Get Schooled

By Snoozer

September 12, 2005 11:19 AM | Link to this

When I was in high school 5 years ago, I was a random snoozer. Not everyday but I caught a nap or two. I was woken up once or twice. I think if it becomes cronic then a parent should be notified. If it only randomly occurs, wake the child and continue class. Just don’t make a huge scene about it. The last thing you want to do is embarass them in front of their peers.

By Jake

September 12, 2005 11:32 AM | Link to this

Perhaps those that really excel at it can be recognized with ‘sleeper of the year awards’ alongside their supportive teachers who will be getting ‘babysitter of the year awards’. The last thing you want to do is embarass them in front of their peers. My question is why should the teachers bother to wake them up? Four years of rest should prepare them well for life in our entitlement society.

By Teacher

September 12, 2005 11:54 AM | Link to this

As a high school teacher, here is how I see it. Sometimes students don’t feel well and can’t go home, so I let them rest. The problem is that some students try to sleep every day, no matter how interesting or motivating class is. Unfortunately, I have approximately one student per year who is biding their time until they can drop out. I don’t care what their long term goal is, they will not have nap time in my class every day. It is insulting and I think they deserve to be embarassed. I’ve been known splash some with water…

By DB

September 12, 2005 12:03 PM | Link to this

They’re responsible for the information. If they decide to sleep, it’s their problem. When they get out into the real world and get caught sleeping on the job, we all know what happens. But, unfortunately, our society makes it tougher for the teacher to discipline kids, which is what they need because it’s not happening at home. Our public schools, instead of teaching them about real life, shelter them from real life. I teach, so you bet I wake them up. And, sorry, the embarassment argument doesn’t hold water. Reminding a kid to wake up is simply, well, reminding them. If any embarassment arises, the kid sleeping is embarassing his/her own self. That’s how life works people. No matter how tired or bored I was in school, I never fell asleep. Why? It’s because it’s disrespectful, and the teacher would have slammed a book on the desk right beside you or shouted at me. Some call that embarassing, but I call that a reminder of real life, and I thank my teachers for caring to “embarass” us. Also, people tend to respect those type of teachers because they respect you in a way by not letting you act like a bum. I’m so sick of the “coddling” of our kids. No wonder 25 year-olds still act like they’re 15.

By DB

September 12, 2005 12:10 PM | Link to this

And, of course, we’re talking about chronic sleepers here, not the kids who are tired about once per year and do the occasional head-bob. Besides, the head-bobbers embarass themselves because all the kids watch that person.

By Robert

September 12, 2005 12:15 PM | Link to this

I do not define sleepers as students that are ill. That is a different issue. Sleepers are students that do not pay attention and/or will not do any work. The teacher doesn’t want them to talk to other students and so the student sleeps.

As a teacher, I am not allowed to touch the students. So I cannot even tap them on their shoulder to wake them. I can yell, tap the desk, or even shake the desk to wake them. If a student sleeps, I wake them once or twice and beyond that, I send the student to the administration with a note for THEM to find somewhere for the student to sleep.

The administration gets angry at teachers if they see a student with their head down in the classroom. So, I let the sleeping student become the problem for the administration.

My school administration is usually good and so they will give the student morning detention or some other light punishment.

By Linda R.

September 12, 2005 12:15 PM | Link to this

Sleeping in class is unacceptable.

For a first occurance, the educators should discuss sleeping with the student/s.

After this, the parent should be notified.

I had a science teacher tell me that my son should get more sleep at night. He mentioned that my son had been sleeping in class for the past couple of weeks. I explained that I was annoyed that this was not brought to my attention sooner.

The actual problem… my son taking a “non-drowsy” allergy medication. “Non-drowsy” can make some people sleep! The teacher apologized.

My point is that by contacting the parent you can rule out medication and/or sickness.

There are many reasons kids may sleep in class:

Eg. some of them get up late… and play video games.
problems at home. stress

By HStchr

September 12, 2005 12:53 PM | Link to this

Teacher—I’ve seen one teacher forced to retire for splashing a child, so be careful…heaven forbid we treat little Johnny the way he deserves to be treated.

The forces to blame here are poor nutrition, bad schedules, lacadaisical parents, boring teachers, and let’s not forget SOCIETY and THE PRESIDENT. Let’s not dare be politically INcorrect and blame little Johnny for his decisions!

By David200

September 12, 2005 01:21 PM | Link to this

As a teacher, I don’t care if they sleep or not. There are many reasons for sleeping in class. The guy (almost always it’s a boy) could have a full-time job after school to help feed his family, or he could be tired because he stayed up all night playing Nintendo. Whether he’s awake or not, I’m here every day doing the best I can to get the curriculum introduced and taught to the entire class. He is responsible for the information I cover. If he can read the book the night before and learn the material and then sleep in class, I have no problem with it. If he fails the class, he, and he alone, is responsible for his actions. Sometimes there are more important things than getting an education. I believe helping feed his family is one. Some teenager take 5 or 6 years to graduate and end up graduationg from night school. Godd for them! On the other hand, he may believe playing Nintendo is more important. In that case, decisions have consequences. At some time Mommy and Daddy have to let the guy make his own decisions and suffer the consequences of them. It’s part of growing up. Mommy and Daddy protected me when I did stupid things as a teenager. I had to flunk out of college before I found out I was responsible for my actions. I wish I had learned that lesson a lot earlier.

By Leia

September 12, 2005 01:34 PM | Link to this

What I have done in the past, which has proven effective if the parents work with you, is take a digital photo of the sleeper and emailing the photo to the parent.

This gives instant “proof” and the parent can see how disruptive little “Johny” is with his mouth wide open and drool coming out is in the classroom!

By Rick

September 12, 2005 01:45 PM | Link to this

Maybe what we need is a local chapter of Anonymous Student Sleepers(A*). Those suffering from this disease would attend meetings on campus as often as necessary and share their stories with other similarly sleepy students. Discussion topics would range from “Dreams I’ve Had in Science Class” to “I Can’t Believe I Drooled on My Math Book.” Recovery celebration rings with “zzzz” set in either amethyst, sapphire, onxy, garnet, or emerald would of course be available for a nominal fee.

By James McCoy

September 12, 2005 01:47 PM | Link to this

What world do you frayers above live in,you are beginning to sound like the Republicans in Washington who say it’s too bad you where too poor to get out of the way of the Hurricane. And for you who claim to be teachers where is your creativity in teaching kids? CAN’T YOU FIGURE OUT A WAY TO CONTROL YOUR CLASSROOM? It sounds like to me you cold blooded teachers need to apply for a job with FEMA.

By Leia

September 12, 2005 01:58 PM | Link to this

Rick - you are too funny!

James McCoy - I haven’t seen any reponses given from any the teachers to provoke your angry response! What do expect teachers to do - dance and sing? We have to teach the other 27-34 students in the class! We are educators, not entertainers!

By James McCoy

September 12, 2005 02:08 PM | Link to this

MOST OF THE TEACHERS WHO NORMALLY POST HERE ARE WHINERS IN MY OPINION. The word teacher it self says what you are suppose to be capable of doing. My experience with teachers in the public school system is one where I can’t help but draw a conculsion that they are just marking time until retirement.

By teachteach.com

September 12, 2005 02:12 PM | Link to this

As so many have observed, students sleep in class for many reasons, the most common simply being they’re tired. Yes, they may be tired for valid reasons, such as working to support their family or completing their homework, but more often they are tired because they have stayed up too late watching TV, playing video games, talking on the phone, surfing the internet, IMing friends, or working at a job to pay for cool clothes, a car, or extra spending money.

It is not the teacher’s job to figure out the reason the child is sleeping, though certainly a compassionate educator might choose to do so. It is the teacher’s job to appropriately awaken the student (the splash of water could land a teacher in a vat of the hot stuff) and to contact the parents if sleeping in class is a recurring problem for this student. While it might be convenient for some to perceive teachers as “cold-blooded” for not becoming social workers and getting to the heart of the problem, the truth is, high school teachers barely have enough time to manage their classrooms and relay relevant, meaningful, required curriculum to their 100+ students. While we can’t just “let sleeping dogs lie,” the best we can do is wake ‘em up and then move on.

By James McCoy

September 12, 2005 02:13 PM | Link to this

By the way Leia my response wasn’t anger,but pure intolerance of people who complain,instead of getting their hands dirty.

By jennifer

September 12, 2005 02:22 PM | Link to this

My cousin used to sleep in class. Somehow, he always knew the material and always had his homework done on time. Myself, I was always too scared to sleep in class because my parents would have tanned my bottom if not, at the very least, grounded me for eternity. I had another relative who would sleep in class (1st grade) and it was because his homelife absolutely sucked. School was the most quiet that poor thing ever had. It’s a sad situation. I have two high school-age children and one in middle school. My high school children have friends who do not have a bedtime. They are allowed to stay up until whenever, if they even go to bed, and play video games or watch movies. This is what weekends are for. Class time is not the time to sleep. Parents are paying taxes for children to learn; not to sleep. My own children, the high schoolers, are in bed at 10:00 and the middle schooler is in bed at 9:00. Of course, this is flexible if they bring home bad grades etc. 10 can quickly become 9pm etc.

By Tammy

September 12, 2005 02:28 PM | Link to this

Wowie, James McCoy. Teachers need to learn how to control their class? Perhaps you should try to substitute teach for a day. Maybe you might actually see just a small amount as to what teachers face every day.

By James McCoy

September 12, 2005 02:38 PM | Link to this

Thanks but no thanks Tammy,my teaching is done at home so when my kids step into your classroom they are prepared to learn. If my kids acted out of line,which they won’t there is no p*** footing around with timeout or gentle talking. Now if the modern day PC teachers were to take their jobs serious then the problems they have would disappear. But instead what the public gets in their school teachers is want to be principals,who have no ideal how to teach.

By Rick

September 12, 2005 02:39 PM | Link to this

Tammy - Don’t you think it might help to tie some semi-immediate consequence to sleeping in class? I seem to remember Dewey said something like, “Education isn’t a preparation for life, education is life.” Or would say that sleepers are typically those students who have little or no intention of even graduating from high school?

By Jake

September 12, 2005 02:44 PM | Link to this

The Unreal McCoy - James, don’t you remember what happened to Doc Neese when he tried to enforce a little discipline on one of his sleepers? In case you don’t, he got fired due to the parents and administrators. It’s a shame you seem to have more compassion for the NO inner city community than you do for the generally hard working teachers that are so hindered by parents and administrators. People who generally truly care and work hard trying to make a difference in people’s lifes, despite the parents and administrators, are much more deserving of your empathy than those who were merely born victims of poverty and have squatted there ever since.

By James McCoy

September 12, 2005 02:54 PM | Link to this

The inner city kids of most major and some rural systems stay in poverty because they are labeled and forgotten just like the White House did ten days ago. Teachers will earn my respect one by one,but as a whole they don’t deserve to be called teachers,maybe Delta could use them.

By David200

September 12, 2005 03:05 PM | Link to this

James McCoy,

You sound a lot like me 15-20 years ago. I did the same thing with my children. I ran a business and just couldn’t understand teachers not being able to control their classroom. I made a similar statement to a teacher. She immediately told me to shut-up or put-up. I did. Sometime I wish I had shut-up. I’m on my 14th year. There are days when I check the market price on insurance adjusters and compare my salary to theirs and wonder why I got into this low-paying job. Some days, the kids’ eyes lighten up and I get an “Oh, so that’s why…” and I know why I quit and became a teacher.

Believe me, the job “reads a lot easier than it is.” Some days my options are to let the little %^%$ sleep or wake him up. If he sleeps, he’s quiet and doesn’t disturb my class. If I wake him up, he destroys any chance the class has for learning anything. Some days, it’s simple survival, because the administrators don’t want me to send the little %^%$ to them because then they have to talk to the parents who say it’s the school’s fault the child is like this. It’s easier for them to tell us to handle the problem; they’re too busy filling out forms for AYP, and they want someone else to deal with the problem.

Rick, If you’ll remember a Gwinnett teacher tried to make sleeping in class have a consequence a few months ago. the worthless %^%$ was a football player; don’t you remember? That teacher works in Barrow county now. School administrators want problems in the classroom to stay in the classroom. They don’t want any confrontation with a disgruntled parent. Their solution is that it’s the teacher fault. It couldn’t be their’s could it? They make almost twice as much money as a regular teacher, so they have to be a lot smarter, right? Teachers learn to keep their heads down and try to create as little friction as possible.

James, I’m not whining. I’m simply stating facts. If all our parents were like you, we wouldn’t have any problems. You’ve done a good job raising your children. In fact, we fight to get classes with kids like yours. You are to be congratulated for your efforts.

By ladyelaine

September 12, 2005 03:36 PM | Link to this

This is a sad dilemma for most teachers, especially high school teachers. I’ve read most the comments and not one has mentioned what I witnessed in my teaching experience: a certain portion of sleepers were doing so due to marijuana use. It’s one of the tell-tale signs. And sadly, many parents choose denial over “reading the writing on the wall”—lethargy, bloodshot eyes, unexplained and irregular hunger, general lack of motivation…

Sometimes what may seem like “no big deal” when added with other factors, might be a big deal. It’s a responsibility most teachers feel—to “add it up,” but it’s an awkward and difficult suggestion to make, so many don’t. The real frustration comes when the child earns a low grade and the same parents want to contest it…

By David200

September 12, 2005 03:37 PM | Link to this

James, I hate to disagree with you about your beliefs on poverty, but you need to do some reading on the subject. Everyone has an opinion, and they’re like rear ends - everyone has one and no one is better than any others.

There have been many studies done on education and poverty, and in advance, I’ll agree most of them a bogus. Psychologist and sociologists have screwed up the studies in very many cases. However, (and there’s always a however) there seems to be a linkage between poverty and a belief that they are not responsible for what happens to them. In many cases the kids in the inner school do not see the benefits of an education; therefore, they don’t want to “play our game.” They’re not dumb. They can learn; they just choose not to. Anyone who succeeds in getting an education gets out of the inner city and doesn’t come back. Even in the rural areas, I’ve asked our poor kids if they’re coming back home after they graduate college. The universal response is “^&^% no! I’m not hanging around these losers.” The kids only see the athletes escape so that’s what they want to be - an athlete. Until the kids see poor people succeeding from getting an education, we’re stuck with only a few poor kids getting good educations - the ones with parents who value education.

Now if you have any evidence, I’m willing to look at it, but for right now - that’s my story, and I’m sticking to it.

By OSC

September 12, 2005 03:43 PM | Link to this

James, Why don’t you bring that hard A**S attitude down to the ghetto and inspire some of the unemployed, welfare lovers to get a job, instead making the same old tired excuses for them! Why don’t you tell them to take their lives seriously and stop p*** footing around waiting for a handout. Tell them “CAN’T YOU FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET CONTROL OF YOUR LIVES AND GET A JOB!”

I know, instead bash people who actually have a job and are PRODUCTIVE members of society, and who try to HELP the poor you are so sympathetic of!

You come across as the biggest whiner on this blog:

Washington just labeled and forget us! So we’ll just throw our hands up and give up. Boo Hoo! I think a need a cleenex!

By Rick

September 12, 2005 03:47 PM | Link to this

David - I do remember that episode. The administration made the teacher look like an ingrate who just wouldn’t follow school policy. But let’s say a student slept through a test or an in-class assignment that would be graded. Are you required to let the sleeper make it up?

By David200

September 12, 2005 04:29 PM | Link to this

Rick, I’ll bet in Gwinnett, the teacher is required to wake the kid up, and if the teacher doesn’t (especially if the sleeper is an athlete), it’s the teacher’s fault. As far as your question, I’ll bet Gwinnett would let the sleeper make it up and probably force the teacher to curve the test because the student was deprived of his rights to an education because the teacher didn’t wake him up. It’s all about the teacher; nothing about the student A dark, hot place would have to freeze over before I would work in Gwinnett.

As for me, I don’t REQUIRE my kids to do anything - homework included. It’s their option. If they want to sleep, it’s their option. I’m taking the test up at the end of the period. The test starts at the first of the period and ends at the end. I don’t extend the time either. A high school football game is 48 minutes long. After 48 minutes and one team is ahead, the game is over - just like my test. You win or you lose based on how you do on the test that day. If parents complain, I ask them if anyone cares how well a football player practices during the week. I ask how many points are added to the scoreboard for how well the team practiced this week. The parents (and their children)look sullen, but they have no comeback. It’s cold and heartless, but that’s the way the world works. No one cares how much the FEMA director, the Governor, and the mayor cried about New Orleans. No one cares about how much they wanted to do right - they didn’t do their job - someone is going to pay for that failure.

By Jake

September 12, 2005 04:32 PM | Link to this

James, David200, and OSC -In a capitalistic society it is generally true that for adults the home you live in and the car you drive (or don’t have and, therefore, can’t escape the hurricane in)are exactly what you deserve. This is just as true for the teacher whining about his salary as it is for the citizens of NO. Perhaps some of the poor lack academic (or athletic) ability as well as the motivation and drive, or the opportunity to escape their environment. But that doesn’t mean they are entitled to have FEMA and other government agencies provide food, shelter,transportation, and health care for them the rest of their lives. While this is way off the subject, I feel the same way about the sleepers. When did it become the teacher’s responsibility to compensate for whatever personal or social ills may be leading the kids to sleep in class? If they’re not a disturbance, let sleeping dogs lie. If they are, then they should be disciplined as class three behavior violations.

By Sampson

September 12, 2005 04:47 PM | Link to this

James McCoy, If I taught your kids, I’d feed them a whole bunch of caffine, take away a privledge they like and stress them out with a test on a Friday afternoon, just so they could go home and ruin your weekend! You’re a big jerk!

By David200

September 12, 2005 04:50 PM | Link to this

Jake you have a point, but playing Devil’s Advocate, I have to call you on your comment about capitalism. In most cases (you can always find exceptions, Sam Walton comes to mind) the rich got rich the old fashioned way - they inherited it! Check it out if you disagree.

As for your comment about sleepers, you’re preaching to the choir. Rich kids stay rich because of momma and daddy (the Kennedy’s come to mind. Their granddaddy - the bootlegger - saw to that). The only chance the poor and middle income kids have is the hand UP (not OUT) that education gives them. It’s a pity that administrators won’t stand up and throw out the miscreants. It’s a pity they won’t stand up to a juvenile court judge and tell him, “H#$$ no! I’m not putting that under-aged criminal back in school. You can put ME in jail, but I’m not going to cause the other kids to lose out on an education.” It’s a pity, but if they had any intestinal fortitude, they wouldn’t have gotten out of the classroom in the first place.

By Leia

September 12, 2005 04:55 PM | Link to this

Most of the sleepers I come across are not the “poverty-stricken” students. They are the upper class kids who are hooked on prescription drugs or smoking too much weed to stay awake! Of course, their parents blame us for not being “engaging” enough, and end up taking their kids out and putting them in private school while they rehab, and then they come back the next semester.

By Karen Armsby

September 13, 2005 08:36 AM | Link to this

Nodding off occasionally is not the same as a student who regularly puts his head down and sleeps the class away. I would mark that student absent, because his body may be there but his mind is absent. If the teacher has a chronic sleeper, then notify the parents, and maybe if they care, they can find out why.

I have three high school graduates and I know that with the time demands of AP and honors class reading and homework, sports, and other activities, that my kids were often dog tired. If I had known, suspected, or been told that they were smoking pot or drinking, then we would have had a big talk, and they would have been disciplined.

We expect our high school students to learn how to balance activities and behave responsibly, but they aren’t adults yet, and there is plenty of room for our parenting while they are still minors living at home. I have also kept up with my kids in college offering advice (go to class, keep up with the work, and don’t party during the week), but much less as time goes on, and as they are doing quite well.

By Monica

September 13, 2005 10:24 AM | Link to this

I seem to remember a huge AJC story last spring about a science teacher who gave a student a zero for sleeping in class, and he lost his job. Is it any wonder that teachers allow students to sleep with no reperucussion?

By Linda R.

September 13, 2005 12:06 PM | Link to this

In Gwinnett county there is nothing written in terms of how to handle it as a discipline.

However, the teacher lost his job because he gave the sleeping student 50% of the lab grade… despite proof of cheating (you can’t participate in a lab if you are sleeping).

The board said “sleeping is a discipline issue.” This is a loophole that can be used or NOT used to punish a student.

I like the idea of the digital photo. This is fine… as long as the parent is interested in proof. In the above case the parent was NOT interested! He wanted the teacher’s head. He got it! The principal served the teacher up, and the board okayed it.

By Sam

September 13, 2005 12:41 PM | Link to this

• I don’t have sympathy for students who sleep in class. Everyone is looking to blame someone for the child’s wrong doing. However all children know right from wrong and sleeping class is definitely not okay. It doesn’t matter that they have to work to take care of the family or stayed up late or any other bul-crap excuse that people want to make. It all boils down to a matter of caring about making the grade. Doing well. If you sleep you miss the lesson and fail the pop quiz or test. who ever said anything about the ghetto and the working poor. Because if i can recall those kids have more drive; than all the kids who are well off and could care less because mom and dad would pay any price to correct their f*k-ups. Rehabs, tranferring schools to proctect reputations and all other necessary means. People want to hear the truth but never want to except fault or blame. Parent want for children to learn responsibility to prepare them for life, but isn’t it true that experience it the best teacher. So stop treating these kids like it’s okay to sleep away and wake their fannies up. Stop making excuses. Teachers can only devote so much individual time to one student here and there. Life will be much less forgiving to a slacker. I wasn’t allowed to slack and for those reason today do i not stand down or loosen my grip on the reins of life. Tell that to your boss and you’ll see the if you sleep on the job he’ll make sure you’re s.o.l. When does this crap stop. Teachers are teaching but students are choosing not to learn because nine times out of ten their parents aren’t doing enough to correct the problem. They only want to be made aware but not take any action. Poor teachers i tip my hat off to you. All the hours you spend trying to make education better for the entire class then having to cater to the needs of one child whose parent don’t believe it is their fault that kids aren’t learning. I not saying that as a parent you have to be at every school function and every pta meeting. But the only way to keep children from going astray is for the parents to take action an stop freakin blaming it on everyone but themselves.

By granny

September 13, 2005 01:19 PM | Link to this

My grand is being raised by a “mother” who strip dances at night. Takes her to somebody to keep and wakes her at 3:00am to go home, go back to sleep, and tries to wake her again for school. She’s not only sleepy, but often late and hungry! Some people should not be parents.

By Marty

September 13, 2005 01:51 PM | Link to this

To sleep or not to sleep?…that is the question. I say go ahead and let’em snooze away. It actually works out a lot better for the rest of the students that actually give a toot where they’re heading in life. Don’t even waste your water on them, Teacher. That stuffs gonna be getting real expensive soon. The fact is, everyone knows who the lazies are and they’re always going to be lazy. Let them be lazy! It’s kinda funny.

By Poetry

September 13, 2005 01:59 PM | Link to this

There are a lot of elementary school kids going to bed at 10 and 11PM. I hear it all the time from my 10 year old 5th grader. She wants to stay up until 9PM, because all of her friends are allowed to do it. Some of them do not have a bedtime. Many fall asleep in class. It’s not always the parents fault, but in elementary school it is definitely their parents fault.

I grew up with an 8:30pm bedtime Sunday -Thursday and Anytime Friday and 11pm on Saturday.

It’s hard to control highschool students who sleep in class, but I have not found a class considered exciting with any students who fall asleep. If you make it interesting, even the slackers will stay awake.

By David

September 13, 2005 03:09 PM | Link to this

One thing: Just wake the little crapping slackers up!!!