Get Schooled

By Jake

October 5, 2005 12:02 PM | Link to this

The administrators probably erred on the side of caution in determining her journal constituted a threat of bodily harm, so expunging her record seems appropriate. But I’d like a little more back story. I want to know why the teacher seized her journal. Was she disruptive or displaying any other behavior that might be considered threatening? Better safe than Columbine where lots of now obvious danger signs were ignored.

By Leia

October 5, 2005 12:28 PM | Link to this

If the teacher did not confiscate the diary, and something bad happened to the teacher written about in the “story”, he/she may be working in Bartow County next to Coach Neese!

By John

October 5, 2005 12:30 PM | Link to this

Overreaction as usual.

Americans have stopped using common sense.

She may have a talent for writing.

Fifty percent of the books, television and movies are horror or murder stories and the nations authors and screen writers developed their skills and imagination in high school.

Oh my God, there’s a terrorist running down my street, gotta go.

By Woodie

October 5, 2005 12:35 PM | Link to this

Not only was it wrong to suspend this person, it was wrong to “take” her journal in the first place. That is the basis for a lawsuit alone. The suspension, based on illegal confiscation is a civil rights violation. You cannot trample the rights of individuals in this country. I’d rather put up with occasional violence than give up the basic civil rights we worked so hard for. This private journal was never offered as information for anyone other than the author. Geez. It amazes me the stupidity of some people in positions of authority. I’m not going to stand by and watch a persons right-to-privacy trampled for some ill-conceived socialist dogma based on post-columbine induced fear. As Micheal Jackson would say, “that’s just ignorant”.

By Tony

October 5, 2005 12:41 PM | Link to this

Students have an obligation to abide by classroom procedures. Writing in a personal journal during a class is disruptive in some cases and is usually not allowed in most classes. Students should be engaged in the activities of the class. There is probably much more to this story than has been reported since schools are not allowed to disclose information regarding a student without written consent of the parent.

That being said, zero tolerance policies are disasters waiting to happen and many school systems enacted such policies after Columbine HS incident. Administrators should use good judgement in all disciplinary matters and that includes being consistent with enforcing the discipline code.

While this may seem to be a case of the school trampling on individual rights of a student, it may also be a case where the student was not on the appropriate task assigned by the teacher and disciplinary steps were required.

By RF

October 5, 2005 12:54 PM | Link to this

School systems are beginning to see the light about zero tolerance. This case is one the brought out the truth. We’re a different world these days folks. Columbine, 9/11 and others have made us hyper-conscious of threat. As time passes, school systems will relax and evaluate case by case more carefully. I think since they revoked the expulsion, the system should, and probably will, expunge her record.

By Mellllll2

October 5, 2005 01:01 PM | Link to this

If they erase her record they need to look at all other children in high school that have blemishes on their records and erase those also. It’s not fair for her to get preferential treatment. Unfortunately there are kids that don’t have families with the kind of resources to sue over the trouble they got themselves in.

I’m curious if this situation happened with a black male student that was caught writing such an inappropriate story during class, would people be behind him?

By Dan

October 5, 2005 01:03 PM | Link to this

While I agree this seems an overeactions lets not forget there are 2 sides of hyper-consciousness. The first, as most of the posts here point out, is the knee jerk zero tolerance reaction to tradjedies like columbine. The second overeaction is just as responsible and that is the hyper-litigiousness (word ?) of this society always wanting to blame someone and reap a reward, it is a lose lose proposition. Catch someone before they do something wrong and you trample their rights, wait til they do something wrong and you should have caught it earlier. The police run into the same issues. Not sure what prompted the teacher to read the diary but if the kid was not supposed to have it in class, too bad, she forfeited her “right”.

By Dan

October 5, 2005 01:41 PM | Link to this

When will kids be held responsible for their behavior????????? I think the time will come when a teacher gets sued over a grade. While this case seems extreme it may not be. Do we know her disciplinary history at the school? We only know one side of the story. Perhaps her rights were superceeded by her actions at that time. I take notes from students all the time if they are writing them in class. Am I imposng on their rights???

By Jake

October 5, 2005 01:43 PM | Link to this

But she wouldn’t have gotten a ten day suspension for Just having a diary in class. And I disagree that this is not fair. It shouldn’t be the goal of government in general, or schools in particular, to function according to your socialist notions of fair. This is a capitalistic society and the idea is to compete for the rewards that go to the successful. Next you’ll be telling me it’s not fair some people get to live in bigger houses or take nicer vacations than others.

By John C.

October 5, 2005 02:23 PM | Link to this

So America, how do we feel as we embark becoming an Orwellian/Huxlian society by turning “1984” and “Brave New World” into reality? From top to bottom this country has lost its collective mind. Will it make you any safer for the government to tell you what to think? Do we allow Congress and even worse, the Supreme Court to dictate what is permissible? Where will it stop? I am ever mindful of the tragic events of Columbine and sometimes am concerned about my children going to school because of adolescent violence; however, that should not give schools and administrators the right to police children’s diaries. So what, the girl has a diary to record her thoughts and feelings for later reflection. Compare this with the music I hear freely broadcast at schools and down the street advocating the shooting of police officers and instigating interracial violence. The diary was personal and not public. Obviously this girl has issues with her teacher and should be for her parents to handle not the government. We advocate the censorship of a girl’s diary but what about these idiots that are free to produce and distribute hate driven literature promoting racial dominance that fills people with hate, stirs up the emotions and would have this entire country dragged into a domestic killing field. What about limits on that speach? Yet, the focus is on one little girl’s diary who wrote a story and calls to police the thoughts of the citizenry. Sounds a little reminiscent of Nazism and Stalinism. Welcome to our Brave New World comrades ……

By Robert

October 5, 2005 02:31 PM | Link to this

The girl should have learned a lesson from this experience. The parents are not helping her by fighting it.

Colleges do not look at discipline records - that is a fact.

By Lee

October 5, 2005 02:44 PM | Link to this

When I was in school, come deer season, just about every pickup truck had a rifle or shotgun in a gun rack in the back window. Every school boy carried a pocket knife all the way from first grade through twelfth grade. If you were having a disagreement with someone, you both could go to the PE coach and he would let you put on the boxing gloves - let you get it out of your system.

Nowadays, if you even draw a gun on a piece of paper, you get in trouble. 8 year old girls are suspended for having a Tweety Bird keychain (they said it was a weapon). They’ve taken away recess so kids no longer have an outlet for all that energy.

Somewhere between then and now, common sense got kicked out of our schools.

By jakesdad

October 5, 2005 02:49 PM | Link to this

not knowing the details I would withhold judgement but given the “prima facia” I would say the burden of proof (from a PR perspective, not necessarily legal) is definitely on the school to back up its (original) decision. there may well be “more to the story” but on the surface it seems a bit much for them to excpect “benefit of the doubt”. kids, the moral of the story is: gpg is you friend (“read THIS, …”)

By Rosalind

October 5, 2005 02:51 PM | Link to this

It is a sad day when teachers have to go on the offensive to do their jobs but it is a fact. I know I personally wouldn’t take a teaching job in this day and age where 60% of the class population, white/black/purple/pink or yellow, doesn’t give the respect due to an adult figure. You have to protect yourself. I do not think the teacher should taken the diary, if the student wasn’t disruptive. But, I have to be and I am, a proactive parent. All parents should be. What does a diary have to do with school? Why was it there? I had one but I never took it to school. Only items pertaining to school should go to school. Parents give todays children too much freedom. Diary’s, cd players, mp3 players, cell phones, ect DON NOT need to be in school. I have a 17yr old daughter. She has a cell phone and I’ve told her, out of sight, out of mind. Do not use it until before or after school. If it’s taken she will not get it back, even if the teacher gives it to me. I’ll keep it. If there’s an emergency & school is locked down, like they were a couple of years ago, the teachers did let the children use their phones. That was reasonable because the school didn’t have enough phones to go around. that was okay. But I’ve sent the expectation for my daughter & other parents should to…nothing, other than books, should go to school. I think the parents should let this be a lesson to their daughter & let it go but I think they’d like some cash as well.

By jakesdad

October 5, 2005 03:09 PM | Link to this

“I think they’d like some cash as well” - yea, $1. you might want to read the article. just a thought…

By Ms.Harris

October 5, 2005 03:28 PM | Link to this

I might be wrong, but students on school grounds don’t have any rights. It’s the same as searching lockers, backpacks, and visual checks of student’s cars. That being said, minors have limited rights regardless so what “Constitutional Rights” can a 15 yr old lose?? It’s much like the theory, “Well I wasn’t doing anything wrong, so I don’t want to be searched”, Hey, don’t do anyting wrong and you’ll be fine.My, what I long post. I think I have carpel tunnel, I think I’ll sue :)

By Booyah

October 5, 2005 03:30 PM | Link to this

The old ” I wrote I killed my teacher in my diary” trick. Agent 86 would be proud. Careful - this girl may end up pulling a Mark Barton on us one day. Lock her up and throw away the key. She’s a timebomb. Tick tick tick.

By Mark

October 5, 2005 03:50 PM | Link to this

If I remember correctly, the student was an exemplary student. There had not been previous disciplinary problems. I doubt that writing in one’s journal is disruptive anymore than day-dreaming is. It won’t get your work done but it doesn’t keep others from doing theirs. When the teacher realized it was a diary, s/he should have stopped further reading. That is a violation of privacy. I believe Neil Boortz (I may be wrong on who I’m paraphrasing) stated that once she took her diary from her house, she lost the right to privacy. Bull! If an adult takes a checkbook/wallet/purse from home, s/he doesn’t grant anyone the right to view it’s contents. Maybe a consultation with a child psychiatrist was in order. Maybe not. The knee jerk reaction was uncalled for.

By Romona

October 5, 2005 04:06 PM | Link to this

I believe there was some overreaction on the part of the school. However, the student should not have had the journal/diary at school in the first place. Students need to leave things like that at home - if especially if it’s something that personal.

By Romona

October 5, 2005 04:09 PM | Link to this

Oops! Sorry about the extra “if”. :)

By Jake

October 5, 2005 04:09 PM | Link to this

The school overreacted by treating what was probably a Level III offense at most as a level I offense, so now the parents are overreacting by suing. It’s unlikely her behavior “endangered the safety of others”, and just about as unlikely her suspension threatens her college admission prospects. UC Berkeley would be happy to have her!

By Amazed (Independent Woman)

October 5, 2005 04:53 PM | Link to this

If I had to decide this case, this girl and her parents would not receive one dime of that dollar. I don’t believe she should have spent 10 days out of school unless she was seeking Psychiatric treatment. A teenager should not be writing or dreaming about killing anyone, at anyplace or time. Her parents should be more concerned about what was written, because it is not normal or creative.

By C.R.H.

October 5, 2005 04:59 PM | Link to this

Students should not have an expectation of privacy at school…as a teacher I don’t have that expectation. Remember the teacher who had some garbabge on her cell phone & the cell phone ended up in student hands? Keep your personal issues at home, school is a place for learning.

By Iteach

October 5, 2005 04:59 PM | Link to this

I do remember the story well. True, the school system may have erred on the side of caution and baybe there is a point for the student’s rights but society caused it to happen.

Since events like Columbine and 9/11 we have pearched on the ledge of fear in this country looking for the next event. Had nothing been done some parent would have heard about the diary and ran to the media to expose the school as being unconcerned about the students’ well being.

Two weeks ago I sent a young man to the office because he had two gun catalogs. He was suspended during an investigation. Did I and my school err. We have 4 gangs at our school. Three students have had family members killed in gang activity in the last two months. There have been two major fights erupt on busses this year.

By Lee

October 6, 2005 08:30 AM | Link to this

Iteach: Say what???

You sent a student to the office for having a gun catalogue? This student was suspended while the school conducted an investigation?

I would love to read the results of that “investigation.” After a lengthy investigation, we have concluded that those terrible guns were merely images on a piece of paper and did not pose a threat to other students.

Either there is more to this story - a whole, whole lot more - or you and your principal are two of the biggest morons I have ever heard of.

People ask me all time why I spend all that money to send my daughter to private school. I tell them I have lost all faith in the ability of public schools to provide for the education of my daughter. Thank you for illustrating my point.

By HStchr

October 6, 2005 08:46 AM | Link to this

Lee- before you resort to childish names, which obviously your money and superb private school edcuation have deluded you into thinking you have the right to do, consider this: in the god-awful, pitiful public school system you so clearly don’t approve of, we have to live by the law. The law clearly states that ANY potential violent tendency, including a gun catalog, MUST BY LAW, be reported and investigated. The reason Columbine HS became such a tragic scene was because too many people said “they’re just innocent kids”…innocent kids who just HAPPENED to be building bombs and buying guns. We can’t bury our heads in the sand, and the law requires us to report any, any potential violence. You should be careful about your judgement—private schools are ripe with drugs and potential violence. It’s the smart kids with money who pose the real threat. They can actually afford to buy the stuff to make the bombs. I too, had a child in a similar situation. He wrote a note about his father, threatening to kill his father. I turned it in, and it turned out the father was being abusive and noone knew. Now the family is getting counseling and trying to fix the problems there. Sometimes, even though it seems extreme, mandatory reporting can result in something good.

By FormerGATeacher

October 6, 2005 09:26 AM | Link to this

I know this situation well…too well. I have heard both sides. To all the people who are questioning the actions of the school, please know that there are in fact TWO sides to every story. Most people do not know the full story, but then again how could you? Fulton County has remained very tight lipped on the subject. That is their choice, and I can’t say that I blame them. They do not want to get caught up in a “he said/she said” shouting match. It looks unprofessional. I know many of you have lost faith in the public education system, and that is your right to think that way. However, know that most teachers are good people with good intentions… just like everyone else. I assure you that this teacher did what he thought was right in the situation, and unfortunately he is being punished for it… as is the whole school system.

By Lee

October 6, 2005 09:50 AM | Link to this

HStchr, please refer me to the Ga Code that states a gun catalogue is equivalent to “violent tendencies.”

You can’t.

If what you say is true, then what that means is that someone in the Department of Education has chosen to espouse their political views; views that are anti-Second Amendment, anti-hunting, and anti-gun into the classroom. This is not about “protecting the children” but rather, making the schools an indoctrination center.

I’ve always found it ironic that schools have “zero tolerance” policies and will suspend 8 year old girls for having a Tweety Bird keychain, but allow baseball players to walk around with ball bats. Go figure.

All these “zero tolerance” policies do is eliminate the need to teachers and administrators to use their judgement. It is much easier to hide behind a rule that to exercise something called COMMON SENSE.

BTW, you stated that you had a child write a note about killing his father. Now that is what I would call a cry for help and would be someting to take action on. But a gun catalogue?? Come on….

I love it when people try to put down private schools saying that they are an enclave of drug use, rich kids with nothing better to do than to get into trouble. Last time I checked, my daughter’s private school didn’t have metal detectors or armed guards - don’t need them. They also say a prayer before school (its called a Christian school) and if your child doesn’t want to abide by the rules, you can take your child and your money and put them back into public school.

By John

October 6, 2005 10:38 AM | Link to this

The correct response would have been to quietly take the diary, without causing a scene, send her to the principal and not read it but hand it over to the parents for them to read, then issue a student, parent teacher counseling session and a detention if they wanted to be tough. They might have also directed her to the english/drama teacher so she could develope her writing and story telling skills.

By HStchr

October 6, 2005 10:45 AM | Link to this

Lee—we’re trained on mandatory reporting every year. THE STATE LEGISLATURE PASSED THE LAW, NOT THE DEPT. OF ED.!!!!! I’m sure the law is subject to interpretation, as is any law. I agree that a gun catalogue MAY not indicate a violent tendency, but wouldn’t you want to know as a parent that your child was looking at one? I would! It’s not about politics or indoctrination, dear. It’s about law and the fact that if I don’t report these things, I could be fired. Your legislature and mine made the law, not the DOE.

Now, if you hadn’t launched the attack on the public schools, I wouldn’t be attacking private schools. My best friend attended a private,christian school and prayed every day. He was also an alcoholic at 16. Not the school’s fault, but even he said his friends had better access to drugs than any of us in the public school. Sure the standards are different, but kids are kids Lisa, regardless of where you choose to “indoctrinate” them. We have to try to educate everyone in the public schools, including those who have been raised in violent homes. So, yes, we have to be a little more attentive. If you choose to stay in private school, that’s great. Let us do what we have to do by law and leave us alone. We’re doing what we can with what we have. And guess what, our kids go out and become doctors, lawyers, and even teachers IN PRIVATE AND PUBLIC SCHOOLS TOO!!

By Dan

October 6, 2005 10:58 AM | Link to this

Couldn’t have siad it better myself HStchr. Some people have to get off their high horse and smell the coffee.

By HStchr

October 6, 2005 11:03 AM | Link to this

Dan—after 16 years, I guess I’m a tad bit p****** about the constant attacks on public education these days by those who are not in it but think they know alllll about it.

By Dan

October 6, 2005 11:16 AM | Link to this

HStchr. Armchair quarterbacks. Sit back and pick apart every decision after the fact. look at the world through monoculars. Only see what they want to see and the way they want to see it.

By RF

October 6, 2005 11:29 AM | Link to this

Lee—you out there?? You might also want to think about this: shouldn’t schools be “anti-gun”? You sound like you’re saying we should allow the NRA to come in and teach some marksmanship classes or something. It’s not about propaganda,it’s about protecting kids. How many Columbines do we need? One was more than enough for me!

By Lee

October 6, 2005 11:30 AM | Link to this

HStchr: Again, I ask you to cite the Ga Code so that I can look it up.

But I disagree. It is about politics and indoctrination. The legislature passes a law and some high ranking school official goes off on an anti-gun tangent and imposes their political views onto the schools - all in the name of child safety. If schools were serious about child safety around guns, they would implement the NRA’s Eddie Eagle program. After all, who better to talk about gun safety than the gun experts. But no, the schools would rather demonize the gun and suspend a student for an untold number of days while the school officials “investigate.” Twenty five years ago, we had a rifle team and actually had shooting competitions. Nowadays, a teacher sees a picture of a gun in a catalogue on drawn on paper, and they go into convulsions.

I love it when you said “…if you hadn’t launched the attack on the public schools, I wouldn’t be attacking private schools”. Nothing like a little t**-for-tat, eh?

I still stand by my earlier comment about these “zero tolerance” rules. They do nothing but allow school officials from having to make a decision. Of course, after observing some of the decisions these officials make, maybe they are right by not allowing them to make a decision.

By Lee

October 6, 2005 11:36 AM | Link to this

HStchr, per your prevous comment: “…after 16 years, I guess I’m a tad bit p****** about the constant attacks on public education these days by those who are not in it but think they know alllll about it.”

My response is that you don’t have to be a CPA to know that the tax code is a mess…..

By Dan

October 6, 2005 11:37 AM | Link to this

Lee wake up. We live in a different world now. we cannot go back to 25 years ago. I wish we could because back then. More people were behind their schools and discipline was done in the home and at school.

By Ronda

October 6, 2005 11:43 AM | Link to this

I was actually a student in my junior year at Roswell High School when this happened. I didn’t know the girl personally to judge if she was the type to actually carry out what she wrote in her journal. I think the teacher was right by taking her journal from her if she was writing in it and being disrespectful by not paying attention in class. However I don’t think the teacher or anyone else had the right to read her journal. But seeing as they did read it I can’t really blame them for suspending her because its really hard now days to know what people are capable and committed to doing. Hopefully she will take it as a lesson learned.

By Lee

October 6, 2005 11:48 AM | Link to this

RF, I’m not defending the perpetrators at Columbine, but it is my understanding that they were harrassed and bullied for quite some time prior to their murderous escapade. I’m sure it was against Colorado law to bring guns and bombs onto school grounds, but hey, its easier to focus on that than it is to work on the underlying problem.

By RF

October 6, 2005 12:05 PM | Link to this

Lee- SB74, SB51 address school safety plans. You might find those interesting as 74 requires private schools to have safety plans as well. Title 16, article 11 if I remember correctly has to do with weapons in public places including schools. I think title 20 also has some information. I’ll look up the memos we’ve gotten if I have one and share any other information available.

You mention common sense. Don’t you think common sense would say that after an incident like Columbine HS you shouldn’t have live ammo of any kind in a school? Where were you when that happened? Seems like “common sense” to me that we would require teachers to report suspicious activities. I know it sounds like a knee-jerk reaction, but think about it. Gun catalog= interest/curiosity. This means you might have a kid who wants to buy a gun. Gun=violence/possible threat to school. Zero tolerance doesn’t always work, but wouldn’t you rather we err to the side of caution where children’s safety is concerned? Believe it or not, zero tolerance isn’t as bad as it used to be. You can bet there’s more to the diary story or gun catalog story that can’t be told due to privacy laws.

Convulsions?? haven’t done that in a while. The mind-altering meds they have me on to make be obey Big Brother’s rules keep that from happening…

By RF

October 6, 2005 12:09 PM | Link to this

Lee—if you know so much, run for governor and fix it. Or better yet, BECOME A TEACHER AND CHANGE THE WORLD! Those who trash the system couldn’t do it for a week. Come on in, we’ll gladly put you to work.

Oh yeah, those code sections I think also mention bullying. Look in a public school agenda notebook (most have them) and there is information about bullying. Another result of Columbine—legislation about bullying. What code does your private school have about bullying/violence/weapons? Don’t tell me prayer and rigor. Can you quote specific information from your school about these?

By Carla

October 6, 2005 12:50 PM | Link to this

This girl was in art class when her diary was confiscated. If you can’t epress yourself there, where can you?

As for OTHER disciplinary problems, we need to incorporate corporal punishment again. I’m 31, and we had no gun or terroist threats when teachers and princiapls could paddle!

By dan

October 6, 2005 01:05 PM | Link to this

Carla- I went to school at that time too and corporal punishment worked then. It wouldn’t work today “you can’t put your hands on my child” Teachers have nothing to hold over the heads of children anymore to get them to behave. Paddle was a deterant to misbehavior right then and there. Now we have to either call home and talk to a parent which could take some time. Or we write the kids up and have the administrators punish them. However, if we have “too many” write ups we are said to have poor classroom management. It’s a joke and don’t think the kids don’t know how things work. They do. Finally, after the administrator punishes them if they or their parents don’t like the punishment then sue. Good lessons learned at home.

By Lisa

October 6, 2005 01:23 PM | Link to this

Okay, lets take off the blinders people. We all know kids do things, say things, and are mischevious to a certain point, no matter how good of a student he or she may be. I’m sure she was directing her comment to a teacher and just happened to get caught. I am a mother and we all want to protect our children, however, we have to accept the fact that even our children can be wrong. And…when they are, we have to let them accept the consequences no matter how painful. We can all judge and we can all armchair quarterback, but teachers/administrators today have a reason to be fearful and based on what has happened in schools across the nation, so what if they overreact just a tad. I think today’s youth are different than the youth of the olden days. Obviously she was guilty of some wrong doing, hence the suspension. I think she should be happy it wasn’t as bad as it could’ve been. Why is it such a pressing need to sue now? Oh, daddy’s little girl wants a clean record prior to college. She should’ve thought about that before she let her pen do the talking. Mom, Dad, it’s called growing up- and tough love. Painful lessons in life cause us to think things through when faced with similar situations.

By coco

October 6, 2005 01:25 PM | Link to this

in regards to Mellllll2. while i agree with you in saying a black male student would not get the support of the masses. i have to say i don’t feel she is getting preferential treatment because the school didn’t decide to lower her punishment on their own she and her parents had to make noise about it. it is unfortunate that some children do not have families to support them this way. But still its not preferential that she does, its a blessing

By Lee

October 6, 2005 01:43 PM | Link to this

RF, SB51 and SB74 sound more like School Board policy. You are right thought that Ga Code 16-11 addresses weapons in public schools. What is interesting is that 16-11-127.1 specifically excludes “Participants in organized sport shooting events or firearms training courses.” Now then, since Ga Law says that you can have “sport shooting events or firearms training courses” on school grounds, does it make sense that it would also say that you couldn’t have a gun catalogue on school grounds. I didn’t think so…

I will agree with you that a gun catalogue does indicate an “interest or curiousity” in firearms. So, I ask you this, does an interest in a lawful activity consitute grounds for school expulsion. That was my original point. HStchr said that he/she reported a student who was subsequently suspended for merely having a gun catalogue.

No, I still stand by my original post that some school administrator has an anti-gun political position and tried to impose their political viewpoint on the school system.

You also said “I know it sounds like a knee jerk reaction….” See, even you realize that it doesn’t make sense.

By Lee

October 6, 2005 02:30 PM | Link to this

(I’m a different Lee)

If the diary was a personal, private diary, then it should have been left at home. If class was so boring that she had to write in it during class, then that is between the student and teacher to keep the students attention.

That being said, I feel the school over-reacted in the situation. Writing covers a broad range of topics, and sometimes violence is present in the writings. (The Sixth Sense plagiarizing here) People don’t look at you funny if you draw smiling faces and rainbows. (end plagiarism) But unfortunately, you get sent to the principals office if you go out of their narrowly focused topics. God forbid you show creativity enough to be the next Stephen King.

By RF

October 6, 2005 02:45 PM | Link to this

Lee- you read 16-11-127. RE-read 127.1 and it clearly outlines a “school safety zone” within which no weapon is allowed. Competitive shooting events haven’t been allowed in GA schools that I know of in a very long time. Those things are offered, but not on any public school grounds I know of. Even if they were, noone would be allowed to carry a weapon with them around the school. If you find a public school that offers competitive shooting, let me know. We have some gangs in Clayton county that might be interested in transferring…

Now, you have to let go of the “some school administrator”. Either find one and name him/her, or admit there isn’t one. I have been in the profession for 16 years, and I haven’t met one yet that went outside of state law and state or local board policy to develop some mysterious “anti-gun” policy or any other policy to arbitrarily allow him/her to suspend students. It just doesn’t work that way, so find another angle to argue. As extreme as it seems, we are TRYING to be careful and protect kids. It’s not an easy thing to do, and we can no longer afford to say “well that’s all right- he didn’t mean to…”

I think it makes perfect sense. I’ll grant you it seems reactionary, but how else do we find the ones who are serious about violence? They ain’t wearing signs or announcing on the intercom that they plan to shoot-up the school.

So, does your private school have a safety plan or guidelines for handling threats? Do they have a policy for dealing with threats? I answered your questions as best I could, sooooo….

By jakesdad

October 6, 2005 02:46 PM | Link to this

Ronda: since you went to that school I’m curious what the reputation of the teacher was(/is) from the students’ perspective. I’ve been out of school for almost 20 yrs but as I recall you (as a student) can figure out within a couple of classes if a given teacher is going to treat you like adults (provided you act that way to them) vs. which have political agenda(s), are petty tyrants, etc. based on what you know about this teacher are you inclined to give benefit of the doubt or is this someone who likes to “beat their chest”?

By I_Teach

October 6, 2005 03:17 PM | Link to this

Robert…

YES….COLLEGES DO LOOK AT DISCIPLINE RECORDS!

okay, now to stop screaming. A child I know lost a full 4 yr scholarship after an incident that left said child expelled and in the alternative school.

So, you are wrong, my friend. Colleges do not accept everyone!

By Lee

October 6, 2005 03:34 PM | Link to this

RF - this whole thread we have been having was initiated when Iteach stated that he/she reported a student who was subsequently suspended for merely having a gun catalogue. HStchr also interjected that “The law clearly states that ANY potential violent tendency, including a gun catalog, MUST BY LAW, be reported and investigated.”

I think this whole thing is absurd and have been asking for specific references to the Ga Law that requires a teacher to report a student’s possession of a gun catalogue. No one has been able to cite this law.

Now then, as far as “some school administrator”, give me the name of the school system and we can probably figure it out. Since it is not a Ga Law, and I can find no reference to it in the Ga DOE website, then it probably was passed down by some local school administrator.

You can cry “We’re trying to protect the children” all you want. My experience is that school administrators are more interested in covering their a##. But hey, the football team’s doing well so the masses are happy.

By RF

October 6, 2005 03:56 PM | Link to this

Now, I’ll agree about CYA!! I’ve worked for a few like that. You have to understand and accept that no local board or school can make up policies like that. Local board policies have to work with state policies. I’m on the inside here, so trust me on this one. We can’t make this stuff up. I’m willing to concede that an individual principal has SOME interpretive leeway, but he has to have the support of the local and state board rules to back him up. I have seen principals overruled by boards too.

No sarcasm or venom intended here—I’m honestly curious what your private school policy is on a situation like we’ve discussed.

By RF

October 6, 2005 04:26 PM | Link to this

Lee—I asked about the gun catalogue, and my asst. principal said she wouldn’t have pursued that one unless it was a student with a discipline history indicating a tendency to be violent or angry. I would think there’s more to the story than we’re hearing besides administrative foolishness, but perhaps… I asked about the mandatory reporting, and she said it is covered under legislation (some I’ve read and you’ve read today) about safe school environments and legislation about terroristic threats. The state board standards are in the school safety guide at www.ga.doe.org Click on the dropdown menu under offices and program areas and scroll down to school safety. Now if a kid has a history of violent tendencies and has a gun catalog, then we have reason to investigate.

No, to answer your question, there is no specific rule about a gun catalog, but it does fall under the jurisdiction of school safety as outlined by the state DOE. No local madmen making these choices, trust me. As a teacher, I would consider the kid carrying the catalog and report it with information about his behavior and anything he might have said about it. It’s not black and white believe me.

By Lee

October 7, 2005 10:29 AM | Link to this

RF, I read through the material on the DOE website. Sorry, I just don’t see anything that would lead me to believe that you should suspend a student for merely possessing a gun catalog.

On a humorous note, getting back to the original topic of this blog, could you imagine what it would be like if Stephen King were in school today? Talk about sending an administrator into convulsions…..

By RF

October 7, 2005 11:20 AM | Link to this

Lee— I’ve taught a few very much like him, and it is a hoot!! It takes a lot of patience and understanding to know when a student is just being a normal kid or when he’s crossing the line. As you have realized, there is no clearly marked line, and it depends on the kid, the teacher, the principal. Seems after my search that the teacher with the gun catalog went a little far. But yeah, I’ve known principals who would have had a stroke over some of the stuff Stephen King wrote. Imagine a teacher picking up a notebook with a draft of “Carrie” in it!!