Get Schooled

By Krystal

December 22, 2005 02:48 PM | Link to this

great idea!

By Zoe

December 22, 2005 03:01 PM | Link to this

Those “poor children” get waivers! We should discuss how all the children that get “free” lunch also get to take the SAT for free too.

By OldSchool

December 22, 2005 03:27 PM | Link to this

How about discussing the start time for taking the test: 8:00 a.m. on a Saturday.

Is that a sacred time? If most teenagers are like the ones in my school, they elect to take the SAT during the fall (football season) and that means few are completely awake at that time. I just wonder if scores would be higher if the test started at 9:30 a.m. or even 1:00 p.m.

I agree with offering students the option of retaking only a part of the test but with only the highest scores “counting” regardless of how many times you take the test, I doubt if it will ever be split.

By Jason

December 22, 2005 03:52 PM | Link to this

Guess what, high school students? Your future professors and bosses are going to expect you to work at the highest level at all times—even when you’re “fatigued” or “hungry” or “totally buggin’.” Suck it up!

This reminds me of the “I’m just not a good test-taker” excuse. If you do poorly on the SAT, you need to study harder for the next test or accept your low score. Stop whining! There are no good and bad test-takers, just prepared and ill-prepared ones.

By Decaturparent

December 22, 2005 04:27 PM | Link to this

Thanks Jason, my sentiments exactly. Could you imagine asking your professor to schedule your final exam later because you will be “tired” after the football game? Or how about calling that big potential client to reschedule an early conference call because you are sleepy in the morning. Puhleeeeeze!

These kids will (presumably) be at COLLEGE in a little over a year. Not long thereafter they will supposedly have JOBS and be productive members of society. They need to be able to get with the program and focus on a little three hour test or they aren’t going to be able to make it through more than about a month of any half decent college.

No… you need to take the whole exam again… part of the deal is showing that you can in fact arrange your life and your brain so that you can focus on a difficult task for a full three hours. If you can’t do that effectively.. college is not the place for you.

Actually.. in Georgia… way too many kids who have no business thinking about college take the SAT… but that is a debate for another day.

By Jane

December 22, 2005 05:03 PM | Link to this

When my son took the SAT in June, he was there from 8:00 am until 1:00 pm. There were two 5 minute breaks. It takes so long because they have to arrive at 8:00, wait until 8:30 for instructions, then get instructions for each test. It is an exhausting test plus they are under so much stress taking this test. In addition, it is not uniformly administered. My children have had several bad experiences. One had a proctor who gave the wrong instructions. (My child knew the correct instructions, but I am sure others didn’t.) One had a proctor who didn’t speak very good English. A friend’s child took it where he could hear the marching band practicing right outside the window. My daughter took it at a boarding school where the test didn’t begin until 9:30 because they wanted their boarding students to have time for breakfast. Meanwhile, my daughter and other off campus students had to wait after arriving at 8:00. When I complained to the College Board about this, they said they would make this school watch a video about how to administer the SAT! I think some of these experiences show that although the SAT is so important, there are many variables that affect a student’s performance.

By Ha!

December 23, 2005 08:47 AM | Link to this

Do you REALLY think college professors are not asked/bullied by parents (often quoting the price tag of the college or university) to reschedule tests, post-pone projects, revamp the grading system as little junior doesn’t do well on tests, is tired, ill, will be away on a family vacation, etc. These parents have had their way all through their child’s education and don’t plan to stop at the college doors. Colleges and universities are just the next stop for these parents. Look out!

By Mara

December 23, 2005 09:52 AM | Link to this

Ha! -

Yes, parents probably do ask college professors to make special arrangements for their children, but, the difference is - they don’t have to do it!

With NCLB, IEPs, and 504 plans in K-12, the parents can get any situation for their child that they want, but, in college - Johnny’s “ADD” doesn’t mean squat! He will still have to perform and earn his grades like everyone else in the class.

By Karen Armsby

December 23, 2005 10:28 AM | Link to this

Jane, While it sounds like there were some problems with the proctors and test sites for your children, certainly those factors would not ruin their entire SAT scores. And they can always retest. I have known students who tested and did well while they were sick, after they arrived late because of a flat tire, and tested in the middle of a soccer tournament out of town at a strange school. If the students are intelligent, well schooled, and have had any test preparation, they will do fine.

As with any standardized test, the more familiar one is with the test format, timing, red flags, and give-away questions, the better the score. Repeated testing usually gives the student anywhere from 50-200 points better on the next test. Home practice with sample book tests, or on the computer and experience with the actual SAT make testing easier. Once the test begins and concentration is focused on the questions, most of the noises and distractions tend to fade away.

I don’t think that the 8am -1pm time frame is too long, nor should they break it into sections on different days. Why schedule more opportunities for pre-testing anxiety?

The SAT is just a baby step in what students may face later on. If they go to medical or law school, or take professional exams/boards for engineering, accounting, nursing etc. they will find the testing 10 times as arduous, and hours and days longer.

As far as being fair, life is not always fair, and the sooner our kids learn how to adjust and cope with the unfairness, the better off they will be. Whining and complaining that something is unfair does not get you very far in the adult world.

By Lynn

December 23, 2005 10:59 AM | Link to this

I take exception to the remarks by people who say there is no such thing as a “poor test taker”. Obviously you know very little about attention deficit, and other issues that many children have that DO make them poor test takers. My daughter studied all summer to take her SAT yet still did not do well. She was in advanced classes doing high B law A work, but would flunk a mid-term - not because she didn’t study. To assume one is lazy or didn’t study without knowing the facts - just shows that ignorance abounds!

By Jo

December 23, 2005 12:41 PM | Link to this

Given the way the SAT is graded it doesn’t matter when the test is given or in what format as long as it is equal across the country. No matter what you do, somebody is going to complain about unfairn treatment.
I personally think the SAT is an awful way to measure intelligence. I have a 3.95 GPA beginning my last semester at Georgia Tech and my SAT score really wasn’t very impressive. I don’t see how memorizing a bunch of awful vocabulary words that nobody uses is ever going to help a person to be more successful or intelligent. All questions need to be refocused so they look into the student’s thought processes and logic instead of their ability to regurgitate useless information.
In response to an earlier comment about parents’ involvement in their child’s college education, I really hope that these parents can grow up and let their kids do the same. College isn’t about the parents! Be supportive and helpful to your child’s growth, but at a certain age they must become adults, and everyone needs to start acting like it! I hope all profs just laugh at these parents.

By Jennifer 3

December 23, 2005 01:10 PM | Link to this

Given ADD/ADHD and other attention-limiting conditions, there ARE exceptions made, such as making them untimed, giving them either four 5 minute breaks, or two 10-15 minute breaks, and other needs as required. I know, because I had those ajustments made for me. And I did pretty well, too, with those adjustments - 1250 on my first try. It is the ADA’s law. If your school’s admin isn’t supportive, check with the Board.

By Al

December 23, 2005 01:12 PM | Link to this

Why can’t parents accept the fact that their child is average or below (heaven forbid!) when it comes to a college entry exam? These tests are specifically designed to measure the test-taker’s preparedness for college. If someone does not do well on these tests, that does not mean they won’t succeed in college, but it means they might not be as well prepared as someone who does better.

Here’s another doozy, some kids are not as “smart” as other kids. “Smart” kids have thought processes and reasoning skills that are aligned with those processes and skills that the test writers have deemed necessesary to do well in college. There is a very different skill-set required to maintain a high GPA (study, memorize, regurgitate, rinse, lather, repeat.)

Many upper percentile GPA students do not do well on standardized tests, but many do. Students who study and study for these tests don’t get the results they are used to getting in their high school classes using the same methods.

Allowing a la carte retakes for sections on which they didn’t meet their goals is just pointless. The ability to perform well on every section at the same time is valuable and rare. That’s how a student can have a higher composite score percentile than they are in any one of the sub-sections.

The testing system is not broken!! Not everyone is going to be above average. Not every college-bound student has the same skills (test taking, abstract thinking, math, or otherwise.) Why not just give everyone big smiley faces and a pat on the head? Then they will feel good about themselves, and not have to worry about stress. And while we’re at it, we can prepare them for the nice, stress free, totally fair, perfect world of college they are about to enter. HA!

By ATLean

December 23, 2005 01:23 PM | Link to this

I feel that the sections on the SAT should be offered separately . Being a recent college grad, I recall taking the SAT and I scored high on the math and written part but my verbal sucked. It would have been great to be able to only take the verbal part over because then I could concentrate only on the verbal practice sessions without worrying about hindering my already good math score. In regards to “poor test-takers”, I feel that there is a such thing because I am one. I am weak when it comes to standardized test. I’m not sure why but I don’t feel that schools should deny you acceptance based on the SAT alone. Scoring high or low on those tests does not dictate whether or not you are a good student or not. I know plenty of my peers who scored high on the SAT but had trouble with regular school work and vice versa. This test really does not prepare you for future task. Some of the things on the test are not words or arithmetic that you will even use in the future let alone learn in day-to-day classes in high school. That’s why they have SAT classes because they know you don’t learn this everyday. The most ridiculous thing to me, however, is why do schools have a minimum SAT score or better yet some schools say you have to score ### on the verbal and ### on the math. Why should it matter if I scored higher on the math than on the verbal? Just as long as I got the score…right? I feel that any student who wants to further their education and attend college should not have to be rated on the SAT alone but overall as a student.

By James

December 23, 2005 02:25 PM | Link to this

this subject isn’t worth discussing…it’s just another way for parents to make excuses for their kids’ shortcomings.

By SWC

December 23, 2005 03:13 PM | Link to this

My gosh, the hostility towards children on this blog is beyond belief.

What is the big deal about breaking up an overly long test? Here’s a radical idea: Offer students a CHOICE - they can take it all at once and get it over with, or they can split it up into 2 parts.

All this stuff about the big old tough world out there has nothing to do with taking the SAT test, unless you plan to embark on a career path that requires sitting for hours while doing boring tasks.

I do not have ADD or ADHD, but just sitting still for 3 plus hours is difficult. If one is physically antsy, it takes away from ones ability to concentrate and perform well on a very boring test. It has nothing to do with being average or above average or below average.

This has nothing to do with whining parents - it is just common sense, but all you hostile martinets out there just can’t get past the idea that you had it so much harder than today’s kids. You sound like a bunch of miserable sods and bitter curmudgeons.

By Al

December 23, 2005 03:31 PM | Link to this

Yeah, that does sound like good common sense. It makes perfect sense to customize the standardized tests. That way all the kids can do their best, because colleges aren’t interested in actually measuring anything, like ability to perform in less than comfy conditions. They just want you to do your best, by golly!

By Karen Armsby

December 23, 2005 04:55 PM | Link to this

Gosh, SWC, I think everyone gave thoughtful answers, and I don’t think you need to call anyone nasty names. Have a cup of Christmas cheer!

By Reality Check

December 23, 2005 05:15 PM | Link to this

As a current college student at Georgia Tech, I’d like to say a few things about this debate. It is absolutely absurd that people are even considering making these rule changes to the SAT. The SAT is a hard test that is meant to weed out those who belong in college and those who don’t. I know from first hand experience that there are some kids who squeaked out a decent enough SAT score to get into college, but once there they can’t hack it. Whether they are lazy or just plain stupid, they do not belong in college. Face it parents, if your child cannot sit through a test such as the SAT because they get tired, or they’re hungry, or they cannot focus for that long then too bad! The longer the system holds their hand and makes things easy for them, the harder they will fall when they’re on their own. If you are not challenged then you will never accomplish anything. The SAT helps some people realize their potential, and others realize their limitations. Please do us all a favor and keep the SAT as a true measure of person’s intellect and mental toughness. If you can’t hack it, then choose a different path in life.

By Lynn

December 26, 2005 09:03 AM | Link to this

This comment is to James - another example of pure ignorance. My daughter has her shortcomings - her room is a total pig stye…and I’m sure there’s another quirk or two, but overall considering the fact she came into this world at 2 lbs and not expected to live - she’s an amazing child. No, she didn’t score well on her SAT - not for her lack of trying, not for her lack of studying until 10 and 11 p.m. But I’ll put my kid up against most teenagers today in a heart beat. She’s loved and adored by almost everyone she meets - from fellow students, to their parents (who have asked numerous times if I’d like to switch - HA NOT!) to teachers who have said she’s one of those students who make teaching worth it. Despite her marks on her SAT, she is still going to college and hopes to fulfill her dream of becoming a DVM.

For two and half years she’s worked in a veterinary hospital - a place where she started simply as a volunteer. Within one week she was offered a job with the Hospital’s groomer. Not 3 weeks later, she was asked to work at the Hospital itself. She had to turn it down as she had no way to get there once HS started again in the fall. But my daughter has such great shortcomings - that the hospital was willing to send someone to pick her up. She’s excelled in her job. At 19 she knows more about the medicines and procedures that are given, can talk with clients about these same procedures and clients at the hospital who don’t come in unless my daughter is there. Her co-workers adore her. She has more “second Moms” than I have fingers to count.

On top of that, she’s started her own business pet sitting. These same clients of the Hospital are clients of hers - and again, she’s just adored…her caring and loving manner wins the heart of some of the hardest people.

Needless to say, I am very proud of my daughter. While I’m sure not perfect, in her 19 years, she’s never given her father or me a moment’s trouble (neither of our two children has).

James - and others like him - there are many many smart, intelligent children out there, like my daughter, who for whatever reason, despite whatever is done for them, just do NOT test well. It doesn’t make them stupid or any less deserving than any other child.

As for SAT scores “judging” a child’s readiness for college - let’s not go there. Have you ever seen the “acceptable” scores for student athletes compared to the average person? But that’s a subject for another day!

By Karen Armsby

December 26, 2005 09:29 AM | Link to this

Lynn, You should not take offense to James’ comments. The SAT is just one measure of the potential of a student to succeed in college. Colleges today look at GPA, the types and number of challenging HS classes taken, participation and achievement in sports, leadership positions held in school government and clubs, awards received, community work and leadership, and jobs held outside of school. It appears that your child has the potential to succeed in college given her experiences.

While the SAT score is not the only critieria used by colleges, it is a good measuring tool and should not be diluted or reworked by breaking it up into sections. Colleges use scores for placement in classes and base scholarship awards on the SAT score. Much of the value of the SAT does lie in the rigor of testing all parts together at one time.

The SAT does allow for application of extended testing times and variations in format for documented disabilities. This is a levelling tool that is available to any student like your daughter. While the SAT may not be perfect, it is a good test assessment for the majority of students.

By Lynn

December 26, 2005 12:59 PM | Link to this

Karen I take exception to his comments because he basically is lumping all children together and that I DO take offense at…not for myself, but for those children who give their all and sometimes fall short.

While I realize the SAT is just one measure, however, it is NOT applied fairly to all children. UGA, for example, has two “acceptable” grade scores on the SAT - it is significantly lower for athletes than it is for others. Why are student athletes not held to the same standards as other children?

I for one do not believe a standardized test is any true indicator of how ANY child will or will not do in college. It all boils down to 1) the child’s desire and motivation and 2) how dedicated he/she is and how hard he/she is willing to work to achieve that success.

The sign of a good student is not one who scores a 1600 on his/her SAT. Yes, it’s very commendable and I take nothing away from those students (hell I wish I was 1/2 as smart!). But I applaud those children who despite what some on this blog say - are lazy, not smart enough, not good enough, not this, not that - whatever is thought - that despite the odds, they pick themselves up, dust themselves off and keep focusing on the goal(s) they have set for themselves. For some it is easier and for others not so.

And think about this - why are those students “lazy” or “not smart” enough? Perhaps they listen to people who tell them they are not? Perhaps they have no one to encourage them to pick themselves up and aim higher.

Granted, there are always going to be people - whether students or in the work force - that just don’t give a rat’s a*. And if they are happy with that - well I don’t want to hear them complain.

But for those students who seek to excel - whether they ace an SAT or whether they have to take it 10 times - I applaud them all. And to those who have to try just a little bit harder than the kid next to them, kudos to you for not listening to the naysayers who say you are not smart enough, you don’t try hard, you didn’t study or study hard enough.

By Leia

December 26, 2005 01:50 PM | Link to this

Did any of you read the article in the AJC about the study done on college grads? They found that rising numbers could not extrapolate information from a piece of text! Here is the link: http://www.ajc.com/news/content/news/stories/1205/26natliteracy.html

I believe that this comes from a watered down high school curriculum and a college admissions system that relies on quotas, athletes, etc. How would allowing the SAT to be broken down help this? It would not. It would further exacerbate the situation. Not everyone should attend college.

By Britt

December 26, 2005 02:08 PM | Link to this

I don’t think hunger or sleepiness or the time of the test should be given as an excuse. In high school I knew I had to be at the given school in order to take the SAT. You have to prepare for that. It’s called being mature and responsible. On the other hand, I do believe that you should be able to take the part that you would like without having to take the whole test over. I know I would have loved to take the part I was unsatisfied with only. Then again, if you do take all portions over do they consider your highest scores from each section?

By teachoverseas

December 26, 2005 03:03 PM | Link to this

One of the great heartbreaks I had as a high school teacher was dealing with parents who could not or would not see that their child should not go to college. Georgia gives ALL students the SAT- and let’s face it folks- not ALL high school kids should go to college. But what teacher would dare suggest such a thing to a parent?

I was chatting with a student a few years ago- a nice kid- who really didn’t like school and didn’t do all that well it in either. I asked him about his plans for the future— he claimed that he was going to college. When I asked him what his career plans were- he said he wanted to be a TV chef. I told him that he didn’t need a college degree to be a chef and that in fact, a technical school is where he should be looking. He had never even heard of a technical school. I did some research for him and got some brochures on various schools. He was so excited to find there was a school that taught the things he was interested in! The next day, I had another student at my door, he heard I knew about “other kinds of colleges” He wanted to work in TV and be one of the camera men. I found a school for him too. The following week, I had three more students at my door- all asking about “other colleges” For all my efforts and hours of work- I got two parent complaints that I was “steering students away from college” It happened that the students (who came to me) were black. My principal (a really good guy) reminded me that it was the policy of the school to counsel ALL students towards college. To do anything else could be construed as racism. The fact that these kids didn’t want to go to college, were not going to do well in college and hadn’t even heard of other alternatives was not as dangerous as the fact that I could possibly be accused of racism. Of course this went the other way when the following week, three more students were at my door (who happened to be white) and I did as I was instructed and referred them to the guidence counselor- who did her job and counseled them to college. I heard from other teachers that there were complaints from them that “she only helps the black kids”

Let’s not even talk about the fact that the jobs these kids were interested in were mainly union jobs with good pay, strictly enforced working conditions, vacation, health insurance and a pension. All much better than I have with a master’s degree.

Parents- you have wonderful children, but not all of them want or should go to college. Don’t rely on the teachers or the school to tell you otherwise- they are too afraid of your complaints. They will ALL tell you that ALL kids can go to college. It’s not the BEST choice for all kids and they will still have a great, rewarding and full future without a college degree!

By Nikole

December 26, 2005 04:00 PM | Link to this

nomoretests.org

By Linny

December 27, 2005 09:33 AM | Link to this

My three boys each took the SAT … the first, who graduated in 1988, made 710/710…then took it again because he wasn’t satisfied with that (out of 1600) and made 740/740…strangely enough… he ended up in the Navy and never went to college (at least not yet) … my second graduated in 2004, took the SAT and made 610/610 (out of 1600), stayed out of school for a year to work(he’s not add/adhd, but does have some attention deficit problems, a bit unfocused) then went to college where he’s maintaining a solid B average and has learned a LOT about managing his own time and money… the third graduated after summer school 2005 … just took the SAT with the new scoring system, and scored 700/510/600 (critical reading/math/writing) i guess the new total is 2400 … has no interest at this time in college, but is thinking of some sort of technical school, focusing on graphic arts and gaming industry, perhaps… all three are avid readers, well spoken, the older two terrific in math-related/science-related matter… all raised approximately the same way, allowing for personality differences… with three completely different sets of goals and paths to those goals…

the point is to CHALLENGE your children do be and do the BEST they can … in all areas of their life… not all are destined for college, not all are destined for worldly financial success… but ALL can be successful in some way… someone before said it best… Lynn maybe… encouragement to do the best they can and pride in what they do, rather than being put down because they cannot do what someone else does…

remember the studies done where teachers are told that a certain set of students are “trouble makers and poor students” and another set are “wonderful A-level students” … but the sets were selected at random… and guess what… “amazingly” enough, at the end of the term, the sets of students were exactly as “predicted” … because of the attitude of the teacher towards them in accordance with reports fed to them… expectations make a BIG difference, so if you expect good things, you are more likely to see good results, and vice versa

By Lewis

December 27, 2005 10:38 AM | Link to this

Isn’t it interesting that SAT scores are so important to various state officials in Georgia. But, what would occur if everyone running for public office was required to disclose their SAT scores. Talk about excuses for low scores - it would be difficult to stop laughing.

By BlindHogHomer

December 27, 2005 10:56 AM | Link to this

All you excuse-making, whining, my little girl is wonderful but doesn’t test well (wonderful and well-liked have very litle correlation to intellect Lynn) crybabies should ask yourselves if you’d like to be represented by an attorney that couldn’t pass the bar or be operated on by a doctor that couldn’t pass the boards. There has to be some way to separate the wheat from the chaff. Standardized testing, though not perfect, is a pretty good way of doing that. School grades are generally so inflated they mean little or nothing. The SAT was watered down a long time ago so that today’s 1400 would have been about 1250-1300 30 years ago. Then there’s SAT prep classes, free state website, tutors, and mulitple retesting. If you can’t get 1250 or higher with all those resources and opportunities, you don’t belong at G Tech. No retesting for individual sections, why not just give them the answers on the way in instead?

By SBB

December 27, 2005 11:04 AM | Link to this

The HOPE scholarship has caused such huge grade inflation in our high schools. College admission officers must use some kind of common equalizer (SAT/ACT) to determine if a student is a good match for their school.

By Linny

December 27, 2005 12:43 PM | Link to this

Oh… i forgot one side note… My middle son, the one who did choose college… when applying to Middle Georgia College in Cochran, a small, two-year institution with high focus on math, my son was told that they would (and did) exempt him from taking the COMPASS tests to enter college, since he scored over a certain percentile on the SAT, but that the SAT was no longer being used as the criteria for entry into MGC, as they felt that the COMPASS was more effective in predicting college success or some such reason. Nor does MGC rely on the ACT testing program. I thought that it was interesting, but since my son did not have to take those tests, I have NO idea what they are about, how they are formulated, etc. Anyone have any input in that area? I’d be curious. (oh and p.s. my youngest corrected me, his math on the new version of the SAT was 570, not 510, (wee above) he felt it was important to set that straight)

I’m proud of all three… just thought I’d throw that in…

By Linny

December 27, 2005 12:44 PM | Link to this

err… that is, “see above” (sheesh) *sheepish grin…and i type for a living!?)

By Valery

December 27, 2005 01:01 PM | Link to this

The College Board should offer a choice of the full exam or partial to the test takers. Of course college is not for everyone, but it is for people that desire it! If a student is making the decision to go to college then it should be their choice how the test is modified to meet their needs. Remember “No Child Should Be Left Behind” Once they are admitted into college their potential will be measured and they will know, if college was the right choice. Technical schools and other trade schools are great choices as well, but it should be an alternative to college. Poor SAT achievers should try an alternative to college and once they have mastered the diploma or certificate, give college a try. You can go to college to reinforce your current skills and knowledge not just for a degree. “Show more respect and have more support for OUR BEAUTIFUL CHILDREN”

By Valery

December 27, 2005 01:14 PM | Link to this

Qwesi, if that is your real name. You are a low down as_ hole. Have you mastered EBONICS, if yes then please elaborate how it goes? I hope you are not a racist son/daughter of an ignorant set of parents or better yet a neglected individual. No matter what your race is, you can still be construed as a RACIST! QWESI, take a long look in the mirror and tell that RACIST bastard to grow up! Oh, and Pray for your soul to get cleansed!

By Jim

December 27, 2005 01:35 PM | Link to this

This is an idea that should already be in place.

By Nikole

December 27, 2005 01:55 PM | Link to this

What did Qwesi say?

By Valery

December 27, 2005 02:39 PM | Link to this

Qwesi, stated that the SAT should contain EBONICS, so that some students can pass. What a jerk!

By Shabazz

December 27, 2005 03:26 PM | Link to this

Qwesi has some good points. The SAT is targeted toward Asian & Eurocentric rationale and thinking. After 400 years of slavery, racism, oppression, Jim Crow, segregation, and Reagan-Bush, the African mind cannot begin to process so much material in so little time. Ebonics may be the answer.

By Joselle

December 27, 2005 03:33 PM | Link to this

$12,000 a year is allocated to each child in the Atlanta City Schools, arguably the worst school system this side of New Orleans. It would be cheaper to send these young minds to private school. At least they would have a chance and have an opportunity to advance and leave the projects behind for good.

By Patti Ghezzi

December 27, 2005 03:45 PM | Link to this

I deleted “Qwesi’s” comments, deeming them inappropriate even by the broad Get Schooled standards.

Patti

By Carrie

December 27, 2005 04:23 PM | Link to this

I just have to laugh at you parents who want to change the standardized tests to meet your child’s “needs”. Your children will not last in the real world……I think I will come into work tomorrow around noon and leave about 3pm since that will suit my needs. It will be so nice to free up the rest of my day and not have to focus on work or get hungry. It is so pathetic. Can you not just accept that your child might be just average? It is okay to be average. Just take a moment to listen to yourselves…..

By Jeremiah

December 27, 2005 04:52 PM | Link to this

Well the “real world” as some people conviently put it makes changes when there is a loud enough voice. So if STUDENTS want something done then these “real world” parents should let them take the proper channels to get whatever they think should be done about the SAT done.

By luvs2teach

December 27, 2005 04:58 PM | Link to this

Valery - you said, “Of course college is not for everyone, but it is for people that desire it!” Well, sometimes desire isn’t enough - I want to be an astronaut, but I can’t pass the eye exam. Should NASA be asked to modify their test simply because I need a different standard to “meet [my] needs”? I don’t think so.

I think we send a very bad message to all our children when we do this type of thing. We are raising a generation who thinks that the world will be modified to meet their needs, and that’s just not going to happen!

I think all students who take the SAT should take the full exam the first time, no exceptions. If they want to attempt a solo section for a second (or third, etc.) time, then it should be coded so that the college knows the conditions under which the student took the exam. It can then be the school’s decision how to handle that situation. Some schools may opt only to the results of the full exam; some schools may give less credit to partial attempts; some schools may weight it all equally. What? That’s not fair? Really? It’s not fair for a college to determine their entrance criteria? Wow, and to think my mom always told me that life wasn’t fair.

By luvs2teach

December 27, 2005 05:07 PM | Link to this

Jeremiah - just because you’re loud, it doesn’t mean you’re right. And just because you’re loud, it doesn’t mean the change you want is a good one.

Are you going to listen to a (member-of-the-political-group-you-disagree-with-the-most) just because s/he’s LOUD?

By Karen Armsby

December 28, 2005 09:06 AM | Link to this

Teachoverseas hit the nail on the head about kids needing another kind of college (aka trade schools). In the early part of the last century when public education was in its infancy, the hightest achievement in many families was for the children to graduate from high school, and very few went to college. Then high school graduation became the expected goal and the highest achievement was a college degree. It appears that along the way the trade schools lost their status of respectablity, both in the community and apparently among educators and counselors.

The truth is that many trade school graduates make better salaries, get a job more quickly and are just as successful in their careers as college graduates.

Perhaps the answer lies in restructuring and renaming trade schools so that they offer a liberal arts college curriculum along with the trade being learned.

Parents and kids want the status and respectbility that a college degree brings, so why not turn the trade schools into colleges?

By Carrie

December 28, 2005 09:26 AM | Link to this

Yeah, we have made concessions to the loudest people who wanted changes to meet their needs……and then when it comes time to downsize they are the first to go. Oddly, they are always the only ones surprised by this. Nobody in the real world cares about your ‘special circumstances’ - we just want you to get your work done so we can all go home on time.

By Carrie

December 28, 2005 09:27 AM | Link to this

I had to take the SAT while I had the flu and I still did well. I didn’t have to study for it or take any special classes either. I just made a practice out of reading on my own and learning about math and logic throughout my life. These tests were not designed for cramming to get a good score. They were meant to measure your verbal, math and logic skills that you should have accumulated throughout school.