Hawks

By ILL-logical

May 8, 2006 04:05 PM | Link to this

Dr. Smith(PHD in sports socio-economic analysis): What will the NBA do if the finals are DT and SA,two lesser media markets without “glamor” players.Steve Nash can’t help them in that instance can he?

By Sekou K. Smith

May 8, 2006 04:36 PM | Link to this

The NBA will do the same thing they did last year, deal with it. Detroit and San Antonio are clearly the two best teams and barring injury to key players for either team, they’ll be playing in the Finals again. And isn’t that really what everybody wants - the two best teams to decide which is the best?

By doc

May 8, 2006 04:39 PM | Link to this

great comments sekou. look forward to tonights gams to see the wonder boy go at it big time against the best.

sam, enjoyed the back and forth, thanks for the forgiveness, too. :-) oh btw, have you stopped beating your wife? i forgive you too bud. dont take it literal or out of context some questions/statements cant be answered or responded to.

will say this, cheating is for the guy who cant do it any other way and they choke when you take the crutch away. case in point, sosa. sponge bob bat and roids. it is a double edged sword.

By buddy

May 8, 2006 04:44 PM | Link to this

Nash not an all around great player? Let’s see, he’s the top passer and free throw shooter in the league, he’s among the leaders in three point percentage and at 6-3, he averages over 4 boards a game. What exactly constitutes greatness in your book Sekou?

By Astro Joe

May 8, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

Sekou, always follow the money when asking a question about entertainment. I would guess that Internal Affairs made a fraction of what any big bombs, fast cars, exotic location, cool gadget and blockbuster star movie has made. Heck, I bet you Wild, Wild West probably did better at the box office (probably the worse movie of the past 10 years). And you are absolutely right, there are 2 kinds of movies, those to make money and those to win Oscars. The summer clearly belongs to the money-makers. Enjoy the popcorn and try to go before 6 PM is my whole take on the theater experience.

By HB Ando

May 8, 2006 05:04 PM | Link to this

Sekou, I think you’re point about Livingston’s upside, compared to Paul’s immediate impact, is quite valid. That’s what two years of college and a sturdier, if much shorter, frame will do for you. I hope Livingston doesn’t go the way of Jonathan Bender, another spindly high schooler (from that Miss. Sam keeps highlighting) who may have suffered from a too physically demanding profession from a too underdeveloped physicality. I don’t think a lot of people who never played the game understand just how hard hoops is on your body, playing 100 games a year at that level. As an aside, and doc can comment on this, I was talking with a doctor about some neck problems that have been ongoing for years, and he said he still plays hockey (at what I would peg to be 50ish), and he thinks basketball is the hardest sport on the body due to the lack of protective gear and the modern shoes inability to sufficiently handle the torque we put on our feet, ankles and knees when playing ball.

Anyway, a real challenging question, with an unknown impact and outcome, will be whether the Clips ride their momentum in the off-season, by re-signing Cassell, and nurturing the uncertain physical reliability of Livingston a few more years (given that he can play along side Cassell with his height and versatility, it certainly doesn’t keep him off the court to do so), or whether they’ll let Sam walk (and talk on his way out the door, from a PR consideration) and take their chances with Livingston at the point next year.

Sounds like they’d like to move Maggette and possibly keep Radmonovic. And though I prefer bringing a starter-quality PG here, I think Johnson proved versatile enough that if the best possible player we could get for Al was an athletic, sharp shooting two-guard to pair with Johnson for the next few years, till we can find the “true” PG of the future, that would be better than getting nothing for Al.

I see you echoing my previous points about the “interchangeable” nature of the majority of players in the league. I’ve been trying to make that point for a while. It goes back to the example of having Marvin and Al both here. It’s not a knock on Al or Marvin that we don’t need both of them. It’s just a simple fact that outside of the true superstars in the league, very few players have a skill set that isn’t replicated by another 10-20 guys within the league. That’s why building a balanced roster is so important. It’s not necessary that we try and get someone as “good” as Al in trade for him. It’s about finding someone who fills one of our needs, who may not be as important, or unique, in terms of his skills on his current team (think Gooden with Varajoe waiting in the wings in Cleveland). There’s a win-win sign and trade out there for Al and the Hawks. It’s up to Billy to optimize his value and address his needs, from a location and contract standpoint, to get him to work with us instead of walking away without compensation.

Truth be told, Sekou, when I met you in person, you were shorter than I thought, too.

And I think the network with the Finals is most frightened by the increasingly likely scenario of Detroit-San Antonio rematch. The ratings will be horrible, while millions avoid watching basketball played the right way.

By Harry Hawk

May 8, 2006 05:06 PM | Link to this

I’m still trying to figure out what Kobe was doing in the second half of Game 7. I don’t chalk it up to “learning the hard way how to be the game’s greatest player.” I think the guy quit on himself in the second half. Some people say that Kobe is blamed for either being too selfish when he scores a bunch of points in a loss or too unselfish when he doesn’t score a lot and his team loses. Some people blame the media for “getting into his head”. Well, Kobe knew that his guys didn’t have anything for the Suns in the second half, but HE did. Kobe could’ve put up 60+ on the Suns in a loss and held his head high. Instead, he says he didn’t take a bunch of shots because he was just trying to get his teammates involved. I don’t care if it was futile for him to rip the Suns to shreds in that Game 7. He had to do it. The Lakers were playing for their playoff life, right? Instead, he decided to play like the rest of his teammates. That was a pathetic showing from a player who has the potential to be one of the best of all-time. He has three rings. He obviously has a lot of pride. He should’ve shown it.

By HB Ando

May 8, 2006 05:07 PM | Link to this

Man, I hate when I agree with Joe, but those are my two primary considerations, pre-six on the cheap, and the biggest popcorn I can get (OK, and no chick flicks), when a trip to the theatre is called for.

BTW, has anyone heard from Princess? I wanted to see if she asked Al about his willingness to participate in a sign-and-trade during her time with him in NY this weekend. She’s prolly recovering today.

By Sekou K. Smith

May 8, 2006 05:11 PM | Link to this

Buddy,

I’d settle for Nash attempting to play a smidge of defense. I mean, how about pretending to try and play defense? Check back down the list of MVP winners and tell me a dude who played only one end the way Nash does.

By Basketball Princess

May 8, 2006 05:13 PM | Link to this

Well guys, I am back, and with a new found respect for Al Harrington. As I sat at the Newark Airport for 3 hours on Sunday evening due to delay because of ATL’s horrible thunderstorms and showers, I felt um….well, words really can’t describe how I felt.

Seeing the league, the Hawks, and life thru Harrington’s heart and eyes give me a different perception on what goes thru the minds of these NBA players. Do some only think about money? Are some willing to take less money to be loyal to a team? Do some really perform well based on teams “systems” and situations? Can some potentially great NBA player’s loose competitiveness and drive depending on the team and coach they play for? Can rookies regress, and regret ever coming into the league because of coaches, and a team’s situation? These are all things that I pondered upon while watching the cutest 2 1/2 year old girl tell her father to go away as she pushed her stroller to the window for some alone time to watch the planes fly in and out…..To be continued!

By HB Ando

May 8, 2006 05:30 PM | Link to this

Can’t wait, Princess! Give us some!

By Chris

May 8, 2006 06:09 PM | Link to this

Could you please attempt to watch Steve Nash play, before you say that he can’t play defense. He is a much better defender than he was in Dallas because he keeps the opposing guard in front of him. I know Smush Parker isn’t a very good player, but explain to me how he shoots 33 percent for the Lakers/Suns series? In the last four games, Smush only shot 17 percent. Somebody named Steve Nash had to be playing some decent defense.

By GuyFromUruguay

May 8, 2006 06:09 PM | Link to this

I feel vindicated by your mentioning Barbosa, as I said in February in this very blog, I think very highly of him, I saw an Uruguay vs Brazil game where he was the best player in the game (that included Batista, Varejao of the Cavaliers and Araujo of Toronto). BTW Batista is here in Uruguay, he’s being interviewed to death :-) and since he’s friends with someone I know, he heard Batista disliked the way some of his teammates here took lightly some of the losses (though if I came from a 13-win team, that might create that kind of attitude, Batista is used to winning at the club level at least).

By clyde

May 8, 2006 07:17 PM | Link to this

Basketball Princess:

I’m sure Al Harrington is a good person but I have no respect for his game. I can’t have respect for him because he is a 6’10 power forward that only had 14 blocks in an entire season of basketball. FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Samuel

May 8, 2006 07:40 PM | Link to this

Ando,

I caught that little crack on Mississippi. Jonathan Bender just couldn’t cut it period. There have been plenty of players who couldn’t stand up to the big boys. Who’s to say he would not have crashed and burned at Ole Miss and ended up “broke as Joe’s Turkey”. What about my other Mississippi studs, including my boy Lindsey, who you accused of being “dead” earlier this year. Remember that.

So are you saying “you do” understand playing 100 games a year?

Cuz, none of the players in contention for MVP this year were “great” on both ends. Kobe was the closest thing but Nash’s defencies on defense were more than compensated for by his leadership and desire to win.

Another story for yall about La. When I lived in Cali I got tickets to Magic’s Mid Summer Night’s Magic All Star Game in 1990. I’m talking all the Stars were there. Janet, Eddie Murphy, MJ, Nique the whole 9. I had a 35mm camera so i said let me try something. My friend dared me. I walked all the way down onto the floor and sat right under the basket the whole game and got some serious shots. Afterwards I paraded right onto the court and started numerous conversations with Eddie Murphy, Arsenio and met one of my all time favorite athletes, Jim Brown. Yall seen that new Bud Lite Commercial. That was Samuel. I loved it.

By Samuel

May 8, 2006 07:48 PM | Link to this

That was supposed to be, “po as Joe’s Turkey” and broke as the Ten Commandements. anyway you get my drift.

“Get Money”.

By doc

May 8, 2006 08:18 PM | Link to this

thus far the nets have had three fouls called as they moved into the defender intnetionally on the way to the basket and shaq has had two called on him in a similar situation. dont mind it when it is called the same both ways but dont like the refs playing a role in the outcome.

By Art Vandalay

May 8, 2006 08:51 PM | Link to this

Smush Parker was missing wide open 3 point shots the last 3 games of the series. Don’t get it twisted, it’s not Nash’s defense that made him go ice cold, it was more of a lack of confidence. Throughout the season point guards regularly torched Nash. Don’t get me wrong, I still think he should have won MVP (since he was the most valuable player to his team in the league) but that doesn’t change the fact that he did nothing defensively.

By A Thinking Fan

May 8, 2006 09:48 PM | Link to this

Shaq 3 rings only one MVP award - Must be the wrong name for the wrong league (Shaq never fit Stern’s image requirements). Steve Nash: 6 rings, numerous MVP awards of the nba playoffs, scoring champion. Oh my bad, that’s MJ I’m talking about - not “New Poster Boy Nash of the nba!” (means Not Black Anymore)

By doc

May 8, 2006 11:05 PM | Link to this

try, not american anymore, atf, and you are closer to home on the significance that is overlooked.

By A Thinking Fan

May 8, 2006 11:09 PM | Link to this

James deserves MVP Paul Coro The Arizona Republic Apr. 16, 2006 12:00 AM

Remember how Steve Nash was going to win the MVP because there was no clear challenger? Well, there is now and I’m voting for him.

If you would like to skip the column and go directly to sending the nasty e-mail, proceed to the bottom for that address.

Otherwise, read on for Insider’s season awards and results of a poll of writers in each city.

Most Valuable Player LeBron James, Cleveland. James and Nash are both indispensable to their teams. They are both entertaining, team players carrying their squads. Both get panned for defense but try like heck.

They are both in rare air. Nash will be the only player besides Larry Bird, Mark Price and Reggie Miller to shoot at least 50 percent from the field, 40 percent from three-point range and 90 percent from the free-throw line. James will be the only player besides Oscar Robertson, Jerry West and Michael Jordan to average at least 30 points, six rebounds and six assists.

This is a tough call when an unselfish, reigning MVP with the league’s most unique game gets even better with less around him. But James is the choice here.

The guess is that Nash will win because James will get punished for being 21. Nash will consistently finish high on ballots, whereas votes for Kobe Bryant, Dirk Nowitzki and Chauncey Billups will affect James more. You know the field is strong when Dwyane Wade and Elton Brand can’t crack the conversation.

Survey says: Nash by a hair over James.

Rookie of the Year Chris Paul, New Orleans. Will Atlanta ever live down not taking this guy when he would have been perfect alongside Joe Johnson?

Survey says: Paul, perhaps unanimously.

Coach of the Year Mike D’Antoni, Phoenix. The reigning Coach of the Year did an even better job, considering he lost Amar� Stoudemire at the start of camp and has only three active players back from the conference finalists. When do people start copying the system instead of knocking it?

Survey says: Dallas’ Avery Johnson over D’Antoni and Detroit’s Flip Saunders.

Most Improved Player Boris Diaw, Phoenix. At least Atlanta has something to do with awards for a change. It let this one go, too, considering him a disappointment in two seasons with the Hawks. He came to Phoenix as a backup point guard possibility but looked like he would not crack the rotation at camp, only to wind up the team’s starting center, saving grace, second-best playmaker and top triple-double threat.

Survey says: Diaw with heat from New Orleans’ David West.

Defensive Player of the Year Bruce Bowen, San Antonio. There is an argument that Bowen can defend the way he does because he has Tim Duncan and Nazr Mohammed behind him. It’s a good one. But it’s time to recognize perimeter defense for a change.

Survey says: Detroit’s Ben Wallace beats Bowen.

Sixth Man of the Year Mike Miller, Memphis. Assist, Eddie Jones. Jones’ arrival moved Miller to the bench, where his similar numbers with a shooting drop stand out more. The big guard with big-time shooting ability had 41 points in one game and a triple-double in another. Plus, his rebounding improvement was much needed.

Survey says: Miller with New Orleans’ Speedy Claxton as a runner-up.

Reach Coro at paul.coro@arizonarepublic.com or (602) 444-2470.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 01:17 AM | Link to this

Sam, Miss wasn’t a crack. Just props for you accurately calling out some serious talent that’s been filtering out your home area the last ten years. And while I don’t know 100 NBA games a year, the constant pounding of 25 years of full court ball and playing at or above the rim (still dunked after my 39th and appears I might be on the permanent IR as I approach 40) has netted me 2 ankle/foot surgeries (with two more recommended, a very bad back and neck, a bum shoulder, bone spurs in my elbow (that might have been baseball) and a broken hand. So while it wasn’t on the big stage, it was 2 hours a day, 3 days a week, for my whole teenage and adult life. And the conclusion is that it’s a very rough sport. What I was saying is that if you never played the game at a competitive level, you probably don’t realize just how physical basketball is. Time was when people said it wasn’t a contact sport. Hmmmph.

ATF, there’s no escaping the sad irony that we traded the most improved player and passed up on the rookie of the year. I don’t care how you look at those two transactions, it truly underscores the way Atlanta is perceived throughout the rest of the NBA, and by a handful of its fans.

By tb

May 9, 2006 02:58 AM | Link to this

Maybe, but leave Diaw in ATL and I bet he doesn’t have a break-out season.

Draft Paul and maybe he doesn’t win ROY.

The Hawks have work to do as an organisation.

By Samuel

May 9, 2006 06:53 AM | Link to this

MVP Candidates:

Nash- Up one game in the second round LeBron- Gone fishing Kobe- Gone fishing Dirk- Can’t get it done during crunch time Chauncey- 4 allstar caliber players as teammates.

By A Thinking Fan

May 9, 2006 08:34 AM | Link to this

Let’s all adopted the new nba moniker: not “New Poster Boy Nash of the nba!” (means Not Black Anymore) And their MVP award now stands for: ”Most Valuable Promoter” nba’s new face is: “Poster Boy Steve Nash”

There are new numbers out this morning on how illegal emigrants have affected the job market for Americans – Just add the American borne nba player to the casualty list.

What was the phrase the ole farmer told the city slicker, “Don’t p** in my and tell me its rain… Being an old country boy myself, I concur.

By the way who was the real MVP of the Phx/LAL series? The Phx. system allows for the run-up of individual player stats, as well as team total stats.

LAL/LAC are both 2nd. tier teams.

By doc

May 9, 2006 08:56 AM | Link to this

atf. what you are then saying maybe the suns are first teir? if not maybe there are only three competitve teams in the nba and the whole season of competition has been a fraud and we have played into it.

miami may have had its pants pulled down and this may mark the end of the shaq era. he better be glad he has his rings as he is beginning to have the same pallor that ewing had in his final years. didnt think miami had the stuff to take the pistons this year and wasnt impressed by the moves they made as it resembled what the lakers did a couple of years ago when they brought in a few old dogs (and egos) and they didnt meld. it is just i didnt think the nets would pull the string on their pants. didnt look hard enough at the stats which were very revealing. the heat were a desultrious like 2 of 16 against the best this year and 1 and 3 against the nets. yes, it was only the reg season however that suggests a lack of competitiveness or lack of pride in some old vets.

if atf is right and the suns are second teir too then that means we are watching the best play with the mavs and the spurs now then have to wait another two weeks for the finale. doesnt say much for the nba.

stay tuned.

ando, it seems like you are ready for some holistic total body medicine. it is called acupuncture along with other methodologies. it wont make you twenty again but it might help you among other things sleep. whatever at all cost avoid the pills. what do you think flash, you think he is ready for what works or should he continue his present course of more surgical trauma on top of trauma?

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2006 09:48 AM | Link to this

Doctor, what is the practical reason players are wearing those long stocking looking things? I figure it most be a muscle/circulation thing.

Just like football, its all about the match-ups. Miami might win the series, but it is clear they are not very good at defening perimeter oriented teams. Speed kills. And as I harp on my “Riley screwed them up with the off-season transactions” rant, how is it possible that the Heat have a top 3 player under 25 years and have NO future as a team? They have a bunch of old guys who can’t run with the Nets (nor the Bulls) and other than Haslem, they have no one who is likely to be a contributor 2 years from now. Riley mortgaged this franchise’s future for his own personal desire to win another ring. Shaq will only get slower and less effective. This year, he playeed nig in maybe 1 of every 3 games. Next year, it may be 1 of 5. Not to mention he makes something like $20M/year for another 3-4 years. Being an NBA GM is hard. I know some think it is as easy as watching college games, reading internet sites and reviewing stats. But when you think of some of the boneheaded moves by some very smart people, it is very clear that being a successful GM is obviously a lot more difficult than any of us can imagine. Jerry West drafting Troy Bell and Dahntay Jones. Riley trading for Antoine, Williams and Posey. Dumars drafting Darko. Kiki refusing to obtain a SG while signing a marginal and oft-injured PF to $70M (and trading 3 first rounders). Kupchak trades a baller like Caron Butler for Kwame. Imagine if there were a blog set up to discuss our every action at our full-time job. “Did you see how he screwed up that presentation?” “What an idiot, how could he have forgot to invite Finance to the meeting?” “Can you believe he was late for work again?” “Is he blogging on company time again?” Oops.

By doc

May 9, 2006 10:25 AM | Link to this

i think it helps with holding heat close to muscle and it helps with fatigue of muscles like a gentle band of fascia around the muscles so the body has to do less to support itself. i like to wear under armor when i work out for glute and thigh support for the same probable reasons. it isnt for fashion and the league shouldnt outaw them until they look into wether it has some physiological benefit to prevent long term injuries.

ando isnt kidding about basketball but i really doubt that footballers and wrestlers can back off the notion that their sport has less trauma. trauma is energy delivered folks, its physics and per pound square inch do you want full force mass of a tight end or the glancing of a vince carter as he leans in to take a foul.

the landing is the problem for bballers, its what makes them good but it is also what makes them fall. repetitive injuries just like the workplace. sp the long stockings may actually help to absorb some of the shock as well. i mentioned it in an earlier post when we were talking about knees, acl,s are commom but the stress fractures like amare has are the new breed as we go higher and longer. ultimately, it is about energy absorption to the body, no one is immune to it, it is the guy who can deflect it so well is the best for longevity, the stockton’s and the nash’s not the iverson’s that look for it or the big boys. macho looks and feels good to a point.

By Clyde

May 9, 2006 11:00 AM | Link to this

The system the Hawks are running limits players on the offensive end. Woody needs to let his players let loose.

This is the reason Josh Smith had a breakout year on the offensive end. He did not listen to Woody and he went out there and played his game. He handled the ball and shot threes when Woody told him not to. FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 11:44 AM | Link to this

doc, On you question to ATF about 3 real contenders and the season being a fraud: I’ve been saying for some time that there were 5 and that all the other organizations went into the season knowing they had no legitimate chance at winning a ring. So, from that perspective, the regular season is a fraud. Always has been. I’m interested because I love watching basketball. But anyone who thought that any team not located in San Antonio, Detroit, Phoenix (while Amare was expected back healthy), Miami and maybe Dallas (I think they went into the season thinking they could win it whether that’s realisitic or not), was kidding themselves.

Doc, would you mind recommending an acupuncturist. I was looking them up yesterday through the BCBS website (they’ve contracted with some alternative health providers and give a 20% discount for members to those select folks). There was one over on Chamblee-Dunwoody who sounded good, as a practioner and a advisor to the state medical board on the practice. It’s definitely a route I’d like to pursue (I’ll never take surgery again unless it’s a unanimous last choice decision, especially in the neck/back, where so many surgeries fail).

By A Thinking Fan

May 9, 2006 12:30 PM | Link to this

If you don’t think this season is slanted towards Phx, then get the word strait from the horse’s mouth. It’s not personal, just business. Of course, this is what the commish will share with us publicly about their strategy.

Stern: NBA will ‘probably’ change playoff seeding format

By BOB BAUM, AP Sports Writer May 9, 2006

PHOENIX (AP) — NBA commissioner David Stern acknowledged one scheduling mistake — and may address another quirk in the playoff format.

The commissioner said Monday night that the NBA will “probably” change the way it seeds the playoffs.

“I think we’re just talking about taking the four teams in each conference with the best records and seeding them one through four,” he said.

Under the current format, the three division champions earn the top three seeds, followed by the remaining teams in order of their records. That’s why San Antonio and Dallas are meeting in the second round, even though they have the two best records in the West. Stern also said it was wrong to schedule the Spurs to open the Western Conference semifinals with an early game Sunday.

“If we had it to do over again, we wouldn’t have acceded to the network’s request on that one,” he said Monday night.

San Antonio wrapped up its first-round series in Sacramento so late on Friday night that it was after midnight in Texas. The Spurs spent the night in Sacramento and didn’t arrive back in San Antonio until about 3 p.m. on Saturday.

They tipped off their series with Dallas at noon, local time, on Sunday because ABC wanted to show the Cleveland-Detroit game in the more attractive later time slot.

“We could lay it off on the network, but that’s our responsibility and we have the ability to say no,” Stern said. “And we should have.”

Despite the short turnaround, San Antonio won the game 87-85.

Stern was in Phoenix to present Steve Nash with the Most Valuable Player trophy before the Suns opened their second-round series against the Los Angeles Clippers.

The long-suffering Clippers had been the butt of jokes in the league for years. “Over the years I used to say to our broadcasting department that this is the year we should put the Clippers on the TV schedule,” Stern said, “and they would say `David, go back into your office,’ and I did. So wishing didn’t make it so.”

Now that the Clippers have climbed into respectability, Stern said, “I feel great for their fans who have supported them over the years. Once every 30 years I think is good at a minimum for a team to get to the second round.”

Stern said that if a team is “well-managed over time, it will make it into the playoffs and management should be held accountable if you don’t. The Clippers have had a dry spell, shall we say, yet their fans have supported them in increasing numbers over the year and I am delighted for the fans.” He said that he at one point favored moving the Clippers to Orange County.

“Shows you want I know,” Stern said. “They’re doing great in Staples Center. I’m hoping to catch a game there sometime this round.”

Stern had harsh words for the talk of an NBA “conspiracy” to get the Lakers and Clippers in an all-Los Angeles second-round series. The Suns had to rally from a 3-1 deficit to oust the Lakers.

It was not the first time that the league had been accused of wanting to arrange a specific match-up or favor a certain team. “I’m embarrassed for the media, actually, when the issue gets raised,” Stern said. Updated on Tuesday, May 9, 2006 2:02 am EDT

By A Thinking Fan

May 9, 2006 12:46 PM | Link to this

Think about Kobe’s performance in the 2nd. half of “Game 7.” *Makes you kind of go Hmmm?

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2006 02:01 PM | Link to this

Sekou, yes, I do believe that we underappreciate Tim Duncan. Personally, I think he is the best big man since Hakeem and that includes Mr. O’Neal down in Miami.

I think part of the reason Duncan doesn’t get his due is because he is a PF. While that position has become more important in the past 8 years, it still does not have the historical significance of the center position. Now we all know that Duncan truly plays the Center position, but is listed as a PF. Whatever he is, he is clearly one of the best big men in the past 10-12 years. But I think the casual fan would give more love to someone like Patrick Ewing than Duncan.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 04:05 PM | Link to this

Only a Knicks’ fan or an idiot……

By buddy

May 9, 2006 04:20 PM | Link to this

Hey Sekou, speaking for slow-footed white guys everywhere, it just goes to show the value of ball movement and spacing when a guy like Nash can win consecutive MVPs. I’ve never heard anybody speak the phrase “Phoenix lost because Nash didn’t play any D in that game.” His ability to space the floor with outside shooting and get the ball to his teammates in scoring position make him a supreme threat even if the man guarding him is scoring 25 a night. And any deficiencies in Nash’s defensive game are covered by help defense… that’s team ball. I’m sure you think since Kobe is 6-8, phenomenally athletic and can shoot the lights out that makes him a “better” player than Nash. And individually, he certainly is. Just like ‘Nique is individually better than alot of players. But the reason ‘Nique didn’t make the 50 “GREATEST” players is because individual talent and accomplishments don’t make you great in a team game. There is no greater team player in the NBA than Steve Nash, and that makes him the MVP over greater individual talents in my book any day.

By Mash

May 9, 2006 04:29 PM | Link to this

Livingston is for real. If only we had that fourth pick, instead we got Childress at the six. Dumb luck.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 04:34 PM | Link to this

Joe and Doc (more Joe than Doc), thought you might be interested in this tidbit from Bruce Levenson regarding Billy Knight’s autonomy as a decision maker, specifically with regards to the lack of moves made in improving the team prior to the deadline. It had been about 3 months since I sent an e-mail his way and I wanted to take he and Rutherford Seydel up on their requests that I offer my opinions on events that had not yet happened, so as not to always fire thoughts that might be best chalked up to hindsight versue insight:

“Thanks Andy. Lots of interesting ideas, including several we’ve been talking about. One thing it’s important for you to trust me on. Our ownership dispute had no impact on our ability to upgrade last summer or our inability to upgrade again prior to the trade deadline. And, it will not impact personnel decisions this summer.

The hardest part of this for us is patience. In the past two years I would have pulled the trigger on two deals that Billy urged us to pass on. In both cases he proved to be right. Again, thanks for your thoughts.”

Now since our opposing opinions on Billy’s accountability have been largely unsupported, I offer this on where I feel the buck stops, when this summer’s activity is completed, with regards to expectations of player personnel transactions…….

Joe, I know you’re knee jerk reaction will be to immediately offer some quick ideas on why you think he’s being disengenious about this position. But I’d like you to really think about it and decide if your position still makes sense, or if you just want to continue to defend it, no matter what.

Since I’ve said several times that I don’t view our opposing perspectives as any type of personal competition, I’ve got no stake in what you believe. I’m always pretty secure in the level of thought I give to determining a position on an issue. And since this is the third owner who’s said to me directly, that Billy has the autonomy and freedom to pull the trigger on deals, I’ll stick with my belief that it was completely a basketball decision to stand pat prior to the deadline and leave this roster as it was for the remainder of the season (without rehashing the implications for the point, paint, Marvin, Al’s trade value, or the impact on manipulating the year or position of the first rounder we’ll ultimately give to Phoenix). The rebuilding of this franchise, for better or for worse, remains in Billy Knight’s hands. These owners have hitched their wagon to that horse. Whether he leads them to a pot of gold or off a cliff remains to be seen. I’ll keep my focus where I’ve concluded it should be, while I offer my unsolicited assessments of the franchise and it’s direction, and see what the summer brings.

By Bigmuddy

May 9, 2006 05:01 PM | Link to this

Easiest way to get over the Diaw thing is to just remember that our GM and Coach have no idea what they are doing - move on! Same goes for Tinsley, Mohammed,Gasol,etc, etc.

By buddy

May 9, 2006 05:36 PM | Link to this

One of the funniest things I’ve read in a long time, from the Racine Times-Journal:

You probably remember how Lakers guard Kobe Bryant, in response to Phoenix guard Raja Bell having thrown him to the floor during their playoff game last Tuesday night, quipped that Bell probably wasn’t hugged enough as a child.

After Game 7 of the series, when the Suns humbled the Bryant-led Lakers 121-90, I was told Bryant, as he dejectedly walked from the locker room to a post-game media conference, was approached by a woman who said, “You look like someone who could use a hug.’’ The woman? Bell’s mother.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 05:43 PM | Link to this

Buddy, I saw that too. That cracked me up. Lady obviously knows how to handle herself.

By buddy

May 9, 2006 05:48 PM | Link to this

Ando,

I don’t care if Al walks away as an unrestricted free agent without compensation to the Hawks. We’ve got his position covered by young potential stars. If we can get something for Al in a sign and trade, great. If not, let his salary come off the books and be added to our pool of available cap space and lets go get somebody that can help us win. The only thing I’m worried about is the Hawks resigning Harrington. If that happens, I will take back every defense of BK I’ve ever made.

By lilman

May 9, 2006 06:43 PM | Link to this

3- TEAM TRADE IDEA

Hawks get Telfair Frye

Blazers get Childress Jamal Crawford

Knicks get Kenyon Martin Al harrington

you can throw in extra players/ draft picks or cah but those are the main components

I think the hawks get first and knicks get 2 more bad contracts

WHAT YA THINK

By alllen

May 9, 2006 06:43 PM | Link to this

hawks should sign brian oliver dennis scott, kenny anderson, and mutombo

By buddy

May 9, 2006 07:20 PM | Link to this

And Drew Barry…

By Shute

May 9, 2006 07:35 PM | Link to this

Sekou, one of your more interesting blogs. A few comments: -I don’t think you can blame the Lakers loss on Kobe reverting back to November - his problem was not being aggressive enough. -Last year, every once in a while Diaw would throw in a real good half. Part of his problem was that he had to play aggressively and with a lot of energy, which he didn’t seem to do a lot. Being used wrong on a terrible team didn’t hurt. -I agree it is important to be in teh right system. I think it applies to other teams as well, just not as dramatically as with Phoenix (they are unique). I also think it applies to Nash and Marion to a certaiun extent. Neither would be nearly as effective playing for Jeff Van Gundy or modern day Fratello.

By doc

May 9, 2006 07:51 PM | Link to this

ando thanks for the insight from the front office. i tend to believe people at their word so ill pass on any dispute though the obvious retort you have raised already.

as far as billy, he hasnt done great, has brought in some players and the memphis franchise hasnt taken off like a rocket after he left though a lot of folks liked some of his choices including white chocolate and felt like he left west a lot to work with. i kind of like the take that astro does for gm’s and sometimes am amazed that his arguments sound so similar but probably more eloquent and certainly more detailed.

sometimes the trade that isnt made is the best one. as a surgeon i know at times i held out on the really crtically ill until there was no other choice, occasionally, the surgery would have killed the individual that got better. you cant take the knife to everything, you get only one chance and sometimes the best surgery was the one not done. some of rhe greatest proceedures i ever saw ended up in death. i fortunately learned that early on. patience.

we have agreed on the big five all year but maybe i gave shaq and dwayne too much cred was the point that has to be made after last night. will the old men rally? a lot of folks have felt that the suns dont deserve the respect though i did, we’ll see. it maybe it was only a trio league all along.

ando, in regards to acupuncture. ill make you a deal. i just dont think handing out emails and phone numbers on this site is practical or safe. ill tell you sometime how a person who thought he was important took exception to one of my comments and threatened me. funny, he had been one of my childhood heroes. big ego!

i do have an office location where we could meet on a tuesday or thursday and ill be glad to offer you a treatment free of charge, after all the harrassment back and forth it might be deserved. if nothing else, i would certainly discuss it with you at length anywhere, anytime. though it is put out there as weird and foo foo there is a lot of scientific support. it is part of the mind body connection but more. vetinarian medicine has a lot of scientific support for it so it bypasses the placebo effect. by the way the placebo shouldnt be knocked as that is important too and what the pharmaceutical companies probably ride on signicantly though they wouldnt want to admit it.

ando, it isnt a cure all, nothing is, but it is healing, if that makes sense. for me, i also would like to know more about the insurance end and what your cost will be to a provider as i am setting up shop. if that doesnt fit ill be happy to find out about what you seek if you give me the name or names as i know of a few in town including the one i go to. if we were to go forward im sure the discount can be included as well by me, though i am not a “member” as that is what my provider does for me. i am not sure my insurance co. had such an arrangement.

either way let me know when or where or some names to check on.

By Astro Joe

May 9, 2006 08:04 PM | Link to this

Ando, thanks fr the email from Bruce. I often have suggested 2 scenarios. This one confirms one of them. The owners think that BK is doing a good job. They have given him the resources and the authority. So, as I stated the other day, to blame Bk for this mess is to blame a Secretary of State for a bad foreign policy. Anyone who believes BK is the root of all that is wrong with this team, must feel even worse to know that the owners have supported him with everything that he needs and still continue to write out a paycheck every month. I’m not real sure that Bruce’s email should make you feel any better. Doesn’t that mean that if BK continues to perform at a comparable level as he has the past 2-3 years, that he keeps his job. Does that make you feel any better? I’m okay, but seems like this may require a trip to the 24-hour Walgreen’s for the BK haters.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 09:30 PM | Link to this

You know, Joe, I’m going to be a basketball fan no matter what happens to the Hawks. This summer will be huge in terms of defining where this team is headed and what it’s aspirations are. I truly am a pragmatic fellow, a realist at heart. I believe more can, and should, be done. Proof will be in the pudding. I guess my point is that if Billy is the guy, and he’s staying, and they don’t make what I consider to be reasonable moves to address what I believe are reasonable roster concerns, then at some point I’ll lose interest in them as a franchise, and interest in chatting about them as a diversion. I won’t get angry, because it’s really not that important in the grand scheme of things.

I like to believe that our blog represents the voice of the concerned, and knowledgeable, Hawks’ fan. I think that we set forth some expectations from the fans about what we think we deserve from a franchise and what we think would get butts in the seats. Truth is that there may never have been more than the two-dozen or so visitors that post here. We may indeed live in our own little internet vacuum.

My name isn’t HB Ando. He’s a product of my imagination, a nickname from college and a character in the story that is this fan blog. If Billy Knight doesn’t end up doing an optimal job as the GM of this franchise, the only folks it will impact are the owners and the fans who can’t let it go. I’ll keep using this forum to challenge his moves (as long as they remain below reproach) and to talk hoops with you guys as long as I feel the urge to come to the site and check things out. It’s far more important to the life of Bruce Levenson whether he’s handed the reins to the right person. I’m just a guy with an opinion….

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 09:36 PM | Link to this

doc, that’s a very gracious offer, that I’d like to take you up on. So how do I contact you or find your office. I’d love a Thursday visit, because I’m probably going to see my Primary Care guy tomorrow, and I’ve got an appointment with a Dr. Sloan, a physiatrist I believe, who’s supposed to be the best non-surgical soft tissue guy at the Resurgen’s practice (Gleason did my two foot/ankle surgeries, and he directed me to him, and I respect his opinion and knowledge). So while I need to get some insight into the actual problem, from a diagnostic standpoint, I’m confident enough in the symptoms that I’ve got an inflamed nerve root in my neck, left side, a few inches behind my ear, and that there’s some soft tissue inflammation that putting pressure on the nerve and firing up some serious tension headaches. I think the issue might present as a perfect candidate for some acupuncture and would like to explore that treatment methodology. Please let me know how we take this from the board to an office visit. Thanks.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 09:55 PM | Link to this

And Joe, let me clarify a response to the way you take this information. I see the fact that he has their full support and authority as a scary thing for them. I’ve told them before that I hoped they would watch his performance very closely, as I identified the areas I have here, that I believe reinforce, as the very least, the question of whether they have the right guy, if not the conclusion that they do not. Again, if they have hitched their wagon to a seemingly non-traditional approach to re-building an NBA roster (long and lean, with no real big men or point guards), and they allow that approach to continue for the next 2-3 years, like you have mentioned, then they go down with their GM. Period.

I suspect that they trust him enough to continue his path for the time being, but I doubt another season of contrarian moves, or non-moves, without some realistic improvement (I think this team should be tooled to be an eighth seed next season, given the talent, cap room, draft slot and trade value of Al, in not Childress as well). If they don’t make some serious moves this off-season, under the guise of a much more patient “rebuilding” plan, they can sell that to the casual fan. But they won’t sell it to me.

This team could have been better this season, without mortgaging the future. It was not an either/or scenario. I don’t need anyone to confirm what is obvious to me. The same reality presents this off-season. There’s acceptable and there’s optimal, and there’s down right indifferent. I’ll be able to tell the difference. And I’ll be sure to point those differences out here, in detail.

By doc

May 9, 2006 10:13 PM | Link to this

interesting take on the herd today that is a reality check on the expectations of high school big men or dominant centers from college being able to take it to the next level. to a man they fail miserably. for every one who makes it there were about ten who didnt.

i would still back my truck up to a point first as no team playing now except the cavs dont have an all star at the point, not all have the big name, all star big. there are a few bigs not playing for lack of a point. saying that care should be taken as we tout the next great big this year and certainly in examining the high schoolers before crowning them the next great …

ando, sent you an email through a way we have communicated in the past. let me know if you dont get it.

By HB Ando

May 9, 2006 11:13 PM | Link to this

doc, the counterpoint to your point about points is that they are still more readily available via free agency and acquisition than even potentially viable big men. So I think you have to do your scouting and make the best decision you can when you have the opportunity to draft a big. Look at the money that was paid to young bigs, on potential, during free agency last summer, in Dalembert and Chandler, both of whom were very disappointing. That just reinforces how few truly adequate bigs there really are. I mean look, if the Hawks’ brass scouts Aldridge and comes to the conclusion that he’s going to be a bust, then don’ draft him (again assuming he’s available when we pick). But you’ve got James, Terry and Banks as unrestricted free agents. You’ve got one to many point guards in Portland and Milwaukee. That’s five potentially viable options to address the starting point guard slot, not counting potential trade options that we might not know about, in a sign-and-trade for Al.

In direct conflict of that scenario is the realistic available free agent class of big men. Wallace ain’t leaving. All others are flawed and restricted. If you can afford to let Al walk away for free, as Buddy has suggested, then you can recover from a solid big man drafted, that just doesn’t pan out. Aldridge brings rebounding and shot blocking, with some serious upside on the offensive end of the court. Some of the big men slotted from 7-20 bring at least the D and boards, like Joe’s S. Williams, and guys like Armstrong, O’Bryant, etc.

I don’t care if it’s at the four slot, or a trade down to pick up some other picks or pieces, I believe we have to take a big man in this draft, and take our chances that we picked a winner. ‘Cause I don’t see us getting that slot any other way, other than to over pay for potential and substandard performance in the free agent market. It’s alot cheaper to be wrong about a draft pick than a free agent big man that you outbid everyone for…….

Sent you an e-mail and will call you tomorrow. Thanks.

By T-Bone

May 10, 2006 12:18 AM | Link to this

Nash winning the MVP is a JOKE. The guy is really good, but MVP NO. Think about this is Nash one of the NBA TOP 50 ever to play the game. Now the voters of the NBA are trying to say he is the most important player to his team. I think without Nash thats a good not great team, but take Lebron or Kobe away from their team they are at the bottom of the league. The way they are saying Nash is MVP Shaq should have won about NINE of them. When you look at all the NBA players who won MVP twice they were the BEST OF THE BEST. I really can’t say that Nash is a HALL of FAMER. What stat did he break or record he was chasing, but let me give him some credit I do think he is the best floor general and knows how to play his position well, but no MVP. The things what LeBron and Kobe did no man have done better.(LeBron age and average 30 points)(Kobe 81 points really could have been 3 times the other two he was taken out in the 3rd because of a blow out, also because he make BIG shots daily from the outside of the basket) I saw one stat that was funny the SUNS NEVER WON A GAME by ONE or TWO points. SO how many game buzzer shot NASH hit this year NONE I mean NONE LeBron hit two in one series and what that really mean that he has a better team than people think. Everyone on that team can shot really good. The guy is good but is NO MVP but BSP (Best Set-up Player).

By RichieRich

May 10, 2006 02:26 AM | Link to this

my thoughts for off-season moves

1. trade jchill, royal ivey and first rd pick to no/ok city hornets for j.r smith and speedy claxton(resigned) and their 2 first rd picks(12 & 15 respectively).

2. with the draft picks, pick from this group of player’s if available…..cedric simmons, patrick o’bryant, hilton armstrong, shawne williams, marcus williams, or jj redick.

3. then trade al harrington to ny for jackie butler and their first rd pick #29 overall(josh boone if still there)

4. second rd pick… rajon rondo or daniel gibson for the future.

just a few things to think about… IMO

By Chris

May 10, 2006 04:18 AM | Link to this

GIVE ME ADELMAN

By HB Ando

May 10, 2006 11:28 AM | Link to this

Rich, in your scenarios, you better swap out Boone to your first group and look at Shawne Williams at the 29th pick, from what I’ve heard…….

Also, and Joe can speak better to this than I can, the free agent signings cannot happen until after the draft (they begin July 1st), so there can be no pre-draft trades of free agent players like Al or Speedy. Kind of nullifies your plan. But hey, somebody is out there thinking.

By Samuel

May 10, 2006 11:51 AM | Link to this

T-Bone,

All that coulda, woulda, shoulda stuff has nothing to do with right now. Right now Nash is MVP.

Suns would be no better than the Lakers or Cavs without their stars.

Ando, looks like the Sheed/Dirk matchup is becomming more and more of a possibility each day.

Any thoughts on the way my boy is stepping up. Still doubt that he is one of, if not “the” most complete big men in the business.

By The Flash

May 10, 2006 12:33 PM | Link to this

SERIOUS ISSUE ON THE TABLE: Now that Sac has fired whatshisname, don’t we want to make a run at him. The guy is a proven winner. Made terrific teams and terrifically entertaining teams in both Portland and Sac town. If Carrill would come with, to me, it is a no brainer. Carrill is no. 1 on my list as a teacher, strategist, which is really the no 2 coach’s role on the team. NO ONE HAS EVER BEEN BETTER THAN THIS GUY. CARRILL IS THE MAN!!!!! On the other hand, doubt his boy Petrie intends to let him go. Also, Carrill might be ready to hang em up. But, if not, I’d think that trying to land the two has to be seriously considered, as in DO IT!!

By honest abe

May 10, 2006 12:44 PM | Link to this

tbone that is the biggest load of crap anybody has written on this blog! the suns who have a bunch of journeymen except shawn marion….are the number two seed in the western conference…which we all know is the better conference. Without nash…the suns don’t even make the playoffs..plain and simple…nash put up better numbers than he did last year, and he did it without amare….not taking away from lebron or kobe…i think all three of them deserve the mvp…but nash is definitely deserving of the award!!!!!!!!!

By Jake

May 10, 2006 03:33 PM | Link to this

HB Ando, BK has said on more than one (thousand) occassions that he would like to get a big -a real one not just some guy who slept at a Holiday Inn-. But no one wants to run out there pull a Babcock and sign a Koncak. Young Bigs are at a premium. The Mavs 7’2” 280 lb Diop may get real rich real soon especially if a Eastern Division team enters the bidding.

If Diaw spent another year in a Hawks uniform the win total would be 26 over two years.

There certainly is no guarantee Chris Paul would have won ROY in Atlanta. Paul did well because he was under the tutelage of a former star PG and fantastic young coach Byron Scott. I think that helped make a difference in his maturity.

By HB Ando

May 10, 2006 03:56 PM | Link to this

Jake, that’s a bunch of fluff. First, find one credible basketball insider who thinks that Paul’s ROY had anything to do with Scott. Kid hit the courts running from game 1 of the season. When did Scott get any kind of reputation as a master developer of point guards. He was a 2 if I remember correctly.

Secondly, before Diop stepped up for Dallas, he was a flop in Cleveland, like Diaw was here. It’s always the Phoenix’s and Dallas’, the good franchises, that take other people coal and turn them into diamonds. There was nothing stopping BK from getting Diop, or Darko (who will be a top-five shot blocker in the NBA next season in Orlando). You don’t have to overpay if you scout and make solid projections (and I’ll give credit for doing just that with Zaza). But Levenson himself said that the lack of moves to improve this team during the last season was completely Billy’s choice. So while Darko and Arroyo, two guys who clearly could have made the rotation here, at positions we sorely lack, went to Orlando for the ridiculously cheap price of the perpetually injured Cato’s expiring contract, and a draft pick, we stood pat. I’ll say again, if Al walks for no compensation, Knight should be fired. I’ll also say again that creating even more cap space by letting Al walk for no compensation is a joke. Chicago tried that approach several years ago and ended up overpaying for guys like Mercer and Rose, when no legitimate free agents wanted to come play for a loser. All that extra cap space would do is force us to over pay for a non-max player.

Time will tell, but you need to try that “Billy knows what he’s doing” story on someone who doesn’t know what he’s talking about. He got cap space, picks, Al, and maybe even Childress, at his disposal this summer to fix the most imbalanced roster in the league. One of the owners said just yesterday that there are no limits on him related to the ownership squabble, that he is free to pull the trigger as he sees fit. If he doesn’t make some moves (it’s just plain moronic to say that there are no solid acquisition targets available this summer) then there are no excuses anyone can make. He just didn’t get the job done. Let’s see what he does this summer. No excuses.

By Astro Joe

May 10, 2006 04:11 PM | Link to this

Flash, I am almost as passionately against Woody as many others are against BK (at least I was at the beginning of this past season). But I am relunctant to change coaches now, not because Woody is great but just for continuity purposes. I think Woody can get us to an 8th seed, but he will need to be replaced when we are ready to take the big step up.

I agree with you about the importance of assistant coaches. And I think we have some very pedestrian assistants surrounding Woody. But I think that more than an offensive guru, this teams needs someone to teach defense (I know, that is supposedly Woody’s specialty). And while a lack of a low post defender hurts, no one can tell me that Josh Smith has improved as an on-ball defender and Al was just plain awful. Even if we had David Robinson down low, our wing players have to stay in front of the ballhandler every now and then. Anyway, I’d love to see Woody bring in someone like Clifford Ray, Paul Pressey or Terry Porter to help build a little toughness with this young squad.

By The Flash

May 10, 2006 04:23 PM | Link to this

Astro, fair enough about needing to stand pat. However, Carrill has been a favorite of mine for so long, and the princeton would not only fit this team (don’t really need a point), but it also would bring people into the stands as it is wildly entertaining to watch. I know conventional wisdom is that offense flows from defensive stops, but, I have found that that is overstated.

When people really, really get an understanding and knowing of the offensive game, the principles that make offensives work, some better than others, then playing defense also is more intelligible. Thus, Detroit develops a great offense and plays great D, for example. My take is that this team has huge strides that can be made with the personnel at hand in their offensive concepts, each player’s basketball IQ and the team’s collective basketball IQ. Carrill is the man when it comes to that.

By the way, the head coach from Sac, I forget his name, always had good defensive teams, didn’t he? So did Carrill, although with princeton keeping the scoring down, hard to tell.

My fantacy camp would be to be able to be in the gym, in the office, while Carrill did his thing. Just a fly on the wall. Can’t help but feel that there are a whole lot of players who would feel the same.

Hey, the way things are going in NY, maybe the sac guys go there and LB comes here as GM, president of basketball operations, and coach emeritus aka Red in Boston. We ain’t got that kind of money (beat you to it Ando); but a guy could dream can’t he?

By doc

May 10, 2006 04:45 PM | Link to this

hey honest give the guy my loser award. i wore it proudly, maybe he will as well.

By The Flash

May 10, 2006 06:10 PM | Link to this

ANDOMAN, just read your most recent. Rock on, that Darko miss is unforgiveable. Leveson said that? Hey, BK, look out for the bus! Oops, too late.

By RichieRich

May 10, 2006 10:02 PM | Link to this

I personally would love to have Adelman and his coaching staff here in the ATL. Woody needs to go along with BK. I am tired of seeing him put the leash on our rookies and hold them back( comes from being around larry brown who doesn’t like playing rookies). We will have another high draft pick( no matter who it is) get that leash put around his neck and get held back again this year.

As far as Chris Paul goes, he would not have started here and probably would have been eased into a game for a few minutes at a time( which is what Woody likes to do), this in turn would stunt his growth as an nba player. Take for instance Marvin Williams, should have started the last 20 to 30 games to get him some experience for the upcoming year.

This team wasn’t going anywhere and he decides to be loyal to Al and not start Marvin and Jsmoove together. These guy’s are the future of this team and you want to play a guy that’s not going to be here over developing your first rd pick…….MAKES NO SENSE……FIRE BILLY AND WOODY…….BRING IN ADELMAN & CREW

By T-Bone

May 10, 2006 11:39 PM | Link to this

Honest ABE when you think about MVP you think about THE BEST OF THE BEST. I will bet you if you could draft any ten player in the league, NASH will not come out your mouth.Let me help you Shaq, Wade, Kobe,Duncan, R. Wallace, Antnony, Billups,Carter,Garrnet,Stoudamire,James, Artest,Arenas, Nowitzki. Now how many other MVP will fall out the top ten NONE. If you can put his career highlights on ESPN all you will see him Passing the Ball to someone else( like I said THE BEST SET-UP MAN) making the basket NO BUZZER BEATER NO HIGHLIGHTS AND NO RECORDS. HELL NO JERSEY SELL or people breaking their necks to see him play. IN all other sports the MVP is the BEST OF THE BEST.

By A Thinking Fan

May 11, 2006 08:42 AM | Link to this

The series are far from over, but the silence of the “Spin Doctors” is deafening!!!

By Astro Joe

May 11, 2006 08:54 AM | Link to this

Woody made his rounds yesterday and was in studio at both 680 and 790 during their afternoon shows. I heard the last segment with the Stews. They had moved on to asking about playoff teams. There is no doubt in my mind that Woody would prefer a quick defensive presence over the Eaton/Dikembe type. Did anyone hear anything relevant during either talk show with Woody?

By honest abe

May 11, 2006 08:58 AM | Link to this

tbone stop thinking before you hurt yourself…. that whole passing thing you mention is an extremely critical component of basketball….(unless you are playing one on one) i really feel like i’m wasting my time arguing with you on this one…anyone who knows a little about basketball know’s that nash should be one of the finalist..now should he have won it over kobe or lebron?? that can be debated…wow i can’t believe i’m wasting my time arguing with you about this…bah! so your telling me all 10 of those people are more deserving than nash…PLEASE PUT DOWN THE CRACK PIPE!

By Astro Joe

May 11, 2006 10:16 AM | Link to this

I’m not sure that criticizing a specific deal is fair to any GM. It takes 2 to make a deal. So in the case of Darko, Dumars woul dhave had to decide if would have rather had Al vs. Cato (in theory). I think that is a no brainer for the Pistons. Al would require more touches, is a tremendous defensive liability and would have altered the chemistry and playing rotations. While he is a far superior player I think this is a case where he is not a good fit for a team that does not need anymore offenseive players. Cato, on the other hand, can quietly sit on the bench and wait until a series when his defenisive presence can help the team. We have seen many Championship-caliber teams keep an obscure 7-footer on their bench. Parrish and Salley in Chicago, Elden Campbell/Dale Davis in Detroit, Caldwell Jones everywhere. Blaming BK for no movement in ‘06 is one thing, but to criticize a very specific deal only makes sense if the team acquired a comparable player. If Detroit traded for Van Horn, Jamison or Shareef, then I could support the arguement. But Cato and Al are as different as kiwis and peaches.

By HB Ando

May 11, 2006 11:28 AM | Link to this

Joe, as a second-half, rent a player, on a championship run, I think you’re being unfair and unrealistic to the attitude Harrington would have brought to that team, with regards to individual demands. Now, I’m not saying the deal should have gotten done that way. But I am questioning the logic you’re using to dismiss it. Prince does not have a viable backup, having played 43 minutes Tuesday, so the idea that Al wouldn’t have been able to fit in on the run, and be a positive contributor is, I think, invalid. Cato was a DNP again.

And, again, any deal I might suggest in this instance would have included properly showcasing Delk, instead of making it clear to the other teams who might be interested (like Detroit?) that they could wait us out rather that trade us anything. When you’re so obvious in your intent to discard a viable NBA player, and nobody respects your front office, that’s the kind of move that occurs. We bury him on the bench, make it clear he has no future here, shop him to people who are saying to themselves, and his agent, “Nah, we’ll just wait until you waive him in the next few weeks, ‘cause obviously you are”.

Can’t play here, but is first guard off the bench for the world champions. Owners said they couldn’t even get a pick for him at the town hall meeting. Uh, that’s because you’ve totally mishandled his situation and everybody else in the league knows it. Please, somebody tell me some more about what a genius Billy is. I guess I’m not buying that the Pistons wouldn’t have done that same deal for Harrington and Delk over Cato and a pick. They had/have no contingency for Prince getting hurt. Don’t think that Harrington would have been a better insurance policy than Cato? Just not buying it. Spin it however you want Joe, but you’re wasting your breathe if you’re trying to change my perspective on it.

By HB Ando

May 11, 2006 11:35 AM | Link to this

Oh, and I just picked up on your comments on Van Horn, Jamison and Shareef. OK, for starters, they are overloaded at the four, with McDyess backing up ‘Sheed, so Jamison and Shareef are both out (like Jamison would be an option?!). Al’s not a four. He just played one on TV because Billy created an atrociously imbalanced roster. Al was even quoted earlier this year, in one of his many candid interviews with OTHER cities’ newspapers, that he looked forward to returning to his natural position of small forward on his next team. Van Horn has drifted into obscurity, as a one-dimensional , 6’10 3-point shooter off the bench. Of the three, he’d be the most likely alternative. But I’m not sure what the point was. We weren’t talking about Wash/SAC/Dallas, as alternative players in the possible acquisition of Darko and Arroyo. We were discussing the value of the perpetually injured Cato and a pick, versus the potential value that Al and Delk would have provided in exchange for those two. I just think that even throwing out arbitrary names like you did, as viable alternatives that you could have seen in this scenario completely obfuscates any point you were trying to make. But whatever, chief.

By Astro Joe

May 11, 2006 02:08 PM | Link to this

Ando, if you assume for a second that Dumars got what he wanted, then you MUST consider that what he wanted was a 7-footer who would be a peripheral player with a very specific value to the team. Or, I guess you are assuming that he wanted a scoring forward and settled for a non-scoring center. Is that the basis of your arguement, because you can’t argue one side of the trade without consideration of the other.

Yes, the Hawks should have done a better job of increasing the market value of Delk. I was especially disappointed that he didn’t get any PT when Lue went down. But unless we were adding Zaza to the package, I don’t see how Dumars wanted anything else from the Hawks that would have netted Arroyo and Darko. Now, if you are saying that BK turned down a straight-up trade of Delk for Darko, then I’ll storm BK’s house with you tonight.

Finally, what evidence do we have about any non-deals that happened between any GMs of any teams? The media? Insiders? Blogs? Of all the GMs in the NBA, who is the least likely to share player personnel thoughts with media/insiders? If you are reacting to non-deals based on a better source than the media (maybe Levinson is giving you the inside scoop), please share with the rest of us.

I’m trying to accept the owners word, that you provided a few days ago. Certainly, BK’s history as a GM suggests that he is NOT afraid to make deals during the season. The fact that he never replaced Collier after his pre-season death will always suggest to me that he was operating under ownership-mandated constraints. His coach publicly requested a big man and got nothing from his number one fan. Its hard to believe that BK would let down his coach/friend for any other reason than the demands of his bosses. But Bruce says differently and I am trying to accept that as the truth, despite mounds of circumstantial evidence to the contrary.

Anyway, i hold to my initial statement. Judging a specific trade when it involves a different type of player makes no sense to me. If the Pacers trade JON & Tinsley for Baron Davis and Troy Murphy (as an example), should we get upset when we know that we have neither a quality PG nor a quality, young PF to send to Indy? I guess you would, but that’s just like yelling at the rain. And doesn’t that leave you wet with a sore throat?

By clyde

May 11, 2006 04:02 PM | Link to this

Billy and Woody are working for Detroit not Atlanta. FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Jake

May 11, 2006 04:09 PM | Link to this

HB Ando No one credited Scott for making the Nets a better team either. All he did was lift them from one of the NBAs worst teams to playoff contention. Scott was the 2 because of -who else- Magic. Scott played some point as Magic was asked to fill in for the injured Kareem. You can’t think that a rookie is so talented that he could come into the League with those kind of numbers without good coaching from someone who has been there.

Diop was an early entry out of Oak Hill. He was raw in Cleveland and no where did I say BK should have signed him. What I said was “young Bigs are at a premium” meaning you could run out and spend money for nothing. Would you rather the Hawks end up with an Olowokandi-type player.

I see a lot of complaints about BK but nothing in terms of plausible solutions. Its easy from the outside to say what moves could be made, but when you are on the phone and the other team’s GM is asking for two promising players what do you do. Basically I’m sick of hearing about Diaw. If he’d stayed his game would not have improved one iota. He’s still not money in Phoenix. Barbosa has shown more potential to be a real scorer than Diaw. Diaw will be steady but nothing special and Johnson is far better than Diaw period.

Cap space means spit if the team you want to deal with doesn’t see any value in the player(s) you are offering as compensation. This isn’t fantasy NBA. You just can’t say go sign KG and expect Minnesota to take Al and J-Chill because it works money-wise.

I agree to wait and see what BK does this summer knowing what is needed. But remember there are ZERO instant wins in this year’s draft. There are some good players but certainly no Jordan, Magic or Bird types in the bunch.

By T

May 11, 2006 04:37 PM | Link to this

Does anyone know what ever happened to John Drew?

By T-Bone

May 11, 2006 05:12 PM | Link to this

Honest ABE this is just good talk and I do know about B-ball. First of all if I drive to the hole and your man come over to defend and I pass you the ball for an open shot and you are a NBA player, you best to make the shot and plus the offence the SUNS run everyone stays behide the three point line just like last night they shot 33 threes. Most players in the NBA do not defend for three because the do not want to give up the easy basket. Also the last time I check Nash does not shot for his players and they also run a small line-up so they can beat you with their quickness and set picks along the three point line for favorable defender so they can drive to the hole and pass to the open 3 point shooter. When you look at their line-up they have no PF or C because they plan to out run you the same way Kentucky did in the early 90’s. The way Nash play is key to their success, but just like last night if you make him defend and all you will get out of him is 14 points and 8 assist Wow

By cowa

May 11, 2006 05:26 PM | Link to this

Just wondering…

Assuming all teams stay at their projected draft spots (Hawks in fourth spot) and managemetn feels that Thomas, Aldridge and Bargnani would all be gone before the Hawks pick, would you consider trading our 1st pick (#4) and Josh Smith to Portland for their 1st pick (#1) and Telfair or Jack? Since most on this blog feel that JSmoove and Marvin block each other at the SF position, I would think this makes some sense. The question is, would you rather have JSmoove, a higher priced free agent PG and Roy or Foye, or Aldridge/Thomas, Telfair/Jack and put the money towards a PF? I know some view trading JSmoove as sacrilige, but with his low salary, the improvements he made over the 2nd half of the year, and the fact that he still blocks Marvin from his natural position, it presents some interesting options. I love Josh’s game, but as Ando points out all the time, this is an imbalanced roster with Harrington or without.

By A Thinking Fan

May 11, 2006 05:45 PM | Link to this

I’m with T-Bone! Now what the heck did you just say my brotha?

By HB Ando

May 11, 2006 06:14 PM | Link to this

Childress yes, Smith, absolutely not. Fact is that I wouldn’t trade Smith for anything in this draft, period. I hope that Portland wants Morrison (some writers/sites have suggested they do). Since he’s likely available at 4, because I don’t see Chicago or Charlotte taking him, my thought would be Childress and #4 for Jack and #1, with Portland getting the guy they wanted in the first place, without having to pay him the first picks’ slotted, and higher, salary. If Portland wants one of the bigs, they’re probably not going to be interested in trading out of the slot (should they maintain it).

Now the issue of, or question, of whether either Marvin or Josh will ever become a legitimate four, and therefore create a logical tandem to develop together remains unanswered, and is likely to be more about finding the right type of complimentary post defender/rebounder to lessen the need for either of them to become a true four. But I wouldn’t trade either of them unless it was part of a package we put together for a legitimate star-quality player.

Joe, I think you view the acquisition of Cato as something far different than I do. He’s not playing. I always viewed his acquisition as obtaining an expiring contract, to create space in the off-season for the raise Ben Wallace is expected to receive. You keep making a case that Dumars made a deal for him to impact their needs this season, and his lack of playing time, nor injury status this year, support your position. There was much talk about him being waived after the trade, though it seems they kept him as an insurance policy in case one of their bigs got hurt. So, we don’t agree. Delk and Harrington provided the same expiring contracts, sans the pick that Orlando sent, as Cato, with far more upside to their immediate title run, given that Cato ISN’T CONTRIBUTING to the rotation. So, as usual, we will agree to disagree.

Jake, I’ll say again, find me one credible opinion (that means besides yours) that Scott is to be given credit for Paul. You said, “You can’t think that a rookie is so talented that he could come into the League with those kind of numbers”. In fact, his monthly statistical splits bear out that he did just that. His averages, every category, including minutes, for the month of November, covering a full 16 games, are identical to his season averages. So your saying that in the brief pre-season Scott led to a surge of improvement in Paul’s game, that flattened out for the ramainder of the full season? The numbers absolutely contradict that. The numbers suggest Paul did hit the NBA running, and he consistently performed to his season’s numbers from game one. By mid-season, Greg Anthony, a guy who knows the point guard position a little, said forget rookie of the year, Paul is already one of the best point guards in the league.

Face facts, and note what most NBA writers have stated regarding the Hawks and Paul. We missed out. We needed a franchise point guard and we passed on the best young PG to come out in ten years to take the potential that is Marvin Williams. If I was the only one saying it, you could make your point. But everyone around the country is saying the same thing. Sometimes it’s better just to accept the facts, acknowledge that Billy made a mistake and not engage in some convoluted nonsense about Scott being a guru of PG development. Next you’re going to tell me Scott was responsible for the development of Jason Kidd, who I assume was not nearly the player in Dallas and Phoenix that he was in New Jersey (right!). And if Scott was so damn valuable to Kidd, why did Kidd and the rest of the team turn on him and get him fired? Nonsense.

Finally, you missed my point about big men. Of course you didn’t say that Billy should have acquired Diop. You said Diop was going to get paid because he emerged this year as a quality young big man. My point is that Diop, Darko, Wilcox, and to a lesser extent on the young part, Magloire, all changed teams this year for less talent than Al Harrington represents. That’s four big men who could have improved this team, going for less talent than the guy we’re either going to let walk away for free, or trade for some unknown (which is why I say we’ll have to see what the final return in on Al). If Al walks for free, and you look at the four big men that, based on the price tags they fetched, could have potentiall been acquired before or during a season, when our paint had easier access than the Texas border, then I don’t think it’s unfair to say Billy didn’t get the job done. Again.

People who like to delude themselves into thinking Diaw could never have developed his game here are half right. Not under Woody. But to think he’s some miracle is to ignore his first round draft status, and that the role he’s playing in Phoenix, versatile point-forward, is exactly the role Billy envisioned when he drafted him. Barbosa has the potential to be a real scorer? So what!? Diaw joined Lebron and Kidd as the only players to average more than 6 boards and assists per game, and you’re comparing that type of versatility to scoring?? That statement alone is enough to undermine any credibility your opinion might have sought. It says you’re clueless about the game of basketball. Again, find me a credible basketball mind/writer/coach who would put Barbosa’s scoring ability on par with what Diaw brings to the Suns. Tim Thomas is a better scorer too. Hell, lot’s of guys are better scorers than Diaw. But what he does, only two others did this season, and they’re two of the very best in the game.

The coaching staff dropped the ball on the kid. That’s the truth, plain and simple. It’s just not that rare that a change of scenery, for a young player, is all they need to get their career on track in this league. And none of these guys would be in the league if they couldn’t play. So we’ve got two guys we gave up on that happily are contributing in the playoffs right now, in Diaw and Delk. And big men we passed on that began showing glimpses of the type of post defense and rebounding that we sadly missed last season, and still have no answer for going into the summer.

And I’ve got Joe reverting back to “Billy didn’t have the resources because of ownerships’ issues” two days after Levenson said directly that that was not, and had never been, the case. I just can’t figure out why people spend so much effort, and take such outlandishly circuitous paths, trying to find excuses for questionable leadership out of the front office, instead of following the most direct, logical conclusions. Let’s see how this summer plays out and see who’s right. That’s all I’ve got to say.

By The Flash

May 11, 2006 06:37 PM | Link to this

A BELATED WORD ON BARRY BASHING: I think it’s wrong, unfair, and based upon a questionable and in my opinion faulty, premise—namely, that guys like Bonds and McGuire did steroids to break records, hit homers. I don’t buy it.

I think that they took steriods for one reason and one reason only—to be able to continue doing what they love as their bodies were failing them. The athlete dying young, do not go gently into the night, rall, rall, against the dying of the light. Heck, if I had a doc like bonds did, who could assure me relative security against the ravages of those things, I’d be taking them in a quick minute. For the chance to get on the court and be able to show Ando that 6’5” or no, he’d have his hands full with this 260 lb 6’3” guy (I have a small head and high shoulders so maybe we’d size up pretty good). You get my point. If not, take a look at the sports section from the NY Times 2 Sundays ago. Lead article about how baby boomers are having injuries and doing corrective surgeries at rates that you’d think only applied to NFL players.

So, McQuire has his back thing, Bonds his knees, and roids make the pain go away and permit them to strengthen so that they can move without the pain, the debilitating pain and catches in the back or the knees that make it impossible for you to do it anymore, at least not regularly and certainly not predicably. It’s over and then somebody tells you maybe not. You go for it.

Now, the records. Did Ruth hit homers for the records? Did Lou play everyday for the records? Did Aaron play as long as he did and better than anyone alive with the possible exception of Willie (and being a Brooklyn boy I’d have to add the Duke) for the records? I don’t think so. The records came and the media sold them and the fans, well we love them, they’re to die for, to strive for, to live for, to play for. Yeah, just ask Rog, Maris that is. Or the Mick. They didn’t care about “the record.” Rog just loved to play and the Mick, well this is a family blog.

And, talking about the Mick, does anybody who watched that guy play think that he would not have been on the juice if it were around back then. More to the point, if you were a fan, and you watched this terrific specimen, this terrific, terrific talent (you do not know how hard this is to write for an old dodger fan), stride up to the plate, and take one of those terrifically timed and powerful swings, completely in sync, only the Mick couldn’t maintain his balance, he’d wince real noticeably while falling backward along with the bat, with his face not only pained but apologetic, letting everyone know how truly sorry he was to not have been able to … . Well, for any of us who saw him, if there was juice around, we’d have gone out and bought him some.

And, if anyone came after him, some twerp like Buddy boy, we’d have stormed his office. I don’t mean with e-mails. I mean we’d have kicked the g-d damn door down and there’d be someone else “running the game” and standing up for its integrity. That was the Mick, and without him, where would baseball have been, we were not ready to let go of him, even years after he left.

And, if the Mick had hit a hundred out, not 73 but a hundred, we’d have called it rightous. Better than the Babe. Hell, we’d sit on the rooves of our apartment buildings in the summer, catching the fire works from miles off in Coney Island on Tuesday nights, having that argument with our Dads, and Grandpas, all of whom would be up there to escape the heat of the apartments and to partake in the debates of the ages. We would be happy to have had the Mick around. And, despite his lack of charm (ya think) we should count ourselves just as lucky that Barry is still here too.

By honest abe

May 11, 2006 06:55 PM | Link to this

wow what’s with everyone writing three page essays????????? ando…a couple of quick point…always been a diaw fan…but i find it unfair to blame diaw’s unproductivity on woody and his cohorts….i contribute his lack of success to a number of different reasons..

1. he was young (only played two seasons in the nba before being shipped to phoenix)

2. he didn’t have a role in atlanta…(go back and read comments made by woody last year) he was always talking about wanting to play diaw more, but that he was too passive. they wanted to turn him into a scorer and that’s not his game. besides when he did come into the game he was always looking to pass and cmon who on the hawks is capable of scoring???

3. position? on the suns he gets to play center. if amare had been healthy, who know s if diaw would have blossomed the way he has this year…he found a role and position on the perfect team for him….drive and dish…that’s his forte…and if that teams got shooters then he’s going to be effective…

if you wanted woody and bk to overhaul their entire roster to accomodate diaw that probably wasn’t going to happen…not saying woody is free from blame..but i think you are oversimplifying things by placing all the blame on woody..

By The Flash

May 11, 2006 08:27 PM | Link to this

My take is that Woody lacks vision, feel, genuis, for the offensive side of the game, or perhaps for the game itself. For sheer will, discipline, intensity, organization, maybe, and I say, maybe, even leadership, okay.

But, neither as a player nor a coach has he showed me that genius for making the game flow. No wonder he could do little with Diaw. Watch out, same problem could be presented in others, I’m thinking a 2d team all rookie player in particular.

From what I’ve seen of Diaw in these playoffs, he could do what he does well from a variety of positions. That he finds himself in the middle offensively and defensively in a happenstance. The guy understands the game and can play it.

I know my man LB has said Woody is great and all, but LB is a loyal guy and, much as I respect him, I’d like to hear more about why he thinks Woody is so great. From anyone who is really knowledgible, maybe like the GM. Tell us billy, what does Woody bring to the table that makes him your guy? Or, is that a secret too. Can’t stay aloof forever can you? I suppose we’re gonna find out the hard way, unless the boyz in charge finally get to agree on something.

By Clyde

May 11, 2006 10:51 PM | Link to this

Billy Knight is the worst GM in Atlanta Hawks history. Read the article in todays paper. He doesn’t give a F about what his fans think. He even said in the article he would not rule out drafting another 6’8 guy. I think the NBA needs to have drug testing on GM’s cuz Billy is on that OWWWEEEE. At least Babcock got us to the playoffs. At least Babcock gave us our last 50 win season. Billy ain’t gave us nothing but a roster full of small forwards. FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By doc

May 11, 2006 10:53 PM | Link to this

flash, first of all bonds didnt have a doc giving him drugs. it was a back room pusher er excuse me a trainer.

second, for all this talk about the greatest ever it wasnt ruth or mantle (though he had severe knee probs in his career), etc. but ted williams. he would have surpassed ruth if he hadnt spent so many years in duty for his country, two not one tours of duty. he is the only ballplayer that is better than bonds. he had tremendous eyesight 20/10 and eye hand coordination. if only i could have had my childhood memories of ted on steroids. i was robbed!

By doc

May 11, 2006 11:20 PM | Link to this

honest, diaw isnt young as he is just 9 months younger than joe johnson. marvin and josh are young, howard is young, paul is young. diaw was a seasoned 22 plus with international and nba experience when he left here, probably the same age or a little older as chills. he is not much younger than al. bottom line he didnt develop and lost his confidence to play where he was needed by the hawks.

sad though as diaw is the athletic stud that can play several positions with versatility that bk says he likes and may draft this year “as you cant have too many of them”, that they couldnt/wouldnt try at different positions. that is even though the team was awful diaws last season here. remember the position that they could have stuck him at was the four where he spent a lot of time this year with the suns as al was hurt the last third of the season. the coach/gm had no vision for his kind of player but bk is unapologetically smarter than everybody according to the bradley interview today.

honest, kind of late to the party as some of your comments were made by a loser several blogs ago. me. especially the argument that he was in the right place at the right time to have two guys go down in the front court, that if they had played as expected this season, as they were when the trade was made, he might not have gotten on the court. no one on either side of the trade expected this of diaw. not keeping score with you per say but thought you might like to know how we are sharing these inquiring minds. am i getting smarter or you dumber? :-)

By HB Ando

May 12, 2006 01:10 AM | Link to this

Hey Flash, I just read that Bradley article. If your buddy Belkin some how gets the team, will you recommend me for the obvious, and first, vacancy in the organization (that would be GM for those of you who use cue cards)?

All I can say is, WOW (OK, I said a whole lot more than wow in the e-mail I just forwarded to one of the owners).

Well, the other thing I can say is if he thinks fans are screaming “point guard, point guard”, he’s not checking in on this blog. How about “big man, big man”. I’m glad he thinks it’s funny that his team routinely got torched by opposing point guards, who routinely smoked past every matodor defender we threw out there, as they faced as much resistance as a high school, JV lay up line. Ha Ha. I guess the joke’s on the paying fan of the Atlanta Hawks, who, clearly, is not a concern of old Billy’s. I believe Mr. Knight attended the Barry Bonds School of Media and Fan Relations. Magna C* Laude.

Hey Joe, tell me some more stories about how Mr. Knight is being unfairly judged. He wrote Bradley’s story for him. I could HEAR Bradley grinning as he wrote it. And people call me a “know it all”?

By buddy

May 12, 2006 07:17 AM | Link to this

Wow, Billy Knight does not come off well in media at all.

By Samuel

May 12, 2006 07:45 AM | Link to this

Flash,

I like your take on the Bonds situation. Good to know that there are some real baseball men out there who appreciate the game.

I also just read the BK article. Actually, I like the fact that he is so confident in himself. Wheather you like him or not you gotta like his confidence. It obviously has worked for him so far in life. I like a man who is not “punked” by a job or by what others say about him.

On the draft, I say draft the best available player, no matter how tall he is. Last year it was Chris Paul. If Morrison or Gay is around at #4, I take them to upgrade our overall talent.

I think we’re gonna be fine next year when it’s all said and done. I don’t know if we can get the 8th spot, but I believe we will compete for it.

By Astro Joe

May 12, 2006 08:56 AM | Link to this

I have said repeatedly that BK is horrificly media savvy. I have also said repeatedly, that the owners have done a horrible job of finding someone to be the media face of the franchise. When i talk about judging BK, I mean the player personnel decisions. His media credentials are indefensible. But at the end of the day, I personally do not need anyone to talk a good game. Just deliver. I don’t need to read about every potential trade, draft or thought. Just deliver. Just give me an exciting product that is capable of winning on a consistent basis. I don;t need a title, as that is a crap shoot (ask Dallas, Sacramento, Indiana, etc.) And yes, I do think we are on the cusp of that here in Atlanta.

By the way, I did hear Woody mention that he did not play wel during his first few seasons in the league. He eventually ended up with the KC Kings and his career took off. he wasn’t sure if KC had a better system or if he matured as a player/person, but his NY/KC days were daya and night. Look at the minutes Diaw played for Atlanta. he started many games got good minutes, didn’t perform at the 1/2. I guess no one hear has ever met a “late bloomer”. Stuff happens. Get over it already.

By doc

May 12, 2006 09:14 AM | Link to this

sam, ted williams is the man, served his country and he still awaits reconstitution by the science of cryogenics. he might break the record yet. hasnt declared himself dead. he batted close to .400 in his 40’s and could still hit the tater. he definitely was the greatest of all time.f

flash how many times did you see the kid play or did you not venture into the majestic yankee stadium with the pillars to get in the way. one of the best days of my life, when twelve, was to go across the gw bridge from jersy where my dad was from to an old timers game there. yankee clipper, dimag was there playing for the old yank and ted the splendid splinter was there playing for the opposition. what a day high along the third base side looking out to the right field porch that allowed so many of babe blows to trickle in. its ok the yanks lost that day to the old senators, they had to get foks to come somehow.

By honest abe

May 12, 2006 09:24 AM | Link to this

doc check back around 2 or 3 months ago…i said the same thing back then…so you must be getting smarter :)

i actually think bk has a plan and i’m willing to wait one more year and see where this thing takes us…if next year is a repeat of this year…then i’ll jump on ando and clyde’s bandwagon!!!

By doc

May 12, 2006 09:28 AM | Link to this

abe, glad to see i’m upping my game, hope you dont mind that we’re on the same wave length. good day dude.

By honest abe

May 12, 2006 09:38 AM | Link to this

one more thing doc you can spin it however you like…but diaw was inexperienced and young.. like joe mentioned i guess nobody has ever seen a “late bloomer” Not every player comes into the league and becomes an all star within their first two years… lets look at some top three picks of the past few years…

darko: still hasn’t done much right?? goes to orlando and starts blocking shots left and right…does that mean joe dumars is a schmuck? Mike Dunleavy: hmmm nuff said Kwame Brown: slowly turning into at least a player that can contribute Tyson Chandler: shows flashes, but still nothing that proves he was worth the 2nd pick. Stromile Swift: took ten steps back with houston. Darius Miles: immature, injury prone, no consistency.

One quick note..these were all top three picks…does that mean all these players won’t eventually be pretty good? NO…sometimes a change of scenery, and a few years experience make all the difference in the world.. diaw was the 21st pick of the 2003 draft…

By doc

May 12, 2006 10:37 AM | Link to this

i heard the interview that aj mentioned earlier, what was implied in the interview on 680 by woody that it took two changes before he was with the right situation for him. how many for billips? dont discount the issue. sadly, though in the same interview, woody also alluded to the fact that diaw found himself at the four positon where he added he hadnt been utilized by the hawks. with al out protecting his knees last year that might have been a good time for them to have tried him at that spot. nothing to lose if they had ben creative. diaw had it in him and he wasnt that young experience wise or birth rite wise. my final take is diaw will be a great 6th man or fit into a system like kukoch was in and have his moments.

what i havent heard these guys say is they made a mistake. they may have been in what they didnt say but never came out and say we missed it and learned from it. it was refreshing to hear d’antoni say the biggest problem for barbaos last year was the coach who continued to try to make him into a point when he was a great scorer and fit the two better. that is coaching to the players attributes or at least finding them.

i am not like some that say fire either bk or woody, in fact the voice of reason at times. i also dont intend to look the other way when it is put out their for us that it “just happens that way” but we are smarter than everyone else. i think woody finally found a coaching staff that could relate to him when he finally “bloomed late”. usually or often late blooming relates to confidence. i think that was instilled into diaw by the suns and not by the hawks. i would hope to hear at some point that woody says he learned something from the diaw experience instead of his present take of it just happens, beyond our control.

your last paragraph or two is the foundation for my argument that we cant get too hung up on one draft or player as the essence of how to build the team. the pistons have only one draftee in their lineup made predominantly of throw aways by other teams or guys that excelled beyond what they had shown their former teams.

though the present hawks mix might not have come together to make a lot of wins and a complete team the four last draft choices can play, jj is a warrior who will be around for a while and zaza adds to the nucleus, so billy has done something right. that is progress. hopefully, lady luck is coming our way with the lottery so the right guy is there for us and there is the next big ben that billy has his eyes on.

however, until you bring the crown please billy, stop with the false bravado. you are a working stiff like us all no better nor smarter, certainly not above all your peers. when is someone going to tell him that winning hearts is part of it the job as well, that is to get people into the seats.

By Basketball Princess

May 12, 2006 11:42 AM | Link to this

Ok, I’m back. I will be the 1st to admit this right here and now of me jumping on the Al Harrington Old man Knees band waggon. My motto is the proof is in the pudding, and my foot has officialy been placed in my mouth, although it’s a small one.

Al’s knees are just fine. Nothing wrong with them. His kness have a clean bill of health according to his doctor he went to go see on Friday when I was in there. Al said if anything, he would expect people to spread rumors about his back. He’s pointed out that he’s only missed 6 games in his career after he came back from the surgery. Some of those missed games were due to a condition that every athlete get’s called jumpers knees. He said he understands though. Things like that come up when it’s trading time or Free Agency which is the situation he’s in now.

So what do yall want to know?

By Astro Joe

May 12, 2006 11:45 AM | Link to this

Doctor, saying that you have found a better way to utilize an existing resource is far different than acknowledging a mistake when it comes to a player transaction. I would not want to risk JJ feeling unwanted because someone comes out and says that we should have kept Diaw and tried to uncover his talent at another position. That could be interpreted as we should have kept Diaw and not acquired JJ. I do not want anyone to say we should have drafted Paul. That could make Marvin feel unwanted. More so than appeasing the fans, BK & Woody need to support their current group of players. And publicly second guessing the transactions of the past few years could only discourage those guys who have landed on our roster because of those transactions. D’Antoni’s confession does no harm to Barbosa. The same would not be true if BK did a mea culpa regarding Deng/Iguodala, Diaw or Paul. And yes, BK’s arrogance is extraordinarily grating, annoying and sickening.

By Basketball Princess

May 12, 2006 12:22 PM | Link to this

Asro, I can Agree with you on BK not publicly admitting his faults with his past draft choices. That would be very idiotic. These guys are feeling quite confident in their positions here in the ATL and players will perform exceptionaly well for you giving you there all if they know they are needed and wanted. I’m not feeling the I don’t care what yall think statement. It not about what you say it’s how you say it. He could have said, “Althought I understand that the fans in the city of Atlanta are unhappy with my current past choices, it is my job to do what’s best for this team and thats what I’m going to do.” It still spells out the same thing without being so abrassive

By doc

May 12, 2006 12:26 PM | Link to this

interesting twist on my words, never suggested the take on jj but maybe they wouldnt have thrown in diaw so easily or found another way to make the present mix work with the addition of jj. it could have been prety to have watched jj, diaw, josh marvin and chills race up the floor game after game. two really good ballhandlers with a few finishers. gee we might have been in the playoffs.

the point i made was his comments about diaw finding himself in a new situation at a position he hadnt played with the hawks and probably could have been explored the way als now sound knees were acting up last year. maybe the guy to have placed to the suns would have been al. after all you, i think, and i have been adamant, that having al around all year has not benefitted the team or tem chemistry for the near or long term future of this organization. i dont think there were two more disappointed and verbal folks on the passage of the trade deadline with al still on the team. maybe the suns would have taken al and a first thereby saving us a draft pick.

didnt come close to denegrating jj nor feel it would have and have been one of the folks routinely saying he is worth what we have given up especially at the costs of other protected free agents as you have ably listed starting with k. martin. i am reading your comments just dont get your read on this one aj based on my comments.

welcome back bp. are you just going to tease us?

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 02:08 PM | Link to this

Ando, I finally got that you have a neck/nerve problem. Doc’s suggestion re: accupuncture is right on. Something else to consider, cranial sacral osteopathy. I’m sure I could get you a seriously good referral.

Osteopaths are medical doctors only not MDs, they are DOs. They receive considerable training in detecting where the muscular skelletal system is out of whack and facilitating release of the dis ease. I’ve worked with osteopaths for years. A subspecialty is cranial sacral work, very, very subtle, and potentially very healing.

Try this for temporary relief and a terrific trip to la la land. Get yourself a regular bath towel, not one of those huge sheets, just a towel, fold it in half and then roll it up. Get yourself something like a tie from your bathrobe. Put on real compfortable cloths, sweat pants and a tee shirt. Put on some soothing music. Now, sit down next to a coach so your side is right up next to it. Lie back, leaving your knees bent; then squoosh around so the legs below the knee go onto the couch and your butt is close to or touching the couch. We’re talking right angles here. your lower leg and thigh are at right angles, your thigh and torso are roughly at right angles. Now, there is a ridge at the bottom of your skull. Take your fingers, you can feel it. The occipital ridge. right under that ridge, between the vertibrae, is a real soft spot. This spot is referred to in cs terms as a still point. Place the rolled up towel under the occipital ridge. Oh, I forgot, take the tie and tie your thighs together. No, not that tight so you squeeze your whatevers. Just so you don’t have to work your muscles to hold your legs together. You will work them otherwise whether you know or not.

Once the towel is in place. Just relax. Plane to spend at least 20 minutes lying there. You can adjust the towel, moving it up or down, to see if one place feels better than the other.

After about five minutes, your breath will deepen. Your diaphram will let go, and your attention will drift inward, lala land I call it. The still point at work. Anyway, without all the momo jumbo, it is a place of deep, deep repose, and opens the possibility of the body’s making micro type adjustments on its own that relieves distress and dis ease. Healing, in other words.

For the rest of you folks, try it, you’ll like it. John Upledger, the originator of cranial sacral work, recommends that people do this 15 minutes every day. The stuff with the couch and tie is my own add on. It really releases the psoas muscle, hip flexor, and lower back. I often ice my knees at the same time, sometimes my hip flexors as well. It’s a terrific thing to do.

Ando Man, no way to answer your inquiry without sounding like something I’m not, except perhaps to say that there is no reason I can see that I would keep the riches that I’ve found here, the passion and perspectives, to myself.

By honest abe

May 12, 2006 03:00 PM | Link to this

man all this billy knight bashing is p** me off!!!!!!!!!!

WHAT DO ALL YOU HATERS HAVE TO SAY ABOUT………………..

DONTA SMITH

heh have a great weekend everybody!

By HB Ando

May 12, 2006 03:28 PM | Link to this

Doc, I see that you too have now tasted Astro Joe’s penchant for putting words in your mouth as a way of rebutting your position. Kind of annoying, no?

Flash, I actually set and ran a physical rehabilitation facility several years ago at the behest of a couple of physiatrists that I worked with at NE Georgia Medical Center. Very familiar with their specialty and their approach. I’m actually seeing a Dr. Rueben Sloan on Wednesday, reported by a couple of different physicians as the best non-surgical spine doc in town. I’m also seeing doc (yes, or very own doc) for some acupuncture on Tuesday.

After spending the last six months viewing Billy Knight with a critical eye, and concluding that he’s not the man to lead this franchise, it’s refreshing to see him make my position that much stronger. It’s the first time in a while where I haven’t felt any need to point out his shortcomings. or defend myself to his dwindling few supporters. His failures out number his successes, decision making-wise, at no less than 2 to 1. That’s a recipe for disaster for this struggling franchise. And he just cost his bosses some turnstyle cash, for sure.

By St. Bernard

May 12, 2006 03:34 PM | Link to this

Flash just tried the towel thing and lost all feeling on the left side of my body….just kidding..but why don’t we stick to talking about the hawks.

By HB Ando

May 12, 2006 03:38 PM | Link to this

Princess, still hoping to get your insights on whether Al has any inclination to work with the Hawks on a sign-and-trade, versus just walking away. That would be the single most valuable information you could provide to us here regarding your time with Al. Because the difference between us getting something of value when he leaves, versus us getting nothing, is tremendous, in my opinion. This is not a team with enough spare pieces to lose a player of Harrington’s caliber with nothing in return but some cap space that nobody wants to take.

By Astro Joe

May 12, 2006 04:15 PM | Link to this

Doc, this is what I was referencing:

what i havent heard these guys say is they made a mistake. they may have been in what they didnt say but never came out and say we missed it and learned from it. it was refreshing to hear d’antoni say the biggest problem for barbaos last year was the coach who continued to try to make him into a point when he was a great scorer and fit the two better. that is coaching to the players attributes or at least finding them.

I thought you were looking for a similar “mea culpa” regarding some of the oft-debated personnel moves. But maybe you were more focused on the “finding the right role” angle. Sorry if I misinterpreted your comments. (By the way, if it is about the right role for the player, Woody did that in game 3 when he moved JJ from the traditional PG to a lead guard role).

And Ando, I think I interpret your comments very well. I think I just find a lot of holes in them. The notion that Dumars was looking for just any expiring contract regardless of what he received in return was a particularly good one. Or, to be more specific:

I always viewed his acquisition as obtaining an expiring contract, to create space in the off-season for the raise Ben Wallace is expected to receive.

It was both. An expiring contract AND a player to play a specific role during the championship quest (which is NOT in the regular season). Don’t you remember Parrish and Salley playing the same role for MJ’s Bulls? They sat pretty much the entire regular season and early rounds of the playoffs until they got a sniff.

I’ll try to do better about copying quotes when referencing statements from other bloggers.

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 04:49 PM | Link to this

Well taken, St. B, don’t try it. Make believe I never said it. What it mean to me, the world?

Want a Hawk take. I would have gotten Darko and the other guy. I think Darko has as much upside as a big, as MW does as a 3. So, if that is what it would have taken, yes, I would have dangled him and Delk. They still take a washed up Cato who we haven’t seen yet?

Dumars needed to get rid of Darko because it was getting harder to not play him, and the longer he waited the better the kid would have been and the better he would have been when Dumars let him go and Dumars’ star image, which he so covets, would have been tarnished. But, could he have turned down BW and Delk, if Astro is right that Al and Delk wouldn’t have gotten it done, which we don’t know was ever put on the table because billy ain’t talking and Brucey didn’t talk about that and probably wouldn’t.

Billy should have some explaining to do, but you see, the last thing brucey boy and Gearon need at this point is some straight talk from Billy, if you catch my drift.

No body in a business like this should get away with treating the consuming public like they are just so many dolts whose only interest should be is watching the boys on the court. Why is Billy? Astro says it’s because Gearon and Brucey and what’s his name don’t care or don’t know. Sorry Astro, that just doesn’t ring true to me. Anyone else troubled by that explanation. If so, what else is left?

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 05:09 PM | Link to this

Astro might have a point about Cato, and the safety net protection. I have several things to say about that. Why do we need to guess about whether BK tried to land those guys, and what he offered? Who does Billy serve by keeping it quiet if he tried but Dumars would not budge.

More important, if BK offered Al and Delk and Dumars turned him down, for Cato over Darko (a pick em, as safety nets, if you ask me), and then sent the guys BK wanted to Orlando, why, how, in the name of all that is virtue, did BK let Delk go to Detroit for nothing? It isn’t like everyone here, and with the possible exception of Ando (only kidding, partially) there ain’t no genuses, didn’t know to a certainty that Delk could really play. and, if BK did not know that Dumars needed a scoring/point veteran to come off the bench he truly is in the wrong business.

Hey, I bet if they had interviewed Dumars when we played in Detroit at the end of the season, he would have sung the praises about how well the Hawks competed. Of course, he’d have been talking about on the court. Behind the scenes, even Dumars would have had to admit that they are a complete joke (and I didn’t say word one about Sheed, did I?)

Okay St. B., tag, you’re it!

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 05:20 PM | Link to this

And, St. B., please in answering don’t give me that blah blah blah that is being passed around about Diaw, and say some nonsense about Delk’s playing and doing well because he’s in the right place at the right time.

Whatever else can be said about that stuff regarding Diaw, and I agree with everyone who says that that is just so much nonsense, it is undeniable that a critical skill for any GM is to be able to project the value of your assets to the other guy. If you can’t, you can’t sit at the table. Plain and simple. And, having given Dumars the key ingredient to a championship team in the form of Sheed, either the guy understood that he owed BK, or BK had to teach him a lesson and do whatever it took to deprive him of Delk. I said it at the time and I’ll say it again, that he did not is nothing short of a disgrace. Of course, I’m waiting to hear BK explain why my thinking is wrong. Yeah, right, and holding my breathe.

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 05:34 PM | Link to this

Astro, just so you know, nothing but respect, even though we disagree on this and related subjects. You probably have addressed this, but if not, maybe you could. As I see it, Dumars had two insurance needs and a need for an expiring contract. He gets one filled for nothing and the guy is playing regularly and very well. The other guy he gives away serious assets for and might never play. How does that work and couldn’t BK done something to cover that cap need; for example, sign Delk to a big contract through the end of the year before trading him to Detroit?

You really can’t say that the need for a big was bigger than the need for a competent experienced 1/2 sub. And, you really can’t say that Cato was worth what Detroit gave for him. So didn’t we misplay this somehow? You know me, this salary cap stuff escapes me. Help, if you can.

By A Thinking Fan

May 12, 2006 08:15 PM | Link to this

James shares MVP honor with Nash By TOM WITHERS, AP Sports Writer May 12, 2006

CLEVELAND (AP) — LeBron James doesn’t believe in second place. In at least one MVP race, he tied for first.

James, who finished a distant runner-up to Steve Nash for NBA Most Valuable Player, has been named the league’s co-MVP along with the Phoenix guard by the Sporting News, which has been giving out the award since 1958.

By The Flash

May 12, 2006 09:11 PM | Link to this

Well, I guess everybody’s tired of this so I’ll set out the obvious and then tear it apart. So, you say, BK was simply relying on Woody and Woody worked with the guy, Darko, and didn’t want them. There, that wasn’t so hard. Yeah, then why won’t BK say it.

And, all I can say if Woody took that view is that there is way, way too much bobby in him to coach any team for me. This notion of I’ll teah toughness, warrierness, and my men will outfight the other guys for each inch of turf is an approach I find a complete bore. I also don’t think that it is the best way to play defense. If you understand the offensive game, I mean really, really understand it, than you are an intelligent and effective defender. You will be able to grasp a team defensive concept and understand how to defend as situations arise.

That is not Woody’s style. It probably is a style that Darko would function in most effectively. Ditto, by the way, for MW. I believe that that is the style at NC under Williams.

And, I also believe that Woodson’s concept, embraced by BK, is that you outwork and outphysical the guys on the defensive end and everything will follow. I am more impressed with styles that can put forth maximum defensive pressure in creative and effective ways at critical junctures, preventing people from timing you, getting used to you, knowing where your limits are.

People say that Phoenix doesn’t play defense. I’d like to see the numbers for the close out of close games, close out of periods, of half times. I bet those numbers tell a different story. All of a sudden, people need to be taking jump shots and from spots they don’t particularly like after they skated most of the time in entirely different ways. Lots of ways to skin a cat; I’m not a fan of Woody’s, and wouldn’t trust his judgment about Darko, assuming he was even consulted.

Bet everybody’s real happy St. B. didn’t let a sleeping dog sleep. Sorry gentlemen, and one great, great broad.

By RichieRich

May 12, 2006 10:48 PM | Link to this

A QUICK COMMENT ON BARRY BONDS….

A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO I WAS TALKING WITH RUSS ORTIZ(NOW WITH THE DIAMONDBACKS) ABOUT THE ACCUSATIONS ABOUT BONDS DOING STEROIDS, AND ONE THING HE SAID WAS THAT BARRY’S HAT SIZE CHANGED A FULL SIZE FROM ONE SEASON TO THE NEXT…..HMMMMMM INTERESTING….

By doc

May 13, 2006 01:00 AM | Link to this

astro, i appreciate the clarification but as you can see the text i was emphasizing was in the first paragraph not the second. usually, find a lot to agree with you on just didnt understand your take from what i had written. diaw is gone and as i have said before i am pleased he is doing well. arent both sides supposed to win in a trade anyway?

just found woody’s comments nonchalant in contrast to the obvious ommision to checking the boy out in that position to be interesting where there had been an opening or need the end of last season. it is called thinking out of the box. not putting words in your blog but from some of your comments it has seemed that you have felt this organization lacking in that department.

By doc

May 13, 2006 01:08 AM | Link to this

saddend to read of the death of larry hughes’ brother. that was as heart warming story and relationship as there has been in sports recently. have followed his career since u of st. louis because of it. prayers of compassion in his loss.

By HB Ando

May 13, 2006 01:23 AM | Link to this

Astro, it’s funny, because you state as fact your opinion that Dumars filled two needs in taking Cato. Where do you validate that statement. Here’s a fact, Cato has logged a total of 15 minutes, over 4 of the 7 playoff games Detroit has played. They have played, are playing, teams that actually have great depth at the four and five, in Milwaukee (Magloire, Bogut, Gadzuric and Joe Smith) and Cleveland (Z, Gooden, Varejoe and Marshall). So you’re whole premise is on using him for extra fouls for Shaq? Just so I’m clear, you believe that’s as much of a factor is clearing cap space this off-season to re-sign Ben Wallace? And you believe that Harrington and a properly showcased Delk, providing the same off-season cap flexibility, and providing depth at the 3, the one position where Prince has no backup, would not have been preferable to Dumars, if negotiated (SS said there were no conversations between Atlanta and Detroit regarding this plausible deal, which, in itself, is damning enough when stacked on all of Billy’s other inactions, to make my case).

Joe, I think it’s you who are offering porous theories. You start stating as fact what is both largely illogical, and completely unsupported by statistics, and you become the pot to my kettle black in that regard. Don’t feed me *%$# and tell me it’s cookies, dude. You need to either go back to the drawing board or learn to admit when your opinion has been usurped by a stronger one (like now).

If SS is right, then Billy’s lack of pursuit of such a trade is one of two things: One, he’s got a better plan to optimize Al’s value this summer, and only time will tell (and I’ll say for the nth time, that if he lets him walk, he’s a freakin’ joke and this franchise is doomed until his successor has had a couple of season’s to undo his damage), or two, he didn’t try, per SS’s contention, and that’s equally telling about how out of the game he really is from a roster improvement/player acquisition standpoint. I just can’t get over how silly you sound maintaining that Cato would some how be preferable as a rent-a-player, to Dumars and Detroit, than Al Harrington and a pre-waived Tony Delk. Delk, alone, is playing 12 minutes per game, 3 times as many as Cato. You don’t think Al, as insurance and rotational relief for Prince, who played 43 minutes the other night, wouldn’t have been welcomed over Cato’s a* on the bench? Crack. Smoke.

By Samuel

May 13, 2006 08:50 AM | Link to this

Doc,

Love watching vintage film on Ted but I can’t concede that he was the best.That was before Blacks were allowed in the majors. I would love to have seen him play against the best. Guess we’ll never know.

Richie, I have heard that old hat size thing before. What year did it jump? I did’t think so.

By A Thinking Fan

May 13, 2006 09:48 AM | Link to this

I wrote this a year ago to Steve Kerr No, No Steve! (Kerr), the brotha’s on Phoenix are what Jordan & Pip were to Steve Kerr, take them away and I would never build a team around Steve Nash: Shaq – YES! Steve – NO!!!

Its’ true in this series for ‘ole SN (MVP – Most Valuable Promoter!)

By doc

May 13, 2006 11:35 AM | Link to this

sam, not quite accurate on the race thing as ted was around to compete in the new era as he lasted into the early sixties, so we do know. as i said earlier he batted .396 after forty i think. i believe the barrier was thankfully dropped about ten years earlier as one of my early childhood heroes was the incomperable catcher roy campenella not yogi. my dad had encouraged me to put the tools of ignorance on as the quickest way to the majors. one practice where a must have gotten about ten foul tips off my right shoulder convinced me first base had a lot of action and less abuse.

i was horrifed when he had the car accident that left roy paralyzed in 1955. the picture of his mangled car is still indelibly encoded in my memory. my older friend flash who is a real yankee(not fan) and dodger fan can fill in the exacts. im sure he can give you the date and time that jackie robinson stepped onto the field to play for the dodgers.

you and i know there is no one great ballplayer. ted was truly the supreme guy of his era which lasted into three decades and then the wand passed to mays. because of his military experience he is often overlooked when people talk greats and why i brought him into the mix as that time away from his career affected his stats. he also spanned two eras and was a war hero to boot of both ww2 and the korean.

ruth, mays, mantle, bonds, aaron, dimag, josh gibson, satch, ted williams could all play and what is interesting about baseball i think they could all stand the test of time and play right now. baseball is not a game traditionally that you can only be great on one dimension. it doesnt require height or bulk which in some ways hurts the baseball player that has all five skills and has been the change seen in football and basketball that negates any comparison of eras.

it is a game for the ordinary size man, discounting the roids, much like golf and soccer. that is also the reason to keep it clean to the traditionalist. you can go to the park and watch a softball game if you want to see one dimensional play, sam and watch the ball soar. it is not all about hitting the tater to the purist.

there is another interesting common comparison between barry and ted. you can be great in baseball without having the world series ring on your finger. that in itself is the distinction and mantle that both williams and bonds wear and can wear proudly.

By doc

May 13, 2006 12:03 PM | Link to this

sam, teds career spanned four decades with no play in 43-45 and onl about 40 games in 51 and 52 due to his tour as a fighter pilot. career started in 1939 ended 1960.

jackie came on in 1947 so a significant number of teds stats if not most were against all of the best.

ted batted .316 in 113 games his last year at 41 with 29 hr, .388 with 38 hr’s at 38. not too shabby.

ted’s final career avg for 7706 at abts was .344 with an obp of .482 and a sluggging avg of .634. huge.

By cowa

May 13, 2006 02:03 PM | Link to this

Ando, while I agree entirely with you regarding the Harrington/Cato debate, I thought Dumars was looking for two pieces in the exchange: an expiring contract and a 1st round draft pick. Detroit is loaded, and obviously didn’t need Cato (or even Harrington, for that matter), but Harrington would have been the best insurance policy out there. Now, whether they would have accepted a 2nd round pick (as we really don’t have a pick that would have fit in this deal), we’ll never know. Would you have traded our 1st round pick this year, Harrington and Delk for Darko, Arroyo and a future 1st round pick that would be up in the 20’s? That would be a lot harder to swallow. Cato was only involved from the salary aspect; it was the pick they wanted to try to actually get something in return for the long run for Darko.

I know BP says that Arroyo is going nowhere, but I still say we go after him from Orlando, as he’s not moving in front of Nelson in the near future.

BP, please get back to us on Ando’s question: Will Al do a sign and trade, or is he willing to take less to get with the “right” organization? How was his visit in LA? Who else is he looking to go to (besides NY, Indy & Chicago)? I’ve been guessing Cleveland with LeBron (even though he would be a lousy fit in my opinion) and Miami (if they could move Antoine). Let us know!

By Clyde

May 13, 2006 02:31 PM | Link to this

Good article in the paper today Sekou. Its obvious the Hawks just can’t determine talent. The just because a man is 6’8 and can play mulitple positions doens’t mean he will be a great NBA player. I think teams look to much at physical make-up rather than skill.

The draft that really made me mad was the 2000 draft. I believe we took a scrub in the second round instead of Redd.

By Clyde

May 13, 2006 02:32 PM | Link to this

Oh I forgot FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Clyde

May 13, 2006 02:41 PM | Link to this

How bout this. Hanno Mottola in the second round of the 2000 darft over Micheal Redd. That hurts. I wonder who the Hawks will pass up this year. FIRE BILLY AND WOODY

By Astro Joe

May 13, 2006 03:17 PM | Link to this

Ando, one last time and I will leave it alone. Al would have likely disrupted the playing rotation and is a horrific defensive player. Why fix that which is not broken? Cato fills a PLAYOFF need. Don’t give me stats from the regular season. Who have the Pistons played in the playoffs with a fierce big man? How about Shaq and Duncan? Some GMs think ahead beyond their arm length.

Bottom line, you can’t force a trade down a GMs throat. It has to work for both sides. If Dumars wanted a player like Al, then why on earth did he settle for Cato? Or are you now saying that you would be a better GM for the Pistons too?

Here’s my assumption. GMs from winning clubs very rarely have to settle for a bad deal. If they don’t like the trade proposal, they walk away. Here’s my other assumption, if a GM trades for a center, he probably didn’t want a SF. I just don’t think too many people go grocery shopping for milk and cereal and come home instead with a chips and dip.

If he wanted a scoring, no defense playing SF/PF, then why would Dumars come home with a defenive center with no offensive skills? CAN ANYONE EXPLAIN THAT LOGIC TO ME??? Instead of reading gossip columns, how about looking at the results of a deal to figure out what the respective GMs were looking to acquire? DUH!

By Samuel

May 13, 2006 05:17 PM | Link to this

Nice try Doc but I wouldn’t exactly call 60 black players out of over 6000 player slots from 1947 to 1960 playing against the best. And that doesn’t even count the great Cuban and other Latin American players.

No matter how you cut it Bonds, Mays, Aaron have excelled against the best in the world and Williams, Ruth and others who played during that segregationists era did not.

By HB Ando

May 13, 2006 05:30 PM | Link to this

Joe, I did explain it to you. Expiring contract. Period. And the stats I quoted were from the PLAYOFFS. Cato has played in 4 of 7 games and totalled 15 minutes in the PLAYOFFS. Ilgauskas and Magloire are both former all-stars. And, as I already pointed out, both Mil. and Cleveland boast the kind of depth in the paint that usually requires expanded minutes of bench players, which has not occurred in Cato’s case (because he’s not part of their plan/rotation). I read no columns, so my ideas are my own on this. I suggested we go after Darko and Arroyo in my very first e-mail to Sekou in June of ‘05. And you can survive a little less defense from a Harrington when he’s a back up. And you could use a viable scoring option off the bench like Harrington. And Prince is playing over 40 minutes a game, which can’t be optimal for his performance and energy levels as the playoffs go deeper.

I don’t even know where you come up with the point about shoving this idea down Dumars throat. Again, I pointed out that according to Sekou, we never even sought out such a deal. Seems that Orlando did. So half my point has been, why didn’t we go looking to make such a deal? And if we let Al walk for free, why in the world didn’t we at least go shopping for a Darko or a Wilcox, in trade for a guy who has clear value on the free agent market. This GM went shopping for a contract and some insurance. He found Cato and a pick for two guys who didn’t project to crack their rotation, ever. Everyone knew that Darko would opt out of Detroit as soon as his contract was up, so his only value to them was in trade. With no needs to improve or fortify their rotation, they took a contract and a pick. The most simple explanation usually works. There’s just no convincing me that a guy who’s averaging 3.8 minutes per game, playing in 4 of the teams’ 7 playoff games, was brought in to have an impact. When the trade occurred, it was widely reported and widely accepted, as the most obvious and logical explanation, that Detroit needed an expiring contract to clear space for Ben Wallace in the off-season. Simple. DUH.

Look, I continue to get the sense that you’re more interested in arguing with me than making any sense. When you stick to your ideas, you tend to have a lot of good ones. But your rebuttals just haven’t had any strength to them. I’m now having to repeat what I already said. Your response just didn’t represent the position I laid out in great detail. You’ve got nothing to support that Dumars took Cato as anything but an expiring contract. No quotes and no minutes or contribution by Cato. He showed up playing a position (PF/C, Wallace, Wallace and McDyess) where they are deeper than SF (Prince alone). And I wouldn’t be surprised if the pick they got is passed on to another team, or used for an undeveloped, high upside guy, as it will likely fall in the mid-teen/early twenty range (given Orlando’s likely continued improvement towards a legitimate playoff contender).

Just so you’re clear that on my side of the coin, this continues to be you trying to take me to task for nearly every perspective I offer. I don’t show up here thinking, “What did Joe say, so I can disagree”. But it seems you do. I’m backing my position up with both logic and pertinent statistical references, and you’re telling me what you think Dumars thinks. Fair enough.

On another issue, I have been thinking about your season long infatuation with Shelden Williams. And if we can’t get Aldridge, I’m increasingly finding the potential fit of his particular skill set as intriguing for this lineup. As I’ve come to the conclusion that the only way for Marvin and Josh to reach their collective and individual potentials, playing next to each other, is for them to have a Wallace-type defender rebounder to reduce the need for either of them to develop into a true power forward. I haven’t seen O’Bryant play, so I just can’t create an opinion of him compared to a Williams. I’m not sold on Hilton Armstrong in that grouping. Also haven’t seen the kid from NC State. And I can only see taking Thomas (though I just don’t see him dropping to four if that’s where we pick) is if Billy plans on moving one of the three young forwards in a trade for a legitimate veteran PF or PG, or as part of a package for a big time name.

My point is that we really see things quite differently, but I’m not so hung up on an imagined competition with you that I can’t see straight enough to give you credit for an idea that has been yours all season and just leave it at that.

You might want to consider a name change to Don Quixote, as you continue to joust with windmills……….

By doc

May 13, 2006 07:18 PM | Link to this

sam, where did you come up with your numbers? it is now humourous that you have included the caribbean players and cubans. that excludes willie and hank as that group didnt come onto the scene in large numbers until after they retired. obviously then their records are tainted by that logic. gee, from 1963 on just two years after ted retired willie only had one year of batting over .300 the rest of his career that lasted until 1973. is mays tailspin due to the influx of african-americans? are you saying that his numbers were inflated as williams were? are you choosing that spin? as you said, nice try :-).

By A Thinking Fan

May 13, 2006 07:50 PM | Link to this

LJ had a true MVP game! Triple-Double!!!

By HB Ando

May 13, 2006 10:49 PM | Link to this

Until albino’s are appropriately represented, as well as hermaphrodites and lilliputians, any records that Bonds sets will have to be considered tainted, as he clearly did not play against the best competition…….And did he ever try to get a hit off of Tonya Harding? I think not. ‘Nuff said.

By Astro Joe

May 14, 2006 12:30 AM | Link to this

Sorry Ando, ain’t buying. Many expiring contracts, he choose one. Phones work both ways. If Dumars wanted Al, chances are, his phone makes outgoing calls and BK’s allows for incoming calls. Recent technical advancement. Magloire, Bogut, Z, nor Gooden are hardly offensive phenoms. I agree, an expiring contract was required. That was key. But from what type of player is the issue. Surely you recognize that there were more expiring contracts than Cato and Al? So why Cato? Because BK did not call to offer Al? Sorry. Any assumption that BK should have consummated a deal begins with an assumption that both GMs agreed to the principle players. If your complaint is that BK did not pick up the phone, I refer you to the Bernie Mullen interview of 680TheFan. While Sekou said differently, I am quite sure I heard Bernie say that Woody did not support going after Darko. No, I’m not picking on you, sorry you feel that way. But surely you recognize that a trade with Detroit requires Dumars’ consent and surely you recognize that he could have traded for many expiring contracts among players at various positions and skill levels and surely your recognize that if he chose a non-scoring, defensive center that maybe, just maybe, dude had absolutely, positively no interest in a scoring, non-defensive forward-tweener. That’s all. Not personal. Just suggesting that people who purchase bacon and eggs are probably not shopping for chips and dip. But maybe that’s just my life experience. I think Dumars went shopping for an expiring contract and a defensive big to help with Duncan and Shaq. And whether BK picked up the phone or not, the result would have likely been the same. I don’t know that to be a fact, but if all we are doing is waiting to discuss facts/history, then this place gets borng quick, fast and in a hurry!

By Astro Joe

May 14, 2006 12:32 AM | Link to this

I hope everyone is showing their “babies’ mama” some love on Sunday. Buy them a 12-game ticket package to the Hawks for next season. That’ll go over quite well I’m sure!

By Samuel

May 14, 2006 08:36 AM | Link to this

Typical Ando,

Making a joke of that issue. Fact is albinos are at least allowed to tryout without fear of being burned alive or hung from the nearest oak tree. Although from the looks on some of those cowards and little kid’s faces when the loath Bonds, they would love to revive that tradition.

I don’t expect you to like Bonds either.

And hell no. The Pistons don’t need no Al Harrington.

By doc

May 14, 2006 11:07 AM | Link to this

it is odd but i have wondered where shawn marion has been during these playoffs, even before he went off. i waas going to mention it earlies until i looked and saw that he was averaging 20 and 10 during the post season. somehow he was being overlooked for his contribution because of the other teammates rising to the occasion. he is an unbelivable talent that is constantly overlooked as he has averaged those same numbers each year now for the past 5 or 6. not many players in the league have been as consistant during that timespan with those kind of numbers.

By St. Bernard

May 14, 2006 11:48 AM | Link to this

All in favor of locking down JJ at the 2, Marvin at the 3, and JSmith at the 4 (unconventional) say ‘I’.

I like Ando’s idea of Marvin and Smith on the floor together, but I don’t think it has to be a Ben Wallace type player beside them. Look at Phoenix. They still lack that, but they have a couple big athletic bigs (sorry to bring up Diaw again) and a pg who knows how to use them. I’m feeling more and more like we either have to get Aldridge or Williams. Then, we sign a big guy with experience (Nene, Gooden, Magloire). If Al walks, Childress is the piece we have to trade. Package him with Salim and you can get Jack and a pick. Get a big guy to develop or a pg to develop with the second rounder this year and we’re okay.

THIS IS THE YEAR TO DRAFT NEED!!! Here’s hoping BK is just trying not to be so obvious what he’s obviously got to do.

By St. Bernard

May 14, 2006 11:49 AM | Link to this

I’m all for picking the player with the most potential….at either c/pf or pg.

By St. Bernard

May 14, 2006 12:09 PM | Link to this

Sorry to keep rambling, but according to draftexpress.com, Williams is the number 4 pick going to the Hawks. They also have the Hawks picking up a 7 footer at the top of the second round from Africa. An interesting pg who has fallen is Washington from Memphis. He’s still really young and as was proven during the season, he can run a team.

I think if we got Aldridge and Washington out of this draft we would be winners. Then pick up a big guy and vet pg in FA or in the Al trade. Makes me think the playoffs are possible. YIKES…did I just say that.

By doc

May 14, 2006 03:33 PM | Link to this

st. b that scenario is about the best we could expect or hope for. it would resemble last years draft where we got a potential superstar with size and a sleeper small guy who can score by putting pressure from the outside but a bit of a risk because of his overstated drive to succeed that got him once again in the dog house. salim put up about 10 a game with limited numbers, pretty impressive for a rook. he is the type guy who if he is let loose might put enough pressure on the other team because of his offense that his defense becomes less of a liabilty.however, the guy i would love to see drop and subsequently in our lap is roy who would be a wonderful complement to jj with his size and athleticism.

By St. Bernard

May 14, 2006 05:05 PM | Link to this

Doc, If you’re talking about Brandon Roy from Washington, I don’t want him. It’s not because I don’t think he’s talented, it’s because I think we have sufficient swing men. The only way that Roy works is if JJ is a legitimate pg. He is a good distributer, but I think JJ is best at the sg spot. Let’s steer clear of attaining more swingmen.

By doc

May 14, 2006 06:14 PM | Link to this

st. b you may be right and maybe have scouted them very thoroughly. statistically and physically washington doesnt come close to roy who avg 20pts, 5.5reb, and 4 assists with 42% from the three point stripe whereas washington was 14/2.5/3 and 42% overall. the roy is 6’6” 210 and washington 6’2” 195.

washington is two years younger so maybe has more potential but i am not sure that roy cant play a big point. he is a blanket when he plays defense, can break down defenses off the dribble, slash with good court vision and rarely committed t.o’s with an ability to create for others. draft express considers him to be one of the most well-rounded players in college this year. i would be happy to find someone of that quality high in the second round but would doubt it. i especially like the comments i have read about his defensive abilities that was truly lacking among the hawk guards this year. he sorta sounds like a dwayne wade type.

By HB Ando

May 14, 2006 06:54 PM | Link to this

I’m reading that scouts don’t think Washington can handle the point. I think Marcus, at 4 (only on that site) is too early, but I did jut read about a workout where he really put it together. The 7 footer from Africa, Sene, is supposed to be a tremendous athlete, who’s only been playing for a few years, but has unlimited upside and has shown rapid improvement. That’s the kind of diamond in the rough we need to look for in the second round. There are going to be some big men waiting when we pick there.

I like Williams if we move down. But I think we’ve got to go big in the top-4 (assuming Morrison or Roy go before we pick).

Sam, I made some very in depth comments on the hatred and racism that players like Aaron and Mays faced during the early days of integration in baseball, specifically in outlining why I respected their accomplishments more than Bonds, days ago when you and I and doc were chatting it up. So don’t go acting like I’m some racist for making a flip comment after you’ve refused to let go of the issue (and yes I know how humorous it must be to hear me talk about not letting a point go). Ease up, bro. You know I’m not the bad guy.

Much respect, Sam (you too Joe, even if we’re just never going to agree on much of anything).

By HB Ando

May 14, 2006 06:55 PM | Link to this

May 24th, the ping pong balls drop. Then our projections get serious.

By A Thinking Fan

May 14, 2006 10:54 PM | Link to this

Another subpar MVP Game! Phoenix star Steve Nash (Most Valuable Promoter) was held to eight points and 11 assists. He shot 3-of-11, and didn’t make a field goal after halftime.

By T-Bone

May 14, 2006 11:35 PM | Link to this

The Hawks should pay close attention to the Clippers. If Cassell becomes a free agent they should fly the first jet with fine womens to pick him up. I know he is old but the guy still can play and knows the game better than our head coach. Plus I don’t see any PG in the draft that can help the Hawks now and I think him and JJ can do great things.

By Basketball Princess

May 15, 2006 09:13 AM | Link to this

Ando, Al wants to stay here in Atlanta. He feels that taking a third year to let this tema get there chymistry together will prove benificial. He says he doesn’t have to have a max deal and starts doing his FA thing July 1. He hopes the Hawks will have scooped him up way before then so he won’t have to go through the free agent sess pool. He feels that if they add the pieces they need they cna have a chance at a play-off birth if we keep him. He said he know;s what he’s getting here, and know’s what to expect from coaches, players and staff.

Doc, what is a woman without a little teasing. Got to play hard to get somethimes. A woman can’t always be easy…..LOL! but no I’ve just been real busy trying to get this article done, and learning this Jarred Jeffries kid. I’ll let yall know when it comes out what magazine it will be in and when it hits the newstand.

By Astro Joe

May 15, 2006 09:14 AM | Link to this

After reading several draft blogs, it appears that while this draft has no guranteed franchise players, it is deep woth role players. I’m hoping that he can secure another 2nd round pick. I just think that guys like Barera, Justin Williams, Yemi Nicholson, Terrell Everett and even Ryan Hollins all sound very promising. If nothing else, we learned last year that shopping at the Dollar Tree for players like Edwards and Batista will not provide the quality depth that we need to compete over an 82-game season. If we believe that we have our requisite 2-3 scorers in JJ, Marvin and Smith, with Salim fueling the scoring off the bench, then we need to start surrounding these guys with quality role players. The 1st round pick will likely come down to 2-3 worthy selections (unless we trade down), but he second round is where BK could find a real gem. As usual, my bias goes toward defensively sound big men and college seniors. But a big PG like Everett or speed demon like Barera are certainly worth scouting. Sekou, usually second round type talent gets worked out first, have the Hawks started any workouts among that universe of players? Give us the scoop!

By Basketball Princess

May 15, 2006 09:15 AM | Link to this

Oh goodness, I have horrible errors, but had to type fast I gotta get to a service review. Check back later. (my blog skills have nothing to do do with my jounalism skills)

By Basketball Princess

May 15, 2006 09:26 AM | Link to this

Had to come back for some papers…..but Al said this, “I dont’ need a max deal to take care of my family, I just want to win.” I asked him if he would take less to stay here in atlanta, he said yes. Al wants to be an All Star one day, and he wants some shots at a ring. He said that’s what evey player should be after. He said going home in april or knowing that your are going home in April, in January, “It Sucks!” He said that at that point what are you playing for?

By doc

May 15, 2006 09:33 AM | Link to this

thanks for checking back with us bp. you have got to give us something to keep us coming back. lol

i also can recognize when you have time to write, dont have time to write or doing your womanly hormonal thing. always informative or fun.

aj of your best scenarios “types” who do you prefer and why?

By Astro Joe

May 15, 2006 10:22 AM | Link to this

Doctor, I have only read and stuff onmost of the second-round types. I haven’t seen any of them play (accept Everett in the Big 12 Conference Tournament). Probably my favorite is Barera. I think he is one of those edgy little guys who can will his team to victory. I recall reading how well he played against Chris Paul during the World Championship games about 2-3 years ago. I think he is a Jameer Nelson-type little, tough guy. The big guy I like is Yemi Nicholson. He is DOWN to 250 pounds on a 6’10” frame. Scouts are concerned about his ability to keep the weight off. But I’d rather have that issue than someone like Ryan Hollins who probably can’t defend the paint at 200 pounds. If we’re looking for someone to give us 15-18 minutes, then I don’t think that we need a finely tuned athlete. Nicholson should be able to block shots, board and play tough interior defense. Imagine Chris Taft before his injury. Sorry, long-winded answer for Barea and Nicholson. Oh yeah, the other 6’10” player who sounds good (other than Justin Williams) is Solomon Jones.

My favorite draft website is draftexpress.com, I think they do the best job of any site, including ESPN.

By doc

May 15, 2006 12:02 PM | Link to this

aj interesting your comments about draftexpress as i found it recently. they are high on brandon roy who was someone that popped up on my radar as the ncaa’s came into view back in late feb early march. doubt he is a player to take as early as we are projected but cant quite get a feel on the comparison between hin a the kid from uconn. didnt htey go head to head sometime to get a read on that one? went to another web site which was more one guys opinion and he was more luke warm on the roy. it is funny even the hts and wts vary.

it will be fun to see who is tried out by the hawks as the time nears as that gave us a pretty good indication of what they were leaning toward beyond the international guy they pulled out of the hat at the end. at the end of the day i was as pleased about their draft last year as i have been in MANY years.

we still dont know what bk thinks are real needs as he is laying low as a tough guy but we both heard the interview with woody and know his preferences …. “bigs”… is the way he put it i believe. he said edwards and batista just werent ready for the prime time and zaza had to carry to heavy a load.

as far as the ping pong balls we had all better up the positive vibes. it is funny how we all acknowledge the power of negative but fail to understand the value of positive. it is part of science now, not just pollyanna.

By HB Ando

May 15, 2006 12:33 PM | Link to this

doc, I’ve been thinking some, and looking up, Roy, as well. I’m at a point where I’m imagining a range of these guys and how they would fit in and contribute. But until I see where we’re picking it’s just futile to start leaning in any direction other than the hope that Aldridge is there for us. He remains my first choice. At the point where he’s gone before we pick, the issue of whether we take one of the other available top picks, or look to get creative with the pick becomes a very interested conversation.

BTW, I recommend everyone read this article from ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/eticket/story?page=saturdaygame

It made me think about all the pick-up games I’ve played, in all the different gyms, and I realized that those guys hold the game in a reverence that we share here, showing up daily to trade opinions and argue, because we just love the game. Everybody have a great week.

By The Flash

May 15, 2006 01:09 PM | Link to this

Looks like LB’s going to be looking. He probably would not consider coming here, loyalty is big with him and I doubt he’d displace W. On the other hand, a Red like job might appeal to him? Probably not. On the ohter hand, a team as young as this, if he had the authority to pull the trigger on signing free agents for some bucks, he might be the very thing everyone says has been lacking, a reason for good players to want to come here. Just a thought.

Thanks, Ando, that article was terrific!!!

By Astro Joe

May 15, 2006 01:13 PM | Link to this

I definitely think that JJ’s ability to play the lead guard opens up many possibilities. Roy is a very strong all-around player. He may be the safest pick in this year’s draft. He may not be a superstar but he is probably the least likely to lay an egg. I think there are many directions BK can go in this draft, traditional PG, traditional SG, combo guard or combo big. Unlike man drafts where after the first 10-12 selections the talent drops off, there will be many 2nd-rounders who may have gone late in the 1st round in previous drafts. That’s why I hope that we can secure a late 1st round selection or early 2nd rounder. We need quality depth and this draft looks like a good one to address that critical need.

Anyone interested in trading Smith AND Marvin to Phoenix for Shawn Marion and then resigning Al? JJ, Marion and Al would be an interesting nucleus of young, veteran, multi-faceted players to build around. Read where Phoenix may trade Marion’s salary and let Diaw play next to Amare and Kurt Thomas next year.

By honest abe

May 15, 2006 01:33 PM | Link to this

lol…watching chills and marion warm up would be quite a hoot! :)

By A Thinking Fan

May 15, 2006 01:51 PM | Link to this

Here! Here! HB “For the Luv of the Game!”

By HB Ando

May 15, 2006 01:56 PM | Link to this

Man, I can’t believe Joe and I are in agreement, but for the last week or so I’ve been thinking about Roy(Doc, you’re cetainly on the ball here) and thinking about the strongest LINEUP that we could put on the floor. And the thing I’ve been coming to is that, as much as I pine for a true point guard, Johnson showed last year that he can handle the primary guard role (my problem with that is that in the fourth quarter he exhausted, and I still think we need a viable lineup that let’s him spend more time off the ball to get easy looks). So, I think, Roy and Johnson, sharing combo duties, or Johnson and, say, Marcus Williams, with both in a traditional role. And from what I’m reading about Roy, for the NBA-style game, I’m thinking Roy and Johnson.

Now, I still would rather pick a big man like Aldridge, and trade Al for a point guard, or sign one of several veteran point guards via free agency.

And Joe, I would absolutely trade Josh and Marvin for Marion and re-sign Al, especially if we drafted Aldridge and obtained a viable point guard. But I’d rather sign Al and trade him, with one of the other two, to get Marion. Doubt that would happen, though. Thing is, that I’ve been hearing rumors of them moving Marion, off and on, for a few years, and it just makes no sense. I don’t believe they’ll do it. He’s simply one of the most productive players in the NBA, and he fits their system perfectly. With Nash, Diaw, Marion and a healthy Stoudemire next year, I’ll take them to come out of the Western Conference. I don’t see them messing with that lineup when it’s so clear it could potentially win a championship.

By HB Ando

May 15, 2006 02:34 PM | Link to this

One of the issues that has remained unresolved is how fast it’s realistic for this team to “rebuild”. I think it hasn’t been happening as fast as it could have. But I also have suggested a willingness to be even more patient if there was a master plan to build for championships versus aspiring to cap out at a 5-8 seed every year, with no real hope of ever winning a championship here. Joe has suggested we look to players who’s upside may be more limited (like Shelden Williams), but who can come in and fill an obvious hole and contribute immediately.

From what I’ve been reading (and I assume it’s much the same as Joe, Doc and the rest of the folks who are seeking out such information), Roy may be the most “game ready” of the draft options. So from that standpoint, the desire to see the Hawks really compete for a playoff spot next season (and truly minimize the value of the pick we’ll be sending to Phoenix to conclude the Johnson trade), then, outside of Aldridge, who I believe has all-star big man potential, Roy might be the best pick for THIS team. As much upside as Ty Thomas has, and with all due respect to Sekou, who disagrees with this opinion, he plays the same positions as Marvin and Smith, and looks like a virtual athletic doppelganger of young Josh. So unless there’s a plan in place to move one of the three after the draft, I don’t see taking Thomas if he’s available. Now, the truth is that if Charlotte maintains the pick before us, I think they’ll take Roy, because he plays the one position they need to fill.

Going back to my overall expectations for Billy to do his job, there are too many ways, both cost effective and practical, to improve this team to playoff caliber this summer, not to get it done. I’ve been harping on the theory of “interchangeable parts” for quite some time right now, and it doesn’t have to be done my way or Joe’s way to be right or wrong. There are a myriad of variations this team can access to optimize its cap space, draft picks and tradeable assets, to enter next season a much improved roster and viable contender for a playoff seed. No excuses will be acceptable from my perspective, as ownership has already publicly stated that Billy is not hamstrung by ownerships legal issues.

By St. Bernard

May 15, 2006 03:27 PM | Link to this

Here’s why Roy is the wrong pick. We are covered up with swingmen. JJ is a capable lead guard, but he is better suited at the 2. Most of us would trade alot to get Andre Miller from Denver, and that’s exactly who people are comparing Williams too. I like Aldridge if he’s available, but if not, the other big men don’t seem to fit. To clarify, with Doc and HB, the only way I would take Washington from Memphis is in the second round. He’s young and talented. I only know what I’ve seen him do the last two years, but I disagree that the kid can’t play pg in the NBA. I’ve read the same analysis, but I don’t understand where that’s coming from. If anyone knows why people don’t like him at the 1, please tell me. I saw him play like a warrior when he was a freshman and then lead a very talented Memphis team this year successfully. I like him in the second round if we take a big man like Aldridge early.

If the Hawks take Williams at 4, I will applaud them for drafting for need. The point of the whole draft is to come up with one potential starter at pg or c/pf and depth. He is worth the number 2 pick if Aldridge is off the board because that’s what we need the most and he has the most potential of solving that problem.

By Astro Joe

May 15, 2006 04:13 PM | Link to this

Well guys, there is one thing that I do not recall being discussed here that has a great deal to do with how much of a step forward this team takes next season. I do believe that Woody is down to his last year on his contract. Historically, a coach in his last year is often considered vulnerable and his ability to effectively lead is diminished. Remember that Adelman just concluded his last year of his contract and was told to hit the bricks, despite the team making a second-half comeback to gain a playoff birth. So does the Spirit extend Woody’s contract in the next few months? If so, for how long? Personally, I would extend him 1 more season and would STRONGLY suggest that he add/remove some assistants. If he fails next season, having to eat one year of his contract shouldn’t be too bad. And if we shock the world and earn a decent playoff seeding, then we will just have to pony-up more money to extend him next summer. But I do not think we can let Woody deal with these sometimes defiant young players with only a year left on his deal.

By doc

May 15, 2006 04:57 PM | Link to this

st. b not disagreeing with the concept but it isnt a perfect world, the draft that is. am i hearing you correctly you would take williams over roy? did they ever go at each other and what were the results? i think there were some comments before a game they were to play and of all the positive kind toward each other with calhoun singing the praises for roy.

i see your point but if both are available it could be a difficult decision especially if the bigger guys have gone off the board. i guess bargani or aldridge would be preferred with some consideration to thomas. though sam touts morrison it would be a bitter pill for me to swallow if they go after either him or gay, speak of overload at one position.

i just wish we could steal frye, the waterbug and a draft pick if they have one or a big from the knicks for al and chills. i think sam might put a positive to that one unless his allegiances to the knicks is greater than the hawks. that might be the litmus test to know where the tup stands and whether he is a carpetbagger.

By Astro Joe

May 15, 2006 04:57 PM | Link to this

One last quick point (and St. B I generally agree that landing a quality player at the position of need is good even if you are “reaching”. But sometimes, you choose a bad prospect at that position of need, see Arajuo in Toronto for the bad and Villanueva for the good). JJ’s versatility lends itself to play next to a boatload of backcourt partners, Mardy Collins, Marcus Williams, Ronnie Brewer, Randy Foye, Brandon Roy, etc. Its not at all a bad position to be in. To be able to choose the best available player from a variety of positions because of the adaptability of your current pieces. (But a traditional PG and big would still be my personal preference).

By HB Ando

May 15, 2006 07:33 PM | Link to this

Joe, completely agree. The reality is that Johnson exceeded expectations with his versatility and that, as a result, there are a range of players you could successfully place in the back court with him that are not traditional, pass-first point guards. But it’s still the preference and bigs are still much harder to find than PG’s, so I think the focus has to be on improving the front court first and foremost.

And I’ll reiterate that because there are a lot of different ways to put a much improved product on the floor next year, without breaking the bank or mortgaging the future, that a lack of activity by the front office, this off-season, under the guise of “rebuilding takes time” will be loudly and repeatedly taken to task by yours truly (not that Billy Knight would notice from his lofty perch atop the world).