Hawks

By vdunkndunk

January 31, 2007 04:13 PM | Link to this

Joe Johnson is definitely playing on an all-star level, and he definitely deserve it. Whether he’ll get it this year or not is another question. If the Hawks were even close to playing .500 ball right now then it would be a travesty not to include him, but since the Hawks stink he might get passed over.

As for the draft…Durant is not the type of guy that would put this team over the top next season, because he’s not ready on defense and he’s bound to struggle a bit on offense. But he’s got a chance to be a foundational piece for the future.

Oden, on the other hand, could lift the current Hawks team into the playoffs, because he’s just what we need…a big, athletic, long defensive presence who can block shots, rebound, and dunk. He’s no Shaq yet, though (remember Shaq took a 17 win team and led them to a .500 record the next year, and then to the Finals within 3 years after that).

By bryant

January 31, 2007 04:29 PM | Link to this

i think that johnson should go to the game. the one player that could take his spot would be vince carter and statistically, johnson has the upper hand on him. the one problem though is that carter has been hyped out of his head by the NBA political machine whereas johnson only gets a 1 minute video on youtube. if he doesn’t make it, it’s just another reason why this team needs to win. it’s sad when your reputation as a team keeps your best player from going to the all-star game.

By Fan01

January 31, 2007 04:31 PM | Link to this

Yes he deserves it, He’s simply one of the best. Joe is so humble though, He needs to start yelling at the Refs so that he can get the calls….

By OmniHawk

January 31, 2007 04:36 PM | Link to this

Does anyone debate that JJ deserves to be an all star? With all those highlight DVD’s the front office sent out, he ought to be a lock.

And only 10 million to bring a WNBA team to Atlanta? I don’t really like women’s basketball, but at that price I’d just dump Speedy and Lorenzen’s salary and never look back.

By HB Ando

January 31, 2007 04:36 PM | Link to this

vdunk, but shaq played 3 years of college ball, and that’s just not the world we live in anymore……….

By A Thinking Fan

January 31, 2007 04:38 PM | Link to this

JJ is the MAN from the ATL in the NBA!

By MannyT

January 31, 2007 04:54 PM | Link to this

Joe IS an All Star regardless of what happens. To put up the numbers he does is amazing considering that no one else on this team is a consistent offensive threat. If he doesn’t make it, the coaches will simply prove that, like the fans, they don’t vote on performance either.

All you draft lovers are like college guys hanging around high school to find a date for next year. You gotta work the ones that are in play now. Most rookies will not have an impact in the short term. If you really believe this team is close to breaking through to the playoffs, you need to add a veteran player either now or in the summer.

Think of how much better we would have been if we had held onto Hawk for a Day (HAD) Rasheed Wallace a few years ago. I would guess that a sign & trade at the end of that season would have netted us more than cap space!

By Jrock

January 31, 2007 05:10 PM | Link to this

I have seen a 2007 All Star weekend preview booklet from TNT.It has Joe Johnson listed as an All-star along with new names such as Emeka Okafor and carlos boozer.It also has sheldon williams playing in the rookie challenge.

By kaiser

January 31, 2007 05:10 PM | Link to this

joe is a star!

By Volman

January 31, 2007 05:16 PM | Link to this

Joe DESERVES to be on the All-Star team…no doubt..He’s played like one throughout the entire season so far..

I think it’s TERRIBLE how fans can vote in someone like Shaq based on his name and career, not based on his performance. If the league does its job, Joe gets a spot. Bottom line.

Sekou, you hit it on the head when you said that Oden, Noah, and Durant are going to bring success to teams, but not what a “Lebron type” could bring. I haven’t seen enough offense out of Oden to compare him to any of the great bigs yet.. but, he’s hurt. Durant seems like a great player but not someone I’d want to build a franchise around (just not yet)..and Noah seems like he will be a great defender and energy guy, but is that where it stops?

Jeremy Richardson? We need to try to find a PG..fast.

Go Hawks!! PLEASE BEAT AL HARRINGTON! LORENZEN USE YOUR FOULS ON HIM! hah.

Get Solomon some playing time, Woody!

Go Hawks!!!!!

By Traceman

January 31, 2007 05:19 PM | Link to this

I think Joe definitely deserves to go. I think it will come down to him, Hamilton, Redd, Pierce and Okafor for the last two spots.

Pierce and Redd have terrific numbers but both have missed a lot of games due to injuries. Joe could have missed a lot more games due to injury too but he played hurt which hurt his stats a little. I give him the edge over both of them.

As for Hamilton, he is the most consistent player on the best team in the EC but his numbers don’t compare to Joe’s and if Joe were on the Pistons, I think he could do everything that Rip is doing and maybe more.

Okafor is a more interesting question. His numbers are VERY comparable to Howard’s and O’Neal’s and his efficiency rating is higher than Joe’s and Hamilton’s. He doesn’t have a great supporting cast either. It would be hard for me to keep him out.

My EC All Stars would be as follows:

Starters:

Shaq Bosh James Wade Arenas

Reserves:

JJ Kidd Carter Butler O’Neal Howard Okafor

Sorry Hamilton, Pierce and Redd.

By tyger

January 31, 2007 05:21 PM | Link to this

JJ in a tough spot: Arenas, Kidd, Billups, Vince, DWade, Rip, Redd.

By Wedgie Evans

January 31, 2007 05:48 PM | Link to this

Joe Johnson won’t make it, because there are too many other guards in the East who are more well-known and play on better teams. But he absolutely deserves to go. A lot of people have Rip Hamilton and Vince Carter going ahead of Joe, despite the fact that Joe is statistically as good if not better than either one of them. I personally would have no problem leaving Half Man/Half Injured out of the game in favor of Joe, since Joe actually bothers to get his teammates involved and doesn’t shoot fadeaway jumpers all day long… and if I had to pick a Pistons player I would send Billups to the game over Hamilton, even though both are very good.

By mavid

January 31, 2007 06:07 PM | Link to this

this just in…

no-one from the hawks makes the rookie-sophomore game.

thoughts?

By mavid

January 31, 2007 06:17 PM | Link to this

ROOKIES

Andrea Bargnani Jordan Farmar Randy Foye Jorge Garbajosa Rudy Gay Paul Millsap Adam Morrison Brandon Roy Marcus Williams

SOPHMORES

Andrew Bogut Andrew Bynum Monta Ellis Raymond Felton Danny Granger Luther Head David Lee Chris Paul Deron Williams

By Chris D'

January 31, 2007 06:40 PM | Link to this

I don’t think Joe gets the invite to the All-Star game this year Redd beats him out at 2 for the final spot. If Redd elects not to go because of injury Joe Johnson takes his spot.

I will repeat what I said earlier in the year. If JJ had put up a 50 spot in a game or two this year I think he goes to the All-Star game.

By HB Ando

January 31, 2007 06:49 PM | Link to this

Really, Paul Millsap made it and Shelden didn’t. Shocker. Guess that about wraps up any lingering debate regarding the wisdom of Billy’s choice. Those two play the exact same position, and the exact same expected contributions on the floor. One went to Duke, and was drafted 5th. The other went to a small school, and was drafted 50th, despite leading the nation in rebounding for 3 years in a row. That’s tremendous scouting. So we obviously wouldn’t have looked at Millsap with the fifth pick. But why not 32nd?

With Boozer out, Millsap had his second straight monster outing, with 16 points, 12 boards, 3 dimes and 2 blocks. If you really want to get a fair gauge on Shelden’s worth, offer him, straight up, for Millsap, and watch Utah laugh so hard they drop the phone…………

And anybody who’s following Roy, please tell me how we wouldn’t be better with a backcourt of Johnson and Roy.

I honestly wish I could let it go. But every single night I check around the league, I get visible, irrefutable reminders of the repeated mistakes of Billy Knight. He has zigged every time he should have sagged. And people take the position that just because the picks he did make are still in the league, still part of a bottom dwelling franchise, as evidence that he’s done well. Guys, all his picks are still on guaranteed rookie contracts. They get minutes and lose. Contributing to regular losses doesn’t make you good. It means your not good enough. To win.

So tell me some more about how Shelden was a good pick. Here’s a guy viewed as more “game ready” than most, coming out of the draft. Here’s a guy that has been selected by a team that has a gaping lack of production in the areas that are his supposed strengths. So he has no viable reason not to produce solid numbers. He’s 23, not 19, like most rookies. He has no other power forward in his way, rotation wise (now here’s where you have to be careful, because if you say that Josh and Marvin were anticipated to be the starting forwards, if you use that as an excuse for Shelden, then how can you justify the franchise saying Shelden was brought in to provide immediate production in boards and blocks?).

Paul Millsap IS what Billy thought Shelden would be. But only Billy, alone. No one else rated Shelden as high as fifth. And now, we see, that Billy was clearly wrong in his assessment of the best available talent. Again. We see that everyone else, who had Shelden rated 5-10 slots lower, was right. But Billy said he doesn’t care what everyone else thinks. Said to this very newspaper that he laughs at people who think they know more than him. Said he knows more than anyone else about basketball.

The emperor has new clothes.

By ATLER

January 31, 2007 06:50 PM | Link to this

Let me see now??? Joe Johnson as an All-Star Hell Yeah he deserves it!!!!!

By HB Ando

January 31, 2007 06:51 PM | Link to this

There is nothing worse than writing the longest Hawks post in history, right as Sekou is posting the new one, leaving to chance all your effort is left behind, without being read by those you have chosen to address. With that I give you War and Peace:

By HB Ando

January 31, 2007 04:35 PM | Link to this

I’m exhausted reading all these delusional opinions. I’ll say it again, Billy Knight has used 3 top-6 picks to get the uncertain potential of Marvin (who still may ceiling at the Harrington he replaced), and two guys who project to be back ups for the foreseeable future in Atlanta, Shelden and Childress.

Let me go from post to post:

Mavid, you are correct that I projected that either Smith or Williams will ultimately go. But I’ve said a million times that it is DUE to the lack of the five we need. Again, with this ownership group hamstrung, quality fives nearly impossible to get via trade, and the reality that no good five is coming here as a free agent, unless he’s grossly overpaid, where do you get that five? Answer is you package one of your very talented 3’s, along with whatever you have to, to get one, or a draft pick which nets you one. And the fact that a need for a five, that can anchor the paint, was clearly obvious, if you were planning on pairing Josh and Marvin together, for the future, is the very reason Billy should have sought out such a prospect in the last draft. As I’ve said a million other times (since before the draft), why draft Shelden, who can only play the four, if you intend to play Josh and Marvin as tandem forwards? Duh?

The idea that Billy Knight has done a good job is simply ludicrous. Every pick he has made, he passed on a player that most insiders had rated over the one he chose (Deng and Igoudala over Childress, everyone in the lottery over Shelden, Monta Ellis over Salim, Ivey over Duhon, and passing on Paul or Williams to get Marvin, when he already had Childress, Smith and Harrington). I don’t care how loud the few myopic Atlanta voices say it, Billy is a bad GM, and no one outside of this town disagrees. He’s ignored the PG position to an absolute fault, and then overspent on a career backup, with a history of injury problems, who turns out to have a persistent, long-term knee condition that will impact the next 5 years, and $28 million we just gave away.

Why would Phoenix give us back our pick to get a guy that plays the same position (only not nearly as well) as Marion? They need one more talented big man, to ease the load on Stoudemire, and they’re looking at potentially running the table over the next 3-4 years. If they want veteran help, they can trade that pick to a team with a big man, who wants to get younger (maybe even Memphis, and Gasol). There’s just no logic to the idea that Phoenix would give us our pick back, for Smith. And Billy would simply look like the dumbass he is, for doing it (“We over paid you for Johnson, when we didn’t have to give you anything. Now we’ll give you an emerging all-star to get what was our original pick, back” Genius!).

Shelden Williams is a horrible pick at #5. Even if he turns into Antonio Davis, Davis was an end of the first round player, which is where you’re supposed to find solid interior role players (see Paul Millsap, #50 overall, who’s a far more talented player, right now, than Shelden, who we passed not once, but twice). Watch Millsap’s numbers over the next 4-6 weeks (the length of time Boozer is expected to be out). Shelden has no upside. He entered the league at 23 years old. There’s not a scout in the league that sees upside there. He’s a one-position, undersized PF, who lacks mobility and handle. He would have been a good pick from the middle to late first round, given how weak the draft was. But you’re supposed to seek out a player with the potential to start for 10 years when you’re picking in the top five. I’ll bet any of you, any amount of money, that he does not start 10 years in this league. You must sign a binding agreement with me for this bet, so you can be accountable for this ongoing nonsense about Shelden being a good pick, so I can collect in a few years (of him being a back up every year). You can get Danny Fortson, right now, for a bag of Dorito’s, and Shelden isn’t half of the rebounder that Fortson is. And I can’t stand Fortson, but almost every team has a guy who can do what Shelden does, and almost none of them wasted a top pick on that guy. Haslem was an undrafted free agent, and he’s way better than Shelden. David Lee was a second round pick. Better. Melvin Ely can’t get off the bench in Charlotte, and I’d take him over Shelden, right now. PJ Brown is 71 years old, and he’s better.

Look, this is wholly unfair to Shelden Williams, because it’s not his fault that Billy wasted a fifth pick on a guy who wasn’t talented enough to justify it. He’ll have a long career. But he was supposed to step in and contribute starters’ numbers right away, because it was understood that what you saw was what you would get. His immediate impact, in helping this team make the playoffs, was the logic behind not drafting a player who might develop, like an O’Bryant. He simply hasn’t performed up to what this franchise tried to sell it’s fans, on draft day. And that was expected by me and quite a few other people. He’s been just what I said from the get go. Biff says character and work ethic will win out. Sorry, but when you’re a 6’7 1/2” PF, with virtually no lateral movement or explosiveness, as well as no handle or first step, character and work ethic aren’t going to make up for the facts. Undersized and underwhelming.

Ray, you’re way off on Oden. He’s got more game than Shaq did as a freshmen. The difference is the wrist, and the fact that he’s deferring to his teammates. Every scout on the planet views him as can’t miss, as the next dominant center. The only reason Garnett lasted until the fifth pick, is that back then no one had the guts to take a high schooler first. But again, you’ve mis-characterized his development in the “KG” as hit or miss. It wasn’t. Not by a long shot.

Durant and Oden are both “can’t miss”. It’s just bizarre to see someone suggest that there are questions about Durant’s legitimacy. He’s half-way through his freshman year, and he’s averaging 24 points and 11 boards playing against the best competition in the country. He’s a legitimate candidate for player of the year, based on what I’ve read from opposing coaches in the Big-12. Please, some one with a penchant for statistics, who’s the last true freshman, playing in one of the major conferences, who averaged 24 and 11?

Joe, organic growth? Sounds like you’ve been smoking the product of such philosophies. Which young point guard and young center do you see organically growing into legitimate starters on this squad? Where are the 1 and 5 in such a scenario? Terry? Terry would trade his new contract to Cuban NOT to come back to Atlanta. Last time I checked, the Mavs have Howard and Dirk playing at the forward positions. Not sure how a Marvin for Terry deal would make much sense to the Mavs. I don’t care how long and bouncy Jones is, he’s a long way from being able to compete, night in and night out, against starting-caliber NBA big men. He has very limited feel and fundamentals. He’s about 30-40 pounds shy of viable. He may, MAY, turn into a legitimate big man. But it won’t happen any quicker than the development of one of the more polished, physically imposing bigs, rated in the upcoming lottery. You don’t want to get younger, but the bigs on the list are simply better, right now, than the guys we have playing the five. It’s appearing more and more that Zaza is not the answer. Wright is a back-up, nearing the end of his run. Shelden is….well, don’t get me started again.

So, I ask again, how do we REALISTICALLY add a legitimate big man to this roster? Because without one, all the organic improvement of Josh, Josh and Marvin isn’t going to stop teams from pounding us to death in the paint. Where is the “organically grown” PG of the future here?

Folks pointing to this roster, this franchise, as clearly on an upward arc, are simply fooling themselves. This is a badly imbalanced roster, with a poor GM, and a lame duck ownership.

THERE WILL BE NO SUBSTANTIVE MOVES THIS SEASON. UNRESOLVED OWNERSHIP DRAMA RUNS INTO THE SUMMER, ELIMINATING OUR ABILITY TO PURSUE QUALITY FREE AGENTS, BASED ON LEGAL RESTRICTIONS. THERE IS NO OTHER WAY TO IMPROVE THIS ROSTER, LEGITIMATELY, THAN TO HOPE THAT WE KEEP THAT TOP-3 PICK. IF WE DO NOT, YOU WILL SEE ESSENTIALLY THE SAME FLAWED, IMBALANCED ROSTER, BEGINNING NEXT SEASON.

If someone can explain to me a realistic alternative, I’m listening. But trade ideas are invalid, when ownership is on lock down from making any transactions with long-term implications for what may be Belkin’s team. That same issue precludes us from spending what it would take to seek out a free agent big man of note. So, to summarize, no freedom to trade, and take on financial liabilities for future ownership, no ability to spend, and take on financial liabilities for future ownership, and no lottery pick this summer means more of the same for as far as the eye can see.

And, lastly, given the joke that is the Spirit ownership group, I think it’s safe to say that when Josh Smith and Dwight Howard talk about playing together, they’re thinking about Josh trying to force his way to sunny Orlando, not the other way around.

Today’s posts have taken many steps backwards, as far as a realistic handle on the big picture here. Viewing this situation with optimism is either cluelessness, or just another drop in from the Hawks marketing staff (we know you guys are out there, and we know you’re just trying to do your job).

Feel free to fire away. You’ll just be shooting the messenger. Which is what I’ve been getting for a year and a half here, despite being consistently right about the state of affairs (and despite opinions to the contrary, I’d rather be wrong and have hope, than right and feel so low about the Atlanta Hawks).

By Jay

January 31, 2007 07:02 PM | Link to this

Certainly his stats say he deserves consideration. But I will admit that if I wasnt a Hawks fan I wouldnt think he should be on the team, following the axiom “its easy to put up good stats on a bad team”. Especially scoring when, statistically, we dont have anything close to a second scorer. It reminds me of Michael Redd…good stats, bad team. Plus take in account his mpg…if he’s out there 43+, he darn well should have some big stats. And fair or not, the Hawks record will be held against him, just like if he was in the running for mvp.

By mavid

January 31, 2007 07:16 PM | Link to this

^^^

wow, best post ever

By Billy Knight

January 31, 2007 08:47 PM | Link to this

Andro you and all the other idiots can stop worrying about the draft. I am the only idiot who counts and I know more than anyone about basketball. I am in Europe scouting players right now and I have found a sleeper no one else knows about. 6’8” 175 lbs and can play guard or foward. Reminds me of myself in middle school. In case you idiots don’t remember I was a perfect player just as I am now the perfect general manager.

By mavid

January 31, 2007 09:03 PM | Link to this

would you believe me if i said that before this draft, i told my friend we should draft roy and millsap…

probably not, but i did

and oh yeah, hawks are gunning tonight!

By mykhalc

January 31, 2007 09:36 PM | Link to this

man, here i am thinkin’ i’ll get to see the game and they don’t freakin’ show it in the bay!!! life as a HAWKS fan just ain’t fair!!!!

By mavid

January 31, 2007 09:42 PM | Link to this

man oh man

“The young Hawks, who scored a season-best 70 points in the first half, seemed to enjoy the rare freedom to run”

Hopefully this game shows Woody what we all know: THE HAWKS NEED TO RUN!

Look at what they did tonight by running… we outplayed golden state playing golden state’s fast-paced game

anyone know why salim didnt even get on the court once the game was out of hand?? everyone played except him and speedy

By mykhalc

January 31, 2007 09:56 PM | Link to this

boxscore says JC had a good game…23pts 7 assists…my new PG!!!LOL JS…was he in foul trouble tonite?? he still got his blocks!!! JJ…the man!!! glad they shut AL and SJ up for once!!!

By Wedgie Evans

January 31, 2007 10:05 PM | Link to this

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe Salim Stoudamire was wearing a suit tonight, which explains why that skinny NBDL guy got playing time. I gotta say though, Jeremy Richardson showed me more today than Cedric Bozeman or Dijon Thompson showed all year.

It’s nice to see the Hawks pushing the tempo and scoring points, which is what they should be doing all the time, but let’s keep in mind that they were playing quite possibly the worst NBA defense ever. I think Georgia Tech could have hung 70 on the Warriors tonight. Let’s see how they do against a surging Raptors team on Friday.

And with Carlos Boozer out for the next 4-6 weeks, Paul Millsap will be playing extensive minutes. I suggest y’all pick him up on your fantasy teams. He is looking pretty good in this game against the Spurs so far.

By mykhalc

January 31, 2007 10:16 PM | Link to this

WOW, first winnin’ month in nearly 3 yrs!!! AMAZIN’!!!!!! AND SAD!!!

By Chris D'

January 31, 2007 10:16 PM | Link to this

mavid, Salim was inactive for the game.

hb ando, I would like to request that your post be put in the “Blog Hall of Fame” so that future generations of Hawks bloggers can savor it.

By Chris D'

January 31, 2007 10:25 PM | Link to this

An ideal Hawks off season would be thus.

Speedy gets a contract buyout for medical reasons. Hawks get the 1st and 15th picks and go Oden and PG. New ownership takes over and that situation is straightened out and HB Ando is appointed GM, he unfortunately gets fired after his first press conference goes on for 5 hours.

All is not lost though as the press conference is taped and put in the “press conference hall of fame” so that future generations of GM’s can cherish and savior his critical but thoughtfully analytical words.

By Volman

January 31, 2007 10:36 PM | Link to this

finally humor on this blogs, no hate! i love it!

By Marie

January 31, 2007 11:25 PM | Link to this

Joe definitely deserves a spot on the All-Star team! He’s an unselfish, talented player who has really turned this team in a new and much more positive direction.

By mavid

January 31, 2007 11:37 PM | Link to this

and yes, joe does deserve a spot

sorry, but rip hamilton and michael redd couldnt carry a team the way joe can/has

i hope the coaches realize just how much joe has to do, and how much he’s done

plus, he’s a stand-up, humble, hard-working guy who deserves it

By ray

January 31, 2007 11:57 PM | Link to this

Ando,

I’m not disputing Oden’s talent. All I’m saying is nothing is ever fully guaranteed to come to pass. So don’t get all over my case for downing Oden when I haven’t. I figure the guy’s going to be good at the least. Dominate? That remains to be determined.

My point was mainly about picking that “sure to dominate” player. I am holding out no hope that we will even get the opportunity to draft Oden. And in thinking this way, my view is that when drafting a player, particularly a post player, a GM needs to be looking at a number of things, one of them getting someone who has the ability to compete on a high level. I mean, we at least need a guy who can START, and be effective. In other words, stop worrying about finding the dominator and make a good pick. If the best guy is available, then yeah you take him. If the next best guy’s available, then you take him. But do you really feel like Oden’s going to fall in our laps?

Besides, didn’t you post something a while back about a sports writer or somebody you were in contact with that told you he felt Oden isn’t as far along right now as Dwight Howard was/is? Perhaps there is such thing as a differing qualified opinion…

By ray

February 1, 2007 12:07 AM | Link to this

Yes, Joe deserves to be there.

How about this needless, draft-harming win, eh? I have to admit, it was fairly exciting just reading the box score and seeing how the guys beat down on the Warriors.

How about 23 points, 8 boards, 7 assists, and 2 steals from our career back-up, sixth man g/f? Better than Al Harrington’s stats tonight. Oh, and he’s a starter…

Speaking of Harrington and his mouthy self, I wonder how he liked getting his butt hammered by one of the far less balanced, younger, weaker teams? Yeah, yeah, I know they got a better record….and better balance, and better everything else. But this one game, they didn’t have it and we did. So, on to the month of February and we get to see how much resiliency and resolve the team really has. Who knows, maybe this month will provide the tanking Ando so ardently desires, heh! Couldn’t resist….

You gotta love JSmoove. So much foul trouble, he only plays 19 minutes, yet he still swats 4 shots.

Shelden: 2points, 2boards. Yech. Every time he does this, I see another 30 paragraphs coming from Ando about last year’s draft.

By mavid

February 1, 2007 12:29 AM | Link to this

i literally almost threw up in my mouth when stern announced the hawks picked shelden at 5

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 01:08 AM | Link to this

RAY, i posted the same thing earlier about JS STILL gettin’ 4 blks!!!

i am REALY REALY REALLY hopin’ that WOODSON DOES NOT let the return of SPEEDY comprise the chemistry that’s developin’!! SPEEDY FOR SPOT DUTY ONLY!!!

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 01:08 AM | Link to this

oh yeah, JJ DEFINITELY DESERVES A SPOT!!

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 01:14 AM | Link to this

spell check!!LOL REALLY…. compromise…

By A Thinking Fan

February 1, 2007 07:05 AM | Link to this

Finally a winning month - Go Hawks!

By Willie Coyote

February 1, 2007 07:31 AM | Link to this

Wow, some of you actually read all of Ando’s post.

By Dan

February 1, 2007 08:34 AM | Link to this

Joe Johnson is an All Star. Next topic.

Good win last night. I wish every team the Hawks played valued defense like the Warriors. That team does not defend at all. There will be more defense played at the All Star game, than the Warriors have played all season.

Be nice if the Hawks could win the next 2 games at home (Raptors & Lakers). I don’t know about that NJ game on Sunday. Looks like a loss.

Love the way Josh Smith is playing. When he goes to the basket, he is special.

Speedy, please don’t play on Friday. What is the point? You obviously do not want to be here and you will just be hurt within the next 3 games. Just leave. Please, just leave. I do not want you on the team. You are the worst free agent signing in history.

By A Thinking Fan

February 1, 2007 08:54 AM | Link to this

The Question should be: Does MW run this team? I agree Speedy should not be interjected back into the starting line-up…

By doc

February 1, 2007 08:54 AM | Link to this

ando, timing is everything, interresting post yesterday but about two weeks late. there is some relevant stuff that biff brought up and credible as a realistic look to billy and the team. has bk made mistakes yes, but havent we all. overall he has put together a credible if flawed team as you put it. look only to other teams that have done worse and a very few in as short a time that have done it better. let it all play out and we might have a prety good team if we can get the owner thing dealt with first before these guys become free agents and have to go for some more of those beloved draft picks you speak. who is available in 2009, surely their is an aau player we can follow as he turns 16?

yesterday, i made a post from another site to commend biff and say a bit more and it blew up because i didnt have my tag and email attached and couldnt pull it back. hate it when it happens. it might have kept me from ando’s wrath however.

i did want to gve a lot of credence to biff as he got my respect for his valid data that went beyond the usual rants contained here. thoughful provocative (got a comeback from the brightest of the bunch) and was filled with truth about previous flaws that critically hurt the franchise before we got the new owners. got my respect there biff.

we forget that there are no assurances in the draft. what biff threw out there was appreciated by my mindset of a historian and a scienctist since there was so much hard data there. it goes beyond the usual entrepreneurial mindset of most who speculate with their flawed remembrances of how it really happened, or what could happen if only soemthing was to come from the draft, for example. the draft is the worst place to go to build a team as it is pure conjecture as to how things will fall, one might be heavily criticized for being among the 30 other people that missed the same opportunity all in retrospect.sad to say i missed on microsoft myself among many others even though someone gave me the tip. there have been no monsters to come out and immediatly make a champion since duncan. paul and howard are anomalies and have made impacts but wait to find out if they can bring a championship. the magic thought they were set for years with shaq and penny only to have jordan take it away and not get a sniff since while detroit built a champion from others problems and castoffs.

the fodder of the railing experts here as they demean and defile marvin is amazing. it is way too early and the kid has played less than 100 games but the results are already in. he shows guts in just the fact he came back from a significant injury early, had only one wing healthy playing against the best in the world and ended up reinjuring it to the point he was wearing a supportive glove. a glove mind you, an egg mcmuffin on his hand; to date that is a first as i have yet to see any other player try that. now why would he risk it? me thinks because he looked around at the wounded in the locker room and figured it out that he was the healthiest among the forwards at the time as chills, sheldon and josh were all out and we shot down his stats and talk of a losing streak while he valiantly played on with enthisaism. do you really think a true vet like a rasheed would have put his cohones out there in a situation like that?

again, for all the smart guys who thinks the draft or the first 100 games make a guy then just look to nash as ray alluded to earlier. he went through two organizations before he hit it big time and became the instigator of the second biggest turnaround in the history of the nba. it was second only to duncan who was accompanied by the admiral who had benched himself with a knee injury assuring the spurs of the no. 1 thereby we got a lottery to avoid yeams just tanking it as the celts are wont to do this year by all accounts and speculation as ainge ses it as his only shot to save his job. lucky the suns got nash back and dont you think with all the right moves that cuban has made he cant get over how stupid he must be to have let nash get away for so little. maybe it is just the way bk feels about paul or williams at times but in their place he has a pretty good player in only his second year who can put up big numbers if not spectacular, yet. look to the development curve of the garnett,s, bosh’s, kobe’s and lebron’s before you go overboard with your criticism.

now, let us all enjoy for a moment that this team has won more than it has lost for the first time in almost three years. yes, it has lost four or five it should not have in only the last month and let two get away last month. yes call me againt the pollyana but so far i havent been too far off on a lot of what developments have gone down, just dont want to have to go to las veagas to folow my team. heh heh.

some have even lost their indentities over our plight, as i used to know a guy named astro. lets not worry too much about tomorrow as we just might get by the raptors again to start the next month off right. stay in the moment, peace.

By honest_abe

February 1, 2007 08:56 AM | Link to this

great win last night in front of a hundred fans last night. typical pathetic showing at the highlight factory……..

the hawks looked great against a team that pays absolutely no attention to defense. they were so focused on transitioning and fast breaking on offense the hawks were able to get the shot they wanted pretty much all the time.

biedrins looked slow and unathletic. he didn’t play much d.

the star of last night’s game wasn’t joe. it was j chill. as soon as he entered the game he was contributing on both ends of the court. i noticed just how effective j chill can be in a wide open, free flowing game. he finished a couple of sweet shots on the break….

sheldon looked like crap.

but everyone was hitting from the outside. lue, marv, joe and chills. jsmith barely played in the first half. and i didn’t even know who that richardson kid was. but he’s got a nice stroke.

hawks might not win a game in february but last night’s game was encouraging.

By Bigboi

February 1, 2007 09:45 AM | Link to this

Does anyone know why Salim was deactivated from last night’s game?

By Dee

February 1, 2007 09:50 AM | Link to this

Of course Joe J should make the ALL-STAR team…MANN this guy was able to put up shots when we won, when we lost, when our team were all injuried, when he was doubled teamed, when he was triple team..when he…etc, etc, etc..PICK JOE JOHNSON!!!!

Feb will be a great month for the Hawks b/c 1st of all we are coming off our best month heading into a new month, we have all our players back from injuries, we tend to play better against great teams, and we play/win better on the road…so I’m looking forward to Feb match-ups..GO HAWKS!!

By roan st

February 1, 2007 10:00 AM | Link to this

I’m starting to change my stance a little bit about how great next years draft will be. After the top 5 or 6 players are taken the talent level drops off dramatically and the crap shoot begins. I don’t think there will be a big decline in talent from the 6 or 7 picks to say the 14 or 15 picks. My top six guys are: oden, durant, noah, wright, hawes, horford. There are a couple pretty talented swingmen behind this group but thats not what the hawks need. So if the hawks play pretty decent basketball the rest of the way and end up giving phoneix say the 7-9 pick it want be as devastating as I once opined. Don’t get me wrong it still sucks to lose a good pick in this draft but I don’t think were giving up a hall of famer or possibly even an allstar.

FIRE BILLY KNIGHT

By Anakin Joe

February 1, 2007 10:20 AM | Link to this

This team needs to continue to win. Continue to learn how to put teams away. Continue to learn how to trust each other. Continue to learn how to dig themselves out of deep holes. To learn how to avoid getting into deep holes. Even if only 6-7 of these guys are here long term, those 6-7 can be the nucleus, the core of the team. They can set the tone on and off the court. The notion that teams win based on talent alone is a false one (again, see the Knicks). This league is not entirely about the GM. Its also about coaches and players who truly want to get better individually and as a team. Players make GMs look good, not the other way around. And players do that by getting good coaching and by having the requisite self-determination to get better.

Ando, we don’t need Oden to become a playoff team. Nor do we need Chris Paul. And until we’re a playoff team, nothing else matters. Because you can’t win a title without getting to the playoffs. So let’s get there first and then fine tune from there. What we can’t do is wait to make a playoff push until we have all the pieces in place. No one has ever done that. They make every attempt to succeed with what they have and adjust along the way. You can’t sit out every hand waiting for 4 aces. Or you’ll never be truly in the game.

By Dee

February 1, 2007 11:27 AM | Link to this

I’m not going to blame Sheldon or Solomon for not making the Rookie team..that blame goes to Woodson. How are you going to put up enough boards/blocks/points sitting on the bench. He did Marvin like that his 1st year & Salim, now once again its Sheldon & Solomon. Its not fair how Woodson treat these rookies & 2nd yr players..I understand why Marvin couldnt make it due to his injury but its no excuse why the others didnt get their opportunity…

Of course Millsap would look better than Sheldon b/c he’s in place of Boozer which means more playing time..let Sheldon replace Zaza or Lo and he can produce as well…Sheldon lead all rookies in rebounds & was one of the top in free throws. I felt with the little time he was handed, he should have made it. Also I believe those who choose these rookies are just getting back on BK for his decision-making but they shouldnt take it out or punish these players as a result. They deserve to go!!

By Woodsongay

February 1, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this

Joe is worst than Redd,Carter,Hamilton,sorry no All Star for him, niggaz.

By minor_leagues

February 1, 2007 12:36 PM | Link to this

maybe if the hawks played even 1 freakin game on network tv or even freakin TNT or ESPN for god’s sake, then maybe people would see how good jj is. since the columbus little league baseball team is on network tv more than the hawks, i don’t think anyone knows about jj.

By jj

February 1, 2007 12:47 PM | Link to this

To Woodsongay: first off joe is much much better than rip or redd. all rip hamilton does is shoot midrange jumpers. redd is injured and he travels on every other play. now vince has jason kidd on his team and compare his numbers with joe. now say sumthin b!tch. You probably just think vince is a great player becuz he dunks. well think again.

By tb

February 1, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this

ZZZZZZZZZZZ…ZZZZ

Wake me up when Ando and Doc finish

Hawks Win :)

By HB Ando

February 1, 2007 01:09 PM | Link to this

Doc, you almost matched me, in length and verbosity. Well done, sir. And I’m not really ripping Biff, but I do believe we are clearly perceiving the same glass of water in very different ways.

BTW, Pollyanna called and she wants her perspective back.

Kevin Durant had 37 points and 23 rebounds against Bobby Knight’s team last night. If you folks can’t tell a star when you see one, I don’t know how to help you.

Ray, you put Oden up against Shaq, coming out. But Shaq played for 3 years at LSU. I may have already made that point, but even I don’t have the energy to go back and read everything I wrote.

TB, you may be sleeping for a long, long time, dude……..

By HB Ando

February 1, 2007 01:22 PM | Link to this

Joe, it’s not that I don’t understand what you’re trying to say. But I don’t see a playoff team. So while you can point to our not needing Oden, or Paul, we certainly need something else. And where will we get that? I’m still looking for an answer to that question, given the situation with ownership, and Billy’s seeming inability to put together a balanced roster.

Dee, I don’t think it’s a matter of “letting” Shelden play in front of those guys. He’s simply not as effective, thus, he’s not getting minutes. He’s been given every chance. But now that Marvin is healthy, and the Hawks are predictably playing he and Josh together for starters’ minutes, there no where for Shelden to play. He can’t play center, like Zaza and Wright. This is, of course, what I predicted when we drafted him. As I said at the time, “why draft a PF, and tell us he’s a solution for boards and blocks, when it seems like the franchise has to commit most of the forward minutes to Josh and Marvin, and see if that’s a tandem that they can build around?”. It is exactly as expected. I said Shelden would end up a 10 minute player, based on that very reasoning, and he is. And that, my friend, is the very definition of a poorly thought out draft selection.

Mavid, kudos to you for calling for Roy and Millsap. I wish you had invaded Billy’s head during the draft, and we’d all be sitting here calling him a genius for your good work.

Joe, nice poker reference. I guess my response would be that I’m pretty tired of Billy going all-in with the Hawks’ future, playing 2-7, off-suit, which is what drafting Shelden was. Childress was more like calling a 10X pre-flop raise with low suited connectors; unnecessarily risky, given that the Hawks were already pretty short-stacked. Taking Marvin was a little better, calling several raisers with a mid-pocket pair, hoping you get lucky and catch a set. So far, blanks. Paul would have been pocket queens. If you ever want to get a little “bloggers” cash game together, I’m in.

I like poker.

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 01:26 PM | Link to this

ANDO, LOL. you killin’ me man!!

By Gutz

February 1, 2007 01:30 PM | Link to this

Ando you can’t keep saying Chilldress was a bad pick with the way he is playing since coming back from his BROKEN FOOT!! Did you see his stat line last night 23pts, 9rb, 7ast. and 2stls! Deng and Iggy are not that much better if at all so quit harping on this pick. Chilldress is a VERY good player with a high basketball IQ unlike IGgy and Deng who you have a mancrush on. They are all 3 very good players but honestly I would take Chill over any of them.

By doc

February 1, 2007 01:31 PM | Link to this

ando you are always refreshing to me even if you may say the same thing over and over. nothing but respect my friend as you know and many of the comments are with an eye to your many strengths. glad to see you contributing. maybe the hawks can win a few more to keep the debate a little more even. now, which perspective does pollyanna want, the rose colored glasses or the retrospectoscope you have worn out through the years. by the way how much do they cost?

interesting but sad stat i saw on si.com as they highlighted the accomplishment of the winning month for the hawks: it has been 58 months since the hawks won more gmes than they did this past month. yes 58, as there were 9 wins in march of 2002. frightening but really points out that this started long before bk, woody or even the spirit got here. they just helped it along as they got rid of the contracts and concentrated on the draft to rebuild.

durant may be the next coming of carmelo?

ando, we have finally found out how to enjoy tb’s company! do you really think he was ever awake?

as my friend h a says; heh heh, heh heh.

now speaking of sleeping dogs, where is flash? do i have to degrade his beano brother to get him to enjoy the month?

again biff good stuff.

By honest_abe

February 1, 2007 01:38 PM | Link to this

the poker analogy was way off. corrections.

the sheldon pick was like having a very good hand such as two pair. but not playing it very well. in the end the hawks still win a small pot. but bk could’ve maximized the pot by not showing his hand…

childress is actually like a mid pocket pair in that you know what you were going to get. how is he risky. great character. good fundamental skills. did great both on and off the court at stanford. so maybe bk with that high of a pick should have played his hand a little stronger….but in the end the hawks didn’t lose that hand either. got a good player.

as for j.smith. there is your suited connector. chance for absolutely nothing. but the potential for a big hit. so far it looks to be the latter.

marv. was like holding high pockets. everyone said he was a sure thing. most experts had him rated as either the best or 2nd best player in that year’s draft. unfortuately kings just like any other hand can get busted. and so far a few people have out drawn on us. but the good news is, we still have the river left. let’s wait to see what that last card brings…

bloggers poker.. what an idea. u guys want to lose some money?

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 01:51 PM | Link to this

man, does JRICHARDSON have a sweet stroke or what??? you gotta sign him for the remainder of the year for his shot alone!! makes my SALIM+a player+a player to get a REAL BIG more likely. question…who would we have to trade along with SALIM to get DOLEAC?? i think goin’ after a big like him is certainly more of a reality than thinkin’ we’ll end up in the ODEN ping pong sweepstakes!!! and SALIM’s 2 yrs of frustration in ATL gets rewarded by goin’ to MIA and SOUTH BEACH!!!

By Anakin Joe

February 1, 2007 02:26 PM | Link to this

Sekou, you asked a few days ago how we can cheer for a perennial loser. Well a good month like January will carry many of us for another 57 months (but not 58, Doc).

Ando, the draft is our only option given the financial constraints. And of course, that’s likely a losing hand as it requires that BK make the right pick. And when you factor that most young bigs take years to develop (see Curry, Chandler, Kwame and Dalembert), there is little that is hopeful about drafting a big. We both agree that ultimately one of the 3 wing players (Smith, Marvin, Childress) needs to be traded. Likewise, Zaza would likely be a very good trade asset as he has a great contract and his value against that contract is tremendous. Throw in someone like Salim who has recognized value in the Vinny Johnson mood, and we have at least 3 tradeable pieces. (This assumes we keep Lue who is obviously a top notch back-up PG with big game experience and demonstrated leadership skills). Obviously, those guys won’t get us Biedrins or Livingston. But we just need an upgrade, not neccessarily the final answer.

The problem will be to trade guys on rookie contracts for an upgrade without spending more money. That is why “fixing this mess” is virtually impossible. GMs don’t typically trade a better player for a lesser one when both make comparable salaries. (Unless, of course, it is for a position of need). That is why I have historically focused my venom on the coaching staff (and owners). Because if you can only play the hand your dealt, then you better know how to play it really well. And in most games, I still believe that Woody stands pat while holding 13 (oops, wrong card game).

By HB Ando

February 1, 2007 02:31 PM | Link to this

Man, anybody else seen the numbers Calderon is putting up while TJ Ford is out? It’s a damn shame that Toronto’s back up is better than any PG we have, and it’s not even close. I know he’s someone we discussed last year as a player we could use. When his contract is up, he’s going to get some very strong offers. Dude can dish…

Doc, can we use the retrospectoscope to help some folks pull their heads out of their asses? Heh heh.

Gutz, mancrush….That’s good. It less about the “crush”, and more about my “manhate” for Billy. OK. I hope nobody misses this, but I hereby admit that Childress is to be fairly judged as a peer to both Deng and Igoudala. I still would have, at the time of the draft, and all times sense, taken either of them over Childress. But the dude is a really solid player. And his continuing emergence as such really gives us some flexibility should we decide, at some point, that we have to move one of our stud 3’s, Marvin or Josh, to acquire a legitimate big man.

How about the numbers Nick Collison is putting up in Seattle?! Over the last ten games he averaging 18 points and 12+ boards. He’s finally healthy and living up to his potential. How about Marvin and Salim for Ridnour and Collison (Has someone else already suggested that one? If so, didn’t mean to steal)?

Abe, do all Koreans play no-limit, and do all of them think they are great? I play with quite a few. Maybe we have met.

By honest_abe

February 1, 2007 02:43 PM | Link to this

lol i doubt in ando. don’t frequent too many p. houses. but i know most of the guys that do. the korean community is a small world. as for thinking i’m great. what’s the point in playing unless u think ur the best? i sure as heck don’t play to fund other people’s activities…heh

and yes we mostly play no limit. but i’m down to play any kind of poker. i don’t discriminate!

last thing i looked up that ridnour/collison trade for salim/marv trade a few weeks back on espn. money doesn’t work.

By Dee

February 1, 2007 03:00 PM | Link to this

I love the team we have..we finally have just about all our “important” players back from injuries. I dont want to see them go. We are really jelling right now so I think we should just be patient and see if we get our protected pick..if not, how cares!! I’m sure we can get a decent pg or big later down the line but I believe we will be O-KAY for now..granted if we continue to have EVERYONE scoring the way we have lately.

By mykhalc

February 1, 2007 03:22 PM | Link to this

i just checked the numbers and WRIGHT for DOLEAC could be done pretty much straight up. if we could agree to a 2yr extension before the trade, then we get to upgrade the 5 and still allow ZAZA time to develop as the backup while WRIGHT gives MIA whatever thru ‘08. they are the same age too, well close anyway.

and fellas, i’m not for tradin’ JS, JC, or MW!! at least, not yet!! these cats deserve another 2 yrs together, IMHO!! but for sure, one more year. they are JUST beginnin’ to show some consistency. they REALLY deserve a LONG HARD LOOK!!! and i think we can upgrade the 5 without havin’ to move anyone just yet!! make it happen BK, damn it!!!!

By HB Ando

February 1, 2007 04:20 PM | Link to this

Joe, that’s exactly what I’m trying to say. We’re genuinely between a rock and a hard place. I also agree that there are no quick fixes in the draft. I just don’t believe there are any likely fixes, given the limitations of the franchise/ownership.

I also agree that the appropriate time to trade one of our young forwards, should that become necessary, would be after a bigger contract is signed. Though our position under the cap does allow us some flexibility in bringing in someone with a bigger contract than the exiting player.

I guess I’m just trying to validate that, realistically, we’re in a pretty bad spot, with the only light I see being that Joe is an all-star, and Smith and Childress, and, too a lesser extent at this time, Marvin, are all showing that they can play in the league. But they’re all swingmen, so something will have to give, sooner or later.

How about sending Lue and our early second rounder, to Miami, who with Williams seemingly unhealthy, or at least unreliable, and Payton being 53 years old, really need to upgrade the point if they are to make a run back into the playoffs, for Miami’s first rounder. It would probably move us up 15 slots, and we’re not going anywhere with Lue (might even cost us a couple of all-important wins, where losses are still in our best interest this season).

But Joe, unless I’m missing something, you and I actually see this the same way, with the only difference being that you can’t fathom that we still may need 2-3 years to build a legitimate roster, and I think it’s almost inevitable, given all the relevant factors.

By Ken Strickland

February 1, 2007 09:51 PM | Link to this

Greetings fellows. Can anyone tell me if there is any certainty Durant and/or Ogden will turn pro after this yr?