Get Schooled

By dk

April 21, 2005 01:13 PM | Link to this

Cobb has $70 million for laptops but not enough money for NCLB?

By Jake

April 21, 2005 01:39 PM | Link to this

NCLB is a terrible piece of legislation that is part of a right-wing conspiracy to dumb down Americans, so that in the future we will all read at a sixth grade level, and be incapable of thinking independently. The goal is that we will then accept outrageous taxes that transfer even more wealth to the already rich, fight needless wars that primarily benefit other nations, and continue to consume terrible products in large numbers, all without question, because we’ll be too stupid to think for ourselves. Oh wait, we’re doing all that already.

By MS

April 21, 2005 01:45 PM | Link to this

If all political & personal agendas would be put aside, we all know what would help education the most. 1. Discipline back in the classroom even it it meant diciplinary schools for students who misbehave. 2. Smaller class room sizes. (Like anything else with 10’s of thousands of teachers you will have some bad ones. But even a bad teacher will do better with 20 students instead of 30 and just think what the great teachers will be able to do.) 3. Better enviroments to teach and learn with more resourses. The standards and curriculum are good and are being revised to keep up all the time. The big 3 above is what we need. Resolve those three problems expecally the 1st and see how education moves up in American for all children. We waste enough money on the other bull including NCLB to do all three of the above and have money left over to give back to the people who earn it. The taxpayers. But political and personal agendas will have to be put aside for it to ever happen.

By JR

April 21, 2005 02:11 PM | Link to this

NCLB is a way of federalizing the curriculum into a national curriculum. It forces states to monitor what they are teaching. One area I think it also unfairly penalizes schools is with special education populations who do not meet “grade level” standards. Yet it does not consider that one of the main reasons they are in a special education program is because they don’t work on grade level! The intent of accountability is good but the realities of working out the intent needs to be worked on some more….

By LISA

April 21, 2005 02:18 PM | Link to this

I JUST WANT TO SAY THANK YOU JAKE AND DK FOR BEING REALISTIC AND NOT IN THE DARK ABOUT THAT NCLB ACT.THANK YOU PATTI FOR PUTTING THIS ON THE TABLE!! SO THE INTELLIGENT SO CALL NO IT ALL PEOPLE WILL HAVE INFORMATION ON WHAT’S REALLY HAPPENING!!! WE KNOW THE FEW THAT ARE NOT WALKING IN THE DARK!!!THAT NCLB ACT IS ALL ABOUT MONEY!!! THERE JUST USING ONCE AGAIN USING MASS WAR OF DESTRACTION!!! TO SIDETRACK THE DUMB DOWN INTELLIGENT THINKER WHO DOT THERE EYES AND CROSS THERE T’S. WAKE UP BRILLIANT MINDS AND REALIZE THERE TWO TYPE OF PEOPLE TODAY!!! THE HAVE AND THE HAVE NOT!!! PEACE!!!

By Shauna

April 21, 2005 02:19 PM | Link to this

The NCLB law was terrible when it was propsed and it is terrible in practice. I guess the problem is that our representatives obviously don’t care what the people think. I have yet to hear from someone who agrees with the NCLB law. It takes all power out of the hands of teachers. They are stressed so they are stressing the children. They probably don’t even know that they are doing it either. I feel bad for them. Parents should speak up and scream and holler at their local governments to start to change this stupid law.

When we were growing up, if you didn’t get the information you failed and tried again next year. Or you went to summer school. Everyone is so obsessed with not hurting a child’s feelings that they are letting them get away with not learning. That is not fair to the kids who study hard and to parents who make sure that their kids are studying hard. It basically tells the kids that it doesn’t matter how hard you work. The truth is that it does matter. When these kids get into the work force, their bosses are not going to have a No Employee Left Behind rule. If you don’t get the work done, you get fired. They aren’t going to care about your feelings. Kids need to learn early in life that no one owes them anything.

The law is terrible and needs to be changed.

By Britt

April 21, 2005 02:54 PM | Link to this

To LISA: I have read the points that you make on other blogs as well as this one…the problem with you is: you make wonderful statements that could potentially have great meaning…BUT you make yourself seem very uneducated. In your above post you do not properly use “there” “they’re” or “their” you use “there” throughout your whole message. Not saying that you are not educated but it is adults who write as you do that make people in the education field and higher at a higher power believe that us Americans have not been properly educated. Therefore, they feel the need to test,test,test the children of the present. Granted they do not need to continue tons of testing-they need to employ capable teachers that are willing to teach properly. I am not trying to put you down or make you seem “dumb” but people higher than us have their views for a reason. When they read something like that..it has tons of grammar errors and miss use of word associations that they think “what are her kids learning from that? Do her kids know the difference in words and their meanings? How does she look in a professional stand point? How will her kids learn to properly communicate when in the professional world?…” Therefore, they get the assumption that they are not doing their jobs and they need to prove to themselves that they are..so they continue to develop new tests such as the CRCT..they raise the bar for SAT and so forth. Instead of making complaints about such topics you should take the time to get yourself educated so you can teach your kids what you feel they are not getting from schools and all the testing.

By LISA

April 21, 2005 03:06 PM | Link to this

Please Brittany!!! can you take you time to deal with the issue not with trying to correct me.I mean I appreciate you observing all my short coming with grammar!! However stick with the topic not me, Sister I’am I been out of school for over 20yrs.And I don’t claim to be a professor but i do have wisdom. Something I see you don’t have as of yet!!! BUT KEEP IT COMING!! I LOVE THE ENERGY!!!

By Sly

April 21, 2005 03:13 PM | Link to this

Yep - NCLB is a conspiracy - and I was in on it. I just want to make more money on knuckleheads like Jake and the beautiful mind of LISA. Thanks for the extra $. Everybody else out there - are these the kind of radical flame throwers (who probably pay minimal income taxes) that you want determining your fate? Like you can’t determine it yourself. C’mon.

By Britt

April 21, 2005 03:17 PM | Link to this

LISA: What do you consider wisdom? Granted I have not been out of high school for 20+ years but it looks to me that age does not make you wiser. If you are going to comment on me telling you something at least spell my name correct…It is right in front of you! Please let me know how assume that I do not have wisdom. I would love to hear your presumption of me! All I was getting at is if you want people to take us seriously then we have to atleast act like we know what we are doing and that we do know proper ways of using words and spelling in order for them to teach children today properly.

By Jake

April 21, 2005 03:19 PM | Link to this

MS - While I think your items 1 and 2 are pretty good ideas (3 being a little general and vague), we can’t get the political or personal agendas out of public education. There will always be the state and/or county, and the NEA agendas, as well as all those parents that think the school system should revolve around their child’s individual needs and wants.

Frankly, that’s my agenda. My daughter is deemed gifted based on standardized test scores and teacher’s recommendations and 8 years of straight A’s. But her critical thinking is mediocre at best. She’s been left behind by schools that teach to the lowest common denominator, and stress CRCT results over thinking skills, encouraged by NCLB funding threats and promises. If we can remove some government regulations, and allow the Big Three of student, parent, and teacher to work together unhindered, we’ll get better results for the gifted and the challenged.

By LISA

April 21, 2005 03:19 PM | Link to this

OH Brittany keep on living and you will realize MONEY is the only thing that matter!! not your spelling or you correct punctuation only GREEN!!! you see Brittany the CEO’S don’t stop selling there product to you just because you can’t spell or read they will still allow you as a consumer to buy a house,car and any other items that are being sold!!! The bottom line is Money!!! now you see I buy houses and bring in between 30 to 50,000 every three months!!!Now I know what to do!!! how to do!!! and when to do!!!SO continue to live and you will see that it ain’t what you know!!!It’s who you know!!! Just ask your conservative President!!!BUSH.

By Jake

April 21, 2005 03:34 PM | Link to this

It’s good to know someone will take the bait, no matter how poorly you conceal the trap. I meant to say my daughter’s critical thinking ability is only marginally better than Sly’s, but then she’s only 13. Go Lisa, this is a blog and should be about ideas, not a spelling or grammar contest. Besides Britt apparently doesn’t know ‘misuse’ is one word or that ‘correctly’ should be the adverb used to correctly modify the verb phrase “spell my name”. Love and peace, out.

By Britt

April 21, 2005 03:41 PM | Link to this

First of all LISA the name is BRITT not BRITTANY… second of all that may be so-they may continue to allow you to purchase those things BUT when they see that you cannot use correct English and grammar they will give you an outrageous interest rate and they will play you for a fool! Ask any respectable salesman! You may be successful in what you do but I also am thank you.. I may be younger than you but I have already been through college-have obtained a degree in chemistry and am a successful chemist as well as own my own business… True money is the way to survive these days BUT happiness also matters. So get over this money make the world go round. Good gosh, get off your high horse and be happy with money or no money…

By Lisa

April 21, 2005 03:50 PM | Link to this

Alright lets get back to the topic at hand not pesonal attack!!! That NCLB ACT!!! I know 2 Principal who are retiring right now, due to that Law that was implemented to there school!!! Before that Law was put in there school, the school was doing really well.Soon after that NCLB went into effect at these 2 High School the school went down hill!!!! The principals at both school knew that this was going to happen,But couldn’t do anything about it.Now both Principal have been offer better jobs in the private sector.How long will people continue to be blind side by policy that is contaminating the whole school system.Especially the public sector.WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!

By Shauna

April 21, 2005 03:52 PM | Link to this

Do these tests take into consideration the children that don’t speak English or A.D.D. or A.D.H.D. children? Or are all of the tests scored the same?

It doesn’t seem fair to expect kids that you know have problems to perform on a test that “regular” kids have to take.

By Dan

April 21, 2005 03:53 PM | Link to this

Federal school spending has almost doubled in the last 10 years!! Yet performance has gone down. Now I know there are myriads of reasons for this but it is pretty clear money is not a significant one. Privates schools perform better spending less per student with teachers that have lower educational standards and lower pay, (and remember I am talking averages here don’t dispute this by pointing to Marist) In reality the teachers are between a rock and a hard place. But the fact is there needs to be accountability. No test is perfect but it is better than no accountability. Teachers are like everyone else there are good and bad ones. I hear a lot of complaints from teachers that the testing does not allow them to teach to their potential this may be true in some cases but I submit that in many cases the testing may be revealing they are not teaching to their potential.

By Shauna

April 21, 2005 04:05 PM | Link to this

Dan,

What do you mean by private school teachers have lower educational standards?

By Dan

April 21, 2005 04:06 PM | Link to this

MS makes some good points, but I think class size is overated. Now as with anything I sure some teachers are better in big classes or small or with different age groups but generally speaking in my opinion a good teacher will do better with 30 students than a mediocre one with 20, and if you found a way to truly determine the best teachers, given the 20 student vs 30 example you could get rid of the bottom 30% and give raises to the rest. That might make the profession more attractive

By Dan

April 21, 2005 04:10 PM | Link to this

Many teachers in private schools do not have education degrees or masters degrees. Or I should say it is not required as it is in many public schools.

By Dan

April 21, 2005 04:13 PM | Link to this

Shauna Your comments regarding special needs children are well founded. I know they address them on some level, I think there is a max % of students that can be classified as such. The problem comes in when 1 a school district honestly has more children in those groups and 2 even scarier the possibility of teachers/administrators placing children in those groups who shouldn’t be there just to help their numbers.

By Shauna

April 21, 2005 04:18 PM | Link to this

Dan,

At my daughters’ private Christian Academy, all of the teachers have to have at least a Master’s degree and they all have to be A-Beka certified to teach. The A-Beka program is one of the best in the country and they have to be recertified every other year. So, not all private schools require less education from their teachers.

As a matter of fact, I interviewed several private schools this past March and most of them required their teachers to have a Masters or higher.

By Britt

April 21, 2005 04:23 PM | Link to this

Jake: So sorry that I made 2 errors…Goodness. I guess I deserve it though,for putting the heat on Lisa. But that was 2 accidental errors compared to hers that keep showing up. If you are going to comment on others atleast inform Lisa on the proper ways of using the multiple meanings of “there”. Thank you for correcting me though. See Lisa that is how you take constructive critism.

By LISA

April 21, 2005 04:28 PM | Link to this

Dan you made a excellent point with the test issue.I agree totally that the teachers, some not all may not be teaching to there full potential.However we know that the best and the brightest teacher do get paid less! But they don’t have to deal with all the red tape, and the lack of respect from the adminstrators.the have more room to be creative and teach. not fuss and yell all day.

By Dan

April 21, 2005 04:35 PM | Link to this

I am sure that some do Shauna I happen to know 3 and all of them teach in private schools, love their job, seem to be very competent (but how do I really know ;o)and all have a bachelors degree only (one in education) and when I finished college in new york a few friends became teachers and taught in private schools while they were working on their masters beacause they weren’t allowed to teach in public. Another women I know quit a marketing career to become a jr high teacher in alpharetta and is trying to fit in a masters degree so she can move to a higher pay rate and possibly move to HS. She btw one teacher of the year last year as selected by her peers, many of who have their masters. My main point is, I think public schools waste a lot of money and energy on things that don’t help the education process.

By Lisa

April 21, 2005 04:36 PM | Link to this

Hey Britt don’t thank me you made the error.A

By Britt

April 21, 2005 04:44 PM | Link to this

Hey Lisa. I was not thanking you. I was thanking Jake for correcting my error.

By Eric

April 21, 2005 04:46 PM | Link to this

Lisa, What standards are you using to say that the two schools you are refering to declined? Have there been socio-economic changes in the area? Have there been major changes at the feeder schools serving the high schools?

People keep harping on teacher accountability. Grades do not measure this, due to grade inflation. The objective way to compare schools is through standardized test scores.

Why should schools be funded at the federal level? With the socio-economic differences, state and local level funding makes far more sense. Local governments are (IMO) slightly more accountable b/c the voting blocs are smaller. Despite this, communities should have some assurance of a minimum standard of public schools.

By Swan

April 22, 2005 09:42 AM | Link to this

“Everyone is so obsessed with not hurting a child’s feelings that they are letting them get away with not learning. That is not fair to the kids who study hard and to parents who make sure that their kids are studying hard. It basically tells the kids that it doesn’t matter how hard you work. The truth is that it does matter.”

I couldn’t agree with this statement more. Thanks for saying it better than I could, Shauna.

By Shae

April 22, 2005 09:59 AM | Link to this

I agree with you Swan. People just seem so intimidated by children these days that we do not want to frustrate them or make them feel bad. We have been overcome by children and their threats to call child services if we punish them as parents that we do not teach them that they need to study hard-whether that means not going to that movie or the mall or talking on the phone unless they know their studies. I don’t know how I feel about the new law but maybe people would not make such a big deal regarding it if we taught the kids how to buckle down and study-that way if they HAD to take any tests they would be prepared.

By Dan

April 22, 2005 11:03 AM | Link to this

Good comments by eric swan and shae Kids have always taken tests like these, but the uproar about them being harmful, distracting and a source of anxiety for kids, started when teachers and districts began to be evaluated on them. Actually many forward thinking schools have been doing this for a while. Could it be that all the uproar is not about whats best for the kids.

By Doug

April 22, 2005 11:04 AM | Link to this

NCLB was put in place by a party that doesn’t even believe in public schools. It imposes unreasonably onerous requirements and isn’t adequately funded, assuring that many schools will fail by its standards. You do the math.

By Matt

April 22, 2005 11:30 AM | Link to this

It’s not the test! It’s not the teachers! It’s not even the system!

All of you in this post, regardless of where you stand on the issues, are here because you care about your kids and their future. The problem, the real problem in America, is that there are not enough of you in our schools any more. You are the minority.

It’s shameful for you to be critical of each other becuase of spelling or where one stands on an issue or who has the most experience in whatever. The truth, even for you folks who disagree, is that you all have one thing in common and that is our children and their future. We need to fix society and then the schools will take care of themselves. We have too many adults who just flat out don’t care and they don’t care how their kids turn out. The one class never taught in school was how to be a great parent. The responsibilities that come with this title and what it really means is known by the few, and they are in this post. Let’s quit the negative talk and move on to the real issues.

By Don

April 22, 2005 12:31 PM | Link to this

Most of the problem seems to be the parents. Parents send their kids off to government schools to be educated by the government. When does the govt ever do anything really well? Think about it. What do you expect? If you care the slightest about your children, you will make the necessary sacrafices and send you kids to private school. Govt is not the solution people! Free market competion creates the best schools and environments for learing. The teachers unions hate competition.

Amazing that people universally talk bad about the governments inability to do much right yet they have no problem sending the most important thing in their life to get their EDUCATION from the very thing they loath!

By Jake

April 22, 2005 01:04 PM | Link to this

Don: Sounds nice but not everyone can opt out of the public education system. What sacrifices can the single mom of three at McClarin HS make to get her kids into Marist or Holy Innocents? If you exclude my conspiracy theories, NCLB is about public schools improving standardized test performance for minorities and the poor, not transporting them to private schools or performing some social engineering on their parents.

By Doug

April 22, 2005 01:20 PM | Link to this

There are many things the government does well. I know you never hear that from your Republican friends, but if you stop nodding your head and think about it, you’ll realize that the roads are maintained, the food and drugs are kept safe, and the country is defended by our government. Those are only a few of the things it does well.

Private schools aren’t necessarily better. My step-brother went to private school for awhile until my parents realized that the school was afraid to honestly report his lack of progress. They wanted to keep getting the tuition even though they were failing at teaching him. Public schools (especially with teachers that have tenure) have no such incentive to lie to the parents.

Look at the daily scandals on Wall Street and tell me private companies are more trustworthy.

Wouldn’t teachers want private schools? There is a higher demand for educators than there is a supply. It seems that salaries would rise if the market controlled.

By Dan

April 22, 2005 01:46 PM | Link to this

Doug The problem with the requirements is they are too lenient and as for funding not only has that almost doubled in 10 years, the schools don’t even use up what is allocated to them. Also most roads are maintained locally, and that is the first time I heard a lib praise the FDA. what tenure really does is provide zero incentive to perform. and lastly if you comare wall street scandals to politcal ones pols would lose hands down. Wall street always has the objective dollar to keep it straight, pols are monitored by half the population who vote. i will take my chances with the dollar

By Don

April 22, 2005 01:59 PM | Link to this

Jake: People make all kinds of choices that affect their lives. What kind of choices did the single parent make to get them where they are? From your statement, which is correct, the kids suffer because of the parents choices. You do realize there are hundreds of great private schools across the state that don’t cost as much as Marist right? Marist is a poor example. That’s like saying you can’t afford college because you can’t afford Harvard.

Doug: You and I both know that the overwhelming majority of the things government touches turns to crap. Schooling is a great example. Free market works best when competition for tuition dollars is involved. What happens whenever you take competition away from another business? No accountability right? Same with government schools. Tenured teachers aren’t accountable since they have nothing to worry about. They don’t really care as much about teaching your kids! Its really pretty simple to understand. They don’t have any incentive to teach WELL but teachers in a private school do since they don’t have stupid tenure rules.

I’m not sure why you have more faith in government to teach your kids than the free market economy?

By Jake

April 22, 2005 02:59 PM | Link to this

I’m sure there are many relatively inexpensive private schools I know nothing about. But that dosn’t change the fact that not everyone can or will opt out unless there isn’t any public school option. The theory, I think, is that the parents are done deeds, so let’s use public schools to raise the achievement levels and, therefore, the future possibilities for the kids. And then they, in turn, will hopefully transmit intellectual/educational values to their children. NCLB is partly the result of the caring, more affluent parents opting out. Leaving the public school environment increasingly to the uncaring, poor and minorities isn’t a solution for them! It just perpetuates, and, in fact, accelerates the problem.
My personal beef is that the focus on the underachievers takes resources away from the best and brightest. My daughter’s middle school originally proposed severely reducing the Venture (gifted) class offerings to devote additional resources to the lesser performers, a direct response to failing the AYP criterion for the second time in the last three years. For her, private school may well have been a much better option, but it wouldn’t have helped the school’s overall CRCT scores!

By Doug

April 22, 2005 03:40 PM | Link to this

I don’t support keeping teachers that are clearly failing. Tenure shouldn’t protect incompetence. It should protect academic freedom and prevent unfair termination. We should do a better job of identifying less competent teachers (human observation and evaluation is the answer, not testing) and compensating the most competent.

Surprise, Dan - I’m actually quite conservative on issues like this. These days, that makes me a Democrat. There are only a few things government should be involved in. Education is one (along with the things I mentioned in my previous post). You’re right, roads are maintained by local governments. So are schools (less so with NCLB). The best thing we can do with schools is localize control and keep the federal government out. I thought this was a conservative/Republican principle. Remember, Ted Kennedy supported NCLB.

If money were the only thing that motivated teachers, many of them would be doing something else. Private schools have an incentive to appear to be teaching well. There’s a difference between that and a motivation to actually teach well, which is already present in our public school teachers.

Public schools and the teachers are accountable through the voters and the administration. Private school teachers don’t care anymore about the bottom line than the cashier at Burger King, so the idea that privatization itself makes teachers care more is a little far-fetched. The accountability, as with Burger King, would be imposed from above. Is it a good thing for teachers to constantly fear being fired? Do we want economics determining how accountability is imposed on teachers? I want a teacher to give an A because the student deserves it, not because the school might lose the tuition.

Private schools only appear to succeed now because they get to choose who they take. And only parents who care about their child’s education will pay the tuition. If all children went to private schools, and there were no public schools, many private schools would get the same results as the public schools.

I’m not sure why you trust the free market economy more than government to provide a public service. If we want a quality education to go to the highest bidder, then the free market economy is the way to do it. If we think every child deserves the opportunity afforded by a quality education, we keep it public. To borrow from John Edwards: In our America, the family you’re born into and the color of your skin will never control your destiny.

By Don

April 22, 2005 03:56 PM | Link to this

Doug: Your making this too easy. Pulling from a comment you made above, ” Is it a good thing for teachers to constantly fear being fired?” Seriously Doug. This isn’t communism, remember? Anyone who is receiving pay is constantly under pressure not to get fired by their boss and why should the person who is charged with teaching your children any different? Seriously. Its a simple rule. If you don’t cut it, especially as a teacher, your FIRED. Simple as that!

I trust the free market more than the govt to provide a service because the free market ALWAYS does it for cheaper and more efficent than the wasteful govt and its not the responsibility of govt to educate our kids.

Also, if everyone was in private school vs govt schools you would not see the same poor results you get from public schools because you would have more CHOICE than you do with govt schools and you vote with your dollars.

By WB

April 22, 2005 04:25 PM | Link to this

Doug: I am very ashamed of your comment. I am a single full-time working mother. Let me break it down for you: All of my children were conceived and born in marriage. The “father” in their life decided that he did not want to be a father anymore. Therefore I don’t have a choice. He doesn’t have enough energy for his children because he spends all of his energy trying to beat the system so he does not have to pay child support. I do not have any help nor do I ask for any help. I DO EVERYTHING! I am their mother and father. So to get to the point, they are my life and if I could afford it they would be in private schools. Some of us don’t have a choice because of We do the best we can.

By WB

April 22, 2005 04:29 PM | Link to this

Doug: I aplogize. The previous message was for Dan.

By Don

April 22, 2005 04:52 PM | Link to this

WB: Why should you be ashamed of my comment? Do you really think I was talking about people like you? I would hope you would know what I’m talking about. There is always a few cases like yours but the majority are not. Its grown-ups deciding they are splitting because of “irreconsilable differences” and crap like that which ruins lives. The kids lives are ruined because of selfish parents and their inability to “man up”, for lack of a better word, and be an adult and deal with problems. So I’ll stick to my guns. People make their own choices in life and those choices have rewards sometimes and consequences other times.

By David

April 25, 2005 09:27 AM | Link to this

concerning private schools….i think you have to look at this fact: there are 2 types of private schools in georgia…no 3…you have your christian schools that are actually backed by or held on church property, then there are your private schools that were built in the late ‘60’s early ‘70’s just to avoid integration, then you have your private schools like the Westminsters, Woodward Academies, Stratford in Macon, Savannah Country Day, etc; etc;….i’m sure the latter schools are very good….but many of the others i know for a fact do NOT have all certified teachers on their staff….

By Dan

April 25, 2005 09:43 AM | Link to this

Not sure how I got in the middle of WB family crisis. Clearly not everyone can afford private school, my comments supporting them were two-fold, first was to rebut the people that think public schools fail because of lack of funding, they don’t they have more money than they know what to do with, relatively speaking, second I view the testing and accountability being put forth by NCLB as a public implementaion of a private sector ideal. Basically in my opinion public schools should learn from private in order to succeed. Currently they are under the mistaken belief that their flaws are inflicted by things beyond their control

By Robert

April 25, 2005 11:44 AM | Link to this

Dan, You said that public schools are under a misconception that their flaws are inflicted by things beyond their control. I disagree that this is a misconception.

Public schools must use the textbook selected by the System. We have no choice or say in the matter. Private schools may select whichever book they wish.

Public schools must admit any student, regardless of academic ability or behavior disorder. Private schools may expel these students as they wish. And, guess where these expelled students end up…. in public schools.

Public schools are limited to the money “passed down” from the State and the System. Private schools can increase revenues by increasing enrollment or by increasing tuition.

You said that public schools should learn from private schools. Gee, I wish we (the public schools) actually could do what private schools do!!!

By otise

April 25, 2005 11:45 AM | Link to this

The interesting thing about these blogs is how personal they get. Perhaps that is the lesson to be learned. On a certain level, I think many of us feel very removed from the legislative process. We seem to wait for it to come down the pipe and then consider it as something created in - or in certain cases in opposition to - the better interests of society. But when we begin to think critically about how legislation like NCLB affects us and some of the underlying social implications that it holds, we do so through an intensely personal lens. We consider it based on the merits that we identify with or are sensitive to: socioeconomic status, race, mental disability, etc. Suddenly, the issue becomes so much closer to us. Social policy becomes a personal issue and we are far more invested in it. Now what we all know is that everyone thinks everyone else should agree with their personal position. I certainly empathize with any policy analyst charged with developing effective legislation.

Now personally, I think NCLB is a horrible piece or crap, but not so much because of how it is written. It should be noted, though, that it probably is some of the worst policy ever. It presented gaping holes upon its introduction, like not offering different standards for schools with a large percentage of ESL students. It offered no clearly discernable way to fund all of its mandates, and there were a host of other problems already covered by many of the other postings. But I think this legislation’s truest flaw is that it sought to - and in many ways still does seek to - standardize educational goals in a system that does not offer standardized education. Our educational system finds its public schools supported in large part by the tax base of its community. Therefore, schools in areas with low property taxes - in spite of federal and state support - are simply not going to have the same resources as schools with very high tax bases. Without those resources, those students are already receiving a very different education, but they are expected to pass the same tests as everyone else. Couple this with the tracking system that most schools have (with the gifted students taking different classes from the “regular” students and so on) and you have an even more stratified educational complexity that will never be addressed by such a simplistic, “standard”, one-size-fits-all piece of legislation.

I am not ignorant to the fact that there are certain academic benchmarks that every young student should meet. It just seems to me that NCLB found a way to re-test for the very same benchmarks that perviously existing standardized tests already did, while injecting a host of very dire consequences for our schools, students, teachers, and communities.

One could go on and on for days pontificating about what needs to happen; I certainly have my ideas, and I am sure many of you do as well. All I am advocating for is that we are honest with ourselves about one thing: we have a highly stratified, complex public educational system that supports a lack of academic parity. As long as we are comfortable with the notion that a good education - even a public one - is something a child’s family should have to afford, as long as we are comfortable with a tracking system that places kids on an academic course based on their earliest performance as an indication of their “aptitude”, there will be no legislation that will ensure any of our kids a good, “basic” education.

That’s all i have y’all. Oh, and by the way, it is my hope that no one will charge any typos or grammatic missteps as an indication of my obtuse intellect or minor education. Should you stumple arcoss anything of the like, just attribute it to my human fallibility.

By Dan

April 25, 2005 12:22 PM | Link to this

Robert, I agree with some of your points regarding admitting anyone. But not test book selection or money, the people that make those decisions are part of the system. State education boards and school administrators. Private schools have the same issues, I am sure not every private school teacher has exactly the text book they want. As far as money as I have stated before, they have more money than they know what to do with. Public educational systems often don’t even spend what is alloted to them and when the do they spend it foolishly.