Get Schooled

By catlady

November 6, 2006 12:46 PM | Link to this

I have never been threatened (except by a kindergartener who was going to tell his mommy on me) but if I ever am I will first, call the police, and AFTER filing that complaint, I will notify school officials. In the past years I have seen too many serious threats by parents and students swept under the rug, and even seen the police told by an administrator that it was “an accident” and they were not needed. You can believe we should take threats seriously and respond seriously every time!

By MMM

November 6, 2006 01:33 PM | Link to this

Reporting MIGHT have something to do with it, but I believe that many parts of Dekalb county are getting rougher so why wouldn’t the behavior on our streets also translate in to more threats in the schools.

I have lived in central Dekalb—just outside the Clarkston city limits for 10 years, and I can tell you the number of gunshots I hear at night, incidents of vandalism in our neighborhood park, crime, racially derogatory remarks casually made toward me are all up by more than 35% in the last three years. The refugees are scared to live in the appartment complexes in Clarkston. The police are finally admitting that there are organized criminal gangs in these areas.

In many of these single parent, drug using families threats are just the normal way the parent keeps the kid “in line”. Is it any wonder if the child uses the same behavior?

By Jeff

November 6, 2006 01:49 PM | Link to this

I have students verbally threaten me virtually everyday, usually it is them saying they’re going to get me fired, though about 10 times a week (roughly) it is that they will kill me. I have to employ controls (vertical holds meant to limit movement) virtually every day, and Friday I had to do a takedown. What is remarkable is that while in the environement I learned these maneuvers in - a non profit, non punitive camp linked with Juvenile Justice - I NEVER used them… and I’ve used things I learned while at that job for virtually the past month straight!!!

By Joy in teaching

November 6, 2006 03:12 PM | Link to this

The other day, I had a 13 kid tell me that she was “going to tell the principal” on me simply because I dared put her in an assigned seat. Is this really threatening behaviour or a child reacting to something that she is unhapping with? I tend to think it’s the latter. In my 19 years of teaching, I’ve only been attacked one time and that was during my first year teaching at a small country school. A student who had just been released from boot camp picked up a desk, threw it across the room at me, and shattered the chalk board behind me. I dodged. (Thank goodness I was young, fast, and cute then.) What set him off? My asking him to have a seat. Needless to say, he was carted back off somewhere, as I never saw him again.

Way off topic here:

Jeff…it saddens me when I hear you speak of your job. While teachers to have bad days from time to time, they also have good days as well. Do you have any good days to report? If the attitude you display on this blog is anywhere close to the attitude you display in your classroom, there is no small wonder you have problems. I do know that as a teacher, while I may not always be able to control my students, I do have the ability to control my attitude and reaction to them.

By Joanne

November 6, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this

Most of the “threats” I have received have been more from body language than verbal or physical. Those I usually let slide, as it would become a he-said/she-said…and teachers are not necessarily the ones trusted/believed any more. The one physical attack that I endured resulted in me persuing “justice,” not the school system;

By Taxpayer

November 6, 2006 03:46 PM | Link to this

I’m a DeKalb parent, and I’ve been shocked and frightened just by the behavior I’ve seen at sporting events. On one occasion, I had some kids at a basketball game try to snatch my purse while I was sitting right next to them. When I raised a ruckus about it, they began to threaten me. There were parents from this school sitting around me, AND THEY LAUGHED! The security guard at the school didn’t do anything about the incident either. When I called the principal at the school the next day, he also blew me off. I believe dangerous incidents are increasing, and the kids who behave this way should be held accountable. But who is going to hold them accountable? Even more disturbing, where are the kids learning this behavior? I think we know the answer to that one, and it is truly frightening.

By Jeff

November 6, 2006 04:18 PM | Link to this

Good days? What are those? At this school, I have days I survive and bad days (which I BARELY survive). Sure, I’ll have things happen OUTSIDE of school that reinforce my desire for and love of teaching, but then I walk back into my classroom….

There was a topic a few weeks back about teaching in high poverty areas and how it drives teachers away… I am one of the teachers that is being driven away by it… and the sad thing is, I remember how at my last school it was virtually impossible to get the smile off my face. (and I had a LOT of people - including most of the adminisrtation I dealt with - comment about that fact.) Here it is quite the opposite: I smile RARELY, because there is RARELY anything to smile about!

By yesiamworried

November 6, 2006 04:21 PM | Link to this

DeKalb is becoming the hood…

By Tina

November 6, 2006 05:07 PM | Link to this

Does the report specify just physical threats? I teach in a pretty good district, so the physical attack isn’t that much of an issue, but I’ve noticed an increase in threats to sue or report teachers to administration. One parent came in for a week and sat in the back of the classroom taking down every word the teacher said (not me, thank goodness!) before the administration was able to stop her. She said she was getting evidence for her lawsuit - never heard another word - just an attempt to bully and intimidate a young teacher!

By Janine

November 6, 2006 05:08 PM | Link to this

more evidence that I got out just in time!!!! In my 32 years of teaching in Dekalb County in elementary and middle school, [which ended in June, 2005 ] I never had a student threaten me with more than “I’m going to tell my mother [or the principal”…neither of which was ever a problem. In every school in which I taught, over 90% of students were on free lunch so we can say they were definitely economically deprived. I do hear my retired colleagues who now do substituting in Dekalb telling spine chilling stories…which is one reason I just can’t bring myself to go back to sub or do part time. Yes Patti I think it’s worse now and getting to be a huge problem. When I retired I told the guy who cuts my hair that I may not get out of bed for a week!!!He said retired teachers should get to do anything they want to do since they have put their lives in jeopardy by walking into a classroom every weekday for 30 years…..!!!!!! That’s the perception of many on the outside of education….If I had been threatened,however…. Like “catlady” I would have called the police first….although that was a real No-No in Dekalb….Never, Never call police….The administrators in Dekalb are like big CATS….going from place to place * covering up piles of POOP*!!!!!

By C.R.H.

November 6, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this

When I taught I was threatened on occasion. I had one reply…”Make whatever you throw at me worth everything your parents have or will ever have because I will own them when all is said and done…and you will be VERY popular with the boys/girls in jail/YDC!” And I made sure I had a big smile on my face when I said it.

By SET

November 6, 2006 05:24 PM | Link to this

Any worker who remains in a physically dangerous workplace engendered by management is part of the problem. Sorry for the unhelpful remark - but it’s true.

The teachers who complain of these horrible working conditions are just like the horse in George Orwell’s Animal Farm who keeps swearing to “work harder” and gets sold to the glue factory at the end of the story.

If things are this bad you have to find other employment and relocate if required. It’s the only moral thing to do.

By 30 Year teacher

November 6, 2006 05:36 PM | Link to this

jeff,

I too have been concerned about your classroom attitude and remember some very negative posts from your old school as well. As you know I teach at risk kids as well as AP. My at risk kids are known around the school (not with affection) as Ms. S’s criminals, sometimes with great accuracy. I do tend to always remember the quote by the great Haim Ginott as follows:

“I’ve come to the frightening conclusion that I am the decisive element in the classroom. It’s my daily mood that makes the weather. As a teacher, I possess a tremendous power to make a child’s life miserable or joyous. I can be a tool of torture or an instrument of inspiration. I can humiliate or humor, hurt or heal. In all situations, it is my response that decides whether a crisis will be escalated or de-escalated and a child humanized or de-humanized.â€?

You might want to read one of his books. They are truly inspirational and give great suggestions.

Personally I have been threatened, of course, with everything from lawsuits to raised fists. None of this ever actually happened. The kid who raised his fist stopped when a much younger and dumber me told him to take his best shot because I’d immediately press charges. He stopped, thank heavens.

In 30 years I can count only 5 of these incidents and some of my kids have been quite violent in the community.

Has teaching changed in the past 30 years? Absolutely, but it has been a great ride! I will retire at the end of this year but I have loved being a teacher in spite of some of the nonsense we all talk about.

By holdingAJCaccountable

November 6, 2006 05:46 PM | Link to this

Re: Joy of teaching “If the attitude you display on this blog is anywhere close to the attitude you display in your classroom, there is no small wonder you have problems.”

Disclaimer: I have NO idea who poster Jeff is…but if a student is out of control to the point he needs to be physcially restrained, my FIRST and LAST inclination is to look at the BEHAVIOR of the student, NOT the attitude of the teacher. What pray tell is wrong with telling the TRUTH about the discipline problems in education today?

Because someone comes here and tells the truth does NOT mean they have a negative attitude toward their students…have you been in his class? It is absolutely OUTRAGEOUS to blame a teacher for a student who assaults and or threatens a teacher. I don’t give a rat’s @ss what the teacher’s attitude is…there is NO excuse for threatening and/or assaulting a teacher. To even HINT that there is by questioning the teacher’s attitude is part and parcel as to why discipline is TOTALLY out of control…

We are training an entire generation of kids to think this kind of behavior is ok…then they get in front of the judge…do you REALLY think the judge gives a rat’s @ss as to the “attitude” of the arresting officer when the LAW is broken?

Please…

By Jeff

November 6, 2006 05:59 PM | Link to this

30year:

I thought my old school was bad as far as discipline went…. and then I came here.

On the positive side though: Here’s the primary difference between old and new: At old, discipline was DECENT.. bad, but at least stuff was done when I sent it to the office. HOWEVER, I had virtually NO support there in terms of “Hey, you’re a new teacher, maybe we can help show you some strategies for getting x, y, and z done.” At new (current), the discipline is virtually non-existent, but I have GREAT support. I even have other teahers drop by on their planning when things are completely out of hand and help me out. Most have told me at some point that this is the worst behaved sixth grade they have EVER seen, and it is NOT just me that has this problem. Both of the other teachers fight similar battles everyday, one with moderate success and the other with about the same level of success that I have. (On those RARE days when one of my classes is actually quiet, we can hear the teacher that has moderate success having difficulties… )

I love TEACHING ladies and gentlemen. What I feel I am doing here the majority of the time - to the tune of about 75% of the time - is nothing more than babysitting. Hence my attitude… I spent 5 years and a TON of the State of Ga’s money to do nothing more than be a glorified babysitter. That both angers and depresses me at the same time. Even as I sit here, I am currently working on “massaging” the numbers so that the kids look half decent on progress reports tomorrow, even though a good 65% of them literally walk around in class and do nothing but talk to their friends.

By holdingAJCaccountable

November 6, 2006 06:11 PM | Link to this

I suppose the teachers who would bash Jeff are the same ones who would bash the foot soldiers in Iraq for losing the war…and just IGNORE completely what Bush, Rumsfeld, et. al. have done.

If a school is perfect and one teacher’s class is out of control, then maybe it’s the teacher…I have NEVER seen that play out in real life.

Put the SAME emphasis on discipline as you do word walls, objectives on the board, and any of the other completely useless things educrates worry about, and the schools would improve.

How the h-ll do private schools do so well with a small fraction of the money? Discipline…you behave; or you’re gone.

How did Rudy G. drop the crime rate in New York? Cracking down on the little stuff to set the tone.

If Cox and the rest want to REALLY fix education…develop a BACKBONE. I can think of a lot of school that have failed with word walls, objectives on the board, yada, yada…I can’t think of one with discipline under control that has failed…

It’s not you Jeff…if it were you, ALL THE OTHER CLASSES would be under control. Why fellow TEACHERS can’t get that, I don’t know….

By OldSchool

November 6, 2006 06:35 PM | Link to this

This teacher “gets it.” I’ve been knocked to the floor (I was only 8 months pregnant and standing against a wall at the time.) I’ve had prescription drugs dropped in my cup of coffee by a psycho student and have had my life threatened in front of an assistant principal (who had the kid apologize.)

I’ve given up trying to inforce the rules that seem to be important to the admins…shirttails in, pants up, no hats, no electronics, no cell phones, no shades…and instead remind my students daily that I am called upon to be a job reference or to give a recommendation to potential employers. I tell the truth. If a student is a behavior problem at school or is tardy, has far too many absences for whatever reason, he/she is NOT a good prospect. Bottom line: I still have some control over the functioning of my classroom. I still have some control over my students while they are with me. I insist on particular behaviours and usually am successful in getting them.

AND…most importantly…I have a really good friend with the power to remove students from my classes during registration if I ask them to. It has taken years of back scratching and proving my own worth as an instructor but it worked. I’ve had parents beg me to accept their kid back in my class and the only time I’ve agreed, they signed a contract that spelled out EVERYONE’s responsibilities including mine.

Administrations are pretty much blind when it comes to classroom behavior and, unless they are out and about and not standing in little groups themselves, they likely have no clue as to what actually goes on with the students out on campus.

I feel Jeff’s frustration and I sincerely hope he can find a better position. SET: teaching contracts in Georgia protect the school system…not the teacher. It isn’t always easy to get out of a bad situation until the next contract is offered.

By Where'sPatti'sStory?

November 7, 2006 11:46 AM | Link to this

Patti,

Ms. Torres’ story reminds…Please tell us that you are still doing your own follow up to the discipline numbers at Southside. And please include how high up the food chain these numbers were signed off on. If these officials asked for the resignation of a principal due to a doctored resume` shouldn’t all those who knew about these numbers (if they are shown to be false) themselves not resign as well?

By jim d

November 7, 2006 12:06 PM | Link to this

When did teachers lose the rights of any other citizen? Unless I’m terribly mistaken making terroristic threats is a felony.

Are students not bound by law when they are in the school house?

Or are teachers just afraid of administrative reprisal should they exercise their rights to be free from these types of threats?

If it is the latter, I have no sympathy.

By Patti Ghezzi

November 7, 2006 12:16 PM | Link to this

I am working on a story about discipline reports that goes beyond South Atlanta. Right now, I’m trying to figure out why it is so hard for parents to get an incident report.

Any parents out there who have tried to get an incident report from your school? If so, please contact me at pghezzi@ajc.com.

By holdingAJCaccountable

November 7, 2006 12:23 PM | Link to this

jim d: You should have concern if not sympathy. Because these children are being taught, yes taught, that VIOLENCE and ITIMADATION are socially acceptable ways of dealing with things they don’t like. And these lessons may very well be carried out in your home one day, or the home of someone you care about. And they will certainly be carried out of your WALLET, as you pay for failed school discipline policies in the way of prisons, aid to families with dependent children, health care for the poor and uninsured, etc.

The reality is, they are NOT bound by law, because the law is not enforced. One VERY simple remedy: make an administrator’s evalution dependent in part of the teachers under them. Have specific catagories such as: When a student created a severe and/or ongoing disruption, did the administrator follow through with board policy and provide the appropriate support/consequence?

It’s all about “checks and balances”…and there are NO checks right now for our VERY “out of balance” students…students you very well may run into a few years hence.

By jim d

November 7, 2006 12:23 PM | Link to this

I guess the bottom line is that I have no sympathy for someone or for a system that enables this type of behavior. Any of you that are familiar with addictive behavior understand what I’m saying.

The problem is not the students and their behavior; the problem lies with those that continually enable this behavior. Now just who would that be? Might it be those that refuse to put a stop to it by having the hooligans arrested? I think so.——— Personally, I’d drop a quarter on the punks.

Are there answers? Sure are, but teachers and administrators don’t want to hear them. Teachers because they feel bad working conditions are better than none and administrators because they fear the felony charges would place their schools on NCLB’s dreaded “unsafe school list”

By Competitive

November 7, 2006 12:55 PM | Link to this

First, I don’t care if a student threatens to sue me or tell mommy or the principal. When they make a comment like that, I encourage them to tell whoever they want. I am confident in what I do and my professionalism. This is just a way to try to bully a teacher, and bullies back down quickly when stood up to.

The real problem is physical violence and threats of physical violence. The solution to this problem lies in 4 places. First, teachers must report all incidents of violence or threats of violence. Second, administrators need to take a zero tolerance policy and immediately suspend these students. I recommend 9 days out of school suspension for the first incident and permanent expulsion for a second incident (in their school career, not in a single year). Third, parents need to teach their kids that the words they choose have consequences and to think before they speak (actually, we could all use help with that). Finally, the police need to start becoming more involved in school. Violent discipline referrals should also be turned over to police, at least to start court interventions.

Last points- One major problem is the way student records are kept. Kids transfer 3 or 4 times a year, discipline files get lost in the shuffle. We need a nationwide, computerized records system to help with discipline and academic records. Discipline referrals need to be cumulative from one school to the next. Finally, forget alternative schools. EXPELLED STUDENTS MUST BE HOME SCHOOLED FOR A MINIMUM OF THREE YEARS. Let’s see how many parents start enforcing discipline if they might have to accept the burden of teaching their kid.

Just a thought. What do you think?

By jim d

November 7, 2006 12:59 PM | Link to this

Holding,

I can’t change the way the schools deal with these issues so why should I let it bother me? And If I were able to change it there’d be no need for concern. However, If there were something I could do and had failed to do it—then and only then would I have reason for concern.

So when teachers get fed up with all the crap they have to deal with daily—They’ll make the changes. Until then we can just set back and listen to them complain and point fingers at everyone else.

By jim d

November 7, 2006 01:03 PM | Link to this

Dear competitive.

Why not simply apply and enforce laws and consequences that are already on the books?

If a kid breaks the law don’t waste time with administrators, pick up a phone—drop the quarter—and call the cops.

By holdingAJCaccountable

November 7, 2006 01:12 PM | Link to this

Jim d: Can’t argue with you for not getting too upset. Not much you can do, except as a citizen vote in your local school board races for candidates that will adress discipline. And support any candidate who would encourage the scope of charter schools and anything else that would leverage the public schools to change their ways.

Teachers don’t advocate for themselves and that’s a HUGE problem. The fact that they join en masse two organizations (GAE and PAGE) that absolutely will NOT address discipline shows that the same people we trust to teach “critical thinking” are so very incapable of doing it in their own right.

As a whole, it’s fair to say teachers get what they deserve. But the problem with leaving it at that, is that SOCIETY will get what it deserves, if we don’t address the discipline problems in public schools today.

I’d start with voting for a candidate who would dismantle NCLB, and the federal dept of education. I think it’s going to have to be totally deconstructed, before it can be reconstructed correctly.

Think I’ll go update my resume’

By jim d

November 7, 2006 01:25 PM | Link to this

I’m headed out shortly (rain and all to do my part)

As for me getting the deserts of not being able to make changes? Well I have a phone with 911 keyed in to fast dial. Should that fail, I have several equalizer around the house, guaranteed to make one think twice.

By Meme

November 7, 2006 02:25 PM | Link to this

jim d. Your comments are right on. If we don’t advocate for ourselves, who will? I for one am tired of all the disrespect from the students. I had two parent conferences today during my planning period and will have more until I meet with all the parents that I need to see. I am putting them on notice that I am tired of bad behavior and I am not going to put up with it any more. Will the administration back me up? I don’t know the answer to that but since I could have retired 3 years ago, I’m not going to let it bother me.

By Taxpayer

November 7, 2006 02:55 PM | Link to this

Meme, I don’t know about the administration, but if you let ALL the parents in your classes know your policy, I bet that you will find plenty who will back you. I know I would. A group of parents (or even just one really loud one) can have a “persuasive” effect on the administration. Parents need to support teachers who try to maintain discipline, and one of the best ways to do that is to go directly to the administration and express that support — often!

By wwww

November 7, 2006 02:58 PM | Link to this

It is common practice for violent incidents to be underreported. It’s no wonder it is difficult to get accurate inventories of how much and where it is occurring.

Jeff: Sometimes a smile even in the worst of situations works wonders. A kind word, especially with 6th graders (even if they are a little old for the grade) often goes a long way. I don’t know anything about you or where you teach or where you taught last, just a little (hopefully) helpful advice.

By Competitive

November 7, 2006 04:36 PM | Link to this

jim d-

I simply try to follow the procedures that are outlined in BoE and school policy. I promise you, if a student ever physically attacks me, the police will be involved. The school administrators job is to involve the police in those instances, but if they don’t do their job I will.

My point is that many students are willing to say anything and everything. Threats, cussing, disrespect, etc. are all too common a part of many students vocabulary today.

Taechers are at school to teach class, maintain discipline, and report (to parents and administrators) the actions of students whose actions go beyond the control of the teacher. Administrators are supposed to, among other things, apply appropriate punishments and disciplinary procedures for misbehaving students. If everyone is doing their job, a teacher should never need to call the police. A student who verbally threatens a teacher today will not be referred to the police by administration; I think it might be something we should consider adopting as school policy.

By SET

November 7, 2006 04:46 PM | Link to this

I hate to say this (again) but the problem is not just the schools it’s the teachers who remain in such nuthouses.

Each day you come to work in an out-of-control school you (the teachers) are perpetuating these problems.

First and foremost you need to quit working at these unsafe schools. But along the way you might bring legal actions against the administration for maintaining an unsafe environment - perhaps sue to be paid while staying home until the schools install adequate security (while actually planning to get real jobs in normal workplaces).

Jim D’s comment about calling 911 on workplace violence and threats is a minimum - and insist on crime report numbers and arrests being made if you witness a felony. While I agree in principle I don’t believe the workers should fight (much) to save the employer’s workplace when the employer thinks the conditions are just fine. Sue and leave.

Another thing is to keep book on the place - literally a daily journal or log of incidents. Use this in court and to support your fellow teachers in their legal proceedings against the district. Maybe send Patti a copy if your attorney oks doing so.

What else can the workers do?

You’re not saints and saviors. You are WORKERS. You shouldn’t allow yourselves to be placed in an unsafe workplace. Not to mention the non-combatant children who are in harm’s way.

By jim d

November 7, 2006 05:39 PM | Link to this

I find it amazing that many teachers wouldn’t enter a resturant that allowed smoking for fear of their health, yet they place themselves in harms way every day by going to work.

I think I’d rather take my chances with the smokers.

By Jeff

November 7, 2006 06:19 PM | Link to this

I had a kid TODAY say MULTIPLE times “You better watch your back”.

As SOON as I find another job, not only am I GONE… but I’m also having that kid arrested!

By Lisa B.

November 7, 2006 06:20 PM | Link to this

Many of the worst schools around the state are unable to fully staff and resort to full-time substitutes instead. Doesn’t that send a message? I guess those in charge don’t care as long as the students (and their funding) show up. Most parents who can or care get their kids out of these schools. I taught in such as school my first year. I survived, but didn’t even bother to sign a contract for the next year. I knew that anywhere I ended up would be an improvement. I feel badly for the kids trapped in that school, but I can’t save them. I’ll be the first to admit I didn’t know how to handle the violence and problems that walked daily into my classroom. My middle-class background failed me.

I can relate to Jeff’s frustration in his current school, and hope that, rather than leave the profession, Jeff will find a school that fits better with his personality. I’ve seen teachers fail miserably in one school, and thrive in another. I’ve seen excellent teachers leave one school to try something new, or move closer to home, only to fail, because they didn’t “fit.”

Don’t give up Jeff. Get through this year and find another school.

By Lee

November 7, 2006 06:21 PM | Link to this

Just a few observations:

• An increase of 35% doesn’t tell us much unless you know the actual numbers and how they compare to similar schools. I’m surprised the math teachers aren’t all over this one. (3 last year vs. 4 this year is about a 33% increase)

• Good luck on getting the police to do anything unless the school administration calls them in.

• If you do stick to your guns and call the police against the wishes of administration, probably need to dust off the ol’ resume.

• I agree with Jim D’s earlier post. I too think that administrators do not get law enforcement involved to keep of the “dangerous schools” list. It usually doesn’t take but about two years on that before they start swapping principals.

• I hate “zero tolerance” policies. These are merely attempts by the school system to insulate themselves from liability caused by poor decisionmaking by bad administrators. Remember, a weak man likes a lot of rules.

• A lot of the problems schools face today are due to the school’s unwillingness to deal with the very small percentage of real troublemakers. Get these troublemakers out of the general population of the student body and see how fast the “hanger’s on” and “wannabe’s” get in line.

• Reference above; if I were a principal and had to deal with one of these troublemakers, I would wait until lunch when the cafeteria was full and have the police handcuff and lead them out in full view of the student body. You’d probably be surprised at the change in attitude of the rest of the kids.

• When I was in school 30+ years ago, they had a thing called expulsion. Bach then, they realized that some kids are just plain bad and there was no sense in ruining the education of the other 98% who had a chance of making something of their lives.

By Lisa B.

November 7, 2006 06:29 PM | Link to this

Lee,

I absolutely agree with your observations.

I especially agree that much of the problem with school discipline could be solved if the small percentage of real troublemakers were gone. Many borderline kids would straighten up immediately if they saw real consequences for disruptive behavior.

By Jeff

November 7, 2006 06:37 PM | Link to this

Lisa (and others):

There is ZERO danger of me leaving the profession. Be it teaching math to 6-12 students or Computer Science to college students, I have EVERY intention to fight to remain in the classroom pretty much the rest of my life.

One wild thing that’s going on at my school though? The very person that hated me the most 4 months ago when I started here is now quite possibly my best (and politically strongest) ally!

By holdingAJCaccountable

November 7, 2006 06:40 PM | Link to this

Jeff,

Don’t know what county you’re in, but you may want to consider joining MACE (www.theteachersadvocate.com) They are “teachers only” they know EXACTLY what you are going through and they will support you…at least check them out.

And you aren’t lacking in “kind words” and/or “proper attitude”. You are lacking in SUPPORT…it’s not you, it’s the screwed up education system…

By Jeff

November 7, 2006 06:47 PM | Link to this

Here’s a math teacher answering Lee’s call:

35% increase essentially means that for any given group of 50 students, there were 7 more incidents this year compared to last year.

It still begs the question though: How many instances were there in any given group of 50 students LAST year???

If you’re talking ONE incident last year, you’re talking 8 this year… if it was 35 last year, you’ve got 42 this year… and that is for ANY group of FIFTY students. A AAA level HS has roughly 1500 students. That is THIRTY groups of 50 students…. so either a from-30-to-240 jump or a from-1050-to-1350 jump.

Again, it ALL depends on LAST year’s level to have ANY meaning….

By Competitive

November 7, 2006 06:59 PM | Link to this

Lee-

I agree 100% with your statement about getting rid of the leaders and the followers will fall into line.

Everyone- After a lot of thought on this, I really don’t like the idea floated by some of quitting if we teachers feel unsafe. I believe that students (most of whom are good deep down) deserve dedicated, qualified, quality teachers to show up and do the job they are hired to do.

One thing I have learned in 8 years teaching, teachers can NOT influence school policy or school board policy. The ONLY people who school leaders listen to are parents. Parents need to do true evaluations of the schools and classrooms where their kids are being taught. If they feel it is unsafe, they need to raise holy H*LL to anyone who will listen. Get the police, media, school board, governor, everyone involved. Then, changes MIGHT happen.

By jim d

November 8, 2006 08:22 AM | Link to this

Herein lies much of the problem.

Schools in Georgia learned a few years ago when GCPS’s was able to get an aggravated battery charge, that was a couple of years old, changed to a simple battery charge (to keep one of their schools from becoming the first in Ga. to be placed on NCLB’s PDS list) that they could simply re-code the incident reports breaking down the charges so that even though they added up to the same charge they weren’t reported as an aggravated battery charge or another violation which would quickly place them on the PDS list.

So in essence, the schools have found a way to lie themselves out of trouble but have placed students and staff at risk. I totally understand how gullible parents that grew up trusting our educational establishment could be fooled into believing this load of manure, but * someone Please tell me how it is that teachers on the front lines don’t revolt against the unsafe working conditions they are being subjected to and why you aren’t demanding hazardous duty bonuses.*

Oh, and competitive, You’re Sooo wrooong—-they don’t listen to parents either. I’ve watched in detail how the school systems intimate parents and can even provide you with a tape threatening jail time and DFACS intervention to get parents to back off.

Indeed, if our school systems spent as much energy solving the violence issues as they spend covering them up our schools would be far safer.

By EW

November 8, 2006 10:21 AM | Link to this

This is a great topic, I have been teaching for five years. I was only threatened this year by a girl who was about to push me out of a door, I told her and I quote ” If you touch me, I will knock you out”; I said it and I meant it. She knew it to, I told my administrators and it was no issue, the girl was suspended. I will not tolerate any child putting their hands on me, at all. Not to mention I’m six months pregnant and I have that motherly instinct to protect her young.

By teach overseas

November 8, 2006 11:03 AM | Link to this

Jeff, one of these days you are going to have to figure out how to go along to get along. I know you feel nobel and strong being the big tough guy on campus, but the fact is, we only have so much energy during the day and we have to figure out how you want to spend it.

It’s very easy for 1st and 2nd year teachers to become consumed with school and the kids, but you have to take a breath and a step back. Put down your grading and planning and walk out the door while the sun is still out.

If you spend all day fighting everything- the kids, the admin, the parents, the system, etc… How much time can you possibly have to say… get a girlfriend/wife, have a child, work on a hobby, hang out with friends, do a sport, get involved with an outside activity?

Pick you battles very carefully. Remember, you can be a dedicated teacher and still have a life. You will probably be a much better teacher for it.

By Jeff

November 8, 2006 01:54 PM | Link to this

Yeah, so that kid that threatened me so much yesterday? I had to put him on the ground about 3 time today beause he tried to wrap me up in bear hug type holds… and I had to put his freidn down as much for the same thing. First kid kept throwing punches and kicks and making sure they would miss. In some ways, I hope he does get stupid enough to connect with one…. “self defense”….

By EducatorX3

November 8, 2006 02:44 PM | Link to this

Jeff, I hate that you are having such a terrible year. I cannot imagine a school where a teacher has to get physical with the students to maintain order - especially in the 6th grade. But…I do need to make a comment about your answer to the mathematical issues of 35%.

You have calculated correctly, but you have calculated the wrong thing. The percentages you are using are the related to the number of students - not the number of incidents. For example, if there was only one incident reported last year, this year there would be 1.35 incidents - not 8. If there were thirty threats last year, there would be 40.5 this year - not 240. The increase was in the number of incidents. It has nothing to do with how many students are involved.

This is not meant in anyway to make the situation less serious. It is a major issue to think that teachers go into a classroom everyday and face these kinds of situations. Let’s just make sure we are looking at correct information.

By Newbie

November 9, 2006 04:48 PM | Link to this

As I have mentioned, I was a para for a number of years at a well-known local school for high achievers. During my last four years there, I went from being able to interact positively with any child in the school (the most I ever had to do in the way of discipline was to move a child to another seat in the classroom or to the silent table in the lunchroom) to being told by a fourth grader to “Watch your back, ‘cause I’m gonna come to your house and kill you” (because I told him he had to sit at the silent table for the week).

Yes, I believe it’s getting worse. (My 9th-grader just told me that someone set a girl’s hair on fire with a lihghter in the cafeteria today…)

By Hmm

November 13, 2006 03:38 PM | Link to this

Newbie, I’d love to know what school you’re referring to, because it sounds alot like my central-Dekalb schools. They had a good rep and a strong program for high achievers and gifted. Now they’re just struggling to the keep the violence down. It’s a shame.

By Newbie

November 14, 2006 02:14 PM | Link to this

Hmmm,

It’s probably the one you’re thinking of.