Get Schooled

By Dave

August 15, 2008 1:13 PM | Link to this

If they are a physical danger to themselves or others, the seclusion room is where they need to be. Take the lilly backboned, “concerned about their self esteem” MTV psychology interns out and leave em out. As if kids can’t come up with enough excuses on their own, now we are giving them more with all of the different “syndromes”. Mind your manners, say yes mam and no mam, be courteous to others, think about someone besides your own selfish interests and then you won’t get into trouble. And to the people who say “He can’t help himself.”……oh, please…..

By Dave

August 15, 2008 1:17 PM | Link to this

Oh yeah, anytime someone in authority (parents, teachers, cop, etc.) tells you to do something, they aren’t talking just to hear themselves speak…….

By Jennifer

August 15, 2008 1:24 PM | Link to this

What does Georgia and local educators owe students with disabilities and their parents ?

-A safe learning environment for their child along with proper oversight and accountability.

-Swift and thorough responses and uncompromising corrections as safety issues are raised.

This is a very serious and real issue.

By Caroline

August 15, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this

If parents can’t control their own children, why is the onus on the school?

By Jennifer

August 15, 2008 3:11 PM | Link to this

Caroline,

You are kidding right ? If the parent were there or appropriately trained professionals and adequate staff it is likely that these types of instances for students with emotional or behavioral disabilities would be reduced.

You read the article right ? The mother said that if her child could not be calmed down in 15 minutes, she would have come to pick him up. No one asked that he be placed in a seclusion cell for 7 hours.

Is being locked up for 7 hours in a holding cell the right kind of therapy for your 13 year old child, much less a child who is emotionally troubled ?

By Sam

August 15, 2008 4:46 PM | Link to this

The school places students in seclusion rooms — small spaces with four concrete walls…

This is nothing but third world-ish, inhuman, institutionalized violence against children! What the heck problem does it solve? It solves nothing but serves to create deeper levels of violence and destruction — in this sad case, self-destruction.

Where is the outcry?

By catlady

August 15, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

Having mama pick you up might just reward your poor behavior. Don’t think that was the solution.

Why did he have to have a rope to tie up his pants? Mama could not see that he either had properly fitting pants or a belt (which of course he could have harmed himself with anyway, if he had been determined to)?

Lots of details in this story, if you will read it carefully.

Gives you an idea what schools have to put up with on a daily basis. Sounds like this boy should have been institutionalized.

I feel sorry for the mother. I hope there are no other siblings.

By catlady

August 15, 2008 4:47 PM | Link to this

Having mama pick you up might just reward your poor behavior. Don’t think that was the solution.

Why did he have to have a rope to tie up his pants? Mama could not see that he either had properly fitting pants or a belt (which of course he could have harmed himself with anyway, if he had been determined to)?

Lots of details in this story, if you will read it carefully.

Gives you an idea what schools have to put up with on a daily basis. Sounds like this boy should have been institutionalized.

I feel sorry for the mother. I hope there are no other siblings.

By Tony

August 15, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this

Children who are so emotionally in trouble need more than schools can provide - even psychoeducational facilities. Yet, everyone wants the schools to fix every problem that children have. I do not wish to sound harsh towards children with emotional and behavioral disabilities, but people need to realize that schools’ resources would be better focused on students with enough social skills to participate appropriately.

No. The child did not asked to be locked up or 7 hours, but the teachers did not ask for the child to become combative and noncompliant. Safety of others is an important issue, too.

Perhaps the mental hospitals would be better places for some of these extreme cases. However, the procedures in some of these institutions is sedate/medicate and send back.

Emotional/behavioral disorders are some of the most difficult for schools to handle. I’m not sure that schools are the best places for students with these needs.

By TheBlogger

August 15, 2008 9:07 PM | Link to this

Schools are not hospitals. Teachers are not doctors. Why in the world would any competent parent expect that a school could treat their son?

A school is a place where students go to learn the 3 Rs among other things.

IMHO, it is not the place to send a child (especially one that is ‘special’) to learn things such as how tie your shoes, how to dress, or how to use a toilet. The parents need to take ownership of teaching those things and let schools teach academic subjects. If your child is so very ‘special’ that they haven’t learned those things that I mentioned by the time 1st grade rolls around, then that child should not go to regular school and the parents should send them to a ‘special’ school.

By Lee

August 15, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

This Alpine school was supposed to be a “special” school. At least, according to their website.

Of course, if you will note on that website linked above, it lists the director as Dennis Cormier. Now then, if you go to the State Audit website and search for Cormier, you will find that he is the “Vocational Director” for White County.

Interesting.

I’m sure the parents of this student thought the Alpine school a Godsend. They were probably told that this school would provide the specialized instruction needed by someone with his particular disability/disorder.

Locked away for SEVEN HOURS in a SECLUSION ROOM?? What kind of online PHD Special Ed program do you have to enroll in to figure out this would be a good idea?

What do you think would happen if your child went to school next Monday and told the teacher that they were locked in a closet for hours at a time?

That’s right. DFACS would be called and you would probably be charged with ‘child abuse.’

But it’s okay for a school to do it????

By lovemy4kids

August 16, 2008 12:34 AM | Link to this

Where is the OUTRAGE? Indeed, a child’s life has been recklessly snuffed out. But I say to YOU, where is the Love, the Faith, that overcomes this demonic darkness, this grip of death? Oh, that we would learn from the Master Teacher!

“And when they were come to the multitude, there came to him a certain man, kneeling down to him, and saying, Lord, have mercy on my son: for he is lunatick, and sore vexed: for ofttimes he falleth into the fire, and oft into the water. And I brought him to thy disciples, and they could not cure him. Then Jesus answered and said, O faithless and perverse generation how long shall I be with you? how long shall I suffer you? bring him hither to me. And Jesus rebuked the devil; and he departed out of him: and the child was cured from that very hour. Then came the disciples to Jesus apart, and said, Why could not we cast him out? And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you. Howbeit this kind goeth not out but by prayer and fasting. Matthew 17:14-21

By catlady

August 16, 2008 10:03 AM | Link to this

I am guessing the child had opportunities to come out of the isolation room but repeatedly showed that he was not in control enough to do so.

Unless you have been around severely disturbed kids, and most of you have not, you have NO CLUE about the manifestations of their behavior, including hurting others and self. Of course, if he had had his clothes removed (to take away things he could hurt himself with) THEN the school would be in trouble for sexual impropriety. The school had a no-win situation. They probably should have made the boy leave the school after the first week and put the decision for finding care and training back on his parents.

By momtoAlex&Max

August 16, 2008 8:29 PM | Link to this

I’m sure they will end up with a huge settlement right out our tax dollars.

By Lee

August 18, 2008 7:15 AM | Link to this

“I am guessing the child had opportunities to come out of the isolation room but repeatedly showed that he was not in control enough to do so.”

C’mon Cat. Surely you’re not suggesting that it is good policy or practice to leave a child locked in a 5x7 concrete block room for the entire school day?

Even their own policy states that the maximum time in the room should not exceed 15 minutes.

I’m guessing that this child had needs that far exceeded the capabilities of the center’s staff.

You know, those on-line Masters Degree in Special Ed programs probably don’t talk about this sort of thing….

By jim d

August 18, 2008 9:37 AM | Link to this

I find it deplorable that schools are using forcible restraint, isolation, and other abusive practices on kids who have been diagnosed with autism, Asperger’s, ADHD, etc.

Apparently the teachers haven’t been properly trained to deal with behavior problems in these kids.

I recall a couple of stories not too long ago aabout an 11-year-old with ADD being hauled off to jail in Texas after he cursed at a teacher. And another 11-year-old in Iowa that actually DIED while being held down by a teacher. I’m certain there are many more stories like these.

This is insanity, folks! We need to pay attention to what’s happening in our schools.

By SET

August 18, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this

Think of it as evolution in action.

The school didn’t kill him. Bogus Lawsuits should be discouraged by making the loser pay all the winner’s legal fees and costs.

The school isn’t an insane asylum and shouldn’t be expected to handle insane children. It’s the parent’s job to place the kid in the right institution - or keep him home and with them.

The earlier posters are correct that untrained & unexperienced people aren’t entitled to have an opinion on how to handle a disturbed kid. What is normal and accepted practice often seems wrong to the uninitiated.

By there by the Grace of God...

August 19, 2008 5:20 PM | Link to this

The school didn’t kill him.<

I beg to differ. What if this were a preschool and the child was 3 or 4? How would locking him in a barren seclusion room left unattended for 7 hours sound then? These psycho-ed “schools” are filled with children with severe emotional disorders AND autism. They are the segregated alternative schools the state of Georgia has designed specifically for these types of students. That means many are of these children are developmentally delayed (emotionally younger than their chronological age), have emotional/neurological disorders as well as learning disabilities. Most child development experts will tell you that all behavior communicates something.

Misconduct (conduct disorders) communicates that the child is willfully misbehaving, perhaps due to bad parenting, lack of supervision, etc.

But the policy governing who goes to psycho-ed centers is clear — children who have severe emotional disorders or autism. The children with conduct disorders (i.e. strickly behavior problems) are supposed to be excluded and sent to other places. So we have to presume this child had a true neurological disability.

There is a growing body of work through SAMSHA that shows the danger of restraint and seclusion on children both physically and psychologically. It sounds as if this boy’s suicidal depression was a direct result of being hopelessly secluded day after day.

Read the literature on what happens to prisoners of war (who supposedly do no have an emotional disorder when captured) when kept in solitary confinement. And this is supposed to be a school for children, not criminals or prisoners.

The parents believed (I know because I was given the same sales pitch) that this school was going to be “therapeutic” and support their child as he learned. Instead, this school did kill their child - there’s no other way to look at it. He was on their property, unsupervised, in a place that caused him trauma with a rope they supplied him. Not only was this school not therapeutic, but it was highly negligent! And the state of Georgia claims no responsibility.

Where is the OUTRAGE!

By jim d

August 20, 2008 9:23 AM | Link to this

SET,

You surely can’t believe that s** you’re spewing.

By jim d

August 20, 2008 9:30 AM | Link to this

SET,

It could be argued that the school system had assumed the responsability of a care-giver, thereby assuming the liability that accompaanies that role.

By suzy

December 10, 2008 10:08 AM | Link to this

As a teacher and parent, there is just not enough information to cast judgement on either side.

We don’t know the clinical diagnosis of the child. He may have needed a psychiatric setting and his parent neglected to meet that need. He may have been in the appropriate setting but could not practice self-control, which would put the teacher and other students in harm’s way. We don’t know how involved this parent was in her child’s education.

What we do know is this: There is no constitutional right to an education. Parents must not check their brains at the door when they drop their children off at school - any school. It’s not just free daycare. It’s inappropriate for students with severe ADHD, autism, etc… to be in a classroom where teachers are ill-equipped to teach them. As for the situation, it’s unclear if this school was the most appropriate place. It’s sad when any child loses his life and I would urge parents to be realistic about their child’s needs.

As a teacher, I too am sick of the multitude of “syndromes” used to excuse bad behavior - including “oppositional/defiant syndrome”. Give me a break. Parents do your jobs and schools will become a better place for learning. No extra money needed, no classroom computers. Government will never replace parents.

By meesa

December 10, 2008 5:46 PM | Link to this

No matter the institution or the reasoning … if ANYONE can not be handled ‘properly’ or at least ‘by the rules’ of their VERY own institution then WHY would you not contact 1- the parents and inform them the child is uncontrollable or beyond THEIR capability of control 2- some other form of authority or proper person(s) to ask WHAT should be done next … there were many other things that could have been done than breaking your own institutions rules! You can not make up your OWN rules to handle things that can not be handled - if they knew after ONCE that this child could not be controlled safely from others or hisself, then something should have been discussed w/the parents as well as staff to determine the RIGHT plan. Another place perhaps? This place seeemed designed to handle ‘problem’ or ‘challenged’ children. We have rights for everyone that have to adherred to and if not then appropriate action is taken - heck even prisoners have rights, even terrorists have rights when they are locked up… the child might not have followed the ‘rules’ but neither did the place he was at! I reiterate that if they knew he was a danger to both himself or others and still after ONE seclusion (should have been the appropriate time) then it should have been dealt with properly even if that meant him no longer being allowed to attend. And to those who say his pants were held up by a belt and that is neglect. Get real. Poor ppl or those who do not have lots are not neglected just because they don’t have the best of everything or the proper things others might have. There were a lot of underpriviledged children and families in the depression and hunger was serious then but it didn’t mean they were not ‘good’ and proper parents. There are always hard times! Have compassion - too judgemental. No schools can’t control everyone and not everyone should HAVE to be like all the others either. Everyone is different. Everyone should follow the rules or face the consequences - but the proper consequences or at least those put in place for proper use.