Get Schooled

By catlady

September 29, 2008 8:31 AM | Link to this

I am a big supporter of field trips. Many of the children in our area have been NOWHERE all their lives, and field trips give them a taste of what is out there in the world. It is very sad but true: many parents do not take the time or effort to expand their children’s lives. Some cannot, and some are too involved with their own needs and wants.

So saying, of course you have to forgo field trips unless you are willing to get rid of some of our highly paid “assistant supts” and other “consultants” hired routinely. Depends on what you are willing to spend your money on, and many systems feather their own CO nests before they worry about the kids.

Funny thing is, the counties that continue to have school trips are usually those whose middle class parents insist that their kids have these varied experiences which the parents are already giving them. Those whose kids don’t get enrichment don’t speak up, perhaps because they did not get any when they were growing up. They also don’t vote as much.

Ya get what ya pay for. One way or the other.

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

Our county just north of Albany has banned all trips other than those that are required (such as a program called Project Success that is required to go to a local college to take some form of test) and sports.

There is also talk of going to a 4 day school week, as evidently some systems nearby have already done.

Of course, if they would just force all busses to stop no more than once per quarter mile and only at the entrance to any subdivision, they would save a TON of gas…

By red

September 29, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

so…. why arent the kids/parents paying for the field trips? Dont they charge some type of admission or something for the kids to go on the field trips? Wont that cover the gas and driver? When I was a kid in school, there was always a charge, I assume it went to the gas and driver. Is that not what happens now? Is so, why would the school cancel the trips that the kids and parents are funding anyway? Field trips are a great experience, but am not sure the school should be paying for them. It should be an optional trip, that kids/parents pay for. The ones not going on the trip should have another equitable activity for the same day.

By PTCMomma

September 29, 2008 8:57 AM | Link to this

Field trips should take precedence over athletic teams using buses. Unfortunately, they don’t in most places. Cultural experiences for a majority of students should be more important than an athletic competition. That won’t happen as long as education continues to be put below sports. Sad.

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 9:10 AM | Link to this

PTC:

As someone who has seen all sides of this particular coin, I can personally atest that sports trips give far more ACTUAL benefit to the students in question than 99% of field trips.

Do you REALLY think that the majority of students that go to some museum are REALLY there to enhance their ‘cultural awareness’?

GET REAL LADY!!!!

They are there because they are out of the school building and don’t have to sit through class all day, nor will they have any form of lesson, assignment, or homework.

By tom

September 29, 2008 9:29 AM | Link to this

Most athletic trips are for HS and HS don’t seem to take students to field trips anywhere as much as ES or MS. So, I’m not sure why some people are mixing those up.

My son’s in a marching band, and the county has dropped the trip to the two farthest away games for this season. Students (parents) are paying $10 each to use charter busses to go to the competitions.

I do also think field trips are too overrated. My kids have gone on way too many questionable field trips. Cutting back those trips won’t be a bad thing.

It’s also interesting why some people instantly jump on criticizing administration and cutting back on those positions. I agree that it is important that we eliminate waste, but not all consultants/administrators are waste, either.

By Clay

September 29, 2008 10:11 AM | Link to this

I am all for field trips. Growing up in the city of Atlanta in the 1970s, we went to the zoo, the High Museum, to see plays, to hear orchestras, to Coca Cola facilities and all kinds of other places. Today in Gwinnett County, “field trips” are done in the school parking lots; or, I have to send money to pay for the trip. We not only need to NOT cancel field trips, we need more of them!

By RC35

September 29, 2008 10:41 AM | Link to this

Field trips should be an essential part of the educational experience. For Metro Atlanta kids, you can shift some responsibility to parents, as they could go to Fernbank, the High Museum, or the Cyclorama on their weekends, using very little gas (under normal circumstances).

However, millions of Georgia kids don’t live near museums. There is one small planetarium (Thronateeska in Albany) south of the Fall Line. There are a few historic sites and smaller museums scattered across the Southern part of Georgia, but without field trips, many kids will never get to a Renaissance Festival, the Museum of Arts and Science in Macon, or hear even a string quartet, let alone a symphony orchestra.

Field trips fire the imagination! There is no “virtual” substitute for touring a factory, seeing a dinosaur skeleton, hiking a battlefield, or watching 10,000 years of constellations at a planetarium. Depriving kids of field trips is simply another way of saying, “We have a misguided set of priorities.”

By Tony

September 29, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

One of the other factors I have considered in deciding to limit field trips at my school is the fact that our parents are also being hit hard with the economy and not just fuel costs. At this point, we have no idea how bad things will get. While many people are content to believe the government will take care of them, I, for one, am unwilling to wait for Washington to bail us all out. We are conserving every resource possible.

Fieldtrips are valuable to learning, but putting food on the table and having a roof over our head is much more important.

By Old School Al

September 29, 2008 10:49 AM | Link to this

As a 7th grade teacher, we have always taken our entire 7th grade to see ‘A Christmas Carol.’ This is in perfect alignment w/the GPS, and provides many students an opportunity to see a live production for the first time. The students paid for their admission and we did a fund raiser (or got ‘sponsors’ to take care of those who were unable to pay their way). We paid the requested amount from the central office for transportation ($1/mile + driver’s hourly rate), and did not have to rely on any subsidy from the school. This year we wanted to do the same thing plus the King Tut exhibit, which also coincides w/the 7th grade GPS.

We were told that it didn’t matter whether or not the students paid their own way, we could not use the buses for the trip. We asked if we could charter buses and we were told no. Our football team, softball team, and cheerleaders ALWAYS have transportation to the games!

I can’t understand why we can’t take the field trips when it costs the county nothing, but the athletic teams can go at the county’s expense.

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 11:00 AM | Link to this

Al:

I’m not sure about this, but you may want to check your facts on who pays for athletic travel.

I know for a FACT that MOST of the improvements at a school related to its athletic programs are most often paid for by the various booster clubs. Which is why you often see a disparity between say the football field and the softball field… the football boosters have raised more money than the softball boosters, and it shows.

By NavyMom

September 29, 2008 11:22 AM | Link to this

If there is no money in the budget for field trips then they should cut them. We all have to make sacrifices and the kids are / will learn a valuable lessons about sacrifice / compromise at a very early age. As for Sports - WE PAY FOR THAT through the Booster Club as stated by Jeff. In addition we pay a mandatory Booster Club fee each year for our kids to participate in Sports / Cheering as well as mandatory fundraisers.

By Kat

September 29, 2008 11:43 AM | Link to this

I loved taking field trips when I was younger. Yes, it was “fun” to get out of school, but it’s not like we were allowed to run around like maniacs. We went to the ballet, plays and other such things at the Cobb Civic Center. My son has the opportunity to go this year, but the forms made it clear that other issues may prevent such a trip - gas prices, participation levels and so on. The option was there to not send in a donation for the trip, but we did send in the requested amount. Seems to me that the trip could take place even if not everyone pays in his/her share. Playing the other side, a school field trip (or lack thereof) does give your child a good example of the state/county paying for things when it has the money or not when the state/county does not have the money. Everyone should live within his/her means, even (ESPECIALLY) the government!

By Old School Al

September 29, 2008 11:54 AM | Link to this

Jeff,

At the high school level, I would agree with you. At the MS level, however, it appears to be quite different. We really don’t have a booster club, and many of the athletes can’t and/or won’t pay to play. The funds are raised through concessions and the gate, which are both manned by teachers — not the parents of the players.

By TheBlogger

September 29, 2008 11:56 AM | Link to this

Yes, field trips can be worthwhile. Some are great learning experiences; others, not so much. I don’t of anyone that is simply just ‘against field trips.’

Yes, field trips are expendable. They are extra and not intended to replace learning inside a classroom.

In my school, we can take students on any field trips - as long as the students pay for it 100%. This means the sponsor must book a chater bus, arrange for meals, collect money from students, etc. The only thing that the school pays for is a substitute teacher for the class(es) not going on the field trip. And, even that expenditure must be pre-approved.

By catlady

September 29, 2008 12:44 PM | Link to this

Our school does not ask for students to pay for anything except admission, and will pay for the admission costs of those who “cannot afford it” (but who have junk/snack food money every day). It means the teachers usually pay for it. It has gotten too expensive for me to foot the bill for the kids whose parents claim they cannot afford it (but come to school reeking of cigarette smoke or worse, have the latest video games, etc).

I think field trips for those with few experiences is MORe important than the books. If you have never been in an elevator or on an escalator, you cannot really imagine what it is like. Reading the story just does not capture it.

I disagree on the sports angle, Jeff. Sports impacts a relatively low percentage of students at most schools. So do you give about 200 kids (counting the band) a chance to go to 5 away games, or do you do something that takes the kids who are not allowed, through lack of skill or lack of parental participation, to be a part of a team to one event? At our h.s., the majority of band members, cheerleaders, and players are the middle class kids (for the first two, they are highly represented by teachers’ kids). I know little about the relative investment of the boosters vs taxpayers, but I know the m.s. don’t have much booster support. It is either the parents or the school. I had 2 children involved in ms/hs sports and we had very little to pay except for uniforms, and all 3 of them were in the band and we had little to pay except for the instruments and cleaning the uniforms and feeding the kids. Maybe the support types vary from school to school. I know we always envied the support the band from Brookwood got—really fancy!

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

cat:

While sports may impact less students than say a grade-level wide field trip to the Georgia Aquarium, my argument is that the sports has an ACTUAL benefit to the kids it impacts rather than the PERCIEVED benefit of the trip to the Aquarium.

By Meme

September 29, 2008 12:56 PM | Link to this

Grades 6 and 7 are only allowed 1 trip per year. However, 8th grade gets 2. Their 2nd trip takes them around the community. You would be surprised at how little some of these students know about the city in which they live.

By John

September 29, 2008 12:59 PM | Link to this

The funds for sports travel do not come out of the school budget. Those funds come from athletic department revenues, fundraising by athletic booster clubs and donations. Nothing spent on sports in Georgia takes away any money from aacademics.

By Mike D

September 29, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

Oh no. The future Civil Rights Museum will not have a captive paying crowd to keep it afloat. Also, assorted other boring sites (ie: Indian Mounds) may have to do something to support their crappy existance.

By Mike D

September 29, 2008 1:13 PM | Link to this

Will Clayton County stop taking their children to government aid offices? These vital trips show the children how to apply for government wellfare checks when they get older.

By Goober

September 29, 2008 1:30 PM | Link to this

On a field trip in the late 40’s when I was 11, an actor in the play stopped in the middle of his line and said, “Ladies and gentlemen, the performance will not continue if the disturbance is due.” You could have heard a pin drop. This must have been a valuable experience on how to conduct myself since I still remember those words.

By Larry

September 29, 2008 2:05 PM | Link to this

I don’t know what other districts do, but I didn’t remember any field trips for either kid that the school subsidized. My son, who graduated last year, just stopped by and he can remember one the entire time he was in school.

It appears Gwinnett has always spent nearly nothing on field trips.

By just a teacher

September 29, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this

To everyone who says field trips are a boring waste of time (I’m paraphrasing), I say you’ve never been on a well-planned, well-executed one. Experiences beyond the classroom are essential to learning.

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 2:30 PM | Link to this

JAT:

Experiences beyond the classroom are essential to learning.

Well, since ‘home’ qualifies as ‘beyond the classroom’, I agree. Homework IS essential to learning.

HOWEVER: Field trips are NOT essential to learning.

By jim d

September 29, 2008 2:51 PM | Link to this

Want to go on a field trip??

JOIN SCOUTING!! a good Troop will have at least one outing a month and you will learn more than could ever be taught in a classroom.

By JJ

September 29, 2008 2:55 PM | Link to this

Remember those words when your child comes to you needing money for a field trip. Be sure to tell him Field trips are NOT essential to learning………..

By Jeff

September 29, 2008 3:16 PM | Link to this

JJ:

Ummm…. my kid will have both parents as either former or current teachers, both with college degrees, and both with the knowledge of places to take him/her to ACTUALLY teach them about things outside of school.

Heck… you’d be AMAZED what you can actually learn in your own front yard…

By hs sped

September 29, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

Having had a child in the public school system since 1986 (and still have 8 years to go) I can say that there has never been a field trip that I didn’t pay for. Having been a teacher for 15 years I can say that they have been canceled due to lack of money (parental money) and due to security risks. Some are VERY worthwhile and some aren’t.

Have to agree with jim…Scouting is great! I’ve been a leader for years (Tiger through Life and Brownie through Cadette- and still going wtih both) and the outings are indeed an awesome learning experience, however, with gas prices, we’ve had to seriously scale back. No one can afford the gas.

By ELEMPAL

September 29, 2008 4:14 PM | Link to this

For many years my 6th graders went to Huntsville, AL to the space center. They also attended Math/Science Day at Six Flags. Did they have fun? Of course! Did they learn? You can bet on it. Both trips were, as some else said, well-planned and well-executed. The students saw physics concepts applied. They experienced science and math. Were these trips essential? Probably not. I can just say that the curriculum was enriched and my students learned more than they could have ever learned sitting in a classroom. (by the way, all trips were sponsored by partners and/or paid for by parents and fund-raisers)

Now, to the original question. Should field trips be eliminated? I hate it, but probably so - at least for now.

Like Tony, I have to consider more than just the school funds involved. I have to think about the number of parents who could not help defray the costs.

By jim d

September 29, 2008 4:24 PM | Link to this

Field trip?

Take the kids to wall street today for a real lesson!

By jim d

September 29, 2008 4:41 PM | Link to this

Economy is in the toilet and we worry about field trips being canceled? Better concern ourselves with if education will be caanceled.

By Old School

September 29, 2008 4:55 PM | Link to this

Both of my girls went to Jekyll Island’s marine biology center. That field trip was very educational and hands on. It’s taught by college students and the middle school kids learned valuable lessons that cannot be taught adequately off site. After all, there is no seashore in Southwest Georgia.

Jeff, you may have grand plans for teaching your future children and I hope you’ll do just that. My mom always said “Do it and THEN talk about it.” We have planned vacations and day trips to get the most educational bang for our bucks but we always included some just plain fun. Our girls love Brookgreen Gardens, Colonial Williamsburg (field trip), New York (field trip), Washington, D.C. (field trips) Yellowstone (summer job) and Disney World (college internship).

We’ve been lucky in that every field trip either participated in was amazing and educational. My husband continues to chaperone the middle school trips… especially the ones involving marine life studies.

It’s easy to say what you’ll do with your kids when you don’t have any. Reality can blow holes in all those plans… big holes.

By mama

September 29, 2008 5:24 PM | Link to this

My child hasn’t been on a field trip in five years of school. I live in a rural county near Augusta. Augusta has some possible field trip options, but the school system has not allowed field trips as long as my daughter has been in school. The kids in this rural community could learn a lot from field trips, but don’t have the chance. The system has plenty of money to bus football players home from practice everyday, but not enough for field trips. Priorities!!! Band couldn’t go to the last away football game, but football players got to go. Why is it that football, softball and other fall sports can take buses, but classes (actual reason for school) can’t take field trips.

By Tony

September 29, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this

I must agree with jim d’s 4:41 post. There are much more important things to worry about right now.

By luvs2teach

September 29, 2008 6:04 PM | Link to this

It’s funny; my students and I were just talking about this today. They, of course, want to go on a field trip (Six Flags was mentioned, as was World of Coke). I had to tell them that, although I don’t mind planning field trips, it might not happen this year. The cost of busses as well as families struggling with money are problems.

My system hasn’t put the kibosh on all field trips, but we can’t go out of state. Our field trips have to be curriculum-related - our system is adamant about that. We also have to have an equivalent back-up plan for those who can’t participate - and lack of payment cannot be a reason for not particpating in the field trip if it’s related to the currculum. It creates a Catch-22.

We do ask that the parents pay, and fee includes the cost of the buses gas, driver’s time, admission fees, and possibly the cost of a sub. We call it a “donation” for each participant, padded slightly to cover those that turn in permission slips w/o money. however, it is understood that if enough money is not “donated” to cover a majority of the students, the field trip will be cancelled. I have had to cancel several field trips in the past for lack of funds, and it’s frustrating - a lot of work for nothing.

As to whether they are essential or not…essential, no, but valuable nevertheless. I teach some kids that don’t have parents who bring them to the aquarium or World of Coke - or even the LIBRARY! It’s nice to give them an experience. What I have found is those kids THOROUGHLY appreciate it and get something out of it - it’s the ones who do things with their parents on a regular basis that goof off the most.

By jim d

September 30, 2008 7:04 AM | Link to this

luvs,

“the ones who do things with their parents on a regular basis that goof off the most”

I know that many teachers find this troubling but can we really fault the child that has litterally had the opportunity to travel around the world, and seen much of what is available at places like the Aquarium in it’s natural habitat, for being bored with the dog and pony show?

Yeah, Yeah, I know. parents shouldn’t spoil their kids, but I see nothing wrong with making trips like the islands, Alaska, the UK, Japan or anywhere else for that matter, and making them learning expierences, if one can afford it.

So much more is gained from visiting and understanding different cultures.

By SET

September 30, 2008 1:19 PM | Link to this

Field trips are a reflection of the socio/economic status of the students. Nobody is going to spend money on lower class kids or run the security risks of taking them out in public. In hard times - the definition of lower class kids moves a bit.

Field trips are great for kids - but some kids will see them a LOT more than others.

By SET

September 30, 2008 1:25 PM | Link to this

I went to a CA public high school that had annual field trips across the USA, 10 days or more in DC and NYC with ground travel between. We also had 3 day trips organized to go across state to tour such things as Regional Med centers - for those interested in medicine.

More toney schools had annual field trips to Europe in addition to more of everywhere we went. And I’m talking about PUBLIC High Schools here, not private.

Ghetto school kids didn’t go anywhere beyond away football games.

By luvs2teach

September 30, 2008 4:56 PM | Link to this

jim d - I don’t think that taking your kids places is spoiling them - I (personally) had parents that stressed the idea of travel, and I was certainly not spoiled! I’m not one of those teachers that has a problem when someone goes on a trip with their folks, either - have at it and learn something about the world.

My comment was more in response to Jeff’s (I think - if not his, then someone else’s) comment about it not being a good learning experience because of kids goofing off. I’ve found it to be the more experienced ones that goof off the most - I work at a school that is diverse in both ethnicity and socioeconomics, so I see both ends of the spectrum - by no means is it all of those kids, either - just the 10% that ruin it for everyone else.