AJC > Sports > Hawks > Blog > Archives > 2007 > May > 09 > Entry
DEL.ICIO.USThe Williams Code
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
I’m as tired of reading and writing about this as some of you probably are of doing the same. But how can you watch Deron Williams and not get an empty feeling in your gut knowing that this is the point guard of the future the Hawks could have (and should have) had on their roster?
The story is old by now, - flashback to the draft of 2005 when the Hawks snag Marvin Williams with the No. 2 overall pick and Utah’s grabs Deron before the Hornets snap up Chris Paul. The thinking then, of the Hawks and anyone else that would have landed in the top two of that draft, was that Andrew Bogut and Marvin Williams were the clear-cut top two players in the draft.
The point guard crew, which also included Ray Felton, was considered stellar but none of them were without an obvious flaw that teams figured would prove troublesome at the pro level (Deron Williams was knocked for his body, Paul and Felton for their lack of size). Per usual, those theories were disproved immediately, as all three of those point guards has outshined both Bogut and Williams through two seasons. It should come as no surprise. NBA teams routinely guess wrong on draft picks (scan any of the past gazillion drafts and see how badly things were botched).
But years from now, if the Hawks can’t get luck on their side for the May 22 draft lottery, a group of players with the name Williams (none related, of course) will tell the story of this sad era of Hawks basketball. For all the Hawks’ personnel missteps of the previous 30 years, none haunts them more today than passing on Deron Williams (not to mention Paul).
Follow me now.
Marvin and Shelden found their way into Hawks uniforms, with both doing admirable jobs under difficult circumstances. Deron and Marcus (both point guards, with Deron being a level or two above Marcus on the NBA food chain) did not. Those decisions have come to define the Hawks’ fate the past two seasons. They haven’t had the talented, young floor general out there to help corral the rest of their assembled talent in a way that lends itself to sustained success.
Granted, Marcus Williams is doing basically the same thing we’re all doing during the playoffs (sitting and watching). But he does have a future Hall of Famer (Jason Kidd) playing like it’s 1999 doing major work in front of him.
Deron Williams, however, is a much tougher case for me. I spent time prior to the 2005 draft studying him and his game and talking to the people closest to him leading up to the big night. They were all convinced that Atlanta was the perfect fit for him and that his workout with the Hawks had gone well enough that they felt good about him landing here (the only player with a bigger Jones for Atlanta was Paul, who to this day mentions how sick he was about not being picked by the Hawks every time I see him).
I understood the logic then of drafting Marvin Williams or Bogut (and please believe that if the Bucks had taken Marvin first, the Hawks and every other team would have passed on the point guards for Bogut. And anyone that says otherwise is being less than honest) then. But I would have been prepared to buck conventional wisdom then as I am now, because my choice would have been Deron Williams at No. 2, and you can ask Ando (wherever he is these days?) if you need outside verification. I just felt then, as I still do, that his playing style was perfectly suited for a team overloaded with similar players on the wing. His competitiveness, size, athleticism, fundamental skills and killer instinct are all things NBA teams are looking for from a leader.
That’s why I’ll be tuned in again tonight, staying up as late as need be, to watch him work. He outplayed Baron Davis in Game 1, something no one has been able to do this postseason. So it’ll be interesting to see what Davis comes back with for tonight’s matchup. One thing you know for sure, though, is that Deron Williams will be up for the challenge.
Comments
By honest_abe
May 9, 2007 9:58 AM | Link to this
ouch. feels like salt over an open wound. what could have been.
sigh
amazing, that the suns would consider trading amare. i’m still not understanding that. granted nash makes him look better, but offensively he’s the best big man in the game today.
i’ll be honest the guy i wanted in that draft was raymond felton. i really like pg’s with blazing speed, and quickness. and he was the fastest and quickest of the bunch. he still would’ve been a more valuable pick than marv. damn damn damn!
and i know this topic is getting old but did you ever imagine in your wildest dreams the level of disinterest in sports biggest record being broken? says a lot of the person and the sport.
By Mike-Tuscaloosa
May 9, 2007 10:02 AM | Link to this
You raise a great question but you never ask it to the right person
ie…Billy Knight
By BlueStreak
May 9, 2007 10:04 AM | Link to this
Glad to hear that someone is sad that the Hawks didn’t pick them. It’s usually the other way around. And I’m as sick as C.Paul is everytime I see the jokes we have trotted out at PG and know that he could have (and should have) been a Hawk. Where would we be now?
By Mike-Tuscaloosa
May 9, 2007 10:04 AM | Link to this
How about asking Billy Knight those questions….
By vdunkndunk
May 9, 2007 10:05 AM | Link to this
The two hardest players to watch this postseason: Deron Williams and Luol Deng. Both could be Hawks. Neither are. If they were, we might very well be watching them play tonight on TNT….in Hawks uniforms.
By JJ
May 9, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this
I remember on draft day i said we better draft a point guard. When we got marvin i was so mad. We already had J-Smith,J-chill,and al harrington at that time. Why do we need another forward. We needed a point guard. And last year we could have traded our pick for a future pick in this upcoming draft. Man Billy Knight is stupid. And I would never choose Bogut. Bogut never impressed me and I still do not see why he was drafted number 1.
By Clyde
May 9, 2007 10:58 AM | Link to this
After reading that article all I got to say is…………
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY
By Traceman
May 9, 2007 11:23 AM | Link to this
Good stuff Sekou. I love Marvin and I think he is going to be a terrific player in this league down the road but I watched Game 1 of the UT/GS series and Deron Williams was simply amazing. When you take into account the fact that we already had J Smoove, Chillz and Diaw (the JJ trade had not been made yet) on the roster when we drafted Marvin, Marvin will need to be AT LEAST Carmelo Anthony good to make his selection a good pick over Deron or Chris Paul.
By Chris D'
May 9, 2007 11:35 AM | Link to this
Look at the all NBA rookie teams. We were the only team in the 06’ draft to draft in the top 8 to not get a first or second team all rookie player.
Two of the other 3 were guards we brought in evaluated and passed on (Marcus Williams and Rajon Rondo). Those 2 guards combined made 1/3 the money Speedy made last year.
Look at Marcus Williams’ numbers in the two games he started this year, 14pts 6asts and 4rebs. The Nets had so much faith in Marcus Williams they were willing to deal Jason Kidd to the Lakers.
I was alright with the Marvin pick but the Sheldon pick is inexcusable.
By Ken Strickland
May 9, 2007 11:40 AM | Link to this
I would like to change the focus of this discussion just a wee bit. Let’s suppose we get either the #2, or #3 slot in this yrs draft. Who do we draft at #2, and why, or failing that, who do we draft at #3, and why?
I’m asking because of the dilemma I’m having about the kid from the U of Tx. If we draft him at #2, where do we play him. At this stage, is he capable of mentally and physically handling the demands of playing C. Is he a better fit than JSmith at PF, or is he really just a tall and talented SF. Or, would we be better off with a legitamite big man, like the kid from Georgetown, I think his name is Hibbet. Inquiring minds need to know.
However, if we get the #1 pick, or finish out of the top 3, forget I ever asked.
By cowa
May 9, 2007 11:58 AM | Link to this
I agree it would be wonderful to see Deron in a Hawks uniform, but I admit I was with Billy in wanting Marvin over all the other PG’s at the time. Williams had the potential of a future star. Marvin had the most potential of any player in that draft. We also knew that it would take patience with Marvin, as he was only 19 years old and his body needed to fill out more. After last summer’s performace (which I realize was against inferior opposition), expectations were high before he was injured. Some pundits are expecting Marvin to excel next year with the injury behind him. This is his year to come through. I still have confidence in Marvin.
Sheldon is the one that hurts MUCH more. He just doesn’t fit at all with what the Hawks were trying to accomplish. BK was sold a bill of goods on him. Now, I’m on record saying that I wanted to pick O’Bryant, who has been performing just as poorly, but at least he has that magic word - potential. If we weren’t taking O’Bryant, I wanted Roy, Foye or Marcus Williams. All of them could have addressed our backcourt needs for the rotation.
Sheldon is not an athletic big who gets up and down the court quickly, beating his man consistently. He is undersized, wing span included. He has a constant dazed look on his face when he’s out there. And if BK realy thinks that the future PF was going to be either Smith or Williams, why use the 5th pick on someone who is projected to be a back up in the foreseeable future? Just sad.
To me, May 22nd decides the future of this franchise. Without a top pick, every other team bottom dwelling team will be better off than us without some major wheeling and dealing, which isn’t in Billy’s make-up.
For those thinking Hibbert is a possible savior, I think you’re wrong. Another big, slow center who’s stats are impressive due to him being bigger than all his opponents at the college level. If the pros, I just don’t see him being a major factor. He doesn’t fit the way the Hawks have been built, unless we want to pair him with Sheldon in a half court offense setting and trash the athletic wing approach. Please let that not be the case.
By Todd
May 9, 2007 12:00 PM | Link to this
Can’t cry over spilt milk…if that was the case then we’d still be crying about Koncack over Karl Malone…bottom line is the team is what it is; and with the luck that the Hawks have they won’t have any draft picks this off-season and can watch the Suns build their team even more and the Pacers will somehow move into the top 10…but if not then the Hawks need to draft Acie Law…or package one of their many combo forwards and the 10th pick to move up and grab Mike Conley…If they get #1 get Oden, #2 get Durant, #3…trade down and get Conley…that would be the smart move…ok, ok I know it’s the Hawks but I can dream, right?
By cowa
May 9, 2007 12:04 PM | Link to this
Ken, with the #2 pick, it’s not even up for discussion. Durant or Oden whoever is available. EVERY team is looking to land one of those two players. Yes, a trade would have to come in the next year or so, but you don’t pass on him no matter what your roster looks like.
With the #3, it’s either Brandon Wright or Mike Conley, but I would much rather trade down. Wright has that beatiful word again - potential. He could be the real PF for years to come, but he’s not ready yet. He would not dramatically improve the team immediately. Conley is the player I want, but with the 11th pick, not the 3rd. Trade the pick.
By J. Shuttlesworth
May 9, 2007 12:05 PM | Link to this
What are the odds Marvin Williams is reading this right now and getting p** and motivated to prove that he’s still got a shot (which I think he does, albeit a long one) to be the gem of the draft?
I don’t know the guy, but from what I see and read, he’s probably sitting at home playing video games not caring and not paying attention to this chatter while he should be doing everything he can to get as nasty as he can for next year.
On a side note, if the Hawks picked Deng over Childress the previous year, is there any chance Billy would have taken Marvin over a PG in that draft?
Deron, Joe, Deng, Smoove, Zaza + another FA w/ Speedy’s money at center?? That team would still be playing ball right now.
By Anakin Joe
May 9, 2007 12:42 PM | Link to this
The only other factor in the selection of Marvin was Josh Smith. Did the team see something during Smith’s rookie year that made them feel like he may NOT be a foundational forward for this team? I recall there was dissentiona mongst the ranks of rookies/vets from the very beginning. i always viewed Marvin’s selection as an indictment on Smith’s future with the club. Of course, his on-court performance this past season has laid to rest most of those concerns (assuming he can play second fiddle to JJ next season).
Lastly, BK obviously prefers veteran PGs over rookies. Its not like he selected the wrong rookie PG, he has avoided them all. Ultimately, that is what should cost him his job, the failure to deliver a quality floor leader. I can even excuse the Shelden pick, since our interior defense was horrific and defensive-minded big men cost a lot of money. But refusing to deliver an on-court general is truly mind-boggling.
By Tyger
May 9, 2007 12:42 PM | Link to this
Useless diatribe, if we hadnt picked Marvin, we would’ve picked Bogut, enough said. Its a non-issue, and I still wouldnt pick a point guard that high not named Magic Johnson.
You can find a PG walking down Peachtree anyday of the week, thats not the problem. The problem is the doughnut in the middle and until thats properly addressed it wouldnt matter which Williams we have.
People act like the 2005 draft was the last coming of the PG, yet jump to 2006 and claim Foye and M. Williams were the answer too. Which is it? And wont 2007 reveal other good PGs as well?
We have a good pick at 11/12 and Mike Conley will be around and thats good value for that pick and we can end this useless discussion. But I’d still rather get two BIGs: Hibbert and Gasol or Jason Smith.
By Floze
May 9, 2007 12:47 PM | Link to this
The problem with Sheldon and Marvin is that Billy picked one on potential and the other on need. In 05, Marvin was the player with the most upside available at 2. I think everyone knew that Chris Paul and Deron Williams could come in here and make a difference earlier but Marvin was seen as a franchise-maker. Now it is a foregone conclusion that they both are all-stars but you can’t really fault Billy because he had a philosophy and stuck with it.
THEN - the very next year, he abandons that philosophy and drafts for need - a defensive banger to stop the tip drill around the hawks basket. We passed over Brandon Roy, Randy Foye, and Marcus Williams - all with better upside to draft Sheldon, the best option at 6 to give us that presence in the middle.
Until last year - I was on board with Billy and the BPA approach. However, by switching in mid-stream, we have missed out on a point guard we so desperately need two years in a row.
With the 11th pick we should take Law because Connelly won’t be there. If we get the third pick - then please let’s just get Connelly and be done with it!
By Dan
May 9, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this
good post, Sekou
This is kind of a tired topic, but one that is hard to get past. I can’t rip the team too much for drafting Marvin. I remember I was on the fence. I liked Deron Williams (saw him play a ton in college) and knew he would be good. Although, I thought it might be a mistake to pass on someone like Marvin. He has all the tools.
I get annoyed when teams feel like they HAVE to pick a player. I think that is the trap the Hawks fell into in ‘05. Everyone was telling them that Marvin was too good to pass on, so Billy Knight just drafted him and didn’t consider the need of a PG.
Still time for Marvin to improve. I think he will, but not sure he will be the superstar that people close to the Hawks think he will be.
I think Billy Knight’s weakest area is evaluating college talent. Last year’s draft was the greatest example of that. Sheldon Williams should have been no where near the #5 pick. I don’t know what the h#ll Knight was thinking.
By Dan
May 9, 2007 12:51 PM | Link to this
Tyger
The last PG we found “walking down Peachtree” was named Speedy Claxton. How did that work out?
I don’t think it is as easy to find someone at that position as you claim.
By Chris D'
May 9, 2007 1:00 PM | Link to this
“The last PG we found “walking down Peachtree” was named Speedy Claxton. How did that work out?”
I think he was limping down Peachtree Street.
FYI everyone left in the playoffs has dominate ball handlers. They do not have dominate centers.
By honest_abe
May 9, 2007 1:26 PM | Link to this
tyger somehow ends up being everyones whipping boy. heh
any truth to the rumor that nique convinced bk to take marvin? from all that i read, bk was infatuated with deron…
By Dale
May 9, 2007 1:32 PM | Link to this
Tyger= dumb-a**
7 out of the 8 remaining teams in the playoffs have all-star caliber pg’s.
We have Tyrone Lue and Craig Claxton. Billy found these guys out on Peachtree!
Secondly, Mike Conley Jr. is not at all ready for the NBA. This kid needs to stay in school I see bust written all over this guy.
Lastly, anybody, including Charles Barkley during the draft coverage could tell that Chris Paul was the best player in that draft. He fell victim to once again; that old “upside” issue. People were impressed with the 6’9” kid that could do everything except start for UNC.
Chris Paul dominated the ACC (toughest division in the Country) he has great court vision, is exciting, and has more heart then anybody. Passing him up for “potential” was a sin that the Hawks will pay for the next 10 years!!!
By LL Cool Scott
May 9, 2007 1:36 PM | Link to this
There are two crucial positions on a basketball team:
We have had 3 consecutive top 5 picks, and come away with not even one of those. Wingmen are a dime a dozen, 5 or more really good ones come out of college every year. What has Billy Knight stockpiled on this team? Wingmen.
By cp
May 9, 2007 1:48 PM | Link to this
For some reason the Hawks and Falcons seem to ignore players who say they want to play for them. People actually come out and say they want to play in ATL and for some reason we don’t draft or sign them. I was on the fence about Marvin but I have to admit I did not think that Derron Williams or Chris Paul would be that good. I saw them play a lot in college and thought they were alright players nothing special but they both are playing better on the NBA leven than they did on the college level in my opinion. The draft last year really hurt. I was hoping we would trade down the whole summer when it became known that the Hornets wanted to move up and was willing to part with JR Smith in the process. I thought we would be able to get both Marcus Williams and Sheldon Williams with those two Hornet picks since it was known that BK was taking Sheldon. To this day I still don’t know how you promise to take him that high without working him out or anything. That baffled me. I was hoping it was a smokescreen like other rumors that pop up during draft time but BK put all that to rest when he drafted him. Marcus Williams said on plenty of occasions that he wanted to play for the Hawks. He was the pg we needed yet BK blew it. I think this has to be the year we finally luck up and get the first pick, at least I pray we do. I just hope this summer goes better than the last.
By 206kid
May 9, 2007 1:54 PM | Link to this
Im not even sure how to respond to this outrageous account that you claim you would have taken Deron Williams at number 2 in stead of Marv. For starters you have to keep in mind that while Deron is playing extremely well his career averages (only two years young) are barely better than Marv’s and he plays a different role on a better team, point guard. Youre honestly going to tell me that if Marv had Carlos Boozer and Mehmet Okur in the post that he wouldnt knock down 6 to 7 jumpers a night as opposed to having to drive around Zaza and Lorenzen who just take up room under the hoop. Dont you worry though. I believe you all saw what kind of summer Marv had last year and I wouldnt second guess for a minute that he comes back this summer as good or even better than he did last year before he broke his hand. All I know that is it doesnt really matter who the Hawks draft because as long as he can pass left to right to either Joe or Marv and he can throw the alley-oop to Smoove the Hawks will be alright because none of the guys like to lose, especially not dudes who win championships @ North Carolina.
By Dan
May 9, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this
Chris D’
I think Speedy was walking with a fake limp. I still don’t believe that piece of crap was really hurt. He just signed the big contract and put his feet up. Screw him.
By cp
May 9, 2007 1:58 PM | Link to this
I didn’t even mention Josh Howard. I know people say hindsight is 20/20 but some of those players were no brainers. I remember reading about how Josh Howard was slipping in the draft and I said if he is there when we pick then it’s a no brainer. It was also said that BK liked Boris Diaw. I looked up Diaw numbers and I just knew he wouldnt take Diaw over Josh Howard but he did. I was so p** that night. Josh Howard over Diaw was a no brainer. I really hope BK gets it right this year if not it is time for him to go.
By honest_abe
May 9, 2007 2:00 PM | Link to this
lol 206kid you might have taken the cake as the dumbest poster in the history of this blog.
it is a million times harder to run a team than it is to sit around the wing and wait to shoot a jump shot.
i’m not saying marv is goign to be a complete bust, but don’t discount what deron is doing just because he has some decent players surrounding him.
By Dan
May 9, 2007 2:03 PM | Link to this
206kid
I’ve watched Marvin brick many of those jumpers you refer to. That guy disappears a lot from games. This year he usually started hot and then wasn’t heard from again.
I like Marvin, but I am not convinced he will be the stud the people close to the Hawks think he will be. He has moments, but at some point he has to do good things all the time. Not just for five minutes a game.
And, I will defend a lot of people on this blog. It sounds like hindsight when people say “we should have drafted Deron Williams” or “We should have drafted Paul”. It isn’t, though. Many on here felt Deron Williams or Paul was the better pick and said so right after Marvin was picked.
By Sekou K. Smith
May 9, 2007 2:16 PM | Link to this
Hey,
I’m not knocking Marvin at all. He very well could end up being the best player in his draft class (it’s taken talents like T-Mac, Jermaine O’Neal and even Kobe years to come into their own after entering the league as teenagers). And Marv’s worked his tail off to get better and improve his game.
All I said is that it’s hard to watch Deron Williams every night knowing that he could have been doing the same things for the Hawks. And 206 kid, I don’t think it’s all that outrageous to say I would have selected Deron Williams over Marv. Not at all.
By Orlando Rivera
May 9, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this
Sekou great post. Watching Deron Williams making plays for Jazz does make me almost sick to my stomach, until I realize one important thing: It wouldn’t have mattered which PG Atlanta selected as long as Woodson is coaching this team. In Utah’s offense he is able to run whereas he would’ve been stuck in an isolation offense under Woodson and not been able to flourish. I agree with your assessment that had Bogut had not been selected first by Milwaukee then Atlanta would’ve been considered foolish not to get him.
Don’t get me wrong, Marvin will be a stud in the NBA, hopefully while wearing a Hawks uniform. I’ve gotten to the point where I believe it wouldn’t matter who plays PG on the Hawks this team will never flourish with Woodson at the helm. He’s bent on making this team the Detroit Pistons with a roster that’s more like Golden State.
That being said, I don’t have faith in whomever BK drafts this year, it won’t matter. Getting that sinking feeling watching Deron Williams on the Jazz is akin to a guy seeing his suddenly smoking hot ex in another guy’s arms.
By Ryder
May 9, 2007 2:22 PM | Link to this
Orlando, while I wouldn’t go that far with the whole ex comment I do believe that this is the chance for the Hawks to finally complete the building process this offseason. I’m not too sold on Hibbert after watching him play at Georgetown here in DC this past season. He’s slow on the boards and relies too much on his height instead of his ability to score. However, if Conley is gone by the 11th pick then what other choice is left. That being said I fully expect Atlanta to pick Jason Smith, Aaron Gray or Joakim Noah.
By Anakin Joe
May 9, 2007 2:38 PM | Link to this
If we had taken Deron in the ‘05 draft, we still would have had a few dozen bloggers complaining about BK NOT taking Chris Paul. So many are interested in style over substance. Meanwhile, Chris Paul has played in how many more playoff games than Marvin?
By Anakin Joe
May 9, 2007 2:55 PM | Link to this
Ryder, I’ve seen comparisons made between Hibbert and Ilgauskas. I know Big Z doesn’t excite fans, but he has been an effective center for 10+ years. Plus, Hibbert is an outstanding passer (from what I saw during the tourney) and I am still hopeful that a Head Coach will someday recognize that this team is full of above average passers and install an offense that utlizes those skills (e.g. Princeton). Oh and Hibbert didn’t appear too robotic in the game against Oden. Much like Hakeem didn’t relish playing against Mark Eaton, I’m guessing Dwight Howard, Oden and Curry won’t be excited about banging Hibbert for the next 8+ years.
By David Letterman
May 9, 2007 3:26 PM | Link to this
Top Ten Better GM’s For the Hawks:
By GT80
May 9, 2007 3:56 PM | Link to this
Watching the playoffs, all of the teams left have something in common, with the exception of the Cavs, who have Lebron and the Bulls, who are about to get swept. They all have top flight PG’s. You can win in the NBA without the dominant center but you cannot win without the dominant PG or the dominant player that has the ball in his hands 70% of the time, i.e. Lebron, Dwanye Wade.
Yes, it’s sickening to watch these players that could have been Hawks being important players for other teams. Billy Knightmare needs to go.
By Wedgie Evans
May 9, 2007 4:07 PM | Link to this
I’m not too bent out of shape over the Hawks passing up Luol Deng for Josh Childress. Childress is still a valuable do-it-all player who probably complements Josh Smith better than Deng would. But even before the ‘05 draft, while other Hawks fans were singing the praises of Paul, I wanted the bigger, stronger, better defender Deron Williams. Even if Marvin becomes the best player in the 2005 draft, it’s not like the Hawks would have regretted taking Deron (or Paul for that matter). Hopefully this is the year the Hawks fix their mistakes of the past few years, by picking Mike Conley, Javaris Crittenton, or Acie Law.
By smartguy
May 9, 2007 4:14 PM | Link to this
Sekou, how about a more thorough examination. Derron Williams is just the patty in our burger of fear and loathing. Start with a foundation of Luol Deng, put D Williams as the meat, and Brandon Roy as the topper. Not only did the Hawks pass on these guys, but each was picked immediately after a Hawks selection. Maybe a kick in the A from the basketball gods, or maybe Billy Knight is a total moron.
We have had the #8, #2, and #5 selections in the past three years, and all we have to show are three role players. Deng, I mean darn.
Nonetheless, I must wholeheartedly agree with my boy Orlando: I really don’t think it would’ve mattered who we took because we still have a completely inept head coach.
By brian
May 9, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this
Marvin was the right pick with the number 2 pick. He can be an immense talk and All-Star for years to come assuming he was drafted by the right team to develop him. The Hawks are unfortunately not that team and stunted his growth because we had so many players at his position.
The Hawks needed a point guard and should have traded down a couple spots. I am not a big Deron Williams fan though I do appreciate his talent.
The man the Hawks missed out on was Chris Paul. Chris Paul can change the game and make everyone better. Paul also has the moxy to be a superstar. We would have been in the playoffs last year - Paul’s rookie year - if we had drafter Paul instead of Marvin.
We need a new GM.
By jitterbug
May 9, 2007 4:30 PM | Link to this
You know dat Shelden Williams is so slow and with that dumb face on all the time is either disinterested, overmatched, or suffering from some Brain Cramps….That was the worst selection since John ” Kontract “, BK ain’t even doing it his way no more…he put some stanky mess on his cheese cause them Whoppers smell more like my moms parrot DeFrancis than any thing you done seen. How’s about we not give teams first round selections that only guarantee we keep them if they are 1,2,or 3’s man. It sounds like the Hawks are cash pooa, and had to go to College Park and hit up T.J’s Pawn off Crescent for some rent money and gave away his key to the damn place man. You know where I’m at.
Jitttttttttterbug
By Anakin Joe
May 9, 2007 4:35 PM | Link to this
smartguy, so you’re saying that Roy would have been able to optimize his rookie season by playing PG or by coming off the bench? And after watching the most porous defense in NBA history last year, you would have been satisfied entering into the season with Lo Wright and Solomon “I Weigh 190 Pounds” Jones as the answer?
Roy was clearly the most ready rookie to contribute, but let’s not allow ourselves to believe he would have been the right fit for our team. Imagine the outcry had BK drafted another wing player. The team that should be most upset about not drafting Roy is Chicago. Their inability to match-up with Billups or Rip will cost them this series.
By Ryder
May 9, 2007 4:37 PM | Link to this
Anakin, I never said Hibbert was a bad passer and he did play for a coach that took advantage of his limitations. I do agree with you in the sense that he will do well on a team that knows how to move around and pass effectively. We all know that team is in Atlanta with the talent already here, too bad the stone age coach will never figure that out. Even a mummy would look fluid against Oden.
By **billy g**
May 9, 2007 4:49 PM | Link to this
I can honestly say that I wanted one of the two PG’s ahead of Marvin. Nothing against Marvin, I still think that he will be a fine player….some day.
You simply don’t pass up on a sure fire PG or Center, if given the chance. We had our chance and blew it.
I worry about the Hawks’ draft. If we land the first pick, I wonder whether Mr Knight would pick Oden. Something tells me that he would draft Durant. Once again, I have nothing against Durant, but you don’t pass up on a sure fire Center, if given the chance.
By jitterbug
May 9, 2007 4:51 PM | Link to this
What time is it? It’s time to show suckas we care bout these birds too. Man we got a terribul reputation for boing dem Falcons and Thrashers…yeah dey suck it but dese Hawks man I love em despites there BK drive thru manager. That Woodson is a good assistance Coach , but we need some proven strenth like a Jerry Sloan ( boring but good mos de time ), Don Nelson( get dem moving and outta half court games ) or my JV coach from the day Hilimus “Meatsauce” Harris. He scaret me so bad I nearly wet my pants before,during, and after games…man no more damn Thousand Dollar suit wearing 6’ tall Bob Weiss lookin accountant mamajama . Gets me some Meatsauce coaches , some guys that dem boys scared to come and see durint dose timeouts and T.v. breaks for commercials bout how dey can lower dere interest rates by calling 1 866 flash yo boobie…Let’s call dem out , People don’t know people luv der Hawks….but I love them, they are the fabrix of the city and Mayor Franklin needs to take some controls of this or it might crumbles completely just like the sewer in my friend Catfish’s front yard. Dat’s what its bout.
JIttererereeing
Jittterbugh
By AK-47
May 9, 2007 4:51 PM | Link to this
Tyger is Billy Knight’s username, don’t be fooled.
BK’s “philosophy” - whatever it is - has run my team into the ground. To have the Rookie of the Year picked immediately after your Top 5 pick 2 straight seasons - both in positions where we desperately need help - just shows that Tyger/BK is the most inept GM in all of professional sports. Perhaps in history.
I want Acie Law in this year’s draft. It sure would be nice to get a player you can actually get EXCITED about. Can’t remember the last pick that we could say that we couldn’t wait to see him take the floor.
Marvin has NO game. I have never seen him step it up and take over the way a #2 should. And yet we gave away Harrington for nothing just so Marvin could flop around on the floor every night.
My head hurts.
By AK-47
May 9, 2007 4:55 PM | Link to this
My last comment about getting Acie Law assumes we will not get the a Top 2 pick, of course. And with our luck, I am sure we won’t.
By jitterbugh
May 9, 2007 5:08 PM | Link to this
AK-47 my head hurs too , but I take sum of dat BC powter and hot damn Jesus, I’m a brand new man. Les do some comprehensive review for the next draft right now. I am callin it comprehensive but its just a few folks..I just tried that ESPN lottree imagination machine and these Hawks done landed the numba 2 spots and da numba 12 spots..U can thanks me later playa…. I belies dat with Hornets picing Greg Oden nubmer 1 wiht furst pick my Hawks , be coming back wit atrade b***…We package numpers 2 picka and get two more fur=st round picks from some other teams , now with the 12th picks I forget to turn my selections in before my alarm clocks go off. Damn! We forfeits de pick and are laughted at by all other teems even dem Damn Clippers and such.
Thanks and haev nice day
Your friendly neighboorhod BK were yu can have it youir way unless you be wanting picks dat maek cents…
SPnaks dat ladies and ladies
Jitterbug bust in yua
By me
May 9, 2007 5:16 PM | Link to this
It would not matter who they drafted, they would still would have just rotted with the Hawks. Long as the Atlanta stupid group owns them, the team is going no where.
By Nick
May 9, 2007 5:27 PM | Link to this
GET RID OF BK and WOODY.
These are two of the most clueless people on earth.
How in the world did they ever landed these jobs??!?!?!?!?!?!
They make stupid pick year after year. I’m just sick to my stomach.
By Braves Fan 79
May 9, 2007 6:06 PM | Link to this
I think the Hawks would be smart to take Crinnention with there 2nd tound pick……o wait we TRADED that pick for ANOTHER carrer backup pointguard…all in the name of getting meaningless wins to make BK look better. sadsad…owell like ive always said….Hawks r cursed for trading Nique! and i know my rockets are out of the playoffs…utah is just a well coached team and used to be my favorite team back in the malone stockton days.
By Edgar
May 9, 2007 6:53 PM | Link to this
what are the odds that Marvin Williams is the next Boris Diaw? As in he will continue to flounder until the hawks trade him to a decently coached squad where he will win comeback player of the year.
At least if BK trades Marvin it will appear that the Hawks are willing to take a chance to better the team. We need more than the draft alone. This team needs another proven veteran to compliment JJ and J-smoove. And that player needs to be a point guard or a big man. Unless we land the 1 or 2 pick, a trade must occur.
By mavid
May 9, 2007 7:22 PM | Link to this
Braves Fan 79, I would bet you any amount of money that Crittenton isnt available in the 2nd round. Sorry, not gonna happen.
By ray
May 9, 2007 8:33 PM | Link to this
Here’s some perspective for you…maybe. How about we’d have been better off either way with Felton, Paul, Deron, or Marcus. Any one of them. The question is, how much better off would we have been with the same coach?
Hell, we would have been better off with Rajon Rondo perhaps. MAYBE. The point is, the team would have had a young, healthy, talented pg to work with. And now we don’t. This has never been about Marvin Williams. We know who this is about: Billy Knight. ‘Nuff said.
Last blog topic got so twisted towards the second half of it. The Lone Ranger vs. the rest of the blog act is so pathetically tired. Same ol’ angry smart-a$$ accusing everybody else of having all sorts of problems because they disagree. Much like the Hawks bad luck: will it ever end?
So, uhhhhh…is the 22nd here yet?
By ray
May 9, 2007 8:35 PM | Link to this
I love how people use the ol’ proverb about “the grass seems greener on the other side.” With our Hawks, it’s not about the color of the grass. It’s about the fact that the “other side” actually has grass.
By doc
May 9, 2007 9:22 PM | Link to this
edgar, marvin to me has underperformed but only by a little but in comparison to paul and d. williams has uderperformed a lot. to say that is unfair but it is what it is. he has been a bit of a better pick than bogut as he has more upside to develop on to me.
to compare him to diaw is way off base and suggests you know little about what diaw didnt do here. diaw was 21 when he came to the hawks with international experience. he had plenty of minutes his first year at 25 a game then dropped to 19 a game his second year at the ripe age of 22. all that time he never averaged more than 4.8 pts a game and certainly didint show he was able to deal with assists avg less than 3 a game.
marvin is way above what diaw has done in his first two years. i still hope he comes back and gets to the level of say a bosh who had a similar path in college into the pros. time will tell but that is a low blow comparison but without any factual merit.
By Mike
May 9, 2007 10:39 PM | Link to this
Sekou I gotta give it to you come straight. Nobody has defended Marvin more than me. But watching DWilliams play makes you sick if you’re the Hawks. He’s got that swagger that you love in a PG. Not sure if would have flourished in Woodson system, he’s a helava PG. As good as DWilliams and CPaul is, there will be other PG’s.
Marvin is still my guy. I just think Marvin gets motivated every time he hears about DWilliams or CPaul. He may not never out shine those guys, but he’s got the potential to be an All Star one day.
Man I know Utah is causing GS match up problems, But I still want GS to win series. I just like how those guys go all out on both end of the floor. It will interesting to see what happens in GS.
By bravo papa
May 9, 2007 11:16 PM | Link to this
To all the folks who think Marvin Williams will be a NBA star stop dreaming. He doesn’t have the heart or work ethic. He was terribly out of shape the whole season. He has no NBA position. He is to slow to be a small forward ( Plus no handle). He is to weak to be a power foward. He is at best a role player. Billy as screwed up this Hawks roster beyond repair. The only player on the entire team worth keeping are Joe and Josh. Everybody else should be traded ASAP.
By Clyde
May 10, 2007 12:36 AM | Link to this
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY t-shirts are still available. e-mail me at atlconnect@hotmail.com.
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY
By Mark
May 10, 2007 1:14 AM | Link to this
I’m no expert, but it seems to me that the Hawks biggest problem is they do not play a style that fits their personnel. A good coach builds his plan around his players strengths, and Woodson refuses to do that. The Hawks have a bunch of 6’8” guys who are long and athletic. Why not run? Hire Rick Adelman, run the opposition out of the gym, score 120 a night and use your strengths. Or lose 50 games a year.
By Edo River
May 10, 2007 5:32 AM | Link to this
MR. Smith, this is your weakest blog, your look back at what might have been. Serves no useful purpose. Just because you feel this way, is not justification to write it. Some articles are better when they aren’t written.
Looking back serves no useful purpose. None, Nada, Zero. Self-indulgence (look up that word).
A kind of self-pity. No useful purpose, I know I said that already.
By doc
May 10, 2007 7:32 AM | Link to this
i see the get roll tide clyde to rio sale is still on.
clyde, are there off season prices on the t-shirts like on vacations to brazil?
deron williams is a step up guy. wow! good game last night. really good tight defense and very physical in a game that had the teams scoring plenty. does anyone think woody could coach this style of game or teams? i really hope he is learning from this and the other series going on in the western semis. teams can play good contesting d and still go over 100 points in a game.
it is really fun to watch 6’8” guys that can shoot (is this the missing link for the hawks?) and are given the green light to do so. that instead of the isolation or set up game of winding it down to the last 5 seconds before any movement is made on the offense as a form of defense. the type of style of defense that the hawks play reminds me of a football game where one team tries to hold onto the ball by a ground attack or ball possession to keep the score down.
it is fun to watch the little guy warriors trying to put a body on the bigger jazz, it doesnt work but at least they are doing it. the hawks could use a huge lesson there. boxout? what’s that?
By jitterbugh
May 10, 2007 9:15 AM | Link to this
Sekou I gots yo back, Deron WIlliams gots in some foul troubles earle on but den he bust a move like dat Young MC. Baron Davis looks like he play at some damn differun speeds than them others. That Russian is got some passing skills, I gots passing skills too but if youse sittin by me when I’ms passin then you be runnin away looking for some dat Lysol…I knew a gurl named Lysol I tink. Baside, the facks we got damn nice arenas and damn fine Hawg Dancas, I wants to see some good hoopin instead of some miss, miss, miss, miss, we slams it with Smoov or JJ buries da trips , dats right I lubs me some JJ and I luvs me sum berrying the bone..
Dont Hate a pLayahah
The jit jitti jit jit jit , Jit Unit
By roan st
May 10, 2007 9:16 AM | Link to this
Bravo Papa, I’m glad to see another fan who has the guts to call marvin out. I have been saying all year exactly what you pointed out. The guy is to slow to blow by defenders and to weak to man the post. Plus he doesn’t play very good defense either. Yet hawks fan keep referring to this vast potential that I just don’t see. At best he will turn out to be a good jump shooter and average 16 points a game. He was certainly not worth passing on those young point guards when we already had josh, josh, and harrington. If the ping pong balls don’t bounce our way on the 22nd we will be in the same sorry position next season.
By Jliu
May 10, 2007 9:39 AM | Link to this
We’ve been talking about the guys who could’ve been Hawks, but it makes me equally sick to think about all the guys who were Hawks. I saw it last season, and the season before that. It’s just a “hey, we used to have that guy…” - think about last year when your final four teams had Rasheed, Jason Terry, Gary Peyton, Diaw, etc. Now this year, you look and it’s the same - ex-Hawks everywhere.
I still chalk it up to the curse of ‘Nique, no matter how much the Hawks have tried to make that up to Nique by making him a part of their org. Just plain bad carma.
Which brings up another point - think about all the stout free agents that were available that we keep letting slip through our hands. The team is always “building for the future.” Trading Nique for Manning was considered building for the future, even though the Hawks were in first and Manning left the very next year. We could have had Shaq in this town before he went to Miami, but no, we passed up on him to build for the future. All this cap room, and no heads. Whatever happened to the “win now” mentality? Yes, 3 to 4 championships strung together is a great thing, but if you keep failing at that, then at least bring in the army and win one now -then, have your fire sale. If building a dynasty has been a failure, then go with the Marlin approach (they still have more championships than the Braves). One title can satisfy fans for at least half a decade.
By honest_abe
May 10, 2007 10:04 AM | Link to this
god i get so sick of people whining about ex hawks.
gary payton didn’t want to play here! he was going to retire before putting on a hawks uni. anyways he’s way over the hill, it’s not like the hawks missed out on him.
jt was expected to be the hawks best player. i’m sorry he’s a good 3rd or 4th option but he’s not a top tier talent. he cant’ be expected to LEAD a team to the playoffs.
you want’ to cry about missing stephen jackson? the people that say getting a guy like stephen jackson is worth the risk are just plain stupid. he was a decent guy in atlanta but he has one good playoff series and everyone’s ready to say that you need to take a serious gamble on character to advance in the nba. pshaw! seems like his stats have dipped now that he has a capable defender on him. jackson is an avg nba player at best and he was asking for too much money. his one year with the hawks was to pad the stats for his next pay day.
hmmm. lets see the hawks got rasheed for one game, to clear cap space.
diaw was a lazy, underperforming t**. i also blame woody for his lack of performance as he didn’t know how to utilize or maximize his skills.
so stop with this whole thing of being sick to the stomach by seeing ex hawks in the playoffs. it’s not like they were the sole difference in the team getting there. instead each ex hawk landed in a very promising situation. so get your facts straight.
By ray
May 10, 2007 10:07 AM | Link to this
Deron Williams is in his second year, in the second round of the playoffs. His playoff averages are 18ppg, 9apg, about 5rpg, and just over a steal per game. All that with an assist-to-turnover ratio very nearly identical to that of Chauncey Billups. What can you say about that? Yes, he’s in the right system and has the right coach. And yes he’s the right player. To use the coach and system as crutches is to say that Stockton was great for only the same reasons. This guy is very much the real deal. And like Paul, we could have had him.
Again, would he have flourished any under Woody? Maybe not as much, but better to have the chance with such a player than not at all.
I still say this isn’t about Marvin. It’s about Knight’s decisions, point blank. And that’s all. Besides, just how fair is it to compare players of completely different positions? Yeah, you can do it based on potential, which is a crap shoot. But when you need to fill a certain position rather badly, you gotta go with that position, not with “potential” that’s not even proven at the starter level in college. I mean, choosing a guy like Durant is more of a so-called “no-brainer” than a guy like Marvin. Durant started for his team and dominated like crazy. Marvin looked good and didn’t start. See the difference? Besides, the pgs in the draft Marvin was selected in had plenty of potential. And regardless of what they saw in Smith or whatever that made them want to go after Marvin…they already had Childress and added Donta Smith. Senselss….
However, on the subject of Marvin. For a variety of reasons, he’s not what we want him to be yet. We would have at least liked for him to give us what Al Harrington gave us. Why else draft him when you have Harrington? Maybe it’s too soon. At least anybody interested in defending him would say so. I say if he doesn’t break out some kind of way this coming season, he probably won’t ever. At least not on this team. Naw, I’m not saying he’s a bust. He is what he is. He’ll be what he’ll be. Being picked 2nd is not his fault at all. But I think we’d all like to see more from him. A nasty streak with even more aggression on the boards and going to the basket.
If we continue to stay with the kind of center we have now, we absolutely must get more production in defense and rebounding. Significantly more. Josh Smith has held up his end. Anybody else wanna step up?
Roan St, you maybe right about Marvin. I hope not, for the sake of Marvin and this team. But you may be right.
One last thing, and this has to do with Josh Smith. In order for him to play “second fiddle” he and JJ must both come to believe in the 1-2 punch concept. The whole idea behind this is that two punches are better than one for the purposes of a knockout. Anything needing a first shot should be hit with a second shot. Makes life so much harder on a defense. Sure, there’s an initial offensive (that being the first punch: JJ). But the change of pace, the other threat (Smith), the second punch…that’s what makes the threat real. Smith has to get over not being the absolute first option or initiator of the offense. But he has to be ready immediately to be the second option right behind the first. Because, you can’t run first option all night. Hell, not even for one whole quarter. Meanwhile, JJ has to get over the idea of someone else not being able to carry the load. He has to be ready to share it, and have some confidence in his teammates. He’s gotta have a running mate, and as of right now, Smith is it. He can do his thing and begin drawing the defense. Smith must learn to move well without the ball and he’ll receive it quite a lot. The simplest way is through pick and roll and back door cuts. It’ll help JJ’s assist totals and his health. It’ll help Smith’s jumper, shot selection, and overall production. It can happen. They should work on it over the summer and through camp.
Most importantly, it will vastly improve team chemistry. And that will help the rest of the team by giving them something to grab onto. This is something the players need to do. It can’t be left up to the coach.
By Jim C
May 10, 2007 11:22 AM | Link to this
The real question is…is Billy Knight familiar with the concept of trading down? Is the concept just beyond his grasp? Even if Marvin Williams was the consensus top 2 pick, if he doesn’t meet your needs and you have 3 guys right him on the board that you can use, why not trade down, get the PG and pick up a future draft pick that you can definitely use. Even more so with Shelden…just because you like the guy doesn’t mean you have to pick him at #5. Especially when no one else had him in the top 10, and especially when teams were jockeying to pick Roy.
By Clyde
May 10, 2007 11:26 AM | Link to this
Doc their 5 dollars off right now. I sold a couple at the Braves game last week.
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY
By smartguy
May 10, 2007 11:27 AM | Link to this
The best thing that would help team chemistry would be a new coach.
To the moron who said this blog serves no purpose: I’m sorry you work for a sorry group like the atlanta spirit. First, a vast majoruty of the junk on the net serves very little, or no, purpose. Second, examining the past mistakes of the same people who are still making those decisions is actually quite useful. Those who don’t learn from the past are doomed to repeat it. Keep up the good work Sekou.
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY!
By Boycott Basketball
May 10, 2007 11:55 AM | Link to this
What I don’t understand is, why are you idiot White people supporting this racist sport?! There are only 91 White players in the league. And until the Extortionist Rainbow/Push came along and strong armed them, the Boston Celtics were the only team to feature 4 white players onthe court at the same time. If White people stopped supporting the sport, and the owenrs gave up the franchise, maybe that would put an end to the thuggery. Attendance is down, season tickets and tv viewership is down-all because the participants are anti white. And you people are supporting this disgrace? Shame on you! Boycott Basketball. The hawks have not been good in nearly 2 decades. The sport is boring-it is a me,me, me thing. go support a sport where the participants THANK the fans and not HIT the fans.
By Mattt
May 10, 2007 11:57 AM | Link to this
Smartguy,
I see that you’re still too arrogant to accept that people can disagree with you without being a paid stooge. How pathetic.
By jm
May 10, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this
Sekou - While I still think Deron Williams would be a decent player if drafted by the Hawks (I thought Chris Paul was the better fit), he would not have developed the same with the Hawks. A big reason for Deron’s play this year is that he spent a good chunk of the off season getting schooled by John Stockton (who could probably still torch most point guards playing today). I wonder if Nique has spent any of his off season taking the Hawks group of swingmen to school (they could use it).
By Matt
May 10, 2007 12:32 PM | Link to this
Christ, was that Boycott post for real?
Hopefully we can all agree, regardless of our other opinions, that such posts have no place here.
By mike
May 10, 2007 12:38 PM | Link to this
Guys Dwilliams is a straight baller no denying that. But all the peoples wining about ex-Hawks is ridicules. Shaq would have retired before he cam to the Hawks. Your boy Belkin and the Spirit gave a mandate to whip the slate clean. The only reason Rasheed came to Atlanta was because the cap numbers fit. JT still lives in Atlanta, but do you think he miss playing for the Hawks get real.
Once Marvin and Salim go to another team we’ll be just like Chicago. They gave up on Tyson Chandler and Eddie Curry. Those guys were still developing. They spent 60 mil on Ben. They could have sign both those guys for that cash and had to legit Bigs for the foreseeable further. It’s ridicules to try to judge these guys early in there development. Stackhouse was suppose to be the next MJ when he came out NC. Rasheed was considered a bust when the Wizard traded him to Portland.
It’s easy to judge these guys in Woodson system and make the assumption that they are under performer. I guess some people forget that Al wasn’t a shoot blocker either. Belkin and the Spirit had no intention on resigning Al. I’m happy for Al he was a stand up guy when he was hear. With all the misery we’ve endured the Hawks have a chance for redemption. If you checkout some of the on-line sources you’ll see that all three of the young guns are very highly regarded in terms of trade value. Yes that includes Marvin. Everyone agrees that JJ and Jsmoove are the pieces to you build around; heck they even gave Zaza decent plug.
This year is different the Spirit got Billy on lockdown. Thanks to Sekou they know we are watching their A*. They know every Hawks fans are monitoring this year draft. What ever it takes draft or trade they have fill these holes in the team. After the ping-pong balls falls, then we can start all over again.
I don’t blame anyone for being upset about us not drafting Dwilliams or Cpaul. Those are the best two young PG’s to come out the draft in a while. I respect everyone opinion. Guys remember we all need to believe we’re going to get those two picks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By cp
May 10, 2007 2:06 PM | Link to this
I like Marvin but I can’t say how good he will end up being. He might be great he might be average who knows. I think what happens sometimes is that some gm’s get caught up wit verticals and all that other crap they do before the draft. I think Marvin worked out alone when he tried out for the Hawks thus the team falling in love with his jumpshot and not seeing if he could move his feet to defend and etc. Im not saying that getting players to go against others at their position will help but I think they would have seen that Marvin wasn’t much of a defender and he isnt as athletic as they thought. It’s easy to sit in the gym alone and put up jumpers especially since he has a nice form. I really hope he works out because if he doesn’t he will be reminded his whole career of how he should have been taken lower. I hope we get 2 pics this year but I just have no faith in BK. I have a feeling that if we did get lucky (god knows we are due) and get the first pick that BK will be fired shortly after Oden is selected but thats just how i feel.
By Send Money
May 10, 2007 6:39 PM | Link to this
Sekou What a load of self serving bs.Where’s the article you wrote stating your objection at taking Marvin over Deron ? So every other team would have taken Bogot and Marvin but you in your wisdom would not have.Few things are cheaper than taking credit based on a lie.So if you made a public statement prior to the draft prove it, if not be a man and shutup.That goes for the rest of you posers too.
By hawks r cursed for trading nique
May 11, 2007 6:54 AM | Link to this
The curse of the hawks lives on….sending nique to dismal clipper land doomed this franchise. And i kinda agree with the boycott basketball guy…while im a big time basketball lover all the me me me attitude gets old and the “thugary” u know what would happen in baseball if after u hit a homerun u pulled your shirt to the side and showed your nipple?? ud get hit with a 90 mph fastball in the head. Now thats a mans sport that actually takes skill to play and dosent rely on a bunch of hyped up players like lebron that have never proven anything. And unlike the hawks….im a diehard fan of my teams and loyal to my players. Go Braves. And even thou Houston lost a tough series to utah….go Rockets. And man i hope crinnenton comes back to Tech…..young i could care less about i think thed be better off without him anyways. Unless the hawks somehow land Oden or Durant….i predict thell suck at least another 4 or 5 years.
By Spencer
May 11, 2007 10:31 AM | Link to this
I was going to write this long drawn out comment, but I have two names that created the Hawks curse. Wilkins and Manning. Nothing good can come after that travesty.
By ray
May 11, 2007 10:41 AM | Link to this
Send Money, so how long have you been around here exactly? Dig in the archives and you will see the opinionated contributions of many members of this blog.
As for why there’s no article making an exact statement as to Marvin being picked over Deron, man I can’t believe you’re so stupid as to not understand…but I guess you are. Oh well, every village has to have an idiot, I guess.
Now go back to living under the bridge that you chase billy goats away from…troll.
By smartguy
May 11, 2007 12:07 PM | Link to this
Where is the love? Maybe would could start being a little more respectful to each other?
Is it possible to show your disagreement by a substantive argument rather than personal attacks?
By LL Cool Scott
May 11, 2007 2:30 PM | Link to this
ANAKIN JOE AND TYGER
Are you guys for real? Are you now, or have you ever been members of the Communist Par…err, I mean…the Knight Family?
Seriously, you’re distant cousins, right?
By Anakin Joe
May 11, 2007 2:50 PM | Link to this
LL Cool Scott, what are you referring to? What “pro-BK” thing did I say?
By LL Cool Scott
May 11, 2007 3:17 PM | Link to this
this: “If we had taken Deron in the ‘05 draft, we still would have had a few dozen bloggers complaining about BK NOT taking Chris Paul. So many are interested in style over substance. Meanwhile, Chris Paul has played in how many more playoff games than Marvin?”
You really think Marvin Williams is half the player Chris Paul is?
By Neil
May 11, 2007 3:55 PM | Link to this
Please someone tell me…..Why was Marvin Williams considered to be so great if he didn’t even start at UNC why wasn’t the guy that started in front of him drafted higher..!!!???!!! Doesn’t make sense to me
By neil
May 11, 2007 4:01 PM | Link to this
If we get the second or third pick we have to get the best big man available and I mean 7’ or taller. Hibbert might not fit the scheme of the Hawks but at least we would finally have a bruiser in the middle that opposing centers won’t be able to walk over. And then pick conley or law at 11. That would be a successful draft……..but oh yeah I guess I am dreaming…..Billy (IDIOT) Knight is picking and will pick another guy who is 6’9”. I tell you what if he does I am done with the Hawks till they get another GM!!!!!!!!!!!
By Anakin Joe
May 11, 2007 4:31 PM | Link to this
LL Cool Scott, I think Paul is a more impactful player than Marvin after 2 seasons. But much like a QB is ultimately judged by wins/losses, so is a PG. So I don’t get nearly as excited about Paul as most fans do because he hasn’t shown that he can get his team to the post-season. I recognize all the reasons over his first 2 seasons. But the whole point of drafting players is for the team to win. If Paul averages 30 and 12 next season and doesn’t make the playoffs, while Marvin goes for 12/4 and we miraculously get in, then I’ll be the first to say that Marvin was a better pick for this team. It’s not about All-Star status or highlights, its about the post-season. And until one of them gets in, neither are worth the debate.
(And by the way, I was pro-Deron before the draft because I thought Paul was too small and I like PGs who aren’t fragile).
By MarkT
May 11, 2007 4:41 PM | Link to this
I am not a Hawks fan but I feel your pain. It was blindingly obvious to me that Deron Williams was the best pg in the 05 draft and the second coming of JKidd. He had an NBA-ready body and mind. You got half of one with Marvin. And Sheldon, eek, Josh Boone at 22 puts up better numbers per 48 minutes. However, luck is with you - the draft is rich in 4’s and 5s and you can sign Chauncey Billups to make your team grow up. If management screws it up, they should be run out of town on a rail.
By Neil
May 11, 2007 5:07 PM | Link to this
I just wanted to say one more thing: **BILLY KNIGHT IS AN IDIOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By doc
May 11, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this
aj, i’ll second that motion about paul as you have read my similar statements in the past as well. until he gets his team as far as deron does then he will be suspect. i have also said he might have the individual talent to get a team into the mediocre range where they suffer continuosly due to poor position in the draft but unable to get them all the way. they went out and spent last year to bring in some credible talent around him and didnt see the results. i know that team also had a lot of injuries but they werent able to come back down the stretch like the warriors did to will themselves into the playoffs against a much easier schedule. i agree the court is still out on him.
By Clyde
May 11, 2007 6:10 PM | Link to this
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY
By honest_abe
May 11, 2007 10:33 PM | Link to this
wow 70 1st half points. amazing!
By Send Money,
May 11, 2007 11:49 PM | Link to this
Ray just admit you love Sekou and you’ll start the healing process.I’m sorry if daddy didn’t love you but it’s not to late,just admit it ! say it !! you love Sekou!! is that so wrong ?.
By CJ
May 12, 2007 3:54 AM | Link to this
You guys can talk all you want but all BK is going to do is draft another foward or tweener. Only thing preventing that is a top pick. He’s done it every summer, what makes this one different esp when they are “almost in the playoffs”.
By ray
May 12, 2007 5:31 AM | Link to this
Send Money, you proved my point. Again.
Baron Davis is a baaaaaaaad man. And if Amare Stoudamire thinks the Spurs are “dirty” it’s a good thing he didn’t play back in the ’90s. The Pistons teams would have really ruffled his feathers. Or even the ol’ Stockton and Malone Jazz teams. Toughen up young fella, the road ahead is long.
By doc
May 12, 2007 7:23 AM | Link to this
i think i sad earlier in the week that amare looked tentative (scared) as he went to the basket, like he had a few bad memories. none other than, mr. a j disputed it with his “35 pts a game avg 2 yrs ago”. well i think they have gotten in his head. nash said after game one they had to play tougher, who do you think he was talking about? at some point when they ask “where’s the beef?” on the front line of the suns, amare is going to have to stand up and say it is me. remember this issue for amare goes waaaay back to even the year that nash came back and they moved amare to the post. he initially didnt want it but came around to it after they started so strong. again, i will say if amare doesnt bring the beef this series the suns are dead as they really dont have someone to do the dirty work. they should have gotten someone for that role before the trade deadline if they wanted the trophy is my sad notion as one of their fans.
By mike
May 12, 2007 9:20 AM | Link to this
Can anyone tell me what Billy Knight has accomplished as a GM? Anyone, Anyone. It starts with a V. Voodoo, Vodoo budget control. Can anyone tell me Billy Knight’s thinking when it is comes to draft picks? Anyone, Anyone
By Ali
May 12, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this
Why did BK pass on Brandon Roy in the 2006 draft?
By Al
May 12, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this
Marvin Williams is not legit the only reason he came out so early was because his stock was high
By Clyde
May 12, 2007 1:45 PM | Link to this
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY T-SHIRTS ARE STILL AVAILABLE. E-MAIL ME AT ATLCONNECT@HOTMAIL.COM
FIRE BILLY AND WOODY
By Mike
May 12, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this
Well I guess there are two mikes on the scene now, but anyway this Mike is checking out for a while. Got some serious medical issues to take care of. Hopefully tomorrow will ease the pain a little. I still think this the best blog in the AJC.
GO SEKOU, GO DRAFT, AND GO HAWKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
By ray
May 12, 2007 11:05 PM | Link to this
Mike, hope the medical issues are resolved for you as quickly, effectively, and painlessly as possible. Get well, dude.
Doc, you said it. The only way he’s going to be and stay an elite player, let alone an elite post player, is to play hard against the best. That would be Tim Duncan. Tim is ahead of the game because he knows his own as well as his opponent’s strengths and weaknesses. No one else in the Sun’s lineup will be able to come as close to dealing with Duncan on either end as Stoudamire could. You learn from the best by trying to beat the best. We’ll see what happens.
By doc
May 12, 2007 11:10 PM | Link to this
come back strong mike.
gd 33 and 19. the guy is a stud. loved it when he slammed and hung on the rim for emphasis.
By A Thinking Fan
May 13, 2007 5:30 AM | Link to this
Love it or hate it the SPURS are applying the “JORDAN RULES” to Steve Nash. Small guards get beat-up come playoff time, big guards rule!
By mike
May 13, 2007 9:41 AM | Link to this
Why does our GM not address the fan base, tackle serious questions head on. I just dont understand ownerships constant support of a performance that seperates and divides the fan base or paying customer if you will from support of the franchise. I recently stumbled onto a radio interview with Bernie Mullin and I was floored at his constant excuses for Billy Knights performance. I just dont get it. Why does this GM not speak? Can someone help me out here.
By doc
May 13, 2007 10:18 AM | Link to this
well ray, it is an interesting phenomena that they used kurt thomas more last night than they have all season. if there is a criticism it is that they havent prepared more for the inevitable of playing a team that can put big guys on the floor that can still play bball. that of course hinges on the fact that they have t. d. in their line-up. he is the best big time player since bill russell. he quietly goes about business in the regular season at a very high level only to escalate it even further when the playoffs start. he also does it in the context of the team game another way that russell did it. i like the suns but really respect how the spurs go after it.
can anyone see how robert horry is still playing at this level as well? it seems he has been playing bball at the premeire level forever.
By smartguy
May 13, 2007 11:29 AM | Link to this
Horry is awesome. Made the playoffs in all 15 seasons! I doubt that will ever happen again. Six rings with three different teams. Best clutch shooter ever. Awesome.
By St. Bernard
May 13, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this
Think it’s time for a new blog?
By ray
May 14, 2007 5:29 AM | Link to this
St. Bernard, yeah proabably. But that would bring us back to the issue of our Hawks team, and that’s just too stagnant of an issue until May 22nd. And then we can commiserate over the results of the ping pong derby right up ‘til the draft, LOL!
Doc, good point. Only they should have more in their stable than just Kurt Thomas. You can rely solely on this style of play, no matter how wonderful it is. In the Suns’ case, I’d stop trying to prove a point with this style and worry about doing anything it takes to win. That would include being prepared to tweak or differentiate somewhat from what they’ve been doing all year if that is what it takes. Like you, I like this team and have to respect what the Spurs bring as well.
Chicago might win one more, but looks to me like Detroit is on a mission.
Wow. Good coaching and balanced contributions may actually win out in the Jazz/Warriors series. But it ain’t over just yet.
By Anakin Joe
May 14, 2007 10:31 AM | Link to this
Good exchange, Doc & Ray. I’m thrilled to see Duncan healthy again. Same for Boozer and Baron. It just shows how much talent there is in this league and too often, we forget about how incredible some of these players are, especialy when they often fight injuries.
Suns will definitely need to make a run at a true big during the off-season. Maybe Haywood would work with that team. They just need a big body who can keep the ball moving on offense and serve as an obstacle on defense.
By The Flash
May 14, 2007 1:12 PM | Link to this
The draft picks is one thing, but these are oh so unforgiveable:
Blake and Dixon could have been had for a song. Blake would be a terrific point for this or any other team. Dixon as a backup scorer has it all over Lue, plus … .
Harrington should have been traded once the decision not to resign him was made, which probably was when MW was drafted. I do not what happened to the Man hereabouts, as in the Andoman, but noone who watched the playoffs can forget the guy screaming for months, ney years on end, about doing a deal that brought NeNe here. Sounds like an incredible winner of a move to me.
Then there was the signing of Speedy.
Roy was definitely the man to pick last year, no ifs, ands or buts. If you had Blake distributing and running until you could get someone better, Blake, Roy, JJ, NeNe, and ZaZa or Sheldon, with Chill, Dixon, JSmooth on deck. You pick up Hibbert, and move Dixon and JSmooth, and get you a flash point, and give me a coach with some offensive concepts, and we are charging.
Oh, we haven’t begun to talk about the give-away picks yet, but I don’t want to rile up doc; he and I been gettin along lately.
By dale in newnan
May 16, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this
hawks suck. who cares anymore.
By Bertie
May 22, 2007 11:44 AM | Link to this
Hindsight is 20/20 but I agree with you 100% that at that point a PG should have been picked because of the roster at the time. MW might end up being a great player but unless you traded Al for a PG that same day you had to pick a PG. If the Bucks had picked MW then picking Bogut would have been acceptable because your roster needed a center eventhough the PGs in the draft have performed better in their first 2 years in the league. Lets hope for the ping pong balls to finally fall our way and get the 1st and 11th picks. On the other hand, I might not mind not getting any picks with current management’s track record that we complete the JJ trade this year and have Indiana’s 1st pick next year. I don’t know if I can survive another screwed up draft.