Get Schooled

By Julian Graham

September 13, 2005 09:25 AM | Link to this

This is just another example of the “Catch 22” profession that teaching has become. The two main concerns in education are test scores and attendance. As long as old sleepy is present and can pass the CRCT things are fine.

By Karen Armsby

September 13, 2005 09:34 AM | Link to this

The ‘hands off’ policy appears to be another ridiculous rule that schools use to limit the threat of lawsuits. Common sense has been abandoned! The real world is full of hand shakes and hugs and pats on the arm and back slap attaboys of appreciation.

By Funk Gee

September 13, 2005 09:41 AM | Link to this

A leader of a workshop for new teachers. Boy there’s a fun job. Am I allowed to say “boy” or is that unthoughtful?

By Teacherman

September 13, 2005 11:07 AM | Link to this

Common sense and public education? HA! Now, ya know … everything we do in public education is “researched based” … that’s why the “Whole Language” approach to reading and the “Middle School Concept” are so successful. Trust in the scholars and the politicians … they know better! Okay … enough of the sarcasm.

What is the purpose of American public education? C’mon, now. Don’t get too deep. This is a social studies question. Remember Thomas Jefferson’s belief (based on the philosphies of Locke, Rosseau, et al)? You know … people CAN successfully govern themselves and actively participate in a democracy. Are we still driven by the same purpose? I would say absolutely not. Public education is the BEST avenue for politicans to create platforms. Why? Because most people are un-educated about education. For example … why in the world do Georgians use SAT scores as a means to measure our schools’ performances? If you do not understand why this is ridiculous … then YOU might be un-educated about education!

So how does all of this tie in to today’s topic? I guess it doesn’t, at least not directly. Public education has become a politically-driven Leviathan … the only thing meaner and nastier is government itself. Public education has become a paper-work laden, “cover-our-butts” institution.

I want to offer you a solution … but I have none. I have vented. That’ll do me for awhile.

By HStchr

September 13, 2005 11:19 AM | Link to this

The day I quit giving hugs when they are needed or a friendly pat on the shoulder is the day I quit teaching. I believe anyone who is paying attention to kids knows which ones can be touched and which can’t. I have some I’m convinced get so few hugs and so little encouragement anywhere else. I feel compelled to offer a quick, light hug just to affirm that I believe in them and their value as a human being. We’re so afraid of lawsuits, but how many have happened in reality?? I’m not talking about full-body grabbing hug, but a simple arm around the shoulder side-be-side hug. That’s always worked for me and I’ll keep taking the chance.

By OldSchool

September 13, 2005 11:51 AM | Link to this

I’m with HStchr because sometimes a quick hug or pat on the back is just what a student really needs. Only once in my 31 years of teaching high school have I had a student ask me not to give him a pat and I respected that. He evidently changed his mind later in the year when he hugged me on his way out.

Along the same line, my students came in Monday with the news that no longer will signs urging the team to “Beat the Bulldogs” or “Pound the Pirates” be allowed on the fences around the stadium because it will make the other team feel bad.

We are sadly disconnecting ourselves from each other…and I need a hug.

By HStchr

September 13, 2005 11:59 AM | Link to this

Old School—hasn’t political correctness just ruined us? What used to be so simple has become so complicated because we must always worry about offending. What a shame! We’re systematically dehumanizing the profession and thus the world.

By Lucinda

September 13, 2005 01:26 PM | Link to this

Oh c’mon now, are some - not all - teachers really so afraid of a lawsuit that they actually follow this rule? Or is it really just another excuse to complain about their jobs? Step up and make it happen or find a new career. I’m sick of hearing all the whining.

By GW

September 13, 2005 01:32 PM | Link to this

Female teachers can get away with the hug or pat but for the male teacher it’s not worth taking the chance. The girls may take it as flirting and the boys may want to fight. The list of “don’t do its” gets longer every year.

By GW

September 13, 2005 01:37 PM | Link to this

Teachers are less afraid of lawsuits than they are the aggravation of whining parents and administrators that will hang them out to dry. Administrators have no tenure and they tend to look for every reason why the teacher caused the problem. Who can blame them?

By T.R.

September 13, 2005 01:44 PM | Link to this

Teacherman - I have a great solution for you - Homeschooling! Statistically speaking, our kids are smarter, happier, and have more fulfilling family lives.

I would recommend reading “Dumbing us Down” by John Taylor Gatto, your post was practically an advertisement for it.

By GW

September 13, 2005 01:49 PM | Link to this

Homeschooling is fine by me. That means less kids that we can’t touch. You would be the first one to howl. Nothing we do in the public schools is right so T.R. has his kids in the best place for all of us.

By Leia

September 13, 2005 01:52 PM | Link to this

Lucinda - this is a record! 1:26 before someone accuses teachers of “whining.”

I definitely follow the rule of no touching. I look very young for my age, and every year a male student develops a crush on me. There is no way I would ever exacerbate the situation by any physical contact, no matter how innocent it would be in my eyes.

We are not whining. We have legitimate concerns. One of my co-workers got officially reprimanded because he grabbed a girl’s jacket when she tried to run away from him as she was being questioned about drug possession. She got away and “lost” her stash, and he has a black mark in his personnel files.

You do the math.

By Leia

September 13, 2005 01:58 PM | Link to this

TR - I teach A.P. Statistics, and I’m always looking for real-life data to use in the classroom. Would you please tell me where I could find the statistics that homeschooled students are “smarter, happier” and “have better family lives”?

Thanks in advance!

By The Coach

September 13, 2005 02:09 PM | Link to this

Just from my own experience, most of the students I’ve had that left public school to be home schooled were the ones who were not on a high enough level(emotionally and intellectually) to succeed in a school with any standards. These kids would leave the evil public institution and enter the home school world were momma and daddy couldnt do the work either. Ah well, these kids weren’t gonna take the SAT anyway.

On the touching note, I think schools were alot better when touching was allowed. The kind when a teacher could provide the physical contact and warming sensation associated with a paddle and a behind. Just my two cents!

By t

September 13, 2005 02:17 PM | Link to this

I see many comments about common sense and education. The fact is that most of this ridiculous policies come from parent complaints. Think on that one.

By abc

September 13, 2005 02:56 PM | Link to this

As a parent, I agree with ‘hands off’ policies. I don’t want teachers using their own discretion as to what’s appropriate touching and what isn’t, just as noone in any workplace would like for their coworkers or bosses to do so. Hands off, what do you need to touch them for?

By Maya

September 13, 2005 03:04 PM | Link to this

You’re absolutely right, abc. There is no reason for me ever to touch one of my students. So, when I don’t wake little Johnny up with a gentle nudge - you’ll know why. When I don’t attempt to separate Johnny and Bobby up from a potential fight - you’ll know why. And when Heather is bawling her eyes out because her boyfriend dumped her the day after her dog got killed - please understand that I will not attempt to rub her shoulders to make her feel better.

As long as you understand that I’m not mean and insensitive, but, just following the rules that the parents have dictated to me!

By Hannah

September 13, 2005 03:09 PM | Link to this

I don’t get it. Parents are up in arms if a teacher touches their children, but, coaches can yell, curse, and call these same kids all kinds of names,and parents won’t bat an eyelash!

By OldSchool

September 13, 2005 03:22 PM | Link to this

Lucinda, (I was going to say “My dear Lucinda” but wanted to avoid a lawsuit.)as with all written words, the “human element” of emotion is missing from my post. I was merely making an observation; I do NOT whine. When one of my students has a “Eureka!” moment, we all get caught up in the joy and he or she will get many pats on the back. Fortunately, I teach in a wonderful small town where that isn’t a bad thing.

I still believe that we are disconnecting from one another more each day. We talk to machines instead of humans; we chat online instead of in person; we don’t want to be touched even in the most compassionate way. I don’t awaken sleeping students (I have very few who sleep) because they know I won’t. My program is individualized and they can make up the work after school if they choose and IF I can stay.I do not repeat lectures or demonstrations but will share my notes…after school.

And I DO NOT whine. I love what I do…even when I have to deal with people like you.

By sea

September 13, 2005 04:39 PM | Link to this

I am a parent as well as a substitute teacher. Going another step further, I am also currently working on my education degree. I enjoy reading this blog and have refrained from commenting until now! No one has the right to comment on anything that pertains to what a teacher puts up with on a day to day basis until that person has spent at least one day in a classroom. In the 3 years I have been subbing, I have encountered situations that are so ridiculous, for example I subbed for a class with a student that no one was allowed to say anything whatsoever that would be even remotely considered negative. Now, I firmly believe that positive reinforcement is the way to go, however there does come a time when words like: stop, don’t and no are appropriate. Give me a break! So because the parents decide to let their children walk all over them, they believe they should be allowed to walk all over everyone else?! Come on people! These teachers are doing this because they love the children. Yes they have bad days, but that is true for any job and just like anyone else they have to vent. We, as parents, should take into consideration what these teachers do for our children. For every bad child, there is at least 4 good children and that in itself is worth it! So don’t tell a teacher to stop whining until you have walked a mile in their shoes!!

By Robert

September 13, 2005 05:03 PM | Link to this

Sorry, but this is not whinning but a real concern for teachers. A math teacher at my school was fired last year for “touching” a student to wake her. I know this math teacher and when he told me that he just “tapped” I do believe that he really did just tap her.

She, of course, started crying out of embarrasment that then turned into “he hit me on the head.” From there, the student went home to mommy and said that her math teacher was punching her in the head. Of course the mother filed charges. In response, the school system fired the teacher to prevent a law suit. I am sure that the teacher could have fought the machine (with great effort), but why bother? Yes, there were witnesses, but some of the kids in the room even exagerated beyond the “charges” that were filed (imagine that! kids exagerating!).

As a good, qualified, experienced math high school teacher he was quickly able to find work in another school system. The school lost out and the students lost out on a good teacher, and the teacher had to change jobs and move.

So then, what are teachers to do? I think this sort of thing happens more in some high schools and less in elementary, but you never know….

By Swangirl

September 14, 2005 08:50 AM | Link to this

Years ago, I might have “pooh poohed” the debate over teachers having to be hands off with students as being overboard but I’m a believer now.

I have a friend who started teaching in Gwinnett a few years ago and she told me about the training new teachers get. It can be intimidating when a school official tells you that if you touch a student in any way, shape or form you must face the possibility of becoming a defendant in a lawsuit. The guy was doing a PowerPoint presentation and even put up a slide on the screen that said DEFENDANT in huge red letters.

So I totally understand why teachers don’t literally pat students on the back any more. How can you know that’s not going to happen to you and that your career’s not going to go down the drain?

By Lee

September 14, 2005 09:14 AM | Link to this

Using a paddle or yard stick to wake a sleeping student should eliminate the threat of lawsuits for touching. A former LHS coach used his paddle to not only wake sleeping students up but also to embarass them in front of their classmates. Education requires discipline or our test scores will never climb out of the cellar.If students don’t study and pass they should be held back like in the old days. This would be embarrassing so bleeding hearts will never allow it.

By HStchr

September 14, 2005 09:50 AM | Link to this

abc—do you ever hug your children? I could quote studies (but I’ll spare us the length) that have documented the importance of touch as a tool of reinforcement for children. Thinking back, I can’t imagine what I would have done without an occasional pat on the shoulder from some of my high school teachers. I would never touch a child to wake him or in a disciplinary situation, but I have always found that kids like to shake hands or have a high-five or get a pat on the shoulder when they do something good. I guess I’ll walk that tightrope—I’ve always had kids in my classes who needed a touch of some kind to encourage them.

By Amy

September 14, 2005 11:37 AM | Link to this

I’m a education major and I have 3 more years left. This makes me sad that it’s come to this but I had to buy liablity insurance just to student teach for 10 hours this semester.

By abc

September 14, 2005 01:54 PM | Link to this

HStchr: of course I hug my children, I’m their parent. I DON’T WANT TEACHERS HUGGING MY CHILDREN. It’s inappropriate. That’s what I mean about not wanting teachers to determine what’s appropriate touching and what’s not. I don’t think that just because they’re a teacher, a person somehow has better judgement about something like that, and suggesting that you’d HUG a student proves the point.

By dmp

September 14, 2005 03:30 PM | Link to this

My daughter does not like to be touched unless she invites it (kind of like a cat), even with friends and relatives. She is clear about this when people touch her.

She had a male teacher in 8th grade who liked to touch - rub shoulders, hug, etc. He also liked to give the girl students pet names. She did not like her pet name, and did not like the touching, and told him so, but both continued.

When she told me how uncomfortable she was with this, I emailed him and asked him, politely, not to touch her or call her anything but her name. He called me the next morning to tell me that he liked to give hugs as encouragement, and the pet names were signs of endearment. I reiterated that my daughter would prefer to not be touched or called anything but her name. He acted like there was something wrong with both of us.

From that point on, he did not call her by the pet name…or any name. She said it was like she had become invisible. He refused to call on her, or acknowledge her.

I agree - do not touch a student, at least after about the 2nd grade. Not every child is able to tell an authority figure that they don’t want to be touched, or deal with the retaliation my daughter experienced.

By Iteach

September 14, 2005 04:56 PM | Link to this

This is a great subject. In my High School we have walk through observations weekly now since we are an “at risk school” for the thrid year. This is the third week I’ve had it notated that I’ve had “X” students asleep.

I teach science and we have lab tables. My general procedure is when I first see a head go down comment hand have them raise their heads. (OK that works for 20 seconcs). When their head goes back down I tell them to stand by their desk (use to atleast). You see, last year a parent claimed that their child was sick and standing made it so bad that she had to take them to the hospital so I was turned into hamburger and told I couldn’t do that. Next step still, bump the table and have them raise their heads - I was berated because the child told their parent that they (the child) thought they were having a heart attack when they were awakened :-). The week befor last since we were doing gravitational potential energy and I was at the point where I demonstrate the affect of height I managed to drop the book right next to the student right as the observer was coming to my door - note on observation - demeaned child by drawing attention to their inapprobriate behavior - but no sleepers.

We feel the burn of being under the microscope. We can spend half of our time waking children. We can’t refer them to the office for sleeping but we can assign endless detentions (the paper work takes time and it’s supposed to be done immediately). We can’t touch them, or demean them by finding some not contact way to wake them. We must show that we have called the parent at least 3 times for sleeping to send the sleeper to detention. Yet, when we are observed we get notes for spending time off of instruction or having the child sleep. This year our annual evaluations will have a section where they total these weekly comments.

I love the comment just be more entertaining and they won’t go to sleep. Former students have made comments that I mix entertainment into the class well. My last comment to the observer was not noted on my sheet but Chris Rock gets millions to be funny and entertaining I get far less.

All of this over sleeping - and this is before we even get to the student performance and teacher effectiveness evaluation.

By Iusedtoteach

September 26, 2005 01:28 PM | Link to this

Iteach, I totally feel your pain. I came into teaching from the science field (chemist in industry for 7 years)because I thought I wanted to teach children. It turns out I would like to teach kids, but all this other stuff (like you mention) makes it so painful that it just isn’t worth it to me. I would say teaching is up there with police officers in terms of stress and lack of respect…but teachers have a constant microscope on them nearly every minute at work. “Makes me wanna holler, throw up both my hands…”