Get Schooled

By KA

May 8, 2007 8:25 AM | Link to this

We are a nation of laws, and if we allow the illegals to skirt our laws and we don’t protect our sovereignty, then we will cease to be a nation. Illegal immigrants are scofflaws and squatters, who have no rights to remain in our country, and they are not entitled to reap any benefit given to citizens. Illegal immigrants have a country, and they need to return to it and work for change there, get their education there, and if they want to come to the USA, then they can apply for a visa like the rest of the world’s citizens. And the illegal parents of American born anchor kids should take them to their home country, and the children can return when they reach their majority. The federal governmetn has failed to enforce the immigration laws, so I support each state law that ensures the distribution of benefits to citizens and legal residents, and excludes and removes the lawbreakers.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 8:32 AM | Link to this

Federal law requires that if illegal immigrants are given a break on out-of-state tuition, then all US citizens be given that same break!

If UGA wants to charge every student from whatever state the same fees…then why are Georgia residents paying to subsidize the college education of other states students?

By thomas

May 8, 2007 9:10 AM | Link to this

This is an issue in which I could go either way on. I work in a school that is 65% Hispanic. Most of my students are Mexicans. I have no problem teaching Mexican students. In fact, I prefer working with them because they, as a whole are more cooperative and are less of a discipline problem (at least at this point). Their parents are less of a problem and are more supportive. I have learned Spanish and about their culture in order to better work with them.

On the other hand, many of them are here illegally. They are here to our detriment. Native Americans suffer due to the lost of jobs and our communities are brought down due to a large base of low income citizens. It taxes our schools and hospitals. You won’t believe the resources spent to “educate” immigrants and native born citizens of foreign origin. Tell me— why does a person born in the United States and have lived here their whole lives need ESOL?

The fact is that, if we Americans were not so difficult to work with, us educators probably wouldn’t be so eager to work with immigrants.

By jim d

May 8, 2007 9:14 AM | Link to this

I must admit I’m somewhat torn on this issue.

If they get an education, they earn more money and pay more taxes, overall those numbers might actually dwarf the cost of education and most of these young people didn’t come here of their own will—they came because their parents brought them.

On the other hand, providing an education for the kids that have grown up here in this country might encourage more illegals to bring their young children just for the hopes of a decent education. But then we would have to consider how much their parents actually contribute to the economy over their life times.

Bottom line to me is the law.

Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of 1996 states under Title VI –Miscellaneous Provisions Subtitle B - Miscellaneous Amendments to the Immigration and Nationality Act Section 625. Foreign Students. An alien may not obtain F-1 nonimmigrant student status to attend a public elementary school or a public adult education program. Entry to attend a public secondary school (high school) is also prohibited unless the aggregate period of F-1 status does not exceed a year and the alien reimburses the school for the costs of providing education. Transfer to such schools after obtainment of F-1 visa, is deemed to have violated F-1 status. This section applies to individuals who obtain F-1 student status after the end of the 60-day period beginning on the date of enactment (around December 1, 1996), and includes aliens whose status is extended after that period.

So either enforce the federal laws already on the books or change the laws.

By savannahsmile

May 8, 2007 10:06 AM | Link to this

I am torn on this issue as well. I have a hard time going against the “law of the land”. I have a hard time supporting illegal activity. However, I also have a problem with the bleeding hearts who say “they take good jobs away from native americans”. Please! Have you tried to get good workers lately? A popular misconception is that employers are paying 2 dollars an hour. My father is a farmer and employs a couple of illegal workers. He pays them 7 dollars an hour.He also employs about 10 “natives” as some want to call them. There is no comparison. They refuse to work ANY weekend, yet they come monday morning wanting to borrow money they’ve squandered away over the weekend. He would gladly pay a “native american”, however, it is virtually impossible to find one who will show up to work consistently, put in a hard day’s work, and not have his wages garnished for child support. It’s hard for me to be against the plight of the immigrants when there are so many lazy sorry welfare dependent Americans out there. I will support the national security argument, but the tax burden is a bunch of crap. If I’m going to have to pay for someone else’s education and healthcare I’d damn well rather pay it for someone who’s busting their butts to make a living.

By jim d

May 8, 2007 10:09 AM | Link to this

Just a thought on this one.

If the Fed won’t secure the borders as they have the responsability of doing and in no way could round up and send all the existing folks back where do we draw the line on educating the ones already here? What costs would be involved with breaking the cycle of poverty compared to the costs of future generations living on welfare because they can’t make a decent living?

Perhaps this is an issue we should think strongly about and weigh carefully before jumping.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 10:33 AM | Link to this

Thomas, please tell me you’re not an English teacher.

Savannahsmile is correct and this is why there are thousands of American businesses, large and small that are supporting immigration reform. People that are trying to run a business today simply want to hire the best person to do the job. They aren’t social workers, immigratation agents, nor political scientists. They shouldn’t be criminalized for trying to hire and retain a stable work force. The rising cost of energy is challenging enough. Now is the time to reform our outdated immigration laws.

By DB

May 8, 2007 10:35 AM | Link to this

No, no, no! Why is this such a difficult issue?!? If they are here illegally, why do they get ANY services? Living in the United States is a privilege that should be extended to those who are willing to abide by our laws and contribute to common good (i.e., taxe). There is no way in hell that illegal immigrants should be provided with free education — or free ANYTHING, for that matter. No other country in the world puts up with this kind of nonsense, why are we?! If there are people in this country who are concerned that Mexicans are undereducated, then they are welcome to go to Mexico and open a school.

Immigrants keep streaming into this country because they know that Americans are inherently generous and fall all over themselves to help those in need. If we did not permit the children to be enrolled in schools and stopped providing routine medical care, food, housing, etc., then hey! maybe they’d stop coming!?! Then perhaps Mexico would take responsibility for it’s own citizens and our medical and school costs would not be so outrageous because we are having to pay not only our fair share, but the share to cover illegal immigrants, too.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 10:40 AM | Link to this

Studies have shown that the better educated the immigrant, the greater the probablility that the immigrant will prosper in the US. Naturally, the chances for success are greater if the immigrant speaks English. The children of immigrants learn English today in the same way they learned for decades, in school. This is nothing new. Please don’t penalize the child and take away the incentive to study and obtain a profession. It is a short-sighted and stubborn reaction to a labor and immigration problem that has to be addressed by the enlightened leaders of our nation.

By jim d

May 8, 2007 10:43 AM | Link to this

DB,

I just found some interesting numbers in this article.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=research_researchf6ad

They stagger the imagination.

By jim d

May 8, 2007 10:49 AM | Link to this

degree,

And why should we continue to penalize our own kids to benefit kids that shouldn’t even be here? Please read the article I linked above.

By seenitb4

May 8, 2007 10:52 AM | Link to this

Savannahsmile Please don’t compare “natives” with illegals. Condider it a privilage to have your fathers workers wages garnished. Thats called CHILD SUPPORT. That means 1 less child on welfare

By jim d

May 8, 2007 10:54 AM | Link to this

a short story.

Went to HD on sunday and a hispanic guy in line just ahead of me was attempting to use his credit card for a purchase. When asked for a positive ID?

You guessed it!

Anyone know how to get credit without a positive ID? I know a lot of folks that would love doing that!

By PD

May 8, 2007 11:05 AM | Link to this

Undocumented for Illegal, how very PC of you. People in the country illegally should be sent home, no perks, just a van ride back to Tijuana!

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 11:24 AM | Link to this

Bridget lets speak to reality. Mingling undocumented and illegal gives an appearance of one and the same. The reality is this, and keep in mind I did not create reality. The majority of illegal aliens in this country are Mexican nationals, who are in fact, very well documented.

What is more distressing in what you have said, to the point if I may, is nowhere do I get so much as a hint in what you have written, any expressed concerns for the college bound U.S. citizen students interests being negatively impacted in obtaining out of state tuition breaks by all of this.

Perhaps you can explain something to me, I detect you may have a Spanish surname, so I’ll take the liberties to think your Spanish ancestral expertise qualify your prospective to address a couple of questions.

Why do, or would you feel, anyone, who for what ever reason, by what ever means, who is in this country illegally should have the right: one – to remain in this country, two - have the right to an education and three - take a place in a university that rightly was meant for U.S. Citizens and legal immigrants?

What is more perplexing in this issue of illegality, if you may answer, why is the onus, the burden always cast upon the backs of U.S. citizens and their country to provide what Mexico, the elites ruling of Mexico and the Mexican people refuse to take upon themselves to provide? (This of course includes all Central American countries as well)

By DLandry

May 8, 2007 11:27 AM | Link to this

I agree with PD…the only perk illegal aliens should get is a ride back to Mexico!

By Janine

May 8, 2007 11:34 AM | Link to this

Bridget…Re your question about whether this new policy will “cut down on the number of so-called undocumented students on college campuses and keep immigrants from moving here illegally”… Neither of these are the primary reason for the new policy…It is a matter of enforcing the law and not allowing an illegal to “steal” the place of a resident. In addition, I can’t imagine anyone actually believing that it’s okay for our state colleges and universities to raise tuition for our in state resident students…[ and even legal resident out of state students.]…while giving illegals a big discount. That’s unconscionable discrimination any way one looks at it…as is accepting an illegal instead of a legal qualified resident.

By Student

May 8, 2007 11:41 AM | Link to this

I’m an undocumented student, and since i go to a community college i have to pay out of state fees. I work a full time job to pay off my school. I’m not sure what to think about all undocumented students paying out of state fees, because i have lived in Georgia for ten years now. And I see American students going to school goofing off, not caring about anything being thought in class. While i work full time and manage to go to school and if necessary i will study all night. My brother and i have always been good kids. We didn’t have a choice about coming here but we made the best out of it. My brother was a Highschool football player, i was in the Orchestra for six years. My brother is now about to graduate this year and i will next year. We’ve never had scholarships, and we had to pay out of state fees. Our parents have been a big help but other immigrant students can’t complete their studies due to money. I think it’s not just a problem for us but also for the communities. I think if this law were to come into effect it would affect the American people. If students don’t have the opportunity some of them are going to become uneducated people with no future, and possibly be more involved in gangs, or crimes and things like that.

By Janine

May 8, 2007 11:42 AM | Link to this

Michael Smith…I agree that primary emphasis should be the negative impact that the preferential treatment of illegals has now and will have in the future..on our resident American students. Bridget’s question ..of whether or not declaring illegals inelegible for financial breaks or even entrance into our universities.. will keep them from moving here is secondary at best.

By JustMe

May 8, 2007 11:45 AM | Link to this

What too many forget is the “illegal” part of illegal aliens. This means that they have broken the law.

There are legal means to be in this Country, but they have made a decision to break the law anyway. In no way should they (or their children) be rewarded for this.

If you are a conservative republican, remember it was YOUR politicans that got us into this mess. It was THEY that wanted cheap labor. It was BUSH that argued for illegal aliens to “do the work no one else wants to do.”

I really don’t know the answer. It is impractical to round all of them up and send them back. It is too costly to round them all up and jail them. It is rewarding illegals to simply give them citizenship and I don’t agree with that.

How about this as a solution….. create a psudo-citizen? This would be a person that comes to the States and doesn’t want or get full citizenship. They can get a driver’s license but cannot vote. They pay taxes (income and otherwise) but don’t get social security or qualify for any other welfare or social programs. Their children born in this Country do qualify for full citizenship and all rights included.

I like this solution because it makes them legal and accountable, but not a full citizen. Since they want to work in the US, fine; but they have to pay taxes. They cannot get the benefits of citizenship like social security, medicaid or medicare, and all; but they are paying into the system to pay for police protection, fire protection, and other benefits. And of course, they cannot vote, but their children will be full citizens.

What do you guys think of this type of approach?

By deegee

May 8, 2007 11:47 AM | Link to this

jim d, FAIRUS is one of the country’s best-established anti-immigration groups. They have received money over the years from groups that have come out with dubious studies concerning race and intelligence. FAIRUS is one of a number of organizations that pander to the fear in white people that brown people are taking over their sovereign nation and diluting the gene pool. They aren’t credible.

By JustMe

May 8, 2007 11:49 AM | Link to this

Student,

First, I am sorry that you are in this situation.

However, you cannot compare yourself to American students/children. It is irrelevant that some of them are lazy or don’t care or whatever. It is also irrelevant that you may be a wonderful person and student.

The bottom line is that your parents have not been paying into the system via taxes all of these years. That money would have gone to create the system you are now enjoying - not only school but the police department, fire department, building of roads, and so on. This is why the majority of US citizens are angry with your parents and with your situation.

By Coco

May 8, 2007 11:52 AM | Link to this

We are spending a fortune of our tax dollars, feeding, educating & immunizing these children. We don’t want a country of illiterates growing up here—-but we won’t have a country left because our tax paying citizens won’t be able to foot the bill any more.

By Jason

May 8, 2007 11:52 AM | Link to this

If you support the illegal immigration of Mexicans to the U.S., you must, in fairness, also support the illegal immigration of people from every other country in the world.

Denying illegal non-Mexican immigrants the American dream because they weren’t born in Mexico (near the U.S. border) is no different than denying illegal Mexican immigrants the American Dream because they weren’t born in the U.S.

Are you prepared to accept a truly open-door immigration policy? Have you thought about its implications?

By Jason

May 8, 2007 11:54 AM | Link to this

If you support the illegal immigration of Mexicans to the U.S., you must, in fairness, also support the illegal immigration of people from every other country in the world.

Denying illegal non-Mexican immigrants the American dream because they weren’t born in Mexico (near the U.S. border) is no different than denying illegal Mexican immigrants the American Dream because they weren’t born in the U.S.

Are you prepared to accept a truly open-door immigration policy? Have you thought about its implications?

By deegee

May 8, 2007 11:57 AM | Link to this

WAKE UP AND LISTEN!!! ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS PAY TAXES!!!

Starting in the late 1980’s, the Social Security Administration received a flood of W-2 earnings reports with incorrect - sometimes simply fictitious - Social Security numbers. It stashed them in what it calls the “earnings suspense file” in the hope that someday it would figure out whom they belonged to.

The file has been mushrooming ever since: $189 billion worth of wages ended up recorded in the suspense file over the 1990’s, two and a half times the amount of the 1980’s.

In the current decade, the file is growing, on average, by more than $50 billion a year, generating $6 billion to $7 billion in Social Security tax revenue and about $1.5 billion in Medicare taxes.

By from STUDENT to JUST ME

May 8, 2007 11:59 AM | Link to this

Hi Just me, I’m sorry that you are misguided by what some undocumented immigrants do. But let me tell you that even though my parents are undocumented they have been paying taxes. Many people are so misinformed about us. My dad is a construction worker but pays insurance and last year he paid over 5,000 in taxes. Yes taxes! When we go to the hospital did you know that some hospitals make you pay upfront? I went to a regular check up and just because i’m undocumented i paid 250 dollars before a doctor could see me. I know people reading this won’t believe it but you know some of us undocumented immigrants really try to better ourselves and try to be good citizens. I said that about lazy students because i just with people could understand how hard some of us work and how tough it is for us, without it being our fault. I don’t blame my parents because i know they did it so we could have food and survive, but my point is that everything we have we have worked for. I have not asked anyone for anything. I have not received any kind of benefit for free like welfare and things like that.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 12:02 PM | Link to this

Yes Jeanie… though my last question if answered correctly will stop illegal immigrations to the greatest degree possible and more so than any other things contemplated in the so-called comprehensive immigration reform bills before congress now – Such as a bartered amnesty, removal of our border and our sovereignty as a nation through the means of newly created Z guest worker visa program that will be violated like all the other visa programs and the hanging of a for sale out for a bought U.S. citizenship.

By V for Vendetta

May 8, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this

This shouldn’t even be a debate. As many have said before, the bottom line is the word ILLEGAL. I could parade a whole van load of wide-eyed little children across the screen accompanied by music and scrolling text reading “they had no choice to come here,” BUT none of that matters. Sorry, in the game of life you win some and you lose some.

Just as I would not travel to Europe and settle in a country like France, Spain, or Italy and expect handouts from the populace in the form of healthcare, wellfare/food stamps, education, and the ability to legally drive a car, I do not think we should tolerate the same thing being done to us. JustMe is right, WE made this bed, but we can either recline in it like morons or do something about the situation. I would prefer the latter.

We need to discourage these people from coming here illegally. I’m all for change and diversity etc. etc., but not at the expense of the general population. Get the problem under control first and we’ll take it from there.

By anita

May 8, 2007 12:03 PM | Link to this

At WHAT point in USA history did we decide that laws were a “suggestion”? I will rob a bank and say hey! I’m just tryin to support my familY so I cant be prosecuted. Can anyone read a dictionary? Please look up the word ILLEGAL. All illegals, regardless of origin MUST be rounded up and DEPORTED! NOW.

By anita

May 8, 2007 12:05 PM | Link to this

Hey “Student” —Al Capone paid taxes too—he was still a criminal. Big freakin deal. GO HOME!

By JustMe

May 8, 2007 12:09 PM | Link to this

Student-

An undocumented worker has no real social security number. How can your dad pay legal taxes without a social security number? It cannot be done. So I really question that you know what you are talking about or that your dad has been honest with you. Possibly he lied and made up a social security number to get his job, but isn’t that simply compounding one illegal act on top of another? And this should be rewarded????

Illegal aliens or undocumented workers do not properly or legally pay taxes!

Again, great that you are hard working, but it doesn’t change the fact that you and your dad are here ILLEGALLY!!!!!

By catlady

May 8, 2007 12:32 PM | Link to this

Aren’t presidents allowed to give out of state tuition waivers to other special groups, such as out of state athletes? Or (legal) but out of country grad students? As I understand it, this has been happening MUCH less often for illegal immigrant children than for (occasionally)dumb-as-a-board basketball or football players. Sorry about the sterotype. I’d rather us keep the bright ones and pass on the others, wherever they are from.

Illegal aliens DO pay taxes (watch them at Walmart)(look at their pay stubs) (See if their landlords give them a break on the property taxes because they are illegal).

We are being short-sighted not to take care of our scholars, which these students are.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 12:35 PM | Link to this

JustMe, there is no such thing as paying legal taxes vs. illegal taxes. If you fill out a W4 and your employer withholds taxes from your check and in turn pays taxes to the government then everyone has paid taxes. The money goes to the US Treasury. The Treasury doesn’t care whether the worker is legal or illegal. They spend the money just the same.

By JustMe

May 8, 2007 12:40 PM | Link to this

catlady,

You are wrong. Please read my post on 12:09. Illegal aliens or undocumented workers cannot pay legal taxes. Possibly, they steal others social security numbers or otherwise give fake ones, but that is not the same thing!

By catlady

May 8, 2007 12:44 PM | Link to this

We already have pseudo citizens as described above. From what I can see, that is exactly what we have now.

What about selecting the best and brightest and keeping them and deporting the others (and charge their home country the cost of deporting them, to come out of their aid from our country)?

And, for goodness sake, we should not allow a child born here to be a US citizen unless the mother is here legally!

I can really argue this both ways, but I’d like us to keep the bright, productive illegal residents (sort of as a fee for all we’ve done for them over the years) and send back the others. And get that border sealed! As long as we keep rewarding Mexico, etc., it will stay disfunctional.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 12:48 PM | Link to this

Student, regardless of your individual merit, as a group illegal immigrants are a huge burden. While racism and xenophobia come to the forefont of this subject often, there is no denying that having millions of non-english speaking unskilled workers will break the back of taxpayers.

I am disgusted at how we act as a welfare state for Central America…as long as so many of their citizens flee here, they can prop up their corrupt and inefficient governments. So I would encourage Student to go home, if you’re here to escape crappy conditions, it’s your job as a citizen of your country to solve those problems.

By catlady

May 8, 2007 12:50 PM | Link to this

Illegal residents can also get a federal tax id number to use instead of SS. But those who use phony or other people’s ss numbers STILL HAVE TAXES TAKEN OUT. THEY JUST DON’T GET THE BENEFITS OF IT. Please, folks, think about it before you start talking baloney about taxes! God gave you a brain! Walmart doesn’t have a line for those paying taxes (legal) vs. those who are not (illegal). And landlords pass the cost of property taxes to WHOMEVER lives there (legal or not).

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 12:54 PM | Link to this

deegee: I have read the FAIRUS article. What numbers in this article do you disagree with?

We all know about how much each county spends per pupil on public education. We also know the commonly used estimates of illegals in this country.

Now, how hard is it to do some simple math? Again, WHAT NUMBERS DO YOU DISAGREE WITH?

These numbers are probably better than the estimates of local and national latino advocates.

By high school teacher

May 8, 2007 12:55 PM | Link to this

Please pardon my ignorance…

what is an undocumented immigrant? I thought you’re a citizen or you aren’t.

By will c

May 8, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this

I have $77,000 in student loan debt. No one is helping me pay off my student loans. If you want an education, you have to pay for it. Where were all these special breaks when I was in school. Illegal immigrants should be treated as out-of-state students and should have to pay a higher rate.

RICH GUYS TROPHY WIFE SPEED DATING

By savannahsmile

May 8, 2007 12:56 PM | Link to this

“Living in the United States is a privilege that should be extended to those who are willing to abide by our laws and contribute to common good (i.e., taxe). “

If you consider PAYING taxes contributing then there are many many Americans who are NOT contributing!!!!If you consider abiding by the law as contributing, there are even fewer who deserve the merits of citizenship. TO the writer who commented that child support helps keep children off welfare. ARE YOU KIDDING? Do you think 70 or 80 dollars a week keeps a kid off welfare? NOPE! AND why do people keeps saying that conservatives just want “cheap labor”! It’s NOT CHEAP!! It’s reliable, consistent, and honest. Every employer I know pays their farm workers well above minimum wage. This is largely unskilled labor. They would earn far less at McDonald’s. Legal labor would be great but the welfare system has literally crippled the human spirit in too many “native americans”.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 12:59 PM | Link to this

Folks, they are working and they are paying taxes. In 2002 alone, nine million W-2’s with incorrect Social Security numbers landed in the suspense file, accounting for $56 billion in earnings, or about 1.5 percent of total reported wages.

Social Security officials do not know what fraction of the suspense file corresponds to the earnings of illegal immigrants. But they suspect that the portion is significant.

“Our assumption is that about three-quarters of other-than-legal immigrants pay payroll taxes,” said Stephen C. Goss, Social Security’s chief actuary, using the agency’s term for illegal immigration.

I would bet that there is more collected in Medicare tax from illegal immigrants in one year than what is spent on Medicaid benefits for crack and meth addicted American citizens in one month.

By War Eagle

May 8, 2007 1:04 PM | Link to this

Breaking and Entering is against the Law-YOU BROKE into this country and ENTERED ILLEGALLY. If you break into a bank and enter the vault and take the money, you are not rewarded-you go to prison.Therefore-you should go to jail or be deported-the latter would be better. Go back to Mexico before th Blacks demand reparations from you. And stop using our Hospitals as your Doc in the Box! Our schools are for those that pay wchool taxes and speak ENGLISH. This is America-you are jsut visiting. Have the courtesy to speak ENGLISH, not Ebonics, not Spanisha nd not Mexican/African-ENGLISH!

By V for Vendetta

May 8, 2007 1:05 PM | Link to this

catlady, true, they pay taxes in some form or another, but the pressure should come on the EMPLOYERS of illegal immigrants. Eliminate the potential jobs for them, crack down with great severity on those who hire illegals, and watch the stream of undocumented workers turn into a more manageable trickle.

Rick, you are absolutely right. When you do the math on a per student basis, the results are staggering and scary.

Student, I applaud you for being one of the few illegals to take major strides toward a better life for yourself. That having been said, the percentage of illegal immigrants like you (out of the MILLIONS who have come here) is very small. Like many people on this blog, I am a teacher. I see the kids in my class every single day. My school has diversified quite a bit over the years. As a result, education is down and discipline infractions are up. By far the largest number of kids getting written up for breaking rules, bringing in drugs, or lack of attendance (most often due to teen pregnancy - which the state pays for!) are hispanic. BY FAR, they are hispanic. It’s not even close really.

By thomas

May 8, 2007 1:06 PM | Link to this

Deegee, AS A MATTER OF FACT, I AM AN ENGLISH TEACHER!!!* WHAT ABOUT IT??? :)

Back to the conversation at hand— Yesterday, one of my students told me that one of her “aunts” was pregnant and was coming to America to live with her. She said that the “aunt” didn’t want to have the baby in Mexico, but here.

ESOL teachers need not worry about job security. We have more work than we can handle.

By JustMe

May 8, 2007 1:08 PM | Link to this

catlady and deegee -

If an illegal alien (by definition, one who has broken the law), steals a social security number (thus breaking the law again) and pays taxes that way, then for me that person doesn’t deserve the dried gum on the bottom of my shoe!

It is ridiculous for you to argue in favor of such a person, period, and you look very foolish in doing so. And, it is just as insane to argue for their children because if that criminal wasn’t here, then their kids won’t be here either, PERIOD. And, it is not my problem or my fault and my taxes should go towards them or their kids, PERIOD.

If a person wants to work in the US and pay taxes, there are proper channels in place to accomplish this. Otherwise, they are just criminals and should be treated as such.

The ones benefiting from illegal workers are the big businesses. These are the “fat cats” that support and reap the benefits of the republican party. That is why Bush will never do any thing to stop this.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 1:08 PM | Link to this

Nobody’s denying that illegal immigrants pay taxes; the question is, do they pay enough in taxes to cover the services they require? I’d say no. There are all sorts of financial figures thrown around. But common sense would point towards a greater tax burden. If a house is rented to 4 undocumented house painters, they are proportionately paying (through the rent) less in property taxes than the two-adult family next door. They hold lower-wage jobs, so they pay less taxes in total. If they bring the family, they have more kids, who also cost schools more for bilingual education. A younger population means higher crime rates and more money for jails and courts, which also must be bilingual.

And the healthcare cost is astronomical. One premature baby born to a 17 year old illegal costs more per day than Student’s father pays per year.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 1:09 PM | Link to this

deegee: Just what percentage of illegals are employed in the cash economy? Most illegals do not pay income taxes whether or not they are part of the cash economy or not.

How many make and report more than $20,000/year? At that level, most still qualify for an earned income credit and food stamps.

To STUDENT: do you parents pay more than $15,000 in taxes a year? That is the amount American taxpayers cough up to pay for the public education of you and your brother. Do you think it is RIGHT or FAIR that the American taxpayer has to pay for your education?

What tax monies are left over to pay for the other services that illegals use?

By AScott

May 8, 2007 1:11 PM | Link to this

The preferred treatment should be in-state tuition for US citizens that are residents, out-of-state for US citizens resident to other states, and out-of-country tuition for anyone that is not a legal resident of the US, not just here on student visa. The out-of-country rate should be about 10 times the in-state tuition. Pay the fare or get your education at Universitad de Mexico.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 1:13 PM | Link to this

catlady - a couple of items are being overlooked I feel in the passing over.

First we should care about where our immigrants are coming from. Two points quickly, if I may, there are national security reasons to consider, then there are reasons of insuring that the diversity we accept is truly diverse in regards to the populous of the world.

Secondly we must demand of our government that it not exceed the powers and authority give to it under Article one Section eight Clause four of the Constitution. Wherein uniformity - which anything illegal cannot comply uniformly in a nation of laws - and the government’s responsibility and as well our responsibilities in the duties of naturalization of all legal immigrants that would be unlawfully passed over, should the who, where and how of our immigrants is being ignored.

We are a great nation that can select the best and brightest minds from anywhere around the world. We do not have to settle for anything less than our own selection process and our own legal selections.

By jim d

May 8, 2007 1:16 PM | Link to this

Student,

“I have not received any kind of benefit for free like welfare and things like that”

Really? Where did you attend K-12? who paid for it? The average cost per student for 4 years of high school alone is something between $24,000 and $40,000 depending upon which county you reside. then in your instance multiply that by 2 for you and your brother. We aren’t talking chump change anymore.

I’m not trying to be mean spirited here, just want you to understand where some of these folks are comming from.

By bullheaded AMERICAN

May 8, 2007 1:24 PM | Link to this

Yes, illegal immigrants may take jobs that others may not want. But, don’t tell me that they do not take jobs from us Native Born Americans!!!

I have done many jobs that I did not “want” to do and what really p** me off in my last search for employment was the fact that I was very well qualified for the positions I applied for but would not even be considered because I was NOT bi-lingual!!! That my friend takes away from my family as they give the job to someone who came to this country to be educated on OUR tax dollars and are bi-lingual thanks to our educational tax dollars. If the immigrants (legal or illegal) would learn the language of the land they want to call home, there would be no need for having bi-lingual employees in any of our AMERICAN industries.

So now, you tell me that illegal immigrants do not take jobs from us. In the city I live in, the average wage has dropped in comparison to the state average because the illegal immigrants are so willing to work for less money that they (big industy) don’t pay what they should to any employees whether native born, legal or illegal immigrant.

By Jesse's Girl

May 8, 2007 1:31 PM | Link to this

This country makes it very difficult to obtail citizenship…to anyone. I have a friend who is teaching on a work visa for a fairly large university here in Ga. She has been on the “list” for 4 years. This is a person who came to teach here on invitation…not to deplete our economic resourses…not to escape the evils of her country. We should be choosy regarding who we allow to live in this country. But because it is so insanely hard to obtain citizenship in the US, people sneak in and live here illegally. Due to our own ridiculous laws that apparently do no good anyway…our right to choose who gets to live here has been taken away from us. Illegals are harming our country. They are destroying our healthcare systems and causing our home values to decline. They should not be allowed any of our rights. But they accept less pay than an American would for the same job….so companies are making money. And after all…isn’t that what its all about? Would Mexico be so accomodating to a US migrant? Hell no! That person would be in jail before he knew what hit him. The same holds true for most other countries. To Student…..You should be thankful you are only “forced” to pay out of state tuition. All things being equal, you should be paying out of country tuition. So how about a little gratitude?

By John

May 8, 2007 1:34 PM | Link to this

All news articles about these people need to stop once the word “illegal” is used. Problem solved. If you want to attend our school and have any rights at all then become a citizen and pay taxes for the services you want to use. Until then, these people have absolutely no right to voice an opinion on the matter.

If you’re here illegally you have absolutely right to have an opinion on any matter in this country.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 1:41 PM | Link to this

Rick, illegal immigrants that work under a tax ID don’t qualify for the earned income tax credit. Those that are working under forged or phony social security numbers don’t file tax returns. They don’t report crimes for fear of being deported. Why would you think they would file a tax return? There are plenty of people, illegals and US citizens working for cash and not reporting income. It’s been going on since the income tax was withheld from our paychecks.

If you really want to make things fair for everyone where it comes to taxes why don’t we do away with the deduction for dependent children? Why should people with the most children pay the least in taxes?

By gtfan

May 8, 2007 1:41 PM | Link to this

If you’re not going to stop the Mexicans, then we might as well let everyone else in the world into the country without documentation.

I work with alot of Indians, Asians, and Arabs. IT. They all have to go thru the lawful ropes to work, live, and stay here.

So should everyone else.

It p** me off knowing I legally have to pay taxes to benefit people who break the law.

By bullheaded AMERICAN

May 8, 2007 1:46 PM | Link to this

Dear “Student”

You are trying to make yourself sound so perfect.

Guess what? Both of my kids (Native born in the USA) worked their way through school and played high school sports just as you and your brother. Don’t give me the crap about being good kids while some of the other kids goofed off. I have been in this situation surrounded by immigrants both legal and illegal, and you know I have seen just as many immigrants not hive a da** about learning either.

I am so tired of hearing how the immigrants are so much more deserving than the natural born citizens of our, get that “OUR” country. I have seen so many other students who have worked 2 and 3 jobs just to get through school without scholarships and did what they had to do to get an education. So don’t think you are in this boat all by yourself, there are just as many natural born “citizens” that are paddling in that boat just as hard as you are.

IF you are undocumented, not matter why you are here or who brought you here, you are illegal and breaking the laws of our land, so don’t give me a bunch of bull about what good kids you are, you are criminals if you do not abide by the laws of the land.

By student

May 8, 2007 1:52 PM | Link to this

RICK IN LAWRENCE- You’re right we might not pay 15,000 every year but how can we when we don’t even get paid as much as the average American. Take your salary and divide it by 3 and take the hours you work and multiply them by two. That’s the salary and the hours we are working.

V for Vendetta- & JIM D If you’re a teacher don’t you think education is the way to go. If we are a burden some to many of you, wouldn’t you rather have an educated burden some. O.k. so you say that i took up about $40,000 dollars going to highschool. Well i think it’s worth it if later on i become a citizen and do something for this government. I have filed papers but it takes even up to eight years to get them. I think that money is worth it considering the fact that i could have dropped out of school and had ten kids asking for welfare don’t you?

For all the teachers that say their students don’t work hard or get pregnant and drop out. Usually those kids actually are mostly legal American Citizens even though their parents might not be and they still have rights. It is a disgrace to see kids like that, because they don’t know what their parents are going through trying to give them a better life. I know it’s not your fault, and i think the government is really screwed up in here as well as in other contries. I think us immigrants are a big necessity in this country because we really do ALOT of work. I just wish there could be some way that the hardworking people could stay. Whatever it is, the government has to do something about it because there are too many of us, yet some of the immigrants really are essential to this country.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 1:57 PM | Link to this

deegee: I have considered your point on educational taxes for taxpayers not having dependent children. I do want to contribute to our next generation of leaders but some families do need to pay more based on their number of children.

On the issue of illegals not filing tax returns…why shouldn’t they file tax returns and collect any money owed them? The IRS does not share information with any other federal agency and they care only that taxes are paid. In fact, Americans file tax returns using SS# or Tax ID numbers that are not their own…and THEY COLLECT THE TAX RETURNS DUE SOMEONE ELSE WHO HAS ACTUALLY PAID THE TAX!

By STUDENT

May 8, 2007 1:59 PM | Link to this

Bullheaded American i didn’t mean to make it sound like i was perfect or like US American students were bums. I said “SOME” my point was just that we are all NOT the same. That some people work really hard and have filed papers and years have passed by and they can’t get them. My point was that not everyone came here to ruin your country!

By AM

May 8, 2007 1:59 PM | Link to this

Deport the illegal invaders. They are law breakers, do not want to assimilate and are adding to the overcrowding and pollution we have to deal with. They drive with no license no insurance. The majority are uneducated and live five families to a home in a single family neigborhood They lower the bar for the school - not to metion the cost to legal taxpayers. WE DO NOT NEED ANY NEW IMMIGRATIONS LAWS - WE NEED TO ENCFORE THE LAWS PRESENTLY ON THE BOOKS! END OF STORY!!

By Jan

May 8, 2007 2:10 PM | Link to this

As an American citizen who has had to pay out of state tuition to attend college in GA, I think its grossly unfair that I have to pay 4 times what an illegal alien pays.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 2:16 PM | Link to this

Student, your father doesn’t pay as much in taxes for a reason…A large number of undocumented workers are unskilled. Putting aside the value judgement, even if he works twice as many hours, you won’t be able to pull your (or his) weight.

The U.S. has a higher standard of living than Mexico. I know you haven’t said you’re Mexican, but I’m using it because it’s the #1 source of illegal immigration. Mexico has a horrifically corrupt system of government, generally less skilled and educated populace, and a higher birthrate. When you transplant large numbers of people from there to here, then it means that we cannot sustain you.

Sorry, I know many illegal immigrants work hard, but working hard isn’t enough to pay for the social and monetary costs to our culture.

You should thank God every day that you can be here, even illegally. You have a much better life than you would in your country, wherever it is. Millions of other people aren’t even able to get here, is that fair to them? You have the luck of geography or some other factor. That doesn’t mean you are entitled to everything. Work hard. Realistically, your kids will have the full shot at the American dream. You won’t. And you shouldn’t.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 2:18 PM | Link to this

Since the inception of this country immigrants have been working the fields, cleaning houses, cooking, working in the factories, and building our railroads, bridges and highrises. Except for times of high unemployment in the US, such as the great depression and the recession of the mid-70’s - early 80’s, Americans have shunned this type of work. Immigration quotas have stagnated while the economy has been booming for the last 15 years. Mexcians have been walking across the border and working here with little fanfare for the last 60+ years. It has become a hot-button political issue so everyone is jumping on the bandwagon.

If you have ever been frustrated by waiting in line for a burger and fries, or had to use a dirty public bathroom, then think about deporting all illegals. If like paying $2.50 for a wilted head of lettuce go ahead and deport illegals. Even Wal-Mart abandoned their “Made in America” promise when it became impossible to comply.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 2:28 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, you don’t find skilled workers crossing the border illegally for a couple of reasons. 1.) they can get visas to come here legally. 2.) they won’t starve in their country of origin.

There is so much ignorance on the part of Americans where it comes to immigration laws. If you think the IRS is complicated take a look at this.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=db029c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCRD&vgnextchannel=db029c7755cb9010VgnVCM10000045f3d6a1RCRD

By AM

May 8, 2007 2:32 PM | Link to this

Degree - I have lived in this country legally for 48+ years. I lived in the north and in the south. What is happening is an INVASION. The USA has always had immigrants - LEGAL ONES. And if we DEPORT the illegals - it will be the same as it has been for the last 48+ years (No $2.50 a head lettuce). Your argument has NO CREDIBITLY. Go serve jury duty and you will see the Legal Americans - but you will NOT see the illegal invaders. Now that is how our country was before the invasion.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 2:42 PM | Link to this

deegee, then we both agree that the majority of people who come here illegally are 1) unskilled, and 2) poor. Don’t you think having a large influx of unskilled and starving people is a bad idea?

We spend billions in foreign aid for countries that have poor and unskilled people, like Botswana. Ultimately, the people in those countries will have to depend mainly on their efforts to not be uneducated and starving. Our money can provide temporary help, but they have to use it in a way to move ahead in their standard of living.

Just as we can’t be the world’s policeman, we can’t be the world’s food bank and school. It’s not a matter of what’s fair. It’s a matter of what’s possible.

I agree that we need more open and less complicated immigration. But to have a double-digit percentage of Mexican citizens residing here is a disaster.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 2:57 PM | Link to this

AM, your verbiage is a cut and paste from the anti-immigrant websites. It’s pretty sad. Between 1880 and 1914, at least 7.5 million people from Eastern Europe migrated to the U.S. These immigrants were part of what is known as the “second great wave” of American immigration, in which 27 million immigrants landed on U.S. shores. Do you think that all 27 million showed up with their visas in hand?

Trans oceanic shipping companies loaded up their steerage with immigrants and headed to the US with hundreds of immigrants at a time. Did they come here on a H1B, H2A, H2B, or H3? Was it an I-129 E, L, O, P, Q or R? Did they come here on a K-1, or was it an I-130 or an I-140? How long did they wait for their application to be processed, 2 years, 3 years, 5 years? If immigration laws existed then as they do now most of us would be slopping pigs, digging potatoes and smashing grapes in some other part of the world.

By Heather

May 8, 2007 3:02 PM | Link to this

Illegal immigrants can pay taxes via a tax identification number. TINs are issued regardless of immigration status by the IRS and the sole purpose is for paying taxes.

By AM

May 8, 2007 3:05 PM | Link to this

Degree You still have NO CREDIBILTY. My grandparents came her legally and I don’t cut and paste. Good Try!

By petunia

May 8, 2007 3:22 PM | Link to this

some of us undocumented immigrants really try to better ourselves and try to be good citizens

So? You are “bettering yourselves” on my dime. Why aren’t you at home “bettering” your own country? And you can’t be a “good citizen” because a) you aren’t a citizen and b) “good” people aren’t serial lawbreakers like you and your family.

What laws, you ask? Did you know that lying on documents or applications (for work, for loans, for school enrollment…W4’s…tax forms…)is illegal too? You know where it says “I promise that the above information is true…etc”? If you sign it, knowing that you are lying…that’s another law you spit on. It just never stops.

I have not asked anyone for anything

except for the privelege of living in MY country.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 3:24 PM | Link to this

Heather, it is true that illegal immigrants can pay taxes via the TIN. And it is also true that TIN applications have skyrocketed over the past year. While the earned income tax credit is not available to people filing a return via a TIN, they can pay taxes under the TIN. Illegals have been doing so in increasing numbers because they want to deflect criticism for their immigration status.

By petunia

May 8, 2007 3:30 PM | Link to this

the “second great wave” of American immigration, in which 27 million immigrants landed on U.S. shores. Do you think that all 27 million showed up with their visas in hand?

why do you think we ended up REGULATING immigration? Because we realized that we couldn’t absorb 27 million people all at once without significant social upheaval and economic hardship. Immigration quotas were assigned according to how many new citizens we could easily assimilate. Illegal immigrants have made it even more difficult for LEGAL immigration to be reformed.

By bullheaded AMERICAN

May 8, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this

Yeah, illegals pay taxes. I have heard that until I want to puke!!!

I have seen how the illegals pay taxes. They claim 5 or 6 dependants and I have even seen them claim 10 and not even be married. You know how they can do this? Because they don’t care if the IRS comes after them, all they do is leave this job and go get another with a different SS# and start all over again. I know I have seen it happen over and over again. I worked for a company that allowed this, I even reported them, but nothing has happened to date. So, I left that job, but I see the same thing at every job I get. I live and work in an area that is overpopulated with immigrants, both legal and illegal, but the majority being illegal.

So don’t throw that crap at me about them paying taxes. I pay taxes based on the number of dependants in my family and most years end up sending dear old uncle Sam even more money. I don’t have the option of getting a new number every few years when they catch up with me. Well, let me put that differently, I do have the option but I choose to FOLLOW THE LAWS and keep my legal SS# and pay may taxes like a good citizen.

By Student

May 8, 2007 3:38 PM | Link to this

Student to Petunia, I have not lied about my status. When i enrolled inschool i told them i was undocumented and they let me in as long as i paid out of state, and at work they know my status and have filed papers for me a few years ago. For my tax forms all the IRS wants is a tax ID number with my money. I’m not bettering my self on your dime i don’t ask you for money. You don’t feed me. I have two hands and two feet and i don’t stand in the corners of street with a sign asking for a dollar. If it’s “your” country do something about “your” screwed up government because the U.S. would be NOTHING without the hardwork of immigrants.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 3:48 PM | Link to this

This is such sad commentary from people that were born and raised in a country of immigrants. A country that was stolen from the indigenous population. A country that was invaded by immigrants from around the world long before there was a department of immigration and naturalization. A country where the Statue of Liberty stands prominently in New York Harbor with the words of “The New Colossus” at her base,

“Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me: I lift my lamp beside the golden door.”

What have we become? We send billions across the oceans in the name of humanity and we scorn those that risk their lives to come here illegally to work and earn a living. Give them an option to come here legally and they will do so. Right now it’s not an option. Shame.

By AM

May 8, 2007 3:57 PM | Link to this

GIVE ME YOUR TIRED BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH. We have the most compassionate, largest legal immigration policy of any country in the world. Why should we reward LAWBREAKERS?? Deport them and ENFORE THE LAWS ALREADY ON THE BOOKS!

By KD

May 8, 2007 4:00 PM | Link to this

No one says that we “just don’t want them here”. We just want them to come here LEGALLY. Pay taxes like we do if you want government services. If you are going to take the time to move here, take the time and do it right, and legally. I wouldn’t expect to move to another country without getting any kind of papers, visas, etc. It is NOT a race issue. I get so tired of people using that excuse. We have laws in place. It IS possible for you to come here legally. DO IT!

By petunia

May 8, 2007 4:04 PM | Link to this

Student - Well bully for you for breaking as few laws as you do. I suppose being robbed by a petty theif is better than being mugged by a felon. And by the by…you ARE bettering yourself on my dime. You were educated on my dime. The entire infrastructure from water and electricity to sewer was made possible by MY government. You drive on streets I and mine paid for. The hospital you went to was more than likely subsidized by my dime. How about the cops that protect you? My dime. Firefighters? My dime. The public university you attend? MY DIME!!

Go home. You are cheating someone who deserves to be here. Someone who respects the US, our laws, and our philosophy of fairness. Go home. You don’t belong here.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 4:09 PM | Link to this

Petunia, immigration is regulated and that is a good thing. However, the laws and quotas have been modified over the last hundred years. That we are now at full employment, we have a growing economy, and we have an estimated 10 million illegal workers says that it’s time to adjust.

By Deanna

May 8, 2007 4:11 PM | Link to this

Can we all just get along people…This commentary is sad but its true…But I must agree..if you enter this country…you must take the “legal” steps to become an American citizen.

On another note it p** me off when I use the ATM machines…call customer service… and I have to select 1 for english and 2 for spanish etc….If you live in this country immigrants should learn our language. But of course with our”capatilistic” society America take advantages of all “economic” opportunities.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 4:29 PM | Link to this

Deanna, At this point in time the law says that if you entered the country illegally it is impossible for you to adjust status and become a legal resident. If the law is changed to conform to the standards that existed prior to April, 2002 when the restriction was applied, the government coffers would be full of money collected in fines paid by those adjusting status and becoming legal residents. Citizenship is another matter. It takes 5 years from the time you adjust status.

By Student

May 8, 2007 4:33 PM | Link to this

Petunia, “How about the cops that protect you? My dime. Firefighters? My dime. The public university you attend?”

Cops that protect me?? Did you not read about the march in California last week? The LAPD threw gas bombs and hit several immigrants in a peaceful march. These marching immigrants had babies and small children, and the police did not care. Now tell me is that “PROTECTING ME”? . I’ve seen so many times how cops take advantage of undocumented immigrants. Ofcourse AJC is very bias on this subject and won’t even mention about the abuses that immigrants take or what really went down at the march in California last week..and I don’t think you’ve read my previous posts that i had to pay before i was attended at a doctor’s office, and at school i pay out of my own hard working earned money! and i don’t ask for loans! Like i told you before if it’s “YOUR” country like you call it why don’t you stop posting your ignorant comments and try to fix “YOUR” government.

By Rita

May 8, 2007 4:39 PM | Link to this

First, I don’t agree that children illegal immigrants are any better behaved or the parents are more supportive. I know a couple of teachers in Gwinnet County that would tell you something totally different!

Yes, some of the illegals may be harder workers, but not all of them. I just fired my lawn mowing company because of the lousy job they have done so far this year. Two guys came out the first week, bad job. Two different workers the second week, still unacceptable. On top of that they refuse to communicate propeerly, yet hold out their hand for $30 the feel they have “earned”.

To top it off, have you seen the amount of money they use getting into trouble (DUI) and bailing out of jail. Just take a look at any metro Atlanta site, such as ScanGwinnett. There is a very high percentage of the immigrant population in our legal system.

I could go on and on …..

By Shannon

May 8, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this

Here is an idea “Student”. Get legal and then use your self proclaimed good work ethic to succeed. That is probably a better route than breaking one law (entering the US illegally) while wishing to change another (getting discouted education). You can’t have everything suited to your needs and pick and choose which laws to follow. Get legal and then you can vote to change anything you want. Until that time you are just another criminal. At least the college students you complain about “goofing off” have parents that PAY TAXES and have health insurance. Illegal immigrants who get paid under the table, have no medical coverage, and send all their money home are nothing but a huge drain on our economy. No matter how much education you have.

By Student to Rita

May 8, 2007 4:46 PM | Link to this

Hi Rita, Did you also know that everytime a person gets caught without out a license has to pay around a THOUSAND dollars or more? Now multiply that by all of those people you saw on that site. Now those guys mowing your lawn, yeah you might pay thirty dollars but they don’t keep them, the businesses they work for do. They probably get paid like five dollars out of those thirty dollars you paid. Do you think they’re really going to take their time with your lawn when they probably have to mow like ten lawns that day for five dollars?

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this

Student: Protesters in that California march threw rocks and bottles at the police!

(1) Is that the way to respond to police?

(2) After being bombarded with rocks and bottles, just how should the police reacted?

(3) Since you are here illegally, do you think that you have any more right to be here than another illegal immigrant from another country?

(4) Do you think that you have more right be here than someone who is immigrating here legally?

(5) How many legal immigrants should we allow into this country each year?

Note: If you do become a legal resident, you will then be paying benefits for all the illegal immigrants in this country.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 4:48 PM | Link to this

Rita, you slave driver. Who cuts yards for $30.00?

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 4:54 PM | Link to this

deegee: You seem to be an advocate for any kind of immigration into this country.

(1) How many immigrants should we allow into this country each year and from what nations should they come from?

Remember, that the world population increases by about 80 million poor people each year. I also feel that you would want to be FAIR to all the people of the world, not just latinos.

(2) Do you think that we can alleviate the suffering of all the poor and hungry in the world?

(3) What have you personally done to benefit these illegal immigrants?

You seem very willing to commit everyone eles’s tax dollars to benefit illegal immigrants…just how do you stack up?

By Student

May 8, 2007 5:00 PM | Link to this

TO:Rick in Lawrenceville FROM: Student

Student: Protesters in that California march threw rocks and bottles at the police!

Re: How do you know that’s the truth? I saw the videos, they even hit reporters, they were all over the news, ofcourse not in AJC but search around and you will find the videos.

(1) Is that the way to respond to police? Nope that’s not the way to respond, i know better specially with my status.

(2) After being bombarded with rocks and bottles, just how should the police reacted?

They should have gone to the government and asked something to be done. The government knows they need most of the immigrant labor so they have to let some immigrants stay.

(3) Since you are here illegally, do you think that you have any more right to be here than another illegal immigrant from another country?

Since i’m paying taxes, I speak english, i do community service, and i try to assimilate yeah i think i have more right then people that don’t pay taxes, drive drunk, and don’t try to assimilate.

(4) Do you think that you have more right be here than someone who is immigrating here legally?

No i respect people that come here legally, but it is extremely hard to get a visa. Ask someone that has come here with a visa and they will tell you how hard it is. People that get visa have money and have the means to get one.

(5) How many legal immigrants should we allow into this country each year?

I’m not sure exactly but i hate the fact that all these people here refer to us as “Mexicans” all the undocumented people here are not “mexicans” i know alot of indians, asians, and africans that are here undocumented.

Note: If you do become a legal resident, you will then be paying benefits for all the illegal immigrants in this country.

note to Rick: If i become a legal resident i will definetly start doing something to change the way the government is handling this immigration issue.

By catlady

May 8, 2007 5:01 PM | Link to this

While we are at it, can we get rid of other groups that are a “huge drain on our society?” I could give you a list, starting with “Americans” who have children without getting married so that Medicaid (taxpayer dollars) can pick up the tab and Peachcare (taxpayer dollars) can pay afterward. Or “Americans” who get special tax breaks for owning a house (taxpayer dollars). Or “Americans” who get agricultural subsidies (taxpayer dollars). The list goes on and on. And quite a few of those taxpayers are illegal immigrants! Just be sure that while we are getting rid of those who are a drain, we get rid of all of them!

By Rita

May 8, 2007 5:06 PM | Link to this

deegee - I know, I learned my lesson! $30 for 3/4 acre sounded too good to be true - and it was considering what I got for the money. Live & learn!

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 5:12 PM | Link to this

deegeee –

“Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me: I lift my lamp beside the golden door.” ~ I lift my lamp beside, jumping over borders and fences, crawling through windows and tunnels, from ship containers and truck trailers emerging?

Notice the word DOOR it is singular; meaning only one way to enter, legally. Ever wonder why lady liberty holds a lamp? So she can inspect closely just who is coming to the door in order to see clearly for granting passages and rejecting acceptances.

The ten million illegal immigrants (a low figure of illegal aliens in this country), does not prove that we should raise the numbers of legal immigrants we choose to accept. It only represents the desperation of the socio-economic conditions existing in the countries south of our border that refuse take on the moral national responsibilities and make the necessary changes within country for a humane life.

Speaking directly deegee, from my field of expertise, the jobs that once were done in the construction industry by American blacks and whites are now done by mostly Mexican nationals. Of course there are reasons for this, mostly concerning money, ill gotten money, just as illegally and wrongfully obtained as the illegal alien labor that produced it. Wages have actually gone down in some areas and certainly remain stagnant in the other remaining areas of construction. If there were a labor shortage this would not be happening.

These claims of we need those workers I don’t believe is the truth. I would be happy to debate that point at length in a timelier forum.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 5:13 PM | Link to this

Rick, On April 2 and 3, the first two days that the CIS accepted filings of H-1B petitions, the agency received more than 120,000 petitions, far above the 65,000 and the 20,000 caps combined. The H-1B is an employment based visa for professionals. They are petioned by American companies on the part of foreign professional workers, IT professionals, physicians, etc. I would suppose you could at least double that number and every other employment based classification as well. Family based visas should be available to immediate family of all that can immigrate legally.

2.) No, we can’t alleviate the suffering of all the poor and hungry in the world but we can try. That’s God’s will be done. What does that have to do with immigration law?

3.) What have I done to benefit illegal immigrants? Language interpretation for one. Treating them with dignity and compassion for another. It didn’t cost a dime but was worth a fortune.

By Rita

May 8, 2007 5:17 PM | Link to this

catlady - I agree. There are a lot of dead beats out there, they come in all walks of life!

The “big drain” that I experienced today was PeachCare. Took my child to the Pediatrician, in a very middle class section of Gwinnett County. I was stunned to see out of probably 5 others parents in the office, I was THE ONLY one at that particular time that WAS NOT PeachCare! You could see the parking lot from the waiting room window - they all dressed as well or better than me and the same for their automibiles! Now that will make you sick. As bad as being behind someone in the grocery store dressed to the hilt, puchasing $200 worth of crap with Food Stamps!

By deegee

May 8, 2007 5:24 PM | Link to this

Michael H. Smith, I understand the venom that comes from Anglos that once made a killing in construction. The market changed and a lot of people that made six figures framing houses couldn’t get that kind of money any more so they quit framing houses and nailing sheetrock. It’s a similar story in the IT field. A lot of people are competing with lower wage immigrant IT professionals and they are unhappy about it. It’s a different world we live in and Americans have to be a bit smarter and willing to learn something new in order to stay ahead of the game. While a lot of people complained about inexpensive Japanese cars back in the seventies, we got over it and the American car industry adjusted.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 5:33 PM | Link to this

Student: I did see some early news coverage and I DID SEE PROTESTERS THROWING ‘STUFF’ AT THE POLICE! This should have prompted some response from the police (even if they were in riot gear and had shields).

The police had to quickly control a situation that could have gotten out of hand. Remember, with thousands of protesters, police could have been overwhelmed by the crowd, especially those that had already decided to throw objects at the police.

We (the people of the USA) do not need most of the immigrant labor! We have just come out of a large home building/construction boom and I expect that home prices will stagnate for several years. I expect that smart builders will seriously curtail the amount of building they initiate. Many illegal immigrants are employed in the construction industry and many are now looking for employment elsewhere.

Yes, we refer to illegals as “Mexicans”. This is just a convenience and everyone knows that illegals can be from just about any country in the world…however, realize that illegal immmigrants from Mexico are the largest source.

It is ‘hard’ to make money, that doesn’t give anyone the right to steal it from a bank. That in essence is what is happening here when illegal immigrants impose on American taxpayers to provide services to those that do not immigrate legally.

I’m glad that you don’t drive drunk (how about unlicensed or uninsured). Some illegals commit crimes and then return to their home countries. Those countries will not extradite those persons to the USA to face criminal charges. Just another reason why illegal immigrants are not held accountable for their actions!

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 5:40 PM | Link to this

Hey student, I’m just curious—what would have happened if those protesters had assembled in your home country? Would they have even been allowed to gather?

Our cops aren’t always nice, they sometimes use excessive force. But have you ever seen the Russian cops arrest someone? You’ve got it better here than almost anywhere else…isn’t that why you’re here? Why aren’t you complaining about the police IN YOUR OWN COUNTRY?

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this

deegee – what happened to all that compassion, have you none for the Americans? Well I suppose I understand now just what you mean by venom?

To whom the fangs belong, deegee.

I would beg to differ with this “we got over it” in many senses of the phrase.

Never mind that U.S. citizens should make the decisions for this country, on this issue and not tie these judgments to their personal ancestry or greed.

By Lisa B.

May 8, 2007 5:42 PM | Link to this

I must agree with comments made by KA, Vendetta and others. ILLEGAL’s should not be here. Immigration laws must be enforced. I don’t blame the children in my classroom for actions of their parents. The immigration problem isn’t caused by the students in the classrooms,and we teach those who walk through our doors. However, I truly feel that if we don’t get a handle on the illegal immigration problem, our country faces horrendous, possibly unsolveable problems. Some states are already experiencing these problems. SET has painted a dismal picture of our future if we allow uncontrolled illegal immigration to continue. Do we really want to postpone action?

By Lisa B.

May 8, 2007 5:47 PM | Link to this

By the way, I am not at all opposed to legal immigration. My life has been greatly enriched by dear friends from around the world who now reside in America.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 5:48 PM | Link to this

deegee: …. I would suppose you could at least double that number and every other employment based classification as well. Family based visas should be available to immediate family of all that can immigrate legally.

Your reasons seem to be more moral than economic. The citizens of the USA are already very generous…we need to help our OWN HUNGRY AND POOR!

I do not believe that our country and handle the extra population, crowding, use of energy and water resources. Add to it the potential for epidemiological disasters caused by diseases brought into this country by illegal immigration. That is why we can not solve the problems of the world by transporting them to the USA.

As I expected, you will not pony up big dollars from your budget and make personal sacrifices to tend to illegal immigrants. Maybe you will give up having your nails done every week…but you will ask the taxpayers to foot the bill.

Listen, I am an IT worker and we do not need foreign IT workers. It is simply a way for employers to bring down IT wages. If we need more IT workers, we should be training our own citizens, not drawing off the talent from foreign countries that SHOULD BE USED BY THOSE FOREIGN COUNTRIES TO BETTER THEIR STANDARD OF LIVING.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 5:51 PM | Link to this

If Student, as a non-citizen, is entitled to all the benefits of citizenship, why do we deny them to anyone? There are plenty of students in Darfur who deserve better. Our illegal Student here would rather see tax dollars go to his tuition rather than other uses, like foreign aid. Whatever.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 5:53 PM | Link to this

Rick -

We have just come out of a large home building/construction boom and I expect that home prices will stagnate for several years.

You can take that to the bank my friend. Warren Buffet said much the same recently and when Buffet speaks, even people like Bill Gates listen.

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 5:54 PM | Link to this

I am ashamed to see that we have so many modern nazis hanging around. For sure you show how you are disturbed by colour and origin. Not for real human qualities. You won’t make a problem for somebody looking European - like me - but you do to people with brown skin. You support thousands of criminals, drug addicts and other stuff that are highly more expensive for the state than illegal, decen immigrants. How different you look people when YOU are the immigrants or tourists and pretend to be treated like kings and queens all over the world just for being Americans. You come to my country - Argentina - where you are sharing your life with good looking European descendants. You are delighted to find bilingual people that understand you when you can’t speak a word in Spanish. How different things get for us when we get there - legal or illegal - just because the same smiley Americans turn to be the new nazis showing up. Are you so blind that you can’t see which are the real values that will make your nation grow? Did you forget where most of you come from? How many of you are Cherokees or other real natives descendants? Lie to yourselves as much as you won’t. The rest of the world is not so blind to see how ignorant and with low values your society is getting. Too much cheap talking about human right and the results of different wars. Then reality show how many of you have an ice heart and a blocked mind to make this world just a bit better. Denying education to kids is one of the most cruel things you can do. But go on, live your own hell. Maybe when you get old enough to see what’s really worth you may regret it.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 6:00 PM | Link to this

Mr. Smith, I have compassion for everyone that is trying to make it and alot of respect for anyone that makes it against all odds. My immigrant ancestors came here and made it. I don’t know and couldn’t care less if they came here legally or illegally. They lived and learned the American way just as today’s immigrants are living and learning the American way. They faced discrimination but found refuge in their immigrant community. Their children went to public schools and learned English. They spoke their native tongue until they died. It’s no different today than it was a hundred years ago.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 6:09 PM | Link to this

Liliana: You said, “Denying education to kids is one of the most cruel things you can do.”

How much have you PERSONALLY spent on benefits for illegal immigrants. If you feel so STRONGLY…then show us your personal conviction! I sure you are just one more blogger that talks big but essentially is a HYPOCRITE! You aren’t making any large personal sacrafices to SAVE THE WORLDS POOR AND HUNGRY!

As for where immigrants come from…I treat them all equally, if they are illegal, they are a tax burden and I already pay enough taxes.

Note: If the immigrants were from Venus or Mars…regardless of color… I will make an exception and allow them immediate entry to the USA and some of our finer institutions of higher education.

As for Argentina…just how have their citizens been SAVING THE WORLD?

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 6:16 PM | Link to this

Liliana, Lewis Grizzard said it about Yankees, but this applies to anyone who thinks they can come here and tell us how to do things: Delta is ready when you are!

I will be happy to attend school in Argentina on your dime. And I will expect classes to be taught in Spanish, not English. That’s what they speak there. The expectations of Spanish-speaking natives seem to differ.

By Fredrick Cooper

May 8, 2007 6:19 PM | Link to this

Instead of hiding behind “tax burden” excuses. Why don’t those good people just admit that they hate the mexicans. If you really look at illegal immigration you will find that quite a lot of illegals are also from canada,eastern europe..yes I said europe, asia and africa. By the way a large number of these people actually do pay taxes…some of them pay more than us.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 6:23 PM | Link to this

deegee-

No it is quite different now than it was a hundred years ago. And very little comparisons can be drawn between the great Irish immigration to that of the great economic attack launched from south of the border against the American workers. Which leads me to inquire of your compassions to answer if you may an earlier question posed to the author of this blog. Your compassionate answer would be greatly appreciated.

What is more perplexing in this issue of illegality, if you may answer, why is the onus, the burden always cast upon the backs of U.S. citizens and their country to provide what Mexico, the ruling elites of Mexico and the Mexican people refuse to take upon themselves to provide? (This of course includes all Central American countries as well)

By Pompano

May 8, 2007 6:27 PM | Link to this

Deegee - they do have an option to come here legally. However, they prefer to enter illegally than to respect the system and handle it the legal way. Why should we grant a special exception to Mexicans over other countries?

As you point out - we already give a lot to charity around the world. However, it’s time for us to stop going into debt as a country in order to do so. This illegal invasion is bankrupting us.

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 6:33 PM | Link to this

To Rick in Lawren: First of all, luckily I’m not American. Just getting married to one, and anxious to get to live somewhere else as soon as possible. My fiancée is also fed up of your empty culture, as many Americans are. That is what Argentina is doing for those Americans who still want to know what life can give them going a step forward from taxes. They come here to Buenos Aires or the South (like Bariloche) Buy land, invest, look for human blood running in their veins. For a hug, a kiss without money interests running around. Just being a bit more human. Look to run away from your cold society. They love sincere smiles, support, something they can’t get or even imagine up there. Fortunately I’m just a tourist in your country. But with all the legal rights on my side now and later, I want to throw up when I see how you treat immigrants who are illegal because your system doesn’t give many other choices. Not all of them are ignorant. Normally they are much better educated than many Americans, but you just put a stamp on their forehead ILLEGAL / HISPANIC. I was lucky to be born white with green eyes. Sometimes you should give a sincere look inside and see why so many people from your country immigrate to countries like mine (and have no restrictions to get in. You won’t historically find a more flexible country than Argentina to immigrate). Just ask yourself what maybe happening that people want to get more than tax return. Maybe our economy is not the best in the world, but for sure our culture is much better in many aspects like yours. We give free education for EVERYBODY here. Free health care also. You live in a nice country that has lost the best values thanks people like you, who simply forget what they are: immigrant descendants. Are you educated enought to know your own history or an Agentinian should tell you how your country was build? Should be ashamed, sir…

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 6:33 PM | Link to this

Frederick: Just what do you see wrong with the ‘tax burden’ EXCUSE? Seems like a pretty good reason to me!

You’re crazy if you think that you can defend any argument about ‘hating Mexicans’ from the contents of this blog.

Most people would allow LEGAL IMMIGRATION from anywhere in the world. That’s really the definition of LEGAL…isn’t it? Immigration that we will ALLOW. Our immigration laws (for the most part) do not speak about race or nationality.

Just what percentage of ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS pay more taxes than the average American that ACUALLY PAYS TAXES? Give me a number!

The top 20% of taxpayers pay 90% of our taxes anyways. Many Americans don’t even think about immigration in relation to their own payment of taxes…since they pay little or no taxes themselves.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 6:44 PM | Link to this

If Argentina is so great, and they have open immigration, why aren’t these millions of Central/South Americans moving there? We’ll be happy to send them to you. After the U.S door hits you in the Southern Hemisphere as you thankfully depart. What a burden it must be for you to suffer here, Liliana.

Gee, I no longer feel the slightest bit of guilt about Student, no matter how hard working he is; he could be in Argentina! What’s stopping him, I wonder?

By Brad

May 8, 2007 6:44 PM | Link to this

Something needs to be done. On the flip side of illegal immigration is whst it is causing taxpayers. I work in Human Resources and you guys don’t have any idea how much illegals are costing us. They come here and pop out 2-3 children in less that 2 years go sign up for food stampsm medicaid, and welfare. Let’s not mention school overcrowding. Something needs to be done.

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 6:45 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, it’s not by chance that so many Argentinians are bilingual. Most of our schools are bilingual. Primary, secondary, some universities also have English programms. You’re welcome to check it out personally when you want. You’ll find people from all over the world coming to study here - for free - and it’s not a problem for us. Those who need an education, will get it. And they will contribute to a better future for us too. Yes, we pay taxes too. Who cares? People who come here move the economy too. Buy food, supplies, clotes, rent or buy, pay for books, etc. Different countries, different points of view. I don’t regret paying taxes to get education for somebody who deserves it. I prefer that than paying taxes to feed a criminal, or to give social support for lazy people, like you do in the US. Think about it. Maybe when you verify where your money really goes you get surprised and discover that maybe the Mexican student deserves much more your support, and may do something positive in the future for you as none of the lazy, drunk or drug addicts you pay for will ever do.

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 6:50 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, as a typical American you can’t see that maybe his family is there. Something Americans don’t give value to. By the way, there are almost none Argentinians in the US. Luckily we can still live here with a smile in our faces. Can you, over there? This student may have family values you never care about.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 6:55 PM | Link to this

Your rambling aside about your personal preferences, would you care to answer the question— “Why does the United States have far more immigrants than Argentina?”

Inquiring minds want to know.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 7:07 PM | Link to this

Uh-huh. Nothin’ but crickets chirping. Perhaps Liliana has escaped the torture she was enduring by living here. Bless her heart.

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 7:09 PM | Link to this

Childish answer. You think your place is the best country in the world? Better known, better advertised than other countries and closer to Mexico and Central America make a difference, don’t you think? It’s cheaper to get there, closer and maybe they already have family in the country that will help. Immigrants are all over the world, not only in the US. They don’t only look for money as you think. Sometimes - and mostly - they are other reasons.

By thomas

May 8, 2007 7:10 PM | Link to this

Quite frankly, and quite logically, I don’t see why are YOU people are so upset over the ton of Latino immigrants we have in this country.

You weren’t mad 15 years when they started flooding into the country. You weren’t made when TRAITOROUS CONSERVATIVE BUSINESSMEN wanted to hire them over native Americans. You weren’t mad when the mega-corporations like Wal-Mart, Best Buy, Stouffer, Kraft, Burger King, etc. starting putting their signs and labels in Spanish. You weren’t mad when Cox Communications (which owns the AJC/Ch. 2/WSB Radio, etc.) put out a Spanish newspaper (Mundo Hispanico). You weren’t mad when those same mega media corporations turned country stations into Spanish language Mexicana. You weren’t when………

SO DON’T COME UP HERE NOW, LIKE THE STUPID FOOL SHEEP YOU ARE, SPOUTING GIBBERISH ABOUT IMMIGRATION AND ILLEGALS WHEN THIS INSANITY HAS GONE ON FOR OVER 20 YEARS!!!!

NOW WHEN BIG BUSINESS HAS MET ITS QUOTA (OR FILL) OF CHEAP MEXICANS, THEY WANT TO SHUT OFF THE FAUCET. And you jump like a puppet on a string, because the Urinal and Constipation (AJC), Rush Limbaugh, Bill O’Reily, and Neal Boortz start talking about illegals (they are nothing more than stooge mouthpieces too.) These same people PROMOTED the arrival of these people some 10-12 years ago. “They do jobs Americans won’t do.” NOW WHEN THE MEXICANS ARE ENTRENCHED AND WON’T WORK FOR PENNIES, WE NEED IMMIGRATION REFORM.

Let the bastards stay over here. This ought to teach you a valuable lesson— one I hope you never forget— THE CORPORATIONS AND MEDIA CARE NOTHING ABOUT YOU OR THIS COUNTRY. DON’T FALL FOR THE HYPE. THINK FOR YOURSELF!!! THINK FOR YOURSELF!!! THINK FOR YOURSELF!!! THINK FOR YOURSELF!!!

IF YOU HAD BEEN A PATRIOT, INSTEAD OF A MINDLESS, STOOGE IDIOT, WE WOULDN’T BE IN THIS MESS!!!!

I was with Patrick J. Buchanan, a LOYAL patriotic American, 15 YEARS AGO, when this mess started. I voted Buchanan for president.

LOVE YOUR COUNTRY!!! LOVE YOUR COUNTRY!!! LOVE YOUR COUNTRY!!!

I’ve been po’ed over this stuff for TWENTY YEARS. My country is going to hades because of dummy people.

Listen to Michael Savage every night 7-10 PM on WSB 750. There is still time to save America. He has been saying “Borders, Language, and Culture” for years.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 7:12 PM | Link to this

Lillian –

If I may intrude, to make a few contributions in regards to my fellow U.S. citizens which are being regarded as lazy and undeserving? First and foremost all persons born in the United States according to our U. S. Constitution are U.S. citizens; so these people and their problems belong to, we the citizens of the United States. So they have rights and we have responsibilities to and for them no matter what. We don’t have to like it but we surely can’t deny them or easily expel them if at all, even the children born to illegal aliens on sovereign U.S. soil. However birthright citizenship I do hold should apply only where one biological parent is in fact a U.S. citizen: meaning the 14th amendment would have to be amended by another constitutional amendment.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 7:18 PM | Link to this

Rick, “Our immigration laws (for the most part) do not speak about race or nationality.”

You couldn’t be farther from the truth. Surf this site and educate yourself a bit more before you make such statements.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 7:21 PM | Link to this

No need to! Just working for an American company in my country, selling to you, people, and visiting yours, dealing with people like you is enough. I see what to do to each other and specially to foreigners, and that’s enough. Luckily just a small portion of the population is so mean, but noisy enough to hurt more than they should, bringing shame to the decent Americans that still go to church on Sunday because they believe, and not to be politically correct.

By Michael H. Smith

May 8, 2007 7:23 PM | Link to this

Thomas –

Point in fact this has been going on for better than a hundred years and no, businesses have not got their quota of cheap labor period – they never will.

One of the biggest stupid reasons for me is this: Wrong has gone on too long in immigration not to make it right now.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 7:26 PM | Link to this

Riiiiiggght. Everyone is moving here because it’s so close by. I want you to explain that to my neighbors, the majority of which speak PUNJAB and the like. No, a childish answer is a non-sequitur like yours, Liliana. We don’t advertise anything, more people want to come here because they want to. Trust me, if Argentina’s that great, they’ll get there. I don’t see the Mexican government printing comic books on how to cross the Argentinian boarder.

And just maybe…their beloved families came here for that reason too! You think Student’s family was kidnapped and dragged here? Not for many generations. Anyone here now is here voluntarily. That includes whining Argentinians who think the soil is too good for them to walk on.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 7:33 PM | Link to this

Oh, Liliana, you are a pill. You work for an American company, and you don’t like us, except for the paycheck? Did the mighty economy and education of Argentina not provide you with enough chances?

By Liliana

May 8, 2007 7:42 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, have you heard before the word globalization…?

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 7:46 PM | Link to this

deegee: I went to the immigration website. I didn’t see anything that implies we have a racist or ethinic-biased immigration policy.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis

Put up the link to a specific page or document.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 8, 2007 7:51 PM | Link to this

Liliana: If you provide taxpayer subsidized, free education, food stamps, and medical treatment for all immigrants legal or otherwise in Argentina…then I truly apologize.

Please encourage your country to spread the news throughout the world and welcome all immigrants to Argentina.

After 20 million or so immigrants arrive at your shore…please write us and tell us how happy you feel that your hard work can provide so much for so many. Perhaps you can rescue all those in the Darfur region.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 7:55 PM | Link to this

Yes, in your case it apparently means an American company is providing you with a job. You’d clearly rather be working in the Utopia of Argentina, if you had the choice. You seem to be one of those immigrants who isn’t concerned with family as much as greenbacks.

And where is Argentina in this globalization? Employing all these Mexicans who are desparate for a better life?

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 8:12 PM | Link to this

Oops! Looks like Argentina doesn’t let Americans (or basically any non-Spanish speakers) just move in. Or Mexicans! Guess we can’t send them to Argentina, as Liliana seems to be the only Argentinian with open arms.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 8:21 PM | Link to this

The joke goes something like this, if you are born and raised in the United States and have every opportunity available for a higher education and you are PO’d because some immigrant with a third grade education that can’t speak English and has only been here for two weeks is taking your job, how pathetic are you?

Rick, if you honestly browsed the USCIS website and found no reference to national origin as it pertains to immigration then I think you just became the butt of the joke.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 8:36 PM | Link to this

deegee, I usually respect your arguments, but just putting up a website “to surf” did seem a little lazy. Sorry, but I’m just sayin’.

Do you mean to imply that including/excluding people on the basis of nationality is racist? Almost every country has limits based on such critera. It makes sense. Why should only one group (such as Mexicans) get to take all the immigration slots?

And considering we’re in the “Get Schooled” blog, the subject isn’t illegal immigrants taking away a minimum wage job at Micky D’s. It’s the fact we have to pay for the three children of the burger-flipper to be taught English, fed, clothed, treated by doctors…you get the idea.

By deegee

May 8, 2007 8:36 PM | Link to this

Michael H. Smith, you know nothing about me. Read some history and you will see that nothing substantially has changed over the last 150 years with respect to immigrants and their acceptance into American society.

Americans are some of the richest, most self-indulgent people in the world. We consume an inordinate amount of the world’s supply of energy and drugs. Yet we vilify nations that feed our addictions. We are some of the fattest people on earth yet we disparage those that risk their lives coming here to work in order to keep from starving. We send billions to nameless, faceless people in god-forsaken countries in all corners of the world in the name of humanity yet we curse the guy standing on the corner waiting for a pickup job.

All I can say is that we better hope St. Peter doesn’t check papers when we get to the pearly gates because I don’t know if we’ll get in.

By Aquagirl

May 8, 2007 8:49 PM | Link to this

Well if St. Peter is Argentinian, we ain’t gettin’ in either. The All-Welcoming Earth Mother Liliana has evaporated, leaving us at the mercy of Argentinian immigration restrictions.

Try not to cast the U.S. as such a freakishly xenophobic nation when other countries are far tougher…and less appealing.

By KMR

May 8, 2007 8:50 PM | Link to this

Why do we educate children here illegally, when they can not get a job after they graduate. Isn’t that the dumbest thing you ever heard of. We spend time, money and energy to educate these children and they will not be able to obtain a job legally in the end. Even if they get a college degree, they will not be able to get a job.

Simple Solution: Hold the Mexican Government Accountable. They laugh at us because we educate their children, send money back to their country and support them financially, all the while they do as they please. You would not be given the same rights or “welcome to our country” sign that we give them. And, God forbid we discuss immigration—the Mexican Government calls us racist Americans. However, they don’t educate their own much less any American who moved down there.

WHY DOES THE AMERICAN GOV’T IGNORE THE CRIMINALS LIVING NEXT DOOR? I’m talking about the Mexican government, not the people of Mexico.

By Lee

May 8, 2007 9:05 PM | Link to this

No Deegee, I’m po’d because I, like most of my fellow citizens, was raised to respect the laws of our country. We realize that lawlessness equals anarchy. We also have been raised to recognize that if we break these laws, there are consequences for our actions. We accept these laws and consequences because we realize that this is what forms the social fabric of our great nations.

Now, the same government that is eager to write me a citation if I roll through a STOP sign at 3mph simply turns a blind eye to the 20-30 MILLION ILLEGAL ALIEN LAW BREAKERS who have invaded our sovereign nation. We see these illegal aliens strain our health care and educational facilities to the breaking point. We see the effects of what happens when schools which were once 90% white become 80% hispanic in a few short years. We see the increase in crime rate when established neighborhoods become mexican barrio’s.

No Deegee, if you think this is about some $5 an hour landscaping job, you are sadly mistaken.

By The Duke

May 9, 2007 8:20 AM | Link to this

To the poor girl who had to pay the hospital $250 before the doctor would see her, waaaaaaaaaaa. The funniest statement she made was calling her papa UNDOCUMENTED, she needs to learn english, the correct word would be CRIMINAL. I’m surprised she hasn’t spit out a little citizen yet so that she can truly enjoy the MEXICAN dream.

By Rick in Lawrenceville

May 9, 2007 8:28 AM | Link to this

deegee: Again, I went to the immigration website. I didn’t see anything that implies we have a racist or ethinic-biased immigration policy.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis

What specific problem do you have with our immigration law!

Put up the link to a specific page or document.

Are you frustrated that you can not get some of your relatives visas into this country?

By Sue

May 9, 2007 9:07 AM | Link to this

This issue makes me SO angry! Illegal immigrants should not have rights in this country AT ALL! They are here illegially and are hurting our taxpaying citizens. By coming here illegially they have proven that they have no regard for our laws and our nation. There is NO OTHER country in the world that would put up with this.

By MM

May 9, 2007 9:31 AM | Link to this

The bottom, sickening line is this: all of these ILLEGALS take the American slogan “it’s a free country” literally. They want hand-outs. The women cross the border with fetuses hanging out of their vaginas (my brother is an EMT in a Texas border town and has seen this many times)so their precious bambinos can be US citizens and can live on welfare the rest of their lives. They stand in line at Walmart with their grocery buggies filled with T-bones and sirloins, while I wait patiently with my pound of hamburger meat, because my husband and I work hard to support our family and we know what it means to live on a budget. But the thing that makes me the sickest about these people is how they use the hospitals to treat of their illegal children—my 5 yr old daughter was severely dehydrated and was sent to Children’s Hospital to be treated. ( we have insurance) We had to wait 6 hours just to be seen by the triage nurse, while illegal baby after illegal baby was seen before us. When we finally got to see the nurse, she was going to send us back to the waiting room—that is when I exploded and told her no way was my sick child going back to the waiting room—see her now!! She’s an American citizen!! And yes, they did see her. I am a teacher and I have students who are legal, but their mamas and papas are not. I know when it’s welfare payday—the next day, the kids show up with new clothes and new shoes, and one mother picks up her daughter in a brand new Cadillac Escalade. When will all of this nonsense end? It is all just a big fat drain on our society—this country is doomed unless some tough action is taken!!

By Michael H. Smith

May 9, 2007 9:42 AM | Link to this

deegee this is not about knowing you or you knowing me. Next time you want to give me a history lesson on immigration perhaps a good place for you to brush-up before holding public class would be to look at the windows. Seen any signs lately hanging in the windows reading “No dogs or Mexicans need apply!” Perhaps you can find political cartoons in today’s major newspapers across America published on continual bases depicting Mexicans as a bunch of drunken brawling monkeys? It is not my lack of knowing immigration history that is troublesome to you rather it is the amount I do know that leaves you in discomfit.

No deegee you are simply very wrong. As I and many others have pointed out countless times on many points and aspects of what you are trying to legalize in telling us we have no right to demand our laws be respected, obeyed, up-held and enforced which you now call these demands racism. As one person clearly and most correctly brought to fore, no U.S. citizen could illegally enter Mexico and demand a Mexican taxpayer funded free education and a break on out of state tuition, healthcare, food, housing, publications written in English, Americans put on the police forces, and most of all demand an amnesty in any form as an illegal alien. Point in very fact, deegee, Illegal immigration in Mexico is a FELONY! That’s right, you go to jail or you go home. Unless that one Mexican legislator I read about recently was able to change the Mexican law otherwise, after seeing how hypocritical it was of Mexico, illegal immigration in Mexico is illegal and the illegal alien committing the act is a felon. Name the racist country deegee that accepts more legal immigrants yearly than the U.S.?

Name one that evens comes close!

Good day to the U. S. Chamber of Commerce, the open borders lobby and any other anti- Americans.

By TV

May 9, 2007 9:58 AM | Link to this

MM,

You are too bitter and hateful to be a teacher. Find another job. I feel sorry for your students.

By deegee

May 9, 2007 10:07 AM | Link to this

Rick, Here’s the statement you made. “Our immigration laws (for the most part) do not speak about race or nationality.”

Now, since you seem to be having such a hard time figuring this out, I’ll help you. Go to the website of the official US government immigration agency, now a division of homeland security, http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis.

Look for the “search” field in the upper right hand corner. Type the word “el salvador” in the field and click “go”. If you want to learn more, type in the word “switzerland” then click “go”. Then type in Nicaragua, and so forth. You will see plenty of references to nationality with respect to immigration law.

Rick, I really wouldn’t have gone to the trouble of doing this except that it illustrates why alot of American companies outsource and offshore technical jobs. They get tired of spoonfeeding American workers that feel that they have a birthright to a good job and a good salary. They get sick of American workers making uneducated statements such as you made and then not having the ability to find out what they are missing.

By Aquagirl

May 9, 2007 12:29 PM | Link to this

Oh, and assuming immigration policy is based on racism isn’t a uneducated statement? Deegee, you’ve been assuming that having different limits on different countries is the same as racism. Our immigration laws don’t speak to nationality as far as “Swiss people are better than Mexican nationals”.

The only spoonfeeding going on is the spoonfeeding of US tax dollars to non-nationals, who think they deserve it more than other people who didn’t enter the US illegally.

Give it up Deegee. People have every right to be mad when a citizen of Tennessee has to pay out of state tuition here, and a citizen of Oaxaca doesn’t.

By deegee

May 9, 2007 1:30 PM | Link to this

Aquagirl, I didn’t make the statement, Rick did. He said “Our immigration laws (for the most part) do not speak about race or nationality.”

I never said we have a racist immigration policy although some may argue that it is. It can’t be denied that immigration law treats people differently depending on their country of origin. For example there is such a thing as a US Green card lottery that grants green cards to 50,000 people per year under a lottery system. Eligibility is determined according to the participant’s country of birth.

It wouldn’t really matter except that it highlights the abject ignorance that many Americans have regarding immigration law. It’s ignorance, not stupidity. It’s stupidity when the ignorant are educated and still make the same mistakes.

As far as the tuition is concerned, the student that is brought here as a minor child, raised in Georgia and knows more about Georgia than Oaxaca should be allowed to pay in state tuition. How many kids from out of state with a relative in Atlanta “move” to Atlanta to take advantage of in state tuition?

By Aquagirl

May 9, 2007 2:00 PM | Link to this

Rick was making the point that immigration law is based in some sort of thinking rationale, not “hug an illegal” fuzzy thinking.

It’s no suprise to anyone that the US allows eligibility according to place of birth. I asked before…do you think it’s fair to have 49,000 Mexicans recieve green cards and have the rest of the world hope they can squeeze in? We’re a melting pot, we need immigrants from everywhere, not just the corrupt toilet excuse for a nation to our south.

It’s your assertion that because an illegal “knows more about Georgia” they should be able to pay in-state tuition. Thank you for that piece of logical analysis. Lots of thought there.

Students from other states who move here with a relative are counted as in-state residents after one year. If you have personal knowledge of fraud on someone’s part, contact the college. I guarentee they’ll go after the extra tuition they’re owed.

It wasn’t that long ago that local high schools went after Georgia resident students and parents who lied about where they lived to attend certain schools. Mexican nationals are just that…Mexican nationals. Their parents are responsible for enrolling them in the proper school. That would be in Mexico. The kid knows Georgia because their parents brought them here illegally. Tough noogies. We aren’t responsible for schooling third-graders in Lithuania.