Get Schooled

By Rod

July 31, 2006 08:23 AM | Link to this

Can you just print out the story referenced by story? I can’t click on the link - I’m not a member of whatever database it is.

By mnt

July 31, 2006 08:40 AM | Link to this

What we teachers won’t be able to buy tax-free (in Georgia stores) might also be interesting to review. Books, for example, unless they are under $20 AND meet the very specific guidelines set forth by the Georgia Dept of Revenue (basically children’s books or books that are part of a reading program – from a list provided on school letterhead as such to the retail store). In other words, if you’re a teacher in middle or high school and would like to buy other fiction or non-fiction books, you should probably go to an on-line retailer who doesn’t charge sales tax and buy enough to avoid shipping to optimize your card benefits. (Yes, it diminishes the benefit to the local economy, but the caveat that the card be used before the teachers go back for pre-planning also has the same effect in many cases. http://www.etax.dor.ga.gov/salestaxholiday_2006/guidelinesforbooks.shtml

Oh, yes, and don’t think you’ll be able to buy: goggles for your chemistry or engineering lab; cloth, yarn or sewing patterns for “home ec;” or, personally, an umbrella to protect your papers and laptop or a wallet, watch, purse, or handkerchiefs tax-free. However, you will not pay tax on: snow-ski suits, tuxedos, girdles, bowling shoes, belt buckles, fishing boots (waders), roller blades, corsets and corset laces, hunting and fishing vests, and garters and garter belts. Who makes up these lists? http://www.etax.dor.ga.gov/salestaxholiday_2006/index.shtml

By Renee

July 31, 2006 09:04 AM | Link to this

What’s the big excitement in a Tax-free holiday anyway? The average tax is 7%. Okay, so would you get all excited if your favorite store ran a sale: 7% off selected items for back to school! Huh?

A sale isn’t worth anything unless it’s at least 20% off, so why go crazy shopping at 7% off? It’s all a political game, making the politicians look like they’re looking out for us (then they raise other taxes to make up for the loss). I’ll go to a real sale.

By Patti Ghezzi

July 31, 2006 09:13 AM | Link to this

Whoops, sorry for the incorrect link. It’s working now.

Patti

By Zoe

July 31, 2006 10:12 AM | Link to this

For some people that 7% is a lot. At least it was enough that shoppers were going to other states that had a tax free weekend before Georgia jumped on board. In addition, if you have ever shopped tax free weekend, the majority of the stores have addtitional sales. The card is only good on tax free weekend because the state didn’t see the point paying itself for the taxes AND purchases by schools are tax-exempt anyway.

By mnt

July 31, 2006 10:41 AM | Link to this

Zoe - You’re exactly right that many stores have sales, so the 7% is an extra discount on the other incentives offered by the retailers all vying for the back-to-school dollars. As you point out, however, teachers can get everything for school tax-free with the tax-exempt letter, so why not just make the card good for, say, the month of August so teachers could use it after they assess what they need for the year? (Also, they don’t have to get in the crowds on the last weekend before the school year starts.)

By Leia

July 31, 2006 10:56 AM | Link to this

Renee - I don’t know if you read the letter that came with your gift card, but, we HAVE TO use the card during the tax-free days! It won’t be activated until Thursday and then deactivated on Sunday night, so you can’t really wait for a “real” sale!

By Zoe

July 31, 2006 11:06 AM | Link to this

A tax-exempt letter doesn’t work as well as you would think. The one our school uses looking like it was orginally typed in the 80s and is a 10th generation copy. I had a copy of one and tried to use it at BJ’s to buy some fundraising stuff to sell and I was told that the school system had to have an account there to use it and a copy of a PO ans some other stuff- this was a couple years ago. The end result was- if I wanted to buy the stuff there, I had to buy it, submit the receipt and pay for the tax myself since the school wouldn’t reinbuse for taxes. Honestly, I’m just glad I’m getting $100, I’ve already spent $150 and haven’t even received my card yet. This $100 is $100 more than we’ve ever received in the past, even if it is a shameless ploy for votes by Sonny. I think we should be grateful we’re getting anything. As far as waiting goes, that is silly. All teachers can figure out what to spend $100 on even before school starts. If it comes down to it, just buy ink for the classroom printers- that is something teachers always need and the schools never want to buy for us.

By SNY

July 31, 2006 12:01 PM | Link to this

Okay, I hope you all remember what I posted last week about my questions. Mainly because I have one that may be a little silly. I have seen and received the class lists for school running around. My question is this, why do you guys need so much stuff at the very beginning of the year? Why can’t it be spread out? I would think that if you let us, as parents, spread out the supplies needed you would be better off towards the middle and the end of the year. I see some teachers wanting 5 packs of 300 count wide ruled paper. Why do we have to send in all 5 the first day of school? Maybe there is some reason behind that madness but I would think that you would have a hard time finding someplace for all of those supplies to be held, especially for those of you that float.

By Gwinnett Teacher

July 31, 2006 12:25 PM | Link to this

SNY - I agree with you, but, most parents want to “get it out of the way” at the beginning of the year. I actually tell my sons’ teachers that I will send their supplies as they need them. Teachers are told to send out supply lists at the beginning of the year, and we do what we’re told! Additionally - most school supplies are cheaper in the beginning of the year anyway. If you don’t believe me, try to buy a pack of paper for 25 cents after October!

By thomas

July 31, 2006 01:21 PM | Link to this

SNY,

I don’t think most teachers want all the supplies up front at the beginning of the year- at least I don’t. With the exception of things such as hand sanitizer and tissue, it really isn’t necessary to turn in anything. I don’t need students’ pencils or paper. Those items are for each student’s own personal use.

HOWEVER this is a hellava time to get materials cheap. 25 cent notebook paper and 10 cent packs of pencils will be $1.50 and $1.10 come October.

By SNY

July 31, 2006 01:38 PM | Link to this

I totally understand and agree that the supplies are cheaper at this time of the year. I just didn’t understand why they all had to be turned in so early. Sometimes it feels like you are sending in supplies all year long and that your supplies are going to other children. I have no problem helping another student with a pencil here or there, but it costs me the same amount of money that it costs everyone else. You just want to make sure that you’re not getting taken for a ride in the supplies department. You can send in only so many packs of tissue and so many bottles of hand sanitizers and baby wipes. Last year, I sent in 6 bottles of sanitizer in the first semester. I refused to send any in after that. I figured another mother could supply the class with it. I did, however, send in more loose leaf paper and tissue the next semester. It just seems like it is never ending. What does the school system provide these days?

Gwinnett Teacher, I took off work on Friday afternoon (6 year anniversary) and my daughters’ AP called and left me a message. My daughter did pass the retake of the CRCT, but only by 8 points. In your opinion, should that still bother me as much as it does or should I just keep an eye out for this coming year?

By jim d

July 31, 2006 02:17 PM | Link to this

So who sends paper and pencils into the school systems main offices? They never seem to run out.

By Gwinnett Teacher

July 31, 2006 02:54 PM | Link to this

SNY - First of all, bless you for sending in all that sanitizer! As a high school teacher, I never get anything from parents or students in terms of classroom supplies. Part of my $100 will go towards sanitizer.

Secondly - did your daughter do poorly on the same portion of the exam that she didn’t pass before? If so, you should definitely work on that for the upcoming school year. I know that you said that your children won’t ever attend a Gwinnett County public school again, but, you really don’t know where they’ll end up in high school, and test scores can “place” students in certain courses. I know that the algebra teachers look at part of the IAAB (I’m not even sure of which test it is since I don’t teach the 9th graders anymore) to place them either in Algebra I or Honors Geometry. It may not seem like a big deal, but, when the kids start looking at being admitted into research universities, having taken those upper level math courses and A.P. courses in high school definitely pay off.

See if you can find out what part she didn’t do that well on. But, don’t stress out about it - it’s done. And please don’t stress the little one about it, we don’t want her to hate math or school or think that she’s not smart. Even if she is lacking in one area, she shouldn’t think that she’s not smart. I am afraid that she wasn’t prepared for the curriculum after coming out of the private school, though. Unfortunately, I see it all the time. Those are the students who need a tutor for their entire 4 years in high school.

By SNY

July 31, 2006 03:13 PM | Link to this

Gwinnett Teacher,

The area that she is struggling with is the Inferential Questions in the Reading portion of the test. She aced the math portion. Her math grade was only a couple of points away from exceeding. I really do not believe that her lack of understanding this concept came from private school because they don’t touch on inferential questions until 3rd grade. She attend the public school for 3rd grade. From what I understand, even the public schools do not touch on this concept until 3rd grade. So it is a concept that she didn’t grasp this year. I’ll just have to make her 4th grade teacher aware of the little hiccup in her learning progress and we will have to work together.

Unfortunately, you are correct about her not feeling smart. She had a hard time wrapping her arms around the fact that she did not pass the first time. When I called and told her that she passed the second time, she said “I knew that I wasn’t stupid.” That literally broke my heart. She said that her teacher drilled into them that anyone with a brain could and should pass this test without a problem. Making the students feel like if the didn’t pass, they didn’t have a brain. I didn’t know about that comment until today. Needless to say, I am not very happy about the comment. So, she has been dealing with these feelings since she found out that she failed by 1 question. How is this suppose to help a child? Anyway, I’ll make sure to talk to her this afternoon when I get home and I’ll try to fix it like a good mommy always has to.

Thanks for the advice.

By Gwinnett Teacher

July 31, 2006 03:24 PM | Link to this

SNY - Please tell your daughter that very few people are good at everything! Case in point - I’m so geographically challenged that I literally have to come out of the same door at the mall for me to be able to find my car!

Anyway, although I share your daughter’s teacher’s sentiment (I’m sorry!), she was a 100% BONEHEAD for telling the class that! I feel the same way about the Georgia High School Graduation Test as well. Anyone should be able to pass that test by the time they’re in the 5th grade, but, I would NEVER say that to my students!

Go home and do that “Mommy thing” and tell your daughter that another teacher thinks her teacher was a BONEHEAD for making such an ugly remark! Since I try to turn every situation into a teachable moment - this might lead to a discussion about how even some adults are mean-spirited and don’t do the right thing.

I’m sure she’ll be fine. She has a mother who cares for her and has her best interest at heart!

By hs sped

July 31, 2006 03:26 PM | Link to this

Our department is pooling ours and making a large purchase (color printer). Our school doesn’t supply us with individual printers, we have network printers (a total of two for a faculty of over 100) and sometimes, one really needs a printer (that works) right then and there. You know what I mean?

I have a question for middle and high school teachers regarding those students that did not pass the CRCT: Did you, middle school teachers, send them on (pass them) anyway? It has happened at my school. The middle school teachers met with the parents and sent all the kids on to high school. So much for no child left behind, right?

By SNY

July 31, 2006 03:47 PM | Link to this

Gwinnett Teacher,

Her former teacher does have a right to her opinion, however, shouldn’t she have noticed that my daughter wasn’t catching on to that particular concept? Is it hard, as a teacher, to catch a student halfway through the concept and retrain their thinking? I mean, she has the concept in her mind one way and now we have to pretty much retrain her mind. I have a feeling that is going to be a difficult task.

By cynthia

July 31, 2006 03:50 PM | Link to this

hs sped - yes, as you suspect: no child is left behind, no matter what.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

July 31, 2006 03:57 PM | Link to this

I am dismayed at how teachers are jumping up and down like they won the lottery over a gift card.

If I were a politican, I would do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about the discipline problems in our schools, or any other obstacle that teachers face in being effective, because at the end of the day, I know I could wave a $100 gift card in ateachers’ faces and they’d jump up and down in approval like a bunch of trained seals.

Honestly…it’s as though teachers are suffering from a collective case of Stockholm Syndrome.

By luvs2teach

July 31, 2006 04:02 PM | Link to this

I am using my card at a variety of places - The Schoolbox, Office Depot, Wal-mart, and Big Lots. I’ll be buying a variety of things such as pens, pencils, paper (notebook, graph, construction), scissors, glue, printer ink, posters, and workbooks.

I’ll also be shopping for my family this weekend, mainly school supplies and clothes. Yes, it’s only 7%, but there are also other sales going on. For teachers, SchoolBox is offering 15 - 20 % off, Office Depot is giving us government contract pricing, and Big Lots is having 10% off on Saturday. For non-teachers, a lot of the clothing stores are having good sales.

SNY - I can’t speak for all teachers (I know your child is elementary) but my 8th grade science list is to let the kids (and their folks ) know what types of supplies they’ll need during the year - I don’t ask them to send in anything except tissues and hand sanitizer (and that’s just my homeroom, and it’s a request, not something they must turn in). I will tell them that they need a notebook/labbook by Friday of the first week, and that’s about it. I expect them to have a pen or pencil, and paper each day - many do not! And that is why I am spending some of my money on those suppplies - I don’t expect other parents to provide for the kids.

If you have a question, you may want to ask your child’s teacher - I personally have a problem with sending in supplies for my child, and having them given to someone else. I don’t have a problem with being told upfront, “please send in __ to be part of a class supply” - tissues and things like that.

By teach overseas

July 31, 2006 05:02 PM | Link to this

Teachers tend to ask for more than each child actually needs for the very reason that a certain percentage of children will be sent to school with nothing more than their hands in their pockets.

I know that not your problem, but it’s not the teachers problem either. Are you willing to let that be the kids problem?

Some elementary teachers collect the whole lot and dole them out to the class on a as needed basis. This prevents some children from having an arsenal of materials and some kids having nothing.

By the way- wait for next year’s budget for teacher supplies to be cut in anticipation of these gift cards coming from the government.

By jim d

July 31, 2006 05:03 PM | Link to this

Holding,

Dismayed?

What part of buying a vote at election time dismays you?

By jim d

July 31, 2006 05:10 PM | Link to this

TOS,

So I’m to supply my kid and send in twice as much as he needs to suuport those that can’t afford?

Damn—how many of them are there?

By jim d

July 31, 2006 05:18 PM | Link to this

I’m sorry, but growing up in a family of 11 children things were generally pretty tight.

We went to school prepared and that means with paper and pencils. We wore the pencils out and didn’t waste or loose paper becuase if we did we had to answer to mama, not ask some bleeding heart teacher for the materials.

Again we get back around to parental and personal responsibility. What are we teaching the kids that come empty handed and ill prepered to learn? If we had done that we would have just been given zeros for work not done. Now we teach these kids dependancy on the system.

I have a bit of a problem with this.

By Ernest

July 31, 2006 05:34 PM | Link to this

Good points Jim!!! The compassionate side of me ALWAYS sends in hand soap & sanitizer throughout the year. It’s easy to rationalize those purchases despite the fact this is something that should be provided by the school system. I’ve seen bathrooms without these and IMO, the health issue outweighs right and wrong.

Sending school supplies is something my wife normally handles as I’ve got the same issues you mentioned earlier.

By Karen

July 31, 2006 05:39 PM | Link to this

To “Holding AJC Acountable” ….. Teachers are hardly a group of trained seals. Most teachers I encounter would love to have a teachers’ union, but unfortunately GA is a “right to work” state. Teachers in GA are bullied into doing many things (as in standing aside when a kid who scored a 270 on the CRCT is bumped to 9th grade)— Teachers also watch millions go into educational programs that will only be used for a year or two — until some new book company comes along with the new “cure de jour.” While the county wastes millions, teachers spend hundreds on staplers, tapes, notebooks, folders, etc…… Teachers I have spoken to are thrilled to get $100 — It certainly doesn’t mean that Sonny will get their vote.

By teach overseas

July 31, 2006 06:10 PM | Link to this

jim d

Most teachers I know would like to take several parents out to the woodshed and teach them a thing or two about personal resonsibilty. But for all your tough talk, I sincerely doubt you think a 1st or 2nd grader should have to do without or get zeros just because they have a**holes for parents.

You may have issues, but some of these kids have real problems. Send in a few extra pencils and deal with your issues.

By luvs2teach

July 31, 2006 06:36 PM | Link to this

To “Holding” and Jim D - while I’m happy to have $100 to spend for my class, don’t think that that’s going to influence my vote AT ALL - I’m happy spending it now, and I’ll be happy to forget it in November. I also plan on forgetting it next year, and I hope the county money counters do the same - I seriously doubt we’ll see it again - of course if we do, I’ll be happy to be proven wrong.

To Jim D and Ernest - you would be utterly dismayed at the number of intentioningly broken pencils and wadded up balls of blank paper found on the floor at the end of the school day.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

July 31, 2006 06:38 PM | Link to this

To Karen: While Georgia does not afford its teachers rights that other (higher scoring by the way) states do, there is one union that’s out there that fight for teachers and understands “good teaching conditions and good learning conditions are inextricably linked”: The Metro Association of Classroom Educators.

The aren’t the largest, but they are the ONLY ones that are willing to deal with discipline head on. I base my statement on teachers collectively having Stockholm Syndrome on the fact that TEACHERS have made PAGE and GAE the largest education organizations in the state.

Why have teachers made PAGE and GAE the largest? Beats me as they are NOT “teachers’ unions” in that they allow both administrators and teachers to join.

So TEACHERS have made two organizations with an inherent conflict of interest AGAINST teachers their voice in the education debate (if you are a PAGE or GAE teacher who is not getting supported, how can those organizations advocate for you when your principal is also a member? And why do you think school systems invite GAE and PAGE to new teacher orientations and NOT MACE)?

It’s collective decisions like these that leave teachers powerless instead of empowered. Time after time, I have brought up a point in a meeting only to have half a dozen teachers say “that was good” AFTER the meeting was over. You may not be part of that mentality, but sadly, too many teachers are.

For those afraid to speak out, at least don’t be afraid to vote in November, and PLEASE let’s stop giving Perdue de facto kudos by gushing over $100.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

July 31, 2006 06:42 PM | Link to this

To Karen: While Georgia does not afford its teachers rights that other (higher scoring by the way) states do, there is one union that’s out there that fight for teachers and understands “good teaching conditions and good learning conditions are inextricably linked”: The Metro Association of Classroom Educators.

The aren’t the largest, but they are the ONLY ones that are willing to deal with discipline head on. I base my statement on teachers collectively having Stockholm Syndrome on the fact that TEACHERS have made PAGE and GAE the largest education organizations in the state.

Why have teachers made PAGE and GAE the largest? Beats me as they are NOT “teachers’ unions” in that they allow both administrators and teachers to join.

So TEACHERS have made two organizations with an inherent conflict of interest AGAINST teachers their voice in the education debate (if you are a PAGE or GAE teacher who is not getting supported, how can those organizations advocate for you when your principal is also a member? And why do you think school systems invite GAE and PAGE to new teacher orientations and NOT MACE)?

It’s collective decisions like these that leave teachers powerless instead of empowered. Time after time, I have brought up a point in a meeting only to have half a dozen teachers say “that was good” AFTER the meeting was over. You may not be part of that mentality, but sadly, too many teachers are.

For those afraid to speak out, at least don’t be afraid to vote in November, and PLEASE let’s stop giving Perdue de facto kudos by gushing over $100.

By luvs2teach

July 31, 2006 06:58 PM | Link to this

A couple other thoughts…

The child without a pencil - it’s a Catch-22: you want to promote responsibility, and not give them something they haven’t earned and probably won’t appreciate, yet if you leave them without the tools they need, you run the risk of having a behavior problem (idle hands…) or being called to the carpet for not helping him/her succeed.

I would rather provide the pencil - but not brand new ones. I pick them up off the floor - broken, chewed, whatever - I also have my busdriver do the same. I keep those for the students. When they complain about the quality (which some of them have the audacity to do), I tell them, “Beggars can’t be choosers.”

HS Sped - I don’t think the TEACHERS sent them along. I know I recommended every child who failed the CRCT (and some who didn’t, but failed classes) to be retained. I was not the only one. Yet, most were promoted, with the general thought being, “Well, in high school, where each class counts separately, they’ll be held more accountable.” Really? Those are the ones at risk of dropping out.

I think what we need to do, instead of retaining at these NCLB checkpoints is to have intermediate grades (I saw this in an eduation magazine) - third graders who failed the state test were put in an inbetween grade. They worked on the third grade reading and math that they failed, but learned the new social studies and science material, instead of rehashing the old stuff. By the end of 3rd/4th grade, they were nearly up to grade level in all areas.

I’m happy about the $100 because it’s $100 more dollars to spend than I had before. I wouldn’t say I’m gushing over it.

By think about it

July 31, 2006 07:32 PM | Link to this

Well I’m certainly not giving Purdue kudos for the gift cards, because I’m not getting one. I teach less than full time, so have been deemed ineligible. Meanwhile, I spend as high or higher a percentage of my salary on materials for my classroom. GO FIGURE! As for the union topic, let me tell you fellow teachers, we are getting ripped off in a big way. I’ve taught in northern states with unions, and we were far better off. For one thing, we weren’t dragged in for “preplanning” and “postplanning” . We were treated like professionals, who came in as needed before school began to set up the classroom, etc. The meaningless meetings lasted all of one day before school started. We were contracted for 182 days per year, not 190 or in the case of some counties, more. (And by the way, we earned more to boot).

By jim d

August 1, 2006 08:03 AM | Link to this

Excuse me, but how many of you bleeding heart liberals take you car to the shop and furnish the mechanics tools? Call the plumber or electrician and provide all the tools he needs to make repairs?

Do you know what you are teaching these kids by providing them the tools they need to do their jobs? I do. I’ve hired a few of them. They come to work much like they did school and they generally don’t last long.

These students that come to class unprepared are obviously not going to continue on to get a college degree, they will in all probability either take up a trade if they are forced to work or live off the state. The message y’all are sending them is that they don’t need to provide their own tools. And that’s just not the way it is in real life. You want to teach these kids something meaningful that is a real life lesson and will serve them well for their entire life? ————————Teach them to be prepared! This is a lesson they will remember long after they have forgotten your name or that you gave them a pencil.

By hs sped

August 1, 2006 08:55 AM | Link to this

jim d - I would love to teach them to be prepared, but I can’t. I’ll get in trouble if I allow a student to sit in class and do nothing because I did not provide him with what he neglected to bring, or was unable to provide for himself, on that particular day. God forbid the kid fail the class. I would be nailed to the cross for that (not providing him with EVERY opportunity to learn). Just like everyone else, I need a paycheck. I therefore have to compromise my integrity all day long. I do, however, hold my personal children to the mat on this topic. I wish things were different, but they’re not.

By WFC

August 1, 2006 09:02 AM | Link to this

I went to my school (Northview HS) to pick up my gift card and was told that the state had “run out of them!” This is so typical. Yeah… and I’m really going to worry about the state holding ME accountable! Politics as usual. Is the media reporting this?

By jim d

August 1, 2006 09:19 AM | Link to this

You mean you can’t tell an incoming class something like this?

I’m here to provide you an opportunity to learn, it is entirely up to you what you make of this opportunity.

In order to take full advantage of what I’ll be offering, you will need to come to class prepared. Being prepared means coming to class with the necessary tools including paper and pencils to take notes, quizzes, tests, or to complete any in class assignments.

You will find these items readily available at your local Wal-Mart, Revco, or office supply.

Should you consistently fail to come to class prepared, odds are you won’t be passing this class.

Pass or fail, I assure you the one thing you will leave this class with is a sense of personal responsibility.

You see SPED, providing the opportunity in no way assures a child will take advantage of it.

By catlady

August 1, 2006 09:20 AM | Link to this

jim d- hs sped is right. We cannot allow anyone the “misfortune” of failing for ANY REASON. To heck with any kind of personal responsibility! Haven’t you seen that displayed in this blog repeatedly? Students also cannot fail just because they sleep all during class. Or because they do no assignment at home. Or because they fail the CRCT. Get it—there is a pattern here.

I won’t vote for Sonny or anyone else who does not make a true investment in my needs and the needs of my class: Discipline, parental involvement, and, most important, teacher power in decision-making and policy, such as the rightfully-maligned NCLB or textbook adoption. I do appreciate the $100 but it surely has been carried out with no real attempt at communication or listening to teachers in planning the implementation of it. I spend from $600-$800 out of pocket during the year. I’d love for someone to address that, with our huge $250 tax breaks available even to those who don’t buy anything out of pocket! Why do our leaders do things regarding education without consulting teachers?!

By jim d

August 1, 2006 09:24 AM | Link to this

Apparently our schools have concluded the only way to leave no child behind is to drag them screaming and kicking through high school.

By Ann

August 1, 2006 09:36 AM | Link to this

I am most grateful for the $100.00 to spend on my student’s classroom needs. I do emphasize needs. I also appreciate the acknowledgement that we, the teachers, know what we require rather than the school bureaucracy. In general, the public has no idea how much classroom teachers provides from our own pockets. This is especially true of teacher’s who serve lower income populations.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 09:39 AM | Link to this

Revco, jim d? Wow! Is there a TG&Y or a Woolworth’s in your neighborhood? You really went back.

Holding, this “seal” is getting ready to balance a ball on her nose because she is grateful for the card. My attitude is, “Any beats none.” However, the “owl” in me is wise enough to recognize voting ploys. Arf, arf!

By PJ

August 1, 2006 09:49 AM | Link to this

You got it, jim d.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 10:21 AM | Link to this

Ok Vel,

CVS—LOL

By jim d

August 1, 2006 10:26 AM | Link to this

I’m not against you teachers getting the measly 100 bucks. I’d rather you were fully reimbursed. Or better yet, not to have to spend your money, just to reduce your liability, and be given a raise.

By hs sped

August 1, 2006 10:46 AM | Link to this

jim d- That is exactly what our principal tells us at each faculty meeting….we are to drag them kicking and screaming to the point where they can pass and to document well that we’ve done everything in our power to bring them to that point. Your incoming class speech is told to every class and to the parents that attend open house. Although, the parents that attend open house usually don’t have the irresponsible kids. Also, we hold our open houses in the evening (non-contract hours which means we’re not getting paid for our time) so that it is more convenient for the parents that work. And no…we don’t get off early to make up for the extra time. We just come in and do it. When did things change? Teachers used to be able to take care of their families on their income alone. Teaching also used to be considered a respectful job. Well, it was when I was growing up (in the northeast). It’s not anymore.

By luvs2teach

August 1, 2006 10:57 AM | Link to this

jim d - I would LOVE LOVE LOVE - !!!!! - to be able to tell my kids what you said - it’s how I feel - I would LOVE to be able to yell at their parents, “Make sure your child has the tools they need before you buy them the i-pod or the cell phone or the PSP. Check their book bags and make sure they are bringing their tools to school and not their toys.”

But I can’t.

Not if I want to keep my job.

Which I happen to like a great deal.

While I do give my students paper or pencil if they don’t have it, I won’t make it easy. I’ll give them my little speech about not hiring a carpenter who doen’t have his own hammer. I give them scraps and remnants and tell them beggars can’t be choosers. I teel them I don’t care about their self-esteem at that point - I tell them it will hurt their self esteem more to be fired from a job later on in life.

Some get the message. Some don’t - too many times and I’ll call home. Most of the time, I find out from that phone call that my message isn’t being followed up at home.

Teachers don’t mind being accountable, but we do mind being accountable for things we can’t control.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 11:22 AM | Link to this

jim d, just thought I would inject a little “old-timers” humor. Actually, I laughed when I read your mention of Revco. You brought back a lot of memories of my childhood years before there were Wal-marts, Targets, etc. Did your town have an A&P grocery store (a store where you could get groceries as well as shoes that were tied together in a bin)? Mine did. ;-)

Anyway, although I’m grateful for the card, I’d rather they keep the cards and get more serious about cracking down on discipline. If they were to reinstate corporal punishment without the threat of lawsuits, just think of all the money that teachers spend on “therapy” that would be saved.

Does anyone remember when teachers stayed in the profession for 30 or 40 years? Why did they stay, even with the lower salaries? I’ll tell you why; they could whup some behinds!!! So, Perdue or whoever is to assume the governership, keep your $100 and give me a nice wooden paddle!!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 11:27 AM | Link to this

jim d, just thought I would inject a little “old-timers” humor. Actually, I laughed when I read your mention of Revco. You brought back a lot of memories of my childhood years before there were Wal-marts, Targets, etc. Did your town have an A&P grocery store (a store where you could get groceries as well as shoes that were tied together in a bin)? Mine did. ;-)

Anyway, although I’m grateful for the card, I’d rather they keep the cards and get more serious about cracking down on discipline. If they were to reinstate corporal punishment without the threat of lawsuits, just think of all the money that teachers spend on “therapy” that would be saved.

Does anyone remember when teachers stayed in the profession for 30 or 40 years? Why did they stay, even with the lower salaries? I’ll tell you why; they could whup some behinds!!! So, Perdue or whoever is to assume the governership, keep your $100 and give me a nice wooden paddle!!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 11:28 AM | Link to this

jim d, just thought I would inject a little “old-timers” humor. Actually, I laughed when I read your mention of Revco. You brought back a lot of memories of my childhood years before there were Wal-marts, Targets, etc. Did your town have an A&P grocery store (a store where you could get groceries as well as shoes that were tied together in a bin)? Mine did. ;-)

Anyway, although I’m grateful for the card, I’d rather they keep the cards and get more serious about cracking down on discipline. If they were to reinstate corporal punishment without the threat of lawsuits, just think of all the money that teachers spend on “therapy” that would be saved.

Does anyone remember when teachers stayed in the profession for 30 or 40 years? Why did they stay, even with the lower salaries? I’ll tell you why; they could whup some behinds!!! So, Perdue or whoever is to assume the governership, keep your $100 and give me a nice wooden paddle!!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 11:31 AM | Link to this

jim d, just thought I would inject a little “old-timers” humor. Actually, I laughed when I read your mention of Revco. You brought back a lot of memories of my childhood years before there were Wal-marts, Targets, etc. Did your town have an A&P grocery store (a store where you could get groceries as well as shoes that were tied together in a bin)? Mine did. ;-)

Anyway, although I’m grateful for the card, I’d rather they keep the cards and get more serious about cracking down on discipline. If they were to reinstate corporal punishment without the threat of lawsuits, just think of all the money that teachers spend on “therapy” that would be saved.

Does anyone remember when teachers stayed in the profession for 30 or 40 years? Why did they stay, even with the lower salaries? I’ll tell you why; they could whup some behinds!!! So, Perdue or whoever is to assume the governership, keep your $100 and give me a nice wooden paddle!!

By jim d

August 1, 2006 11:32 AM | Link to this

Yo Cat,

I really hate to go here. BUT, Part of the problem, however minute a part, is that teachers have given up demanding to be treated as the professionals they are. This is in my opinion no fault of teachers in that it has evolved over time. During that time school administrators have slowly but surely stripped you of that courtesy, of your authority in the classroom and all creativity in reaching those hard to reach students by scripting and micro managing your classes. In other words they have converted y’all to rank and file workers.

Until y’all get really fed up and do something it will not improve. I realize Georgia is a right to work state, but what’s it going to take to force teachers to finally ban together. Hypothetically speaking, do you honestly feel every last one of you could be replaced at one fell swoop? Sure they’d threaten such actions but then where on earth would they find replacements?

Y’all under estimate your true strength.

By velatra

August 1, 2006 11:33 AM | Link to this

Sorry for the triple post, guys. The little bird in my computer stopped pedaling.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 11:35 AM | Link to this

Vel,

I’ll do you one better.

I recall making those wooden paddles in shop class every year.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 11:38 AM | Link to this

Re: (From luvs2teach) “Teachers don’t mind being accountable, but we do mind being accountable for things we can’t control.”

If there is a mantra teachers ought to invoke it would be “No Accountability Without Authority”.

As far as this “gift card” Perdue is PerDON’T. He’s the head of the “rule of law” and “personal responsibility” party in Georgia, and he (nor Kathy Cox) for that matter has done a THING about the discipline problems. Yet we expect teachers to teach in these environments with no authority to hold students accountable.

And I thought Democrats were the “soft ones”…

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 12:42 PM | Link to this

To Jim D: Yes, yes, yes! A thousand times yes! It’s my biggest disappointment with teachers. We are 100,000 strong in this state, yet act like 100,000 WEAK.

We have made two organizations, PAGE and GAE the biggest “teachers’ unions” in the state our voice in the education debate, even though they won’t take a stand for teachers, and the need to restore discipline, because they allow teachers AND administrators to join. (How are they going to support a teacher who is not being backed by an administrator when that administrator is a memeber of the same organization?)

As I have said, teachers act as if they collectively suffer from Stockholm Syndrome. Like the have been battered into submission. Time after time we’d have some dubious “reform” we’d have to implement, and I’d be the only person to ask a question, so of course we’d have to do it.

But, AFTER the meeting, no less than a half a dozen teachers would say “it was good you brought that up.” AFTER when it did absolutely no good.

I see evidence of it the way teachers are acting like mangy feral animals fighting over a scrap of patronage the governor has fed them in the form of a “gift card”.

That’s $10 million that could have gone to discipline and made a REAL difference; something you would think the “rule of law” and “personal responsbility” party would promote.

I guess they think it’s best that these children learn those lessons via the criminal justice system. Me, I’d rather they learn lessons about the consequences of behavior in a school, NOT a jail, but I guess that’s too much like smart.

PS Not saying the Dems are better on the discipline issue (they absolutely are not) but they don’t preach the “rule of law” mantra.

By SNY

August 1, 2006 01:11 PM | Link to this

Vel,

You might as well forget about seeing corporal punishment back in schools. I know for me and my family I would absolutely kill a teacher or administrator that puts a hand or a paddle to my child. I don’t have a child that behaves badly most of the time but kids will be kids. Teachers and administrators need to remember that part of a childs job is to test their limits. Granted, they shouldn’t do this all the time, but how else are they to grow. You are correct with your point about discipline. But schools need to find a better way to deal with the students that get into trouble every now and again. Let’s face it, we all did something in school that we shouldn’t have. Even if it was only once.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 01:34 PM | Link to this

Actually Vel,

I was busted several times in school. Would have been more had it not been for that little hunk o wood. Besides, I thought that was the reason the good lord gave kids an as$

By hs sped

August 1, 2006 01:38 PM | Link to this

I grew up in the northeast, and we didn’t have paddling. However, my children have grown up in the south and I remember one of my daughter’s friends being paddled in 6th grade (1994) for tossing pebbles into a newly aquired satellite dish. He wasn’t bruised and his self-esteem wasn’t shattered. He didn’t do it again either. Maybe it worked?

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 01:48 PM | Link to this

SNY,

I guess we’ll agree to disagree. Judging from your posts, you are only about 2 years younger than I. I came up in a time when paddling was in full effect. I also came up in a time when 1st and 2nd graders did NOT talk back to and threaten their teachers. Fourth and fifth graders did not tell teachers to “kiss their [mules]”. As I’ve said on other posts, the stuff we got paddled for back then would only be a very minor infraction today and wouldn’t even get a nod. The threat of a paddling alone was enough to deter major misbehavior. Detention and suspension were unheard of until I got to 7th grade.

Yes, kids will be kids. But, since when does talking back and refusing to do what is told “being a kid”? Yeah, your little darling may not behave “badly most of the time”, but, having been a little darling myself, I wasn’t perfect at school. I’m so glad that my parents did not spare the rod at home and supported my teachers when the very few times I was paddled. Out of the few paddlings I did receive, I’m glad my parents did not know about many of them because I knew there would be more trouble when I got home.

Your attitude is one of the reasons why I stopped going to a former beautician who shared the same attitude. In her eyes, her child could do no wrong. When I told her that her son had accused another child of misbehaving (the other child wasn’t; I was looking right at him), she made excuses for her child. I also witnessed her child telling a grown man that he stank as he was playing with the child (it was her co-worker’s husband). The child’s father told the child to apologize, but the mother said that the man had no business playing with him. Wow!

So, continue to raise your children as you wish. As for me and my house, I have no problem with anyone that I trust my children to be with to spank their behinds, including teachers and principals. If I can’t trust that person to discipline my children fairly, then my children will not be left in their presence. I’d rather my children get a whipping with a paddle now than a police officer’s billy club later.

Perdue, I’ll trade my card for a paddle and the right to use it whenever necessary.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 01:48 PM | Link to this

SNY,

I guess we’ll agree to disagree. Judging from your posts, you are only about 2 years younger than I. I came up in a time when paddling was in full effect. I also came up in a time when 1st and 2nd graders did NOT talk back to and threaten their teachers. Fourth and fifth graders did not tell teachers to “kiss their [mules]”. As I’ve said on other posts, the stuff we got paddled for back then would only be a very minor infraction today and wouldn’t even get a nod. The threat of a paddling alone was enough to deter major misbehavior. Detention and suspension were unheard of until I got to 7th grade.

Yes, kids will be kids. But, since when does talking back and refusing to do what is told “being a kid”? Yeah, your little darling may not behave “badly most of the time”, but, having been a little darling myself, I wasn’t perfect at school. I’m so glad that my parents did not spare the rod at home and supported my teachers when the very few times I was paddled. Out of the few paddlings I did receive, I’m glad my parents did not know about many of them because I knew there would be more trouble when I got home.

Your attitude is one of the reasons why I stopped going to a former beautician who shared the same attitude. In her eyes, her child could do no wrong. When I told her that her son had accused another child of misbehaving (the other child wasn’t; I was looking right at him), she made excuses for her child. I also witnessed her child telling a grown man that he stank as he was playing with the child (it was her co-worker’s husband). The child’s father told the child to apologize, but the mother said that the man had no business playing with him. Wow!

So, continue to raise your children as you wish. As for me and my house, I have no problem with anyone that I trust my children to be with to spank their behinds, including teachers and principals. If I can’t trust that person to discipline my children fairly, then my children will not be left in their presence. I’d rather my children get a whipping with a paddle now than a police officer’s billy club later.

Perdue, I’ll trade my card for a paddle and the right to use it whenever necessary.

By Just Wondering

August 1, 2006 01:53 PM | Link to this

Velatra - Preach!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 02:04 PM | Link to this

Sorry for the double post.

jim d., you are so funny. LOL. I guess that’s why there’s more “padding” on the fanny.

I forgot to add that when I was younger, I never saw teenage criminals on the 6:00 news, unlike today (I’m in my early to mid 30’s). What I’ve learned is that a lot of these kids come from families where the motto is, “If you touch my kid, there’s going to be trouble.” Then, these same parents stand in front of the judge with their sob stories about how their little darlings were good children. Yeah, right.

During the time when corporal punishment was still used, I NEVER knew of an incident where a child was paddled too hard. And, yes, I do think it should be a last resort after other “interventions” have been tried. I even think that parents should have the right to come to school to paddle their children if they don’t want others to do it.

By holdingajc"accountable"

August 1, 2006 02:09 PM | Link to this

SNY, It’s not about student who act up “once in a while”. It’s for students who act up EVERY day. Who throw chairs, and kick holes in the wall. Students who PHYSICALLY ASSAULT MULITIPLE TEACHERS, and the administrators who literrally blame the teacher for making the child mad!

Yes this really, REALLY happens and MUCH more than is reported. Address that, and then and only then will you see a LEGITIMATE rise in test scores.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 02:22 PM | Link to this

SNY,

You never would have survived school in the 60’s with that attitude.

By Lisa B.

August 1, 2006 02:55 PM | Link to this

Teacher’s have no authority to discipline students, must supply school supplies for those who don’t bother to bring them, keep students awake, and are totally responsible for student achievement. We are fussed at if absenteeism is too high, or if too few students pass the tests. Our jobs are on the line if the kids fail, no matter how little the children or their families value education. I strongly believe I shouldn’t be resposible for providing school supplies for my students, but see no alternative. I will spend the entire $100 on pencils, notebook paper, and the required markers and sticky notes.

By Just Wondering

August 1, 2006 02:57 PM | Link to this

jim d - SNY is barely surviving in the 00’s with her attitude!!!

By Lisa B.

August 1, 2006 03:03 PM | Link to this

SNY,

The parents of students who assault teachers and other children don’t want their kids paddled either. They also threaten to “Kill” any teacher or administrator who touches their children.

Sigh.

If a parent ever threatens to kill me, I will file charges of terroristic threats.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 03:12 PM | Link to this

Lisa,

I just can’t help myself, gotta ask this question.

No discipline power, must buy supplies, are responsible for test scores and anything else that could go wrong.

Sounds like you are responsible for everything. Why complicate it by throwing students and parents into the mix?

By catlady

August 1, 2006 03:13 PM | Link to this

jim d—re: teachers not speaking up for themselves

We (elementary school) have been told we will lengthen our school day by 15 minutes to add more math time. This works out to more than an extra week of teaching a year (at no additional pay). Those of us under the thumb of Reading First put in 80 extra hours of work a year, unpaid but required. There is also talk that we will have to give up a lunchtime regularly (teachers are supposed to have duty free lunch, thanks to the state) to supervise the lunchroom. Add in the other duty, such as before school supervision, breakfast supervision, and bus supervision, and our system gets its money’s worth from us! Oh, and we are encouraged to come in the week before preplanning starts (unpaid) because we have so many hours of required meetings, inservice “education”, and other functions to attend that there is no way we can get our rooms and plans ready to start in only 5 days! I was told last year that we (elementary teachers) are not guaranteed ANY planning time during the day. And we trod meekly on, afraid to be accused of not being willing to go the extra mile “for the child.” More and more responsibilites are piled on the top, but nothing comes off the bottom!!

So, why do we do it? The jolt of joy when we see a light come on behind a child’s eyes. The love notes we get left on the desk when the class exits. The student who comes up to us, years later, and recounts something that happened in our room that was important to his life. Former students who become teachers and tell us we are one of the reasons why. I could go on and on. That’s why this is year 33 for me.

One day in faculty meeting (during our planning time) I made a list of the items we are expected to do, in addition to instruction, evaluation, and planning, and I ran out of notebook paper (I wasn’t prepared!) after 3 sheets.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 03:14 PM | Link to this

Lisa B., right on! (I’ve been watching too much “Good Times”.)

I use to tell my students that if they hit me, I would hit them back. I no longer tell them that since I’m a little smarter now. I tell that if they hit me, I am going to sue their parents. Hitting the pocketbook is the best retaliation. Somehow, the threat (actually, the promise) of taking their Christmas money and leisure activity money because of stupidity is enough to make them think twice about it. Y’all pray for me that somebody’s child won’t take his/her “job” of “testing the limits” seriously.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 03:24 PM | Link to this

Catlady,

I did just what you talked about today. I found my 5th grade teacher’s e-mail address via her school’s website and wrote her, thanking her for being a wonderful teacher and the impact she had on my life. I have not seen this lady in over 20 years, but I could recount some special memories that I have of her and her classroom.

Initially, I did not seek to become a teacher, but I do try to emulate some her character and teaching tools that she used. Thanks, Mrs. M.!

By catlady

August 1, 2006 03:42 PM | Link to this

Vel, you did a very good thing today in writing your former teacher. She will treasure it! As a teacher, I pull mine out from time to time when I am having a particularly bad day.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 03:51 PM | Link to this

To Catlady: To help combat the violations of state law you describe (such as taking away duty free lunch) I strongly suggest you check out the Metro Association of Classroom Educators (MACE).

I know the editorial board of this paper absolutely skewers them (if they would but look at themselves with the same eye they look at Dr. Trotter, and ask themselves why they have been COMPLETELY silent on the discipline issue). Say what the editors will say, but MACE like no other organization WILL fight for teachers’ rights, and they seem to be the ONLY organization that understands that good teaching conditions go hand in hand with good learning conditions.

I’ll bet a penny that from what you describe your school has issues with low morale and high turnover. Does anyone ever consider how THAT impact these children we all so claim to care about?

MACE…at least give it a look.

PS to Patti: I said “the editorial board” to exclude you because you HAVE given teachers a forum to discuss discipline. My beef with the editors is that they haven’t written a SINGLE editoral in ten years about improving support for discipline. (Kinda like talking football mascots and not mentioning “UGA,” to break it down for folks not familiar with education issues…)

By SNY

August 1, 2006 03:56 PM | Link to this

Vel,

Don’t get it twisted, I do spank my daughter when it is warranted. But that is MY right as her mother. It is not the schools right, period. I do not share the same philosophy that if I leave my child in the schools hands, then I trust them enough to paddle my child. I do trust them enough to discipline, but I don’t know how hard another person hits, nor do I know how angry they are when they hit. There are too many variables and things that could go wrong.

By Ann

August 1, 2006 04:05 PM | Link to this

For luvs2teach: Just read your 10:57 post,”Teachers don’t mind being accountable, but we do mind being accountable for things we can’t control.” I may print and frame your quote.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 04:09 PM | Link to this

Do you teachers even understand what the hell a right to work state is?

I really don’t think so. What it amounts to is that you can’t be forced to join a union in order to keep your jobs. It does not mean you can’t form one to negotiate labor contracts.

Y’all stay stuck in the rut you find yourselves simply due to a lack of back bone.

By jim d

August 1, 2006 04:27 PM | Link to this

OK, Ok, I’ll chill. I just truly have a problem comprehending how a single group of people that are all college grads. can be so niave when it comes to understanding their own rights and so reluctant to stand against an anarchist employer.

By Leia

August 1, 2006 04:53 PM | Link to this

jim d - Why don’t you have this rant with all the teachers you claim to have in your family? Are they also naive and without a backbone?

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 05:06 PM | Link to this

Re: Y’all stay stuck in the rut you find yourselves simply due to a lack of back bone.

Jim D is completely totally 100 percent right (and no, I don’t have ANY idea who Jim D is…)

Teachers…don’t take it personally; ask yourselves if what he is saying about teachers as a “collective whole” is true.

It most emphatically is. I have seen teachers “adopt” what they say are COMPLETELY asinine ideas that required the faculty’s vote to implement…and they went lock step along even with an ANONYMOUS ballot!!!

I’ve seen time and time again, where I brought up a point and then AFTER the meeting a bunch of teachers said “good point” but not DURING the meeting when it could have had some impact.

Teachers make sheep look like William Wallace’s soldiers in Braveheart. And until that stops, teachers will continue to be treated as second class citizens.

Jim D is right…HEAR what he is saying, BEFORE you get offended.

I would encourage all teachers to stand in front of the mirror and say “No Acccountablity Without Authority” as a beginning to straighten out that backbone…

By hs sped

August 1, 2006 05:16 PM | Link to this

How do we start a union? Do we join an existing union? I believe each state has its own union, but is there a nation-wide union? What would they, or could they, do for us? I understand how unions work in other states and I have to say that I’ve heard conflicting stories…bad stories from Florida but excellent stories from Maryland (makes me think about moving there).

By Kage

August 1, 2006 05:23 PM | Link to this

I agree that discipline is out of control, but I don’t see paddling as the answer. It is not, in my opinion, within the school’s authority. But, something’s got to be done. We have a new principal who promises that we will see some back up for disciplinary issues. My hope is that this year, if a first grader tells his teacher to F off (without abbreviating it as I did), that when he’s sent to the office he doesn’t get a piece of candy so that he can think about sweet things to say! (True story)I don’t know what to do about parents who refuse to believe that their child does anything wrong. Maybe our new principal will be able to talk to the parent who told her third grader ‘don’t let those honkies get you down.’ Our former principal’s attitude was ‘I’m not risking my house for one of these problems’. The first thing most repeat offenders yell at us is, ‘I’m gonna tell my mama to sue y’all!’ I don’t think I knew about lawsuits when I was first grade.

I think it will take two things to see a change. One, legislation that protects educators from ridiculous lawsuits. Two, the parents of non-trouble making kids stepping up and complaining loudly about the impact that lack of discipline has on their child’s education. Maybe it’s those parents who need to start suing.

Maybe I’m just in a foul mood because I just left a meeting in which we got reamed for our CRCT scores. Ugggh.

As far as the gift cards go, is my district the only one that cut teacher supply $ by $100 in anticipation of us receiving the card? Before we left in May we were told we’d have $150 to buy supplies for the year - $100 less than last year, $150 less than the previous year, etc. etc.

By catlady

August 1, 2006 05:37 PM | Link to this

Will we have to claim tht $100 on our income tax??!!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 05:38 PM | Link to this

I don’t have anything “twisted”, SNY. My comments were pretty “straight”-forward (pun intended). I did not think that your comments meant that you do not whip your child. If you read a later post, I said that I’ve never known a child to get a paddling severe enough to harm a child. What is harming children today is the attitude that “nobody better touch my child”, and, unfortunately, that attitude has run over into “watch how you talk to my child, even if he/she just cussed you out or hit you”.

Again, I say that we’ll just have to agree to disagree. My own son is one of those who doesn’t believe fat meat is greasy until he gets his behind whipped (which, by the way, I’ve done AT our school the couple of times he got crazy enough to be sent to the AP’s office). He, like some other children, have to receive immediate, sometimes painful, consequences. Praise God, that it is not too often, though.

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 05:45 PM | Link to this

Catlady,

Something tells me we’ll have to. Bummer!

By jim d

August 1, 2006 05:46 PM | Link to this

Leia,

They live in other states and I have spoken to them.

I’m in no way attempting to start anything with anyone on this blog intentionally.

I just really don’t understand how anyone would stay with a job where they aren’t treated by management with respect. Teachers are subjected to all kinds of atrocities in the classroom and they tolerate it in the boardroom.

WHY in heavens name would they do this? And please don’t feed me the standard line about job satisfaction. We both now that one all too well. Y’all complain too much to be satisfied. .

By jim d

August 1, 2006 05:51 PM | Link to this

Sped,

time to do your homework. Here’s a couple of links and I’m sure you could find more.

https://www.nea.org/JoinNea/

http://www.aft.org/

By edwatcher

August 1, 2006 05:59 PM | Link to this

Sped, If we had a union, we would have collective bargaining, which would ensure things like a duty-fre lunch, planning time, work hours, etc. Furthermore, we would sign a contract KNOWING what we will earn, rather than signing before the state and local school boards have decided what we will be paid. I have taught in NY and CT, and frankly the teacher working conditions in this state are appalling to me. I am only here because of my husband’s (much higher paying) job. As for how to start a union, I have no idea. I guess you could start by talking to representatives from one of the educator’s ASSOCIATIONS like GAE. I do know that in the campaign for the Cobb school board seats, the candidates have been asked whether they support collective bargaining (Several said yes, and then changed their minds). I really don’t think most people understand it. jim d, thatnks for your explanation of GA’s right to work rule. Got any ideas as to how to get a real teacher’s organization or union in this state?

By edwatcher

August 1, 2006 06:02 PM | Link to this

jim d -

just saw your msg and links

you answered my question, too. thanks

By Lisa B.

August 1, 2006 06:39 PM | Link to this

Jim D.,

You are right. We do complain a lot! I think the reason most of us are still teaching after all these years is that we do focus on the 22 who passed the CRCT, rather than the four who didn’t, and the 20 or so who come prepared, rather the six students who seem never to have supplies, or who tear up what they do bring. We talk much more about the five or six students who misbehave, and who don’t care, but it’s the 20 students who do try and who do care who keep us in the classroom. We don’t spend much time on this blog talking about the successes and the good kids, because we have no problems there. We look for solutions to the problems caused by the four, five or six children who give us all such grief. All of us who teach would love to help those succeed as well, but instead are treated rudely by those students, fussed at by their parents, and then fussed at by our administrators. It can be frustrating.

By yetanotherteacher

August 1, 2006 06:54 PM | Link to this

Unions: most teachers at my school join primarily for the legal representation benefits. I’m a huge supporter of unions, but the two main ones here in GA are so ineffectual that I don’t get any real benefit out of them beyond the “insurance policy”.

Gift cards: As a diehard “flaming liberal”, the cards certainly won’t influence my November vote. I’m just looking at them as a pleasant little bonus to add to what I already would’ve spent. I’m changing grade levels this year, so I’ll be buying actual classroom supplies to help me with 8th grade Reading. The exemptions list is really frustrating, though — teachers can use the cards for markers and filler paper, yet we can’t purchase workbooks or curriculum-based materials to help students reinforce what we’ve taught them? THAT is what I spend most of my money on; I can get basic office supplies from my school, but they won’t buy me those great, innovative workbooks full of genuinely enriching sheets for my students to use for homework… and those things are expensive!

Student “gimmes”: I teach in a low-income school in metro Atlanta, and many of my students come to class without necessary supplies. I’m not fond of doling out freebies, so I use my stash of pens and paper as rewards. Kids can “buy” materials by earning points for high grades or good behavior. Ethically, I don’t like reinforcing behaviors that they should already know, but this does make a difference to many at-risk kids.

I really disliked the tone of the article linked in the original post; many of the teachers quoted came across as whiny and greedy. Sure, teachers are great at complaining. ;) Yet I suspect most of my colleagues are grateful just to have that additional $100 boost on top of what we already spend. Every little bit helps.

By Leia

August 1, 2006 06:59 PM | Link to this

People - we don’t have teacher unions in Georgia! We have teacher “organizations” which are quite different. PAGE and GAE are two such organizations.

By Lisa B.

August 1, 2006 07:01 PM | Link to this

Yet, That’s a good idea to hand out supplies for incentives and rewards. As you say, we end up giving away pencils and paper anyway. I will try that with my 4th graders. I’ve always given pencils, etc. for birthdays and Christmas, but perhaps children will take better care of things received if the items are “earned”, rather than “free.” I really do have to be careful about giving things away, because my school provides NO student supplies or suppy money for teachers, and 25 children can quickly consume amazing quantities of paper and pencils!!

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 07:05 PM | Link to this

To those such as Lisa B., Catlady and others who are concerned about discipline and the way teachers are treated. Here’s a link that offers REAL hope: www.theteachersadvocate.com.

Check it out and post back what you think: With all due respect GAE and PAGE do NOTHING in terms of discipline because they have teachers AND administrators as members.

If your principal won’t support you, how on earth are GAE and PAGE going to support you when your principal is a member?

MACE is “teachers only” and WILL support you. (I’m NOT a paid endorser, just a “true believer” in that teachers need to be respected and that “good learning conditions CANNOT take place without good teaching conditions”)

Would love to hear from anyone who checked out the site…

By catlady

August 1, 2006 07:42 PM | Link to this

Kage—our system did not cut our yearly supply money because of the governor’s card. Guess they didn’t think of it :-) Naw, really, they are not that bad.

Holding—I have a concern about what appears to be a strident voice coming out of MACE. Of course, that is probably what we need, instead of all the hand-patting we seem to get from the other 2 associations. I had thought at one time PAGE was going to be a little more active in assisting teachers, but maybe it is as you say, they’ve been co-opted by their “mixed” membership. It shouldn’t be an us vs. them thing.

The thing I remind myself of is that pretty much all of us want to educate the children. A lot of education folks at different levels want to do it and keep everyone else off their back, but we have such different paths to that goal. Principals want achievement and no problems, as do teachers and administrators. It’s just that ownership of the solutions to the problems seem to be mixed up—lack of power by those most directly affected, such as teachers and the parents and students who want to achieve. Teachers seem to be at the bottom of the food chain.

I had this great t-shirt by Gary Larsen that showed a flock of sheep, and this one sheep standing up on its back legs and yelling, “Hey, we don’t have to be JUST SHEEP!” I sure wish I still had it. While it spoke to me 15 years ago, it speaks to me even more clearly now.

By catlady

August 1, 2006 07:55 PM | Link to this

OOps! Blood sugar must be low or something. The t-shirt was from the Far Side guy and not a choreographer.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 1, 2006 07:59 PM | Link to this

Catlady: I have heard the same concerns about MACE’s “strident voice”. But I really do believe it’s what we need now.

When I think of their overall good intentions in restoring discipline back to the schools and empowering teachers, I have to say I’d rather their “strident voice” than a spineless one.

You can always join MACE and keep it confidential…they don’t (unlike the other major players) disclose your membership info. You don’t have to use your “mace” but I’d rather have a “MACE” to protect me than a GAE or PAGE “position paper”…

PS It funny I’m such a “true believer” as I am pretty much a person who seeks to find common ground with others in day-to-day life. But we have to do SOMETHING about discipline. I’m tired of seeing former students ending up in jail, because they spent their formative years getting away with bloody murder at school, and thought that’s the way the world works…

That’s all for me today…remember “No Accountability Without Authority” :)

By Lee

August 1, 2006 08:20 PM | Link to this

So many topics here…..

• $100 gift card. Probably wont make a dent in the money that most teachers spend out of pocket. Nice gesture though….

• School supplies and socialism. I don’t mind chipping in a few extra supplies or dollars if the teacher asks for it specifically for a “community supply.” I do have a problem if the teacher takes away my child’s supplies that I bought specifically for her to use and distributes it to the “less fortunate.”

• For those parents who say they can’t afford the $20 or so for supplies - if you’re that poor, what the he11 are you doing reproducing anyway?

• Paddling. I think it effective for elementary age students. I remember in high school it was a show of manhood to get a paddling and act like it didn’t hurt.

• Paddling 2. Two teachers you never wanted to get a paddling from - the football coach (for obvious reasons) and the shop teacher. The shop teacher always had the most wicked looking paddles….

• Paddling 3. I always heard one of the reasons they did away with corporal punishment is that a student was paralized when he was struck in the lower back on the spine. (Maybe an urban legend, maybe not…)

• Paddling 4. My daughter’s former middle school principal - no way I would let that moron paddle my daughter. If the lying sob told me it was raining, I would go look outside. My only hope is that the school doesn’t make AYP one more year and the state fires his butt.

By Lisa B.

August 1, 2006 08:23 PM | Link to this

I am definitely putting a “No Accountability Without Authority” bumpersticker on my car, right above my “Educator” license plate :-)

By the way, Holding, I checked out the MACE website. Interesting. Thanks!

By OldSchool

August 1, 2006 08:49 PM | Link to this

As I begin my 33rd year of instructing students in our high school, I want to say thank you in advance for all the parents who will be a positive influence on their students; to all the other teachers who will continue to do what they love and sometimes reach the unreachable; to the students who will come in on that first day full of anticipation and excitement and who will learn because of and in spite of the adults in their lives. Thank you, Governor Perdue, for the gift card that will indeed buy additional supplies. Thank you bloggers, for your interest and passion for making education better for all our kids.

And a personal thank you to the mom who stopped me today in the hall to tell me how excited she and her freshman son are that he got my class this term and that I was not retiring. It made my day!

By Velatra

August 1, 2006 08:51 PM | Link to this

Gosh, Lee. I agree that paddling is most effective for elementary students. However, I can’t seriously imagine paddling a high school student. Shoot, some of those jokers—girls and boys alike—look like they could be offensive linemen for the Falcons. My ideal form of discipline for high schoolers, especially seniors, would be to deny them admission to the prom and maybe even graduation. Just mail their diplomas (or 12-year certificates of attendance) to them. That’s how it was at my middle Georgia high school, and maybe that’s why there were very, very few fights during the school year.

By jim d

August 2, 2006 08:06 AM | Link to this

Leia,

Unfortunately most of the teachers in Ga. have been brainwashed by their employers.

I suspect that now you will need to explain the differences between “teacher organizations” and a real “teachers union”.

By SNY

August 2, 2006 09:04 AM | Link to this

Okay, I was talking to a mom on my cheerleading squad last night and she is a teacher. After talking to her, I realized, because I could see her facial expressions, how totally stuck teachers are feeling. I felt so sorry for her. She loves what she does and she teaches kindergarten. But she told me that kindergarten children come to school unprepared and that they have no respect already. She said that for some of the children, school is their first run in with discipline. Is it this bad even in elementary school?

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 09:36 AM | Link to this

SNY—Yes.

By SNY

August 2, 2006 09:58 AM | Link to this

Vel,

Then for all of the parents out there who don’t do everything possible to make their children listen and follow the rules, I’m sorry! I know hearing it from one parent that you don’t even know (and most of the time, do not agree with) doesn’t help but it is the best that I can do.

By catlady

August 2, 2006 10:11 AM | Link to this

SNY—actually, it is worse than that.

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 10:24 AM | Link to this

Thanks, SNY. I appreciate it more than you think because I think that you’re beginning to understand the plight of teachers a little more. Perhaps you now understand why I endorse paddling in elementary school, even if you still disagree. “Time outs” just aren’t cuttin’ it. I praise God for Mrs. J. and her son, my nursery and kindergarten teachers, who used a leather strap as discipline (I got only one spanking during my matriculation and that was for laughing at someone else who got a spanking). Most of the “graduates” from their school were super advanced in first grade; I was basically my 1st grade teacher’s “aide” because she kept running out of stuff for me to do. Thanks, Mrs. J. and Mr. F (R.I.P.) for your teaching and leather straps!

By the way, in your own words, don’t get it twisted. :-) It’s only SOME of the time when I disagree with you.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 2, 2006 10:29 AM | Link to this

SNY: Here are some quotes to illustrate how bad it is: “I’m going to put a bullet in your mother f—king head”. “My uncle’s gotta Glock and I’m coming back with it to blow you away”. “I know where my dad keeps his gun in the closet”.

The common thread? ALL were reported. NONE were punished. It IS that bad.

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 10:44 AM | Link to this

Holding, I’ll add one to your list. A student told other students that he wish he could kick a pregnant teacher (he referred to her as a female dog) in her stomach and kill her baby. Because he did not make the threat directly to the teacher, he got only 2 days of ISS.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 2, 2006 10:53 AM | Link to this

Velatra: We have PLENTY of evidence, yet the AJC editorial board has yet to write the FIRST editorial advocating increased support for teachers in matters of discipline. NOT ONE! (If I’m wrong Patti, please let us know…I have written the editors myself on this issue, yet still seen ZERO response, editorially speaking.)

By SET

August 2, 2006 10:55 AM | Link to this

Doesn’t the crowd think it’s interesting that the teachers here can’t even discuss gift cards without bringing up paddling students?

And exactly which students does everybody think needs paddling the most? Ken and Barbie or the out-of-control ghetto kids? (This is a public school discussion after all.)

The utter refusal of the government schools to impose discipline on the ghetto kids is why such a huge percentage of those kids end up dead or institutionalized. Paddling kids sounds like a lot of trouble to me but so does suturing lacerations. If the kids need paddling to keep them from death and prison - shouldn’t we provide?

And don’t bother demanding the parents do their jobs. If they had parents we wouldn’t be talking about this. The screwed up undisciplined kids have sperm donors and birth mothers. The public schools long ago withdrew in loco parentis services. It’s time to bring them back.

Because if we don’t, these mortality number will continue to climb. I’d like our public schools to once again be a route to upward mobility not just downward.

Brave New World.

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 11:16 AM | Link to this

SET,

Since I’m the one who made a casual remark about paddling, let me be the one to tell you that once again, I’m tired of your clueless remarks. Dear, while I didn’t mean for my preference of a paddle over a gift card to get this far, I will say that it’s not just the “ghetto” kids who need a good behind whipping. For your information, I teach at a school IN a surburban area. There are NO “ghettos” around here. Perhaps there may be “ghetto” attitudes, but there are many undisciplined children from affluent households.

As I have asked you on another post, when was the last time you volunteered to become a mentor to some “ghetto” kids? I see that you failed to answer that question, but you can always find time to spew your self-loathing rhetoric. I always try to live by one of my personal mottos: If I can’t give or be a solution, then I won’t talk about the problem.

Unlike you, I take the time to be a mentor in my school to many kids who seem to get into trouble. I don’t coddle them, and I “keep it real” with them. In fact, I can get them to behave better (at least temporarily) than their homeroom teachers. Why? Because I love them and most of the time, all these kids want is to know that at least one person loves them in this world.

Then again, I shouldn’t expect any different from you. All I will say is that I get my love from the greatest Source of love. You should know what I’m talking about.

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 11:31 AM | Link to this

Oh, I forgot to answer your question:

I think any child who deserves a paddling should get one. That goes for Ken, Barbie, Christie, Shaniqua, Shaquan, Pepe, Lupe, Sitting Bull, Pocahantas, Jung, Yun Sun, and whoever else.

By SNY

August 2, 2006 12:09 PM | Link to this

Holding & Vel,

Come on, are we talking about the babies in elementary school? There has to be some way to reach these children. See, I live in my own little world in the suburbs and I have my children protected in private schools and private daycares, so I must seem really out of touch to most of you. But, part of me does that on purpose. What if I allow my children to see these things and they loose their minds and try to immulate what they see. Then I would have teachers calling DFACS on me for trying to snatch my children up.

Vel, I have a question for you. You say that you are all for paddling in school, what if you had a parent tell you “If my child acts up, I am ASAHM. All you have to do is call me and I’ll be there in 5 minutes.” Would you call that parent, knowing that the parent would take the child out of class and off campus to spank that child? The reason I ask is because a teacher that I know said that if any school personnel believes that a child is in danger from their parent that they must call the police or DFACS. It’s like, you (the school sytem)want me to discipline my child as long as I don’t correct them on the spot in school. I would think that, especially in the cases of the younger children, immediate discipline is exactly what they need.

By OldSchool

August 2, 2006 12:18 PM | Link to this

You know, if this blog topic had been a standardized test, there would be precious few of us who would even come close to passing. Can we save the paddling discussion for another time?

The topic was: “Teachers, have you picked up your card? What are you going to buy? Someone says their school ran out of gift cards. Anybody else have this experience?”

Since even I drifted off topic, I am proclaiming a “do-over” for myself.

By SET

August 2, 2006 12:27 PM | Link to this

Hi Velatra! Love the comments!!

I work with the ghetto. I have since I was 12. I’ve had a variety of jobs before and after college and grad school. Most of them have been dealing with black urban dwellers in medical, retail credit, and legal settings. Most of my family going back 4 generations have been teachers, social workers, physicians and lawyers. It’s only the generation after mine that has moved into the carriage trade. Maybe I haven’t made this clear.

Yes I have experience with all races. But as you may have noticed, urban blacks have the most pathology around here. The other groups are by and large doing quite well. This isn’t GA.

This week I had a 30 year old black male get 14 years for stealing DVDs and that was a gift. He was facing 25 to life and was up against a trial date on what would have been a half day trial. If you’d seen his rap sheet you’d have given him 25 to life yourself. (Remember, nowadays you don’t get a prison term for what you’ve been caught doing this week, but for your entire rap sheet - it’s called the strike system.) I would have given him 25 to life if it were my call.

And next week I have a another speaking engagement for a local inpatient co-ed rehab program. Believe me, I get around.

When I rant about how the public schools need to change it’s from the prospective of having been a public high school student in this state and one who sees largely black young people going to prison for long long terms every week. And don’t even start on the rest of the family and their war stories. Have you seen what’s going on in the emergency rooms around this state?

Yes, it’s not Ken and Barbie winding up in prison and in early graves. At least not in CA.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 2, 2006 12:49 PM | Link to this

In regard to “off topic”. What does discipline have to do with a gift card? Nothing. And what does a gift card have to do with fixing the educational woes of this state? NOTHING!

Yes, the blog went off topic…and? It’s the nature of the beast.

To SNY and “there must be something we can do”. Yes…it’s called “consistant consequences” and that means if a teacher enforces a consequence, the child must accept it, without exception, without fail. When children realize “they can’t get away with it” it STOPS.

But children realize a trip to the office can mean some SNACK FOOD and some coddling…and then a return trip to the classroom with ZERO consequences. And this after ASSAULT of a teacher!

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 12:51 PM | Link to this

SNY—Yes, I would and have called parents who do that. Believe me, I know the difference between discipline and abuse. I’ve seen both.

SET—Again, for the last time, WHEN HAVE YOU MENTORED ANY “GHETTO” STUDENTS? You may “work” in the environment, but do absolutely nothing to help it. Save your patronization for someone else.

OldSchool—As a person who has successfully passed many standardized tests (by the grace of God), I look at these “extensions” of the topic. If we stayed on topic, the blogs would be much shorter and more boring. (LOL) Actually, I’ve learned more from some of the “off-topic” responses.

By SNY

August 2, 2006 01:24 PM | Link to this

Vel,

Well, I think that you may be the first public school teacher that I would actually trust with my child. If you could promise me that you would be consistent and call me for back up if you needed it, everytime, you would be my first choice for a public school teacher.

My daughter isn’t a constant problem at all. She will, however, test you if you don’t stop her the very 1st time around. If you let her think that she is cute, and the boss, you have lost the battle with her. I’m working to change that, but it can’t be done overnight.

By Lisa B.

August 2, 2006 01:28 PM | Link to this

Patti,

It sounds like school discipline needs to be addressed in another blog. We’ve had some interesting comments about discipline from both teachers and parents. What consequences do parents and students think students should face for misbehavior? I saw a news clip this morning about five girls in Kentucky who are suing the school because they were continually bullied, and hit. According to the clips, the bullies were suspended several times, but the abuse continued. How can bullying and assaults be stopped?

By SNY

August 2, 2006 01:34 PM | Link to this

Lisa B.

Good topic!

By Velatra

August 2, 2006 01:45 PM | Link to this

SNY—Thank you. About 98% of all of my seven years of students’ parents really liked me and my no-nonsense, but loving, approach to education. I still get phone calls from former students and their parents; so, I must be doing something right. Praise God!

Lisa B.—I agree. Those are excellent blog topics. I can tell you mine now. Question 1: Whip their behinds. (wink, wink, SNY ;-)) LOL Question 2: Get the police involved and press charges against those bullies if they continue after the third offense.

By SET

August 2, 2006 01:50 PM | Link to this

Velatra:

You’ve got what I’m giving for the moment, too busy for now. I enjoy reading your posts…

Too bad if you think you have been patronized. You have no idea.

This is a blog about gift cards. I hope to exchange points of view again. You have your experiences and I love reading about them.

By SNY

August 2, 2006 01:56 PM | Link to this

Vel,

I agree with your second question, but I do think that they should get 3 chances to act an a*s. The police should be involved from the 1st incident. I’m sick of these children getting the 3 strikes and you’re out. This is not baseball, it’s life.

By holdingAJC"accountable"

August 2, 2006 01:57 PM | Link to this

Without discipline, EVERY other aspect of “reform” can be dismissed with one simple question: Other than that, how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?

The answer (IMHO): As John Rosemond would say, COMPELLING consequences. Applied 100 percent of the time, without exception without fail.

This doesn’t have to be harsh. Far from it. Children cross over the line, you put them back in their place with a consequence. It’s not severity, but how consistent you are. Let an administrator not back a teacher ONE TIME, that child will be empowered to try it again the next twenty.

It’s NOT rocket science. It’s a matter of will…yet the AJC (edtorial board to be specfic) will batter organizations like MACE and give a free pass to GAE and PAGE when they consistently have failed teachers on the issue.

And teachers, Jim D is right about spinelessness. TEACHERS have made the two organizations who WILL not and CAN not address discipline (because they have administrators as members that they have to protect) the two largest in the state. If teachers need to be held “accountable” for anything, it’s that they haven’t advocated as a collective whole strongly enough for the good teaching conditions that lead to good learning conditions…IMHO

PS No, I’m NOT a MACE employee…and yes, they have been much more Hosea Williams than Andy Young in approach. But we have teachers being PHYSICALLY ASSAULTED, and the students who do such literally get ZERO consequences. How can you be “nice” about that?

By SNY

August 2, 2006 02:46 PM | Link to this

Okay, I know that I use words like “Kill” if a teacher put their hands on my child, but I don’t literally mean “Kill”. With my newy acquired knowledge of the threats and assaults that go on in schools these days, I will no longer use that word. I’m starting to see that you guys face this as a real threat everyday.

By Gwinnett Teacher

August 2, 2006 03:09 PM | Link to this

SNY - I’m glad you’ve reconsidered your choice of wording! Seriously, if you made the statement that you would “kill” a teacher in front of a teacher or an administrator at my school - you would be arrested and charged with making terroristic threats. I’m totally serious - it has already been done. A parent made a similar statement, and was arrested. He hired a very expensive attorney and subsequently lost his case. His child had been panelled out of the school, and the family could not afford private school (the attorney was apparently very well paid) and they had to move to another school district for Jr. to attend school after his expulsion was served.

Be very careful about what you say and to whom you say it!

By SNY

August 2, 2006 03:28 PM | Link to this

I still won’t condone someone putting their hands on my child, but I use the word “beat” when I speak of spanking my children. Of course I don’t “beat” my child, but I do spank as a last resort. I guess to me, it is just a word. It never dawned on me that teachers were in a double war zone. One against the students and another against the principal.

BTW, is should have said my “newly” acquired. Sorry, forgot the “l”.

By SET

August 2, 2006 05:13 PM | Link to this

SNY:

People don’t need your condoning to put hands on your child. All they need is your child to cross an invisible line. Do you teach your child what to expect when he/she crosses that line?

Chris Rock did a video that is widely available on the Internet called “How Not to get your A** Kicked by the Police” or some such title. (Involving black males) I highly recommend it. Dave Chappelle has a skit about “Keeping It Real” that involved a female.

The point is that when these kids (or adults acting like kids) say and do certain things - they will get beat down on the spot - or worse (and if Mommy gets in the way - her too) and it’s much better if they are taught this early and often.

By luvs2teach

August 2, 2006 06:42 PM | Link to this

To “Holding…” - I checked out MACE’s site a few days ago, before this blog. I really like the part about parent responsiblity and student discipline. I truly believe it’s a message whose time has come - and not just for teachers!

As a parent, I worry about this type of behavior in my child’s school - the class disruptions, the time it takes away from instruction, etc. Administrators and school boards need to stop worrying about the one idiot with the problem child threatening to sue, and start worrying about the other 29 parents pulling their kids (and their support) out of the public schools.

Did anyone see that the judge threw out the Roswell girl’s case (she wrote about killing her teacher in a journal). We need more judges taking similar stands, and throwing these lawsuits out.

The weird thing is, I have been traditionally anti-union, prior to my being a teacher. But the longer I do this job, the more I think it might be necessary. It’s funny, because to me, professionals shouldn’t need a union - that always seemed like a blue-collar concept. But, in states that have strong teacher unions, teachers ARE treated like professionals.

Weird world.

By catlady

August 3, 2006 02:49 PM | Link to this

Thursday afternoon—anyone go out to use their “gift” cards today? What a madhouse!!! My daughter says the line at School Box Gwinnett was 200 persons long! At Town Center, I only waited in line 32 minutes!

By Mrs. B

August 4, 2006 08:46 AM | Link to this

Why didn’t speech langauge pathologist recieve the gift cards? We buy just as many supplies as teachers do, and we dont have parents that send in “classroom supplies”? Our contract says that we are teachers, so why did we recieve what the teachers got?

By SLP

August 4, 2006 08:49 AM | Link to this

Why weren’t speech pathologists given teacher gift cards? We spend just as much as teachers on materials, markers, pencils, tissues, paper etc as teachers do. We also do not have parents that send in “classroom supplies” for us or other students to use. Our contract states that we are teachers, we are paid on a teacher salary scale, yet we are excluded from the “teacher” gift cards.

By SLP

August 4, 2006 08:50 AM | Link to this

Why weren’t speech pathologists given teacher gift cards? We spend just as much as teachers on materials, markers, pencils, tissues, paper etc as teachers do. We also do not have parents that send in “classroom supplies” for us or other students to use. Our contract states that we are teachers, we are paid on a teacher salary scale, yet we are excluded from the “teacher” gift cards.

By catlady

August 4, 2006 10:10 AM | Link to this

I wish we could call them school supply cards instead of teacher gift cards. I don’t think I was GIVEN anything. My class was given additional, state-paid supplies. I did not get any gift.