Get Schooled

By FarLeftLoons

April 15, 2008 9:57 AM | Link to this

I’m betting the white districts are more involved than the blacks, given the 70% of out of wedlock birth rate for blacks. Of course, you’ll never hear these stats in the leftwing AJC. And now the politically correct loons will start throwing things at me, which is specifically why the problems in the black community will never be solved.

By JustMe

April 15, 2008 10:00 AM | Link to this

At my school, it seems that most parents want to be informed, not involved. There is a difference. There is a school web site, parent access to real time student grades, emails sent out, and of course PTA meetings. There are a handful of parents that are ‘involved’, but most of them just want to be informed.

By mmm

April 15, 2008 10:27 AM | Link to this

Just me makes an excellent point. If you want to get people excited, just start them complaining about what they think they may have been “kept in the dark about”. Getting them involved in a way that ACTUALLY HELPS THEIR OWN CHILD is harder, getting them to help TO BENEFIT THE CHILDREN OF OTHERS is extremely difficult in this “it’s all about me” world.

Check out this op-ed piece that talks briefly about my school for some other discussion that I think is pertinent to our topic:

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/eboopatel/2008/03/diversityanditsdiscontents.html

By B. J. Jackson

April 15, 2008 10:39 AM | Link to this

To get parents and community members involved The School Reform Team One (18 elementary schools and 5 middle schools)of Atlanta Public Schools has formed a Family/Parent Engagement Task Force. Meetings are held to address a variety of issues. Parents are encouraged to attend and voice their ideas, suggestions, criticisms and concerns to improve the quality of the task force outcomes.

If your child attends a school in SRT-1 and you would like to get involved you may call 404-802-3667. This is an opportunity for parents to get involved.

By One

April 15, 2008 10:42 AM | Link to this

My daughters school became a charter school last year. One of the “requirements” is that parents volunteer at least 10 hrs. per school year.

By mmm

April 15, 2008 10:52 AM | Link to this

Sorry folks. Let’s try that link again . It will work if you cut and paste the whole thing:

http://newsweek.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/eboopatel/2008/03/diversityanditsdiscontents.html

By The Truth

April 15, 2008 11:09 AM | Link to this

FarLeftLoons, You’re 100% correct in your assessment. AJC is crap and has always been crap. They have an article talking about how great freaknik was and when you look at the photos there are several shots of blacks getting arrested. That was how black college students celebrated. When you call a black person out for being an idiot you get called a racist. White people are tired of blacks acting like mindless zombies and destroying society. Yesterday I got in to a debate with a black woman who called me racist for disagreeing with her. She then proceeded to call me a cracker.

By Camille

April 15, 2008 11:41 AM | Link to this

That’s funny. I recall when I attended a predominantly White university that the White students partied harder than the Black students did. I won’t even go into some of the stupid things that they did, whether drunk or not. So, both Black and White college students “celebrate” in ways that may be deemed unsavory. So, now that we’ve gotten that out of the way, what does that have to do with the topic?

By The Truth

April 15, 2008 11:53 AM | Link to this

Camille, The difference between freaknik and regular spring breaks is that whites don’t go around shooting up gas stations, raping women in the streets and looting Macys. Big difference. What does it have to do with the subject? FarLeftLoon wrote about the AJC being leftwing and always promoting the wrong kinds of ideas. Make sense to you? I was reiterating his point about the AJC. Also, this topic was about parents getting involved in schools. If parents were acting like parents instead of acting like kids, then we MIGHT not have these problems. When white people point these things out it’s only a matter of time before people like you make excuses and try to turn it around.

By EnoughAlready

April 15, 2008 12:21 PM | Link to this

I know you all aren’t stupid enough to think that black kids are the only ones “partying” and acting out of control. If so, then you are as stupid as your comments!!!!!!!!!!! Whites/Blacks/Hispanics/etc. can all be a part of this. Why do you never hear about white kids killing/raping/loitering, you ask? Well, it’s simple, the media (tv, newspaper, radio, etc) will almost never show any whites doing things like that, because they want the public to believe it’s only black kids. Anyone with half a brain, who has lived more than 10 years can see it. Reality is that blacks (and other minorities) are always going to be ostracized, while the white crimes are hidden, and nine times out of ten, it is because mommy and daddy can pay enough to get their precious little hoodlums off without any repurcussions. Those that don’t see it are plain blind………..a good example, the white guy that caused the fatal wreck with the limo carrying the family, killed three people, and his family is trying to hide the fact that he was drinking and actiong a fool. I guarantee he’s from a (somewhat) wealthy family, and is used to getting away with everything!! If not, then why didn’t his parents take him to the police station as soon as he got home (without his car, which he had wrecked on the interstate, but CLAIMS he didn’t know others were involved!) Why? Because they wanted to give him a chance to sober up, if he had gone in that night, the police would’ve tested him, and they know it!!!!!!!!! BULLSHYT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Look at all the white kids (usually of wealthy parents) driving around tearing up shyt in these expensive cars, most are on dope, haveing sex way too soon, and basically just doing whatever they want. Because mommy and daddy have them thinking they are privileged to do so. And ya’ll want to make this about black kids vs. white kids, don’t even try it!!!!!!!! My child is in a very diverse school, guess who brings the most dope to school? Geuss who dresses the skimpiest? Guess who has the money to do whatever the fvck they want? HAHAHAHAHAHA, y’all are funny as he!!!!!!!!!

By catlady

April 15, 2008 12:29 PM | Link to this

NO black folks in my county. Yet, we have massive non-engagement with the white parents. A half dozen show up for PTA (mostly the officers). When we have a Latino meeting, 120+ parents and kids show up. Pretty sad commentary on our parents, huh? It is not an issue of race (nor, from what I have observed, SES). Just my observations, however. Folks offer to “help” their kids, but what they help their kids with are excuses.

By Go find another blog

April 15, 2008 12:31 PM | Link to this

The truth — if you re-read that article on freaknik, you’ll note that it is about the demise of freaknik — and points to, among other things, the violence that eventually took over. Nice job of skewing the facts to match your political stance. Did you forget what Ft. Lauderdale used to be like for “white” spring breaks? Now please, contribute to the topic at hand or go find another blog.

As for the issue at hand, I agree with JustMe about parents wanting to be informed, if not involved. My guess is that parents will get involved when they think they see a problem, but otherwise they’re happy to let the (over)zealous PTA parents do their thing when it works.

I am not sure what the local schools in my area do to get parents involved. I do know that they push for 100%-teacher participation in the PTA.

By Camille

April 15, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

I was not making excuses nor trying to turn anything around. I’m not even sure how that could even be implied from my response. It just amazes me how these blogs always turn into this hate-fest against Black people, as if White people never do anything wrong. And, I find extreme fault with your premise of only trying to use spring break to make your point when college partying is conducted year-round. I attended Florida State University, and it has the reputation of being The Party School, and it is definitely not because of the Black students.

Irregardless of that, there are some Black communities that do have problems with parent involvement in the schools. But, there are also some Black communities where the parents are quite involved. The attempts to make it appear that all or even the majority of Black parents are not involved is asinine. I get sick of people trying to label an entire group of people based on the actions of some. I am very involved at both of my children’s schools. In fact, I may be labelled as one of those parents that are too involved, but the education of my children is extremely important to me. So, I don’t fit into that mold that is trying to be placed upon me.

Now, if you like, we can continue posting along racial lines, but it would be extremely counterproductive, especially to the issue at hand.

By nita

April 15, 2008 12:34 PM | Link to this

what difference does it make. all parents, black and white want their children to succeed in school. When will we stop turning every issue into black and white. I hope and pray that truth and farleftloon never need anybody’s help. This same attitude is in our school systems and parents are looked down on by admin and teachers. This issue goes to the core of our society. i’m a single parent who works full time and attend college full time. my ex is a graduate of georgia tech and my other ex is a self employed truck driver. my children are in the gifted program and i have not been an active member of the pta in years. i always join but find the pta too cliquey and most of the parents over the pta think that they deserve a medal for what they do. I would much rather pay a monthly room fee of $10 as opposed to buying candy and junk that can be purchased in the dollas store. I do not need the pta nor the schools for that matter to make sure my children learn what they are supposed to learn, it is up to me. When my high schooler is registered for her classes, i take it upon myself to look at her schedule and make sure they are the right classes and that the counselors do not make any mistakes. Both my 10th and 8th graders have been recruited by the Duke Talent Search Summer program since both were in fifth/sixth grades (i can’t afford to send them). My 10th grader has been invited to join numerous academic societies. I at one time served on the School Council and i enjoyed it but had to use my vacation time to make it to the meetings. My involvement is purely based on how i am received by the teachers and the administration. I did a report in one of my classes last fall that showed that many parents are not involved because it reveals their weaknesses. Often times parents are intimidated by their lack of education and feel they are encapable of helping anyone. The study i read also noted that teachers often times make parents feel as though they are not qualified to teach their own children. Parents are their child’s first teacher. If teachers and administrators would look for ways to bridge the gap between the teachers and the parents, they will help the parents become more involved. When schools go back to the idea that we are a community of learners and that learning starts well before formal schooling, then and only then will the school system see a surge in parental volunteers. when my children were in daycare, i attended parenting classes and started a newsletter with another parent. i did so not because i needed parenting lessons but but so that i could feel involved and give parents who could not take time off work a way to keep up with what was going on in our center. I volunteered for the good of the center, my children,other children and me. Our education system has gotten so far away from being child focused and educating the whole child. When education stops being so political maybe it can be repaired and set about educating our children.

By BlackGirl

April 15, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

FarLeftLoons and The Truth, Freaknik was great in the beginning. This of course, was well before it received so much recognition. Those of us in our late 30’s and early 40’s remember going to the park and just hanging out with college kids from other schools. We had a great time! Then, as it became so overwhelming popular, things changed. I was there in the beginning, I’m sure neither of you were, so speak on that which you’ve directly experienced. Freaknik started in the 80’s, not the mid 90’s!

Secondly, I live in a predominantly black neighborhood in South Fulton with schools with high test scores and parent involvement. Students at my son’s schools were recently featured on 11 Alive during black history month. One of their female anchors has a child at that school as do many other highly successful blacks, and you’ll find her at many PTA meetings and school events.

I’m amazed that right off the bat, someone needs to bring up race. Yes, there are black communities that have issues, but it’s not THE black community. Get your facts straight. Let’s remember, black kids ain’t shootin’ up schools and instantly becoming mass murders!

As for answering the question, both of my kids schools have parent groups such as all male groups for parents, a non-profit organization, a business organization and regular meetings. The improvements I would like to see are with specific teachers, not the school as a whole. I chose this community because of its schools, and I haven’t been too disappointed.

By The Truth

April 15, 2008 12:35 PM | Link to this

EnoughAlready, So, you hate white kids? Can you please show me proof that white kids behave like that? You sound like an angry person who hates white kids. I’m white and worked hard to get where I am. I don’t blame anyone for my mistakes either. Also, you may want to learn how to simplify your comments so that your anger doesn’t get in the way of your point. I’m still not sure what your point is other than whites are worse than blacks. Oh, and the media is anti black.

By jim d

April 15, 2008 12:36 PM | Link to this

Yeah right! Like they want parents involved? NOT! All they want is people to appear involved to rubber stamp the same ol same ol they do every day.

As For Mr.Alvin? I can assure you he does everything within his power to keep the truth from coming out. He can talk all this trash he wants to but until he allows information to flow freely to parents, their involvement will remain flat. Point and case—Want an ansewr to a question? File an opens record request.

I’ve seen it time and again over the past ten years. When parents step up involvement he slaps em back down,(just as he does teachers) he has passed up oportunity after oportunity to get parents involved. and now wants to talk smack about getting parents involved? Well dear friends he can just kiss my money-making A$$. 26 school days left till graduation!!! (but who’s counting?)

By diddy

April 15, 2008 12:54 PM | Link to this

Thats why Obama needs to be elected as President of the United States. He has been emphasizing education since day one. Please tell your friends in PA to vote for Obama. He will not let you down.

As for the matter at hand, a lot has to do with the teachers. They are not involved enough.

By EnoughAlready

April 15, 2008 12:55 PM | Link to this

TheUnTruth, if that’s the case, then you sound like an angry fool who hates black kids, or should I say, any non-white kid!! Obvioulsy I didn’t read pass the first sentence of your ignorance, because that’s all you ever post, IGNORANCE!!! And you have the nerve to ask for proof? What an idiot!!!! Now the only ? is, are you a black man trying to get the “acceptance” of White America, or are you an ignorant white man who has no clue about the Black Community? Either way, you seem to be a waste of skin. NOW READ THIS…………….ALL kids get into trouble, ALL!!!!!!! Idiot…………

BlackGirl, you wouldn’t be talking about Sandtown Middle, would you? Good post!

By jim d

April 15, 2008 1:02 PM | Link to this

Yeah right diddy—I’m gonna run right out and do that. NOT!

Here’s his platform on early education. You may wish to rethink your support.

Zero to Five Plan: Obama’s comprehensive “Zero to Five” plan will provide critical support to young children and their parents. Unlike other early childhood education plans, Obama’s plan places key emphasis at early care and education for infants, which is essential for children to be ready to enter kindergarten. Obama will create Early Learning Challenge Grants to promote state “zero to five” efforts and help states move toward voluntary, universal pre-school.

Expand Early Head Start and Head Start: Obama will quadruple Early Head Start, increase Head Start funding and improve quality for both.

Affordable, High-Quality Child Care: Obama will also provide affordable and high-quality child care to ease the burden on working families.

By The Truth

April 15, 2008 1:07 PM | Link to this

EnoughAlready, Here we go with the ignorant comments. I was waiting for someone like yourself to say that. No, not all kids get in trouble. You’re dead wrong about that. People like you can not give me stories or data to back up that white kids act worse than black kids. Look at our prisons. I think it’s funny that blacks cry racism as soon as someone points out the facts about the black community. Blacks are just as racist and any white racist. Blacks have BET, black colleges, black beauty contests, black scholarships and get tax breaks because of skin color. Pretty racist stuff to me.

By jim d

April 15, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this

BTW Diddy,

Nowhere in his platform does he address how we are to pay for all of this.

Sounds pretty much like another babbling politican without a clue about education. just trying to buy a few votes.

I’m not telling you who to vote for but would suggest you look deeper into a mans character rather than stopping at the color of his skin or his colorful oracle skills.

By mmm

April 15, 2008 1:11 PM | Link to this

Did anyone read my link?

There is no single “Black culture” as there is no single “White culture” and there are growing numbers of people that simply want to check the box “other” because they reject both stereotypes.

There are patterns of behavior that will put you and your children into a perpetual underclass that are very hard to break. The difference between those that break them and those that don’t has to do with the values and drive that the individual chooses and upholds. But choosing differently than your family and neighbors carries a high cost.

By Gwinnett Educator

April 15, 2008 1:15 PM | Link to this

My only wish is that some would stop painting everyone with the SAME paintbrush. I am quite sure that if you(general you) with the residents of cities where Spring Break is celebrated by mostly white students, you will hear of rape and looting, etc. (shooting may not be a big issue) but I am SURE where there is an ABUNDANCE of alcohol and partying, a lot of illegal things are happening also. We were able to get a full picture of what was happening during this predominately black event due to the fact it was local.

Now, with that being said, I agree with JustMe. I think one of the things that matter is that parents do not have to always show up to be involved. Parents can show their involvement in other ways rather than showing up for a meeting. (donating items to the classroom, readily assisting teachers, etc).

By DC mom

April 15, 2008 1:16 PM | Link to this

I will never understand how you can just put your kid on a bus or drop them off and pick them up at the end of the day and not want to know FIRST HAND what happens all the hours in between.

I work a full time day job. I still squeeze out time - even if it is vacation time to “drop in” and visit.

After you get to know, first hand, the people in the school, and what is happening in the community - involvement is natural.

• P S, Kids, especially elementary school - LOVE IT when you visit them at school.

By BYUGRL

April 15, 2008 1:18 PM | Link to this

Well said; “Enough Already.” Thanks for taking a stand. Who do they think they are?

I’ve witnessed the same thing, time and time again. They are in complete denial. Interesting how they always try to put a good spin on the appalling, lewd and down right criminal acts that they are engaged in. As to make everyone think that they don’t commit the same crimes as every other culture. Let me refresh their memory: Ted Bundy, John Wayne Gasey, Green River Murder, Wichita Code Enforcer, JEFFERY DAUMER - not sure of the spelling - don’t have time to look them up, but you’ve got my point.

My husband wonders why I refuse to allow my son to hang out with their kids (without one of us being present), it’s precisely of that reason. If something goes wrong, he will be blamed, while their kids will more than likely get off. When I’m out and about and notice one black child with a group of white kids, sadly those thoughts always enter my mind. I’m not ignorant to believe that every white person in the world thinks like these idiots, but I can’t take that risk. My child is too precious to me. It is my duty and responsibility to protect him (as much as I can) from people who think like these idiots. My parents did it for me and I intend to do it for my child.

Getting back to the subject: My child attends a school that happens to be one of the top schools in the state. Approximately 25% of the parents volunteer on a regular basis, the others do not. I volunteer 2-3 times a month.

By Teacher, Too

April 15, 2008 1:27 PM | Link to this

Teachers are not involved enough?

Really,now, when would you like teachers to become more involved? I’m sure there are many teachers who come in very early in the morning (as I do) and/or stay late in the afternoon to chaperone extra curricular activities or tutoring, for which they donate their time.

Our students put on a great musical not too long ago. Our teachers were here early in the morning and late in the afternoon/evening and on the weekends, helping the students learn their lines, sew costumes, build sets, etc. They asked parents to come and help on the weekends, and NOT ONE parent showed up. Who did, though? The teachers. Yes, they took time away from THEIR families to donate to the kids they teach to give them a worthwhile learning experience.

I’m sure, like in any profession, there are teachers who stroll in with the kids and leave with them as well. In my experience, though, the majority of teachers go above and beyond their contractual duties because they recognize the intrinsic value of education.

By AlreadySheared

April 15, 2008 1:34 PM | Link to this

Gosh,

*By Taxpayer October 12, 2006 08:12 AM | After ten years in the public school system, I’ve come to believe that PTA stands for “Pushing, Tampering, Aggravating.” *

why aren’t parents more involved?

*By KA October 12, 2006 11:17 AM | Taxpayer, I agree with you. The busybody parents at MES need to grow up and mind their manners. If I had a bunch of gossipy, pushy volunteers come into my office to help out, and they started prying into private areas, and tried to tell me how to do my job, then I’d have them out the door in a flash. No other profession would allow this meddlesome behavior, so why do these parents feel so entitled? *

Don’t they care about their kids? What’s the problem?

By Gwinnett Educator

April 15, 2008 1:42 PM | Link to this

The “truth”- I am quite sure when the statement was made that “all” children get into trouble..it was meant that children of ALL races get into trouble. (different kinds of trouble..but trouble never the less.)

Also, you went from saying that white children dont get into trouble to showing you that black children get into more trouble. Unless there is a survey done where EVERYONE is accounted for, we will never know TRUTHFULLY who actually gets into more trouble. We know that things are not always reported “truthfully”.

Just for the record..black colleges came about because blacks were not allowed to attend the white ones. Blacks have BET (thats a joke and NOT because it is owned by a white person). Although I DO NOT subscribe to the idea of voting according to skin color (but for the candidate that best represents your beliefs) for YEARS white people voted based on skin color due to the fact that blacks didnt even have the right TO vote.

BOTTOM LINE…this is a racist nation. Things are done everyday that are racist/sextist, etc. So instead of always coming out with the “ITS THE BLACK FOLK” or “ITS THE WHITES” or “ITS THE ILLEGALS”..why can WE all try to be the best WE can be and lead by example??

By BYUGRL

April 15, 2008 1:45 PM | Link to this

The Truth, the majority of people who take advantage of tax breaks and minority business contracts are white men (who use their women as covers)… Be careful what you wish for; of I forgot you and your family are perfect and you don’t know of anyone white who has broken the law.

We already know how statistics are presented in such a way to make whites look good. Yes, the majority of people in prison are non-white. Yet there is undisputed proof that non-whites are sentenced to prison far more than whites that commit the same crime. Yes, there is a higher teen-age pregnancy among non-whites. Yet, there is undisputed proof that more whites use ABORTION as a way to terminate their TEEN pregnancy. Yes, we have some violent NON-WHITES, but they learned from the best; whites that is. Anytime an ethnic group can take his entire family on a picnic to watch the lynching of people on Sunday afternoons and still be considered non-violent by nature is puzzling (especially since, again this is an undisputed fact). Lastly, it’s a fact that there are more whites on welfare than blacks.

By Kennedy

April 15, 2008 1:47 PM | Link to this

Why am I not shocked that the very first comment is a racist one?

By ITP Mom

April 15, 2008 1:49 PM | Link to this

MMM: I would be interested in reading the article - however, the link you posted is cut off. Thank you.

By Stacey

April 15, 2008 1:51 PM | Link to this

My son attends a Title 1 elementary school (which surprised me based on the surrounding houses). I don’t know for sure, but just from observation I would guesstimate 60% Black, 20% White & 20% Hispanic. I am a PTA member & attend the meetings and I volunteer at after hours events such as carnivals, dances, etc whenever possible. As Catlady said, Hispanic parents seem to turn out in droves for these events. While turnout is nowhere near a majority, the principal has commented more than once that she is plesantly surprised by the turnout (though she may be pumping sunshine).

I frequently check the school’s website for information (I wish it was updated more frequently) and read the MANY handouts that my son brings home. For somethings they will print reminder stickers and put them on the kids shirts. His teacher actually called last night to see if my husband or I could be a proctor for the CRCT (my husband is available one day, I’m not). My only complaint about the notes is that (more than once) I have gotten a note the day before asking for a some kind of contribution. I usually don’t even get a chance to review my son’s folder until he gets in the bathtub so unless I happen to have what they need at home, they may not get it.

By Gwinnett Educator

April 15, 2008 1:53 PM | Link to this

OOOPS I meant to say Why CANT WE all try to be the best WE can be and lead by example?

By BYUGRL

April 15, 2008 1:56 PM | Link to this

Kennedy, Welcome to AMERICA.

By EnoughAlready

April 15, 2008 2:04 PM | Link to this

BYUGirl, thanks for keeping it real!!!!

TheUNTruth, again, didn’t even bother to read your ignorance!!!!!! You’re not worth it!!!!!! FOOL!!

GwinnettEducator, you are correct. Thanks for keeping it real!!!!!!

By JustMe

April 15, 2008 2:17 PM | Link to this

Why must so many of these topics evolve into some racial argument? It gets very old!

By Kennedy

April 15, 2008 2:20 PM | Link to this

Oh trust me, I know.

I am a married black woman and my husband and I make a pretty decent living. We don’t have kids and education is very important to us, so we are always in search for info on good schools.

Its amazing the amount of stereotypes that people believe.

We fit NONE of those stereotypes! We are not on welfare, we don’t have kids yet and we are good people, but it never matters.

By The Truth

April 15, 2008 2:29 PM | Link to this

EnoughAlready, Prove me wrong. There is a race barrier between blacks and whites. It comes from both sides but I’ve seen it more on the black side in the past 10 years. You can thank Jesse and Al for that.

Gwinnett Educator, There will always be prejudice in this country and every other country. Diversity DOES NOT WORK. I grew up in Georgia and heard FAR MORE from blacks about how bad white people were and how white people hated black people. Yet, I never saw any white people abusing blacks. What it boils down to is money. Reparations for slavery. Prove me wrong. And, no, I’m not racist.

By ITP Mom

April 15, 2008 2:49 PM | Link to this

Okay JM - Let’s get it back on track. I don’t think you hold a very high opinion of parents based upon what I read of your posts. Can we both put that aside for a minute.

I would like to hear what you think…..I am the PTO Pres for next year at my son’s elementary school. I have two other (younger) children and work full time outside the home. Please give me your suggestions about how to get parents more involved but how to temper that so that the parents don’t get in the teacher’s way. Looking forward to your comments.

By EnoughAlready

April 15, 2008 3:02 PM | Link to this

It is nice to see that not all people buy into the ignorant stereotypes that exist today. And the funny thing is, most of those spouting that ignorance have nothing but “keyboard courage”. I dare them to spout that nonsense in the settings they are talking down about. Anyways, for those of us who can think outside the box (whether we agree or not), kudos to you!! For the rest, those are your issues and ignorance to deal with, don’t try to push it off on others, we aren’t having it!!!! Keep it real, truthfighters!!!! Peace…..

By well

April 15, 2008 3:59 PM | Link to this

Actually, it was Rich’s that they completely looted (a nice word for CLEANED OUT) during Freaknik. Proud.

By Gwinnett Educator

April 15, 2008 4:00 PM | Link to this

Hopefully this will be my LAST comment in regards to this “race” issue. “THE truth”—no kidding there is prejudice EVERYWHERE..thank you for the news flash. Now, whether or not diversity works is completely up to the individuals. I have a diverse classroom. It works. I work in a VERY diverse setting..It works. Do we have spats? OF COURSE. That’s human nature. How people handle diversity depends on their maturity level.

And..just because your experiences have been a certain way does not make it the same for everyone else. Your reality is just that..YOUR REALITY. My reality is that..MINE. I would be wrong to think that every white person (or insert racial group) is negative based on MY experiences. I know not to look at the actions of a few and think that is the case for the WHOLE.

(just because you didnt “see” things happening doesnt mean it didnt happen. a tree fell in some forest today. did you see it? if you didnt..did it really happen?)

By JustMe

April 15, 2008 4:04 PM | Link to this

ITP Mom - Well to answer your question, I can only speak from my experience as a classroom teacher. The parents that I know of that are involved are ones that have:

Please understand that you are wrong when you state that “I don’t have a high opinion of parents.” It is that I have a realistic perspective of parents in general. Not all of them are good and not all of them are bad. However, I have seen many more that are uninvolved and don’t really care about their child one way or the other. I very much appreciate the many wonderful parents whose children I have taught over the years.

Interestingly, I feel that many of these same qualities of the good involved parents may also be found in the good involved teachers.

By Sam

April 15, 2008 4:57 PM | Link to this

Race - The Power of an Illusion

Funny how some people keep alive the illusion of so-called “race.” Funny how people who have been most hurt on account of the “race” illusion seem to most deeply embrace it rather than cast it off. Funny how some people have been programmed to define and speak of themself in terms of the “race” illusion (I am a White this or that. I am a Black this or that.) Funny how this blog turned into defensiveness over an illusion. An illusion, people.

By terryb

April 15, 2008 5:10 PM | Link to this

My 2 cents…For what its worth. Parent involvement largely depends on the school’s administration. If administration or administrators rule the school with a heavy hand, toward both educators and parents, and brush concerns off with throwing everything under the carpet, you have an environment where no one wants to be involved. I have no interest in being involved with any administrator that would lie to my face on any issue. But when it comes to my kids’ education, I supplement it at home whenever I could with enrichment at home and will do whatever I can to reinforce what the teachers needs me to reinforce at home. I don’t need to be involved with the PTA who takes money from me so they can get in good with the administration. No thank you.

By catlady

April 15, 2008 5:23 PM | Link to this

My experience: Title 1 school. 630 kids, 3rd - 5th grade. Most parents are lower middle class. Parents who have the time are unwilling to go through being fingerprinted, etc, so they do not volunteer. We have about 5 parents who help out a lot. 4 are PTA officers. We have about 20 white parents who show up at VERY special occasions, such as Read Aloud Night. Contrast that with about 25 Latino parents who show up for these same events, altho amost all of the program is in English. 4th grade did a special evening activity that kids had to sign up for in advance. The vast majority of the parents who signed up and came were Latino, atho no part of the program was offered in Spanish (and Latino kids are less than 20% of our population at school). Most of the white parents who came to this were higher SES. We do have parents show up occasionally to eat lunch with their child.

We have a great deal of trouble getting the white parents to come in for any reason unless it is to defend their kid from a perceived slight. Some parents will not give us a correct address or phone number to use in an emergency (I think we should take them to DFACS or court about this neglect). Some parents have caller ID and won’t answer if it is the school. I have only had one ESOL parent who refused to come in, in the 5 years I have taught ESOL. The others come in, even after working an all night shift. Or they leave work, risking their jobs.

I used to (20 years ago) have a cadre of parents (mostly mamas but a few dads and a couple of grandmas) who helped out one day a week or every two weeks in my class. I miss that.

My personal opinion is my school is distinctly unfriendly toward parents. It seems to me to be more than non-effort; it seems to be genuinely not wanting parents to come into the school. That is a terrible shame, and as I work with younger teachers and I model how to bring parents in and talk to them, it seems like sometimes a light comes on and they see it does not HAVE to be adversarial. But I know a lot of us teachers have been badly burned in the past by parents who see us as the enemy.

I have found with the Latino parents that I have to show them HOW to help their students (especially because quite a few are not literate in any language). But they seem to gamely try, and when I have talked to a Latino parent about behavior or poor work, I have almost always seen improvement. I have not had that experience recently (last dozen years) with white parents. In fact, on behavior issues, many times the behavior has worsened (what do the parents TELL their kids—go to school and make it impossible for anyone to learn?)

I feel pretty discouraged about what is and is not happening in my particular school and in the home lives of many of the students. It is so different from how I was brought up. There seems to be little interest or time devoted to the kids. We all pay for this, end (or through) the end.

By hmmmm... would be interesting

April 15, 2008 5:26 PM | Link to this

Let’s do it.

Not for fun - it needs to be done.

Laura, will you take Atlanta Public Schools?

This is a PERFECT sample. It DOES need to be done. Statistics of attendance - plain and simple.

Aside from it being the district of our state capitol, it really is pretty segregated. There ARE “white” (Morningside, Jackson, Mary Lin, Smith, Brandon, et al - if any more) schools and “black” (mostly ALL the others) w/in the disctrict.

You NEED to take the PTA attendance and compare it. Morningside vs, say, Hope. Show ALL the schools - the racial demographics, w/ the % PTA attendance (some will claim to not have it - this IS APS, after all!).

It would also be interesting to look at, say, a “Hispanic” school (perfect example - Garden Hills Elem). I would bet they have pretty good attendance - I don’t know - just guessing.

(I have kids in upper elem - I don’t know about the PTA attendance in middle/high schools - I’m guessing it gets WORSE.)

SO, can we do it? This blog leads to it. It should be your next article!

No slant - no bias - just an article w/ the statistics. Plain ‘ol statistics!

By catlady

April 15, 2008 5:42 PM | Link to this

hmmm, Laura would probably need to match for SES as well. Some of us posit that it is not race but parental education and family income that explains the difference. Are there upper middle class “black” schools that could be compared with Mary Lin, etc? Upper middle class Hispanic schools? Or, could we compare “poor” mostly white schools with poor mostly black schools? We need to have some sort of equality to measure if race is the deciding factor in parental involvement (as measured by PTA attendance, or what?) as opposed to SES? That still does not take into account the leadership of the school, however.

By catlady

April 15, 2008 5:53 PM | Link to this

Also if we use PTA attendance as our measure of “involvement”, you must ask: does the school schedule PTA meetings at a time when most parents in the community can come? For example, in my area many of the Latino parents work the evening or night shift at the local major employer. The white folks get the day shift. So, having PTA meetings at 7 pm might mean that many parents are excluded from even considering attending. I can imagine this could be a problem in working-class areas of the city(I have always wondered about that label. Working class. I mean, don’t most all of us work? I guess it means non-professional.) Sort of why we NEVER have school functions on Wednesday evening. The Baptists would howl (altho they don’t seem to show up anyway!) Also, does the school have lots of PTA meetings that the kids perform at? That raises the attendance considerably.

By SAMMI

April 15, 2008 7:20 PM | Link to this

LAURA…ET AL…..I realize that most of you will tell me that”TIMES HAVE CHANGED”…BUT ….back in the day,parents …..my parents and the parents of all students in my classes NEVER, ever became involved in school. They came to school only when we were performing at Christmas, etc. to see and support us. Only if there was an incident of misbehavior…big time misbehavior…did a parent cross the doorway of the school . School was the dominion of the teachers and principal….one principal. Parents expectations were quite important. Parent involvement in the school…not an issue.

By SET

April 15, 2008 11:13 PM | Link to this

Sammi is right. Schools now use the parents as an excuse for the school’s failure to manage their students and educate them.

By Lee

April 15, 2008 11:56 PM | Link to this

Here’s what “parental involvement” means to many public schools:

• Sell the candy.

• Sell the overpriced wrapping paper.

• Come work on the fall festival and other fund raisers.

• Attend the many awards programs where 90% of the kids get an award.

• Never, ever, under any circumstances, question how they run the school.

Back in the early 90’s, I was asked to be on my local high school’s Business Alliance committee (I think that was what they called it). We had one meeting and that was it.

My own experience was similar to Sammi’s. Of course, we didn’t have an awards ceremony or parent/teacher conference every 5-6 weeks either…

By Rev. Jimmy Jack Bourbon

April 16, 2008 1:42 AM | Link to this

heedabeeda heedabeeda heedabeeda hoo hoo heedabeeda hoo hoo

By JustMe

April 16, 2008 7:58 AM | Link to this

Lee,

I feel that your opinion about that parents should “never question how they run the school” is harsh.

Like any organization (and it really is most any), people that are outsiders that come in at first and start preaching how this or that should change are looked down upon and often ignored. Imagine that you join a new Church, and the first words out of your mouth to the pastor is that the service is not good enough and must change! When anyone joins an orgainization, they must first establish credibility - and that is usually through longevity of becoming involved (working WITHIN and not AGAINST). After that initiation period, then yes, organizations are usually more open to suggestions for change.

Why would a school be any different?

By the way, this goes not only for parents but also for teachers. New teachers to a school that come the first day telling everyone how the school should change are quickly shunned.

By ITP Mom

April 16, 2008 8:52 AM | Link to this

Thank you for those insights. I really appreciate them. I am not an educator so I find what many of you have to say on the variety of topics discussed here to be of interest. Most of the time I check the topic of the day and lurk in the background if it is of interest to me and doesn’t deteriorate into a nasty exchange.

From my point of view (involved parent), it is a challenge to get parents to volunteer - whether it be for the holiday program, in the classroom, etc. (We don’t sell stuff so I don’t have that challenge.) I think by showing an interest in my child’s school - he understands that his education and school is important to me and therefore, it is important to him.

When recruiting volunteers, I find the personal approach via phone or in person (as opposed to e-mail) works best. I think lots of parents want to volunteer they just don’t know how to take that first step. Follow up with volunteers is also important - do what you say you are going to do.

One of the challenges though is once you get enthusiastic volunteers it can sometimes be difficult to manage the volunteers so that the enthusiasm doesn’t cross the line from helper to something else that isn’t so helpful. Telling a parent that you appreciate the help but they are doing it wrong or are overstepping their bounds is always difficult to do.

I hope this post makes sense - I am pressed for time this morning. But again, I appreciate the insights from the other side of the fence, so to speak. Many thanks.

By Pjj3

April 17, 2008 6:46 AM | Link to this

KA: …If I had a bunch of gossipy, pushy volunteers come into my office to help out, and they started prying into private areas, and tried to tell me how to do my job, then I’d have them out the door in a flash. No other profession would allow this meddlesome behavior, so why do these parents feel so entitled? This is not about the entitlement of parents, but about public trust. KA forgets that these are not PRIVATE areas. These are PUBLIC schools funded by taxpayer dollars and the PUBLIC (meddlesome parents) has the right to ask questions. In my opinion, the administration is all about protecting their “paycheck bureaucracy” and not about educating our children. True parental involvement means that the system must be transparent. Administrators will fight this until the bitter end.

By correction for Pjj3

April 17, 2008 11:28 AM | Link to this

Pjj3 - you’re taking that quote WAY out of context. That was cut and pasted from a blog awhile back on PTA parents who were too pushy, getting into private information (like students’ grades - which are confidential, PUBLIC school or not), and causing problems instead of creting solutions.

KA is a parent (who hasn’t posted in awhile - where are you KA???) and not a teacher or administrator.

By jim west

April 21, 2008 10:03 PM | Link to this

instead of the state testing elementary students bmi use that money to get the student-teacher ratio the same in a academic subjects. How do you expect a teacher to teach 40 2-3 graders with no parapro or fellow teacher. Also many schools lack adequate pe supplies and facilities. Even the best teacheers cannot provide an adequte pe program