Hawks

By Spud Webb

November 14, 2006 04:14 PM | Link to this

No one involved has a problem with it, neither should you.

By Dontspankyourkids

November 14, 2006 04:18 PM | Link to this

Knights actions were fine. Everybody is so damn sensitive these days. Trying to fine controversy where there is none. I bet Coach K, Kelvin Sampson, Lute Olsen, and Paul Hewitt have all done something similar in practice. And to a lot of players, coaches ARE father figures and need parental-like discipline from them.

By Gutz

November 14, 2006 04:27 PM | Link to this

Because of his past his every move is watched through a microscope. The player he touched even said it was no big deal including his parents too. All he did was push the kids chin up when he was trying to talk to him. I think any coach would do that when trying to explain something to a player about what they did wrong on the court. This is already getting blown way out of proportion!

By JMar

November 14, 2006 04:27 PM | Link to this

As far as Knights go, I condone Bobby’s action far more than I condone Billy’s.

By newkid

November 14, 2006 04:32 PM | Link to this

WOW, a Bob Knight thread. Must be time for college basketball. Heels open season tonight after scoring 140 points in Saturday exhibition game. Who cares about Bob Knight.

Go Heels!! Go Hawks!!

By Astro Joe

November 14, 2006 04:35 PM | Link to this

Oh, that Knight. I thought Billy was planning a covert attack on our boy Ando and you were trying to pre-empt the carnage.

I think when parents send their sons to Coach Bobby, they know precisely what they are doing and have eyes wide open to what he is all about. Ultimately, when his act prevents him from recruiting top talent, then he will face the music. Until then, actions like these will be swept in the “he’s just being Bobby” file.

Zaza vs. Bogut is one of the least discussed match-ups that should be fun tonight. Not exactly Hakeem vs. The Admiral in terms of athletic prowess, but they both get the job done in their respective ways.

By gary

November 14, 2006 04:44 PM | Link to this

Have you already run out of things to write about the Hawks? BRILLIANT!!!!!

By im going to see panic for NYE

November 14, 2006 04:53 PM | Link to this

SEKOU MY MAN

dont write this crap! ive been bragging about you since the season started as being the sole reason i visit these damn blogs but this has nothing to do with the hawks and basketball is a MANS game. not being sexist but even 95% of the ugas girls team could beat my a* but players are suppose to grow up and become men in college not babies a little slap in the face is just fine.

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK FOR THE HAWKS AND LEAVE THE Bull S H I T for the other ajc writers to b*** and moan about

i still love you bro

By vdunkndunk

November 14, 2006 04:59 PM | Link to this

What makes Bob Knight, or anyone else, think that being a basketball coach gives you the right to choke or punch other people?

I’ve talked to Neil Reed about Bob Knight, and I’m convinced that he shouldn’t be allowed to coach kids under any circumstances.

He’s demonstrated time and time again that he can’t control himself, and for whatever reason, people are willing to cover up and make excuses for him.

But that doesn’t make it right. Winning doesn’t make it right. Graduation rates don’t make it right. The fact that sometimes he’s a charming and charasmatic person doesn’t make it right.

Ultimately, Knight is an embarrasment to any institution that keeps him around, because nothing excuses the physical and verbal abuse of your players.

By John D.

November 14, 2006 05:03 PM | Link to this

I wish I had the opportunity to play for Bobby Knight and if I had a son with the ability and opportunity I would send him to play for Coach Knight. I had much less capable coaches in college in my face, saying things just as profane without the positive life lessons.

How many of coach Knight’s players have been involved in unsavory conduct in the NBA? None come to mind. I have posted here more than once in opposition to the language at the NBA games and my position has not changed but I also know what happens at practice and in the locker rooms of college and NBA games.

Always make sincere apologies and look someone in the eye when they talk to you. At least we know Coach Knight adheres to the latter.

If the Texas Tech administration, the player and the player’s parents are unconcerned, then why should we be concerned.

By vdunkndunk

November 14, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this

John D.,

Hate to tell you this, but Indiana WAS concerened about Knight’s behavior.

He was a living legend there, but eventually they had seen enough and they sent him packing.

So my question to you is this: if Indiana WAS concerned, why SHOULDN’T we be concerened?

By shock

November 14, 2006 05:22 PM | Link to this

Wow Sekou…..

Not a good blog. You’ve been a great beat writer so far for our Hawks, but this is way off. I’m not sure if your just trying to stir the pot or not, but leave your opinions of college basketball by the wayside and out of a Hawks forum. Other than this blemish, your a fantastic writer.

By G-Money

November 14, 2006 05:34 PM | Link to this

I have to agree with the other blogger who wanted to leave Bobby Knight alone as a blogging topic. Nonetheless, I had coaches snatch me by the helmet, kick me in the butt on the football field. But that was a bygone era and even then those kind of things were rarely done. It’s a new day. There isn’t a place for that kind of thing in basketball. Hey for those of you who want to send your kids to be coached by Bobby Knight, go ahead. Me personally would rather see them going to another school. Maybe my kid would just have to play D-II if Knight were the only option.

But my preference is to talk about the Hawks and the other B. Knight.

By the way, I also thought about the ZaZa-Bogut match up as being something pretty interesting. Hope they can pull this one off.

By JMar

November 14, 2006 05:35 PM | Link to this

“How many of coach Knight’s players have been involved in unsavory conduct in the NBA?”

Does the play of Alan Henderson count?

By fitzi

November 14, 2006 05:42 PM | Link to this

I guess that you’re right. He should be taken out and severely repremanded with a stern warning. I mean really what he should have done when the player came off the court all dejected was comfort him and later upon reflection written a stern letter followed up by grounding him.

Come on,,, I guess this is right up there with spanking your child. All the fur seal protesters must be absolutely besides themselves with outrage!

By honest_abe

November 14, 2006 05:44 PM | Link to this

ah don’t listen to any of these numbskulls sekou… write about whatever you want… there’s only so many ways you can break down how practice went, or how marvin’s finger is progressing or what the team ate today…LOL.

having said that… i don’t think coach knight did anything wrong. maybe it’s because i’m from a korean background and in korean society… teachers still hits kids that misbehave… i’m not condoning hitting kids… but i think when you send off your kids to play basketball for someone… that man/coach becomes somewhat of a father figure. coach knight comes from a military background and sometimes in the heat of the moment he might have a “different” way of getting his point across… but the man has a history of graduating his players… most (MOST) of his former players still love and have the ultimate respect for the man… now if they still love the guy… it’s irrelevant what we as outsiders think… i dont’ think coach knight was trying to hurt the kid.. he was trying to encourage him… society has gotten too sensitive on issues such as harassment, abuse etc.. some of these cases are warranted.. and should be rectified… but a lot of these instances are blown way out of proportion and i think last nights incident falls into that category.

ss can i get a little piece on what side of the bed j-smith like to wake up on?

By CLM

November 14, 2006 05:49 PM | Link to this

The uproar over this “non-issue” is another example of a growing attempt by certain levels of society to transform our youth into helpless wusses. If we keep this up, future generations will be scared to walk outside in the rain. The player had no problem with what Knight did. His parents, sitting across from the bench, had no problem with it. So why does the liberal, panty-wearing media want to make a deal of it? Grow a few more layers of skin, people.

By vdunkndunk

November 14, 2006 05:54 PM | Link to this

Knight got fired from Indiana for twisting a STUDENT’S arm on campus. Why did he do it? Because the student said, “Hey Knight” instead of “Coach Knight” or “Mister Knight.”

So what is the great teacher really teaching here?

Let’s take a look at a couple of Knight’s favorite lessons: If people don’t look you in the eye, give them a nice shot to the chin. If student’s don’t address you properly, twist their arm until they learn their lesson. It’s OK to choke someone as long as you’re trying to get a point across.

Defend him if you want, but he’s a disgrace.

By Tyger

November 14, 2006 06:00 PM | Link to this

If Bobby Knight were black, he wouldve been fired, sued and run out of coaching 20 years ago. Sekou makes an excellent point, if a player, let’s say (Sprewell) hits back, then what??

Bobby Knight suffers from the same psychosis as Terrell Owens, they simply need attention and if they have to create controversy to get it, then so be it. Now, let’s all sit back and watch Coach Bobby blame everyone but himself.

By Ryder

November 14, 2006 06:15 PM | Link to this

tyger, are you sure you’re not terence moore? that actually is a very good point. of course if he was black then he’d be ran out of town.

sekou, great work. I mean, what else is there to discuss about the hawks/bucks? other than the matchup of JJ vs. Redd, or will JSmoove continue to resurrect the spirit of Antoine Walker with his penchant for 3’s? or how about that duel of the titans in the paint between Bogut & Zaza? or how about an Atlanta team that should learn from Sat. night and get this victory?

By THL

November 14, 2006 06:25 PM | Link to this

Parents do need to “touch” their kids more; but that’s more so the police won’t have to “touch” them. I don’t care about Bobby that much. If he touches a kid inappropriately and they hit him back then good for them. If the kid says it wasn’t a big deal then…well I don’t care either way. I think it would be interesting to compare the reactions that the “talking heads” would have if someone who isn’t Bobby Knight did the same things he did.

By Wedgie Evans

November 14, 2006 06:26 PM | Link to this

Yeah, I thought this was about Billy Knight too.

Compared to Bobby Knight’s past actions, what he did yesterday was nothing. He was yelling at a player and the player decided not to make eye contact with him so he gave him a little tap to make him pay attention. No big deal.

By Darrin "The Vent King"

November 14, 2006 06:49 PM | Link to this

I must admit, I am actually kind of crossed on this one. I actually can kind of see both sides of this arguement. I disagree with the notion that if this was some other coach it wouldn’t be a big deal. It probably would be such a big deal on the NEWS, but just because the WHOLE world doesn’t know about it, doesn’t mean it’s not a big deal. Some of those same people who say it wouldn’t be a great deal would probably jack up or at least have words with whatever Jo Schmo coach did that to their kid. At the same time, the others who wouldn’t are by products of a society that has become desensitised to things like this and I don’t mean that in a bad way. With things like the Iraq war, N. Korea, the economy, and terroists going on, it’s kind of hard to put any emphasis on this unless you were actually involved. Like “Spud Webb” said, “no one involved has a problem with it, neither should you.” So, to me there are obviously better ways to coach kids than banging them in the chin, but just because you like chittlings and I don’t, doesn’t mean something is wrong with you. If that’s okay with the kid and his parents, let’s move on. It’s the media that won’t let us because they make their living feeding us stuff like this. As long as it’s not my kid, cool. I still think Knight should find better ways to coach because I don’t care how good a guy he may be to those that truly know (and I, for the record are not one of those people)him, striking people in the face is against the law- PERIOD. No one, even if they have the highest graduation rate, invented the wheel, sold ten million records last year, cured cancer, or broke the homerun record last year is above the law. But, if the law up there doesn’t feel that is the case (I could be wrong) and the parents and the kid have accepted it, the rest of should, because their are alot of other things to worry about.

By mike

November 14, 2006 07:13 PM | Link to this

You never see Knight recruiting kids out of prison who are 6’9” and can jack a three like some college coaches. If the kid doesnt have a problem with it, his parents dont have a problem then let it go. Jump on Urban Myer for resinstating the convicted felon right before the Tennessee game.

By Frankie the Hat

November 14, 2006 07:37 PM | Link to this

The thing that bothers me about the slap is a) it is such a bully move — it’s not designed to hurt, it’s designed to intimidate, which Knight is so good at and b) how the student and his parents are trying to play it off as Knight simply pushing his chin up. That is such obvious BS to anyone that’s watched the tape. It is so pathetic to see people continue to make excuses for Knight’s boorish behavior. There are MANY examples of great college basketball coaches who have still conducted themselves as perfect gentlemen (Coach K, Lute Olsen, Jim Calhoun), so why why why do people keep sticking up for Bobby Knight when he has acted inappropriately, by ANY standards, time and time again?

By vdunkndunk

November 14, 2006 08:15 PM | Link to this

I agree, Frankie. The AD for Texas Tech can say whatever he wants about Knight lifting up the kids chin, but we all saw it…and you don’t “lift” someone’s chin with a closed fist.

Knight has choked Neil Reed, punched a kid in the chin, twisted a student’s arm on campus, headbutted his own player, kicked his own son, pushed an opposing player into a trashcan, and pushed a reporter into the bushes…and all this stuff is documented. And who knows what other stuff he’s done behind closed doors.

To me that’s just a lack of self control and a lack of class. I liked to see what he would do if one of his players gave him a taste of his own medicine.

By Amistad

November 14, 2006 08:21 PM | Link to this

Ahh, the “overseer” mentality has returned.

What do you call a guy who constantly at odds with those whom he knows have no real power to retaliate?

I call him a coward. If that’s my kid then they’d be asking me eventually what I want for my last meal.

You can’t hit anyone like that in the Military Academies. As far as Keady goes who the hell is he to tell people how to raise their children?

If you hit enough people you’ll find one who hits back….and hard!

By Robert Yates

November 14, 2006 08:35 PM | Link to this

The time I spent at Parris Island in USMC basic training taught me one thing. You absolutly do not, under any circumstances, have to hit someone to intimidate them physically or mentally. Knight’s actions display his cowardice. He doesn’t have to use the methods he does in order to instill discipline. I had 5’7” drill instructers that used to scare me to death with one thing defined by the Marine Corps as: Command Presence

By Chris

November 14, 2006 08:43 PM | Link to this

Mike,

You are correct Knight does not recruit kids out of prison for good reason. If he did, he would have gotten his throat slit along time ago. I think he recruits kids that won’t hit back out of the need for self preservation.

By Chris

November 14, 2006 08:45 PM | Link to this

I heard different reports and I wasn’t sure until I saw the tape. For his actions Mr Knight needs to be immediately sanctioned by the NCAA. If they don’t they are authorizing the use of force in American Universities when ever anyone sees fit. It is a bit odd to me how Bob Knight always seems to be the only coach in college that has these assault issues. Calbert Cheney put a goon in to hurt players on the other team he was suspended. Bob Knight is a punk and he needs to be held responsible for his actions. Next time you watch the tape, take a look at the look on the assistant coaches face. He is totally disgusted by Knight’s actions. He looks up and he can’t believe it. That was a smack to the face, not a nudge and there is absolutely no excuse for it.

By ƒüçking Knight again

November 14, 2006 09:50 PM | Link to this

Doesn’t anyone have the balls to stand up to this bully?

By Samuel

November 14, 2006 09:52 PM | Link to this

If i’m not mistaken,

Some guy on this blog was going on and on about cussin at ball games. I hope this same guy is calling Bobby Knight what he is, a straight up thug who prays on the weak. Like somebody here said, Knight is over the hill and can no longer recruit because he is mentally ill.

Somebody else here said that none of his NBA players get into any trouble. What NBA players

By michael m.

November 14, 2006 10:14 PM | Link to this

give woodsen credit for taking a tech for the team when they needed it most. but why does it take something like that to get our team motivated to bring their A game on defense, which then allows them to get out in transition for some easy buckets. we went from 10 down to up 10 in the mid 3rd to early 4th period. these guys can be maddening in their inconsistency.

can’t wait for marvin to get back so that josh smith can get pulled when he insists on ticky tack fouls and launching contested 3 pointers. he never seems to learn and has the attention span of my dog.

lue and childress really brought it, i give them credit. but this team needs to learn how to finish. they lack a killer instinct. if they’re not gonna bring the hustle full bore, they are going to keep losing. they’re not good enough to play so lax. their first half effort was atrocious.

By Wedgie Evans

November 14, 2006 10:26 PM | Link to this

Today’s game reminded me of last year’s Hawks. Lue, Johnson and Childress were great, but the defense was terrible in the first half, the Hawks came out flat with no energy, Zaza Pachulia was outplayed by Bogut on both sides of the floor and Josh Smith played like a rookie playing his first game. I wasn’t a huge fan of Woodson’s coaching down the stretch either, after we went up 90-82 we should have been able to put the Bucks away. Instead we let them back in, and in the final minute Woodson’s play-calls coming out of the timeouts were pretty ineffective. Hopefully they bounce back next game.

By GuyFromUruguay

November 14, 2006 10:27 PM | Link to this

Does no-one want to talk about the game? The Hawks seem to have rallied after being down in the 3rd, but still fell short.

I couldn’t watch it… I just tuned Bobcats vs Hornets and saw Tyson Chandler having his teeth taken out by an elbow from Sean May… ouch. I had Morrison penned as my ROY candidate but he hasn’t been playing like I expected.

Speaking of which, Shelden seemed to be doing well, why did Lorenzen play that many minutes?

By mavid

November 14, 2006 10:39 PM | Link to this

we didnt play great, but we shouldve won that game…

as much as i love joe, that foul at the end was a costly mistake… no reason to let yourself foul redd at that point

By Clyde

November 14, 2006 10:41 PM | Link to this

What nobody wants to talk the game? Where you at Ken Strickland? I posted when we were winning so you gotta post when we are losing.

All I know it seems to me when JChill scores 20 or more we lose.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By vdunkndunk

November 14, 2006 10:43 PM | Link to this

I don’t want to talk about the game because the game made me sick. Neither team played well, but the refs handed this game to the Bucks.

What was up with all the phantom traveling calls against us…and then Redd takes about 7 steps and they don’t call anything…except another phantom travel on Zaza, and then a T on Woody for complaining. That kind of stuff is disgusting.

And then you have all the and-1’s for Redd when there was almost no contact…especially on that last play. JJ played PERFECT defense, and the refs decided to just decided they didn’t want to wait around for OT and gave the game to the Bucks. Sickening.

It’s hard enough to battle other NBA teams every night…it’s almost impossible to take on the refs as well.

On a positive note, though, Shelden grabbed 15 boards and Chill looked incredible. We need Speedy and Marvin back, because although Bozeman’s been OK, I’m ready to see nothing but Speedy, Lue, JJ, Chill, Marvin, Smoove, Shelden, Lorenzon, and Zaza.

By G

November 15, 2006 12:11 AM | Link to this

It was definitely a frustrating game.

I’m a season ticket holder and get to watch a lot of these games live and I think it’s obvious that Woodson is not very good at handling personnel. This is especially obvious in how he makes (or more appropriately = doesn’t make) in-game adjustments to what is actually happening on the floor. His use of players is similarly confusing to Billy Knight’s inconsistency in drating players.

Salim, of course, is a good example. If Knight likes guys at each position with extra length, why draft a short shooting guard? Why does Woodson leave him on the bench for almost all of the first 6 games but suddenly insert him for spot work? What next - will he start? If I were Salim, I’d be confused. What’s our plan for him? It’s similar to Diaw - we drafted a guy and had no plan.

His numbers won’t show it, but when Salim came in we went up by 10. He drew a couple of fouls and had a turnover but things flowed nicely. We took him out…we got cold…Woodson made no personnel adjustments…we lose.

Woodson has to realize he doesn’t have the same players that he had in Detroit. He needs to adjust and strategize based on what he actually has.

Another general example is how Woodson will strangely have starters such as Johnson on the bench in the final minutes of the first half when they should be out there closing the quarter. They have halftime to rest for the 3rd and 4th! This is just common sense, simple stuff.

I’m glad we are doing well. I don’t think Knight is terrible but he’s not great. Woodson is similar. I hope he proves me wrong.

Just thought I’d vent. Hopefully one or two will read this. I simply want the Hawks to maximize their talent.

By Justine Gray

November 15, 2006 12:56 AM | Link to this

Thanks for FINALLY saying what needed to be said about “Bully” Knight. If this sort of psychopathic behavior is accepted in College athletics, then where will it end? The concept of “sportsmanship” will be replaced at all levels (even Little League) with “winning is the only thing” no matter sadistically achieved. Knight has been a disgrace for years. He belongs in a straitjacket, not in the colors of a so-called “institution of higher learning.”

By RAMON

November 15, 2006 02:19 AM | Link to this

How come people think it is acceptable for Knight to do things like this without punishment, yet if your boss came to your desk and popped you on your chin ‘Bobby’ style, you’d be in your lawyers office fifteen minutes later or making a statement to why you shoved the stapler up his a**??? If your boss cant do it, what gives Knight the right to. He makes over 2 million a year when you include tv show, radio and endorsements, yet he cant control this. People get mad when Stephen Jackson shoots after being ran over by a CAR, but General Patton my bad i mean Bobby Knight can do whatever he wants. And to whomever said about Knight not having NBA players in the news, b/c he hasnt had an NBA player SINCE Calbert Cheaney (who no one really knows played in the NBA except for when they run across his card in an Upper Deck pack). Knight has put about as many players in the NBA as a torn ACL. He’s a great teacher when his hands are in his pockets, wait my bad cant say that b/c he has a deadly headbutt. Everyone says he has a high graduation rate, but never considered the fact its b/c he never have the type of talent that could possibly skip out and goto the NBA without waiting. If the kid would’ve hit Knight back on the chin, everyone would’ve cried Sprewell. I’m a black young man in middle Georgia, so where I’m from ANYTIME I put my hands on ANYONE’S chin in an intimidating matter, there’s a charge soon to follow. So forgive me if I dont see why he can’t AT LEAST

By RAMON

November 15, 2006 02:19 AM | Link to this

sit out 4 games.

By Jay

November 15, 2006 02:28 AM | Link to this

Stick to writing about the Hawks and the nba, not some two-bit school out west and their past-his-prime coach.

By tb

November 15, 2006 06:08 AM | Link to this

Noone has the right to impose their will or desires on another person. We live in a society of rationalizations though and since Bobby K is empowered by a University and the NCAA to coach, he thinks he can cross the line. There is never a line. it is just wrong. The only place where that is acceptable is the military and even there we are simply not yet evolved enough to stop living the rationalisations and just do what is right.

By smitty

November 15, 2006 08:27 AM | Link to this

If I ever had the skill/height to play division 1, I would have killed to play for knight…he is one of the absolute masters of the game…..think of it compared to training with the navy seals or the army rangers….ain’t very tough then now is it? A simple push in the chest or a chin flip????? SO WHAT!!!! If you can’t take that maybe you should take up knitting. Believe it or not Div 1 BB is a contact sport! It ain’t for sissies. Knight has never and would never hurt one of his players…..well maybe their feelings. Knight knows how to play the game and he gets the most out of boys as they become men….hey and I am a 50 yr old Purdue fan….thats gotta say something coming from me.

By brewerfaninATL

November 15, 2006 08:34 AM | Link to this

Yeah, the refs handed the Bucks the game…riiiiiiiiiight! The Bucks are such a powerhouse chock-full of superstars that they can intimidate refs enough to “steal” a win…come on, please! The Bucks won fair and square, but barely…just live with it and move on, focus on your next opponent. I’m sure you think the Sonics were handed that game against you by the refs too, right? Quit making tired, old excuses, you’re improving and going through growing pains, you’re going to win some gut-wrenching games and lose some heartbreakers as well, that’s what happens when you’re a young team. GO BUCKS!

By get your facts

November 15, 2006 09:04 AM | Link to this

Hey Mike, first of all if you are a Tennessee fan you need to look at that parole program and shut up. The kid at Florida was not a convicted felon as you incorrectly stated, as he never was arrested. He violated another rule that was not for drug use and Meyer kicked the kid off the team. You need to get your facts right and quit spouting off about something that you don’t have the facts on.

By doc

November 15, 2006 09:05 AM | Link to this

first of all want to say that i had a great time at the phillips arena watching the hawks last night. ando was on his game ananlytically and a huge fan last night. a lot of insight and someone who makes the gaame and atmosphere better.

very pleased to be included to go and sit in the seats that jhan has picked out. they are unbelieveable. we were so close to the action that we were closer to the basket than josh smith was for most of the offensive posessions in the second half. yes that says a lot about josh’s game last night, there was no movement, no effort and my son could have rented him his sleeping bag the way he camped outside the 3 point line and just waited for the ball to come to him rather than work to get others shots or make him available for something other than a long shot uncontested. the reason he is soooo open is because when he is out there the other team realizes that it is a one man advantage close to the basket, fewer defenders to cover and he is out of position to make any play after he shoots because he is so far away from the basket. even some of his defensive stops were after poor shot selection by him or mistakes. not impressed, bad game but when i can say i had more movement from where i was and was closer to the basket i can honestly say he worries me.

sheldon on the other hand shows the fundamentals that will make him a great teammate not necesarily a star inthe league. he moved without the ball,went to the basket, boxed out and set some mean picks which guys like lue and salim need to make there plays and survive, even jj will come to love him.

lo and sheldon worked well and the second team almost won this one. we didnt know the reason but villinueva presented some major matchup probsa and his not being there at the end made it close, ando’s assessment and agree wholehaertedly.

couldnt believe who ando was singing the prises over, even made sekou smile. got to mmet our fearless leader and what a great smile but if it turns to a frown i can imagine why he doesnt get on the airplane. samuel with his bad boy act your cuz doesnt get on my plane. heh heh

bobby knight exists because of cronyism and enabelers. it is their problem not mine. he is just doing what we know he does all the time at practice, the kid signed up for it and is okay with it. unfortunately, if knight doesnt get out soon he will do it to the wrong person or hurt some one or himself. the problem is he really is out of control when he does it and it is reflexive.

By redwhiteandbruised

November 15, 2006 09:49 AM | Link to this

I’m not sure what’s worse here. The continual unabaited abuse of a psychotic mad man that would land any other person in jail or the parents and kids who choose to put themselves in a position to have to put up with this a$$. If you make a decision to put yourself or your kid in that position knowing what’s in store then it’s your own fault and you shouldn’t complain when it happens. Which obviously, it will and as history shows,will continue. Any program that hires him or any player that chooses to play for him know in advance what they may have to deal with. I firmly believe however that he will be his own worst enemy, I just hope others around him don’t have to pay when his eventual implosion occurs….one other thought, I wonder how HE would react if someone “touched” his face or grabbed his throat???

By JB

November 15, 2006 09:57 AM | Link to this

Have to issue an unequivocal “maybe” to Sekou’s issue. The “chin up” gesture (which I admit I haven’t even seen replays of) probably wouldn’t have meant so much if it had been another coach. I wouldn’t do it, because those are boundaries I prefer not to cross.

This particular incident doesn’t upset me, though—because the guy is a college student, not a peewee or junior high kid. It just tells me Knight has not changed, which we all knew anyway.

I do agree with those who’ve said that Knight’s act carries its own punishment in that it hurts recruiting. It also helps select a certain kind of recruit—one whose parents have drilled into him a submissiveness to authority that may help him execute fundamentals better, but doesn’t serve him as well when it comes to self-motivation, creativity or just knowing himself. In other words, it’s bad for basketball and bad for life. And it’s buyer beware.

Of interest to me is the observation that our management is heavy on Bobby Knight proteges. How much of that mindset—“discipline is its own reward”—has crept into Woodson’s style or Knight’s style? Or if they don’t have that approach, do they have any comment, Sekou, on Knight’s latest antics?

By honest_abe

November 15, 2006 10:21 AM | Link to this

disheartening loss… but i was impressed the way the hawks rebounded after that flat start..

jsmith is going to be up and down this year.. i think what everyone is failing to realize is.. he has very little confidence in his handles so he seems to try to set his drive up with the outside shot… as long as he’s hitting from the outside… he can then pump fake and that allows him to drive more effectively… but as long as he can’t hit from the outside he’s a liability on the offensive end.. as it seems to take away from all the other positive things he can do..

jchills is slowly maturing into a damn effective player..

sheldon reminds me more and more of hendu.. haha don’t know if that’s such a great thing…but i guess it’s not bad as hendu was a pretty effective rebounder and defender in his hay day … but the similarities such as 100 pump fakes underneath the basket …solid rebounder and limited offensive skills..are scary!

the return of speedy should definitely help the hawks.. as they had alot of problems getting into any kind of offensive sets early.. and looked like a bunch of confused playground kids…

By Astro Joe

November 15, 2006 10:25 AM | Link to this

I missed all but the last 5 minutes of the game. The box score suggests we settled for jumpers and the Bucks took it to the hole aggressively and got to the free throw line. Interesting that Redd drove on his game-winning shot while JJ ended up settling for a contested jumper. Probably summed up the entire game.

I think I have a new forecast for young Mr. Smith. I used to put him somewhere in the Darius Miles - AK 47 range. Now I’m thinking about another player. Someone who has a ‘tweener and never quite found his role early in his career. A guy with great skills and instincts but a guy who never nurtured his talents into tremendous personal success. His name is Robert Horry. Most know Horry as “Big Shot Bob”. But before those exploits, he was a 6’10” guy who shot too many 3s, blocked more shots than many players his size and had obvious talents. But I’m not sure Horry ever made an All-Star team because he never could put together all of his considerable talents. Smith is usually a good 4th quarter performer, so maybe he will have some big shots in his career eventually. And maybe even have rings on his finger as a distant scoring option on a championship team. But he is not looking like a core franchise player to me. More like a role player, ala Horry. Its early, but I’m prepared to see young Mr. Smith in another jersey next season. Maybe we can trade him to Portland for Aldridge and have Zaza, Shelden, Solomon and Aldridge as our 4 bigs for the next few years. A nice assortment of everything you need from bigs across those four guys. I’m done with Mr. Smith.

By JohnD

November 15, 2006 10:26 AM | Link to this

I went to the Hawks game so I just now saw the posts on Coach Knight.

Obviously some of you and I were raised in different times and I will take my time of no nonsense in the schools and less concern about people’s “feelings”. Corporal punishment was not only allowed but encouraged by the parents. The pledge and prayer were encouraged.

Vdunk and Samuel, I am the one who posted about the profanity in the NBA that occurs within range of the fans and I still stand by my prior post. What does Indiana University have to do with this incident? Nothing, and the “University” was not concerned - the President of IU simply wanted Knight gone, since the coach was the more popular.

There are posts here equating the use of a gun with Coach Knight’s actions. Who are you people? My God, no wonder this country is so screwed up.

Coach Knight is a disgrace? I submit to you Bob Huggins is the all-time disgrace and there are several more like him. How about the coaches who were having drunken affairs with students? How about the coaches using drugs? IU nor Texas Tech has been on probation under, or after, Knight. The list is long of others who leave the schools with huge problems, Jim Harrick and his son here at Georgia are an example.

As for the “What NBA players” remark, you obviously do not follow the league very closely. IU sent 49 players to the NBA and 31 of them played under Coach Knight. Calbert Chaney was accused in this post of sending a thug into a game (that was at John Chaney at Temple), but Calbert played at IU as did Isaiah Thomas and Scott May (Sean May’s father). Check Coach Knight’s graduation rates.

All you sensitive people out there support players with more illegitimate children than legitimate, thugs like Stephen Jackson and Ron Artest, support firing a gun in public and on and on.

Most of the wimps here could not have played for Coach Knight - no cohunes.

By The Flash

November 15, 2006 11:04 AM | Link to this

You guys know what I think of bobby-ball, right? Well, let me briefly explain. Knight changed the game, for my mind, much, much, much for the worse. How? Had players use physical intimidation all over the half court—“you want to take a step, not so fast buster; see that spot there, 35 feet from the basket, going sideways, I own that spot.” Real in your face crap. It’s war, baby, they don’t call the man “the general” for nothing.

I’ve never believed that Knight’s concept of defense actually comports with the rules of the game. If there’s serious contact, the rules say that somebody fouled somebody. Well, boxing out aside. But, fighting for position, 35 feet from the basket, please.

So, how do you get guys who love the game, the rhythms and flow of it, to destroy the game in the name of winning. Smack em upside the head, now and then, to make them real men, to play the game the General’s way.

I find the General’s way BORING. It also makes me angry beyond description that so much of that way now passes for basketball.

Thankfully, I believe that the game is passing bobby-ball by. I don’t think that it’s just a matter that the guy is a collosal idiot; I think that the new passing games (Triangle, Princeton, soccer-ball) have made trench-warfare approaches to defense well on the path to obselescence.

That Knight would pop a kid hard on the chin, without a thought is not surprising. Nor is surprising that the head of a school in a place called Lubic, whose only other claim to fame is Janis Joplin, would find “nothing” inappropriate about it. They deserve eachother if you ask me.

Woody, my man, take a good look at your mentor; forget bobby-ball; you’re too good a man and too smart a coach to be wedded to the sins of a craven bully, just because he was a mentor.

By tb

November 15, 2006 11:11 AM | Link to this

John D; you have become my least favorite blogger in record time . It is clear that you consider yourself part of the morally righteous.

And your old school discipline and conformity are out like Bush.

If you continuously want to sound your mighty trumpet, please go find a regularly scheduled church channel and preach to people that might actually want to hear it.

Funny guy. Profanity is the root of all evil yet purpose driven intolerance or “my way or the highway and if you don’t like it I’ll kick your a$$ is OK”

Why don’t you, Bobby K, McCarthy and all the other self righteous fundamentalists find somewhere to go and tell each other what to do and how to behave and think. The rest of us might be able to finish our daily toil, kick back and be civil and sensitive to each others “rights” and feelings without having to look over our shoulders.

Oh, where have you gone Johnny boy, Johnny boy? He hasn’t gone anywhere and he hasn’t changed a bit in two thousand years.

If you want to take this somewhere else and spare the Hawks bloggers that come here to talk about the Hawks and B-ball, just tell me which intolerant morality based blog you usually choose to preach on and I’ll make sure to avoid it.

By Luke

November 15, 2006 11:19 AM | Link to this

Sekou, how could you stoop so low as to getting in this bandwagon. Get off it. He told the kid to look up, no one is complaining, you just want to jump on the feeding frenzy.

I would have expected this from Terrence Moore, but not you.

By honest_abe

November 15, 2006 01:55 PM | Link to this

only in georgia is things THIS black and white… sad.. really…

By mykhalc

November 15, 2006 01:59 PM | Link to this

first of all, ket’s be real honest…take was NO tap that KNIGHT hit the kid with!! thus, the kid tryin’ to adjust his TMJ after he went to the bench. and if i remember correctly, KNIGHT hit him with a closed hand too??!! bottom line is, KNIGHT has anger management issues, pure and simple. the cat is ready to blow his eye sockets out ‘cause of a blown assignment!!??? get real!! it ain’t real life and he needs a get and learn what a perspective is!!! the death of COLLIER last year was REAL and how a coach helps and teaches his players to deal is what a REAL man/woman/mentor does. BOBBY KNIGHT NEEDS HELP….PERIOD!!!!!!!!

JOHND, first all, ALL CHILDREN ARE LEGITIMATE!! so come down off of your high-horse with your definition of what’s acceptable and what’s not. it’s obvious what side of the fence you sit on and arguing with ‘you people’ is toooooooo time consuming!! learn to live in some diversity. the world is full of it!! and i’ll leave it at that!!

By mykhalc

November 15, 2006 02:12 PM | Link to this

alrighty then………..LOL

DOC, thanks for the recap!!! good observation about JS and long range game too!! as excitin’ a player as JS can be, i think will see how much more polished MARVIN’s game is compared to his once he returns. you’d think that the easiest time to make corrections to somethin’ that’s not workin’ is IMMEDIATELY afterward, when it’s FRESH!! JS does not seem to have/want that desire YET!! this is where WOODSON HAS to step in. and if WOODSON is not makin’ it a req from JS then WOODSON is to blame. let’s hope the adjustments are made quickly!!!???!!!

By mykhalc

November 15, 2006 02:54 PM | Link to this

oh yeah…i much as i’m on SALIM and his game, i have to give him some props about his attitude as reported in SS’s article. tho there have been reported sightings of pouting on the bench, at least there seems to be ‘some’ recognition and effort on his part to do what’s best for the team. NOW, let’s work out that trade with him, JS, and whatever else it takes to get KG!!!!!! YEAH BABY!!LOL

By mykhalc

November 15, 2006 03:06 PM | Link to this

sorry for not PROOFING my previous posts…my bad. just a ‘little’ worked up there!!

By jhan

November 15, 2006 03:07 PM | Link to this

Had a great time at the game with Doc & Ando. I have to report that there was NO Andro sighting last night. I have to agree that speaking with him in person is nothing like the blog character he represents.

It also was nice to meet Sekou. He was gracious enough to grant us an audience for a couple of minutes at half-time.

I can’t be certain (maybe Sekou can verify) but it sure seemed like Woody was completely annoyed with JS after each time he launched a three. I know he was yelling at him, but couldn’t quite hear what he was saying. I agree with Doc that Sheldon really shows his basketball IQ while he’s playing. This man definitely has a future in this league.

I’ll let Ando sing the praises of his new “boy” on the Hawks. Many will be suprised. LOL

By doc

November 15, 2006 03:51 PM | Link to this

sensed lack of confidence from coaches while salim was in but he is a competitor. maybe too many fouls in five minutes of play and because he isnt game ready for the speed of the game.

josh smith also looked lost when the game is not a transition one and confused often looking to the sidelines after a missed shot from three point land. on one possesion he lost and regained the ball twice before he lost it for good on the thrid grab, another time he went to make his move and slammed the ball to the floor so hard he lost control of it as it bounced beyond his reach from the top of the key. he is a work in progress but can do little to help the team when he isnt making his shots or having his best game because he isnt in the flow of the game at all if last night is an example. right now without a doubt our best three is j chills.

want both of those guys to succeed as they are very talented and competitve players.

jd come on man, there is no excuse for the behavior of knight just as there was no excuse for woody hayes doing it to get himself canned. it is reactive unconcious behavior which has come out in other places beyond the basketball floor for knight. he is a bully period, he gets to say it is part of the game when he does it there. intimidation is his game and he just hasnt fallen from grace enough to be humble … yet.

someone needs to watch their language, how can they denounce knight if they cant even handle their own issues on a blog which takes the effort to maybe think and then the chance to not push the button? that may be more reprehensible than knight’s behavior that has been condoned and passed off on for a lifetime.

By honest_abe

November 15, 2006 03:52 PM | Link to this

let me guess jhan… i won’t be hearing any more grief from ando about taking chills before iguodala or deng??? heh

By tb

November 15, 2006 04:02 PM | Link to this

Liked the Sheldon pick from the beginning.

It might just take Marvin to give Smoove his wake up call. and if the alarm could just go off, josh could get to work on his handles and turn into something special

By A Thinking Fan

November 15, 2006 04:14 PM | Link to this

Good BLOG posts today. I thank all of the game attendees for their game assessments…

By John D.

November 15, 2006 07:43 PM | Link to this

tb,

If you come back to this - thanks for the compliment. Being your least favorite is a good thing. This thread was about morality or did you miss the article?

Do not presume to tell me what is accptable in my culture, and that of about 60-70% of the US. Why do you think there is more crime in some segments of society? Could it be because there is no father in the home since the self-absorbed “father” has a couple of girlfriends bearing children for him along with, or instead of, a wife?

The destruction of the American family is “the root of all evil” as YOU put it, not I.

So Bobby Knight is a bully. Unacceptable in society, yes. Unacceptable in basketball? Hardly. The man knows the game, coaches solid fundamentals and solid citizens. So you do not like him or his style and because you or I, or anyone else here says so then he should change.

Why don’t you focus all this energy on changing something that will have an effect on society for the better? The Texas Tech team and school can police their own situation.

By John D.

November 15, 2006 07:46 PM | Link to this

mykahlc,

The “you people” reference was to those who equated what Coach Knight did with those who fire a weapon in public. Please re-read the paragraph. How can there be any comparison?

By RAMON

November 16, 2006 01:59 AM | Link to this

John, what Knight did was a cowardly act, nothing more than a ‘my bono is bigger than yours’ move. Jackson’s move, though foolish, was in self defense. You let me give you a pistol and I take the keys to an SUV and lets see if you fire a weapon in public. No matter the case, you can not just put your hands on someone in that manner and it be acceptable. THAT IS WRONG. As I said, the day that you let your boss do it to you, thats when you say it is acceptable. Although he’s a player, he is a MAN who should be treated with respect. And what man thinks someone slapping their chin with a closed hand isnt disrespectful?

By John D.

November 16, 2006 07:18 PM | Link to this

Egad, we have people in society who have stabbed or shot someone for some show of disrespect and this is supposed to be acceptable? Where did all this emphasis on how people are treated come from?

I agree that people SHOULD treat others with respect but if not then the offended party has the opportunity to discontinue contact, not commit some act of mayhem. This is all based on false manhood and has nothing to do with society in general.

People earn respect. Respect is not mentioned in the Bill of Rights nor in the Bible as a given right. Real MEN do not earn respect by committing acts of violence in an attempt to DEMAND respect.

Everyone needs to get over this. The players, coaches, administration, student body and parents of the players at Texas Tech are the only parties to this who actually have an opinion that MATTERS.

There are far too many news outlets trying to create stories.