Get Schooled

By Karen Armsby

June 7, 2006 04:50 PM | Link to this

IMHO I think it’s OK for seniors with good grades to skip finals, especialy for those in AP classes who already took the end of year national AP exam earlier in May.

By posterchild

June 7, 2006 04:52 PM | Link to this

When I was a senior (8 years ago), you could exempt all your 2nd semester exams if you met grade and attendance requirements. You still had to take any AP exams. The rest of the school had a policy where you could exempt 1 final on attendance, or 2 if you had high enough grades. I always took advantage of the policy, because, realistically, if I’ve carried a 98 average throughout the semester, then it’s probably obvious that I know the material. A stitch in time saves nine!

By posterchild

June 7, 2006 05:01 PM | Link to this

When I was a senior (8 years ago), you could exempt all your 2nd semester exams if you met grade and attendance requirements. You still had to take any AP exams. The rest of the school had a policy where you could exempt 1 final on attendance, or 2 if you had high enough grades. I always took advantage of the policy, because, realistically, if I’ve carried a 98 average throughout the semester, then it’s probably obvious that I know the material. A stitch in time saves nine!

By Ernest

June 7, 2006 05:04 PM | Link to this

In fairness, I remember this policy during my last quarter in college many moons ago. It was something all graduating seniors looked forward to. I’m not sure if that is still the case but it is definitely a ‘reward’ and ‘incentive’ for doing well.

By Litmajor

June 7, 2006 05:09 PM | Link to this

I don’t see a problem with it. Way back when I was in high school, we pitied the people who couldn’t exempt finals. There was an attendance requirement as well.

Find me a senior who doesn’t suffer from senioritis and I’ll sell you a bridge. I don’t understand what’s meant by “letting them off too easy.” Obviously the students have put in the hard work, let them enjoy the fruits of their labor.

By Leia

June 7, 2006 05:26 PM | Link to this

I think that it’s great that we can reward the seniors who meet the attendance and grade criteria to exempt finals.

Most of the time, the “good” kids don’t get the perks, so this is a great thing for them.

And, by the way - it is by the discretion of the teacher if we really feel that the student shouldn’t exempt.

By decatuparent

June 7, 2006 05:40 PM | Link to this

Ditto! Fully on board with seniors with good grades and good attendance getting off easy senior year. I agree, high achievers are seldom rewarded these days because it would hurt the “self esteem” of the poor performers. If a kid has an A average and has been to class all year they know the material and one night of cramming won’t reinforce it any more.

By Teacher2

June 7, 2006 06:06 PM | Link to this

Not a problem for me either. We give our seniors the option, in case they want a last-ditch chance to raise their grade. We used to exempt finals for our underclassmen (in no more than 2 subject areas) who had all A’s and no more than 3 absences, but we nixed that idea this year. I have no problem with seniors getting the break, but the others have to earn their final grades.

By SET

June 7, 2006 06:35 PM | Link to this

Well, if the students are not experienced in time pressure testing because they’ve been allowed to avoid it in High School they may be at a disadvantage in College.

This sounds like another example of administrators running schools to keep the students happy and to make things pleasant.

Even your good students will wear better if they are regularly called on to prove themselves - both in doing their scheduled assignments and by time-pressure testing.

Things are rough after high school and they have to be prepared.

And If I’m paying 10-20k a year tuition to a private school I’m not paying all that money to have Sonny made comfortable and be given a good time. I want him stress tested now so I don’t have to worry so much about what will happen when he goes away to college and there’s no chance for me to see trouble coming.

By SET

June 7, 2006 06:37 PM | Link to this

I just can’t see spending money on a stable of racehorses and not racing them. That’s what these kids are to me. Expensive horses that eat a lot and have to be shoveled up after!

By Leia

June 7, 2006 06:54 PM | Link to this

SET - the final exemption form requires a parent/guardian signature on it - you just don’t sign it!

Everybody’s happy!

By jim d

June 8, 2006 09:19 AM | Link to this

Set,

One very well may spend money on a stable of racehorses and not race them. They may raise them for breeding. There’s no real advantage to racing proven winners and risking breaking a leg.

Give these kids a break—they’re proven winners.

By Belle

June 8, 2006 10:27 AM | Link to this

I remember in high school being able to skip exams for the high grades. Did this hold me back in college? No, I still graduated with a 4.0 GPA. Students who work hard all year long deserve a little reward. They give up free time to study and prepare, and I don’t see any problem with not taking an exam.

By SET

June 8, 2006 10:33 AM | Link to this

Jim,

Sorry, I’ve too much experience with people who had it all at High School Graduation who either quickly slacked off or slacked off over the middle to late 20’s.

I’m not voting to abbreviate the time pressure testing of high school kids - especially the ones who might be University material.

Your last phrase illustrates the difference between us: “Give the kids a break”.

I don’t give people breaks.

I used to, I want to, I have really given people breaks.. I remember several cases 20 years ago when I gave (different) people breaks. It feels good to “give” people breaks - to see them happy and to have them like you.

Well I’ve learned the hard way it doesn’t pay for them in the long (3 years) run.

We need the high stakes testing and the stressing of these kids, especially the University bound - to better assist them in learning how to stand on their own and take what will come later. If they are so great then let them take finals and midterms or whatever with everyone else and continue to demonstrate how good they are.

School isn’t the North Pole and I don’t want teachers “giving” away anything.

I think the kids are just safer this way. Discrete weaknesses and problems can be revealed and handled in time this way.

It’s just my experience and point of view, and I’m confident in the knowledge that my educator grandparents and great-grandparents always took the same approach and in their lifetimes took students higher in life (through education and good grad school placement) than the students and their families ever hoped to reach. You have to stay on these kids (even the bright ones) until they have outgrown you and are some other teacher’s charge. Never let them think they have done enough.

By SET

June 8, 2006 10:55 AM | Link to this

Jim & Co:

I’m not saying every teacher and every class should use the same approach as I mentioned. My Grandfather was a Chemistry Professor in a historically black college. His students were pre-med. In the 1940’s through 1960’s he had to get them into and ready to survive in Med Schools. I suppose he could never work them hard enough to feel safe about the competiton and stress they would encounter later.

There were very few black PhDs in Chemistry in the United States. His students were headed to doctorate programs in integrated grad schools as well a Meharry. All his life he worked them like hamsters on a wheel. He died when I was 8. I heard the stories about life with him as a professor from old men who were his students before I was born. They all told me that if he hadn’t worked them so hard (and never been “satisfied” - they might not have made it though what was to come later when they went into grad school.

I heard the same thing about (tyrannical) relatives who taught all-black schools which were later integrated in the mid-20th century. I met them when I was young but they died before I was an adult. These people ran their schools like Joe Clark in the movie “Lean On Me”. Their students were the “firsts” that broke into mainstream professions.

I haven’t even mentioned about my own parents and their attitudes on teacher giving their kids a “break”. They went nuts. They correctly interpeted that as not caring enough about the kid’s future to fight with them.

So it’s just my experiences that makes me do it this way. Maybe I’m too insecure.

But then I pick up the broken pieces of other people’s lives for a living.

I’m angry about what has happened to blacks in public schools because I’ve lived long enough to have seen when (black) people were safe in public schools (if they didn’t get kicked out) and did relatively well afterwards. Every generation did better than the one before. That’s all gone now. But we throw massive amounts of money at them and want them to have “self-esteem” and feel good. Skipping finals and whatever else sounds to me like another feel-good move.

By NJA

June 8, 2006 11:33 AM | Link to this

I think it’s a great idea. These students have proven that they are not slackers. There is nothing wrong with a little incentive for hard work.

When I was in high school it was allowed. I went to an HBCU for undergrad (Howard) and some professors also gave that option. I went to a predominately white university for graduate school and surprise- it was also an option in some courses. One of my graduate school is well known worldwide, he is also a black man. I mentioned all of this to say- what does being black have to do with exempting students from finals. Yes, as a group black students are not doing well. But from what I know there are rules that come along with the exemption- mainly behavioral, academic and attendance must be up to par.

By jim d

June 8, 2006 11:40 AM | Link to this

Set,

No offense meant, but this isn’t a black white issue. Nor is it really about another damn test. This is about rewarding students that take the inniative to do well in the first place. These students will generally do well under any circumstance because they have developed a self discipline that enables them.

And since you’re mad as hell. DO SOMETHING and then HAGD.

By Jeff

June 8, 2006 12:22 PM | Link to this

Jim,

I must say, You’re on fire today dude!! Not often that we agree on something, but isn’t it so much better to play nice every once in a while?

BTW Bloggers,

I’ll be in PCB through Monday, not sure how much I’ll be on today. Have a great weekend!

Jeff

By jim d

June 8, 2006 12:32 PM | Link to this

Jeff, Think a the break helped? :-)

By Jeff

June 8, 2006 12:37 PM | Link to this

I did notice now that you started posting again that you’d been gone for a while. What’s been up?

By jim d

June 8, 2006 12:53 PM | Link to this

Actually had to work for awhile—things are busy.

By Jeff

June 8, 2006 02:03 PM | Link to this

Ah! Yeah… in South GA, things should be much more hectic for me, not sure how much I’ll be on once school starts back. (The plans I’ve already laid/ am toying with are pretty intense. HOPEFULLY they’ll have the desired results. Once I officially right down my strategy, I may ask Patti to see what y’all think about it.)

By Litmajor

June 8, 2006 02:17 PM | Link to this

SET,

I’m sure we all appreciate your comments and concerns but come on; what does being black (or white) have to do with giving students permission to skip their finals?

By SET

June 9, 2006 01:18 PM | Link to this

Litmajor:

See my above posts. I think I’ve explained where my viewpoint comes from.

I don’t see giving anyone passes on finals unless the course is not a serious subject.

Other reasonable people may disagree.

I prefer to know that when a person has a specified degree he or she has undergone certain things the same as all others with that degree.

And it’s not a race thing, it’s just that minority students have more problems with their reputation in the workplace as not being competent due to Affirmative Action. So you have to be obviously better than most to be taken seriously in your field. Creating systems of skipping finals is a red flag for me.

As it is, I can not trust the degree or diploma alone to give me an assurance of acceptable competency as compared to others with the same degree (because of the loosy-goosy standards most schools have sunk to).

By SFR

June 13, 2006 12:43 PM | Link to this

SET: First off, we’re talking about high school, not college, students. Secondly, an exam is not going to matter as to whether or not a student has a better reputation in the workplace. College finals, IMHO, should be left in place regardless of grade or attendance.

High school seniors with perfect attendance and, say, better than a 96 average with an overall 85+ average, should be rewarded. It would be an incentive to do well through the year as seniors (or anyone else, for that matter) don’t like finals and, if your grade average is that high, you deserve a little perk. Studying that hard all year is hardly “loosy goosy”.

By SET

June 13, 2006 05:17 PM | Link to this

SFR:

I see your point, and reasonable minds can agree.

I also don’t mind the concept of perks, with better students having certain freedoms and privileges that younger or less accomplished students don’t. I don’t mind having really serious perks - like trips to DisneyLand and New York or Oz or wherever reserved for the best academic students.

I’ve thought about this over the time I’ve blogged on it. I prefer to keep the finals. I prefer to keep lots of experience with time pressure tests. I know it’s not college. I want the more accomplished high school students to continue with the time-pressure tests (for experience). I don’t think it’s a little thing. It’s a real big thing. I want the “good” students to have the “pleasure”.

If I want to reward/bribe/pay them off I’d give them the good parking spaces, or something else.

That’s the way I feel is best for all concerned.