Get Schooled

By Anita

May 10, 2006 04:55 PM | Link to this

Glad to hear this!

By Amber

May 11, 2006 10:12 AM | Link to this

This is a bit unrelated, but not completely. I am for any book that encourages students to read, but should we include them in our classroom curriculum? Maybe I’m a snob, but I believe that classroom instruction should be devoted to the “classics,” books that we all recognize as accepted by the “canon.” These works should be diverse; they should include everyone from Ernest Hemingway to Maya Angelou, and they should include both older and more modern works, but they should be challenging to our students. The book room at my school is overrun with the “latest and greatest” young adult novels. They’re not “fluff,” but they’re easily digested. I believe that these books should be reserved for pleasure reading, and not used for the core content in the classroom. These books are supplemental to the classics of literature. There are students who are graduating from high school that have never read The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, Jane Eyre, To Kill a Mockingbird, Ethan Frome, A Raisin in the Sun, The Great Gatsby, or anything coming even close to these pillars of great writing. I’m not down on the latest literature, I encourage students to read the latest Young Adult novels, but I think we’ve lost something when we use them to replace literature that is more challenging. Yes, Macbeth is difficult, but it’s worth it. If we don’t expect our students to read something they may struggle with, we can’t complain when the surveys say that the new generation only reads People and Cosmopolitan, nothing else. How do ya’ll feel?

By V for Vendetta

May 11, 2006 10:43 AM | Link to this

Now we’ve given JK Rowling a chance to make more money in the form of a “prequel”

Harry Potter and the evangelical b#*ch

Potter- 1 Christians- 0

(Sorry, I saw that episode of House the other night when he was keeping score against God. That was brilliant)

By Karen Armsby

May 11, 2006 10:54 AM | Link to this

Amber, I agree with you that students should read the classics before they graduate from high school. My three kids all read classics in high school in their gifted/honors/AP classes. However, there is a large group of poor readers who make it to high school and are not capable of understanding the vocabulary or concepts in the classics, but maybe they can understand the Cliff Notes. I think many language arts teachers are happy if the poor readers read anything, and so the popular young adult novels do serve a purpose; not to teach literature, but to teach reading skills to slow readers. I had an argument with a mom who said the classics were boring and she saw no value in her kid reading them. What do you say to someone like that?

Good reading habits are the key to a good education. Students learn to read before the third grade, then read to learn starting in third grade. Poor readers are not competitive with good readers, and fall farther behind as they get passed along to higher grades.

By Karen Armsby

May 11, 2006 11:00 AM | Link to this

V, Is name calling really called for? This woman fervently believes that what she is doing is correct. I think she is uninformed and overzealous, but certainly not deserving of your name calling.

By V for Vendetta

May 11, 2006 11:33 AM | Link to this

Oh, sorry Karen. I didn’t know that making claims about a book you haven’t even read yourself and causing a big uproar about something that brings millions of children joy is grounds for sympathy and compassion from all of us.

The woman is an idiot, bottom line.

By Karen Armsby

May 11, 2006 11:43 AM | Link to this

V, Sarcasm and juvenile name calling are low brow and crude. Grow up.

By Marta

May 11, 2006 11:56 AM | Link to this

While I agreed with her conclusion, I was disturbed one of Su Ellen Bray’s reasons for keeping the books in the school library. She stated that “The book’s characters don’t endorse the Wicca religion.” If the book’s characters had endorsed the Wicca religion, would she have seen fit to ban them? Replace the word Wicca with Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Catholic, Hindu or Buddhist and think about how troubling that statement is.

While I don’t practice Wicca (or any of the other religions I just listed), I have no problem with my children reading books written from any of those perspectives. Indeed, my daughter recently read a book written from the perspective of a young Aztec, but I don’t worry that she is about to take up human sacrafice.

By Amber

May 11, 2006 12:28 PM | Link to this

Karen, What I guess I am saying is that readers who are so far behind that they have no hope of understanding a challenging work (with the guidance of a good teacher), should not be in a traditional high school. These students needed to be placed in programs that can help them. Take for example my 9th grade “College Prep” English class. Most of the students have 4th to 5th grade reading levels. Thus, I was forced to “teach to the majority.” The students who walked in to my room on a 9th grade reading level, are walking out of my room having spun their wheels for a year while I try to improve the reading skills of “the majority.” If I had had “high expectations” and taught for 9th (or even 6th, 7th, or 8th) grade reading levels, those students who simply couldn’t meet the mark would have failed, and then my failure rates would have been through the roof, and then I may have been labeled a “bad teacher”. All I know is that while I may have helped increase the reading levels of a few students, no one walked out of my class prepared for college, as “College Prep” would suggest. I don’t know the answers, it’s just very frustrating.

By V for Vendetta

May 11, 2006 12:33 PM | Link to this

Marta,

Exactly! What’s the difference between a kid who practices magic at a fantasy school and a guy who healed the sick, gave food to people, and came back from the dead?

If a religion class is offered at my school (that no one seems to complain about), then why cant kids read books about non-religious subjects?

By jim d

May 11, 2006 12:46 PM | Link to this

But V, It is but another religion. Perhaps yet another reason to strike the bible classes since equal time isn’t being given?

Gwinnett County recently adopted a bible History class How bad will they look if they now ban the potter books?

By Beccaann

May 11, 2006 12:48 PM | Link to this

Amber, I don’t understand all of your first post. I don’t think Harry Potter is being offered anywhere as part of the classroom curriculum. It is a library book. I do agree with the fact that more of the classics should be taught. When I taught just 6th grade LA years ago, we all read Jane Eyre. One of the reasons that we don’t do many of the classics now is that we have dumbed down our curriculum.

By decaturparent

May 11, 2006 01:40 PM | Link to this

Amber - just curious, why aren’t the kids entering high school and coming into your class getting screened by the 8th grade CRCT reading and math test? The kids have to pass both to move on from 8th grade, right?

I have a feeling that the answer to my question will be that a kid can pass the CRCT without being on grade level in reading and math. I don’t have kids that old yet, so I am a bit clueless and naive I guess.

By Amber

May 11, 2006 01:44 PM | Link to this

Beccaann, I was just piggy-backing on the Harry Potter debate to bring up my issue. Harry Potter isn’t a part of our curriculum here, but I can see how in the near future it may be. Which isn’t a bad thing, just so long as the students are getting a healthy dose of the classics as well. In any case, I say the students should be able to read all the Harry Potter they want.

By Beccaann

May 11, 2006 02:23 PM | Link to this

Thanks, Amber, I am having a very stressful day and I sometimes get confused. decaturparent, I am waiting to see how many 8th graders they actually hold back or to what lengths they will go in order to get them in high school even if they fail the CRCT/classwork.

By Beccaann

May 11, 2006 02:25 PM | Link to this

I would have a lot more sympathy for Mallory, if she had read at least one of the Harry Potter books.

By SET

May 11, 2006 04:53 PM | Link to this

Vanetta and Karen both have a point.

The deranged woman in question is a b*** as some would define the word. But it’s not a term that educated people use in public discourse. When we call women a b*** for taking a political stand in a public forum we make ourselves look like children, or worse, uneducated adults. (still, sometimes it is hard to resist)

So I for one will confine my commentary on this crazy woman to more clinical terms. Actually she reminds me of a woman I knew in high school who was a laughingstock of the community and whose children were ashamed of her. I felt sorry for her family - they seemed to be nice people.

But people who take a position in public discourse, run it through to the end and fail to advance their position still help us all. Once in awhile we need to have to justify our beliefs and our policies even the ones that seem to be unassailable.

The writer above makes a point that people who want their mythology taught in the public schools are the first to want to ban books.

By V for Vendetta

May 12, 2006 08:07 AM | Link to this

Jim-

Good point, but I don’t have a necessarily have a problem with religion classes being taught, it’s the fact that she wants them banned from the LIBRARY that has me all fired up. When you start banning books from the library, things are out of control (unless the books are CLEARLY inappropriate for high schoolers, but that’s a whole different argument).

SET-

You’re right, I was feeling rather childish yesterday. I apologize to everyone. As you said, sometimes things get the better of us and we go off in a way that is, well, shall we say slightly negative? :-)

By Beccaann

May 12, 2006 09:16 AM | Link to this

Glad to see that Harry has not been banned. Now I am waiting to see for which political office Mrs. Mallory is planning to run.

By Karen Armsby

May 12, 2006 09:53 AM | Link to this

Amber, Regarding your comment at 12:28 yesterday, I totally agree with you. Poor readers do not belong in the regular high school classroom. I used to tutor adult illiterates, many of whom had graduated from high school! I also administered the GED, and the major stumbling block for most test takers was poor reading skills. We often referred them to the adult reading classes before they went to the GED prep classes. I think the schools need to start reading “Boot Camp” classes at all grade levels to require any poorly performing student to complete before coming back to the regular curriculum. Learning boils down to the ability to read; to understand vocabulary, comprehend the material, and use higher thinking skills to learn and build a body of knowledge from what you have read.

By jim d

May 12, 2006 10:00 AM | Link to this

While Harry just won round two it remains to be seen if the bell will ring for round three. Mallory may still appeal to the state.

By Karen Armsby

May 12, 2006 10:07 AM | Link to this

I watched the 11 o’clock news last night and saw a brief interview with Ms. Mallory at the school board hearing. She said that witches and spells are real, and there is real danger out there. What I want to know is, has anyone tried any of the spells in the Harry Potter books, and do they work? Just Curious : )

By Beccaann

May 12, 2006 10:23 AM | Link to this

Karen, it is so obvious that she doesn’t know what she is talking about. I think that what bothers me the most is the fact that she hasn’t read the books. I have been on the committee at my school for years and we had to read any book before we could make a judgment.

By jim d

May 12, 2006 10:26 AM | Link to this

I just attempted the Petrificus Totalus spell.

Can you still move?

By jim d

May 12, 2006 10:33 AM | Link to this

Karen, just in case I didn’t get that one right I just cast the Rictusempra spell on you.

Are you rolling on the floor in uncontrollable laughter yet?

By Karen Armsby

May 12, 2006 10:47 AM | Link to this

Beccaann, I agree, Ms. Mallory cannot see the difference between fact and fiction! Part of our jobs as parents is to teach our kids the difference between fantasy and reality, to encourage imagination, but know what is real and what is not. Ms. Mallory should be more concerned about the kids who are not reading, than the ones who have learned to love reading through the Harry Potter books.

jim d, Sorry I have not been petrified nor am I rolling on the floor laughing, but I am snickering ; ), so maybe you just need a little more practice!

By jim d

May 12, 2006 10:53 AM | Link to this

Ok Karen,

One more, just in case the other two worked. Wouldn’t want to leave you in that state so I’ll cast a Finite Incantatem to free you from the other spells.

Let me know how I did.

By Karen Armsby

May 12, 2006 10:59 AM | Link to this

jim d, Thanks, I feel refreshed!

By Karen Armsby

May 12, 2006 11:12 AM | Link to this

Here’s a question, what is the difference between a spell and a prayer? Both are supplications to an out of body entity for action or results. And I would think both can be used for good, or evil.

By Amber

May 12, 2006 11:24 AM | Link to this

decaterparent, sorry, I guess I need to “out” myself…I’m a teacher in South Carolina, not Georgia…we do something called “PACT” testing here up until 9th grade…it rates you “below basic” to “proficient”…I don’t think you have to do well on it in order to go on to the next grade, it’s just a sort of “for your information” exam..I do know that over half of my students failed the “EOC” test last week, which tests whether or not they have an adequate understanding of basic skills, but it counts as a report card grade, so they could conceivably go on to the 10th grade.

By Kathleen

May 12, 2006 06:31 PM | Link to this

As the daughter of a librarian, I am glad to hear that the Harry Potter series did not get banned from the Gwinnett County School System. I do think that some books may be more appropriate for certain ages and that parents should not only read to their children but also talk with their child about what they are reading and what the meaning of the book is. Children should be provided with a variety when it comes to reading material. Interesting to think that some of the classics have been on the top 100 list of banned books—e.g., “I Know Why The Caged Bird Sings”, “The Grapes of Wrath”, “Catcher in the Rye”. I just wonder if Harry Potter is ever banned in the school, what books are next and where does it stop?