Get Schooled

By Jeff

May 30, 2008 9:16 AM | Link to this

Laura:

Correction:

GPS has been taught for several years already. I know for a FACT I taught it two years ago at Randolph, and that the kids I taught it to had already been under it in various subjects for at LEAST two years prior to when I had them.

In other words, the phrase ‘schools began teaching this year’ is misleading at best, and an out-right lie at worst.

By teach1

May 30, 2008 9:43 AM | Link to this

The GPS is rolled out in phases. We were still under QCCs for some subjects until this year.

By RandolphCountyAdmin

May 30, 2008 10:14 AM | Link to this

tsk, tsk, tsk Jeff I see that you are at it again. The only thing that you taught our kids was how to hold adults in contempt. We are still repairing the damage that you caused.

By Jeff

May 30, 2008 10:21 AM | Link to this

RandolphCounty:

You seem to think you know so much, care to explain why only white teachers were ran out of the system that year? (I can point to at least 4 that I was hired with that year that weren’t there the next, as well as at least one other that fled all the way to dang near Chattanooga to get as far away from there as possible!)

Could it be that Lee Byrd and Bobby Jenkins are some of the biggest racists in this country?

And if you DO know so much, publicly identify yourself. Others in your position have on here…

By Jeff

May 30, 2008 10:25 AM | Link to this

Furthermore, RCA:

Care to explain why students were allowed to ASSAULT A TEACHER with ZERO punishment to the student?

What about why students could LITERALLY not turn in ANYTHING, and the teacher was FORCED to give them a 60 on the assignment?

Or even how about a reason for the fact that even when presented with DOCUMENTED PROOF of student lies, they were STILL believed ahead of the teacher?

And you WONDER why you’re the poorest county in this state, and are so desparate for teachers that you wind up hiring about a dozen TAPP teachers EVERY YEAR????

By RandolpCountrySuper

May 30, 2008 11:34 AM | Link to this

Jeff Do you have any facts for these allegations? Look you didn’t work out as a teacher in my county. I assume that you are doing okay; you sure do have plenty of time to post messages here. Leave the education of Georgia’s youth to us professionals and do whatever it is you do best.

By EducatorX3

May 30, 2008 12:12 PM | Link to this

Implementation of the English/Language Arts GPS began in the 2005-06 school year. High School science,6th and 7th grade science, and 6th grade math was also implemented in the 2005-06 year. Other content areas were phased in in pieces. Social Studies and High school math are still not completed.

So Jeff, what you KNOW to be FACT is indeed misinformation. The curriculum was not complete or in the hands of the schools until the year prior to the implementation. Training started in the 2004-05 school year, so your school could not have had the curriculum for “at least two years.” You want to speak as an expert on these blogs, but you rarely have all the information. Makes you look pretty dumb.

Dr. Domaleski is one of the most intelligent people I have ever had the opportunity to know. He spelled out the process of developing the test exactly as it is done. Teachers are involved in the validation of the test items.

Is there a disconnect? I suspect that there is a combination of things that caused the dismal scores. Of all the curricula developed under the GPS, the social studies is the weakest (in my opinion.) It is still filled with discreet knowledge and skills -even though teachers are told to teach broader concepts. The test, from what I understand, tested some very specific factiods. Most of these facts are probably in the curriculum as examples, but not the focus of a standard. (Andrew Lloyd Webber, for example.) This, combined with the expected “implementation dip,” caused scores to drop.

Is it possible that some of the information was not taught? Sure. Is it possible that there were some invalid test questions? Of course. Is it possible that the lack of background knowledge caused by elementary schools not teaching as much social studies impacted scores? Yes.

Bottom line? The DOE needs to make sure the test and the curriculum and the training are all heading in the same direction. Teachers need to do what they do best - teach to the standards. Parents need to support the curriculum through educational experiences for their children. Students need to pay attention and study.

Wouldn’t it be nice to live in a perfect world???

By HS Teacher

May 30, 2008 12:58 PM | Link to this

I think that Jeff shows that there are as many people that offer misleading propagande on one side of the fence as there is on the other side of the fence.

We all know that we cannot trust politicans to do right by education. And, we cannot listen to any individual that is nothing more than a disgruntled employee (or ex-employee).

What we desperately need is a real teacher union in GA where all teaching professionals can speak with a single voice to improve education. Look at the States that lead in education and you will find a very strong teacher union. GA needs one, period. What I am referring to is not our current weak ‘professional organizations’ such as PAGE or GAE. We need a real union such as AFT (American Federation of Teachers).

Check out their web site at:

www.aft.org

Part of their stated mission is to “improve the quality of services we provide”. Who won’t want a teacher union like that?

Ask your teachers if they have joined AFT.

By Lisa B.

May 30, 2008 1:14 PM | Link to this

This is the first year that ALL the middle grade CRCT tests were based on GPS. Language Arts was phased in first, followed by Science. The phase in is not complete. As a system facilitator for GPS redelivery, I know the report referred to in the article Laura referenced is correct on which tests were used for the first time this year.

By Tony

May 30, 2008 1:36 PM | Link to this

While many may be alarmed at the failure rates of 8th grade math CRCT, it was expected. The students in 8th grade began the use of Georgia Performance STandards in math when they entered 6th grade. In 7th they continued the new curriculum and in 8th also. Each CRCT from 6th forward was based on GPS rather than QCC for math. This is the first high stakes test for these students based on Math GPS.

Georgia must have a math curriculum that is more demanding and this new plan is just that. While some have called the Math GPS “fuzzy math” they could not be further from the truth. The GPS is a rigorous curriculum and students will have to buckle down and work harder to master it.

Some have complained that their “A” student failed the test by a couple of points. They will have a chance to retake the test. While I am not in favor of high stakes testing, I am in favor of higher standards of learning. The worst thing we can do for our children is to make excuses for why they failed this test.

One of the challenges schools face when it comes to teaching higher level mathematics is finding well qualified teachers. For teachers to have had 3 or 4 math courses is not sufficient to teach middle and high school math. They should have been math majors. Yet, as a school principal I know it is nearly impossible to find such qualified teachers. So, we have to do the next best thing. Hire the ones we think will do the best job.

HS Teacher, as much as I would like to think some professional organization could help us speak with a single voice, these organizations have contributed to the misinformation brigade, too. However your point about teachers speaking with a united voice should be heeded by all educational professionals. The politicians hold us in contempt, constantly berate us, and then throw us “bones” in the form of $100 cards. We have the power to make a difference through the election of people who are truly concerned about children’s education. Remember Roy.

By Middleschoolteacher

May 30, 2008 1:57 PM | Link to this

Tony, I was with you all the way until you made fun of my “Sonny” money! Remember, it is the most tangible thing that our govenor has done in his time in office!

By I am with MACE

May 30, 2008 3:56 PM | Link to this

Forget AFT. It is weak just like GAE and PAGE. I have been a member of all three of them. Four years ago I joined MACE. Couldn’t be happier with the service. www.theteachersadvocate.com

By I am with MACE

May 30, 2008 4:06 PM | Link to this

Why didn’t my message post? Do you have to be nice about GAE and PAGE and AFT for the comments to post? I was a member of all three at one time or another. AFT is weak in Georgia just like GAE and PAGE. Four years ago, I joined MACE and have been happy with the service. There’s no comparison. Perhaps the AJC does not like MACE.

By WhatWillLauraDo?

May 30, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this

No, the AJC doesn’t like MACE because they tell the truth about discipline. And the AJC can’t tell the truth about discipline without telling the truth about Atlanta Public Schools.

That’s why once again we have a discipline scandal that is reported, then allowed to die with absolutely no follow up.

Yes Laura I mean you. A teacher was brutally assaulted at Southside. You reported the student was expelled, but didn’t report originally she came back to school and bragged to her friends as to what she had done.

Where is the follow up? The teacher reported it took ten full minutes for administration to respond to a brutal physical assault.

Just because APS doesn’t want to talk about it, doesn’t mean that you don’t have to report it. Was the tribunal process followed correctly, according to state law. Or was it ignored, as MACE has documented so many times before?

One would think as a “reporter” you would actually report on this, unless your job is to “kill” stories, as oppossed to reporting on them, as seem to have been the case with your predecessors on this blog.

If it isn’t the case then tell us where is the follow up story? If you can’t tell us that, sadly, you’re tell us all we need to know about your credibility, or to be fair, your independence to report without interference from your superiors.

By carrie

May 30, 2008 6:32 PM | Link to this

Hey, don’t knock the Sonny money! While I wish the governor did more for education, I’m not going to complain about the “bones” I am thrown.

BTW, Jeff, just in case you didn’t know, the rollout for the GPS has not finished. Elementary schools are covering the new GPS in Social Studies this next school year. I’m pretty sure science was new last year in K-5. You were in high school, so you received some new GPS before other grade levels. Please don’t look ignorant.

By Lee

May 30, 2008 7:05 PM | Link to this

What do I think?

I think anytime I see someone who will not release the raw data but instead throws out meaningless percentages is playing games and trying to manipulate the results.

I think taxpayers will be footing the bill to pay for summer school for tens of thousands of students who probably should not have to.

I think I made a very good decision several years ago when I placed my daughter in private school.

By Tony

May 30, 2008 7:39 PM | Link to this

Accepting the “bones” is exactly what the politicians expect the teachers to do. As I said, they hold us in contempt and degrade us. It’s only logical that a token should hold us at bay.

Lee, I’m not sure what raw data you would like to see released, but in July the state will publish school by school results for AYP. These reports will tell the numbers of students who passed the CRCT by individual schools and by school systems. If you’re asking to see the test. Well, that ain’t a gonna happen! Currently, Georgia does not invest enough into its development of testing items to afford the annual release of test questions.

As I said earlier, we need to hold higher standards than we have in the past. It is only logical that more kids will fail the new tests based on higher standards. I still maintain that high stakes testing is not the answer and the net result will be a dumbing down of the curriculum.

By luvs2teach

May 31, 2008 12:05 AM | Link to this

8th grade physical science rolled out this year - we saw a double digit drop (not more than 20% though).

By Math Educator

May 31, 2008 10:04 AM | Link to this

As my name suggests, my area of interest is mathematics. So, this (longish) post will focus only on math. As someone else has already pointed out, the new GPS in mathematics was phased in. Grade 6 implemented the GPS for the first time in the 2005-06 school year, Grades K-2 and 7 started in the 2006-07 year. This school year was the first time for Grades 3-5 and 8. I looked around and found the CRCT results (math) from 2005 (for the school year 04-05, before the GPS), 06, 07, and now 08. Here are the percents passing: Grade 3: 89% → 91% → 90% → 71% Grade 5: 87% → 88% → 88% → 72% Grade 6: 74% → 62% → 65% → 69% Grade 7: 78% → 80% → 74% → 80% Grade 8: 68% → 77% → 81% → 62% Bold letters indicate the results under the new GPS. Clearly, these percents may be influenced by the setting of the passing scores and the equivalence of the tests (at least within the same standards). I don’t have any information on those and other issues, but if we can’t assume that there was no intentional manipulation of those factors, discussion such as this one will be totally meaningless. So, for the sake of our discussion, I am assuming these data are indeed comparable. I want to make three observations. First, let’s look at the change in before/after the GPS (year 1). Grade 3: 90% → 71% (down 19 % points) Grade 5: 88% → 72% (down 16 % points) Grade 6: 74% → 62% (down 12 % points) Grade 7: 80% → 74% (down 6 % points) Grade 8: 81% → 62% (down 19 % points) It is clear that the CRCT results in the first year of the new standards are always lower. In some ways, as a group, Grade 7 teachers from 2006-07 school year prepared themselves better than any other grade level teachers. Although Grade 8 (and Grade 3) results show larger decline than other grades, the actual percentage of students passing is the same as the Grade 6 result from 2006, their first year. The big difference is that Grade 8 is a high-stake year (as Grades 3 and 5 are). As a matter of policy, I’m not sure if we can simply say that “the decline in the first year is expected.” If nothing else, this year’s results for Grade 3, 5, & 8 should be “advisory” as there are factors beyond students’ own control that may have influenced their performances.

Second observation is the change in the results from Year 1 to Year 2 (and 3 for Grade 6): Grade 6: 62% → 65% → 69% Grade 7: 74% → 80% Grade 7 result is already at the same level as the pre-GPS level, and it may be reasonable to expect that Grade 6 will reach the pre-GPS level within a couple of years. The new GPS is definitely more rigorous, thus, if students are passing at the same level then that signifies an improvement. The new GPS was heavily influenced by the 1989 Japanese standards, among other things. According to a large scale international study, the Japanese standards were about 1.5 grade level above a typical Grade 8 US math curriculum (whatever “typical” means). So, if we can go beyond simply looking at percents, these results may be showing some positive trends. Third observation is on the changes in results of the same cohort of students. This year’s Grade 8 cohort’s scores in Grades 6 & 7 were 62% and 74%, respectively. This year’s Grade 7 cohort improved their score from 65% in Grade 6 to 80% in Grade 7. It is troublesome that this year’s Grade 8 cohort could not maintain the improvement they made from Grade 6 to Grade 7. Given that another group made a similar improvement, is seems worth examining more carefully what is happening in Grade 7. At the same time, we need to examine more carefully what is going on in Grade 8. Finally, I want to make two comments on what we should do based on these results. First, clearly, we need to improve mathematics teaching in the state of Georgia. That means providing teachers with meaningful, coherent, and continuous professional development opportunities. That means more money dedicated for that purpose. Teachers probably do have to spend some of their own money as many other professionals in other fields do, too.
Second, teachers need much better textbooks and other instructional materials. Again, international studies have shown that the quality of US textbooks to be rather dismal. There are some high quality textbook series that were developed with the funding from the National Science Foundation. Unfortunately, their contents don’t always align well with the GPS. In this regard, it will be very interesting to see what happens in Hall County, where they have adopted a textbook series based on a Singapore series. Although the most important factor in students’ learning is mathematics teaching they receive, teachers need (deserve) a high quality textbook series that will support their efforts.

I apologize for the length of my post.

By MountainMama

May 31, 2008 2:34 PM | Link to this

After so much reading and researching about the CRCT scores, and recalling that my 7th grade all “A” student came home the day she took the Social Studies portion of the 7th grade CRCT and said to me (her words) “something wasn’t right about that test”….I was fully prepared to have her “not meet expectations” for the first time ever in her life. I was VERY pleasantly surprised, however, that she “met expectations” with a score of 805 (800 meets) and that she “exceeded expectations” in all the other areas of the CRCT. Her SS teacher even admitted that the test was “hinky”….(again my daughters’ word) but I attribute her meeting the test expecatations to several things: (1) the lively debates/discussions the students in her class had on current event topics and the tie-ins that the teacher made to relate said discussions to info in their SS curriculum; (2)the fact that my daughter does a lot of reading of news reports, mostly online as well as listening to many tv newscasts so she stays pretty well informed; and (3) the fact that she’s got pretty good common sense.
Even though my daughter did “meet expectations”, I am another parent who is very happy that the SS test was “tossed out”.

By Tony

May 31, 2008 3:08 PM | Link to this

Thanks Math Educator for your analysis of results. Your summaries are right on target as are your recommendations.

If I may add one small point to your information, the seventh grade math curriculum has a couple of gaps in it that may have allowed that group to score slightly higher. The main point you make remains: scores will improve each year.

Your point about coherent, meaningful, on-going professional learning is especially important. Our governor and legislators have seen to it that this part of education funding was eviscerated. We are at the lowest levels of funding for professional learning in decades. While the politicians will maintain that balancing the budget is a precarious effort requiring priorities to be followed, it becomes apparent when you examine the pet projects inserted into the budget that they do not want teachers to sharpen their skills.

By Math Educator

May 31, 2008 9:51 PM | Link to this

Tony,

Can you elaborate on this “gap” in Grade 7 math GPS?

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June 1, 2008 12:56 AM | Link to this

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June 1, 2008 1:04 AM | Link to this

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By Sick

June 1, 2008 1:15 AM | Link to this

Yes, Dukakis and Gore, I am sick of this mess. I am Adam-Sandler-Sick-Of-This-Mess.Com. Our liberal piltos are flying combat and suicide mission over us each. day. Growl, growl, that is th e sound of Wally Butts.

Go Jerry Glanville.

By jim d

June 1, 2008 1:25 AM | Link to this

Laura: Can’t you keep the riff raft off of this informative board in the after hours? We (my associates and I) have been having very meaningful discussions each week, but now you have allowed this micreant poster to come on here with all kind of crazy utterances. Please forgive me if I decide to do my own thing on another board. The mother of all good, my math teacher in high school, just texted me. I must run.

By Yusef P.

June 1, 2008 7:37 AM | Link to this

Hendy and Ha: I completely agree about Kathy Cox. Why is she in charge of our schools? I presume because she got elected. Wow. Is this her “jibberish” on this board? That “jibberish” is fairly reflective of how our so-called educational leaders see public education in Georgia. There’s is no theory of public education in America. If so, succinctly state it. There is none. Please state it. Do you think that Kathy Cox can articulate a theory of public education? No. I am not asking for a convoluted, lenthly theory. Just a one sentence theory of public education. I bet that even Mom3Boys can come closer to stating a theory (= explanation of phenomenon) of public education than Kathy Cox can. How do you espect Cox, et al., to “fix” our problems when she and Stuart Bennett and Company have no notion of how it works. Let me get off this board before I start ;alhsdo;ojp’iqoiqo;d ajp’iodti[ ’ [pofgas!!!!!!!!!!!!

By Bob

June 1, 2008 7:59 AM | Link to this

Yusef, I agree with you, having taught under three State Superintendents, Werner Rogers, Linda Schrenko, and now the hapless Kathy Cox. Kathy may be the most clueless of all. (Can’t Kathy Cox drag out John Trotter and blame this latest CRCT fiasco on him?) The shine of Anything Fayette is now wearing thin. The headlines in Fayette County were full of angst and anger as well. Perhaps if Kathy Cox attends another “Bootstrap Meeting” she will find a “consultant” who can help her. No, she is probably in way over her and Stuart’s heads. Hey, by the way, I would like to see Kathy or Stuart teaching for one year at Kennedy Middle School in Atlanta or Osborne High School in Cobb or Columbia High School in DeKalb or even Sandly Creek High School in Fayette or Douglas County High School in Douglas. Yes, the disease of the children and parents getting to beat up teachers (verbally and physically) is spreading throughout the suburbs and even into the exurbs. Is Fayette an “exurb”?

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By Kathy

June 1, 2008 7:57 PM | Link to this

Y’all leave me alone. Y’all leave me alone. jim d, please defend me.

By Tony

June 2, 2008 8:39 AM | Link to this

Bob - Kathy is way better than Linda!

By jim d

June 2, 2008 8:45 AM | Link to this

HS teach,

Teachers in Ga. don’t need a union. They have followed Homer’s advice.

“If you don’t like your job you don’t strike.You just go in every day and do it really half-assed. That’s the American way.”

— Homer Simpson

By Tony

June 2, 2008 8:49 AM | Link to this

Math Teacher -

The biggest gap between 7th and 8th grade CRCTs is in the domain of Algebra. Below is a link to the CRCT web page where you can find the content descriptors for math. (Look on the right side.) You can see for yourself the gaps that exist. Our teachers have worked hard to identify the gaps and “plug the holes”, so to speak.

CRCT Math Content Standards

By Math Educator

June 2, 2008 6:12 PM | Link to this

Thanks for the reference.

I am not quite sure what you meant by “gaps” in Grade 7. In comparison to Grade 8 content description, the amount of topics in Grade 7 seems to be much less. On the other hand, this is the grade level where students are really learning to work with algebraic expressions and equations (ones with letters as variables) much more formally than previously. They are also learning the concept of linear equations and their solutions.

In Grade 8, they are expanding the type of “linear” equations to include those with absolute values, and they also look at linear inequalities. They also study graphs of linear equations and understand what slope represents.

So, what they are doing in Grade 7 seem to be important prerequisites for Grade 8 topics, and I can’t necessarily see any missing topics. In comparison to Grade 6, the amount of topics in Grade 7 seems to be comparable. So, I am still not sure why Grade 7 test would be any easier than Grade 6. I can see the possibility that Grade 8 test is harder, in part because there are more topics.

By Audrey Lambert

July 10, 2008 3:37 PM | Link to this

I had to take the CRCT this year, and i failed it, went to summer school, and now i’m a freshmen at Cartersville High School. However, the test was hard the first time around. I’ve had all A’s and B’s the whole year in math class and yet i failed. So you could only imagine how hard that test must’ve been for me and others. The state should’ve deff. started the change with a kindergarten class instead of a class already used to the old curriculum. That was deff. a ludicrous decision. How could one possibly just get use and adapt to the new curriculum when for the past 7 years they’ve done something else? [Slow exhale] The whole idea is stupid to me .

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