Hawks

By Wedgie Evans

April 27, 2007 2:26 AM | Link to this

Considering the level of fan interest in the perennial playoff contenders over at Turner Field (or lack thereof), I wouldn’t be so quick to assume that Philips Arena can sustain the same playoff atmosphere you see in Phoenix, San Antonio, or even Orlando.

Also, is there anyone Tyronn Lue is not tight with? Seems like with the number of teams he has played for, he must know pretty much everyone in the league by now.

By bleeder

April 27, 2007 3:53 AM | Link to this

This organization is like a wound that won’t close. Woody says its a marathon, and the fact that some guys were hurt, added to a 3 win improvement, is supposed to be enough? No Way. Not good enough Woody. Even Woody himself likes to talk about how his staff has come up way short, but when his job security becomes a factor, all of a sudden the excuses start flying.

Small improvements simply are not good enough. This is the NBA, not road running (and certainly not a marathon). What does Woody want? Another five or ten years to prove his shortcomings? No thanks. I have a fantasy of the Hawks making the playoffs before Josh Smith turns 30. That will not happen under the current circumstances.

I will say that I was overwhelmingly relieved to hear that a final decision has not been made on the future of our head coach. But why do they need to wait until the lottery is decided to make a decision on the quality of the head coach?? Are they packaging Billy and Woody together? I don’t care for either, but when it comes to the reality of winning individual games the head coach has much more influence and control than the GM.

Atlanta is dying for the Hawks to be worthwhile. Put a competitive Hawks team in the playoffs, and the fans would show up in droves; Phillips Arena would undoubtedly be rockin.

The problem is: while I can defintely picture a playoff scene at Phillips, I cannot even fathom it with Mike Woodson as head coach. Please Spirit, PLEASE.

By billy

April 27, 2007 5:21 AM | Link to this

CUT OR TRADE MIKE VICK.

I can’t believe I’m writing this, but this guy has too many question marks. He’s due in court soon. He’s got a fake water bottle something or other. He’s making obscene jestures. He’s got drugs in his cars, drugs on his properties, drugs everywhere. He’s running a dog fighting ring (what the heck??!!) Doesn’t this guy make enough money where it would just be easier to give his cousin (or whomever) $10,000 instead of letting him run a dog fighting business. And don’t tell me he didn’t know. 1. If he didn’t, ignorance is no excuse and 2. I’m quite sure he knew.

I dont care about his potential. I dont care about his contract. I care that this guy is the face of the Falcons and this face isn’t looking so good.

Trade him or cut him loose. Maybe the Raiders will take Vick straight up for the first pick.

By Trillness

April 27, 2007 6:36 AM | Link to this

I thought this was a basketball blog.

By doc

April 27, 2007 6:54 AM | Link to this

billy. we talk about many things here but that is a cut and paste from 8:38 yesterday with a similar comment 8:41.

you said your piece that’s fine, spare us repetition on contrived stuff like that. we are left to ask if you cant believe it once then why a second time and are you in such little control as you have to continue the same stuff? not your a game there dude.

By Dan

April 27, 2007 8:35 AM | Link to this

Sekou

Good post. Cool you get to go to the games in Orlando.

I went to the Thrahsers 1st game against the Rangers in the playoffs. Even with hockey, which is a sport I do not watch very often, you can feel the difference in the playoffs vs the regular season. I was sitting at that game just trying to picture the Hawks playing in that kind of environment. I couldn’t…….that team in the playoffs is almost beyond my wildest dreams. This year just did a number on any positive feel I have for that team.

By Knock-Knock

April 27, 2007 8:56 AM | Link to this

Just as heavy smokers should avoid long flights, so should NBA’ers seeking the playoffs avoid the Hawks. Hawks are in the running for worst franchise of all time and it ain’t going to improve anytime soon. Hawks and Spirit are an absolute joke.

By Medium-Size Sexy

April 27, 2007 9:10 AM | Link to this

Great column, Scoop.

But you forgot to mention who you hung out with at the after party!

By Anakin Joe

April 27, 2007 9:22 AM | Link to this

Just heard Bernie Mullen on 680 The Fan (Bernie is BK’s boss). Highlights included:

He will NOT recommend that BK be fired to the owners.

He has advised BK NOT to spend much time with the local media and that Bernie will play that role.

Sekou Smith is one of very few media people BK will spend time with.

BK is responsible for delivering a PG and C during the off-season.

Marvin will have a breakout year and Childress is the most desired player by other GMs.

The owners wil ultimately decide the fate of Woody and BK.

By honest_abe

April 27, 2007 9:45 AM | Link to this

i’m starting to see that bernie is more of an operational guy in terms of the day to day operations, phillips arena, etc.. i don’t think he has the same kind of responsibilities that larry bird has for the indiana pacers and other nba presidents around the league.

aj: how bad was that golf analogy? i can kind of see his logic. but if the instructor’s swing is flawed, no matter how much you practice you won’t see improvement.

as bad as things look for the hawks i think bernie had a point when he said the hawks have a stable of young talent. now all they need is a coach who knows what he is doing.

By Pitiful

April 27, 2007 9:51 AM | Link to this

The Spirit LLC need a serious lesson in PR. Nobody should speak on major issues until official consensus has been reached. These guys look like “2 guys in a garage” ownership.

Arthur Blank has made his share of mistakes with the Falcons but he also has been quick to repair those mistakes. The Spirit LLC keeps making mistakes upon mistakes but will never fess up to any nor make any changes to correct them. Colleges should be taking notes on this ownership group in order to teach students with sports majors how NOT to run a team.

BK would be out of work if not for the Hawks and Woodson wouldn’t be a head coach. They should thank their lucky stars that bozos like the Spirit LLC exist to keep them over-employed.

By Anakin Joe

April 27, 2007 10:00 AM | Link to this

Abe, I had to finish my cup of coffee before I could understand the golf swing analogy. And yeah, it was pretty stupid. At least they allowed some tough questions to be asked of Bernie, “what more does BK have to do to get fired?” I still say that if BK or Woody resigned tomorrow to go and rent water sports equipment on a Caribbean island, that the owners wouldn’t be able to unite to choose a replacement. And I did appreciate his owning up to the fact that he has advised BK to stay away from most of the media. And I did agree with his assessment that he’d rather have a GM who can construct a team than a media darling. Too bad we have neither.

By billy

April 27, 2007 10:14 AM | Link to this

Sorry, guys/gals. No Falcons blog to post on. Copied/pasted here because new blog came up right after I posted.

Just saying my piece. Hope that’s OK around here. We all love ATL sports. I just think Vick has too many question marks and he needs to either get his act together (apparently incapable of that) or go.

By mountain_jim

April 27, 2007 11:13 AM | Link to this

Save it billy. I came in here to get away from all that **.

Now, concerning the Hawks ** - when is the darn judge going to rule on the case between the owners? Because unless or until that’s resolved, we are not going to see anybody in Hawksland fired or hired. No one any good would come into this unsettled situation for seemingly clueless owners who may not even be ownsers much longer.

Funny, but assuming that is resolved in the Spirit’s favor, the ping-pong balls this draft may determine BK’s future fate. No picks (pretty small chance but Hawks draft luck is legendarily bad) and BK’s gone I bet.

Next year determines Woody’s fate.

mj

By honest_abe

April 27, 2007 11:37 AM | Link to this

mj: from what bernie said this morning i don’t think so. he said they don’t want diff philosophies on how to build a team, so he’s not in favor of changing gm’s. instead he wants to continue on this path and he’s pretty sure the owners agree with him.

said bk trusts sekou, i wonder who he doesnt’ trust.. could it be mr. bradley? heh

By LL Cool Scott

April 27, 2007 12:06 PM | Link to this

I can see why they wouldn’t want to change philosophies on how to build a team. This current one is working tremendously well. A mythological roster of versatile 6’9 players (with magical powers). You’re doing a great job, Billy Knight. Don’t let the laughter and mocking get you down. Stay in your safe little media-free hole and keep drafting swingmen, please.

By Anakin Joe

April 27, 2007 12:41 PM | Link to this

LL Cool Scott, my sense from the interview with Bernie is that BK has one more season to show and prove. Berne indicated we would make every effort to “complete” the team by securing a PG and C. I think the BK-experiment gets one more season, which coincidentally suggests that once the ownership fiasco is complete, there could be more severe consequences for performance. Abe, did you also hear Bernie allude to a “1 more year” ultimatum, or am I just listening wishfully?

Of course, no decent GM would come in now with ownership rights up for grabs. So I’m not sure this is new news, that nothing will truly change for another year.

By MsDee

April 27, 2007 12:49 PM | Link to this

I say since the Spirit cant hire a new coach til the ownership gets settled, why wont they just let Larry Drew take over for next season..if he cant get the job done, hopefully by that time, the Hawks would have AN owner and can therefore hire a decent coach.

By ray

April 27, 2007 12:52 PM | Link to this

Philosophy? What philosophy? The one that says you can win by playing half court ball with full-court players, an apparently ineffective head coach, pg by committee (whoever’s not injured plays), backup centers who don’t defend adequately, and a bunch of young swingmen who have no chemistry together? Oh that philosophy…

On the subject of Jarrett Jack, I don’t see why we shouldn’t go after a guy like him if we can’t draft a good solid pg. If we have better luck getting a good big in the draft, then you go for the pg via free agency or trade. No, Jack isn’t elite, at least not yet. He’s only been in the pros one year guys! But he played and started in 79 games and posted respectable numbers. Those who say his numbers are nothing to look at must remember a couple of things: he’s on a very young team that had little cohesion and direction. They were a bunch of talented individuals. A point guard’s stats and effectiveness have as much to do with his teammates abilities as they do with his own. Jack is sizeable, strong, and Solid. Solid is all we need. While there are obviously some possibilities in the draft, we already know the beginnings of what Jack can do. A rookie pg on a very young team in the West puts up 12 points and 5 assists per game. Not bad stuff.

I’m not saying that this is the answer and Jack is our savior. I’m saying looking at the total picture from our limited point of view, this deserves some consideration. And who knows, a multi- player deal could gain us some other usable assets. You never know.

This definitely rates some consideration when you think about the possibility of us not getting a draft pick at all. And while a Bibby or Billups just about has to make us better, I don’t see either guy having enough motivation to do so. Chauncey’s Pistons are doing well right now. They’re going to get some rest before facing their second round opponent. Bibby would probably rather go to a winning organization at this stage in his career. Or at least one that’s much closer to playing .500 ball than we are.

By ray

April 27, 2007 12:53 PM | Link to this

Ooops, didn’t mean to say Jack was a rook, he’s a second year guy.

By Anakin Joe

April 27, 2007 1:02 PM | Link to this

Ray, I’m not defending BK, just paraphrasing what his boss (Bernie) said. And actually, he didn’t talk about a philosophy as much as the type of player BK likes (which might be part of the problem… scheme vs. personnel). Anyway, he only mentiion BK’s desire to have a roster of long, versatile players. He even defined long during the interview… wingspan greater than their height, so they play longer than their actual height. And versatile was defined as being able to play/defend multiple positions. Again, no information about how those physical characteristics are supposed to translate on the court.

By hooligan

April 27, 2007 1:07 PM | Link to this

Small point, I know, but people here seem to forget that BK hasn’t drafted or signed a swingman since JJ two years ago. Last year’s draft and FA market was horrible in general, and especially horrible at PG and C. Speedy was the best PG on the market last year besides JT, who had no intention of leaving Dallas (he signed a contract with them on the first day he was eligible to). So I have no reason to believe that BK won’t do everything he can to get us a good PG and C this offseason.

By F A Skippy

April 27, 2007 1:39 PM | Link to this

Ray let me make a point about Jack I tried to make last night.When I wrote that with Jack and JJ we would have an elite backcourt I’m not calling Jack an elite player (yet) My point is they should make one of the top one, two, combos in the league.How many teams have two elite guards ? These two should bring 40 points 11 rebounds 11 assist on average with size and full court, half court play.

By doc

April 27, 2007 1:53 PM | Link to this

billy, if we wanted that kind of stuff we would be at the falcon blog. we arent and you arent, you aired it out one time so that is it. you can vent a bit, most of us do it a lot on many things but we try to hold the irrelevant rants down. your mea culpa accepted. i think it is funny you come from the falcon blog to rant here where you can really let loose on the other one. lets also pray we dont come to the likes of the other blog though we do go off here occasionally. lets drop it, know you are frustrated to see someone with such talent throwing it away. his gm wasnt willing to throw him under the bus yesterday on 680, maybe we shouldnt either. i’d just as soon let him talk on the field. it does seem that he is begininig to wake up by his recent comments that family are doing him in. maybe telfair can learn a bit from it as well as many others. posse’s are good for the street however at mil’s a year you can hire better protection than that. all these guys need to look to is mike tyson to see where faith misplaced hurts and it hurts to continue to do the same thing over and over.

aj, missed the start of the interview but it seems that i heard most of it except the golf analogy. mullin really does have bk’s back and it is healthy to hear him saying it. it seems he is also stating up front what to expect from the hawks in regards to press contacts and releases as roles are now defined. bk doesnt have the skills to manage media and that should be accepted and we need to move on. the broken atlanta spirit need to also note that communication of their goals is very important to what is the investor, its fans and do a better job of it if it wants street cred around here. the gm for the thrashers can handle it. overall it was a refreshing interview from what i heard. rude’s line at the end was classic as he ended it by saying “and now next up on the line is jerry west”. the pause by mullin was classic, they got him. good interview.

want to stress he also gave a huge amount of cred to our guy sekou who bk “will talk to all day” and the only one in the media. yes, it is a huge pat on the back for our guy sekou who we like a lot; it suggests that sekou is honest and fair as well it also shows the tenuous relationship journalists have with the people in the know. sekou i know it is a tough thing to balance, continue to enjoy your work and your interactions here at the liars table.

By The Flash

April 27, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this

Always liked Jack. Didn’t Portland let two other young points go (I always really liked Blake as well; he should have been here for a song two years agos, along with Dixon, but that is another issue). Why would Portland let Jack go now?

Dowdell seems to have a lot of Jack in him (Jack impressed me terribly as a leader/winner) with a better offensive arsenal.

I’d take a Jack/JJ, or Dowdell/JJ backcourt anyday. Both Jack and Dowdell have the size and athletism that could make the overall size of the team on the court impressive, and both play the game with respect for what it can be.

I am not a fan of adding any player at the point whose style is more egocentric no matter how good; not saying Conley is like that, but he well might be. And, the injury thing is nothing to sneeze at.

From what Doc said many moons ago about Drew and his offensive concepts (the Princeton), that might well be a way to go, certainly in the short run. As a player, I thought the guy was economical and effective; I liked watching him. Interesting concept.

By F A Skippy

April 27, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this

Doc you forced me to comment if Vick had prior knowledge to barbaric and criminal acts on his property but failed to act he is a thug and a criminal.I said if but in that event he should be finished not just in Atlanta but in the NFL.Bank robbers don’t learn and move on they get their a*’ hauled to jail,so should felon sadist.

By doc

April 27, 2007 2:30 PM | Link to this

f a i dont force anyone to do anything, i certainly have no unknown strengths along those lines. it is your perogative to say or act on your own accord therefore take it as your freedom and responsibility. as far as your comments i have never been able to read anyones mind or intentions for their knowledge of when or how things occur. as far as what needs to be done to him i let the law dictate it and who gives him his paycheck.

vick gets to meet with goodell in a pr event; maybe goodell will tell him how not to end up in his office like pacman did recently at the same time. good to hear it from vick that he is tired of the hangers on, now his actions can be followed from here. agree vick has a long leash but it might be getttting shorter.

as far as what vick knew going on in a home 100’s of miles from his own can the same be said for kerney who “slept” while others entered his home and an alleged rape occurred. again, it is up to the law to determine not me. you might have misconstrued my voice to be taking up for vick i wasnt.

now, i wonder how chills toes (no that is a different blog), er feet are doing and what is the prognosis for healing sekou? inquiring minds want to know.

By doc

April 27, 2007 2:33 PM | Link to this

flash getting scary dude, agreein and all. pleasures mine.

seems, like there are a few falcons that need to stay away from dogs in the off season. maybe it should be written into some contracts.

By doc

April 27, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this

oh dear just discovered that t. moore had a similar thought about the meeting with goodell and vick that i just expressed. the pleasures not mine. my bad.

By dale

April 27, 2007 3:08 PM | Link to this

I have never heard of a GM that doesn’t talk to the media. That is more of an insult to the fans, then the crappy product he has put on the floor over the last 3 years.
BILLY KNIGHT IF YOU CAN’T TAKE THE HEAT STAY OUT OF THE KITCHEN.

We have been through so much crap as Hawks fans, from JR Rider, to Adam Keefe, to Doug Edwards, to Stephen Jackson, this is crazy.

If the Spirit Group had any respect for the City of Atlanta, they would fire Billy Knight and sale the team!

By Matt

April 27, 2007 4:08 PM | Link to this

Those guys you mentioned, Dale? All from the Pete Babcock era, with the exception of Stephen Jackson, who was actually a damn good signing and a damn good trade on Knight’s part. We got Jackson for a bargain-basement price, he had the best season of his career here, then we traded him away after he got more expensive. The guy we traded him for (Harrington) then put up even BETTER numbers than Jackson had, while Jackson went on to serve a 30 game suspension less than a month after joining his new team.

How was that a mistake again?

And I’m thankful that Knight doesn’t listen to people like us who frankly don’t know jack about scouting, coaching, or being a GM in the NBA. Unless you’re at the practices, reading the scouting reports, and talking to the other GMs, Knight has no reason to listen to you. Any GM who lets fans or the media dictate what moves he makes is dooming his team.

The Hawks are going in the right direction. Keep the faith.

By F A Skippy

April 27, 2007 4:35 PM | Link to this

Point taken Doc This is my last post on the subject. I just want to make clear if Vick turns out to be guilty of the worst possible thing in this by that I’m talking involvement in running a felony dog fighting gambling ring it would be a major felony and probably time in a federal prison.This isn’t a bong in his bag or flipping a fan,it could be about having a violent felon as the face of the Falcons.

By F A Skippy

April 27, 2007 5:16 PM | Link to this

Here’s one fan’s view of what the birds could look like next year with a big bunch of ifs. pg 1 - J Jack 2 - Claxton sg 1 - J Johnson 2 Childress sf 1 - J Smith 2 - Childress pf 1 - M Williams 2 - S Williams c 1 - Pachulia 2 - Hawes ( the Washington Husky) Add Jones working in at pf and c and This would start looking like a team that could play winning NBA ball.At least that’s one view from one fan.

By Matt

April 27, 2007 5:50 PM | Link to this

How do we get Jack without giving up any of the other guys listed?

And would you take Jack if there was a chance we could get Conley?

By F A Skippy

April 27, 2007 6:08 PM | Link to this

Matt good point a fly in the deal for sure,I would probably take Jack if we could use the pick to take Hawes.Childress could be the odd man out in this plan but I have him backing two spots.So help me out here,who’s expendable ? Jones,Sheldon ?

By mavid

April 27, 2007 8:18 PM | Link to this

Matt, just gotta point out that Camby has just been named Defensive Player of the Year. ;)

By billy

April 27, 2007 8:36 PM | Link to this

Fair enough.

Here’s a b-ball question: What do the Hawks do if the balls “kind of” bounce our way and we get the 3rd pick? Apologies if this has already been discussed at length.

Saw where Sekou (or someone) asked what we do if we get the 11th pick (Noah or Conley). But I’m wondering what we do (Noah or Conley or Hoford or Wright or what about JianLian?) with the 3rd pick.

If we go Hoford then we’re filling a position of need (PF) but then admitting that Sheldon was a bad pick and we don’t think he’ll pan out. Don’t think BK is ready to do that. If we go Noah then we’d be trying to fill a position of need (5), but I’m not sure Noah is big enough to play the 5 the way Woodson would want him to (Noah could play the 5 the way the Suns would want him to). Wright is too much potential not enough now. So for me the 3rd pick would come down to Conley or Jianlian. All I know about Jianlian is what the articles tell me — 7-footer who can move. Averaging 25/11 in China. I’d have to know more/see video to make an informed decision, but if Conley impresses in interviews/workouts/etc. then I might go with a PG at #3.

Your thoughts?

By GHook

April 27, 2007 9:14 PM | Link to this

I know most of you will be watching the playoffs the next few weeks - when you’re watching the Raptors pay attention to Jose Calderon. He is a 2nd year PG out of Spain who backs up T.J. Ford. This guy is way too good to be a backup.

When Ford went down with an ankle injury, Calderon started in his place. He led his team to a 7-1 record and shot 57% from the field, averaged 13.3 points, 8.8 assists and only 2.1 turnovers as a starter. If you watch him play, you can see he plays with a lot of heart - he led the Spanish team to a world championship. The Hawks need this guy, and I think we could get him. Ford just got signed an extension this season, and the PG spot is getting crowded now that Calderon has earned about 22 mins of the playing time.

The Raptors aren’t going to give him up easily, we may have to offer Chill to get him. I would hate to lose Chill, but Calderon would come in and make an immediate impact at a need position for the Hawks, which might not be the case if we were to draft a PG like Conley or Acie Law. Also, we can focus our draft pick/picks on our other huge need area - big men.

By Clyde

April 27, 2007 9:44 PM | Link to this

On a more serious note I think everyone needs to read the new article on police corruption in the Katherine Johnston case. Police corruption has been a problem in Atlanta for a while. I have been the victim of it myself. Here is a line from the article:

“officers then lied to a judge, illegally broke into Johnston’s house, fired 39 shots at her and handcuffed her as she lay bleeding before they planted drugs in her basement.”

Atlanta is starting to remind me of LA.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By St. Bernard

April 27, 2007 10:56 PM | Link to this

First, I have to say I love what Sekou is doing here, but I’ve been reading this blog for two years and I haven’t seen an interview with BK and Sekou. If he’s open to talk to SS, then why haven’t I seen it? How can we take anything these guys say seriously? Can Belkin be this bad?

By doc

April 27, 2007 11:07 PM | Link to this

roll tide clyde left you some love last night.

agree with the comments about the police, however i think dekalb might have atlanta beaten by a mile. not an indictment on all but it doest take much to spoil the whole thing. tragic and no leaership from the elected leaders leaves pause as to why. where does the corruption start and is it eh chicken or the egg. are leaders intimidated by the police?

By Matt

April 27, 2007 11:18 PM | Link to this

Mavid,

Haha…guess I owe some people some money on Camby, then ;-). Good for him. I still say he’s overrated. Call me a purist, but I like my centers to weigh at least 50 pounds more than I do.

(On a related note, I always thought Mutombo was a bit overrated, but I think Deek at his best is better than Camby at his best)

Skippy,

I like Jack well enough, but I’m honestly not sure he’s a heck of a lot better for next year than a Lue/AJ combo would be, and I’m not sure his ceiling is very high long term. I think he’s one of those guys who we would have to overpay and over-trade to get. That doesn’t mean we don’t listen, of course, but that’s my opinion. If we could land him by trading one of our current PGs along with Shelden or Solomon, I say go for it. If it means having to part with Childress (and I think it would) PLUS Shelden and probably one other player, I think we don’t make the move, because I think we will ultimately be able to get more in exchange for Childress.

I think Childress will be in an ‘04 Al Harrington type of position come this time next year - clearly a guy who can start and put up good numbers on a team with room for him. I don’t think he’s achieved that rep just yet, though.

Given that, I don’t think that Jack would be worth the price we’d have to pay for him. I’d be more interested in packaging Childress and those guys to move up and take Conley.

By AL

April 27, 2007 11:30 PM | Link to this

THE LAST TIME THE HAWKS MADE THE PLAYOFFS MY SON WAS IN THE 2ND GRADE MY SON IS A FREAKING SOPHOMORE AND THE HAWKS STILL HAVEN’T MADE THE PLAYOFFS THATS SAD

By doc

April 27, 2007 11:35 PM | Link to this

you know clyde reflecting more at the lack of outrage by the public as numbers of deaths at the hands of the police is sad especially when there is such quick outrage at the sports personalities and the likes of bk and woody among others. sad to say where are our priorities about our real lives?

i recognize too the role of criminal and the amount of pressure there is to save your own life when sometimes undermanned. some of this reminds me of things going down in nyc.

how about gs doing a number on the mavs? big al going off.

By Matt

April 28, 2007 12:37 AM | Link to this

I can tell you guys from my pro bono work that the institutional level of corruption and racism in the criminal justice system as a whole - from the beat cops to the DAs to the jury selection process - remains a shameful aspect of this country. I know from personal experience that blacks have a hard time getting taken seriously in the world of corporate law, but it’s even worse in the criminal justice system.

Oh, and if you think it’s bad in Atlanta (and trust me, brother, I know) then you should see it in Philadelphia. Both race relations and corruption are even bigger problems here. “City of Brotherly Love” my a*.

By F A Skippy

April 28, 2007 12:40 AM | Link to this

Matt no way you give up Childress AND Shelden for Jack if we do that we might as well throw in Philips arena.Only if the price is right would I do the deal and then I’d give it more thought.Shelden alone is a pretty high price and he’s the guy who fits Portland’s roster best anyway.Watching da Bulls tonight they have by far the best young group of guards in the game,I mean everything they’ll need in the backcourt for ten years is already there.

By F A Skippy

April 28, 2007 12:53 AM | Link to this

More on Jack and Lue as far as ceiling Jack played five or six games this year at a level Lue simply doesn’t have the game to achieve,I mean there was a stretch where he was playing as well as anybody.I think the real question is can he bring his a or high b game enough,that’s something that has to play out with any player whether it’s heart,guts or stamina only time will give us that answer.Don’t get me grong Lue is a valuable player but he can only give what he has.

By F A Skippy

April 28, 2007 1:04 AM | Link to this

Two mistakes on my part first the type-o spelling wrong,and flat being wrong on Portland’s roster needs.Childress would be the better fit on the forward rich Blazers.

By Clyde

April 28, 2007 1:06 AM | Link to this

We got crooked cops on the street shootin’ innocent people and we’re worried about Mike Vick dog fighting.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Mark

April 28, 2007 1:15 AM | Link to this

I was in the Omni for game 6 in 1987 against the Celtics. They had a banner that read: “K.C. Jones retirement party”. I think the Hawks have been cursed ever since.

By cowa

April 28, 2007 1:20 AM | Link to this

Matt, you must take into consideration the NBA trade rules. If you want o tthrow out various combos that have zero chance of ever happening, go ahead. But due to the salary cap, you must make trades work financially. Jack makes $1.2M next season. Childress makes $3.6, and Sheldon makes $3.2. Since Portland is over the cap already, so they can’t take on more salary then they are giving. A trade that works financially would be Jack and Przybilla for Childress and Lue. You gotta make the money work.

I think Jack is just what the Hawks need. I’m from the northeast, so this is not a homer comment. He’s a relatively big PG, plays great D, thinks pass first, and is developing his shot.

Is it May 22 yet?

By doc

April 28, 2007 1:30 AM | Link to this

cowa, i dont see a cap but somehow salaries have to fit in a trade. if there was a salary cap morris wouldnt be in new york. it cant be as simple as a “cap” as it is a misnomer and really doesnt exist in the nba where all but two teams are over the “cap”.

By smartguy

April 28, 2007 6:25 AM | Link to this

Here is how we get Jack for jack. If we land the third pick, then we trade down with Portland and take Jack in return. That would still leave us with two picks, plus Jack, so that may be too many players, but I would love to see Speedy given away. Maybe Portland would take Salim, Solo, and a future pick, but I doubt it.

With regards to Calderon, that guy is awesome! DA BK has missed out on several quality point guards, including Jack, just because they don’t seem to fit his “ideal” mold. That being said, WOody MUst GO. Mike Vick and Petrino will take the Falcs very far this year. If the Hawks don’t make a similar change, they will be regretting it big time.

By newkid

April 28, 2007 11:23 AM | Link to this

Lies, deception, personal wars; sorta sounds like Bush, Cheney, Wolfie, Rove, Rummy, Condi, Colin, and others doesn’t it? Checkout Professor C. Johnson’s trilogy, “Blowback”, “The Sorrows of Empire”, and “Nemesis”. Oops, I’m sorry, this is a basketball blog isn’t it?

AJ, any idea just what Mullen has in mind when he says Marvin will have a breakout year in 07/08? Is there perhaps gonna be a transformation between Marvin’s ears this summer? If so, how would Mullen have prior knowledge of this supposed metamorphic activity? Sounds strangely like a sales job to my ears. Serving up a little bovine excrement - to GMs - in preparation for a trade, oh yeah.

By Steve T

April 28, 2007 1:19 PM | Link to this

The teams that consistently win do it through free agency and trades. This organization needs a face lift before we make another dumb move to set this franchise back. Like letting Josh Smith because we don’t want to pay him like we did Jason Terry.”

Hey man, most teams build thier base with the draft and then look to FA to add the missing link. Let us look at MJ and the bulls. They drafted MJ, Pippen, Grant and Predue. They added Rodman, Cartwright, etc.

Let move on the spurs of today. They build their base through the draft.

Now the problem with the hawks right now is you have to show the FAs that we have a good base. I think we are ready to show other that we have the base. You have to have a selling point for a FA.

We need a center and we need to be able to tell him how he can help us. For example, the hawks lots of game in the 4th when they had a huge lead.

We can say that if you sign with us, you can help us win X number of games that we fail to close last season. We need you low post scoring to help maintain our lead. We need your defense to pair with J. Smith. I don’t see why you two can not control the paint. J. Smith is an excellent shot blocker. He will help you on the block with his defense.

While I am speaking about Josh, we have two more young men that can help out down low. We have Shelden. As you are aware he was a very good shot blocker in college. We believe that he will do the same thing when he get use to the speed of the game.

However, we need you more to help develop Solo. This young man will be very good when we get him develop. I can see you, him and Smith on the floor in crunch time when we have a huge lead in the 4th. The reason why I am saying this is because with you three, I beleive we can control the paint with ease. If you sign with us I believe we can win 60 games. I believe we can go deep in the play-offs. In two years, we can win it all.

“AJ, any idea just what Mullen has in mind when he says Marvin will have a breakout year in 07/08?”

Most people in the NBA believe that Marvin will have a break out season based what he showed this season and in the summer of last year. Marvin is a talent, and he showed in the final games of last season of what he can do.

By Anakin Joe

April 28, 2007 8:02 PM | Link to this

newkid, he didn’t elaborate and I would guess he is just being optimistic. When you look at his last 10-15 games, he did do a better job of hitting the boards and produced a few 20 point games. I also like the fact that he asked to meet with Woody after he, Smith and Childress were called out for playing poor defense. But, to answer your question, Bernie did not provide any reason for his statement that Marvin is ready for a breakout year. Personally, I think Woody is holding him down with his primitive offensive scheme. And until that changes, Marvin may never be allowed to do anything other than catch and shoot.

By jhan

April 29, 2007 11:17 AM | Link to this

I don’t think Woody is forcing Marvin to “catch & shoot”. If Marvin could attack the rim and average 25 & 10 a night, do you think Woody would stop him? Marvin is the only guy holding himself back. I feel he is still too uncoordinated to finish in the lane consistently. He seems to trip over himself or jump off the wrong foot while attacking the basket. A lot of times he is shooting at or below the rim like ZaZa when he is in the lane. He needs to be more like Josh Smith and shoot from over the top. It is much harder to block. Keep working Marvin!

By reese

April 29, 2007 12:11 PM | Link to this

Jhan, your finally starting to see the light. Very good observations in your last post.

What is the big fascination with Jarrett Jack. He is not an elite point guard. Who cares that he played for GA tech and those who keep asking that we trade for him must be tech grads or fans.

Its almost as bad as those who keep asking for Przybilla to come back.

By newkid

April 29, 2007 4:48 PM | Link to this

Thanks AJ. Both you and jhan make points my post intended to insinuate regarding Marvin. Red Auerbach often made the point that the 5 inches between a player’s ears is by far the most important element in his game. An understanding of one’s attributes, a commitment to busting one’s butt to improve those attributes each year (a la Michael Jordan), and a dogged determination to give your utmost every minute you’re on the floor (instead of standing around on the wing watching JJ dribble, dribble, dribble, then shoot); all this starts between the ears. Maybe he will have a ‘breakout year’ (whatever that means), but if he does it’s gotta start in that grey matter.

If Woody doesn’t drastically modify his ‘the offense will take care of itself’ approach to utilizing the talents of Marvin and others to put points on the board, then Marvin’s mental and physical transformation won’t matter at all. Additionally, if there’s no point guard - and motion offense - to get Marvin the ball where he can be effective, than we can forget about a ‘breakout year’ for Marvin here in Atlanta.

By Anakin Joe

April 29, 2007 6:00 PM | Link to this

newkid and jhan, interesting points. I don’t think Marvin is naturally aggressive. I think the term deferential was ued to describe him coming out of college. He appears to be fairly obedient and interested in pleasing his coach. Smith, on the other hand, is quite ambitious. Smith will shoot 5-7 3 pointers in a game because he wants to develop into an elite player. So what if his team suffers as he shoots less than 30% from deep, he is using game time for on-the-job-training. I don’t think Marvin has that in him. Coach calls a play, Marvin runs it. Smith? It depends on his mood and the value to his own self-development.

Somewhere in between Marvin’s passiveness and Smith’s self-centeredness lies the right balance. Maybe, that’s why they may ultimately provide a nice forward combination. A little ying and yang in 6’9” bodies.

By ray

April 29, 2007 8:28 PM | Link to this

Anakin Joe, I read the same article you did and picked out what irritated me. I wasn’t after you at all, man. I recognized your paraphrase and know you weren’t defending Billy. Like you said, the problem is how the “concept” translates to the basketball court. And 6’5” or taller pgs are just not a dime a dozen these days, so the concept is somewhat flawed from the get-go. If indeed that was the idea. What remains is still the need for a lead guard. They tried that with JJ and it didn’t work. I feel like that was the case because it wasn’t his natural spot and they were trying to get him to pull double duty on a young team with little or no chemistry and a few missing pieces. It’s fine to have a big combo-type lead guard if you have the kind of guard that compliments him. If not, it’s nothing more than a failed idea.

What is the deal with people repeatedly saying Jarrett Jack is not an elite pg? I can’t even recall anyone here saying that he was. Nor does anyone expect him to “save” the franchise. The only thing said here was that if the guy is at all available, the idea of acquiring him in a workable trade should at least be considered. And as far as this guy’s ceiling, look at Chauncey Billups. Five NBA teams had him before he really blossomed in Detroit. Do you think those teams would have let him go if they knew he could be what he is now? He didn’t put up Jack’s second year numbers until his fourth year, which was with Minnesota. You just never know.

If you’re looking for that next bright star at pg in this year’s draft you might not find him. Or you might and not know it for a couple of years. Who’s to say?

By ray

April 29, 2007 8:40 PM | Link to this

Matt,

I understand what you’re saying. But how many simpletons do you really think are here? Obviously a GM who listens to a group of bloggers and then makes his decisions based on what they say is more than a fool and shouldn’t be in that office anyway. Hell, we as bloggers can’t all agree on just about anything. How would he make a decision based on the rants we come off with? Don’t be silly.

The point has never been that Knight should do what bloggers think he should do. The point is many people are dissatisfied with what he has done overall. And he’s not the only one, either. I have to say that I disagree with your conclusion that this franchise is headed in the right direction. But since you’re defending the decision makers…explain how passing on several promising young point guards was a good thing. How was picking Shelden Williams 5th and then placing the “ready to contribute right away…play defense and rebound…anchor the post” tag on him the right move? Drafting for need my bahonkas! Yes, Knight made some good moves. Every GM has, I imagine. Even the absolute worst ones. Our two free agent acquisitions were Wright and Claxton. What did we get out of them this season? AJ made a difference (late season acquisition) but was it worth giving up a 2nd round pick? Talk about a rhetorical question…

Sorry, but my “faith” is badly damaged here. We still don’t have an effective center, still don’t have a steady pg. And now we don’t even know for absolute certain if we even have any draft picks this year. And whether or not we do is not a result of good moves on the part of our GM. It’s dependant on our record, other team’s records, and a bunch of ping pong balls. Yeah, that’s some dang direction we’ve got there…

By doc

April 29, 2007 11:06 PM | Link to this

samuel, it is official. the king is dead, long live the king.

By Mike

April 30, 2007 12:09 AM | Link to this

Sekou, great article. Unless you’ve been following the Hawks for a while you would think that this city doesn’t know how the NBA playoff feels. But I have many playoff memories with this team. That’s why while I may not agree with all the decision that the organization makes, the Hawks are still my team. Some people think that if you cheer for Hawks you either know very little about basketball, or you just like losers’. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The last time the Hawks had a legit playoff team was during the Steve Smith era. Even then they never made it past the second round, because MJ and the Bulls was sitting there waiting. During the Nique and Steve Smith era all the strong teams was in the East. So every round in the playoff was a struggle.

This is the best group of young talent Hawks the have had since than. I’m not going to go into BK drafts pick, I think that dead horse have been beat to deaf. My point is those teams started out like this team, they had 1 or 2 superstar players the rest was utility guys that came in and made a contribution. I certainly agree with the rest of the bloggers, it’s time to draft for need. However I disagree with anyone that says this team doesn’t have a bright future. After watching the guys put-in the dedication and hard work to improve their game, I’m looking for more improvement from this team next season.

If the Spirit, BK, and Woodson are to blame for all the suffering going on in this organization, then time will tell. There is an old saying, “Careful what you wish for.” I’m not a big Woodson fan, but I respect him. If he gets to come back next year, I wouldn’t be overjoyed. But I could live with, it’s not like they’re extending his contract. There are too many issues surrounding the team to make any major moves. Who knows how this team will play next season. We are bloggers and we’re talking about how much we miss the playoff. Image how the guys on the Hawks feel?

I think Jack would be a great pick-up at the right price. What would be better is a Jack and Magliore deal, then we get a Big and a PG. Portland is shopping both players. It’s better to wait till the draft before making any moves. This draft will be a defining moment for BK, that’s why I think they are keeping BK away from the media; they don’t want him to screw things up running his mouth. I think this year the fans will be treated with respect. Which I think is long over do. I also thinks that goes both ways.

By smartguy

April 30, 2007 7:49 AM | Link to this

Good stuff ya’ll. Did anyone see that Golden State game last night? I loved it for many reasons, but two things in particular may be very pertinent to the Hawks.

First, that arena was rockin like no other in the league. Cities hungry for NBA success will blow up at first taste of the playoffs. Anyone remember when the Braves first started their run? It was mad. There were signs and tomahawks all over the city. Unfortunately that novelty wore off after a year or two, but my point is that this city would go nuts for a quality playoff team (and I don’t think we’re that far away).

Second, their style of play would seem to work very well for the Hawks. On offense, its basically a race up the court. And the set offense consists of plays and movement that find and exploit mismatches. Meanwhile, Woody insists on a slow game, and is incapable of finding mismatches.

On defense, the Warriors fly around and apply heavy pressure; they also rebound in mass. This may be a question equally of the players’ will and the coach’s strategy, but I would love to see Hawk red flyin around like that next year.