Hawks

By Tyger

October 25, 2006 03:45 PM | Link to this

Great news! I was concerned about Solomon, if he blocks shots like he dunks then thats a wrap! I’m still a little concerned that the Hawks dont have a seasoned scorer besides JJ.

All have seen those qtr. long droughts where we cant buy a bucket. Freije would help there. And what if JJ gets nicked up? We know Marvin and Smoove are going to struggle so why not some insurance.

By Gutz

October 25, 2006 03:54 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the updates Sekou!! Keep them coming. I hope Speedy is that “missing piece” and I can’t wait for this season to start. Do you know if Speedy is going to be the opening day starter at Philly? Lo Wright was a steal for only 3mil a year! And yes we all still have to be patient with Marvelous and Smoove. I have to remind myself sometimes that they are both only 20yrs. old. Do you think Solomon will stay on the roster or go to the NBDL? Go Hawks.

By G-Money

October 25, 2006 03:57 PM | Link to this

Sekou, thanks again for the great update. I don’t want to misinterpret but it sounds as though you feel as well as most of us bloggers that the Hawks are vastly improved versus last year. It sounds as though there is healthy competition at each position, enough to push everyone who’s ahead of the next guy. It also sounds like the guys on the 2nd team are good enough to give most of the 1st team a run for the position.

Yet, on the other hand, I also hear you saying that there are still going to be growing pains. Nearly every basketball page I turn to (exception: Heat, Spurs, Mavericks) says that their team has improved a lot. Is this just pre-season excitement or have most of the other teams made significant improvements as well (enough that the Hawks could actually be sitting near the same spot that they were last year at the end of this year)??

By Astro Joe

October 25, 2006 04:06 PM | Link to this

Tyger, if Marvin can get to the free throw line consistently, that will be a tremendous help in terms of offensive support. Also, Speedy’s ability to penetrate and dish should also help us avoid some of those horrible droughts from last season. But ultimately, this team has to play better defense so that we can stay competitive while likely scoring fewer points than last season.

Personally, that 20-year old stuff doesn’t work for me. Are they getting paid a discount for being a younger 2nd or 3rd year player? Does Jameer Nelson make more money as a 4-year college player than Smith? Does Sean May make more as a 3-year college player than Marvin? Here’s hoping that Woody takes off the kid’s gloves with these guys this season. If they’re being paid like a 22-year old, then dammit, step up and play like an experienced pro. If not, have a seat on the bench and let some grown folk play this game.

By mykhalc

October 25, 2006 04:09 PM | Link to this

Sekou, thanks and keep ‘em coming. after spreading my tea leaves and studying the stars, i do have to say that i find it veeeeeery interesting that you did NOT mention SALIM in your update/progress report today along with the other young guns????? very interesting……but hey, maybe it’s just me!!LOL GO HAWKS

By AJW

October 25, 2006 04:22 PM | Link to this

We are bigger all around this year than last. WE were given a major blow last year when Jason Collier passed. This year we are in a much better position to compete down low. Zaza is only going to be better too. Hopefully he has improved his 15 foot jumper. Opponents laid off him so much because he knew his jump shot was weak and he wanted to drive to the basket all the time. Also, just having a solid floor general in the final minute with Speedy out there is going to help immensely. Go Hawks. Can’t wait to c ya this year.

By GuyFromUruguay

October 25, 2006 04:42 PM | Link to this

G-money, I agree, I see every team saying they improved, and many did.

Still, I think the Hawks should be better than:

• Boston: what with all the changes, trades, etc - even though they do have Pierce.

• Philadelphia: depends on Iverson, really.

• Toronto: again, lots of rebuilding, though I like the pieces they got.

• Memphis: without Gasol, they’ll have a very rough start

• Portland: depends on whether any of their rookies turns out to be better than expected, because last year they were horrid.

Maybes:

• Indiana: this one is a long shot, but I still think they’re worse than before the Artest debacle. If all stay healthy, then they should be better than the Hawks.

• New York: they will start better than last year but I expect them to fall apart.

• Charlotte: they might win a couple more games this year, but I expect the Hawks to be more improved as well.

• Seattle: they mostly stayed put, drafted for upside and have even bigger ownership troubles than the Hawks

• Golden State: Baron & J-Rich might be an amazing backcourt, but they’re mostly alone until their rookies improve.

This is of course my optimistic opinion :) and nothing more than that.

By Sekou K. Smith

October 25, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

I didn’t leave Salim out for any particular reason. He was sick today and wasn’t at practice. Salim’s been fine. He struggled running the point a bit early, but I’ve already gone on and on about that. He’snot a point guard. He’s a shooter deluxe, one of a handful in the league who score in bunches like that (Ben Gordon comes to mind).

And I forgot to mention Solomon’s blocks, he had two today in the same sequence (the second probably was goal-tending) that were sick.

Astro, the reason I wrote that item about Josh and Marvin was to head off posts like the one above. You can want them to play like they’re “22” all you want. But they’re not. And they won’t be for at least another year. Whether you like it or not, they are what they are right now.

By G-Money

October 25, 2006 05:24 PM | Link to this

I have to agree with you Sekou. Maturation takes time. It isn’t instant. When you look at most of the really good NBA players (not pehenoms) it took time to develop whether in college or in the NBA. We know that we’re still a year away from making any real noise. Let’s not get too carried away with preseason.

I went out on a limb and said we’d win 35 games. I looked at who we were playing and it isn’t going to be easy to get to 35. The reality is that while we might be competitive, we’re not complete and some wines you have to be patient for. This team isn’t a beaujolais. Regardless, it’s going to be a better product to watch than last year by a mile. Enjoy the ride.

By mykhalc

October 25, 2006 05:36 PM | Link to this

ok SS, we’ll roll with that…for now!!:o)

this is what concerns me about SALIM’s game (not that anyone is askin’)…my gut feel is that he is one of these cats that always gotten by on his raw talent and he just happened to be one of the best at every level he competed on EXCEPT THIS ONE!! now he’s finding out the competition is bigger, stronger, better, faster, can score just as good, and with MORE all-around skills!! i liken it to these NO.1 draft choices in football that can’t believe how much faster the NFL game/player is compared to the college level. they are blown away by it!!thus SALIM’s frustration. thus his unhappiness with his situation ‘cause he feels like he SHOULD BE on the court. thus WOODSON’s frustration ‘cause he’s waitin’ to see SALIM turn the corner on bringin’ the things to the court that he needs/requires for him to bring. and it’s hard for me to see how it’s is gonna be a winnin’ situation for all (the team or SALIM)when he’s asked to play a role that currently is NOT suited for him. and now with SPEEDY and LUE at PG, JJ and CHILLS at SG, where EXACTLY does SALIM fit (despite your feelin’ of him being a shooter’s deluxe)??? does that one skill somehow trump his lack of handles and defense??? can he get minutes at SG where he is best suited??? for whatever reason, i don’t see it!! but like i said, it could just be me!!!

By doc

October 25, 2006 06:02 PM | Link to this

aj we dont differ often but it doesnt help to set expectations based on salary when these guys are concerned. look to other young guys to see that the maturation takes about three years. the only one that broke that mold is none other than c paul that we spent a whole lot of time talking about. look to bosh recently, lebron, kobe, garnett, etc. ( the list is really long dude if you think about it) to see that whether we like it or not these guys wont be who we hope them to be before nid-season or next. that is why i repeat there is hope even if we start slowly this year at about the same rate we finished last year.

By ray

October 25, 2006 08:48 PM | Link to this

Mykhalc, see my off-the-top-of-my-head comments about Salim on the blog prior to this one. It’s sort of like what you’re saying. We know the guy can shoot, but we’ll have to see what he does this season, assuming he’s still with the team.

Sekou, you’ve got me on pins and needles. I can’t wait to see who we end up keeping. Thanks for the info, as always, the 5 points format is working pretty good. Kinda like a revised power point presentation, lol!

Clyde, interesting post on the prior blog in regard to Josh Smith. The game against Washington certainly begins to support that theory. And if you’re right, then some very exciting times are upon us. For the record, do you think he’s going to turn out to be more dangerous than Marvin? Just had to ask…

By Sean

October 25, 2006 09:46 PM | Link to this

I can’t wait to watch this team in the regular season. I really think they will be much improved. Harrington does equal addition by subtraction on D and I think we have enough guys who can make up for his points. The Hawks went all of last year without a steady backup to Zaza. Joe can distribute, but now he doesn’t have to. Can you imagine an NFL team saying, we don’t really need a true QB?

I do want to say that the beat writers are the absolute best the AJC has to offer! And among those guys, Sekou is the KING! His posts are informative and insightful: he brings the stuff we want to know about and he steers clear of unfounded rumour junk. Wyche, DOB and Curtright are also very good: way better than Bradley, Moore and Bisher. I feel like the editorial guys just don’t keep up with the local teams and sports they cover to really write about either intelligently. You know that feeling when you’re used to the local radio play by play guys and then you watch your team on national TV and Joe Buck or Marv Albert gets their names wrong or gives some interesting fact about the wrong player?

BTW, it’s Wed. night @ 9:45 pm and there’s an “Atlanta Hawks preview show” on Turner South.

Go Hawks!

By mykhalc

October 25, 2006 09:54 PM | Link to this

RAY, on point again my friend!! and we are sayin’ the same thing. and like you said it does become a bad cycle for him. i think one of two things has to happen for him…either he lands with a team that accept/needs him for what he brings or he goes to the shed and really develops the skills that’ll help him (in the long run) and the team. right now, his game reminds me of AI’s game (with less AI skills). and i’m not sayin’ it to knock him at all. i think the day of players like AI being the first, second, and third option for a team are fading. players, especially his size, are gonna have to be able to handle and distribute the ball UNLESS they end up in PHOENIX with a coach named D’ANTONI who realizes that a 2 can present itself lookin’ like a 1 and defense ain’t a prereq!!!!

and like you RAY, i can’t wait to see how things shake out!!! GO HAWKS!!

By Astro Joe

October 25, 2006 10:43 PM | Link to this

I recognize that they are who they are right now despite my desires, but that doesn’t mean I have to like it nor be silent with my criticism. This team has been the NBA version of Daddy Day Care for 2 years. Its time for the babies to step up. And with the added depth, if they can’t or won’t, then sit their young butts down and let the grown folk play.

Admittedly, I have never been a Josh Smith fan. He reminds me of the type of talent that gets coaches and GMs fired. Its easy to see all that is wonderful about his potential and forgive him for not yet realizing it because of his youth. That works for a while, but now its time to deliver. Smith has logged over 235 NBA games in the big show. Shelden probably played in less than 200 games at Duke. Smith has had better training yet many fans will forgive Smith because of his age while demanding comparable dividends from Shelden starting 11/1. Shouldn’t experience count more than age? I don’t want this franchise held hostage by Smith’s unrealized talent. When I see BK bring in guys like Lue, Speedy, Lo, Zaza, JJ, Salim and Shelden, I see an element of toughness and substance becoming a primary characteristic of the players. Heck, even thin-as-a-pencil Childress attacks the game every minute with a level of toughness that is admirable. Those guys aren’t worried about style points, they just want to “leave it all on the court”. And then there is Smith and Marvin. If they can’t keep up with the new culture of this team and stay tough (especially mentally), if they get too wrapped up in ESPN highlights and league recognition, if they rather block a shot from behind than move their feet to stop penetration and if they would rather throw up long distance bombs than attack the rim, then sit them down and let the grown folk play.

Diaw robbed this franchise for 3 seasons and most of us blame the coach or GM. I blame Diaw for not being a true professional and I blame the media and fans for not calling him out as an under-achieving, soft-as-a-croissant, quiche-eating Frenchman. If Clyde can shine a spotlight on Woody and BK multiple times a day, I’ll make no apologies as I do the same for Smith this season. They ALL need to earn their paychecks and the admiration of the Atlanta Hawks fan base. And I sincerely hope they do so. NO BABIES ALLOWED… DAMMIT!

By mykhalc

October 25, 2006 11:14 PM | Link to this

JOE, good points and totally on-point about DIAW!!!

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 12:00 AM | Link to this

only one week to go, guys!

astro, you make it sound like josh smith has been all hype up to now. go look at his numbers, especially the 2nd half of last year. the man can fill up a stat sheet and brings a lot to the team. he and marvin do still have a lot to learn but they are on the floor because of what they bring to the team, not because of where they were drafted. you need premium, skillfull talent to thrive in this league. a team comprised solely of hardworking role players will not get it done. it is good that we have more veterans around to teach him the right way, but our young core do not seem like a bunch of malcontents. their talent is going to lead us on the floor alongside the wily veterans. and those veterans are going to lead them off the floor as well, hopefully reinforcing the coaches in making sure they bring their all on a consistent basis and not take games, quarters, or even minutes off. at least we now have the depth to let them sit and watch at times. be positive, my man. i know you know the game.

i dont get where some of you think salim might get cut. we didnt sign him to a 3 year contract to cut him after a year. he’s a sniper who can put points up in bunches. there will be games where he barely gets off the bench, but there will also be games where we are lacking for offense and he will score 20 points in 20 minutes. his role is very specific at this point. until he cuts down on the turnovers and improves his d, his role will be limited to that. but make no mistake, when salim’s shot is on, he can be deadly. there aren’t a ton of guys in the league who can do that and we are not going to cut him. that’s just silly, uneducated talk.

i believe we have 13 guaranteed contracts:

jj, smooth, marvin, zaza, speedy, lue, childress, shelden, salim, zen, solomon, ivey and batista.

the hawks roster can have up to 15 players, with 12 active for each game. so if we don’t cut anyone 2 free agents can be signed, most likely to minimum contracts. the question is whether our management is willing to lay out the money to sign these guys who often won’t even get off the bench. and once the season begins, there are less practices, and some might say less need for the additional bodies.

i believe solomon will start the season in the nbdl. if he does, i think that bodes well for the big greek. he would be a smart signing since legit bigs with skills aren’t easy to find. and he brings 6 fouls to every contest, which can be a significant factor against the big-bodied miamis and orlandos of the league.

it also sounds like woodsen is more comfortable bringing in bozeman than ivey. considering speedy’s health history, cedric could contribute at some point this year. so i think he has a chance as well. i doubt they would flatout cut ivey unless a number of conditions are met: first, that management wanted to keep both the greek and freije. and second, if 3rd year players are not allowed in the development league. i can’t remember right now if its only for first and second year guys, or not. anyone remember the rukes there…?

i doubt they keep freije just because it’s hard to picture how he would ever get minutes when we are at full strength. even batista is going to be glued to the bench most nights. but if they feel matt has value beyond this year, then i guess it’s possible. he does seem to possess skills. just seems unlikely but then we haven’t been able to see them in action yet except through box scores and the radio.

if ivey and batista didn’t have guaranteed contracts, it sure sounds like they would be cut. but they do. and in a few weeks, most of this won’t even matter. we will be playing with a 10 man rotation at most. but for the here and now, that’s my take.

on another note, it sure is great to hear sekou’s report on speedy. we really need what he promises to bring to our team.

and like many have already said, it is terrific that we have sekou to feed us information on what’s going on with our mostly beloved hawks.

By curious

October 26, 2006 12:53 AM | Link to this

Astro Joe- People don’t understand why you complain about Josh and Marvin. I read this blog all time and see your comments about everyone. You are jealous of them. I wish someone could come to your job and analyze you. Then we can find out if you’re perfect. Don’t throw stones out of glass houses. Relax and let these talented kids grow. If we listen to your criticism Mcgrady would not be in the NBA. He was horrible his first 2 years in Toronto. Young athletes mature over time. WHY DON’T YOU TRY.

By Clyde

October 26, 2006 01:39 AM | Link to this

Ray I think Josh Smith will become more dangerous mainly because of his commitment to play top notch defense. To me Marvin has not made that commitment. He does not try defend the lane and Josh Smith does. Sometimes I think Marvin is afrid to try and block shots.

Now on this Boris Diaw thing. Coaches have to develop and bring out the talent within young players. D’Antoine brought Diaw’s talent out and Woody didn’t. Point Blank. Matter of fact Woody hasn’t brought out the talent in none of our young players. Josh Smith developed his skill ignoring the yells from the sideline not to shoot 3’s and not to handle the ball.

Good coaches get the most out of their players and that’s all I got to say.

FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Wedgie Evans

October 26, 2006 03:31 AM | Link to this

Salim strikes me as the kind of player who would fit better on an established playoff team where he could focus just on 3 point shooting, kinda like how Steve Kerr used to be on the Bulls. On a team like the Hawks, where you are not surrounded by talented veterans, I think it’s harder for someone as one-dimensional as Salim to fit, since he’s a liability both as a point guard and on defense. I think it would be smart for the Hawks to showcase him in the preseason and maybe the beginning of the regular season and then see if they can trade him for another veteran or maybe a first-round pick. To be able to parlay a 2nd round pick (Salim) into a first-rounder or a contributing veteran would be a good move in my opinion.

By Jay

October 26, 2006 05:11 AM | Link to this

Went to the preseason game on monday. Our team looks like it was put together poorly. Against a team with no legit lowpost presence (wizards), the Hawks had NOTHING on the inside. Its clear that Sheldan is our best bet down low. Which means what…bench J-Smith or Williams, or put Sheldan at center? Either choice is not good. And its all Knight’s fault. This mess that is growing is his and it wont be resolved until one of the two is traded. Fact of the matter is he passed on one of the best pg’s to come out in years for a project at a position we already have covered, and now Woodson is stuck playing him.

Thanks Knight, you cleaned up Babcock’s mess to make your own.

By G Money

October 26, 2006 08:32 AM | Link to this

Jay, either you didn’t get any sleep last night or you woke up to early. What a crock? To go to a game one night and base your entire assessment of the value of MW and JS on one 40 pre-season game is rather ludicrous. If you follow the Hawks, you would have also read that the coaches felt that the performance of the team was sub-par. I think they learned their lesson. Nonetheless, if I look at the stat line I see MW with 17 pts, 4 rbs, 3 assists, and 2 steals. I see JS had 14 pts, 11 boards, 7 assists, 2 steals and 3 blocked shots, a double-double on his way to a triple double. Put ZaZa’s, Zen’s, and Shelden’s numbers together and what do you get? It sounds like the whole team could have played a bit better. Stop looking for stuff that’s not there. If you’re going to gripe about something (and that is your prerogative), at least do so with some fact to base it on.

Astro, I would ask you to look at JSmith’s stat line for the last game and help me understand your complaining as well. Is it because he didn’t go to college that you don’t like him? Do you think that we just picked him up off the playground in a rough neighborhood (not referring to all the mess at Duke)? The guy has played incredible ball since mid-season. The one person besides JJ that all commentators talk about. Help me out. I don’t get it!

By macaroni Tony

October 26, 2006 08:51 AM | Link to this

Joe I agree about what you said about Diaw. When he was here he played like a b@@ch. He would not shoot the ball, all he would do is pass and pass like you was scared are something. I hated him here, but then he went to The Suns and made BK look like a fool. As far as JS, I think he will be just fine this year, and Childress will make some you a believer about his game. Salim need at least to the end of the year to blossum like we would like him to, but our microwave will heat up. Go Hawks!

By Astro Joe

October 26, 2006 10:34 AM | Link to this

Curious, you’re right. I am jealous that I was only making about $5,000 a year when I was 21 years old and I unilaterally hate each and every person who made more than I did 20 years ago (including those YouTube guys). And the reason I criticize Smith for sometimes sleeping on the court is not because I am a passionate basketball (and Hawks) fan who wants maximum effort from the players but because I am jealous that he has a 40-inch vertical while I can jump maybe 4 inches on a good day. Yes sir, you have certainly figured out my game.

(Back to reality)…

If Smith builds off of his post-All Star performance, then I will be thrilled beyond belief. But I’m not going to allow the “keep in mind he’s only 21” nonsense as I evaluate him. You all can baby these guys if you choose to, but as a former peer once told me, “when you expect more you get more”. And I’m not going to expect Smith to play like a 21 year-old novice to this league and to the teachings of Coach Woodson. I don’t expect my 2nd grader to read at a 2nd grade level and I won’t expect a guy who played as well he he did late last year to have lapses of mental focus or effort this season.

Many on this blog choose to evaluate BK as if he has the same ownership support as any other NBA GM. Some expect him to overcome those obstacles and still be an outstanding GM. Well, excuse me if I choose to ask Smith to overcome being 21 years old and still perform at a level equal to his talents. You have your ax and I have mine to grind. I’ll expect more and hopefully I’ll get more.

By HB Ando

October 26, 2006 10:51 AM | Link to this

WOW!

I think I just stepped off on an alternate universe. I’ve been too busy to check in, and when I do, I’ve find Astro Joe, off on a critical rant, and the bloggers assailing him for his negative thoughts. When did Joe become Andro? I want my spot back!

TOO DAMN FUNNY!

Josh is a year ahead of Marvin, so he has less excuse for poor, or inconsistent, play. Josh’s numbers from the second half last year leave you drooling at his potential. We’ve beaten into the ground how much we’d like to see him play like Marion, instead of AK 47. But, I’ll say this: If he will bring intensity to the floor, and build on last years’ numbers, and play with consistency, then asking him to be something he’s not, or something that we wish he was, isn’t really fair. If the truth is that he develops into the solution at the 3 here, and he does so before Marvin can establish that presence, then it will be up to Marvin to find a role that keeps him on the floor, not Josh. So, I guess I’m saying that the first guy who creates a solid role for himself on the floor, forces the other guy to complement that presence, if he wants to play. It would be easier, and, I think, better, if they find complementary roles from the outset. But if they cannot, or won’t, then it’s likely going to come down in the manner I prescribe.

In the end, and per Joe’s comments, Woody can’t coddle anybody if this team expects to make a move in the W column. They have veterans and depth now. But they have two choices, which I still believe may be somewhat in conflict with one another: play with singular focus on winning, or play with one eye towards the future and keep throwing Marvin and Josh out there together. May cost us some wins this year, but it will let them know what they’ve got to build off of going into next summer. And I’m not saying these two issues are mutually exclusive, just that they may bump into each other as we move through the season. Letting two 20-year olds play through growing pains WILL cost you some W’s. But it will also define your future potential. And I think that’s more important, for the long haul.

31-34 wins. Bottom-five record. But better than last year, and something to be hopeful for over the next few years (like, hopefully, a new GM and a top-3 draft pick next summer).

By HB Ando

October 26, 2006 10:59 AM | Link to this

One more thing: the Jones reports do make me ponder the possibility that he’s a Ratliff in the making. I keep saying that the one way you can support Josh and Marvin playing in tandem is to give them a Wallace/Ratliff type center to protect them when they get beat by opposing fours. I don’t think Shelden is that guy. And we know that Zaza and Wright aren’t (nor never were in Wright’s case) that kind of shot-blocking presence, down low.

I don’t know if they can put enough meat on the kid to become a legitimate solution there, but his length and explosiveness are compelling. Big time shot blockers are not a dime a dozen (unlike scoring small forwards or undersized power forwards). Doesn’t sound like he’ll impact this year. But, as most of you know, I’m already looking past this year anyway. Everything I watch this season will be taken in the context of what it means for the future. This isn’t a playoff-contending team, so making decisions based on what will be best two-three years from now is just plain smart, in my book.

By G Money

October 26, 2006 11:31 AM | Link to this

Ando, I actually agree with your blogs. However, my only issue (not with your blog)is the premise that some are making that Josh Smith isn’t playing to his potential. I find that very quizzical based on the line I saw for the last game which again is 14 pts, 11 boards, 7 assists, 2 steals and 3 blocks. I just want to know the reason for the tirade. Hey if most teams have guys giving them that every night, they’re ecstatic. Is there some inside scoop that says Josh is being another Bonzi Wells in training camp? Is he being selfish and taking ill-advised shots? Is he not defending or not hitting his shot (last game: 44% from the field, 40% from 3pt, 100% free throws)? Or is it that maybe some just don’t like his demeanor. I guess that’s as legit as any other reason not to like a player. I just want to understand. Then we accept ZaZa’s performance and stick up for Ivey not getting the job done because they’re nice guys.

By HB Ando

October 26, 2006 12:07 PM | Link to this

G, and I know your comments aren’t directed at me, so take this response for what it’s worth: I think that there is an underlying feeling that Josh’s potential is to be a star, versatile power forward, like Shaun Marion. He appears to remain content hanging out on the perimeter, rather than mixing it up. There’s no denying his talent, or his numbers (especially on a night where he fills up the box score like that). The question is whether he is doing everything he can to better the team, or just to better himself, individually.

You’re looking at a kid who’s nearly 6’10, with a 40-inch vertical, and a solid frame, who likes to settle for 3-point shots. He plays for a team that is dying for a low post presence, and he’s the guy you keep looking at and thinking, “man, Josh has everything you’d want in a superstar power forward, except the desire to get his hands dirty”. The fact that he could lead the league in blocks, DESPITE avoiding low post play just goes to show how tantalizing his upside is.

This team is better if he goes to work inside, rather than floating on the perimeter. This team is better if he sacrifices a little of what makes Josh happy for what makes sense. Doesn’t mean I don’t want him on my fantasy hoops team, or that I think we should trade him. I’m just still on the fence about whether his personal goals fit with where this team wants to go. And I’m not saying he should have to subjugate his game for the team. Iverson never has and he’s a superstar. But Iverson hasn’t ever won a ring either, and he won’t, unless it’s late in his career, like a Gary Payton. Because what’s good for AI, and his fans, doesn’t translate to wins or championships. I’m just trying to figure out which guy Smith is going to be. And since he’s just trying to establish himself in the NBA right now, the expectations that he should be everything for this team, right now, maybe unfair. So I’m not going to beat him up. But that may be what some other folks are referring to when questions come up about Josh Smith (not that I’m talking for Joe, or anyone else, here).

By mark

October 26, 2006 12:19 PM | Link to this

Does anyone else think that it’s sad or a little weird that David Stern actually has to ask his players to leave their guns at home? This isn’t the old west! That’s just amazing to me that someone would actually have to be told that!

By HB Ando

October 26, 2006 12:32 PM | Link to this

The NRA has been saying we can take their guns when we pry their cold, dead fingers off of them, for a long time. It’s not just the NBA that’s strapped. They’re joined by a whole bunch of pick-up truck, drivin’ dudes, who you ought to think twice before cuttin’, or flippin’, off, in traffic. We live in a pretty angry, scary society these days.

By Phil

October 26, 2006 01:16 PM | Link to this

Ando,

I agree with you about JSmoove. I haven’t been able to watch the games, only look at the boxscores I’ve noticed the Hawks are getting abused in the points in the paint category. They’ve been outscored in the paint by 10,14 and 22 points in their last 3 pre-season games. We have an outside presence in JJ already. We gotta get someone who can score down low and I don’t know if Josh or Marvin can or are willing to do it. Shelden and Zaza aren’t primary offensive weapons. Its gotta come from either Marvin or Smooth or we’ll have to re-organize our roster if this team is ever going to compete for a ring. I know they are both talented and can score out there if needed but hope they can sacrifice and do whats best for the team.

By tb

October 26, 2006 01:30 PM | Link to this

It’s not that way everywhere.

Ando; this is a first , but I agree with you on Smith. He can be so much, but it’s been my opinion that his attitude is a bit me first and that he is not always following the best path in his progress.

He definitely needs to make his game be more based on the outside threat opening up his inside penetrations and post work. He also needs to learn to play much better straight up D.

He should do what he needs to just because it’s the right thing. He needs to assume the responsibility of the situation that he has chosen.

I’m pretty sure that Woody and every other sane person wants him to play more inside instead of trying to over develop and use the three game. i think that’s what AJ was talking about.

They are young, but they are also amongst the best we have. Got to ride em hard and get the most out of their talents; unless they have the drive to do it themselves, and the brains to listen to their peers.

By Ryder

October 26, 2006 01:48 PM | Link to this

Just found out Marvin broke his hand out 6-8 weeks. NOW what do the Hawks do? Man talk about cursed!

By mykhalc

October 26, 2006 01:56 PM | Link to this

GEEEESSSSHHHHHHH!! ok….what could be next???!!!!!!!!!!!!

By StarvinMarvin

October 26, 2006 02:13 PM | Link to this

Everybody said Marvin would have a “break” out year!

By Phil

October 26, 2006 02:14 PM | Link to this

Boy oh boy are the Hawks cursed or what. Look on the bright side though, this might help them actually get a top 3 pick next year.

By cowa

October 26, 2006 02:22 PM | Link to this

IMO, what this new broken hand does is to establish Josh at the 3, with Lo probably added to the starting line-up. It could be Sheldon, but throwing a rookie in right away seems silly. Sheldon will now get even more minutes, with a 3 man rotation around the 4/5 positions. Childress just can’t be added to the starting line-up IMO, as we would be so weak with Salim being the only option to sub in for JJ. I know there are ways around this to make it work if Childress starts, but I don’t think it’s best.

Now, the ramifications. Putting JSmoove at the 3 makes Marvin the 4 when he comes back, or possibly the 6th man if the team is making progress. Can Marvin play the 4 effectvely? I doubt they would move JSmoove to 4 after playing the 3 for the first 4-8 weeks (depending on how long Marvin is out). This broken hand, although easier to replace in the starting line-up than Speedy’s, makes things very tough for team chemistry when Marvin comes back.

Sekou, now do you think 7-13 might be an optimistic start? If so, welcome to the Oden/Noah sweepstakes.

By newkid

October 26, 2006 02:36 PM | Link to this

Bummer. The faithful in Chapel Hill were so looking forward to the guys from the ‘04 NCAA championship squad competing against each other tomorrow night at the Smith Center. Sekou, would you care to speculate on how this injury to Marvin might (or might not) affect the decisions about which training camp invitees are retained?

By Astro Joe

October 26, 2006 02:38 PM | Link to this

I think we would be doing Smith a disservice by asking him to move to the 3 and later move to the 4. Marvin’s hand injury is not career-threatening and eventually these guys will need to share the court. We definitely need an offensive player to move into the starting line-up. Do we consider Salim with JJ moving to 3? Or do we place a call into Keith Van Horn, Lamond Murray, Toni Kukoc or another veteran SF who can give us solid offense for the next 2 months (and almost 30 games in November & December). Do we place a greater burden on Smith to be the 2nd scoring option with Speedy being the 3rd? Do you move Shelden into the starting line-up with Smith and ask Solomon to serve as the back-up PF (instead of shipping him to the NBDL)? Does this provide a roster spot for Freije with the need for more offense?

I can’t wait for the 5 what we know now update. ‘Cause I don’t know what the answer is. Oh and I can update my win prediction?

By doc

October 26, 2006 02:46 PM | Link to this

huge setback for one of the young guns but opens up things for someone to step up and get some time in. it will certainly give a different flavor to the opening stretch.

it is also going to be interesting how management deals with this when it comes to cuts. it may be that it works in the best interest of the team if they have to keep a guy who they were going to cut prematurely then have to keep only to see him flourish. i would like to think someone is going to get a 6 to 8 week extension on his audition.

finally the odds on getting down to the lottery is looming larger. i feel that without injuries they win 36 now i have to wonder if 32 isnt more like it. one doesnt have to think back too far and realize the team had no injuries to significant starters last year to address though lue was out significant time as was salim and still only got to 26 wins last year. think i see andro grinning at the adversity as his desires to obtain noah or oden goes up along with some other sleeper that will step up during the season. guess it is good we got sheldon afterall as my boy roy probably couldnt take charge at the three though jj at three, roy at two and sleepy at one might have been formidable. on second thought now why didnt we get the guy people are now saying is the leading candidate for rookie of the year? sheldon you better look good dude, cant expect me to look out for your dookie back too much longer.

By G-Money

October 26, 2006 03:04 PM | Link to this

Ando, thanks for the analysis. It makes sense, but as you said, it takes time…The other question is how best to motivate this guy if that is the problem. Obviously, the techniques employed with Boris did not work. Perhaps he needs the mentorship of a great power forward to teach him all that he needs to know. He just may not understand a)what greatness is all about or b)how great forwards have become such. He doesn’t really have any role models to follow around him. No disrespect intended. (And I don’t believe the NBA is better at teaching the fundamentals than college. The NBA is about nuance.)….

Uh-oh. It’s unfortunate that MW has just broken his hand, but maybe that lights a fire and causes him to now have to play a different game. We shall see.

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 03:05 PM | Link to this

the hawks really just can’t catch a break, can they?

it’s gonna be a little while now before we see if marvin and smooth can create the right yin and yang on the floor together. perhaps smooth will get the 3’s out of his system over the next 6 weeks. sure am glad we have shelden now. wouldnt want to play another extended part of the season without an inside presence. looks like we are going to see what he can do fairly quickly. our depth with shelden, childress and zen will allow us to cover the loss to an extent.

one thing i want to point out regarding those that favor losing a lot of games in the hope that we get a top 3 pick. i would partly lean that way myself if it weren’t for the fact phx gets the pick if it’s 4 or below. even with the worst record, the odds are against you getting a top 3 pick, crazy as that sounds. with the hawks luck we would end up just missing out. so, at least at this early juncture, i am all in for grabbing W’s this year and bringing a winning culture to the hawks. that doesn’t mean i won’t be rooting for the ping pong balls to come up our way, it’s that we need to move beyond thinking of winning the lotto instead of winning ballgames. that said, i do agree with ando that winning the lottery will be our greatest hope of winning a championship in the next few years. but that’s going to require a degree of luck that isn’t worth banking on.

i hope marvin is as quick a healer as he says. what’s up with everyone breaking their hand? speedy… marvin… i hope that’s the extent of it. but belkin must have some kind of voodoo doll that causes all kinds of clipped wings on our hawks.

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 03:08 PM | Link to this

the hawks really just can’t catch a break, can they?

it’s gonna be a little while now before we see if marvin and smooth can create the right yin and yang on the floor together. perhaps smooth will get the 3’s out of his system over the next 6 weeks. sure am glad we have shelden now. wouldnt want to play another extended part of the season without an inside presence. looks like we are going to see what he can do fairly quickly. our depth with shelden, childress and zen will allow us to cover the loss to an extent.

one thing i want to point out regarding those that favor losing a lot of games in the hope that we get a top 3 pick. i would partly lean that way myself if it weren’t for the fact phx gets the pick if it’s 4 or below. even with the worst record, the odds are against you getting a top 3 pick, crazy as that sounds. with the hawks luck we would end up just missing out. so, at least at this early juncture, i am all in for grabbing W’s this year and bringing a winning culture to the hawks. that doesn’t mean i won’t be rooting for the ping pong balls to come up our way, it’s that we need to move beyond thinking of winning the lotto instead of winning ballgames. that said, i do agree with ando that winning the lottery will be our greatest hope of winning a championship in the next few years. but that’s going to require a degree of luck that isn’t worth banking on.

i hope marvin is as quick a healer as he says. what’s up with everyone breaking their hand? speedy… marvin… i hope that’s the extent of it. but belkin must have some kind of voodoo doll that causes all kinds of clipped wings on our hawks.

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 03:09 PM | Link to this

the hawks really just can’t catch a break, can they?

it’s gonna be a little while now before we see if marvin and smooth can create the right yin and yang on the floor together. perhaps smooth will get the 3’s out of his system over the next 6 weeks. sure am glad we have shelden now. wouldnt want to play another extended part of the season without an inside presence. looks like we are going to see what he can do fairly quickly. our depth with shelden, childress and zen will allow us to cover the loss to an extent.

one thing i want to point out regarding those that favor losing a lot of games in the hope that we get a top 3 pick. i would partly lean that way myself if it weren’t for the fact phx gets the pick if it’s 4 or below. even with the worst record, the odds are against you getting a top 3 pick, crazy as that sounds. with the hawks luck we would end up just missing out. so, at least at this early juncture, i am all in for grabbing W’s this year and bringing a winning culture to the hawks. that doesn’t mean i won’t be rooting for the ping pong balls to come up our way, it’s that we need to move beyond thinking of winning the lotto instead of winning ballgames. that said, i do agree with ando that winning the lottery will be our greatest hope of winning a championship in the next few years. but that’s going to require a degree of luck that isn’t worth banking on.

i hope marvin is as quick a healer as he says. what’s up with everyone breaking their hand? speedy… marvin… i hope that’s the extent of it. but belkin must have some kind of voodoo doll that causes all kinds of clipped wings on our hawks.

By honest_abe

October 26, 2006 03:09 PM | Link to this

the hawks curse continues.

what’s next?

San Diego Hawks?

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 03:09 PM | Link to this

the hawks really just can’t catch a break, can they?

it’s gonna be a little while now before we see if marvin and smooth can create the right yin and yang on the floor together. perhaps smooth will get the 3’s out of his system over the next 6 weeks. sure am glad we have shelden now. wouldnt want to play another extended part of the season without an inside presence. looks like we are going to see what he can do fairly quickly. our depth with shelden, childress and zen will allow us to cover the loss to an extent.

one thing i want to point out regarding those that favor losing a lot of games in the hope that we get a top 3 pick. i would partly lean that way myself if it weren’t for the fact phx gets the pick if it’s 4 or below. even with the worst record, the odds are against you getting a top 3 pick, crazy as that sounds. with the hawks luck we would end up just missing out. so, at least at this early juncture, i am all in for grabbing W’s this year and bringing a winning culture to the hawks. that doesn’t mean i won’t be rooting for the ping pong balls to come up our way, it’s that we need to move beyond thinking of winning the lotto instead of winning ballgames. that said, i do agree with ando that winning the lottery will be our greatest hope of winning a championship in the next few years. but that’s going to require a degree of luck that isn’t worth banking on.

i hope marvin is as quick a healer as he says. what’s up with everyone breaking their hand? speedy… marvin… i hope that’s the extent of it. but belkin must have some kind of voodoo doll that causes all kinds of clipped wings on our hawks.

By michael m.

October 26, 2006 03:30 PM | Link to this

sorry about that, not sure what happened since i only hit the Post button once.

regarding smooth moving between the 3 and 4 spots, it shouldn’t be that big a deal. remember our team is about players who can move smoothly (no pun intended) between multiple positions. he was going to play both spots anyway. he will still play the 4 some when he is in the game alongside chill and jj. where it hurts is in the development of marvin personally, and marvin + smith as a forward combo working out the kinks together.

By mykhalc

October 26, 2006 03:45 PM | Link to this

i’m EVEN MORE curious now to see how the cuts shake out!!! what does it mean for BROWN, FREIJE, the BIG GREEK?? off the top of my head i’d consider starting the BIG GREEK and movin’ ZAZA to the 4. or puttin’ FREIJE at the 4 and leavin’ ZAZA at the 5. and i KNOW they gotta make the team first!! but i would try to leave my rotations intact from the second unit and approach it like they did with IVEY being the starter last season. you knew he was in there JUST to get the game to a certain point. and the more i think about it, FREIJE might make the most sense ‘cause he’s got some offense to go along with his size. but for some reason i would not want to mess with the rotation of ZEN and SHELDEN comin’ off the bench. anyway, like i said, off the top of my head!!

By mykhalc

October 26, 2006 04:22 PM | Link to this

well, my first thought was shot all-to-hell with the cut of the BIG GREEK!!

SEKOU’s new blog spelled it out for us clearly…IT’S NOT ABOUT PUTTIN’ THE BEST TEAM ON THE FLOOR…SADLY BUT ONCE AGAIN!!!

By ray

October 26, 2006 08:42 PM | Link to this

Well, here we go. Marvin’s injury is nothing to panic about, but it does remind me that this kind of thing (and worse)can happen anytime during the season. The most immediate effects are: Marvin will be languishing on the bench while his teammates are facing the test of the start of the season, Marvin/Smith frontcourt tandem is on hold for a while, and we lose some scoring potential. On the flip side of the coin, Shelden will probably see more minutes early in the season and get a chance to produce or not produce accordingly. Wright may be injected into the starting line-up, but with Glyniadakis cut, who’s Zaza’s back-up? I agree that Shelden shouldn’t be played at center much at all. Perhaps this means Freije gets to stay, perhaps not. Maybe the dice is being rolled on other team cuts, but I don’t see where exactly. I see Brian Grant and Luke Jackson were both cut. Perhaps Grant could provide a lift.