January 25, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this

Jo Bling,

Are you related to Steve? It sounds like it with all the Josh Smith nonsense you are spewing - how can you say J-Smooth’s performance is disrupting the game plan - do you even know what the game plan is?

I’m waiting for you to start singing praises for Duck - then I’ll definitely know you are related to Steve.

By Tyger

January 25, 2008 5:18 PM | Link to this

Put me on the Jamaal Magloire bandwagon, I’ve wanted him for two years now. He’s low risk, high reward and loves to bang.

ZaZa for Magloire makes perfect sense for us, dont know how ZaZa works for NJ except as a backup big with a good contract that can be packaged in a bigger deal, but they can do that with Magloire so again, why ZaZa?

But if we can get him who cares?

Second, lets go after Mike James, he’s better than any PG we have right now. See if the Rockets will take on Speedys contract, which is expiring too. Not technically, but he hasnt played in one single game this year so he’s headed towards retirement, medical exemption or buyout.

It would be great to take that $6M off our books but if it gets us a gritty PG that knock down 3s at will and defend then God Bless!

Moreover, Speedy played for Rick Adelman and has a good relationship, maybe a more supportive environment would help his knees.

By I.MUS WRITE

January 25, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

Tyger- all of those centers you mentioned are okay to garbage IMO. The only one i see making a contribution next year or at all is Hibbert.

Im starting to feel like Astro Joe-Im tired of waiting on players to develope. I think Hibbert will be serviceable on the next level- but im really glad he went back to college -because we wouldnt have Horford.

By smartguy

January 25, 2008 5:49 PM | Link to this

I would much rather have cap room than Zaza. Used to be a fan, but he has been awful this year. Maybe he got his feelings hurt when Horford was drafted, but thats just too bad. Get his butt out of here, and give that $4 mil to Smooth.

Steve makes a bunch of anti-Smooth posts, then disappears, and up pops jo-bling. Either way, I’m tired of the debate around Josh Smith. Let me just say this, without #5 we would lose by double digits on a frequent basis.

And I also want to say a few things about Marvin. Yea, that duck is funny, but his game has gotten much better this year. Does he consistently drive, rebound, or play defense at a high level? Not necessarily, but he has improved by leaps and bounds. His first two years, he couldn’t drive, rebound, or play D, but this year he is actually making an effort at each. Regardless of success, he does take the ball to the hoop every now and then. And more importantly, I have seen much more effort on the board and on the defensive end. He still has a long way to go, but he sure has come a long way from where he started.

woody still sucks.

By Inside

January 25, 2008 6:22 PM | Link to this

This is Woody’s last game if the Hawks lose tonight.

By Ken Strickland

January 25, 2008 6:25 PM | Link to this

CP—it’s entirely possible that your previous references to GKnapp subconsciously triggered my comparison. It’s hard for me to believe the players alone are responsible for the transition. Our current problems seem to coinside with the increasing issues Woodson is having with certain players.

At first I was reluctant to accept what some of you were suggesting concerning Woodson’s inability to manage a full roster. Now, I’m almost convinced it’s true. Since our bench is no longer limited by injuries, one could argue Woodson is using any excuse to limit the number of players he has to manage.

TYGER—I seem to remember a former New Jersey C named Mike Geminski(not certain of the spelling)that was simular to Zaza in size and height. However, Geminske was more polished. Geminski realized his strength was outside shooting and developed into an excellent high post center. Zaza seems to have trouble grasping that same reality. He might do well in the Nets system, especially with JKidd. It seems JSmith and Zaza haven’t played to their respective strengths. Josh has wanted to be an outside threat and Zaza seems to see himself as an inside threat. The complete opposite is true for both.

By mykhalc

January 25, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this

i hope it doesn’t take a loss for that to be true!!!!

By doc

January 25, 2008 7:18 PM | Link to this

if woody goes what is the alternative? drew or heh heh, bk?

By Sto?

January 25, 2008 7:46 PM | Link to this

Yo Salim is Awsome trade or do whatever to get Joe off the team he is to much of a ball hog, when he is not even a good shooter under pressure he has only made one game winning shot in his career with atlanta and if salim played he’d make more than Joe IN A WEEK

so joe sucks trade him

By sykes

January 25, 2008 9:01 PM | Link to this

hey astro joe brian skinner is w/ the suns now man! got it?

By Malone

January 25, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

If the Clippers situation blows up, that might make Dunleavy available. He would make a playoff team out of this bunch QUICKLY.

By jami$$iondadon

January 25, 2008 9:15 PM | Link to this

What’s Hattnann ATOWN? Time 4 a change.TRADE TRADE. We r way beyond a simple trade,that new coat of paint might make the house look better on the outside 2 the rest of our neighborhood ,but we who stay here know,bout the roaches,rats,termites that infest our home,the cheap landlord who doesn’t want 2 improve our conditions &the abusive father who has neglected his kids.Our father needs 2 be evicted,4 he hasn’t developed deez boyz 2men. Do u think he’ll do better with some stepkids than his own NOT!!

By The Flash

January 25, 2008 9:55 PM | Link to this

what is the alternative. Cut to the quick, I say, eh tu Doc? Hire Larry!

By jami$$iondadon

January 25, 2008 10:19 PM | Link to this

FIRE WOODY,JJ,ZAZA,LUE,LO WRIGHT,AJ,SPEEDY,DUCK,& SHELLS.EVERY1 ELSE HAS A ROLE PURPOSE4 DA TEAM.JS THE HEART&FIRE AL DA ANCHOR,CHILLS VERSATILITY6THMAN,WEST D STOPPER OURBRUCEBOWEN,,SALIM OUR MICROWAVE SNIPER,LAW RUN N GUN PG,SOLO OUR CAMBY JOHNSALLY. JJ HAS MOST TRADE VALUE,HE’S A ROBIN& ROBIN AIN’T A LEADER.BATMAN IS. INCOMING,GUARDS MAGGETTE GOODATHLETICGUARD,SERGIO,DUHON,ARROYO,LOWRY,OR RIDNOUR GOOD BACKUPS AFTER LAW LEARNS.KAYMAN,GASOL,NOCIONI,CURRY INSIDESCORING. MAGLORE4 ZAZA INSIDE D.BK LETS DO DIS

By Najeh Davenpoop

January 25, 2008 10:45 PM | Link to this

I don’t know how many of you are watching right now, but that play Marvin just made is Exhibit A as to why he will never be good.

He is on a fast break 1 on 1 against Earl Watson’s midget a*. Instead of dunking on him, laying it up, pulling up for a short jumper, etc. he allows Watson to rip the ball right out of his hands, collapsing in a heap. To add insult to injury, Watson bounces it off him out of bounds, possession to Seattle.

How useless can you possibly be.

By mykhalc

January 25, 2008 10:48 PM | Link to this

FLASH, are you takin’ advantage of the free NBALP goin’ on now????

By preston

January 25, 2008 11:19 PM | Link to this

oh boy…….Marvin’s jump shot is falling for him in front of his family, and against the worst team in basketball…..this is all we need for Steve, Jo-Bling, and the rest of the gang to come out of the woodworks again and proclaim his greatness……but again no inside moves or coordination going to the basket……he is what he is………a good mid-range jump shot.

By Steve (Hawkfansince84tilforever)

January 26, 2008 1:06 AM | Link to this

You guys are idiots, Marvin tore it up tonight.

By Melvin

January 26, 2008 1:08 AM | Link to this

Good game by Marvin tonite… ZaZa played okay as well… The offense look patheic in the 4th quarter… Can we please get Luke Ridnour in a Hawks uniform….

By Joe Bling

January 26, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

You guys are going to be surprised when Josh Smith is the one who gets traded. You think that just because a guy can score and play defense that he is helping THE TEAM. But you ought to expand your analysis a little further. Yeah, he hit those free throws against Detroit to tie the game, but you might want to look at his performance in a wider sample, including the crucial one-and-one he blew in OT against Portland, not to mention the NUMEROUS other one-and-ones he’s failed to convert in the fourth quarter this year. As for the Detroit game, read this write-up.

Smith’s attitude isn’t helping the Hawks Chris McCosky / The Detroit News • The Atlanta Hawks appear to be a team on the rise, but I fear there is one issue — one player, actually — who could torpedo their ascent. Josh Smith. He may be one of their most talented young athletes, but he’s also showing signs of being the most immature, as well. During the Hawks game against the Pistons, he was yelling at teammate Tyronn Lue because he wasn’t passing him the ball enough. He yelled at coach Mike Woodson to get Lue out of the game and had to be restrained by coaches and teammates. When he did get the ball, he often broke plays to get off his own shot. Then, after playing terribly most of the game, he was given a gift of three free throws (on a debatable call against Rasheed Wallace ). After he made the free throws, which only tied the game, he gave the Pistons’ bench the stink-eye, as if he did something heroic. The Pistons won the game on the ensuing possession. Smith, an unrestricted free agent in July, is playing for a contract and not necessarily to help the Hawks win games. That is a dangerous element on a young team.

Before the season started Sports Illustrated ran a breakdown of teams as analyzed by opposing scouts. I thought the review of the Hawks was a little over the top, but still pretty interesting to read now that we’re almost halfway into the season:

“An opposing team’s scout sizes up the Hawks

I give them no hope of making the playoffs. Josh Smith is the embodiment of all of their problems. And Joe Johnson doesn’t look happy with the way it’s going, to judge by his body language. As a team, they’re just taking turns getting shots up. The offense is ugly. And even after drafting a point guard, they still don’t have one who can help them through this year. Acie Law has size and girth, but I don’t see him making plays for people. This team is so bad that you can tell who’s taking the first shot simply by whoever gets it in his hands first … On certain nights if they’re on, they can run another team off the floor athletically. It will happen if the Hawks are motivated in some mysterious way and the other team is coming in from a back-to-back and is tired and doesn’t want to run up and down. That’s how they won last year … Mike Woodson is probably the first guy out there on the list of coaches who are in danger. He’s trying to do things; he’ll post up Johnson and do what he can. But their execution is very poor because too often it’s one pass and shoot. When they look good, they’re in transition and playing with four guys who can put the ball on the floor and take it to the basket — Johnson, Smith, Marvin Williams and most of their point guards — so if you don’t get back, they’re laying it in … Both Smith and Williams look like power forwards, but Marvin stands on the perimeter the whole time while Josh attempts to guard the goal — he doesn’t guard any person, he just guards the goal. Altogether, they have seven guys who could be a power forward, including Lorenzen Wright and Zaza Pachulia … Where do we begin with Smith? He’ll dunk it three times straight, and next time down he’ll want to see if he can get the three-point shot working and so he’ll throw one up out of the flow … clank. Or he’ll make some stupid pass into the third row, or he’ll jump in the air and throw it at somebody’s knees like Nolan Ryan from 10 feet away. He’s the kind of guy who will block the shot out of the court and return possession to the opponent rather than try to keep it in play so his team can get it. He’ll lower his head to drive and just barrel into people, but he’s not the only one. Their games are so sloppy because so many of them just put their heads down, and it’s painful to watch. It’s unbelievable how many stunts Smith and these other guys will pull to help lose games on a consistent basis. I’m talking about making an unbelievably good play and following it up with a knucklehead move. They’re ultimately going to break hearts more often than they please their fans. It’s an acceptable failure to miss a shot at the end of a game so long as you’re giving the effort, but to walk up the floor and pound your chest after dunking when you’re down by 20 doesn’t bring the fans back and make them root for you. One of the worst things that can happen to them is to see Smith making his first couple of threes because now he thinks he’s got it going tonight … So why is it like this in Atlanta? It’s because they threw a guy like Smith the keys from the very beginning, they said this is your baby and we’re going to ride you. But he doesn’t have the discipline to carry a team and he doesn’t know how to because he came straight out of high school. Look at how Kevin Garnett was raised by the Timberwolves: His teammates were Sam Mitchell and Terry Porter, two future head coaches in the locker room with him when he was a kid. But who has Smith been able to learn from? … Defensively, Woodson will try to trap and scramble the game so they can get points in transition, which means they don’t have to execute in the half-court. Sometimes it will work if teams are lazy … Their No. 3 [overall] pick, Al Horford, is everything they wished Shelden Williams — their No. 5 pick a year ago — was going to be. Horford has a better chance of being a successful pro than Smith or either of their Williamses. He’s got a little more control of his game, and he knows what he is and he sticks with that. Seeing Horford in person, I was surprised that he wasn’t taller; he’s never going to be Dwight Howard, let’s put it that way. But he can still be a good back-to-the-basket scorer. He has a turnaround jump hook and he looks fluid in his moves. He isn’t putting the ball on the floor four, five, six times. He has big shoulders and he’s still going to grow some and fill out more. As a defender, the effort is there … With their absence of centers, they’ll wind up playing two power forwards together unless Pachulia is out there. Shelden Williams is not a back-to-basket guy and he doesn’t rebound well enough to be out there. He isn’t that great of a shooter, and even though he’s big and tough, he’s still more of a face-up perimeter guy. He’s going to need a big year to prove himself or he might not have his option picked up. Until he becomes a cold-hearted, 15-to-17-foot jump shooter, he’s going to be a journeyman … I just don’t see the quickness of foot from Marvin Williams, the ability to change directions. I don’t see him doing stupid things to embarrass the franchise like some other people on their team. But he doesn’t get it: He suffers from poor shot selection, shots at the wrong time and has an inability to knock down open jump shots. For every time that he takes the ball to basket and goes to the free throw line, there’s another time that he’s turning the ball over by making drives and bowling over people. Marvin thinks he’s a jump shooter but he doesn’t make jump shots, and he thinks he’s a ball-handler but because he’s not quick enough to get by people, he’ll run into them and draw a charge. And he does not pass the ball … If they were to start all over again with a new rebuilding plan, Johnson would still be a big asset. You could go with Horford as a power forward and Pachulia as your backup center, and you may even give Shelden Williams and Law the benefit of the doubt … Johnson takes bad shots, and while he’s capable of making them, it still creates a chicken-or-egg argument. Does Johnson taking bad shots encourage Smith and other guys to take bad shots too? Or is Johnson trying to take his shots before Smith can? They’ll come out of a timeout and run a pretty neat play and not deliver the ball to a guy when he’s open; instead, they’ll throw it to Johnson on the wing and he’ll jab step and hoist a 20-foot shot. It’s a situation where they look like they’re competing against each other for shots instead of playing off each other, even though Woodson has some great stuff coming out of timeouts … If Johnson were on a good team, I wonder if he would be the No. 1 player. It’s a hard one to figure out. Let’s say you traded him straight up for Rip Hamilton. Detroit would have as much success as ever with Joe, and Atlanta would be just as bad with Rip. By going to Atlanta, Johnson took the big money [$70 million over five years], and I bet deep down now he’s regretting it. He knows he could have taken $55 million from Phoenix or somebody else and invested it well and be enjoying himself on a winner … Johnson isn’t a playmaker, but he is a versatile scorer with three-point range and a post-up game, and he’s a real strong guy who can take it off the dribble and pull up off the dribble. One thing he hasn’t been for all of the money they’re paying him is a team leader, because he hasn’t been able to reel in the rest of his teammates … “

Maybe I’m not in the minority after all.

By DeMan

January 26, 2008 8:51 PM | Link to this

I’m from Memphis and I’ve been hearing there’s already a deal on the table for Gasol for Marvin Williams and Josh Smith. Not sure who else would be included for the salaries to match up, but I’m all for that…MAKE THE DEAL!!!

By My eyes are bleeding

January 27, 2008 2:18 AM | Link to this

D@$%, Joe Bling just posted the entire Encyclopedia Brittanica! When you write that many words, some of it has gotta be intelligent! Where was JB when I needed help with my book reports?

By john

January 27, 2008 2:30 AM | Link to this

I wish I could be in charge of player personal for the hawks. Yes a deal for Paul Gasol will help if we can get a point guard that makes other players better. We could easily ship Marvin Williams and Sheldon Williams to Memphis, throw in speedy claxton with his five million per year salary, and its a done deal. We may have to pay half of speedys salary for a year, but that would be better than throwing away five million for him to sit at home or on the bench. Shipping Marvin and Sheldon will allow real fans from reminiscing about what could have been done with the draft picks we used on them. Chris Paul, [who wanted to play here in ATL],we past on the Utah Williams kid, Andrew Bynum, Donte Ellis, Brandon Roy, and Lamarcus Aldridge. All these players have developed into allstar caliber players over the last three years. Passing on the best talent in drafts has been going on for a while with the Hawks. I am tired of them. is

By Homey,I'm a honkey

January 27, 2008 3:28 AM | Link to this

Pau Gasol=Caucasian Shareef. Had CP3 not punched another man’s stones while at Wake, Hawks would have taken him instead of #24. As far as I know, LA was the only team willing to invest in young, awkward at the time, Bynum. I won’t make any excuses for MANY other failure to land good player draft day doings by ATL. Seems like yesterday, Hawks had 4 1st rd picks. They ended up with Cal “Where am I now” Bowdler, Dion (not dijon)Glover, Jumaine (draft me if you’re insane) Jones and Hanno “Heavy” Mottola.Nice track record.Great franchise. WE CAN ALL BE PROUD!